S16 E4: Knock at the Door

[0] Wondry Plus subscribers can listen to something was wrong early and ad -free right now.

[1] Join Wondry Plus in the Wondry app or on Apple Podcasts.

[2] I'm Dan Tversky.

[3] In 2011, something strange began to happen at a high school in upstate New York.

[4] A mystery illness, bizarre symptoms, and spreading fast.

[5] What's the answer?

[6] And what do you do if they tell you it's all in your head?

[7] Hysterical.

[8] A new podcast from Wondry and Pineapple Street Studios.

[9] Binge all episodes of hysterical early and ad -free on Wondery Plus.

[10] Something Was Wrong is intended for mature audiences, as it discusses topics that can be upsetting, such as emotional, physical, and sexual violence.

[11] Content warnings for each episode and confidential and free resources for survivors can be found in the episode notes.

[12] Some survivor names have been changed for anonymity purposes.

[13] pseudonyms are given to minors in these stories for their privacy and protection.

[14] Testimony shared by guests on this show is their own and does not necessarily reflect the views of myself, Broken Cycle Media, or Wondry.

[15] The podcast or any linked materials should not be construed as medical advice, nor is the information a substitute for professional expertise or treatment.

[16] All persons are considered innocent and less proven guilty in a court of law.

[17] Thank you so much for listening.

[18] I was thinking about how cool it is that you and I are able to support each other and love on one another and be empathetic towards one another when we are going through two like polarizingly different experiences on Mother's Day.

[19] You've lost your mom so tragically and horrifically and I've lost my mom by choice.

[20] You lost your mom tragically and horrifically too, though, I think I would say at her own hands.

[21] but still.

[22] Thank you.

[23] It's really cool and something I was thinking about on Mother's Day that we are both able to acknowledge each other's experience and be there for one another and hold space for one another, even though we have such different histories with our own mothers and journeys to this place, we can still relate a lot so much through other things to each other.

[24] Also, I really want to direct listeners to the episode that Amy just did on what came next.

[25] It came out the Friday before Mother's Day.

[26] It's an update episode about Amy facing her brother, her mom's murderer, in court, and reading her victim impact statement for the first time after 16 years of waiting.

[27] And she shares about what that day and weeks leading up to that day were like for her, all of the wild twists and turns that even brought her to knowing that this event in court was taking place.

[28] and how everything came together about sharing her victim impact statement and the justice that was received, but also the cost of the justice that she received.

[29] At the same time as beginning this process of sharing your story, not me, but you sharing your story on something was wrong, season 16.

[30] It was just the craziest timing, and I often, I want to take a moment and say that I often reflect on the capacity that you hold to hold space, for my experiences in trauma, I find you, like, I have a very interesting relationship with a lot of my girlfriends who have layered relationships with their mothers.

[31] They don't have the same capacity a lot of times to hold space for me. Having had the relationship that I did with my mom and the positivity and the memories that I hold, a lot of people don't have the capacity that have been abused by their parents to speak candidly and hold space for me to love on mine so deeply.

[32] So I think about that often.

[33] My mother's day was the best fucking mother's day.

[34] I've ever had, which sounds really weird.

[35] I'm so glad.

[36] You deserve it.

[37] Yeah.

[38] Thank you.

[39] Hadass deserves it.

[40] Please go listen to the update episode, everybody.

[41] It's seriously so moving.

[42] It literally changed my life.

[43] It took me 10 Mother's Days to say that I could like celebrate that day.

[44] The justice that I got that day literally transformed the way I see everything, including Mother's Day.

[45] And that day was just like beautiful.

[46] Also, my kids are just amazing and I love them so hard.

[47] They made the day.

[48] So beautiful.

[49] All I could be is thankful.

[50] There was no reason to not count my blessings that day.

[51] And I hope you have a similar day.

[52] It's so beautiful.

[53] And it makes my heart so happy that you got that because you're so deserving.

[54] My mother's day was great.

[55] I think about cycle breaking.

[56] That's what I think about on Mother's Day.

[57] I try not to think about my mom at all.

[58] What I think about is how proud I am of the mom that I am and how thankful I am for the relationship that I get to have with my kids.

[59] And open cards that say things like happy Mother's Day.

[60] You're the best mom ever.

[61] You're so sweet, funny, and kind.

[62] That was from Ozzy, my youngest.

[63] Then we have Ruby.

[64] Ruby says, I love you so, so much, Mom.

[65] I hope you have the best Mother's Day because you deserve it.

[66] Okay.

[67] Making me cry.

[68] And then we have from my oldest, Jude, dear mom, today is that day for you.

[69] And I'm so happy to have a mother who can feed us and put us in a roof and a mother who cares about friends and family.

[70] P .S. You are the best.

[71] P .S. Keep being yourself.

[72] Like, my kids are the best.

