JRE MMA Show #132 with Joaquin Buckley

[0] Joe Rogan podcast checking out The Joe Rogan experience Train by day, Joe Rogan podcast by night All day Mr. Buckley, how are you, sir?

[1] Man, I'm doing good, Joe Good to have you in here, man, man, thanks for having me. You are the owner of the most highlighted, the most viral video in the history of MMA, I think.

[2] That fucking jump, Spending Backkick to the face?

[3] Yeah, yeah, yeah, I think so, man. You know, it took a minute for me to actually, like, think that it is, you know what I mean?

[4] Because there's so many other, like, awesome knockouts out there.

[5] you know, like my man, you know, Dan Hendo over, you know, Bisbee, you know, with the H -Bomb.

[6] And then with my man Esen Barboza with the, you know, spinning hill kick on Terry Edom, you know.

[7] And, like, for instance, and Ganoo, you know what I'm saying, like, just so many, like, different heavy hitters out there with great chaos, you know.

[8] But once I really, like, sat back and looked at it and it took some time to actually, like, take everything in, I'm like, yeah, that's pretty dope.

[9] Well, yours was crazy because he's holding one foot and you jump spinning back, kick him in the face with the other foot.

[10] Yeah.

[11] I mean, that is just wild.

[12] I mean, have you ever done that in a fight before?

[13] No, so that was my first time.

[14] So, you know, if you want to really hear it, man, it's a long story with it because nobody taught me that kick, you know.

[15] Like, I never had an instructor.

[16] Really?

[17] No, not at all.

[18] You know, I was just fascinated with martial arts, you know, since I was a little kid, you know, and, you know, once I got, you know, started with MMA and stuff like that, the gym where I came from, it could only teach so much.

[19] The instructors only knew so much, you know what I mean?

[20] It was just like a mom and pop, you know, gym type stuff where, you know, a lot of, you People just get there to, you know, get into shape, you know.

[21] Right.

[22] But overall, though, when I used to go on YouTube, I used to watch a lot of different videos, you know, on how to, you know, not just train as a mixed martial artist, but just to learn, like, different moves and techniques from different disciplines from different disciplines from different, right?

[23] And then I looked at the disciplines, I looked at who are the best people in it, right?

[24] And then I looked at different people.

[25] that's in those disciplines, whatever.

[26] And guess who I ran into when I got into Taekwondo?

[27] I seen one of your videos.

[28] No, no, for real, for real.

[29] On you taught George St. Pierre, like, how to correctly throw the spinning back kick.

[30] Yeah.

[31] You know what I mean?

[32] But you at first showed them how to throw the sidekick.

[33] And I used to watch those videos, you know, over and over again, you know.

[34] And then it evolved when I seen Raymond Daniels perform the two touch.

[35] Oh, my God.

[36] Yeah, he did that two touch.

[37] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[38] That's probably one of the biggest highlight reels in kickboxing history.

[39] Big facts, right?

[40] But I seen that, I was like, man, that's dope because it's a level up from what you're showing, right?

[41] So I used to perform that on the bag, on the heavy bag, all the time.

[42] And people are like, man, what are you doing?

[43] Like, whatever.

[44] But I used to generate so much power when I used to balance, you know, my right foot on her, because not my right, but my left foot because I would come in like a roundhouse kick because I'm a softball.

[45] I would balance on the bag and then I would prepare myself off the bag and I was spin.

[46] And we used to make this hard pop like a shotgun, right?

[47] And we would bend the entire bag.

[48] So I'm like, bro, I feel like so powerful, like, throwing this kick.

[49] I mean, but regardless, though, just seeing these people, like, do this stuff and just learning from them and just imitating these moves, you know, years later, then I end up performing that kick.

[50] You know who's got some of the best instructionals of that of, like, traditional kicks, like sidekicks and turning sidekakes?

[51] Michael Jai White.

[52] I'm already hip.

[53] I'm already hip.

[54] Watch the thousand.

[55] Michael Jai White has some sharp technique.

[56] Yeah, big facts, big facts.

[57] And on top of that, even before him, Bill Superfoot Wildest.

[58] Oh, yeah.

[59] Come on now.

[60] You know what I mean?

[61] So, you know.

[62] Well, he had the best hook kick.

[63] ever.

[64] His hook kick was incredible.

[65] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[66] And it's the thing.

[67] He only had one knee.

[68] His knee was fucked up.

[69] Yeah, big facts.

[70] Yep.

[71] And that's why, because he used to do, like, judo, you know, he used to do throws and stuff.

[72] He couldn't do it anymore, so he ended up transitioning just to kickboxing.

[73] But he taught himself how to just fight on that one side, you know, make himself, you know, just like a line hard to hit, you know, but he made his leg like a jab, you know what I mean?

[74] He would stick guys, but he would hit with a roundhouse, like you said, a hill hook kick, you know what I'm saying?

[75] Or just like, just like, spinning back kick as well you know if you can find a highlight of Bill's superfoot Wallace oh man it got plenty because because the fact that he only used one leg because he had one knee that was just really fucked up so he couldn't kick with it so because he did everything off that one leg his one leg had so much dexterity yeah yeah it's like that old school quote from bruce lee yeah that's why i used to watch i used to watch stuff like this all the time you know and it's cool just coming back to it and he was so fast too with it like it was hard to see yeah Yeah, this is old school.

[76] And he would joke around about, like, you know, the camera not being fast enough to see his feet, you know.

[77] Yeah.

[78] But he had the very best kicks off the front leg.

[79] Yeah, yeah, man. He's still getting after.

[80] He's still getting after.

[81] I don't want to try to be funny, but I think my man's still alive, yeah.

[82] Yeah, I think he is too.

[83] He did commentary in the first UFCs.

[84] Yes, he did, yeah.

[85] In the very early days.

[86] Yeah.

[87] So he's still out there.

[88] Look at that.

[89] So this is just a year ago.

[90] Yep, yep.

[91] Good for him.

[92] Yeah, man. Well, see if you can find some of his fights because he knocked a lot.

[93] a lot of people out with those little kids.

[94] Yeah, just try to put, like, verses and it'll pop up on its own, so, like, be a super foot.

[95] And there's, like, verse and then there's show.

[96] It was just so hard for people to deal with.

[97] Oh, that was in a force of one.

[98] Yeah, yeah.

[99] I think he fought this guy named Joe Lewis.

[100] Yeah, Joe Lewis down there.

[101] And Ray and Cowell is that one right there.

[102] Oh, there is a good one.

[103] So Joe Lewis, not the heavyweight boxer, but the heavyweight kickboxer was a legendary karate fighter.

[104] Yeah, exactly, yeah.

[105] And this is a fun fight to watch.

[106] And look at that.

[107] Boom!

[108] That style with that front leg.

[109] The thing about that style, though, I always wondered, like, how would those guys do against, like, a Muay guy through leg kicks?

[110] Because we saw that with, you know, with a lot of fighters that had that style once they encounter, like Rick Rufus.

[111] Once they encountered leg kicks, they got kind of fucked up until they realized how to deal with it and how to use the leg kicks.

[112] Then Rick Rufus became an incredible leg kicker.

[113] Well, I mean, perfect example.

[114] So Peter Cunningham.

[115] Yes.

[116] So you know who Peter Cunning is?

[117] Oh, Superfoot.

[118] Sugarfoot.

[119] Sugarfoot.

[120] Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[121] So, but he fought more Thai guys and used to whoop their head.

[122] Yes, because he could throw leg kicks.

[123] Yeah, he could throw leg kicks and he had hands.

[124] Yes, he had everything.

[125] Yeah, yeah, bro.

[126] That's like the beautiful thing about MMA is we're seeing all those techniques being incorporated.

[127] Yeah.

[128] Like a guy like you who can do all the other things.

[129] Now you're learning, jump spinning, back kicks and all this other stuff.

[130] See, I always assumed watching you fight that you had some sort of a traditional martial arts back ground because you throw so many sidekicks and they're so clean they're so sharp i i assume uh i guess i can attribute that all from martial arts movies that's wild literally all from martial arts like people think it's a joke but literally when i was a kid you know uh you know just growing up you know i mean my mom you know raised me she was you know single mother and stuff like that so she can only do so much you know i mean so i was on the tv all the time that's what raised me you know just watching just watching big facts you know uh because i was around a lot of women you know so when she needed help.

[131] I was with my godmother, Erica, and stuff like that.

[132] And I was with, you know, my guys' sisters and stuff like that.

[133] So there was a lot of, you know, women around.

[134] So I was looking for male influences and the fastest way I could find it was just on TV.

[135] You know what I mean?

[136] So just looking at Bruce Lee, looking at Jackie Chan, looking like Michael Chow White, Donnie and Tony Jha.

[137] Like these are guys.

[138] I'm like, oh, man, I want to be like them.

[139] You know what I mean?

[140] So, yeah.

[141] It's amazing how many people got influenced to fighting and to traditional martial arts from movies.

[142] Big facts.

[143] Yeah.

[144] Some of the greatest kickboxes will tell you who, Bruce Lee.

[145] Yeah, Bruce Lee is the one that got him into it, you know.

[146] It's the best salesperson ever is those movies.

[147] Yeah, Vic Fax.

[148] I mean, you look at, like, the emergence of karate academies in the country after Bruce Lee movies, like, through the roof.

[149] Yep, yep.

[150] Everybody wanted to learn.

[151] Mm -hmm.

[152] Including Chuck Norris, you know.

[153] Yes.

[154] Yeah, including Chuck Norris.

[155] So when you, what was your first actual, like, coaching in martial arts?

[156] My first coaching, that was the gym at Finney's MMA.

[157] And how old were then?

[158] I was 18.

[159] I started.

[160] As soon as I got out of high school, man. man, because school wasn't for me at the time, man. You know what I'm saying?

[161] I was like, you know, not taking it seriously, but, you know, I just always wanted to be a part of martial arts, you know, when I was younger.

[162] And I knew that wrestling was going to be a great foundation of starting.

[163] You know, so when I was in middle school, got into high school, whatever, I got into wrestling.

[164] And then after that, after I graduated, went to Finney's M .A. So when you were wrestling in high school, were you thinking that you were doing this to prepare to fight?

[165] Yeah.

[166] Yeah.

[167] Well, I mean, like, low -key, but, like, I knew, like, that's what I wanted to do.

[168] and it was the closest thing to a discipline, to a martial arts discipline, is wrestling.

[169] That's the only thing.

[170] And probably the most important thing.

[171] I wasn't good at football, wasn't good at basketball, wasn't good at baseball, you know what I mean?

[172] Couldn't catch water if I fell out of boat.

[173] You know what I'm saying?

[174] So my biggest thing is like, you know, I never really liked sports anyway.

[175] It's just martial arts.

[176] And the only thing that I could apply those skills to was wrestling, you know, because my mom didn't want to put me into, like, any karate.

[177] Oh, that stuff costs money, you know, at the end of day, but wrestling was free.

[178] And so when you first got into actual coaching, you already knew, how to kick then just from watching movies and shit uh somewhat i want to say i actually knew how to kick but like that's where it's imitation you know what i'm saying uh life imitates art right so that's my biggest thing it's just like i used to watch these guys and used to and you got to realize like these guys that's playing or actors are real martial artists oh yeah you know me so they're using real techniques at the end of the day so i just get to look at that and use it and and just apply it you know i love like one of my favorite movies to watch is blood and bone you know uh with michael joe white yeah kempos slice you know and uh it's a lot of techniques that he uses that i'm like oh but that'd be dope to you know pull off you know so yeah i would say like that was my my start into martial arts was the movies but my real like actual training started when i was 18 and so when you were 18 how long was it before you had your first fight uh right actually didn't take long i think it was like a little bit of like um nine months 10 months into training and i had my first fight was it an mama fight Yeah, yeah, it was MMA fight.

[179] Yeah, so in Missouri and St. Louis, whatever.

[180] So as amateurs, like, we didn't need the head gear.

[181] We didn't need to wear, like, shingars, and nothing.

[182] So you fought like a pro.

[183] You know, the only thing that you couldn't do was, like, heel hooks and knee to the head.

[184] No heel hooks.

[185] No hill hooks.

[186] Interesting.

[187] Yeah, no hill hooks.

[188] But all the other submissions are okay?

[189] Yeah, and no elbows.

[190] Yeah, every other submission was cool.

[191] No elbows, no knees, no cuts, you know?

[192] And then no hill hooks.

[193] That was only rule.

[194] So just a few limitations.

[195] Yeah, yeah.

[196] And so do they have a comprehensive amateur approach?

[197] program there like or was it was it balanced were you fighting someone that had experience or we just fighting another person man like i don't think it was balanced yet you know even in 2012 you know uh everybody had the showdown you know uh so like you know the promoter you know mean putting fights together and everything but people still trying to figure out actually like the gym wise or how to you know uh develop a fighter if that makes sense you know because i feel like still to this day that a lot of mMA gyms still not doing it right you know but that's a whole other the conversation for another day.

[198] So a lot of these guys that was in amateur fighting just wanted to fight just to get the feel for it, you know, and that's the type of guys I was fighting almost like at the amateur level, you know.

[199] Well, when we had dinner that one night, we were talking about the difference between going to a big gym and the way you're doing it at a smaller gym.

[200] Yeah.

[201] And there's some interesting conversation to be had about that because you made some really good points about when you're in a smaller gym, you get individualized attention and you're not getting lost in the crowd.

[202] And that there's so much information out there already with all the videos that are out there and all the fights you can watch.

[203] So sometimes it's good just to be...

[204] So my coach is a perfect example, right?

[205] He'll have us working on the same thing over and over and over again.

[206] And we know it, and we know it by heartbeat.

[207] And we tell us like, hey, coach, can we do something different?

[208] He's like, yeah, yeah, yeah, but I want you y 'all to do this.

[209] You know what I mean?

[210] And you need that type of discipline, whatever, just to keep doing the same thing because that's how you actually work on your tools.

[211] You work on the basics over and over again.

[212] you know what I'm saying where then it becomes instinct you know so even though we have so much applied knowledge out there and so many things that we can do sometimes it's like the basic knowledge that we have and if we work with a smaller gym we're able to focus on that a little bit more you know as a team you know instead of everybody just doing their own thing because I don't know nobody say like big gyms everybody just doing their own thing everybody just working with who they working with you know they're not even working with the coach unless they got a name and they got a big fight coming up that's the thing right because that's what I hear it's like you get two arguments one of them is iron sharpens iron And so if you're around, like if you go to ATT, if you're an American top team, world -class facility, giant plays, dormitories, world -class guys coming from the world.

[213] But when I've talked to fighters who train there, they say, look, man, you get in there with some Russian dude you never met before and he's trying to kill you.

[214] Yeah, big fact.

[215] And that there's no supervision.

[216] Like if you're not a world -class guy, if you're not a top of the food chain guy that has a lot of money riding on him, they'll put you in there with everybody who's in class.

[217] Big fact.

[218] And you're going to have to sing or swim, you know what I mean?

[219] And you have to develop and become that individual in order for them to work with you.

[220] But they're not going to develop you, you know.

[221] So a lot of guys get it twisted when they go to these big gyms and they think that they're going to be elevated because of the guys that they're around.

[222] But at the same time, like you said, people just trying to beat you up.

[223] Right.

[224] You know what I mean?

[225] So you're not really learning anything.

[226] So that's one thing I talk about structure, right?

[227] So just because you're a big gym and you're able to have all these, you know, um, housing for fighters, you know what I mean?

[228] You got the big, nice match.

[229] You got the heavy bags and all this other stuff.

[230] You got all the pretty stuff, but you have no structure within the gym.

[231] You know, a lot of guys should be working with certain people to develop their skills.

[232] So, like, let's say, you know, certain pros, high -level pros, you know what I mean?

[233] Not saying that a high -level pro can't work with an amateur, but certain amateurs shouldn't be working with certain pros.

[234] Like, they should be developed to a certain point where they're showing that they know enough and now they can move up and work with certain individuals.

[235] Right.

[236] So I get fed to the wolves.

[237] Exactly.

[238] You know what I mean?

[239] Because all it's going to do is hurt the little young amateur.

[240] And then sometimes amortures be doing the wrong thing and be going too hard and could end up cutting, you know what I'm saying, a high -level pro, you know, and they might not be making a lot of money, but that's somebody that's a potential prospect.

[241] Yes.

[242] But now they ain't got a fight coming up because they was going with this amort because they ain't had nobody else to go with.

[243] Right.

[244] You know, so, you know, it's a lot of things, you know, that play a part into having a big gym in a small gym.

[245] But I just love having a small gym just because you get that actual attention that you need.

[246] Well, it sounds like your coach is a fantastic coach.

[247] Oh, he won't the best in the world.

[248] What's his name?

[249] Joaquin Mercoselago.

[250] So we got the same first name.

[251] That's crazy.

[252] That's an odd name.

[253] It's not a lot of those walkings out there.

[254] So when you're, what is the name of the gym?

[255] Mercy.

[256] And when you're working with him, it's specifically with him and a bunch of other people?

[257] So he's the head coach, you know, for MMA -wise.

[258] And then we have Nick Simmons.

[259] So the gym itself is called SART Academy.

[260] It's a wrestling academy.

[261] So he has a lot of high -level prospect, high school wrestlers, middle -school wrestlers, some of the best wrestlers, you know what I'm saying, in the nation, you know, that come to him to learn wrestling.

[262] So his name is Nick Simmons.

[263] But I work with his older brother, Andy.

[264] No, actually, younger brother, Andy Simmons.

[265] That's who I work with.

[266] And he's more of my size and stuff like that.

[267] So I get a lot of high -level wrestling from him because both of them are Hall of Famers at Michigan State, which is pretty dope, you know.

[268] And so they got a nice revenue, you know what I'm saying?

[269] revenue but like a great career uh within wrestling went undefeated you know what I'm saying for the longest time like I think over 200 300 bouts or something like that undefeated and then I got a conditioning coach at the hbI human performance institute just in heart that he was an NFL player you know that's where we get all our conditioning work in so like we don't have many many guys you know but at the end of the day we have enough to work with we also got a guy that works with our jihitsu who works at magic named brandon berry who does all our jihisosu but the you think about him.

[270] He's not a black belt.

[271] He's not a high -level jihitsu guy.

[272] He's somebody that's just passionate about jiu -jitsu who watches it every day, you know, and he shows the stuff that actually works, but he's somebody that's committed to it, you know, and who watches it every day, and that's who we learned jih Tzu from.

[273] Well, that was the case a long time ago.

[274] There was a lot of guys that were, like, blue belts and purple belts that were opening up schools because they didn't have a real good school around them, and they knew that they could teach at least a base of fundamentals and if they were really excited and passionate about jujitsu, they would grow with their students.

[275] Exactly, exactly.

[276] And that's exactly what he's doing with us, you know.

[277] Because I can see Brandon going very far, you know, and being an instructor going far into jihitsu, you know.

[278] But just somebody that, you know, not looking for anything out of it.

[279] You know, he never asked me for any money or nothing like that.

[280] But he shows me a lot of things that helped me win a fight against Arbor Dua, you know, how to get the stand up, you know, how to get my guard back, you know.

[281] And, you know, it's just crazy because in that fight, a lot of people have me pick to lose, you know, and thinking like, okay, I'll be able to drive your trains at this big gym, you know, at extreme couture and stuff like that.

[282] He has all the tools.

[283] He has all the resources.

[284] And then I go back to Michigan.

[285] I don't have much.

[286] But I got the people that's able to work on that things that we need to work on.

[287] And we do it repeatedly until I get it down and then we're able to show that in the fight, you know.

[288] And I feel like that's what I'm saying.

[289] Like, we actually showing what works within this game, you know, because if you got the right group of people that you're working with, they can help advance you.

[290] your career and stuff like that, then that's what you need to mess up with.

[291] But a lot of fighters feel like they need to move on from the gym that they come from that they was developing well at to go to a bigger gym, you know, and that's not the way to go all the ways.

[292] Not always, right?

[293] It really does depend upon the environment and who the coach is and what kind of relationship we have with them, but it seems like you got a good one set up.

[294] Yeah, yeah.

[295] So how do you balance out how much grappling you do versus how much striking you do?

[296] It seems like you prefer striking.

[297] That seems like your level of expertise.

[298] I only say the level of expertise, but that's where the money comes in.

[299] You know what I'm saying?

[300] Yeah, that's what the money comes in.

[301] Yeah, I just want to always be exciting, you know.

[302] But now we're trying to, you know, switch the gears into just becoming a winner, you know, because now we got money in the bank, you know, so my biggest thing is like when I went out for my first UFC fight with Kevin Holland, I just chose to stand on the feet.

[303] I could have took Kevin Holland down.

[304] I could have, you know what I mean, put myself in a better position to win, but I decided just to strike.

[305] And, you know, I fell on that.

[306] He beat me, you know, in the third round, you know, and he got the advantage on me. But at the end of the day, I was like, I want to make these fights exciting and fan appealing, which even with the loss I had against Kevin Holland, people still wanted to watch me fight.

[307] Right.

[308] You know, and then coming into my second fight with Ampa, Kasagina, you know, still chose.

[309] I mean, I'm mixing a little bit of takedown, but I let them back up.

[310] I was like, right, I want to keep this on the feet.

