Adam Scott

[0] Hi, welcome to the armchair expert.

[1] Today, we're going to speak with Adam Scott, who's just an all -around nice human being on a lot of levels.

[2] He is currently the star of a show he produces called Ghosted on Fox, which airs Sunday nights.

[3] And you've seen him in a million movies.

[4] He's unbelievably funny.

[5] He's also an incredibly skilled actor.

[6] If you've seen the HBO show, Monica, what's it called?

[7] With the women are very powerful.

[8] Big Little Lies.

[9] He's great on Big Little Lies.

[10] Again, though, I want to put an emphasis on just what a good person he is.

[11] But before we listen to Adam, Monica, and I chat, I want to do a little bit of housekeeping, as my friend Sam Harris calls it.

[12] A couple things, it's been brought to my attention with the help of social media that I interrupt people too much.

[13] And I'm willing to accept that that's probably true.

[14] This is, I guess, how I talk in real life, which is an unfortunate realization on my end.

[15] But, you know, I'm always trying to learn and better myself.

[16] So you will hear some episodes before I was given that.

[17] loud, clear note from the world on social media, but I'm going to make a much better effort.

[18] That's not a great sentence.

[19] Is it, Monica, a much better effort?

[20] You're going to make an effort.

[21] I'm going to make an effort to interrupt less.

[22] Also been brought to my attention.

[23] Some people don't realize that Monica is very much a part of this podcast.

[24] Physically and emotionally, she sits right next to the guest.

[25] We've kind of left her out of some photos, which is, I'm going to blame Rob.

[26] That's really his department, not mine.

[27] But if you feel like Monica's interrupting at some point.

[28] She's very much not interrupting.

[29] She is an integral part of the conversation at all times.

[30] So if you hear her, she's not budding in.

[31] She's just adding the color that we love to get from her.

[32] Side note about Monica, I've recently become obsessed with her grandma.

[33] Holy smokes.

[34] I'll post a picture of her.

[35] You have to on the website.

[36] Her grandmother who was married in India and an arranged marriage and the photo was taken, I assume, right around that.

[37] I've been told wedding day.

[38] Oh, wedding day.

[39] You guys, she's in an 11.

[40] She's so smoking hot.

[41] If I had a time machine, I would not go by Apple stock.

[42] I would go straight to India and try to woo her away from Monica's grandpa.

[43] She's a stone cold fox from a very high cast, I understand.

[44] Very high.

[45] Very, the highest.

[46] I'm flattered by proxy.

[47] Yeah, you should be.

[48] I think you've...

[49] I don't look like her, so...

[50] No, I see it.

[51] Yeah.

[52] Anyway, she's don't go box.

[53] Hopefully we'll get a picture of her up on the website and everyone else can have the same obsession I have.

[54] I'm regretting saying that.

[55] I don't know if I want everyone to docking and leering at my grandma.

[56] I would love it if everyone thought my Papa Bob was super hot.

[57] It would make him so happy and abstentia or whatever you say posthumously.

[58] I think in the grave he'd be smiling to know that everyone thought he was handsome and well built.

[59] Without further ado, please sit back and enjoy our conversation with Adam Scott.

[60] can listen to armchair expert early and add free right now.

[61] Join Wondry Plus in the Wondry app or on Apple Podcasts.

[62] Or you can listen for free wherever you get your podcasts.

[63] He's an upchairs coffee cups we want.

[64] You can sell these for an arm in a way.

[65] Yeah, yeah.

[66] That's the plan.

[67] Adam Scott, thank you so much for joining me on The Armchair Expert.

[68] Thanks for having me, Dad.

[69] You're a very busy man. Sure.

[70] You're an accomplished man, a productive man. And suffice to say, I did feel guilty asking you to make yet another hour of time for someone else.

[71] Dex, that if you feel that guilt, feel that times a thousand for me asking you to come and do ghosted.

[72] Okay.

[73] Now, what's great is, and maybe this could be cathartic for both of us, I was nothing but flattered when you asked me to do ghosted.

[74] I thought, oh, wow, here's a show this guy created.

[75] it couldn't be closer to his heart, and he would trust me with some scenes in it.

[76] That's insane.

[77] First of all, that you would think I created it.

[78] That's very flattering.

[79] But you coming...

[80] I apparently am misinformed.

[81] You didn't create it now.

[82] I mean, Naomi and I produce it, so we're in there with it.

[83] But a guy named Tom Gorman actually created it.

[84] But you coming and doing it was above and beyond.

[85] And also the fact that I email.

[86] mailed you or texted you to ask you, just sort of cringing as I send the text or the email.

[87] Like, this is a huge ask.

[88] And within, I'd say, four minutes, you're like, yeah, where and when?

[89] Well, I'm so, by the way, I only invite people on here that have had that experience with me because certainly people have had other experiences of me and I keep them very far away.

[90] You do not want them speaking into a microphone.

[91] But I will say that after doing that day on your show, I said, my goal in life now is to get cast as like a Max Hedrum type character.

[92] Yeah.

[93] Because I was throughout the whole episode, but I was able to shoot it in about 90 minutes, sitting still and reading a teleprompter.

[94] That's right.

[95] That is not the dream job.

[96] I'm not sure what is.

[97] It really, I was so jealous of you.

[98] Yeah.

[99] You were able to just do that.

[100] A whole episode.

[101] It's not like I had an A scene.

[102] You're in the entire thing.

[103] Peppered throughout.

[104] Yep.

[105] Yeah.

[106] And I knocked it out in 90 minutes.

[107] You sure did.

[108] Knocked it out of the park.

[109] Oh, well.

[110] How did you and Naomi come to produce that?

[111] Naomi is your wife.

[112] Yes.

[113] And she's a fox.

[114] She is.

[115] And she's brilliant.

[116] Yes.

[117] That's a pretty damn good combination you got.

[118] She really is.

[119] As you've noticed from being friends with Kristen, not very bright.

[120] No. No, no, no, no. So, yeah, yeah.

[121] So I am in great envy of your situation.

[122] I'm so sorry about your situation.

[123] Tom came and pitched Tom Lennon Tom Gormacken A couple of years ago Just kind of a really kind of I would say the bones of an idea And then it kind of grew from there We all went out and pitched together with Craig Robinson And then ended up on Fox But the interesting thing is Is that now we are Sort of rebooting it in a way Oh you are We are shooting another six episodes now With different showrunner different writers.

[124] It's a whole new tone.

[125] It really is a completely different show.

[126] Wow.

[127] Really wild.

[128] Which I don't know if that's been done before in the middle of the first season, but.

[129] Well, I know Arnette's show somehow actually switched genres, right?

[130] It went from either it either started a single camera and then went multi -cam or it started multi -camera and went single camera.

[131] I think the former.

[132] They were going to turn it into multi -cam, but I don't think they ever - No. Actually did it, but I know they were about to do or something.

[133] They wrote episodes.

[134] They all agreed to that.

[135] I think, yeah, I think right before they actually shot maybe one.

[136] Yeah.

[137] So other than that, yeah.

[138] And how extreme.

[139] Well, first of all, let's just say that ghosted is, as I understand it, it is basically a kind of a comedic ex -files, right?

[140] With you and Craig?

[141] That was the intention, yeah.

[142] Supernatural.

[143] Yeah, there is a lot of story.

[144] There's cases.

[145] It's a bit procedural.

[146] Yes.

[147] And comedic.

[148] Which is a really, there wasn't really a template for the sci -fi action comedy half -hour show.

[149] And that was something that ended up being a real challenge was having a case or a villain or a monster in 21 and a half minutes.

[150] Yeah.

[151] But people might not even realize just to get very basic, which is typically in television, your comedies are a half hour and your dramas are an hour.

[152] Yes.

[153] Which really is 44 minutes and 22 minutes.

[154] Yes.

[155] And you are given eight days to shoot generally a drama and you're given five days to shoot a comedy.

[156] That's right.

[157] So it is very hard if you're telling a network I want to do this show and you want to break that paradigm.

[158] You want to go, oh, well, it's a dromedy, I want it, but I want to do it in 22.

[159] You know.

[160] Yeah.

[161] So already what you're saying is you're fitting in it in a box that normally it probably doesn't go in.

[162] That's right.

[163] And it was a challenge.

[164] Did you guys discuss, like, let's just do a dromedy.

[165] Let's do 44 minutes.

[166] We wanted, yeah, I mean, originally I think the idea was kind of my ultimate fantasy was let's mix midnight run and the twilight zone.

[167] Let's get those two things together.

[168] Let's get a mind bending cross -pollination.

[169] Yeah, yeah.

[170] And with that really kind of tender, real relationship in the middle of the whole thing.

[171] Yeah.

[172] these guys that you care about and trying to stuff as much story into each episode as we did like for instance your episode introducing you your AI character and then having it having the character be this wonderful pleasant addition to the office and then turn into a villain turn everybody against each other all the things that you did in that episode would have worked if we had spread it out over, say, three episodes, right?

[173] Uh -huh, right.

[174] But in 21 and a half minutes, inevitably feels a little undercooked if this big turn is happening and you had just got to meet this care.

[175] And you're trying to get jokes in there and characters.

[176] Yeah, well, because as I think of it, the A plot line of that really is the fact that you and Craig, you obviously desire to be better friends with him.

[177] Right.

[178] You want to go to concerts and stuff with him, right, right.

[179] And so that's like at the core of the storyline.

[180] So that gets short shrift, as does the kind of suspense element and that, you know, wanting to have your, your AI character be genuinely scary.

[181] Everything sort of gets a little.

[182] Fast forwarded.

[183] Yeah.

[184] It's how people listen to this podcast, I think, on 1 .5 or two.

[185] Fast forward.

[186] They look at it like two hours my ass.

[187] I can make this an hour.

[188] We all sound like the chipmunks.

[189] Yeah, exactly.

[190] So everyone was doing a great job.

[191] and I think it's entirely, working with everybody was great, and I think it's entirely possible for well -meaning people to have fun working together, but also be maybe trying to make different shows at the same time.

[192] Oh, of course, yeah, yeah.

[193] So it was all great and everything.

[194] It just didn't totally end up clicking in the way that.

[195] And was this an observation of your own?

[196] Were you going, hmm, this isn't hitting the bullseye in my mind of what I wanted it to be?

[197] To be totally honest, yes.

[198] Right.

[199] Which is fucking terrifying, right?

[200] It is.

[201] Because you're making that show and you're, once the train leaves the station and you're making a network show.

[202] Yeah.

[203] I know Mike Scher's analogy for it is you're in, you know, the Indy 500 and you have to change all of the wheels and gas up the car and everything, except you aren't able to pull over.

[204] Right, right.

[205] So you got to get these episodes shot, cut them together, and put them on television.

[206] And there's, no matter what they are.

[207] They're almost made the way these superhero sequels are made, where they have a release date long before.

[208] They've already made the cups at McDonald's.

[209] Yeah.

[210] So you've got to fucking shoot on April 4th, whether you got a script or not, which happens all the time.

[211] Totally.

[212] Yeah.

[213] It's a beast.

[214] It is terrifying.

[215] You've been through the whole thing.

[216] So we're kind of starting over.

[217] Paul Lieberstein came in, a guy that ran the office for years, terrific writers.

[218] It's a totally different tone.

[219] It's really focused on character.

[220] and there is a mystery, a larger kind of mystery and big, big question, but it's spread out over five or six episodes rather than trying to stuff it in.

[221] So we're able to really focus on the characters in the ensemble.

[222] That feels a little bit to me the successful approach that Last Man on Earth took Forte's show, which is this overarching issue of that he's alone on planet Earth and there's been some horrific apocalypse or whatever.

[223] Yeah, but you're not solving any given thing on a given episode.

[224] It's just like a very tiny, yes.

[225] Yeah, the episode stories are more personal.

[226] Right.

[227] And then you'll have that kind of an overarching story that happens throughout the series.

[228] Yeah.

[229] And so that big overarching thing has room to breathe and the audience can have fun with it and there's this big unanswered question and what is that?

[230] What does that mean?

[231] Meanwhile, there are fun little personal stories.

[232] And, you know, we have a deal, Actar.

[233] We have Allie Walker and Amber Stevens West, who are the other three regulars on the show.

[234] And they're so great.

[235] And there wasn't really room for them to really show how great they are before.

[236] And so there's really room for them to, they're all amazing.

[237] Yeah.

[238] And we added some more ensemble players.

[239] So it's a different.

[240] But it'll stay half hour?

[241] Yes.

[242] Okay.

[243] Yeah.

[244] And did the network come to you?

[245] Did the studio come to you?

[246] and pitch this solution or did you send up a red flag and say let's talk how did how did that all happen and how how defensive were you initially hearing that or how open to it were you i think that we were all in favor of figuring out a way to make this thing where i think it was clear to everybody this isn't quite functioning in the way the end product isn't the thing that is you know like i said there was no template for it and so everyone was doing their best trying to make It was a square peg in a round hole a little bit as far as genre and tone.

[247] And trying to make this thing really click in 21 and a half minutes.

[248] Yeah.

[249] And, you know, we were all working our butts off trying to make it work.

[250] And it was, you know, it ended up just not being the exact kind of way to go.

[251] So I think everyone was in favor of figuring out some way to shift it.

[252] And Paul had a really great idea of how did Paul Lieberstor?

[253] had a great idea of how to do that.

[254] Uh -huh.

[255] So we went back and sort of just repitched it to the, to the network and sort of.

[256] Well, isn't that?

[257] And that's great.

[258] They were open to that.

[259] Oh, totally.

[260] Yeah.

[261] They were terrific about it, really.

[262] Oh, that's great.

[263] I mean, that's a big ask.

[264] Oh, fuck.

[265] Let's.

[266] You know this thing you green lit?

[267] Yeah.

