E37: Joe Wicks - Changing Millions Of Lives in 15 Seconds!

[0] Joe Wicks, the body coach.

[1] You know, I've met, interviewed and had the chance to understand the motivations, personalities and the desires of hundreds of successful people over the last five years.

[2] And it continues to blow my mind how different every individual is.

[3] We often hunt for the secrets that made a certain person successful.

[4] What made them succeed?

[5] But interestingly, the more I've interviewed successful people, the less patterns I've been able to identify.

[6] Maybe that is the secret.

[7] Maybe there is no secret.

[8] Joe grew up on a council estate in London.

[9] His mum left school at 15 years old.

[10] She had her first baby, age 17, which is Joe's older brother, and then Joe arrived just two years after that.

[11] She was always on benefits.

[12] She didn't have a clue about food or fitness.

[13] And Joe, he was predominantly raised on a diet of sandwiches, pasta and chocolate.

[14] Joe's dad, he was a drug addict, and he was continually in and out of rehab.

[15] And so his home life and upbringing was far from the white picket fence and parental solidarity that you often see in movies.

[16] Growing up, Joe aspired to be a pea teacher.

[17] But after eventually finding work as a teaching assistant, he realized that he wasn't cut out for it.

[18] It just wasn't for him.

[19] He switched lanes, borrowed money from his parents to buy kettlebells in a personal training course, and soon after that, he became a personal trainer.

[20] After handing out flies in his local area, outside tube stations, and anywhere he could, so few people turned up to his classes that he was, unable to pay his parents back the £2 ,000 they had lent him.

[21] He recalls being so upset by the lack of clients he had and by the prospect of not being able to pay his parents back, but he was not prepared to give up.

[22] Soon after this, he had the idea to start posting short recipe videos on his Instagram and his now famous 15 -second recipe videos called Lean in 15 exploded.

[23] Joe doubled on social media and he eventually became one of the most followed health and fitness channels on Instagram.

[24] His first published cookbook, Leanin 15, was a best -selling book in 2015.

[25] Lean in 15 has been translated into 18 languages around the world and sold over 1 million copies in the first year alone.

[26] He is a Channel 4 television presenter with his own show called The Body Coach.

[27] Joe has sold over 3 million books and has the second best -selling cookbook of all time.

[28] He sold 40 ,000 copies of his fitness DVD in a single week and he's allegedly responsible for a 25 % in in broccoli sales.

[29] He's worth tens of millions.

[30] He's an investor, a husband, a new dad, and quite honestly, one of the most genuine, real, authentic people have had the pleasure of meeting.

[31] Joe was the same guy on and off the podcast.

[32] He was sincere.

[33] He genuinely wants to lead a health, fitness and well -being revolution that will positively impact the lives of everyone from your kids to your grandparents.

[34] So why do I think he's been so successful?

[35] I think he's the right guy at the right time, on the right platform with the right message, fueled by real passion and guided by pure intentions.

[36] You know, when you meet someone and you think to yourself, I'm so glad that this person became successful.

[37] Joe is one of those people, and his mission now is to get young people all across the UK fit and exercising.

[38] The world really is his oyster.

[39] So without further ado, this is the diary of a CEO and I'm Stephen Bartlett.

[40] I hope nobody is listening.

[41] But if you are, then please keep this to yourself.

[42] Joe, an absolute honor to be in your presence.

[43] You're a heavily, heavily admired young man for a variety of reasons.

[44] I want to get right into it because there's so much for us to talk about today.

[45] I guess the place I want to start is with context.

[46] And the context I'm kind of looking for is the context of who Joe is and why.

[47] And I guess a lot of that will come from your childhood and your early experiences.

[48] I think that's the foundation of everybody.

[49] What's the story of Joe Wick's childhood?

[50] Well, firstly, thanks for having me on the podcast.

[51] I'm a recent listener, and I am well into it, mate.

[52] Honestly, your honesty, your openness and your self -awareness of just life and learnings and business.

[53] I think it's really, really inspirational.

[54] So I'm buzzing to be on it.

[55] Oh, thanks, man. And I was actually on a five -hour journey up to York, and I listened to that three or four, and I was like, this is going to be a really good chat.

[56] So which ones are your favourite podcasts from The Divers Year?

[57] Which ones are the ones that you've enjoyed?

[58] So the first I listened to was the Toby Pierce, which is obviously quite close.

[59] to me because I'm a massive fan of Kayla and what she's achieved and he's a very, very interesting guy and I was really just blown away by the growth and the kind of the dedication and the consistency with their brand because they never they never promote anything.

[60] It's just always the app.

[61] And you can see where that effort has come out because I think they said, you know, up to 35 million people are using it.

[62] I also love the chat with Ben Francis from Jim Shark.

[63] He's very inspiring.

[64] I really believe there's two types of people in this world.

[65] There's people that genuinely like from their heart and soul love to see someone succeed and then there's people that just can't quite really truly be happy for other people you know what I mean that may not be from like a jealousy perspective or an envy but maybe they just like they just can't maybe they just wish it was them but when I see stories like you and I see stories like Ben I just get fascinated I'm drawn to successful people and I love I don't want to drill down and find out what is it they've done and what have they you know what behaviours have they learned or kind of implement to achieve that success so do you know what I mean about that yeah and do you know what I think there's something remarkable even from spending a couple of moments with you today there's something remarkably authentic about you and I think this for me forms part of the picture as to why you've resonated with a lot of people because um you've been on social media a long time and people are going to figure out who the real joe wicks is eventually especially when you're constantly making videos and content and just from the you know I don't know I've been in about 20 minutes now I've your authenticity I think is part of the reason why um people have been drawn to you.

[66] So I've totally evaded the first question.

[67] My childhood, that's the thing.

[68] If you had met me as a kid, you know, you just would, well, basically, I come from a pretty kind of hectic, chaotic, you know, upbringing.

[69] I was, I grew up in a council estate.

[70] My dad was in and out of rehab for drug addiction.

[71] So I was around quite a, quite a chaotic home and a lot of shout and a lot of, you know, verbal abuse and whatnot.

[72] And I was, I was very hyperactive, maybe that, you know, I had behaviour issues.

[73] I didn't have very good attention span.

[74] I wasn't academic and I couldn't focus on anything for very long.

[75] But as a kid, I was very into like fitness and activity and moving and I always, I was going to use that as a release I imagine because I was just always on the move.

[76] So I wasn't like an overweight kid, even though my diet was terrible.

[77] But you would have looked at me and thought he's going to end up in prison or he's going to end up on drugs.

[78] That's what you really would have thought about me because I was just climbing the walls.

[79] I was swearing.

[80] I was up and, you know, running about and didn't respect any kind of rules as such.

[81] I was a bit of a, I was probably, I was more like a class clown than an actual, like, naughty kid, but I was just always attention seeking and disruptive.

[82] So you wouldn't have looked and thought that's going to be like an entrepreneur and that's going to be someone who's going to like go on to connect with millions of people and help other people with, you know, with my business.

[83] Did you ever see yourself becoming, what did you think you were going to become in your own head?

[84] That's a good question.

[85] And I think I, like I said, I don't come from an ambitious family.

[86] We're not a family of entrepreneurs.

[87] You know, my mom's a social worker who left school at the age of 15 with no qualifications.

[88] She had me and my brother by the time she was 19.

[89] She was really young.

[90] And my dad's a roofer.

[91] So we weren't pushed to go to university.

[92] We weren't encouraged to do anything other than be happy.

[93] My mum and dad always used to say for all the drama and trouble I went through as a kid, one thing I always had was love and support.

[94] I always knew that my dad loved me. I always knew that my mum was there for me. And she used to say, I don't care if you're a dustman or a doctor, I'll always love you.

[95] And having that kind of feeling and that support behind you definitely.

[96] made me feel relaxed about who I was going to be.

[97] I wasn't under pressure to be anything.

[98] But in my head, all I was ever going to be was a PE teacher.

[99] I thought I'd be a school teacher because I'd work with kids and I'd have fun and I'd have summer holidays and maybe get a mortgage and have a house one day.

[100] But it's really weird when you come from that culture of not much self -belief and not, no expectations, you know, like there's no one around me doing a lot and succeeding in a lot as a kid.

[101] And so my ambition and my motivation came really just through having fun and putting content out and realizing that I have an ability to connect with people on a really deep level.

[102] So there's this, I guess, this stereotype that entrepreneurs are so intentional that they were like, you know, selling suites in primary school and they've always been hustlers and, you know, motivated and they come from, you know, part of the stereotype as well, unfortunately, is that they come from, you know, great families or that they have, that they have money or some kind of advantage.

[103] That's a stereotype that kind of varies, but you kind of really buck that, that stereotype and that trend, because from what you've just said there, not only didn't you ever think you were going to be an entrepreneur, people around you didn't really think you were going to be an entrepreneur either.

[104] And it happened, I guess, through the love of something and the passion and that ability to resonate with people.

