245 - Time Is Becoming A Serious Problem

[0] This is exactly right.

[1] Welcome to my favorite murder.

[2] That's Georgia Hard Star.

[3] That's Karen Kilgariff's sigh.

[4] I was like, are we going to do the thing where we define it somehow?

[5] We are now.

[6] Sometimes we do a thing where we define it.

[7] And then you laugh in your room.

[8] They never know what to say those two.

[9] You think after five years they had had known what to say.

[10] Or would care enough to prepare it in some way.

[11] way, but no, we know the magic is in the lack of preparation.

[12] That's right.

[13] Every week, we just spill stuff out of our mouths into a microphone and...

[14] That's our guarantee to you.

[15] Good.

[16] I have two sleeping dogs in this room and they will not, it won't continue.

[17] So at some point we're going to have a surprise.

[18] You just have constant anxiety about when your dogs are going to park.

[19] When I'm recording a podcast, yeah, that actually I make a living off of it should matter more well if that mattered we would have made up a beginning too an intro true it would be like okay for sure next week Georgia on the here's our action list I made you cue cards we start with we start with hey how are you you know what you're meeting America should we not say hey America oh yeah hey in Canada and the greater oh right with greater territories of what's up what's up Finland oh man hey Finland hey Finland I see you girl hey girl you look good girl I do all right no more nonsense yeah let's get serious how are you fine how are you good good fine yes should we should we tell people what we were just laughing about or wait is that going to ruin it for your show, Stephen?

[20] I don't think so.

[21] It's somewhat surprised.

[22] Well, this is a spoiler alert.

[23] Yes, it's a sneak peek.

[24] It's a teaser sometimes or trailer.

[25] Stephen was just telling us about, like, who he, what cat owner he has on for the purcast.

[26] Upcoming?

[27] Upcoming.

[28] And it's, um, just look up hashtag Steve Buscemi cat.

[29] And then I have never, and he sent us a picture and I've never heard Karen laugh so hard and loud.

[30] And then, and then Steven's comment, I'm just, you tell.

[31] Okay, so this cat is, there is an Adam Driver cat that looks literally exactly like Adam Driver.

[32] And long ago, we did a bit on Ellen, like, literally in the early days, like 2004 or something.

[33] Send us a picture of your pet and we'll tell you what celebrity looks like.

[34] And we had a cat that looked exactly like Scarlet Johansson and it was really hilarious.

[35] And the cat was kind of scrappy too.

[36] It wasn't like it was some gorgeous.

[37] It was really funny.

[38] I think Doddy looks like Adam Scott.

[39] She looks like she could be Adam Scott's teenage daughter.

[40] Do you know that I've known Adam Scott since I moved to L .A.?

[41] Stop it.

[42] Yeah, yeah.

[43] He used to, my old roommate used to be in an acting class with him.

[44] So we've known each other since we were 24.

[45] Wow.

[46] Yes.

[47] But we don't really know each other anymore.

[48] Like, meaningfully, like, hey, it's you.

[49] I literally at the beginning of this year, I think.

[50] or the end of last year ran into him in the grocery store and we had a lovely like ketchup kind of funny thing because he was a huge fan of Mr. Show so he would come to our like rap parties and stuff back in the day.

[51] Well then great so then you can text him or tweet at him about Doddy's dotty looking like his teenage daughter I shouldn't describe this cat because it's better for you just to go have your own experience but all I'll say is this is an insane looking cat and as I'm looking at it and laughing my ass off Steve, I look down at the Instagram post that Steven sent us a caption of and the first comment is from Stephen and it does this insane cat face and it just says, iconic.

[52] I do that on a lot of cat Instagrams.

[53] I love it.

[54] It's really good.

[55] Iconic.

[56] Let's put it on our Instagram slideshow of this episode.

[57] But it is a preview for Stephen's podcast, the purcasts.

[58] I don't want to steal all Stephen's light.

[59] we're definitely feeling Sarah his light Sarah and Stephen's light and thunder by even approaching this topic at all very rude I love it what are you got what's you doing this week how's your life well medium here's the problem if I have an appointment that's at a 30 so it's at 2 .30 it's at 1230 I will be either earlier late for it I can't do on the half hour time is becoming a serious problem for me that honestly it's like I'll say to my friend like oh we should definitely talk let's try to let's try to talk this week three weeks will pass yeah and then they'll be like hey so do you still want and I'll be like what I thought we just had that conversation it's all getting very blurry and strange yeah but I think it's because I just I think I need to leave my house more than I am and just like drive or you know put on my mask and go to a Starbucks drive -thru or whatever yeah well I saw you on Sunday though we saw each other's faces yes it was so nice vinson I came over for a socially distance poolside hang at karen's you fucking you fed me a nerds rope and you took great pictures of your dogs and I need to send you yes you did um are you know a nerds rope believer would you say oh my god yes yes like you kind of end up thinking about them later on higher thing and it was amazing it's so good I was going to order like a delivery or whatever from the grocery store I was going to get a bag of Halloween candy but the one and tell me if you agree or disagree on this the one of the bags of candy had nerds in it and I was like here we go but then it was like it had half fruit based candy and half chocolate and I don't like that because they should be separate chocolate picks up the flavor of the thing it's laying next to so then you bite into like a Snickers but it also tastes like oranges yeah no dude I get that okay I'd never thought about that before shit well I don't think I don't think we need to think about it that much but I mean oh I have a news thing to tell you about that someone also I think I talked about nerds ropes on so many podcasts that people started tweet someone actually tweeted me and it was really funny where they were like I started thinking everyone was talking about nerds ropes and then I just realized it was podcast you were on I need to stop talking about candy and I don't know and see you have prepared something for the beginning you just use it on every podcast it's the same I'm picking up the same index card sitting on my desk hey folks I've heard of these nerds ropes I'm a little offended I thought it was like a special thing between you and me but it's cool.

[60] It is, though.

[61] Okay.

[62] No one can take away our nerds Ropes moment when I can converted you to my side.

[63] It's like the Elvis turd that was just on the couch.

[64] It's a special thing between you and me. No, that's not the same.

[65] Damn it.

[66] Oh, I have a news article to read to you.

[67] Ooh.

[68] I have one for you.

[69] Oh, my God.

[70] What if it's the same?

[71] Is it about teeth?

[72] No. No. Okay.

[73] This one starts.

[74] out for at least the third time construction workers in Georgia have opened up the walls of a former dentist's office only to discover thousands of teeth in the wall look at this picture yeah oh god and there and the and the and the dentist office was only open from 1900 to 1930 something so those are all vintage fucking antique teeth teeth that he would just like throw over his shoulder probably and like into the wall he had a great aim it was his version of having like the little basketball hoop yes the Nerf it was like his Nerf basketball hoop from 1910 yeah and we're saying we're saying he because women weren't allowed to do anything back then so it definitely wasn't true probably it's a safe assumption it's a very safe assumption although if you have a relative that was a yeah a groundbreaking dentist in the 10s that was a lady the first female dentist it was what's interesting and you would just look this up you know but instead you're sexist goodbye okay that's crazy I mean I feel like we've gotten that story we've heard stories like that over the years at least once before but in Georgia it's already happened three times it's like an epidemic in Georgia apparently it's crazy I don't know why I feel proud a little bit because my name is just Georgia.

[75] I have nothing to do with the state, but I'm a little, like, proud of us.

[76] You know, and you should be, as you should be.

[77] Also, you know what I was thinking the other day?

[78] Because I read, I was reading, oh, this book I'm reading that I really like and the state of Georgia gets brought up in it.

[79] And then I was like, it's such a good name.

[80] Yeah.

[81] Have we had this discussion?

[82] It's such a great name.

[83] Thank you.

[84] I say that because I hated it when I was a kid.

[85] And then now I'm like, fucking own it.

[86] It's a great name.

[87] Yeah.

[88] And I think it's like.

[89] I think it's like part of my personality too.

[90] You know what I mean?

[91] Like if I had been named something else, I would have been a different fucking person completely.

[92] Is that true?

[93] Do you think if you weren't Karen?

[94] Potentially, yes.

[95] If you weren't Karen, you think you would just be a different person.

[96] If you were like, me. Yeah, I think.

[97] Yes, for sure.

[98] Because first of all, and I've told you this, no one could rhyme anything with Karen.

[99] So the meanest thing they could call me was the Red Baron.

[100] And I was like, you fools.

[101] It doesn't hurt at all.

[102] Don't even try.

[103] Get away.

[104] So there is that like, yeah, it's your, like, my cousin wanted to, I won't say the name because then people get hurt, but my cousin wanted to name his firstborn a certain name.

[105] And when he told my sister, she was like, so you just want her to be unpopular.

[106] But it was.

[107] They were trying to do one of those old -fashioned.

[108] you know, Agnes -style names.

[109] But don't be mad because I actually think Agnes is a very cool name.

[110] It's a very good name.

[111] There's a couple old -fashioned names that are old because they went away for good reason.

[112] You know, let them go away.

[113] No, we're just going to name someone who listens is going to be named or their beloved grandma.

[114] Yeah.

[115] We're going to bring back.

[116] It's only going to hurt ratings.

[117] Yeah.

[118] No. It's fine.

[119] And every single Sloan that ever listened to it.

[120] us is never going to listen to us again.

[121] Sloan is a great name.

[122] Fuck yeah.

[123] I love the name.

[124] That's a beautiful name.

[125] Sloan.

[126] Did you have a, you had a thing.

[127] I have another name that I really like, but it's going to, I have to fold it into something else.

[128] I'm going to tell you.

[129] But this is the news item I printed up for you.

[130] Okay.

[131] Which somebody tweeted on Vice.

[132] I think our friend Josh Mancowicz retweeted this on Twitter.

[133] Shout out.

[134] But remember the story.

[135] of Kim Wall, who was the Danish journalist who got killed by the guy that invented his own submarines.

[136] Yes.

[137] That guy, his name's Peter Madsen, escaped from jail by taking a prison psychologist hostage and walking her out of this jail.

[138] They caught him.

[139] He's back in jail.

[140] So he only got a kilometer away, which, as Americans, we have no idea how far his butt.

[141] So he got around the world.

[142] He got three baseball stadiums away.

[143] He got a 400 meter dash away.