[268] And 10 episodes isn't nothing.

[269] We made a bunch of them.

[270] Build sets and all these things.

[271] Special effects, the whole thing.

[272] So going.

[273] back and re kind of imagining it as a different thing.

[274] And for them to put it back on the air with the same title, same time slot, same characters, but different things.

[275] I have to imagine that's a testament to how much they just want a show with you and Craig.

[276] They must really like you guys.

[277] I think that's a pretty strike gold combination between you guys.

[278] When you told me you were doing the show camping, I think we were.

[279] I was like, oh my God, what a pairing.

[280] That's really great.

[281] I'm so glad you guys are together.

[282] So they probably want to sell.

[283] any version of that, that they can.

[284] Maybe so.

[285] I would if I ran up anything.

[286] Maybe so.

[287] I mean, I think that was always the thing in the show that really did work were those two characters together.

[288] And working with Craig is so, so fun.

[289] It's an exciting thing.

[290] So I think, yeah, I think that was certainly part of it.

[291] Because I don't know if we would get the two of us together again.

[292] Yeah.

[293] You know, I don't.

[294] So, yeah.

[295] Yeah.

[296] What's interesting is, you know, I've made a couple movies and I've made this mistake twice.

[297] I'll probably continue to make it again and again, which is I have my own particular interest, right?

[298] I have a certain recipe of things I like.

[299] I like self -help.

[300] I like sobriety.

[301] Yeah, yeah.

[302] I love dirt bikes and off -road cars and racing.

[303] And talking about your childhood.

[304] That shows in your movies, too.

[305] Right, but so while, like, let's say hit and run, as I set out to make this movie, I actually convince myself, oh, this is amazing because it'll attract both people who love love stories and who love car movies.

[306] But the end result is actually the people who love love stories see all these cars jumping and they want nothing to do with the movie.

[307] And then the car lovers see like an opening scene with me talking sweet to Kristen and they want nothing to do with it.

[308] So I weirdly alienate both audiences, but in the prep of it all, again, I don't regret any of it.

[309] Because ultimately, all you can do is make the movie or show you want to see for yourself.

[310] And so that's all you can do.

[311] What can you do?

[312] That's true.

[313] But I will say that with hit and run, for me, it was a perfect combination of those two things because for me it was like one of those old James Garner movie.

[314] Do you remember Tank, that movie, Tank?

[315] No, I didn't see it.

[316] And C Thomas Howell or Reynolds movie.

[317] I do.

[318] I remember the VHS cover at the...

[319] Yeah, yeah.

[320] It was a VHS thing.

[321] Or a Burt Reynolds movie.

[322] They're sitting on a tank, right?

[323] Yeah, he has to get a tank out of a, some sort of facility.

[324] It was just an excuse to get James Garner saying funny shit.

[325] Yes, yes, in a tank.

[326] Or a Bert Reynolds movie.

[327] Oh, all of his.

[328] But it had this very real beating heart at the center of it.

[329] And people you really cared about and you cared about, you and Kristen's relationship like you needed this thing to survive but you kept messing up, can you curse?

[330] Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[331] So racial slurs we try to keep to a minimum.

[332] But they are allowed, you must.

[333] Yeah, yeah, it's the only way you can tell the story.

[334] If you're quoting somebody.

[335] So I think that that you, that was a perfect combination of those because I love watching car chases but it's car chases aren't fun unless you care about the people in the car, right?

[336] Well, that's kind of my take on it.

[337] You know, like Smoking the Bannon, which for me is the all -time greatest car chase movie of all time.

[338] You know, you're watching Bert and Sally Fall in Love, which was one of the greatest parents in Hollywood history.

[339] And then, you know, on and off screen, they had all this, you know, busyness.

[340] And they were great in Hooper together.

[341] You could have just watched them forever.

[342] So, yeah, also, you know, between Bert Reynolds and the Snowman, Jerry Reed, that too is this amazing.

[343] You know, if you think about it at the beginning of that movie, he goes and gets him out of bed.

[344] He takes him away from his wife.

[345] Yeah.

[346] And what you see there is like, oh, the snowman will follow the bandit anywhere.

[347] Sure.

[348] And that's kind of the dream friendship we're all after.

[349] Yes.

[350] That I can just nudge you in your bed and go, fucking desert your family and kids.

[351] Come with me on this adventure.

[352] Sure.

[353] Let's do it right now.

[354] Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly.

[355] That's great.

[356] Instead, we just meet on your set or in my attic or wherever.

[357] For like, you know, a couple of hours.

[358] and then we don't see each other for three months.

[359] Yeah, but you can, in prep of things, you can definitely convince yourself, oh, so fuck, X -Files, all these people love that, and then people love comedy and us in comedy.

[360] So I'm gonna kind of, I'm gonna aggregate all these audiences, but weirdly you can end up kind of splitting.

[361] Yes, I think that selfishly, I thought when I said, it's like Twilight Zone and Midnight Run, just assuming everyone loved the thing, about Twilight Zone and Midnight Run.

[362] Yes.

[363] Maybe they haven't seen Twilight Zone.

[364] Maybe they don't care about Midnight Run.

[365] But I think that that's just a common language and everyone loves it as much as me. When you say that, Midnight Run and Twilight Zone or Midnight Run and Stranger Things, that particular tone is razor thin.

[366] Not only is it razor thin, but you could also misdiagnose the reaction because when you say Midnight Run, I go, I smile.

[367] Yeah.

[368] And then when you say Twilight Zone, I'm very happy about that too.

[369] Yeah.

[370] That doesn't mean I know how to mash those things up.

[371] Of course not.

[372] basically said chocolate ice cream and and Reese's peanut butter cups.

[373] I like both.

[374] I don't know that they're going to go well together.

[375] Right.

[376] By the way, that sounds delicious.

[377] Yeah, they do.

[378] They do.

[379] Yeah, I use a bad example.

[380] Chocolate ice cream and and a Zippo lighter.

[381] Yeah.

[382] Sure.

[383] Yes.

[384] Much better.

[385] Much better.

[386] Side note, I think it's safe to say that 70 % of pitches in Hollywood be them TV or film reference Midnight Ron.

[387] Of course.

[388] Yeah.

[389] I know.

[390] That is the go -to.

[391] I myself have said it selling stuff a lot.

[392] Isn't it funny that we all hold that movie Midnight Run on this pedestal of just the high watermark of what a buddy action film could be?

[393] I know.

[394] It's so overused.

[395] And so certainly the studios and networks have bought dozens and dozens and dozens and dozens of projects that had that as the template.

[396] Yet I've not seen Midnight Run since.

[397] I know.

[398] Nothing that good.

[399] Yeah, I just can't think of.

[400] And again, you get into like, okay, maybe the script was perfect.

[401] But then what a fucking weird pairing.

[402] You don't even know that De Niro and say his name.

[403] Charles Groden.

[404] Yeah, Grodin are going to have that kind of symmetry.

[405] I know.

[406] It's such a great pairing.

[407] And Martin Brest clearly backed off and gave them room.

[408] I mean, I'm sure he was a great facilitator, but also whatever dance that was that he did to let those two guys have that much.

[409] Magic.

[410] Because they were at each other.

[411] Yes.

[412] But they loved it.

[413] It was a love story.

[414] It was.

[415] And it weirdly fits the paradigm of of the black -white comedy movie that followed it, like, you know, lethal weapon and all of them, right?

[416] Because the archetypes were so drastically different that it was really fun to watch.

[417] Yes.

[418] Yeah.

[419] It's just a perfect movie.

[420] But it's also, the relationship is incredibly grounded, but the movie also has this language to it that's heightened, like right out of the gate, even as the opening credits are rolling, they establish like, For the next 90 minutes, whenever someone gets punched in the face, they are out cold.

[421] And you can do anything you want with their body for the next couple hours.

[422] What a great point.

[423] You know?

[424] Yeah, the world they enter.

[425] They tell you what the physics of this world are right out of the gate.

[426] Right away.

[427] Yeah, yeah.

[428] And you just, you're like, okay, fine, you know.

[429] I did that and hit and run.

[430] I punched Rosenbaum out cold and I'm able to, you know, remove his corpse and position it in his car and everything's good.

[431] Sure.

[432] When was the last time you got anything hit, hits your face and you are out cold.

[433] Conveniently for three or even better, like three minutes in my case.

[434] Rosenbaum comes to just as everyone's pulling out.

[435] Yes, yes.

[436] Yeah, I've been hit several times and it was where I grew up and I've even lost consciousness for a second, but I've never, yeah, I've never come to like five minutes later after commercial break.

[437] If you're out for that long, it is a serious problem.

[438] An ambulance needs to be called.

[439] Yeah, you're in a, you're in a pet scan or whatever.

[440] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[441] You have a very good memory for all these movies we watched as a kid.

[442] When you're from Santa Cruz?

[443] Yeah, yeah.

[444] And that's a very surfy, hippie, right?

[445] Yeah.

[446] Mushrooms.

[447] Grateful Dead.

[448] Big Redwood trees.

[449] It's beautiful.

[450] Yeah.

[451] Pass -fail at the university, I think.

[452] Uh -huh.

[453] Have you been up there?

[454] I have.

[455] I went there when I was probably 25 and I bought one pound of mushrooms.

[456] Yeah.

[457] With my buddy.

[458] It's a lot of mushrooms.

[459] It's so much more mushrooms than you think it's going to be.

[460] It was two full gallon -sized Ziploc bags of mushrooms.

[461] It was so much mushrooms.

[462] And he and I, Aaron and I ate half of them.

[463] And when then we sold half in Michigan.

[464] And God bless him.

[465] He drove cross -country with this gallon -sized bag of mushrooms under.

[466] So he drove them from Santa Cruz to Michigan.

[467] Well, no. He and I drove from Santa Cruz back to L .A. We took a bunch of them.

[468] And then he took a gallon bag back to Michigan and sold those.

[469] And we made out like a bandit financially.

[470] when you're 25 and unemployed, you know, I think we cleared like 1 ,600 bucks from this and then had free mushrooms for two years.

[471] Amazing.

[472] I found that it's not a good idea for me to have a gallon -sized zip -lock bag of mushrooms in my freezer while also a functioning alcoholic because invariably at midnight I thought it was a great idea to eat some.

[473] So there was a few drinks in.

[474] You know what?

[475] You know what made this great?

[476] You know what we should do right now instead of going to bed?

[477] Yeah, it was a bad idea.

[478] But I had some good times.

[479] But at any rate, were you a surf person?

[480] Did you follow the stereotype of a Santa Cruz kid?

[481] Not really.

[482] I never really surfed.

[483] I got into skimboarding for a while.

[484] Do you know what that is?

[485] Throw it on the beach?

[486] Throw it on the, yeah, on the wet sand.

[487] Right as the water is pulling back into the ocean and there's that thin layer of water still on the sand.

[488] And hydroplane.

[489] Yeah, you can hydroplane across that and then kind of go off into the smaller waves.

[490] It's really fun and it's, I think, a mixture of seeing Jaws at a young age and being intimidated by the surfers because the surfers...

[491] Well, up there, it's pretty serious too, right?

[492] Yeah.

[493] You're, it's like the football players in Friday Night Lights.

[494] Yes.

[495] It's a small town.

[496] Surfing is the thing.

[497] Yeah.

[498] There's even like little surf gangs, am I right?

[499] Oh, yeah.

[500] There's like, it breaks you can and can't go on or you get your ass beat.

[501] Yes.

[502] The skimboarding thing kind of happened later on as a kid.

[503] kid.

[504] Growing up, I was just into watching TV and comic books and going to the movies.

[505] I would just go to the movies.

[506] On a weekend, I would go at like, you know, 11 a .m. and just go to the multiplex in town had four screens, which was like the biggest.

[507] I would just go see everything there.

[508] Sure.

[509] Yeah.

[510] I was just into movies.

[511] And you're the youngest of three?

[512] Is that?

[513] Yeah, yeah.

[514] And were your older siblings also into movies?

[515] Not as much, but they definitely kind of, in influenced what I first.

[516] My brother really got me into music.

[517] And early on, my sister kind of pointed me to what cool movies were.

[518] And then my brother and I kind of discovered comedy together.

[519] But I was the one that dove head first into it.

[520] Yeah.

[521] You know.

[522] You kind of break the model.

[523] In my town, the third youngest was always insane.

[524] Just crazy.

[525] Yes, it got progressively crazier.

[526] Because they were spoiled.

[527] No, because they're competing with.

[528] people older than them, right?

[529] So if they're jumping off the dresser, then the, you know, the one -year -old does.

[530] So just in my experience, the third one was always bad shit crazy.

[531] I hate when I learn my stereotypes don't hold up all the time.

[532] Yeah, I'm really glad you did that.

[533] And now I can't stick to it.

[534] That's a really, that's really interesting.

[535] Have you noticed that?

[536] No, but I think it's a cultural thing, maybe.

[537] Probably.

[538] It was most evident in skateboarding and And the second oldest one was always like, oh, wow, he's actually much better than the older brother.

[539] He's fearless.

[540] And then the third one would come out of nowhere and was just, you know, insane.

[541] Just taking risks that they should not take.

[542] So many risks.

[543] Yes.

[544] Terrifying to watch.

[545] That's interesting.

[546] Now, I'm a bit of a risk taker, but I have a brother that's five years older than me, and I was competing with him all the time.

[547] So I was good at skateboarding in junior high while I was still competing with him.

[548] But then when he went away, I no longer was doing that.

[549] And I was never really good at anything after that.

[550] Maybe it's that my brother was a computer guy.

[551] There we go.

[552] And so it wasn't about going out and doing crazy shit.

[553] He was like on his Apple 2E.

[554] Uh -huh.

[555] Writing little programs.

[556] Sure.

[557] Guys doing jumping jacks and stuff.