[105] And that's why, honestly, from just like the meeting meeting you for like 20 minutes I'm like okay the author because my job here and the reason why I travel and meet guests often is because I'm trying to figure out why they became successful so I can take a bit of that into my own life but also I'm trying to like debunk stereotypes and your authenticity and how like when I met you I'm like there's no other version of you like you're not going to walk out this door now and say oh I think fuck he's gone prick like yeah no that's true and you're like you said when you live your life on social media for Instagram and stories every day like you can't hide you can only you can you can you can put on a face and be a character but how far is that going to get you and i've always just been really honest and really um passionate and and i've and i very recently i've got into this thing where i i never used to believe in the secret and the law of attraction i think it's a bit you know wishy -washy but in the last month or so i've been putting out a lot of positive content really powerful inspirational stuff and i've realized i've actually become a kind of channel just for my my philosophy and my energy but when I put positive stuff out there it's coming back in waves and waves and I feel like I'm in this flow state where I'm putting out content I'm reaching out to people and sharing their testimonials and their stories and it's coming back in waves I mean I'm spending so much time at the moment doing DMs and voice notes to people and I'm not just a fitness training I'm counselling these people I'm life coaching them and I've realized I love it like I really enjoy it people that have really deep stuff like been suicidal or in relationships or going through depression or eating disorders and I used to find it really hard to reply but now I take a moment to read and I flag them when I've got the energy I come back and I send them a voice note and I always bring it back to the thing of you know getting yourself moving maybe get out some fresh air do some exercise and bring it back to exercise so I'm not trying to be a counsellor but I'm giving these people like a little bit of information or a tiny little catalyst or a nudging the right direction to get them feeling happier and it's so powerful sometimes it's just letting them know that someone gives a F about them you know or cares that of what they've said as opposed to the advice itself it's just that you know what it's listening yeah and I can never read one and I can't read a message like that and ignore it I just can't I can't let them see that I've read it and not kind of giving them my attention and it might just be a 15 second voice note but that means so much to people and so I can continue doing that and my dad said the other day like you know be careful because a girl came to her I did a meetup and she was in recovery for cocaine addiction and she said she came to a hill sprint session at 8 o 'clock in the morning on Richmond Hill and she asked me to record a message for her for her group and before I thought about it I was thinking right I really need to think what I'm going to say and I had this really emotional feeling that she's gone from having a really tough struggle and she's been really you know struggling to get off of her addiction through through drugs and she's turned up at 8 o 'clock in the morning to run up and down a hill with me and I found that so inspiring so I shared that message and now the last week or so I've had so many people you know in recovery and addiction saying how amazing that one story was so you know my dad said to me joe be careful because the addicts have they They love vampires.

[106] They want attention and they don't know when to stop and they'll keep asking.

[107] And I said, Dad, what you don't realize is they're actually, it's giving me energy.

[108] I mean, I'm feeling alive and happier doing this right now than I've ever been.

[109] And I think he didn't quite understand where that was coming from.

[110] But it's because I'm having an impact, so I'm helping people that it isn't, it isn't kind of draining me. It's actually in a way, like lifting me up.

[111] And like I said, I've become a vehicle for this positive energy and this message that I'm spread in.

[112] And it's way more than just fitness now.

[113] It's becoming, I'm really, I'm inspiring people to change their lives to get out of relationships.

[114] Not like on purpose, but just by the way I am, people are really kind of leaning on me and I think it's such a wonderful position to be in and it's really like what makes me happy on a daily basis.

[115] And yeah, so like, you know, people will look at you and here's what, I think here's what they'll think.

[116] Good looking guy on Instagram, delivers great fitness advice, making a lot of money.

[117] I bet that his ambition or his motivation is coming from making all this money and looking beautiful.

[118] Is that correct?

[119] It's so far from who I am and the truth.

[120] And when I do get negative sentiment on social media, if it's about people call me a sellout or saying he's just about the money and he's...

[121] What do they say?

[122] What's the...

[123] The negative sentiment is like, so I don't believe that the general population should count calories.

[124] I don't and I just think you should focus on healthy cooking and regular exercise and by doing that, you naturally put yourself in an energy deficit and therefore you can get lean and stay healthy.

[125] And also that I'm a sellout, and that it was all about money and the whole thing with Instagram and Lean 15 or any deal that I get, it's all about money.

[126] And I really think that the money is as a bipartisan of success, but the real success is that I've been able to talk to you, your mom, your nan, seven -year -old kids that turned up to my events.

[127] Like I'm talking to such a wide demographic of people that, and it does, you know, it comes from personal trainers.

[128] It's always personal trainers.

[129] I never get like a random mum or dad follow me saying, oh, what a sellout or, you know, he's lying.

[130] keeping information from these followers like it's always personal trainers and snobbery and you know that comes from a place of um you know jealousy and envy and i actually used to get upset used to really affect me on a spiritual and emotional level i would lay in bed thinking how can someone so positive so um passionate of putting out such a good message still be getting dug out by these people but i know it comes from a frustration like when i was a personal trainer running around doing boot camps clients cance on you and not people not turning up it's a tough industry it's difficult it's stressful and it's hard to make a true you know truly make a career out of it so i'm actually more compassionate of people that attack me now how do you deal with it now someone says joe you're you know you're hit or whatever and they start coming at you for things that really matter to you like your work yeah how do you deal with it like talk me through it you open your phone you look on instagram there is personal trainer ken and he said some stuff what what goes through your mind so it used to affect me. Like I used to get really, you know, upset.

[131] Like it would drain my energy and make me feel really low.

[132] What about all the positive comments?

[133] Yeah.

[134] So now I've learned to, basically, the positive stuff I'm doing, it drowns out the negative.

[135] I never engage in negative comments.

[136] I never reply, you know, people like do podcasts and videos about me and dedicate their time to like slagging me off and saying how bad my messages.

[137] But I always think, why have I sold three million cookbooks?

[138] Why have I got five million people following me?

[139] And I always come back to, it's because my message, I've never ever talked about calories.

[140] I never talked about people.

[141] tracking this and counting that and so I'm doing something right and I just I've learned to kind of just have a moment and read a positive comment and it drowns that out but one of the most hurtful things was when someone said I'm surprised he's not charging them kids for the hit sessions like all he cares about his money but I actually traveled all around the UK with Nikki and my friend Dom and Glenn we took a cameraman it was self -funded I went to 15 schools in five days I trained with 10 ,000 kids and I was I was knackered and we had brands offering to give us 100 grand to be a part of it and I was like this is about me making an impact I don't want any I don't want to get paid for this and so when someone said that it's like how can you how can you say that when I'm so passionate I'm clearly on this mission and you think I'm going to charge the kids for the hit sessions like so it does hurt it affects you but it might be like a temporary thing it might be a couple of hours whereas before it'd be a few days and it would like affect me and I wouldn't want to do videos I'd be like it's it's kind of making me feel sad like it would make me feel sad I'd sit with Rosie and I'd be like why why are these videos there and stuff but now it might last an hour or two hours and And I can go, right, back to work.

[142] So what has all of that taught you about the nature of haters?

[143] It comes back to that thing of, I look at people like Ben Francis or, you know, Kayla and Emily Sky and amazing people doing great things.

[144] And I get excited by their success.

[145] It inspires me. Whereas to some people, other people's success, makes them feel inadequate or unsuccessful.

[146] They get green with envy and jealousy.

[147] But I always think, how can I learn from these people that are doing these amazing things and be a better, you know, role model or businessman.

[148] So that comes down to that thing of, can you accept other people's success?

[149] And you might experience this.

[150] Even close friends to you that you went to school with, some of them you can just tell are genuinely happy for you.

[151] And the other ones that may say they are, but they're just not quite the same.

[152] And that is just something that is within people.

[153] So I think anyone out of there that feels that jealousy or envy or want to have a stab at someone, try and turn that kind of that feeling into a positive inspiration and be like, right, I want to do a little bit more of what he's doing.

[154] I'm going to be positive.

[155] I'm going to put out a positive message and reach more people.

[156] I just think negativity.

[157] You can't, it won't breathe success.

[158] So for all the people that do send negative stuff my way, I always combat it with more positive, more nice videos, more DMs, more voice notes.

[159] And I get more back.

[160] I'm like, I'm all right.

[161] I'm doing the right thing.

[162] And so I remember that my mission is still the same.

[163] And do you, I think this is something we're all guilty of, including myself.

[164] I can go on a post something that I've put online.

[165] and there will be, there could be a thousand lovely comments.

[166] But it's that one negative comment, because as humans, I think we all have a negativity bias.

[167] I've got to the point now where I, all the positive things people say to me, honestly, this is just the truth, so I don't care if it sounds bad.

[168] It goes over me like a water for ducks back.

[169] I just don't absorb it.

[170] And I think what's happened to me is I've realized that with me personally, I'm unable to accept some things in and not others.

[171] For me, it's either all or nothing.

[172] And I think with people generally, their opinion of themselves is either created by external narratives or society or opinions, or it's not at all.

[173] So I think very early on, I decided that the good and the bad, I'm not going to let it form my opinion of myself.