[144] He got three minutes of skipping.

[145] He's he's back.

[146] He's back in jail.

[147] That's the most important part.

[148] But anyway, I was just kind of, that's just almost in the, in the topical true crime news area that I just went, oh my God.

[149] This guy, he won't quit.

[150] What a dick.

[151] But other than that, I have a couple new TV shows that I've watched because I, aside from time not working normally for me, I've become procrastinating things, like, things I don't even need to procrastinate.

[152] I'm, like, calling people and being like, can you cancel that for today?

[153] Can you?

[154] Like, it's so, I'm getting, it's like my new passion and hobby is to, is to, like, procrastinate.

[155] Yeah, you got to do it.

[156] Ms. Hussein in these trying times.

[157] We're like, sorry, I just really need to put that off for today.

[158] And it's like, you made the appointment.

[159] It was your, it's not a hard.

[160] No, you don't.

[161] You don't at all.

[162] Yeah.

[163] But it's so nice when you like suddenly don't have anything, when you thought you had everything and you suddenly have nothing for the day.

[164] Suddenly, it's a blank slate.

[165] It's like the room gets bigger and all of a sudden.

[166] And the TV becomes more beautiful, if you can imagine that, a more fascinating The weather has been like weird and foggy here.

[167] So it's like, oh, and I just, I can't do anything.

[168] It's so beautiful out.

[169] I probably should have soup and put on an Irish fair aisle sweater and curl up.

[170] And it's like, it's 82.

[171] I know, but for L .A. Actually, last night when I got into bed, I had a duvet inside of a duvet cover and I had to take it out because it got so hot.

[172] Oh.

[173] And this was, you know, I did that, say, a month ago, because I was like, what am I doing?

[174] I don't need to sleep under this duvet cover or whatever.

[175] Last night when I got into bed, I was laying there reading and I was cold.

[176] And then I basically had to go change into like long sleeve, long pajamas and put on like winter pajamas.

[177] Because there was no way I was putting a duvet in a duvet cover in the middle of the night.

[178] But I was like, oh, that's how we know the season's turning.

[179] That's how you know in L .A. is you need a light duvet.

[180] Yeah.

[181] You go from a single sheet to a light duvet and that means it's Halloween.

[182] Two and a half months and then it's 82 again.

[183] Then you're sweating and it's Valentine's Day.

[184] Hey, what's up?

[185] Okay, what's your show?

[186] Okay, I have four.

[187] But I'll do them.

[188] I'll do them fast.

[189] I have none so you can take mine.

[190] Oh, okay.

[191] I'll do your voice for the second.

[192] Great.

[193] Good luck with that.

[194] just that okay I don't talk like that I'm like TV I'm not TV I'm here to you okay the first show okay remember in Rick Ricky Jervais Netflix show Afterlife I loved it Remember the sex worker named Daphne Yes Who is just the best vibe The best most genius It's such a wonderful part well written hilarious well that woman is a woman named rochane canadi i believe i'm pronouncing that right but there's lots of ways to go wrong there sure she has a series called game face on it's on streaming whatever it is so fucking funny what is it it's just her kind of trying not it's like it's it's a typical setup where it's just like her and her crazy life and she's like an actress that also has to be a temp uh -huh um but it's her personal.

[195] So I guess she started as a stand -up.

[196] Oh, wow.

[197] Does stand -up or whatever.

[198] So it's like, and she is the, she created this show herself.

[199] Oh, wow.

[200] Awesome.

[201] So it's like, it's her own vehicle.

[202] Okay.

[203] It's really funny.

[204] There's some stuff that happens in it that is so hilariously insane.

[205] It's just like a great, great show.

[206] Okay.

[207] I watch it.

[208] Game face.

[209] Then there's another show that like, then you start getting things suggested for you along the lines.

[210] So the next one was, um, it's a show called the other one.

[211] It's so good.

[212] Remember in Catastrophe?

[213] The Rob Delaney, Sharon Horgan show.

[214] So good as well.

[215] The babysitter that they get who's like has the accent and she has her all her hair pulled back and like she's like, you know, I can't do the I can't do the accent.

[216] I don't remember.

[217] I don't know what where she's, she's from a certain part of London that is very like she's like a. Yeah.

[218] You know, she has a certain kind of accent.

[219] I don't know.

[220] I don't know how to explain it because maybe it's Cockney or maybe it's a different area.

[221] But she's just basically kind of supposed to be quote unquote street, I think.

[222] Okay.

[223] And she's really funny.

[224] She's like the baby.

[225] She just doesn't give a shit all the time.

[226] Okay.

[227] So she's in this show called The Other One.

[228] The Other Ones, Plural.

[229] And it's about a mom and daughter and the husband has just died.

[230] The father's just died.

[231] And then they find out he has a secret family.

[232] and the secret family is that woman who's the babysitter and then her mother who is the woman from shit sorry I should have written all this down because I didn't I didn't get this far in it's it's basically it's a bunch of your favorite British people who are really good at acting and the two of them so it's basically like kind of the snobby upscale people who then have to deal with the father's other family and it's so good.

[233] I love that premise.

[234] That's such a great idea.

[235] It's really good.

[236] And it's not, they don't do with it what you expect and it makes it so much funnier.

[237] Yeah.

[238] It's great.

[239] Hey, love it.

[240] That one.

[241] Checking that off.

[242] Check that off.

[243] And then there's one called not safe for work.

[244] And that is, basically it has the vibe of like the office a little less verite.

[245] And it's this woman.

[246] who basically works at this place and then she finds out she's getting sent up to Northampton I think it was it is which is basically where they send all the people who are bad at the job and she's like but I'm great at the job this doesn't make any sense and she gets up there it's just an it's like an office comedy it's brilliantly done it is like I couldn't stop watching it I definitely binge that that's called not safe for work and everyone in it is super talented and super good and you also recognize them if you like British shows from a bunch of other shows that's all if you British comedy female driven British comedy is like three in a row I was like seriously I was just kind of watch whatever came on and they're also well written funny great the problem is over there they do like one season of a show and they just because it was like one of these shows was from 2017 and I was like there's only one season of this why it's so good yeah they do that a lot and then the last one is just i finally watched the it's on hulu and it's the biography i want my m tv about the m tv you know life yes it's i kind of it was one of those things again where i didn't watch it right away because i'm like i'm going to have all kinds of feelings and the visuals whatever i was i literally found myself cheering aloud at certain parts there's it's such a good like if you are um younger than generation x and you are interested in why we are the way we are or you know like or you're interested in the trends from the 80s or whatever it's such a good comprehensive visual like yearbook of this time how they built this network and it was our entire lives it was our entire lives around and remember how so the thing the way i found out about MTV was they ran ads on local TV that was just Sting or Mick Jagger or someone popping up Pete Townsend and going, I want my MTV, call your cable provider.

[247] And then they put your cable provider's number on the screen.

[248] So it's like the individual places did it.

[249] Because they couldn't get most of the cable providers to agree to host their basically teenage show.

[250] And it starts out explaining how no, there was no TV that was aimed toward kids in like the late 70s, early 80s.

[251] It was all adult conceived and adult directed.

[252] VH1 and we wanted our MTV.

[253] I can't even, I want, it's so weird.

[254] I just like realize that people younger than us don't realize how fucking huge MTV was like as a kid that was your entire fucking life.

[255] It was your life.

[256] And I actually think as good as a job they did.

[257] And man, they started talking about how they got like those.

[258] creatives where when they you know how the the the logo art would change so like the logo would stay the same but then all the art around it would change yeah the reason it was like that is because they they brought in all these examples for for the guy to pick and he just went let's use them all and it was this idea that they set up that it's like this is 24 hour it's always going to be changing this is the new 80s like this is life now everything's going to go fast for fucking teenagers it's fascinating and then there's just all these moments The first time I ever ditched school, I was, like, in fifth or sixth grade and I stayed home to watch the premiere of like a fucking Debbie Gibson video.

[259] Yes.

[260] Only in my dreams?

[261] No, it's like electric youth or something.

[262] Electric youth.

[263] I was just like, well, fuck it.

[264] I'm not going to school until 10 today because.

[265] Hell yes.

[266] Happening.

[267] Yes.

[268] I was when the thriller video premiered, I was at Holly Gardner's house.

[269] Holly Gardner, who's now been made famous by the terrible tampon in the suitcase story.

[270] But that wasn't the only moment we had.

[271] We shared a wonderful childhood.

[272] And it was like, I guess, in sixth grade or sixth or seventh grade.

[273] And it was appointment TV.

[274] We went to her house and wait.

[275] And it was a countdown till the thriller video.

[276] It's just like watch it.

[277] If you're like Gen X like me and this was like a thing that like hypnotized you as a kid, it's such a satisfying series show your teenage kids now because we're old enough to have teenage kids isn't that weird gross uh i know gross um cool yeah that's my whole that's my whole one life what have you haven't you have no we're watching anything we're watching the same we're going back no oh yeah we need i get it it's just not happening right now got it what about podcasts uh no i'm you just taking a break.

[278] I've taken a break from everything.

[279] I've read a couple books, which is nice.

[280] Ooh, that's very good.

[281] I think not drinking just like completely changes my like my whole schedule.

[282] Like, I can't do the same things anymore.

[283] I have to like go at nine o 'clock, I have to go downstairs and get into bed to read a book or take a bath or something.

[284] Otherwise, I'm in a fucking drink, you know?

[285] Yeah.

[286] Yeah.

[287] Well, that's good that you've come up with these other things to do though.

[288] Yeah, that's nice.

[289] It's getting boring real quick.

[290] But then I wake up and I don't feel like shit.

[291] So that's nice.

[292] Yeah, that is, you just got to tip the, tip that seesaw toward the not feeling like shit is a good thing thing.

[293] Believe me, I've been talking about nerds ropes for three weeks.

[294] So it's not like I'm saying that in any kind of high horse way.

[295] Speaking of a good thing, let's do exactly right news.

[296] Let's do it.

[297] Well, I think the most exciting, or let's not judge, let's not have it be that way.

[298] Sure.

[299] an exciting piece of information.

[300] We're about to debut a new logo for SSDGM that someone drew for us in, like, I think, the summertime.

[301] And we decided to hold it off just because we didn't know what was going on or anything.

