Allyson Felix (Olympic track and field athlete)

[0] Welcome, welcome, welcome to armchair expert, experts on expert.

[1] I'm Daniel.

[2] Rather, I'm joined by the Duchess of Duluth.

[3] I'm here.

[4] Yeah, you're here.

[5] Hello.

[6] Present.

[7] If you know the minister and I, you know we love the Olympics.

[8] So much.

[9] I'm like craving the Olympics.

[10] Do do, do do do, do do do do.

[11] And the most decor.

[12] The decorated American track and field Olympian of all time is Allison Felix.

[13] And she has 31 global medals at the Olympics and World Championships and titles as both world record holder and a master's world record holder.

[14] My goodness, is she incredible.

[15] And she's so adorable and fun.

[16] She's sweet.

[17] She is very, very, very nice.

[18] And you get it when you meet her, like how she became this.

[19] And also, like, she's better than all of us.

[20] Just as a person and a runner.

[21] Yes, yes, yes.

[22] She has a lifestyle and footwear brand called Seish.

[23] And Seish not only aims to create an encouraging and supportive community for women, but it also designs and manufactures athletic -inspired footwear made for and by women.

[24] Yes, I love this.

[25] We talk about it a lot in the episode, and it's, we learn a lot about the description.

[26] and sees in footwear between men and women.

[27] And she's...

[28] And how the athletes are treated.

[29] And everything.

[30] Yes.

[31] So please enjoy Alison Felix.

[32] Wondry Plus subscribers can listen to armchair expert early and ad free right now.

[33] Join Wondry Plus in the Wondry app or on Apple Podcasts.

[34] Or you can listen for free wherever you get your podcasts.

[35] Let me fill you in.

[36] Do you want some hot gossip?

[37] Yeah, it's goss.

[38] This is total gossip.

[39] Okay, so she's owned the house across the street for how long?

[40] I closed in January 2020, three and a half years.

[41] Okay.

[42] She needed one of the neighbors to sign off on a thing.

[43] He would not sign.

[44] So for eight months held her up, full bully style.

[45] Oh, my goodness.

[46] And I have a right to it.

[47] It wasn't a favor.

[48] Yeah, exactly.

[49] He was so insolent that they had to go around him at the city.

[50] And then finally it was like, yeah, He's nuts.

[51] Go ahead.

[52] So now it's started.

[53] And he's currently outside screaming at them.

[54] So this is going to be like a whole thing.

[55] Yes.

[56] And I just got off the phone with my contractor who's had to deal with him every day.

[57] And he's like, he's telling us we can only come up and down the driveway so many times.

[58] And nope, that's not the law.

[59] And he wants it pressure walk.

[60] The driveway.

[61] It sounds like he has a lot of time.

[62] He has a lot of time.

[63] It's a good first thought.

[64] And I, yeah, I had just got.

[65] off the phone.

[66] And so I was already steaming on this walk.

[67] I walked here today for my apartment, which I have to live in, because I can't live in the house.

[68] And he's standing out there.

[69] And I just what's the problem?

[70] Oh, that was your delivery?

[71] Yeah, I'm like done now.

[72] I've been so nice.

[73] And he said, we're just chatting.

[74] He said, okay, you're just standing here.

[75] And he said, yeah, he's out here, like your construction worker or something.

[76] And we're all just talking.

[77] And he said, is there a problem.

[78] I said, I'm asking you, is there a problem?

[79] Oh, wow.

[80] This got hot.

[81] Eleanor, just in time.

[82] Are you so excited to be?

[83] I should have pulled up a little earlier.

[84] I know.

[85] You just been brewing for three and a half years.

[86] You're here on the day.

[87] And he was like, no. Looks like this is going to be done in the next day.

[88] Like, you shouldn't know about my house.

[89] You shouldn't be telling me stuff about my own house.

[90] Anyway.

[91] Well, here we are.

[92] This is kind of in keeping with the theme of what this conversation will be about.

[93] Ultimately, like that.

[94] Right, it reeks of that, of course.

[95] Yeah.

[96] Yeah.

[97] Bullies, really.

[98] Welcome to the show.

[99] I got to say, to bring you up to speed, Monica and I are Olympic Addis.

[100] Yeah.

[101] Oh, really?

[102] It's very exciting for us.

[103] We're so interested in the Olympics.

[104] It's almost comical.

[105] I'm going to spare you one of my niche interests in it.

[106] Let's just table back.

[107] Maybe to the end, if you really trust me at the end, I'll share with you one of my proclivities in watching.

[108] But I've watched you run every single time you've Oh, my goodness.

[109] And I have had so many thoughts about you over the years.

[110] I just think, this woman is so smiley.

[111] There's something so genuine and pure radiating from this human.

[112] I also would say you're kind of an iconoclass for me. You kind of shattered what my image of someone who's dominant would be.

[113] In many ways, this is your history even in high school.

[114] Chicken legs.

[115] Oh, gosh.

[116] Right?

[117] I share that with you.

[118] Yes, same.

[119] I feel like I can say that to you.

[120] Yeah, it just stuck and hasn't gone away.

[121] It still hasn't gone away.

[122] But I got to say, I'm just pretty overwhelmed how many times I've watched you run and smile and give interviews and everything.

[123] And you're sitting here and it's very exciting.

[124] I'm so surprised that you've ever even seen me run.

[125] Oh, my God.

[126] I really think maybe every time since, I don't know.

[127] Probably not every single time in her whole life.

[128] Well, I see Olympics.

[129] I mean, not that much.

[130] Let's start with something that is a great fascination of mine.

[131] I think I watch sprinting the most because I'm so fascinated how each event gives you a very specific build.

[132] Yeah, and I have the complete opposite build of what you would think.

[133] So that was always intimidating for me when I first got on the scene.

[134] I was a teenager and skinny, the chicken legs, whole thing.

[135] You didn't start until ninth grade, right?

[136] You started track in ninth grade.

[137] That feels late.

[138] It was late.

[139] Just very different for most Olympians.

[140] I went out for the track team because I didn't have friends.

[141] I was at a new school.

[142] My family's like, oh, you should try running.

[143] You'll meet people.

[144] Brother was a little ahead of you, and he already was a runner, yeah.

[145] Yeah, so he's two and a half years older than me, but he was going to a different high school.

[146] Okay.

[147] So he was running over there.

[148] So I knew he was good and everything.

[149] And I was like, okay, try it out.

[150] Ten weeks later, you're finishing seventh in a state championship?

[151] Yeah, it happened fast.

[152] Wow.

[153] That's preposterous.

[154] What if I started racing motorcycles and then 10 weeks from now, I finished seventh in a MotoGP race?

[155] That would not.

[156] Spectacular.

[157] Yes, it's the same thing.

[158] It's not real.

[159] But were you surprised with yourself?

[160] I knew that I was athletic.

[161] So even though I wasn't doing anything in organized fashion, I was always faster than the boys.

[162] Okay.

[163] You know, and P .E. and stuff like that.

[164] Right.

[165] So when I came out, I was like, oh, I like this.

[166] And then, yeah, I didn't expect it would go that quickly.

[167] Yeah.

[168] But I was like, oh, this is my thing.

[169] Yeah.

[170] I'm so jealous.

[171] Monica's two -time state champion cheerleader.

[172] High Flyer.

[173] Oh.

[174] So don't even try to act like you don't know about this athletic game.

[175] But this is why I'm jealous because I've decided this.

[176] I'm not naturally talented at anything, okay?

[177] All right.

[178] I'm not.

[179] I work hard and then I become good at things.

[180] Oh, but hold on now.

[181] But I don't have any natural abilities.

[182] We took a 23 and me. She has elite muscle mass. I don't.

[183] So first of all, fuck you.

[184] Well, let's start with a big, fuck you.

[185] It hasn't translated into any metals.

[186] And there's this.

[187] Yeah.

[188] That's true.

[189] But I worked hard at that.

[190] Okay.

[191] I'm going to try to contrast these two spots on the continuum, which is you're saying, which is a very common story in sports.

[192] I just worked hard.

[193] I had no talent.

[194] It's a much more glorious story.

[195] I don't even know.

[196] But it is, right?

[197] We would acknowledge that.

[198] Sure.

[199] And then on the other end of the spectrum is you.

[200] and it annoys me just as much, which is God gave you this talent to run.

[201] That's your take on it.

[202] God gave me dyslexia.

[203] Why did he like you so much more than me?

[204] Right.

[205] Well, she's nice.

[206] Well, she does deserve it.

[207] It definitely felt like a gift, though.

[208] It all happened very quickly.

[209] But don't you think both ends of that argument are pretty extreme?

[210] Either I have no talent and I'm such a hard worker, I've put myself here, or God just gifted me with this and I woke up on the podium.

[211] Total combination, because then when I look at myself and I look at other athletes, I'm like, There's a lot of things that I feel like I had to make up for.

[212] Yeah.

[213] Your build helps your argument quite a bit.

[214] As someone who just admitted, I have studied the physiques of all these sprinters.

[215] Back to my original thought.

[216] I look at all these events.

[217] The swimmers, it's so specific.

[218] They just become V's.

[219] Their shoulders, I don't know how their bone structure changes.

[220] They get super wide shoulder.

[221] Crazy wingspan.

[222] Really narrow little hippies.

[223] I worry about Michael Phelps having a baby.

[224] I don't think it'll be for him.

[225] And then you look at the shot putters.

[226] They have a very specific build.

[227] And the sprinters to me, my own assistant.

[228] I'm like, oh, fuck, if I could look like any one of those dudes, I would be stoked.

[229] And my curiosity is, I've been wanting to ask this for 25 years in your here.

[230] No one's lifting weights upstairs, right?

[231] No one's doing upper body weight training, are they?

[232] Oh, yeah.

[233] Oh, they are.

[234] Talk to me about that.

[235] They're doing full body.

[236] You know, everybody has their own philosophy, but for sure, because your arms are such a part of it.

[237] Pumping and offsetting your legs.

[238] Yeah, I never think of that as even a remote factor.

[239] Yeah, that like dictates how fast your legs go.

[240] There's a lot of upper body stuff happening.

[241] But my assumption, and now I find out I'm wrong, was just the act of running is an upper body workout, that just the active running actually will develop your upper body.

[242] Sprinting specifically, that's like a total workout, even if you didn't do the weights.

[243] I think most people, they don't even know how to really run fast, like take their body there.

[244] But when you do, you're right.

[245] It's the dream body for me. Everyone's got their own aesthetic.

[246] Yeah.

[247] And I imagine, too, back in the same.

[248] 70s, 80s.

[249] They still had that body.

[250] They probably weren't weight training upstairs.

[251] A lot of push -ups.

[252] Maybe some crunches.

[253] Some body weight things happening.

[254] Pull -ups, maybe.

[255] Yeah.

[256] All old -fashioned.

[257] And now I have to know, what are people doing when they think they're running fast versus actually running fast?

[258] I think they're trying, you know?

[259] Yeah, everyone's doing their best.

[260] But what are they doing wrong?

[261] Yeah, usually it's like a technique thing.

[262] You got to clean it up.

[263] You got to get the arms right.

[264] You got to get your legs going right.

[265] I always thought it was just a natural thing.

[266] You just kind of run.

[267] But then I learned it's not.

[268] You've got to get some instruction.

[269] And once you get that down, I think it's easier to push yourself further.

[270] It's probably as complex as a golf swing.

[271] Yeah.

[272] Oh, yeah.

[273] Once you get into the technique, it's complete biomechanics.

[274] You're breaking everything down because you're talking about like hundreds of a second, you know?

[275] So one little change is a big deal.

[276] Oh, as we get into your multiple Olympic rivalry with Campbell, I think that notion of 0 .02 and 0 .3.

[277] What a maddening, but let's earmark that.

[278] I'm super into Formula One racing.

[279] It's a thousandth of a second.

[280] Between glory and no one knows your name.

[281] A thousand.

[282] You can't even start and stop a stop watch.

[283] For them, there's going to be another race.

[284] That's like four years before anybody cares, you know?

[285] 21 seconds, you mess up.

[286] Wait four years.

[287] Try it another 21 seconds in four years.

[288] Oh, it's so crazy.

[289] Okay, so you're from Los Angeles.

[290] Born and raised.

[291] And you come from what would seem like on the outside of very idyllic household, which is mom is an elementary school teacher.

[292] Dad is a, we have this in common, your father and I ordained minister, mine over the website.

[293] His is probably legit.

[294] And then he taught New Testament.

[295] He was a professor.

[296] Yeah, he taught Greek.

[297] So religious household, married household, both parents' working household, aspirational mother.

[298] Yeah.

[299] This is as good as we can get.

[300] I mean, as far as, like, quote, good family, right?

[301] I mean, it was pretty amazing.

[302] Definitely solid foundation.

[303] It set me up, for sure.

[304] You said it a second ago off mic, but you were cringe on Washington, is that we said?

[305] Yeah.

[306] Okay.

[307] First of all, have you been down there recently?

[308] I actually was just there a couple of weeks ago.

[309] One of my childhood friends was getting married, and she got married in the backyard of her parents' house.

[310] It was beautiful.

[311] But changed so much since you've lived there, yeah?

[312] So I lived in Lafayette Square, which is like this historic black neighborhood.

[313] In the square, it looks the same.

[314] The neighbors are a little different.

[315] But the outside of it, you come out and you come out on Crenshaw and like you're in the neighborhood.

[316] So it's not too different.

[317] Okay.

[318] I cruise down there.

[319] I'm into cars.

[320] Okay.

[321] That's where the cars are at.

[322] Now, you also grew up in the era of Boys in the Hood.

[323] What's it like to be in this like pocket of a very safe and functional nuclear family?

[324] But then the media you're watching is portraying where you live in a very interesting way.

[325] And then clearly you're probably seeing great opposition to how you're being raised.

[326] What was that like?

[327] I think I didn't even.

[328] even know that there was anything strange about it.

[329] There is this house, like two houses down.

[330] They had this lion in front of it.

[331] And we were only allowed to ride our bike to that lion.

[332] And like, when I go back, I'm like, that was barely anything.

[333] You can't even get a good ride going.

[334] But as a kid, I didn't know what that was about.

[335] And so I felt very safe in my family.

[336] And then the things like the riots would happen.

[337] And I would see smoke.

[338] And we'd have these conversations.

[339] But I felt kind of in the bubble of it.

[340] So I think looking back, I see it was really dangerous.

[341] But when I was in it, it was just normal.

[342] So I'm opposite.

[343] I'm like single mom, lots of stepdad's moving all around.

[344] But mom's pointing out to us all the time.

[345] Like, see that?

[346] They didn't do blank.

[347] See these people?

[348] They went to college.

[349] Always trying to show us, if you want to live here, this is the route to get there.

[350] If you want to live here, this is the route to get there.

[351] Was that happening a lot?

[352] For sure.

[353] Even more from like a religious standpoint, because my dad was a pastor.

[354] And so things were very strict.

[355] This is the path that you want to be on.

[356] And being a pastor's kid.

[357] It's just hard.

[358] It's got to suck in elementary school in junior high.

[359] It's like people are waiting for you to mess up.

[360] Are they really what they say they are type of thing?

[361] I have that.

[362] I got to tell you, full honesty, because we were so not the right thing.

[363] You weren't supposed to be divorced in the 70s.

[364] Our neighbors were, I felt like at least very critical of my mother raising us.

[365] They all seem to have in common.

[366] They all went to the same church.

[367] I of course filed that as, oh, these are the goody people who are judgmental of us, shitty people.

[368] So I have a chip on my shoulder about that.

[369] And I imagine you had to have felt that from a lot of kids that were living in probably the opposite situation you were.

[370] I think I felt more so just the pressure.

[371] I want to be able to live up to this.

[372] But then we're all people and everybody has their stuff.

[373] And I think as I got older, I realized that.

[374] But when I was younger, it was just really hard to like fit that mold.

[375] Of perfection.

[376] Yeah.

[377] Because it's not going to happen.

[378] Well, and that's the other thing is when I look at a story like that there's part of me. And again, I know I'm a cynic, but a little bit of me is like, it's all too good to be true.

[379] People are really.

[380] fucking flawed and messy.

[381] People really screw up all the time and it's super normal and natural.

[382] It must just be hidden in those situations.

[383] Yes, I think it's just not talked about as freely.

[384] I mean, who has the perfect life, you know?

[385] Yeah, I've yet to meet the person.

