Ramy Youssef

[0] My name's Rami Yusuf.

[1] And I feel the inevitability of God coming into our lives about being Conan O 'Brien's friend.

[2] I feel like I've wanted to meet you for such a long time.

[3] This is the only correct answer anyone's ever given.

[4] Right?

[5] Yeah, that is the correct answer.

[6] God made this happen.

[7] Back to school, ring the bell, brandy shoes, walking loose, climb the fence, books and pens.

[8] I can tell that we are going to be friends Yes, I can tell that we are going to be friends Hey there, welcome to Conan O 'Brien needs a friend And I do need a friend I think we all need a friend The operative word here is need Yeah, I really do need someone We're worried about you To be my friend, and you should be Yeah I'm joined as always by Matt.

[9] How are you, Matt?

[10] I'm good, thanks.

[11] Oh, okay, that went well.

[12] How are you?

[13] Nice.

[14] I'm good.

[15] Okay.

[16] That's good.

[17] Went well.

[18] That's nice.

[19] Why don't you guys ask me how I'm doing?

[20] Um, we're okay.

[21] Okay.

[22] Wow.

[23] Well, in case you hadn't noticed, I took a big chunk out of my face.

[24] What happened?

[25] Wait, are you serious?

[26] Did you have you noticed it?

[27] Shaving.

[28] I never do that anymore.

[29] Shaving with.

[30] I thought the dermatologist.

[31] No, no, no, but it's funny.

[32] Because here's the thing.

[33] I did this two days ago, and you know that I'm just shaving.

[34] But are you just shaving or are you like?

[35] Yes.

[36] Shaving with a Zamboni?

[37] Sona, tell them, this is honest.

[38] This is true.

[39] Well, I think because anything you do is just very like, I just want to get this over with, right?

[40] So I feel like you're just like angrily.

[41] That's what I shout as I'm making love.

[42] I'm just want to get this over.

[43] That's hot.

[44] It's been 40 seconds.

[45] This is intolerable.

[46] Oh my God.

[47] My wife is a saint.

[48] Most everyday things, things that you just have to do, you're annoyed by.

[49] Well, it's not that I'm annoyed.

[50] I've seen my father does this too.

[51] Like when my father would wash his hands, the way Superman squeezes a piece of coal into a diamond, that's how my father would wash his hands.

[52] There's something in my genetic or cultural makeup, which is when I, all those years, Sona, when I'd do a show and I'd have makeup on afterwards.

[53] they'd give me these nice, moist, you know, towelettes that take the makeup off.

[54] Yeah.

[55] I would shred them against my face.

[56] Yeah.

[57] Like I was trying to eliminate all of my features of sandpaper.

[58] Oh, Jesus.

[59] And so what happens is I have to tell myself when I'm shaving, just chill.

[60] You don't, you know, they always tell you you don't push down, especially with these, you know, modern blades.

[61] And they have the swivel action head, the atra, whatever.

[62] They're just, you're just supposed to.

[63] Oh, you really got it.

[64] And I took, now, you guys are going to get mad at me, but I have a very strong jawline.

[65] And so, which is.

[66] It's not we're not mad.

[67] It's more just pity, I guess.

[68] Oh, is that what I'm just like, what I have, what I'm saying is I have a very, you know, strong, handsome jawline.

[69] It's when you say things like that.

[70] And one of the canons of beauty, male beauty for many years.

[71] And so when it has to take that turn, sometimes.

[72] when I'm impatient.

[73] So I have this deep chunk that I took out of the side of my face.

[74] Here's the interesting thing.

[75] It's really noticeable and it's like a long scrape and scar.

[76] It'll heal up in a couple days.

[77] No one's said a thing.

[78] No one has said, hey, Conan, what happened?

[79] Which makes me think that people think that I like try to have a facelift or something.

[80] I'll tell you exactly what it is.

[81] Because it is a gash that you would not associate with.

[82] just a razor nick.

[83] It seems like you have a condition or like you've got, I don't know, shingles or something like that.

[84] Jesus.

[85] Well, and you still didn't say anything?

[86] Why didn't you say anything?

[87] Well, I don't want to point that out.

[88] If you would have already known it, I'm sure.

[89] Did you notice it?

[90] So, Adam, you noticed it.

[91] Adam's coming over.

[92] I did.

[93] We were talking in the kitchen earlier.

[94] Yeah.

[95] And I did notice it.

[96] But why not say, hey, what happened?

[97] I thought it was like you went to the doctor and they took a biopsy sort of.

[98] Yeah.

[99] It is like it's a divot in your chin.

[100] Eduardo, did you notice it?

[101] I did not know.

[102] Oh, that's right.

[103] You're not really that into me or my welfare.

[104] Watching the soccer games over there.

[105] I do think a lot of people who do know you maybe saw it and were like, he got himself shaving angrily again.

[106] I do.

[107] Classic Conan just angrily shaved his face and ripped a part of it off.

[108] What is that?

[109] Because you've seen it in action, Sona.

[110] And I don't just, again, it's this, I'm going to shave now.

[111] energy and I honestly don't know but that's the approach I take to eating like I'm gonna get this food in me and then I've just gotta get to my coffin and die and I bet oh my God it's like where is this whole quote from?

[112] And I bet like brushing your teeth you brush it angrily I do that too I've seen you put hair product in your hair and you're like get a fucking hair product I don't put hair product in my hair yes you do I've seen you Sona I don't I've never put hair product in my hair That's not something I would ever do Okay, I'm sorry What happened?

[113] You don't want to We're just going to tell the party line I don't put hair product in my hair Okay Is your food thing and maybe I can relate to this?

[114] I don't really do anymore Because now I appreciate food And you can tell because my belly's grown I'm becoming fat daddy But listen Is it that your meals are just like These are in the way of the rest of the day This is just utilitarian stuff I got to get through to I remember it as a kid And this is true wishing, you know the way they came up with Soylent in Silicon Valley, this sort of warm, milky drink that gives you pretty much everything you're supposed to have.

[115] And it was a big thing because coders and quote geniuses, they don't need to be distracted.

[116] They can just sit there and go gloop and gloop and gloop and get everything they need while they're coding.

[117] I remembered coming up with that idea when I was in fifth grade because I was so intense and focused and a little crazy that I was thinking why isn't there just a cube I can have like a blue cube that I just eat and it gives me what I need and then I can get back to hating myself so yeah it's a problem like you're so aware of it why don't you just change change yourself listen to what you're asking you know what I mean I don't know I mean why don't you like when you're angrily shaving just be like Conan no I but you have stop yeah Yes.

[118] Yes.

[119] But you have to be on it all the time.

[120] And I am pretty good.

[121] I'm better than I used to be.

[122] But then my wife is constantly saying to me, no one's taking that away from you.

[123] We'll be in a restaurant.

[124] And I'm just, and she's like, no one's taking that away from you.

[125] And she always says, Neil isn't here, my older brother.

[126] She's like, Neil's not here.

[127] He's not going to take that pork chop.

[128] Now, I do think Neil is going to get that pork chop.

[129] He's in the vents of the restaurant.

[130] with a fishing rod and a hook.

[131] He's going to get that.

[132] But yeah, I do think this was a moment where I forgot.

[133] And it's not just a little nick.

[134] I took a piece of my face off.

[135] Yeah.

[136] What if you do an artery or something?

[137] Oh, right.

[138] And then we have to say like, oh, he was just angrily shaving his face.

[139] What a way to go.

[140] It's actually not a bad way to go.

[141] What are you bleeding out because you were shaving?

[142] It feels like falling asleep.

[143] Oh, come on.

[144] man. come on.

[145] Annie.

[146] Should we wrap this up?

[147] Seems like a pretty good place.

[148] Just don't shave.

[149] Yeah, would you ever bring the beard back?

[150] I don't know.

[151] It's funny.

[152] People were split on the beard.

[153] Oh, really?

[154] It's not in their business.

[155] I think women liked the beard and men, it seemed to irritate them.

[156] Will Ferrell had enraged him.

[157] He was like, get rid of that beard.

[158] He even shaved it.

[159] He was the one that shaved it off.

[160] Your face, your choice.

[161] You could do whatever you want.

[162] That's right.

[163] Thank you.

[164] Yeah.

[165] Thank you.

[166] You can go half -face beard, half -face not.

[167] No, you don't have, no. That's weird.

[168] That's stupid.

[169] This is trend -setting.

[170] What I might do is grow crazy long sideburns, like real choppers.

[171] You should.

[172] Those were the good.

[173] Well, I did.

[174] I tried it once in the late 90s, and a TV critic who liked me wrote a piece and wrote nice things about the show, but then said, Conan, who lately has morphed into a riverboat gambler.

[175] Now, that's not altogether bad.

[176] No. Maverick.

[177] I was a card sharp.

[178] But yeah, I'll do something.

[179] But I don't know.

[180] The beard, you know, I did it.

[181] It felt like that was then.