[302] And now we get to premiere it.

[303] And it's based off of something you wanted, right?

[304] You were like, I want this to look.

[305] Yeah, I just wanted it.

[306] I just wanted a new.

[307] feel because we've done kind of all the things and you know look could be interesting but it just is like it's SSGM but it's it basically is it reminds me of um schoolhouse rock yeah in terms of the art it's very 70s very 70s art it's super cute and it looks like it belongs on a lunchbox so we made lunch boxes of it good news goth girl girls everywhere.

[308] Although there's not that much black.

[309] It's kind of pastely.

[310] I think it's more like a riot girl, like emo girl kind of a thing.

[311] So bring back.

[312] Whatever kind of girl you are, take a look because we are now, we are premiering that new SSDGM logo and we've got t -shirts, tank tops, mugs, the lunch, the legendary lunchbox, tumblers.

[313] Right.

[314] Take a look.

[315] My favorite murder .com.

[316] There's the store is there on that website.

[317] Oh, and this is the, um, Denton pointed out that this is the, this is the design that actually made me cry during one of our meetings because I loved it so much.

[318] I just love it.

[319] You're so sick of seeing cutesy things with, with cutesy writing and cutesy flowers that when you saw, and I'm always like, I love it, I love it.

[320] And then when finally something for Karen showed up, the fucking SSVM.

[321] This is what I'm talking about.

[322] I love it.

[323] She cried.

[324] I mean, I like cutesy too.

[325] But how about, you know, we can do all kinds of tones and feels.

[326] Me too, cutesy.

[327] It's next level shit.

[328] That's right.

[329] It's for everyone.

[330] Okay, exactly right.

[331] Hey, here's a couple exactly right podcasts that are doing something fun this week.

[332] On this week's episode of Bananas, Kurt and Scotty have musician Phoebe Bridgers.

[333] Friend of the fam.

[334] We love her.

[335] It's so funny.

[336] They talk about weird news, like a woman who fell off a cliff trying to save a puppy.

[337] That ends very well It ends very well Don't worry And then there's one The Parrots at a zoo Who won't stop swearing at people That might be my favorite thing I've ever seen in my entire life Yep And more more So check bananas out this week With Phoebe Bridgers It's very cool I love that That they booked her I love that we got that And then it's not You know what I mean It's like usually It's family It's like I know I know I love that people are willing to do stuff like this now because we're all quarantined and whatever.

[338] So yay, thank you, Phoebe, for being on that show.

[339] It was hilarious.

[340] Oh, this is great.

[341] On the Fall Line this week, Laura interviewed Josh Hallmark, who's from True Crime Bullshit, and Anna Priestland, who's from Murder Town, about their deep research methods for series crime cases.

[342] It's fascinating.

[343] So cool.

[344] So that's out this week as well.

[345] Fall Line.

[346] Very exciting.

[347] And then, oh, my God.

[348] okay, here's another, this is a, we saved this exciting news to tell you that our newest podcast that's coming out on November 10th, I saw what you did, the trailer dropped.

[349] So you got to hear it and hear what it's going to be like.

[350] And it's so fucking exciting and cool.

[351] And we, I'm so proud of this podcast.

[352] So each week, Millie, who's a film expert and Danielle, who's a film enthusiast, will discuss two movies with like a theme like neighborhood creeps and great 70s apartments.

[353] So that's going to be a really fun.

[354] podcast that we're so excited about.

[355] We're so proud of.

[356] Please subscribe to it.

[357] That's like the biggest thing you can do for podcasts if you want to support them is to subscribe and to rate and review.

[358] And I know everyone says that at the end of every podcast, but it is because it puts you up on the charts on iTunes or Spotify or whatever.

[359] So it helps get visibility and people can see, people will see the podcast.

[360] So it's like, oh, it's that.

[361] And then they'll follow it too.

[362] So that's the coolest thing you can do.

[363] It's another great hang from the exactly right team.

[364] That's right.

[365] So I saw what you did.

[366] So please subscribe and all that stuff.

[367] And yeah, that comes out on November 10th.

[368] And you get to hear it right when this episode ends.

[369] So we're basically tagging it on to the end of this episode.

[370] So it'll be there waiting for you as a delicious sampler of our newest podcast that's going to come out.

[371] Is it time for me to do my story, Georgia?

[372] Yeah.

[373] It's a oneer.

[374] God, I loved last week when you just did yours and you were just like, mine's really long.

[375] She was just like, yes.

[376] Yes.

[377] Again, procrastination.

[378] Yeah, but then this week, it's...

[379] Then this week.

[380] It's your turn.

[381] The burden's on me. Let's see.

[382] I tried roller skating once, by the way, with my week, and it didn't go well, and I've given it up already.

[383] Hold on now.

[384] Where did you do it?

[385] Outside of my house on the...

[386] I know, but...

[387] No. Vince had to hold me up the entire time.

[388] I wouldn't let go with him.

[389] I was terrified.

[390] And then I just had this realization that I could really hurt myself.

[391] like really really hurt like I posted it on Instagram this like photo like I'm doing it and then but like a long time ago I bruised my tailbone or I like crack my tailbone so I'm really scared and then all these people are like go get them Georgia you can do it hey once I broke my wrist when I was roller skating and then people like sweetly were just like yeah me too telling me their horrible injuries from roller skating yeah and I was like wait a second I'm 40 I don't want to break anything I don't want to go to the hospital I don't want to hurt myself.

[392] But it's for Instagram likes.

[393] Do it.

[394] I did it.

[395] I got one post up and it was liked a lot and I was fucking cute in it.

[396] And now I can put those fucking roller skates in the basement and save them for, I don't know, never.

[397] Save them for when the moonlight roller rink and over in Glendale opens back up and we go to like fucking 80s MTV night.

[398] That's a great idea.

[399] Great.

[400] Because when you fall at the roller rink, yes, I mean, you may have that.

[401] that's where you may have broken your tailbone, which I...

[402] It's not.

[403] It's on the fucking...

[404] It was on the sidewalk.

[405] Yes.

[406] I think you can throw yourself into a carpeted wall.

[407] Like, that's what you need to do.

[408] Because it's all about, like, stopping the forward motion if you're out of control.

[409] But, like, city streets ain't it.

[410] Because there's gum and holes and gravel and shit.

[411] Like...

[412] I don't know what I was thinking, but I'm giving that up and I'm going to try to have another hobby soon.

[413] Ice skating?

[414] No. That's not going to main.

[415] me in any way and make me go to the hospital during COVID, driving cars with no brakes.

[416] Let's see what else.

[417] Swords.

[418] He's just fucking two sword shit in the park.

[419] Perfect.

[420] Did you see that story?

[421] Somebody retweeted this and I can't stop thinking about it.

[422] I do this all the time where I look at Twitter and I absorb it, but I don't like save or fave any of the stuff.

[423] We all know this because I do it every week.

[424] But somebody posted a picture talking about how.

[425] How disturbing.

[426] Like, we're all talking about social media and the social dilemma, which is the amazing special on Netflix about how totally thought we are with all this stuff and how it's affecting us.

[427] But somebody posted a picture.

[428] There is a private jet set.

[429] So it's like the Hollywood set.

[430] Oh.

[431] That if you were on a sitcom, you would go and sit on that.

[432] And it's like, oh, this is a scene where we're in a private jet.

[433] that Instagram influencers are using to pretend that they are on private jets.

[434] Stop it.

[435] Because people started recognizing, that's that same jet.

[436] And then basically, oh, that's from Veep.

[437] I think I saw that on the set of Veep.

[438] Why does that say that the president's plane?

[439] What?

[440] Do you know there's a, oh, my God, go on.

[441] Well, no, no, my point is just, I keep thinking about it because, you know, when I see, like, people from Instagram, it's like some of those Kardashian pictures where I'm like, oh, my skin will never.

[442] glow like that and I will never have like it's too late for me because like the the monologue that starts in my head about how I hate pictures of myself well the reason is because I'm comparing myself to mannequins to 3D images that were created in a computer these are not real people they're not real situations people who make them look like that there's a there's a subreddit that's called Instagram reality where they'll show the photo that someone posted and like how tiny their waist is and how hot and big their butt is and then they're like look at the look at the wall in the back and the wall's like bending because it's really good because or like there's like people without pores that don't have pores in their lives it's like not fucking real these people are I mean it's fine do your fucking thing but it's but when but people like who have low self -esteem or who feel bad about themselves need to not fucking take that seriously or eating disorders where you're you're taking you know and I will speak just for myself in this where it's always an issue for me and it's always a concern of mine and it's a problem because again because I grew up in the 80s where you had to be 89 pounds like on coke and blonde yeah and back then it was all kind of real because I guess they didn't have the technology but when you bring when I bring my issues to social media it's only basically to get beaten up I'm going to the playground to get my face punched by feeling bad about how great everyone looks like the other day I was looking at there's like a group of friends picture that somebody posted on Twitter for some reason and I was like oh my god I would look terrible if I was in that picture and I'm like they're 26 like I did that 25 years ago I'm not supposed to look like that and you're I looked fine then no none of this like all we're all comparing it's like we're all back in high school whether you're fucking 50 or 18 or or or fucking eight like it's really not good for us no take it all with a grain of salt I guess yes thing also if somebody could take whatever Georgia posted in her skates and somehow animate that um to make it look like she's going off a jump like Tony Hawk we'd love to see it basically live for Georgia and make it look like what she posted it's like now I'm the best roller skater of all time.

[443] You might be able to because I look like I'm sitting on a curb tying my skate.

[444] So you might be able to look like I'm doing a jump where I pull my, you know, pull the board up high.

[445] You just basically posted a picture of like, I'm getting ready.

[446] And then just never, never did anything else.

[447] Well, there was no hands available to take photos of me while I was skating because I wouldn't let go of Vince, truly.

[448] I like kind of hurt him when I was my grip.

[449] So there was no one to take a photo.

[450] I was like, okay, put my skates on.

[451] And then don't let go of me, please.

[452] Oh, shit.

[453] I just don't want to do that to him again.

[454] Skaporting.

[455] Another fucking thing I hurt myself really bad at when I tried.

[456] It's tough.

[457] Don't try.

[458] The answers don't try.