[311] I want to keep going.

[312] And then, of course, we did what we did, you know.

[313] So, like, my whole course is just going through my career.

[314] I just wanted to strike with these guys.

[315] and get good knockouts so I can get a third check.

[316] So you are thinking that way.

[317] That's how I was thinking.

[318] That's how I was thinking.

[319] And now you're thinking I want to be a champion.

[320] Yes, sir.

[321] Yeah.

[322] Yeah, that's the shift, right?

[323] The pivot.

[324] And sometimes guys get criticized for that.

[325] And I am opposed to that criticism.

[326] People are saying, oh, they're fighting boring.

[327] And I'm like, I don't know what you think is boring.

[328] I think baseball's boring.

[329] I don't think fighting's ever boring.

[330] Because there's always a potential for something crazy to happen.

[331] but the intelligent fighters you know how to win.

[332] Yeah, yeah.

[333] I mean, like Floyd Mayweather.

[334] Like, for me, when I watch him, and obviously you got some of the best defensive fighter is him.

[335] But when you watch him fight, you can call it more than if you want to, but when you really pay attention and the things that he's doing and how he's, you know, moving around fighters and how he's evading these punches and, you know, and able to counter fighters, like, bro, that's very intriguing.

[336] Masterful.

[337] Masterful.

[338] And then now we talk about, you know, Izzy.

[339] You know, it's the same way.

[340] Same thing.

[341] Same exact thing.

[342] That was my argument.

[343] about the Jared Cannoneer fight.

[344] They're like, oh, he should have engaged more.

[345] I'm like, dude, he's fighting Jared Cannonier.

[346] You can't engage all the time recklessly with that.

[347] That dude's a powerhouse.

[348] And that's the thing.

[349] I'm not mad at Izzy for what he done because that's what he keeps doing, right, in order to retain his title.

[350] And I hope he keeps doing.

[351] I hope he does it against Alex Furr.

[352] I pray, I pray.

[353] I want to talk to you about that fight.

[354] Big facts.

[355] Because it's kind of your division, but maybe not in the future.

[356] What are you going to do?

[357] You decided?

[358] Actually, I don't already decided.

[359] I'm going down to one seven.

[360] Yes.

[361] I'm about to get that.

[362] But you're going to have this fight with Chris Curtis?

[363] Yes, Chris Curtis.

[364] And that's at 85.

[365] That's at 85.

[366] So they wanted me to have one more fight at 185.

[367] They was like, well, if you want to make this good little money, re -sign at 185, fight and fight C -C, and then we can talk about you moving down to one -sept.

[368] Are they opposed to you moving down to 170?

[369] I don't think they opposed, but they only seen me at 185.

[370] Right.

[371] You know what I mean?

[372] So they're like, well, first of all, because there's so many different things because people haven't seen me fight at 170, even though the majority of my fights or what the way fights, you know?

[373] Really?

[374] Yes, sir.

[375] Yeah, so the majority of my career since I was 18, since I've been an amateur, everything, and going into pro, I was a 175.

[376] Dude, you're pretty fucking swole.

[377] Yeah, I am pretty slow, but, you know, don't let these muscles deceive you know what I'm saying.

[378] So, I mean, I think Michael John White talked about it before, too, like, when he's bulking, you know what I mean?

[379] Like, a lot of people think he's bigger then.

[380] Well, he is bigger, but they think he's smaller when they see him.

[381] But when he's cut up, you know what I'm saying, and he's clean, that's when they think he's his biggest because they see all the muscle and they're so defined and everything.

[382] But he's actually lighter.

[383] But he's actually lighter, you know.

[384] And it's the same thing with me, you know.

[385] So it's just that perception that people see, like, oh, they think I'm a lot bigger than what I really am.

[386] Actually, in that Nashideen fight, I walked into that fight at 185.

[387] Did you really?

[388] Yeah, yeah, at 185.

[389] I actually cut too much damn weight.

[390] No way.

[391] I was walking around at 181.

[392] No. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[393] Even the PI guys, they can tell you.

[394] So what do you weigh right now?

[395] Yeah, I'm a little heavy right now.

[396] I've been eating good, you know?

[397] Texas barbecue.

[398] Yeah, big facts.

[399] But I never get up to 200.

[400] So I'm probably like 195.

[401] I never get up to 200.

[402] Interesting.

[403] That's very light for 85.

[404] Exactly.

[405] Especially when you look at some of those giant dudes.

[406] Yeah, I mean, all of them.

[407] Shoot, Nashville, Alex Pereira, cutting from 240.

[408] You know what I'm saying?

[409] Jericho Neneer used to be a heavyweight.

[410] Oh, yeah, Jericho Kennedy is as big as a guess.

[411] You know what I'm saying.

[412] He's as big as he gets at 85.

[413] Well, that was what I was saying about Izzy.

[414] The way he fought him was the perfect way to fight him.

[415] Oh, he was smart.

[416] You got to fight Jared Kennedy.

[417] The only person that I give any slack to is Jerry Kenanier himself.

[418] Because he had the best opportunity, right?

[419] And I feel like even if he didn't win, he still could have brought the fight a little bit better.

[420] Because Izzy doesn't mind a fight, you know what I mean?

[421] But he wants you to bring the fight to him.

[422] But you see Jared Kenanier trying to clench up against him.

[423] Try to do tactics.

[424] I ain't never seen him do before.

[425] What happened to the killer gorilla?

[426] You know what I'm saying?

[427] What happened to the rocks that you keep in your pocket?

[428] You know what I'm saying?

[429] Like all these little different things that give you, you know, mental fortitude, but you fought scared that night.

[430] I don't care.

[431] I don't care.

[432] I don't care.

[433] Really, you think he fought scared?

[434] I never seen a fight.

[435] I mean, when he fought Jack or Massey, he ran through him.

[436] But that's a different fighter.

[437] It's like he's fight.

[438] When you fight Izzy, I think you're fighting a supercomputer.

[439] When that dude's standing in front of you and he's throwing all those faints and movements.

[440] We can debate all day.

[441] Let's debate.

[442] But my thing is, if I was to fight, is you got to put that pressure on like Kevin Gasselm did.

[443] Right.

[444] And now, of course, Izzy could have gotten better from that fight, which he more likely did.

[445] He certainly did, but still, you never seen him fight that type of fighter again.

[446] You know, with Kevin Gasselin been in the South Paul, a shorter fighter, an inside fighter as, you know, putting pressure on him, he never fought that type of individual again.

[447] you know and I feel like my striking and my stature fits like a Kevin Gasselm you know and I feel like my footwork is a little better than Kevin Gassel as well so I wouldn't just be going straight in I would hit different angles on Izzy that's how you beat Izzy I feel like it's taking it out of a kickboxing range you know I mean putting in the boxing range and fighting inside you know and then guess what mixing in the takedowns you know but guess what it's kind of hard to take down Izzy but at the same time like even with Robert Whitaker a lot of people say he probably won that fight but I feel like he didn't do enough that though, you know?

[448] There's so many little debates that you can put up behind it, but my thing is, I feel like Izzy is able to be finished in certain positions that he put itself in because there's a lot of things that he do because of his reach.

[449] He leans back a lot to try to counter away from punches, right?

[450] But if you can find that angle, and you can see the holes open there because his body is there, his chin is available, you know?

[451] You can find that punch, and I felt like Jared Kenanir could have exposed a lot of that if he fought the way that he fights a lot of other guys, you know?

[452] You just have to run the risk.

[453] getting knocked out there it is there's a hey you're scared to get knocked out then you know what I mean you probably shouldn't be in this game right or wrong yeah but I think he probably felt like he'll find that opportunity somewhere in the fight so it's like don't get knocked out while you're trying to find that opportunity yeah but at the same time like it's scary though I know what you're saying you know it's scary like so my biggest thing it's just trying to figure out Mike Tyson one of my favorite fighters like he always put pressures on guys like you could you could knock out Mike if he came towards you but he was He's moving his head the whole time, moving his feet, shifting everything, and it was all about angles, but he never let the pressure down because he could probably get knocked out, you know?

[454] He just worked on his defense, so even with Robert Whitaker, that first fight that they had, that's why he got knocked out because he added so much pressure, but he left a lot of holes open for easy to expose.

[455] but if you could have just worked on just keeping your hands up and working inside and moving your angles and stuff you probably could have did a little better on the second end which he did taking them down and trying to but you're trying to game plan on how to take the belt like bro you got to beat that individual and I don't know how you feel about that but my biggest thing is just like you can't just like barely beat a champion and be like all right it's my belt now you know that's just me and my opinion and that's how it's always been you know I kind of see that but whoever wins the fight wins the fight If someone wins a clear -cut, unanimous decision for a title, that's still winning.

[456] Yeah, where have we seen that, man?

[457] Like, you know, with Dominic Reyes and John Jones.

[458] Valentina, I feel like Valentina lost that last fight, like, low -key...

[459] Very close fight.

[460] Very close fight.

[461] But debatable that she lost.

[462] Yeah, debatable.

[463] You know what I'm saying?

[464] But at the same time...

[465] Well, debatable Robert Whitaker and Izzy.

[466] That's debatable, too.

[467] But the thing is, though, forget debate.

[468] Y 'all got to take that thing.

[469] You got to take it.

[470] You got to take it.

[471] I feel that.

[472] I completely appreciate that.

[473] I think Robert Whitigar was a way better fighter in the side.

[474] second fight.

[475] I think losing to Izzy just reignited that fire inside of them because I think fighters, and you know, you could speak to this better than me, but I think fighters, they go in sort of cycles, like sometimes they're just not totally focused and motivated or maybe they're overwhelmed by pressure or, you know, so many different things because you don't never know what's going on outside.

[476] You know what I mean?

[477] And they live and stuff.

[478] But for Robert Whitaker, I mean, he went into the fight as a winner.

[479] Like, I mean, it was, I remember Michael Bisbee said something like Robert Whitaker didn't look as confident in the second round but my thing is though like Robert Whitaker getting up to that title fight he's been winning in decisions right so he got used to just beating guys and taking them to a point where he's just outpointed him for real even with the Jared Kennedy when he broke Jerry Canaan his forearm.

[480] It ain't like he was hunting for the finish just he's just outpointed just touching guys you know you're thinking with a man with one arm you probably be able to get him out of there but did he know he had one arm though He didn't know his arm was broken I ain't say you know it But at the same time If you apply that type of pressure And you put it on somebody You know what I'm saying Like you can only do so much With a broken arm But shout out to Jerry Ken and then For you even fighting like that Right Yeah So I was hoping that same dog Would come out in the Izzy fight But regardless Like we're skipping points You know I know what you're saying But you know It's an armchair quarterbacking Right So with With Robert Whitaker You know what I'm saying Like I felt like In my mind He just got used to just coasting for a lot of his fights because it wasn't close like he would win every round when he fought what Kevin Gasolam when he fought Darren Till you know what I'm saying like he just beating these guys by decision and fairly easy and Jerry can in there fairly easy and then when he got to Izzy he thought he could win the same type of way you know I think he's also I think the Izzy fight it's just my opinion but I think he was suffering from those fights with Yo -O.

[481] Romero too when you fight Yo -O Romero that motherfucker you just changed right?

[482] Take something from you.

[483] He takes, that's like fighting a brick wall.

[484] That dude is I can see that.

[485] He's different.

[486] I can see that.

[487] He's so different.

[488] And those fights were horrendous.

[489] Remember he got knocked down and hurt?

[490] Yeah, yeah, and got back up.

[491] Yeah, like a gym.

[492] You know?

[493] He tried to do the same little tactics that YoL did you know what I'm saying?

[494] When you jacked his knee up in that first fight.

[495] Yeah, I heard.

[496] What do you think about that side kick to the knee?

[497] That's controversial, right?

[498] I mean, it's legal.

[499] It's legal.

[500] Yeah, I mean, I haven't done it.

[501] You know what I'm saying?

[502] To anybody, I haven't seen the opportunity to do it.

[503] but if I see like somebody like with a straight leg you know I'll never do it if somebody has a strong stance it wouldn't make any sense to do it then but if I see somebody has like a Sean Strickland it's a perfect example if you stand if you stand straight up yeah I'm killing that knee yeah big facts well John Jones is the master at that yeah he's the best at using distance no one's better at using distance John's the best yeah he is the best but because it's attributes you know I mean because like the 84 you know what's reach like that's crazy and then On top of that, the legs, I don't know, I don't know, but your legs is longer, you know.

[504] So we're having all that reach, I feel like that's what, but a lot of people like, oh, he's like one of the best defensive or best footwork.

[505] I'm like, nah, not at all.

[506] But it's not a footwork thing.

[507] It's using his attributes.

[508] Yeah, but that's what some people are saying.

[509] Mighty mouse has the best footwork.

[510] Oh, no. Hold on now.

[511] Hold on now.

[512] You know, I got some good footwork, too.

[513] You got very good footwork, but come on, man. Mighty Mouse is off the charts.

[514] Oh, no, that's my time one.

[515] That's my top one.

[516] That's my goal.

[517] That's my goal.

[518] Doesn't he be over here?

[519] No, big facts, big fans.

[520] You know, I gotta put myself in the mix.

[521] I understand.

[522] Yeah, but no, I love Mighty Mouse, man. Shout out to him, man. He definitely, uh, on my pound for pound.

[523] You know what I'm going to go.

[524] Of all time.

[525] Of all time.

[526] And he's a guy who talked about having all the stuff in your personal life in order.

[527] Last time he was here, he's like, you know, a big part of my success is having a stable family life, having a wife, having, you know, every, not having any personal problems, no grace of people in your life, no bullshit that drags it down.

[528] Big facts.

[529] Which is a problem with fighters.

[530] Yeah, I mean, because it can apply, you know, negative energy into your life and into your training.

[531] You know what I mean?

[532] You're not able to focus on the things that's really important as in, you know, being able to provide for your family because this is how we eat.

[533] Yes.

[534] You know, and if you've got to focus on other stuff and try to get your life in order like a John John Jones.

[535] And that's crazy thing.

[536] John Jones will be going through crazy stuff.

[537] The craziest.

[538] And still able to maintain on the highest level.

[539] Still the go.

[540] You know, and still to go.

[541] Crazy.

[542] Remember when he said to Daniel Carmere, I fought you and beat you after I did Coke.

[543] Like, that's wild.

[544] And he was like, oh, no. Because, you know, Daniels in there training with Kane Velasquez and drinking only water.

[545] Man, and that's wild to me that John Jones.

[546] But I feel like he probably been doing it for so long that it became natural for him.

[547] Because obviously he was a champion at the age of 23 years old.

[548] And he probably was always doing this little crazy stuff.

[549] I mean, Kobe Covington was talking about it, like when he was roommates with him.

[550] Like, he was always a wild boy.

[551] I always loved a party.

[552] So it was just something that he came accustomed to and a part of.

[553] But sometimes I was like, brother, you ain't getting tired of it.

[554] you know what I'm saying you ain't getting rolled out like you think so I mean my man wait how old is John now 30s 30s 30 you know I think he's a little old than that how old is John is he 34 I mean John because he won the title the youngest ever this the time to come back I feel like for John like if he waits any longer I feel like he need to just stay away well according to John the the hold up is steepe did not want to sign for the fight for December 10th and I don't know what that is whether they didn't offer steep enough money I don't know what's going on, so I don't want to speak out of line.

[555] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[556] But I think they're targeting when Francis's knee is recovered of Francis and Gano, John Jones fight.

[557] Oh, okay, so they're getting rid of the stepe because I feel like before he fight Francis, he needs to fight somebody like a stepe or to a vasa, you know what I mean?

[558] Somebody like that just really shows that you belong to heavyweight before you just fight for it.

[559] I would say that for anybody else.

[560] For anybody else, I would say that.

[561] But when you're talking about the greatest light heavyweight, maybe the greatest mixed martial arts of all time.

[562] I understand.

[563] Let him fight it.

[564] No, and I would have said that probably two years ago.

[565] Yeah.

[566] But it's time, you know what I'm saying?

[567] But he's training.

[568] The thing about John is, John's wild, but he's also smart.

[569] Yeah, yeah.

[570] One of the things that John's doing is putting on so much weight.

[571] He's fucking huge now.

[572] I mean, John's like 255 jacked, fall filled out.

[573] Big fat.

[574] If he can maintain that endurance and keep that kind of pace that he had a light heavyweight at 205.

[575] And if you look at his, the strength and conditioning work that he's doing, man, And he's doing it the right way.

[576] It's nasty.

[577] He's building up slowly.

[578] But this ain't lifting waist, though.

[579] It's not lifting weights.

[580] You already know.

[581] It's not lifting weights.

[582] Be honest with you, like, we don't see what goes on.

[583] And I know he's training hard.

[584] I know he's, uh, well, first off, he did change the team, obviously, right?

[585] He got kicked out of, uh, Jason, I don't know the story behind that.

[586] You know, the story either.

[587] Yeah, so my biggest thing.

[588] So, like, yeah, all right, who you're training with now?

[589] Who you're sparring with?

[590] Like, who you're working with?

[591] Like, you know, those are the things that I want to see.

[592] I don't want to just see you in the weight room.

[593] Is he doing something with Henry Sohudo?

[594] I don't know.

[595] I have no clue.

[596] You know, I think he was working with him for a minute.

[597] A lot of guys working with Henry's doing.

[598] I like what Henry's doing.

[599] I like what Henry's doing.

[600] That's a focused man. Big fact, man. He's a focused man. And he's keeping himself involved, for sure.

[601] Even though he's not fighting, he wants to come back, for sure.

[602] Well, they're talking about him fighting Al Jermaine Sterling for the title, which I hope takes place.

[603] Yeah, I hope it takes place.

[604] That's a very good fight.

[605] I like that fight a lot.

[606] Mm -hmm.

[607] For him to come right back straight to the title, makes sense.

[608] Yeah, man. Two -division champion, Olympic gold medalist, one of the grades.

[609] Yeah, you're right.

[610] And actually, that was the original weight class that Henry came from, right?

[611] Yep.

[612] So it was 125 and 135.

[613] Yeah, well, he, you know, he won at 25, and he was the top.

[614] But he also won at 35.

[615] I feel like him coming back at 35 to fight Aljo is a very legit fight.

[616] I like that fight a lot.

[617] Be honest with you, I think Al Jermain take them.

[618] Al Jermaine's a motherfucker, dude.

[619] I think you take that one, low key, bro.

[620] And right now, Al Jermaine's a champion, you know what I'm saying?

[621] Like when a guy becomes a champion, real champ.

[622] Yeah, like the way he fucked over T .J. Dillashar, he beat the shit out of that, dude.

[623] I know T .J.'s shoulder was fucked up, but dude, this just, the way Al Jermaine fought Piotr Yon in the second fight, too, he's a champion now.

[624] There's a thing that happens to a guy when he comes into his own and you go, you know what, I can't wait to see him again because I think he's going to be even better.

[625] That's how I feel about Aljo right now.

[626] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[627] It's like that you realize, like, the confidence is there.

[628] And when you talk about, like, and for 135, like, the physique that Al Jamein has, like, the type of shape that he's in.

[629] Oh, yeah.

[630] I'm like, bro, he ain't looking like other 135 is not hurt.

[631] He's the perfect 135.

[632] It's like the perfect amount of weight cutting.

[633] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[634] Like, he's got his diet dialed in.

[635] He comes out shredded as fuck.

[636] But he also has great cardio.

[637] Big fact.

[638] And he's long, too.

[639] Yeah.

[640] For 35, he's big, dude.

[641] I mean, he's walking around 176 when I saw him.

[642] That's wild.

[643] That's wild.

[644] You know what I'm, and that's the thing.

[645] That's why I know I'll be cool at getting down the one.

[646] 170 because I ain't got to cut a massive amount of weight.

[647] And definitely when I clean up my diet, the only probably, the biggest I probably cut is is like 20.

[648] Well, if you were walking around at 181.

[649] I wouldn't even need to.

[650] I wouldn't even need that, though.

[651] That seems easy for you to make 170.

[652] You know what I'm saying?

[653] But that's the thing.

[654] Like, I was walking around at 182, 185, you know what I'm saying?

[655] Like when I was like, 21, um, 22, shoot, shoot, shoot.

[656] I think, how long I've been walking?

[657] So, like, since I was 18, going up to, like, 23 years old.

[658] I was walking around that way.

[659] I didn't actually start to fill out until I didn't get any fights at 1 -7.

[660] It makes sense that they want to see you like cut the weight though because like you see there's so many problems like Hamzat's the biggest problem.

[661] Trying to get down to 170 and the dude misses it by 8 pounds which is fucked up the whole card.

[662] Yeah man. Now hold on okay and I love to talk about this too because I don't think the UFC set this up like no crazy stuff I ain't trying to be on a Brennan Shavs but low key it just worked out too well.

[663] It did work out too well, but that's how things happen sometimes.

[664] You think so?

[665] Yeah, it's my whole life.

[666] It's your whole life.

[667] All right, man, I get it.

[668] I get it.

[669] Trust me. Things just work out sometimes.

[670] Yeah, big facts.

[671] Okay.