[174] And I'm going to try my very, very best, to build my own opinion of myself based on my own thought, and my own rationale and my own logic because I'm scared of if I let Jenny over here tell me that I'm amazing and that I was incredible for doing whatever I've done I'm also going to let Dave here from Burnley who says you're an asshole and a failure and a da -da -da -da I'm also going to let him in and so my sort of self -defense has been don't believe any of it but I still full fault of when Dave pops up and says something what is a negative thought what I'm just trying to think why anyone would dig you out like what can I think about everybody gets dug out a guy the other day you're an absolute fraud there's no record of you ever making a million quid anywhere online and there I am in my bedroom thinking do I do I go at him do you engage or not I never engage never go into combat the older the older I've got the more I've learned to just let them go and if I do respond it's with kindness now years ago would you have snapped oh my lord every one of them I would be like publicly or just by DM it would I try and keep it as private as possible especially as my business got bigger and I became, you know, an employer of, you know, 700 people, I have to set a good example.

[175] And there's people following me, and I have to set a good example.

[176] But, you know, when someone says something, you, and they, as you said, they come at something, which is the antithesis of the truth.

[177] When they say, oh, you're selling out to, you know, you're rinsing kids, and you know you've just gone around the country and given to kids, and that's something that's very close to you.

[178] Yeah.

[179] It's one of those things.

[180] Maybe they know that.

[181] They know what's going to nudge you.

[182] They do.

[183] They know what's going to hurt you.

[184] And it is about hurting that person, not.

[185] an emotional level but like I said this I reckon 1 % is negative 99 % of my content and my stuff coming is positive and I'm so I'm so clear with my vision and I'm more I'm you know that thing of purpose driven over profit and I truly believe in that I believe in you know giving before you get given and I gave you know 10 ,000 tweets before I made a single pound on social media and you know hundreds of thousands of comments and tweets and replies to people and all the stuff I've given means that when I release a book in six months time, it becomes a bestseller because the love is there and the attention's there and the respect and the admiration for what you do means that people will support your products.

[186] I think a lot of people assume, well, I've got a million followers there for a million people by my book, but it doesn't work like that.

[187] It really doesn't.

[188] You have to be nurturing people.

[189] Yeah.

[190] And some people would assume that I had a market degree and I understand social media and I did this big digital content course.

[191] But I was in my kitchen, in Surbiton, with my iPhone, shouting out midget trees and broccoli and, you know, Lucy B and all that.

[192] And I had no idea I was building the brand.

[193] There's no idea.

[194] My next question, I guess.

[195] Why were you successful?

[196] So here's the thing.

[197] So there was a guy called Joe Flicks and then there was Joe Wicks.

[198] Both of them were really into fitness and food, healthy eating and all of these kinds of things.

[199] Why were you successful and not this?

[200] apathetical Joe Flicks guy.

[201] What is it about you?

[202] I get asked that question.

[203] I always want to kind of spin it on the person and say, why do you think I stood out?

[204] But I'll ask you that in a second.

[205] So first of all, there's obviously millions of trainers and there's obviously led to people with different philosophies and different ideas.

[206] And I think if I had started today, as Joe Wick, doing the same thing on social media, I wouldn't have had the success that I've had because it was the right time, with the right idea where 15 minutes was a good amount of time for people to get engaged and it was a 15 second video.

[207] I think people's attention spans change.

[208] I think people's, even now, even busier, plus there's probably like a billion news on Instagram.

[209] So my growth was quite, you know, in the early days was quite quick.

[210] But it comes down to I had an idea that was just simple that got people in the kitchen.

[211] You know, like when Jamie Oliver used to get cook it, get you excited about food and made it fun and simple.

[212] And all I did was I took a 15 second Instagram video and showed how to cook a 15 minute meal.

[213] And I called it Lean in 15.

[214] That was the hashtag.

[215] But like I said, there was no real video.

[216] vision.

[217] I didn't think I was going to get a book deal off Hammett million.

[218] And consistency, but also just me as a person, like if you threw me into a room into a party with people I didn't know, I'd come out with a few mates.

[219] You know, I'll just, because I'm, I'm like that.

[220] I like talking to people.

[221] I like getting to know people and I like listening to people as well.

[222] And I think that's a, that's a two -way thing.

[223] Social media is a conversation.

[224] I've always been about what can I do to help you?

[225] What can my content do?

[226] Is it, is it about me showing off my abs and building my ego and feeling great about myself?

[227] Or is it like, can I use this bit of content to make you want to go and do a workout and make you go and feel good.

[228] And so it really, I think it's obviously a personality and a genuine passion when there wasn't really many Instagram fitness people like monetising as such.

[229] You had Kayla was a couple years before me. But I obviously, Kayla and me and some other big people have set the standard that you can make a lot of money through fitness content.

[230] So now when you see fitness Instagramers, yeah, they might really love fitness and want to help you, but they could also know I'm going to make business out of this.

[231] So like here's how I'd summarize it from your assessment.

[232] I imagine it almost like a padlock.

[233] You know the padlocks where you've got to get four numbers in a row?

[234] Yeah.

[235] Right.

[236] And if you get the four numbers in a row, then the lock opens.

[237] Or like the lottery where you've got to get six numbers in a row to win.

[238] I think you got the like proverbial four or five numbers in a row where you're the right person, right?

[239] And when I say the right person, I mean aesthetically you're a good looking guy.

[240] But you also have a lot of, and I took and then also personality traits, consistency, passion, right?

[241] And that's what constitutes my definition of the right person at the right time.

[242] and I think not just in the evolution of social media but in the sort of societal trend of getting healthy, fitness, yeah.

[243] Fitness, recipes, things like, you know, veganism and eating well and look at, you know, I think that's a sort of a rising trend.

[244] I think the right place in terms of the right platforms and things like that.

[245] Yeah, being around at the right time, getting on there early.

[246] The other thing I'd like to add to the right person is your personality because I think people really resonate with you.

[247] And as you said, you can walk in a room and I believe you'll walk out with loads of friends because you're real right and that's something that you just can't fake in the long term and then yeah the last one's the right message delivered in the right way so doing it in a concise way that's simple for jenny in a bedroom or whatever i think that combination is like getting the right number four times on a padlock and it opens i think that's a good analogy actually and i when i go to some of my book signings or i do these random meetups i've got into recently i'll say right meet me rich and park we're going to cycle around and there'll be you know like seven -year -old kids and there'll be 65 old women.

[248] I really speak to everyone because I'm trying to make fitness accessible and fun for everyone.

[249] My whole brand, if I was to summarize my brand, it's like fitness for all, you know, accessible, non -judgmental and I really am on a mission to get people happier.

[250] And it's not just about fat loss and losing weight and look in a certain way.

[251] I'm now way more in tune with the mental health benefits of exercise, you know, elevating your mood, productivity, just general happiness.

[252] And I'm more.

[253] in tune now with that than ever, which is suddenly, I'm talking like the last few weeks since I've started doing the voice notes.

[254] It's really open up a whole new world.

[255] Because I used to sit and do written stuff, but the power of a voice note has allowed me to engage.

[256] And I now realize that I am on a mission so clear that I'm actually working harder now than when you met me four or five years ago.

[257] Like if I, if you met me when I was bang on my phone doing tweets, I was stuck in it.

[258] But now I'm doing more, but more valuable if you know what I mean.

[259] So it's not scalable in terms of I can't do a thousand messages a day, but I'm doing it.

[260] a hundred really good quality ones that are having a massive impact so i'm working harder now than i ever have been i want to talk about that so um there's a few things i want to talk about the voice note thing but the second is about the impacts of fitness this is just a personal thing because i'm i'm on the on a mission to try and get fitter but on the voice note thing a bit of context um ahead of you meeting me today you sent me a voice note on instagram just saying like hey mate they're looking forward to etc etc um and a few other things and that really caught me off guard.

[261] Really?

[262] But in a good way.

[263] You don't, I had voice notes from people yet.

[264] People don't, people send me voice notes, um, but it's rare.

[265] And it's, and it's very personal and like, um, in a really good way.

[266] It's like, he's in my room.

[267] He's here right now.

[268] It's like, oh my God.

[269] And it's like you broke this wall because it was into it.

[270] And it meant that I had to send one back as well, which I liked and I would never have normally done.

[271] But it instantly was like I knew you.

[272] Right.

[273] And I, there's something so powerful about things like that, that most, people don't do that kind of break that wall that I just think is so and it really inspired me actually I thought why why do I sit their type into people when I know my voice and them listening to me when I give them advice would be so much more powerful mate I can't stress it enough like if you are someone on social media who's trying to build an audience or wants to engage and help people by doing that it speeds that it's so much quicker it's so much easy you can read their message as you do it you can you know refer back to what they've said because I'm getting some really intense deep messages that it just wouldn't warrant a couple of texts it would be like it wouldn't really truly listening to them.

[274] So I listen to it, I read it, I digest it, and I send them a little 30, you can send a minute, sorry, a 60 second video, sorry, a 60 second voice note.

[275] And I sometimes do a couple, but the impact that has on people, firstly, they cannot believe you read the message.

[276] So let alone, you know, they think it's someone else.