[459] Well, don't try to stand or sit on things with wheels that have no brakes if that isn't something you've done before, maybe, or a lot.

[460] Karen, you know I'm all about vintage shopping.

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[481] Goodbye.

[482] Well, this week, I'm going to do the Pied Piper of Tucson.

[483] Okay.

[484] We've never done this one before.

[485] I don't think I know it.

[486] It's old.

[487] It's from the 60s.

[488] Okay.

[489] And it's been covered a lot because it's one of those things that wasn't just the case itself.

[490] It was then kind of taken at the time to reflect a cultural issue.

[491] And so it's kind of, it's pretty, it's pretty interesting and the reason um the reason i picked this one is because i got this tweet and so did you are you fucking stalking me on twitter so did you yep i'm blocked yep i like to check your mentions don't you dare block me um this is from a listener named brena and she said to both of us added both of us i'm an english professor at lSU and just read um where are you going where of you been, which is a short story by Joyce, Joyce Carolotes, with my intro to fiction class, not realizing it was inspired by this article about the Pied Piper of Tucson, would love to hear it on the pod.

[492] Beautiful.

[493] And she, yeah.

[494] So she linked this article from Life magazine, 1966, called the Pied Piper of Tucson.

[495] And the other, just so thank you so much, Brenna, for sending that.

[496] And because she's a professor, she didn't just send the suggestion, but she lived.

[497] linked the article so that so that the research would be there but I also used my azibar .org murderpedia Wikipedia and once again Jay found a research document from Radford University from their psychology department I used one of these once before at a live show I remember because they break down criminal cases or or killers and they break them down because they're psychology wise so they give a really great criminal.

[498] by year listing the year age and then the event that happened and they go through the whole thing of like is the triad of um oh yeah yeah you know the try is the dark triad in there is this is this and basically it's for it's them basically learning that that stuff but when you're when you're doing these stories you can go in and know exactly the year the thing happened so good it's amazing so thank you to jacclan mullins shana Brown and Quentin Preston.

[499] They're the ones that researched and summarized all this information for the Department of Psychology at Radford University.

[500] Ooh, I'm like excited about this one that if it's so interesting that psychologists have to like fucking take it apart and shit.

[501] Yeah, it's well, yeah, because it is, it's one of these, it's an interesting one.

[502] They also, a crime to remember, covered this too.

[503] Yeah.

[504] Such a good shit.

[505] Yeah.

[506] So well done.

[507] So, okay.

[508] Okay, so it's May 31st, 1964, and 15 -year -old, Aline Rowe gets ready for bed so she can get up early for a test the next day at school.

[509] She's a test at 6 a .m. Fuck that shit.

[510] I mean, horrifying.

[511] She's a sophomore at Palo Verde High School in Tucson, Arizona.

[512] She's an above -average student.

[513] She's very pretty.

[514] and she has dreams of going to college to become an oceanographer.

[515] Her parents are recently divorced, and she and her newly single mom, Norma, they just moved to Tucson the year before.

[516] Aline adjusts to life in her new town quickly.

[517] She makes friends with a neighbor, 18 -year -old Mary French, who's a high school dropout.

[518] And for some reason, Jay included in his research that she was in quotes from, And it made me laugh for so long.

[519] What the fuck?

[520] You live 18 years of your fucking life getting by to be described as frumpy?

[521] Frumpy forever.

[522] You know she was wearing some moss green sweater.

[523] Like she just got pulled in a cardigan that was a little oversized.

[524] Sorry, I can't be a supermodel all goddamn day and night.

[525] She was like the first one to wear pants in her town, the girl, to wear pants in her town.

[526] So they call her frumpy.

[527] Frump.

[528] Makes me mad.

[529] I don't know why.

[530] I argue for frumpism at all times.

[531] I'm a big frump supporter.

[532] Careful.

[533] Okay.

[534] Oh my God.

[535] So Mary has this boyfriend.

[536] Mary works at the nursing home in town, and she met the son of the owners of this nursing home.

[537] And his name is Charles Smitty Schmidt.

[538] He's 21.

[539] Mary's 18 He has jet black hair And a drawn -on beauty mark on his cheek And he wraps his cigarettes up In his fucking white t -shirt sleeves Yes, he's doing complete Elvis drag Okay Or a James Like he wants people to think he looks like Elvis He wants people to tell him he looks like Elvis Like it's his obsession In addition he's 5 -3 And sometimes Smitty His friend 19 year old John Saunders hangs out too John Saunders, tall and gangly.

[540] Shmitty, five foot three.

[541] It's a hilarious combination.

[542] Oh, so funny.

[543] Not really.

[544] Okay, so Aline's mother doesn't like Mary French.

[545] She thinks she's a bad influence on her daughter, Aline.

[546] She's seen the kids that they hang out with racing up and down the street.

[547] Street racing was big in Tucson at the time.

[548] And she's also caught Smitty staring at her with what she calls pinpillar.

[549] point eyes.

[550] She has an especially bad feeling about him, but she's also so glad her daughter has friends that she can't complain and she's a single mother.

[551] Um, so she's, you know, she can only do what she can do.

[552] Yeah.

[553] So Aline goes asleep that night, May 31st, 1964.

[554] And Norma heads out, she's an, for her night shift, she's a nurse.

[555] Okay.

[556] So she goes to Tucson Hospital.

[557] Um, once Norma leaves, Mary, Smitty and John pull up, um, to the house.

[558] Mary taps on Aline's window and wakes her and invites her to come out drinking with them so of course Aline goes because right high school that's your high school dream and these kids are older so she's 15 she's 15 she's 15 and these kids are 18 and then the boys are even older than that so it must have actually been very thrilling to be like included and hey come on we got a party oh my god for sure so Smitty drives all of them out to one of their usual drinking spots in the secluded desert in the dark of night.

[559] They park and walk down into the wash, which is a dry creek bed that only fills up seasonally.

[560] Jay literally left the definition in because of, I think because the last time when we talked about a slew or a slough, whatever, I think we discussed how it would be pronounced.

[561] And someone wrote in when we talked about that and said that the Petaluma River was considered a slew or slough, which I think.

[562] found offensive.

[563] Anyway.

[564] So they're down and they're drinking, right?

[565] This is kind of just what kids do, you know, like to get away, go drink a beer out in a weird field somewhere.

[566] We drank in the Orange County, like river bed, like the L .A. River.

[567] Did you?

[568] Uh -huh.

[569] Was it cement, like the, like from Greece?

[570] Cement and empty.

[571] Yeah, it was exactly like it was like from Greece.

[572] Love it.

[573] And you took it, you take off your neckerchief and then start the drag races.

[574] Always.

[575] yeah um you're you're the best dancer from st bernadette's okay so they're out there they sit and they chat and then according to mary smitty um sorry and then later according to mary smitty and mary walk back to his car and they leave aline and john behind um but then as they're walking they hear a cry so mary goes on and gets into the car alone and smith Smitty goes back to the wash. Mary sits in the car alone for 45 minutes, and then John shows up at the car and says that Smitty wants her to come back to the wash, but she says she refused.

[576] So then he leaves, and ten minutes later, Smitty appears, gets in the car beside Mary.

[577] Oh, no. And in an excited voice says, we killed her.

[578] I love you very much.

[579] And then he kisses Mary, and he grabs a shovel from the trunk.

[580] And then he and Mary walk back to the wash. where John is and they find him standing over Aline's body.

[581] She has blood on her head and her face.

[582] She's laying face up.

[583] Then they dig a shallow grave, put Arlene in it, wiped Smitty's car clean of her fingerprints and leave.

[584] So Tucson in the 60s is basically, has the appearance of a typical peaceful American suburb.

[585] It's after World War II and the population goes from 85 ,000 to 300 ,000.

[586] It's filled with older retirees, you know, who want to enjoy a simple life in the warm weather.

[587] But there's not enough work to go around.

[588] And there's so many retirees that pick up like part -time jobs that there aren't enough for the kids in the area to take those part -time jobs.

[589] So they don't have a lot to do.

[590] And the schools are overcrowded.

[591] So they're on, it operates in split sessions.

[592] So some kids go to school during the first half of the day.

[593] Other kids go to school in the second half of the day.

[594] So that leaves a bunch of kids free.

[595] to roam around from either noon onward or from 6 o 'clock until noon the next day.

[596] Yeah.

[597] So it's not like everyone has to be up and ready to go at 7 a .m. or whatever.

[598] So basically this is like a recipe for kids partying and like hanging out.

[599] Teenagers cure their boredom by driving around a stretch of road called the Speedway.

[600] And they also hang out at burger joints.

[601] There's a teen nightclub called the Pickup Palace.

[602] Oh, dear.

[603] Well, they call, sorry, they call it the pickup palace.

[604] I don't know what it's called.

[605] They also use fake IDs to get into bars.

[606] So sometimes they just go out into the desert and throw what they call a boondocker, which is basically a desert kegger.

[607] Yeah.

[608] And that, my friends, was the birthplace of Burning Man. Just kidding.

[609] Just kidding.

[610] The long and the short of it is, the teens of Tucson, it's very easy for them to get in trouble.

[611] Yeah.

[612] Because there's just a ton of hanging out.

[613] There's nothing to do.

[614] So the elderly king of these teen troublemakers is none other than Charles Smitty Schmidt.

[615] He was born July 8th, 1942 in Tucson.

[616] He's adopted by wealthy owners of the Hillcrest Nursing Home, Charles and Catherine Schmidt.

[617] And they spoil him rotten.

[618] He's strange and he's a bit of an outsider, but he's not unpopular.

[619] He's obsessed with Elfell.

[620] Elvis, as I said, he always tries to emulate his style, so he dyes his hair black.

[621] He styles it the same way.

[622] He puts makeup on his face so he can appear tanner and then draws the beauty mark using axle grease because that's because Elvis had one.

[623] And he also puts a clothespin on his lip to pull his lip downward and give him the pouty look that Elvis had.

[624] You know, he had like that.

[625] Wait, does that work?

[626] Because we've been on the fillers.

[627] I doubt it.

[628] Yeah, exactly.

[629] He dreamed of fillers.

[630] He was trying to get that gone.

[631] He's also super insecure about his height, which is very difficult.

[632] I think, like, the height thing for men is, like, the weight thing for women.

