S10 E6: [Maribelle] Dating Website Predator

[0] Wondry Plus subscribers can listen to something was wrong early and ad -free right now.

[1] Join Wondry Plus in the Wondry app or on Apple Podcasts.

[2] I'm Dan Tversky.

[3] In 2011, something strange began to happen at a high school in upstate New York.

[4] A mystery illness, bizarre symptoms, and spreading fast.

[5] What's the answer?

[6] And what do you do if they tell you it's all in your head?

[7] Hysterical.

[8] A new podcast from Wondry and Pineapple Street Studios.

[9] Binge all episodes of hysterical early and ad -free on Wondery Plus.

[10] Something Was Wrong is intended for mature audiences.

[11] Episodes can discuss topics that can be triggering, such as emotional, physical, and sexual violence, suicide, and murder.

[12] I am not a therapist or a doctor.

[13] If you're in need of support, please visit something was wrong .com slash resources for a list of non -profit organizations that can help.

[14] Names have been changed for anonymity purposes.

[15] Opinions expressed by the guests on the show are their own and do not necessarily represent the views of myself or audio chuck.

[16] Resources and source material are linked in the episode notes.

[17] Thank you so much for listening.

[18] Coercive control is a strategic form of interpersonal violence, which perpetuates ongoing oppression and terrorism used to instill fear and control.

[19] While anyone can experience coercive control, it's often grounded in gender -based privilege, Between 60 and 80 % of women seeking assistance for abuse have experienced coercive control.

[20] In order to subdue their targets, abusers use coercive control tactics such as limiting access to money, monitoring all communication, isolation, gaslighting, emotional abuse, reinforcing traditional gender roles, parental alienation, controlling body autonomy, accusations of infidelity, sexual coercion and abuse, and threatening children, pets, or loved ones.

[21] While this form of abuse is illegal in some countries, including the United Kingdom since 2015, it's not considered illegal in the United States unless another crime has been committed.

[22] I'm Tiffany Reese, and this is, something was wrong.

[23] My name is Maribel.

[24] I am 37 from Oklahoma, and I'm going to be sharing my story with my ex.

[25] Hunter.

[26] I met Hunter on Plenty of Fish in 2018.

[27] I was attracted to him because he was the typical southern guy I was looking for.

[28] He was into all the same things I was into.

[29] After we started talking on Plenty, of fish.

[30] We took it to texting, talking on the phone, FaceTiming.

[31] He worked out on the road.

[32] So the first three or four weeks of our relationship was long distance.

[33] And I found it sweet and intriguing that he wanted to talk to me on the phone all the time.

[34] That's how he caught me. I thought it was romantic and sweet.

[35] What initially attracted me to Hunter was his, everything about his profile was country.

[36] It was southern gentleman.

[37] He liked to fish and hunt.

[38] That attracted me at first.

[39] Then after taking it to the phone, he had the accent.

[40] He just was everything I wanted in a man. I wanted the perfect southern guy that was outdoorsy and worked hard and he worked out in the oil field.

[41] We started texting and talking on the phone, FaceTiming all the time.

[42] It was all the time.

[43] all evening every night.

[44] And at first I found that endearing.

[45] Later on into the relationship, I found it to be very controlling.

[46] It was a whirlwind sweep you off your feet type thing.

[47] He was very good at love bombing.

[48] He showered me with affection while he was out on the road.

[49] He bought me jewelry and sent it to me, sent me flowers all the time, bought me a purse, just showered me with gifts.

[50] Maribel doesn't remember all of the specifics about their first in -person date, but she does remember feeling comfortable enough with Hunter to invite him to stay at her place that evening.

[51] I was living with my roommate and I felt safe with everybody there.

[52] The next day, it's like we started a relationship that we had already been in.

[53] It was like he came in from out of town in a relationship we'd been in for a year.

[54] What he had told me about his background was that he was from Alabama.

[55] He had four or five brothers, two or three sisters.

[56] He owned a very large property that he had down in Alabama, but he was transferred up to Oklahoma from his job.

[57] He got a job up here.

[58] When he came back into town, He had told me that he had been staying at an extended stay hotel because he said his company put him up in it because he had just moved here and he works out on the road.

[59] So it made sense to me that he could live in a hotel.

[60] I used to work in the oil -filled business in the office, so I never questioned it.

[61] He had told me that he lost his wife and two -year -old son in a car accident back in Alabama.

[62] The drunk driver had hit them or he had.

[63] had fallen asleep.

[64] That drew me in because I felt horrible for him.

[65] I cried with him many, many nights on the phone and after he got back into town as well.

[66] But I felt like here was this widowed man that just moved into a state he doesn't know.

[67] He had me from there.

[68] I'm a loving, nurturing, caring person, and he picked up on that quick, and I wanted to be with him.

[69] I wanted to fix him.

[70] I wanted to heal him.

[71] I wanted to show him that life can be great again.

[72] Did he show you pictures and videos of his son?

[73] He did.

[74] He showed me a couple videos, pictures of him.

[75] As a baby, they ended at about two.

[76] He said he passed away when he was two.

[77] But he would share videos, pictures, There was even one video that had his wife, the boy's mom, in the background.

[78] And I heard her voice and felt horrible for him that he had lost his wife and son.

[79] It was tragic.

[80] What did your friends and family and your roommate think of him?

[81] My roommate, my best friend.

[82] She, from the moment she met him, knew there was something wrong with him.

[83] She knew from the get -go that there was something.

[84] not right.

[85] I didn't listen.

[86] Even my mom, she felt the same way, and he didn't really meet a whole lot of my family.

[87] Something always came up that we couldn't go.

[88] It was work or something, something always came up.