[386] Yes.

[387] Growing up in church, there's all the issues.

[388] I think I held on to that even into my career of feeling like fitting in this perfect mold and it wasn't until later I was able to kind of break out of that but childhood was definitely a lot of that.

[389] At one point I just realized it's impossible.

[390] I'm striving for something that is unattainable.

[391] I think once I got to that realization, it was like, okay, I can mess up.

[392] That's all right.

[393] It's just like this freeing experience of this weight off of your shoulders.

[394] What age would you say that transition?

[395] I think it was more like high school.

[396] Did boys have anything to do with that?

[397] Because that'll put you to the test pretty early.

[398] That will.

[399] It wears a lot of activity in high school to really test those limits, I think, and my family was very strict.

[400] Would you have been able to go on dates?

[401] No. Did you resent them for that?

[402] It was just like it was what it was.

[403] You didn't push back.

[404] on it.

[405] No, that wasn't the sticking point.

[406] I think it was going to college.

[407] I can't live up to my parents' expectations and the expectations of, like, people in the church.

[408] I just have to be me. You have to figure out what you value and stay true to that, but you have to now go to the drawing board and decide what you value.

[409] Yeah, a lot of deconstruction.

[410] And probably having not been, no insult to them, but just not encouraged either to explore your own morality and platform as a person.

[411] Hey, don't have to think about anything.

[412] It's in this book.

[413] We'll tell you exactly how to do Absolutely.

[414] So definitely had to find my own way.

[415] Yeah.

[416] So you were an enormously successful high school athlete.

[417] You won high school athlete of the year in your senior year.

[418] Yeah, high school was good.

[419] High school was good.

[420] And you then chose to go to USC, though, as a professional, you made yourself ineligible for college athletics by signing a deal with Adidas.

[421] Yes.

[422] And then they paid your tuition.

[423] So they kind of gave you the full right.

[424] Was that decision hard?

[425] what led up to that decision?

[426] What were your parents advising?

[427] What were your parents advising?

[428] What were you wanting?

[429] So because I started running late, we weren't a family that knew about the sport.

[430] So it was never on the radar like, oh, this is our grand plan.

[431] In the States, I think I was the first person to do that.

[432] So there wasn't like a blueprint also to follow.

[433] So it was a very criticized decision.

[434] And we just took it as a family.

[435] And I think a lot of people thought, oh, this is like a financial choice.

[436] But for me, it was more timing.

[437] My senior year had just finished.

[438] And the Olympics were the next year.

[439] So this is 2003.

[440] The Olympics were in 2004.

[441] And my brother was already at USC.

[442] So he's competing there.

[443] And so I have a year where I can just watch what he's doing.

[444] And as a collegiate athlete, like, you have to score points.

[445] That's the most important thing.

[446] So NCAA is like, that's what it's all about.

[447] So the decision really came down to, was I going to be able to do the NCAA system, do all the meets, everything that you had to do and still have enough left to make the Olympic team?

[448] It's probably going to make more sense just to focus on the Olympics.

[449] That's the big thing and try to make the team.

[450] And so that's the route that I went.

[451] When did you first say to yourself, I think I want to go to the Olympics or I'm going to go?

[452] When did you express that as a goal?

[453] Because if you started at ninth grade, like that's so fast.

[454] What a hack.

[455] Like everyone else had already suffered for a song.

[456] I know.

[457] And they've been dreaming about it in their bedrooms for so long.

[458] Which is really weird.

[459] That wasn't my dream.

[460] Right.

[461] I haven't wanted to be a gold medalist since five.

[462] I wanted to be a teacher.

[463] That's very sweet because a mom.

[464] Yeah, and I studied that at USC.

[465] But it was like my junior year.

[466] And it wasn't even so much that I really want to go to the Olympics, but then it started to be, this is like an opportunity to live a different life.

[467] Yeah.

[468] So what's your hot take on why it was so controversial what you did?

[469] Because I think a lot of this is deeply layered in some racism.

[470] Interesting.

[471] Yeah, I think there's this NCAA kind of hoity bullshit, not living in reality.

[472] I'll give you for me the most infuriating example, being.

[473] taking away the Heisman trophy from Reggie.

[474] To me, I was like, oh, what a great place for you to judge from where you don't have to decide if your mom's going to get shot or you can give her a house.

[475] That's not a decision your kids had to make, but you're in full judgment of this kid who that was what was on his plate.

[476] That, to me, is infuriating and fuck all those people.

[477] And I think it's deeply racist, I do.

[478] Yeah.

[479] I think the NIL now, it's just like so long overdue, all of that, just how much money is made in the collegiate system.

[480] There's a little bit of a plantation mentality, too, which is like, it's no secret.

[481] This is generating billions and billions of dollars, but they shouldn't have it.

[482] They should be so grateful they got an education.

[483] Everybody's getting paid, except the athletes.

[484] Yes, there's this foundational thing where it's like, you should be so lucky and you should be grateful to make me a billion dollars.

[485] That's at the end of the day what it was.

[486] It's pretty disgusting.

[487] Do you think that had that sheen at all?

[488] You know, she's not prioritizing the right things.

[489] You know what?

[490] I never really thought about it in that way.

[491] I really thought of it as the purest of track and field.

[492] It just hadn't been done before, so it was like, you have to follow the system.

[493] Who are you to mess with this?

[494] And I remember, like, my brother's at USC, and they have the dual meet with UCLA every year.

[495] It's like the big meet.

[496] So I'm watching on TV, and I'm just a fan watching my brother.

[497] And all of a sudden, the commentator starts talking about my decision.

[498] I think one of my events came up.

[499] And they're talking about, like, the potential of the athletes, you know, who are running collegiately in this meet to go on to the Olympics.

[500] and who are going to make the team.

[501] But they're like, she's made the worst decision in track and field history.

[502] She's not going to make the team.

[503] And she should have been in college.

[504] And you should prioritize the glory of your college over yourself.

[505] All of that.

[506] But I did it.

[507] But even, yeah, the term purists, like, if you really chase that down, what does all that mean?

[508] It ends up always meaning the white way.

[509] People shouldn't celebrate after big plays.

[510] Basketball players should not go between their legs.

[511] You know, you just go through the list of all the things that were chipping away at the integrity of the game.

[512] And it really was just however white folks did it, that was the way that was full of integrity and any other way was the wrong way.

[513] Okay.

[514] So now chicken legs is going to the Olympics.

[515] Wow.

[516] That should be a children's book.

[517] You write.

[518] Yeah.

[519] Right that children's book.

[520] Chicken legs goes to Athens in 2004.

[521] Just before that though, or is it right after that, that you had to switch coaches?

[522] So I switched coaches when I went pro.

[523] I had my high school coach She was amazing John Patton.

[524] And then I went and switched to Pat.

[525] And so she was my first professional coach.

[526] And she was old school.

[527] She coached Evelyn Ashford.

[528] Just so many things that I thought were normal.

[529] And I learned later, no, all coaches aren't doing this.

[530] What are some fun things?

[531] Did she have a bizarre take on diet or anything?

[532] Yes, she did.

[533] In Athens, I had to drink raw eggs.

[534] I knew it.

[535] Really?

[536] And I don't even eat eggs.

[537] It was very, very traumatic.

[538] But I remember, like, she came over my apartment.

[539] took all of my heels.

[540] At one point we went to the Olympic Training Center and she took my car keys so I couldn't leave.

[541] And I think at this point I didn't realize I'm an adult.

[542] Yes, yes, yes.

[543] I was just like, I got to do what she says.

[544] And so it was an interesting year.

[545] You got Silver and the 200 at Athens.

[546] And then you switched to Bob.

[547] To Bobby Cursey.

[548] It said in Wikipedia, controversial coach.

[549] And then I read about him when I didn't see that.

[550] I know, she sounds controversial.

[551] Well, I thought Pat was crazy.

[552] Bobby took it to another level.

[553] Oh, okay.

[554] And he was the coach at UCLA as well?

[555] He did coach at UCLA for a time.

[556] I mean, I feel like he was crazy just because the things that he asked us to do.

[557] I think every great coach has a little bit of madness to them.

[558] He, like, would never tell us what the workout was going to be.

[559] It was like, get on the line, I'll tell you the distance, walk recovery, I'll tell you what's next.

[560] And it was all these mind games.

[561] Training you to follow his direction and not think.

[562] Yeah.

[563] Some days we didn't even know what time we were going to train.

[564] It was just like, your day is mine.

[565] Oh, wow.

[566] You would have hated that, Dax.

[567] I couldn't have done well in any of these things.

[568] You have to call so many rules.

[569] A lot of rules.

[570] You can't cheat.

[571] You can't juice.

[572] I don't want anything to do anything you can't juice in.

[573] A lot of people wear.

[574] Yeah, I was going to say, I mean, you can't.

[575] Well, that's a good timing for that question.

[576] So when does it start occurring to you that some people are using performance -enhancing drugs?

[577] And like, what are the signs that you see?

[578] Is it rumored?

[579] When does it come online for you?

[580] That first year that I went pro.

[581] So that was the year, if you remember, in 2003, of Balco.

[582] The doctor in the Bay Area?

[583] For me, Marion Jones was like everything.

[584] I loved her so much.

[585] I'm so in love with her.

[586] The Sydney Olympics, it was incredible.

[587] So when she went down, this is my idol.

[588] It was heartbreaking.

[589] Yes.

[590] I feel terrible for her.

[591] Yeah, that was a tough one.

[592] So that was my introduction of like, oh, this is not really what I thought it was going to be.

[593] Meaning more people are using this stuff than I would have guessed.

[594] I didn't even think it was a thing.

[595] I came into the sport late.

[596] I'm a high schooler.

[597] I was just totally naive to it.

[598] You're also pretty sheltered, it sounds like.

[599] For sure.

[600] Yeah.

[601] So then when I start to see this ripple effect, all of these people start getting taken out.

[602] Had it been suggested to you at any point?

[603] No. My dad is pretty intimidating.

[604] They didn't want to deal with the fall out of.

[605] It was just too much.

[606] You telling their dad that they.

[607] And you didn't ever in your head think, should I try that?

[608] No, just my upbringing.

[609] And also, I'm so competitive.

[610] Then you don't even know, like, did you really?

[611] Yeah.

[612] Not to excuse anyone else.

[613] behavior, but you also had the privilege of being great.

[614] You were finishing one, two, one, two, one, two, two.

[615] It's not like you were staring at some chasm between you and where you wanted to be, that you were starting to wonder, can I ever genetically do that?

[616] I mean, I'm successful, but I don't feel like I dominated to the purest.

[617] I don't have a world record in my event.

[618] There's a lot of room where I could have improved.

[619] Okay.

[620] I feel like, so.

[621] That's a crazy assessment of your career, but I'm going to let you have it.

[622] Yeah, we're like, what?

[623] You're the winning.

[624] This track and field Olympian of all time.

[625] But yeah, you probably should have done better.

[626] Go ask track people and they'll be like, yeah, but she did really well in the relays.

[627] God, track people sound rough.

[628] You did more than really well in the relays.

[629] You set some records for splits.

[630] Yeah, but that's not good enough.

[631] Honestly, it sounds like you found your perfect sport because if you grew up in a very rule -followy household with high expectations, you then went to a sport that obviously is that.

[632] Yeah.

[633] Apex.

[634] Total.

[635] Dedication.

[636] surrender to the process.

[637] I was prepared for it.

[638] You can't reach perfection.

[639] Even right now in your mind, you think that you didn't have a perfect career as a runner.

[640] And if you didn't, everyone else is fucked.

[641] A lot of therapies needed with this whole thing.

[642] Yeah.

[643] But the drugs thing, I think that was really hard for me in my career just because there were definitely a lot of athletes who went that route.

[644] And as an athlete who isn't going to do that, it's so frustrating.

[645] You're giving everything you have.

[646] You're coming to the line and you're like, this is not.

[647] not even a level playing field.

[648] Yeah, that would be really maddening.

[649] I would not do well with that.

[650] Yeah.

[651] I would have told myself everyone else is, and it now is fair if I do it as well, because now we're all juiced up.

[652] Let's go.

[653] Yeah, people were testing positive, but it would be like after and they still get their metal.

[654] Like, it's just a whole thing.

[655] So, yeah.

[656] The other thing that would have created in me is this like enormous suspicion of anyone who's doing well I might write off is that's the explanation.

[657] Do you think that was happening at all?

[658] I think that's a hard part of track and fill too because the history of it so steeped in drug use.

[659] Time and time again, I feel like it's happened on the biggest stage.

[660] So everybody is suspicious, like you said, of anybody who does well.

[661] Now, would you ever be looking at people's faces trying to find clues?

[662] I would only know from, like, bodybuilding world.

[663] People who have used human growth hormone for decades, you know, their foreheads are really pronounced, like their jaws get too big.

[664] All these things that normally stop growing continue to grow.

[665] There's like some pretty signature signals.

[666] It's the same.

[667] What kind of things we're looking for?

[668] Big bulge in the single.

[669] on the woman.

[670] Progression is a big thing in track.

[671] So if all of a sudden there's like a huge drop in time, it has to kind of make sense and when things don't.

[672] That's a great one to point out.

[673] Do you know this guy Lane Norton by chance?

[674] He's a nutritional scientist.

[675] He's also a world record power lifter.

[676] Oh, okay.

[677] And natural his whole life.

[678] That's his point.

[679] He's like, you can look at my weight lifts since I was 18 until now.

[680] You'll see like the most predictable gains.

[681] It's when you see these big leaps.

[682] The biggest indicator when something just doesn't make sense.

[683] How can I all of a set and have a second drop?

[684] You go from a 51 to a 49 -8 or something.

[685] And then there's all the physical things like you're saying.

[686] You don't just start lifting weights and like your neck is getting bigger.

[687] Yeah, the next would give away.

[688] Was it ever tempting for you when you felt pretty surely that one of your competitors was juicing and you would come in second and then you'd be in an interview?

[689] Was it ever tempting to just imply?

[690] No. Just back to that perfection, I think for the majority of my career, I was like, I'm not messing up.

[691] Starring up trouble or anything.

[692] But would it personally aggravate you?

[693] If you had lost to someone, a competitor that you were pretty convinced was, would it just drive you nuts?

[694] Years of frustration of like, do I really want to keep doing this?

[695] Yeah.

[696] I feel like I'm taking crazy pills at a certain point because it's like, I'm doing everything, but I'm not reaching where I want to go.

[697] And can I?

[698] Is it possible?

[699] Can I do it naturally?

[700] Yeah.

[701] And you did.

[702] It's kind of shocking.

[703] I would have loved to see you juiced up.

[704] I bet you could have ran a 47 -8.

[705] Oh, my gosh.

[706] Okay, so 2004 Athens.

[707] We get a silver in the 200.

[708] We switch coaches.

[709] We're with Bob.

[710] And then you start kind of collecting world championships.

[711] Is it frustrating to you that we care so little about those compared to the Olympics?

[712] Or you, too, have that same weighted priority?

[713] I have that same weighted priority, but just because the world cares about the Olympics.

[714] So so much of my career.

[715] It's tied to that.

[716] Your sponsors, your income, so you have to subscribe to that as well.

[717] I was curious for these, like, world challenges.

[718] Championship.

[719] Champions of Jesus, kids.

[720] Do you get paid to go to those?

[721] So you get prize money.

[722] What kind of prize money existed back then?

[723] So it's the same prize money that's been there, I think, for the last 50 years or something.

[724] Yeah, $60 ,000 if you win.

[725] But do you have bonuses built in your endorsement deals?

[726] Yeah, you do.

[727] I mean, you're not talking about a ton of money, but then all.

[728] Also, that's the one championship of the year, you know?

[729] No, I know.

[730] That's your big poker tournament.

[731] I hope you plays.

[732] There's no way to make money unless you have endorsements or these things.

[733] So the majority of your money is coming from your sponsor.

[734] So that's your Nike, your Adidas, the big players.

[735] And those are like five, six year deals.

[736] And then you will get an appearance fee to go to a track meet.

[737] And then you'll get prize money.

[738] And that's a basic structure.

[739] And then outside of your shoe sponsor, you can have whatever other sponsors.

[740] But track, there's like a huge displeasure.

[741] So the very top can make good money, but then below that, it's a struggle.

[742] A lot of people have jobs.

[743] It's a hobby, fourth place till 30th place.

[744] And that's the hard part.