[633] He buys elevated cowboy boots, stuff some with newspapers, and crushed up beer cans, and adds inside the boot adds three inches.

[634] So he's got the heel of the boot that's adding height.

[635] and then inside he's basically wearing high heels.

[636] I've done that.

[637] So that he appears tall.

[638] I did that as a kid because I wasn't tall enough to play a laser tag.

[639] So what'd you do?

[640] Photon, it was called.

[641] And I fucking went in the bathroom and stuffed my shoes with paper towels to try to be a little taller and it didn't work.

[642] So my brother and sister got to go pay a laser tag.

[643] And would you do you just stare at like the gumball machine?

[644] Yeah.

[645] Or like there's this like walkway at the top that you're allowed to stand on and like shoot down, but you don't get it like actually play.

[646] Oh.

[647] Yeah.

[648] And then it closed by the time I was.

[649] tall enough.

[650] That's why I am a college dropout.

[651] And that's why.

[652] If they would have, if they just would have let me play laser tag.

[653] The one thing is he is legitimately good looking.

[654] And he does have, they say he did have a certain kind of charisma.

[655] So he was very popular with the ladies.

[656] He was usually dating as many as he could at the same time.

[657] So even though Mary considered him her boyfriend, he had more than one girlfriend at the time.

[658] He actually, in fact, bought two fake diamond rings, gave one to marry French, and then another one to a girl named Kathy Morath.

[659] He proposed to both of them and convinces both of them to get jobs and joint bank accounts with him.

[660] Oh, no. Uh -huh.

[661] So then they work, they deposit their paycheck, he goes and takes all the money.

[662] When Kathy Morath realizes Smitty never cared about her and was just basically setting her up so that he could take money from her, she breaks up with him and starts dating his best friend, Richie Bruns.

[663] Smitty is also a bad student.

[664] He once wrote a theme paper about how he wanted to quote, run naked down the main street of Tucson, masturbating and screaming obscenities at the world.

[665] Great.

[666] So I need a new hobby.

[667] That sounds pretty fucking awesome.

[668] I know roller skating is out for you, but if you would just consider this, because you'd have to get good at running and masturbating at the same.

[669] time.

[670] Sure.

[671] I need, like, I have the tiger playing in my headphones.

[672] Just focus.

[673] You have to drink a bunch of raw eggs.

[674] Okay.

[675] But the thing about him, he is not a good student, not interested in school, a really great athlete, though.

[676] He led his high school gymnastics team to the state championships in 1960.

[677] But the same year, he steals equipment from the school's machine shop.

[678] So he gets suspended.

[679] And then he just decides he's not going back.

[680] So he was suspended, but he was an he wasn't expelled.

[681] So they're just like, oh, here's your punishment.

[682] And he's like, peace.

[683] Hey.

[684] And because his parents spoiled him and, you know, whatever, they let him do whatever he wanted.

[685] Instead, he just hangs out in the school parking lot.

[686] So he socializes there.

[687] He meets girls there.

[688] He doesn't have to have a job.

[689] His parents buy him a little house so that he can live in it on his own.

[690] And they give him an allowance of $300 a month.

[691] Which I'm sure is a lot today.

[692] Stephen, will you look up and see in 1964 how much $300 a month would have been?

[693] I'm going to say $1964.

[694] I'm going to say $14 .50.

[695] Georgia guess is $14.

[696] Wait, Stephen, we're going to do some guesses.

[697] Okay, cool.

[698] Georgia guesses $14 .50.

[699] $300 a month.

[700] I'm going to say $2 ,500.

[701] Stephen, what's your guess?

[702] Wait, you already know the answer.

[703] I'm going to guess the right answer because I just looked it up.

[704] You asshole.

[705] It's a little over $2 ,500.

[706] 5 ,500.

[707] Whoa, Karen, the mathematician.

[708] And I win $2 ,500 shot?

[709] I owe you $2 ,500.

[710] Yeah, from Georgia.

[711] That's the bet.

[712] That was the bet.

[713] Sorry, sorry.

[714] Sorry, that was the bet.

[715] Damn it.

[716] Wow.

[717] I mean, so.

[718] That's a lot of fucking money.

[719] That's, especially when he owns his house.

[720] He doesn't have to spend any of that money on rent.

[721] No. He spends all of his money on cans to crush up to put in his boots.

[722] He throws a lot of parties.

[723] He goes out drinking with anyone who'll hang out with them.

[724] He's also a pathological a liar.

[725] So he does stuff like he lies to make himself sound cool.

[726] And here's an example of one of those lies.

[727] He tells people his birth name is Angel Rodriguez.

[728] Which is a cool name.

[729] But it's also weird lie.

[730] Yeah.

[731] It's like, well you could say, yeah.

[732] What is it getting you in conversation?

[733] Yeah.

[734] Like if you're like angel like from God?

[735] Great.

[736] Congratulations.

[737] He also so that's like to seem cool but then he also does stuff like he told a girlfriend once that he shot out the windows of his own car and then told his girlfriend I was shot at by thugs trying to protect you this is what happened so he he's he's up for lying about kind of anything um to make himself look cool or badass he he also lies to get sympathy so he tells people that his mom was a famous lawyer who wanted nothing to do with him and put him up for adoption and wouldn't talk to him or whatever.

[738] There is a story about him having a, when his parents told him he was adopted, he met with the birth mother and it didn't go well.

[739] So it's almost like he's trying to take that story and kind of like play it for sympathy and interest, I guess.

[740] His recklessness and his willingness to spend his money on other people makes him very popular with the bored teenagers of Tucson very popular um so teenagers are totally down to hang with this guy because he is buying uh which is the way to do it if that if you're if you're a weird 23 year old yeah that wants to be around 15 year olds you better get that wallet out so when norma returns from work um so that's that's everything the horrible shit that happened the night before So Norma, who's just worked a night shift, gets home and her daughter's not there.

[741] She calls the police reports are missing.

[742] They search for Aline, but they don't find any sign of her.

[743] Norma immediately suspects that Smitty has something to do with it.

[744] And the police do question him, Mary and John.

[745] But all three, Smitty, Mary, and John have the same story.

[746] They were all supposed to go on a double date, but when they showed up to pick up Aline.

[747] she wasn't there so they left and the police have no evidence to suggest anything different or that they had anything to do with it so they just let them go now norma doesn't believe this story for a second and she knows she knows there's a lot of kids that are kind of up to no good in town aline told her there was a rumor going around that smitty was running a sex club where if you wanted to be in it you had to have sex in front of a bunch of other people.

[748] That was like the initiation.

[749] Whoa.

[750] Weird rumors like that where I'm sure it added to his kind of like reputation and prowess or you know like fascination or whatever.

[751] But yeah.

[752] Yeah.

[753] But I'm sure Mary as a 15 year old heard about it and was like, oh my God.

[754] You know, like so.

[755] So Norma knew, you know, that there was there was stuff going on and that she, her daughter didn't just like walk out of the house and walk away.

[756] So Norma tells the police all of this stuff that she knows.

[757] They dismiss her.

[758] They say, it's just rumors.

[759] They're making it all up.

[760] You know, that's what kids do.

[761] And of course, the cops assume Aline ran away.

[762] So Norma, the badass that she is, takes the investigation into her own hands.

[763] Oh, yeah.

[764] She questions other schoolmates of Aline to see if they know anything.

[765] She also reaches out to reporters to get the word out.

[766] She also calls Arizona's Attorney General and the FBI trying to get them to help.

[767] She speaks with a New Jersey psychic who tells her that Aline is buried somewhere in the desert under a tree.

[768] Police refuse to search because they don't have evidence to warrant it and they wouldn't know where to start if they did.

[769] Norma leaves her kitchen light on every night in hopes that Aline will turn back up and come on home.

[770] That's the saddest.

[771] saddest, worst.

[772] But after a year, the investigation loses steam and fizzles out, which sounds like it never had any steam in the first place.

[773] Then just two months later in June of 19th...

[774] Then just two months later, in July of 1964, Smitty meets 17 -year -old Gretchen Fritz at the local pool.

[775] And she is the troublemaking daughter of a wealthy surgeon.

[776] And basically, that's his type.

[777] I mean, that's, like, perfect for him is the rebellious, rich girl.

[778] fun who wants to like yeah exactly she wants to go be dangerous yeah um and so he basically follows her home from the pool and knocks on her door and starts a conversation with her so they are immediately obsessed with each other um but they fight constantly and gretchen never wants him to go out with his friends she doesn't want him to talk to other girls which is what he's all about he does both of those things constantly and they're fighting It's definitely go verge into abuse, for sure.

[779] Once Gretchen gets jealous, not physical abuse, but then just, like, ridiculous stuff.

[780] Like, she gets jealous so she dumps a bottle of shoe polish on his car.

[781] Then he takes it 95 steps further and writes a letter to the Tucson Health Department accusing Gretchen of spreading venereal disease around town.

[782] Oh, my God.

[783] So they're, yeah, it's like real housewives, but it's 1964.

[784] Oh, my God.

[785] And even after this kind of stuff, he also, because her parents hated him, of course, and didn't want her going out with him.

[786] And in one of these fights later on, he wrote the parents, her parents a letter saying, just so you know your daughter is still going out with me to fuck her over.

[787] Like, it's insanity.

[788] Oh, my God, I'm never having kids.

[789] Yeah.

[790] So crazy.

[791] So they're still inseparable, though.

[792] It's part of it.

[793] Of course, naturally.

[794] They're fucking.

[795] Yeah.

[796] And eventually, Smitty confides in Gretchen telling her that he killed Aline Rowe.

[797] He also claims to have killed another person before Aline, a boy who he says killed his girlfriend in a car accident.

[798] Gretchen doesn't care.

[799] She still keeps dating him.

[800] Oh, God.

[801] But after a year.

[802] Well, because.

[803] Because, and I shouldn't say doesn't care, but this would be, he's basically put down a bonding opportunity for her to go, I'll keep your secret.

[804] It's just you and me in this world.

[805] Yeah.

[806] You know, like now I, she's probably scared now, you know, where she seems like, oh, then I don't want to date you anymore.

[807] Like, you're a murder.

[808] Right.

[809] I'm good.

[810] That's not going to happen.