[558] Or eat my fart and it would repeat a trillion times.

[559] Exactly.

[560] Playing Castle Wolfenstein in 1983 for hours.

[561] But at any point while you were deep diving at the Cineplex.

[562] So safe to assume you were stealing those next three movies.

[563] Right.

[564] You were just paying for that first one.

[565] Of course.

[566] Of course.

[567] Ever considered making restitution know that you're flush?

[568] Yeah.

[569] Just go up there and handle the manager.

[570] Now that you mention it, I should probably head on up there.

[571] Drop off a few bills.

[572] Movies back then were like a matinee was like $2.

[573] So I've got to owe them at least $24, $25.

[574] Did you have friends that you went there with?

[575] Yeah.

[576] I mean, I went starting in the like sixth grade through, but I had like a three year awkward phase.

[577] I got chubby.

[578] Uh -huh.

[579] And so I kind of, what grade?

[580] Sixth grade.

[581] And so it carried me through junior high.

[582] That's a rough time.

[583] It was a tough one.

[584] My social standing was really interrupted and really got kind of sidelines there for a couple of years.

[585] Right.

[586] You're the chubby kid and, you know, it just and they weren't surfing.

[587] I wasn't surfing.

[588] Were you skateboarding?

[589] That was big there as well, right?

[590] I was trying.

[591] Because back to the future, I was like, oh, of course.

[592] Yeah.

[593] You need a Toyota pickup truck and a skateboard.

[594] But I was never, I never really got the hang of it.

[595] I was never particularly good on a skateboard.

[596] You're pretty good on a skateboard.

[597] I was at that time.

[598] I was around in the era where it started getting insane.

[599] We're like a big thing to do is to get two feet of air on a half bite.

[600] But then quickly it became the McTwist and these flips and 15 feet of air.

[601] I just immediately was like, that's not for me. I don't have the, I'm afraid.

[602] Yeah, you know.

[603] It's really scary.

[604] Oh, fuck, yeah.

[605] I mean, but when I was a kid, like my best buddy when I was a little kid, Kemper Bates, his sister was Keith Meek's girlfriend.

[606] Keith Meek had the Slashers skateboard.

[607] Do you remember the Slash?

[608] Oh, yeah, uh -huh, absolutely.

[609] And Rob Roska.

[610] and all those guys.

[611] I used to go to those parties when I was like 12 and see all those guys on the half pipe.

[612] Yeah.

[613] Because there was a very popular skateboard brand Santa Cruz, which I assume was made there.

[614] Yeah.

[615] And what was the skateboard magazine?

[616] Oh, Trans World Skate or Thrasher.

[617] Thrasher.

[618] Yeah, that was it.

[619] Yeah.

[620] All the guys that were in Thrashor, I would see them.

[621] That's pretty wild.

[622] As a kid in Michigan, you were basically in the epicenter of where I would have killed to have been.

[623] Right.

[624] But then I probably would have been just, I've been at the Cineplex with you, stealing three movies a day.

[625] You probably would have gotten up on the half pipe and probably done some damage to yourself.

[626] Yes, yes.

[627] I would have.

[628] I would have felt for better or worse, the big motivator for me most of my life is you're a fucking coward.

[629] There's just a voice in my head going, you little fucking coward, you know, just a self -loathing hatred that got me to do most of the things I've done.

[630] I don't think I've ever done one thing out of love.

[631] I looked at it and thought, that'll be fun.

[632] I thought everyone here thinks you're such a coward if you don't do it.

[633] So that's pushed you to make some really bad decisions?

[634] Absolutely.

[635] Yeah, I've had surgeries and stuff.

[636] My knees hurt at 43.

[637] Yeah.

[638] So where does that come from?

[639] I think, again, competing with someone five years older than me at all times.

[640] I think by comparison I felt like I couldn't do a thing, you know, or that he was fearless and that I wasn't.

[641] Mind you, comparatively to the kids my age, I was, they thought I was fearless, but it was all a comparison scale.

[642] And I, he was, you know, he was 13 when I was eight.

[643] That's a big gap.

[644] Right.

[645] Yeah.

[646] We fought every single day.

[647] We fought every single day until I finally won.

[648] Yeah.

[649] And then we never fought again, coincidentally.

[650] Till you really heard him.

[651] I, well, I didn't even heard him.

[652] I just won.

[653] And it was obvious that those days were over of him having the upper hand.

[654] Are you guys close now?

[655] We are.

[656] Yeah.

[657] Yeah.

[658] Cool.

[659] Yeah.

[660] But, uh, we, We definitely had a lot of growing pains because of that gap.

[661] It's such a big gap.

[662] Sure.

[663] I see these brothers and I'm jealous.

[664] Do you know the Avet brothers?

[665] The musician?

[666] Yeah.

[667] Have you seen the documentary about them?

[668] No, I hear it's terrific.

[669] Oh my God.

[670] I really recommend it if you want to hate yourself.

[671] Did Judd direct that?

[672] He did.

[673] Yeah.

[674] He and someone else.

[675] Yeah, yeah.

[676] So I don't really know who directed what.

[677] But they are, you know, they're very close in age and they were best buddies their whole life and they're still best buddies.

[678] And it just seems very effortless.

[679] for them.

[680] They live like next to each other.

[681] In North Carolina.

[682] They write all their songs together.

[683] It's very idyllic and dreamy.

[684] That's what I want for my son and my daughter and they're they are so kind of at each other's throat so often makes me sad and I want them to be those like best friends.

[685] They might grow into them.

[686] That's yeah.

[687] I mean all brothers and sisters at nine and 11 of course they're going to.

[688] That's what.

[689] age they are.

[690] Yeah.

[691] Yeah, I think school can, can help in ways because they kind of have to become a united front or sometimes that's advantageous and then that they feel the safety of having someone who will really die for them, even if they don't like them.

[692] Yeah, yeah.

[693] And I had that.

[694] How much older is your brother?

[695] Five years.

[696] Oh, he is.

[697] Yeah.

[698] Okay.

[699] So you had a similar, I'm sure most of the time he didn't want you around, but then occasionally he did.

[700] And that was confusing, right?

[701] It did end when I finally heard him.

[702] Okay.

[703] And then I remember exactly.

[704] where we were and then it never happened again.

[705] Yeah, how old were you?

[706] I must have been like 12 or 13 or something and he was 18.

[707] You know, it must have been even earlier than that because I can't imagine he was doing it that way.

[708] Did you use a weapon?

[709] Is that what turned the tables?

[710] That's right.

[711] A switch blade.

[712] I cut his aortic, aortic.

[713] No, it was a I must have been like 10 or 11.

[714] Whatever it was, I heard it.

[715] I heard him and I felt horrible.

[716] Uh -huh.

[717] And he, I think it was just a kind of a wake up like, oh, wow, this is stupid.

[718] What are we doing?

[719] Yeah.

[720] Well, my dad had a very clear rule, which was we were allowed to fight from sunup to sundown if that's what we wanted.

[721] Yeah.

[722] But you were not allowed to hit in the face.

[723] Uh -huh.

[724] If you hit each other in the face, then you were going to fight him.

[725] Yeah.

[726] Which wasn't appealing to either of us.

[727] No, no, no. We got older.

[728] That is a shift when it goes to the face.

[729] Yes.

[730] That's a different.

[731] Oh, you know Nate Talk.

[732] Yeah.

[733] So Nate Tuck, that's a great example.

[734] So there's, there are three brothers and then Marshall's the youngest and he's the craziest.

[735] Like, you know.

[736] Yeah, Marshall's the youngest and he's the craziest.

[737] And they used to clobber each other in the face.

[738] That apparently wasn't a rule in the Tuck household.

[739] So they were, yeah, constantly.

[740] And they were so close that it was like a battle royale.

[741] Wow.

[742] So you would go to the Tucks and just be like, holy shit.

[743] Yeah, you got to step back.

[744] They're talking around.

[745] Oh, yeah.

[746] They're killing each other.

[747] But anyways, at what point that you're watching movies that do you think, I think I want to try to do this?

[748] Really early on.

[749] It was, I can't really remember ever thinking I would or wanted to do anything else.

[750] But it was a long time until I shared it with anyone because it was kind of an embarrassing thing to think that's what we go.

[751] You know, it was probably Raiders of the Lost Art, which is when I was like nine years old.

[752] It was like, oh, I mean, why would you want to do anything but that?

[753] Yeah.

[754] That movie really blew my mind.

[755] Uh -huh.

[756] Just the comedy of it and the feelings in that movie.

[757] Yeah.

[758] I still watch it a couple times a year.

[759] Oh, it's incredible.

[760] It's incredible.

[761] It's both like it brings me joy and it brings me deep depression because it's so flawlessly made.

[762] And then you tell yourself, oh, I wonder if I had that amount of time and that that budget.

[763] in those actors, but I know in my heart, no, I couldn't do that.

[764] It's such a unique gift that he has.

[765] It's beautifully put together.

[766] Yeah, it's incredible.

[767] It's so fun.

[768] Every single, even, I mean, that movie is just, it doesn't stop.

[769] One of my favorite sequences is the fist fight with the airplane, the errant airplane that's kind of moving around.

[770] She's stuck up in the thing.

[771] The bald guy, who he clearly will never be.

[772] Yes.

[773] The gas is on fire.

[774] That's coming for them.

[775] There's a lot of things happening.

[776] Yeah.

[777] And he is getting his ass kicked.

[778] How is he going to get out of this?

[779] Uh -huh.

[780] The propeller kills the guy.

[781] That's taking care of.

[782] But she's stuck in the fucking thing.

[783] And the gas is, the gas is on fire.

[784] He's still got two things he needs to.

[785] Like, it's so great.

[786] Yeah.

[787] Stakes on stakes on stakes.

[788] Oh, that's great.

[789] So you, at what age do you express to your, do you say to your parents?

[790] Your parents are all teachers?

[791] Yeah, they're, wow, you really know this stuff.

[792] I made a rule with myself that I'd only know the beginning.

[793] And I'd force you to tell me. It's really nice.

[794] Yeah, they're both teachers.

[795] I remember the specific moment and it was when River Phoenix was nominated for running on empty, which I don't know the exact year is probably like 87.

[796] So I was in high school, I think, or junior high or something.

[797] And I remember it was either watching the Oscar.

[798] or something I was watching.

[799] I had my own.

[800] The only TV in the house was a five -inch black and white that I had in my room.

[801] But I remember watching it and telling my mom, like, I think I can do that.

[802] Mm -hmm.

[803] Because I was already, like, doing plays and stuff at school.

[804] In high school.

[805] Yeah.

[806] Or whenever this was.

[807] I, yeah.

[808] And I remember telling her, that's, I think I can really.

[809] win an academy award Well that is exactly how that story sounded by the way you thought both you could be as gorgeous as River Phoenix and as talented and win in Austin Mom I will look and act like him very shortly I am going to achieve all of that and what was her response immediately like yeah of course you can they were always really supportive but also having no idea what it entailed going and trying.

[810] Where are they from?

[811] Are they from California?

[812] They're from Santa Cruz, both of my parents, yeah.

[813] That is very peculiar to me. Yeah.

[814] So you're like second or third or fourth generation Santa Cruz.

[815] Yeah, they're both of their, you have logging in your history or something?

[816] My, my, my dad moved to Santa Cruz from Colorado.

[817] He's not from, he was like 12 when he moved.

[818] Okay.

[819] From Brush Creek, Colorado.

[820] His dad was a rancher.

[821] And they moved out to Santa Cruz to meet up with some other family out there because his dad was sick sold the ranch although we still have the industry there I mean I have to get in Colorado or Santa Cruz although we could get a Santa Cruz like board of tourism sponsor out of this yeah um as we keep it positive Santa Cruz my mom's side of the family Sicilian and so there was a lot of fish a lot of seafood industry up in the San Francisco so fishing or or trading in fish I believe trading in fish a I'm not mistaken.

[822] Brokering fish.

[823] Yes.

[824] And then her dad was a podiatrist in Santa Cruz.

[825] He was in the World War II as a podiatrist and then opened to practice there.

[826] But I think they started up in San Francisco.

[827] Okay.

[828] My dad's mother was a teacher and she moved to San Cruz and started working there.

[829] So they both ended up.

[830] My mother grew up there and my dad ended up there.

[831] Yeah.

[832] Okay.

[833] So your mom says you can do that.

[834] But again, she doesn't really have.

[835] any sense of that.

[836] But she, I assume, knows that college is next.

[837] You'll major in that.

[838] Did they try to talk you out of that?

[839] You know, again, it was, I can be an actor.

[840] It wasn't the Academy Award thing.

[841] No, no, we heard you loud and clear.

[842] You were definitely, it sounds ridiculous.

[843] Well, by the way, I was at home going, I think I could be Bert Reynolds, who was his biggest box office star seven out of 10 years in a row, never been duplicated.

[844] Is it true that in today's dollars, cannonball run would have made like $700 million or something like that?

[845] It was so successful.

[846] I have to imagine.

[847] The big, big success was the first smoking in the band at 77.

[848] Maybe that's the one.

[849] Yeah, and I think it was the third biggest movie of all of that year.

[850] And Jaws was that year as well.

[851] It made like 108 million and 77 on, again, these Monica Facts checks us, by the way.

[852] So at the end of this, she'll correct every erroneous thing we said.

[853] But it was on, you know, 700 screens or something.

[854] Not only didn't make 108 million, which is worth whatever now, it's on no screens.

[855] And, but it's on 700 screens for a year and a half.

[856] Yes.

[857] Yes, it probably ran and ran and ran.

[858] I remember going to see E .T. After it had been out for six months.

[859] Yes.

[860] The only movie that's done that in the recent history was maybe like, I feel like Avatar went and went and went for maybe almost a year.

[861] But other than that, it just doesn't happen now.