[89] But the one time he met my brother and a couple other family members, they all felt off about him.

[90] My mom and my best friend actually felt so much unease about him that a few weeks into the relationship with him, they paid to have a background check ran on his license plate so they could find out information on him.

[91] It came up nothing, unfortunately, because it was a work truck, and they couldn't get anything, kind of at this point wish they could have.

[92] It would have saved me a lot of trouble.

[93] I was in a vulnerable state when I met him.

[94] I came out of a pretty bad relationship before that, and I know that sounds terrible, but I did it.

[95] I was in a vulnerable spot and just wanted to be loved, like everybody wants to be loved and cared for.

[96] Here I have this knight shining armor, this picture of what I've always wanted come riding into my life, and he's love bombing me with everything that I want to hear.

[97] I fell 100 % head over heels in love with him.

[98] Absolutely.

[99] Another part of his story that also drew me near him.

[100] him and he led into fairly quickly that was that quite a few of his family members had passed away.

[101] He had lost his mom.

[102] He had a brother that was in jail.

[103] He had another brother that had passed away.

[104] His life was just surrounded in tragedy.

[105] I thought, well, I've got a great family.

[106] I can bring him into mine and show him love and what a wonderful family is.

[107] Then he told me that he had four sisters.

[108] He never had a relationship with them.

[109] They have different moms.

[110] A couple of them have different moms.

[111] A couple of them have different dads.

[112] It was a complicated story that he never went into much detail.

[113] And he made it so upsetting that it was kind of one of those things that I didn't ask if he didn't tell me. I didn't talk about it unless he talked about it.

[114] Early into their relationship, the couple began living together in a local hotel room that Hunter was staying at for work.

[115] He told me he had owned a couple different businesses.

[116] One was a trucking company.

[117] The other one was a food product.

[118] He had an engineering degree.

[119] He had two patents.

[120] He wanted me to quit my job and go on the road with him.

[121] I was too scared to quit my job so I started messing up on attendance so they would let me go.

[122] It is so embarrassing to say.

[123] But I didn't really truly want to quit my job.

[124] I didn't want to leave.

[125] He wanted me to go and I felt like that's what I should do and I quit my job.

[126] And that's really where the isolation said and I didn't start going back home and staying back home.

[127] I basically gave my dog to my roommate because he didn't really want dogs in the hotel even though it was a pet hotel.

[128] He didn't want him there.

[129] Even the dogs, he didn't even want you to have your dog.

[130] It's like his insecurity or something being projected onto you because they want that 100 % power and control over you.

[131] Absolutely.

[132] I even stopped answering text messages.

[133] I turned my location off all the time because I didn't want my mom and my best friend to know where I was at because they were all starting to get suspicious, I started to get pretty bad, a very lonely road.

[134] They isolate you to gain that control because they know that the people around you can pick up on that.

[135] They know that they have to dupe you over one person at a time.

[136] And he knew when he met my best friend and when he met my mom, he knew from that moment he was not going to be able to win them over.

[137] They have the most significant influence on my life.

[138] They're the two people I go to the most.

[139] I'm getting emotional.

[140] I didn't think I would.

[141] Things took a strange turn one afternoon.

[142] The couple had separated so Maribel could do laundry while Hunter ran an errand, and then her phone rang.

[143] He called me and told me that the room key had expired.

[144] And I needed to go to the front desk and get the key card renewed and to tell him who it was under in the room number, blah, blah, blah.

[145] So I get to the front desk and I tell him I need to renew the key for room 204.

[146] And he says, what's the name on it?

[147] I give him Hunter's name.

[148] And he says, well, I don't have anybody here by that name.

[149] Is there another name it could be under?

[150] I give him my name, Maribel.

[151] He says, no, it's not under that.

[152] I said, what's it under?

[153] and he says, John.

[154] And I just laughed it off.

[155] I said, oh, he's funny like that.

[156] He likes to give fake names like celebrities when we go to hotels.

[157] And I got the key renewed, and I went to the elevator.

[158] And I knew at that moment that everything he had been telling me was a lie, that something was wrong.

[159] I knew he was lying to me. and I got upstairs, got to the room, waited for him to get back, he got back.

[160] We were going to go out to dinner, and I was trying to decide when I was going to ask him about it.

[161] I decided I couldn't wait anymore.

[162] I asked him, I said, who's John Green?

[163] And he looks at me, and he puts his head down, and he puts his head in his hands.

[164] He paces and I'm sitting here waiting for some kind of crazy explanation and he goes and sits down in the corner, put his head in his hands again and tears up and says, well, you remember how I told you I had to go to jail once?

[165] I said, yes.

[166] He said, well, I went to prison because I beat up the guy that killed my wife and son.

[167] And so I didn't endanger my companies.

[168] I changed my name legally so my companies wouldn't be affected so I could continue to have business.

[169] Did he seem convincing?

[170] He was 100 % convincing.

[171] I, of course, inquired.

[172] I was inquisitive about it.

[173] I didn't 100 % full on believe it.

[174] I asked him why he would do that, why he would have to change his name.

[175] why did it matter?

[176] People would find out the truth anyway.

[177] I then asked to see ID because I wanted to know what his actual real name was.

[178] So he breaks out his driver's license and his passport shows me that that's him.

[179] And I felt bad for him because he had lost his wife and son, and I didn't want to pry into that.

[180] I knew it was a difficult subject.

[181] And, I mean, I couldn't blame him.

[182] I would want to hurt the person that killed my significant other, especially my child.

[183] So I guess I sympathized for him and rationalized it in my head that it was okay, that that's what he did.

[184] After her discovery, Hunter pushed for Maribel to put the subject to bed and move forward.