[182] This is now.

[183] I gotcha.

[184] But I think you just need to just slow down.

[185] What?

[186] I fixed you.

[187] Thank you, Sona.

[188] Wow.

[189] Wow, that's pretty good.

[190] Can you fix me?

[191] No, I do.

[192] You're good.

[193] I've always thought one of the.

[194] reasons that you and I click, if this is actually us clicking, but no, it is, is that you embody many of the things that I can't be, and maybe I embody some things you can't be.

[195] Yeah.

[196] And so, to be very honest, you have an ability to take things as they come, and I've always been this, you know, sort of grinding.

[197] I mean, Kevin Nielan always talks about me back at SNL, like grinding my fingers together.

[198] Yeah.

[199] I mean, there's something about all that that's, you know, allowed you to do a lot of the things you did.

[200] But, you know, you're good now.

[201] You did it.

[202] Yeah, you made it over the finish line.

[203] Just, uh, what?

[204] Well, not the finish line, but you won that.

[205] You won your race.

[206] You're done.

[207] You get to cruise.

[208] You're done.

[209] This is a shocking.

[210] Yeah, it's hard.

[211] Here's your watch.

[212] This is a horrible turn of events.

[213] I mean, I'm glad I'm very fortunate.

[214] For he's a jolly good fellow.

[215] For he's a jolly good fellow.

[216] I bought an RV.

[217] All right.

[218] Well, we got to get to it because my career's over.

[219] I got to wrap this up.

[220] My guest today is the creator and star of Hulu's hit series, Rami.

[221] I'm very excited to chat with him today.

[222] Rami Yusuf, welcome.

[223] I mean, the way we came in and hugged you, and I was like, I'm such a fan.

[224] We haven't met, and then we meet with this hug.

[225] I know.

[226] You walked in the room.

[227] I went to shake your hand.

[228] You said, I've got hands.

[229] hand sanitizer.

[230] So we ended up hugging and then I refused to let go of you.

[231] Well, yeah.

[232] And the hand sanitizer thing was just for the hug.

[233] Right.

[234] Yeah.

[235] I was like, let me have a wet hand so that we...

[236] And then I noticed you would sanitize your back, which was weird.

[237] Your back was all...

[238] It was wet and smelled of alcohol.

[239] Yeah, but I wanted to be clean for you.

[240] This is New York City.

[241] Like, I don't...

[242] I can't just show up dirty.

[243] I love it.

[244] I love...

[245] I was really excited because we were planning this trip to Needs.

[246] New York, and I thought, it'd be so great to get to talk to you because I love what you do.

[247] I'm a big fan of your work.

[248] And so it was just a nice happening that you were able to do this.

[249] Were you able to come in?

[250] Yeah, it's really exciting.

[251] Yeah, it is.

[252] It's exciting for me. And I never get excited.

[253] It's just, I'm so medicated.

[254] I'm in a lithium coma.

[255] Yeah, I wish people could feel what it's like being in the room with you because, yeah, I definitely feel that.

[256] it's like a melatonin of sorts.

[257] That's why they put me on late -night television was to get people to go to sleep.

[258] Just ready.

[259] Yeah.

[260] It's the only way America could...

[261] No, and the ratings always were solid because people fell asleep in front of the TV and couldn't change it.

[262] Right.

[263] So people were like, your consistency among viewers is incredible.

[264] It's incredible.

[265] Yeah, and then they looked into it and they were, oh, they've all passed out in front of the TV.

[266] First of all, thank you so much for doing this.

[267] I have so many questions.

[268] I'm just going to start with, I love your show.

[269] I really do.

[270] I love your show, and I love the combination of the humor is so sharp and it's so well written.

[271] It's so beautifully cast.

[272] Oh, thank you.

[273] I mean, really, everybody is so solid on the show.

[274] I mean, it's an incredible cast.

[275] It's really crazy.

[276] I mean, and then it's cool, too, because I think a lot of the roles are written for everyone who's there.

[277] And I think there's this thing with.

[278] that I don't think people understand with TV is that you have very little time to rehearse.

[279] Like a lot of the times you're meeting people at the table read or you meet people the day of or whatever it is.

[280] We have this really cool thing with our cast where so many of us have kind of known each other from different parts of life for many years.

[281] And I think you could feel it on screen.

[282] I think that was something immediately when we shot even our pilot or the first season.

[283] There was this immediate chemistry.

[284] And everyone was like, it's the writing.

[285] And it is on a level, I think.

[286] But I also think there's just this, well we know each other and there's this deep comfort so we're so your friends on the show are people you've known for a while the guys you hang out with in the diner yeah yeah i mean like mo and and and dave who plays ahmed in the diner we've all lived together at different times uh steve my buddy you know muscular distra i've known him since the third grade so that even on a core level then may who plays my sister we knew each other for years layth who plays my uncle i knew him since i was 18 so there's this like deep history and and i didn't even go to the network being like these are my friends they just won in the audition tapes but I knew while I was writing I was like oh this is this will feel really good with them okay so an obvious first question and it's something that when I watch the show I'm fascinated by is is that guy you completely or is he a version of you I mean I think like you know we and I'm sure you relate to this but I think a lot of the time without the idea of writing without the idea of comedy I was writing and making things since I was really young and then I know the same thing for you.

[287] So it's like, I think a lot of this guy's like, man, if I didn't have that outlet starting at 14 or 15, there'd probably be this void because I don't think there was anything kind of in quote -unquote real world or a real career that I could have ever imagined the No, I'm not fit to do anything in the real world.

[288] And I'm so impressed and stunned, when someone is building something anywhere near me, I'm amazed.

[289] And every now and then I'll meet someone like a Nick Offerman, who's funny and creative, but also, oh, I just made a canoe out of mahogany that I repurposed.

[290] And I don't understand because I have no function other than acting like a fool.

[291] That's the only thing I know how to do.

[292] No, it's really wild.

[293] Like, I set up a Wi -Fi routing system in the house, and that was, I was like, whoa, I'm really handy.

[294] Like, that was the closest I could get to my dad.

[295] I have to say that sounds really impressive.

[296] Oh, dude, it's plugging certain things in in the right spot and you got to route it.

[297] And that was the most I'd ever felt like I'd use my hands as a man. Right.

[298] And then it kind of ends there.

[299] Yeah.

[300] Just stop there.

[301] And I would think back to like history, I'd be like, what would I do in a different era?

[302] Oh, that's all I think about is, and I've often thought it's a field in Ireland, some really crappy, boggy part of Ireland.

[303] And everyone is building a stone wall and I'm in the corner doing bits.

[304] Yeah, yeah.

[305] And they're all like, oh, they fucking, oh, Jesus, that doesn't shut up.

[306] It doesn't fucking shut up.

[307] And you're so tall.

[308] And I'm not doing anything.

[309] I'm not, or I'm doing a bit about, like, you know, I'm doing a bit with the stones.

[310] And, and look at me. I'm Stoney Stonerson.

[311] And I'm going to make a stone wall.

[312] And you're like, just feck and build a wall.

[313] We got to get this farm wall built.

[314] You fucking ass.

[315] A jester was a thing, though.

[316] Yeah, yeah.

[317] Yeah.

[318] But I'd have been murder.

[319] I think I would have been beaten by the townspeople.

[320] You know what I mean?

[321] Well, I would think about this a lot.

[322] And then, yeah, I would see murder for sure.

[323] I feel like I would maybe be like a food tester for the king just to make sure that like, kind of that like, is there poison in this?

[324] Hey, Rami, come over here, take a bite of this.

[325] Here's what never made sense to me about food testers.

[326] Poison does take a little while.

[327] I never got that.

[328] Where someone's like, you, taste this pudding.

[329] Okay, I tasted it.

[330] I'm still alive.

[331] Very good.

[332] I'm going to eat great quantities of this pudding.

[333] The guy dies four hours later, the king, half an hour after that, right?

[334] That's how it should work.

[335] Maybe it's always been like a 15 -minute, kind of like when they wait after the vaccine to make sure you do.

[336] Maybe 15 minutes has been like the universal.

[337] It's like now with Pfizer or whatever, but it's like, we'll know in 15 minutes.

[338] Yeah, nothing is that.

[339] Everything is 15 minutes.

[340] Everything's 15 minutes.

[341] Nothing's that slow release.

[342] Wow.

[343] This is good to know.

[344] But, yeah, so not much else I could have done.

[345] You know, I think I was trying to go to college for a bit, and I left pretty quick.

[346] I wasn't able to do it, but it was because I had something that I really loved.

[347] Right.

[348] And so I think the character is without love.

[349] And I think in a way that that kind of hole that he has, you know, we kind of all try to fill that.

[350] Yeah.

[351] People can fill it with a passion, with a relationship, with God, with whatever it might be.

[352] And I think he's kind of struggling with what goes in that kind of empty puzzle piece in him.

[353] The character is trying so hard to find his relationship to his religion, God.