[811] Yeah.

[812] The fuck.

[813] Yeah, exactly.

[814] Scared, fascinated.

[815] Like, can't get away.

[816] Yeah.

[817] She's afraid of the letters he'll write after she leaves.

[818] I mean, I still can't get over that.

[819] That's like a weird burn.

[820] It's like not in the heat of the moment where you take shoe polish and dump it on the car.

[821] It's like, dear, you know, like, did he fucking write it freehand and type it or what?

[822] He had to lick an envelope.

[823] He had to take it down to the fucking post office.

[824] Minimum 12 steps to fuck your girlfriend over that you're just going to make up with again.

[825] Totally.

[826] So after about a year, the relationship reaches a breaking point.

[827] She threatened Smitty saying that if.

[828] he doesn't stop seeing other girls, she's going to go to the police and tell them that he murdered Allie and Row.

[829] Shortly after August 16th, 1965, Gretchen takes her little 13 -year -old sister, Wendy, to a drive -in movie.

[830] But they never come back.

[831] Gretchen's dad assumes that Smitty has something to do with it.

[832] Obviously, the parents never liked him.

[833] It's, you know, he hires a private detective, and the detective finds Gretchen's car abandoned behind a motel when the police go to interview smitty he tells them he thinks the two sisters ran away to mexico can you imagine losing two daughters like it's just horrifying losing two daughters horrifying being a single mom and losing one daughter only child yeah i mean yeah it's total total destruction devastation yeah okay so the week after that on august 23rd 1965 smitty has his best friend Richie Bruns over to his house and they start talking about Gretchen and Smitty says you know I killed her right I did it right here in the living room then he says that he strangled both of them dumped their bodies in another desert spot where they would go drink sometimes wiped down Gretchen's car and ditched it behind the motel so Richie has been friends with this guy long enough to know that he's definitely a compulsive liar and brags about weird shit to make himself look good so he doesn't really believe him but a couple nights later smitty shows up at richie's house with a couple intimidating guys in suits smoking cigars and the guys take the boys to an apartment where more guys in suits question them about gretchen and wendy they say they were hired to find her by the family and smitty believes that they are mafia connected oh shit yeah so Smitty remains calm.

[834] He says he doesn't know where the girls are, that maybe they went to California, and the suit and men let the boys go.

[835] So back at Smitty's house, they go back to Smitty's house, and Smitty calls the FBI.

[836] What?

[837] Uh -huh.

[838] He tells them that some mafia, members of the mafia harassed him about Greshon's disappearance.

[839] They tell Smitty they'll send someone to come and speak with him.

[840] Oh, dear.

[841] Yeah.

[842] It's not too bright.

[843] So now Richie's scared.

[844] He doesn't actually really know what's going on, but he knows that now the FBI is going to figure it out and be involved somehow.

[845] So he tells Smitty, if he really did kill the girls, that he and he just put them in the desert, he's going to need a better hiding spot.

[846] And Smitty's like, you know what?

[847] You're exactly right.

[848] Come with me. And they go out.

[849] He drives them to where he basically dumped Gretchen and Wend, Wendy's bodies.

[850] They aren't even buried.

[851] They're still like on the surface.

[852] And then they try to bury them.

[853] But the shovel they have can't break the ground.

[854] It's like where they are is too hard.

[855] So they pull the bodies deeper into the wash to hide them better.

[856] So now Richie's implicated in this.

[857] He's now become a part of it.

[858] Totally.

[859] So the next day, Smitty meets with the FBI agents to report what happened with these alleged mobsters.

[860] But then later the same day, Smitty goes with those mobsters to San Diego to quote unquote look for Gretchen.

[861] And when he's there, he gets arrested by the police for impersonating an FBI agent.

[862] What?

[863] Uh -huh.

[864] They release him without charges.

[865] He comes back to Tucson.

[866] So that's just like this weird thing where, uh, yeah, it's kind of a mysterious part of the story where he would go he would actually go to California every once in a while and he would go and get into trouble out there he was like kind of always going out on these trips and coming back um so yeah that's that's one part whether or not he actually went with the mafia guys whether he's taken against his will whatever was going on with that he's he's picked up for saying he's in the FBI like how does that happen I know all of it it's super crazy so then but after that like trip in that whole thing there is a chance that those people that were hired actually were putting real pressure on him because he starts unraveling he becomes more violent um he starts destroying his own home like having these these outbursts of rage um on September 9th 1965 he goes on a blind date with a 15 year old girl and a month later he marries her oh my god yeah legal I Guess so?

[867] I don't.

[868] And back then or maybe the laws?

[869] I don't know.

[870] But he, it was basically kind of like on a whim.

[871] Because clearly he's like a womanizer and, you know.

[872] But now he has a 15 year old wife.

[873] Then he starts threatening Richie's life saying he's going to kill him next.

[874] So he clearly didn't trust that he had this person that shared this horrible secret.

[875] Yeah.

[876] So you might remember Kathy Morath who went out with Smitty first.

[877] The neighbor.

[878] Well, and no. That was, it was just another.

[879] It was the girlfriend that also, yes.

[880] Yes, yes.

[881] Now she's Richie's girlfriend.

[882] Okay.

[883] And she starts having weird experiences.

[884] Her family screen doors mysteriously cut.

[885] Um, they, they report to police seeing an unidentified prowler on their property.

[886] Richie gets scared that Smitty's going to kill Kathy next.

[887] So he decides he needs to keep watch over her house.

[888] So he sits outside her house all day and all night.

[889] Sometimes he's, he walks his dog by, sometimes whatever.

[890] the family has him arrested for stalking.

[891] Oh, no. You're not being a hero by being a guard.

[892] Right.

[893] But there was a whole thing about him.

[894] We'll talk about this in a little bit.

[895] There was a whole thing about snitching.

[896] So he's keeping this.

[897] He's keeping this secret.

[898] But clearly he's kind of going insane too.

[899] So basically the police in this arrest or whatever, he's told to leave town.

[900] Richie is like they say, I believe it's the judge after he gets arrested.

[901] they're like go live with your grandparents in Ohio you need to get away from this girl we don't care what your reasons were whatever like clearly this is a problem so they send him to live to stay with his grandparents um but late one night in october of 1965 richie gets drunk and tells his grandparents the whole story oh shit yeah and they don't believe him they think he's just drunk and being crazy which makes him snap and he calls the tucson police directly.

[902] Wow.

[903] He tells him the whole story, including Marion John's part and Aline Rose murder, and they have him come, they basically say, you need to come back here.

[904] So in Tucson...

[905] Hey, remember when we kicked you out of the city?

[906] Come on back.

[907] Now we understand why you were stalking.

[908] So in Tucson, Richie rides out of the desert.

[909] He basically takes the police out to where he hid the bodies with Smitty.

[910] Um, shows them exactly where when Gretchen and Wendy Fritz's remains are.

[911] And shortly after that on November 10th, 1965, the police arrest Smitty in his home.

[912] A few days later, Mary French and John Saunders are arrested as well, uh, for their part in Aline Rose murder, even though, um, Aline's body has not been found.

[913] Um, but they now have the whole story.

[914] Um, both Mary and John confessed to their involvement almost immediately, Mary's sentenced to four to five years for being an accessory to murder and John's sentenced to life in jail for his part in the murder.

[915] They try to lead the police to Aline's body but they can't find it.

[916] So prosecutors push to have the trial for Aline Rose murder first because then a guilty verdict there would almost guarantee a guilty verdict in the case of the Fritz sisters.

[917] But the judge orders that the trial for the Fritz sisters murders goes first.

[918] And that begins February 15th 1966.

[919] And in this trial, the court hears testimonies from Richie Bruns, Mary French, but John Saunders pleads the fifth.

[920] Smitty does not take the stand.

[921] The trial lasts two weeks and on March 1st, 1966, he's found guilty on both murder counts.

[922] Later that month of March of 1966, he's sentenced to death.

[923] So Aline Rowe, the murder of Aline Rowe, that trial begins May of 1967.

[924] But this time Smitty adds another lawyer to his team because remember his parents were rich.

[925] So they go ahead and hire Ethley Bailey to defend him.

[926] That motherfucker.

[927] And that mother fucker.

[928] F. Lee Bailey, you may know he was involved in the Boston Strangler case and Sam Shepard in the 50s and 60s.

[929] He mo - Flee Bailey motions that the judge not consider the death penalty as Aline Roe's body as hasn't been found, the judge denies that motion.

[930] So Mary French testifies again.

[931] She recounts her side of the story telling the court that on May 30th, 1964, the day before Aline's murder, Smitty told her that he wanted to kill a girl just to, quote, see if he could get away with it.

[932] Mary reveals that she was pregnant with Smitty's baby at the time, and she wanted to make him happy so that he'd man up and be present in the baby's life.

[933] By killing...

[934] yeah well also but then there's a there's a different piece of it that's her story but there's another side of the story that says that actually smitty was like bored with mary and mary had made friends with aline and aline was pretty and of course we remember that mary was frumpy so um he started paying a lot of attention to her so mary may have had uh some kind of cycle you know psychological reason in her mind that it was okay to get rid of this like competitor.

[935] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[936] Perhaps.

[937] I mean, it goes in there with the like thing of you're getting rid of the competition and you're trying to do the thing I mean, either way, she didn't feel bad about sacrificing this 15 year old.

[938] Having her friend, like allowing her friend to be murdered and saying nothing about it.

[939] It doesn't make a lot of sense.

[940] It's tough.

[941] It's tough to, it's tough for us who read true crime stories constantly to kind of process, imagine what people in Arizona in 1960s were doing in the mid -60s, let's say.

[942] So basically, Mary goes on to say that Smitty shared a list of three potential victims with her, and together they decided that the best choice would be Aline Roe, which is so cold -blooded and horrifying.

[943] Later, when Mary French gave birth to Smitty's baby, that child would be still born.

[944] so it was in this horribly ironic, awful way all for nothing.

[945] If she really is honest in saying that that's the reason she didn't.

[946] Mary told Aline the four of them would just go out drinking in the desert, believing her friend.

[947] Aline was excited to go.

[948] And so that night while Mary sat in the car, Smitty and John restrained Aline.

[949] They testified Smitty told John to rape her, but he wouldn't do it.