[862] No. But anyways, yeah, that's who I was trying to be, which is egotomaniacal to say the least.

[863] I was trying to be Harrison Ford.

[864] Like, you know.

[865] Yeah, it doesn't really matter.

[866] No. Yeah, it's really fun.

[867] In fact, the people I've interviewed so far to hear who their North Star was because none of us really end up anywhere near that.

[868] But in trying to do that, you can find your own lane, which is interesting.

[869] For sure.

[870] But you went to college and you - Well, I went to acting school.

[871] I, you know, my one real regret is I was so focused on, you know what, I'm just going to finish high school and I'm just going to go and, you know, be an actor.

[872] I had fantasies of NYU because I was really in the sports.

[873] Spike Lee, I dressed like him.

[874] I wore a New York Knicks hat and grew a goatee in high school.

[875] And directed plays with like really kind of impressionistic lighting like he used to do and like do the right thing and stuff.

[876] What's his signature move with a dolly?

[877] He does like a, well, a zoom, a reverse zoom and a pullout or something crazy.

[878] Yeah, that started after, that started with Mo Better Blues and you kind of do it.

[879] Student of Lee.

[880] I love it.

[881] Oh, yeah.

[882] I love.

[883] Oh, my God.

[884] Do you have a favorite Spike Lee joint?

[885] You know, do the right thing, of course, is his real masterpiece, and it's perfect.

[886] I haven't seen it in a while, but it is a perfect movie.

[887] I think that a sentimental favorite for me is Kruklin.

[888] But Malcolm X, I saw a few years ago.

[889] That is a fucking great movie.

[890] That is a great.

[891] Yeah, I loved it.

[892] And I didn't know anything about Malcolm X. When I saw it, I only had been given the kind of cultural take on him in my area, which was he, we like Martin Luther King.

[893] He's nonviolence.

[894] And Malcolm X is bad because he was violent.

[895] Of course, I was completely naive to the whole thing.

[896] And I saw the movie and it made me love him.

[897] So that is a real testament.

[898] Because I'm going, why are they making a movie about the guy who was violent?

[899] It was in, because culturally, remember the X hats and it was a whole thing.

[900] But watching it.

[901] White America was very scared.

[902] Yes.

[903] Yes.

[904] Yes.

[905] watching it 20 years later away from all of that.

[906] And just as a movie, it's impressive.

[907] Right.

[908] It's a really terrific movie.

[909] But I also, I loved Inside Man. That's one of my favorites.

[910] Yeah, that's a really cool movie for a heist movie, right?

[911] It's really good.

[912] And what is it about Spike Lee, do you think?

[913] Were you longing for some kind of, I don't know what the right word that's non -offensive is, but was there something exotic about that world that was so foreign to Santa Cruz that was appealing.

[914] Santa Cruz is very white.

[915] And did you like hip -hop?

[916] I was never that into hip -hop, although do the right thing got me into public enemy and got me way more into hip -hop than I was kind of opened my, open me up to that hip -hop to music, but also opened me up to, you know, black culture and and really kind of how, what black culture was in 1989 and how, you know, where, where they were at that.

[917] I mean, I think it's a really good kind of check on how people were feeling at that moment.

[918] Yeah.

[919] You know?

[920] Yeah.

[921] Because at that time, what I'm seeing in film and television, with the exception of a couple of great television shows that celebrated black culture, you're seeing a pretty one -dimensional take on it.

[922] And it's all crime.

[923] It's all this.

[924] But yeah, I remember watching do the right thing and feeling about it the way I felt about Paris, which is like, oh, this place is colorful.

[925] Like there is some life happening here.

[926] It's not sterile and it's messy, but it's, there's a ton of beauty in that.

[927] And yeah, it was pretty eye -opening.

[928] I think another thing about him that really kind of opened me up to and made me really start paying attention to filmmaking was like you said, it's a big colorful world.

[929] It's a really impressionistic world.

[930] And you get connected to these characters.

[931] They're really like, Giancolo Esposito's character is.

[932] big brash guy and Sal and John Totoro and those guys.

[933] Oh, Tatoro is.

[934] Oh, amazing.

[935] Richard Edson.

[936] But then also Spike.

[937] And is Sam, Samuel Jackson's in there?

[938] Samuel Jackson is the DJ.

[939] One of his first things.

[940] It's this big colorful world and you become connected.

[941] It's like almost like a, you know, traipsing through a kind of Disneyish world.

[942] It's really beautiful.

[943] And then it's upset.

[944] It gets really upsetting.

[945] And there's some big questions.

[946] It's like a Basquiat, the whole thing.

[947] Yeah.

[948] It's a great, great movie.

[949] And did you feel like I had this?

[950] So I lived on the perimeter of Detroit and then I moved to downtown Detroit to a certain point.

[951] And I just had this total affinity for that culture.

[952] Right or wrong, I don't know, but I had an affinity.

[953] And then I also had this a little bit of sadness that I was never going to be involved in that.

[954] Like you're never going to be involved in the strength.

[955] of that?

[956] Not even the struggle just like that, the juge of that life, the color you're talking about, the vibrancy, all that the characters, the like over the top expressive, all these things, I just thought, well, hmm, that's frustrating.

[957] I will never be, you know, included in that or embraced in that.

[958] Yes.

[959] And then to a fault, I think I've tried to be a part in ways that maybe you know we're a part of what a part of like that culture black culture yeah i mean i never like say i didn't have a malcolm x hat i did uh you did and i had the africa the leather africa oh wow okay no i went for it okay good good good this is great if i got nothing else out of you than that you had that i was uh what was that what was that clothing company tricolor or something that that had it was the three stripes the i don't know i'm talking about but i know Spike Lee had a company, 40 acres in a mule.

[960] Right.

[961] And they even had a shop on Melrose.

[962] They did.

[963] And I went into it.

[964] Yeah, it was pretty close to the groundlings.

[965] Yes.

[966] Yeah, like in between rehearsal, I would like wander down that street.

[967] Yeah.

[968] I went in there.

[969] It was, and I was always depressed.

[970] It was never full.

[971] Yeah.

[972] Because again, you have this idea of all this stuff, right?

[973] When you're on the outside, I'm in Michigan.

[974] You're in Santa Cruz.

[975] Yeah.

[976] Like to me, once you're Spike Lee, everything is downhill from there.

[977] And I mean downhill, like, you can put it neutral and global.

[978] lied into everything.

[979] So my assumption is if he starts a store, boy, there's a line out of the tour.

[980] And then I walk in there, I'm like, oh, it's subject to all the realities of any retail store.

[981] There's nothing's going to guarantee.

[982] There's only so much demand for a 40 acres in a mule baseball hat.

[983] Yes, yes.

[984] And the people who bought him probably bought them and that was, whatever.

[985] Yeah.

[986] I never had enough money to buy one.

[987] I wanted one.

[988] You wanted one.

[989] This would be a great.

[990] See, if I was Jimmy Kim, our mutual friend, I would store this in my head.

[991] And in this Christmas, you'd get, I would find on eBay a sweatshirt and a hat and I would get it for you.

[992] But I will forget in three hours.

[993] That is a, that is a Kimmel move.

[994] Isn't it?

[995] Oh, my God.

[996] He's almost aggressively generous.

[997] I told him that.

[998] It's like, there's a point where it's just, I feel bad after the gifts.

[999] Oh, yeah.

[1000] So thoughtful.

[1001] So incredibly thoughtful.

[1002] It's amazing.

[1003] It can leave you feeling nothing but less than.

[1004] Oh.

[1005] Inevitably.

[1006] Every single time.

[1007] Okay, so you wanted to go to NYU, but you didn't go to NYU, right?

[1008] No, I didn't have the grades.

[1009] That's what I was saying is that my regret is really not getting the grades in high school.

[1010] If I wanted to go to NYU.

[1011] I feel like that would have been a really great scene for you.

[1012] What's that?

[1013] From what I know about you, just New York, to be able to leave Santa Cruz and go to New York City.

[1014] Because Spike Lee used to publish a journal with each of his films, a journal he took throughout the making of the films.

[1015] And she's got to have it.

[1016] and school days it was a lot of NYU in there because that's where he went to school so it was like NYU film school I didn't have the grades so I would have had to like go to junior college and so I went to an acting school that didn't require a GPA yeah down here in LA have you met Spike Lee no oh you haven't no god I feel like we should make this happen well I would yeah I mean to my knowledge you would only need to buy a ticket at a Knicks game maybe so yeah Maybe that's the way to do it.

[1017] Another thing I would do if I were Camel.

[1018] I figure out what his season tickets are and I'd buy you the seat next to it the next time you're in New York.

[1019] Well, when Kristen hosted Kimmel, she surprised you with the human.

[1020] That was.

[1021] Who was it?

[1022] Oh, yeah, Mark Camel, right?

[1023] That was really a moment.

[1024] Was that a surreal moment for you?

[1025] Truly.

[1026] I mean, that's one of those moments where you don't know.

[1027] You know when you're truly surprised.

[1028] Uh -huh.

[1029] And you question everything.

[1030] in a split second time, time continuum.

[1031] Yeah, it was pretty amazing.

[1032] Yeah, and I'm sure you have the same thing I do, which is you have this crazy privilege of meeting a ton of these people that you grew up idolizing and whatnot.

[1033] But quickly you realize they're all people and they had to brush their teeth and they're watching their diet and you know, the work of life is still there for them and it just gets a little less exciting.

[1034] So the few experiences I've had that delivered in what I thought the 12 -year -old me would be like was getting to be on Letterman the first time.

[1035] And I really, it was just in my head going, stop smiling.

[1036] Like plug in here.

[1037] It's not the time for this because I was just, it was beyond surreal to me. And to be a foot from his fucking face that I had stared at.

[1038] At that point, thousands of hours.

[1039] Yeah.

[1040] And fantasize about him interviewing me. And all of a sudden, and then when you get in those situations and I wonder if when you were in the Mark Hamel situation, you got to really put your ego in reins.

[1041] Because for me, I start going, wait.

[1042] Have I willed this whole thing?

[1043] Is that how life works?

[1044] Is this the reality?

[1045] Did I somehow make this, am I the recipient of a ton of good luck?

[1046] Or did I, did I force this to happen?

[1047] It's just very confusing, right?

[1048] You want to be able to enjoy it and experience it.

[1049] And yet also reign in your ego for me, that's the problem.

[1050] Or I'll start thinking that I've like pulled the right levers in the universe.

[1051] Yeah, the Letterman thing was the same for me. But that's different because you're on there to, you want you, you can't believe it's happening.

[1052] But you also, you're like, I have to put that aside because I have to try and do a good job on here.

[1053] I got a job to do, yeah.

[1054] Yeah, I want to be funny or I want him to think, want to have me back.

[1055] Of course, yeah.

[1056] But yeah, Letterman was the same for me. It was literally half of why I wanted to do this in the first place was to sit on his.

[1057] Did you, did you?

[1058] Don't worry.

[1059] That's just the house next door to us being raised.

[1060] Is that how we say it?

[1061] Did you, did you used to sit on a couch and pretend you were, were there with Letterman when you were like a kid?

[1062] I wouldn't act out like the space work of it.

[1063] It was just mostly while I was brushing my hair in the mirror in high school.

[1064] I would like think of a question he'd ask me and then I think of a really funny response to it.

[1065] And yeah, it was a, it was a big preoccupation of mine.

[1066] Again, and at that time, I had no desire per se to be an actor.

[1067] So I'm not quite sure what I thought he was going to interview me about.

[1068] Right, right.

[1069] It was probably, I probably was more focused on being a race car driver and I thought maybe I'll win some I knew I wanted to talk to him and have him ask me questions.

[1070] Because that was a sign not only of success, but of a particular kind of that you, not only did you achieve something, but you had done something else right to earn that spot next to David Letterman.

[1071] That's true, because you can be an actor who's working and that doesn't necessarily mean you're, in my case, the weird reason I got to be, because I got on very early while punk was airing.

[1072] Oh, cool.

[1073] I shouldn't have been a guest on the show, but I had also done two episodes of Bonnie Hunt's show, and I played two different characters, like a week apart.

[1074] Wait, her talk show?

[1075] She had a sitcom.

[1076] Right.

[1077] Bonnie Hunt had a sitcom, and I played two drastically, I played a video director in one episode, and then just two weeks later I played a plastic surgeon, which was great about her show.

[1078] It just didn't matter.

[1079] And he got a bang out of that, and he liked the plastic surgery episode and said, I want to have this kid up.

[1080] So it was just really weird dumb luck that all that happened.

[1081] I couldn't have got on just from being on punk.

[1082] All these other stars had to align.

[1083] He was a huge fan of Bonnie Hunt.

[1084] They were friends.

[1085] So he was into, that's even cool.

[1086] He was into what you did.

[1087] Yes.

[1088] And in fact, like, the fact that I was on this show, Punked, that was a little bit of a phenomenon.

[1089] But again, not on his radar.

[1090] He didn't even know about that nor care about it.

[1091] The interview had nothing to do with Punk.

[1092] It was all about an episode that aired six months before.

[1093] There was really nothing to promote.

[1094] that's really cool yeah so again a whole bunch of serendipity all ending up really cool yeah so during acting school did you quickly get an agent and start auditioning in in in no it was in pasadena and i didn't have a car or anything so hollywood was like may as well have been you know in new york city yeah like i i was just there doing that and then when i was a two -year school and i graduated and then moved here and would I be right in assuming that you were aiming initially to be a dramatic actor yes right for sure obviously if you're you're in love with river phoenix yeah you're thinking yeah I was very serious he's one of the first guy I was obsessed with River Phoenix yes like he's like again I wasn't super into movies in in in the like the movie making aspect but he was one of the few people that I'd see any movie he was in or I rent any movie like him and Nicholas Cage yeah and a couple people I would just see anything like my own private Idaho I wouldn't wasn't necessarily into those type of movies but because river Phoenix was in it I had to see it yeah yeah I think stand by me was my real where you found love with them yeah and that movie really because I was that age of those guys when that right came out did you feel like an outcast did you feel like they were telling your story because I was that was during that, like, chubby face.