[354] And is that you?

[355] That's your struggle as well.

[356] In a different way probably.

[357] I mean, I think that, like, for him, you know, the answer feels incredibly elusive.

[358] I think for me in my life, I've found, you know, ways that I relate.

[359] I've found teachers I really gravitate towards.

[360] I've found, you know, the meditative nature of prayer.

[361] All those things have genuinely made my life better.

[362] But I think I like the idea of conceiving this character by someone that's caught in the industry of religion, caught in the cultural wars of religion, caught in all those things that make religion pretty shitty, which is kind of how it is right now.

[363] And so I think that there are totally, you know, glitches where people kind of get a good slice of I think I kind of wanted to show him really in the crosshairs of all the reasons why this doesn't work right now.

[364] You know, for me, watching your show, one of the things that I find myself drawn into and kind of attracted to is all the ritual that goes along with Muslim prayer.

[365] And I think, you know, I was raised Catholic, very Catholic.

[366] And I'm sort of drawn to this whole concept of everyone comes together at the mosque and the rugs and the praying and the, you know, the ritual of it seems very calming and welcoming to me. Yeah.

[367] And I think that's because I grew up with, you're going to get in this pew.

[368] It's really hard wood.

[369] It's not comfortable.

[370] I mean, there's some things about it.

[371] Like, for example, in Catholicism, you can pray wherever you are.

[372] Yes.

[373] You can literally be in an elevator and just cross yourself and you're done.

[374] Yeah.

[375] So it's very user -friendly that way.

[376] Totally.

[377] I mean, I don't need a rug.

[378] Yeah.

[379] I don't need to know which direction is east or west.

[380] You know what I mean?

[381] There's nothing.

[382] They made it, they dumped it down so much in Catholicism.

[383] Well, we have, you know, we have two different, we have that kind of like you can, you know, direct line any time.

[384] You can just put your hands out, like, you put your hands out, making this little kind of V shape, and you can just ask God for anything that's anywhere.

[385] And then you also can pray anywhere And you see that a lot in New York There's just like a guy in the middle of the sidewalk praying And just in everybody's way But he'll do it It's funny like I was kind of wanting to get a cab This was like a couple weeks ago And there was this taxi cab pulled over And the light was off so it was available But then I looked in and there was a couple They were like looking in They were like this guy's gone crazy And then I walk by and I look at him And he's like praying on the steering wheel But I could tell like with what he was was doing with his head, like what point of the prayer he was in.

[386] And I was like, oh, he's almost done.

[387] Like, I'm about to get this cap.

[388] Like, they went, it was a long block, long block, and they just start walking towards Houston.

[389] I'm like, these people are going to be sweating.

[390] And I'm like, you guys don't even understand.

[391] This is the last part of the prayer.

[392] He's going to be done in 10 seconds.

[393] He finishes, he looks at me, I'm like, yo, and hop right in.

[394] Right, right.

[395] So your knowledge, your deep understanding of the prayer cycle got you a cab.

[396] Save me from going on the subway.

[397] It was unbelievable.

[398] But, yeah.

[399] Yeah, the carpets are soft, so no hardwood and pews when you go in the mosque.

[400] And I think that the ritual is the most beautiful part of it to me. I think that's the cleaning yourself, too.

[401] I mean, I was not aware.

[402] There's so much I've learned from watching your show.

[403] And this is one of the things I really love about it.

[404] I learn a lot.

[405] The show is not, it's so far from preachy.

[406] It's so far from, you know, trying to instruct.

[407] It's about people.

[408] It's about people, really funny people, and a lot of awkward situations, and I know that you're a Larry David fan, and it evokes some of the, in a great comparisons to just awkward, great comedy situations and humanity.

[409] It's just, you know, in the program, in the show, I love the fact that I watch it, and when I come away, I feel I know not just your characters better.

[410] But I feel like I have a better understanding of what it might be like to be Egyptian, Muslim, and come here to the United States, you know?

[411] Yeah, well, I think like part of the design for us was making it clear that we're kind of giving people a window into some of those rituals, into some of the rules, into some of what's going on.

[412] And then the second we introduced that, we're making it really clear that everyone here is doing it wrong.

[413] And I think that's what makes it funny, where it's like, I'm going to show you the thing, but then also it's so clear that this is not instructive because, man, these people are dealing with their egos on level 10 and they're making a mess wherever they go and I think that's that to me is what makes it a fun thing to make because I never want to be in a situation where I need to feel like an educator or preachy or whatever because all that shit's just like it's anti -comedy but I do think what I've really enjoyed you know in terms of looking at the history of comedy is I think the idea of a character going to church in and of itself is a joke like it's a joke that someone would believe in the unseen and I think here we've kind of flipped the joke where it's like none of the unseen thing is a given like that relationship isn't what we're making fun of we're kind of making fun of everything that happens under it and I think that um has opened up situations that I feel get to be unique to our show because we're we're kind of we have this different um machine as to like what we're interrogating and and I think yeah a lot of people have been like, dude, your show is my favorite show about Catholic guilt.

[414] Oh, and then like, because it's all the same.

[415] It's all, it's guilt.

[416] We're all, I mean, it's so funny to me is anyone who was raised in religion has these ideals that they're supposed to live up to.

[417] And then we all have the workarounds.

[418] Yeah.

[419] And that's the part that cracks me up is all the characters in your show doing workarounds for, yeah, I don't drink, but I'm going to drink or I'm not supposed to really have sex, but I'm going to have a lot of sex.

[420] But we're going to figure this out.

[421] We're going to work this out later.

[422] And I think that's every religion.

[423] You're handed these lists of very severe rules early on, and you can have every intention of being down with that.

[424] But then you have your, yeah, we're going to work around that.

[425] But still, I am a devout Muslim.

[426] But, man, it's Ramadan, but I'm going to eat.

[427] I'm going to, because that's a Big Mac.

[428] And we'll figure this out later.

[429] You know what I mean?

[430] It's this feeling of like constantly like refinancing with God, you know?

[431] And I think that's really like.

[432] That's a great way to put it.

[433] And it's just by the end, by the, by the end, you're just terribly in debt.

[434] You're just, I mean, I think we're all doing that.

[435] You know, we're all constantly saying, look, I'm going to just put this on my tab.

[436] Yeah.

[437] Just put this on my tab, God, and we'll figure this out because I just had a ninesome.

[438] were, I had sex with eight different people.

[439] A ninesome.

[440] And, um, and then I had a cocaine enema.

[441] But we're going to figure this out.

[442] Because I love you, God.

[443] And trust me, I'm very devout.

[444] We're going to figure this out is, I mean, that's the energy, you know, for, for, for, I think that's what keeps us all going.

[445] It's also, um, I love what is something that, uh, fascinates me. Because I see it in Catholicism as well, the double standard.

[446] with men and women.

[447] Because it's something that I saw growing up where, I mean, Rami, you party, you go out with your friends, and your parents think, oh, that Rami, it's just adorable.

[448] And then your sister, who's, I think on the show, she's 25, 26, and just very attractive, modern woman.

[449] If she wants to do anything, it's where are you going, you have to be back by nine.

[450] And that exists, you know, when I was growing up, I know my mom, like my brothers and I would be chewing gum And she wouldn't say a word And then if one of my sisters started chewing gum She'd be like, spit that gum out Yeah You know, you don't want people to think you're trash You know, you're not some common ragamuffin I mean, that's how my mom spoke And gum chewing is very ragamuffin behavior It is and we won't have that Just to be clear There'll be no rag and muffery around here So just work that into Rami What's one of the characters to start talking about I'm no ragamuffin and people say the writing is off this year.

[451] What happened?

[452] And then you see the Conan O 'Brien writing credit at the end.

[453] Special cultural consultant.

[454] Please put me in as a special cultural consultant.

[455] Done.

[456] Yeah, yeah.

[457] Just in one of the prayers, there's many mentions of ragamuffin, Tom Foolery, chicanery.

[458] People are, I think they lost the thread this year.

[459] What happened?

[460] Did you watch to the end?

[461] I did.

[462] Did you see the Conan O 'Brien cultural credit?

[463] I mean, that might be a problem.

[464] No, but what you're talking about is is amazing to me because I think that is something that in making the show so many people will relate to that thing, even that disparity between men and women because obviously, and I think we see this more and more, especially lately, that's a real American problem as well.

[465] I think the way that in the microcosm of a family, you know, how are the sons treated and how are the daughters treated?

[466] And it's something that I think we put on, you know, this Muslim family, And I think that obviously there's some comfort in kind of this, like, I think there's an American comfort in being able to say, oh, wow, like, look how that is in the Middle East because there's kind of all these things of like, oh, women there can't drive, you know.

[467] And then you kind of start to break that down.

[468] And you're like, well, no, that's only just in Saudi.

[469] And then you're like, oh, wait, well, in Saudi now women can drive.

[470] And abortion seems to be just about as hard in both places.