[73] I'm so thankful for them.

[74] Every day is Mother's Day with them.

[75] They're the best.

[76] I'm so thankful that the universe gave me the honor of being their mom.

[77] I know you feel the same way about your kids.

[78] A hundred percent.

[79] The healing that gets to come from breaking those sites.

[80] and creating the environment that you always longed for, for your own children.

[81] As we discuss how the abuse you faced at home heightened, especially, like, not only cyclically, but it kind of snowballed over the years.

[82] Can you speak to how your parents treated Bobby?

[83] Please speak to, like, the difference in treatment that you received and how you really were kind of ostracized, even by your parents' behavior.

[84] It wasn't like you only feeling differently.

[85] they treated you differently as well.

[86] You talked about how Tony received different treatment and that manifested and he was therefore abusive.

[87] He persisted that cycle.

[88] You chose to do differently.

[89] I never felt resentment towards Bobby for not being abused in the same ways that I was.

[90] Now, Bobby was, as listeners I've heard, he experienced a great deal of trauma just by living in the household, seeing myself be abused, seeing Tony be abused, like he was a witness to everything.

[91] So he is also, you know, obviously a victim.

[92] He also had to deal with some really, really, really fucked up stuff that no kid should ever have to deal with.

[93] And I could see that from a very young age.

[94] But when Bobby was born, it was like, all of the sudden, I had purpose in my life.

[95] And I took my role as being his big sister very seriously.

[96] I never wanted anything but the best for him.

[97] But he was absolutely the golden child.

[98] I was the forgotten child.

[99] Tony was the scapegoat child.

[100] And Chad was, I think, a forgotten child to the most extreme extent.

[101] It was like Bob just wanted to forget he ever existed because it didn't fit his narrative.

[102] You mentioned his adeptness and athletics and everything.

[103] When he would have a win like that, would there be any sort of like lull in the abuse at your mom's hands?

[104] Or would she get angrier at you when he had wins?

[105] Do you know what I'm saying?

[106] I'm just curious.

[107] Not that she needed much to elicit anything.

[108] No, she didn't.

[109] But I think if I'm trying to identify an event that may have, for lack of a better term, triggered her rage, it was usually me in her perceived mind embarrassing her, whether that be saying the wrong thing or if somebody saw in public me doing something which she deemed incorrect or just embarrassing her by existing in a way that she didn't approve of, that's usually when the biggest waves of abuse towards me would come from her.

[110] Bobby was always a winner.

[111] I was not jealous, like not happy for him or bitter in any way when I say jealous, but I was jealous and like, man, that must be nice because he's so good at sports.

[112] From a very young age, he was the best player on any team he played on, and this isn't me being biased.

[113] It was known.

[114] The way that I channeled my pain into creativity, my brother channeled his pain into his athletic abilities.

[115] He absolutely could have been in the Olympics for snowboarding or skateboarding later on in life.

[116] He was just incredible.

[117] He just had that physicality and body control and intuitiveness with his body.

[118] Just in case anybody had any doubt, my parents were also terrible, like show parents, sport parents.

[119] Nobody's shocked by that.

[120] But yeah, so of course, they had to like make everything as uncomfortable and competitive as possible.

[121] So there was a lot of that.

[122] And the pressure that was, then put on him over the years to perform and excel became less fun.

[123] He felt that pressure.

[124] It definitely reduced his joy, but it didn't reduce his drive.

[125] If anything, he was somebody who responded.

[126] That's the difference often between people who are professional athletes is that when the pressure is on, they can keep calm and perform and produce the necessary outcomes.

[127] and Bobby was very good at that.

[128] I loved watching my brother play.

[129] I still love sports.

[130] It reminds me of those happy memories, getting to see my brother play sports, enjoying sports together, watching football with my brothers and my dad.

[131] And yeah, it still means a lot to me. He certainly had a lot of pressure put on him and was deeply impacted by my parents' behavior.

[132] and the pressure that was placed on him, the body image abuse that he saw placed on me, which was not hidden, led to both of us having eating disorders at the same time.

[133] I was around 15.

[134] My brother was around 11, 12, and we both were experiencing disordered eating.

[135] My brother playing sports and feeling the pressure to perform quite literally every day.

[136] had a lot to do with that, as well as my mom's constant fat phobia and body image abuse.

[137] Just to, like, paint a picture for people how fatphobic Liz was, if that wasn't clear by now, she saw a picture of a baby, and she was like, oh, my God, I hate that.

[138] I hate when babies are fat.

[139] Who could say hate and babies in one sentence?

[140] The rubber band baby arms are my favorite thing on the planet.

[141] All I want to do is shove my face in them.

[142] and sniff them and kiss them and love them.

[143] All babies are amazing, but that's how fucked, fucked up she is.

[144] That is how deep this goes.