[672] That was a situation where it was the best case scenario in terms of options because Kevin Holland had fought at 185 before and he was available and he was willing and then they got in a squabble backstage and so they said, all right, let's just make this at 180 and Kevin's like good because Kevin was already supposed to fight Daniel Rodriguez at 180 that all that made sense yeah the guy who got fucked over but the thing is though and uh that's the thing it really didn't make no sense because why they fighting that when they and then why did they just put it on a card last minute well they had no other options the only other option was cancel a card like what what is the option why would they why would they have to cancel no no no no no i'm not talking about like no no no i'm talking about why i even put Kevin holland versus uh what's homeboy named d right why i even put that fight on car and why is it catch weight Kevin holler can make the weight D has always fought at 170 so why is he already making up the mind or I want to fight at 180?

[673] Well they had made that arrangement far in advance and I think it was a last minute fight that they put on yeah but I mean it wasn't like the day of Daniel Rodriguez and Kevin Holland all I'm saying is just like for it to be at 180 and them to make their like decision to make it at 180 that's all I'm talking about because then also Tony Ferguson versus G. Leanne that fight didn't make no sense when they made the fight that fight didn't make no sense to me well that fight made sense to me all right go ahead go ahead It made sense to me because Tony Ferguson's coming off a knockout loss to Chandler.

[674] And then...

[675] Moving up to 170?

[676] Yeah, but that...

[677] The thing about it is, like, I think as you get older.

[678] Yeah, okay.

[679] And I think it becomes more and more difficult for you to make the weight.

[680] You feel weakened by the weight cut.

[681] Daniel Rodriguez is the reason why that made sense.

[682] If you look how big he looked against Lee Jingleon, and what I mean big, I mean like...

[683] Oh, yeah, yeah, he's chubed.

[684] I don't know.

[685] D .D .R .R. ain't never come in shape.

[686] He's in shape, but he's just not ripped.

[687] You know, he's just got that...

[688] that Kane Velazquez -style body, you know, where they never look shredded, but they're always in shape.

[689] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[690] And I think that he was probably heavy, and he said, look, I'll take the fight, but I'm heavy right now.

[691] I'm not going to make 170.

[692] I'll kill myself.

[693] Uh -huh.

[694] So let's do it at 180, and Kevin's like, fine.

[695] I fight at 185 all the time.

[696] We're good.

[697] Right, right, right.

[698] So it's got all the pieces of a conspiracy theory.

[699] Yeah, man, it really do.

[700] But there's logic behind it.

[701] Yeah, big fact.

[702] It makes sense.

[703] Because the Hamza and Diaz makes sense only because, like, USC don't want D .S. to come on, you know what I'm saying?

[704] and be able to shine off the top.

[705] But sort of didn't make sense, though, right?

[706] Because a lot of people like, Jesus Christ, Hamzat's so big.

[707] Diaz has fought at 155.

[708] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[709] Hamzot's coming in.

[710] This motherfucker is like...

[711] It's an easy kill for Hamzai.

[712] Yeah, it's a big...

[713] Easy money, you know?

[714] And then also you help develop, even though Hamzot still got a crazy following, but it's still not the, you know, American base, you know what I mean?

[715] So, like, it helps build his name.

[716] So that fight did make sense for me right there.

[717] But then it's just like the whole switch up.

[718] I'm like, bro, that's too perfect because then you have Kevin Holland and Hanszad that had their whole little dispute right yes and you already got kevin holland who didn't have to cut no weight and that's the thing about even kevin's shout out to him he wasn't cutting the weight for real at 185 you know what I'm saying like like my man was just walking around you know smoking doing this little thing and like walking to the cage and then fight at 185 yeah you know yeah for sure so to have that fight at 180 and then tell haunt when I want to say tell hans out but hams i said himself that the doctor told him a stock couldn't wait hans out was like uh well I can make it you know what I'm saying so I don't think it's on the fighters but I feel like the UFC was able to mess this up a little two will.

[719] Well, let me tell you because I know.

[720] Yeah, you know.

[721] I'm behind the scenes.

[722] I talked to Dana when the shit went down.

[723] He's like, this is a fucking mess.

[724] What the fuck?

[725] He goes, I don't know what we're going to do.

[726] So they were in chaos.

[727] And then they masterminded.

[728] They got together and they brainstormed.

[729] They said, okay, what do we do this and this?

[730] And it turned out, like, we were talking about it, it's a better card.

[731] It was a way better.

[732] Way better.

[733] Ferguson versus Diaz, a competitive matchup.

[734] That made sense.

[735] You know, Hamzot versus Kevin Holland.

[736] That makes sense.

[737] I'm not arguing that.

[738] That's how it should have been in the first place.

[739] The only thing that just makes sense to me, I think Lee Jean Leone got fucked.

[740] Oh, he got played.

[741] Because he's so small.

[742] He even said it, too.

[743] You know.

[744] He didn't even get far away.

[745] But D -Ride is still a 170 fighter, though.

[746] Yes.

[747] But he do cut a lot of weight, though.

[748] Yes.

[749] You know what I'm saying?

[750] And my thing is, though, but G. He had to put in that extra work in order to get that weight down to 170.

[751] Yes.

[752] Because Gis Leanne is a ripped guy, you know what I mean?

[753] So I know it's hard to even try to get to the 170 weight class for him.

[754] So, you know, he did have a little.

[755] disbanded.

[756] I felt like Gile ain't won that fight, too, man. I feel like he did enough to win.

[757] It was so close.

[758] Certainly a very close fight.

[759] You know what I'm so.

[760] But then, you know, and shout out to Neil Magny, who just finished D -Rod, because Neil Magny is one of the most underappreciated guys in the UFC.

[761] Yeah, Loki.

[762] That guy has Cardi.

[763] Oh, the pace that dude puts on people, he's such a workman.

[764] He just comes in and just constant volume, long reach.

[765] I don't know.

[766] I feel like Neil Mac, he does a good job of getting guys to fight his.

[767] style yes you know what I'm saying he takes his time with guys and like guys take that pace but then don't realize okay oh time is getting ate up right now and Neil Mackey does a good job of time guys up just using that long job it's boring I ain't gonna lie to you it's so big even though when you say like oh it's not boring it's masterful but there's a lot of things I'll be saying Neil Macon you do and I be I ain't a lot of you I'd be falling asleep I do because you like exciting shit you're wild man I am a wild man but I don't know well speaking to Neil Macon you know and I'm glad he got a win because you never know with the USC with you know losses and stuff like that But that Shobcock kid, though, the undefeated, you know what I'm doing, he demolished the little magnate, bro.

[768] He's good.

[769] And what he got him out, the first round?

[770] Yeah, that guy's good.

[771] He's under the radar.

[772] Yeah.

[773] Like, with mainstream people, they do not know how much out.

[774] That's the real, that's the killer to me. He's a bad motherfucker.

[775] Like, what, 16 finishes, 17 finishes?

[776] And he does everything.

[777] You know?

[778] He can do everything.

[779] Yeah, big sight.

[780] He's a striker, grappler, everything.

[781] I think he got a fight coming up against Jeff Neal.

[782] Oh, yeah, yeah.

[783] That's right.

[784] That's a banger.

[785] That's a banger.

[786] I like Jeff Neal now.

[787] Jeff Neal's back.

[788] Yeah, yeah, big facts, big facts.

[789] You know, he went through a period of time where he was dealing with his own bullshit and, you know, wasn't really totally focused.

[790] I mean, if I'm not mistaken, I almost died or something.

[791] You know, he was in the hospital.

[792] Yes, he had a really bad infection.

[793] Bad infection?

[794] Yeah, real bad.

[795] So it took him out for a little minute, you know.

[796] And then recovering from that was difficult and then he had some personal life shit.

[797] Big fact.

[798] But now he's back.

[799] He looks like the Jeff.

[800] Like when Jeff Neal fought Mike Perry, I was like, this motherfucker's a dark horse.

[801] Oh, I'm almost though.

[802] because he's got timing, man. His timing and foot, when Jeff Neal's on, he's one of the best guys in the division.

[803] I can agree with that, you know, and definitely what he did to Vicente Leuke was masterful, you know.

[804] And I was telling a lot of guys, like, you know, watch out for that because just how Vicente Leuke he strikes.

[805] And he's a powerful guy.

[806] Don't get a twist.

[807] A lot of knockouts, but he just keeps his head straight up.

[808] Takes a lot of damage.

[809] Takes a lot of punishment.

[810] But if you've got somebody got decent footwork, good combinations that they put together, which Jeff Neal does have, you know, you've seen like, I mean, just picked them apart.

[811] Just with boxing alone, you know, and a lot of those guys with those Dutch styles, you know what I mean?

[812] I feel like, man, they just be getting touched too much.

[813] It's a hard style.

[814] It's hard style, you know what I mean?

[815] I mean, you could deliver some bangers, but that's somebody standing right in fronty, and Jeff Neal wasn't doing that for him.

[816] Yeah, he masterfully moved around and picked his shots.

[817] That was big.

[818] The division is wild.

[819] Like, all divisions are wild right now in the UFC, but I feel like 170 in particular.

[820] And I feel like the only thing that's missing from 170 is the personality part.

[821] You know, you got the cold.

[822] Kobe Covington and now we got you know Kevin Holland as a 170 fighter but a lot of these guys I don't feel like promote themselves even Vicente Lucay what is his nickname the silent you know assassin you don't talk much you doesn't do anything you know Gilbert Burns is one of them you know I mean like that don't really promote itself like that Jeff Neal don't really promote itself like that you know but they all talented but you don't have a lot of personality that goes within you know fighting that people want to actually attach themselves and want to watch you fight you know and that's what I feel like the 170 division is missing for a month's for Masvedol's overrunning time.

[823] You know what, 11 in the world now?

[824] Like, come on, brother.

[825] Like, he's eating.

[826] But, like, I feel like Marzvi dog, even though he's a personality, like, he's a journey man, man, man. I ain't trying to be, you know, like, it is what it is.

[827] Mosvado is still dangerous as fuck.

[828] Boy, I'll take that fight.

[829] If I can get that fight, I'll love that fight.

[830] You might be able to get that fight.

[831] I mean, you think so, Joe?

[832] I might not.

[833] I mean, I'm on your show.

[834] You know what I win with Chris Curtis?

[835] I ain't know if.

[836] I'm going to knock that fool out.

[837] And I'm going to be.

[838] And I'm a bad motherfuckerucker.

[839] He is, bro.

[840] That's a really good fight for you too It's a great fight for me But you can't stand right in front of that man So when he fought Phil Hawes Right?

[841] Yeah, Phil Hawes was beating his egg You know, putting the jab on him You know what I'm saying?

[842] Hit across like level changing You know on him And that's the thing about Chris Curtis He's able to just You know, he's able to just shrug off A couple of those shots, you know what I mean And just be patient And just wait But when Phil Hawes got comfortable And just like, you know Feel like he just flowing That's when he got caught Yeah Boom and took that one shot And then it was over with And that's the thing about people one of those never say die guys you know what i'm saying he's always there he's always there but i love it stylistically with you because if you're style of fighting yeah yeah yeah in your last fight even though you lost that third third round you showed why people love you you came out guns blazing yeah man i was well i went into that fight with the wrong um mentality the the same way i came out in the third i should have came out in the first and the second because i was hoping and i was praying them because i was you know nickpicking on a lot of stuff you know you know I mean, I was just talking about where you's from, you know, being Russian, but not being a Frenchman.

[843] So, like, you ain't got a real home at the end of the day, and people love me more than you out here in Paris, and I'm getting more love, and they don't even know who you are.

[844] Like, just little things.

[845] Like, I'm talking about, like, eating up Nassadine cuisine, like, just, like, just picking on them the whole time.

[846] But regardless, though, like, that first round, I was hoping that he was going to engage a little bit more.

[847] But because of that size and because of that length that these guys have, you know, they will only fight me at bay, you know, which is smart family.

[848] He's intelligent, right?

[849] Why try to expose yourself and then the pressure too hard where I can catch you, you know?

[850] But I was hoping that he would come in with a little bit more emotion, you know, but he didn't.

[851] He kept poised.

[852] So you were fucking with him hoping that he would get out of character.

[853] Yeah, exactly, man. But, you know, he did his job, you know.

[854] But at the end of the day, when coach said, you know what I'm saying?

[855] We definitely losing.

[856] We had to pick that, you know, shit up in the third round.

[857] I said, say less.

[858] So I was like willing to get knocked out in order to go knock him out.

[859] Yeah.

[860] That's the only difference.

[861] That third round, you emptied the gas tank.

[862] I had to.

[863] That was impressive.

[864] I had to, yeah.

[865] I'm surprised he survived that knee.

[866] You know what I'm saying?

[867] Crazy knee that hit on him, man. So that's why I'm thinking, like, bro, maybe fighting at my more appropriate weight class, you know.

[868] It's like George St. Pierre, like, you know, moving up to 185, but he never stayed there because at the end of the day, he already knew that these guys would be big.

[869] Even if he's better as a fighter, these athletes are just different now, you know what I mean?

[870] And anything that you're giving up, whether it's size, length, strength, like, these all play a part, you know, when you messing with some of the best people in the world.

[871] Yeah, most certainly.

[872] I think 170 is a much better weight class for you.

[873] Yeah.

[874] Yeah, in every way.

[875] And especially if you're really walking around at 181 sometimes.

[876] I mean, that...

[877] So that's what I was.

[878] I accidentally cut down because I was just chilling, like, you know, and I was eating whatever I wanted in Paris.

[879] Like, I was enjoying my whole time there, you know, so I was eating before waiting.

[880] You know what I mean?

[881] Wow.

[882] If I just can't say that.

[883] You know what I mean?

[884] I was at the restaurant.

[885] Restaurant.

[886] You know what I mean?

[887] Just, just just chilling.

[888] And my biggest thing is just like I'm not afraid to fight guys that's bigger you know I know I'm giving up some type of you know you know advantage for them because of the attributes and stuff but at the same time like my mentality is that I'm willing to fight and brought with anybody that that stands in front of me you know because when I started off with MMA that's all I used to work with was bigger guys and sometimes I was like oh man I can actually take the advantage because I'm faster and my footwork is there you know what I mean or I'm just better and or skill set wise you know because you already you know, like the heavier the weight class, you know what I'm, the less skills.

[889] Smaller weight class, the more skills, you know what I mean?

[890] Flyweight division got some of the best fighters in the world.

[891] Do you think that's the case in the, like, 170s and 185s?

[892] Because I don't think that's the case.

[893] I mean, well, I mean, structurally when you see at 170, but even at 185, you still got a lot of guys that's not that good, but they're just powerful.

[894] You know what I mean?

[895] But I would just put it a great example.

[896] You see a lot more strikers in the 185 division, but in 170, what do you see more grapplers.

[897] And at the end of the day, in my humble opinion, MMA is still structured for grappling.

[898] It's still structured for jihiscus, wrestling, judo, all that other stuff, because at the end of the day, you got to grab, you got to clinch.

[899] So I feel like the grappler, the better grappler is always going to win in MMA.

[900] That's just my opinion.

[901] It's most of the time.

[902] Yeah, it's not every time, but like Leon Edwards and Kamar Usman.

[903] Yeah, that's barely.

[904] Come on now.

[905] Barely.

[906] Barely, yeah.

[907] But it still, it doesn't, barely doesn't mean anything when you win.

[908] the world title by head kick knockout.

[909] It's like Ben Ashton versus Jorge Marciard.

[910] It's a great situation where a flying knee you pop them with, but if they fought again, that probably would never happen.

[911] I think there's a bunch of factors there.

[912] First of all, you're dealing with a Ben Ascran that, Ben Ascran, this is all common knowledge now.

[913] He had a fucked up hip by the time he got to the U .S. Big facts, big facts.

[914] He was already blown out.

[915] Came in too late.

[916] Yeah, he came in too late.

[917] But you've seen him with Douglas Lima, Andre, you know, like when he fought those guys, you know what I mean?

[918] And those are great MMA fighters.

[919] Like, Andre, I forget his last name.

[920] Cursecoff.

[921] Curse off.

[922] Like, but he destroyed them dudes.

[923] Yeah, ragdoll.

[924] We're just wrestling alone.

[925] Yep.

[926] We're just a great example to me again because shout out to Michael Johnson, right, from St. Louis.

[927] actually went to the same high school, too, as well.

[928] You know what?

[929] I mean, we got to look at a little crazy story with that.

[930] but, you know, he was the only person to really hurt Habib and could have had an actual opportunity to beat Habib, right?

[931] But Habib said, what?

[932] I'm gonna say, I'm gonna take you now and keep you now.

[933] Yeah.

[934] So I feel like the majority of grapplers is always gonna, or the better grappler's always gonna beat the better striker.

[935] I think it's the most important skill in MMA.

[936] Because the grappler has the ability to dictate whether the fight stays up or goes to the ground.

[937] That's why when a guy like Bo Nickel gets into the MMA world, everybody's like, oh shit.

[938] Big facts.

[939] Because it's just such an accelerated restaurant.

[940] But at the same time, it still levels to it, right?

[941] Sure.

[942] Because Aaron Pico, I think, is a great example because they rushed him too fast.

[943] Because he actually fought a dude named Zach Freeman, who's from Missouri as well.

[944] And experienced dudes.

[945] You know, Zach Freeman was, like, the most talented, but hardworking dude.

[946] You know what I mean?

[947] And he was a vet.

[948] So he had multiple fights in the game.

[949] And then Aaron Pico, even though he's a, what, Olympic wrestler or something like that.

[950] And then, you know, golden gloves, boxing, all this stuff, which is cool.

[951] He didn't have that experience in the MMA cage, which is a little bit different, you know.

[952] And I feel like if you don't develop these guys skills And experience first They can get caught Even though they got all the skillsets in the world They still just gonna get caught You know, by somebody that's already been in that, you know On that level Did you see Aaron's last fight where he blew out a shoulder?

[953] Well, he blew out his shoulder No, I didn't say Yeah, he had the same thing that happened with TJ He dislocated his shoulder And then had to stop the fight He threw a left hook And it just popped out And I'll be one of like what these little injuries Be coming from like that, you know Well, some of these wrestlers Their shoulders are so fucked By the time they get into MMA, they have all these tears and shit and they're kind of barely holding on anyway.

[954] Right, right, right, right.

[955] I mean, that's the things, though, because it might be happening, like, in training.

[956] So if it's happening in training, like, you've got to do something about, like, to keep it or prevent it from happening, you know.

[957] Because he was staying active then, right?

[958] Aaron Pico?

[959] You know, he was...

[960] So here it is.

[961] They're trying to pull it out.

[962] Oh, they didn't end up in the corner doing it?

[963] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[964] Look, they were trying to pull it out.

[965] Oh, no. I don't know.

[966] I don't, there's, like, a technique to pulling someone's shoulder.

[967] He just put, no, no, no, no, there ain't no technique today.

[968] He's just pulling that thing.

[969] I don't think that's how it goes.

[970] Yeah, I don't think that's how it goes.

[971] I think there's a way to do it.

[972] I don't know necessarily think this guy is doing it correctly.

[973] He's trying.

[974] He's trying.

[975] Isn't there a way?

[976] Isn't there a way you're supposed to do it?

[977] I can definitely look it up.

[978] And like Mel Gibson slamming his shoulder in the wall.

[979] That's right.

[980] That's not the right way to take this up.

[981] But it's a common thing where guys blow their shoulders out.

[982] Yeah.

[983] Have you had any surgeries or any, like, The major injuries?

[984] Yeah, the only time I had surgeries when I got into the USC.

[985] Yeah?

[986] I ain't had no injuries throughout the fight until I started fighting on the best promotion on the planet, which I'm fighting the best fighters.

[987] What injury did you get?

[988] ACL tear, meniscus there, so meniscus, and as well as the orbital fracture in the Antonio Oroyo fight.

[989] Yeah, that was bad, you know, because I was seeing two of him, you know, and I was coming off a loss of Alessio, so that's who told my meniscus when he had kicked me with that, roundhouse kid because I was ducked and I was trying to box too much you know kick me outside my head but the way I fell end up tearing you know what I'm saying my meniscus and then after that fight that I had with him getting that surgery I had went into the fight with Antonio Arroyo won that fight but he left a good little mark right underneath my eye but find out that he had broke my orbital so did you have to have surgery in your orbital?

[990] Yeah yeah so they had to replace it like with a little rod yeah so like the base of my like my eye itself like it was gone so like My eye was just floating her, so I could have had a lazy eye, you know what I'm saying?

[991] So it was like, yeah, we got to replace this, you know, so you can't have that wall back underneath that foundation almost.

[992] What does that, can you feel?

[993] Can you feel it when you touch your face?

[994] I mean, yeah, I can feel it a little bit like the soft part that you have here.

[995] So I can feel like right here where it's a little harder, you know, yeah.

[996] And they said if it was metal, then I couldn't be able to compete.

[997] So he put like a plastic one.

[998] And I was asking, like, is they going to affect it?

[999] Is it easier to break?

[1000] They was like, no, it's hard to reach type of shit.

[1001] So, yeah, actually it makes a lot strong because the bone is so, like, frag.

[1002] So it was metal you wouldn't be able to fight because it would open up with cuts or something?

[1003] I don't know.

[1004] That's what they said.

[1005] Like anything that's metal in your body, you won't be able to compete, you know?

[1006] I think that was coming from the UFC had hit him up and told them that.