[471] And then you start to kind of zoom out.

[472] And you're like, whoa, we have a lot of these problems.

[473] And I think that's part of why the show resonates because at first you're like, oh, I'm learning about this other thing.

[474] But then you dig into it and you're like, oh, wait, this is in my family too.

[475] You know, this is here too.

[476] And I think that starts to kind of open up what I hope could be a bridge.

[477] Does your family watch the show and think, wait a minute, I never did that, you know, I didn't, I never stole a blender.

[478] I just made that up.

[479] That's not a plot point.

[480] I know that, you know what I mean, I know that if I did a show called Conan and it was, I hired actors to play my parents and all my brothers and sisters, I would be constantly getting.

[481] calls like what the fuck was that you know you had me uh steal a scrunchy you know you you know what i mean no totally i there was this big period of my life where my parents weren't seeing any of the comedy i was doing i mean i think i did stand up probably i wouldn't i wasn't putting anything online i wasn't doing anything i just kind of did it silently for for you know almost 10 years just trying to get it you know where i wanted it to be and and then um you know when the show was coming out and my stand -up was coming out.

[482] I kind of told my parents, I was like, look, this is really I'm taking from everyone in the community, you know, and there's a writer's room.

[483] It's not just me, you know, and I think I worked hard to create enough likeness, but also enough distance between all the individual family members.

[484] So I think my parents were kind of like, okay, he's doing something different.

[485] And they're also really big fans of television.

[486] Like, my parents watch everything.

[487] You know, they, they, they, like, would know specific bits of yours.

[488] Like, my dad loves comedy.

[489] He'll watch late night.

[490] He watches everything on HBO.

[491] So he, I think, at first, maybe had a little bit of this, like, why are you doing this?

[492] And we had a couple of those conversations.

[493] And then very quickly, like, the TV fan and him kind of clicked on.

[494] And then, you know, he will watch the seasons.

[495] And now we're at the third season.

[496] And he's like, oh, yeah, you really nailed the tone.

[497] You know, and I'm like, oh, cool.

[498] I'm like talking about tone with my dad.

[499] That's, like, really cool.

[500] You know, so that's something.

[501] My father has never said to me, you really nailed the tone.

[502] Dad.

[503] That's what every son hopes to hear.

[504] Coming home.

[505] I'm in the East Coast.

[506] Just try to muster, you really nailed the tone.

[507] And then something about ragamuffins.

[508] That's what every Hollywood son would love to hear from his father.

[509] You nailed the tone.

[510] Don't even get me started on the lighting.

[511] That's where it gets emotional.

[512] Your show went to the Middle East, and I'm really fascinated by this.

[513] Tell me exactly where you shot.

[514] Yeah, so season one we shot in Egypt.

[515] and then season three we shot in Egypt and we shot in Jerusalem.

[516] Yeah, and so we took my character, you know, from the first season, we've kind of seen him.

[517] He, again, he doesn't really have a passion.

[518] He gets into his uncle's family business.

[519] Yes.

[520] And he's selling jewelry in the Diamond District, which was based on a couple of my buddies that I grew up with who were like the three Lebanese dudes in the district and everyone else is mainly Jewish and I would walk in and just the banter would be hilarious.

[521] I mean, everyone's just going at everybody and it's the same guys, everyone's going back and forth, like saying really, really crude shit.

[522] And then, like, hugging and making deals and like the whole thing.

[523] Which crazy, too, is your uncle character is so anti -Semitic.

[524] Yes.

[525] And that's, you know, obviously, to have an anti -Semitic character, but also at times, and this sounds insane, but the stuff he's saying is absolutely crazy, but almost cartoonishly crazy, and you're just saying, nope, that's okay, no, that's not true.

[526] And he's just, but you also give him some dimension so that there are times where I almost feel for him.

[527] Do you know what I mean?

[528] Or where I think, okay, I see there's a human being in there, which I think is next to impossible to do.

[529] Yeah, I mean, I think, you know, we wanted to kind of show him in this position where we have the Rami character and so much of his thing is like I'm looking at things in my family I'm looking at things in my tradition I'm looking at all these things and I'm figuring out which things do I want to move forward with what things do I want to be part of my life so on one hand there's the spiritual element of it where I think he's really grasping towards a lot of these great things that he wants but then there's a couple of cultural things and family things that he's like you know there's certain level of strictness that's wild and then there is this like uncle who walks around with his anti -Semitism and just watching Rami kind of bat that away and what that struggle is is really exciting and because I think it's so real and so I think when people see it, they're like, I think it's clear what the intention is as to why we're showing it and how we're showing it and it exists in every family.

[530] I mean, there's actually this really great show that follows a Jewish family called Stissel and they have an uncle.

[531] I love that show.

[532] Oh, it's so good.

[533] And they have the uncle who hates Muslims.

[534] So it's like, it's so funny because it's like you see oh yeah that's and that's another thing that I've heard from you know my Jewish friends who watch the show they're like dude I have that uncle he just says it's like it becomes algebraic you know he just says insert whatever thing and then you got to you're trying to fight that off from that generation well the cross currents of kinds of racism when you see in cultures if you'll sometimes you'll I'll be talking to someone who's from Mexico and they'll they'll be like oh look at that guys from Nicaragua and those people And you're like, what are we doing?

[535] You're not even, I know.

[536] You know what I mean?

[537] And then the person in Nicarag was like, just, you know, keep that Bolivian away from me. Most people, I don't know how you do it.

[538] And you, you know, and you realize that this is happening in China.

[539] Oh, yeah.

[540] They've broken it down 75 different ways.

[541] And, oh, that province.

[542] Well, you know, can't marry into that family.

[543] And you realize that this is something in our genes.

[544] It's everywhere.

[545] And I've always felt like.

[546] it's a little bit unfairly attributed to being like only white people, you know?

[547] Right.

[548] Because I think white people are just the best at racism.

[549] Like I think they like, you know, institutionalized it in many ways.

[550] But it's racist.

[551] We turned it into like McDonald's.

[552] We took people like, you know, people are like a hamburger and then white people said, no, no, there's a way to do this much more efficiently and on a massive scale.

[553] Just branded it.

[554] Yeah, exactly.

[555] But it's not just, there's a lot of organic homegrown racism in all of our communities.

[556] that just isn't branded in the same way.

[557] But it really, even something like Islamophobia, you know, I've always felt like, yeah, there's this idea that people who aren't Muslim hate Muslims, but I've never seen anyone hate a Muslim more than another Muslim because they're not the type of Muslim that they think they should be.

[558] Like there's like Islamophobia, then there's like Muslim Islamophobia where it's literally like just put Indians and Pakistanis in a room and it's just like, man, can we find what we have in common?

[559] Why are we so against each other?

[560] Right.

[561] And I think that's a lot of what we have in.

[562] the show too is just some of those elements of again like looking at something that is a human virus and I don't want to be in the position where okay I'm making this show and I need to show everyone Arabs and Muslims are really lovable and you know don't hate us because then it just feels so sanitary and it feels so unreal and it feels you just kind of don't believe it so we have a character like my uncle who exists for that reason just to say we're putting it all out on the table Yeah.

[563] That's, I think, the thing is you're getting really near these third rails and kind of touching them a little bit, which I think is important to do.

[564] I feel like that's a good way to put it.

[565] That third rail or that button you're not supposed to touch all those things to me feel like the best thing that we could contribute as comedians to do that as thoughtfully as possible.

[566] And the do it in a way where hopefully we're not just like spreading the issue or I would say adding to the problem.

[567] But yeah, that feels like the most useful thing I could do because I don't think any of us are, you know, that well read or, you know, fit to like lead the country in any sort of direction.

[568] But I do think if we can kind of get into emotional complexities and play with them a bit, that that starts to feel really fun.

[569] And, you know, we're also just trying to be funny.

[570] So I think that helps.

[571] Yeah, that's the important thing I think is it's got to be comedy first.

[572] Yes.

[573] Comedy first and dedication to telling it truthfully and well.

[574] I think sometimes people go into comedy with a message or a purpose or a cause and you just have to make sure the comedy's got to be there.

[575] Yeah.

[576] You know, and if the cause and the message starts to take over the narrative, you know, what do you really, what do you have?

[577] Yeah.

[578] I mean, I think even ethnicity or culture, any of those things, you know, and the cause that to me is icing like I really do feel like the main base of it should be the engine of what makes it funny you know the engine of someone's struggle you know I do love Larry David because it's so clear what's making everything funny about him is his anger you know it's just really funny yeah and and for me I was in in everything that I explored on stage I was like oh the thing that I find the most fun to talk about and that makes anything funny is just like my massive indecisiveness it is my you know belief in my higher self and my continually living in my lower self.

[579] And it creates this fucking tension that, you know, at times it's really sad, but at times it's really funny.

[580] And the more that I kind of turn that into something, the more that it's like, oh, yeah, someone finds an entry point into that.

