S3 E3: Nobody's Getting In My Head

[0] Wondry Plus subscribers can listen to something was wrong early and ad -free right now.

[1] Join Wondry Plus in the Wondry app or on Apple Podcasts.

[2] I'm Dan Tversky.

[3] In 2011, something strange began to happen at a high school in upstate New York.

[4] A mystery illness, bizarre symptoms, and spreading fast.

[5] What's the answer?

[6] And what do you do if they tell you it's all in your head?

[7] Hysterical.

[8] A new podcast from Wondry and Pineapple Street Studios.

[9] Binge all episodes of hysterical early and ad -free on Wondery Plus.

[10] This podcast is intended for mature audiences and discusses topics that could be triggering to some.

[11] Opinions expressed by guests on the show are their own and do not necessarily represent the views of this podcast.

[12] I am not a therapist or a doctor.

[13] All resources, books, and sources mentioned on the podcast can be found linked in the episode notes.

[14] Please note, names have been changed in this story for anonymity purposes.

[15] If you or someone you love is being abused, please contact the National Domestic Violence Hotline at 1 -800 -799 -7233.

[16] If you or someone you love is struggling with a suicidal crisis or emotional distress, you can contact the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline 24 -7 at 1 -800 -273 -8255.

[17] Please note, some of today's episode involves suicidal ideation, or thoughts of suicide.

[18] Please take care when listening.

[19] Thank you.

[20] In Dr. Stephanie Moulton's book, Gaslighting, she writes, when it comes to friendships with gaslighters, the word frenemy comes to mind.

[21] In 2010, Frenomy was added to the Oxford English Dictionary, described as a person with whom one is friendly, despite a fundamental dislike or rivalry.

[22] Like all gaslighters, gaslighting friends feed off of human.

[23] They are emotional vampires.

[24] You feel exhausted after spending time with them.

[25] They want to know all about all of the terrible things that have happened to you in great detail.

[26] Conversely, they pay little attention when you want to tell them about something good.

[27] They have no interest in the things that are going right for others.

[28] They see others' success as one -upping them.

[29] You are their competition.

[30] This is because Gaslighters' views the world as having limited resources.

[31] They can't grasp the concept that being happy for people around them could also lead to their own greater happiness and success.

[32] Gaslighters are terrible gossips.

[33] They love learning unfortunate tidbits about other people's lives and sharing it with others.

[34] It is the fuel they thrive on.

[35] It gives gaslighters a feeling of power and control over others.

[36] People's personal information is like currency to them, and sharing said info gives them the attention they crave.

[37] The difference between your basic gossiper and the gaslighter is that they will use the information about others as a way to gain power and pit people against each other, whereas the basic gossip is usually more of a yenta or a busy body.

[38] The gaslighter wields information like a If you suspect that a friend is a gaslighter, think about how they talk to you about other people.

[39] Last episode, we covered how gaslighters love splitting and triangulation.

[40] In friendships, the gaslighter purposefully pits people against each other.

[41] They love to see a fight and get excited by the fact they have made it happen.

[42] One of their most common tactics is telling you that a friend said something in flattering or unkind about you.

[43] Gaslighters have no problem lying, especially when it means having greater power over others.

[44] Gaslighters know that people are curious about what others are doing, so they will make up gossip as a way to distract from their own bad behavior.

[45] Gaslighters would love nothing more than for them to be your only friend.

[46] That way, gaslighters think you will devote all of your time and attention to them.

[47] They will go as far as you're splitting to isolate you from your partner and family.

[48] Gaslighters see friends as commodities or things.

[49] They don't see a need for having a reciprocal or even relationship with people.

[50] They see friends as stepping stones and a way to get what they want.

[51] You'll notice with a gaslighting friend that the friendship is never fully reciprocated.

[52] There is no give and take.

[53] It's all take.

[54] It's all takes.

[55] all the time.

[56] This includes taking your time and energy until you're exhausted.

[57] You will never fulfill a gaslighter's narcissistic needs.

[58] They are bottomless pits.

[59] They may act like your best friend today, but will drop you in seconds if they find someone who seems better, more fun, or a higher social status.

[60] To them, it's all about appearance.

[61] Gaslighters don't want to friend as much as they want a pet.

[62] They look for friends who will be dependent on them and cater to their every whim.

[63] They do not know how to form real friendships.

[64] Gaslighters will often go to great lengths to form a special bond with your partner.

[65] They will pretend to be a good friend to your spouse and will emphasize how good they are at listening.

