The Good Place Week: Kristen Bell

[0] Hello, everybody.

[1] Welcome to Armchair Expert.

[2] I'm Dan Rathers.

[3] And next to me is Monica Lewinsky.

[4] Monica Lewinsky's here.

[5] Put your hands together.

[6] Today we have by popular demand.

[7] Sure.

[8] People have been calling for it since episode one of Armchair Expert.

[9] Yep.

[10] Love My Life, Kristen Bell.

[11] Rounding out the Good Place Week.

[12] Cleanup hit her, as they'd say.

[13] The bases were loaded.

[14] We have three on.

[15] And of course, Sweet Bell's here to knock it right out of the fucking park.

[16] which she does again.

[17] Yes, ma 'am.

[18] You know her from the instructional video at the Liberty Bell, where they tell you the history of the Liberty Bell.

[19] You also know her from her work in Pouti Tang.

[20] Sure.

[21] And probably most impressively, the Sears catalog that circulated the Metro Detroit area in the mid -80s.

[22] Kristen Bell.

[23] Wondry Plus subscribers can listen to Armchair Expert early and ad -free right now.

[24] Join Wondry Plus in the Wondry app or on Apple Podcasts.

[25] Or you can listen for free wherever you get your podcasts.

[26] He's an object to.

[27] He's an up to chat.

[28] You're going to put your headphones on a little, bugs?

[29] How close you...

[30] Aye, aye, aye, aye, aye.

[31] I'm chewing.

[32] Yeah, people like the sound of chewing.

[33] It's okay.

[34] Well, not, they can't hear anything over your yodeling.

[35] Was it?

[36] Unless they have misohornea slash mesothomia.

[37] Misophonia.

[38] Misophonia, which Ryan Hanson has.

[39] So, Ryan, you're not going to be able to listen to this one.

[40] Sorry, bro.

[41] Read the transcript.

[42] Because Kristen is...

[43] Chowing down on some Miga's tacos right now.

[44] Yummy.

[45] I love that you've basically fallen into a pattern already, which was the first time you were on.

[46] First of all, thanks for being the first repeat customer.

[47] Sure.

[48] The reason I thought I, I, I might be a fun song to sing is it would launch us right into one of the many times that we've been moving throughout planet Earth and I've embarrassed you.

[49] Oh, yeah.

[50] Well, we don't have enough time.

[51] We only have an hour.

[52] But do you remember specifically when that was really got your gourd?

[53] Yes, I know exactly what you're talking about.

[54] And I just want to point out, now you can feel very safe.

[55] I wiped the sauce off my hands from the megas tacos, putting my earphones on.

[56] Do you want to give a shout out to where those megas tacos?

[57] Were they delicious?

[58] Square one.

[59] Oh my God, they're heavenly.

[60] Yeah, square one fountain and somewhere around between sunset and Edgemont.

[61] And there's also one at Griffith Park and Hyperion.

[62] Oh, there is?

[63] Right sort of catty corner from the Trader Joe's where the big drama was two months ago.

[64] Remember, there was a person killed from a, there was a big shoot out there.

[65] There was.

[66] For some reason, when you said the big drama, I was expecting something frivolous.

[67] Monica did that trigger for you?

[68] No, I knew exactly.

[69] Well, there's one thing Monica knows it's one.

[70] making a joke.

[71] That's right.

[72] And when I'm not.

[73] I know.

[74] Her jokes.

[75] Which that's actually a joke because lately my jokes have been falling flat because Monica doesn't recognize their jokes and I feel like I'm I should quit comedy.

[76] Because you're too good of an actress.

[77] You always leave that part out because that's the complimentary part.

[78] But that's the truth.

[79] Yeah.

[80] What's been happening is I've been delivering in a batting slump.

[81] Things that I thought were really funny.

[82] But my problem was I didn't have the improv training you guys did and I'm delivering them way too sincere.

[83] There's no sarcasm at all.

[84] It's just, it's just, it's delivered as truth.

[85] Yeah.

[86] No wink.

[87] There's not even the tiniest wink.

[88] But I think fully commit.

[89] It's amazing.

[90] But then they fall flat.

[91] But you came back hard the other night.

[92] I'm trying to remember what we, Houston's.

[93] It was at Houston's.

[94] We were out for a celebratory double birthday dinner for Jess and myself.

[95] And, yeah, what was it that, hon, you really, you brought the house down.

[96] Oh, God, God, God only knows if I remember.

[97] You didn't put it in your great joke journal when you got home?

[98] I didn't.

[99] I mean, this was supposed to be a good place episode, but I think much more appropriate to have it a Miga's Taco episode.

[100] It's Miga's Taco Week on Armchair Expert.

[101] Now, back to Ai, aye, aye, y, y, aye, y, y. You and I, when we were first dating, we went over to Italy to do a couple weeks of shooting on a terrific film entitled When in Rome.

[102] When in Rome.

[103] Yeah, we made the mistake of living together and got too close, too quick, but it worked out.

[104] It worked out.

[105] But one of the, since you brought the question, if I am recollecting correctly, was one of the many ways in which you've embarrassed me and peaking one of those times was when we were in Italy, you have a bit of an impulse control issue, especially with songs that you want to sing at inopportune times.

[106] It's like a torrents kind of auditory Tourette's, you know.

[107] And we would get in very small confined spaces like elevators in Italy.

[108] And he would.

[109] With Italians.

[110] Yes.

[111] Presumably.

[112] And you would start singing at the top of your lungs.

[113] Well, a racial song.

[114] Well, hold on, though.

[115] He'd say, that's so in this way, see me. Hold on, hold on, hold on.

[116] I was not doing that.

[117] No, no, no, no, no, no. No, no, no. I was, I will absolutely own, I'll own the parts that are true.

[118] And by the way, it's not that we would get in the elevator.

[119] I'd see some Italians and think, ooh, time to sing that song.

[120] I was just, most of the day, those songs were caught in my head because I was in, but see, I disagree.

[121] Now I have two toddlers and I see something happening in their brains that I see happen in your brain all the time.

[122] And it is noticing the most inappropriate time to take advantage of something.

[123] But because it came into your brain, you're like, oh, I'm shoulder to shoulder with some Italians.

[124] And then in the elevator, we press 40.

[125] from the first floor and then you just start and then you just start da -da -da -da -da -da -da -ra -da -ra -da -ra -a -pap -a -a -samo -a.

[126] Hold on.

[127] I mean, as I shrink into the corner.

[128] Listen, the reason I don't think that's inaccurate assessment of the situation was that you'll also admit that I was, it was in my head all day long, 24 -7 while we were in Italy.

[129] But oddly when we were strolling down the street together without any Italians near who could be offended, I don't remember it coming to the surface.

[130] Okay, well, listen, let's earmark this to circle back to.

[131] I disagree.

[132] But the more important thing I want to get to is that when you were upset by it, I pointed out how much I would enjoy being in an elevator here in Los Angeles and five Germans get on tourists.

[133] I can tell by their shoes and stuff and their satchels.

[134] Belts and.

[135] Yeah, you just, you're getting all.

[136] these visual cues.

[137] Oh, these guys are in from Hamburg.

[138] And then they start like in their thing.

[139] Let me see if I could get what it would sound like.

[140] Hit me with the American, are they on national anthem?

[141] They were like, oh, say, can you see?

[142] Yes.

[143] By the dawns early light.

[144] I would be thrilled.

[145] Here's what I would think.

[146] Look at these cute Germans.

[147] They're here in America and they are drinking the Kool -Aid.

[148] They're singing our song.

[149] They're so happy.

[150] I would take it as such a positive thing.

[151] And you guys think it is somehow mean.

[152] No, I would take that positively too.

[153] But you aren't singing the Italian national anthem.

[154] You were singing a cartoon.

[155] Yes, when the moon hits your eye like a big pizza pie is the national anthem of Italy.

[156] You were singing a caricatured version of an Italian.

[157] Okay.

[158] If they were singing.

[159] Oh, I got it.

[160] I got it.

[161] I know our charactery song.

[162] It's over.

[163] here over there the jerseys are coming over there you know that song it's a big World War II war film song the jerrys are coming by the way jerry's is not a nice word to call Germans but we did do it during World War II you know that song the juries are coming I don't know I don't know over here over there but I think if they were name a song that you think I'd be offended if the Germans were singing.

[164] That's the problem.

[165] I don't know that we have that.

[166] But see, this is...

[167] Do you know, no, do you know why we don't have it?

[168] Because we are the culture that makes up the offensive songs.

[169] Well, first and foremost...

[170] They don't have a, like, poking fun at American songs because they don't spend their time writing them.

[171] The first global empire was Pax Romanica.

[172] That's not the right word.

[173] But the very first hegemonic world -dominating society was Rome.

[174] So, no, they had...

[175] a big, long empire.

[176] So again, I'm not going to feel that they're disenfranchised.

[177] I'm not saying they're disenfranchised.

[178] I'm saying they don't spend their time making caricatures out of Americans.

[179] When in America, we do spend time making caricatures out of a lot of different countries.

[180] Oh, totally disagree.

[181] I think all humans make characters out of all out groups.

[182] But we, you guys, you both, you carry on this guilt.

[183] Like, we are so much worse than everybody else.

[184] No, I mean, we have some.

[185] No, no. Well, hold on.

[186] Well, you know, you just said.

[187] that we're the only country that's making characters out of every other country and that's just horseship.

[188] Well, so name a country that has made like a well -known.

[189] Yeah.

[190] Turn on any 80s, German, French, English, Bombay TV station and any of their comedy programs and you're going to see them doing characters of other outgroups.

[191] Are you theorizing this or have you turned on recently and or in the past?

[192] German television shows.

[193] Yes, I've traveled in the 80s throughout Europe and watched local TV and son.

[194] Oh, these French people are clearly doing a blank group.

[195] So rather than getting angry at Monica and I, why don't you recognize that we've had a different experience than you, Monica, I think I can speak confidently for you that you didn't travel to Germany throughout the 80s, did you?

[196] Did not?

[197] And I did not either.

[198] So we didn't watch as much German mad TV as you did.

[199] So calm down and understand.

[200] that we had a different experience.

[201] Okay, but why would your assumption be that we're the only people that characterize other people?

[202] Because we are the, we are currently the hegemonic group.

[203] We are the ones that are the, tend to be the bullies.

[204] And when the bully pokes fun, it's very different than when someone that is marginalized pokes fun.

[205] We also, you can't name one, sorry, I know you did a song, but we don't know it.

[206] You can't name one stereotypical song and you can make any little stereotypical song for any other country that everyone would recognize as a stereotypical song of that country.

[207] Yeah, I just think it's what I think is interesting is that you guys don't think the other countries have that song.

[208] So yes, so we have these, hold on, we have these auditory cues that have existed in cartoons from the beginning to Disney, which is you go to any Asian said anything and you hear, do do do do do do that's the cue to know oh we're in Asia yep and then there's one for France or Russia or whatever we have all these musical cues and the notion that the other countries don't have that same thing for every other country that's what I just don't understand I wouldn't disagree with you there I'm sure they do my argument I suppose is I don't think they hold the same power as our sound cues hold and as our stereotypes that we sling hold, it doesn't hold the same power, and therefore ours should be tread on carefully.

[209] Well, listen, I definitely also don't condone going over to Europe and acting like the loud, ugly American, which, you know, that I might have been guilty of.

[210] But again, I was not trying to offend anyone.

[211] I just literally was having a blast in Italy.

[212] Oh, that was another one.

[213] Oh, my God.

[214] So close to people's ears in the elevator And my head would sink And I would want to melt into the floor If you had to give like a top five Most embarrassing things I've done around you Can you?

[215] I know we've discussed your memory's not the best But are there any of that just pop out right away?

[216] That's up there.

[217] The TSA line I guess I've talked about.

[218] Oh my God.

[219] That's for short.

[220] your short temper in places that just simply are like a way of life where I just don't see anyone else having a short temper or the reason for a short temper and that's definitely the summit is TSA like you go in there like you're in brave heart ready for battle and I'm like oh my God and on the way there I'm trying I genuinely try to compensate and say you know know, the TSA agents, they probably have little kids and they got up this morning because they have a government job that's not very fun.

[221] And like they're just, they were given rules by their job that they're trying to execute.

[222] And everybody gets bossy about the rules.

[223] You were pretty bossy about putting my headphones on when I got in here.

[224] And I may not, well, hold on.

[225] I may not have wanted to put them on.

[226] But you were like, no, I like him on.

[227] And even you defended him.