[277] And like I said, I will come in this living room and I'll do my workout, I'll put Indy to bed, my little daughter, Indy, and I'll come in here.

[278] And I get in here at 7 o 'clock and I go, Rose, I'll be up in an hour, I'm just going to do an hour.

[279] I look at my phone, it's 11 o 'clock.

[280] And I swear to God, in my head, I've been doing it.

[281] hour because I'm I'm enjoying it I love it and I and I'm getting voice notes back and people are like wow I can't believe you can do this thank you so much you have no idea and now I'm used and I always ask the people um you know can I screenshot and share your little testimony on my story I always get permission but by doing that it means there's more and more coming on a daily basis because people go he's reading it he's he's listening he loves it I'm going to reach out to him now on my DMs you got a lot more followers than I have on my DMs it's out of control right like so I get you know depending on what I upload and what I'm doing sort of in terms of my personal brand stuff there's thousands of messages a week and some of them as you mentioned earlier are very personal and really really hard to read at times how do you deal with the amount of DMs you get and how do you decide what to respond to and what and do you read all of them I pretty much open my so my little cousin Luca he's my community manager he kind of overseas because I've got a community about 6 million across all the platform so he'll be the kind of you know the eyes and the ears if you like but in terms of the voice it's always me you know it's always me doing the voice knows it can't be anybody else you can't replicate that so i have a system now where i'm kind of i'm bad in a way that i will do it all day long for the minute i wake up so now i'm trying to sort chunk it and do it in a certain period of time so i might come in the living room and do like three or four hours of it and that does seem crazy but that is my job that's my work that's my energy source is what i do how do you decide what to reply to oh in terms of so i i if it's a really you know a little quick little thing like i don't want to give the game away yeah if it's a little thing like you know hey jo i just try one of your workouts for the first time i loved it i might just send a little emoji say well done have a great day see you soon you know let me know you get on with the next one but if it's a really intense paragraph of like i said people with eating disorders or you know really really tough kind of social issues at home or whatever i flag i need to be in the right mindset um but before the voice note i was doing videos yeah but what i realized is sometimes i didn't have the energy the emotional energy in my face So voice notes change because I can be really tired and be a bit lethargic But I can pick up the energy Through my voice And send them a really really lovely message So I If it's anything where look Joe I know you might get millions of messages And I know you're not going to read this I always give time to those ones Because they're the ones that have really You know reached out And I almost I treat as if like You walked past me in the street And you try to stop me and say hi And say thank you Or be grateful for saying Or say you know Thanks for giving me some help So for me to ignore it Like it's the same I'm not just seeing screen names.

[282] I'm seeing people.

[283] And like I said, like the last few months, I've become so in tune with it and realize how powerful it is that I'm actually cranking up my energy levels.

[284] I'm doing more.

[285] I'm putting out more Instagram lives.

[286] And so now what I'm doing is taking a collective of questions that I'm getting a lot of motivation.

[287] I did a little IGTV on motivation.

[288] So I'm taking what I'm learning from these questions and spinning into a little 60 second video so that the general population that follow me can also learn from that.

[289] I mentioned a second ago.

[290] I'm trying to get into fitness a bit more.

[291] I've been going to the gym quite consistently.

[292] Before I beat through, I was doing a little bit better.

[293] Went to I be through a week ago, kind of downhill since then.

[294] But the challenge that everyone has with fitness, as I'm sure you've heard, is the dedication and the commitment to stick at it and to keep going.

[295] What is the reason why people like me sometimes bottle it and we struggle to form a routine?

[296] Why is that?

[297] The biggest challenge that people face is motivation.

[298] and that's the thing that people struggle with, whether it's cooking or exercising.

[299] And really, I said today that you're not going to wake up to my morning feeling motivate to work out, but the motivation is waiting for you at the end of the workout.

[300] So when you go for a 15 minute hit session or you go for a power walk or a cycle around the park, at the end of it, you know, the physical endorphins that are released in your brain make you feel good.

[301] They give you energy.

[302] It makes you feel a little bit more focus, a bit more productive.

[303] So for me, when I ask the question, why do you exercise?

[304] it always comes back to the energy, you know, the energy that I get through it and the kind of happiness that I feel from it.

[305] And it doesn't need to be this long, kind of one hour long session with a PT or going to Barry's boot camp or CrossFit, you know, I really believe that the future of home, the future of fitness is home fitness, is home workouts.

[306] We're seeing that with Peloton, we're seeing that with, you know, lots of online platforms and, and my YouTube channel growing so quick, you know, I get two and a half million views a month of people doing the workout.

[307] So, you know, make your living room.

[308] This is my studio.

[309] This is why I film my workouts by the guy.

[310] I have my tripod and camera there.

[311] This is I move the sofas.

[312] I film the workouts.

[313] It's me. I press record in real time.

[314] And people love that it's just anywhere, any time.

[315] And so.

[316] But Joe, I need loads of equipment.

[317] No, no, you don't need equipment.

[318] Your body is, you know, a great, a great piece of equipment.

[319] You can do all sorts.

[320] I do like 20 minute, 15 minute workouts.

[321] But ultimately, you want to be successful and that can be for all your business.

[322] But nothing is more important to you and your family and your loved ones and your kids when you're older than your health.

[323] So it's not about putting pressure on yourself to have this really crazy routine where you're doing hours a day, but, you know, 20 minutes a day and a lot of you, you might have read, you know, listen to podcasts and read some stuff about entrepreneurs and CEOs that most of the truly hyper, hyper successful people all have a fitness routine, whether it's, you know, Tony Robbins or Gary Vee or whoever it might be.

[324] Richard Brant is another example.

[325] He plays tennis every day for the past 40 years, goes cycling.

[326] like 70 years old, these people fundamentally see the benefit of exercise, not on just the way you look, but the way you operate on a daily basis.

[327] I mean, I don't know what you're like with sleep, but another thing that's underestimated is the importance of sleep.

[328] And it's all great being a hero, like, you know, I'm running on this amount of sleep, but a good night's sleep is the best pre -workout and the best way of functioning and optimising your day.

[329] You know, your focus, your vision.

[330] So really it comes down to, you know, your food, your sleep and your exercise.

[331] And your love life.

[332] And your love life, yeah.

[333] And I think, I think it's just people have been confused by becoming this complicated thing.

[334] But really, it's like I said, just working out consistently, doing whatever you can, 15 minutes here and there, cooking healthy food and consistently doing it and keeping it up.

[335] First of all, you're not really out of shape.

[336] Some CEOs, getting all the, and I've met a few CEOs with startups.

[337] They go, oh, Joe, you should have met me two years ago before I started my company.

[338] But it is, it's the hour, it's the work.

[339] It's the hours they've put into their work.

[340] What stops you from X's and what's coming you back?

[341] So right now I've been doing, and I was asking that question.

[342] I guess more as like a I know that my audience struggle with that question and it's people ask me that question all the time right now I'm like I'm in a bit of a rhythm and a bit of a flow state so I've um with work or fitness with with fitness right I've been going I'll go every other day um if not every day and if if I don't go that day it's because I'm not on a plane or something and how much better do you feel after do you feel amazing amazing yeah amazing and in fact when I got back from holiday recently and I didn't go for two two two or three days I I swear to my life it felt like my life I had gone every day for five months from about February, right?

[343] And the three or four days I had off, I'd like, it was like hard to get out of bed.

[344] I was like, I wasn't motivated about much at all in life.

[345] Ibif is a, you have, it's a come down pledge, you don't sleep much as well.

[346] It's a tough one to come back from.

[347] Yeah, and you're right.

[348] And I didn't, but I didn't even really party in Ibith.

[349] I went out one night over the four that we were there.

[350] And it was, I just, I lost that.

[351] Momentum kind of thing.

[352] Yeah, and the endorphins, whatever it gives you in your brain.

[353] I just lost it and then I went back to the gym a couple of days later and I felt great again.

[354] You can really, yeah, you can want to reset it.

[355] I went to a wedding at the weekend.

[356] I slept five hours a night in a teepee and was boozing gin and tonics, smashing the champagne and whatnot.

[357] I felt like death, but I got on my little Peloton bike, did 20 minutes and it just reset me almost instantly within 10 minutes.

[358] I just, it levels me out.

[359] It reminds me why exercise.

[360] So I'm one of these people that can have a little blowout or a little, you know, a little party, but I can quickly switch back into what I want to be doing.

[361] I think that's the thing.

[362] It's not dragging it out for a week.

[363] You know, you've done your IB, you've had your fun, get back to work, get back training and feel the benefits.

[364] It's been amazing for me. It's been one of the biggest sort of productivity and success hacks I've experienced definitely this year is consistently going to the gym.

[365] And you're right, my sleep's been fine, but it's a lot better now.

[366] Yeah, an extra hour, even if you have an extra hour or night, that that cumulative effect over a month and a year is so powerful.

[367] And I think people just underestimate it as a kind of health fact and a marker in your health that sleep is so important and you might have an extra hour and let's just say you turn the TV off an hour early and that extra sleep means that the next day you can operate and reach more people, connect and you know have a more productive day.