[1095] You were Jerry O 'Connell.

[1096] You were Jerry O 'Connell's character.

[1097] And, uh, and having like a couple tight friends, but not really being a part of any social strata at school.

[1098] Uh -huh.

[1099] You know.

[1100] So that movie was a big, a big deal.

[1101] And it's, you know, it's a great movie.

[1102] And you went to that college completely by yourself.

[1103] You didn't go with a friend, right?

[1104] Yeah.

[1105] Yeah.

[1106] Did you make friends there quickly?

[1107] I did.

[1108] You did.

[1109] Yeah.

[1110] It was, it was great.

[1111] It was really fun.

[1112] And, and I, you found your tribe, yeah.

[1113] Which people can do on the internet now, but we couldn't do.

[1114] I don't know if people realized that.

[1115] You had to actually go and fend for yourself.

[1116] You had to stand at IGA at the grocery store and just hope you saw another kid with an exploited t -shirt on.

[1117] Yeah.

[1118] But you weren't going to see that kid.

[1119] It was hard.

[1120] It was hard to do that.

[1121] So now you're at an acting school and these are all people with a similar passion and you're.

[1122] Yeah.

[1123] Maybe suffice to say nerdy.

[1124] Yeah, I guess so.

[1125] But they're, again, at acting school, it's like, oh, these people are all.

[1126] nerds about they're all into this stuff like I don't have to feel weird about any of this anymore is it's great right it's great yeah um and so I kind of dove in and really excelled there and did well and really uh worked my ass off just doing doing plays and doing plays and acting and there was a dance movement class there's voice and diction it's a whole thing yeah and it was great.

[1127] I loved all of it.

[1128] I just soaked it all up.

[1129] You weren't embarrassed when you were doing these exercises like, now act like a gorilla.

[1130] No, it was all about.

[1131] Someone stole your banana.

[1132] No, I, you know, all that stuff.

[1133] It's embarrassing when you're doing it in high school and there's the jock that's taking acting class for credits or whatever.

[1134] Yeah.

[1135] But there it's like you're all trying to find the banana better than that.

[1136] That's the competition.

[1137] Right, right.

[1138] So I was able to to kind of let my freak flag fly, I guess, a little bit and kind of indulge in...

[1139] And did you do any comedy while you were there?

[1140] Did you do any comedic plays or...

[1141] Yeah.

[1142] And, you know, I was really into comedy as a kid, too.

[1143] I don't know why I never...

[1144] Like, if I had it to do over again, I would have gone.

[1145] And after school, I would have gone and tried to, you know, do groundlings like you did.

[1146] Uh -huh.

[1147] Or UCB or something.

[1148] Or UCB or something like that.

[1149] Um, but I mean, it wasn't even around yet.

[1150] It was so long ago, but something like that.

[1151] I think that's a real, talk about finding your tribe.

[1152] Like that is a, oh, not only a great groundlings at UCB, those aren't just great places, but the people that are there are just lovely and they're all.

[1153] We were all the freak in our town and we found each other.

[1154] Yeah.

[1155] It was pretty exciting.

[1156] And it was, as you say, it was really competitive, which was healthy, I think, because the groundlings in particular, the, the workload was great if you wanted to have success there.

[1157] You had to write six sketches a week and put them up on Wednesday.

[1158] And then, you know, if you were super lucky, too, got under the show on Sunday.

[1159] And you just had to be really prolific.

[1160] And it did teach, above all things, just a discipline that you were going to have to have if you wanted to do this.

[1161] And which is great because I think when they teach you that discipline at school, I was also going to college.

[1162] It didn't seem to apply to anything.

[1163] I thought, why do I have to write these six -page papers?

[1164] I'll never do this in real life or whatever.

[1165] But when you have to perform it in front of an audience.

[1166] Yes.

[1167] Like, yeah, that's real.

[1168] I have to make this.

[1169] I have to make something of this.

[1170] And the bug stops at you.

[1171] Like you're saying with your show, there's really no one to point the finger at.

[1172] And it's a great way to be able to get honest with yourself in a hurry.

[1173] Yeah.

[1174] Because as I've said a bunch, all six sketches I put up every single week for a year, I thought were equally great.

[1175] Yeah.

[1176] And as it turns out on a stage, about 25 % of the stuff, I think, sure is great is broadly appealing sure right but you don't know no they all are the same to me see i think that's a key to to it that's really great that you were forced to create that much that volume every week that is that's huge yeah and some people didn't you know some people were so gifted some some some people were so good at impersonations and characters that they they could have a great show just by getting cast in other people's stuff i wasn't that great of a performer.

[1177] I was like a fine performer.

[1178] So I really had to generate my own shit if I wanted to be on stage.

[1179] And then also I recognize, oh, no one's making video stuff.

[1180] You know, there's TVs in the corners of this audience for the theater.

[1181] And no one's really doing that.

[1182] So I'm going to do that because no one's doing it yet.

[1183] And then I could sneak in a couple more sketches that were helpful while we were changing outfits and whatnot.

[1184] And then I kind of got into like shooting stuff and editing stuff and all with the goal selfishly of just getting more airtime there.

[1185] Yeah, yeah.

[1186] But so grateful that's what you want to get that's what that's what you're doing there yeah go for it but you know what this this theme has come up a few times already which is um i think is really i hesitate and saying advice but to have flexibility with your identity is super beneficial in this pursuit right because you were going to school to be river phoenix yeah and then you found maybe i'm wrong i don't really know this is from the outside looking in you found the bulk of your success in doing comedy right and And you have to be open to that.

[1187] Yeah.

[1188] Although for me, it took like 15 years because it wasn't until stepbrothers that I got just as a flu.

[1189] Total fluke that I entered that comedy world.

[1190] You know, I didn't even know that I could do it.

[1191] I didn't even know if I could improvise or not.

[1192] As it turns out at the time, I really couldn't and just had to figure it out on set.

[1193] But that was when I was like, oh, my God, this is fun.

[1194] Yes.

[1195] And what makes you such a great comedian, in my opinion, is you're approaching it like a dramatic actor, which is my favorite kind of comedy.

[1196] But by the way, this is where our past cross, I don't know if I've ever brought this up to you, but Step Brothers, do you know this about us?

[1197] Uh -uh.

[1198] So I had signed with a manager.

[1199] I had never had one, and I signed with one that was great with the hopes that I could be put in these other comedies with actors I loved like Will Farrell.

[1200] Yeah.

[1201] And so one that seemed like a slam dunk was going to be Step Brothers.

[1202] And I went met on it and I auditioned for it.

[1203] And I thought, wow, I have ever.

[1204] a really good chance at this.

[1205] And then you got it.

[1206] Oh, man. And I didn't know who you were at that point.

[1207] And so I start, of course, by going, who the fuck's Adam Scott?

[1208] I hate Adam Scott.

[1209] I hope he dies.

[1210] Why'd I get this manager?

[1211] All kinds of thoughts.

[1212] And then I go and see Step, Brother.

[1213] And this is one of the, this has happened a few times in my life where I go in, I'm expecting to point out everything you did wrong and I hate you and they really shit the bet on this casting choice.

[1214] And I, within three sentences.

[1215] is I love you.

[1216] And I go, oh my God, this guy is so much better than I would have been in this role.

[1217] And they made the right decision and none of it had anything to do with me. And like, thank God they got this guy.

[1218] Right.

[1219] Are you curious about what the other one was?

[1220] The other what?

[1221] The other actor who got a job over me. Please, yeah.

[1222] I have dozens of them.

[1223] Okay, good.

[1224] So Wanted was going to go to, who was in it.

[1225] James McAvoy?

[1226] James McAvoy.

[1227] Right.

[1228] So he was going to do the movie and then he had some kind of a scheduling thing and then he was not going to do the movie.

[1229] So I met with Timor, the guy who, who directed it.

[1230] He really liked me. We actually business affairs called.

[1231] I am about to do wanted, which is blowing my mind because I'm not on a level to get that kind of movie.

[1232] But for whatever reason, Timor liked me, it is what a crazy opportunity it was going to be for me. And then his schedule then opened up somehow and then they had to say, sorry, James is now available.

[1233] At this point, I don't know who James McAvoy is.

[1234] I haven't even looked up a picture of him.

[1235] I just know that this is my arch nemesis.

[1236] And then I go see the Africa movie.

[1237] A Last King of Scotland.

[1238] I'm watching Last King of Scotland I don't know that that's James McAvoy and I must lean over 15 times to the person I'm seeing a movie with going this guy is a revelation this guy's a revelation I actually get my phone out because I'm like I'm going to write down his name when the credits come up so I can see everything he's in and then it comes up and I start typing James McAvoy and I'm like oh my goodness I wouldn't hire 10 of me to replace this guy like again they did they made the right decision and he's one of my face Favorite actor is alive.

[1239] He's great.

[1240] Can you think of one that you really were like?

[1241] Well, you know, funny enough, I remember without a paddle coming out and being like, that is like the kind of comedy that they don't make anymore.

[1242] And Dax Shepard does not deserve to be in a big comedy movie like this yet.

[1243] Oh, sure, sure.

[1244] Oh, and I didn't.

[1245] He hasn't been around as long as I have.

[1246] doing guest spots on NYPD Blue for 15 years or whatever.

[1247] And then I saw it and it was a similar thing.

[1248] It's like, oh, well, I would never be able to do that.

[1249] Like, that's hilarious.

[1250] But then also I auditioned for Zathura.

[1251] Oh, you did.

[1252] And because Favreau and I, back in like 93, 94, 95, lived in the same kind of shithole building on Franklin Avenue.

[1253] He was a couple floors above me. In fact, there's an establishing shot of that building in Swingers.

[1254] And you can see a bed sheet in the window, which is my curtain.

[1255] Oh, really?

[1256] So I kind of knew him back then.

[1257] And so I was like, all right, I'm going to go audition for John for this role.

[1258] My neighbor.

[1259] Yeah.

[1260] And we'll talk about the good old days.

[1261] And then I'll get this awesome part in Zathura.

[1262] And then you got it.

[1263] Yeah, I got it.

[1264] But again, I would never have been able to pull that off like you did.

[1265] Actually, that movie's terrific.

[1266] It's a great movie.

[1267] It's weirdly, it's probably the best film I'm in.

[1268] Like, that could potentially like three decades from now be a really, I mean.

[1269] It's so good.

[1270] Yeah.

[1271] It's so fun.

[1272] It was very misleading to me because I had been in Without a Paddle, which, again, I've said this before.

[1273] I couldn't be more grateful for that movie so don't get me wrong.

[1274] A, as you point out I did not deserve that.

[1275] I mean in my mind a little bit of it did because I had been in L .A. for 10 years trying but yeah, just based on a reality show.

[1276] There is no deserve and not deserve.

[1277] That's just something jealous actors.

[1278] Yeah, but it occurred to me at the time like, wow, they don't give out lead roles and movies to people have been on 10 up, eight episodes of a fucking MTV show.

[1279] So I knew that, but when we got there, we took it incredibly serious.

[1280] I mean, it's very endearing how serious we took it.

[1281] We, thought, and I had Seth on and we talked about it, we thought we were making diner in the woods.

[1282] As embarrassing as that is.

[1283] And then when we saw it, we realized, oh, this skews much younger, which by the way, they were right to do.

[1284] So it was good they didn't let us edit the movie.

[1285] But that movie made a ton of money for very little money.

[1286] And that was my only experience in movies so far.

[1287] And then I go do Zethora, and I see that movie and I'm like, holy fuck, opposite experience.

[1288] It's 20 times better than I could have ever known by being on set with the effects and everything, the way John did it.

[1289] Now I start my ego goes bananas and I'm like, well, if without a paddle made this amount and it's that good of a movie, then Zathura is going to make a couple billion dollars.

[1290] And I am then expecting that to happen.

[1291] And then as luck just has it, it doesn't make any money.

[1292] You never know.

[1293] It's so crazy.

[1294] It's so weird.

[1295] You finally stop trying to figure it out, which is the freedom eventually that you get to.

[1296] Yeah.

[1297] But that's, I had no idea that we cross.

[1298] But then when I was reading about you before you got here.

[1299] You and I were in the same movie really early on that I had no idea about.

[1300] We were both in a movie called Hairshirt.

[1301] That was originally, yes, but it was then called Too Smooth when it was released.

[1302] Is that the same?

[1303] Nate produced it.

[1304] Yes.

[1305] Were you in that movie?

[1306] I was.

[1307] So your role is something great like guy at the bar or something.

[1308] And my role is vomiteer at a party.

[1309] That's my first credit.

[1310] I know the guy ever saw the whole movie.

[1311] Yeah.

[1312] Dean Perist Stavopoulos.

[1313] That's right.

[1314] I went to acting school with him.

[1315] Oh, you did in Pasadena?

[1316] Yeah.

[1317] Yes, Dean Paris.

[1318] I think he's dropped the Gopolis or maybe he brought it back, but there was a period where he...

[1319] Dean Paris.

[1320] Yes.

[1321] When I was in school with him, it was just Dean Paris.

[1322] Oh, then he brought it back.

[1323] Brought it back.

[1324] Yeah.

[1325] And maybe it's gone now.

[1326] I haven't seen him in a while.

[1327] He's a terrific guy.

[1328] Yes.

[1329] So yes, you were in that and I was in that.

[1330] That's so funny.

[1331] Yes.

[1332] And I had no idea there's a third thing.

[1333] And I couldn't have known the without a paddle thing.