[228] You work for this TSA operative.

[229] And you were like, he likes it when the headphones, around and I was like, I didn't say it like that.

[230] No, but you didn't.

[231] You're right.

[232] But I was like, from my point of me, I'm like, y 'all, calm down.

[233] I've been in the booth before.

[234] I'm cool without my headphones for a minute.

[235] I'm just saying everybody has rules that makes their job easier.

[236] So here's where intention is relevant.

[237] And I'm so glad you're here because I had recorded something I wanted to release that was, I was making your case for you, but you're here and you can make it instead for us.

[238] But my intention was to be having the same experience as you.

[239] That's all.

[240] I wanted to have the exact same experience as you.

[241] So I thought if you had headphones on and I had headphones on, we'd be more closely having the same experience.

[242] So that was my intention.

[243] Did it occur to you that while, to look at my point of view, which is that I had a drippy taco in my hand, and if your desire was to have the same experience, maybe you could take off your headphones while I had my headphones off and then put them on at the -a -trippy taco?

[244] No, but put them on at the same time that I was able to wipe my hands and get my headphones off.

[245] Like if that was really your intention, I think it would have occurred to you to go, I'll take my headphones off and hear the same sounds in the room as she does.

[246] And then we'll put them on at the same time.

[247] Yeah.

[248] Yeah, that's true.

[249] I could have definitely chose that.

[250] But minimally, we could understand that my intention was altruistic.

[251] I don't know.

[252] The TSA employee who was asking me to hold up my pants yet put my hands over my head at the same time, I was having a very hard time understanding what they're altruistic most.

[253] motive was to help me in that situation.

[254] I'm curious what you would have done in that.

[255] So just really to bring everyone up to speed, I went through one of those things where it circles around you and you've got to put your hands over your head, but you've taken your belt off to put it through the machine.

[256] And she said, put your hands over your head.

[257] I did that.

[258] My pants, they fell down just below my hips.

[259] It's not like I had pubs exposed or a shaft or anything like that.

[260] And she said, pull up your pants.

[261] And so I pulled up my pants.

[262] She said, put your hands over your head.

[263] After we cycled through that three times and it became abundantly clear.

[264] There was no way I could put my hands above my head and also have my pants being held up.

[265] I said, I'm not going to play this game anymore.

[266] This could go on indefinitely.

[267] There's a Laurel and Hardy sketch.

[268] How would you have handled that situation?

[269] Clearly me yelling was not the answer.

[270] Right.

[271] Well, I believe that any situation always has an alternate solution.

[272] I don't believe that clearly there was no way this was going to.

[273] I don't believe in that.

[274] And exactly like you just said, you had altruistic intentions you wanted me to put my headphones on but then I said to you hey you know what another option would be if you really really wanted to have the same experience with me meet me there and notice that I was struggling with a drippy burrito and I didn't want to wipe the taco sauce all over your expensive headphones take yours off and then we both win we have the same experience and you're meeting me halfway I think there's always an alternate way to look at it that that person I would be able to quickly assess, because this is my skill set, that this person was simply following rules.

[275] There's probably a sexualization rule, which is don't let people like, don't let their straps fall down or don't let them, you know, whip it out at TSA.

[276] But also you need to be in the position that the person behind the camera needs to check for metals in their body.

[277] And so I would, if I went pants up, heads up, please pull your pants up, hands up.

[278] If I was in that position, I would say, look at them, make direct eye contact, acknowledging that we're both human beings in this position and say, I'm so sorry, I'm having trouble holding my pants up and my hands at the same time, what would you recommend I do?

[279] And put it back in their hand, because the bottom line is at TSA, they are supposed to be the boss.

[280] When their training happens, they're supposed to be in charge.

[281] That's how they keep us safe.

[282] So it's just like with our kids, we can't ever let our kids think that they're the boss.

[283] So if you put it back on her plate, she is obligated to help you find a solution and if she's and if if she doesn't then then she's not doing her job and you can report her but the other option I would see is I've had very loose waistlines in the past because I was pregnant and then not pregnant and I have pants that are all different sizes if you bend your knees a little bit squat and squat a little bit your pants stay up but I don't think you were in the mindset to want to find a solution now is anyone at the TSA just fucking with people because they're They are disgruntled in their job and they enjoy the authority and they like to be able to tell people what to do.

[284] And they have a sadistic bent.

[285] Are any of them that way?

[286] Maybe.

[287] And I don't know which one's which and I guarantee you don't know either.

[288] And that's why I'm not willing just like our justice system to put someone innocent in jail.

[289] But also that person is going to be way less likely to fuck with the nice person than the arrogant person.

[290] Yeah.

[291] That's an easy target for them.

[292] By the way, you're playing, you keep saying you don't want to play their game.

[293] You are taking every card they're dealing with you.

[294] The arrogant person who's trying to fuck with people at TSA is waiting for someone like you.

[295] They're not waiting for someone like me. I would argue there's even another layer, which is you by your own admission, which made me so happy you acknowledged it.

[296] You admitted that sometimes people are gunning for me. When we got pulled over on the side of the road in Oregon in the very short, gentleman cop ran me up and down the flag pole he walked back to the car and you said you know what people some people do think you're the jock from high school and they can't wait to get their turn on you yeah yeah I do I did see that and I but I also just because you're so capable of having an evolved point of view I'm not going to let you slack on this I also know that the way people act has much more to do with them than it does anyone else.

[297] How you act in a situation is what is going on inside your body.

[298] That man was made to feel small by someone else.

[299] Maybe it was his wife this morning.

[300] Maybe it was someone at the police station.

[301] Maybe it was a history of criminals he's dealt with.

[302] Maybe it's been his physical height.

[303] Right.

[304] Maybe it was a jock in high school that looks similar to you.

[305] Either way, in my eyes, you, Dax Shepard, who I know to be a kind and evolved human being, are not part of the equation.

[306] But my challenge to you is you allow yourself to become part of the equation when you say he's out to get me and I'm like no no he just has an emotion you could let it bounce off of you like rubber and glue you know and let it stick to him exactly like that's how I walk through I'm like oh my god I see this guy and he's definitely fucking with me but that's so sad that he that he's carrying around all those frowns today yeah and I think we would concede that over the last 11 years I've gotten much better at it.

[307] Absolutely.

[308] And now I go into all of our airport experiences with a little speech to myself before we ever step foot in there.

[309] I get my expectations correct.

[310] And then I'm not shocked or in awe of anything that I find offensive or disagreeable.

[311] Yeah.

[312] And I can roll with it.

[313] I go, oh, right, this is exactly as I expected.

[314] Cool.

[315] Yeah.

[316] I'll stay in there and do this thing that makes no sense.

[317] You also, you don't like to be told what to do.

[318] Well, you really don't like to be told what to do.

[319] You don't like even anyone to suggest it.

[320] And I know that.

[321] That's 70 % of it.

[322] Yeah.

[323] But 30 % of it is I don't like carrying a couch through a doorway sideways.

[324] A lot of people are fine being a part of a couch carrying exercise where they just approach the door sideways and they just slam into it to see.

[325] I find that very, very discomfort.

[326] But I think that's insulting to like Monica and I don't like being a part of a bad plan either.

[327] It's less painful for you.

[328] You don't know that.

[329] Yeah.

[330] You don't know that.

[331] We handle, no, we handle negotiating getting to a better plan differently than you do.

[332] It's interesting because you are aware and vocal often about your own limitations.

[333] You have an auditory thing.

[334] So if you hear some light music while the conversation's happening, your brain short circuits.

[335] I'll explode, yeah.

[336] And you explain that to me and I accept that.

[337] And you tell me that's way more painful to me than it is to you.

[338] And I acknowledge that and accept it because I can see the reaction to it.

[339] It's very clear.

[340] So when I say, no, I have a much different reaction to you, you say you don't know that.

[341] That's your answer.

[342] Well, that's a good point.

[343] That's a good point.

[344] So, yes, it is much more difficult for you.

[345] Let me acknowledge that then.

[346] Yes, I don't have the creepy, crawly feelings like I need to peel my skin off.

[347] Well, you don't have a, yeah, in your mind, this thing isn't representing 18.

[348] years of stepdad's, you know, like, it just, it has more weight.

[349] I'm coming at it with a bunch of biochemical stuff.

[350] You have your own, unique biochemical stuff.

[351] Tusha.

[352] You're right.

[353] You're right.

[354] I'm just, I'm, I'm pointing out because I know you can take the challenge, because I've seen how much, A, you've evolved over the last 11 years, and B, how much you've allowed, you've taught me to evolve, you know, and in a thousand different ways is that when, like, Let's, I'm only just lump Monica and I in because we're not in the...

[355] Well, I'm really glad people are hearing this because this is our real -life dynamic.

[356] Yeah.

[357] Yeah.

[358] So it's usually two -on -one, just in general, because you guys both have very similar points of view.

[359] Well, we're not trying to make it two -on -one.

[360] You're not out to get me. It's just a fact that it's generally you guys have a similar opinion and I have a conflicting.

[361] For the reasons that you pointed out, you are genetically predisposed to be the fighter, you have 18 years of going along, stepfathering.

[362] I think I personally, because I won't speak for Monica, I just, if I see a bad plan and I can fast forward five minutes into this plan and see, you know what, Sarah, who I'm helping move the couch, really just wants to see if it'll fit.

[363] And I know it's not going to fit.

[364] And I'm going to let Sarah figure that out.

[365] And then in five minutes, I'll let her move the couch.

[366] I think that's great.

[367] I aspire.

[368] I aspire to that.

[369] I do not do that, by the way.

[370] I'm not like that.

[371] I'm not like you either.

[372] I would just say, hey, I've done this before and I think you should do it like this.

[373] And if they don't, then I just stop helping.

[374] You won't carry it, right?

[375] Yeah, I'm not going to make me nuts, but I'm not also not going to be like, okay, we'll just keep doing this thing that I know is wrong.

[376] But let's say it's me and I'm carrying a couch and you say, Kristen, I got this couch in here.

[377] And I go, please, I just, I really think it'll fit.

[378] You wouldn't under any circumstance go, okay, I'll lift it up.

[379] I'll show you how it won't fit.

[380] Maybe it's my mom.

[381] instincts of saying when my kids say that they can do something and I know it's not going to happen, I go, you know what?

[382] Let me see.

[383] Here's the round peg and go to the square hole.

[384] See if it will fit.

[385] I'll wait while you learn.

[386] Well, I would.

[387] You're right.

[388] I probably would just be like, all right, but I would be so annoyed at you.

[389] And I would not, I would not be like.

[390] Well, you know what Monica weirdly is on the, on the spectrum, Monica is in many respects directly between you and I. I just don't understand I just don't understand being annoyed while someone else learns.

[391] If I see geometry, which I borderline failed differently than you, and my brain actually, I'm not like dying to waste our time while we move the couch, but if I genuinely think it's going to fit, why wouldn't either of you want to say, okay, let me pick it up.

[392] I'm going to show you so that you have a better teaching technique and have more information going forward.

[393] Well, yes, but I would say if you know that you have a limitation, that you almost fail geometry and that someone else is there who did it yesterday, who has more knowledge than you, why would you ever...

[394] There's a little bit of arrogance in that.

[395] It is.

[396] It's like, why would you ever be like...

[397] Because otherwise, I'll never learn more about shapes.

[398] If I don't ever get to try it, I'll never learn.

[399] Because it's just like I posted this the other day on Instagram.

[400] If you fold it for me, cut it for me, color it for me, and, you know, draw it for me, all I learn is that you do it better than me. And that's the thing about kids.

[401] Like you have to let people try their own things.

[402] It doesn't bother me that adults learn things.

[403] It doesn't bother me. Now, Monica, what would you have done at the TSA?

[404] If your slacks were falling down and your mom's pubis was being exposed and then they were telling you to put your hands above your head.

[405] What would you do?

[406] I would, again, it would have been in the middle.

[407] I would have been very annoyed at that situation too.

[408] But I would never have screamed at someone.

[409] I just would have said, I don't think I can do both.

[410] Mm -hmm.

[411] And I would not have done the step that you said, which is a very good step that I would like to implement myself, which is like putting it in their hands and saying, what would you like me to do?

[412] I would not say that.

[413] I would just say, I can't do both.

[414] I'm sorry.

[415] Yeah.

[416] And then I would just stand there.

[417] Yeah.

[418] Stay tuned for more armchair expert.

[419] If you dare.

[420] We've all been there.