[145] That was so eye -opening to me. It was one of those circumstances where in adulthood I was waking up to this shit and repeated it to somebody laughing.

[146] Like, what in the world?

[147] How could anybody possibly look at a baby and be judging the baby?

[148] Like a literal infant baby.

[149] What are you talking?

[150] about.

[151] So, so bizarre.

[152] It's so backwards.

[153] Something is wrong.

[154] You think you know me. You don't know me well.

[155] I'm Dan Tiberski.

[156] In 2011, something strange began to happen at the high school in Leroy, New York.

[157] I was like at my locker and she came up to me and she was like stuttering super bad.

[158] I'm like, stop fucking around.

[159] She's like, I can't.

[160] A mystery illness, bizarre symptoms and spreading fast.

[161] It's like doubling and tripling and it's all these girls.

[162] With a diagnosis, the state tried to keep on the download.

[163] Everybody thought I was holding something back.

[164] Well, you were holding something back intentionally.

[165] Yeah, well, yeah.

[166] No, it's hysteria.

[167] It's all in your head.

[168] It's not physical.

[169] Oh, my gosh, you're exaggerating.

[170] Is this the largest mass hysteria since the Witches of Salem?

[171] Or is it something else entirely?

[172] Something's wrong here.

[173] Something's not right.

[174] Leroy was the new date line and everyone was trying to solve the murder.

[175] A new limited series from Wondery and Pineapple Street Studios.

[176] Hysterical.

[177] Follow Hysterical on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts.

[178] You can binge all episodes of hysterical early and ad -free right now by joining Wondry Plus.

[179] Scammers are best known for living the high life until they're forced to trade it all in for handcuffs and an orange jumpsuit once they're finally caught.

[180] I'm Sachi Cole.

[181] And I'm Sarah Hagee.

[182] And we're the host of scam influencers, a weekly podcast from Wondery that takes you along the twists and turns of some of the most infamous scams of all times.

[183] time, the impact on victims and what's left once the facade falls away.

[184] We've covered stories like a Shark Tank certified entrepreneur who left the show with an investment, but soon faced mounting bills, an active lawsuit followed by Larry King, and no real product to push.

[185] He then began to prey on vulnerable women instead, selling the idea of a future together while stealing from them behind their backs.

[186] To the infamous scams of real housewife stars like Teresa Judice, what should have proven to be a major downfall only seem to solidify her place in the Real Housewives Hall of Fame.

[187] Follow scam influencers on the Wondry app or wherever you get your podcasts.

[188] You can listen to Scamfluencers early and ad free right now on Wondry Plus.

[189] After the incident of seeing Bob on the news, I don't recall it ever being revisited or getting any sort of follow -up information in those matters.

[190] I recall, like most things, it was preceded by lots of screaming, substance use and fighting, which was pretty typical.

[191] After the homecoming dress conversation where my mother said the horrific things about my inability to essentially have value unless I lost weight, I decided to start starving myself and I began working out obsessively.

[192] Over the summer, between freshman year of high school and sophomore year, I lost around 100 pounds through starvation and jogging outside in the Sacramento heat for the summer.

[193] I was heavily encouraged by my parents to continue this behavior, to eat as little as possible, and to exercise as much as possible.

[194] My mom started saying she was proud of me, and that felt, really good for the first time to be received that way.

[195] And I became fixated on getting as small as possible.

[196] When I returned to Christian school for a short time, the beginning of sophomore year, I'll never forget walking down the hallway the first week or so of school and the way that I was received as if I was a completely different person.

[197] It was like I finally had value to so many people that needed me to apparently lose the weight to see who I really was.

[198] There was like many boys who were upperclassmen that I thought were cute that came up to me and commented to me about my new body and congratulating me and it felt really good.

[199] It felt really validating and I wanted as much of that feeling as I could get.

[200] I asked my parents if I lose 50 pounds, can I have my belly button pierced?

[201] And they agreed, of course.

[202] Once I lost 100 pounds, I was able to go to public school again.

[203] It felt good to have a fresh start.

[204] I knew some people from the scene and from concerts and shows that I went to and started hanging out with the punk rock kids.

[205] My parents were giving me way more positive attention and I was getting a lot more positive attention at school.

[206] It felt really good.

[207] It felt really validating.

[208] And it also confirmed almost the things that my mom had said to me in the car.

[209] She had said no one's ever going to love you or people are going to see you differently or treat you differently or think differently about you.

[210] And so a lot of that behavior confirmed those things and made me want to starve myself more.

[211] Reading was another way that I often escaped my reality.

[212] When I was younger, I was obsessed with the R .L. Stein goosebumps and Fear Street books, any sort of mystery novels.

[213] My favorite book was, and it's still one of my favorite books, to kill a mockingbird.

[214] Another book that really impacted me as a young adult was a book called Speak.