[581] Like, I find the entry point into, you know, the anger that I see in people, but they turn it into something where it makes those feelings, you know, more digestible, I guess.

[582] Right.

[583] What was your experience?

[584] So you're, where'd you go?

[585] Did you go to the West Bank.

[586] So we were in, our plan was really to shoot between Haifa, Tel Aviv, and the West Bank.

[587] When we were there, we weren't able to actually shoot in the West Bank.

[588] There was this really kind of just horrible thing that happened.

[589] This journalist Sheree Nebuchadha was killed.

[590] And that happened while you were there or just before you went there?

[591] On our locations.

[592] On your, oh, Jesus.

[593] Oh, wow.

[594] So it was kind of this thing too where, you know, You know, my mom was like, why are you going to shoot there?

[595] Can't you just shoot it somewhere else?

[596] I'm like, no, we have to go there.

[597] Like, I want to work with the cruise there or whatever, and it'll be safe.

[598] Don't worry.

[599] Don't believe the issue.

[600] And then she said Vancouver.

[601] Yeah.

[602] Shoot Vancouver for Tel Aviv.

[603] That's how much my parents.

[604] I didn't really have certain that many fur trees in Israel.

[605] That's incredible.

[606] My parents know that much about the industry.

[607] They're pitching Vancouver.

[608] No, it would really be great.

[609] They're like, no, no, the rates in Vancouver are great.

[610] I was like, you got to, my dad's like, you got to live.

[611] lead with the tax incentive, all right?

[612] Go to Vancouver, go to Toronto, be smart.

[613] Save the production money.

[614] This reminds me of I was watching, I went and saw a top gun with my son, and at the end they have that big, you know, we go together with like, we go to war with a fictional country.

[615] And it's kind of not clear where it is, but there's just a lot of fur trees and a lot of snow, and it looks really beautiful.

[616] And, like, the lights came up afterwards, and I said, why did we go to war with New Hampshire?

[617] I was just like But I could see It's a really funny to me is That's a funny idea Someone who's like, you know, we could go We probably should go to Tel Aviv I don't know We got such a good rate in Vancouver And who's going to really know Who's going to really know Don't think New Mexico wasn't thrown out on a call Really Conan, you know enough to know New Mexico No, Mexico was thrown out on the call.

[618] Oh, absolutely.

[619] Absolutely, that was thrown out on the call.

[620] By the way, no one talks about how woke the new top gun is.

[621] They really don't mention another country.

[622] It's kind of nice.

[623] You don't know who it is.

[624] You'd like to say it's woke.

[625] You could also say that they wanted to make sure that it did well in every market internationally, which is, I suspect, what was really going on there.

[626] I called that financially woke.

[627] That's beautiful.

[628] Hey, let's start that movement, the financially woke movement.

[629] Just like, no, no, that's very financially.

[630] That was very offensive.

[631] Well, but financially, very woke.

[632] Financially, very woke.

[633] Yeah.

[634] I did walk out of that going, wow, I didn't hear Arabic.

[635] I didn't know what country was pretty impressive.

[636] Look at that.

[637] They did it.

[638] Way to go, Tom.

[639] I was excited.

[640] I was in there.

[641] I was like, whoa.

[642] It was so generic as a country.

[643] And I thought, God, this place looks beautiful.

[644] I don't know where they are, but.

[645] Is this Turks and Kekos?

[646] Yeah, exactly.

[647] I also love that in the movie, they had far superior fighter planes than the United States.

[648] And I'm like, which country is this?

[649] It's a country I've never heard of that looks suspiciously like Maine.

[650] And they have fighter jets that are like three generations ahead of ours.

[651] Wait a minute.

[652] Don't we have the most expensive military in the world?

[653] Who laid down on the job and let Switzerland get all these amazing planes?

[654] So that kind of blew my mind Yeah, no, it's...

[655] And that's why I brought you in here, by the way, is...

[656] Yes.

[657] I wanted to sort of rope -a -dope you with...

[658] We'll talk about Rami and we'll talk about, you know, your religion and the struggle.

[659] But I really want to talk about Top Gun.

[660] Yeah.

[661] And how I wanted to know about that country.

[662] Yeah, I think we walked out of that movie as Americans with a lot of questions for our government.

[663] You know, where are these planes?

[664] Why don't we have them?

[665] The other thing that I love, and I'm going to keep going, talking about Top Gun is that Tom Cruise is the best pilot ever.

[666] You know, Maverick has dedicated his whole life to serving his country.

[667] He's absolutely amazing.

[668] Everyone says, hands down, he's the best.

[669] And his superior officer like, get in here, you shit.

[670] What was that stunt you pulled where you did that really amazing thing and saved everybody's life?

[671] Well, sir, I shut up.

[672] Shut the fuck up.

[673] And I ran into John Hemp.

[674] Ham somewhere.

[675] He's obviously, as everyone knows, he's in addition to being great.

[676] Actually, he's a very funny guy.

[677] But I was like, what was your problem with Tom Cruise?

[678] All he's done is, and he's like, I know, I know.

[679] And all you do is, and then it's like, do you see what Tom Cruise just did?

[680] Do you see what Maverick just did?

[681] He just saved America.

[682] And that person was lost and he rescued him.

[683] And then he put a plane together out of Legos and got everybody out of there.

[684] Yeah, get him in here.

[685] you piece of shit well because I think you're forgetting the beginning of the movie he blows up an expensive plane right which goes against the movie's principles of financial loakness so I think that's that is you know the biggest issue okay you know like I mean if you're kind of tracking the line of what they care about the guy's fucking up I mean because it's not about the country I mean it's about the budget you're right you're right and so I see it now he did blow up that plane I get into you little shit you're ruining our budget if you save more lives one more time.

[686] It's just that old trope that's in everybody caught movie where you have to get chewed out even though you've clearly done an amazing job.

[687] Oh, you're handsome, you're skilled, somehow you're the underdog.

[688] Yeah.

[689] I don't know how.

[690] Literally just gorgeous.

[691] Like just better skin than my sister.

[692] I know.

[693] And I don't know how.

[694] I root for that guy because I think we are about the same age.

[695] And I'm just, you know, he like takes his shirt off.

[696] in that movie and I somehow felt that I had gotten in shape.

[697] Yeah.

[698] And I just was like, see?

[699] I am a movie star.

[700] My wife was like, what are you talking about?

[701] Well, we're the same age.

[702] Right.

[703] But he's got all these genetic gifts which you do not have and he works out like crazy and you do not.

[704] And I was like, me, me, me, me, me, me, me, me. No, I think you should write like a thing piece you know, it's just like Tom Cruise got jacked for my whole generation.

[705] He did.

[706] I think he did it for all of you.

[707] Yeah.

[708] And he's beautiful.

[709] I think you're shocked when you saw me in person and how old I look.

[710] And I think you look great and I thought you were very tall.

[711] That's really what struck me because when we were hugging, it was this long hug and I was just firmly in the middle of your chest.

[712] I held you.

[713] I held you for a while.

[714] I cradled you.

[715] It was a really nice cradle.

[716] Your feet did not touch the ground.

[717] I lifted you.

[718] I held you for a while.

[719] I put you in a baby Bjorn.

[720] Remember that?

[721] And we walked around.

[722] Around the serious XM office.

[723] And everyone was like, wow, we don't know what this is.

[724] We don't know what it is, but it feels progressive.

[725] It feels very progressive.

[726] Yeah, it feels like the future.

[727] I felt that.

[728] I was like, wow.

[729] Maybe things can change.

[730] Well, I'm really looking forward to the season where you, again, visit the Middle East, but shoot it, like, in a place that can't, Canada, you know, someplace northern Canada.

[731] And you have to keep coming up with, you keep having to write in.

[732] justifications for why there's a big bear and the ground is littered with pine cones all the streamers are you know everyone's just figuring out like what's going on with money just if you know our fourth season is so clearly going to be Toronto it's going to be crazy it's just we're going to just be in downtown Toronto and and just making it work right that's what it's going to be but the fact that we got to go it was it was unbelievable I mean it was we were there for that massive event it shifted a lot of our shooting i think there was a few american crew and then we had our palestinian crew right and we were in the middle of jerusalem you know and and and we went to her funeral and this this journalist who got killed um is christian and so so it's so it's like we're at a church in jerusalem with this really just diverse group of people and you know because there's americans there american jewish crew and and american muslims and and and palestinian Christians and, you know, Christians in Israel.

[733] And it's like, I think everyone kind of walked away, especially when you go there.

[734] And you've been, yeah.

[735] Yeah, we shot a show there.

[736] And it was fascinating because we shot first in Tel Aviv.

[737] Yeah.

[738] And then we went to Jerusalem.

[739] And what I remember very clearly is we had our team that was Israeli.

[740] And then we went over to shoot in Jerusalem.

[741] them that the teams had to shift over.

[742] So it's different security because they need to be Palestinian.