[421] Turning to the internet to self -diagnose our inexplicable pains, debilitating body aches, sudden fevers, and strange rashes.

[422] Though our minds tend to spiral to worst -case scenarios, it's usually nothing, but for an unlucky few, these unsuspecting symptoms can start the clock ticking on a terrifying medical mystery.

[423] Like the unexplainable death of a retired firefighter, whose body was found at home by his son, except it looked like he had been cremated, or the time when an entire town started jumping from buildings and seeing tigers on their ceilings.

[424] Hey listeners, it's Mr. Ballin here, and I'm here to tell you about my podcast.

[425] It's called Mr. Ballin's Medical Mysteries.

[426] Each terrifying true story will be sure to keep you up at night.

[427] Follow Mr. Ballin's Medical Mysteries wherever you get your podcasts.

[428] Prime members can listen early and ad -free on Amazon music.

[429] What's up, guys?

[430] This is your girl Kiki, and my podcast is back with a new season, and let me tell you, it's too good.

[431] and I'm diving into the brains of entertainment's best and brightest.

[432] Okay, every episode I bring on a friend and have a real conversation.

[433] And I don't mean just friends.

[434] I mean the likes of Amy Poehler, Kell Mitchell, Vivica Fox.

[435] The list goes on.

[436] So follow, watch, and listen to Baby.

[437] This is Kiki Palmer on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcast.

[438] That sets up beautifully for, again, I recorded this thing and it didn't involve you, but now you're here.

[439] So this is great.

[440] I can do it this way.

[441] Someone has pointed out something, some great tweeter, an armchair, a learned arm cherry that said that I'm regularly talking about this thing called behavior attribution error but I don't know that that's what it's called so let me give you the definition okay as a simple example of the behavior attribution error theory seeks to explain consider this situation where Alice a driver is cut off in traffic by Bob Alice attributes Bob's behavior to his fundamental personality he thinks only of himself.

[442] He is selfish.

[443] He is a jerk.

[444] He is an unskilled driver.

[445] She does not think it is situational.

[446] He is going to miss his flight.

[447] His wife is giving birth at the hospital.

[448] His daughter is convulsing at school.

[449] Consider two, the situation where Alice makes the same mistake and excuses herself by saying she was influenced by situational causes.

[450] I am late for my job interview.

[451] I must pick up my son for his dentist appointment.

[452] She does not think she has a flaw in her internal characteristics, e .g. I am a jerk.

[453] I treat others in contempt.

[454] I am bad at driving.

[455] I think this so perfectly sums up most of the way you and I move through planet Earth, where when you get cut off in traffic, you generally think that person was in a situation that kind of caused them to do that.

[456] Is that accurate?

[457] Yeah.

[458] Yeah.

[459] There are times when I question it and say was that person a jerk and but it still doesn't make me very angry because at that point I just go how sad for them well here's the crazy breakthrough I had I didn't think that behavioral error thing even got deep enough so here's what I then thought of later I said oh my god yeah that's Kristen and I you give people the benefit of the doubt you assume that they needed to do that thing I immediately go to that person's an entitled asshole who doesn't want to And it has now occurred to me, the reason I can so quickly ascribe an intention to that person is because I myself have that intention very often.

[460] I am an entitled asshole who hates to wait.

[461] So I have cut people off many times to get ahead and not wait my turn.

[462] So it's quite easy for me to believe that the people around me are equally as shitty as I am because I don't think I'm a fucking monster.

[463] I think I'm human and I'm in this big rat cage with everyone else.

[464] trying to get fed. So all this really says about either of us is that you actually don't cut people off in a hurry.

[465] Is that accurate?

[466] Yeah.

[467] I'm a very bad driver.

[468] So I don't really even know how to cut someone off.

[469] Like I just, I wouldn't know like when to accelerate.

[470] But you're not a bad walker.

[471] And if you were to be approaching a supermarket checkout line and you notice you were equidistant from the line with someone else, you wouldn't pick up your pace to beat them there.

[472] Absolutely not.

[473] I would surrender to the other person, yeah.

[474] Just out of manners.

[475] Yes.

[476] And I 100 % would like pick up my pace a little bit, right?

[477] And so my breakthrough was your view of the world is strongly impacted by how you're moving through it.

[478] And that the way you could potentially solve all your problems is just to be a conscientious patient person who's benevolent because weirdly downstream, that's how you will end up seeing the world.

[479] the crazy benefit from your way of doing things is that you don't think everyone's out to get you and steal from you and cut you off and that's a more pleasurable way to float through life I think I think you end up like my my benefit my reward is that I get places 17 seconds faster than other people that's my big reward but I had 45 minutes of anger while I was getting this 17 second reward where everyone was out to fucking cut my throat if I didn't cut theirs first.

[480] So I had an hour of misery to get the 17 seconds of being there first.

[481] And you, now you're going to take a big hit.

[482] You're going to be 17 seconds later than me. But the whole ride was pleasurable.

[483] Right.

[484] And I, first of all, I think you're on to something.

[485] And I also acknowledge what a gigantic compliment that is to me because you're telling your wife that she's patient and benevolent and that you are happy with the way she's walking through.

[486] It has a nice ass.

[487] Has a nice butt cheeks.

[488] But I, so, A, thank you.

[489] That's very complimentary.

[490] But I also would like to shoot that right back at you and say, how evolved do you have to be to even recognize a comparison like that?

[491] Or to even take the time to read that tweet and truly think about it.

[492] That's why I learn so much from you.

[493] And yes, you may have had a history, 18 years of stepfathers, that really did.

[494] Well, you had just as many.

[495] You don't have the same baggage, which is weird.

[496] Yeah, but maybe my experiences weren't as severe as yours.

[497] You know, I mean, there's a thousand different reasons why.

[498] Some of them on paper sound like they were, but perhaps they affected me differently.

[499] We don't know.

[500] But the bottom line is I learn so much from you because as much as you want to say, like, you're an impatient piece of shit.

[501] you're like borderline not an impatient piece of shit because you're so evolved that you can recognize it you're truly like one step away.

[502] I want to get shirts made up that say borderline not a piece of shit.

[503] Borderline not an impatient piece of shit.

[504] But you're not because an impatient piece of shit wouldn't, oh, oh my God.

[505] Oh, here we go.

[506] Salsa?

[507] What are you?

[508] in your fucking, do you have a, is it tissue, is it tissue paper?

[509] Do you have a tumor?

[510] Is it another pair of underwear?

[511] Oh my God, did you just pull your underwear out through your pant leg like people do with the bra and the shirt?

[512] Are you the first person ever take your underwear off?

[513] I think that there was a pair, like from the laundry, there was a pair of underwear stuck to the side of my stretch pants and I put the stretch pants on haphazardly this morning and then noticed there was like a static cling piece of underwear on my calf and I was like what is this bulbous mosquito bite and it wasn't it was undies um anyway uh i can't remember you're not a borderline you're borderline not an impatient selfish piece of shit but you're not though because those people that that have that uh label don't recognize things like you recognize they're not as evolved and that's why i i'm so attracted to you i mean feel like i get scared coming on the podcast because i just want to be as strong as you and as smart as you and i don't give like off as much fun vibes into this microphone but it's because I want to...

[514] You really think I'm going to take you to task.

[515] Not even that, but I don't, I don't, I know you're, I'm the only person that you described bad intention to.

[516] No, but it's like I, I'm happy to just let you interview me in a fun way, but I think that you want, A, I know you want more out of this podcast because I hear you talk about what you want this podcast to do for people and that you don't just want it to be whole that fills a listening part of their day that you want people to learn and that's why you do expert on experts and it's just it's important to me that I come with a you know clear mind look I want people in a dream world to to take the the telescope they have that's aimed at everyone else's imperfection and just occasionally swing that motherfucker 180 degrees back at themselves that's that's really i think my if i had to distill it down to a single hope is that we would we would uh we would not concentrate so much on everyone else's faults and just occasionally look at her own and i think that's all get a little better but i think that's so admirable for both of you because what what you two are doing is something that it's you're executing one of my life goals which is like spread more self -introspection more fierce moral inviative like all that because those things make people healthier and I guess I'm just rambling because I want to give you both a compliment that it's just a really cool thing you're doing and it's one of the reasons I'm so attracted to both of you well but it's also one of the reasons I don't come in here and just be like super giggily like I would on a talk show but you don't have to be that's not what this is yeah no that's what I mean yeah you shouldn't feel like you feel free to eat your biggest tacos on the mic if you want this is equal parts fuckfest and brutal moral inventory right it can just be yeah To be whatever you even wanted to be.

[517] So in the last go -around of this, we spent a lot of time exploring Belenice history and peculiarities.

[518] But I think this episode, I would really like to take people through your other marriage, which is to Manika Padman.

[519] Oh, that's nice.

[520] I would love that.

[521] Because you guys are very much in an emotional relationship.

[522] Yeah, yeah, I have a wife.

[523] Yeah.

[524] I love my wife.

[525] Baby, mom.

[526] Uh -huh.

[527] Yeah, let's go through some of the things you would describe Kristen as Monica.

[528] To me?

[529] Yeah.

[530] You just hit them, but I wanted to be clear that they're coming from you.

[531] She is both your baby.

[532] My child and my mother all at once.

[533] For real.

[534] For real.

[535] I take care of her.

[536] She takes care of me. Uh -huh.

[537] And we have sex.

[538] So let's go through the how she takes care of you.

[539] Oh, boy.

[540] I can think of some.

[541] I know.

[542] I mean, there's too many.

[543] She's very thoughtful to you.

[544] She thinks about her baby all the time.

[545] Yeah, she does.

[546] I love my baby.

[547] You do love your baby and you take great care of her.

[548] Even like we're going to Brooklyn in a couple weeks, I get an email from Kristen.

[549] I heard this great, there's a great magician out there in New York.

[550] You got to take Monica to this thing, basically setting us up on a date.

[551] Yeah.

[552] You got to go to this magician because Monica loves magicians.

[553] and in her free time, which she has none of.

[554] Yep.

[555] She is somehow figuring out a way to get you in front of a magician.

[556] I know.

[557] While you're out of town shirking your other responsibilities that involve herself.

[558] That are her.

[559] Yeah.

[560] That's one way.

[561] She's in, yes.

[562] In that way, you know, I do think because she is, that's a good example, the most generous person alive, I think.

[563] And even more important, thoughtful.

[564] Because people with money can just dump it places.

[565] It doesn't mean they put in the energy.

[566] No, no, not generosity of money.

[567] Right.

[568] Time and thought.

[569] Yeah.

[570] Generosity of spirit.

[571] And it is often, I mean, I think you're that for everyone.

[572] But for me, maybe a little extra because I'm your baby.

[573] But you do that for my favorite baby.

[574] You do that for everyone.

[575] I feel a little bit like I'm having an out of body experience right now.

[576] Like I, because it's like I'm watching the best television program ever made where the television program's talking about me and all my.

[577] good features and characteristics.

[578] Well, yeah, her bone structure for one.

[579] And it's like, I don't know what to do.

[580] No. My heart's racing a little bit.

[581] I'll run you through the mud before this is over.

[582] Oh, yeah, I've no doubt.

[583] We'll come back out the other side.

[584] And that's why I love you.

[585] One another thing that she's given me big time is what you were talking about earlier.

[586] Her outlook on life has rubbed off.

[587] I don't even remember who I was before I started working here.

[588] Like, I don't remember how exactly I saw things or how I took things in.

[589] But, like, I also, when I'm driving down the street and someone cuts me off, am not, I do not have, I do what Kristen does.

[590] I do like, oh, that person might be going to the hospital.

[591] Oh, you do?

[592] Yeah.

[593] Uh -huh.

[594] But I don't know if that, I think I have to, I have to credit a little bit of that to her and for being around her all the time, some of the goodness, I think, has rubbed off a little.

[595] Only some.

[596] I like more, but only a little bit.

[597] But I do think that I'm so lucky to be in such close proximity to such a light because it's really.

[598] Well, what's really funny is, yeah, you're like really the middle ground between the two of us.

[599] She's exactly the 50 % mark because she's very small.

[600] like me, but she's very powerful.

[601] She's very alpha.

[602] Yes.

[603] She's so powerful and smart like you.

[604] She would be fighting the incoming champs.

[605] But anyways, I can only imagine and I pray, I know, A, I know you do and B, I hope you do, as you gossip about me when you guys are together sometimes.

[606] Of course.

[607] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[608] But when is it going to be my turn to say what I like about Monica?

[609] It's coming, it's coming.