[745] I think the sport hasn't really defined what is professional because I think a lot of people are saying that they're professional, they're Olympic hopefuls, and they're not really making money.

[746] How much of it was yours and how much of it came from Bob to manage the mental aspect, knowing that, as you just said, you're going to do this thing once every four years.

[747] That's the time the starter pistol goes.

[748] I imagine so much of your overall time is impacted by your reaction time, which is ultimately mental you sitting in the block.

[749] So like what kind of techniques or strategies did you use to stay chill?

[750] Yeah.

[751] I mean, he had a lot of different things.

[752] I think most of it was just the mind games.

[753] But I think more than anything was just get on the line, set your blocks.

[754] And then you'd be like, move your blocks to a different lane.

[755] When does that happen?

[756] When am I at the Olympics?

[757] And they're like, actually, go to.

[758] you know, but it's like ready for anything.

[759] But I think you do it so much that eventually it becomes habit and you have to realize nothing is different except the environment.

[760] And for me, it took a while to get that and understand that.

[761] Like I had the silver medals until it clicked.

[762] And it's like, okay, now I'm able to dial in and really execute and not be phased by what this moment means, what it can mean, and just what's happening around me. Stay tuned for more armchair expert.

[763] if you dare What's up guys This your girl Kiki And my podcast is back with a new season And let me tell you It's too good And I'm diving into the brains of entertainment's best and brightest Okay, every episode I bring on a friend And I don't mean just friends I mean the likes of Amy Polar Kel Mitchell, Vivica Fox The list goes on So follow, watch and listen to Baby, this is Kiki Palmer on the Wondery app Or wherever you get your podcast We've all been there.

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[774] Did you have like a mantra or anything?

[775] Or was there anything like the five minutes leading up to you walking over to get in the blocks that you were doing?

[776] I had to occupy my mind with technical thoughts.

[777] So the moment I don't have anything in my head, that's bad.

[778] I have to be thinking like, okay, what am I doing the first step out of the blocks?

[779] What am I doing at 10 meters?

[780] Giving my mind something to do so I'm not just like, oh, there's a lot of people here.

[781] Letting him.

[782] Like, oh shit, who's that dude?

[783] I don't want him to see me get anything but first.

[784] Exactly.

[785] Where were you at dating at this point?

[786] I'm wondering how one juggles all these things.

[787] Yeah.

[788] I met my now husband, but my boyfriend.

[789] We were on like a world junior team together when we were team.

[790] He's a hurdler?

[791] Yes.

[792] So we met, I was like a junior in high school.

[793] And then it was just off and on.

[794] So at this point, we're leading into my second Olympics.

[795] I think we're on.

[796] You're on.

[797] We're on.

[798] Okay, that brings me to one of my most salacious questions, which is we hear these really juicy rumors about the Olympic Village.

[799] The Olympic Village, yeah.

[800] And we've even talked to some other Olympians, and that's where I would have blown my whole preparation.

[801] I would have been so distracted by all these different people from all around the world.

[802] Everyone's so beautiful and in shape.

[803] I mean, I can't imagine not being distracted by that.

[804] It was so funny.

[805] Did you ever get to have any fun in the Olympic Village?

[806] It was very business for me. You know, I had heard the stories.

[807] And I saw, like, the bowls of condoms.

[808] Like, I saw that stuff.

[809] Evidence of fornication.

[810] That wasn't the life I was living.

[811] Yeah.

[812] No one was catching your eye, like, when you're in the little cafeteria, and you guys all eat in, you're not like, oh.

[813] You know, when the basketball team came through.

[814] Oh, sure.

[815] That was, like, very exciting.

[816] Yes.

[817] That's got to be fun.

[818] And they've got to be trying to get a little business.

[819] with you.

[820] I mean, they weren't, but I'm sure that I think maybe you missed it.

[821] I got a hunch you might have missed it.

[822] Like, Monica misses it.

[823] Like, Monica and I walk away from a dude all the time and I'm like, you realize that guy was like coming at you hardcore.

[824] No, he wasn't.

[825] Yes.

[826] Maybe I missed it.

[827] I think you missed it.

[828] There's no way that the basketball players weren't trying to get a little.

[829] Yeah, because the basketball players are doing something so different than everyone else there.

[830] They're rock stars.

[831] They've been watching you just like I have.

[832] The Olympics isn't their big thing.

[833] Not at all.

[834] Yeah.

[835] So for them, it's just like another kind of fun thing they're doing and going to the village.

[836] Yeah, they came to the village like, oh, this is what happened.

[837] You know, like, we're like, do animals or something.

[838] We're six to a suite.

[839] And they have like, they're visiting.

[840] And the discipline is probably much different for them because it's not their every four years moment.

[841] Their whole career does not ride on.

[842] Did you have a crush on any of the mail runners I had crushers on?

[843] Obviously, you seen bold.

[844] Did you get sucked up into that?

[845] Didn't have a crush.

[846] on him.

[847] No, we were like the same time coming up and everything.

[848] I had my moments with the track guys.

[849] But now my boyfriend was running as well.

[850] Okay.

[851] Not maybe what I had hoped.

[852] I just imagine you're like you're out there and then you're just kind of like, you got some free time and you're like, oh, this is a discus people.

[853] Oh, that's a son of a good.

[854] What is he?

[855] Six -nine?

[856] There was a big team.

[857] There was a lot happening.

[858] But I was pretty dialed in.

[859] Okay.

[860] Well, and it shows in your results.

[861] That's how you get here.

[862] You mentioned training.

[863] I've heard you talk about it a bunch.

[864] I guess at its peak it was a six day a week, five hours a day.

[865] Training regiment.

[866] What actually happens in those five hours?

[867] You can't run at that speed very much.

[868] So you're spending like an hour warming up.

[869] You're running.

[870] You're stretching.

[871] You're doing drills.

[872] It depends on the part of the year.

[873] So you'll go through a conditioning period where we're running on San Vicente and our coach is in a truck and he's yelling things at us.

[874] Oh, my God.

[875] What years was that, do you think?

[876] Oh, my gosh.

[877] You just brought me back.

[878] I've been on San Bacente.

[879] In Santa Monica?

[880] Uh -huh.

[881] Okay, because I'm an ex -drug addict, right?

[882] So I used to go out on Friday nights.

[883] It would go into Saturday.

[884] I'd be driving home.

[885] In specific, this one gal's house, I used to party up, and she lived off San Bacente.

[886] And I'd be driving back to my apartment.

[887] Uh -huh, at like 8 a .m. on a Saturday morning, and I would see y 'all.

[888] And I would think, look how good they're making their lives.

[889] It's like my lowest point of being a drug addict was seeing the athletic people train on San Bresente as I'm driving back to my apartment.

[890] and to try to figure out how to shut this thing down.

[891] Oh, the notion I might have seen, might have triggered me. Sorry about that.

[892] No, that's what we need to see.

[893] You need to really realize you are missing out on life.

[894] Other people are bettering themselves every step, and you're like going quickly down into the toilet.

[895] Oh, my God, Sama Sinti.

[896] Yeah, Sama Scenti, many of mornings.

[897] Would you ever do the stairs in Santa Monica?

[898] Yeah, we did the sand dune in Manhattan Beach.

[899] You'd bump into NFL players out there sometimes I'd see them out there.

[900] Yeah, before they, like, shut it down and you had to have a reservation.

[901] So all the gyms around LA, we did.

[902] And would you do strength training?

[903] Yes.

[904] And what would that typically be?

[905] So after we finished our time on the track, then we would go about two hours in the gym.

[906] And so that's like Olympic lifts, stuff with your own body weight, sleds, all the powerful things.

[907] And is there a sweet spot?

[908] I'd imagine with you guys you only want to put on X amount of muscle.

[909] You don't want to become too heavy and carry around extra muscle that's not optimal.

[910] Yeah, you're running so much that it's really not much of a problem.

[911] But it's a balance.

[912] We would be in the gym four days a week and you would taper with the season.

[913] Was there a recovery period between all the training before an event?

[914] Was there like a standard break you took to just let your body completely come back?

[915] Our taper was like two weeks.

[916] Two weeks out from an event, you'd really slow down the training.

[917] Yeah.

[918] So you start to come to practice and you would do maybe one fast run.

[919] All out, your workouts become very dialed in and you're letting your body recover and prep for whatever that competition is.

[920] Would you ever mentally have a thing where you felt like you were deteriorating by stopping?

[921] Because it would become so habitual.

[922] Yeah.

[923] I mean, you would think that, but your body is so ready to go at that point.

[924] You've trained so much that you can feel it.

[925] Like, you know you're ready.

[926] Because the competition is going to be probably a couple weeks.

[927] You're going to have rounds.

[928] You're just getting ready.

[929] We famously learned how Michael Phelps prepared dieterally, right?

[930] That became the funnest thing of whatever Olympics that was.

[931] Yeah.

[932] What kind of dietary thing on a race date?

[933] you guys doing?

[934] Ours wasn't as fun.

[935] Yeah.

[936] Ours was just very balanced.

[937] For me, it was like everything in moderation.

[938] What I was eating when I was training, I continued to eat that when I was competing.

[939] Nothing exciting.

[940] Salmon, brown rice, vegetables.

[941] Very healthy.

[942] You never had 16, 17 pancakes before.

[943] That sounds like the good life.

[944] I was not doing that.

[945] If your boyfriend then husband was a runner, was that ever uncomfortable?

[946] That you were so successful.

[947] That's hard.

[948] Yeah.

[949] He doesn't have, like, that ego.

[950] I think it would not have worked with a lot of other runners and people.

[951] He understood, and it became, like, a team thing.

[952] This is something that we're going to accomplish together.

[953] It could have gone a lot of different ways.

[954] I feel like it mostly could have gone the other way.

[955] Yeah.

[956] It was always blown away by that.

[957] He has always been my biggest cheerleader and has always just helped me reach my goals.

[958] And he doesn't like the spotlight at all.

[959] Oh, he doesn't.

[960] Not his thing.

[961] But he clearly has some kind of internal confidence.

[962] that is not threatened by you shiny.

[963] What a dude.

[964] That's good for him and you.

[965] I applaud that.

[966] Okay, so after Athens, we go to Beijing.

[967] Now, this will be the second time you get silver against Campbell, the Jamaican sprinter.

[968] Yeah, it was rough.

[969] But then you get gold in the 4 by 400, your first gold.

[970] It didn't fix it.

[971] It didn't fix it.

[972] Okay, so here's where I want to ask you about this kind of well -known thing that we've talked about numerous times, the plight of silver.

[973] Where did this come from?

[974] Maybe we read it or something.

[975] But you must know it well, right?

[976] If you look at any podium in the Olympics first place, they're fucking ecstatic.

[977] Silver's miserable.

[978] Bronze is much happier.

[979] Okay, so you've had all three of those.

[980] And does that track perfectly with your experience?

[981] Bronze was pretty miserable as well for me. For me as well, like I would watch other people compete and I would see the joy sometimes in the people who did not win.

[982] I would want that for myself.

[983] And I just could never.

[984] it's really miserable because at the same time you are grateful and it's a silver medal it's like you're the second best in the world yeah and you feel bad like i'm devastated yeah but nobody really understands that too because you come home and it was dark i was embarrassed like did not want to show my thing because i was like the favorite you know i'm supposed to be like this phenom here it is this rematch all the things are you serious like another silver medal a do you ever see these documentaries and be if you do do you find yourself identifying an example of this that it always feels so brutal is these boxers who are kind of undefeated and how much of their identity is that and then they get beat and how much it fucking destroys their total identity like george foreman when he got beat by ali he went into a 10 year depression i look back of pictures i don't like to but if i see a picture from 2008 immediately it takes me to this place where i'm like oh that was not a good time in life.

[985] Over being the second fastest runner in the world.

[986] I get it.

[987] I get it, but it's also madming.

[988] It's a singular focus.

[989] Yes.

[990] That's all that matters.

[991] Here's a fun theoretical question.

[992] Do you think someone who isn't upset by Silver ever finds a way to get gold?

[993] I think it's hard.

[994] You got to hate yourself.

[995] You probably hated yourself.

[996] Oh, it took a lot of unpacking to get past.

[997] Like, I was literally paralyzed in that moment of just failure.

[998] You're also really well -constructed.

[999] to feel that way, given the background, too.

[1000] Because it's already this kind of pursuit of perfection.

[1001] And you're getting interviewed and you have to act happy.

[1002] Are you disassociated?

[1003] Can you even remember doing all those posts?

[1004] I remember I was so sad.

[1005] There's this video of me. I see my parents and my brother and just full meltdown.

[1006] And like, people are like, oh, this beautiful.

[1007] Like, she's so happy.

[1008] Oh, God.

[1009] They're literally holding me up.

[1010] Like, I cannot stand on my own.

[1011] I remember that.

[1012] Yeah.

[1013] So it's been a lot.

[1014] Taking into the account the fact that you were the favorite and the golden child, there is only one way to go.

[1015] Yeah.

[1016] Which sucks.

[1017] If you had one gold, I bet you wouldn't have felt happy.

[1018] You just would have been like, thank God I did that.

[1019] But that's it.

[1020] And I think the lie you tell yourself is that the love everyone had for you is conditional.

[1021] In some way it is.

[1022] We love you because you are so fun to watch be brilliant.

[1023] But it's also not conditional.

[1024] We love you.

[1025] Like we love you in second.

[1026] But I bet that's impossible to accept.

[1027] Yeah, because everything is tied to the results.

[1028] Your pay is.

[1029] Your worth is determined on if I win or if I lose this race.

[1030] You know, you get older and you start to understand the things.

[1031] But in your early 20s, wasn't at the place.

[1032] But for me, it would be the pain of disappointing all these people who believed in me and rooted for me. That would be my source of embarrassment.

[1033] That was the embarrassment for me. So many people poured into me. I wanted to make the country proud.

[1034] Like, you know, that's the thing as an Olympian.

[1035] And little girls and all the things you stack on your shoulders.

[1036] That's the lie, though, we tell ourselves.

[1037] In that moment, no one's mad at you.

[1038] Everyone can see you tried your hardest and they love you and they're heartbroken for you.

[1039] Yeah.

[1040] And they can't wait to see you come back.

[1041] I think I learned that my next Olympics.

[1042] When you came in and just fucking destroyed the place.

[1043] So next up is 2012 London Olympics.

[1044] And that is one of my questions.

[1045] Again, back to Campbell.

[1046] At this point now, she's beating you two Olympics in a row.

[1047] At some point, you can mentally beat somebody or you can get it in your head.

[1048] I can't beat this person.

[1049] That seems the most improbable that you would have, after.

[1050] Losing to her twice would have come and beat her on the third time.

[1051] Seems like mentally probably your biggest accomplishment.

[1052] Was she a mountain or no?

[1053] I was having success in the world championships.

[1054] I could beat her there, but why can I not beat her here?

[1055] So I think I knew that I could do it, but it was getting over.

[1056] Can I do it on the biggest stage?

[1057] Yes.

[1058] But I think getting through the disappointment of 2008, I think I was just in a better place.

[1059] And I remember before that Olympics, a sense of peace, if this happens or if it doesn't happen, like, I'm going to be okay.

[1060] You know that you can survive it because you just did it.

[1061] Before, I was just like, I'm not going to be okay.

[1062] After I went through that, it's like, okay, no, I'm going to be okay.

[1063] If this is for me, it's going to be for me. And we'll see.

[1064] And then you destroyed her.

[1065] And it was for you.

[1066] You were in four events and you won three gold medals.

[1067] Finally, it was that moment.

[1068] Everything came together.

[1069] Can you articulate that?

[1070] Have you done MDMA or anything?

[1071] Are there any drugs you can compare to?

[1072] What is the sensation?

[1073] You know what's crazy is that it's nothing of what I thought it was.

[1074] Great.

[1075] One of my favorite topics is like the fantasy we build about things.

[1076] And then when we're in them and this huge dissonance between what we fantasize about.

[1077] So what was the fantasy and then what was the reality?

[1078] So the fantasy was my life is not going to be the same.

[1079] I will go to the Olympics.

[1080] I will win the medals.

[1081] Nothing will be the same.

[1082] Like I will transcend my sport.

[1083] Like all, you'll have no personal issues anymore.

[1084] You'll get along with everyone in your life.

[1085] Yeah, you'll be an angel.

[1086] I came home from that Olympics.

[1087] and I was like, everything is the same.

[1088] That was a realization.