[215] It's about a young girl in high school who is sexually assaulted.

[216] I also took several writing classes.

[217] When I got into this public high school, I took a creative writing class.

[218] I often and didn't get very good grades or wasn't one to do well testing -wise.

[219] However, reading and English were my strongest subjects.

[220] In public high school at Placer High School, I had this amazing creative writing teacher.

[221] He would give us a lot of freedom and the things that we could write about.

[222] I started to write about the things that would happen in my family and try to do it in a humorous and irreverent way to sort of help cope with the tragedies that I was writing about.

[223] We would often read our pieces that we would work on.

[224] As I got braver and read more stories in front of people in my class, I found that people were laughing a lot.

[225] My teacher was really encouraging me to continue to hone that skill.

[226] He made me feel like I was really talented in that area.

[227] My peers also made me feel that way, and that was much more gratifying than the types of praise that I would receive about my appearance or weight loss.

[228] I'm very, very thankful to that teacher for believing in me, supporting me, and encouraging me. I never cut that class.

[229] I cut a lot of other classes, but that was not one that I ever wanted to miss, and he was a fantastic teacher.

[230] But at Placer High, started a punk rock band called PMS, and that led to making even more friends.

[231] And that's actually how I met Michael.

[232] I remember showing up, and we were there early to get, load our stuff into this weird gym auditorium, totally not meant for playing music in.

[233] Somebody pointed Tiffany out to me, like, oh, there's Tiffany over there.

[234] And I was like, oh, you know, I should go introduce myself, having no idea how to actually introduce myself to anybody.

[235] I was terribly socially awkward from many years of homeschooling and really struggling to make eye contact with anybody due to that social anxiety.

[236] But knowing I needed to meet Tiffany, I decided the best thing to do was to compliment her.

[237] So I walked up to her in a group of friends and I said, excuse me, are you Tiffany?

[238] And she turned and looked at me like with a side eye and was like, yeah.

[239] That's so not true.

[240] And I said, oh, I love your hat or your dress.

[241] I don't remember what it was, but one of them was sparkly.

[242] And he looked at me and just like, thanks.

[243] And then just like whipped your hair around and started laughing at me with your friends.

[244] That's so not true.

[245] First of all, I was drunk.

[246] I went back to my friends and decided not to be friends with Tiffany from that point on until a few years later.

[247] The funniest thing about that show while I'm thinking of it, afterwards, my dad was shuasted.

[248] My dad said to me in fucking full seriousness, and it was our worst show we ever played, worst show we ever played.

[249] And he said to me in all seriousness, Tiffany, you guys are so good.

[250] You could be on Good Morning of Fucking America.

[251] As much as I loved going to shows and playing music and hanging out with those friends, I was putting myself in a lot of unhealthy and sketchy situations, partying a lot, drinking a lot, smoking pot, being out of control.

[252] It was like, hey, I'm going to go to my friend's house for the weekend.

[253] I'd just be gone.

[254] A lot of high -risk, scary situations and behaviors that I put myself in actively.

[255] I was very traumatized and I was trying to cope any way that I could.

[256] A lot of the kids that I hung out with came from similar households and we kind of found each other.

[257] I thought I was really grown up because of the trauma that I had already experienced and the environment in which I grew up and not feeling like a kid.

[258] At 16, I felt like I was ready to go.

[259] I was ready to be done with these people and with their life.

[260] And once I got my driver's license and started to see that I could potentially be better off and do better as a human being away from them, away from my parents, I started focusing heavily on that.

[261] After losing weight, my parents would encourage me to dress sexier as a 15 and 16 year old.

[262] One day my mom was driving us to school in the morning and she just said to me, you know, Now that you've lost weight, you could really wear shorter skirts.

[263] It just seems really weird and inappropriate.

[264] When Bobby's eating disorder became undeniable, they put him into treatment.

[265] When my disorder became a parent, they encouraged it at all costs.

[266] One time after I had lost this weight, I was eating something that my mom would have deemed inappropriate.

[267] She, like, walked into the kitchen and saw me eating.

[268] She looked at me so disappointed and she was like, that's not you.

[269] That's the old you.

[270] It's like she thought of me as a completely different person.

[271] She really told on herself a lot.

[272] A few months before the discovery of my father's first legal charges in 2003, he had won salesman of the year and we had gone on a trip that he won for that award.

[273] In the pictures from that trip, it's so obvious how unwell my brother and I were and how much we were starving ourselves.

[274] I think that was the last trip that Bobby and I would ever take together.

[275] I remember we went snorkeling and we played tennis and we had a good time despite the misery.

[276] Today is Friday, April 14th, 2003.

[277] And I am going to go through a box of stuff from my childhood that I haven't looked at in a really long time and see if it helps bring back any memories.

[278] Concert, Flyer.