[610] But I just wanted to point out that Monica and I will also gossip about you in the, in the, I hope you do.

[611] The cycle of it is so fucking funny because generally it's like we both observed something you did that we wouldn't do it that way, right?

[612] So it's whatever it is.

[613] You know, Kristen had to go to the grocery store, but she thought she should go to Glendale first then come back to the, you know, whatever.

[614] Maybe something illogical or whatever.

[615] And we start there.

[616] And then one of us is always in the right headspace to them point out like, yeah, but you know, she's a lot better than us at Blank.

[617] We always, we can't even really gossip about you successfully.

[618] Well, that's so exciting.

[619] I'm going to turn this TV show up.

[620] Yeah.

[621] It's getting good.

[622] One of us is always like in a mood where we'll go, we'll both recognize like, yeah, and we should probably aspire to be that way.

[623] Yeah.

[624] All right.

[625] So what do you want to say about Monica?

[626] You seem like, you felt left out.

[627] Well, no, I wasn't feeling left out.

[628] I just wanted to know when my turn was.

[629] Well, let's go context.

[630] So context is, and I think we've talked about just briefly on here before.

[631] I have so much to say by it.

[632] But Monica starts just babysitting occasionally for Lincoln and then.

[633] Well, no, that's more specific than that.

[634] Monica was a part of our friendship group of like you know your friendship group when it gets to like 15 or 20 and there's five or seven in that group that you're not like best friends with you don't have lunch with every day there are sort of slightly more peripheral acquaintance.

[635] You're only seeing them at that mutual friend's house.

[636] Yeah, you're only seeing them at game nights but you still know them and we were needing a sitter for Lincoln and I was pregnant and we knew we might have to have someone else in the inner circle when Delta came and you specifically said to me, I have a very, very positive feeling about Monica.

[637] And I was like, oh, yeah, well, Monica's great.

[638] And you said, I'm, I just gravitate towards Monica.

[639] And you said all these positive things without even knowing her.

[640] Because I didn't really, we didn't, I didn't know like the inner workings of Monica.

[641] And then I reached out to you and you were like, yeah, I am.

[642] I did House of Lies.

[643] That's, oh, yeah.

[644] Well, that was before.

[645] That was even before, right?

[646] That was before.

[647] But I said on that.

[648] I said, you know, I babysit.

[649] sometimes if you ever need a babysitter.

[650] Okay, good.

[651] That helps my memory because I was trying to figure out when I thought it was appropriate to go from knowing you were like a comedy actress to asking you to babysit.

[652] Because sometimes that feels like...

[653] It could be triggering.

[654] Yeah, but so Monica got cast as my...

[655] As a person in the office, like my assistant or something, my secretary on House of Lies, and she did an episode and it was exciting because we were there together.

[656] And then she mentioned I also babysit.

[657] Simultaneously, you said, I've got a really good feeling about Monica.

[658] we invited her into the inner circle she babysat for about three months before she started running the show I think she noticed I was underwater and said I can help you with some of this scheduling and writing and all of this stuff and I at that moment realized her skill set was like annoyingly endless um because she could be a caregiver that I needed when I was working too much and reminding me to have water or something something silly like that and also scheduling incredibly difficult events like a really good executive assistant was, but then also producing projects I wanted to be a part of like getting them off the ground.

[659] I mean, she's the reason this podcast exists because she did the producerial work and does it all the time and then realizing she has a skill set as a writer because she studied at UCB and then going, oh my God, if I have to be on something, when I was on the SAG Awards, Monica Padman wrote the SAG Awards.

[660] Well, let's just say that for the eight years prior to Monica being around, I did a lot of writing with you.

[661] And whatever project you were doing, I read and I gave my two cents.

[662] And if you were about to start a movie, I made a list of joke ideas you should pitch or what I thought was wrong with the story, blah, blah, blah.

[663] So I had that role.

[664] And I was quite busy too.

[665] And I sometimes...

[666] Hated that role.

[667] Well, I didn't hate it.

[668] You can be honest.

[669] I know you hated it.

[670] I could feel it.

[671] No, here's what it is.

[672] There's two things.

[673] I just was listening to Jonathan Haight talk about the five pillars of our morality we're born with.

[674] And one of them, number four, is our sense of justice.

[675] Maybe it's number three.

[676] It doesn't matter.

[677] But I have an overly inflated sense of justice.

[678] So that's my daughter, Monica.

[679] Yeah.

[680] So I would be in these situations where, like, you're hired to do all this stuff.

[681] And then basically, they're just getting me as a writer for free.

[682] That was my sense of justice that was triggered.

[683] like, well, twofold, I'll be even more revealing about my gross side.

[684] Not only are these people just getting a good writer for free, you're then the one shining from my words.

[685] So you're going to go out on stage and make a great joke or you're going to go on Kimmel and say some line that I wrote.

[686] And then you'll be perpetuated and propelled forward.

[687] And I don't even knows I'm doing that.

[688] And I'm not going anywhere.

[689] So in the moments that I feel stalled out and I'm watching my work propel you, I have to do some mental I can't just let the feeling that arises in there I've got to do some deconstructing of that because that could be cancerous to me which I totally understand and I don't I feel confident that I wasn't taking advantage of you I mean first of all you're totally entitled Let me just start by saying you're entitled to that you help me in 90 other ways that are very commensurate work whites I'm just going on the ego trip Of course and I'm saying that I'm, it never, it never made me angry when you had those feelings because I'm so confident I'm not taking advantage of you.

[690] It doesn't trigger me. But what I would say is, do you not want to do this?

[691] Because it does seem like you don't want to do this.

[692] And if you don't, that's okay.

[693] But from my point of view, I'm going, I have had a career that started 15 or 20 years ago where I've done a lot of jobs that got me to this job.

[694] So I may not be able to punch up this joke, but I did a lot of other work.

[695] I also can deliver things in a very shiny way and I know how to do that and I've honed that and that's why I get hired for a lot of things and a lot of people cannot do that.

[696] So I do have a skill set but I'm very open about my skill set definitely not being like joke punch ups which you two are so good at.

[697] So from my point of view I'm going I have this and the ability to make more for our family more jobs, more money, more opportunities, whatever.

[698] Let's all be a team.

[699] but I can definitely acknowledge why that feels shitty because you're contributing to something that you're not getting credit for.

[700] I just feel like there's a lot of things that are contributing to it.

[701] It's not just like I'm taking your essay paper and putting my name on it.

[702] Like I did actually get the job.

[703] I'm just saying that, hey, when I do this job, it'd be great if I did it to the best, of the best of the best of anyone's ability, would you help?

[704] And let me just add a little clarification.

[705] So in my mind, it can be two things.

[706] Both can be working simultaneously.

[707] One, I can not want to do it.

[708] Mm -hmm.

[709] I can never want to do it.

[710] And then I can also, would never choose if I could make you look better to not do it.

[711] Mm -hmm.

[712] I can have both those things happening at the same time.

[713] I would never not do it.

[714] Like, I don't know.

[715] Who was the old timer you just celebrated the other day?

[716] Oh, Dick Van Dyke.

[717] Dick Van Dyke.

[718] And you had a speech.

[719] And then it occurred to me that there was a cool metaphor to be made about when he was born and what was made the year he was born.

[720] And basically like the Chrysler building was built the year he was born.

[721] And I saw this neat metaphor for when he was born and what think of these things we regard as institutions that this man was here before those things.

[722] I don't know.

[723] I felt compelled to sit down and write that thing because I thought it would be a good speech in that.

[724] Which you did and it was incredible and I was so grateful for it.

[725] And there, it was so well written.

[726] You handed it to me like five minutes before.

[727] Your emails, you were driving there and I was still working.

[728] Uh -huh.

[729] And then it was, you know, 10 sentences that I memorized in five minutes and went out on stage and spoke.

[730] And it was brilliant.

[731] And as we've gotten more, more that I've accepted that there isn't a division between you and I. Like I think definitely having kids helps with that, which is.

[732] is like, this is this unified thing, this household we have.

[733] And Monica's involved in this unified day.

[734] Yeah, by the way, I do want to acknowledge we've like, I was in the middle of my compliments of Monica.

[735] We got very side -tracked.

[736] Oh, we're going to come back.

[737] I'm good at circling back.

[738] Okay, okay, I can juggle a few balls.

[739] Because she's my mom.

[740] Okay, so, and my wife.

[741] As more and more of it has broken down, when you try to figure out like what part of either of us are in our shared success, it's almost impossible to figure out.

[742] Like, there've been these really specific moments in your professional life that are spikes, the sloth video being one of them.

[743] Like, I think that was a moment where a lot of people got to see real Kristen who cries over silly things like this and couldn't be cuter and it was infectious.

[744] And so that's your thing.

[745] But then at the same time, I had gotten you the sloth.

[746] So without me, there's no video of you doing that.

[747] And then things that I've had, they don't exist without you.

[748] Can you think of an example of one of those?

[749] Yes, I can.

[750] Well, hold on.

[751] I'm really on the spot.

[752] I was thinking.

[753] I know because I wanted to challenge you.

[754] You don't have to.

[755] It's okay.

[756] I was just being aggravated.

[757] That's that people like me over.

[758] It's more a failure of.

[759] Like even hit and run.

[760] Oh, yeah.

[761] Hit and run.

[762] You wrote for me. So, yeah.

[763] And it was a brilliant, brilliant.

[764] movie.

[765] I can't do that without you.

[766] I'm not going to, they're not going to hire me to represent Samsung.

[767] They will hire me attached to you and then I can write those things and then I can, then the thing I do well can shine through, but I don't get to do that without you.

[768] So it's, what I'm saying is more and more over the 11 years.

[769] I have stopped thinking about like your money, my money, your career, my career.

[770] To me, it's, It's gotten very clear that it's just all a big mesh now.

[771] Yeah.

[772] For better or worse.

[773] So anyways.

[774] For better.

[775] Yes, much for better.

[776] I don't even know why I said for worse.

[777] But I used to do a lot of that writing.

[778] And as you got busier and busier and busier, you've definitely gotten busier and busier and busier since we met 11 years ago.

[779] The philanthropy work you done is probably times 10 now.

[780] You have three different TV shows.

[781] You produce a lot of stuff.

[782] That just went up, up.

[783] I was at max capacity.

[784] Q Manika Padman, we're back.

[785] So Monica, when she came into our life, she is unassuming and that it's a giant fucking trick because of her size to look at her and go, oh, she takes up this much space in the room.

[786] But what you don't notice about her is that she is looking at every crevice and every hole and every alcove in the room and seeing how she could better it.

[787] And she does it without you even knowing.

[788] So she said, oh, by the way, I babysit.

[789] And I thought, oh, cool.

[790] She might have some time.

[791] I trust her.

[792] Let's have her babysit.

[793] And then she said, and this was, they were all like very not big suggestions.

[794] Inocuous.

[795] Inocuous.

[796] Yeah, like it wasn't.

[797] Hey, I should cut your hair for the Emmys.

[798] Exactly.

[799] Like it was like, if you need me to schedule anything for you, let me know.

[800] And then I was like, God, yeah, I do because I can't actually.

[801] get my lines memorized while having to make this schedule.

[802] So I said, yeah, if you could schedule this next week while I remember it.

[803] Anyway, the point is everything that she does is so at 110%.

[804] But so she's so not a person that walks around showing you she has 110%.

[805] It's like this wonderful gift where, because you have like no bravado.

[806] people that do things as good as you and as efficiently and as quality as you tend to have a lot of bravado they wave their dick around yeah vibrato bravado bravado yeah bravado vibrato is when you go oh yeah exactly but oh i knew this was all a set up bravado we walked right rob gave me a beat no but it it's incredible because um it sneaks up on you And then you realize, at least what I realized is like, oh, my fucking God, how did I do any of this without Monica?

[807] And it's not, it's not just.

[808] Well, just really quick, you didn't.

[809] The work you've done since Monica is exponentially more.

[810] But it's, I'm not even just talking about work.

[811] I'm talking about going through life.

[812] Like, I don't know how the fuck I dealt with you solo before I had a sister wife.

[813] because having a sister wife, it's like...

[814] I'm a lot.

[815] Yeah, and I'm a lot too.

[816] So how did we make our marriage?

[817] Our marriage is so much safer and happier with a sister wife.

[818] I also mean from a friendship perspective, like I don't know that I spend so much time working and on business stuff.

[819] And that sounds so lame and like my therapist would probably be like, what do you want your life to be?

[820] But I do.