[1089] I am not what I do.

[1090] I've got to really own that.

[1091] I have built it up to be this life -changing moment.

[1092] And I think I felt relief more than anything.

[1093] Don't get me wrong.

[1094] It was happy, but it was not.

[1095] It was an elation.

[1096] No. I know this is the sad truth with all accomplishments, really.

[1097] I think elation only happens when it's not expected.

[1098] When you stumble across something amazing.

[1099] But if you've been working towards something for so long, and then you finally get it, and it's been up and down.

[1100] Then it's just this sense of like, complete, God, I did it.

[1101] You can feel sort of at peace, but the actual happiness, and not to equate the championships, the cheerleading championships.

[1102] You should.

[1103] We won twice, and the first year, we were total underdogs.

[1104] We had no idea.

[1105] We weren't even good at first.

[1106] We didn't think.

[1107] And then we started kind of winning over the course of the Sierra.

[1108] It was like, oh my God, I think we're good.

[1109] We were all kind of excited by that.

[1110] And so winning, that first time it was elation because, well, look at us.

[1111] We did this thing.

[1112] We weren't supposed to be able to do.

[1113] And we had no expectation.

[1114] But then the second year, because we had won, of course, we were supposed to win.

[1115] So then when it came down to we might not, then winning was just pure relief.

[1116] It was not happiness at all.

[1117] It was like, well, if we don't, I'll be dead, I guess.

[1118] Like, I guess I'll die and that'll be the end of that.

[1119] Yeah, that completely resonates.

[1120] For me, I feel like the wins didn't feel like what they should have.

[1121] felt like, but the losses did.

[1122] Right.

[1123] Right.

[1124] But the shitty side is true.

[1125] I feel that.

[1126] Yeah.

[1127] It's all great when you're an underdog and you're taking names.

[1128] And then when you have the target on your back, it's like, okay.

[1129] Oh, it's brutal, right?

[1130] Now you've got to find a whole new motivation.

[1131] Absolutely.

[1132] So what became the new motivation?

[1133] Because you're like, okay, I'm not going to be walking around on a pink cloud.

[1134] Yeah.

[1135] It took me time to unpack.

[1136] Even my next Olympics.

[1137] I changed events.

[1138] That was different.

[1139] But it wasn't until real life stuff started happening to me. So am I going to help?

[1140] a family, am I not?

[1141] That's when I'm really understanding that this is not who I am and that separation is happening.

[1142] Well, the thing that's God so precarious about what you guys do is your life is singularly focused on a single thing.

[1143] And I don't know that you ask yourself, okay, what happens if I get the thing?

[1144] I haven't looked anywhere else in my life for fulfillment and identity.

[1145] For me, it was like you just keep going, you know, right?

[1146] It's like, okay, I did this now.

[1147] what's the next goal?

[1148] And then I came to a place where I have the medals, but I've always wanted to be a mother.

[1149] And so that was my big thing.

[1150] I've given my life to this sport.

[1151] And I think I want to have a family.

[1152] You might maybe even start recognizing, I will have nothing once this part's over.

[1153] I haven't built anything else other than obviously you were in a relationship that you're still in.

[1154] But I wanted more.

[1155] And I think that for me, there was so much fear because in our sport, you don't see it.

[1156] All of my teammates, I saw them struggle.

[1157] through motherhood.

[1158] There was not like a clear example of someone who was like a mother and who was dominating.

[1159] That wasn't the story that was being told.

[1160] There were a mother and doing well, but it was hard.

[1161] And I think I was just like, okay, well, what I'm seeing is that you have to do all these things and then you do that.

[1162] Right.

[1163] Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[1164] So finish all of your career goals and then give up all that and now switch to this other family goal.

[1165] Yeah, that was kind of my path.

[1166] I like that a little bit because there's this false narrative, especially for women, about doing it all 400 things at once and not really.

[1167] I think part of it is unfortunate because maybe you can't do it all beautifully and well.

[1168] At 100%.

[1169] Yeah.

[1170] But I think you can do it and I think you should be able have the choice to do it.

[1171] Yeah, totally.

[1172] And I think that's what I felt and I think a lot of women in my sport felt like they didn't have the choice.

[1173] Like if they made the choice then it was like, okay, well, now you're done because of what was happening in the sport.

[1174] Athletes were not supported.

[1175] And so basically women would become pregnant and their sponsors would pause their contracts.

[1176] Or if they were trying to secure a new contract, they would hide their pregnancy, get the offer, sign the contract, and then just like reemerge afterwards.

[1177] Holding a baby five months later.

[1178] Oh, wow.

[1179] And like literally time and time again that happened.

[1180] So that's what I saw.

[1181] And I think that just amplified my fear also.

[1182] Maybe if I accomplished all these things, maybe I won't find myself in that same situation.

[1183] I'll be more secure.

[1184] Absolutely.

[1185] And that didn't happen for me. We're almost to the Nike story, which is a great But I am curious, after the hugely successful 2012 Olympics, in 13, you get your first pretty major injury.

[1186] You have a hamstring issue.

[1187] Ironic that it was nine months as well.

[1188] I don't know if you thought about the similarity.

[1189] It was kind of like your first trial run.

[1190] So when you had that, I have to imagine that's also a very, very disruptive experience.

[1191] And I have to imagine some depression would come out of that.

[1192] When you're so used to the routine and the schedule and the purpose.

[1193] And now you've got to hang.

[1194] It was interesting because it happened at the World Championship, which is the last competition.

[1195] And so essentially it was like all of off season.

[1196] So I felt like it was kind of good timing.

[1197] But it was hard.

[1198] It was my first major injury.

[1199] The thing about injuries is you have to go back to the basics.

[1200] You're doing band work and you're in the pool.

[1201] And so that was challenging for sure.

[1202] You have to have so much patience, which isn't a strength that we look for.

[1203] Many athletes have.

[1204] Yeah, no. It's almost the opposite is rewarded.

[1205] Just the physical act of exercising gives you so much good dopamine, serotonin, all this stuff.

[1206] And you're used to a pretty steady supply of uptick dopamine from this exercise.

[1207] And now that's gone.

[1208] Biochemically, you probably had a bit of a crash landing.

[1209] I was definitely down.

[1210] But I think my darkest moments were 2008.

[1211] I could see a way back before, like in those moments of paralyzed failure.

[1212] I'll never get there.

[1213] Yeah.

[1214] Okay.

[1215] Okay, 2016, Rio, you get a silver in the 400, you get two more gold, you pick up in your relay races.

[1216] Now, at this point, you've been to four of them.

[1217] Who hosted the best Olympics at this point?

[1218] London.

[1219] Do you think that might be...

[1220] It might be buys a little bit?

[1221] To your experience while in London?

[1222] I mean...

[1223] But I will say, out of all the Olympics, it ran the best.

[1224] It was packed crowds.

[1225] Morning session, evening session.

[1226] I think it was also very easy because they're English -speaking.

[1227] I stayed in an apartment right near the stadium.

[1228] My parents stayed in a house down the street.

[1229] My mom cooked for me. It was very simple, whereas you're in Beijing, and it's very hard to move around.

[1230] It's challenging.

[1231] So I'll say it's probably the most comfortable.

[1232] Did you at all get a little tingly with the notion that your first Olympics was in Athens, home of the Olympics?

[1233] I did, for sure.

[1234] I would feel simulation -y if I were you, like, wait, this is too convenient.

[1235] I was like, this is good to be.

[1236] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[1237] Okay, so then now between Rio de Janeiro and your...

[1238] last Olympics, 2020, Tokyo, is when you become pregnant.

[1239] And I'd love for you to tell everyone how your training switched.

[1240] I think that's really telling.

[1241] Yeah.

[1242] And were you excited or were you anxious when you found out?

[1243] I was terrified.

[1244] Because I didn't know.

[1245] I was really scared because at this point, I had come off of the World Championships.

[1246] And I think at that World Championships, I became the most decorated male.

[1247] female.

[1248] But my contract was supposed to be getting renegotiated.

[1249] Like, I'm nearing the end.

[1250] And this is when you were with Nike.

[1251] Yes.

[1252] In 2008, I started working with my brother.

[1253] So he became my manager and we have a very special relationship.

[1254] He's a true big brother.

[1255] He's always taken care of me. He's amazing.

[1256] He's a good boy.

[1257] Yeah.

[1258] He's a good boy.

[1259] You know, Wes?

[1260] Yes.

[1261] So we're starting the process of renegotiating this contract.

[1262] And during the process, I have all this fear about starting a family because I'm not sure.

[1263] Is this a safe time to do it?

[1264] I think for Olympic athletes, for women, our mind works in four -year blocks.

[1265] For track and field, there's one off year.

[1266] So you have a world championship every other year, and there's one year where there's not a major championship.

[1267] So usually that's the year if you're going to have a baby.

[1268] Spit your kids out.

[1269] That's when you do it.

[1270] So we're in that year.

[1271] Really quick.

[1272] Had it ever crossed your mind like freeze eggs and just do it later, kick it down the road.

[1273] It didn't.

[1274] It should have.

[1275] But singular focus.

[1276] It wasn't super popular.

[1277] Yeah.

[1278] Yeah.

[1279] Which I should have been, but I make the decision.

[1280] I'm going to go forward even with all this fear.

[1281] I'm going to do that.

[1282] Really quick.

[1283] Pressure's on you and your husband.

[1284] It's like, okay, window starts now.

[1285] Now.

[1286] Get me pregnant by Wednesday.

[1287] For this to map out perfectly, I need to be pregnant in four weeks.

[1288] It is odd.

[1289] So when I found out happy, yes, because this is what I wanted.

[1290] But also the reality starts to set in that like, oh my gosh, I'm in between contracts, essentially.

[1291] I've done the thing that has not gone well for most women in my sport.

[1292] And so I think there was more so just a lot of fear and what am I going to do?

[1293] And then as we're doing these negotiations, even before I tell anybody that I'm pregnant, they start out as 70 % less than what I was making.

[1294] At that point, it's probably just age -driven, yeah?

[1295] They think you're not going to perform as well in Tokyo.

[1296] They were right.

[1297] That's it.

[1298] That was evil, but it was a pretty good joke.

[1299] Well, that's just too much.

[1300] Maybe I want you in apology?

[1301] She's just so nice.

[1302] I know, she does.

[1303] But I also think she might be a rascal.

[1304] Oh, okay.

[1305] You're trying to get the rascal part.

[1306] Yeah, I want to see the closet of a lot.

[1307] They can.

[1308] Yeah, you don't win goals.

[1309] Well, we'll get there, right?

[1310] You don't win goals by being to push over.

[1311] Okay.

[1312] You're already being faced with yet another force in your life.

[1313] You're getting older.

[1314] These negotiations are already bad.

[1315] So because they're out a place where they're bad, but also they haven't put anything on paper, I make this decision that.

[1316] I'm going to just hide my pregnancy.

[1317] I'm going to do what everybody else has done.

[1318] And that was really challenging.

[1319] So you asked me about how the training changed.

[1320] I didn't even tell my coach at the beginning.

[1321] Oh, wow.

[1322] So I literally just kept going.

[1323] At the place where I was, where I wasn't showing, I was still competing.

[1324] I was still training.

[1325] Hadn't told anybody.

[1326] And I'm just like trying to figure it out.

[1327] Yeah.

[1328] Oh.

[1329] Everybody was trying to figure out like what was wrong with me. But I continued to do that.

[1330] I eventually told him, but I started training like ridiculous times in the morning.

[1331] 4 a .m. she'd go out for her.

[1332] She said no one could see her when it was dark.

[1333] God, this is so...

[1334] I know, I don't like it.

[1335] I know.

[1336] I feel like this is like toxic.

[1337] She's a national treasure.

[1338] I know.

[1339] She shouldn't be hiding this.

[1340] Something happy.

[1341] Hiding something happy.

[1342] This miracle.

[1343] And that was really challenging for me because I always wanted the bump and the baby shower and like all the stuff.

[1344] And here I am, baggy clothes.

[1345] I was like not leaving the house because I was in such a state of like, well, I know I want to still compete.

[1346] And I've seen what has happened to other people.

[1347] I don't have anything on paper.

[1348] And so eventually get to a place where I do tell them.

[1349] I tell Nike, who I had been with at this point for almost a decade.

[1350] And they set all the right things in the moment.

[1351] We have baby Jordans.

[1352] We'll send some over.

[1353] That's the move.

[1354] Powerful.

[1355] So the negotiations are still going bad.

[1356] It's not getting better.

[1357] And then that's when I make this shift to start focusing on maternal protections and not the salary that was being offered to me. So basically what that means is like track and fill contracts, they're performance -based.

[1358] So you go to World Championships, you go to the Olympic Games, you get a bonus.

[1359] You don't, you get a reduction.

[1360] But if you're pregnant during that time, or if you just had a baby and you're not running at the same level, there's nothing in place to protect you.

[1361] So essentially what was happening in the sport is that women would have babies and they would be reduced and reduced and they would be pushed out of the sport.

[1362] I just basically asked for time to be able to recover.

[1363] Like a time period where you could work back to top four.

[1364] They told me I could.

[1365] That's great.

[1366] That's what I'm asking for.

[1367] The money is the money.

[1368] I can take that disrespect.

[1369] But this would be great if we can move forward like this.

[1370] But then the contract comes back.

[1371] And there's no mention of maternity.

[1372] They don't want to set a precedent.

[1373] Exactly.

[1374] They're very nervous about what they're going to put in writing at that point.

[1375] They were not willing to put it in writing.

[1376] And so that was the point where it was just like, this is not going to work for me. By the way, in some bizarre way, the initial 70 % percent reduction is a bummer for you and not for them.

[1377] Yet the fact that they had already tried to reduce you by 70 percent also helps your decision to go, you know what?

[1378] Fuck this.

[1379] I'm not even walking away from much.

[1380] Absolutely.

[1381] So they kind of weirdly secured their own fate by not being generous from the get.

[1382] And to me, it wasn't even the money.

[1383] No, but it would have been a much harder decision if you were going to get full freight for the next three years.

[1384] Yes, but what I mean is the 70 less.

[1385] I wasn't even thinking like what that number was.

[1386] I was thinking they don't believe in me anymore.

[1387] Right.

[1388] Yeah.

[1389] I'm done.

[1390] And I get the business.

[1391] in sports and that's how it works, but that was challenging.

[1392] Yeah, I will say if any company has great data on a player still being enormously profitable post -retirement, they're the high watermark.

[1393] Jordan has created tens of billions of dollars after retiring from the game.

[1394] That was one of the hard things with the whole pregnancy issue anyways, because they still wanted to use you.

[1395] They still wanted to use your image, but if you weren't on the track, then you weren't valuable.

[1396] Like, that doesn't.

[1397] That's bullshit.

[1398] You're or you've transcended your performance.

[1399] It doesn't go both ways.

[1400] They've got like Arthur Ash under contract.

[1401] There's all these lifetime contracts, you know?

[1402] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[1403] So, yeah, when it came back that the contract didn't say that, that's when I made the decision along with Wes, my brother, to write this New York Times op -in.

[1404] So some of my teammates had already spoken about this.

[1405] And the reason that it's not talked about at all before this is because all these athletes are under NDAs.

[1406] Oh, really?

[1407] That's a standard part of the contract.

[1408] Mm -hmm.

[1409] So many women would have loved to speak about this.

[1410] And so for me, I felt like I was in this position where now I'm not under contract anymore.

[1411] This has been happening over a long period of time.

[1412] And so I have the opportunity where I can be the one to start talking about it.

[1413] Yeah.

[1414] And so, yeah, made that decision.

[1415] And it was really impactful.

[1416] It was.

[1417] Nike did do the right thing, albeit with their arm twisted, but they started having maternity leave as part of their contracts.

[1418] I mean, I was terrified to write this op -in.

[1419] Oh, I bet.

[1420] Oh, my God.

[1421] It was crazy.

[1422] And I ended up actually having my daughter during this time period because it spanned such a long time.

[1423] You had a hard pregnancy on top of everything.

[1424] It's traumatic.

[1425] Did you ever watch, what was that ridiculous English show about the fancy people?

[1426] Oh, Doughton Abbey.

[1427] Oh, you know what?

[1428] No, I never did.

[1429] I did.

[1430] And there was an exact scene that took me out of the show entirely where one of the women characters had preeclampsia.

[1431] Oh, and they would say it like that.