[279] This is the set list from my 16th birthday that I threw for myself.

[280] I coordinated a 12 -band show, rented a facility, charged a cover.

[281] Let's see how many ex -polyfriends are on this list.

[282] 210, 2002 Blackhawk Down movie ticket.

[283] Like, I can't, who convinced me to see that?

[284] Not a Miller's Outpost, $20 off your purchase valid through March of 2002.

[285] Glad I hung out into that.

[286] Oh, a Josie and the PussyCats movie release tattoo unused.

[287] Must save forever.

[288] California State Fair ticket.

[289] If you haven't been to the California State Fair, then I don't think you're actually from Sacramento.

[290] No. It's a postcard for my brother.

[291] May 2000.

[292] Dear Tiffany, hope you have a fun time with your friends at science camp.

[293] Love Bobby, smiley face.

[294] Oh my god, and the stamp is 33.

[295] That's my lucky number.

[296] That's my brother's football number.

[297] That was like my sports number as well.

[298] Oh, here's a postcard from my dad.

[299] This is the most fucking bobheading shit ever.

[300] Oh my god.

[301] Okay, so this is a this is a postcard he sent to me at camp.

[302] Tiffany, I love you with all my heart.

[303] We're buying house today in Tahoe.

[304] It's brand new.

[305] 2 ,600 square feet.

[306] It's being built for us.

[307] Love dad.

[308] Thanks so much for the real estate notice.

[309] I got this and I had a fucking panic attack because I'm like, wait, we're moving to Tahoe.

[310] So I remember like calling them and crying because I thought that's what this meant.

[311] And then they said it was going to be a quote vacation house.

[312] But who knows what they knew.

[313] I don't know how they paid for that house.

[314] That must have been during the financial planner years.

[315] On a very fateful day in 2002, there was a knock at the door.

[316] Both of my parents were home.

[317] I don't recall either of my brothers being home when this occurred.

[318] I heard my mom go to the door.

[319] I heard her open the door.

[320] Some sort of exchange took place.

[321] And then I heard her scream out.

[322] and I heard yelling between Bob and Liz.

[323] I stepped out of my room and I went to the stairs.

[324] When I reached the stairs, my mom was vomiting on the ground, crying, saying, we're so fucked.

[325] We're all fucked.

[326] Like, you've fucked us.

[327] How could you do this?

[328] Bob just deny, deny, deny.

[329] Acts shocked.

[330] She's clearly coming under.

[331] done and he is gaslighting her, that this is nothing, that he is being targeted because of his success, and that it was all going to get worked out, and that it was going to be fine.

[332] Liz did not believe him.

[333] She did not buy it.

[334] And I just remember her being basically unreachable and unavailable for a good year after that, in terms of how intoxicated she was regularly her lack of function.

[335] She was a non -functioning person.

[336] Part of whatever that paperwork said, that legal paperwork that was upsetting, which I didn't understand or know, the circumstances, the way that Bob had explained it to me, he made it sound like it was something to do with taxes, like he had done something to the government that the government was upset at him with.

[337] He was able to sort of justify it or try to justify it to me that way.

[338] And being that I was a kid and have no idea how those things work, really, I took it at face value.

[339] I wanted to believe what he was saying, that this was all a misunderstanding and that it was going to go away and be taken care of over the following months.

[340] It became clear that that was the case.

[341] As part of their response to this news, they sold their Auburn house and they let us know that we would all be moving.

[342] I was very upset because I didn't want to switch schools again.

[343] I felt that I had made some really good friends.

[344] I didn't want to start over again.

[345] I had grown really attached to the people I felt close to at that time, and I was sick of starting over.

[346] It was an especially difficult transition.

[347] She struck him with her motor vehicle.

[348] She had been under the influence and she left him there.

[349] In January 2022, local woman Karen Reed was implicated in the mysterious death of her boyfriend, Boston police officer John O 'Keefe.

[350] It was alleged that after an innocent night out for drinks with friends, Karen and John got into a lover's quarrel and route to the next location.

[351] What happens next depends on who you ask.

[352] Was it a crime of passion?

[353] If you believe the prosecution, it's because the evidence was so compelling.

[354] This was clearly an intentional act.

[355] And his cause of death was blunt force trauma with hypothermia.

[356] Or a corrupt police cover -up.

[357] If you believe the defense theory, however, this was all a cover -up to prevent one of their own from going down.

[358] Everyone had an opinion.

[359] And after the 10 -week trial, the jury could not come to a unanimous decision.

[360] To end in a mistrial, it's just a confirmation of just how complicated this case is.

[361] Law and crime presents the most in -depth analysis to date of the sensational case in Karen.

[362] You can listen to Karen exclusively with Wondry Plus.

[363] Join Wondery Plus in the Wondry app, Apple Podcasts, or Spotify.