[821] But to have someone that intricately weaves emotionally as a friend in and out of business to pleasure, I didn't realize what a hole I had had.

[822] I didn't realize how empty I was, but now that it's Monica and we can like go to a work job together where she's like, you know, writing and producing mom spaining or the SAG Awards or any of these other projects and then also come home and like talk shit about it or watch Castle Rock or watch whatever.

[823] It's just I didn't realize how much more fulfilled I was until you came into my life.

[824] Can I offer a theory?

[825] Yeah.

[826] Can I just say a couple more things I like about her?

[827] First of all, she has a hair of a mermaid.

[828] Oh, thank you.

[829] Okay?

[830] Second of all, she has really good taste.

[831] Enclothes.

[832] Inclothes.

[833] Internal decor.

[834] Oh, yeah.

[835] Her apartment, I'm so jealous because it's...

[836] It looks better than our house.

[837] It really does.

[838] She has a hundredth of budget, yeah.

[839] And also, she is so steadfast.

[840] Yeah.

[841] But again, without...

[842] She doesn't scream.

[843] She's so steadfast and strong and qualified.

[844] It's an incredibly comfortable thing to be around and it makes me feel so safe.

[845] And I always call her my external hard drive.

[846] And this is to say nothing about how like fun and funny you are and how I just want to hang out with you on a Saturday anyway.

[847] Well, all your social time has taken up with Monica as well.

[848] Oh, 100%.

[849] Yeah.

[850] But even if I have social time, it's Monica and I doing something together with another friend.

[851] It's the best.

[852] Stay tuned for more armchair expert, if you dare.

[853] But what I was going to say is by having a very good friend that you're working with, it makes all those little things that exist in a vacuum.

[854] Like going to host the SAG Awards, that's going to take up seven days of your life.

[855] And that is just a vacuum.

[856] The only purpose of it is work, if not shared with a person that you share your real life with.

[857] So it makes the process a process and not just.

[858] results oriented.

[859] It's something you guys are sharing together.

[860] And as you say, you'll go home and you'll talk shit about this person or that.

[861] And now it was something that you did for your life, your friendship.

[862] Right.

[863] Yeah.

[864] That's true.

[865] Yeah.

[866] She's also extremely nurturing.

[867] Oh, this is what I was going to say about her.

[868] My number one favorite thing and probably why I said from the get go, let's get her.

[869] The thing that I find least attractive in people is people who have a victim identity.

[870] Oh, yeah.

[871] And she'll never, she doesn't get off on letting you know how put out she is by something.

[872] It's just, just happens and it was probably difficult as fuck but she doesn't seem to get off on like how put out she is which is awesome we're all fucking put out she also one of the best things she's ever said to me is I think I said I was feeling extra sensitive and I said like I think when I asked you about that like hey could you do this or because we ask each other a lot we're business partners like can you do something or vice versa and I said can you do something and she responded on Marco Polo with like, yeah.

[873] And then I said, you know, I feel like sometimes you're annoyed with me and like I'm, you know, you just feel like put out.

[874] And she goes, yeah, sometimes I do.

[875] And when you ask me about things, if I'm annoyed, it might just come across like I'm annoyed.

[876] But I'll get over it.

[877] It might just be annoyed.

[878] And that's okay.

[879] It's okay if I'm annoyed.

[880] No excuse for it.

[881] And I couldn't get into like the, we both have feelings moment that I wanted because she goes, yeah, well, I was probably annoyed.

[882] And it stopped me in my tracks.

[883] She just owned that she was annoyed.

[884] Oh, my God, yeah.

[885] Yeah, that's part of being alive.

[886] Yeah.

[887] And she also didn't apologize for it because she knows you don't have to apologize if you get annoyed.

[888] Right.

[889] Well, it's come with a lot of highs, the relationship, because it is a very intimate one, y 'all's.

[890] But then it's also been tricky at times to work through.

[891] Okay, you started as acquaintances.

[892] then you became best friends.

[893] Then you guys are in a very intimate relationship where your guys' emotions are co -mingling and linked to one another's.

[894] And then yet you have a professional relationship where there is a dynamic that's unavoidable, which one person is the boss and one person is not the boss.

[895] And that's dicey, right?

[896] But I do my best.

[897] I'm looking at Monica.

[898] Oh, is that dice?

[899] No, you can say that though.

[900] You do your best and you do a fantastic job of not making it feel like you are.

[901] the boss and you are the boss but you never use that tool ever well I don't find it in it's not a tool in my toolbox because there's a very large part of me that that knows that I'm not the real boss but when I introduce you I introduce you as my partner yeah I introduce her sometimes as my writing partner which gives me a real ego boost but then within five seconds I've blurted out and what and what I mean by that is that Monica writes and I know you You never let it fully lift.

[902] I always want to be like, this is my writing partner.

[903] It's what I mean is like she writes and I just say the words.

[904] Well, this is an interesting story.

[905] Well, I guess years ago and I sort of first started, must have been when I first started doing real stuff for you.

[906] You, Dax, went on a talk show, a pot.

[907] You went on a radio show or something.

[908] And you told a story and it involved me like very just quickly because you were talking to me. You said I was talking to our babysitter and blah, blah, blah, blah.

[909] And you told a story.

[910] Yeah.

[911] I think probably trying to get our babysitter to do drugs.

[912] I think that's what it was.

[913] Yeah.

[914] Still a thing.

[915] Was a thing back then?

[916] Right from the get -go.

[917] And you said that.

[918] And then I heard it.

[919] I listened and I heard it.

[920] And I told you that it bothered me. Yeah.

[921] That you referred to me as the babysitter.

[922] but the only reason it bothered me is because you, Kristen, never referred to me as part of the...

[923] Staff.

[924] Yeah.

[925] You always said, our friend Monica, my friend Monica, my external hard drive, my this.

[926] And you never even, you, even when I'm doing assistant stuff for you, you so rarely say the word assistant every now and then you have to, so it happens.

[927] But it is, it's not.

[928] your go -to ever so when when you did it it rang so much louder if you had been doing it like it wouldn't have even thought twice about it but it felt like I'm not I'm not I'm not a babysitter and I was it was totally a babysitter but well hold on what's really great because you and I hashed it out which is so great that you brought it up to me because it could have just been something that was between us for the rest of our lives fucking steadfast that's what I mean and what we figured out, and which is so good to remember, is that, A, I was sorry that I, that I said something that it made you feel that way.

[929] Yeah.

[930] But then I owned my own, what was really going on with me had nothing to do with you.

[931] I, what entered my head was nanny.

[932] Yeah.

[933] And then my own personal ego was I don't want people to think we have nannies.

[934] Like we're rich people who have nannies.

[935] And it was preservation of my own image that made me choose babysitter, because That sounds like something you just have occasional.

[936] That everyone has.

[937] Yes.

[938] All Americans have babysitters.

[939] Rich people have nannies.

[940] And it was all about me. It really had, it was not an assessment of you.

[941] It was my own ego.

[942] And I just thought, boy, it would be great if I could remember that when someone says something that hurts my feelings, they might just be preserving themselves.

[943] And it's really not a comment on me. And I could have just said, I'm trying to get my friend to do mushrooms.

[944] But I did think it's funnier that I'm trying to.

[945] trying to get the babysitter to do much.

[946] But I also, from having been in the position of being conscious of Monica's feelings and how to identify her and also been in the position of being an actor representing themselves on a public platform, you are allowing the audience to see things through your lens.

[947] And it is a little bit more specific to say how Monica relates to you instead of just a friend.

[948] But can I also say one thing because this podcast is all about staying woke?

[949] We don't in the mom community.

[950] under any circumstance, think nannies are bad.

[951] We have decided not to shame any mom.

[952] We don't shame working moms about having nannies, and we don't shame non -working moms about having nannies.

[953] And yes, nannies require a little bit more of a budget, but whether or not you have a babysitter or a nanny, we don't separate them anymore.

[954] And as the, like, goodness community of moms and in an attempt to stay woke, we don't think nanny is a bad word, and we never fault anyone for saying they need help with their children.

[955] I have two immediate reactions.

[956] One is the cynic in me goes, that sounds like something rich people decided, who have nannies and have their own shame about having nannies.

[957] So they decided to de -shame nannies because they have them.

[958] No, it's about moms, a community of moms.

[959] Well, okay.

[960] And then the second part of me is the anthropologist that knows that we have the entire time we've lived on planet earth.

[961] We've had nannies.

[962] Women get in estrus at the same time.

[963] That's why you sink up your cycles so that everyone can have the babies at the same time.

[964] So there can be this group of women all helping.

[965] raised the kids.

[966] So nannies are from the get.

[967] Yeah.

[968] They're from the jump.

[969] You know what it is?

[970] It's whether you send your kid to daycare.

[971] You send your kid to preschool.

[972] You have a babysitter.

[973] You have grandma come or you have a nanny.

[974] That's a great point.

[975] Whether or not just leaving them in the box.

[976] Whether or not you work or you do not work, there is not one acceptable way to raise your children.

[977] It takes a village.

[978] So whether or not you have a person that comes over because, A, you can have that luxury.

[979] Maybe your kid has special needs that he can't have the luxury of going to a daycare with other children and you have to have a nanny come over, that is an acceptable form of raising your children, going to a preschool or a daycare because it's like the cost might be cut a little bit.

[980] And even if they're there long hours, that is an acceptable form of the village that you need to raise your children.

[981] We do not in the mom and mom -splaining community, uh, fault anyone for having help with their children, whether it's babysitter nanny or daycare.

[982] What if you have a person that's in the basement in a good size cage?

[983] You know, like eight feet by 12 feet.

[984] And you let them out in the morning to help with the children and then at the end of the night you push them back and that's unacceptable that's like that's some castle rock shit okay all right good I'm glad we clarified um yeah wait going oh yeah oh it still would have bothered me if you had said nanny that was also my own shit too I was I didn't want to be considered any of those things because I probably I have a hang up and I probably felt like I'm not just someone's I'm not just a babysitter I'm not just a nanny I'm I'm I'm important here.

[985] Right.

[986] Well, you actually, well, two things.

[987] Number one, the nannies and the babysitters are important.

[988] The most important.

[989] They're actually.

[990] Carly who would, our sister, who would be considered if anyone is like a nanny, is also does a variety of other things and is definitely the most important part of the family.

[991] But you were contributing to other areas.

[992] We joke about what would fall apart.

[993] And in my estimation, what really falls apart is Carly doesn't show up.

[994] Because then everyone has to stop doing what they're doing on the writing, acting, from.

[995] Yeah, right, totally.

[996] But also, I guess in that regard, if you were talking about Carly, you would say, I was talking to my sister and blah, blah, blah, blah, like that is the first rung.

[997] Sure, that, well, yes, that's the most descriptive thing for me and her is that she's my sister.

[998] It's the first relationship.

[999] Yes.

[1000] So for me, I did not want the first relationship element to be babysitter, nanny, one of the job things.

[1001] And ironically, he didn't leave.

[1002] with this, but ironically, the first relationship was he was somehow felt in his bones that he was attracted to you as a person.

[1003] Because you didn't just say, Monica looks like she could, you know, not let the house burn down.

[1004] You said Monica is really interesting.

[1005] I like her personality a lot.

[1006] I would because I know this about Dax and you know this about Dax.

[1007] The first five years I dated him, he didn't want any of my friends to come over.

[1008] And I was like, what?

[1009] My friends can't come over?

[1010] I didn't want anybody in my house.

[1011] You didn't know.

[1012] That wasn't in your inner circle.

[1013] So for me, to have seen him gravitate towards someone who wasn't in his inner circle was so shocking.

[1014] And he said, because I just in my bones feel, I have a really good feeling about Monica.

[1015] In my groin.

[1016] Right.

[1017] Largely in my groin.

[1018] Right.

[1019] I have a really good feeling.

[1020] She's probably wearing a tight shirt.

[1021] I have a growing feeling in my groin about my groin.

[1022] But, and she does have really nice boobs, which is why we can talk about it.

[1023] It's just a, well, when it becomes a fact, it's like, well, you've seen them.

[1024] They're the most, fucking unicorn.

[1025] Can I just tell you for anybody who's listening and brings those signs to the live shows that they love Monica, you can't, I'm probably going to get, do you think, listen, am I, do you think I'm, Me -to and you right now?

[1026] No, no, no. I have permission to talk about the shape of your boobs.

[1027] You do.

[1028] Okay, good.

[1029] I want to make sure.

[1030] The density in the way.

[1031] Whatever you think is happening under that, under there.