[1007] Oh, yeah, don't, you know what I'm saying?

[1008] Don't quote me, but that's what I heard the doctor tell them, you know.

[1009] Oh, yeah, yeah.

[1010] Maybe it's just in the face when they did?

[1011] Because, like, did you see, who was that dude who fought Canello, Billy Joe Saunders, where he got his whole face caved in.

[1012] Cheak bone.

[1013] Everything.

[1014] It was like up here, here.

[1015] Which one you think is words?

[1016] That one or the Sage Northcutt When he got his Like, oh, Sage was a bad one That was a bad one Yeah, yeah And then you got, who else got their face cage And it's sad because it's multiple Sideboard with MVP That was probably the worst ever That was right, the skull Caved his forehead in That's scary because it's supposed to be the hardest part of your hit The hardest part where everybody breaks their hands And they caved in like you got hit with a missile Man, that was nasty That was the wildest flying knee Michael Venon Page is a bad motherfucker, dude.

[1017] He's so wild.

[1018] Yeah, yeah.

[1019] I remember I wanted to fight him when I was in Belvoir to get my name out there, for real, for real.

[1020] But I just wanted to challenge myself against somebody like that because he had that style of, like, traditional martial arts.

[1021] Like a point fighting, you know?

[1022] But he was really knocking dudes out, though, you know.

[1023] Oh, my God, yeah.

[1024] Look at it.

[1025] That's his, the fracture.

[1026] This is cyborg, yeah.

[1027] Look at all the plates he has in his fucking head.

[1028] And that was it for him, man. Oh, yeah, that's over it.

[1029] Yeah, he said he was going to keep fighting after that.

[1030] And the doctor's like, no. Unfortunately, you can't, big fella.

[1031] Yeah.

[1032] Let's see, play that again.

[1033] Watch this.

[1034] Here it is.

[1035] And, like, you could hear it, too.

[1036] Like, if you could play it, something that's nasty.

[1037] When you hear the pop.

[1038] Ooh.

[1039] Like, you just heard it break.

[1040] Oh, just heard it cave in.

[1041] And a dude is tough as cybor.

[1042] See him writhing in pain like that?

[1043] Oh, but you would have seen me kicking my legs, boy.

[1044] I would have been, like, out there swimming.

[1045] And then look at MVP, like, the fucking Pokemon.

[1046] Like he even caught Pikachu or something Like that's crazy And he's a show man for sure But he got his asshole by Mike Perry Oh yeah That was wild I was shocked That's a whole different type of style of fight Yeah You know I'm sorry Like you know You thinking because you got gloves on Or you take the gloves off And like it's still gonna be a type of fight But bro like that's bone on bone You know what I mean And like that takes a different type of beast Like to fight bare knuckle boxing Well Mike Perry's designed for that shit Oh yeah he was made for that Yeah he's made for that shit Big facts man Yeah, I've always thought, like, it's kind of weird that the elbows aren't covered by a pad, your shins aren't covered by a pad, your foot's not covered by a pad, your feet's not covered by a pad.

[1047] Like, they did it old school, like y 'all got to start right in front of each other and just get the bang, you know what I mean?

[1048] So, I mean, I like bare knuckle box.

[1049] It's very interesting, but not for me. No. Definitely not for me, man. You don't have to come with a big check?

[1050] Nah, no, I mean, because it makes you...

[1051] A little bit of hesitation.

[1052] I mean, because I'm thinking about that check.

[1053] You know, but at the same time, know it's just like, man, your health is everything, you know, and people come out looking different with bare knuckle boxing, you know, Pauli Molinagie, you know what I'm saying, versus Ardum, that shit was crazy, Paige Van Gantt, like, like, come on, like, you get rid of your money, you know what I'm saying?

[1054] Like, you're a pretty -ass girl, like, you don't need to be in bare -knuckle boxing.

[1055] Chris Lieben, he fought in bare -knuckle boxing, it looked like you got hit with a hatchet.

[1056] Yeah, his whole face was busted.

[1057] Nasty, man, and then you just get cut up because of the knuckles, you know what I mean?

[1058] So you just got all these little splits down in your eye.

[1059] Yeah, I'm sorry, bro, just too, too much.

[1060] But do you think that it's, like, is there an argument for doing that at MMA to for eliminating gloves?

[1061] Because if you don't have gloves, if you don't have pads on your knees and your shins and your elbows and all the other weapons that you hit people with, why do you have pads on your knuckles?

[1062] Well, that's good, but it's the break of the hand, you know?

[1063] Right, but doesn't that make it unrealistic to be able to just wildly punch people?

[1064] I didn't know they were trying to make it realistic.

[1065] I thought they were trying to make it a sport.

[1066] It is a sport, but it's a sport of fighting.

[1067] And if you have no padding on all these other areas.

[1068] So here, let me show you, King of the Streets.

[1069] This is real fighting right here.

[1070] So it's a KOTS, King of the Streets.

[1071] Who was fighting?

[1072] No, no, I don't know the name is these fighters.

[1073] I'm just about to show you this, like, this form of fighting.

[1074] It's a promotion.

[1075] This is real fighting at its element, you know what I mean?

[1076] Because they fight outside, they fight in a warehouse.

[1077] And as well, they don't have any bare -knuckle, like, nothing.

[1078] This is king of the street.

[1079] This is real fighting.

[1080] This is what UFC can't do this Underground Fight Club Yes So everybody got a face mask Everything like that Because they don't want to get exposed Out here In just case of murder Murder happened Is that a mat?

[1081] Like what are they fighting on?

[1082] They're not fighting on the mat That's concrete That's cement That is cement Yes sir And they actually Pretty popular right now With sneakers on Well yeah that's a real fight Wow sneakers on concrete You're outside with it But bro you get K -Oed And you fall back Oh shit And they got many They got many KOs Yeah If you get body slammed on concrete, that is fucking bad.

[1083] So one dude got rocked with a left hook, right?

[1084] Failed down.

[1085] And as he fell down, the dude kicked him right in his face.

[1086] And, like, my man just seizes out.

[1087] Oh, my God.

[1088] Now, this is brutal.

[1089] But this is the closest thing that you get to a real fight because this is a real fight.

[1090] It's a real fight.

[1091] And the only thing that's covered is they're wearing sneakers.

[1092] Why are you wearing sneakers, though?

[1093] I feel like you shouldn't wear it.

[1094] First of all, you shouldn't be wearing running.

[1095] Oh, this dude is just getting piled right.

[1096] So you take your shoes off, Joe, before a fight?

[1097] No, I wouldn't, but I wouldn't wear those.

[1098] I wouldn't wear those shoes.

[1099] I would wear wrestling shoes.

[1100] We wouldn't wear them sketches down there.

[1101] No, we're wrestling shoes.

[1102] Wrestling shoes are lighter.

[1103] They have no...

[1104] If you have cushioning under your soul, that cushioning is making you unstable.

[1105] It's making you move.

[1106] Like, if you have running shoes on and you're going side to side, you're not fully planted on the ground like you are if you have wrestling shoes on.

[1107] Wrestling shoes would be the way to go.

[1108] Big facts.

[1109] But in a real scenario, you would never have wrestling.

[1110] shoes on and getting ready and then you ain't go pause and somebody like hey wait wait wait let me put these wrestling shoes off because I didn't ban in street fights I didn't know the element I used to work security in St. Louis and I worked security for like eight years bro two damn long but the only reason why I worked security man because it was so fun you know what I mean there's so many different stories there so many different things that's going on and just being out there in that environment because like and just regular life like ain't nothing going on for real you know what I'm saying just having a regular as job you know and I'm fighting still and I'm just training but this is where like the fun part of it, the nightlife, you know what I'm saying?

[1111] Almost being, like I said, the John Jones.

[1112] So I'm glad I didn't get signed earlier in my career because I would have had a bunch of little crazy stories to tell.

[1113] You know what I'm saying?

[1114] No, for real, for real.

[1115] You know what I mean?

[1116] But luckily I was able to mature over time.

[1117] But regardless, though, like, I didn't see the street element where a lot of guys think because they train jihisu, because they train boxing, they train, you know, MMA, that they're going to be good fighting in the streets, but there ain't no rules, bro.

[1118] I didn't see a dude be calmly like, like, oh, man, I don't want to fight you because you do -do -doo.

[1119] and I got a beard in their hand and they smash their head in immediately.

[1120] But they're not even seeing, like, just the body language, right?

[1121] You're not paying attention to certain stuff, you know?

[1122] And I feel like a lot of guys that train the discipline, which is nothing wrong with training the discipline, but they don't, they use that alone to think that's going to save them.

[1123] You know what I mean?

[1124] You got to actually have the mentality that, like, you know, you are going to enter threat at any given moment by using anything that is necessary at that time, you know?

[1125] And a lot of guys don't do that because I've seen guys on the floor thinking like it's a jihisium match, but it gets stomped out.

[1126] Right.

[1127] You know what I'm saying?

[1128] Like, it's like different things like that, you know what I mean?

[1129] So I feel like people would be having the wrong idea when it comes to, like, jihitsu, wrestling, M &A, like, that ain't the core element of fight itself.

[1130] Well, if you're fighting like those guys are on concrete, that is a whole different ballgame.

[1131] Especially with takedowns.

[1132] That's a real fight, though.

[1133] And like I said, I'd never do nothing like that.

[1134] That was for no amount of money, you know what I mean?

[1135] I bet they're not getting paid very well either.

[1136] No, not at all.

[1137] They're just going viral.

[1138] That's it.

[1139] You know what I'm saying?

[1140] They're just going viral, you know?

[1141] But besides that, though, but I do respect it because at the end of the day, that is real fighting.

[1142] Oh, it's real, yeah.

[1143] Period.

[1144] Especially on concrete.

[1145] Yeah, big fact.

[1146] If you're on concrete and you're fighting a wrestler, you're in deep shit.

[1147] You're in deep shit.

[1148] Well, hold on.

[1149] I didn't see any wrestlers get knocked out, though.

[1150] Oh, that happens too.

[1151] Come on now.

[1152] It's just like, you know, because they're thinking just double -leg itself, but do pulling your hair.

[1153] That's true, too.

[1154] Adding stuff to it, like, you know, head button.

[1155] Right.

[1156] If you're only a wrestler, yeah.

[1157] Big facts, you know, because you're thinking like your actual form of.

[1158] wrestling trying to you get in the wrestling stance like come on man like what did you do it like but i didn't seen it before like where people actually pick a stance like to get in that's not real fight right you don't even show that threat you just make the move right you know what i mean and like i say you eliminate the threat as fast as possible you know what i mean shout out to the uh detroit dust you know what saying dale brown you know but he speaks about it as well because it's just like you you you want to be in the most calm position as possible if you among somebody that's trying to fight you you know i mean now if you know this about to go there like you shouldn't show that you want to fight them you should actually like be more calm and be more whatever and then once they actually make that mood that's when you counter whatever and hit whatever part of the body that you can't.

[1159] Just be aware.

[1160] Just always be aware.

[1161] Always be aware.

[1162] You know what I'm saying?

[1163] Always be alert.

[1164] Do you find that now that you're known and you become like a famous fighter do people fuck with you now?

[1165] I ain't never been really fucked with now.

[1166] Like for real like I ain't never just had no type of problems like that.

[1167] But you're a nice guy though.

[1168] Yeah.

[1169] That's also part of it.

[1170] I walk with respect everywhere I go, you know what I'm saying?

[1171] So I never, like, be out of pocket, never, you know, be out of line, you know what I mean?

[1172] So I never add any situation where anybody will want to fight me, you know.

[1173] But, you know, me working security, I guess I hadn't had opportunities where I could have jacked up a lot of guys.

[1174] You know, definitely when I was younger, I was definitely effing up a lot of guys, but that's not the security job to do.

[1175] You know, you're supposed to de -escalate a lot of situations.

[1176] But you had a lot of guys that will, you know, try to press your patience, right?

[1177] And I could pop on them, but I just keep it cool, keep it calm.

[1178] and try to get people out the smartest way you're possible like hey bro you know what I'm saying let me highlight you outside real quick you know but then kick him out right you know what I'm saying like I'm trying to have a conversation with you and then hey man let me see you got something on your wristband break it off and then they got to leave you know what I'm saying but you get you do have scenarios for myself like when I was working security where guys will try to challenge you you know I mean and try to buck up and stuff like that where you do have to do something but at the end of the day don't nobody really try nothing because then you know they lose I'm undefeated in these streets I'm glad you're out of that situation now that's a dangerous game to play I mean and I've been playing it for a long time you know and that's why I say like it ain't scary getting into that cage that does play a factor guys have been in street fights and a lot of them it's calmer in the cage way more calm because like it's the actual it's competition you know what I'm saying like I got somebody right here on the side of me which is called a referee that if anything does happen he's going to stop the fight you know you don't got that in the street element you know I mean because once you get knocked out I didn't see a dude where they get K -O and dude keep pummeling, boom, boom, boom, and not stopping.

[1179] Yeah.

[1180] Like, bro, you're going to do some life, bro.

[1181] Like, you're going to do some life, bro.

[1182] Like, you kill this dude, you know what I'm saying?

[1183] And that's how people die.

[1184] All the time, you know what I mean?

[1185] And regardless, though, but those scenarios in dealing with that type of stuff, like I said, I feel like I'm at home when I'm in that octagon, you know?

[1186] Because this is where I feel like I'm free and then I can express myself freely without actually being judged for doing what I'm doing.

[1187] You know?

[1188] So that's why I love, you know, fighting in the USC right now now when you look at your career going forward you've got this chris curtis fight you plan on winning that fight and then you want to drop down to 170 no i am point blank period i was already i was already planned on moving down to 170 but what my manager told me i ain't trying to you know put this stuff out there like that you know uh i'm signed with sucker punch uh brian butler but he was telling me i can get a better contract if i signed one more fight at 185 okay you know so ufc offered you this fight they want to make an exciting fight for this big card in Vegas.

[1189] That's a great card.

[1190] And they love it, right?

[1191] You know what I mean?

[1192] Because it's not one fight that the UFC gave me that I did not.

[1193] I didn't take every fight.

[1194] I was even supposed to fight Alex Pereira, fan.

[1195] Really?

[1196] Yes, sir.

[1197] What was that?

[1198] So I had to result out of Hassan fight, right?

[1199] We were supposed to fight the first card of the year in January.

[1200] He's talking about the shoulder hurt.

[1201] You know what I'm saying?

[1202] He did something to his shoulder, whatever.

[1203] Blasee, blah, blah.

[1204] So I was like, man, forget that, bro.

[1205] I've been training hell hard.

[1206] Like, just give me anybody.

[1207] You know what I'm saying?

[1208] So if it ain't resolved, because I'm not going to push that fight back.

[1209] I want to fight in January, whatever.

[1210] So he was like, all right, Brian was telling me, I let me call him back, whatever, and let them know.

[1211] And they came back with the name.

[1212] And he was so hesitant to tell me, though.

[1213] This is the funny part, right?

[1214] So he was like, wow, man, you know, I don't really like this fight for you, man. You know, he's not really well known, but he's pretty good.

[1215] And I already said it forward before he said it.

[1216] I was like, Alex Perrier, he said, how do you know?

[1217] And I just already assumed just with my style and who he is because I always make sure I pay attention to who's on the roster.

[1218] I got to pay it to, even bow nickel, you know what I'm saying?

[1219] Like, even though he's not nowhere yet, that's still a name that people pay attention to and people want to see him do well.

[1220] So I pay attention to fighters like that.

[1221] And knowing that Alice Pereira really only got signed because he beat, I was like, that's somebody to pay attention to.

[1222] So when I was able to guess that name, he was like, yeah, that's the fight they want you to fight.

[1223] Immediately I said yes to it.

[1224] So he calls them back and he calls me back.

[1225] It was like, hey, I got some good news and I got some bad news.

[1226] I was like, oh, what's up?

[1227] He said, good news, you look great to the UFC that you're taking this fight, you know what I mean?

[1228] but bad news is they said they won't be ready in time and at first I was like oh man this dude being scary but now it makes sense he ain't scary to cut the weight he got so much weight to cut he big he big in him you know so it wasn't that Alex Ferrell wouldn't be able to take the fight because I think his coach or whoever his training is the one that declined because of the time frame wasn't messed up he needs time to cut weight you know what I mean but I would have took the fight though because I already know that he has to cut a lot of weight that dude's walking into the cage like 220 easily easily Easily, bro, you know what I'm saying?

[1229] Because he walking around 240.

[1230] He's got so much power.

[1231] What are your thoughts on that fight this weekend?

[1232] Because that's a big fight.

[1233] My thoughts on it, bro, is way different from everybody else's.

[1234] You know what I mean?

[1235] Because people call me crazy all the time.

[1236] But I think it's going to be like the same fight that we've seen, Yowell and Izzy with where you got two people just staring each other down, you know, not trying to make that move because, you know, they both had the capabilities of knocking each other out.

[1237] Or Francis and Gano versus the Derek Lewis.

[1238] You know what I mean?

[1239] So, and with everything, the height.

[1240] being behind this fight too you know uh izzie is going hopefully like i said if he don't apply his emotions into it like he hasn't done with every other fight i feel like he's going to do enough to win but i feel like alice perere is not going to be able to apply that pressure uh on uh izzie just because he won't have the energy to sustain that for five rounds remember this is a five round right because of the fact that he's cutting so much weight thank you you know what and then plus we don't see uh alex perrera move a lot anyway right in his fights right you only seen with bruno silver where he pushed him up against the cage a lot And that was a good fight to watch.

[1241] It was a very good fight to watch.

[1242] You got hitting that fight.

[1243] We got touched up real good.

[1244] Bruno Silva's a very good striker.

[1245] Man, big facts, you know.

[1246] I don't know.

[1247] But I go what you're saying.

[1248] He's got good power.

[1249] He's in your weight class.

[1250] Yeah, I know, yeah, yeah.

[1251] I'll be seeing guys and I'll be like, this is why they win in these fights.

[1252] You know what I mean?

[1253] So I know that you're not a boxer.

[1254] I know that you're not a kickbox.

[1255] He's not a heavy striker because he's more of a jist.

[1256] He's more of a grappler.

[1257] But Bruno Silver got a good power.

[1258] You know what I'm saying?

[1259] like Bruno Silver beginning his ass, even Jordan Wright was touching him.

[1260] Jordan Wright was touching Bruno Silver, but then, you know, Jordan Wright just got caught.

[1261] He stood in front of him.

[1262] He stood in front of him, got caught, and it don't take that much in the four -ounce gloves.

[1263] And that's why this Pereira fight is so interesting, though, because Pereira has that ridiculous power.

[1264] He just need that one shot.

[1265] But the thing about Izzy, he is patient?

[1266] And he would, and he would, well, we're not going to call it boring, but he would strategically break you down all night long for 25 minutes.

[1267] If he got to touch that leg all day, he don't touch it You know, if you ain't going to do nothing about it If you're not going to answer back That's what he's going to do But I feel like in my heart You know what I mean That Alex Pereira unfortunately He doesn't have the actual ability To fight Izzy the way he needs to win For five rounds For five rounds.

[1268] Because he's so big Yeah, that's one of the reasons But I just think between both of them It's going to be a boring fight It's not going to be as exciting as people think it might be And that's the thing Izzy needs that type of exciting fight right now You know because the Jared Canaanier fight.

[1269] You know, we could say Paula Costa, but that was so, how long?

[1270] It was 20, you know what I'm saying?

[1271] So we've been expecting this front of the champ because he's so pulverized outside the cage where, you know, the French Tills, the Pearl necklace, you know what I mean, doing all these little videos and dancing and all that, just show me and stuff.

[1272] But we want to see that showcase in the cage as well, you know.

[1273] And that's my biggest thing.

[1274] I'm impressed by Izzy, and I'm a fan of Izzy, first off.

[1275] But I feel like if you don't bring the fight to him, he's not going to bring it to you.

[1276] That makes sense?

[1277] Yes.

[1278] So like Anderson Silva in his pride.

[1279] Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, big facts.

[1280] I mean, people forget that there was quite a few fights where Anderson Silva did the same thing.

[1281] He laid Talas Laitis.

[1282] Remember that fight?

[1283] Yes, yes.

[1284] You know, there was many fights where, you know, he laid back and waited for guys to come at Anderson.

[1285] Even better, there was Damien Maya.

[1286] Yes.

[1287] And, you know what I'm saying?

[1288] And I'm, boy, Danny was mad about that one, you hear of you?

[1289] You know, but at the same time, that's the way he won.

[1290] Yes.

[1291] You know?

[1292] Because why would I, why would I?

[1293] I engaged with you knowing what you're trying to do.

[1294] Right.

[1295] You understand?

[1296] Yeah.

[1297] So like I said, with that being said, I'm not mad at Izzy because he's going to do whatever it takes to keep that belt.

[1298] That's the money.

[1299] Right.

[1300] You know, Alex Parr wants that.

[1301] But the thing is, though, I don't think his ability is going to beat her in order to take it away from him, you know, and they're just going to be standing right in front of it, and it's going to be a kickboxing about and they were like, oh, well, the other ones were kickboxing, but you already seen from Izzy, well, I was a little bit more emotional in those other fights.

[1302] And that's why I lost.