[66] Gaslighters know exactly what many people in long -term relationships want to hear.

[67] They have an uncanny ability to know what your spouse might need to feel better about themselves.

[68] They will slowly ramp up their flirtatious behavior.

[69] They slowly increase their visits to your home when you're conveniently not there.

[70] They start with simply complimenting your spouse.

[71] Then come the sexual innuendos.

[72] Next, it's standing too close, up to full physical contact.

[73] If a gaslighter knows you're having problems in your relationship, they may focus on stealing your spouse from you.

[74] They will use inside information you have shared with them to manipulate and groom your partner.

[75] Gaslighters almost always have an ulterior motive.

[76] Never trust them alone with your spouse.

[77] Gaslighters can act so sweet and innocent, despite their pattern of deceitful behavior and lack of boundaries.

[78] Gaslighters are amazingly good at faking empathy, and your gaslighting friend likely knows exactly what to say to attract your spouse.

[79] Their ultimate goal is to steal your partner from you simply to feel like they have won.

[80] They don't care about you, your spouse, or your relationship.

[81] They live for this kind of winning.

[82] Once your spouse breaks off the affair with the gaslighter, things can get very ugly, very quickly.

[83] Gaslighters will stop at nothing to destroy your family if they feel they have been wronged.

[84] I'm Tiffany Reese, and this is, something was wrong.

[85] Ted had gotten so distance that he actually moved out of our bedroom and moved into another bedroom of the house and he was, he stayed out for about six months.

[86] Here's Victoria.

[87] And when he moved back, I thought, oh, wow, you know, things are looking better.

[88] He even said, he's like, you know, don't read into this.

[89] He says, but, you know, I'm going to move back and, you know, we'll see how things go.

[90] and I would, we would have talks, him and I would say, I says, do you want a divorce?

[91] Do you want to be single?

[92] I says, because you sure do act like it.

[93] I said, you don't want my input about anything.

[94] You go and do things all by yourself.

[95] You go to functions by yourself.

[96] Do you want a divorce?

[97] And he's like, no. And I says, well, do you want out of this marriage?

[98] I said, do you want to separate?

[99] And he's like, no. I says, so what you're telling me is you want to be married, but you want to live like this.

[100] And he's like, well, I'm just not there yet.

[101] I'm like, okay.

[102] And I said, well, let me ask you this.

[103] He says, do you still love me?

[104] And he says, yes, I still love you.

[105] And I said, well, you have a funny way of showing it.

[106] And as time went on, these talks got fewer and fewer, because every time I would bring up his feelings, he would get enraged and get angry and say that I've turned him into somebody that he doesn't like.

[107] And I said, well, that's kind of funny.

[108] I says, because, you know, we don't do much together other than go to the O 'Brien's.

[109] And I don't understand.

[110] Meanwhile, during this time, too, Patty started seeing all these faults in my children.

[111] My children were adults.

[112] They were getting married.

[113] She threw in my face that I didn't let her come to anything to help play.

[114] my daughter's wedding, which was a bona fide lie because she did, and that she wasn't more involved when she was pregnant for her first child and would just throw the stuff in my face constantly that things that I weren't wasn't doing.

[115] So I tried to make sure she was included in everything.

[116] And we did vacations together, and she would get angry when I would want to invite my children.

[117] And she's like, no, no, you know, this is for the adult.

[118] I says, well, but you're taking your triplets.

[119] You're taking your children, and the Johnsons are taking their children.

[120] So why can't I invite my children?

[121] Or your children are adults.

[122] They're on their own.

[123] So there was another excuse why I couldn't be around my kids.

[124] And she just kept pulling me further and further away from my kids, and I just couldn't understand that.

[125] And as time went on, it got to the point as my children married and my daughter started having grandchildren, that the strain on the marriage was so to the point where we were our most roommates now.

[126] We didn't have relations.

[127] We didn't.

[128] We weren't physical.

[129] We existed.

[130] And like clockwork about every six months, I would ask Ted, you know, is this working for you?

[131] because it's really not working for me. Are you happy?

[132] And he's like, everything's fine.

[133] He says, you just need to give a time.

[134] He says, you know, you're going to counseling.

[135] You're working on things and you're trying to straighten your things out.

[136] That's why I'm here.

[137] I'm here to make sure you get all straightened out.

[138] And then we'll see about us because everything was always my fault.

[139] Everything was my fault.

[140] And I believed him.

[141] I believed her.

[142] She would say the same thing.