[1432] Yes, and they would say preeclampsia.

[1433] Yeah.

[1434] And then during the delivery of the preeclampsia baby, the man was like holding the bedpost and like, he was suffering.

[1435] I was like, oh my God, what is it happening?

[1436] They made it about him.

[1437] Yeah.

[1438] I was like, he was suffering.

[1439] I was like, what is happening with the show?

[1440] Anyhow, I remember anyone that actually had preeclampsia.

[1441] That was like kind of made popular by that show, but you had it.

[1442] Yeah, I had it.

[1443] What is it?

[1444] Basically, your blood pressure is skyrocketing.

[1445] So you're at risk of having a stroke, your vision, like all of these things.

[1446] And also puts pressure on the base.

[1447] baby's heart rate as well.

[1448] Yeah.

[1449] Exactly.

[1450] And your placenta basically isn't giving the baby what it needs anymore.

[1451] And so the only solution to it is to deliver.

[1452] But for me, I was at 32 weeks when I found out that I had it.

[1453] I just went in for a regular appointment and found out.

[1454] Because they did your blood pressure and they're like, oh, my God.

[1455] Do you eat a salt lick for breakfast?

[1456] Yeah.

[1457] So they like monitored me and they admitted me. And then it was literally the next day that I ended up having my daughter.

[1458] The next day.

[1459] Yeah.

[1460] It was.

[1461] was a horrible night.

[1462] Just really bad.

[1463] Yeah.

[1464] Especially if you're someone who like, you have a schedule and you have a routine and I know what's next.

[1465] I thought I was going to have a baby and like be back training in three weeks.

[1466] That was my plan.

[1467] So to give birth two months early, to have emergency C -section, like we're a month later and, you know, my daughter is in the NICU still.

[1468] It's very traumatic.

[1469] Very.

[1470] You can't hold the baby.

[1471] Yeah.

[1472] It was the worst, literally.

[1473] Yeah.

[1474] Even that moment where they were taking the baby from my wife's abdomen over to the table.

[1475] and they had her and not me. I was like, uh -uh, give me that.

[1476] That's my baby.

[1477] What are you guys doing over here?

[1478] What do we got here?

[1479] To have to deal with a month of that, not being able to touch this little beautiful creature you mean?

[1480] And I was upstairs and she was downstairs and was a whole production to get me down there.

[1481] And I honestly think going through that simultaneously with all of the Nike stuff, I don't know if I make that move without it.

[1482] I was going to suggest, did it right size the importance of the Nike thing?

[1483] For sure.

[1484] It shifted everything because I'm looking at my daughter who was literally fighting for her life.

[1485] There's no way that I am not talking about this.

[1486] And there was a moment.

[1487] That's when it all changed.

[1488] I had come home from the hospital and I'm sitting in her nursery and my brother calls me. And at this point, we're still trying to figure it out with them.

[1489] And he calls and he's like, I have this request from Nike.

[1490] He's like, don't shoot the messenger.

[1491] But they want you to be a part of their women's World Cup commercial.

[1492] We want to use my image.

[1493] And I'm like, what is happening?

[1494] Like, we're literally having this internal battle around maternal protections.

[1495] And you want me to be in your women's world?

[1496] Like, what?

[1497] Yeah, represent women for you.

[1498] Tell them they can do anything.

[1499] Except for our kids.

[1500] Yeah.

[1501] I looked at my daughter and it was just like, we're doing this.

[1502] But it did have impact a little over two weeks after we wrote the op -ed.

[1503] They did change their policy.

[1504] And I ended up leaving the company over that.

[1505] But amazing for the women who are there now coming up.

[1506] I think initially, I am like, yeah, if you can't work, you can't get paid.

[1507] I start with some very basic what I grew up thinking.

[1508] Yeah, you get paid to work.

[1509] You're out with a baby for a year and a half.

[1510] That makes sense, yeah.

[1511] Right?

[1512] But then you go, okay, so in our society, the pressure of having a child is only going to fall on half of the people on planet Earth.

[1513] Even though the child is a shared creation of both genders and absolutely the lifeblood of everything, we need children.

[1514] We can't just stop having kids.

[1515] we as a country, there's panic when our population starts dropping.

[1516] We got to figure that out.

[1517] So this is a kind of shared goal.

[1518] And one person's going to have to bear a lot of that, inconvenience, the body changing, all these things.

[1519] Once I detach it from this notion, like, that's your problem versus this is a societal thing.

[1520] This is a couples thing.

[1521] This is everyone's issue in the same way that all cars have to have baby carriage hook up.

[1522] Now, you might buy a car and you don't have a kid, but we've agreed it's safest world to have these latches in the back.

[1523] We have to protect everyone involved because we all need this.

[1524] Is maybe my road to that point away from like, well, yeah, you don't work, you don't get paid.

[1525] From my view, I think you're still working.

[1526] They still want you to do stuff.

[1527] Well, especially in your situation where you are a brand that has transcended the events you're in at this point, as is all their marquee spokespeople.

[1528] Yeah, yeah.

[1529] I might see Tiger and commercial.

[1530] I don't even know if he plays golf anymore.

[1531] But if you're a younger athlete, the person who has a person who, like, I can't put in a commercial if they're not competing.

[1532] I'm more thinking about that situation.

[1533] For sure.

[1534] My hope in it all is that there is a place where an athlete feels like they can still have a career and be a mother and do all the things and that this is not the end point, like that this doesn't mean that they cannot work anymore.

[1535] So even if it's okay, if I'm under contract and I am still training through my pregnancy and I'm going to come back, that there's still a world where that works.

[1536] Yeah, what are you penalizing me for?

[1537] I did the job and I had the kid, so why?

[1538] Yeah, so I think that's my hope.

[1539] But I definitely hear that argument if you're not doing anything in that time period or you're not having a performance on the track that we're paying you for.

[1540] That's our choice.

[1541] And it is.

[1542] Like, they're not legally doing anything wrong.

[1543] I don't think it's great.

[1544] Yeah.

[1545] Because none of the male athletes have to deal with this at all.

[1546] If you want women doing anything ever besides having kids, then you have to give these protections.

[1547] Yeah, exactly.

[1548] Or we have a society with no kids is what I'm kind of arguing.

[1549] stay tuned for more armchair expert if you dare in any other job you have that security that your job is going to be there when you come back but as an athlete can you step away right and you prove to juggle it all because then you go back to Tokyo for your fifth Olympics and I know you hated it but you got a bronze and at your age in 2020 that already is hugely significant forget the baby right I think even if there's no baby in the That's an incredible outcome for someone's fifth Olympics.

[1550] Oh, yeah.

[1551] I mean, I had so much doubt.

[1552] When they say, like, making it to the starting line is a victory, like, oh, yeah.

[1553] So much happened from there.

[1554] I parted ways with Nike.

[1555] I then go on to start my own shoe company.

[1556] So getting back there in my own shoes.

[1557] Because children have this incredible ability to right size the importance of everything else, the real singular priority is now presented itself to me. I've experienced this where it's like, yeah, I still care about everything else, but it's all in second.

[1558] Yeah.

[1559] So I imagine, too, there might be a little mental gymnastics happening where it's like, well, I'm going to enter this Olympics knowing that it's actually not the most important thing anymore.

[1560] Can I still achieve greatness knowing it's the second most important thing in my life?

[1561] It's weird because for the first time, I came into that year and it wasn't just about the times.

[1562] It was more, I've been through this crazy ordeal.

[1563] Now I am this true representation for women, for people who just have been told they couldn't do something.

[1564] I've started this company and I now have the ability to promote your own company.

[1565] Yeah, the first athlete to compete in a brand that I own.

[1566] Yes.

[1567] Through that process also, I learned that shoes are not made for women.

[1568] So there's all of these pieces that are unfolding that bring me to this place at the Olympics where I'm like, wow, this is a bigger moment.

[1569] What do you mean shoes weren't designed for women?

[1570] That's a shocking revelation to me. It was shocking to me as well.

[1571] So I leave Nike and I don't have a footwear sponsor.

[1572] I'm over it.

[1573] I'm talking to my brother, and I'm just like, this is crazy.

[1574] At this point, I have six gold medals in the Olympics.

[1575] Nobody wants to give me shoes to wear the Olympics.

[1576] I can't find one footwear sponsor.

[1577] I had a great new apparel sponsor at the time, but I couldn't find a footwear sponsor.

[1578] And so he's just like, well, we should just do it ourselves.

[1579] Wow.

[1580] So Wes came in.

[1581] He's like this big visionary, but I'm like, do what ourselves?

[1582] How the fuck does one create a shoe?

[1583] And this is pandemic.

[1584] We go down this path of exploring.

[1585] Is this even something that we could do.

[1586] And that's when we learned that shoes are not made for women.

[1587] So a shoe is made off of a lass, which is just a mold, a mold of a foot.

[1588] And it's the mold of a man's foot that is used to make women's footwear.

[1589] It's a small male foot.

[1590] Yeah.

[1591] And for me, it was hard to grasp this.

[1592] I've been to Foot Locker.

[1593] Like, you go in and there's that wall of the women's side, right?

[1594] You didn't even go to Lady Foot Locker.

[1595] Okay.

[1596] We've got stuff.

[1597] And then I learned it's marketing.

[1598] Even when you think about the measurement of shoe sizes, a men's nine is based on a unit of measure.

[1599] But for women, it's not.

[1600] It doesn't directly correlate to a measurement.

[1601] It's just for us to think that something is for us.

[1602] I have heard that the sizes of shoes have changed for women since the 70s, that people didn't want a seven.

[1603] So they started making sevens, calling them sixes.

[1604] And then they started, have you heard this whole thing?

[1605] And dress sizes too.

[1606] Yeah, dress sizes have gotten increasingly bigger so people can say there are three still.

[1607] It's a racket.

[1608] But, you know, like European sizing, 39 is a 39.

[1609] It doesn't matter if you're a man or a woman.

[1610] It's still going to be what it is, right?

[1611] Yes, it is weird that we have two different.

[1612] And anatomically, men and women's feet are different.

[1613] Women have a wider forefoot, a more narrow heel.

[1614] Even when women wear heels, their Achilles' heel can shorten and as little time as three months.

[1615] The foam in a shoe is on average for the average weight of a man. So we can't even usually get the benefit of some of the foam density.

[1616] Even if you look at the structure of the body, there are differences.

[1617] Your foot is your foundation.

[1618] Yeah.

[1619] You know, they don't study medicine on women at all because women have their period.

[1620] They concluded that's a hard test subject.

[1621] So come to find out all these popular medications have far different potency in men and women.

[1622] One of them being Ambien, do you know this one?

[1623] It's like two X is powerful for women.

[1624] They started having these epidemic levels of women waking up in the middle of the night and doing crazy shit on Ambien, driving their car.

[1625] Yeah.

[1626] Eating in a blackout.

[1627] Finally, someone thought, maybe this is stronger in the female body.

[1628] And yes, it metabolizes completely different in a female body.

[1629] And women need half the dose.

[1630] The seatbelts in cars.

[1631] For a long time, that was the case.

[1632] Even jeans were for a long time not made on a pattern of women.

[1633] So I guess it's not that shocking.

[1634] And yet it is.

[1635] Yeah.

[1636] Well, it should be.

[1637] So, yeah, we started Seish making footwear for women designed to fit the form of the female foot.

[1638] What's the word Seish come from?

[1639] Saish is a type of wave.

[1640] spell it phonetically.

[1641] The sache wave is found in enclosed bodies of water.

[1642] So atmospheric pressure, when it brings the water to one side, it's the sache wave that restores balance.

[1643] And so that's what we're, you know, you're all about reiss storing balance.

[1644] Yeah, that's our company.

[1645] And what we thought we were doing was just creating shoes for me to wear in the Olympics.

[1646] That was the goal.

[1647] But then we realized this is a bigger thing that we can do.

[1648] And you have a new shoe now.

[1649] You have the Felix Runner.

[1650] Yes.

[1651] You previously didn't make a running shoe?

[1652] Not a running specific shoe.

[1653] You made like an athletic shoe.

[1654] Yeah, so this shoe that I'm wearing now are Seish one.

[1655] It's able to do all the things, but our Felix runner is a running shoe specifically.

[1656] And you recommend people sleep in them.

[1657] That's how much you believe in the product.

[1658] Of course.

[1659] Why would you ever take it off?

[1660] Do you enjoy the aesthetic process?

[1661] I do.

[1662] I've always loved shoes, but there's been so much learning.

[1663] And I think it's been interesting as I've transitioned away from sport.

[1664] Having this new thing has been just really good for me. and also the purpose and the meaning behind it.

[1665] And it's like, yeah, we make shoes.

[1666] And sure, the world doesn't need more shoes, but it's our purpose and why we exist.

[1667] When I see women wearing them, it's like you stand with women.

[1668] You're a change maker.

[1669] That's what I hope that this shoe is more about.

[1670] The story resonates with you and you want to stand with them.

[1671] You want a signal.

[1672] Yes, I'm getting some for sure.

[1673] I was going to say, I'm going to buy you some for your birthday, but then that feels kind of anti -eatism.

[1674] Yeah, I'm going to buy myself.

[1675] Yeah.

[1676] Okay.

[1677] Yeah.

[1678] In fact, you buy me some.

[1679] That feels more.

[1680] Because I think I might have a feminine foot, to be honest with you.

[1681] I mean, we have been wearing men's shoes for it.

[1682] Yeah, exactly.

[1683] You do 11 and a half, whatever that equates to.

[1684] Okay, wonderful.

[1685] It did cross my mind that I wanted to race you in the yard.

[1686] Like, to feel fully humbled in like a profound way.

[1687] I really miss it, so I might take you up.

[1688] Okay.

[1689] I mean, it'll be so easy for you.

[1690] You could probably be singing a song while you did it.

[1691] You're fast.

[1692] I am, first of all, not that fast.

[1693] I was just tall, so I ran hurdles.

[1694] I mean, that's good, though.

[1695] Oh, you ran hurdles.

[1696] In junior high.

[1697] Tall is good.

[1698] You have, like, that stride.

[1699] If I can get out of the blocks.

[1700] Like, by the time I'm up right, you'll be fucking halfway through the yard.

[1701] But that was my issue, too.

[1702] The long legs, trying to get out the blocks.

[1703] It's a thing.

[1704] And then you start shining at what meter.

[1705] 60.

[1706] That's a problem.

[1707] If you're trying to run the 100, if you're just coming 60, like, yeah, good luck.

[1708] Well, also, it's got to be, like, mentally overwhelming because you're watching people.

[1709] Everybody's in front of you.

[1710] You've got no give up in you.

[1711] That's what's clear.

[1712] You come from behind.

[1713] Most of these stories I read about your greatest runs.

[1714] They're always from behind.

[1715] You're running mid -pack for some of it.

[1716] Never the front runner.

[1717] Oh, what a story.

[1718] Okay, here's a juicy, just a, I need your take on it.

[1719] When I would watch Bolt, it would appear to me that he always stopped running the last, like, 10 meters, because he was always so far ahead.

[1720] And I found that very curious, like, I guess he just doesn't care about a world record or he doesn't care about this.

[1721] He just wants to win, which is very defendable position.

[1722] What is your take on that?

[1723] And did you have that same sensation when you would watch him run?

[1724] I mean, for me, it was more like, I wish.

[1725] You could be right up at the end.

[1726] You were so good.

[1727] There's no way.

[1728] Like, I'm diving for, you know.

[1729] It could have also just been a move, which builds the overall aura of him.

[1730] I mean, he doesn't even have to run the whole way.

[1731] But he didn't because he was still breaking world records doing that.

[1732] Yes.

[1733] So that was the crazy part.

[1734] That's a level of dominance.

[1735] I don't know.

[1736] So do your thing.

[1737] It's pretty cool to watch.

[1738] Oh, for sure.

[1739] I would argue, sprint is the purest event in all of Olympics.

[1740] It's just who's the fastest.

[1741] And it's so objective.

[1742] It has to be the very first thing humans ever did to compete with one another.

[1743] And that's the thing.

[1744] Everybody can relate to it.

[1745] We've all raced somebody at some point.

[1746] And I always think in the Olympics, they should have one person who's like a normal person.

[1747] They should have you.

[1748] And now I got a 48 -year -old guy from Los Angeles.

[1749] Just for context.

[1750] It would be really fun to have like a dead average person running next to the island.

[1751] Yeah.