[1303] But then you see The strategic Izzy now, I don't see Alex Perrette beating him.

[1304] Interesting.

[1305] Very interesting.

[1306] Yeah, take into account what you're saying about the five rounds and the weight cut, because that is a big factor.

[1307] That's a big factor.

[1308] That's a big factor, yeah.

[1309] Because Alex is so big, but without the wrestling threat, because Izzy is not really a guy who takes anybody down.

[1310] I'm about to say, yeah, who out there are wrestling?

[1311] Right.

[1312] So everybody thinks like, oh, Izzy going to turn into a wrestling.

[1313] No, he ain't.

[1314] No. You only fight the way you train, you know?

[1315] and not saying you don't work on that element of wrestling, but I don't see, is he, like, shooting a jab, shooting across, shooting a hook, and double it.

[1316] No. That's not going to happen.

[1317] I mean, if it does, I'll be stunned.

[1318] I'll be shocked.

[1319] I'm sure he can do it.

[1320] I'll be shocked.

[1321] But the thing is, though, now you've got to engage with it, and that boy is sniper.

[1322] Alex Pereer, can we pull up that, you don't mind?

[1323] Please.

[1324] With Alex Pereer, with him shooting, like, you know what I'm saying, sniping with the arrows.

[1325] Yeah, when he shot the soccer ball.

[1326] Bro, man, that's crazy because my biggest thing is, though, like, Alps Perez, the same type of beast, too, right?

[1327] He's a trap.

[1328] He waits all day.

[1329] And once you expose yourself or you come close enough, he hits you.

[1330] Like Sean Strickland.

[1331] Exactly.

[1332] Sean Strickland stood right in front of him.

[1333] But it wouldn't even just standing right in front of him.

[1334] He was marching him down with his hands down.

[1335] Well, yeah, he keeps his hands like, he has a very strange style.

[1336] Yeah.

[1337] So here's him.

[1338] I ain't go a lot.

[1339] This was cold.

[1340] It's pretty badass.

[1341] This was cold, man. It's pretty badass.

[1342] And it ain't one of those special.

[1343] little arrows either like bow and arrows like it's one of them he just made in the house well that's a recurve bow he grabbed a stick and grab a strain yeah that's a recurve bow that's a hard much harder bow to shoot than what I shoot I shoot a compound bow man that's that takes real skill yeah look at him that that roar that he has is terrifying I'm very excited about this fight man I don't know you know what kind of preparation he's done in terms of getting himself lighter for a five round fight and making sure that the cut is not as bad I don't I don't know, but he looks shredded already.

[1344] He looks shredded, man. And he looked like he's killing himself to make that weight.

[1345] That's all I'm going to say.

[1346] He certainly is losing a lot of weight to make that weight.

[1347] He killed himself to get to that weight.

[1348] But he's done it many, many times.

[1349] But you see Izzy doing all this press, doing all this stuff.

[1350] Now, I'll be honest with you, I'd be like, it's a positive thing.

[1351] But at the same time, I ain't never seen him do this much work before or preparation for a fight where it comes to, like, selling it.

[1352] Yeah, press, yeah.

[1353] Yeah, but they make you do that.

[1354] I mean, this is mass and square guards.

[1355] This is the most I pay attention to these fighters all the time because they're in the weight class, right?

[1356] I want to beat these guys, right?

[1357] I want to take their belt, right?

[1358] So I pay close attention to what they do all the time and especially because he's the champ, you know?

[1359] So besides it just being ESPN Plus, you know, he got his own YouTube channel and everything like that.

[1360] And I mean, like, I feel like he didn't amp it up even more.

[1361] And there's nothing wrong with that.

[1362] That's either showing me that you have a lot of confidence, you know, about yourself and you were able to take this fight and I want to say not so serious, but not as serious because you're not as serious, You're doing other stuff on top of this, right?

[1363] Alex Perey is only focusing on training and fighting right now.

[1364] There ain't no press for him for real for it.

[1365] You know what I mean?

[1366] So he's taking it into the initiative.

[1367] I'm talking about Izzy to promote this fight as best as he can.

[1368] So you're also taking away from your training at the end of the day.

[1369] Right?

[1370] So that's – but I feel like he think he's good enough to do what he's going to do in order to take time away from his training.

[1371] But isn't that just what the UFC obligates him to do?

[1372] Because he's selling the fight and he has paid.

[1373] Paperview points.

[1374] Not with everything.

[1375] But he has paper view points.

[1376] I feel you, but I feel like...

[1377] And he also is the only one that speaks English.

[1378] Alex doesn't speak English.

[1379] Yeah, yeah, true.

[1380] So that makes it difficult.

[1381] Yeah.

[1382] But I feel like a lot of stuff he's been doing on his own as well.

[1383] Mm. Doing extra stuff, you know?

[1384] Which I don't mind that because you got to promote the fight.

[1385] You got to do whatever you got to do in order to get people to buy in.

[1386] You know, and be honest with you, it's not that hard of a buy -in because even with Alisprera not being able to speak English, he's the only person that beat him.

[1387] Only person that knocked him out.

[1388] Right.

[1389] You know what I'm saying?

[1390] So that's an easy sale on itself.

[1391] So my thing is why is I'm saying trying so hard?

[1392] You know what I mean?

[1393] Like this is the one that if I wasn't an MMA head and I was just like whatever just watching this stuff I'm like oh okay that'd be interesting to watch dude that already knocked them out this dude is undefeating MMA but still could be a close fight I'll watch it you know but Izzy is going about his way and like I said I don't know what's going on in his head but I feel like he's not trying to think about the fight itself even though it is the press conference and all this other stuff he's trying to get himself more calm right he want to be around more people i forget who it's another fighter that talked about that and the reason why he always stayed um you know in the press and interviews because it it took him away from the fight you know they always wanted to be in the light i forget what i know what you're saying so you know the more you do other stuff you could just have fun and yeah yeah yeah big fact you know exactly and you ain't got to actually focus on the the uh the actual mission itself you know you just go to the mission you know so i don't know it's it's it's Two ways to go about it, you know.

[1394] And I feel like if Izzy goes out, like I said, emotional, he will get caught, you know.

[1395] So I feel like he needs to keep doing it.

[1396] Like even when he play around like, oh, I might just kick his leg and just jab him in the whole fight.

[1397] Do that.

[1398] Even with him joking, do that.

[1399] Yeah.

[1400] You know?

[1401] Because at the same time, that's how you've been winning your fights this whole time.

[1402] A lot of them.

[1403] The thing about Bahara is he's there to get hit.

[1404] He can be hit.

[1405] He fights with his hands down.

[1406] You said it right.

[1407] You're a mahogany tree.

[1408] He is that.

[1409] Like he's made out of wood.

[1410] You've been not running to him, though.

[1411] Yeah.

[1412] You understand?

[1413] Yeah.

[1414] He's, like, built different, man. He's so dense.

[1415] Yeah, big fact.

[1416] I mean, just the way he hit guys with that left hook, right?

[1417] And it's the crazy part.

[1418] It's not just him knocking them out, but they all fall the same.

[1419] Yeah.

[1420] They fall like they just shut off.

[1421] And they got shot.

[1422] Yeah, it's crazy.

[1423] Yeah, I had never seen that before.

[1424] Like, even with Mike Tyson, when he knock out guys, at least they fall, whatever, like, in different type of ways.

[1425] But, like, you said, it's like he almost killing these guys.

[1426] Yeah.

[1427] It's like a straight, you know, blank shot to there.

[1428] Boom.

[1429] And then like their whole body just shuts down Like the LFA knockout Then he did I don't know who the dude he knocked out Find that fight Yeah I mean he's a motherfucker with that left hook But he's a motherfucker with everything You know when he knocked out Jason Willness You know hit him with a head kick And a flying knee He didn't have that many fights But hold on Did you see his loss though?

[1430] Which one?

[1431] He only had one In kickboxing No no no no Oh my bad So uh In MMA?

[1432] Yeah he got submitted Correct He got submitted Yeah yeah But it was a So have you seen it though Yeah I did I saw a while ago So it's hard to find I found it one time And that's why it gave me A lot of confidence Like to fight buddy Right Just seeing the fight that he had Against Duel And trust me Dude was taking a lot of punishment Don't get it towards The dude was tough as hell You know But just seeing How that guy was able To persevere And still Clench up against Alex Pere And wear him out And make him tired And get him to the ground And then eventually End up submitting him I'm like I'm gonna put that dog work on That's the type of style That I bring I don't care Who I'm fighting I'm still gonna bring that style I don't care who you is you know what I mean so all I need to do is see that it's like oh you ain't got that great of conditioning and it's not that you don't work out harder you don't train hard you couldn't all this weight to get there your body ain't never gonna be 100 % I also think that was very early in his approach to MMA and that was also but like six months later he was in the UFC but it was also before he was fighting Glover or training with Glover I think that made a big factor in both Glover and his career might have but he's still fighting the same way to me right Like I said I look at the last loss Like even with Not even lost with Izzy But like with the fight with Kevin Gadsden Where he got touched the most You know And that's the fight that you lose This is This is What is this This is kickboxing lost?

[1433] No he lost a few times In kickboxing he got liverhooked Yeah I ain't see this one Oh that's a good kickboxing fight Yeah Yeah he got caught with a left hook But I think Izzy beat Homeboy right there though Left hook Leg kicks He's lost before Yeah of course But again This is Alex early in his career.

[1434] But this is kickboxing, though, man. And this is why I'm trying to say, like, if I fought Alex Pereira, I'm putting the singling on.

[1435] You know?

[1436] Right.

[1437] Like, I'm not going to play with you.

[1438] Like, you know, I'm going to take the fight where I feel like I have more advantage as it.

[1439] Yeah, he lost his last kickboxing fight in glory, a very, very close decision to, I forget the gentleman's name, but this Russian cat who's a guy.

[1440] No, no, no, that's neat now.

[1441] Boy, that was nasty.

[1442] That was nasty.

[1443] I give him that, but like I said, yet again, dudes standing right in front of him.

[1444] Yes.

[1445] He's setting up that trap, you know?

[1446] Yes.

[1447] Yeah, he set up the trap.

[1448] Look, look.

[1449] Not only that, Izzy called that.

[1450] He was actually in the dressing room, and he called that fight.

[1451] And that's Bruno Silver.

[1452] Yeah, that's Bruno Silver.

[1453] And Bruno Silver was getting his ass with by Jordan Wright, and I felt for Jordan Wright, man. You know, he just got that little 50 -K though for a fighter night, but he's just a warm round fighter, though, I feel like.

[1454] Well, he fights wild.

[1455] Yeah, Jordan fights wild.

[1456] So this is the Bruno Silva fight, which is the only fight that he went in the UFC to decision, But you see Bruno hit him with some shots Brunsched with him here Put the dog fight down Put the dog fight on But Al Jarrell so he's a dog too though You see him?

[1457] Oh yeah Still coming back Boom But he got him pressed up against the cage though Look he don't move his feet though He's standing right in front of him And Bruno survived We have to put that out I mean guys have finished Bruno But he survived against Pereira But again I mean the Bell saved him a little bit Yeah Bell saved him a little bit But again you fight a guy like him Like if you put him In this fight Even though he walked out of it With a decision that took something away from Bruno when you get a beating like this against a guy like Pahara you know that's also how I feel about Francis Sangano's first fight with Steepay stepe won that fight but man he took a lot of punishment a lot of punishment yeah a lot of punishment and I don't think you're the same after that there's certain fights where fighters that that was the strong Sean Strickland was like almost like Taylor made for him walking forward so this is what I want to say too because the reason why they need Alex Pereira's because there's nobody that's going to be able to well not nobody because I could have done regardless it's three walls that's saving Izzy right you know what those three walls is Robert Whitaker Marvin Vittory and Jared Kennedy if you were a fighter Upcoming Matt Fack National Day right I lost to him if he's trying to work his way up into fighting for a belt you got to fight one of those guys If you can't be those guys you're not going to fight Alex Pereer did he fight any one of those guys I missed no but I feel like Alex Pereira get exposed if he fall any three of those.

[1458] Well, I think that's one of the reasons why they fast -tracked him to the title because of the fact that it's hyped up.

[1459] Yeah, it's a big fight.

[1460] It's a hard about money.

[1461] But, yeah, I think Marvin Vittori is a very tough fight for him.

[1462] Marvittory, Robert Whitaker, and shoot Jerry Kenney.

[1463] Yes, all three.

[1464] But Vittoria, in particular, really good at takedowns big fucking guy.

[1465] Big as well.

[1466] Big as fuck.

[1467] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[1468] You see that guy, like, how the fuck is that $185 pounds?

[1469] I mean, shoot, Paula Costa.

[1470] Actually, that's one of the best fights I've seen in the minute between him, Marvittory and Paul because they both fall at their natural weight right right didn't cut anyway didn't cut it because at first I gave that same prediction at first I was like bro these guys fighting that 185 it's gonna be the slowest dragged -out fight because both of them gonna be depleted but instead Paula Costa didn't come in cutting weight he was like oh I don't want to cut weight man I don't want to be what you said 205 or something like that he was like no forget that I don't want to be heavy weight because like my man came in damn there like a heavy weight I don't care nobody say you know so even though they made that 205 like uh light heavy weight together they were both just walking around you know what I'm saying comfortable the craziest aspects of MMA the day before a cage fight you're supposed to dehydrate yourself dehydrate yourself to the point of death yeah yeah um it's wild ain't it wild yeah doesn't make any sense and I'm trying to go back to it with my crazy ass but my thing is though it's just understanding they just keep getting bigger yeah you know you know and like I can do it you know and uh my biggest thing is like I'm not scared but it's just I got to be smart right you know and um you know Being able to fight these guys, you know, I got to realize, like, I got to be safe in the first and second round.

[1471] You know, that's why I didn't mind, like, one in the main event, because I feel like I could definitely put that pressure, had a condition, and it would go 25 minutes on the guys that's in middleweight, right?

[1472] So we can fight a little bit smarter, but only having three rounds, I can only do so much.

[1473] Right.

[1474] And that's what happened in the National Day fight.

[1475] I'd have ran out of time.

[1476] Yes.

[1477] So I played myself, you know.

[1478] But, yeah, these guys, man, like, it's just crazy just to see the development of 185.

[1479] So a lot of these guys that's going up into the rankings and stuff like that, if you're not fight.

[1480] those three guys right there and you don't beat them you're not going to fight the belt so now that Alex Perey was able to skip over the head like he was a knight like you playing the chest was able to skip over those three ponds and now he's getting the king you know what I'm saying so hey that's lucky him you know I ain't even mad at it because we want to see something that's different in my eyes though I just don't see it because I don't believe Alex Perret has the skill set necessary to fight the type of style that we need to see is he against and what type of style you think that is aggressive grappler forward pressure good hands, Kevin Gassum, even though Kevin Gassum lost, right?

[1481] Another style like that, a Southpaw.

[1482] I don't believe that's the only Southpaw they fought, I believe, is he?

[1483] Well, Yoel, Y 'L's a Southpaw too.

[1484] Oh, Y 'OL?

[1485] But Y 'L didn't do nothing.

[1486] You didn't do much.

[1487] Y 'L was being perfect, but he just stood like this.

[1488] Y 'L might be 60 years old.

[1489] We don't even know how old he is.

[1490] Then he went like a lawsuit or something?

[1491] Like, didn't he get paid?

[1492] Like, I don't know.

[1493] Like, somebody was talking about that.

[1494] A supplement.

[1495] A supplement.

[1496] It was a supplement, like, retain it, whatever.

[1497] Like, he got a bag from that.

[1498] Yeah, something happened.

[1499] I don't know how much he got.

[1500] Okay.

[1501] But he just won his last fight in Bellator.

[1502] He did?

[1503] Who you went against?

[1504] Oh, no, no. Actually, I think I probably might know.

[1505] Melvin Manoff?

[1506] Yes.

[1507] No, yeah, yeah.

[1508] And I hate that because Melvin Manoff was one of the guys I looked up to, though.

[1509] Oh, my God.

[1510] Melvin in his prime.

[1511] That was the pure Sabbath.

[1512] Like, that was the Mike Tyson, the kickboxing.

[1513] 100%.

[1514] Come on now.

[1515] Yeah, 100%.

[1516] Like, but just seeing like guys.

[1517] With those gladiator shorts?

[1518] Man, you mind with those gladiator shorts?

[1519] Shredded.

[1520] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[1521] Come on, ho, ho, ho, we're in the leash.

[1522] To the death.

[1523] He'd come out to the death.

[1524] I mean, that dude fought like a fucking demon.

[1525] Yeah, man. He was so good as a kickbox.

[1526] The guy knocked out Mark Hunt.

[1527] Yeah, I know.

[1528] How about Mark Hunt?

[1529] Knocking out that undefeated fighter at 48 years old.

[1530] Do you see that shit?

[1531] Mark Hunt, first of all, Mark Hunt still fighting?

[1532] Mark Hunt still fighting.

[1533] Still fighting.

[1534] He won his last fight.

[1535] And he won two, hunt.

[1536] Hey, shout out.

[1537] He fought this undefeated boxer and knocked him out.

[1538] He was like a huge.

[1539] underdog and why end up knocking him out?

[1540] That's why is 48 years old?

[1541] And that's, but my thing is, Joe, why you think that is, though?

[1542] Like, not why he knocked him out, but why do you think these guys continue to fight like this?

[1543] At this age?

[1544] Well, I think Mark Hunt is born for it, first of all.

[1545] He loves it.

[1546] He's been around forever.

[1547] I mean, Mark Hunt was the K -1 Grand Prix champion, you know, fought in pride and the glory days of pride, fought in UFC, and the glory days of the heavyweight division, and still slinging leather at 48 years old massive respect My thing like With all that being said and done Like you think like you'd be done I don't know man You know like what more do you have to prove And show and do Like Anderson silver man That broke my heart when you lost to Jake Oh bro And like you got this little kid bro Like you know And he's doing his thing right You see that he's an athlete You see that he's working on his His style of fighting You know what I mean when it comes to boxing But at the end of the day It's still he picking He picking at every MMA head right and he's fighting Tyron Willie, Ben, Ashton, now Anderson Silver, and then guess who he said probably going to be next, right?

[1548] Jake Paul.

[1549] No, Andrew Tate.

[1550] Oh, actually, they just posted it today.

[1551] They just faced off the day.

[1552] The name that he was talking about was Diaz, though, at first, at first.

[1553] Well, the Diaz fight is a big name and a big money fight, but he's a lot bigger.

[1554] He's a lot bigger than Nate.

[1555] Wait, but that's the point.

[1556] Yeah.

[1557] He wants as many.

[1558] He is doing it smart, but at the same time, he embarrassing all of us.

[1559] Like for real And it's sad Because he's saying All these different things And he's talking about And having these Real conversations That need to be had But it's coming from him He means about money You are you know But it's not But it's not a conversation For him to have But it is It is because it helps him get attention And it helps fighters Take his point I love what he's doing I hate it I love it I want to be to that I'm sure you do But you're a fighter And I'm gonna get a check for it too Yes But it's not because I'm just a fighter Because he's telling us that we're not even and brave enough to fight for ourselves.

[1560] So I'm going to fight for y 'all while I'm knocking out y 'all legends in the process of it.

[1561] Well, what he's doing is very intelligent.

[1562] Oh, no, no, it's smart.

[1563] The promotions off the chart, he's hilarious, he's brash, and he's winning, and he's winning.

[1564] But it's who he's winning against, though.

[1565] Yeah, but Anderson Silva, you've got to say, that's the most impressive fight that he won.

[1566] You got to say Anderson Silva is a legend.

[1567] Maybe he's 47 years old.

[1568] But that's the thing, I had Jake Paul to win.

[1569] I knew Jake Paul was going to win Just because of the age itself You know what I mean?

[1570] And then on top of that I didn't see Jake Paul knocking out Anderson either though You understand I just knew it would be competitive enough For Jake Paul to take it You know what I'm saying Take the win But at the same time It's just like Bro like If you fall Anderson When he was you know what I'm saying In his prime You get knocked out Right Well you're talking about Most certainly in an MMA fight Not even most certainly In the MMA fight Like Anderson to box boxes, bro.

[1571] And that's the thing, too, I hate about MMA dudes, like, since we're on here.

[1572] Like, a lot of these dudes be like, I'll box Canello or our box, you know what I'm saying, Mayweather and all this stuff, but never getting the actual ring and just train and spar with actual real boxes from, like, whatever the neighborhood.

[1573] You know what I'm saying?

[1574] Like, I used to actually box with the guys from the neighborhood and Pagedale boxing, like Josh Temple, you know, Vaughn Alexander, Devin's brother, you know.

[1575] I had to actually work with actual boxers to realize, oh, this is a different type of game.

[1576] Yes.

[1577] You know?

[1578] But when you're just boxing with the guys that's in the MMA room and you're thinking, like, because you're touching them, that you're pretty decent, you're going to find out if you actually get in with a real boxer before you actually compete with them.

[1579] That, yeah, you don't know what you're doing, you know?

[1580] Because there's a certain little combination and there's certain, like, cadences that we do as MMA fighters that will get us knocked out from a boxer, you know?

[1581] Have you thought about competing as a boxer?

[1582] Yeah, yeah, that's what I'm in.