[185] Despite her hesitations about his truthfulness at the time, she'd become completely financially dependent on him, furthering his control.

[186] I had filed for unemployment, but that only gives you so much a month, and he didn't want me to work.

[187] So he set me up an extension off of his bank account, so I would have money.

[188] So we go to the bank and go inside and set up, and I get a debit card, and everything.

[189] Money to use whenever I want.

[190] He whined and dined me. It was expensive restaurants.

[191] It was expensive clothes, jewelry.

[192] He would take me shopping.

[193] They would take me to Victoria's Secret.

[194] Everything.

[195] The whole nine flowers, everything.

[196] So when we set me up on his bank account, they put in my home address for where my debit card should go to.

[197] a few weeks went by, and I didn't get it, and I called him, and he had said it went to his trucking company's address, and that they would be sending me a new one, which they did.

[198] Shortly after she received her new bank debit card linked to Hunter's account, she decided to log into their online banking to see if she could verify which name he was using.

[199] I started to question things.

[200] I started to really search him out on the internet, and I couldn't find anything.

[201] So I was getting suspicious.

[202] So he leaves and goes back out on the road.

[203] He tells me that the hotel's good through Sunday.

[204] This is a Friday.

[205] He leaves and I really get to work on searching this guy out to see who he is.

[206] So I started digging in his bank statements and I found another address for a town close to the town I was living in that he said that he did not have an address for.

[207] So I dug around a little more and I found another name attached to his main bank account because my app fed into his main bank account I found out.

[208] And the name I found was Evelyn Green.

[209] And I thought, well, okay, that's, I've never heard that name.

[210] So I instantly go to where does everybody search?

[211] Facebook.

[212] I search the name and the profile picture is of a woman with two children.

[213] And one of the children looks familiar.

[214] So I open up and dig further into this profile because there were several Evelyn's.

[215] And I come to a picture of a little boy that looked familiar.

[216] And then I kept flipping to the pictures.

[217] And there was the picture that he sent me the first time when he told me that his youngest son had died.

[218] The same picture.

[219] Posted on Facebook.

[220] like a couple weeks before he had sent me that picture.

[221] There it was right there.

[222] The kid is alive and well on Facebook.

[223] I see the same video.

[224] This child is alive.

[225] This wife is alive.

[226] It was unbelievable.

[227] Scammers are best known for living the high life until they're forced to trade it all in for handcuffs and an orange jumpsuit once they're finally caught.

[228] I'm Sachi Cole.

[229] And I'm Sarah Haggy.

[230] And we're the host of scam influencers, a weekly podcast from Wondery that takes you along the twists and turns of some of the most infamous scams of all time, the impact on victims and what's left once a facade falls away.

[231] We've covered stories like a Shark Tank certified entrepreneur who left the show with an investment, but soon faced mounting bills, an active lawsuit followed by Larry King, and no real product to push.

[232] He then began to prey on vulnerable women instead, selling the idea of a future together while stealing from them behind their backs.

[233] To the infamous scams of real housewife stars like Teresa Judice, what should have proven to be a major downfall only seemed to solidify her place in the Real Housewives Hall of Fame.

[234] Follow scam influencers on the Wondry app or wherever you get your podcasts.

[235] You can listen to Scamfluencers early and ad free right now on Wondry Plus.

[236] I'm Dan Tiberski.

[237] In 2011, something strange began to happen at the high school in Leroy, New York.

[238] I was like at my locker and she came up to me and she was like stuttering super bad.

[239] I'm like, stop fucking around.

[240] She's like, I can't.

[241] A mystery illness, bizarre symptoms and spreading fast.

[242] doubling and tripling, and it's all these girls.

[243] With a diagnosis, the state tried to keep on the down low.

[244] Everybody thought I was holding something back.

[245] Well, you were holding something back.

[246] Intentionally.

[247] Yeah, well, yeah.

[248] No, it's hysteria.

[249] It's all in your head.

[250] It's not physical.

[251] Oh, my gosh, you're exaggerating.

[252] Is this the largest mass hysteria since the Witches of Salem?

[253] Or is it something else entirely?

[254] Something's wrong here.

[255] Something's not right.

[256] Leroy was the new date line and everyone was trying to solve the murder.

[257] A new limited series from Wondery and.

[258] Pineapple Street Studios, Hysterical.

[259] Follow Hysterical on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts.

[260] You can binge all episodes of Hysterical early and ad -free right now by joining Wondry Plus.

[261] So I actually blacked out and passed out in the hotel.

[262] After she came to and tried to comfort herself, Maribel put the address she had found linked to their bank account into her GPS and saw that the home was only 15 minutes away.

[263] And at this point, it was about 3 or 4 a .m. So I get in the car and I drive over there.

[264] And I find where the house is and I park a little down the street and let the sun come up because it's dark and I didn't want to drive by the house just in case.

[265] So I park a little down the street.

[266] The sun comes up and I see a very familiar dodge.

[267] And there's this truck parked in front of the house.

[268] And I was like, oh my God, he has a home here.

[269] That was the first thing that went through my head.

[270] He has a home here.

[271] He does live here.

[272] Then it was he's got a kid, he's got a wife, what was happening?

[273] Before I even had a chance to process this, I see him walk out the front door across the yard and get in his truck.

[274] And two seconds later, my phone rings.

[275] And it's him.

[276] If it was that early in the morning, he knew.

[277] I knew I would be asleep.

[278] I knew I had to answer the phone.

[279] If not, I was probably cheating, quote unquote.

[280] And so I had to, like, I was asleep, answered the phone, played the whole thing off, and he told me he was just over the border or wherever he was working at the time.

[281] And he was at the gas station filling up and getting back on the road.