[1752] And I guess like with gymnastics, And Essex is a really expensive sport to put kids in.

[1753] So already there's an inequality built in to a lot of sports.

[1754] Very democratized.

[1755] Yeah.

[1756] Everybody can run.

[1757] Obviously, with your husband being a competitive runner and you being who you are, I want to add most Olympic medals of any track and field athlete of all time.

[1758] Past Carl Lewis in the Tokyo games.

[1759] Incredible.

[1760] Your child.

[1761] What do we think about?

[1762] Will we start running with her early?

[1763] What do we think?

[1764] I really don't want her to run.

[1765] Why?

[1766] This is this thing that.

[1767] How can actors do, too?

[1768] They're like, I don't want my kid to act.

[1769] I'm like, oh, go hang out on a set and play pretend to get overpaid.

[1770] You'd hate that for your kid?

[1771] Oh, God.

[1772] I mean, I don't think that I'll win.

[1773] I want to delay it as long as I can.

[1774] I think track is such a hard sport.

[1775] Because you have to love it.

[1776] It's not the payday.

[1777] It's very isolating.

[1778] But don't you think you're in the most advantage position to guide someone through all that, having been through that?

[1779] And to model so much.

[1780] I think I've also seen all the pitfalls.

[1781] I don't know if I want that for her.

[1782] Well, that's what the actors do.

[1783] They're like, I don't want my child to experience the amount of rejection, but you should want for your kid rejection.

[1784] Like, you should know your kid's a bad motherfucker, probably badder than you and be faster than you and let them go get it.

[1785] I mean, that's a view.

[1786] I'd like to officially sponsor your child right now.

[1787] I'm willing to come in the ground floor.

[1788] Oh, I love that.

[1789] And she could be the first athlete to ever run in her mom's shoes.

[1790] It's sponsored by her mom.

[1791] Pretty cool.

[1792] But she could do that in other sports.

[1793] Okay, just not running.

[1794] Yeah.

[1795] But we'll see.

[1796] I mean, she's grown up on the track.

[1797] So she's trying to race us all through the house.

[1798] And so that's what I'm like, I don't know.

[1799] Genetically, she's got to be predisposed.

[1800] She's pretty quick.

[1801] She is pretty quick.

[1802] Well, Alison, it's been so nice to talk to you.

[1803] You're so delightful.

[1804] I'm so tickled that we're seeing you in real life.

[1805] I do wish you had been in your running outfit.

[1806] Are you ready to tell her?

[1807] Are you going to tell her?

[1808] Oh, yeah.

[1809] What was I going to tell?

[1810] Part of why you like the Olympics so much.

[1811] Oh, God.

[1812] I love when I see the penises flop around.

[1813] It's my absolute favorite.

[1814] thing and I'll always go back and then I record it and then I send to my best friend Nate and he's also watching all the Olympics and he's showing me all the penis pictures and there is a whole subset of us you know there's been some metal ceremonies where these guys are fully erect they're fully erect this is not the thing I thought you were going to say how could you have guessed it there's no way you go to it is a great preoccupation of mine there's nothing ever watch the Olympics in the same way it's hard don't even pretend like you're fully engaged as well actually going to say to you why aren't you including me in that I didn't want to out you because you're having like a sisterhood moment, but Monica loves it too.

[1815] Well, once he brought it up, it's true.

[1816] You can't not see it.

[1817] And they're everywhere.

[1818] And Monica, too, captures them.

[1819] And we're on a chain.

[1820] It's you, Nate and I. It's pretty fun.

[1821] Someone else on there?

[1822] Yeah, there was some Swedish boys who had full erections at the metal ceremony.

[1823] I was like, ladies guys, two things.

[1824] The penis is the stupidest appendage on any animal.

[1825] It's in the wrong spot.

[1826] It's so cumbersome.

[1827] It's right between their legs.

[1828] It's not where you want it.

[1829] It's too much business.

[1830] And it's just, innately silly looking when it starts flopping around.

[1831] And then also why it responds to certain situations is also curious.

[1832] We're mainly into it for science.

[1833] Yeah, this is more of a scientific idea.

[1834] You can't really remind me to say that.

[1835] I made my bed and I'm lying in it.

[1836] Well, Mrs. Felix, what a delight to meet you.

[1837] And I'm sorry you had to sit through my penis.

[1838] Well, can I take the funniest story about that now that you know this about me?

[1839] I'm directing a movie.

[1840] I've never had an assistant in my life.

[1841] But when you're directing a movie, you have to have one they give you one.

[1842] And I've written the movie.

[1843] And my laptop shits out right after I've done a rewrite.

[1844] I'm supposed to be printing in and dispersing it.

[1845] And my laptop completely dies.

[1846] I'm panicked.

[1847] And I got to go on a location scout.

[1848] So I send Amy to go to like a Mac expert.

[1849] They figure it all out.

[1850] And I come back from this location scout.

[1851] She goes, they fixed it.

[1852] She opens my computer and she turns it on to show me. My eye photos is open in the page with all of the penis pictures from the Olympic.

[1853] And this is my female assistant.

[1854] And I'm like, oh, thank you.

[1855] And I slam my thing down.

[1856] And now the rest of the day, I'm obsessed with the fact that I'm going to be a part of a sexual harassment suit.

[1857] So then I'm on my way home from work and I call her.

[1858] I go, listen, I don't know what to say about, listen, this is not perverse.

[1859] It's a fun thing I do with my friend.

[1860] Yes, with Nate and Monica.

[1861] And there's a woman involved even that does these pictures.

[1862] It's just a laugh.

[1863] Thank God.

[1864] She said, knowing you have that made me like you more or not less.

[1865] So don't panic.

[1866] Okay.

[1867] I'm sorry you were a part of any of that.

[1868] I promise you won't get canceled.

[1869] That'll be me. So nice meeting you.

[1870] I hope everybody goes out and gets themselves the Felix runners by Seish.

[1871] They're very, very smart and fashionable.

[1872] And they've been actually designed for a woman.

[1873] You'll feel the difference.

[1874] You can go to sache .com.

[1875] Yep.

[1876] But also they're sold through.

[1877] Oh, Athleta?

[1878] You can get a lot of Athleta as well.

[1879] Okay.

[1880] I learned so much today.

[1881] Athleta.

[1882] Seish, the Felix Runner.

[1883] It's all available.

[1884] Get it all.

[1885] All right.

[1886] Be well.

[1887] Good love with everything.

[1888] Thank you.

[1889] Next off is the fact check I don't even care about facts I just want to get in their pants Allison Felix She's fast She's very fast So how was your weekend It was really fun Tell people about your poison ivy Oh okay I have poison ivy Tell them more about it I think maybe you'd be better suited to tell them Well I don't know about it I just know you have it all over your left And it looks covered in calamine.

[1890] It looks like a, like maybe some kind of velociraptor or something with a very large hand, bigger than a human hand.

[1891] With clawed me. Yeah.

[1892] Like some kind of mythical creature with huge claws.

[1893] It's just scraped across the whole front of my, whatever you call that, front of your fucking shin, your shin, yeah.

[1894] So, yeah, pretty gnarly bit on the leg.

[1895] And then on the forearm, the top of the forearm into the elbow on my tattoo tattooed arm, my right arm.

[1896] Yeah.

[1897] And we're like playing it really fast and loose with is it contagious?

[1898] Well, I would argue to quiet you and Wabi Wob's fears, I have been interacting with my family and my children nonstop since I obviously acquired this.

[1899] And you know, I would have played it safer.

[1900] But in fact, I thought I was dealing with mosquito bites at first because it was.

[1901] It was super itchy, right?

[1902] I'm pretty certain it's, I told that great story about being hosted by John and Krista.

[1903] And then we took a walk with the dogs and there was a point I went off -roading to get the kids.

[1904] And I think that's probably where it happened.

[1905] Okay.

[1906] But for the first couple days, I thought I had mosquito bites.

[1907] And then I was like, it's crazy.

[1908] I even said, like, isn't that crazy that these mosquitoes bit me in a perfect line?

[1909] Like the lower one came up first.

[1910] I'm like, there must have been like eight, or did it go, and then it kept going back for more in a perfect line.

[1911] And then at some point, but late, like three days of having it.

[1912] I was like, oh, no, that's poison ivy, because then it's just fucking everywhere and it's expanding.

[1913] Is that how it expands?

[1914] Like, how does, I've never had it.

[1915] You haven't?

[1916] Oh, you're lucky.

[1917] I think it's really rampant in Michigan.

[1918] You can't grow up in Michigan, not get it.

[1919] Really?

[1920] Most people I know have had it.

[1921] Yeah.

[1922] And my father had chronic.

[1923] poison ivy or poison oak because he was a golfer and he was constantly going out in the woods to squirt while he was on the golf course which is again i was doing a ton of outdoor squirting i have to be honest so it could have also happened in martha's vineyard because i was regularly popping into the woods to a squirt um and that's how it would get my father now my father got it so frequently um and his method was to take a rag and douse it with chlorox bleach and then scrub Oh, Jesus Christ.

[1924] Yeah, because in his mind, that's how you got rid of the oil on there.

[1925] I don't know how any of it works.

[1926] I haven't looked it up.

[1927] I didn't go to WebMD.

[1928] I don't know what you're supposed to do.

[1929] I know my father put bleach all over it.

[1930] I was half inclined to do that because minimally, the guy dealt with it a hundred times.

[1931] Well, I mean, dealt with is.

[1932] I mean, don't you kind of trust someone who's been through something?

[1933] Not really, because he keeps getting it over and over and over again.

[1934] Well, that's just because he's got to go peepee and he can't do it in the center of the golf course.

[1935] Okay.

[1936] I don't mean to disparage him because he's passed.

[1937] No, you can be critical.

[1938] He wouldn't mind.

[1939] It's because you're cute.

[1940] He would be fine with whatever.

[1941] Any attention you'd be giving him, he'd be fine with it.

[1942] Yeah, yeah.

[1943] Okay, but you didn't put bleach on.

[1944] I haven't.

[1945] I wanted to, I think I floated that by Kristen, and she had a very similar response to the one you just had, and so I didn't push it.

[1946] You went with Kalamine.

[1947] If I was single, there'd be some Klorox on this.

[1948] A few days ago, I would have doused it with Klorox, I bet.

[1949] Because there's some, I see the logic in the oil.

[1950] You're responding to the oil.

[1951] No, the oil has nothing to do with chlorox.

[1952] Well, the chlorox cuts the oil.

[1953] How do you know?

[1954] Says who?

[1955] Maybe Dawn, too.

[1956] Dawn's are really good at cutting grease and oil.

[1957] I really do trust Dawn so much.

[1958] Yeah, it's a trusted brand.

[1959] Yeah, yeah.

[1960] You're doing a good job not itching it, though.

[1961] Thank you.

[1962] It's challenging.

[1963] It's very challenging.

[1964] I would love to scrub my forearm right now with my feet.

[1965] fingernails.

[1966] I would most like that.

[1967] Bleach is not good for it, apparently.

[1968] Oh, you already got an answer.

[1969] When you apply bleach directly to the skin, it removes the top layer causing irritation.

[1970] Well, but is the irritation less bad than the irritation?

[1971] It's a quick fix removing the rash, but you could be doing more damage to your body.

[1972] Oh, quick fix.

[1973] I want to know he had some like to stand on.

[1974] Okay, sure.

[1975] He's very wise.

[1976] This would be crazy to me that he did that over and over again.

[1977] He hadn't figured out that it did reduce the term of the, illness or something.

[1978] Well, that's true.

[1979] But it makes it harder for the wound to heal.

[1980] Okay, damage your tissue.

[1981] Oh, tissue.

[1982] So that's the bad news.

[1983] You're nursing some injuries.

[1984] I'm nursing a little bit of, well, not even a little bit.

[1985] A considerable amount of voice in Ivy.

[1986] Oh, wait.

[1987] So does it grow?

[1988] But here's what happened.

[1989] Why was I in this situation?

[1990] I was somewhere and I was with one of the two kids.

[1991] And, oh, I know, because we were constantly using.

[1992] the bathroom.

[1993] When you're with the kids and you're at an airport for 36 hours and I'm already extending it.

[1994] It was only 26 hours.

[1995] Thank you for catching yourself.

[1996] Yeah, real time.

[1997] I do appreciate that.

[1998] I'm in and out of the bathroom with the girls all the time.

[1999] And I take them do a stall and then they go and then I go.

[2000] And at one point I was like taking my meundies that had bunched up high on my thighs a little bit and I put my arm down my pants to pull them back lower.

[2001] Yeah.

[2002] After I just peed and all of a sudden I just had this moment I was like, oh, my God, get your fucking hand out of your pants.

[2003] Because of the ivy?

[2004] What if I got the ivy?

[2005] Yeah.

[2006] On the crown jewels.

[2007] It can't be spread from person to person.

[2008] Can or can't?

[2009] Cannot.

[2010] It's not contagious.

[2011] It can only be picked up from the plant?

[2012] But can you get it all over yourself?

[2013] I thought like whatever, like, whatever gets on you on the plant, I would imagine before you wash it, you could spread more of that around.

[2014] Yeah.

[2015] The oils.

[2016] Apparently, I think is full of the oil.

[2017] That's what the chlorox is for.

[2018] Even with open blisters, you won't spread to other areas of the body.

[2019] Oh.

[2020] This is from Harvardhealth .edu.

[2021] Oh, wow.

[2022] That's.

[2023] From here.

[2024] Wow.

[2025] I don't think we've ever had a source that good.

[2026] That's the zenith.

[2027] I'm just summited.

[2028] But I thought you were prompting me to say the highlight of my weekend, which was I went on a date with Delta.

[2029] On our vacation, Delta said, you have so many things with Lincoln, you guys ride.

[2030] Motorcycles together, I want a thing with you.

[2031] What can we do?

[2032] somehow it was figured out that we would go, what just happened over there?

[2033] My tea got weird.

[2034] I put my poison ivy in your tea.

[2035] Oh, I got to taste it.

[2036] Yeah, and it's sour?

[2037] Ew!

[2038] Imagine it's so sour.

[2039] Don't call it sour.

[2040] Sour poison ivy.

[2041] Oh, God.

[2042] Okay, go on.

[2043] So it was decided that Delta nice thing would be we would go to the Hollywood Bowl.

[2044] I think I was telling someone that my favorite thing in L .A. the Hollywood Bowl.

[2045] I think it's our greatest thing.

[2046] So then it was decided, okay, we'll go.

[2047] Well, then we got home, and then she brought it up.

[2048] And I was like, well, let's go right now and look at the calendar.

[2049] So look at the calendar, and this was Friday.

[2050] And the first thing I see is that night is Quincy Jones 90th tribute by the Hollywood Bowl orchestra.

[2051] Yeah.

[2052] And I'm like, oh, that would have been fun.

[2053] Then I realized it's a two night affair.

[2054] It's also on Saturday.

[2055] Get in there.

[2056] Great tickets.

[2057] There's two left in the little area where you can have a picnic, you know, in the little boxes.

[2058] How much?

[2059] $3 .20 a ticket.

[2060] Yeah, it's expensive to go not...

[2061] $3 .20.

[2062] That's not that much.

[2063] I just bought Taylor Swift tickets.

[2064] You did?

[2065] For you and who?

[2066] Well, Allison and Anthony bought them.

[2067] Anthony bought them.

[2068] And when we were picketing, he was like, oh my God, I got Taylor Swift.

[2069] And I've been trying, I have had my eye on them.

[2070] The ones that, like, I wanted to sit in it were $5 ,000 a ticket.

[2071] Insane.

[2072] And so I was asking my agents.

[2073] I was like, I was doing everything.

[2074] And they were like, we'll try.

[2075] We're working on it.

[2076] And then...

[2077] Along with everyone else.

[2078] Well, I said, I said, I'm sure you're getting this every day.

[2079] Anthony found tickets.

[2080] Like randomly, I guess what's happening.

[2081] Like Charlie and the chocolate factory?

[2082] Yes, golden tickets.

[2083] Randomly, these links have been going out, basically.

[2084] Like, more tickets are available.

[2085] And then if you get them fast enough.

[2086] So he got four tickets.

[2087] And he didn't know I was on the hunt.

[2088] So we were picketing and he said, oh my gosh, this crazy thing happened.

[2089] And I got four Taylor Swift tickets.

[2090] I'm going to sell two of them to cover all four of the costs.

[2091] Of course, probably.