[1334] Without a paddle, that movie's terrific.

[1335] There's a real story.

[1336] there.

[1337] It's really about the friendship.

[1338] And I love that they were trying to, they were doing that in one of those big movies.

[1339] Because this is pre -hangover.

[1340] Pre -old school.

[1341] Yeah.

[1342] Yeah.

[1343] And now, again, now I'm, now I'm on the way other side of it, which is I'm now tried to make movies.

[1344] And now I can better appreciate what Brill accomplished in that movie.

[1345] And I also can recognize how movies benefit or fail based on chemistry, which you just can't, you can't figure it out.

[1346] Like, you either hit the lottery or you don't.

[1347] And then by some luck, the three of us just fucking loved each other.

[1348] I mean, we were having every bit as much fun in real life as the characters in the movie were.

[1349] And we were as in love.

[1350] And that just, you just don't know if you're going to get that.

[1351] So all those things now I recognize like, wow, that was one of the better experiences I've ever had and probably will be.

[1352] Yeah.

[1353] That's a, that's a lucky, lucky situation.

[1354] So when you do stepbrothers and it comes out and makes a bazillion dollars, and then you're now, I'm assuming, getting thought of a lot more for comedies.

[1355] Sort of.

[1356] I mean, Step Brothers is a weird thing.

[1357] Like, it came out and it made a lot of money, but it was also like Tropic Thunder and Pineapple Express came out on both, on either side of it.

[1358] Right.

[1359] It was a...

[1360] And it got a little...

[1361] It didn't, I didn't really get the effect or a boost or anything from Stepbrothers until it kind of marinated in the culture a little longer, like home video, cable.

[1362] That's when it really took hold.

[1363] And that's a highly rewatchable movie.

[1364] Yeah.

[1365] Which is also hard to predict.

[1366] Yes.

[1367] Some movies just have a great, great shelf life.

[1368] Yeah.

[1369] And I just showed to my kids recently.

[1370] I hadn't seen it in years.

[1371] And it is just so funny and just really great filmmaking, too.

[1372] I mean, obviously, McKay is a great filmmaker.

[1373] but also I realized this is really inappropriate it's it's it's I should not be showing to a nine and 11 year old yeah I've forgotten how just how profoundly dirty it is uh it's it's it's great though were you um what kind of feelings did you have while you're watching it with your kids was it embarrassing you or were you just having a moment of like ooh this it was it was it was fun because it was it was it was fun for them to see me be uh an asshole mess hole like that.

[1374] Yeah, because I've seen you with your children.

[1375] You're just generally a very kind, nice, wonderful dad.

[1376] Thank you.

[1377] Yeah.

[1378] So they must get a bang.

[1379] They were like, Dad, because I say a lot of crazy stuff.

[1380] You're so, so, so good.

[1381] I mean, honestly, and I am the biggest Will Ferrell fan.

[1382] You were by far my favorite part of that movie because it's the least expected thing.

[1383] It was so great.

[1384] Yeah, I'm immensely proud to be to be in that because that's a movie I would go see and see a hundred times.

[1385] Yeah.

[1386] And then a little, like inside gossip, you know, a lot of people in this town have bad reputations and they're kind of deserve.

[1387] You invariably work with a ton of assholes.

[1388] But Will Farrell is the guy that you want him to be.

[1389] He's a perfect fucking human being.

[1390] He parties, but not too much.

[1391] You know, everything is just right in the moderate bullseye.

[1392] He's just a kind person and he's generous as hell, right?

[1393] Very curious.

[1394] You know, wants to know about you.

[1395] Like he really is a lovely regular dude.

[1396] Yep.

[1397] And just like really one of the funniest guys that have ever been in movies.

[1398] Like he's really like he's like belly laughs always.

[1399] For me too.

[1400] And a part of his recipe that people don't understand is what we were talking about is he is a prolific content creator.

[1401] So he's not just there to say your lines.

[1402] He's not reliant on that.

[1403] He is so he's you know 60 % of his skill set is a writer, you know, whether he's taking pen to paper or not, which is coming up with stuff, yeah, making stuff.

[1404] So, um, I want to talk about the fact that you, you, when do you decide you want to create content and not just act?

[1405] Yeah.

[1406] Early or does that happen post stepbrothers or what?

[1407] Yeah, it happens after that because I kind of start because and then right, when stepbrothers comes out, I start doing party down with Kristen was part of that early on and, and, uh, and, and, and, and And then she came back in season two as well, which was awesome.

[1408] So doing that with that group of people and getting really close with Marino and Martin Star, Lizzie, just that whole group.

[1409] Ryan Hanson.

[1410] Ryan, I just ran into Ryan.

[1411] You know, he's my favorite person, yeah, planet Earth.

[1412] Just the loveliest and the funniest.

[1413] Yes.

[1414] He's a source of life.

[1415] So funny.

[1416] Yes.

[1417] So we got really tight all of us.

[1418] And it was kind of like.

[1419] And that was largely improvised.

[1420] right?

[1421] No. Oh, it's not?

[1422] No. Oh, barely at all.

[1423] Oh, okay.

[1424] John Enbaum and Dan Etheridge and Rob Thomas really wrote, John Enbaum wrote the bulk of it, but those guys really were great.

[1425] But it was kind of like, we never expected anyone to watch it because it was on stars.

[1426] And at the time, it really did matter where you were because people weren't streaming yet.

[1427] And so we just figured we're doing this for ourselves.

[1428] So there's something about that where it was like, this just feels good.

[1429] I don't give a shit if anyone sees this.

[1430] That's nice.

[1431] So let's, yeah, so it kind of, let's just make stuff.

[1432] Well, at that point you really, the sign of successes is if you make the thing you wanted to watch, basically, right?

[1433] Because you're not in it for, your expectations are no one to watch this.

[1434] Yeah.

[1435] So it had better, it had better make you guys happy.

[1436] Yeah.

[1437] And I think also getting into Paul Shear and seeing just how much output that guy has.

[1438] And it was really inspiring to me. I don't even know if I ever told him that, but that really was a, because we did.

[1439] Piranha to get, like in between seasons I'm party down, I went and did Piranha 3D in Lake Havasu in Arizona and Paul Shear and Jerry O 'Connell were in that.

[1440] And so just getting to know Paul and watching just how busy he was with stuff that he was creating, just making was a real eye -opener.

[1441] And so I'm still not, you know, making stuff at the level that I want to be or should be.

[1442] it really is the most satisfying thing.

[1443] Is the first thing these, the title sequences?

[1444] Yeah, that was the first thing.

[1445] So this is brilliant if you guys haven't seen it.

[1446] What's it called?

[1447] The greatest event in television history.

[1448] And where do people find it?

[1449] It's on YouTube.

[1450] I mean, it's an adult swim.

[1451] It was on adult swim.

[1452] But now they're all on YouTube.

[1453] There are four episodes where we recreate opening credit sequences from television shows from the 80s and a mock documentary about the making of.

[1454] Yeah.

[1455] And they're incredibly accurate.

[1456] They're so funny because they're so well executed.

[1457] Yeah.

[1458] We went to a lot of the original locations, tried to find as much original wardrobe and cars.

[1459] And what I totally respected about it too is that it existed purely for the laugh that you're going to get in that moment, right?

[1460] Because it was an incredible undertaking, I have to imagine.

[1461] It was probably way more work than you were expecting, right?

[1462] And it probably cost a bit to do that.

[1463] And then ultimately you don't really have anything that's super sustainable.

[1464] And I love that.

[1465] That makes me so fucking happy.

[1466] It's pointless.

[1467] Yes, it's pointless.

[1468] And when something slides through the cracks like that, and I can recognize, oh, this is just someone's love for this thing.

[1469] It's wonderful.

[1470] It's really incredible.

[1471] We didn't make any money doing it.

[1472] Of course not.

[1473] Obviously not.

[1474] Adult Swim gave us a decent budget to do something that's, again, pointless and stupid, but not a ton.

[1475] Right, right.

[1476] I'm sure it was hard as hell.

[1477] Yeah, it was really hard.

[1478] And so we stopped doing it because it was so difficult and stressful.

[1479] And then at the end of it, what do you have?

[1480] How much content do you have 15 minutes?

[1481] Each one, one of them is like nine minutes long.

[1482] Another one's like 19 minutes long.

[1483] They're all kind of different, but none are over like 19, 20 minutes.

[1484] Right.

[1485] So at the end, you don't have any model that it's going to fit into, right?

[1486] No, no, no, no. You can't sell it.

[1487] as a thing.

[1488] I absolutely love that.

[1489] Yeah.

[1490] But I imagine that your success in executing that, then opens up the door for more things.

[1491] Yeah.

[1492] You know, directing those and Paul Scheer and I kind of wrote them together.

[1493] Paul wrote the first one, the Simon and Simon one.

[1494] Oh, God.

[1495] And then we did it together.

[1496] And that way I learned a lot from him.

[1497] And Paul also, he had the idea to like have a host.

[1498] So we, so it was like, Oh my God, that's incredible.

[1499] So I got Jeff Probst to come and be the fake host of it.

[1500] So it all kind of came together.

[1501] Yeah.

[1502] And it was really, really fun.

[1503] And like, as you know, directing something and making something is so satisfying.

[1504] You're way more tired than you've ever been, but it feels great.

[1505] Well, and I think the best way I can describe it is when I'm on a set as an actor, after about eight hours, I'm ready to get out of there.

[1506] Yeah.

[1507] You know, it just doesn't hold my attention much longer.

[1508] But when you're there as a director, you are wishing.

[1509] you could have started earlier and you're mad when the sun's going down.

[1510] You could just do it if they let you, you could do it for 36 hours straight and you want to keep going.

[1511] Yes.

[1512] You never get off your feet.

[1513] There's no time in your trailer.

[1514] Right.

[1515] You know, watching you Netflix or whatever.

[1516] Yeah, and Chips, they towed a trailer all around the city and I never ever got in it.

[1517] Yeah, would change on set and get my makeup done on set.

[1518] Yeah.

[1519] It's great.

[1520] Nothing more fun than that.

[1521] It's truly.

[1522] Yeah, it's so engaging.

[1523] I compare it to being on cocaine.

[1524] Uh -huh.

[1525] I just, that's the most awake.

[1526] my brain ever feels.

[1527] There really is adrenaline from the moment you wake up when you're directing something.

[1528] Oh yeah.

[1529] To the moment you go to sleep.

[1530] Yeah.

[1531] The stakes are so high.

[1532] Oh my God.

[1533] The stakes are high.

[1534] And I was directing a recreation of a, of existing context.

[1535] I can't even imagine doing a studio movie like you did.

[1536] Right.

[1537] But as much as you think you've thought of every problem.

[1538] And certainly you have an answer for a lot of them.

[1539] But there are many, many problems arising throughout the day that you haven't thought of.

[1540] So you've got to now commit that brain power to that problem and and uh and that's its own thing about being being able to be humble enough to acknowledge you didn't think of that and what how that reflects in front of your crew there's just so much going on yeah it's wonderful yeah so after that i wanted to find a movie to direct and and it's been a while and i just haven't found that thing it's Naomi and i started a company together and we've produced three movies yeah you've had some sundance yeah we've all three of them have been to Sundance the overnight and other people Chris Kelly directed that one Patrick Bryce directed the overnight and then fun mom dinner so we had three movies and that's incredibly satisfying too we're really hands -on producers were there on set every day and it's really satisfying and having this company with Naomi is great we also produce ghosted as well right and how do you juggle there's two things I want to ask you about because you again, this is all from the outside.

[1541] You could be a mess.

[1542] Yeah.

[1543] But you do seem like one of the people I know in this business who is very authentic.

[1544] You take time to do things that you just love.

[1545] Again, your title sequencing.

[1546] There's no point to that.

[1547] Right.

[1548] So I have so much respect for that.

[1549] You're just universally loved.

[1550] Every single person I know really, really likes you.

[1551] You're always available when we've called you to help with stuff, like getting someone elected or any kind of charity you're there.

[1552] It's all quite incredible.

[1553] Tell me about your ego in this experience of being an actor, because it's very dicey, right?

[1554] Yeah.

[1555] How, have there been times where you were full of yourself?

[1556] Have there were times where you have no faith in yourself, no belief in yourself?

[1557] How do you ride that wave?

[1558] It's a thing that I always kind of have.

[1559] I'm still figuring out.

[1560] And I have, it is a, it's a dicey relationship that I have with, with myself.

[1561] I mean, you know, Naomi's always kind of, there is a lot, when you said earlier the thing about kind of self -loathing and I have a, you know, I have a real, so it's kind of a stop gap for me as the sort of more times than not I'm cringing after I have an interaction with someone or I finish a day at work or, you know, I just am, uh, do not always.

[1562] have the highest opinion of, of myself.

[1563] And I think that's, uh, that's, at this age, it should be kind of moving on from that.

[1564] But that's something that I'm always battling, trying to work on in battle.

[1565] Yeah.

[1566] And I, you know, started therapy like, you know, I think also Parks and Rec kind of, I had an experience sort of being, uh, a recognizable person.

[1567] Right.

[1568] consistently before, and that really changed my life in a very slow.

[1569] It was kind of like the frog in the water.

[1570] It happened slowly for me over a long period of time, but then all of a sudden I was, you know, it just felt like there was a disease on my face.

[1571] Right, right, yeah.

[1572] People just kind of, you can feel eyes on you, you know, that feeling?

[1573] Well, in a very, very primitive sense, right?

[1574] us being primates.

[1575] Primates don't stare at other primates.

[1576] If they do, and then that primate turns and acknowledges, I see you looking at me, you either have to submit, you know, or it's go time.

[1577] It's a very unnerving, just the reptilian part of your brain has a very hard time digesting that whole experience, right?