[950] And so Smitty does.

[951] and then beats her in the head with a rock and kills her.

[952] After Mary's testimony, John Saunders once again pleads the fifth.

[953] The prosecution reads John's preliminary hearing testimony aloud to the jury instead.

[954] And then the court takes a recess.

[955] And when they come back, F. Lee Bailey surprises everyone by announcing Smitty is ready to plead guilty to murder in the second degree.

[956] The trial ends with Smitty making his guilty plea on May 10, 1967.

[957] So at least in that case, F. Lee Bailey's like, hey, buddy, we're not doing this.

[958] Like, it's only going to get worse from here.

[959] Yeah.

[960] A few days later, Smitty motions to fire his lawyers and tries rescinding his plea.

[961] The judge asked Smitty to submit to a psychiatric exam and he refuses.

[962] Great.

[963] He then withdraws his request for a new trial and the plea stands.

[964] He's once again, he's sentenced to death.

[965] A month later on June 23rd, 1967, Smitty tells the sheriff that he'll show him where Aline's body is buried.

[966] Just pretty big.

[967] He says that if they can see Aline's skull, listen to this fucking reasoning.

[968] This is, you think maybe he's doing it because why would you not?

[969] Like, it's a thing we always talk about.

[970] We're just like, just tell them what they need to know.

[971] They know who you did it at this point.

[972] Right.

[973] Yeah.

[974] You're going to jail.

[975] But here's his lot, his reasoning.

[976] He says that if they see Aline's skull, they'll see that they'll see that they're there's no fracture, disproving the conclusion that Smitty bashed her in the head with a rock and thereby proving his innocence.

[977] Oh my God, dude.

[978] Yeah.

[979] Of course, it's ridiculous because he knows where the body is.

[980] Right.

[981] Implicating him right there.

[982] Yeah.

[983] And especially after the fact that John and Mary could not find it when they went to bring the police to show that the body, you know.

[984] So either way, they want to find Aline's body.

[985] So they take him out to the desert In cuffs, he leads the police to Harrison Road, which sits on the outer part of eastern Tucson, and there Smitty locates a spot with the team and the team starts digging.

[986] And it's the same area that John and Mary had taken the police before, but they learned that Smitty, the two of them, they all learned that Smitty had gone back after that night of the murder and moved the body to a different spot.

[987] That's why they couldn't find it.

[988] What the fuck?

[989] It's a lot of interfering with corpses type of shit that I hope were brought was brought up in the sentencing because it's clearly there's no concern there's no repulsion it's like you just keep going out and doing I mean I guess that's insane he murdered these people in cold blood so obviously he doesn't care but right when they find the body the corpse is just buried one foot below the surface police find that Smitty was completely wrong about the skull there's a massive fracture.

[990] It proves exactly what John and Mary attested to in court and basically submit these death sentences stand until 1971 when Arizona temporarily abolishes the death penalty.

[991] So his sentence is commuted to 50 years to life.

[992] So essentially he goes to jail, but then there is this kind of cultural after effect.

[993] So that article from Life magazine was written in 1966.

[994] But basically, the news of these murders cast this, you know, Tucson in this very unfavorable light.

[995] And they're just kind of talking about like that the youth culture there is out of control and that they're all kind of like slackers and criminals and, you know, basically the whole, the case becomes national news.

[996] But the locals find themselves constantly defending Tucson's reputation against this onslaught of stories, making, you know, their hometown look like this den of sin and, you know, whatever.

[997] Palo Verde High School students actually stage rallies and write pieces in their school paper expressing their opinion.

[998] They've all been painted as bad kids just because of a few, quote, misfits.

[999] But what was especially disturbing to investigators is how many kids not involved with the murders heard rumors that Smitty killed Aline Rowe and the Fritz sisters and never said anything, never went to the police.

[1000] That's a big deal.

[1001] It's, you know what it reminds me of is, remember the movie River's Edge?

[1002] Uh -huh.

[1003] It's that.

[1004] Yeah.

[1005] It's that thing.

[1006] Six of Aline and Gretchen's classmates knew enough about the crimes at least to warrant going to the police and notifying them about these rumors that were swelling around.

[1007] Not one of them did.

[1008] That's, that's dark.

[1009] Yeah.

[1010] One student claims that they, quote, didn't know Smitty committed murder, but then goes on to say that, quote, even if I had known, I wouldn't.

[1011] have said anything.

[1012] I wouldn't want to be a think.

[1013] Oh.

[1014] Yeah.

[1015] Richie Bruns would later, he's, you know, who's the one who basically broke this story and told police.

[1016] He recently wrote a book because right after all this stuff happened to him, he kind of wrote everything down that was like his side of the story.

[1017] Because of course, he had a horrible time in Tucson.

[1018] Everybody either said like he would go into places and they're like, we're not going to serve you get out.

[1019] Because he snitched.

[1020] either because he had something to do with it or because he snitched so he couldn't win either way he was he was you know yeah it's very understandable that these local people would just be like you had your hands all up in this horrible crime a but then this other side of like get out you snitch so here's this this is a really good quote from this article from the website tusson .com which is where I go for all my news but this was an article when this when so when Richie Braun's book came out, well, Richard now, because he's an adult, he titled it I Squealer, which is kind of a hilarious title.

[1021] Yeah.

[1022] And basically, he was talking about how awful life got for him in that town in both directions.

[1023] So he tells the story about getting turned away because he didn't tell the police soon enough, whatever.

[1024] Then he says once he was playing pool with his brother at a bowling alley, on South Alvernan way.

[1025] And he says, quote, at the table next to us was somebody I recognized had gone to prison.

[1026] He was this big dude and I thought, oh my God, I'm in trouble.

[1027] He shot a couple balls and said, how you doing, Richard?

[1028] And he was friendly as hell.

[1029] So here was somebody who was in prison and lived by a strict you don't squeal code.

[1030] And he recognized the difference between squealing on somebody for stealing a candy bar and squealing on somebody who was out there killing girls.

[1031] It was quite a different thing.

[1032] But your average high school kids who grew up with things and had these wonderful jobs, they'd drive by my house and throw stuff and yell derogatory things, mainly about being a rat.

[1033] Fuck.

[1034] Yeah.

[1035] That sucks.

[1036] Yeah.

[1037] At the time, there was this kind of like, it was like Marlon Brando, you know, like, it was very like that motorcycle pompadour culture, where it was kind of like, yes, exactly.

[1038] And that idea of like being a rat or being a snitch, which I. don't disagree with in terms of like that in the way he said it is just so perfect though because it's like you have to have a line you have to have a personal moral line where where you would absolutely like you're not you would absolutely you're not betraying your friend you're uh trying to help his murder victims it's like a totally different thing and their families and their mothers who are leaving the kitchen light on all night to me yeah it snitching is one when you get arrested for something and you say, I have someone bigger than me that you want.

[1039] So let me give you this information about him so I can get a shorter sentence.

[1040] Yeah.

[1041] Whether it's true or not.

[1042] During Smitty's seven -year stint in prison, he attempts to escape three times.

[1043] The first two attempts fail.

[1044] On the third, he and a triple murderer named Raymond Hudgens managed to break out.

[1045] They make it to a ranch in Tempe, which I had a friend who used to live there.

[1046] He says the way you pronounce it.

[1047] pronounce it as Tempe.

[1048] Oh, good to know.

[1049] On this ranch, they take four people hostage.

[1050] They end up somehow, even with all that, they escape from that.

[1051] And they escape without harming these hostages.

[1052] They get away from that situation.

[1053] They stop and eat at a sonic drive -in.

[1054] And then they split up and they both go on the run separately.

[1055] And that's how those sonic commercials were invented.

[1056] The two dudes sitting in the car talking about.

[1057] how much they love the weird slurpy they're having.

[1058] Oh, my God.

[1059] Both men are captured a few days later and thrown back into prison.

[1060] A couple years later, Smitty tells his fellow inmates that he has leukemia and he doesn't have very long to live, which is, again, a lie.

[1061] He is trying to get sympathy from his fellow inmates, which is tragic.

[1062] Then on March 10, 1975, Smitty gets into a fight with two other inmates, and they stab him 47 times.

[1063] Holy shit.

[1064] He's taken to the hospital.

[1065] He dies 20 days later on March 30th, 1975, at the age of 32.

[1066] Oh my God, he's only 32.

[1067] He's 32.

[1068] He has burnt out his life.

[1069] Like, he's just, his mom decides to hold a Catholic burial for him in the prison cemetery, but his body is allegedly stolen from the morgue.

[1070] And it never turns up.

[1071] The funeral is carried out with an empty casket.

[1072] What happened to his corpse?

[1073] please.

[1074] I mean, horrifying.

[1075] Basically, if you watch the episode of a crime to remember, they really talk about that part of teens going bad and the cultural thing of like these apathetic teens that don't care, they care more about being cool than they do about blah blah, blah, that kind of whole story, which is really fascinating and interesting thing.

[1076] What I think they were actually tapping into, though, because it's 1966 when this life article comes out, it's three, years before the cultural, like, revolution of the 60s, you know, of the, of the, of the hippie movement.

[1077] Yeah.

[1078] So I think they were just kind of tapping into that first thing of like, oh, all these, the believe it to beaver days are over and something else is going on in the streets of America with these teenagers and we don't know what it is.

[1079] Yeah.

[1080] They're already starting to, you know, get parents scared of what their teenagers are going to do.

[1081] Right.

[1082] And that the teenagers are like have no conscience at all.

[1083] Right.

[1084] Which is such an oversimplification to just say now all teenagers are bad and rebels.

[1085] I mean, like, it's a ridiculous oversimplification, but it's almost like they were tapping into the beginnings of this complete sea change in the way all of American life worked.

[1086] And it wasn't just the teenagers.

[1087] It's like the teenagers are who they wanted to pin it on and talk about.

[1088] And can you believe them with their street races and their rebellion and their rebels without a cause?

[1089] Yeah.

[1090] Well, and there was a way huge thing happening culturally.

[1091] What's interesting is that I highly recommend, especially if you, if you like great writing, the Joyce Carol Oates short story, where are you going?

[1092] Where have you been?

[1093] Which she, she basically read about these cases and ended up writing a fictionalized version.

[1094] But, like, that's what that short story is about.