[364] Emerald Bay is like heaven on earth if you've never been.

[365] and it's one of the most gorgeous, peaceful, awe -inspiring places.

[366] No matter how many times I've gone, it's incredible.

[367] My brother and I would have so much fun, wakeboarding, snowboarding, being outside.

[368] It's just a gorgeous place.

[369] Being outside was way better than being trapped inside with our parents, trying to focus on our lives outside of our parents as much as possible.

[370] I applied for a full -time job at 16 at having, heavenly ski resort in South Lake Tahoe.

[371] I remember going to the interview.

[372] My parents were very encouraging me of me of this.

[373] They would tell me, yeah, you should probably learn how to like start paying your way and figuring out how to take care of yourself because we are so fucked now that we, one, might be in prison and two, definitely have very little money right now.

[374] Bob being Bob, you would get loans from past clients or do his little scheming, his moving money around or starting a new thing or whatever he would do.

[375] somehow they would still be able to keep it together for a little bit.

[376] The woman that interviewed me, she was rad as hell.

[377] Her husband was in a punk band, and I had told her about being in bands and telling her about that, and she hired me on the spot.

[378] My first day, when I went in to fill out my paperwork, she was like, you're 16?

[379] And I was like, yeah.

[380] And she said, we're not supposed to hire for the ticket office under 18, but I already hired you, so we're just going to let it happen.

[381] She was hella cool, and I think she could see that I was wanting to work.

[382] I started high school at South Lake Tahoe High School.

[383] I went for maybe a week or two, and I was just like, I'm not doing this again.

[384] I have switched schools so many times in my life.

[385] I need to get away from these people.

[386] So I went to them, and I basically was like, I'm going to go on homeschool so I can work full -time, so I can save money, so I can go to college earlier.

[387] And my parents were like, okay.

[388] I discovered that in Nevada, like an hour from where we lived, I could test out of high school at 16, whereas in the state of California, you had to wait to be 17.

[389] I figured that out.

[390] I went on a Saturday.

[391] I tested out of high school, had a full -time job, and was paying for all my own stuff, paying my own way, going to college and paying for it myself.

[392] Casual.

[393] All of the people that I worked with during that time were in college.

[394] a lot of people that came from other countries that would work at the ski resort because the ski resort had an exchange program with colleges whose summer is during our winter.

[395] So like Australia and New Zealand, they would come during their school summer, which was our winter, work and live in the dorms.

[396] So it was kind of like a college experience working at the ski resort.

[397] I always worked hard and I've been pretty much promoted.

[398] at every job I've ever had because I take things seriously and I always try to do my best.

[399] The reason why I bring up the people that I worked with age is because I didn't see myself as underage partying with a bunch of people who are older than me. When I worked at the ski resort, I made friends with a young woman who I got very close to and she had a boyfriend.

[400] They were a few years older than me, probably three or four years older than me. one night they were celebrating one of the guys from Ireland's 21st birthday there was like 12 people from Ireland all living in this house they hired a sex worker my friend's boyfriend he knew that I was bisexual I was open about that and he was like let me get you a lap dance and I was like no no no I don't want that well he paid her and she like started giving me the lap dance I remember whispering in her ear please stop or something and she immediately left me alone which I was thinking thankful for.

[401] But later that night, we got back to my friend's house, the girl, who was dating this guy, and she decided she needed to take a shower.

[402] We had work in the morning together.

[403] I laid down.

[404] I was very intoxicated by this point.

[405] And I had started to go to sleep.

[406] And I woke up to her boyfriend sexually assaulting me. When he was assaulting me, I tried to make it stop, and it didn't.

[407] My friend came out of the shower.

[408] He had a blanket and he had rolled off, but she could tell that she was like, what are you doing?

[409] And he said, she was just trying to get me to mess around with her.

[410] And I just pretended to be asleep.

[411] I didn't know what to do.

[412] I was afraid that my friend was going to believe him and be mad at me. I felt like it was my fault because I had been drinking.

[413] I wanted to pretend it didn't happen.

[414] Bisexual women are sexually assaulted at the rate of about 61%, making them one of the highest groups of people to be sexually assaulted.

[415] That was surprising for me to learn later when I would work on the podcast.

[416] I don't know if it was a crime of opportunity or if he saw me in a different way because of my sexuality, but that's when I stopped being open about that and stopped telling new people I met that I was bisexual.

[417] I never told my girlfriend.

[418] I would later move away and her and I stayed in touch through things like Friendster and then MySpace and then Facebook later after they had broken up and it had been several years.

[419] I felt like I needed to tell her.

[420] I wanted to share it with her and so I messaged her.

[421] We haven't spoken in a long time.

[422] I know that I witnessed some things in your relationship that we're unhealthy and we've spoken about those things.