[282] And I'm sitting here staring at him in his truck.

[283] And we get off the phone, he gets back out and he goes inside.

[284] and I backed out and left and went home and didn't tell anyone.

[285] At this point, I was in complete disbelief that the woman and the child, the child especially, because I mean, I've always wanted kids, and at this point I didn't have any in.

[286] I was so just blown away that this child was still alive, that someone, could say that their child was dead and pass them off as dead just, that's where I couldn't wrap my mind.

[287] I was trying to wrap my mind around.

[288] Was this actually real?

[289] I think for several days, I was in complete denial that this was even real.

[290] I went on pretending with him for weeks and weeks as if nothing ever happened, as if I never found out.

[291] But internally, I try to process it more more every day.

[292] And I was doing this alone too because I was so scared to tell my friends and family.

[293] For one, I was scared if I was wrong or if there was a legitimate reason for this.

[294] I didn't want them to hate them because I knew we were already struggling on that end anyway.

[295] I was scared to find out the truth.

[296] I didn't want to look like an idiot again for picking another bad guy being in another bad relationship.

[297] I didn't want to admit I failed again.

[298] As she was processing and searching for more answers on social media, she came across a message that had been sitting in her spam folder from Evelyn, who she suspected to be Hunter's very much alive wife.

[299] Asking me if I knew Hunter, and I never responded.

[300] I was too scared to him.

[301] And he got back into town, and I still didn't ask him about it, for a few days.

[302] I pretended like everything was normal.

[303] I was 100 % dependent upon him for money.

[304] I was scared to leave because there went my income at the time.

[305] I had to pay rent.

[306] I lived with my roommate.

[307] She has a daughter.

[308] I didn't want to leave them high and dry.

[309] So I was scared for multiple reasons to even confront the situation with him.

[310] At this point, really started to look into who Evelyn was and got her information.

[311] And I became an FBI agent with this guy, okay, a private investigator.

[312] So I found her phone number and email.

[313] So I created a fake email address, pretended I was one of my friends, and emailed her asking who he really was to get some questions answered.

[314] I did not think that through.

[315] just at this point wanted answers.

[316] I had to know.

[317] While trying to pretend everything was fine and simultaneously messaging Evelyn, she headed out for a night of bowling with Hunter.

[318] But before they even began their game, Hunter approached Maribel, furious.

[319] He comes up to me and he says, we're leaving.

[320] And I said, why?

[321] And he said, we're leaving right now.

[322] And he said, don't play dumb with me. And I said, well, what are you talking about?

[323] And he said, you know what you did, you know what you did.

[324] We got in the truck and we left and got into a huge argument, huge argument.

[325] And at this point, I had started to see his anger a lot, so I started voice recording our arguments and things like that.

[326] Because I was scared that night.

[327] That was really the first night I saw that side of his anger.

[328] And I admitted it that it was me. At first, I did lie.

[329] I told him that it was my friend and I didn't know.

[330] and then I admitted it that it was me because I wanted answers and he said you should have just asked me about her and I said well who is she so we're arguing in the truck and we get back to the hotel and he gives me the second tragic sob story of his kids and who Evelyn is.

[331] He tells me Evelyn is his dead brother's widow and the two kids are their kids together.

[332] And he married Evelyn to give them his military benefits.

[333] And that neither one of those children were the child he had lost.

[334] He told me that there was a son that he lost.

[335] And he really did lose his wife, but this wasn't the same people.

[336] And I said, well, what about the picture?

[337] picture you showed me. Oh, that was a different picture.

[338] That was a different picture.

[339] I was like, that is not a different picture.

[340] I must have sent you the wrong one.

[341] There was always an explanation for everything.

[342] Is he again convincing?

[343] At this point, I'm thinking you are completely full of crap and you must think I'm dumb.

[344] But at the same time, I didn't know.

[345] I thought, I know for sure you've been lying about your son and you're trying to pass that one off.

[346] So how am I supposed to believe that you really do have an actual debt?

[347] Where's the proof of this?

[348] Who is this?

[349] How do you know?

[350] I wanted to know more about that.

[351] And he got really defensive and we got into a huge argument that night.

[352] And I ended up leaving.

[353] I told him I needed a break.

[354] Conveniently, Hunter was headed out of town for work.

[355] So she was able to get some distance to process.

[356] We spoke a little bit here and there.

[357] He tried to constantly win me back, and when he went out of town was when I decided to go ahead and respond to Evelyn's Facebook message and tell her who I was and that I knew who she was and let her know what was happening to tell her what her husband was doing.

[358] So at this point, when I told her what was happening with Hunter, she told me. that this wasn't the first time.

[359] She started to lean into the whole story of him.

[360] You're one of several girls.

[361] She started giving me the names of the other girls.

[362] Just all of these unreal things.

[363] He never had the wife and kid a died story that was new with the two right before me and me. And she didn't know about the two right before me. But that's a whole other story.

[364] He was married to one other woman before her, and he cheated on her with Evelyn, and Evelyn and Hunter started off their relationship, staying in a hotel all the time because he worked down on the road, and his story about moving and his same M .O. She told him that we had spoke.

[365] So cats out of the bag, he knows I know, he knows that we have talked, and this is where he starts to flip and go completely psychotic, I would say.

[366] He turned into a complete psycho.

[367] He started to message me. I would block his number, and he would text me from a texting app.

[368] And then he would text me from the texting app, from different numbers, pretending to be friends of his, vouging for him that he loves me and that's not really his wife.

[369] And just trying to defend him.

[370] It was crazy.

[371] And finally he came back into town and, like an idiot, I met up with him.

[372] And he came out with the full story.