[1583] But the thing is, though, It's so deluded because the whole perception of M .M .A. guys won the box is because of money.

[1584] Because I would never just get into it for money.

[1585] My biggest thing is I would actually commit myself to the sport of boxing.

[1586] I would get me a boxing coach.

[1587] Like when, even George St. Pierre, like, I feel like he could have been pretty decent, you know, had a great jab in M .M .A. But you see he was working with who, Freddie Roach, you know?

[1588] Right.

[1589] And Anderson Silva also found a boxing coach.

[1590] I figured who he was working with as well, but you can see him that he was training that art of boxing.

[1591] and he could actually compete in the actual ring back in the day.

[1592] So you would need a timeline?

[1593] You would need.

[1594] Yeah, definitely a timeline.

[1595] How much time do you think you would need?

[1596] Well, since I already been working with boxes for a minute and I got a great boxing coach at St .L Boxing, Reggie Thomas Child to him, I probably only need like two, three years to actually find me a profile, you know, and actually work up my - But that's a realistic assessment.

[1597] I'm glad you said that.

[1598] Two -three years is correct.

[1599] Oh, yes, sir.

[1600] You can't just hop into it.

[1601] A year time ain't just going to work for you.

[1602] And then I'm not just going to call out the best in the world, you know, pound for pound.

[1603] I'm going to work my way up.

[1604] Right.

[1605] I'm going to get some lockouts.

[1606] I'm going to get some good little names.

[1607] I'm going to get some prospects.

[1608] And then I'm like, once y 'all see, I got a resume now.

[1609] Now let's see what them names talking about.

[1610] Now, when you're talking about your future, like, how many more fights you have on your UFC contract?

[1611] Oh, man, man, I'm going to keep that on a lot.

[1612] Oh, how many do I have on my contract right now?

[1613] Yeah.

[1614] Yeah.

[1615] I just signed.

[1616] I just signed.

[1617] I just signed.

[1618] I still got four, I guess.

[1619] So the C .C. is the new fight on the contract.

[1620] So when you...

[1621] So I got a four -fight contract.

[1622] When you get over those four fights, have you seriously considered...

[1623] I know exactly what my plan is.

[1624] What is your plan?

[1625] I can't give out the plan now.

[1626] Tell me later.

[1627] Yeah, I'll tell you later.

[1628] Yeah, I can't tell you the plan now.

[1629] But you do have a master plan.

[1630] I got a master plan, baby.

[1631] It's beautiful, too.

[1632] Yeah.

[1633] Yes, sir.

[1634] Yeah.

[1635] So we're working on it.

[1636] So ideally, when you move to 170, do you have a name in mind and a point in mind?

[1637] Oh, man. Yes, sir.

[1638] So my big...

[1639] First off, you already shot it.

[1640] one of Mawvidar, I didn't even think about him.

[1641] Mazvedal.

[1642] I didn't even think about him, right?

[1643] But for Mazvedal, he's looking for the top of the - Exactly, so it'd be a waste of time.

[1644] He'd be a waste of time.

[1645] So a real fight, right?

[1646] So we just talked about it.

[1647] And even though he had killer and I love him, right?

[1648] And just as a fan of M .M .A. Schiwkot, right?

[1649] And he already got a fight book with Jeff Neal.

[1650] I feel like if somebody fall out in that fight, I would love either one of those guys.

[1651] If somebody falls out, you know what I mean?

[1652] Right.

[1653] Because both matches between me and Jeff Neal, we kind of fight similarly, right?

[1654] So it would be a test of skills right there.

[1655] And Shotcott, we just don't know about him yet.

[1656] Like, we're going to find out how good Shotcott is when he fight Jeff Neal if he does or if he fights me. We would really see how good he is.

[1657] When is that fight supposed to be taking place?

[1658] I have no clue.

[1659] I just know they looked at.

[1660] Is that a fight night fight?

[1661] Yes.

[1662] I might go to the apex for that.

[1663] Is that the apex?

[1664] Yeah, I believe.

[1665] Dude, I love going to the apex.

[1666] Yeah, big fact.

[1667] I went to the Apex recently.

[1668] I watched Song Yudong and Corey Anderson.

[1669] No. No, you might have said it.

[1670] I'm not in the, Corey Sanhank.

[1671] I got you.

[1672] Sorry, Corey Anderson.

[1673] Shout out to Cory Anderson.

[1674] It's killing it in Belltor.

[1675] But Sanhagen and Song Yudan was a wild fight.

[1676] And to be there live with very few people in the crowd.

[1677] And right, that apex is something special, man. I hated the fact that fighters had to fight there during the pandemic but I love being there I think for me right now like even shout out to my man Charles Johnson he got a fight coming up you remember Charles and I said NERG he finally in the UFC you know what I mean a little shaking dangerous flyway big facts man so we got another fight November 19th in Vegas but I feel like it's just a good start for a lot of guys in the UFC you know I mean sure get their feet wet in the apex you know because the lights ain't so bright you know it's not like a whole arena and stuff like you still get an audience you know you still get a little feel for it but like i feel like that's where guys need to start off at you know what i mean at the apex and then work they way up to a bigger venue type stuff so i would agree with that i think the apex is a good start off you know for a lot of guys okay does not have a location they don't it might not be the and celtvin calvin galson and nasson is a very good fight that's a very good fight but i think kelvin gassum could have been a world champion at 170 oh most i really do he's just like eating You love eating too much.

[1678] Look at the Shafcott versus Jeff Neal is good.

[1679] That's a good fight.

[1680] And that's the thing, though.

[1681] I know how talented Jeff Neal is, so we're going to really see how good Shepkaid is.

[1682] And Carlos Hernandez and Nassimento is a great fight too.

[1683] I ain't going to like you.

[1684] I don't know who those is.

[1685] I don't know who they.

[1686] Hernandez is the guy that submitted, fuck is his name, that fucking gigantic jujitsu guy.

[1687] Oh, my God.

[1688] Is that Fluffy Hernandez?

[1689] Okay, okay, I don't know his real name.

[1690] Okay, yeah, that's good.

[1691] Okay, but who is he fighting in?

[1692] So who is Fluffy fight?

[1693] Who is it again?

[1694] Nassiamento.

[1695] He's a very good fighter, too.

[1696] That's a good fight.

[1697] It's one of them underrated fights.

[1698] Yeah, there it is.

[1699] Who is that?

[1700] Oh, no, stop playing.

[1701] He's good.

[1702] He's good, what?

[1703] He's a good fighter.

[1704] Okay, 19, 19, 16, oh, 13, so you're a submission arts.

[1705] Yeah, he's a Brazilian cat.

[1706] He's very good, man. Okay.

[1707] He's very good.

[1708] That's a good fight.

[1709] That's a good fight.

[1710] That's a good fight.

[1711] Oh, no, no, okay, so this is $125.

[1712] So Fluffy ain't the right dude I'm talking about then.

[1713] That's 125?

[1714] That's 125?

[1715] Oh, so that's a different Carl Sanandez?

[1716] Oh, it is.

[1717] Okay.

[1718] I'm so like, I don't recognize it because I pay attention to my weight class.

[1719] Fluffy Hernandez is not Carl Sanandez.

[1720] This is his name.

[1721] Yeah, I don't know.

[1722] Google Fluffy Hernandez.

[1723] But you write it about because he submitted the dude that, and I mean.

[1724] Anthony is his first name.

[1725] Yeah, Anthony.

[1726] That's what's, sorry, Anthony.

[1727] Who did he?

[1728] he just won recently as well.

[1729] And you know what's funny about this, though?

[1730] They called it the Kevin Holland effect, right?

[1731] Because Anthony Hernandez and myself lost to Kevin Holland, right?

[1732] Rodolfo Vieira.

[1733] That's who he beat.

[1734] That was the big fight.

[1735] That was huge.

[1736] Yeah, a lot of, well, not a lot of people.

[1737] And he beat Barrio in his last fight, too.

[1738] Whoever better on him to win by submission got some good money.

[1739] Crazy money.

[1740] Yeah, big fun.

[1741] Because that is unheard of.

[1742] The fact that he did that, he was able to submit one of the greatest jujitsu guys to ever compete in MMA.

[1743] And that's another guy that.

[1744] It's enormous for that weight class.

[1745] Oh, big fan.

[1746] If you're standing next to Viera, you're like, how the fuck are you making 85?

[1747] He's so big.

[1748] So on top of just talking about that, right?

[1749] So a lot of people on the internet, man, they'd be going crazy, man. But it was the Kevin Holland effect because Anthony Hernandez also lost to Kevin Holland and then I lost, right?

[1750] So when I came back, I did my crazy kick after loosening him.

[1751] Right.

[1752] After he came back, he did his crazy, like, you know, submission on, you know what I'm saying?

[1753] Didn't nobody expect it.

[1754] So he was like, man, hey, it might be a good thing to lose.

[1755] or Kevin Hollen, man, you might have your crazy little next fight.

[1756] Because my name blew up after that, and then his name blew up.

[1757] You know what I mean?

[1758] And it was all just, like, so it's just crazy how the internet just be going wild like that, you know.

[1759] It is interesting how, like, put things together.

[1760] One big moment can just, like, catapult your career.

[1761] Yeah.

[1762] Well, only, I feel like it's only in M .M .A., brother.

[1763] They work like that, you know, because, like, you see a Marswood doll, you see a D .S. You know what I mean?

[1764] Of course they didn't took losses, but are they need, it was a couple of wins, a couple good finishes, bro, and their name was, you know what I'm saying, massive, you know, at the end of the day, you know?

[1765] Well, that's also why you fight the way you fight To get those big moments Yeah, true story Because you're like one of the most fan -friendly styles That's in the sport Well, it's just the people I used to watch Who I used to love watching So I just imitated them, man Like I said, so Melvin Manoff was one of my favorite Fighters, bro, to watch Rampage Jackson Man with his personality outside You know, UFC and stuff And, you know, a lot of these guys that, you know I used to be fan of Those are the people that I emulated my style out of And I just messed my own type of style into it Melvin, man, Jesus Christ.

[1766] Melvin in his prime.

[1767] He was so fun to watch.

[1768] But without a doubt, one of the most all -time scariest fighters.

[1769] Pure Savage, man. And my man was only, what, eight, five, seven?

[1770] Yeah, he wasn't big.

[1771] And he was fighting, like, Tyrone Spong, like, who else did he fight, the Gohan, go -cudu, what's his name?

[1772] Yeah, go -cunzaki.

[1773] Yeah, you know what I mean?

[1774] He fought fucking Mark Hunt.

[1775] He bought Mark Hunt and knocked Mark Hunt.

[1776] And not Mark Hunt out.

[1777] In the first round.

[1778] My hunt tried to come out after him real, but he's like, no, forget that, sat down.

[1779] He was so fast.

[1780] Melvin and his prime was so fast.

[1781] And so savage, those kicks were just insane.

[1782] Yeah, bro, a whole different level, man. Yeah, well, he was one of those guys out of Mike's gym, those do -or -die guys, you know?

[1783] Big fat.

[1784] Just like Botter Hari, you know, whatever they're doing in that gym, man, they are creating monsters.

[1785] I don't even know if it's the gym, but the people that they bring in it, you know?

[1786] Like this type of lifestyle, that you live and your upbringing is the biggest thing, and that's what makes for a great fighter, you know what I'm saying?

[1787] And, like, you know, I don't know much of Melvin Manoff, you know, past anything like that, but they were just talking about how he just come from humble beginnings and everything like that, and how life was hard, you know what I mean?

[1788] And I believe we were talking about Francis Ngano, you know, in the back, whatever, but we were just talking about, you know, how great of a fighter he is because of all the things that he had went through, you know?

[1789] And when you see him walk around it, and the way he carries himself, you can't just tell, like, can't nothing faze him.

[1790] Right.

[1791] Can't nothing hurt him.

[1792] Just a fearless.

[1793] fighter you know what I'm saying but it was all because of what he experienced in his life that led to like I said so making fighting real easy now did you hear the story that he told on this podcast yeah of course crazy it's wild crazy on some movie type stuff you know what I mean like come on bro you know and just to believe like to keep going through that right yeah like he did and that's the thing too like he could arrest dying to go like you know what I'm saying through that journey you know what I know but multiple times eight times he got arrested you know sent back to the desert right and he was like I'm gonna keep going until I get there yeah like come on now that's perseverance right there that's real perseverance yeah bro so yeah that that right there alone like I said you can use those as examples that people actually go through to not stop doing what you doing because I almost gave up on dream on some bullshit you know what I mean like so like back in the past like when I used to have a gym at Finney's in May that's where I started that's where I developed my skills a little bit you know but But the promoter himself, me and him, like, we was real close, you know.

[1794] It was almost like on a father and son relationship type thing, you know.

[1795] And at the end of the day, you know, I was never looking at it as business, you know.

[1796] He was always booking me up for fights and always, you know, putting me out there on like a main event or a main car and stuff like that.

[1797] And people will come and watch me fight.

[1798] And I would be cool to do it because I just wanted to fight, you know.

[1799] That's all I wanted to do.

[1800] I had no other intentions, not even making money.

[1801] I just wanted to compete.

[1802] And that was it.

[1803] and, you know, not saying he's using me, but he used me. You know what I'm saying?

[1804] Because he's making money.

[1805] He's making good money, you know.

[1806] So he wasn't thinking about your overall career.

[1807] Like a manager.

[1808] He wanted to keep me stuck in St. Louis.

[1809] But I didn't know no better anyway.

[1810] Right.

[1811] You know, so my thing is I didn't want to reach out and find different other places to fight because I'm like, shit, I'm getting fights here because he's a promoter, you know.

[1812] So at the end of the day, you know, once I started to grow as a fighter and stuff like that, I end up getting a Bellator fight.

[1813] I only got like a one -fight contract deal.

[1814] and Bellator came to St. Louis.

[1815] So they do stuff like this, right?

[1816] Belator comes to St. Louis, and they assign, like, the local fighters on the prelim, right?

[1817] You get a one -fight contract deal, but you would just fight the dudes that you would have fought on the local promotion, you know, anyway, but now you just fight them on the Belator show.

[1818] But I end up showing out for Bellator, end up going crazy.

[1819] I thought, uh, I know his name.

[1820] I know his name.

[1821] Uh, yeah, bro.

[1822] That's sad, bro.

[1823] You know, I'll be forgetting my man's name sometimes, man, but I think his name like Chris something.

[1824] Anyways, I end up beating him.

[1825] beat him in the second round this is when I first met Big John McCarthy right so this is the first time like a big promotion a big name referee actually like referee in my fight so end up beating dude you know end up getting signed to Bellator later on but before I had signed Tabillator I looked for Jesse for advice I was like hey man should I read over this contract he was like just signed like don't want you worry about it like this is the best contract you will ever see in your life just sign the contract right so I end up signing the contract doing whatever, you know what I mean, end up taking my first loss in Israel, whatever.

[1826] Once I took my first loss, they kind of held me back for a minute.

[1827] You know, I got a K .O. loss against Jackie Goss, but like, it took like seven months, eight months before I could even get back into actually competing, whatever.

[1828] But I was already ready.

[1829] I was like, bro, I can fight again.

[1830] Like, I'm good, you know.

[1831] Because sometimes they'll put that restriction on you for you not to fight for a certain amount of time.

[1832] After K .O. But I was already cleared.

[1833] I'm like, hey, I'm ready to fight again.

[1834] So I end up getting another fight.

[1835] And this was with Justin Patterson, I believe the name is.

[1836] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[1837] So once I fought him, whatever, I had to string another fight, string layoff, another, it was another like eight, seven months again.

[1838] So with me, I'm getting paid, but I'm not really making no real money.

[1839] And all I'm doing is training.

[1840] All I'm doing is fighting.

[1841] I'm not doing nothing else.

[1842] All I'm doing is just focusing on that.

[1843] You know, so I'm really kind of just living off of these checks, you know.

[1844] And I'm not being smart about it because all I'm doing this is just like, like, I just fighting.

[1845] thing this is what's going to work out so they end up giving me pretty much uh four fights so they end up fighting uh venetius de hazus and they end up fighting uh logan storeley whatever so i only have four fights within like a two year period so i went two one year and two the other you know what enough i wasn't even close no you need not to eat no and also to stay active exactly right so but my thing on top of it is just going into the story while almost You know what I'm saying?

[1846] Just gave up on it.

[1847] But, you know, I was like, damn, man, I kind of just, like, lost out on a lot of experience, you know what I mean?

[1848] Because, like, I was 22 when I got signed, you know, I was 24 then.

[1849] You know, so I'm just like, damn, I could have had a bunch more fights than what I had.

[1850] So Bellator ended up cutting me, though, right?

[1851] End up letting me go.

[1852] So with all this being said, me and the promoter, whatever, we was bumping heads on a lot of things because I was like, bro, I want to learn more.

[1853] I want to do more.

[1854] Like, you know what I'm saying?

[1855] Like, but I feel like I'm being held back.

[1856] You know what I'm saying?

[1857] So he would never really communicate with me what was really going on, you know?

[1858] And the thing is, the only thing, like, my man was just using me for, like, the potential to get more clients in the gym.

[1859] Because they would use my name, like, hey, we got a Belator fighter here.

[1860] He's a trainer here and all this other stuff.

[1861] And they would use that to sell, like, for, like, you know, more people just to sign up for the gym, you know?

[1862] And it is what it is.

[1863] But I just didn't like that, you know?

[1864] So how did you get out of that?

[1865] I just love.

[1866] I was like, man, forget this gym.

[1867] You know what I mean?

[1868] I literally just like, man, forget everything.

[1869] Because once I got cut from Bellator, you know what I mean?

[1870] I was just like, man, that's some bullshit because this is the highest level of, you know what I'm saying, promotion.

[1871] Now I got to go right back into fighting on Sherrock.

[1872] There's some bullshit, right?

[1873] So I left the gym and I did my own thing, but the thing is where I ain't had no connections.

[1874] I have no network, like, you know what I'm saying?

[1875] As in people to reach out to.

[1876] So when I was dealing with Jesse, he provided all them things from the gym, the information for instructions.

[1877] and also the promotion for the fight, you know.

[1878] So those are the main things that I need, and I didn't have it at that point, you know.

[1879] So I had to hop from gym to gym to try to find me another spot.

[1880] But every gym that I found, man, was kind of whack.

[1881] You know what I mean?

[1882] I was like, bro, these ain't the ones I want to be at, you know, because just like the instruction wasn't there or they weren't able to find me fights.

[1883] It'd be, like, multiple little reasons.

[1884] So I was like, man, I won't just start doing this on my own.

[1885] So I started hitting YouTube like crazy, you know, and I started just watching and just being a student of the actual craft and the actual sport itself.

[1886] Like, what were you watching on YouTube?

[1887] Thousands of things, man. I mean, it got to the point where it was so crazy.

[1888] I was watching Wing Chun, bro.

[1889] Like, so, Master Wu.

[1890] I don't know if you know him.

[1891] Master Wong, I think his name is.

[1892] He does, like, a lot of self -defense moves, you know what I mean, online.

[1893] But he does funny instructional videos.

[1894] And I used to watch him all the time.

[1895] I watch Shane Fazzin.

[1896] I don't know if you know who that is.

[1897] You know, but actually, if you can look him up, like, so he has fight tips, whatever.

[1898] And he shows, like, all different things.

[1899] But these are the things that was, like, the foundation to me learning.

[1900] It's Shane Fasson?

[1901] Yeah, Fasin.

[1902] I don't know how to really spell his last name.

[1903] F -A -A -A -Z -N or something.

[1904] And you got it?

[1905] Jamie's got it.

[1906] And his, so his YouTube channel is just all instructional stuff?

[1907] Yeah, all instructional stuff, like this.

[1908] So this is where I started off with.

[1909] So that's just his Instagram.

[1910] But his YouTube got, like, millions of followers on it, though.

[1911] Yeah.

[1912] Interesting.

[1913] And so his whole thing is just, Just instructionals?

[1914] Big facts, right?

[1915] Oh, Muay, rock, paper, scissors theory.

[1916] Oh, okay.

[1917] So he's one of those dudes who's breaking shit down.

[1918] Man, you got countless stuff on there.

[1919] And I'm not saying he's the best instructor at all, but when you talk about you just need more knowledge and you need more information, these are the type of videos that I was watching.

[1920] It's amazing how many of those there are out there now.

[1921] It's so good.

[1922] You know?

[1923] For a young fighter, it's such a good time to learn.

[1924] There's so much knowledge out there.

[1925] There's so much data.

[1926] And there's so many people like him that are obsessed with communicating that knowledge.

[1927] Yeah, yeah, exactly.

[1928] And then he used to work with, not work with, but he had Farage as a hobby on there.

[1929] You know what I mean?

[1930] Breaking stuff down with him and stuff like that.

[1931] And I got to see different, like, real coaches.

[1932] Yeah, so this is the other guy, yeah, Master Wong, right here.

[1933] So this was like the street fighting element and all this other stuff and different techniques.

[1934] But because I didn't know, some of these guys be sometimes low -key, like, full of it, right?

[1935] What is he telling you to do this?