[1578] And it is a weird stupid dichotomy because, of course, that is a symbol that you've achieved something.

[1579] Yes.

[1580] So part of you is very grateful for it.

[1581] And then part of you just on an animalistic level is I got these little kids and you're all aware of us and I feel like I'm not protecting them.

[1582] It's just all dicey, right?

[1583] Yes.

[1584] And I think also if you have deep down a low opinion of yourself, right, and the opinion you're going to have of a person who comes up to you thinking you're great is even lower than the one.

[1585] Well, that's a great point.

[1586] So that's an unhealthy.

[1587] You're not worthy of any kind of praise.

[1588] So only a real bottom feeder would like you.

[1589] Exactly.

[1590] Exactly.

[1591] Even though I'm a huge fan of yours, you know exactly what I'm talking about.

[1592] Yes, yes, exactly.

[1593] So I think that anyone who gets, who becomes even moderately recognizable like I have, I think going into therapy is a really good idea.

[1594] Yeah, it's probably necessary.

[1595] Yeah.

[1596] Because you're also not an extrovert by nature.

[1597] Not at all.

[1598] No. Right.

[1599] And it does force you to be an extrovert because when you start interacting with somebody, if you don't take the lead, then you're at the mercy of them.

[1600] steering and you're going to be stuck in a corner for for hours and also you need I've found that the moment something starts happening you step in the driver's seat put them at ease yeah take control wrap it up give them a pleasant experience that they can carry with them yeah and but you know also make sure that it that it doesn't weird your kids out well yeah and then I'll use a just a separate example is I've become friends with a lot of men in this industry who occupy a very alpha position status -wise.

[1601] But that's not who they were growing up.

[1602] So it is a very weird coat to be wearing for them.

[1603] And even in simpler terms, guys who have never done well with ladies, they get recognizable.

[1604] And all of a sudden they have all this access.

[1605] And it can be very corrosive.

[1606] It can be very, they can be a lot of mistrust in it.

[1607] I've met friends who have said it's actually made them massaginistic in weird ways.

[1608] So it is a, and it's an incredibly unique sociological experience, right?

[1609] And you seem to navigate it well.

[1610] But don't you think, how much credit would you give to Naomi as far as keeping your head in a realistic place?

[1611] Oh, everything.

[1612] All of it.

[1613] All of it.

[1614] She's not enamored with you.

[1615] Not at all.

[1616] Which is great.

[1617] Not at all.

[1618] Never was.

[1619] Maybe when you're in the coffin.

[1620] Perhaps.

[1621] She'll give it up.

[1622] Yeah.

[1623] She has the best taste of anyone I know.

[1624] And I trust her implicitly.

[1625] She's the smartest person I know.

[1626] She's, you know, it's all.

[1627] She's a real fucking home run.

[1628] She's super attractive.

[1629] She's very just a person you would love to be caught having to talk to at the grocery store she's wonderful she's the best i'm uh i'm very lucky but but for me it's a real asset to have Kristen as a wife because if i start thinking my shit doesn't stink because i have this unique job it's really great to live with someone it's like hey hot shot i have the same fucking job side note i'm actually more popular than you so you want to help me with a dish yeah and whatever thing you think is insurmountable that you're doing poor you're you're you know it is very helpful to me to have a sounding board that a has some experience with it herself and then be just there's nothing um cool or fancy about what I do I think I could see myself abusing this role I have if I was with someone who had a job they hated and mine seemed ideal you know yeah oh totally I think you know Kristen seems like the kind of person that always has a plan for stuff and even if she doesn't she's able to formulate one quickly like when that thing happened with the hurricane and she was helping out the folks.

[1630] The whole people.

[1631] I saw that kind of popping up on social media and it was like, yeah, that makes total sense that Kristen is taking it by the reins, figuring it all out, making everyone feel fine about what's happening.

[1632] Yeah.

[1633] For some folks, their favorite memory of the last five years was being evacuated in a hurricane.

[1634] Exactly.

[1635] Yeah, which is an incredible gift.

[1636] Something I don't do all that well like she does.

[1637] I would panic and not know.

[1638] Because like you, I suffer from some warped self -perception most of the time.

[1639] And so I would go to a place where like they wouldn't want that from me. How presumptuous of me. And then ultimately fraudulent.

[1640] I don't deserve, like, I just don't assume that I'm going to walk in.

[1641] The seniors are all going to even be aware of who I am and want to get on my fun train.

[1642] Right.

[1643] Which blows.

[1644] Yes.

[1645] But what it comes down to is they don't care.

[1646] Maybe they knew Kristen was.

[1647] Maybe they didn't.

[1648] The fact is she came in and lit up the room and made them feel all right about everything.

[1649] She just pulled out that happiness oozy and just started spraying sunshine all over the place.

[1650] Yeah.

[1651] Yeah, it was pretty incredible.

[1652] Yeah.

[1653] Well, Adam, I thank you so much for coming and being honest with me. Thank you for having me. This was terrific.

[1654] And I feel so good to know that you once hated me about that.

[1655] That really helps me in ways you can't really understand.

[1656] I'm so busy being envious of other people.

[1657] I can't even comprehend.

[1658] Someone may have wanted to be where I was.

[1659] Well, the moment you talked about about not getting a role and wondering who the fuck is Adam Scott, that is the moment you pray for when you start acting that one day you want to get something and make someone else.

[1660] Yes.

[1661] That's, I've never heard that about myself before.

[1662] So that's coming from someone like you.

[1663] It's incredibly.

[1664] Oh, yeah.

[1665] There was a period where I hoped I ran into you in a dark alley until I saw you.

[1666] That's great.

[1667] So I feel honored to be friends with you, and we shall team up on all kinds of fun things over the years and come back again soon.

[1668] Anytime.

[1669] Stay tuned if you'd like to hear my good friend and producer Monica Padman point out the many errors in the podcast you just heard.

[1670] What's up, guys?

[1671] It's your girl Kiki, and my podcast is back with a new season, and let me tell you, it's too good.

[1672] And I'm diving into the brains of entertainment's best and brightest, okay?

[1673] Every episode, I bring on a friend and have a real conversation.

[1674] And I don't mean just friends.

[1675] I mean the likes of Amy Polar, Kell Mitchell, Vivica Fox.

[1676] The list goes on.

[1677] So follow, watch, and listen to Baby.

[1678] This is Kiki Palmer on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcast.

[1679] Monica Padman, what do you have for us in the way of facts with Adam?

[1680] You mentioned that Midnight Run kicked off the sort of black and white comedy buddy movie.

[1681] But then you did.

[1682] You did.

[1683] Or maybe I said I thought it had been an emulated kind of like it became a genre.

[1684] Yeah, but it was it turned into black and white.

[1685] Right, right.

[1686] And then you had said like lethal weapon.

[1687] Mm -hmm.

[1688] And then you couldn't say others.

[1689] So I just wanted to fill your gap.

[1690] Here's some others.

[1691] 48 hours rush hour kind of.

[1692] Yeah, some of these predate that movie, but whatever.

[1693] These are awesome movies.

[1694] Cop out men in black, die hard with a vengeance.

[1695] Fuck, yeah.

[1696] Sam Jackson.

[1697] And that's all for that.

[1698] Okay, so you said that in hit and run, you punched Rosenbaum out cold.

[1699] And then I just wanted to say that's Michael Rosenbaum.

[1700] Oh, okay, great.

[1701] Yeah, he deserves that credit.

[1702] Yeah, he needs a shout out.

[1703] Took a great punch in that scene.

[1704] Uh -huh.

[1705] And we're all here basically because of Michael Rosenbaum.

[1706] Yes.

[1707] Rob, our other podcast producer produces Rosenbaum's podcast.

[1708] Inside of you with Michael Rosenbaum.

[1709] Whereas where I met Rob.

[1710] Yeah, me too.

[1711] It's where I met Rob too.

[1712] Well, not at that podcast, but anyways.

[1713] Yeah, well, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[1714] Okay, so you guys are talking about in movies when people get hit in the face, they're out cold for too long.

[1715] Sure, conveniently.

[1716] And then you said if that happened in real life, you'd have to get a pet scan.

[1717] But you might have to get a pet scan, but more likely you'd probably get a CT scan or an MRI.

[1718] Great.

[1719] But probably a CT.

[1720] Great.

[1721] So if you get knocked out at a bar.

[1722] bar or something, and you're on that stretcher in the hospital, requests one of those that Monica just said, not a pet scan.

[1723] Yeah, because it's the cheapest.

[1724] Oh, it's affordable, good.

[1725] Well, I wouldn't, I don't know if it's affordable.

[1726] You're probably going to have other bills, too, if you just got knocked out.

[1727] Probably.

[1728] But that's the more in -depth x -ray.

[1729] So that's like the first thing they're going to do.

[1730] Okay, just to, yeah.

[1731] Pet scans are more for diagnosing disorders.

[1732] Ooh, okay.

[1733] Yeah, anyway.

[1734] Cognitive disorders.

[1735] Okay, so you said that you see Santa Cruz has pass fail.

[1736] Oh, fuck.

[1737] You're obsessed with past fail.

[1738] I really am.

[1739] You brought it up during joys.

[1740] I thought Stanford had it to you, right?

[1741] Yeah.

[1742] Yeah, you did.

[1743] I don't know how you know so much about universities in their past fail system.

[1744] But anyway, they did have pass failed.

[1745] In 2000, the professors voted to start instituting letter grades to the student's chagrin.

[1746] And this makes sense because all of my knowledge of colleges stopped in 2000 when I graduated from college.

[1747] So this makes a ton of sense.

[1748] that I, you know, because when you're on a university, especially in a UC system, everyone's going, yeah, these motherfuckers up in Santa Cruz pass fail.

[1749] Yeah.

[1750] They're going to get 61 % or whatever the hell passes.

[1751] Yeah.

[1752] But it just started to make no sense because people didn't under like when they tried to get jobs.

[1753] Right.

[1754] It didn't mean anything.

[1755] Yeah.

[1756] Everyone was in the top 100 % of their class.

[1757] Right.

[1758] Exactly.

[1759] So you mentioned that there are surf gangs in Santa Cruz.

[1760] And there's a whole history of surf games.

[1761] Oh my gosh.

[1762] Yeah.

[1763] It was crazy.

[1764] Mainly there's the west side and the east side rivalry.

[1765] Okay.

[1766] Which is weird because the ocean's on the west side.

[1767] It's all on the west side.

[1768] How could you be an east side anything?

[1769] Yeah, east side of the west side.

[1770] And that started, but it started out kind of like tongue and cheek, like, get out of my beach.

[1771] I'm sure.

[1772] But then it became serious and had to.

[1773] some real gang implications.

[1774] He started like merging with real gangs.

[1775] Oh, any fatalities?

[1776] Yeah.

[1777] Oh, yikes.

[1778] I know.

[1779] I started to get scared.

[1780] So you stopped reading.

[1781] Because I used to think I was going to get sucked into a gang.

[1782] I really did.

[1783] I believed that for 100%.

[1784] Yeah, I really was scared.

[1785] All of a sudden I was going to wake up and then I was in a gang.

[1786] Okay.

[1787] So Adam mentions playing Castle Wolfenstein.

[1788] I had never heard of what that.

[1789] Had you heard of it?

[1790] I still haven't heard of it.

[1791] even though he apparently said it.

[1792] Oh.

[1793] That's too weird of a word for my brain to hear all the syllables.

[1794] Castle Wolfenstein?

[1795] Some game.

[1796] Well, now I know.

[1797] It sounds like Quackenstein.

[1798] That's a book we read, the kids.

[1799] Very good book.

[1800] Probably the best.

[1801] Yeah.

[1802] It was really sweet.

[1803] I'll adopt.

[1804] Yeah.

[1805] It's nice.

[1806] Castle Wolfenstein is a stealth -based action adventure shooter video game.

[1807] Hmm.

[1808] For the Apple 2.

[1809] Oh.

[1810] Okay.

[1811] It was released in 81.

[1812] and then later ported to MS.

[1813] Doss, the Atari, and the Commodore 64.

[1814] So this is the age we're, you know, we're living in here.

[1815] Right.

[1816] Commodore 6 -4s, Intellivision, Calicovision.

[1817] But it is a video game.

[1818] Shootout video game.

[1819] Okay.

[1820] So Adam said that movies in the 80s, when he was seeing movies, the matinees were $2.

[1821] Approximately.

[1822] The annual average U .S. ticket price in 1983, I just picked.

[1823] 1983 was $3 .15.

[1824] What a bargain.

[1825] I know.

[1826] But you know what's weird, according to this website, it says the average in 2017 was 897.

[1827] For a matinee?

[1828] No, average ticket price.

[1829] So that includes matinees, I'm sure.

[1830] It's just the general.

[1831] Yeah.

[1832] But don't you think we're getting ripped off here in L .A?

[1833] In L .A. Or here in L .A. It's $15 .18.

[1834] If you go to that, I'm not going to.

[1835] about them.

[1836] But my favorite place where you lay down in a recliner, that's like a $30 trip.

[1837] It really is.

[1838] Yeah.

[1839] With parking.

[1840] You know, and that might seem like it outpaced inflation, but at the same time, the price of movie making has even further outpaced that.

[1841] So don't be too mad.

[1842] I'm a little mad.

[1843] Okay.

[1844] So you mention a Mick Twist, which is a skateboard moves.

[1845] Yes.

[1846] Yeah.

[1847] And a snowboarding move.

[1848] Uh -huh.

[1849] We saw our hero in this Olympics.

[1850] They're flying tomato.

[1851] Yeah.

[1852] I don't know if he did a mid -twist, but we, certainly talks about it.

[1853] These are here when we want them on the podcast.

[1854] We're going to say that publicly.

[1855] Yes.

[1856] We love you, Sean White.

[1857] You're so cool.