[373] He told me the truth that that was his wife.

[374] his kids.

[375] But the new story was that they were separated.

[376] They had been separated for a long time.

[377] And she knew that.

[378] And he was moving out.

[379] He was looking for a place.

[380] And she knew about me. And she's lying.

[381] He started to turn on Evelyn.

[382] And then starts saying that Evelyn is saying that I'm making up things.

[383] He turns it into this whole huge back and forth.

[384] starts pretending he's Evelyn to send me text message to convince me to be with him from her standpoint.

[385] Maribel tried to dig deeper into Hunter's background, and at first she couldn't find much.

[386] But then she hit pay dirt.

[387] I'm digging.

[388] I find out he is not from Alabama.

[389] He is not from Oklahoma.

[390] He's from a completely different state.

[391] He does not own any businesses.

[392] He tries to pass off, however, that he did own a trucking.

[393] business by creating a fake business card.

[394] I still have that fake business card, by the way.

[395] And he didn't have a degree.

[396] Nobody had ever by that name, been to college.

[397] None of it was real.

[398] No patents, nothing.

[399] Where he worked wasn't even real.

[400] The only thing I found out about him was that everything about him was a lie.

[401] And I got names of the other women that he had been in a relationship with during the time that he had been with Evelyn, the ones that Evelyn knew of.

[402] She gave me two names, and one was a girl that is down in Texas, Amy.

[403] He had an assistant named Amy, and this was supposedly his assistant, but she was actually his girlfriend that was living in Texas, that they had been together for five years.

[404] And let me just add in that him and Evelyn have been together for seven at this point.

[405] do the math.

[406] When Evelyn and I finally spoke to each other and were telling each other our sides of the story, he panicked and went up to my mom's work, my mom owned a business, and he went up to her store.

[407] I didn't even know he knew where it was at this point.

[408] I think we had drove by it once.

[409] And he showed up, and as soon as my mom saw him walk in the door, she told him to talk in the door.

[410] turn around and get out and to talk to him outside.

[411] She knew we'd broke up and that he was a controlling jerk, but not the name, the kids, everything.

[412] And I still don't know really what happened in this conversation to this day, but she'd basically told him to leave me alone, leave all of us alone, and to never show his face around us again.

[413] And if he did, that she would call the police.

[414] And he started sobbing to me, don't, please don't, please don't tell your mom that I'm this bad, terrible person.

[415] Nobody will ever like me. I won't ever be able to get in with your family.

[416] They'll all hate me. I wish you could see our eye rolls right now.

[417] Right?

[418] It's the only downside of podcasting, the eye rolls.

[419] Shortly after the incident at her mom's house, Maribel reached out to Hunter's other girlfriend, Amy, to warn her about his lies.

[420] It's the same story.

[421] The lie.

[422] The name was a lie.

[423] And at this point, she had still believed the wife and kid's story.

[424] She didn't know that that was fake.

[425] She knew that he was controlling and that he was a bad guy and that he was cheating and that he was married.

[426] She found out about the married part, but never knew about the wife and kids.

[427] So I broke her to that.

[428] So she's also just finding out this information.

[429] And they had been together for five years?

[430] Yeah, they had dated for five.

[431] years.

[432] At this point, they'd been broken up for, I think she said, at this point it was six or seven months.

[433] So he had just stopped seeing her when he and I met, basically, is what it was.

[434] And did he use the same fake name with her that he used with you?

[435] He gave her the fake first name, but the real last name.

[436] She just solidified everything I already knew.

[437] that he lied.

[438] I obviously knew that he didn't have an assistant named Amy, that there wasn't really actually a trucking company.

[439] His lies were truly unraveling, and I knew everything at that point was absolutely a lie.

[440] He tried to justify everything, and there was a quick answer for everything, there was a reason, and I got tired of his excuses, and we stopped talking, and he came back into town and we met up once and he apologized.

[441] It was a sob story.

[442] It was I'll do better from this.

[443] I'll prove to you I'm leaving Evelyn.

[444] These are my boys.

[445] I want you to meet my boys.

[446] I am proud of them.

[447] It was a whole new.

[448] You showed me that I don't need to lie.

[449] I was just unhappy in my marriage.

[450] I'm sorry I lied.

[451] It was a whole new hunter.

[452] And part of me wanted to believe it.

[453] me entertained it, I guess you would say.

[454] And he got a hotel and we started to hang out again a little bit.

[455] I feel like a complete idiot.

[456] But we did and things were just bad from there.

[457] The couple's relationship was rocky and tensions continued to rise.

[458] In spite of his promises to do better, Hunter's anger and abusive behavior continued to escalate.

[459] It was him acting controlling.

[460] It was him being mean, rude.

[461] He started to tear me down, physically, emotionally about my body, about who I was.

[462] He would rip me apart.

[463] And then he would come back and love bombing again.

[464] And it became a toxic cycle for what seemed like forever for several months.

[465] And he went as far as to rent a place in the same town I was living in.

[466] And I knew he was going to do it, and I didn't stop him, but I didn't encourage it either.

[467] And towards the end, whenever he did actually rent it, I told him that I didn't want him to, and he went ahead and rented it anyway, and made it this big show that it was going to be our house, and I could move in there.

[468] He gave me a key.

[469] I could go over any time I wanted.

[470] We don't even have to be together if he's working out of town and I just want to go get away.

[471] I could go over there any time I wanted.

[472] So that's how he tried to snare me back in again.

[473] It was with hopes of having something and I took the key.

[474] We were off and on at this point seeing each other occasionally, but this is when things really turned volatile and just nasty.

[475] He really got to be verbally abusive and physically abusive.

[476] He would talk me into getting over there, what I would like to call lure.