[1936] I'm curious what's he's telling you to do there guys grabbing them what's the move you had to turn it up a little bit it's not go very much my head it down head but me it's not going to go very far either second thing you learn to understand that on the throat hey he fast as hell though he be okay this is the problem somebody come along and try to get your hand both into hand of that and try to smack in a face you might be fit them up you might be do something naughty i got no idea this is the question somebody asking me if somebody quap you in a color what's your thing do you do let me show you my man can be a standard community I ain't gonna lie to he's got that interesting combination of like like an Asian accent with an English accent I think he'd be capping no you know yeah well he's being entertaining exactly and that and that's what it is at the end of the day so this is most of like street fight and stuff yeah all yeah self -defense stuff like just quick ways to like end a fight you know instead of like hitting combinations I want to, one strike, you know what I mean, in the fight type thing.

[1937] But regardless, though.

[1938] So you go from that to just watching YouTube videos, training yourself.

[1939] Did you have people that you were training with and sparring?

[1940] So I was just working with the guys that I was working with at Finney's.

[1941] So my close friend, the one that you just met, Edgdillet, he's like a brother to me. So we used to wrestle together in Marquette, and I actually got him into MMA, you know?

[1942] And the thing is, he's been watching, like, the UFC you know what I mean, for the longest time.

[1943] but like the actual training of it he ended up coming to finish him and made only because of me you know so we end up training with each other and like I said once I split ways with them I was working with him the whole time so things that I would watch things that I would see on YouTube I was like hey bro let's practice let's do this you know and I actually got good at holding mitts you know what I mean just because I wanted to see a lot of things and just work a lot of things that he couldn't perform like actually hold for me so I had to hold it for him you know to actually get it down just a little bit and be honest with you like I said that got to show me a lot of different just creative ways to throw your hands creative ways to throw combinations like you don't have to throw it like a box you don't have to throw like a kickbox like you can add those fun traditional moves in there with the fundamental basics you know and that's what we was doing we just having fun and just doing that but the thing is though I wasn't able to find any fights while I was doing this type of stuff how much time was going on here between you leaving that gym so I got cut in 2018 that's when I left the gym in 2018 and then I was able to get a fight in 2019.

[1944] It was only a year's time, but I felt like I got played with the two years that in 2016 to 2018, I felt like I got played, you know what I mean, and not having that many fights, and I was still struggling as a fighter.

[1945] And I was with Bellator, and I was still struggling, Loki, you know what I'm saying?

[1946] So I felt like I wasted a good amount of time, you know what I'm saying, within that game, but I didn't know when I was going to be able to fight again.

[1947] That was the problem, you know.

[1948] So even though it was only like, shit well it was kind of close to two years but it was still like just a year and some change that I was able to find another fight it still felt like it was so stretched out because I didn't see when I was going to be able to find another fight so you were really considering quitting yeah yeah I mean well actually I wanted to consider I actually did it so I went I went about the part of just training but I just gave up on actually like hunting the dream down I just got a regular job you know I mean uh I was taking care of my grandmother at the time like which that was a big deal as well I had moved in with her because I ain't had no house I I didn't have anything to my name.

[1949] Unfortunately, my grandmother was stricken with ALS, Lou Gehrig's disease, you know what I mean?

[1950] And that's a rough one, you know.

[1951] I have a friend going through that right now.

[1952] Yeah, yeah, yeah, I'm sorry to hear that, you know.

[1953] But it's a neuron disease where, you know, it shuts down all your motor functions, you know, and it kills the muscles where it puts you in paralysis almost, you know.

[1954] And that's what I was dealing with the whole time as well, too.

[1955] So a lot on my mind outside of it.

[1956] So I was like, man, I can't be focused on trying to chase a dream when I got to help my grandmother wash up.

[1957] and eat and all this type of stuff, you know.

[1958] So, yeah, I had to go through that first, right?

[1959] And once I went through that, it's funny how once I kept training and kept motivated with just my friends around me, even Maraibat, that's one of the kids that train with me at Finney's M .M .A., but anytime I called him up, he'll work with me. RIP to my man Ryan Sutton.

[1960] He was one of the guys that came out with me in my first UFC fight, but he passed away.

[1961] But that's another person that I looked to and called in order to get some training in.

[1962] But it was just a small group of guys that I would call up to just ask to get some working.

[1963] And these guys are the people that I depended on in order to, my mental, just to hit paths outside in Forest Park in St. Louis, you know.

[1964] And this whole time I've been doing that, and I just stopped chasing after the whole goal of getting a fight.

[1965] And then one day a guy named Mike Rogers hit me up because I was, you know, coming at his gym, not in and out.

[1966] But just coming there just to get some spawn work in, you know what I mean?

[1967] But not actually, like, learning anything, but just some spawn work.

[1968] and he told me like hey man LFA hit me up I was like oh for real he was like yeah man like if you want to I can give you their number whatever and then you can contact the matchmaker yourself because he didn't want to do the in -between talk for me like he didn't want to be like a management because I ain't have no manager I ain't had nothing at the time so he told me about LFA and I ended up getting a fight with LFA against Chris Harris but the funny thing about that that little setup was that I only took the fight because I needed some money some extra money that was it but the way the only reason why I took the fight as well because I couldn't find any other fight at Walterweight.

[1969] So I had to fight that middleweight at 185.

[1970] And they tried to tell me it was a catchway.

[1971] I was like, what's the way?

[1972] I was like, is it 175 or 180?

[1973] It was like, no, it's 185.

[1974] I was like, man, that's a whole weight class.

[1975] So when they told me that whatever I watched the dude, I did my own film study on Chris Harrison, I take it.

[1976] It's easy money.

[1977] I need the bread anyway.

[1978] And funny enough, that's why I stayed at 185.

[1979] That was the only reason why I moved up.

[1980] Because didn't nobody want to fight me at 170 and what's the way that whole time, you know?

[1981] So I took that fight, got that fight, but I didn't worry about it.

[1982] Once I won that fight and got that little check that I got from LFA, I was back to work, doing what I was doing, just chilling.

[1983] And then a year later, I still get another call.

[1984] This is 20 -20 now from LFA to fight Gregory Rodriguez.

[1985] I don't know if you know who that is.

[1986] Robocop.

[1987] Yeah.

[1988] He doesn't want to have his head split, whatever.

[1989] He's a bad motherfucker.

[1990] Yeah, yeah, but I need that bread at the time, too.

[1991] so I took that fight with him it was going to be for an LFA title and you know unfortunately he had pulled out the fight you know so they had to find me another fighter and you know like I said funny enough me not even chasing anything but people just coming to me now I was able to get these fights you know so and a fight when did you wind up at the new gym that wouldn't until the kick really yeah yeah I didn't have no team I just had the people I told you I was working with So even the Kevin Holland fight, no team?

[1992] The guy that passed away, RIP, Ryan Sutton, he didn't want to help corner me in that fight, but he was just a teammate.

[1993] He was going through stuff in his own life as well.

[1994] So you were just kind of on your own training yourself?

[1995] Yeah.

[1996] Wow.

[1997] Yes, sir, yes, sir.

[1998] I didn't have no. Fighting at a world -class level on your own, training yourself in the UFC against top guys.

[1999] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[2000] Wow.

[2001] So just to even be able to get there, the way we got there is crazy in itself, you know?

[2002] Because like I said, I only took those elements.

[2003] LFA fight because I needed a little bit of money, but I wasn't like, all right, I'm going to be in the UFC one day or I'm working towards to be a UFC champion.

[2004] Like, I just was like, I need money or just for my mental health, I kept training.

[2005] Now, but I want you to speak to the difference in the structure.

[2006] Like, once you got to this new gym and all this structure that you're praising and all the way that your new trainer trains you and the new environment, how much different is that and how much of an impact does that have on your career?

[2007] I think the biggest part of it was just the commitment that they had to me, you know, I never got from that other gym.

[2008] Like, so all the information that I had to find on my own, they had information for me, you know?

[2009] So I was actually learning, you know.

[2010] So instead of trying to like figure out the information on my own, I already had people that was already great at what they did and they were showing me stuff, you know what I mean?

[2011] And now I'm able to learn a little faster and more efficiently, if that makes sense.

[2012] That is so incredible that you were fighting on a world -class level with no coaching.

[2013] Nah.

[2014] I mean, well, I did have world -class coaches because you got to just imagine, like, the people that I've been watching for, like, influences as instructors on YouTube.

[2015] Like I said, even from yourself, bro, even if you don't call yourself a coach, that sidekick, I only knew how to throw a sidekick because I watched your video.

[2016] It's hilarious.

[2017] It's hilarious, but it's the truth, you know?

[2018] I wish I was around to show you in real life.

[2019] It's better.

[2020] Right, big facts, you know what I mean?

[2021] But even though you showed, with, like, the internet and everything in YouTube, you showed a thousand, if not a million people that kid, you know?

[2022] But it's about people actually taking that information and applying it to their own life if they want to.

[2023] You know, and that's why I like Bruce Lee so much because, like, that's why, you know, Jikundo is such an awesome style because it was his own style.

[2024] Right.

[2025] It was his own form of fighting that he took and he mastered, but he took it from other places.

[2026] And he did it back when that was taboo.

[2027] Big facts, you know what I mean?

[2028] That was very taboo.

[2029] Even when I was doing Taekwondo, you weren't supposed to do other things.

[2030] You were supposed to only concentrate on the art that you did.

[2031] Big facts.

[2032] And Bruce Lee was like, that's not smart.

[2033] Not at all, you know.

[2034] Because your style of fighting should be like a fingerprint, you know?

[2035] You should have your.

[2036] your own style like you said it shouldn't be like a person like when you look at them you're like oh they doing kick -bomba in my opinion are they doing kickboxing oh that's a wrestle like it's a mixed martial arts like you should be trying to pick the pieces in the puzzle like what they actually doing well you mostly see that now you see very few real specialists now that are only doing one thing I mean I mean we getting there but I still haven't seen that actual like for real on some boy good like I said man I'm from like you know me watching a lot of movies and stuff but like you know one of those complete fighters you you know, except for like a Demetrius, you know what I mean, or GSP, you know.

[2037] It ain't a lot of those out there, though, in my opinion.

[2038] Well, I think you're seeing more of them now than ever before, but we have to also take into consideration than MMA in terms of real sports is relatively recent.

[2039] Yeah.

[2040] There's no sport like MMA where if you go and watch the fighters from 1993 and watch it from 2022, they're completely different.

[2041] Yeah, because the athlete changes, though.

[2042] Yes.

[2043] You know?

[2044] So that's why I would say that, but I feel like.

[2045] Yet again, so like Habib, perfect example, you know, he retired.

[2046] Like, he was only winning one type of way.

[2047] Right.

[2048] You know.

[2049] He's a real specialist.

[2050] Yeah, he's a real specialist.

[2051] But, you know.

[2052] Man, good at that fucking special.

[2053] Jesus Christ, he was so good.

[2054] A lot of people can't stop it, you know.

[2055] But I'm just trying to think, like, good, like, people that they fight a certain type of style, which is great for them, and it fits them a way.

[2056] But, like, a Hamza, I wouldn't call him, like, a complete fighter.

[2057] I feel like he's just great.

[2058] what he does and if he's able to fight another grappler he's able to switch it up to a striking prowess but even then gilbert burns was touching yes because i would say the murchart fight but like he only got he only got one punch out of that you know but you can't call him no great striker because he was able to land that one punch right but when i seen it he fought gilbert and he started to stand with him like oh you're not a great striker because gilbert burns is not a great striker but he was able to land i don't know how many punches on umz out in that fight gilbert's a wild man Gilbert's a wild man. Yeah, yeah, I figure Wild Man is, yeah, you could be a wild man all you want to, but at the end of the day, it still takes technique in the striking man. Oh, he's got technique too, but it's just one of those things where I think Hamzad tried to walk him down.

[2059] And, you know, you want to engage like that with Gilbert, you're going to get caught.

[2060] And, like, I'm not disrespecting these guys when I say, but they're good at what they good at, you know?

[2061] That's all I'm trying to say.

[2062] Like, Gilbert Burns is a monster, but you see when Hansa had took him down and Gilbert burned threw up them legs a couple times.

[2063] Hansa didn't like that.

[2064] He's like, let's stay on the feet for a minute, you know?

[2065] And then I realize, oh, Hansa ain't good at striking because he just stands right there.

[2066] And also, as a matter of fact, I shouldn't even say it because I could potentially fight this man one day.

[2067] But one thing that he does that is terrible, he only hits on one side.

[2068] He favors one side too much as a striker, and we watch it all the time.

[2069] Now, you can take it back and watch Hansa fight, but when you watch it, you're like, oh, that's what he's talking about.

[2070] Right hands.

[2071] He don't, all day.

[2072] Right hands, right feet.

[2073] You know, uppercut, all and he favors, no setup.

[2074] Everything just with power and intention to knock you out, which is great and all, but you still putting yourself in a position to get hurt.

[2075] Were you stunned by that Kevin Holland fight with him?

[2076] No, no, no, no. I wasn't stunned because I knew Hans -out was going to immediately try to shoot, you know?

[2077] And Kevin is not, like, no real, real wrestling.

[2078] You know, he worked with D .C. And he said he worked with Johnny Hendricks and all this stuff.

[2079] Like, it takes years.

[2080] Like, I come from a wrestling background.

[2081] Like, bro, I was a trash -ass wrestler, like, in high school, you know?

[2082] It took me years to kind of understand what wrestling is, and I'm still trying to figure it out.

[2083] But I know I'm a better wrestler than the majority of guys that's at the 185 division, some of them, you know.

[2084] But now I'm going to focus on grappling even more because I'm going to a grapple heavy division, which is at 170.

[2085] Right.

[2086] You have Homsa, Kobe Covington, Camaro Ouzman, you know what I'm saying?

[2087] Like, these guys are grapple heavy.

[2088] So if I'm able to get up to that level and be able to compete with them, It just stuffed the shot.

[2089] I know that they couldn't compete with me on the feet.

[2090] Yeah.

[2091] When you think about your transition from being self -coached to now being on your own team, it's like you have so much potential right now.

[2092] It's so much potential to get even so much better.

[2093] This is all I get to focus on now.

[2094] Yeah.

[2095] Even with my grandmother, you know, her daughter, my auntie came back, you know, to live with her, to take care of her.

[2096] because I wouldn't be able to be in the UFC if I had to keep taking care of my grandma because, like, that, like, low -key, like, people don't understand.

[2097] Like, that's a 24 -hour thing.

[2098] Yeah.

[2099] You understand?

[2100] And it was sad because I had to leave my grandmother in the bed, you know, in order to go to work to Walgreens, but I had to have a close job.

[2101] And I had to keep a monitor to watch her to make sure that she was fine.

[2102] You know, and anything that she needed, I had to lead the job, you know, and I had to work overnights at Walgreens in order to make sure I check up on her throughout the day.

[2103] So I had to work the night shift.

[2104] You know what I mean?

[2105] So when she slept, I was working and then went you know what I'm saying so just little things like that you know that it was hard to actually maintain the actual career as a fighter you understand I when I was a kid when I was 24 I lived with my grandmother for a while my grandmother and my grandfather my grandmother had a stroke and they gave her 72 hours to live and she wound up living for 12 years and I was there with my grandfather when my grandfather was taking care of her 24 -7 and one thing that imparted upon me is that life is short and that you've got to appreciate your health and your ability to do things now and appreciate it in a way where knowing my grandmother when I was young when she was this wild lady and then seeing it my grandmother went to jail for for running numbers for mom okay wow my my grandmother was wild she they tried to get her to give up names and she's like fuck that I'm going to jail so we were always like where's grandma and like oh she's visiting her auntie no right right they lied to us right and me while grandma was in jail for running numbers.

[2106] It was kind of crazy.

[2107] So to see her when I was older, when I was 20 in my 20s, that sick and inability to move and pain all the time, it was like, damn, you got to do something with your life.

[2108] Yeah, I don't know.

[2109] That's 100%.

[2110] Short window.

[2111] So, and even with my grandmother going through that, you know, she still had great spirit, you know, what's sad about ALS, you know, the first thing that went was her voice.

[2112] You know what I mean?

[2113] Like her voice became faint.

[2114] You know what I mean?

[2115] She wasn't able to speak, you know, and all these other things.

[2116] But she's still able to smile, you know.

[2117] And it's sad that about this disease, that can even take that, that can take that away as well.

[2118] But she's still able to smile and still able to, you know, laugh about, you know, certain things.

[2119] And, you know, that's one thing about my grandmother, her spirit is so, has such an impact that it can affect you, you know.

[2120] Because she don't look down on it.

[2121] herself because she was stricken with this terrible disease, you understand?

[2122] Like, even with, it stands for amitrophic lateral sclerosis.

[2123] It's the actual name.

[2124] She even changed the acronym where ALS is, stands for abundance of love and support.

[2125] Wow.

[2126] Because that's what you need in order to defeat something like this.

[2127] And I had that with her because she lost her daughter, which was my mother.

[2128] I lost her at a young age, and my grandmother took me in, you know.

[2129] And I didn't have my dad around in my life so she was the one that was taking care of me the whole time so when it came to my turn right couldn't hesitate you know so I was willing to give up everything in order to take care of my grandmother that's beautiful you know what I mean it just had to be that way it speaks to your character yeah yeah but regardless though I wouldn't even be around you know what I'm saying if she was never around in the first place you understand yeah but I understand what you're saying like that really shows me like anything that I really even go through ain't really that hard right ain't that hard you know what I'm saying like we good we can get through it You know, so having her go through this type of experience and being able to see what she goes through, but how she's still able to hold her head out is beautiful.

[2130] That is beautiful.

[2131] And now, you know, and I feel like every fighter is not just their skills, but an accumulation of their life experiences that give them character.

[2132] And that most certainly gave you character.

[2133] I guess, you know what I mean?

[2134] Like I said, man, my granny took the responsibility up when nobody else wanted it, you know.

[2135] Like I said, I was, you know, with my mom and stuff, being a. single mom she raised me so I was with her all the time every single day I was with my mom you know I mean and if I wasn't with her I was with my godmother you know so I was around a lot of women at the time and like I told you before like the male influences the only thing I got was from TV and watching you know movies all the time you know so um having that you know and doing what I was doing you know it's just crazy that you know once my mother had passed away unfortunately some of the people that was in my life before left too you You know what I'm saying?

[2136] So, like, the people I used to always see or hang out around, that was around my mom a lot when she passed away, you know what I'm saying?

[2137] It's like they passed away with, you know, type stuff.

[2138] So my granny was the only person that really took the responsibility or raised me and taking forth that because I went through, like, a depressing stage.

[2139] Like, you know what I mean?

[2140] I was never, like, what's the word, like, never seen the third person or nothing.

[2141] But, like, I felt like I went through a depression stage.

[2142] I thought I lost my mom, and it took me a while to even, like, speak to people, you know?

[2143] It ain't like I turned mute or nothing like But it took me a while to even just be around other people Because I was just so upset You know That the person that I was around all the time Was just completely gone Yeah You know what I'm saying Just out of nowhere in my eyes, you know And it took a minute for me to just like Accept the fact that she was gone You know And I won't even say get over it But like I just said You know I just kind of That's the word I'm just forgot about my mom ever existing To get over the whole fact that she was going In the first place Yeah I didn't even go to her like her burial, nothing.

[2144] I just like, yeah, yeah, it'd be good.

[2145] I couldn't take it, you know what I'm saying?

[2146] So I was just like, man, maybe if I just forget about it, you know what I'm saying, it'd be cool, whatever.

[2147] But on top of that, you know, just understanding that life is short, like you were saying before, like, it's good just to go for your dreams and stuff like that, you know?

[2148] Because I ain't trying to, like, bounce into, like, too much stuff.

[2149] But before my granny even had, like, ALS and stuff, and I was still in high school, she was raising me the whole time I was kind of a bad kid you know in and out the house doing what I wanted to do and I wasn't bad like robbing people or trying to like gang bang and nothing like that but I wanted to do what I wanted to do you know and being raised by so many women like you feel like you demand the whole time you know so eventually my grandmother ended up asking for my father's help in order to coming back into my life and stuff like that and try to raise me you know what I mean or help raise me and I'm like 16 at the time you know what I'm saying 15 at the time and this is my first time really even meeting this man you know so once I you know having interaction with him like I was trying to tell my green like I don't need to stay with him I just leave I just like you know live on my own you know what I'm saying oh run away type of shit right you know what I mean but you know my dad was like yeah you being disrespectful you you know acting out of pocket and stuff like that I was like yeah even if I is what you're going to do about it you know and that's where we had a whole situation a whole scenario so the only reason why this is crazy right is that, you know, I find out where my fighting power come from, you know what I'm saying?

[2150] It's from my pops, because my pops used to wrestle as well back in the day.

[2151] So when I used to wrestling in high school, I thought I was somebody special.

[2152] So when I got into it with my dad, whatever, and we was in the kitchen and stuff like that, you know, I thought I had the upper hand because, you know what I'm saying, I'm wrestling and whatnot.

[2153] And I remember I had through a punch, she blocked and hit me dead in my chest, right?

[2154] I'm like, ooh, caved me in.

[2155] I end up wrestling them.

[2156] I was like, I wrestle.

[2157] I'm going ahead, take a shot on.

[2158] As soon as I took a shot on, because that was the only thing I was good, there was a double leg, right?