[2092] And then some.

[2093] Well, he could and then some for sure.

[2094] But his goal was just like have those cover.

[2095] Being that neutral.

[2096] He's a writer and let's be honest, they've been on strike for 100 plus days.

[2097] And I was like, no, I want the ticket.

[2098] I want to go.

[2099] Can we go?

[2100] Can we just all go?

[2101] Yeah.

[2102] And he said, no, I can't do that to you.

[2103] Right.

[2104] But you can.

[2105] Right.

[2106] I said, yes, you have to.

[2107] Because I'm going to buy tickets anyway.

[2108] I'm going to buy them from somebody else, some random person.

[2109] I'm going to spend more than what you're going to charge me. Yep.

[2110] And then we can all go together.

[2111] Yes.

[2112] And he said he had to think about it.

[2113] He really was struggling with this decision.

[2114] Of course.

[2115] He was like, the right thing to do is just we all buy our tickets and then we go together.

[2116] Yeah.

[2117] But in his head, he was like, we can't go unless our tickets are paid for essentially.

[2118] Right.

[2119] Which, yeah.

[2120] What's so expensive?

[2121] What's face value?

[2122] $5 .50.

[2123] Oh, my God.

[2124] She must be making.

[2125] I know.

[2126] I mean, it'll be over a billion dollars.

[2127] Yes.

[2128] Because how many dates is she doing in L .A.?

[2129] A lot.

[2130] 20 or something?

[2131] No. Like two or three.

[2132] How many?

[2133] Maybe five.

[2134] I don't know.

[2135] fucking Harry Stiles did like 21 days here, didn't he?

[2136] Well, she's all over.

[2137] Now she had international.

[2138] I mean, she is going to make so much money.

[2139] It's a three -hour -long concert.

[2140] I can't believe she's even able to do this.

[2141] She's such a beast.

[2142] Anyway, so he texted me a few days later and said he would allow it.

[2143] Oh, great.

[2144] Good, good, good, good.

[2145] So I'm going.

[2146] I'm so excited.

[2147] When is it?

[2148] Six L .A. shows.

[2149] Oh, that's it.

[2150] Okay.

[2151] She showed in 20.

[2152] Whoa.

[2153] What?

[2154] Anthony Allison just texted me. Oh, that's crazy.

[2155] Impossible.

[2156] He said, our tickets came with these commemorative boxes.

[2157] Inside there's a pin, ticket, 4T Swift prints, canvas tote bag, and a lanyard we're supposed to wear at the concert, I guess.

[2158] Oh, my God.

[2159] Anyway, okay.

[2160] Okay, back to getting the tickets.

[2161] You got tickets at a cute little spot with a picnic.

[2162] Yeah, the Hollywood Bowl, you can bring picnics.

[2163] And then there's these great seats towards the front.

[2164] I'm not going to lie, they're nice, nice seats.

[2165] And they have little tables and you have like a whole little thing.

[2166] So my expectations at that point, what I think it is is it's a tribute to Quincy Jones from the orchestra.

[2167] So we go.

[2168] We take the motorcycle because it's impossible to drive a car to the Hollywood Bowl.

[2169] It takes 45 minutes from our house to go two miles.

[2170] Yes.

[2171] So we take the motorcycle.

[2172] We're already in the greatest mood because we're just ripping by people.

[2173] And we know we're getting away with murder because we don't have to wait.

[2174] And we get up there and we park.

[2175] We already had a great time on the motorcycle ride.

[2176] We were laughing and having a blast.

[2177] I kept looking her in the rear of the rear of that cute little face in her helmet.

[2178] It's already great for me. Sit down and it's the first time she's ever been to a concert at night.

[2179] So A, it's a lot of people, right?

[2180] There's like that I don't know what the bowl seats, Rob.

[2181] Maybe it's like 10 ,000 or 9 ,000.

[2182] It's a big venue.

[2183] Maybe it's even more.

[2184] 17 ,500.

[2185] Yeah, okay.

[2186] You know, that was in my mind, I thought, that's way too big.

[2187] Anyways, and everyone in the boxes is drinking wine.

[2188] That's why people get those tickets, right?

[2189] So everyone's got their water.

[2190] So she goes, I'm a little scared.

[2191] There's a lot of people, they're all drinking.

[2192] And I go, yeah, but you don't need to be afraid of them drinking.

[2193] There's not going to be any rowdy drunks here.

[2194] There's a very, like, adult, whatever.

[2195] I'm trying to comfort her.

[2196] I said, but we can leave any minute.

[2197] Yeah.

[2198] She's like, okay, well, let's stay for a little bit.

[2199] So they start the show, right out of the gates.

[2200] I follow this insane piano player from Cuba on Instagram.

[2201] I'm obsessed with him.

[2202] He's like the most outrageously talented.

[2203] I have looked to try to find where he's touring so I could go see him.

[2204] Wow.

[2205] And I, he's never been in California.

[2206] Yeah.

[2207] He's playing the first song.

[2208] And I'm like, no way.

[2209] I've been wanting to see this guy play the piano first.

[2210] So right out of the gates, I'm like blown away.

[2211] Then they bring out another singer.

[2212] They're incredible.

[2213] Delta's like now liking it And then she's like how long before it's half You know the show's halfway over it And I'm like oh it's in this and she goes Okay well let's stay to the half Okay And I go okay great so this is progress Then Jennifer Hudson comes out And she lets it fucking rip And I'm like this is incredible Already excited And here comes a man Walking another man out on stage Assisting and I'm like first Oh why is this guy need assistance I'll tell you why it's Stevie fucking Wonder.

[2214] That's insane.

[2215] Stevie Wonder comes out.

[2216] Again, I think just the orchestra is going to play, which he's going to already be great.

[2217] Now Steve, I'm like, I never thought in my life I'd see Stevie Wonder.

[2218] I know.

[2219] So the first song, it's just him playing this kind of laid down guitar thing.

[2220] I don't know how it needs.

[2221] Then the second song is, you got it bad girl.

[2222] You got it bad girl.

[2223] One of my favorite Stevie Wonder song.

[2224] Da da da da da da da da da da da da da da and he was scatting then he pulled out that fucking harmonica the one we all know in love delta and i are losing our minds like even she she got it she knows stevie wonder oh wow she knows like superstitions one of her favorite songs and she knows what's up we could i couldn't believe we were watched so then okay so now we that takes us to the halfway point of the concert and she had been saying at the bowl there are these like rubber moving walkways that go up the steep grade because it goes way up tall to it's it's a canyon and there are seats way at the top of the canyon yeah and so she wanted to go to the very top we went to there's several escalators a couple moving carpets we get to the top and now the second part of the show starts and now it's all michael jackson the whole rest of the show is fucking michael jackson and they have the best singers ever coming out a woman singing a song two different dudes singing his song and they were so good that delta was like oh my god we got to go back to our seats so we went back to the seat rock with you oh my god thriller amazing it was dynamite anyhow that was very long but it was it was the date of a lifetime awesome yeah love it you got to go got to go the bowl's the spot you can't let summer i know you're going to taylor swift but you got to get to the bowl let me look it up portugal the man's playing there on Sunday.

[2225] On Sunday.

[2226] Are you going?

[2227] Yeah, I think I'm going to take help.

[2228] Oh, God, it'll be delightful.

[2229] You would think we were supported by Hollywood Bowl at this point.

[2230] Couldn't be a bigger.

[2231] We haven't been supported by Hollywood Bowl for season.

[2232] It's like no one wants to say.

[2233] Carrari.

[2234] Oh, Mercedes.

[2235] Actually, we have been supported by Mercedes.

[2236] But they haven't given us any free cars.

[2237] Speaking of, I broke my car.

[2238] Oh, you know.

[2239] You ripped your bumper off.

[2240] Yeah.

[2241] I had a bad morning.

[2242] The fascia, not the, Yeah, physical bumper, but the plastic cover.

[2243] Well, yeah.

[2244] I mean, I just don't know anything about cars, so I don't know what happened.

[2245] But you described what happened.

[2246] You were leaving your parking spot.

[2247] I was leaving my parking spot in my apartment, and it's like tiny spaces with these, like, wooden poles.

[2248] Very common in L .A. for this, this type of parking situation.

[2249] And I was in a rush because I was trying to go to my Durham College just because I'm having.

[2250] Having a bad face week.

[2251] Okay.

[2252] And I was rushing and then I just cut it.

[2253] Yeah, cut it too quickly, early.

[2254] It smashed in smithereens.

[2255] Well, I was picturing a caved -in fender, which could have also then pushed into the hood.

[2256] Like what you described and what seemed most likely, I had very low expectations.

[2257] Yeah.

[2258] But then you sent me a photo.

[2259] And I think luckily you just tore it.

[2260] The whole plastic cover of the bumper all goes in with clips.

[2261] So it's easy for it to pop out if it's going in reverse.

[2262] So I think that'll be able to get slid right back in and then you just have some paint to do.

[2263] So as I told you, I think you got off very light.

[2264] Yeah, you feel optimistic about it, which I like.

[2265] And then you asked if I could try to push it back in myself.

[2266] So I went to do that the next morning.

[2267] How much effort did you put in?

[2268] I did put in a lot of effort.

[2269] But like it felt like I was doing surgery.

[2270] Like organs were spilling out.

[2271] And I didn't know where to put the organs back.

[2272] and I didn't want to put the organs in the wrong spot because then they'll die.

[2273] It'll bleed out.

[2274] Sure, sure.

[2275] So I had to just let it sit there.

[2276] And I'm getting it towed tomorrow.

[2277] Okay.

[2278] To an auto body shop.

[2279] It'll all be fine.

[2280] And then, as you know, I got my ears repierced.

[2281] Not the one that went rancid that you saved you from.

[2282] Took care of.

[2283] Took care of biz.

[2284] Before you went septic.

[2285] I got in there just before you went septic.

[2286] I just got my second and third holes repierced.

[2287] But now the third hole is feeling a little itchy.

[2288] Are you putting your alcohol and all the stuff you're supposed to do?

[2289] Yeah, but I think I am touching it too much because I have a fixation.

[2290] You tried bleach?

[2291] Oh my God.

[2292] Good idea.

[2293] Dip your ear and bleach.

[2294] It's good for the dermis.

[2295] Yeah.

[2296] So you might have to do another.

[2297] I don't want you to because I want You want some You want a story I do, I want it your story Yeah I understand I almost when I was in there I was four seconds away from saying Just go ahead and do that Oh the top Yeah the top It would be my third time trying Fool me once shame I mean come on I know it looks so cool Repeating the same thing And expecting different results I guess this is why people keep smoking Because it looks so cool Yeah you try shave in one of your sides before you do that i know you you really want me to do that i'm never doing that i like my hair yeah it's fantastic just think how cool it'd look with one side i'm not i'm not cool like that i know you want me to be so punk rock you just decide you think genetically people are but i don't you don't desire right like no shade to punk rockers i think they're awesome but i don't look at them and think i wish i can be like that what about i'm like the row.

[2298] What about the girl, though, where we first saw this?

[2299] You love her.

[2300] Yeah.

[2301] You don't?

[2302] You love that girl, yes.

[2303] Okay.

[2304] You do or you don't?

[2305] I can't remember.

[2306] She's great.

[2307] She's cool looking.

[2308] She's Danish.

[2309] She's, okay.

[2310] She has, it is a girl on a TV show that we all watch together, Stranger Things.

[2311] She had a shaved side.

[2312] Yeah.

[2313] I think you guys look a lot alike.

[2314] And you think we look like, and so you want me to do a shave side.

[2315] so I look as cool as her.

[2316] Yeah, yep.

[2317] But, you know, I'm just not going to do it.

[2318] What if I was like, what if I was like, tax?

[2319] I just think you should try.

[2320] Yeah, hit me. I'll tell you how I feel.

[2321] Because I really, really like it.

[2322] Uh -huh.

[2323] For six months, can you just, or no, I'm sorry, for a year.

[2324] Can you wear polo shirts?

[2325] Because I, like, I love polo shirts.

[2326] I can't come into that.

[2327] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[2328] But to me, there's a possible win for you, and I don't see the win of me wearing polo shirts every day.

[2329] A ton of people wear polo shirts love it.

[2330] It looks great.

[2331] Because they've given up.

[2332] No. Guys are like, I don't know what to do, but I'm supposed to look good.

[2333] So I guess I wear this polo shirt.

[2334] Trust me. That's what every dude who wears a polo shirt thing.

[2335] That's not fair or true.

[2336] I have many people in my life who are polo shirts.

[2337] And they're like, they're amped about it.

[2338] And that's their thing.

[2339] Oh, my God, there's a new polo shirt out.

[2340] It's exactly the same as the other one, but it's a different color.

[2341] Yes.

[2342] Okay.

[2343] Well, I'm glad to.

[2344] They're enjoying that.

[2345] I think it's a standard move for guys who have entered a certain socioeconomic bracket.

[2346] And they're like, what am I supposed to do now?

[2347] Well, you're supposed to golf and then you're supposed to wear these polo shirts.

[2348] Hopefully with the polo logo on it.

[2349] Yeah, hopefully.

[2350] Best case.

[2351] I don't think so.

[2352] That's if you're a hipster.

[2353] No. Not originally.

[2354] Right.

[2355] But they went through a whole phase where they disappeared.

[2356] Now these guys who want to go golfing, they've got to have polo.

[2357] They're not trying to fuck around with LaCosta.

[2358] I don't think.

[2359] I think more younger people that are cool that want to wear polos a little more funky -wise, they're into La Costa.

[2360] See, I'm actually an expert on Polo shirts.

[2361] You aren't.

[2362] You aren't.

[2363] I could get a few experts on the phone right now.

[2364] Well, let me just ask you, Rob.

[2365] If you had to wear a polo shirt, would you wear a polo brand or La Costa?

[2366] I think I wouldn't wear a polo shirt.

[2367] Right.

[2368] I don't know enough about...

[2369] You'd either have the alligator or you'd have the polo shirt.

[2370] The polo logo.

[2371] Probably the polo.

[2372] Yeah, you'd wear, I feel like you'd wear polo.

[2373] Oh, really?

[2374] I think you'd wear lacosso.

[2375] I guess why you keep calling it LaCosta.

[2376] What's it called?

[2377] Lecost.

[2378] LaCost?

[2379] Yeah.

[2380] Oh my God, what a diff.

[2381] You're an A. I would probably find one that didn't have either logo, though.

[2382] No, no, that's not.

[2383] The question is you have to wear either a polo shirt or a lacost shirt, alligator shirt.

[2384] I can answer this for you.

[2385] You would wear an alligator shirt.

[2386] No. I just answered he would wear a polo in because it's at least then it's classic.

[2387] You're wearing a, you're essentially wearing a polo shirt right now.

[2388] No, that's a button down.

[2389] That's a way to, you don't understand what.

[2390] It's a button, short sleeve button down that they honestly sell it, Ralph Lauren.

[2391] If Rob was wearing a straight up polo shirt, you would be like, what's Rob?

[2392] It would be so alarming.

[2393] I know.

[2394] You have to admit that.

[2395] It would, yeah.

[2396] Well, if either of you were.

[2397] Yeah, you'd be like, what is he trying to pull off?

[2398] Yeah, you're preppy.

[2399] Is that?

[2400] You're a prep.

[2401] You're a prep.

[2402] I'm a greaser, girl.

[2403] You're a soche.

[2404] You don't even know what that means.

[2405] No, I do.

[2406] It's from, oh, I thought it was from Greece.

[2407] Yeah.

[2408] Well, they were greasers too.

[2409] Another thing I hate.

[2410] Is grease?

[2411] Yeah, I hate grease.

[2412] Oh, wow.

[2413] So I don't know that I'd say I'm a prep.

[2414] Would you?

[2415] I can be open to this.

[2416] Yeah, I mean, yeah, you're preppy.

[2417] I mean, cheerleaders are kind of the definition of preppy.

[2418] And like you're playing being a stereotype.

[2419] Well, no, like your outfits, like I could see you at a country club and all these outfits.

[2420] They're like upscale.

[2421] They scream upscale.

[2422] They thank you.

[2423] They are upscale.

[2424] Right.

[2425] But to me, you can be upscale and also not preppy.

[2426] Are you thinking of like WASP specific Tommy Hillfigure ad, East Coast?

[2427] Correct.

[2428] Well, if you're thinking about it in that, that way, then no, you're not wearing like all white with polo shirts and shit.