[477] He would lure me over there with promises of love and care and gifts and dinner and I'm going to change and it was all these promises and I would get there and it would be the same thing.

[478] It would be the same fight.

[479] It would be the same controlling behavior.

[480] I would do something wrong.

[481] I would put a dish up wrong or I would close the bathroom door wrong or sit wrong.

[482] He would like grab my hood on my hoodie and rip me backwards or grab my hair and rip me backwards and I would turn and yell him, you know, get off me, scream, get off me and yell at him.

[483] He lived into duplex.

[484] So if I ever yelled too loud, he would grab me and put his hand over my mouth and he'd say, shut up, they're going to hear you.

[485] And if the neighbors hear you, then call the cops.

[486] Don't say anything.

[487] They're going to call 911.

[488] I would just leave and then I would get lured back in every time.

[489] And it got worse and worse and worse.

[490] I finally just stopped.

[491] I was done.

[492] I said, this is ridiculous.

[493] I'm done.

[494] After Maribel broke up with Hunter and tried to cut contact with him, he began exhibiting other abusive behaviors.

[495] And he started stalking me. He started driving by my house, me and my roommate's house, and we lived down a dead -in street, and he would still drive by.

[496] He would go down, turn around, come back, and he would drive by on the highway.

[497] He would just leave messages in my mailbox on the driveway.

[498] He would throw gifts in the driveway.

[499] He just did weird things.

[500] Well, I had told him that I was done and that I didn't want to do this anymore.

[501] And he came into town early one morning.

[502] He drove back purposely because I would not talk to him.

[503] And he drove all night and showed up at my house at 6 o 'clock in the morning and my roommate answered the door.

[504] And I was like, I don't want to see him.

[505] I do not want to talk to him.

[506] I said, please tell him to leave, so my roommate tells him to leave.

[507] After showing up at her place and being turned away, Hunter texted Maribel to say that they needed to meet up one last time.

[508] It was that we needed to meet up and give each other back our things.

[509] And he said, he was going to go to my work.

[510] And I said, no, don't go to my work.

[511] He said, okay, I'm going back into town.

[512] So I'm driving to work and I turn and my work is right off the highway.

[513] And I see his truck parked in the gravel parking lot.

[514] And I blow past it.

[515] I was not going to turn in.

[516] She struck him with her motor vehicle.

[517] She had been under the influence and she left him there.

[518] In January 2022, local woman Karen Reed was implicated in the mysterious death of her boyfriend, Boston police officer John O 'Keefe.

[519] It was alleged that after an innocent night out for drinks with friends, Karen and John got into a lover's quarrel en route to the next location.

[520] What happens next next?

[521] depends on who you ask.

[522] Was it a crime of passion?

[523] If you believe the prosecution, it's because the evidence was so compelling.

[524] This was clearly an intentional act.

[525] And his cause of death was blunt force trauma with hypothermia.

[526] Or a corrupt police cover -up.

[527] If you believe the defense theory, however, this was all a cover -up to prevent one of their own from going down.

[528] Everyone had an opinion.

[529] And after the 10 -week trial, the jury could not come to a unanimous.

[530] decision.

[531] To end in a mistrial, it's just a confirmation of just how complicated this case is.

[532] Law and crime presents the most in -depth analysis to date of the sensational case in Karen.

[533] You can listen to Karen exclusively with Wondery Plus.

[534] Join Wondry Plus in the Wondry app, Apple Podcasts, or Spotify.

[535] I blow past work.

[536] He sees me, but I have time to get far enough ahead of him and try to park in a store parking lot off the highway.

[537] And I see him coming and he starts to try to turn in and I see his blink around.

[538] I fly out and turn across the highway.

[539] He turns across the highway to follow me in front of traffic in front of everyone.

[540] I hit the gas.

[541] I lose him behind me. I get to work, park in front and run inside because I truly honestly thought he was going to get a gun out and shoot me while I was trying to run into work from my car to work.

[542] I'm so sorry.

[543] It's okay.

[544] He was truly such a predator.

[545] Oh, my gosh, he was such a predator.

[546] Just after that, he started calling work.

[547] He would call my work and ask for me if I didn't answer the phone, or he would ask if it was Sonic and say he had a wrong number if I didn't answer the phone.

[548] And even when I did answer the phone, he would just hang up.

[549] He just did it to see if I was there.

[550] And the text messages just went out of control.

[551] It was all day long.

[552] Some days he would create a new number and text me, create a new number and text me. Sometimes it would be himself.

[553] Sometimes he would pretend to be, he liked to pretend to be other women that he was dating or talking to.

[554] And he would talk to me as if he were them trying to make me jealous to come back.

[555] And he started sending me really vulgar horrible things.

[556] He would send me pictures of naked women and him and other women engaging in sexual acts.

[557] He would send me pictures of himself.

[558] He even took a picture with one of my necklaces on her and sent me the picture.

[559] I mean, do you really think this is going to get me back?

[560] After his harassment and stalking behavior began, Hunter also started to try and intimidate her in other ways.

[561] He started threatening that he was going to tell my job that I was doing heroin and meth and all these things and he was going to get me fired and he was going to tell my whole family that I was on drugs and all these horrible things about me to try to get me back.

[562] And then he would text me the next day or later that night as himself and apologized for that person and try to love me. I'm so sorry they did that.

[563] I told them not to ever do that again.

[564] He would be the protective defensive.

[565] And then when that didn't work.

[566] It went back to, well, then you're a piece of crap, you're fat, you're ugly, you're stupid.

[567] I mean, he would literally call me these things all the time.

[568] I'm not sure what he expected out of that, but it starts to wear down on your psyche after a while when you have someone calling you those things every day.