[2159] That man, power driving, he grabbed my hip like this, picks me up, boom, slams me. He's like, you ready get back in the car?

[2160] You know what I said?

[2161] Oh, you ready to get in the car?

[2162] I was like, oh, yeah, I'm good, bro.

[2163] I ain't trying to fight you no more, you know what I mean?

[2164] So, but the reason why I bring that up is because, like, I realize I'm almost just like this dude, right?

[2165] You know, I never met him, you know what I'm saying?

[2166] Just that fighter mentality, that fighter will, like, you know what I mean?

[2167] That's where I get that from.

[2168] And it's crazy that even then at that time, I never gave him a chance, unfortunately.

[2169] And without me giving them a chance And not getting to actually know him I end up losing him as well You know what I'm saying So I end up losing my mom and my dad But the thing is I never even got a chance To even try to talk to him And get to know him Because I never like actually went up about The opportunity to talk to him And speak to him Because he was almost like a big brother to me Because we both living with My grandpa which is his dad You know So I feel like it was more like a big brother relationship between me and him You know Yeah And when I lost him, you know, and I didn't get the opportunity to actually experience him like, I should have, you know, by the time I wanted that he was already gone, you know.

[2170] But, I mean, it's going as a teenager and just meeting him for the first time.

[2171] You can't put that on you.

[2172] I mean, you didn't have.

[2173] No, yeah, no, no, yeah.

[2174] I was like, because I ain't been to call this man Daddy or nothing, you know.

[2175] That's hard.

[2176] That's so hard.

[2177] No, big fact, man. Did you call him by his first name?

[2178] Yeah, yeah, so I call him Marcus.

[2179] Wow.

[2180] Yeah, yeah.

[2181] That's weird.

[2182] And not as it is, right?

[2183] I mean, not at all, because it's how I knew.

[2184] Right.

[2185] You know what I'm like that?

[2186] You know, everybody used to call him Jug, too.

[2187] That was his nickname and stuff like that.

[2188] So, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[2189] So like I said, once, but that's the crazy part then, like, once, um, just growing up around him, like, for, and it was only, like, a year time, too.

[2190] It was only about, like, a year where we was able to, like, actually be in the same household and actually speak one another.

[2191] But everything that he used to do, I was, like, certain things that I did as well, that I was always wondering where I get it from.

[2192] you know and I got exactly from him like we moved the same we talked the same we walked the same and I was like this my first time really like meeting this man that ought to be weird yeah it was a little weird though I ain't gonna lie I ain't gonna lie you know but it made sense though yeah where it came from yeah completely yeah yeah well all those things are that's a part of character that's a part of what makes you who you are I mean I think people that come from an easy life have a very difficult time make it in the world of fighting yeah yeah it's it's very it's not the same i mean people have done it you know the people that come from good households and good families j pan yeah j pan well george st pierre i mean george st pierre was bullied when he was young and that's what got him into martial arts but he had a very good relationship with his parents yeah yeah yeah but having a rough childhood is almost like a prerequisite to being a great fighter so many fighters come from like dark times uh yeah big fights i mean like i said like your experiences alone can prepare you for fights you know i mean and that's what makes some of the best fighters in the world, you know, but I feel like with everything that I went through, I guess you can say it prepared me for fighting, but it really showed me and this is what I'm trying to get to, you know, and I ain't trying to like put all this together, but like losing my mom and losing my dad just showed me, bro, like, just go for it, you know what I'm saying?

[2193] Just like go for your dreams, man, go and do what you want to do, you know what I mean?

[2194] Because at the end of the day, we only got one life.

[2195] Like, my mom died at a pretty young age, like it was like 35, 36, you know what I mean, dad died pretty young, you know what I'm saying, almost getting to the age of 40, you know, um, no, no, what's she, no, well, how, what's, my mom, how did your dad die?

[2196] Overdose.

[2197] Oh.

[2198] Yeah, overdose.

[2199] Heroin, overdose, unfortunately, you know, but I feel like, you know, he was trying to use that to, like, you know, block the pain or the stuff that he was dealing with.

[2200] Of course.

[2201] You know?

[2202] Yeah, of course.

[2203] Unfortunately, you know.

[2204] So many people are dealing with so much.

[2205] I mean, that's, that's this fucking.

[2206] crazy dance of life and your dance is very crazy and that makes sense now knowing your childhood while you're so ferocious inside the octagon.

[2207] I didn't think about it like that.

[2208] I didn't even think about it like that.

[2209] The life experiences that you've had.

[2210] I mean, it is a major factor in what forms a man's personality and what you've gone through those trials and tribulations.

[2211] You can't substitute that.

[2212] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[2213] Somebody that has that or they don't.

[2214] There's a fire that some dudes have and you have I appreciate it.

[2215] A lot of that comes from just bad times.

[2216] Yeah, yeah.

[2217] And also, man, it's just like when I see that, right, with my mom passing, when my dad passes, it's like, you know, the only people that are the people that's closest to us.

[2218] Right.

[2219] You know what I'm saying?

[2220] And my thing was, like, I just always wanted to leave my name here and print it somehow or some way in some type of fashion, you know, because it's a fun little quote, you know what I mean, that I like, I don't know who said it, but it was like, you know, you die twice, you know what the first time you die is when you take your last breath and the second time you die is when they say your name for the last time and that always spoke volumes to me because I was like man I want my name to be remembered some way you know and that that was my real pursuit for real for real doing like MMA and chasing my dream leave your mark leave my mark somewhere well you definitely have that opportunity I mean you've already left your mark but you have an opportunity you're only 28 right yeah only 208 you have a giant future ahead of you because especially knowing your background now and knowing how little real formal training you've had and the fact that you've reached this level of proficiency and skill and accomplishment it's pretty crazy you're in a really great spot right now especially now dropping down to 170 pounds which is your natural weight class where you're not going to be at a disadvantage physically like in the nordine fight yeah so i mean but i think everything plays a part you know what i mean and everything happens for a reason So I'm glad I fought at 185.

[2221] I'm glad I was able to develop my name, you know what I'm saying, in the middleweight division and stuff like that because it's not going to make it harder to go down to 170 and fight a couple of other, you know, rank good names instead of starting all the way back over.

[2222] Well, you can fight guys like Imov who's like, what is his natural weight?

[2223] I mean, what is he walking around?

[2224] I don't know.

[2225] He probably 215, you know what I'm saying?

[2226] Much, much bigger.

[2227] Yeah.

[2228] And Nassarine is, I mean, he's like a, he's an elite level fighter that weight too.

[2229] Yeah.

[2230] So you have, I fought, I mean, be honest with you, when I look at my resume at 185, I ain't fight no bones.

[2231] No?

[2232] I ain't find no bombs.

[2233] So I fought a lot of, you know, high -level guys at middleweight, and I did a successful job.

[2234] You know, I took a couple L's here and there, but, you know, I was able to accomplish, you know, get five wins up to four knockouts.

[2235] Yeah.

[2236] In the middle -weight division, you know.

[2237] And I think that should speak volumes for me to go to a weight class that's more fitted for me. Much, yeah, much better, much better for you.

[2238] And also with this structured training and the fact that you really do have relatively little incomprehend, comparison to the amount of time you've been fighting.

[2239] Yeah, yeah.

[2240] I mean, well, I've been fighting for a long time, you know, for 10 years, but I just didn't know nothing.

[2241] Right, but that's what's so crazy.

[2242] It's like you, and you accomplished a lot with that.

[2243] And now having very structured training and being in your physical prime and going down to a natural weight class, I mean, once you get past Chris Curtis, if you get past Chris Curtis, you know, no, no, but it's just that one mentality and me like, you know, it was like, this is all the preparation.

[2244] that I've been putting in and doing and just taking the time and opportunity to actually promote the fight for myself.

[2245] You know what I mean?

[2246] Coming out here with you and speaking to you, you know what I mean, to sell this fight, even that.

[2247] You know, I just developed too much time and effort into this fight to lose.

[2248] I can't, you know, because everything that I want on the other side is riding up to this fight.

[2249] It ain't like the national team fight.

[2250] Like, this is the fight right here.

[2251] You know what I mean?

[2252] So the last fight that I got now on my contract, but of the year, because this would be my fourth fight that I had, you know what I'm saying, within one year, you know, and that's a big deal to me. And I feel like I really need to show out for this one, you know, because I've never been a fighter either to lose back to back.

[2253] Because I at least, like, if I'm not learning in the gym, I'm learning for those fights.

[2254] Trust me. Well, I think you did learn from that fight, and what you're talking about with that third round that you should have fought that way in the first round, isn't that a big part of the whole experience of having high -level competition?

[2255] Yes, sir.

[2256] Is these little lessons that you learn in each individual encounter.

[2257] And they imagine, you know, even though they're small.

[2258] they make for major adjustment or major improvements that's what i mean to say you know so having that fight with nashidine is showing that i need to put the gas on a lot of these dudes early period you know and make them work you know so i didn't make nashdine work as hard as i should add in that first and that second round you know now what kind of strength and conditioning routine did they have you on because you have such a wild style of fighting i mean you have to have a deep deep gas tank to fight the way you fight i got a i got a psychopath man as a conditioning coach man like perfect because uh yeah big facts shout out to uh just an uh heartick man so he been sending me actually workouts right so this is what i just did uh here i can actually show you because he hasn't been out here with me to help me train so like this is one of the workouts that he had me do uh right here matter of fact i let you look at so look so look this is also cool right so he sends this out like a little history lesson right talking about uh akanawa uh in that war you know what i think d day you know and just talking about like you know what the soldiers had went through and how they had to you know keep fighting and and keep going up that hill doing so many obstacles and dodging bullets and all this stuff that's all about kamikaze shit right tell you about it wow and then he gets to the workout wow all this history lesson and then the workout yes sir and it gives me pumped you know what saying like because it's just a reminder like bro like like like it's a mentality thing you know what you go through and then how you take the fight or how you take your training and And seriously, you know, you got to make that switch.

[2259] You can't just go through a workout.

[2260] I'm like, I'm like, I'm just get this done.

[2261] Like, you don't live or die.

[2262] Like, I'm training for, like, war, point blank, period.

[2263] You know, and that's what I love about him.

[2264] So we do a lot of, you know, cool, unique things, man, with him.

[2265] But he makes sure to push me to my limits, you know.

[2266] Now, how do you balance out strength and conditioning workout with skill workout?

[2267] Like, what is your, like a week's work with you structure?

[2268] So Monday through Friday, man. So I'm in the gym, point blank period.

[2269] And I even work out Saturday and Sunday, but I'll be doing my own thing, you know.

[2270] But Monday we do HPI work, so that's strength and conditioning.

[2271] On that same Monday, we do striking MMA work with my head coach, whatever.

[2272] So just two days, you know.

[2273] Tuesdays, same thing, working with conditioning coach.

[2274] Then I'm working grappling.

[2275] Tuesdays is grappling day, so wrestling M &A.

[2276] And then Wednesday, same thing, conditioning.

[2277] So we might work, let's say, like functional, work, you know what I mean?

[2278] Just working the weights like kettlebells or like what's the one they have.

[2279] Mace.

[2280] Still mace.

[2281] And do functional work with that.

[2282] And Wednesday we got spawned.

[2283] You know, and then Thursday we had the same thing just outside conditioning.

[2284] Now we're running.

[2285] You know, we outside with it.

[2286] And after that with Thursday, we got jihitsu training.

[2287] And then Friday we have just open mat, you know what I mean?

[2288] That we work with coach.

[2289] But then also Friday we, we hit a heavy lift.

[2290] Yeah.

[2291] And so do you have days where you, like, are you specifically doing jujitsu some days or wrestling some days?

[2292] Yeah.

[2293] So Tuesdays and Thursday, they're grappling.

[2294] Tuesday is wrestling primarily, and then Thursday is jujitsu.

[2295] Is it hard to get everything in?

[2296] Because that's one of the things about MMAs.

[2297] There's so many skill sets you have to work on.

[2298] Yeah, yeah, of course, of course.

[2299] I mean, but the core things, you already know what the core things is for real, is jujitsu, boxing, kickboxing, slash moitai judo and what else what else can we put on that um i guess that's it for real four things you know that those are core things so we we get to work all those fundamental things you know but it's actually like trying to actually form our own type of martial arts and then coach is just always trying to have us work on our you know abilities right and try to form us into the best fighter that we are you know and he just tries to work those attributes that we have you know and when you do by yourself on the weekends so what do you do just constantly on what you think you need to work on?

[2300] Like, how do you do that?

[2301] So with Saturday and Sunday, I usually work with Andy Simmons with wrestling on Sundays.

[2302] And Saturday, I pretty much just do my own thing.

[2303] So like a little workout, watch some little videos.

[2304] I still do the same thing that I've been doing for the longest time.

[2305] I always trying to find different videos, but do a little fun little workout.

[2306] But it's nothing too stressful.

[2307] It's just having fun and just keeping my tools tight.

[2308] You know, so that might just be hitting the bag and just working on certain little basic techniques.

[2309] But Sundays, though, I work out with Andy Simmons almost every Sunday, you know, and Andy Simmons is a dog.

[2310] Like, you can bring them up if you want to, but, you know, like I said, from Michigan State, undefeated, was undefeated in his high school and then went into being a collegiate wrestler at D1, Michigan State, and going crazy there, too.

[2311] So do you have anybody that works with you on your nutrition?

[2312] I mean, we don't work on it necessarily, but, like, we eat clean, though.

[2313] You know, so Justin cooks up all our meals.

[2314] So that's my coach again, conditioning coach.

[2315] Oh, well, that's great.

[2316] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[2317] So it cooks up the bison.

[2318] Everything is like, I feel like it's like dog food, man. We eat the same stuff every day, man. But we eat up bison meat and chicken and just white rice and broccoli.

[2319] Real plain, real simple, real boring, you know, nothing too crazy.

[2320] But I told you, like, with me, it is perfect, though, you know.

[2321] But at the same time, I don't have to really focus on, like, literally what I'm putting my body until going to 170.

[2322] You know, so I still play around.

[2323] I still eat whatever I want to, you know, being at 185.

[2324] So was he doing, like, meal prep, or he gives you, like, pre -portioned meals, and then you just save them for the week?

[2325] Yeah.

[2326] We eat that same thing.

[2327] Oh, yeah, yeah.

[2328] But it's the perfect nutrition, what you're saying.

[2329] Yes, sir.

[2330] That's the right.

[2331] Yes, sir.

[2332] What about recovery stuff?

[2333] Do you do sauna, cold plunge?

[2334] We do all that.

[2335] All of it, all of it, man. Like, it's nothing too crazy.

[2336] Like, it's all the things that fighters been doing for the longest or boxers been doing for the longest.

[2337] So we do ice plunge, we hit the sauna.

[2338] I like cryo a lot more for myself I hate being cold and wet you know but the thing about just the regular ice plunge that you have to do I feel like it's more mental because you can stay in there a little bit longer you know what I mean and I feel like just for the attitude and get into the ice plunge and stuff like that that's why I think it's great for but I feel like cryo I like cryo a little bit more you know what I'm saying for inflammation in my arms or if my body aches if I have anything going on I feel like cryo get me right real quick because I only get to be in her for like three minutes.

[2339] You know, yes, sir.

[2340] When you do the ice plunge, how long you stay in there for?

[2341] We try to do 10, 15 minutes, you know what I'm saying?

[2342] And then two sessions.

[2343] So you're doing buckets of water with buckets of ice in it, not doing like a real cold plunge where it keeps it to 34 degrees.

[2344] I mean, well, we keep it there, you know, so, yeah, we checked the temperature.

[2345] And that thing beginning to 32, you know.

[2346] And we in Michigan, too.

[2347] Oh, boy.

[2348] So that helps.

[2349] The winters in Michigan.

[2350] You can just get in a lake.

[2351] Big, I mean, big facts, you know.

[2352] And you try to do that at the evening.

[2353] Like, when do you do that, the recovery stuff?

[2354] We try to hit it.

[2355] So usually we've been doing it Monday, Wednesdays, Fridays, you know, right after, like, a workout, you know what I'm saying?

[2356] With him and then we go straight into it, you know.

[2357] But don't do the, like, bucket of ice and stuff like that.

[2358] Don't do it every day.

[2359] We don't do it every day.

[2360] No. Do you get massages or anything like that?

[2361] No, I don't really get no massages, man If I do get a massage, man It'll probably be at the mall or something But I like the compressions Oh, yeah, Norma Texx Norma Text is cool, you know So that works, you know But yeah, I don't really get like massages Nothing too crazy like You know, everything real basic, man Like my thing is like It's just every day now I get to train every day So it might not be like the craziest things That I'm doing But I'm doing the same thing consistently Right having no job has to be a big fact Oh, yeah.

[2362] Going from, you know, having a job and training when you can to having training being your whole job.

[2363] Big fact.

[2364] Because like I said, I'm not doing nothing crazy or special just able to do it every day.

[2365] There's so many fighters that fight at a world -class level that still have a job.

[2366] It's crazy.

[2367] I mean, that's just a sport that we're in, you know?

[2368] But my thing, I'm, yeah, it is unfortunate, but I've been blessed and I've been fortunate enough to, like, be able to fight the way I'm fighting, and I've been rewarded for it.

[2369] You know, so, you know, I feel like a lot of fighters, if they put more on the line and they go out and actually try to take a little bit more risk, they could potentially, you know, be on the other side.

[2370] But at the same time, it's all about winning, you know what I mean?

[2371] But unfortunately, you see some guys that win some fights, whatever, but they're not exciting, they're not fun, and you don't see where their career takes them, and they don't make a lot of money, which you see, like you said, they got another job.

[2372] They're still training.

[2373] They still, you know, trying to find sponsors, whatever, just to pay some certain bills and stuff like that.

[2374] you know so it's that risk and reward factor you know so if you're willing just to win but not be exciting you know what I mean just realize like you're not going to get the money that you're really looking for and you're going to have to I guess that's the harder route I feel like you know unfortunately it's interesting like that those calculations like are you just trying to win or are you trying to win and be someone who's very entertaining yeah big facts and I feel like you know a lot of guys don't train that way and I've been training like that for a long time you know and I wouldn't even say like I'm a hard guy to spar and nothing like that but I'm trying to touch you though You know, I mean, we see it in kickboxing.

[2375] We see it in boxing how those guys sparred.

[2376] Not those guys spar for real.

[2377] They be trying to knock dudes out, you know.

[2378] And I feel like some guys in the MMA coach or whatever, they just want to touch like, man, I don't really want to hurt, you know, so we're just going to touch like this and just tag each other.

[2379] But I feel like that plays a part in your fights too, you know.

[2380] And a lot of guys get touched up even more because of that in a fight instead of actually taking the series and sparring.

[2381] Because they're not used to sparring hard.

[2382] Exactly, right?

[2383] So now they're getting touched up for real in the actual fight, you know.

[2384] How do you balance that out, though?

[2385] Because if you spar too much, you leave too much in the gym.

[2386] Well, how many times did I tell you I spar in a week?

[2387] One time.

[2388] One time.

[2389] That's it?

[2390] That's it.

[2391] What I need to spar more for?

[2392] Interesting.

[2393] Yeah, big fact.

[2394] But it's a hard day.

[2395] But it's a hard day.

[2396] Yeah, man. What day is that, do you spar?

[2397] Wednesday.

[2398] Yeah.

[2399] And so Thursday and Friday, thinking about working drilling.

[2400] Well, it sounds like you got a great thing.

[2401] plan, man. And I'm very, very much looking forward to this fight in December.

[2402] It's a big fight for you.

[2403] And I love the fact that you drop it down to 170.

[2404] No, big facts, man. And before that, though, too, like, before we even end off on that, you know, because I said I wanted to fight at 170 and you ask me, like, who's some names?

[2405] Yeah.

[2406] So if it's not child cotton, it's not Jeff Neal, you know, I love to fight Sean Brady, you know what I'm saying, or Vicente Leuke.

[2407] You know, those are two great names, two good matchos for me, you know, and they both coming off of L, you know.

[2408] Those are great fights.

[2409] I'd like to see all of them.

[2410] Big facts.

[2411] Well, listen, man, I'm a big fan.

[2412] I'm really excited about your future.

[2413] Thank you, man. And hear your story has been fantastic.

[2414] I appreciate you for having me. I appreciate you very much, man. And, again, I'm really looking forward to December.

[2415] And your whole career.

[2416] And that's 100, man. I appreciate it.

[2417] Thank you very much.

[2418] All right.

[2419] Tell everybody your social media so they can find you.

[2420] Oh, yeah, yeah.

[2421] You already know, man. So my social media is Newmast, 94.

[2422] That's my Instagram.

[2423] I got a YouTube channel now.

[2424] That's Joaquin Buckley official on YouTube.

[2425] And then as well, I got, you know, my own little business, solid foundation, you know.

[2426] So make sure y 'all go follow that page as well on Instagram.

[2427] What is that business?

[2428] Solid foundation.

[2429] It's just apparel, just merch.

[2430] Oh, okay.

[2431] Yeah, you're on clothing line.

[2432] Yeah, yes, sir.

[2433] That's good.

[2434] Spread it out.

[2435] Yeah, yeah, you already know.

[2436] All right, brother.

[2437] Thank you very much.

[2438] Bye, everybody.