[423] I wanted to let you know that part of the reason that we grew apart over the years as you continued to date him is because he did this to me. I don't remember the full message back, but I remember it included the phrase the last time I saw him, the police were removing him from my house.

[424] So this doesn't surprise me. Thank you for sharing for that with me. And I'm so sorry.

[425] So you sharing that.

[426] actually almost validated her own experiences to a certain degree.

[427] I hope so.

[428] Before the sexual assault happened, there was a period of time where I was considering moving to L .A. for school with these two individuals.

[429] The boyfriend who sexually assaulted me was from Southern California.

[430] And we were supposed to stay with his mom and sister.

[431] We were going to go look at the college and get a feel for the area and stuff like that.

[432] I want to say it's probably eight to ten hours from where we were living.

[433] When we got there, within the first few hours of entering his mom and sister's home where they lived together, there was this really strange incident where somebody said something like, oh my gosh, I'm going to cry, jokingly.

[434] And the sister turned to my friend and said, you want to cry?

[435] I can make you cry.

[436] I'll tell you some stories that would really make you cry.

[437] I remember being so effing confused.

[438] What are these people talking about?

[439] I didn't know anything about their relationship.

[440] I don't know what was going on, but I know that we had to leave and we were supposed to stay with them for like a week.

[441] And we ended up having to stay at some really crappy hotels instead because we were super broke.

[442] And those are the only hotels we could afford.

[443] Now, in hindsight, I'm like, I wonder what that was about.

[444] I wonder if he abused his sister or if he had done something that she knew about.

[445] Because he immediate was like, let's go.

[446] Got us out of there so fast.

[447] It was very strange.

[448] But yeah, I appreciate your validation and support.

[449] I never, ever considered pursuing legal charges ever.

[450] If you want to talk about statistics that are really shocking, the number of actually reported rapists or assaulters, like sexual assaults that are pursued in court, there's like 1 % of them or actually, or something insane.

[451] 2 .5.

[452] Thank you.

[453] 2 .5 out of 100 perpetrators are prosecuted and actually end up in jail or prison.

[454] That's a current statistic.

[455] That is a huge deterrent to people who would even think of filing.

[456] Yeah.

[457] I had been working full time at Heavenly Ski Resort for quite a while and had attended a few semesters of college after what took place with my friend's boyfriend and my parents' continued behavior.

[458] I devised a plan to get out of there.

[459] I went online and I started researching.

[460] colleges that would let you attend under the age of 18.

[461] There was several junior colleges in the state that would allow you to live in the dorms under the age of 18.

[462] So I went to my dad and I convinced him to agree to this.

[463] Something that my mom told me in later years was that she preferred the time that I was away because she could feel less self -conscious about how intoxicated she would become.

[464] She later on told me that that was one of the reasons that she constantly tried to push me away and alienate me was that I held her to accountable.

[465] I found a college in Humboldt County, the Emerald Triangle, one of my absolute favorite places on the entire planet that I've ever had the opportunity to go to.

[466] It is so gorgeous and it's like the Pacific Northwest, but in California.

[467] It's on the border -ish of California, Northern California, and Oregon.

[468] It's also the weed capital of the world.

[469] But I went to a college called College of the Redwoods.

[470] So at 17, it was in my third semester of college.

[471] It was definitely a party town.

[472] Weed culture was obviously very prevalent as it is, as you do, which I was fine with.

[473] However, what was very very, uncool was how many people were doing cocaine in the dorms.

[474] After a semester, I was pretty much feeling like, this is a bit too much for me. I was feeling ready to go.

[475] The most popular girl in school at the Christian school that I talked about before, Madge, she and I had stayed friends throughout changing schools.

[476] She had heard a little bit about what was going on with my family and where I was living and how I was feeling about being there and talk to her mom about it.

[477] And they offered for me to come live with them.

[478] I then moved out of my dorm room and I moved into a bedroom in my friend Madge's house.

[479] I lived with them for probably six to nine months.

[480] Honestly, that was one of the first times I think I felt safe staying somewhere, like at peace.

[481] I had virtually nothing in my room when I stayed there, but I was very thankful and still am very thankful to her and her family for opening their home to me. I started dating somebody very quickly it became serious.

[482] I was really focused on that relationship, going to school and hanging out with my friends and going to shows.

[483] I joined a different band, another band called Invisible Inc. It was very much giving email.

[484] As I got older though, I was able to start creating so many happy memories for myself too.

[485] My relationship with Madge or my ex -boyfriend or friends, I was able to see the joy and human connection that can come from safe relationships and people outside of the home and starting to experience more of the real world and the differences between all of the versions of the world I had kind of been told about through school or home or media.

[486] I was experiencing it for the first time as a young adult.

[487] It was great that I was able to focus on myself.

[488] I would still hear about a lot of my parents' behavior and things like that through my brothers.