[368] I want to go in a different direction.

[369] Completely different direction.

[370] Something you said at the start of this conversation was that the household you grew up in was full of drama and you referenced that it was full of shouting.

[371] Yeah.

[372] The reason that triggered me a little bit or resonated with me, shall I say, is because the household I grew up in as a kid was full of my mom, in particular, screaming in my dad's face for hours and hours and hours and hours on end.

[373] And my mom will probably listen to this.

[374] My mom could scream in my dad's face for six hours and she's Nigerian so she can get real volume.

[375] And my dad would sit there like a mannequin as if he was no longer with us, right?

[376] And I have said on this podcast before that growing up that taught me that relationships were like hell.

[377] because the only model as a young kid that I knew was relationships equal lady screaming in your face for six hours no freedom so why would I want that yeah why would I ever want that so when I was 14 years old and I like fell in love with this like girl as you do the minute she said she wanted to be in a relationship with me I told her all the reasons why we couldn't be and I had chased her for two three years or whatever and that story played out again and again in my life you know I look behind you and I can see um there's not your daughter up there that's my daughter India that's my wife Rosie yeah and then me and Nikki, when we got antiqued with flour at a house party, someone threw flower on our face.

[378] Yeah, I'm a family man now, and I am very different to the child, and I'm a different parent to the way I was parented.

[379] And because of that, experience, I mean, I definitely had issues around, you know, trust and commitment, you know, because my dad would always be in and out.

[380] I know, I'd always think, you know, why is he off in rehab again?

[381] Why are we not enough?

[382] Why can't he stay at home with us and stuff, and it definitely used to upset me. but I don't want to be someone that shouts at India I don't want to be impatient and snapping I see that in my mum and dad I see, you know, and there used to be holes in my door like when I used to live in council house the doors were really thin and I remember seeing like holes and it was like cardboard inside and I always just think why are them holes there and it was only when I got a bit older I realized that was because my dad would have had a row and punched his whole, you know, his hand through the fist and his fist through the door and I'm so much more calm and I really, I've taken what I've learned as a child and rather than replicate that and follow that pattern I've actually really done the opposite and I really focus on speaking to Rosie calmly and polite and being respectful around her and also treating Indy like being patient and it's hard when you've got a baby like they push your buttons so you've got to try staying calm when they're having a meltdown but I just have a few techniques that help me to not be that dad that shouts and that dad that throws stuff across the room and you definitely have to learn it's something you have to practice and put into practice through time but I just didn't want to be I didn't want to get involved in drugs I didn't want to be someone that wasn't there for their kids and their partner.

[383] So now, like, if you had met me a few years ago, I didn't believe in marriage.

[384] I just thought, no, I'm never going to get married.

[385] I met Rosie and I fell in love and then suddenly I wanted to be married and it's made me actually really happy.

[386] It's made me realize that you can be in a relationship and be content and be, you know, faithful and loyal and not just run away when things get hard because that's all I've learned that you run away when things get hard.

[387] And even as a teenager and things are tough, I'd slam the door, I'd run out of the house, I wouldn't come back for a few days or I'd go travelling when things got difficult.

[388] It always, always ran away.

[389] That works to an extent, but then you get to a certain age.

[390] You're like, this isn't working anymore.

[391] What is it?

[392] So I'm the exact same where, and this is, if my ex -girlfriend's listening to this, which she probably is, she'll tell you the same thing.

[393] Because I learned that relationships were, like, prison, whenever my ex -girlfriend would, like, basically say the same thing to me twice in a slightly aggravated way, I would literally get my stuff and go.

[394] And I told her, I said, if you ever shout at me, whatever, I'm going to get, I'm not going to, I'm never going to shout at you back.

[395] And I never ever have ever in my history, even got like really emotionally moved by a romantic like interest.

[396] I would just get my stuff and go.

[397] I would like, immediately get.

[398] So you're quite calm.

[399] You're passive.

[400] Super passive.

[401] Yeah.

[402] I'd never get my stuff and I leave because my dad never would.

[403] He would never get up and just go.

[404] So I used to stand there as a kid saying, dad, like don't allow her to speak to you like that.

[405] Go.

[406] And so, you know, whenever my girlfriends was out, I just get myself.

[407] So what was, what is it about Rosie that made you change your perspective on marriage and commitment and think, do you know what, I'm going to settle down.

[408] I'm not going to keep running away from.

[409] Well, I was actually in a relationship from the age of 19 to 29.

[410] So I went traveling to Australia.

[411] So I'm actually, I say I wasn't, I say I was a, I was frightened of commitment, but I wasn't.

[412] I just wasn't, the marriage thing was the whole, the whole thing that kind of really intimidated me. But because my mum and dad never got married and if they had, they would have been divorced over and over again.

[413] And so when that relationship ended and I met Rosie, I just, I just felt instantly like myself around her.

[414] And she's really, she's really like open and loving and she's just, she's kind.

[415] And when you're with someone that makes you feel like you're completely yourself, I suppose it just made me really settle into it.

[416] And it was a natural progression.

[417] We had indie first.

[418] We had the baby before we got married.

[419] But I just, it all moved so quick.

[420] Like I wanted to live with Australia.

[421] I wanted to have a house.

[422] I wanted to.

[423] And before I was always fighting that, I was always like, I'm too young to settle down.

[424] I'm 19.

[425] but I'd still be there when I was 27, 28, 29, and I definitely hung on and hung into that relationship too long.

[426] And by the end of it, I was not the person I truly was.

[427] I wasn't being patient.

[428] I wasn't being kind.

[429] I wasn't being affectionate and loving.

[430] I just was kind of hoping that, you know, she would leave me and it's just such a bad way to think.

[431] But there's so many people in that predicament where they're with someone that they're like unsure about that person has turned them into a worse version of themselves.

[432] I truly believe that, yeah.

[433] And I just remember thinking like, this isn't my true spirit, this isn't who I want to be.

[434] And I actually, and I'll be honest of you, I used to talk to my mum and dad, but I was with this girl from such an age, and we really, we grew apart.

[435] And I actually went to have some therapy.

[436] I said, I need to speak someone who isn't someone I know.

[437] And I had a two -hour therapy session with a lady in London.

[438] And after that, I walked out and I came straight home and I told, I can't be of any more.

[439] It was that simple.

[440] It was listening to someone that didn't know me and said, why are you still in this relationship?

[441] Like, why are you doing this yourself?

[442] And why are you not being happy?

[443] Why are you holding this person back?

[444] and it was a two -hour therapy session and it changed my life forever because I think I might have you know I could have potentially stayed in that relationship for longer and had a kid and do I mean I'd done the right thing and I got help and it was great and that was the only time I've ever had therapy but I can say if you're in a position where you feel like you can't make a decision and you want to speak to someone speak to someone who's completely impartial and unbiased it really helped me and why had you stayed in that relationship for 10 years if you kind of deep down knew that this person wasn't making you know you the best person you possibly could be and they weren't it's like that thing you talked about on your podcast when you said about the frog in the saucepan you know of hot water like you don't just jump out it gets a it starts off really good and it's all warm and cozy and suddenly it gets a little bit hotter and then eventually you know you you kind of a part of you dies and not being who you truly want to be and being out of that relationship and being with rosy and having indian i'm now like way more content than i've ever been and it's really calm it's quite a nice feeling to like not be thinking the grass is greener to not be wanting to get out of a relationship you're in and to kind of want to be running away and it just came through making a decision of like let go of this person you're doing a good thing for her but you're also freeing yourself and all I think about is that she and I really hope that she's as happy as me and she's met someone and we don't speak or anything but you know that's something I hope that's happening somewhere in the world so you know talked about a lot of things that are great love life smashed it kid looks amazing got a really nice house you're successful in your business you're growing you're in a bit of a flow state at the moment and good things are happening because you've put a lot of good energy out into the world I guess my question is what are you what are you scared of what am I scared of I'm scared of I'm scared of like regretting you know looking back and thinking like did I spend enough time my friends and family but I also know that I'm doing that on it I'm instinctively I'm not just driven to work constantly all the time like I have really amazing periods where I'll smashed work, I'll work intensely for like a month or two.

[445] Then I went traveling from a month to Costa Rica, with Indy and we're about to head to America.

[446] So I'm kind of, I already know the balance.

[447] And like I said, I'm now, I've got this clarity in my mind, and like this flow state that I'm in, that I just feel like nothing can go.

[448] If I keep doing what I'm doing, nothing can go wrong.

[449] Are you scared of dying?

[450] I'm not, I'm not scared as, no, I'm scared of...

[451] How do you feel about death?

[452] I don't know, I just, I don't think about it really.

[453] I'm scared of well I'm scared of my mom and dad dying I haven't had any family close to me died because they had me so young so my mom was 19 so all my family are quite young my mom and dad are and I think losing them's going to be tough but it's all part of life isn't it I suppose what does your mom mean to you?

[454] My mum's like she's so wonderful my mum and she's probably my most kind of she I'm most connected to my mum more than anyone I think and that's because of what we've been through and I really now want to take care of her and look after her and she's so wonderful.