[743] And so you understood that it's crazy because all you've ever heard is this amazing, horrible conflict that no one can seem to figure out.

[744] And then this was just, okay, we're going to stop here.

[745] And then these guys are going to take over.

[746] Hey, guys.

[747] Yep.

[748] Okay, thank you very much.

[749] And they had it all worked out.

[750] Yeah.

[751] just made me feel like maybe the answer is, on a showbiz level, people figure things out.

[752] They do.

[753] And maybe that's the answer in the Middle East is how do we turn this into show business, you know?

[754] And then everyone's going to be like, okay, wait a minute, all right, I can see, I see how we can do this.

[755] I see how we can figure this out.

[756] Well, it's so funny that you say that because we had these kids who came from this area called Janine, which is one of the most dangerous areas in the West Bank.

[757] There's a lot of unjust violence happening.

[758] And these kids have this thing called freedom theater in the middle of all of it and they're working on becoming actors they don't it's like and it's unbelievable they sent in these audition tapes and these kids are like I'm going to be a big actor and it's like wow and we saw these two kids we fell in love with they got to be in the show and we were going to go and shoot by them then this happens and we can't and so we had to ask the government for a visa to get them in to Jerusalem and everyone's like this is impossible it's not going to happen and somehow it did so I mean your theory that somehow show business makes things work.

[759] I'm like, these kids had never gotten a visa their whole life to come over.

[760] And then this kid came and he went to the sea for the first time.

[761] Like he went to the water for the first time in his life.

[762] Oh, wow.

[763] To shoot our thing.

[764] And so he was like, this is the best week of my life shooting this TV show.

[765] And there was this really interesting thing that did happen where you're there and you're just seeing all the pieces work.

[766] Even though this horrific thing happened while we were there, everyone kept cool everyone was like okay we're gonna just figure this out somehow the visa still cleared like all these things that you would think wouldn't be able to happen happen and I agree with you when you're there on the ground you're seeing people speaking you know like one of our guys is this is driver Palestinian dude he speaks English Arabic Hebrew and a bunch of everyone so he's like he knows Hebrew and he's walking around he's speaking to a to a Israeli soldier in Hebrew and then they're going somewhere else and then he's speaking Arabic and and you just see this desired to keep making things work and somehow pep in the step and somehow just like, we're going to get through this, we're going to figure it out.

[767] And I don't know if you felt this, but I walked away and I was just, I was inspired, you know?

[768] I've done all these travel shows and gone to these different countries and ended up with this philosophy that I think there's a tendency for people to want to make things simple.

[769] And there's a lot of pundits that like to say, it's easy, you know, whether it's in America, they like to say it's an easy choice.

[770] And I like to point out that things are very complicated.

[771] Things are extremely complicated.

[772] And so that's been a little bit of bone of contention of mind is when you go and you see that there is no simple truth that explains.

[773] It's very, it's so complex that when people act like, no, no, no, this is easy.

[774] On one side of the other, I think I get offended by that.

[775] Yeah.

[776] Because it feels to kind of just like underwrite a bunch of real complicated human experiences.

[777] Right.

[778] Well, you know, my therapist will say a lot of times things are simple, but that doesn't mean they're easy.

[779] Right.

[780] Sometimes the hardest things are the simple things.

[781] Right.

[782] You know, and that's where a lot of the complications come in in that vacuum of like, well, it should be, you know, why can't, like, it is a very hard thing to achieve simplicity even at home.

[783] Right.

[784] You know, with your family to be able to do the simple thing.

[785] And so I think that the thing that gives me hope when I'm there is seeing certain.

[786] in microcosms of how people deal with each other, that can be inspiring.

[787] But, you know, and I think my hope comes from like, okay, what if we were able to get enough microcosms right that the macrocosm would solve itself?

[788] And I actually think that probably is like in many ways a pattern that would work, but it's really hard to nail a microcosm.

[789] It's really hard to nail just what's going on in your own house.

[790] Well, that's, I think, again, going back to your show, that it's all about this is a family.

[791] And And years and years and years ago, when I worked on The Simpsons, I remember thinking, my job here is just to think of the funniest jokes I can and the funniest situations I can.

[792] And then sort of hearing the people that ran the show said, you know, you have to remember first and foremost they're a family.

[793] And I thought, what?

[794] What is this?

[795] Drivel.

[796] I'm going to write the craziest Mr. Burns jokes you've ever seen.

[797] I don't care about that.

[798] But they were right.

[799] It's first and foremost a family, which.

[800] is what makes it work.

[801] And I think that's the same thing with, I think the reason that your show has an impact when you watch it is because I relate to this family, because it's really not that different from any other family.

[802] Yeah.

[803] You know, and there are specific things that, of course, very different, but that's why I'm there.

[804] That's why I'm invested is because, like, the episode you made about your mom and her struggles and she becomes a lift driver and just, I felt terrible for her.

[805] I felt like no one's seeing her.

[806] No one's, no one's taking care of her.

[807] You know, you blow her off for dinner.

[808] You're out the door.

[809] And she's made this great dinner.

[810] And you suck, by the way.

[811] You're a bad guy.

[812] Why did you do that?

[813] I got mad at you when you did that.

[814] I'm like, can't you see your mother made that nice meal?

[815] And then you're like, Mom, I got to go.

[816] I got to meet my friends.

[817] And she just, the door shuts and she's there with a lot of food and she's alone.

[818] Fuck you, right?

[819] I know.

[820] Sorry, but come on.

[821] So many people will say that to me. Like, man, I fucking hate your character.

[822] But the most heartbreaking line in that scene to me was, and the way she delivered it, she really made it even better than it had been written.

[823] But she was like, you know, I think my Facebook's not working.

[824] Like, I haven't gotten any likes.

[825] You know, and I was like, oh, man, that's hard.

[826] Like, that's always the hardest thing.

[827] How do you explain to someone?

[828] Yeah.

[829] It's like, no, it's just.

[830] You just didn't get any likes.

[831] You just didn't get any likes.

[832] And I think there's so much in that.

[833] episode and in those dynamics where it's like man we we feel everyone feels this thing for their mothers on a level even when the relationships are complicated where whether you feel it a lot or you see it in a glimpse or you have a window of looking at your mother and being like man she gave up a lot yeah she gave up a lot and and and and especially in a time where we crave our individuality and we crave our self -expression in this era you know and then you're looking at that you know a mother and you go wow she she put it all to the side for us and i think again that creates a little bit of the show so much of it is about obviously it's not just even just spiritual guilt it's even that kind of guilt you know that you can have right in in just what was sacrificed for you and and i think in the design of also yeah making this character and i mean you know this because you um you know you you walk and it's different in a way because i made a fictional thing but like I think the level of self -deprecation that's in your humor and the way that things roll off of you is I just have always felt like you present in a way where it's not this like look at me look at me like kind of thing and I think it's it's why you're one of the greats and then when I was hugging you earlier when you were kind of like it was a bit of like a stronghold you had me and I wouldn't let go I wouldn't let go and I felt it in that too where I was like yeah this guy is like a real fucking dude.

[834] Dude, I love this.

[835] And I think in making the show, for me, I didn't want to make this character.

[836] I was like, oh, Rami the hero.

[837] Look at him.

[838] He's just struggling.

[839] And I think sometimes I've got a little bit of the criticism that I go too far.

[840] But I really, I like leaning into those more, you know, lower self parts of me on screen.

[841] And I like leaning more into the like, I don't want you to think, oh, this is a hero.

[842] I'm rooting for him.

[843] I'd rather, you know, put my character in a position where, yeah, he's really, he's really.

[844] He's dealing with his ego, and it feels a lot easier for me to live with.

[845] Like, I just don't even think I'd have fun making the show if it was just like, oh, man, he tried his vest, but he's such a sweetheart.

[846] Right.

[847] You know, like, it would just, something about that rings false to what I like about comedy.

[848] Yeah.

[849] Like, yo, comedy's where I get to be a little shit.

[850] Like, I, this is a part of me that, like, I have fun being a little fucking shit.

[851] Yeah, and it's also, I think the life -saving thing for me in comedy has been, I was raised to be, you know, very supposed to be, you know, polite.

[852] There's all these rules that you're supposed to follow.

[853] And I think I was a good rule follower.

[854] And then I found this world where you can act in the most insane manner and it's part of your job.

[855] And everyone's like, good job.

[856] I'm like, what are you talking about?

[857] I just, I screamed at Jordan Slansky, this guy that works for us and or I threw him through a window.

[858] and they're like, I know it was fantastic.

[859] It was great, great job.

[860] And part of that, I think, is how you were raised because it's like just on a real base -based level.

[861] It's so clear that you're such a good boy.

[862] You know, like, it's so clear.

[863] It's so clear.

[864] It's what you do that stuff.

[865] And then it's like, oh, I get the spirit that it's in.

[866] Right.

[867] And there is comedy I watch where I'm like, oh, this is just mean.