[143] She says, well, maybe if you wouldn't make them out angry, Maybe if you wouldn't make him upset, try to do things that he likes to do, try to fix him things that he likes to eat.

[144] And there was always something, always something that would make Ted angry or something that would make Patty angry.

[145] And I even told Patty on several occasions, I think he's having an affair.

[146] I'm Dan Tiberski.

[147] In 2011, something strange began to happen at the high school in Leroy, New York.

[148] I was like at my locker and she came up to me and she was like, stutter.

[149] I'm like, stop fucking around.

[150] She's like, I can't.

[151] A mystery illness, bizarre symptoms, and spreading fast.

[152] It's like doubling and tripling and it's all these girls.

[153] With a diagnosis, the state tried to keep on the down low.

[154] Everybody thought I was holding something back.

[155] Well, you were holding something back.

[156] Intentionally.

[157] Yeah, yeah, well, yeah.

[158] No, it's hysteria.

[159] It's all in your head.

[160] It's not physical.

[161] Oh, my gosh, you're exaggerating.

[162] Is this the largest mass hysteria since the witches of Salem?

[163] Or is it something else entirely?

[164] Something's wrong here.

[165] Something's not right.

[166] Leroy was the new date line and everyone was trying to solve the murder.

[167] A new limited series from Wondery and Pineapple Street Studios, Hysterical.

[168] Follow Hysterical on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts.

[169] You can binge all episodes of Hysterical early and ad -free right now by joining Wondery Plus.

[170] Scammers are best known for living the high life until they're forced to trade it all in for handcuffs and an orange jumpsuit once they're finally caught.

[171] I'm Sachi Cole.

[172] And I'm Sarah Haggy, and we're the host of scam influencers, a weekly podcast from Wondery that takes you along the twists and turns of some of the most infamous scams of all time, the impact on victims and what's left once the facade falls away.

[173] We've covered stories like a Shark Tank certified entrepreneur who left the show with an investment, but soon faced mounting bills, an active lawsuit followed by Larry King, and no real product to push.

[174] He then began to prey on vulnerable women instead, selling the idea of a future together while stealing from them behind their backs.

[175] To the infamous scams of Real Housewives stars like Teresa Judice, what should have proven to be a major downfall only seemed to solidify her place in the Real Housewives Hall of Fame.

[176] Follow Scamfluencers on the Wondry app or wherever you get your podcasts.

[177] You can listen to Scamfluencers early and ad -free right now on Wondry Plus.

[178] I used to come home from work and come up on the deck and wonder if I was walking in to see Mr. Hyde or Dr. Jekyll today because he was so moody and so off the wall because I just didn't even know who he was anymore.

[179] And, you know, Patty just kept saying, why don't you just go get him some help?

[180] You guys need some counseling and you guys need this and you guys need that.

[181] And I says, well, he won't do any of that.

[182] And then she said, well, why are you still with him?

[183] Why don't you just leave him?

[184] I says, because I love him.

[185] He's the father of my children.

[186] I love him.

[187] you know I'm trying to weigh out on this hope and that whatever he's saying that the counselor's hopefully helping me with that we get somewhere and we can make amends she's like I don't know about you but she says I don't see anything good in any of this and she's like I'll talk to him I'll talk to him and the relationship just kept dwindling the only people that we practically only see would be Patty and her family and the Johnsons it just I just kept getting worse, and I just thought, how can I fix this?

[188] I don't know how to fix this anymore.

[189] And my counselor kept saying, you know, try to get him to come in and talk to me. And I said, I have begged him to come and talk to you.

[190] And he just keeps saying, every time I ask him, nobody's getting in my head, this isn't about our marriage.

[191] This is about you getting fixed.

[192] You're the problem in this relationship, not me. And I'm like, I have done everything.

[193] everything that you tell me that I do wrong, I have corrected.

[194] So how can it still be me?

[195] My extended family stopped coming down because they didn't feel welcomed.

[196] They said that Ted made them feel unwelcome and just kept saying, you know, you just look so unhappy.

[197] And I thought, well, I just don't know anymore.

[198] I'm just got at my wits end.

[199] I feel like I'll walk around with eggshells.

[200] I can't do anything right with anybody.

[201] I get yelled at from Patty.

[202] I get yelled at from Ted.

[203] My son's angry at me. Then three years ago, my job was eliminated where I work, and I got home, and Ted was waiting for me, and he was wonderful.