[455] She's given her whole life, basically, dedicated herself to, like, helping raise me and Nikki, and now she helps her, she helps people who've been through, like, young offenders and through difficult stuff.

[456] She's a social worker and stuff, so she is everything, you know, but I've also, my relationship, my dad, like, it was difficult when I was growing up, but now, you know, we are, we're communicating a lot better, we hang out, you know, we're, I don't hold anything against my mom and dad, like, for all the madness.

[457] I just think that was what we've been through that, that's our journey.

[458] That's you are who you are, today because of it.

[459] So I'm not someone who looks back.

[460] I think we've all had difficulties, but some people really hold on to that and it affects them forever where other people can just let it go and let it just move on.

[461] Like it's done.

[462] Like that's what it was.

[463] Just love the person they are today.

[464] That's more important.

[465] That's a really, really, I think, important point that for me appears to be the answer to a lot of the energy, the negative energy I experience in like my direct messages from people is their like inability to like let go of someone that's wrong them and the real shame is because that person's wrong them once upon a time they're then dragging that negativity through their life and letting it destroy their future and their present yeah and like you know i've got a someone that's really close to me that um had a really bad experience with their dad when they were younger um and they just won't let go and i see it damaging their adult life now even though they don't speak to their dad anymore but because they just won't forgive that person so how do you forgive someone more generally not just your parents but how do you forgive someone that's you know harmed you or done you wrong in the past what's the i totally i can hear that message and i can see where that's coming from because you know my mom and dad have they've had their own trauma such to such an extent that they've been in you know therapy and all their lives and also you know with addiction it's manifested different ways but it and it makes me sad all you want all you want is your mom and dad to be happy and want the people around you to be happy but sometimes I can see they've been struggling their whole life to let go of whatever it is that's hurting them and, you know, holding them back.

[466] And for me, it's a case of I just believe you have to live for the moment.

[467] You have to enjoy the day.

[468] Like, what's going on today?

[469] Like, what can you do today to make you feel happy?

[470] And how is it going to serve you thinking about what you went through as a child?

[471] Like you can have, my mom and dad have had all kinds of therapy, like, you know, regressive childhood hypnotherapy.

[472] You go back to the, you know, my dad's even started doing ayahuasca and plant -based medicine to go back and just to get it all out of him.

[473] But I just think you have to just take ownership and control of yourself on a daily basis.

[474] And, you know, that's going to be done through like exercise, eating healthy food, being connected.

[475] Like some people are so disconnected from their family and friends and their community, whatever that may be.

[476] And that's the most important thing.

[477] They say that one of the key factors in success is, are you connected?

[478] Are you helping other people?

[479] Are you giving or you're just taking off people?

[480] So, you know, don't focus on what you've been through and let that just be like the past and what is happening today.

[481] you can't even deal with the future.

[482] Don't even get what.

[483] Some people are so, they suffer anxiety from what could happen in the future.

[484] But you have to just focus on today, you know, what is the point of looking back?

[485] I just think it can, it can really consume you.

[486] And you could go, you could go your whole life about ever truly being happy because you're worried about the future or you're thinking about what happened in the past.

[487] Like, there's something crazy in this, in this, like, truth that to overcome your own struggles and your own pain, it seems to be the case that by helping others, is you kind of help yourself.

[488] And I've observed that with a lot of people that have been through tough times.

[489] They say that, you know, their recovery has come from just like, you know, making content for other people or being there for other people.

[490] And it's often the case that people who had the worst childhoods then focus all of their sort of adult life on helping kids or, you know, wanting to support kids in some way.

[491] And there's something in that, which I think is quite profound and human.

[492] It's not, yeah, it's not a cliche.

[493] It's not like some, it's an actual fact that when you are giving back when you're helping others, it makes you feel good.

[494] And so it's tuning into that.

[495] Like, I do that on a massive scale of a big community.

[496] But you could do that, you know, with a few people you know, your friend, your auntie, your cousin, your nan, whatever it might be.

[497] Like, you can help other people on a smaller level and build your own community.

[498] But that is so important.

[499] I think we're so detached and we're so focused on social media and having followers and engaging with people that we might forget.

[500] Like, also people close to your, the real people that you grew up with and your family that raised you.

[501] They're also really important to stay connected to.

[502] There's this, I don't know if you've read this book called Lost Connections, but I had the author of the book, Johan Hari, on this podcast, and I asked him a question as to why people in the Western world, like the UK and the US, were so depressed and anxious and all these kinds of things.

[503] And he said, one of the really interesting things he observed from his studies abroad was that in other cultures, in Asia, when people are told to go and do something to make themselves feel good, their default over there is to go and help someone, their family members, their nan, whatever.

[504] Yeah.

[505] Over here, in the Western world, because of society and social media, we go and help ourselves.

[506] We go shopping.

[507] We do something for ourselves, yeah.

[508] And he said that the market difference and the impact it has on your happiness is just tremendous.

[509] That, you know, our default because of advertising is, do you know what, I'll go get my thing, I'll go get my hair nails done, I'll go buy myself an iPhone or a new outfit.

[510] Definitely, I agree on that.

[511] And that's not the human way to help yourself.

[512] You shared a really nice quote from it as well, saying that you can be, you can be, you know, around hundreds of people, but if you're not giving anything back or giving something that's going to help those people, you can still be very lonely.

[513] You can have millions of people around you or all this love as such, but you can still be very disconnected and not attached to people.

[514] And so I feel like I'm on a little bit of a spiritual.

[515] I'm not religious in any sense, but I feel like, and I'm not into the, I'm not like Tony Robbins and NLP and all that sort of.

[516] But I'm on some kind of spiritual journey where I'm really learning about myself quite quickly and what does and doesn't work and what makes me feel good and what is helping others.

[517] And it's a case of trying to tune into that.

[518] And obviously with business, we sometimes often focus on, you know, the profit and the turnover and the growth.

[519] But sometimes the purpose, if you can focus on the purpose and what you're really trying to achieve, then it suddenly like brings success.

[520] It kind of follows you and it pushes you like a momentum in what you're doing.

[521] And what is your mission then for, let's look forward now.

[522] What are you working?

[523] I know you're doing a lot more with young children as well and young people.

[524] What is Joe Wick's mission for the future?

[525] My mission is to, I want to be remembered as someone that just, really, really, really got millions of people active and feeling good and exercising and eating healthy food.

[526] And that's going to be from kids in primary school right through to adults.

[527] And I really want to be someone that inspires, basically.

[528] So it's not just about how many books I've sold or how many Instagram followers I've got.

[529] It's like, can I truly make an impact like culturally, like culturally get families exercising together?

[530] Like, why?

[531] So this is a question I always ask when I ask that question.

[532] Because I'm seeing it happen.

[533] I'm seeing like, I'm seeing these parents with my YouTube workouts doing a workout with their five -year -old kid and it makes me so happy and the message they're sending is my little kid hasn't got off their sofa all summer and they've just done a workout and they feel amazing and we're all eating a healthy recipe tonight now that is important and it makes me happy and I think if I can do that millions and millions of times over why wouldn't I like my cat I can inspire I've just got to work out how to reach more people so it's the why is because it makes me happy and secondly because I'm helping people live a healthier life and that that and I you know I think in 20 years time when you remember the body coach like you remember jame oliver it's because not of his book sales or how many companies he's at it's because he was the guy that got kids eating better in the UK or he was the guy that you know has always been on a mission to get people healthier so I do believe I'll be here in 20 years time I do believe that other trainers around might fizzle out and might not be around but I will still be doing this in 20 years time I'll still be sharing a message and and being positive and evolving as I go with what I'm doing.

[534] And you've gone from being a young guy that didn't have money, grew up on a council estate and didn't know sort of material things, to now having, you know, three, I mean, you sold millions and millions and millions of books.

[535] You hold records for your recipe book, I believe, right?

[536] So my, yeah, my second book, so my first book, the Lean 15 one is the second best selling cookbook of all time after Jamie Oliver.

[537] So Jamie Oliver's 30 minute meals sold 1 .6 million and my red one sold 1 .4.

[538] So it's been mad.

[539] It's been mental.

[540] And I remember, like, that's real people.

[541] It's not just book sales and revenue and, like, commission on books.

[542] It's like, that's actual family who's cooking for my book.

[543] And it does, it does really motivate me. It does get me gas and think, come on, let's do another book.

[544] Like, why not?

[545] It's a long process doing books there, right?

[546] Yeah, it's a long process.

[547] It takes a lot of effort, yeah, with the recipes and stuff.

[548] But I've got another three books in the pipeline.

[549] Exciting.

[550] Can you let any cats out of the bag?

[551] So the next one's called Wien in 15, which is a baby book for babies and toddlers, because I've just gone through the process of getting India onto solid foods.

[552] And it's fun, but it's also quite daunting.

[553] You're not too sure what to do.

[554] So I'm now building a sub -brand, if you like, and a separate audience on another Instagram called Wienin 15, where I'm now sharing recipes and content for parents.

[555] And the engagement on that has gone crazy.