[1032] Oh, geez.

[1033] It's 10 times as good as you think it is.

[1034] Because I saw Monica take her bra off once and her boobs went up.

[1035] Oh, my goodness.

[1036] I couldn't believe what I was seeing.

[1037] The shape is perfect.

[1038] She's strapping them down is what you're saying.

[1039] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[1040] Yeah, because otherwise they would.

[1041] hit her in the face.

[1042] Well, they wander.

[1043] They go up and they go out.

[1044] They want, they're curious.

[1045] Yeah, they've got a mind of their own.

[1046] And it's, they're incredible to shape all the circles layered upon circles.

[1047] They're all perfect shit.

[1048] They're just beautiful.

[1049] Anyway, that's why we can joke about Monica because it's just a fact.

[1050] It's like joking about our kids are short.

[1051] They're short.

[1052] Yeah, how good and bad I am.

[1053] Yeah, exactly.

[1054] Totally joke about it.

[1055] Exactly.

[1056] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[1057] But I was always kind of taken aback because I've never heard him say that about.

[1058] at anyone.

[1059] He had, which I'm usually the emotional being that has a good feeling about someone, but he does have very good character assessment right off the bat.

[1060] And he said, I have a really good feeling about Monica.

[1061] So what's ironic is that he didn't just say she looks like a trustworthy babysitter.

[1062] He said in so many words, she looks like she's an intellectual that we can hang with and be stimulated by.

[1063] She looks like someone that we can trust.

[1064] She looks like someone that we want to have around.

[1065] So it is weird that you put her in the position of babysitter, because that's Not even actually how it started.

[1066] But because we do like to get real here, very tricky thing to navigate as someone does become more and more vital to everything.

[1067] Now she is the co -host of this podcast and the producer and the editor.

[1068] And the editor.

[1069] That is going to, as she takes that on, she's going to have to leave something else behind.

[1070] She's only one human being.

[1071] And the evolution when things are so emotional is not this similar to the evolution that happens in a marriage or any relationship or best friends.

[1072] One goes away to college.

[1073] One stays at home to party.

[1074] All these things.

[1075] And to think that it'll all just work out on its own.

[1076] Yeah, not really.

[1077] Well, it just happened.

[1078] Yeah.

[1079] It just happened last month because I was definitely feeling like I was second tier to this podcast.

[1080] And part of me went, yeah, but you kind of are because that is a very professional gig that is taking off like a 747.

[1081] Like you guys, do you guys acknowledge that you started this podcast this year and how many people are listening to it?

[1082] And I was feeling like it wasn't like you were not doing things for me. It wasn't like things were falling through the cracks.

[1083] Let me be very clear because that's, again, not how Monica works.

[1084] But I was.

[1085] The business stuff was getting taken.

[1086] care, but maybe the personal stuff was starting to suffer.

[1087] I don't even know that, maybe a little bit, but it was the very, very small stuff.

[1088] And it was, I'm an emotional being that acknowledges when someone else is at high capacity or at at max capacity.

[1089] And I was sensing that I couldn't ask you for as much.

[1090] And I don't like to overextend.

[1091] So I knew, oh, don't ask her right now.

[1092] She's in the middle of editing that episode.

[1093] And I know she has a deadline because if this doesn't happen today, then that recording doesn't happen tomorrow.

[1094] Like I'm, I'm in on most of it.

[1095] So it was partially that I felt like I couldn't have as much of her as I wanted.

[1096] And by the way, some of that was also social.

[1097] I couldn't have as much social time with you as I wanted.

[1098] Um, because I depend on you to like download funny things during the day or like talk about things that happen.

[1099] And then there was also an aspect of, I know a lot of what goes on here and try to, you know, help wherever I can.

[1100] But there's also a lot that I don't know.

[1101] And I, because I was working this summer and you, you guys were like hitting a peak.

[1102] You were like at your black diamond skiing hill this summer of this podcast.

[1103] I was coming home and you guys were having like a thousand inside jokes I didn't know about.

[1104] You guys were talking about like incredibly interesting experts you had on that were some of my favorites too, but I didn't know what you were referencing.

[1105] And I would come home like tired after work and feel excluded and feel left out even though that was not at all your intention.

[1106] and I knew it wasn't your intention but I was definitely feeling left out and figuring out how not to play a victim but how to say to you guys I'm feeling really sensitive like I'm left out.

[1107] Well, and what happened quite physically is that for two years, you guys had business together.

[1108] For two years, Monica and I had no business together.

[1109] She's never done anything in my business world.

[1110] And now, yes, now we had the same thing that you guys had where you guys would be on a shoot for six, days and you'd have all these jokes about some weird AD who did something weird and I had no idea what was going on and that kind of flipped and I wasn't prepared for like my empty nest for Monica like I wasn't yeah she had been such a huge huge part of my being for four or five years and And then I felt her growing in this direction of actually getting the things that not only did she want, but I knew she was qualified for.

[1111] Like not being an executive assistant or being an assistant or just someone's writer, but writing for herself or producing this podcast or, you know, producing these live shows.

[1112] And I guess I just wasn't ready.

[1113] It was like my little girl went to college and my mom got a job all at the same time.

[1114] And your wife was having an effect.

[1115] wife was having an affair.

[1116] Literally it was.

[1117] My baby went to college.

[1118] My mom got a job and my wife was having an affair.

[1119] And it was just a lot for me. Yeah.

[1120] It was a lot for me. So last month I definitely had like a, I had to have a sit down with both of you about my feelings about it and saying I want your podcast to be so good.

[1121] And I want you guys to have this huge business.

[1122] But I just, I feel left out.

[1123] And I also feel like I'm now going to have to hire someone new because I or work with someone new in addition.

[1124] because I know you can't handle as much and I know I need a lot.

[1125] You still need your needs met.

[1126] I still need, yeah.

[1127] Or even the needs of the business met.

[1128] Yeah.

[1129] But do you think it's gotten better since we talked?

[1130] Yes, of course.

[1131] Especially when you said that funny thing about, yeah, sometimes I'm going to be annoyed.

[1132] And I was like, there she is.

[1133] Well, it's just, that's what is certainly back to the beginning of just resetting everyone's expectations.

[1134] Yeah.

[1135] of what is going to happen.

[1136] And even in that, just emotionally, like, yeah, I'm really busy.

[1137] So I might not be super smiley when you asked me to do something.

[1138] And that's, you know, I could try to be better.

[1139] I say all the time to Dax.

[1140] Yeah.

[1141] I can't be super happy when I come home from a 16 hour day.

[1142] You're just going to have to let me lay on the pillow and cuddle me while I fall asleep.

[1143] And you were saying that to me and I was like, I was under.

[1144] even though I now was also understanding what Dax deals with with me when I'm overworked.

[1145] Yeah, it's hard.

[1146] I mean, when we have that conversation, we had a dialogue about it, but it took a day.

[1147] You had a come to Jesus meeting.

[1148] Yeah, but it took a day because the first, because I brought it, I brought up that I felt that I was at capacity and that we needed to make some changes.

[1149] And I had this expectation of how that conversation was going to go based on knowing you so well and then it did not go that way it went in a in a perfectly human way but I I was I was just expecting something different you could tell that my feelings were hurt and I needed to process and it didn't we had already talked about the fact that we were both too busy and like maybe within this business of the bell shepherds we needed to hire someone new yeah and you were probably expecting me to go oh so we just need to hire someone new to get your needs met.

[1150] And I think it's funny because at that moment, I was, you were expecting me to be the mom and I wasn't.

[1151] I was being the daughter.

[1152] Right.

[1153] Yeah, we have all these layers.

[1154] It's so layered.

[1155] Yeah.

[1156] So then it did not go great, in my opinion.

[1157] And then that was a terrible 24 hours.

[1158] That was a rough day.

[1159] It was a really rough day for me. You were very sad.

[1160] Yeah, I was.

[1161] Because for, again, all the layers.

[1162] One, my best friend is mad at me. also I'm I guess I'm losing my job no I wasn't mad I just needed to process because I wasn't expecting such a I guess I guess I know I was I was expecting such a blunt request I wasn't wanting to hear it because I was afraid of the change and there was an emotional thing happening with the feeling left out there was so much happening I think you were probably expecting and ask for permission and not a boundary and that's hard to admit but I think maybe that was part of it.

[1163] Because it wasn't phrased as like, hey, I'd like this.

[1164] It was phrased as, hey, this is going to happen.

[1165] Yeah, but I don't think in my revisionist history, because of the way my feelings were hurt, I want to pretend like Monica phrased it really boldly.

[1166] And I don't know if I'm being truly honest that she did.

[1167] I think she phrased it very responsible.

[1168] respectfully like someone who was my partner, which she is.

[1169] She didn't phrase it like an assistant because she has no reason to.

[1170] And I don't know that I would have reacted for permission.

[1171] Any better?

[1172] Any better.

[1173] Because either way, it's I get less, Monica.

[1174] I guess I'm going to wrap all this up to say that one of, we've listed several amazing qualities about Monica.

[1175] But one of them is that she knows her value.

[1176] People should know their value.

[1177] She will bring shit up to us.

[1178] She will say, I want this, I want that.

[1179] And sometimes it's met favorably.

[1180] And sometimes there's pushback.

[1181] And it's funny.

[1182] It weirdly is a great quality.

[1183] If people have fear of stating their needs and being honest, it's so worth getting through the difficult hurdle of it.

[1184] Well, Brunay Brown says it's eight seconds of discomfort when you ask for something that you know you deserve or you give hard news.

[1185] And that's the thing about Monica.

[1186] I don't think that any time she's asked for something or stated in need, she's not known entirely, logically and intellectually that she deserves it.

[1187] Yeah.

[1188] Her side of the street's pretty clean.

[1189] But she's human too.

[1190] We'll get into her foible soon.

[1191] But either way, this, I'm glad we talked about all this because it does seem like we do get along so well that I'm glad people know that there's still work that happens in these relationships.

[1192] Like, no, that's what I love about what your podcast preaches, that people that are listening know that, like Monica and I have shit too but we do work it out but you're not you're not immune to those things just because you're you try you try and you work through it you know and all of these relationships have baggage both people are wonderful and both have great intentions there is going to be conflict there's going to be growth there's going to be friction and that that is a fact and we can't avoid it so we have to have tools to deal with it as it arises yeah and you have to stay vulnerable last thing I want to talk about is because it is is Good Place Week.

[1193] Oh, yeah.

[1194] It's Good Place Week.

[1195] I get to see, because I've seen you now have dozens of jobs.

[1196] And you generally like, you're a good egg on set.

[1197] You get along with people.

[1198] You have fun in most of your work environments that I've seen.

[1199] But I would say this in particular has given you, I would say that you're on a high of all highs from this great show you're on.

[1200] Well, I love my dad, Mike Scher.

[1201] Yeah.

[1202] He's the best there ever was.

[1203] the kids on the show are amazing I say kids just as like the young group of Jamila and Manny and Will and Darcy they're so, so wonderful and Mark Evan Jackson who also has a podcast about The Good Place if you love podcasts Mark Evan Jackson has one that does exclusively good place topics and interviews are writers and actors but and then Ted who has truly become one of my best friends it's just it's such a lovely place to work I like working on a show that talks about what it means to be human and how we're all supposed to share this earth and how we're all supposed to get along.

[1204] I feel like the show is important yet, like what Ted says, it's wrapped in a giant fart joke, so it's incredibly digestible.

[1205] You know, it's like I...

[1206] It's an ethics lesson wrapped in a fart joke.

[1207] And it's so fun to do that work.

[1208] And I also, I love the character because it's like the opposite of me. I'm always struggling to figure out what someone thinks, and where their emotional temperature is and Eleanor is the polar opposite and she, you know, she's just so rude to people sometimes because she's safe to say you're playing me. No, no, no, no, no, no, no. She's kind in her heart too.

[1209] Yeah, she is.

[1210] She doesn't want the worst for people but she never got the training of how to work, play well with others.

[1211] Look, she's a survivor.

[1212] She grew up in a shitty scenario with shitty parents and she's learned how to survive and then under all that is a good person.

[1213] And what happens this season?

[1214] Obviously, it's always so probably hard to promote this show because it takes.

[1215] Well, this season, I will tell you this.

[1216] And this is going to air the week it comes out.

[1217] So I don't feel like this is too many spoilers.

[1218] But so our show has, if you haven't caught it yet, it does, I would recommend starting at the beginning.

[1219] They're quick episodes.

[1220] But the show does reinvent itself.