[1095] Cool.

[1096] And it's award winning.

[1097] And that is the basically the very rudimentary story of the Pied Piper of Tucson.

[1098] Nice.

[1099] I had never heard of that.

[1100] Great job.

[1101] Thank you.

[1102] Should we fucking hooray our way out of this?

[1103] Let's do a little fucking hooray backwards walk offstage with our hats.

[1104] You can't see it because this is a fucking podcast, but I'm doing a hell of my baby hat, top backwards off stage.

[1105] Yeah.

[1106] Okay.

[1107] You want to go first?

[1108] Sure.

[1109] This one's from Morgan underscore Cutter.

[1110] My fucking right is that my 17 -year -old little brother got his first job yesterday.

[1111] And then she put the kind of crying eyes emoji.

[1112] Yeah.

[1113] Or the acid eyes emoji, depending on your background.

[1114] He's pretty reserved, but he's loved being in the culinary program at his high school and was hired as a cook at one of our favorite lunch spots.

[1115] He texted me before the interview for advice, which literally made my day.

[1116] And then she did the kind of hand -type emoji of a crying guy or a smiling guy with a nose.

[1117] I'm not sure which one.

[1118] But either way, I love that.

[1119] I love like, I really feel like as shitty and insane and very difficult as everything has been.

[1120] The idea that people are getting closer to their family members who they might not have really, may not have put so much energy into is beautiful.

[1121] It is this thing where, like, the highs that you, there's so many lows and that, so the highs mean more, you know, they're like more important.

[1122] You realize what the important things in your life are and you have gratitude towards so much more than you did before this.

[1123] Not that we needed this.

[1124] Especially people, like when you and Vince left my house on Sunday or Saturday whenever it was, I wanted to like hug both of you and cross.

[1125] at the same time.

[1126] It's so hard not to hug people.

[1127] And like just to be like, I just, it's so nice to look at another person and be like, hey, did I tell you this?

[1128] And then you gave me the perfect reaction of like, are you kidding me?

[1129] Whatever.

[1130] Where it's like all these things we just, that used to be no big deal.

[1131] Now it's like, ooh, I just got my shot of like another expression on someone else's face and like empathy and listening and understand.

[1132] I don't know.

[1133] It just fucking really did it for me. Aw, good.

[1134] It's nice.

[1135] It's nice.

[1136] I'm glad.

[1137] Excuse me. Okay, mine is...

[1138] That was the belch of empathy.

[1139] Okay, this one is from where they wander.

[1140] Here's my fucking hooray.

[1141] I recently turned 30 in a pandemic and finally decided to go to therapy for the first time in my life.

[1142] I started...

[1143] Yay.

[1144] I started off the pandemic feeling very thankful for my job slash home stability.

[1145] But things quickly turned sour when my apart.

[1146] Apartment caught fire in April due to my neighbor's fireplace.

[1147] Jesus.

[1148] I was living out of hotels with my husband and our two large dogs and our cat.

[1149] After a hotel hopping for three plus months, we finally found a new apartment and have settled in.

[1150] Seems like the perfect time to get my life together.

[1151] I think my 30s will be when I stop collecting traumas and start working on being happy.

[1152] I just love that sentence, don't you?

[1153] It's beautiful.

[1154] Thank you.

[1155] Thank you for normalizing therapy and mental health.

[1156] I spent so many a pandemic night crying and listening to MFM.

[1157] I don't know how I would have survived this year without you.

[1158] Aw.

[1159] That's nice.

[1160] Nice.

[1161] Well, good luck.

[1162] I mean, Jesus, that's a load of shit.

[1163] Yeah, there's a lot to have.

[1164] Lots of different loads of shit people are dealing with in these ridiculous circumstances.

[1165] Thank God they found an apartment.

[1166] Two dogs and a cat.

[1167] And like the fucking days in, Jesus.

[1168] Okay.

[1169] This one, I believe this is from the fan cult.

[1170] The title is Dad Pride.

[1171] And it's from Lacey Kins.

[1172] My fucking hooray is that for the first time in his 68 years of life, my dad has finally decided to vote at this election year.

[1173] Wow.

[1174] I've always shrugged off his disinterest.

[1175] So it was extremely surprising to me when my stepmom told me that he was working on his ballot.

[1176] I started to cry.

[1177] We've had so many recent conversations about the current political climate and how important it is to change the direction that our country is headed.

[1178] I knew my dad had a voice to be heard and I'm just so proud that he finally realized it too.

[1179] Oh.

[1180] That's amazing.

[1181] Progress.

[1182] So much progress because you can't ignore it forever.

[1183] Well, also I think that's, you know, I was reading this thing today about how it's much more effective, you know, because there's lots of people that are volunteering and doing calls and whatever, but they say it's much more effective when a family member or a friend, someone close to the person has a conversation that a non -confrontational, non -anything, but it's basically just about, hey, here's what I think and I want to know what you think and I actually want to have a, not a fight, not a way, not a way to work out a bunch of our other shit, but a conversation about like what's actually happening in this world, not online with strangers, people you don't know, but a family member where someone else is looking in the face and saying, hey, this is important.

[1184] Just don't do it with toxic people.

[1185] Yes, because another great tweet I read recently, someone wrote, there's no, sorry, can I just take one second to read this because it's fucking genius?

[1186] And I know I have it saved in my legs for sure.

[1187] A woman named Francesca Ramsey, who on Twitter, Her handle is Chesqualee.

[1188] And she wrote, resist the urge to explain yourself to someone who's committed to misunderstanding you.

[1189] Love that.

[1190] It has 43 ,000 likes right now.

[1191] Yeah.

[1192] It's so genius and so good.

[1193] Yep, I do too.

[1194] Okay, I have one more.

[1195] Great.

[1196] This is on Instagram.

[1197] It's from H .L .'s Bell.

[1198] It's like Hell's Bell with an extra H and an extra E. on the end and stuff.

[1199] Yeah, sure.

[1200] Like a ladies, a lady's hell and a lady's bell.

[1201] Yeah.

[1202] So this says Georgia, congrats on a couple days of not drinking.

[1203] My fucking hurry this week is that after hearing Georgia talk about this naked mind in January, which is a great book I'm listening to again about getting sober and this woman's incredible journey, I've stayed sober from alcohol ever since.

[1204] No longer am I waking up with a hangover, self -hatred, and having to apologize to everyone and wondering where the fuck my car is.

[1205] Thank you.

[1206] Your recommendation saved my life and help me live a better life while I still get to live it.

[1207] Wow.

[1208] So 10 months sober, she heard it in January and wow.

[1209] That's incredible.

[1210] It's really impressive.

[1211] Keep it up.

[1212] I'll try.

[1213] Just do what feels good.

[1214] And get real about what feels good as opposed to what you've been doing that you tell yourself feels good.

[1215] That's a great point.

[1216] she said is she shoved another nerds rope into her mouth we have to end on that that was it that was the button I think we're done that was your last cue card that you pulled up since we planned this whole podcast and great I read my cue card and that's been our show ladies and gentlemen thanks for listening we appreciate you so much yes please um stay safe um if you feel like it stay sober if that works for you.

[1217] Oh, and stay tuned for the I Saw What You Did trailer from Millie and Danielle.

[1218] Listen to it right now.

[1219] You're going to get a great sample of your favorite new podcast.

[1220] But mostly stay sexy.

[1221] And don't get murdered.

[1222] Goodbye.

[1223] Elvis, do you want a cookie?

[1224] Good boy.

[1225] I'm Millie to Cherico.

[1226] And I'm Danielle Henderson.

[1227] And we're the host of I Saw What You Did, a brand new podcast about the fun of watching movies on the exactly right network.

[1228] Each Tuesday, we will pick a different theme.

[1229] Like, really bad boyfriends.

[1230] Great 70s apartments.

[1231] Neighborhood creeps.

[1232] Movies about the mall.

[1233] And hysterical women who have every right to be hysterical.

[1234] Then we pick two films that best showcase it.

[1235] It's like having your coolest, single, childish, chain smoking, aunt handpick movies you've never heard of are always meant to watch.

[1236] This movie is so hilarious in so many interesting ways to me, like that scene where they're going to this party, dressed in actual garbage bags and Marina is like got hers tight and belted it looks like a dress and it's got a slit and Michelle, White Michelle Williams is literally wearing a garbage bag like she's just wearing a sack bag and this is a moment of such tenderness because it's about virginity and sex and you know Marina's like I'm going to do everything and for her everything includes doing heroin in a garbage bag and you're so right about that.

[1237] We talk about the kinds of things that you do when you're leaving a movie theater with your best friend.

[1238] Like, who would be the worst movie character to be in a relationship with?

[1239] And guess what?

[1240] They both suck.

[1241] They both suck.

[1242] They both suck.

[1243] That's horrible choice.

[1244] Horrible choices abound.

[1245] And why are some friendships so mean?

[1246] They both go for him.

[1247] Well, let's just say this.

[1248] Holly, you can tell it's like, this guy's up my alley because he's deep and sensitive and he's an intellectual and that's my guy.

[1249] Marina, though, does she want the challenge?

[1250] Does she want the attention?

[1251] Like, what's your take on why they both ended up sleeping with the guy, essentially?

[1252] Yeah.

[1253] I think with Marina, it was really vindictive, like straight up vindictive.

[1254] But there's a part of her of this character that feels like so hurt to me that she knows what she's doing, but she's so selfish in that need for love that she doesn't care that she's doing it.

[1255] Or what's the greatest outfit ever worn on film?

[1256] And, most importantly, who needs to calm down?

[1257] There's a segment where you can ask a female film programmer, that's me, Millie, all of your viewing questions like, what movie should you watch with your upstairs neighbor who only likes British period pieces?

[1258] And we'll occasionally talk to my horror movie loving grandma.

[1259] You'll definitely build your movie knowledge and fill all of your watch lists.

[1260] If you love movies, are sick of falling asleep to the same sitcom every night, or just need a break from the daily fresh horrors of the world, tune in every Tuesday to I Saw What You Did.

[1261] starting on November 10th, and be sure to subscribe on Apple Podcast, Stitcher, or wherever you like to listen.

[1262] And find us on Instagram and Twitter at I SawPod for all your double feature needs.