[204] He was wonderful, and Brad came over, and they were very understanding, and I was just a mess.

[205] Ted turned around and told my brother, which is his best friend, that if I didn't find a job within just a few months, he was going to kick me and all my junk out.

[206] And that's not how he was at all.

[207] I was lucky enough to find a job within five months and got back to work.

[208] But when I got back to work, Ted and Patty said, well, did you tell them that you were eliminated, that you got fired?

[209] and I said, I didn't get fired.

[210] I was eliminated.

[211] I got a severance package.

[212] They told me I was eliminated.

[213] Well, no, the word was terminated.

[214] And so you lied to them?

[215] You lied to that organization?

[216] I said, no. I even got on the phone with the unemployment office while Ted was standing there and said, what am I supposed to tell employees when I go to, employers when I go to interview?

[217] And the lady said flat out that your job was eliminated.

[218] And Ted, in a rage, threw his arms up and said, whatever.

[219] If you want to believe that, then you believe that.

[220] And Patty kept saying, well, I think you should tell them exactly what happened.

[221] And I said, I did tell them.

[222] Oh, so you told them you were fired.

[223] I said, I wasn't fired.

[224] I was eliminated.

[225] I mean, they couldn't even be, they weren't even happy for me. And I didn't understand that for the longest time.

[226] It didn't make sense.

[227] So much of my life just didn't make sense anymore.

[228] I just felt like I was spinning out of control.

[229] Here's C .J. Bishop.

[230] My mother -in -law, they abolished her job position at the office she was working at.

[231] So she was let go and she really didn't see it coming.

[232] And the first thing I thought of when that day happened was, oh, I bet Patty is just loving this because it's something bad happening to my mother -in -law, and she loves it when bad things happen to our family.

[233] I mean, she would just thrive off of it, and nothing good could ever happen to my mother -in -law, sister -in -law, father -in -law, nothing good could ever happen to them without her complaining about it.

[234] My mother -in -law got offered a job, a very good job at a college, and she gets more vacation time, she gets more lenience.

[235] I mean, she works with an amazing group of people, and she's very happy there.

[236] Well, when she was hired with the college, I got a text from Patty.

[237] saying, oh, I bet she didn't tell them that she probably got fired from her last job.

[238] And I bet that she was hired under false circumstances.

[239] Somebody should write an anonymous note and tell them the kind of person that she's hiring because she lied on her resume.

[240] She just went off about it.

[241] Whenever, first of all, she didn't get fired.

[242] You know, her position was just eliminated.

[243] And I remember responding to her, like, she must have thought I would have joined in on the bashing of Victoria.

[244] And I wasn't having it.

[245] I text her back and all I said was, wow, you're really not happy for your friend, are you?

[246] And she wrote back, oh, no, no, I'm very happy for her.

[247] I'm very happy for her.

[248] I'm just concerned that, you know, somebody might find out something that wasn't truthful in her resume.

[249] You're right.

[250] It's not my business.

[251] Called out.

[252] Okay.

[253] She struck him with her motor vehicle.

[254] She had been under the influence and And she left him there.

[255] In January 2022, local woman Karen Reed was implicated in the mysterious death of her boyfriend, Boston police officer John O 'Keefe.

[256] It was alleged that after an innocent night out for drinks with friends, Karen and John got into a lover's quarrel en route to the next location.

[257] What happens next?

[258] Depends on who you ask.

[259] Was it a crime of passion?

[260] If you believe the prosecution, it's because the evidence was so compelling.

[261] This was clearly an intentional act.

[262] And his cause of death was blunt force trauma with hypothermia.

[263] Or a corrupt police cover -up.

[264] If you believe the defense theory, however, this was all a cover -up to prevent one of their own from going down.

[265] Everyone had an opinion.

[266] And after the 10 -week trial, the jury could not come to a unanimous decision.

[267] To end in a mistrial, it's just a confirmation of just how complicated this case is.

[268] Law and crime presents the most in -depth analysis to date of the date of the case.

[269] sensational case in Karen.

[270] You can listen to Karen exclusively with Wondry Plus.

[271] Join Wondry Plus in the Wondry app, Apple Podcasts, or Spotify.

[272] My nephew was getting married and this was my brother's son and I wasn't even invited to the rehearsal dinner, but the rest of my family was.

[273] I went to the wedding and I was treated very, very coldly by my brother and his wife.

[274] and I wasn't welcome to stay.

[275] So I drove home that night, and that was three hours from home.