[489] When Bobby was in eighth grade, Bobby and his best friend played on a sports team together.

[490] They had some sort of either team party or after a practice.

[491] They had gone to the lake.

[492] They were all swimming together and Bobby's best friend drowned and died in front of the whole team of boys.

[493] I was not living there at this time, and I felt very guilty that I was not there.

[494] I did travel back for the funeral.

[495] It was incredibly gutting and heartbreaking and emotional and impacted Bobby greatly, understandably.

[496] After this was when I found out that Bob would be, for sure, going to jail.

[497] for the 2003 crimes and because honestly they could not afford to live there anymore.

[498] Bob and Liz were forced to sell the Tahoe House as well.

[499] Bob took some of the money to prepay in cash and rent a rental house in Auburn for one year for Liz and Bobby to live in while he would be in jail.

[500] Bobby actually started attending the high school that I attended in Auburn, Placer High School.

[501] Bob begged me to come live at the rental house to help take care of Bobby.

[502] I also didn't have enough money to afford to live on my own.

[503] California is very expensive and I was still newly 18.

[504] I didn't make it the whole year, but I did stay there for some months.

[505] When Bobby was a freshman in high school, when we moved into this house, was when I knew of that he had begun drinking, parting a bit more and being a bit more rebellious.

[506] It was really difficult everything he had been through, especially the loss of his best friend, then also Bob's going to jail and the witness of Liz's unraveling and substance he, use in response to those traumas was very severe, especially at this time.

[507] So I was happy in a way to be in the home to look out for people, but I was also sensitive and deeply impacted.

[508] So it was a struggle.

[509] I also was in college and working multiple jobs to put myself through college.

[510] I had no financial support.

[511] Although my dad didn't go to prison for tax -related stuff, what he told me about the taxes was true.

[512] When I entered college, I had questioned Bob about his tax returns and needing those tax returns in order to apply for student loans for college.

[513] I was made aware that Bob hadn't paid his taxes for several, several years.

[514] And unfortunately, because Bob had not paid his taxes in so many years, I actually was unable to apply for student loans.

[515] I met with several counselors.

[516] There was nothing that anyone could do.

[517] So I had no choice but to put myself through school.

[518] I worked as much as possible.

[519] I did that shit.

[520] I navigated some of the most heartbreaking years of my life while working multiple jobs and putting myself through college.

[521] I'm very proud of myself for that.

[522] The last time my mom would ever physically assault me was in this house.

[523] And that's because I finally got to a place where I no longer allowed it to physically happen.

[524] Bob was in jail the first time.

[525] She was drinking so heavily and didn't have Bob to direct some of her rage at.

[526] So she became extra volatile towards me during the months that I tried to, to live there and navigate it.

[527] This is when she told me I just wasn't the daughter that she wanted and that she wanted a prettier daughter and a skinnier daughter and a daughter that looked like a cheerleader, whatever that means to her.

[528] And she would also comment that I looked like shit and if I didn't take better care of myself or if I didn't like put more of an effort into my outfits and my makeup that my boyfriend was just going to get bored of me and leave me. She would also say whatever she could to poke at me, to push me away.

[529] I was home during the day.

[530] I don't believe anyone else was home.

[531] I was changing in between school and work or work in school.

[532] And she had tried to talk to me about something.

[533] I said something she didn't like and she got mad and she physically attacked me. We were in the hallway.

[534] It was a small house.

[535] We were in the grabbing at my hair.

[536] I was much taller and stronger than her by this point.

[537] And it had been maybe a couple years since she had tried to physically assault me. I pushed her off of me and she fell back into the wall a bit.

[538] And I said, don't ever put your fucking hands on me, ever again.

[539] She had a look in her eye like she knew that I meant it.

[540] This season on something was wrong.

[541] Them tossing your room, tossing your whole house, looking for whatever evidence, and you not really understanding what the whole deal was about, just knowing that your dad had done something again.

[542] I found something very shocking.

[543] Oh, my fucking God, what is this?

[544] No. Fuck.

[545] This article is from March, 2003.

[546] When I found out who wrote it, it was really eye -opening.

[547] I also remember feeling like, fuck.

[548] I worked for him.

[549] Am I going to be arrested?

[550] Am I going to be charged with these same things that he did, even though I literally had no idea what was going on, being very scared at that time.

[551] Thank you so much for listening.

[552] Until next time, stay safe, friends.

[553] Something Was Wrong is a Broken Cycle Media production, created and hosted by me, Tiffany Reese.

[554] If you'd like to support the show further, you can share episodes with your love, loved ones, leave a positive review, or follow Something Was Wrong on Instagram at Something Was Wrong podcast.

[555] Our theme song was composed by Gladrags.

[556] Check out their album, Wonder Under.

[557] Thank you so much.

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