[556] It's actually, I think, in a few years' time, will be bigger, potentially, than what I'm doing on the body coach stuff.

[557] So this is a question.

[558] As someone that, you know, pretend I didn't know this industry.

[559] It just happens to be the industry that I'm in.

[560] But one of the questions that a lot of people will want, and ask is how do you make your money and what's your philosophy for making money?

[561] Because you've got a very big audience, a very engaged people.

[562] You do something that a lot of people brings a lot of value to people's lives.

[563] How are you monetizing this and living off it?

[564] Okay.

[565] So the first thing I did was launch an online fitness program.

[566] So I've obviously got my free content, which is my YouTube channel.

[567] I make a little bit of ad sense from that.

[568] It's not massive.

[569] It's not my main thing.

[570] I've got obviously my Instagram and recipes and stuff.

[571] And then I've got my online fitness plan, which is a 90 -day plan.

[572] You sign up through my website and you get tailored meal plan and recipe workouts.

[573] So that's one revenue, which is the online plan, which is my most lucrative, my most lucrative part of my business.

[574] The second thing is obviously the books, which...

[575] And how much is that online plan?

[576] It's £97, and we've had half a million people do it in the past sort of five years.

[577] It doesn't take a genius to do the math.

[578] I'm really proud of that.

[579] And again, that was something I just saw all.

[580] like, not a gap in market, I just saw that I was getting all these questions, I was driving them to my YouTube channel, but I could produce a plan.

[581] So it's like I saw the demand and I created the plan, put it out to the world and didn't really know what was going to happen.

[582] But that, that is a, you know, I'm really proud that I've got that many people to do that plan because it is changing their lives.

[583] It really does help and gets them healthier.

[584] I've then got my book.

[585] So, you know, the book advances were tiny when I signed up.

[586] But when you sell three and a half million books, you can imagine the book advances grow exponentially and the royalties and stuff.

[587] So I've got the online plan, the books, I've got a partnership with Gusto, which is a recipe company box.

[588] And the interesting story to this is that I turned down a deal with a supermarket for two million pounds.

[589] And I never talk about numbers, but when I get called a seller, I think if only you knew all the things I said no to, all the brands with energy drinks and post this and do that.

[590] And I say no to so many things.

[591] But when that supermarket deal came, it was like ready meals.

[592] It was fast food and microwave dinners and, you know, all that sort of stuff.

[593] And I thought, look, I'm not doing it.

[594] There's no way I can do it.

[595] but I thought I need to find another opportunity in the food space.

[596] So Gusto is a recipe box company.

[597] You still learn to cook.

[598] It's all a healthy ingredient.

[599] So that kind of filled the void of the $2 million that I pushed away.

[600] And that's been so successful.

[601] It's been so well received because people...

[602] If they still want someone to do it, then I'm...

[603] I'm checking out.

[604] Oh, you want to do the supermarket deal.

[605] I'm joking.

[606] And so that was a big decision.

[607] But yeah, so I've got...

[608] Sorry, I keep having to summarize it.

[609] The online plan, the books, the Gusto partnership.

[610] And then you've obviously...

[611] got merchandise in terms of I've got pots and pans and I deal with my protein from the Huck Group.

[612] So, but again, you know, these things aren't lighting up the world, but it's still things that I have the chance to do and I have an opportunity and sometimes it's good.

[613] Sometimes you think, wow, that's going to go mad and you're going to sell millions of pounds of pots.

[614] But, you know, that's a different kind of product.

[615] It's a slower burn, you know.

[616] I definitely say no to a lot of brand partnerships because of the money I make through other things.

[617] If I wasn't, then obviously I'd have to be promoting your peanut butter and your jam and energy drinks and all this sort of stuff and money what what impact it like i almost asked this question before but was there anything that you wanted to buy when you were broke like i was and you thought you know and you went and bought any toys or anything that anything material that you um i didn't i wanted to just i really always wanted to have a house you know like own a house and i when you when you're in a council house and it's always rented like none of not one member of my family has a mortgage i mean think of that like one of the people i know own a house so like for me to buy a house and own a house and be mortgage free, it's amazing.

[618] So the first, I know this is super cliche, but you might feel the same, that when you weren't money, you wanted to take care of your mum and dad.

[619] So the first thing I did, I bought my mum's council house for her.

[620] So she, she has that and she's done it up and she's super happy with that.

[621] And then I bought my own house.

[622] So that was the, that was the main thing, was have a nice place to grow a family.

[623] I like guitars.

[624] I can see I'm learning pedig guitar.

[625] I've got an electric skateboard.

[626] I've got a boosted ball, which I love.

[627] But I'm pretty low maintenance.

[628] I'm not someone who kind of, as I got exponentially wealthy that I went and bought exponentially bigger and grander things.

[629] Like I love my holidays.

[630] I love experiencing things.

[631] I like traveling with friends.

[632] And, you know, if we go skiing, I sort my friends out.

[633] If I go to Vegas, I get the hotel and pay for some of the, you know, the booze and that.

[634] It's not like it's all the time.

[635] But I do love bringing my friends together and some of my mates are skin.

[636] So I say, come on, we're going to go to our beefer for a few nights, you know, things like that.

[637] But I'm not, I'm not very materialistic.

[638] I did buy a nice watch when I turned 30, but I never wear it.

[639] I just got my Apple watch on all the time.

[640] What watch was it?

[641] I bought a Rolex.

[642] Nice.

[643] And I never thought I'd ever want a watch, but I thought, I'm 30, you know, it's a big day.

[644] Let's get saying to her, you know, remember it, and I bought it.

[645] And I liked it, and it feels nice, but I actually feel quite shy when I wear it.

[646] I feel like it's a bit showy -offy.

[647] So I wear it if I go to, like, a nice wedding or part or something.

[648] But I actually just, I'm much more, I'm an Appleman, really.

[649] I bought a Rolex and then I lost it.

[650] Oh, you lost it?

[651] Yeah, I thought to me. myself.

[652] I know someone had got bashed over the head over there in London they stole it off his wrist so be careful of your Rolex Well no this is actually part of this story so I came home one day and someone that works at social turn my business was staying in a spare room for a couple of days while they were sorting themselves out and their car keys got taken out of the draw their car got smashed up around the corner and my Rolex went missing up my room oh no but I thought Stephen you're a rookie you know should have better security so I'm not I'm punishing myself I'm not going to buy another one for another five years or something but I did like special occasions, you know.

[653] What's it like for you being a 28 year old, just turned 28?

[654] Just turned 27 last week.

[655] God, you're even younger.

[656] It's 26 a week ago also.

[657] It's even more inspiring.

[658] What is it, what is it meant to you and for you to become wealthy and have this huge company, because you've got an empire essentially.

[659] And what does it feel to you?

[660] And when you think about money, yeah, did it change your perception?

[661] As it inflated your ego, if I met you five, six years ago before you're making serious dough, are you the same man now?

[662] Or has your ego and your personality changed at all?

[663] gosh, my, my, my, my mom said the thing she's most proud of is that I haven't changed at all.

[664] And all of my friends have said the same thing.

[665] Like, because honestly, it does, it just doesn't matter to me. And in the same, like, the reason why I really don't, I sold my range and bought bicycle.

[666] And like, it's because money, I've, especially as I've gone on this sort of self -development journey of really understanding what happiness is and where it comes from and intrinsic motivators versus doing things because you want to show off.

[667] And all the, and basically because of this podcast, I've learned what happiness is more and more.

[668] And I know that it's not amassing large amounts of money.

[669] I don't care about the wealth side of things.

[670] And even with my, I said it, I said in this podcast, when I was, I was making, when I left my first business when I was 21 years old, I was making 70 grand a month from being a consultant from all these brands paying me just to tell them what to do with their businesses.

[671] And I could not find the motivation to walk down the stairs in my apartment and respond to an email just to send an invoice that would make me 20 grand.

[672] I said to my business part of the time, if I go downstairs and send that email, we'll make 20 grand, right?

[673] Me, it comes into my bank account.

[674] I can't be asked to go downstairs.

[675] There was no motivation to make more money.

[676] Really?

[677] It would have no impact on my life.

[678] I could buy everything.

[679] I was 21 years old, traveling the world, making 70 grand a month.

[680] What's 80 grand a month when you can fly however you want to fly, stay wherever you want?

[681] I had no overheads.

[682] Did you get flash, though?

[683] Did you have a little plan?

[684] No, because I didn't even know how you got flash.

[685] What was it going to buy?

[686] You're not into up the club and seeing and going like popping champagne spraying out of beef and all that I was 100 % I was going to move When I was 18 I saw all these guys spraying like buying all these bottles in clubs So I thought I'll give that go See if that makes you happy Did that for a whole year Just buying Don Perry on bottles In nightclubs Spraying your dough These nightclubs knew me Right And I had there was a little star By my name Because I'd come in and I'd buy five bottles of Don Perrione And that didn't do it That didn't make me happy I've got a good question for you So I know what you wanted at 18 and I know you as 28 -year -old Stephen, what does 38 -year -old Stephen want?