[569] Every day I had to look over my shoulder because he was always there.

[570] He just ended up always being there.

[571] I had to change my route.

[572] to work.

[573] I had to change my route home.

[574] I would call, see if my roommate had seen him drive by.

[575] I would go stay at my mom's on weekends.

[576] It was horrible.

[577] My life was completely consumed by him.

[578] And, I mean, in all honesty, it ended up costing me my roommate.

[579] We're still best friends, but we ended up not living together anymore because she was in fear for her child.

[580] And I feel really bad about that to this day, but I don't blame her for wanting to protect her child, absolutely.

[581] And I just, I felt like a horrible person.

[582] So I moved in with my parents and I didn't tell him, but I got a bouquet of flowers one day at my parents from him.

[583] And it just said, I love you, Hunter.

[584] And he did that, not to be sweet, he did that because he wanted to tell me he knew where I was at.

[585] How does living in fear like that affect you physically and your ability to go to work and function in everyday life when you're living in constant fear?

[586] Not only living in fear, but also the toxic things that he was saying, even if I would block, he would just create another number, 204 to be exact in the end he created.

[587] It tears your psyche down whenever someone does that to you.

[588] And then living in fear of that same person just wreaks havoc on your body.

[589] I ended up losing probably quarter of the hair on my head.

[590] All my hair started falling out.

[591] So I went a long time, not really doing much because I was afraid.

[592] I didn't want to go to my best friend's house because I was afraid he'd follow me and find out where she lived.

[593] It was rough.

[594] It was a really dark time.

[595] Thankfully, Maribel was able to find a new job, which brought some relief because Hunter did.

[596] didn't know about it.

[597] Her car had also broken down, so she had gotten a different car, which helped her feel a little bit safer.

[598] I mean, thank God for my mom and my best friend, because they are the two people that stood by me and loved me no matter what, and no matter how much I isolated myself away from them, they were always there.

[599] So between that and getting a new job really started to help.

[600] So I started to get him off my back a little bit.

[601] Then he started again.

[602] Oh God, this time he caught me in another vulnerable moment.

[603] I had stopped talking to him completely.

[604] He was still messaging me. I wasn't responding to his text messages.

[605] But I got put in the hospital with pneumonia and he found out about it.

[606] And he started texting me. He started texting my roommate and trying to act genuinely concerned.

[607] And I was in the hospital.

[608] I was horribly sick.

[609] And I responded to his text messages.

[610] We just talked on a friendly level.

[611] He sent flowers again.

[612] He just tried to be my friend.

[613] And I got out of the hospital and we saw each other one time I guess I just needed one last final confirmation that I was getting rid of him I stayed the night I didn't sleep at all that night because I was terrified and he had to leave early that morning too he went back on the road he told me I could stay there and get ready and go to work well I called in late so I could snoop because this was the first time he had ever left me alone around his stuff I needed to know who this guy was.

[614] I found a lot of gifts and packages and pictures and a sweet little memory relationship book from a woman that he had been with for two years and was still with her.

[615] After discovering this, Maribel decided to reach out to Hunter's other, other girlfriend.

[616] They are still dating at this point.

[617] She thinks they are full on in a relationship.

[618] I am the one that broke to her.

[619] His name is not Hunter.

[620] It's John Green.

[621] She had no idea.

[622] She had no idea about Evelyn, the kids.

[623] She thought that Christy and the little boy were dead still.

[624] I mean, she had still believed the whole story, and they were in a full -blown relationship.

[625] And I had to break it to her.

[626] That was hard.

[627] I turned her world upside down.

[628] she had kids that she involved with him and everything.

[629] Regretfully, Maribel went to Hunter's house one more time after this incident.

[630] He came back into town.

[631] I went back over there one more time to, he lured me back in with getting my mom's earrings.

[632] I had been looking for a pair of earrings, and he told me he found them and I went back over there and he expected me to, he literally thought in his mind that we were just on a break, that we would get back together and I would move in to his house.

[633] And I told him, no, that is not what is happening.

[634] We are done.

[635] And we got into an argument.

[636] And I looked at him and I said, we are not together.

[637] I don't have to do this anymore.

[638] Why am I doing this?

[639] I said, I'm leaving.

[640] I'm out.

[641] And as I was stepping out of his front door, he sucker punched me in the back of the head.

[642] He didn't make full contact, probably half contact, enough to jolt me forward.

[643] And I had a water bottle in my hand, and I turned and looked at him, and I said, really?

[644] And I chunked the water bottle at him and it hit his front door down at his shin level.

[645] But I knew as soon as I really said, that that was probably a bad idea, because at that point he took off after me. And I took off at my car, and I jumped in my car and he catches me at my car and he shuts my leg in the door and bruised the heck out of it.

[646] He's trying to reach in and grab my keys out of the ignition.

[647] I'm screaming at the top of my lungs for someone to help me. It's like 4 .30 in the afternoon.

[648] It's the daytime on a weekday.

[649] And he even had a neighbor outside and I'm still screaming because he's like trying to keep me from backing out.

[650] And he stands in the street and says, go ahead, scream.

[651] at the top of your lungs, go ahead and yell for the cops, antagonizing me to call the cops.

[652] That's the last time physically I saw him.

[653] But he continued to still try to follow me. He would drive around my parents' neighborhood.

[654] I would see that.

[655] But I had the new job.

[656] I had the different car.

[657] I didn't live at my parents' house anymore.

[658] I had moved to another town.

[659] I had started to get rid of him.

[660] His only attachment to me was on the phone.

[661] So he tried for a while longer with text messages with trying to get to me. It took probably total of a year to finally get him to leave me alone.