[868] And I don't like it.

[869] And I'm just like, oh, I don't care about this.

[870] Like, I'm not interested in this.

[871] Right.

[872] This is, I think this person is mean.

[873] I think this person is just taking a shit on everybody.

[874] and then there's just something with the things I like where it is it's like you were raised to be and I think it's so clear that you are and that's why you're able to do all that stuff and it's so funny well I hope so until someone says no wait a minute I think he is an asshole so are you done now you've completed the third season yeah third season is is out um and yeah I mean it's it's funny it's like there's so many things out it's so crazy I I mean, and we put it out last month, and then I think people are just kind of finding it.

[875] Like, people come to me like, hey, did it come out yet?

[876] I'm like, yeah, I came out last month.

[877] No, but it's, but it's, it is, I mean, I ended my late night show.

[878] So it's been almost like a year and a half since I ended my like, whatever, almost 30 years in late night.

[879] And all the time people come up to me in the street and go like, man, I love your show.

[880] It's, well, you're killing it.

[881] And I'll be like, you know, I don't do it anymore.

[882] I do a lot of other things, but I don't do that.

[883] And I mean, I swear to God, I've had people say to me like, man, every night I'm watching it and I'm just loving it.

[884] And I think it's just hard for there.

[885] There's no awareness of, and actually it's very humbling, but there's so much content out there.

[886] And I think what's happened is it's very hard for, I have a philosophy that.

[887] that good work is never wasted.

[888] Yes.

[889] And I believe that if you make something good, it's the field of dreams idea.

[890] If you build it, they come.

[891] Yes.

[892] And by keeping your head down and doing your good work, we live in this world now.

[893] The flip side of there's so much out there is that things don't go away.

[894] No. It's always going to be there.

[895] And there are shows I watch that I think have probably been off the air for like 15 years that I didn't find.

[896] when they were first on and or Borgon about you know what's the government in Denmark and I'm like I'm watching this show and I really like it and I'm like this great this new show is fantastic and people say that shows from 2009 asshole I don't know no I mean someone's starting Breaking Bad this morning you know like someone is watching it for the first time they're home and they're like I kind of keep hearing about this thing so I agree like it's it is and I think in this career too and you're such a great example of it.

[897] I think it's just like it's a lifelong thing and it's and it's you just keep doing it and you just keep, you know, because you keep growing from it and hopefully you keep getting better at it.

[898] Yeah.

[899] That's the, that's the inspiring part is could I get better at this?

[900] Could I do it differently?

[901] It's a different world now with different technology.

[902] That's been a huge thrill of this podcast is this was a total arc and I love these conversations more.

[903] than the conversations I had, you know, for almost 30 years on late night.

[904] I loved those.

[905] They're very different and they're performative, but these mean a lot more to me in some way because it's a real connection.

[906] If you, if we're talking on a late night show, I will not get this sense of you.

[907] No. Oh my God.

[908] Do you know what I mean?

[909] I would have loved to do the couch on your show, but that never happened as it was ending and I was kind of just getting into a position to be able to do that stuff.

[910] But this is so much more like to get to sit and hang for an hour.

[911] And you can really smell me right now.

[912] Like you smell what I smell like.

[913] Yeah.

[914] And that never happened.

[915] We had all kinds of fans and deodorizers on the late night show.

[916] But now you're smelling my musk.

[917] I would say that's the biggest difference, you know, seeing you, is you realize, yeah.

[918] Your show is so, it's such a deodorized version of you.

[919] Like, like on TV.

[920] Sandalwood.

[921] That's what the, all those years I was on NBC or TBS, it was a sandalwood.

[922] Yeah.

[923] hints of cinnamon, and then this is just me. This is who I am and what I smell like.

[924] So you're going to have to deal with it.

[925] I think it's beautiful.

[926] I think it's raw.

[927] You know, I think it's special, you know.

[928] Well, my only request, I'm going to wrap this up, is, first of all, so cool getting to talk to you.

[929] No, seriously, you're a lovely fellow.

[930] You're so talented, and I really do like your work.

[931] So my hat's off to you, and I'm not wearing a hat.

[932] Why did I do that?

[933] No one even knows what I'm wearing.

[934] You could have been wearing a hat.

[935] I'm wearing a Willy Wonka top hat, and I'm tipping it to you right now.

[936] And that takes a lot of finger strength.

[937] It does.

[938] It's a big hat.

[939] It's a 35 -pound hat.

[940] It's made of copper and iron.

[941] Very cool having you here, and I want you to keep doing your thing.

[942] Thanks, ma 'am.

[943] And we're going to hang.

[944] I know we're going to hang.

[945] I love that.

[946] And my only request is that you figure out an organic way to work me into the show.

[947] Of course.

[948] A very tall Irish Catholic guy, but I have to play Conan O 'Brien.

[949] Oh, okay.

[950] It's not an acting part.

[951] You have to be.

[952] It's got to be one of those Jump the Shark episodes.

[953] Okay.

[954] Where Rami bumps into Conan O 'Brien and brings him to the mosque.

[955] And I keep looking into camera and saying like, well, this is going to be, you know, this is going to be an interesting turn of events.

[956] You know what I'm saying?

[957] You know, and, you know, yeah.

[958] Last time I saw a rug that big, I was at a wig store.

[959] I'm looking right into the camera.

[960] I mean, I'm going to get a real tone lecture from my father, but I'll do it.

[961] I'll do it.

[962] You'll be like, why?

[963] I'll do it.

[964] Your thing was going so well.

[965] We raised you for tonal consistency.

[966] And then you pulled this Conan shit.

[967] I'm sorry, Dad.

[968] It's the episode where Rami jumps the shark completely.

[969] Oh, who I found.

[970] I bring him to the diner.

[971] It's Conan O 'Brien.

[972] hi guys looks right into camera and hello out there audience fuck why did he do that he broke the fourth wall he didn't seem to understand much about the religion or the culture maybe i'll just end at season three science and history let's just get into it don't know much about history okay this is very interesting this is a headline from a news article you ready the bacteria Conan super resistant to radiation could survive million years on Mars it's nicknamed Conan it's named Conan Why?

[973] Yeah why do they name?

[974] Well I guess it's actually Conan Conan the bacteria but I thought that that might be relevant Well I mean I'm very resilient in my career many times there have been attempts to destroy me and I come back like a persistent bacteria.

[975] So I see it.

[976] I see it.

[977] Yeah.

[978] I'm proud to be linked to a rare bacteria that can exist in the harshest, harshest climates.

[979] You are?

[980] I wouldn't want, there's a lot of things to be named after me. I wouldn't want bacteria to be one of them.

[981] What would you like to be named after you?

[982] A building.

[983] Oh.

[984] Why don't, why don't we name this building the Sonom of Sessian I don't think we can because I really think of this as Erica Browns.

[985] Oh yeah, that's more relevant.

[986] Erica takes care of this place and runs it and she's you know, this is Erica's house.

[987] I agree.

[988] So I say...

[989] Can I have a wing?

[990] No. And it's just wing.

[991] It's not winga.

[992] There's no hard G. Why do you always do that?

[993] You waste everybody's time.

[994] Every single time you have to point.

[995] Can I have a wing?

[996] There's a G at the end of the word.

[997] I don't know why.

[998] Why do you think you're right?

[999] You're not right.

[1000] I am.

[1001] Well, I think Matt will tell you.

[1002] Come on, don't bring Matt into this.

[1003] Matt, be honest.

[1004] It's wing.

[1005] Yeah, let's bring the other guy who's just like me. No offense.

[1006] But you guys are like, yeah, my family's been here forever.

[1007] So we know English better than your people.

[1008] Excuse me. I was going to defend you.

[1009] And then you threw me under the white man's bus.

[1010] Yeah, that's wrong.

[1011] Well, first of all, Gorley, you've been in the country the longest.

[1012] Personally?

[1013] Well, no. I mean, your family.

[1014] My family.

[1015] Yeah.

[1016] I think your people, they've, You look like guys that were working on a podcast on the Mayflower.

[1017] That's right.

[1018] That's absolutely right.

[1019] It was 100%.

[1020] Well, we left the great podcast famine of Ireland and then had to come over.

[1021] People were eating microphones and they were like, we've got to get out of here.

[1022] What year did your family come over?

[1023] Well, I want to say it was a late 1860s, 1870s.

[1024] But as we've said many times, my people made the drive.

[1025] dreadful mistake of not diversifying the line.

[1026] Right.

[1027] And so...

[1028] Like royalty.

[1029] Like royalty.

[1030] I am much like royalty in that I am horribly imbred.

[1031] Irish trash.

[1032] Anywho, my children have been saved because my lovely wife embodies many different genetic strains.

[1033] And so my children have surpassed me. They have powers that I could only dream of.

[1034] They're only half imbred.

[1035] That's a nice way to say.

[1036] Did you say that about my children?

[1037] Yeah, what you said?