[687] Because, you know, like Gary Vee, like, I'm going to buy the New York Jets, man. His whole life is built up towards that.

[688] What do you want in the next 10 years?

[689] What's your goal?

[690] I can't say anything about another man's ambitions, but for me, when I'm 30 years old, I get so much out of this journey of this, like, philosophical journey of figuring out what happiness is and getting smarter and wiser.

[691] I'm making, because I'm helping others, but I'm making decisions in my own life, that are bringing me closer to feeling good every day.

[692] Yeah, I totally agree with that.

[693] You know, feeling better every day.

[694] I feel good every day now.

[695] And so one of the big things I'm, I love this podcast because I get to unpick people's brains and learn more for myself.

[696] It's a very selfish thing.

[697] But I know it's selfless in the sense that you'll listen as well.

[698] What are my goals for when I'm 30?

[699] Honestly.

[700] Don't have a couple of them?

[701] A couple of kids, maybe?

[702] I do.

[703] I want more balance.

[704] So one thing I've always said in response to that question is more balance.

[705] So that means tie in the knot, potentially.

[706] I'm still in a place where you were where I'm not 100 % sold on marriage yet but I'm sold on having a long -term partner and I'm sold on having loads of kids and then helping my family more helping other people more and then do you know what I think the big thing is really going after some of the world's biggest challenges and what I mean by that is maybe politics and really trying to disrupt politics as someone that is not a politician and has a very unapologetic view on the way things should be done or does that mean trying to go after the education system or something like that i think that's i want to put myself in a position where i'm fucking terrified and where the world half of the world fucking hates me because of what i believe and half of the world um understands me sounds like an amazing mission man i love that you're i don't know what it is you are very inspiring and the fact that you you do a lot of stuff with schools don't you yeah yeah project working with young young children yeah we've just done that tv show with channel four which is um which is still sort of feeling the effects of now and and i bet you love that i bet i bet i could just ask you i just know that that that probably doing that.

[707] I bet it was exhausting, but I bet it's also one of the things that you've probably enjoyed and got the most satisfaction from, right?

[708] Yeah, 100%.

[709] You nailed it.

[710] I hated the process.

[711] Exhausting.

[712] I was just saying to the girls on my team, waking up at 6am and having to walk down the same street eight times just so they could get the angle, sitting in a classroom for an hour where kids are just like telling the teacher to ref off and asking me what five times five is.

[713] Exhausting when you've got a business to run, right?

[714] But coming at the end of it, my perspective on education was transformed and I was inspired.

[715] and I was in love with, to us, I was in love with young people again and realized how important they are.

[716] And, and also how delicate it is.

[717] Like, as you said with your story, how a small thing that happens when you're younger can knock you either one side of the fence to believing in yourself or to, to, to not.

[718] And how, like, malleable and influential young people are.

[719] So, yeah, so influential and so, so kind of, they're so impacted by decisions at a young age.

[720] If a child doesn't exercise through primary school and second school, you are really going to struggle to get their moving as an adult.

[721] They could be sedentary their whole lives.

[722] So it's the same with anything.

[723] If you can get the early, you can get in there and into their mindset.

[724] And that's what I'm doing the schools thing.

[725] It's like I'm teaching them that it's fun, it's quick and simple, and you're going to feel better.

[726] And I'm changing behaviours and the culture of exercise in the home and I keep saying to parents, I keep saying you're a role model.

[727] If you sit at home with your kid and you just watch TV and you don't ever do any exercise together, your child will never want to do it.

[728] Like you need to start demonstrating it.

[729] it's really having a nice effect on people.

[730] So that's kind of the big mission now, is engaging families and kids, exercise, you know, through fitness and having, having fun with it and just keeping on the mission, really.

[731] I think you're going to go a very, very long way.

[732] I think you are too, mate, 27 years old.

[733] You're on the Forbes list yet?

[734] It should be.

[735] Oh, no, I don't care about the list.

[736] No, no, no, right.

[737] So I guess my last question then, which was why I asked all my guests, so if you've heard this podcast before, you probably, you should have prepared an answer if you listened.

[738] Go on, yeah.

[739] But no one ever prepares an answer to this.

[740] Dinner party.

[741] This is one of those expressions.

[742] You always get stumped, yeah, the guest for the dinner party.

[743] And I always think, oh, it's like, who's your favorite musician or what's your favorite movie?

[744] I always struggle, but how many of mine are to invite them?

[745] Different ones.

[746] So there's a table there in this hypothetical room, right?

[747] I'm there because it was my idea to have the party.

[748] You're there because it's your house.

[749] Okay.

[750] I'd probably, I'd definitely have, I'm a massive fan of the office, so I'd want David Brent there, but not as Ricky Javis, I'd want him to be actually David Brent.

[751] The US office or the UK one?

[752] You don't like the US?

[753] No, I don't.

[754] I tried it.

[755] I love both.

[756] I just, it was just ripping off all the jokes.

[757] So I'd have David Brent for the comedy and for the value.

[758] In terms of interesting kind of subject matter to talk about, I'd probably say someone like I'd probably have Richard Branson.

[759] I think from a business perspective and just like he's kind of, you know, the way he's just built that company is incredible and he's very mission driven as well.

[760] So I've got Ricky Jervais, I've got Richard Branson.

[761] and is it getting harder hang on can you have a musician to like sing music and stuff anybody you want I'd probably have someone like Stevie Wonder singing some music because I love I love going to watch him I love Stevie Wonder, have you seen him live I've seen him a few times yeah Stevie Wonder is the last in a generation I think yeah Steve's a Hyde Park this time wasn't he?

[762] Really?

[763] I saw him in New York briefly could I have my mum there?

[764] Of course you can yeah I'd like to have mum there because I'd like to you know just because I'm proud of of my mum and it'd be nice for us to be there if we're having this great dinner.

[765] David Brent, although he'd be rude.

[766] You want to introduce your mum to David Brent, would you?

[767] No, probably not.

[768] In terms of food, right, this is my dream food, yeah?

[769] Whatever, yeah.

[770] I'd have, like, Arancini and Calamari to start.

[771] Nice.

[772] I'd have burger and chips with truffle, parmesan, fries.

[773] Right.

[774] And dessert.

[775] People are going to think, Joe, burger and chips.

[776] Yeah, this is my dream, like, death row meal.

[777] And I'd also have, for dessert, I'd have like a chocolate fondon with vanilla ice cream.

[778] So I love my food, but my favorite, if I go to any restaurant, if there's a burger on the menu, I'm always getting it.

[779] I mean, I'll always choose the burger.

[780] And because we've just had a burger and chocolate funnum, we're going to have to do some kind of exercise, right?

[781] So what exercise would you make the dinner party do?

[782] I'd probably do a little 20 minute hit session in between courses, yeah, like a few burpees, few squat jumps.

[783] Is that your like go -to, like, quick?

[784] Yeah, that's my, most of my content is just literally me in the living room with my body, no weight, no equipment.

[785] no kettlebells because you can actually have a really good workout and have a good physique I maintain my physique through body weight training really really yeah I did like weights when I was little but I do you know pull up some dips and press up some things so keep it simple get yourself moving amazing and I'd love to see David Brent trying to do a little 20 minute that would be funny if you watch my stories a lot of my humour like I just do like office jokes and it goes over some of people's heads but people now I'm like look I'm not making these jokes up you need to watch the office and then you'll get it well anyway listen thank you so much for your time it's been an absolute pleasure um listen i don't have to tell people where to find you because they can they can type in the body coach joe wicks anywhere and you'll come up i'm sure there's no there's no other sort of impostors um it's been an absolute pleasure to talk to talk to you and really sort of get to know you and um i've i've come away with a lot because more than anything because of how you are as a human being and i think that's probably really underappreciated that people can see things on social media but of all the people I've met on this podcast you're that you certainly feel like there's no one more authentic than you and real than you and also your intentions as to why you're doing what you're doing are unquestionable so thank you man thank you so much for that you know you're having me on I'm genuinely excited to be and I hope that I've added some value to the audience but I also I'm super inspired I love being around successful people and it's rare because I'm on my little world in my Instagram my tripod and just me in this living room so to meet other people that are doing well in their field it's incredible and I hope that people out there find it inspiring and one little challenge for you is this week for the rest of the week send voice notes back when you get the DMs see the impact of you just doing it and and you might get some back you might not but you'll you'll realize you'll understand in a week just how amazing and powerful it is and how much that person will love and appreciate that you've sent that and it's quicker it speaks things up you can do way more to spend half an hour doing it and I'd love you to let me know how that had an impact on your audience and your personal feeling of like what you're doing it kind of it amplifies your your your mission and what you're doing so when you put out something positive through voice note it's way more powerful than a bit of text so do that for a week and send me a message yeah and let you know how to anyone else out there too don't ignore the voice note function on instagram DMs hit it up send a voice note and watch your community grow and and you know not just in scale but in depth and that's so powerful in this day and age it's all about engaging and caring about those people on a real deep level and you will grow your business and your brand or whatever it may be and so yeah that's my top tip amazing thank you so much so appreciate having having your time today thanks mate