[662] It took me changing my number finally to get him to stop.

[663] And to be perfectly honest with you, the story continues.

[664] Last week, he messaged me on Facebook from a fake profile.

[665] He is still doing the same thing.

[666] His most recent ex -girlfriend has reached out to me. He's currently doing the same thing to her.

[667] The stalking, the fake numbers, the fake text messages, the fake people, the same story, everything.

[668] He's still doing this.

[669] Thank you so much for sharing your story and making the time.

[670] And I know you're a mom now and you have a whole new life and you're trying to move forward.

[671] Unfortunately, this person's still trying to make a negative impact on your life.

[672] But how is the recovery and your moving forward process been?

[673] A lot of people ask me this question all the time.

[674] If you could go back to that dating site message and not reply, would you?

[675] And I answered, yes, I would still reply.

[676] As much as it does still continue to affect me. It still affects me on my everyday life, I still look for him because he is still around and he still mentions me, but it has made me become more vigilant about my surroundings.

[677] It has made me become a much stronger person.

[678] I no longer let men treat me the way I've let men treat me. He's a different level, but it taught me to stand up for myself and the importance of your friends and family.

[679] And if it for all this, I probably wouldn't have met my now boyfriend and we have a son together.

[680] We're going to be getting married in a few years, I hope, and I'm sure he'll probably hear this.

[681] It changed me who I was, but for the better.

[682] I would say that I am still partially in recovery.

[683] I've got PTSD from the things that he did and the experiences and the stalking.

[684] But I live my life completely different.

[685] day.

[686] I live it as if I'm not going to get another chance to because he could have taken that away.

[687] There's so many men like him that domestic violence ends so badly and my story didn't end badly and so many others end badly.

[688] And I'm just thankful for that.

[689] I'm thankful that I'm able to share this story and maybe help another woman out or help one of his victims out.

[690] He is a dating website predator, and there are men like him everywhere out there.

[691] And if I can help one person with my story, then every bit of it was worth going through.

[692] Thank you so much.

[693] Sorry, got emotional on that one.

[694] I know that probably sounded cheesy or anything, but that is just the truth.

[695] I'm very passionate about this.

[696] You have been since the first time we spoke, and I know it's hard.

[697] And I really appreciate all of the emotional energy and time you've given to share this story, because I truly believe sharing stories like this saves lives.

[698] 100%.

[699] And you have no idea how thankful I am that you selected my story because, I mean, I literally, I sent that on a whim.

[700] My best friend, the same one I've been talking about, she sent me the first season.

[701] And she said, oh my God, you got to listen to this podcast.

[702] This sounds just like you and Hunter.

[703] And you have to listen to it.

[704] And I listened to it and I was like, OMG, this, I feel for Sarah, I feel for this girl.

[705] I get it.

[706] I get it.

[707] At the end of the podcast, it tells you you can submit the story.

[708] So I go to the website and I'm like, why not?

[709] And then I got your email and I was like, the timing of your email is so weird too because he had just crept back in with sending that inappropriate picture of me to his now recent ex.

[710] and that gave me the first courage to finally file a police report on him.

[711] This whole time that he did all this, I never filed a police report because I was terrified of him.

[712] And I was just, how can I stop this guy?

[713] How can I help?

[714] How can someone stop him?

[715] Because men like him don't get arrested.

[716] You don't get arrested for cheating.

[717] You don't get arrested for lying.

[718] Our country doesn't take domestic violence serious enough.

[719] So how can I help get this guy out there somehow or help someone in a similar situation?

[720] And you chose my story and picked me and I was like, okay, well, this was meant to be.

[721] I so appreciate you.

[722] I've been getting so many stories of women like yourself being victimized by predators on dating apps.

[723] And the pandemic has definitely only increased this because what I've learned from speaking to law enforcement as well is that when the shutdowns happened, predators were used to being able to go to bars.

[724] And women were staying home more.

[725] Absolutely.

[726] I just can't speak enough about how important it is for us all to just take those extra safety precautions when we can with online dating.

[727] But I also think at the end of the day, all the responsibility goes to.

[728] him because it's his behavior that caused it.

[729] But I wonder if there's an opportunity for these dating apps to start taking more responsibility for what they're allowing to happen.

[730] And it's something that I've been thinking about a lot this past year.

[731] If there's nothing legally we can do to protect ourselves or others, what else can we do to try and prevent these things from happening to the next person?

[732] Absolutely.

[733] Because with the internet, he can just go on there and tomorrow do it all again.

[734] Proof of it, he currently is.

[735] The current ex -girlfriend, he's riding around town with this new girl trying to make her jealous.

[736] He's already got another one and I can guarantee you I know where he met her on a dating site.

[737] If I can give any advice, if you're going to be on a dating website, research, research, research who that person is.

[738] And if things start to add up or if they don't have an internet trail, something's wrong.

[739] Because everybody should have some form of an internet footprint, especially if they're being honest about who they are.

[740] Liars and cheaters and predators like this don't have an internet footprint because they use fake numbers, fake emails, fake names.

[741] If the evidence doesn't line up, it's probably fake.

[742] Thank you again so much.

[743] Thank you.

[744] Absolutely Thank you.

[745] Something Was Wrong is an Audio Chuck production, created and hosted by Tiffany Reese.

[746] Our theme song was originally composed by Gladrags, covered this season by Basic Comfort.

[747] So what do you think, Chuck, do you approve?

[748] If you like Something Was Wrong, you can listen early and ad -free right now by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app.

[749] or on Apple Podcasts.

[750] Prime members can listen ad -free on Amazon Music.

[751] Before you go, tell us about yourself by filling out a short survey at Wondery .com slash survey.