[2429] So I guess it's the extreme version of it.

[2430] You don't look waspy, but you look preppy.

[2431] Okay.

[2432] All right.

[2433] I'll take it.

[2434] I bet no one's used the word preppy in about 25 years.

[2435] Yeah, that's what maybe why I can't connect with it.

[2436] Yeah, my dad loved the word preppy.

[2437] My dad was very preppy.

[2438] He was?

[2439] Oh, my God, yeah.

[2440] My dad had like the biggest appetite for fine clothing of any man you've ever met.

[2441] Oh, my God.

[2442] Oh, my God.

[2443] You lived at the store, Lumavoc.

[2444] Oh, you got all these suits.

[2445] They got to Lumavoid.

[2446] Then he was in the polo shop at Lord and Taylor.

[2447] They had their own, like, Polo had its own shop.

[2448] And he'd get, like, every color when he made some money.

[2449] Did he wear jeans?

[2450] Almost never.

[2451] Just like slacks.

[2452] Slacks, yeah, and loafers.

[2453] He wore loafers.

[2454] And did he wear a lot of belts?

[2455] Jewelry.

[2456] Yeah, he wore lots of jewelry.

[2457] Like what?

[2458] He had, like, gold, you know, bracelet and a necklace with some gold charms and a ring.

[2459] Wow.

[2460] Yeah, he was into a Coutrema.

[2461] But that makes messages, though, because I don't imagine preppys.

[2462] to wear jewelry.

[2463] Well, obviously that part's mixed messages, but to wear jewelry.

[2464] That feels a little more like flashy.

[2465] I just remember anytime we would end up in a polo shirt because it was fucking photos at whatever, you know?

[2466] And he'd go, oh, you guys look preppy.

[2467] Like preppy was a good thing.

[2468] Dave, you look preppy.

[2469] Like, he wanted us to look preppy.

[2470] He wanted us to look socioeconomically thriving.

[2471] Yeah.

[2472] My dad had great clothes and great cars.

[2473] Yeah.

[2474] Like, yeah, great style.

[2475] You've probably heard my mother tell you that.

[2476] Like, he could decorate a house, like no one's business.

[2477] You would think for sure that some woman had done it.

[2478] Yeah, that's cool.

[2479] Yeah, he had really good style.

[2480] I like that about him.

[2481] And he's good dancer.

[2482] See, now we say some good, since we earlier we talked about his poison ivy.

[2483] Now we can talk about his style.

[2484] He's a great dancer, too.

[2485] That's good as Bruno Mars?

[2486] Probably.

[2487] Different weight class, but.

[2488] Oh, my God.

[2489] Okay.

[2490] I love my dad.

[2491] I know.

[2492] I know.

[2493] We all love your dad.

[2494] When you really paint that picture, like, he's a real anomaly.

[2495] He's in Michigan dressing like he lives in Manhattan.

[2496] Yeah.

[2497] And he's got great style.

[2498] He loves a dance.

[2499] And he's fighting at the gas station.

[2500] Yeah.

[2501] Yeah.

[2502] I thought that about my dad the other day.

[2503] I really was like, he's unique.

[2504] Mm -hmm.

[2505] An original.

[2506] He is.

[2507] Yeah.

[2508] I don't know many like him.

[2509] I'd like to see him shave one of his sides I don't talk to him That's not gonna he's old I know what I'm gonna talk about it's gonna look like a Disease He might allow me to do it for the free haircut Don't you think I could talk him into Like let me cut your hair save you a trip Barber And I'll shave one side He goes to gray cuts Clips Whatever it's called Great clips I used to work there You did?

[2510] My first job when I was 15 Did you cut hair?

[2511] Did you mom?

[2512] Of course he didn't cut him.

[2513] I swept and cleaned cums.

[2514] They don't just let anyone walk in.

[2515] Well, if I tell my dad that you used to work at Great Clips, he probably let Rob do it.

[2516] It was 15.

[2517] Ironically, because I'm a pretty good hair.

[2518] I know, but he likes to know about people's credentials.

[2519] Okay.

[2520] Well, he's going to miss out on a gem of a great hair cutter, and he's going to got a guy who swept the floors and he's going to butcher his hair.

[2521] Yeah, he is.

[2522] No, I cut Calvin's hair sometimes.

[2523] And how do you do?

[2524] What do you give it out of ten?

[2525] And be honest.

[2526] About a six or seven.

[2527] That's pretty good.

[2528] That is pretty good.

[2529] A lot of parents do it.

[2530] Yeah, my mom used to do it to me. Wasn't great.

[2531] She'd a bad job.

[2532] I watched a lot of videos to figure it out.

[2533] Well, now, yeah, now.

[2534] Now anyone.

[2535] Nothing counts now.

[2536] I think my, actually, I think my mom now cuts my dad's hair.

[2537] But if somebody even told me they split an atom in their basement, I'd be like, yeah, of course.

[2538] You watch it on YouTube.

[2539] Right.

[2540] Okay.

[2541] A couple facts.

[2542] Poor Allison.

[2543] One is, because you said Nike has had.

[2544] had or has Arthur Ash under contract no I said that yeah Arthur Ash is dead Arthur Ash is dead yeah yeah also passed also respectful yeah his fight is over yeah well his legacy lives on absolutely yeah there's the Ash tennis Arthur Ashe Stadium at UCLA is that where it is I'm pretty sure no so I've been Arthur Ashe Stadium is where the U .S. Open is in New York.

[2545] Do we have one on UCLA as well?

[2546] I think we have an Ash something.

[2547] Speaking of U .S. Open.

[2548] Okay.

[2549] There's a, do you want?

[2550] Yeah, go ahead.

[2551] UCLA Arthur Ash Student Health and Wellness Center.

[2552] Oh.

[2553] Nice.

[2554] There we go.

[2555] Close.

[2556] You spent lots of time there.

[2557] Picking up condoms.

[2558] No. I didn't wear condoms.

[2559] I was with three.

[2560] It was raw dogging my way through that whole education.

[2561] You were in an open relationship.

[2562] With a severely broken hand from a battle I had had on the weekend and had them deal with it.

[2563] Yeah.

[2564] Yeah, that was my one trip there.

[2565] They gave me a cast.

[2566] It was pretty great.

[2567] That's nice.

[2568] Speaking of U .S. Open, since I got into the tennis show so deeply, I really want to go to the U .S. Open this year.

[2569] Oh, wow.

[2570] Okay.

[2571] That doesn't shock me. And I think I'll thrive here.

[2572] He goes there?

[2573] Everyone.

[2574] Tune into a U .S. Open.

[2575] Can you get me tickets?

[2576] Oh, I don't know.

[2577] I don't know.

[2578] Well, Anthony and Allison could get me Taylor Swift tickets so I probably should be able to get me U .S. Open tickets.

[2579] No, I'm so into tennis now.

[2580] You've got to go straight to the...

[2581] And I want to go to Wimbledon.

[2582] I know, but I missed Wimbledon.

[2583] I didn't watch the tennis show until after.

[2584] September.

[2585] In New York.

[2586] Yeah.

[2587] At Arthur Ash.

[2588] No, it'll be Leo sitting there with Cooper sitting there with...

[2589] It's the who's who.

[2590] But I don't think I can get those type of tickets, but I just want to go.

[2591] Well, it all is like what match.

[2592] There's a hundred fucking matches.

[2593] You can go to the final match.

[2594] So that's going to be like Spielberg and Billy Joel.

[2595] It'll be other people.

[2596] I can buy the ticket.

[2597] 6 ,000.

[2598] That might be light.

[2599] No, it's not.

[2600] I already looked at.

[2601] I did look into this.

[2602] How much is a ticket?

[2603] There were some 2 ,000 tickets.

[2604] For what match?

[2605] Final match.

[2606] Really?

[2607] Mm -hmm.

[2608] I'm shocked.

[2609] And I mean, not in the very front, but not like super high up.

[2610] Well, now they know what Taylor Swift concert is, it's a little insulting.

[2611] That's what I thought.

[2612] I was like, wow, these are nothing.

[2613] Exactly.

[2614] Relative to the Swift concert tickets, everything's a bargain.

[2615] That brings me to one of my facts.

[2616] Okay.

[2617] Which is more of a thought.

[2618] Well, we were talked about the NCAA having like hoity -to -y racism, like taking away the Heism and stuff like that.

[2619] I'm going to talk to all about a lot about that.

[2620] Mm -hmm.

[2621] And I noticed that so much in the tennis dock.

[2622] I was getting so mad at these.

[2623] The way they were evaluating the Brown players?

[2624] Well, yeah.

[2625] And mainly this one boy, bad boy of tennis.

[2626] Oh, yeah, from Australia.

[2627] Yes.

[2628] His name's Nick.

[2629] And he is called the bad boy of tennis.

[2630] And he is, like, rude and stuff.

[2631] Yeah.

[2632] But I hated the way some of the other players were talking.

[2633] talking about him because they were like, this is a gentleman's sport.

[2634] And I was like, ew.

[2635] Also, they need to watch some John McEnroe matches from the 80s and tell me if it's a gentleman's sport.

[2636] He was yelling, fuck you at the line judges and throwing his racket across.

[2637] I mean, no one had bigger meltdowns than McEnroe.

[2638] Jimmy Connors, too.

[2639] Yeah, and I think Agassi had a couple moments.

[2640] It's pretty common.

[2641] Yeah, and then one of them even said, like, this isn't basketball or this isn't the NBA or something.

[2642] And I hated that.

[2643] I hated that.

[2644] I was like, it should be the NBA.

[2645] Basketball games are fun, and that's why.

[2646] See, here's where it gets, as these things often get really tricky.

[2647] His behavior's not great.

[2648] No, I know.

[2649] That's why he fucks himself.

[2650] Like, his behavior's not good.

[2651] He doesn't have any harness on his emotions.

[2652] Yeah, exactly.

[2653] But then when you start bringing an NBA, that gets, you know, clearly we're veering into, like, some racism.

[2654] So, you know.

[2655] And this, like, that's not what this sport is.

[2656] Tradition.

[2657] Yes, like the words they use around it.

[2658] Exactly.

[2659] It's just synonymous with white.

[2660] Yeah.

[2661] Which is so.

[2662] Well, we do everything right.

[2663] That's why it rhymes with white.

[2664] White is right.

[2665] White is right.

[2666] So I am a huge fan, which is contradictory to me. I am a huge fan of the bad boy of tennis.

[2667] You like bad boys.

[2668] I don't know when you play.

[2669] You're a preppy girl.

[2670] You're a soche that falls in love with greasers.

[2671] No, I don't like when people can't control themselves.

[2672] Well, he can't control themselves.

[2673] I know.

[2674] I know.

[2675] That's what I'm saying.

[2676] I love them, by that.

[2677] way i think that was the best episode of that show well this is what i'm saying normally i see that and i'm like can you just get your shit together please but that's more because i find that chaos scary but now that it's in juxtaposition to people saying he's not a gentleman and stuff then i i want him to keep being bad right anyway i just wanted to bring that yeah yeah he's hot too he's hot there are a lot of hot tennis players i'm realizing after watching that show they're all very young though.

[2678] I think they're, I'm too old for them.

[2679] Okay.

[2680] Nick was born in 95.

[2681] Oh.

[2682] Nick Currios.

[2683] Yeah.

[2684] Okay.

[2685] So back to Arthur Ash and Nike.

[2686] I wanted to read the 10 most expensive Nike shoe endorsements.

[2687] Okay.

[2688] Jordan, 60 million a year.

[2689] Although, okay.

[2690] You don't like when I add stuff to these things.

[2691] So let's take it at that.

[2692] It's way more than that.

[2693] Well, yeah, because you're not including, this is not including the revenue from the shoe.

[2694] The royalty, right?

[2695] This is just an upfront number.

[2696] This is the number of the contract.

[2697] 60 million a year.

[2698] Okay.

[2699] Number two is Rory McClory.

[2700] What?

[2701] Wait.

[2702] Is that a golfer?

[2703] Yeah.

[2704] Rory.

[2705] Oh, and I forgot Tiger.

[2706] Mickelroy.

[2707] Oh, yeah.

[2708] He's 25 million a year.

[2709] Okay.

[2710] Number three?

[2711] Mm -hmm.

[2712] He's 20 million a year.

[2713] Okay.

[2714] LeBron is 15.

[2715] Uh -huh.

[2716] Raphael Nadal, ding, ding, ding, ding, tennis, 10.

[2717] Uh -huh.

[2718] Derek Jeter is also 10.

[2719] Federer, 10.

[2720] A lot of 10, not the 10 strata.

[2721] It's still current, even though they're not playing?

[2722] This is from...

[2723] This is probably just the all -time.

[2724] Okay.

[2725] Federer 10, Maria Sharapova 10...

[2726] I'm sorry, Maria Sharapova 8 .75.

[2727] Mm -hmm.

[2728] And Kevin Durant, 8 .5.

[2729] Kobe 8.

[2730] So Kevin Durant just got a lifetime Nike contract.

[2731] Mm. And there's only LeBron, Jordan, and Cristiano Ronaldo.

[2732] Are they, they're the only what?

[2733] Lifetime contracts.

[2734] Oh, Lifetime contracts.

[2735] And now Kevin Durant.

[2736] Oh, wow.

[2737] I know.

[2738] Jordan's made $1 .3 billion from Nike.

[2739] Yeah, just watch Air like I did.

[2740] Just check it out.

[2741] It's very watchable.

[2742] Um, okay.

[2743] Now, have dress sizes for women change so people can say they're smaller size?

[2744] Yes.

[2745] And it's called vanity sizing.

[2746] Hmm.

[2747] And it makes sense if you ever shopped vintage.

[2748] Oh, because you probably get the wrong size really easily.

[2749] If you're a six, it would be like a 16 or something in vintage.

[2750] Yeah.

[2751] It's great.

[2752] It's, yeah, it's much different.

[2753] something here said that an eight in the 50s is now a double zero there you go which I think even shoe size is also a little bit probably manipulated over time I'm sure yeah so funny because women would in the 80s they'd be like I love I'm a five and and they would name the brand I'm a five in glory Estevan and that's a positive thing because she might be a six in Calvin Klein so it's like people are going to just pick that gene because there are five in it instead of a six somewhere else.

[2754] So you get and then you get into a size war because they all know that.

[2755] Yeah.

[2756] I wish there was an equivalent on the male size.

[2757] Like there was some kind of a gusset measurement in your groin and they started acting like it was humongous.

[2758] Would belt be like that?

[2759] Well like men don't want a bigger waist.

[2760] Oh right.

[2761] They just want bigger dingus.

[2762] Right.

[2763] Testy and dingy.

[2764] So I don't know.

[2765] There was anything that we would have to buy.

[2766] I bet it would go the other way.

[2767] Well, condoms.

[2768] That What's that equivalent?

[2769] Like if you have to get a baby petite condom?

[2770] There's only regular and then magnum.

[2771] Oh, there's only two sizes?

[2772] When I was in the gown.

[2773] I don't think they make baby condoms.

[2774] They should.

[2775] What about four babies?

[2776] I mean, how more babies are supposed to do sex safely.

[2777] Okay.

[2778] So Ambien, we hit on Ambien.

[2779] Yeah, women metabolize Ambien reaching maximum blood levels 45 % higher than those of men.

[2780] And that's it.

[2781] That's everything.

[2782] She was a delight.

[2783] She was a delight, and she's a secret rascal, I can tell.

[2784] You can't talk about her, though, and not say cute.

[2785] Like, she's quintessentially cute.

[2786] So cute.

[2787] I know, it's weird that cute has now become...

[2788] A pejorative?

[2789] Well, I don't know if it's...

[2790] If anyone gets told they're cute, I think it's fine.

[2791] Well, I guess it depends on the context.

[2792] Well, if you're going like, oh, well, that's cute, she wants to raise, that's one use of the word cute.

[2793] Yeah, true.

[2794] And some people want to be seen as sexy and not cute.

[2795] Yeah, I think.

[2796] But it's positive.

[2797] I think it's because originally you think of children as cute or babies as cute.

[2798] Yeah.

[2799] And then I guess people feel like, well, no, I'm not a kid.

[2800] I'm an adult.

[2801] I'm a big sexy woman.

[2802] I'm a size three, but I'm a big sexy woman.

[2803] Um, yeah, so that was, that was a fun one.

[2804] Yeah, all right, love you.

[2805] Love you.

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