[1038] I did.

[1039] Okay.

[1040] Actually, I'm thinking about it and it's just true.

[1041] It is.

[1042] Oh, it's just true.

[1043] Okay.

[1044] I was going to get mad and then I was like, oh, it's just true.

[1045] But yeah, I sort of know, this is not in me giving you a hard time because you, you know, came to this country as a child.

[1046] It's not.

[1047] I didn't.

[1048] Born here.

[1049] We've been through this.

[1050] No, I was born here.

[1051] You can't convince me that I was not born in this country just because you say it often because I was born here.

[1052] Born where, exactly.

[1053] Monabello.

[1054] Manabello is not in the United States.

[1055] I've been over this.

[1056] No, it is.

[1057] I grew up in two cities away from Monobello.

[1058] Just because you don't, you like...

[1059] I think it's a...

[1060] Montobello is an island in international water.

[1061] No. Oh my God.

[1062] I'm pretty sure.

[1063] Anyway, the point is...

[1064] Anyway, just name a wing after me. Winga.

[1065] I don't care.

[1066] Maybe get a winga at the Montabello town center.

[1067] Oh, I'll take it.

[1068] And you should...

[1069] Is there anything honoring you in Monabello?

[1070] No. You should be.

[1071] You were a celebrity.

[1072] You were a legitimate celebrity.

[1073] Well, I'm not.

[1074] Well, you are.

[1075] You have a book that was a New York Times bestseller.

[1076] Right.

[1077] It's out right now.

[1078] And I bring up your name in front of any crowd.

[1079] You get big cheers.

[1080] That's nice.

[1081] You are known.

[1082] You are a known person.

[1083] And who are you competing with?

[1084] What other celebrities are there in Monobello?

[1085] You know what?

[1086] I don't know.

[1087] Eduardo's from Monabello, too.

[1088] I'm also from Mono.

[1089] Do you know anybody from who's famous?

[1090] The Great Sonem -Sessi.

[1091] No. Right.

[1092] Don't know.

[1093] But don't you think.

[1094] Sona, I mean, I'm going to just put this out there.

[1095] Yeah.

[1096] I do think Sona should have some kind of recognition by Monobello.

[1097] I agree.

[1098] I don't know if it's a park bench.

[1099] I can go bigger than a park bench.

[1100] I think you should be Grand Marshal in the Monobello Christmas parade.

[1101] Yes.

[1102] Is that a Christmas parade?

[1103] I don't know.

[1104] There should be.

[1105] We'll make a parade and I'll be the Grand Marshal.

[1106] I don't know.

[1107] I think that people always want me to do things because they think you'll do them with me. Yeah, but that's called the old.

[1108] bait and switch.

[1109] Yeah, I know.

[1110] What?

[1111] Uh -oh.

[1112] So I just pulled up on Google, Monabella celebrities, and on the short list of like eight people, Sona's name is on.

[1113] What number is it?

[1114] And above or below who else?

[1115] It's three after Sir Han -Sir -Han.

[1116] Oh, man. Robert Kennedy's assassin.

[1117] You should feel pretty good.

[1118] She's number seven.

[1119] And who else is on there?

[1120] Anyone we'd know?

[1121] Gina Rodriguez.

[1122] Oh, yeah.

[1123] She's an actress.

[1124] Yep.

[1125] Actor, yeah.

[1126] The rest, I don't know that I know.

[1127] Just say some names.

[1128] Kim Langford.

[1129] Nope.

[1130] Chelsea Rendon.

[1131] Nope.

[1132] Actress.

[1133] Michelle Bauer.

[1134] You're bigger than all these people.

[1135] Michael Trevino.

[1136] Also an actor.

[1137] That sounds fun.

[1138] And Deborah Foreman.

[1139] Oh, yeah.

[1140] Okay.

[1141] I bet if I looked up Brookline, Massachusetts, notable people from Brookline, Massachusetts, don't say, Eduardo, but it would probably not include me. Because it's so many famous people.

[1142] John F. Kennedy.

[1143] You guys both had presidents from your cities.

[1144] That's very cool.

[1145] And I'm, you know what I mean?

[1146] And so would say things like John F. Kennedy, number one.

[1147] Number two, Wilson Fetterman, number three.

[1148] Alicia Cornwallis, number four.

[1149] Can we see what number you are on the list?

[1150] You're number two for sure.

[1151] Can you Google famous Brooklyn?

[1152] I googled it.

[1153] Conan's number two.

[1154] I knew it.

[1155] I knew it.

[1156] Nice.

[1157] Who's number one?

[1158] John F .K. He always wins.

[1159] What about Alicia?

[1160] What did he ever do?

[1161] Do I ask not what your country can do for you?

[1162] Ask what you can do be a country.

[1163] My God.

[1164] It's getting weirder.

[1165] I'm sorry!

[1166] I have to keep making it a stranger and strange impression.

[1167] God, he always beats me out.

[1168] He should.

[1169] He always will.

[1170] You need a library.

[1171] You need to do a library there.

[1172] There needs to be a Conan O 'Brien library.

[1173] This is a bad idea.

[1174] This is a great idea.

[1175] Hey, about this.

[1176] In Monabello, I bet I could get a Conan O 'Brien library.

[1177] If they put the Sonom of Sessian Bench out.

[1178] front I'll take a bench if but you get a you want a library yeah okay it's there's more fun buildings like more fun than the library corley what do you make of that blasphemy I don't want to take sides okay don't you want to school wouldn't a school be cool if it's named after you oh my god yeah we're uh how about that yeah kona o 'brien's school where all the kids are bullied.

[1179] There are no bullies, only kids who are bullied.

[1180] They go on to be huge bullies.

[1181] Who's bullying them?

[1182] Exactly.

[1183] They have to bring people in to bully them, but they aren't actually part of the curriculum.

[1184] But then they leave as bullies.

[1185] They get trained into being bullies.

[1186] Hey, I was taught by my older brothers who bullied me. Not Luke, Neal.

[1187] Definitely bully.

[1188] But then you passed it on probably to like Kate and Justin.

[1189] I'm really just.

[1190] I went hard after Justin.

[1191] That's not nice, though.

[1192] It's not nice, but I tried to make it up for him.

[1193] It was done to you and you did it to your younger brother.

[1194] That's not cool.

[1195] I don't know.

[1196] O 'Brien High.

[1197] Yeah, no, O 'Brien High.

[1198] Only bullied kids, no bullies.

[1199] Oh, God.

[1200] I just don't know why they bust the bullies in.

[1201] Why don't they stop?

[1202] They bust them in.

[1203] It's just what the Conan O 'Brien's school is.

[1204] All the kids wear pants that don't fit.

[1205] They're not long enough.

[1206] Where did they get the bullies from?

[1207] Is that another school?

[1208] Yes, the bullies are professional.

[1209] bullies that are shipped in.

[1210] They're paid the same way that the teachers are paid.

[1211] They have a union.

[1212] They're brought in.

[1213] They bully and, hey, where do you think you're going?

[1214] Bang.

[1215] Hey, what's stuff from in a locker?

[1216] Hey, guys, it's 3 o 'clock.

[1217] All right, time to check out.

[1218] Let's go.

[1219] Get in their cars and drive away.

[1220] Why would anyone go there?

[1221] Anyway, look for it soon.

[1222] Conan O 'Brien Elementary School.

[1223] And you can find it because the Sonom of Sessian three -legged bench.

[1224] Oh, I don't even have four.

[1225] Oh, that's expensive.

[1226] And anytime you try and sit in it, it dumps you.

[1227] It falls over and dumps you onto the lawn.

[1228] There's also a bacteria on Mars named Conan.

[1229] Oh, yeah.

[1230] Well, hey, your own.

[1231] Okay, boy.

[1232] We really had fun with that story.

[1233] Conan O 'Brien needs a friend with Conan O 'Brien, Sonam of Sessian, and Matt Gourley.

[1234] Produced by me, Matt Gourley.

[1235] Executive produced by Adam Sacks, Joanna Solitaroff, and Jeff Ross at Team Coco, and Colin Anderson and Cody Fisher at Earwolf.

[1236] Theme song by The White Stripes.

[1237] Incidental music by Jimmy Vivino.

[1238] Take it away, Jimmy.

[1239] Supervising producer Aaron Blair, Associate talent producer Jennifer Samples, engineering by Eduardo Perez.

[1240] Additional production support by Mars Melnick, talent booking by Paula Davis, Gina Patista, and Britt Kahn.

[1241] This episode was mixed and edited by me, Brett Morris.

[1242] You can rate and review this show on Apple Podcasts, and you might find your review read on a future episode.

[1243] Got a question for Conan?

[1244] the Team Coco hotline at 323 -451 -2821 and leave a message.

[1245] It could be featured on a future episode.

[1246] Please subscribe to Conan O 'Brien needs a friend on Apple Podcasts, Stitcher, or wherever fine podcasts are downloaded.