[276] And that night, I literally sat on my bed with my gun in my hand and almost pulled the trigger that night because I felt that unwanted.

[277] Because Ted didn't want to come home with me. Ted was staying to have a good time and party, and that I was to leave.

[278] And this was my family, not his, my family, my brother.

[279] They're isolating you from every ankle.

[280] Everyone.

[281] My family, my extended family, my siblings, they were making everybody believe that I was crazy.

[282] Here's Brad.

[283] My dad would hammer my mom.

[284] Hammer her.

[285] She's this, she's that, she's this, she's that.

[286] He wants out.

[287] He wants gone.

[288] wants this, he wants that, just making my mom out to be a monster.

[289] That hunting season was the first hunting season that he didn't call his son to come hunting with him.

[290] And that completely like, that just broke Brad.

[291] So that was like a major turning point and this struggle with figuring out what the problem is between us and his dad to not get invited hunting.

[292] but he went, but he went with Patty's kids.

[293] He took her at least he offered to go hunt with Patty's kids instead of his own son that year.

[294] And the fact that Patty's kids went, like, they're good boys.

[295] It's not their fault.

[296] Like, we're not salty with them about it, but it broke my husband's heart.

[297] I was nine years old, my dad and I deer hunting together.

[298] Every single year.

[299] I mean, we looked at it as a type of Christmas morning.

[300] You know, it was just something we did.

[301] together again we don't have family down here it was just him and i and i'm a pretty big hunter you know i've gone out i go out a lot more than he does and stuff like that 16 2016 2016 it was like a week or two before season i still haven't heard from my dad finally i'm like hey man are we going out or what okay yeah we threw something together okay almost the whole year went by 16 into 17 17 come around and my wife's like you're going to talk to your dad deer season's like right around the corner and i'm like no i'm not i'm not i i can't force this guy to have a relationship with me. I can't.

[302] As much as it pains me, I thought about it every day.

[303] I think about it a lot more now, obviously, but, you know, I says, no, I'm not going to.

[304] I'm just going to wait, and I never got a call from them.

[305] I ended up going out with my father -in -law, and that really crushed me. That really hurt.

[306] And I never heard from them.

[307] In the last Hell Mary pass, full court free throw, you know, whatever you want to call it, is I actually e -mailed my dad.

[308] It was the end of 17 and I'll have to get through this without getting upset, but basically I told him, like, listen, I've man -to -man, talked with you face -to -face.

[309] I don't know how many times it hasn't worked.

[310] Basically, I told him, like, the one big thing that just was just a knife through the heart, for a guy, I guess, to call it, you know, as a guy, I says, we've been hunting together since I was nine years old, and you never even picked up the phone to see if I wanted to go.

[311] But he took the O 'Brien's boys out.

[312] So it was just like, man, I don't know what I did.

[313] I'm your only son.

[314] Whatever I did, I'm sorry.

[315] I don't know what it is.

[316] And I didn't end it terribly.

[317] I mean, it was definitely tough love, the email.

[318] I mean, I was really ported on pretty thick.

[319] But I left it open, thanks to my wife.

[320] And it's like, don't you dare end it bad.

[321] You leave that door open.

[322] I'm like, yeah, she's like, well, no, because he's the type of guy.

[323] He's prideful.

[324] He'll shut down.

[325] He's like, you know what, screw you then.

[326] You know what I mean?

[327] So I left it open.

[328] You know, I love you very much.

[329] I'm here.

[330] Anytime you want to come, that door's open, and I'm here.

[331] You want to talk about something?

[332] I'm here.

[333] I text him.

[334] I said, I sent you an email.

[335] He said, okay.

[336] And that was pretty much the last time I really talked to him.

[337] That email was kind of a big piece of the start of all this craziness, I guess.

[338] I don't know how else to put it.

[339] Next time.

[340] Patty's husband had found stuff on the eye cloud.

[341] I said, I just got some disturbing text from Patty.

[342] I picked up that phone, and I could hear her screaming.

[343] And we floored it through the whole city.

[344] I was hot on his tail.

[345] And when we got to my parents' street, he pulled over, and I floored it, folded upstairs, and there was a sea of cops, the ambulance people in the hallway.

[346] And I tried to make my way through.

[347] Something Was Wrong is written, recorded, edited, and produced by me, Tiffany Reese.

[348] Thank you so much to the Bishop family for participating in this series.

[349] To reference sources, resources, and links that are mentioned on the podcast, check out the show and episode notes.

[350] Music on this series by Gladrags.

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