[1221] They're only six minutes.

[1222] At the end of each season, it reinvents itself.

[1223] There are major plot twists.

[1224] It's like, you know, lost, like where there's just so many different plot twists.

[1225] But I'll go a step further because you would never be able to say this.

[1226] But I'd even say get through that first season regardless because the first season sets up this incredible world.

[1227] Yeah.

[1228] And there I just think it gets exponentially better as you get into season two and then what I know of season three.

[1229] What I loved about this season is that season one and two took very, very, very, very big ideas and turned them on their head.

[1230] and the plot twists were very big.

[1231] Mike Scher, as our creator, committed to having every end of episode be like an end of season.

[1232] Be like a season end or a crazy cliffhanger.

[1233] This season, we thought, God, how are we going to then flip it again on its head?

[1234] There are only so many sides to the cube.

[1235] What he did was make the most important problems on the show incredibly tiny and emotional.

[1236] And they are so much, I dare I say more resonant and more important than the first two seasons, which you're dealing with pretty much heaven and hell, the first two seasons.

[1237] So I don't know how you get a problem that's bigger than that.

[1238] But what he did was make all the problems emotional this season.

[1239] And because of that, there are some moments that are, I mean, they just rip your insides out in a great way, in a funny way, and in an awful way.

[1240] And just it is.

[1241] You said there's been table reads where half the writers and everyone's just bawling hysterical.

[1242] Oh, well, well, for the, I'm not going to say which one, but there was one where, yeah, I had some information to deliver and I was crying.

[1243] And the cutest thing was Darcy, who had like nothing to do with that scene, fucking lost it.

[1244] Lost it.

[1245] And then she had a happy scene right after that and could not get through it.

[1246] So it started with Darcy being so moved by the scene I had done because it was, you know, it was gut wrenching.

[1247] And then she was crying so, hard during her Janet instructions.

[1248] And she's a robot.

[1249] And she's a robot.

[1250] The whole room was laughing.

[1251] And then she was laughing at the fact she was crying.

[1252] And then everyone else started crying.

[1253] It was a mess.

[1254] It was a mess of a table where the executives were crying.

[1255] Uh -huh.

[1256] It was great.

[1257] But it was, I think that proves how connected people are to the characters.

[1258] These aren't just people you're watching do things on screen.

[1259] You're not watching these physical beings move around.

[1260] You're picturing yourself as them.

[1261] you're feeling the emotions they have and I think that's what the goal with any show is.

[1262] Well, I have had the experience where I am just dying inside for you and Cheaty to kiss, which I think is a real testament to the show because I want you guys to be together so bad.

[1263] I want you guys to kiss and roll around and look in each other's eyes.

[1264] And really quick, it's only once in, I think, our experience where you've wanted me to kiss somebody really bad on screen.

[1265] Do you remember this?

[1266] Who?

[1267] There was a scene in parenthood where Minka Kelly and I were about to kiss and it took forever.

[1268] It was trilling shot the shit out of it.

[1269] It was like just this agonizing moment where you knew they were going to kiss and we're watching this.

[1270] And then you go, fucking kiss her already.

[1271] Like we were watching the show and you turned to me as if I had some sway over it.

[1272] It was like fucking kiss her.

[1273] But it was expertly done by trilling and you and Minka because I did.

[1274] I wanted you guys to share that.

[1275] Yeah, isn't it funny to, that's to me kind of when I know the thing we've done works is that I've separated that.

[1276] That is Eleanor and I want Eleanor to be really bad with Cheaty.

[1277] I think it's kind of a weird test for you and I am how good the thing is executed.

[1278] We also have an episode this season that, God, I'm figuring out how I can tease this, that is, I've never seen writers take a joke from.

[1279] season one and expand on it to give it an entire life that has again flipped on its head and put it's a storyline that jason mendoza has who is played by manny they took a tiny passing joke from season one they wrote an entire episode about it you do not see it coming and it is one of the fucking funniest things i have ever seen done on television it makes me so do you know what i'm talking about yeah i do It's so fucking funny.

[1280] Anyway, so just, you know, if you like the show, watch it because it will be worth it this season.

[1281] Yeah, if you like the show, don't stop watching it.

[1282] For sure.

[1283] No, no, no, no, no. Don't stop watching it.

[1284] That makes zero sense to stop watching something.

[1285] Well, listen, Love Bug.

[1286] I do also, you're leaving right now, but I do want to publicly acknowledge both Monica and I would probably like to that there is no armchair expert without you, without you launching this show with the interest people having you and then the work you've done.

[1287] and our Instagram account and making live stories and talking about it impressed.

[1288] You've given Monica and I a real dream and probably our favorite eight hours of every week.

[1289] So I love you and thank you for giving us this as you've given us so many things.

[1290] My little babies, stupid car I just got.

[1291] I love you, thank you.

[1292] I'd say something, but I'm having trouble.

[1293] I love you guys so much.

[1294] I love you.

[1295] Should we move to Utah?

[1296] I love you both And Rob, you're a necessary part too Rob's a piece of fucking shit He's not even borderline piece of He's sitting over there Be in handsome Wobby Wob That's what our kids call Have you talking about that That's what both of our girls call Rob Wobby Wob But his shirt was Mine says borderline piece of shit His says 100 % piece of shit All right I love you Go to your next thing And now my favorite part of the show The Fact Check with my soulmate Monica Padman Monica, it's fact check time.

[1297] And this is probably the most amount of facts you've had to check for yourself.

[1298] And there were almost none.

[1299] Oh.

[1300] So, look at that.

[1301] Yeah, look at that.

[1302] I don't know if I trust the fact checker checking the fact checkers checks.

[1303] Well, get over it.

[1304] How much facts could a wood check check if a wood check could check checks.

[1305] Uh, yeah, I did a, I did, I did it.

[1306] You did it.

[1307] You did a good job.

[1308] You stayed right out of the fact.

[1309] Although interesting, because you wanted more facts.

[1310] I did.

[1311] You should have just thrown some out there.

[1312] Wasn't a fact heavy episode.

[1313] It was an emotional heavy episode.

[1314] Yeah, it was girls' time.

[1315] You, don't worry.

[1316] You were, you were present.

[1317] Oh, I'm sure I was.

[1318] Yeah.

[1319] I'm sure I was too present.

[1320] You weren't.

[1321] That seems to be the trend.

[1322] On the rare occasion that I listen to this podcast, I almost throw up about 10 minutes in with my own voice.

[1323] I'm like, enough, enough.

[1324] The actual sound of the voice or what you're saying?

[1325] Just me. It's hard.

[1326] It's hard to be around yourself.

[1327] Yeah.

[1328] Yop.

[1329] All right.

[1330] Let's begin with mesophonia.

[1331] Oh, great.

[1332] Misophonia.

[1333] Yes.

[1334] Misophonia, also known as the Ryan Hanson disease.

[1335] He should get that disease named after him like Lou Gehrig's.

[1336] Exactly.

[1337] And like the Tommy John surgery.

[1338] Thank you.

[1339] We've referred to all of these on previous fact check.

[1340] Parkinson's disease.

[1341] Parkinson's disease.

[1342] After Bill Parkinson's.

[1343] No, we don't know who was the first name.

[1344] And what was the, on Mila's fact check, we talk about a law about children working.

[1345] And that's also named after a person.

[1346] Mm -hmm.

[1347] I'm blanking.

[1348] That's right.

[1349] But I think let this be the first signer and co -signer of the petition to have miso -hornea permanently called Ryan Hanson's disease.

[1350] Ryan Hanson's hornea.

[1351] Or Ryan Hanson's syndrome.

[1352] Sure.

[1353] That sounds.

[1354] RHS.

[1355] RHS.

[1356] Yeah.

[1357] Yeah.

[1358] Well, you know, that guy could never work at Sizzler because he has RHS.

[1359] It's a really bad case of RHS.

[1360] There's so much chewing at the workplace.

[1361] He would die.

[1362] So, yeah.

[1363] So misophonia is, oh, it also has, it already hasn't also known as.

[1364] We can add RHS into the mix.

[1365] But it's also known as Selective Sound Sensitivity Syndrome.

[1366] SSSS.

[1367] Just got diagnosed with.

[1368] S to the fourth power.

[1369] Selective sound sensitive.

[1370] Selective sound sensitivity syndrome.

[1371] You know, what's funny is even in saying it, you make all kinds of sounds with your mouth that misophonia people would not like.

[1372] Yeah, it'd be cool to come up with the name of it whereby they would not be able to tell anyone of the disease that they had.

[1373] That's maybe it.

[1374] Yeah, because if it was like the name of the disease was they could never tell anyone.

[1375] Although I bet they don't mind when it's their own obnoxious chewing.

[1376] You're right.

[1377] There's no way it bothers Ryan when he's so selfish.

[1378] eating some beef jerky, chewing a nice slice of trident.

[1379] But it starts with the trigger, often an oral sound.

[1380] The noise someone makes when they eat, breathe, that's unfortunate, eat, breathe, chew, yawn, or whistle.

[1381] Sometimes a small repetitive motion is the cause, a fidget, jostling, wiggling of the foot.

[1382] If you have a mild reaction, you might feel anxious, uncomfortable, the urge to flee, disgust.

[1383] Okay.

[1384] And what if you have a...

[1385] You have a more severe response.

[1386] Rage, anger, hatred, panic, fear, emotional distress, a desire to a desire to kill or stop whatever's making the noise.

[1387] Okay.

[1388] Yep.

[1389] Skin crawling and suicidal thoughts.

[1390] I wonder if this has ever been anyone's defense in a murder trial that they, like, had to kill their husband because he...

[1391] Yeah, RHS.

[1392] That did not make her misogonia.

[1393] Yeah.

[1394] If this had not been included as a genetic marker in our 23 of me, you think, I would say this condition was utter bullshit.

[1395] I know you would, yeah.

[1396] Yeah, I would go, no, you're just really intolerant.

[1397] You would dismiss it.

[1398] Plug your fucking ears.

[1399] Yeah.

[1400] Even though, which is interesting because, because.

[1401] Because I have a fake disease alcoholism.

[1402] No. But you do have a high intolerance for things that you attribute to it being biochemical.

[1403] Like?

[1404] like annoyances, like putting a chair through a door the wrong way.

[1405] Like you believe that you have a hypersensitivity to the plan to not being able to go along with a plan.

[1406] But yeah, but I don't think it's biochemical.

[1407] I think it's my - No, I think it's my nurture.

[1408] I've said I'm like, I think I'm alpha by biochemistry, like, supposed to battle.

[1409] Yeah.

[1410] You did say that in this very specific episode.

[1411] That's why it's not my brain because I did this today.

[1412] Right, but I said no, stepdad's.

[1413] I said, I have four stepdad's and that's why I don't like being a part of a bad plan.

[1414] I don't think I genetically am predisposed and not like plans.

[1415] But it's not just not liking plans, but being hyper sensitive in those situations and not being able to, because nobody, like Kristen was saying, nobody likes being a part of a bad plan.

[1416] but your extra anger in those situations, you attribute to something more than...

[1417] Yeah, I just, all I'm trying to be is very clear.

[1418] So, yeah, when it comes to TSA, I do think my biochemical not liking being beta to strangers is, yes, I think I will still claim that that's in the mix.

[1419] Yeah.

[1420] Yeah.

[1421] But not being a part of people's bad plans, I think, is just all nurture from childhood.

[1422] Okay.

[1423] But it mixes.

[1424] Mm -hmm.

[1425] Right?

[1426] Yeah.

[1427] There's overlap.

[1428] Someone's an authority.

[1429] I'm not the authority.

[1430] Yes.

[1431] Yeah.

[1432] But also, let me just say, I hate those parts of myself and I'll acknowledge.

[1433] So when I would say to someone with misophonia, like get over yourself, I'm also saying to myself, get over yourself, Dax, stand on the fucking footprints on the ground in front of the metal detector.

[1434] Yeah.

[1435] But I'm holding my.

[1436] myself accountable for my shittiness.

[1437] Right.

[1438] But you're also, but I'm saying to dismiss it as not real is maybe not fair.

[1439] Mm -hmm.

[1440] Well, now we know it's real because of 23 and me. So this is sort of moot.

[1441] You're right.

[1442] I would be wrong.

[1443] Okay.

[1444] And I can't imagine what they go through when they hear someone having a lollipop.

[1445] Well, we're going to have lying on here.

[1446] And that's going to be the main focus of the conversation.

[1447] I'm excited to hear with the apex of his experience.