[1858] Your hair's so thick.

[1859] I love it.

[1860] It's so pretty.

[1861] You're such a show -off.

[1862] Luscious locks.

[1863] So a Mick Twist is a transitional trick that was invented by McGill.

[1864] Yeah, McGill.

[1865] He was a Paul Perolta, uh, Bones Brigade skater on the ridge.

[1866] Okay.

[1867] And that consists of a front flip combined with a 540 degree rotation.

[1868] That's a twist in a half, I believe.

[1869] It's a lot.

[1870] Dang.

[1871] So you brought up Nate Tuck a lot of times.

[1872] But you just said Nate.

[1873] Oh, because he knew Nate as well.

[1874] So I didn't feel like he needed any introduction.

[1875] He didn't, but the world does.

[1876] Yeah, so Nate Tuck is my, I'd say the second stage of my life, Aaron Winkley, of course, my childhood best friend.

[1877] But Nate Tuck and I met at the first level of the growlings in 1996.

[1878] And boy, did we fall, head over heels in love.

[1879] We've been in love ever since.

[1880] he produced the first movie I ever made, Brothers Justice, then he produced hit and run, and he produced chippies, and he's just all around perfect human being.

[1881] We're all in love with him.

[1882] Yeah, me too.

[1883] We need a female perspective.

[1884] I love naked.

[1885] Ugh, he's so perfect.

[1886] He's wonderful.

[1887] Irish background, Bay Area kid, father, a lawyer, smart.

[1888] The nicest person alive, probably.

[1889] A basketball player has elbowed me in the nose intentionally several times.

[1890] He has a real fiery streak, which is really fun to see because he's so kind and he explodes.

[1891] Yeah, that's fun.

[1892] Anyway, Adam mentioned when River Phoenix was nominated for running on empty.

[1893] He, like, couldn't remember the year.

[1894] He thought maybe it was 87.

[1895] It was 89.

[1896] And then Adam had said he was in high school or junior high at that time.

[1897] But I crunched these numbers, and he would have been 16.

[1898] He would have been in high school.

[1899] Sure, sophomore, maybe.

[1900] I was much older than I was.

[1901] You weren't born.

[1902] I was a senior when I was 16.

[1903] You were?

[1904] No. Yeah, I was.

[1905] How?

[1906] And then I turned, no, I turned 18.

[1907] You can't start your senior year at 16 and turn 18.

[1908] No, listen, I turned 18 a couple weeks in to my freshman year of college.

[1909] Oh my goodness.

[1910] That's too young.

[1911] No, it's the right age.

[1912] It was, okay.

[1913] So Santa, you asked what kind of industry Santa Cruz had.

[1914] Uh -huh.

[1915] And he suggested fishing.

[1916] Santa Cruz relies primarily on its agriculture, Tourism, high technology, and educational industries.

[1917] Educational industries being the college.

[1918] The past fail, you see.

[1919] That we now know isn't past fail.

[1920] Correct.

[1921] Bert Reynolds, you said, biggest box office star seven out of ten years in a row.

[1922] Well, not in a row, but seven out of ten years.

[1923] Non -concective.

[1924] Seven out of ten, what ten years then?

[1925] Any old ten years?

[1926] Well, no, in a ten -year period, he was the biggest star, but not seven in a row.

[1927] It's like he skipped a couple years.

[1928] Yeah, I think you had said it.

[1929] I also, I think I read this in a Playboy interview with him.

[1930] I don't think it's right.

[1931] Okay.

[1932] Long story short.

[1933] I looked for a long time and I could not find that.

[1934] This is what I did find.

[1935] He was the fourth highest biggest box office star of the 70s.

[1936] Okay.

[1937] After Robert Redford, Harrison Ford, and Richard Dreyfus.

[1938] Okay.

[1939] And then he was the third biggest star of the 80s.

[1940] Okay.

[1941] After Clint Eastwood and Eddie Murphy.

[1942] I do want to add, though, one thing when you're talking about, that so people will get these like uh their lifetime average well if they land in a franchise like star trek or star wars or whatever whatever if you fucking open smoking the bandit that had a 30 page script and it makes a 190 million dollars that's much different to me that's a much you can you can attribute that success to that actor so i do i wish there was more complicated calculus to give him the credit that he deserves sure i understand he definitely was in these really low budget movies and they made a ton of money.

[1943] Of course, we can't really compute that.

[1944] No. I'm just only making the point that if you're making a $30 million movie, they're regularly hitting $150, clearly the stars.

[1945] You're doing a good job.

[1946] But you could fucking put me in a Marvel movie.

[1947] And even I wouldn't tank that thing.

[1948] It would still make a billion dollars and have no credit to me. Right.

[1949] But you were wrong.

[1950] I was wrong.

[1951] Yeah, good, good, good, good.

[1952] I just want to circle back to the fact that you were wrong.

[1953] Thanks for pointing that out.

[1954] So you said Smokey and the Bandit was the third biggest film of that.

[1955] year and Jaws was made that year and it made $108 million and that was in 77 and it was the second highest grossing movie that year after Star Wars oh okay yeah huh what when Jaws was maybe earlier maybe I'll have to look I guess the film actually grossed 126 million 7377374228 in north America wow that's great yeah that's huge mm -hmm so you said after Avatar went for a year in theaters.

[1956] Uh -huh.

[1957] Avatar was in release for 34 weeks.

[1958] Holy smoke.

[1959] So not quite 52 weeks, but damn near close.

[1960] Yeah, really close.

[1961] Spike Lee's signature move on the dolly.

[1962] Mm -hmm.

[1963] Okay.

[1964] Does it have a name?

[1965] Double dolly shot.

[1966] Double dolly shot.

[1967] Which it gives the illusion of someone floating to camera.

[1968] Mm -hmm.

[1969] I'm going to tell you how to do it, okay?

[1970] Okay.

[1971] So usually a dolly shot is executed by mounting a camera on a tripod.

[1972] and mounting that tripod to a track.

[1973] Is that correct?

[1974] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[1975] Or if not a tripod, an actual physical dolly, the little Chapman machine that's got wheels on it.

[1976] Sure, but the guy can sit on it.

[1977] So the camera glides in and back and whatever.

[1978] Well, the camera gets physically closer to the object that's filming.

[1979] Yeah, in a gliding motion.

[1980] So for the double dolly shot, he set up a dolly per usual.

[1981] Then he puts the actor on another dog.

[1982] Oh, that's what it is.

[1983] And he moves the camera and the actor at the same time.

[1984] Cool.

[1985] So the actor, yeah.

[1986] That's neat.

[1987] And it gives the effect that they're floating.

[1988] Yeah.

[1989] Oh, I like that.

[1990] Good job, Spike Lee.

[1991] Yeah.

[1992] Sorry about the Knicks.

[1993] You know, it's a basketball joke.

[1994] I know what the mix are.

[1995] I know, I know.

[1996] How dare you.

[1997] But, you know, he got really popular during the Indiana Pacer playoff games.

[1998] Reggie Miller, like, hit three -threes.

[1999] 12 seconds or something unheard of And he kept looking right at Spike And Spike was yelling at him He'd get on the car You know Yeah, he's a big deal at those Yeah, he is the biggest deal I think You referenced Bonnie Hunt's sitcom That you were on twice Which is so funny That was called Life with Bonnie Life with Bonnie Yeah and that show only ran two years And you were on twice In the same year Oh yeah, I'm telling you I was only separated by like three or four episodes And I played a completely different person It was a surgeon and then a director.

[2000] Oh my God.

[2001] Yeah, you played.

[2002] Dr. Iscar.

[2003] Yes, Dr. Iscar and Kyle Levine were your characters.

[2004] Oh, that was my director name.

[2005] Yeah.

[2006] And they were your third and fourth credit.

[2007] Yeah, I believe that.

[2008] On IMDB.

[2009] Yeah.

[2010] So, so I, the first thing I, the first movie I was ever appeared in that was released was cheaper by the dozen.

[2011] I was an Oprah's camera crew and I had like one line to Steve Martin.

[2012] And on that set, which Bonnie Hunt was in, she was so nice.

[2013] And I got to talking with her by her trailer and she said, I'm going to call you in to do my TV show.

[2014] And then she really lived up to that word.

[2015] Times two.

[2016] Yeah.

[2017] And then punk hadn't even come out yet.

[2018] But it came out in the interim.

[2019] And then whatever.

[2020] It was cool.

[2021] She got me on her show and I had nothing, no reason for her to think I should do that.

[2022] Other than chatting with her at her trailer, she's the greatest.

[2023] That's really, really nice.

[2024] Chewer by the dozen isn't your first, your first credited credit is hair shirt.

[2025] Yeah.

[2026] But it wasn't released to my knowledge in theaters.

[2027] Be nice, that's Nate's brother.

[2028] I know, I know.

[2029] They talk who you now know about.

[2030] Now everyone knows Nate Tuck, but yeah, it's just a name.

[2031] It just makes me, yeah, that's a weird name.

[2032] Because you said he changed the name, and it's not on IMDB, it's hair shirt.

[2033] Right, and it ended up being called Too Smooth, T -O -O.

[2034] Jerry O 'Connell's character and stand by me is named Vern.

[2035] Okay.

[2036] Tessio.

[2037] Great.

[2038] Good.

[2039] And then you said you had to stand at IGA.

[2040] Oh, that's a supermarket chain.

[2041] It's a grocery store, as I love.

[2042] learned.

[2043] I had no idea what that was.

[2044] It says they're all over, they're nationwide, but I've never seen one.

[2045] Okay.

[2046] So according to you, they're not nationwide.

[2047] Okay.

[2048] Okay.

[2049] And then you guys both talked about groundlings in UCB and just for listeners who don't know what they are.

[2050] By now they probably do, but they're both comedy schools in Los Angeles, Groundlings and Upright Citizens Brigade.

[2051] And you're a product of UCB and I'm a product of groundlings.

[2052] And we fight about it.

[2053] Yeah.

[2054] And UCB was started in New York, right?

[2055] Poler and Besser and Matt Walsh, Matt Besser, Amy Poehler, Horatio Sands.

[2056] No, he was part of that first concoction, but they're great though.

[2057] If you've never been to a UCB show, Ian Roberts, I did it.

[2058] Ian Roberts.

[2059] And you can see them in New York and in Los Angeles.

[2060] They might even have more that I don't know about.

[2061] And then Growlings is just in Los Angeles.

[2062] Yeah.

[2063] And they're very, very famous popular comedy schools.

[2064] You said without a paddle made a lot of money with very little.

[2065] And that was the opposite of Zathura.

[2066] So the budget for Without a Paddle was $19 million and made $69 .63 million in the box office.

[2067] That's a good.

[2068] U .S .D. Yeah, that's a good, that's a good ratio.

[2069] Yeah.

[2070] We like that.

[2071] And then Zathura had a budget of $65 million, USD, and made $64 .3 million.

[2072] Okay.

[2073] So it actually made a sort of comparable amount of money, but in relation to how much they spent, making it.

[2074] Yes, both, both making it and marketing it.

[2075] They spent considerably more trying to open so they're on a Thanksgiving weekend.

[2076] Right.

[2077] And we were in the last weekend of summer without a paddle.

[2078] You said 60 % of Will Ferrell's skill set is a writer.

[2079] And I couldn't give you an actual number, but that is not a fact.

[2080] That's not a real statistic.

[2081] We don't know.

[2082] It's not really quantifiable, I don't think.

[2083] So, but you try to quantify it.

[2084] This is just from my own professional point of view as a fellow graduate of the same school he went to, yeah, being the groundlings.

[2085] I would say his, could be.

[2086] Could be 40.

[2087] He is a hell of a performer.

[2088] You guys mentioned the frog in the boiling water.

[2089] Uh -huh.

[2090] So that's a fable for people who don't know.

[2091] That's a fable.

[2092] It's also a scientific fact.

[2093] Yeah, I've watched a nature show where the frogs wandered into these pools that are being fed by like geysers and they're heating up and they will sit in there until they die.

[2094] Yeah, I guess.

[2095] I mean, I've witnessed it on TV.

[2096] Maybe they were lying.

[2097] They poisoned those little pools that the frog swam into.

[2098] Well, no, no, that is the truth.

[2099] But they have to be put in tepid water.

[2100] Then once you start boiling it, then they'll stay.

[2101] Yeah, the whole point is if you raise the temperature slowly, the frog will not really acknowledge it.

[2102] If you were to put him in scalding water, he would jump out.

[2103] Yep, that's the fable.

[2104] Oh, great.

[2105] And I guess also signs it.

[2106] But when you say fable, it makes it sound like it's bullshit.

[2107] But I think it's real.

[2108] Yeah.

[2109] Maybe it's both, though.

[2110] I think it's both.

[2111] Oh, great.

[2112] that's all oh wow that wasn't too shabby no it wasn't yeah well thank you you're welcome follow armchair expert on the Wondry app amazon music or wherever you get your podcasts you can listen to every episode of armchair expert early and ad free right now by joining Wondry plus in the Wondry app or on Apple podcasts before you go tell us about yourself by completing a short survey at Wondry dot com slash survey we've all bet there.

[2113] Turning to the internet to self -diagnose our inexplicable pains, debilitating body aches, sudden fevers, and strange rashes.

[2114] Though our minds tend to spiral to worst -case scenarios, it's usually nothing, but for an unlucky few, these unsuspecting symptoms can start the clock ticking on a terrifying medical mystery.

[2115] Like the unexplainable death of a retired firefighter, whose body was found at home by his son, except it looked like he had been cremated, or the time when an entire town started jumping from buildings and seeing tigers on their ceilings.

[2116] Hey listeners, it's Mr. Ballin here, and I'm here to tell you about my podcast.

[2117] It's called Mr. Ballin's Medical Mysteries.

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