[1448] experience with this disease is.

[1449] I think our friend Jess really...

[1450] He exacerbates his condition.

[1451] Sure.

[1452] Yeah.

[1453] I like it.

[1454] You like when he gets pushed.

[1455] Well, no, I like Jess's weird mouth noises.

[1456] There's a lot of them.

[1457] Jess, he makes a lot of weird mouth noises.

[1458] Oh, I thought you were making one right now and there was no sound.

[1459] He goes, like before he says anything.

[1460] Yeah.

[1461] I like that.

[1462] Yeah, me too.

[1463] Square one restaurant is a few.

[1464] blocks west of Fountain and Vermont in case anyone wants to go there.

[1465] Few blocks west of Vermont on fountain.

[1466] Right.

[1467] Perfect.

[1468] Okay, you said the first global empire was the Pax Roman Empire.

[1469] Yeah.

[1470] Well, okay.

[1471] That's what you said.

[1472] What do you want to change or what are you saying?

[1473] Well, I want to say that the Greeks were an empire prior to that.

[1474] And so there were a Syrian empire prior to that.

[1475] But this term Pax, that went Pax Romanica, I think.

[1476] And then it went Pax Britannica.

[1477] And now it's Pax Americana.

[1478] That's what I'm specifically saying.

[1479] That there's been three times where they've labeled a dynasty Pax.

[1480] And that was the first of the three.

[1481] Just so I'm clear.

[1482] Okay.

[1483] But you said the first global empire.

[1484] Mm -hmm.

[1485] You're going to say, what, Mongolians?

[1486] No, Portugal, actually, is, was the first global empire.

[1487] Oh, global because they sailed to the new world, yeah.

[1488] Oh, the Portuguese established the first global maritime and commercial empire under the leadership of Henry the Navigator in the 15th century.

[1489] Hmm.

[1490] The radio show that I referenced that you were on that you call me a babysitter.

[1491] Oh, yeah.

[1492] That was a Jason Ellis' show.

[1493] Oh, was?

[1494] Mm -hmm.

[1495] Okay.

[1496] So I don't know if that show was archived.

[1497] but people could maybe go back and find it.

[1498] I wonder.

[1499] It was on XM radio on his normal daily show.

[1500] Yeah.

[1501] So it wasn't a podcast.

[1502] I don't know how easy it would be to find.

[1503] Right.

[1504] I don't know how long it sticks around.

[1505] But I mean, I found it a couple days later.

[1506] Oh, right, right.

[1507] At least lasted for a couple days.

[1508] That's good.

[1509] Good for him.

[1510] Hung in there for a couple days.

[1511] Yeah.

[1512] Okay, so I do want to talk about this for a second.

[1513] the stereotype conversation that we were having about when you were in Italy and making songs and stuff like that.

[1514] Because you were, we were arguing that Americans are more likely to imbue stereotypes on everyone else and make up those songs and whatever, all those things.

[1515] And you were saying, no, all of the other, everyone does say.

[1516] And I think you are right.

[1517] I think every, every country has stereotypes of other people.

[1518] But ironically, the American stereotype is one that is loud and arrogant and and thinks and entitled and thinks they belong everywhere.

[1519] The ugly American.

[1520] Right.

[1521] So ironically, what you were doing was was the stereotype.

[1522] Sure.

[1523] So that's interesting.

[1524] Makes me happy because you know I love trading in stereotypes.

[1525] It's such a shorthand.

[1526] Don't say that.

[1527] You can say whatever you want, but I hope that's not true.

[1528] Did I like stereotypes?

[1529] Yeah.

[1530] I like them.

[1531] Yeah.

[1532] I think it's fun to go like, yeah, men generally make the mistake of trying to solve their wife's problems instead of just listening to their problems.

[1533] Like, that's a stereotype, and it's useful.

[1534] We can get at this problem that is pretty ubiquitous.

[1535] Now, we could acknowledge that certainly 20 % of men or some number of men don't do that.

[1536] But it is very common among men to treat problems like that with their wives.

[1537] Men, the most hegemonic group in all of the world, men, you're speaking specifically of American men.

[1538] I don't know that.

[1539] I only know American men.

[1540] I only have these conversations with American men.

[1541] Right.

[1542] So that's who you're referring to in this conversation.

[1543] I guess, but I got to imagine it's a global phenomenon.

[1544] I bet men, I think that's how men, they think that's what their wives are asking them to do is to solve their problem when they talk about a problem.

[1545] Like at work, they're having a problem at work.

[1546] And men hear, oh, she's telling me this because she wants me to solve this.

[1547] and they're not good at just being empathetic and listening to the problem and commiserating with them and acknowledging why they feel bad.

[1548] Women are great at doing that with one another.

[1549] Yeah, I don't know if it's cultural or not.

[1550] I would probably venture to say that it's more cultural than you think.

[1551] But regardless, stereotyping the least marginalized group is not, you're right, not that big of a deal.

[1552] But when you apply stereotypes to all these people, when the stereotype is being used against them all the time, it's a problem.

[1553] Well, I don't, look, there's negative stereotypes, clearly.

[1554] And then there's some that are totally innocuous.

[1555] I like the innocuous ones.

[1556] Okay.

[1557] People in the Midwest wear T -shirts when it's 45 degrees out in spring because they think it feels like 90.

[1558] Well, not everyone does that, but that is definitely a thing.

[1559] If you travel through the Midwest around May, you're going to see people with their convertible tops down when it's 45.

[1560] I feel good about saying that.

[1561] That's a stereotype.

[1562] I don't think that's a stereotype.

[1563] I think that's the difference.

[1564] I think just having an observation about a group of people is not, or an individual observation or whatever it is, is not the same thing as this nationwide stereotype that people use against people.

[1565] I don't, I've never heard that about the Midwest.

[1566] That's not a thing that I know.

[1567] Most stereotypes of ethnic groups, I know.

[1568] Well, but lots of them are positive.

[1569] Asians are good at math.

[1570] Jewish people are good with money.

[1571] Fucking, Indians are great with computers.

[1572] I don't know.

[1573] There's a million stereotypes that are positive.

[1574] They're not negative.

[1575] It's still all made up to put people in a box.

[1576] I'm not good at computers.

[1577] So.

[1578] Pretty good.

[1579] No, I'm not.

[1580] I'm not very good at all.

[1581] No, I don't like it, even if it's positive.

[1582] Because it's not, it's not true.

[1583] It's not true to everyone.

[1584] And also can have an effect of like, I should be this, but I'm not.

[1585] But then, well, okay.

[1586] Well, I'll just say, though, then you can't do anything.

[1587] You can't say that people in Kentucky have a culture of pride.

[1588] You can't say that.

[1589] What they do?

[1590] It's the truth.

[1591] They were settled by generally people with a subsistence mode that was hurting.

[1592] And people who heard have a certain culture.

[1593] And those people all moved to Kentucky.

[1594] And you can explain why there's been, in Kentucky, more family feuds that have ended in homicide than the rest of the nation combined.

[1595] So there's an explanation for it.

[1596] It involves some stereotyping.

[1597] And it's just, it would be a lie to pretend that's not happening, that there's not some kind of.

[1598] of phenomenon that's existing.

[1599] I mean, my knowledge, that's not being used against anybody.

[1600] No one's putting, no one's like, oh, you're from Kentucky.

[1601] Oh, you have a culture of pride.

[1602] Like, no one is doing that.

[1603] But then why don't you be specific that you don't like stereotypes that are what you're saying?

[1604] Because there's a, there's a division.

[1605] That's what I'm saying.

[1606] Like, we're smart enough to deal with the nuance of when it's negative in a pejorative and when it's not.

[1607] But for me, but I think a stereotype.

[1608] is different than observing something about a group of people or people or making observations is different than using that observation to lump a whole bunch of people into one thing.

[1609] The observation is a lot of Indians in the United States work in computers, and that is real because that's why they came here and that's why they were able to come here in the first place and get visas and stuff.

[1610] So that is true, and that's a fine observation.

[1611] to take it to the next level and say Indians are good at computers.

[1612] I went way too far with that.

[1613] But I was on the top.

[1614] I was just trying to think of positive ones.

[1615] I don't think anyone's saying Indians are good at computer.

[1616] But yes, a disproportionate amount of the Indians that are in America are great at computers.

[1617] Mm -hmm.

[1618] For that for that reason.

[1619] And a large percentage of Filipino females that are in the country are nurses because that was something that they decided to invest in as a, a valuable career path that they focused on.

[1620] So now we have a disproportionate amount of Filipino nurses.

[1621] Yeah.

[1622] Oh, I was just going to note, because you were talking about your sense of justice when discussing Kristen's, like, asking you to help her and how you feel like the accrediting thing.

[1623] And I have the same thing.

[1624] I was just saying, I just wanted to commiserate with.

[1625] you and say that I have the same thing.

[1626] Yeah.

[1627] That's, yeah, but I work hard at it.

[1628] Yeah.

[1629] Yeah, what do you, can you drill down specifically?

[1630] And I mean, I, I wonder if yours and I's, although the same thing, is also slightly different.

[1631] I'm sure it is.

[1632] Uh, mine is about getting credit.

[1633] Yeah.

[1634] And specifically not getting credit.

[1635] Uh -huh.

[1636] When it's more that.

[1637] It's not like I need credit in all scenarios.

[1638] It's that if I'm not getting credit for something I've done, it feels like a big injustice.

[1639] Yeah.

[1640] I work on that a lot because I know it's crazy.

[1641] Mm -hmm.

[1642] And I know that it's that her way of looking at the world and people you love is better.

[1643] Yeah.

[1644] Yeah.

[1645] And the other thing is if she was just the type of person that just took favors all the time.

[1646] Yeah.

[1647] And just consume them.

[1648] I've never met anyone that's more willing to do a favor for somebody.

[1649] Yeah.

[1650] Like if you call her about something you want to get to Ryan to be on your thing.

[1651] Like she'll do anything.

[1652] She'll write a letter.

[1653] She does it for the show all the time.

[1654] She'll call people to help us get guests on and stuff.

[1655] She'll anything.

[1656] Her friend wanted, you know, a dog out of her house at 10 o 'clock at night.

[1657] And she's like, yeah, I'll come over.

[1658] I'll get the dog out of your house.

[1659] You know, like, so part of me is like I do recognize for her.

[1660] all just flowing in and out.

[1661] Everyone's doing everyone else's favor.

[1662] It's very much a collective.

[1663] Yeah.

[1664] For me, this is not a thing specific to her.

[1665] My stuff with her is much less than myself with other people because of that.

[1666] Yeah.

[1667] But in general, I have that issue.

[1668] And I think part of it has to do with, like, in comedy, your specific point of view is your commodity.

[1669] It's how, it's your currency.

[1670] It's how you.

[1671] climb up the ladder, how you fall off of it.

[1672] So if you have something and you see that it's working for somebody else, it feels like that was mine and whatever.

[1673] But it's also silly and it's very possessive and not, and also wrong.

[1674] Yeah.

[1675] Mine is probably deeper than that too.

[1676] With her, she's the more likable of the two of us by far.

[1677] Like America likes her more than they like me. So I also think when like she's saying my words that are to what you're saying, my point of view and people love it, I'm like, well, this isn't fair.

[1678] That's my point of view.

[1679] You love it when it comes out of her mouth and you don't like it when it comes out of mine.

[1680] Which is not true, though.

[1681] That's the thing.

[1682] And that's my thing too.

[1683] Yeah, if I want everyone to like me. Yeah, me too.

[1684] Like they like her.

[1685] Yeah.

[1686] So it's not going to happen for us.

[1687] She's so likable.

[1688] Okay.

[1689] All right, that's all.

[1690] I'm teasing.

[1691] Did that hurt your feelings?

[1692] No, it's okay.

[1693] No, did it?

[1694] No. A little bit?

[1695] Maybe.

[1696] Okay.

[1697] That's okay.

[1698] That's the truth.

[1699] She's just uniquely likable.

[1700] Yes.

[1701] You have other skills.

[1702] She owned it in the interview.

[1703] She's like, I can't write and you guys can.

[1704] I do this other thing.

[1705] I'm sparkly.

[1706] Yeah.

[1707] Yeah.

[1708] That's it.

[1709] I think if we stay in our lane where it'd be great.

[1710] I don't think your lane.

[1711] is not likable.

[1712] I think everyone likes you.

[1713] I think everyone likes you.

[1714] Thanks.

[1715] That's all.

[1716] All right.

[1717] Good night.

[1718] Good night.

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