Without a Paddle Reunion

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[3] Welcome, welcome, welcome to Armchair Expert.

[4] I'm Dan Rather.

[5] I'm joined by Minuture Mouse.

[6] Hi there.

[7] And we have a very special episode today.

[8] We do.

[9] I've been teasing that this was coming out.

[10] But it was the 20 year anniversary of the release of Without a Paddle on August 20th.

[11] I had hoped we could time it perfectly, but Matthew was in Toronto filming the sequel to a very successful movie.

[12] He's a biz of which he plays Voldemort.

[13] Which you'll hear about in the fact.

[14] Yes, which is not, maybe he doesn't play Voldemort.

[15] But, yes, so Seth Green, we love Seth Green, Matthew Lillard, myself, and we got to just go down memory lane for two hours and it was so fun.

[16] And also, I'm going to add, to further confuse everybody.

[17] This is a Monday episode.

[18] Yeah.

[19] And it's video.

[20] And that's not how we're going to do it.

[21] But I thought if ever there was one that would be fun to have on video, this would be the one.

[22] And why not?

[23] It's also our first episode of the New Deal.

[24] Welcome to our New Deal.

[25] Welcome to our new deal.

[26] Welcome, Welcome, Welcome, Welcome to our new.

[27] Hello, hello.

[28] It's Bob.

[29] So yeah, please enjoy Seth Green and Matthew Lillard.

[30] Without a paddle reunion.

[31] Without a paddle reunion.

[32] WAP reunion.

[33] Oh, oh, wow.

[34] Uh -oh.

[35] That's, there it is.

[36] What's up, guys?

[37] It's your girl, Kiki, and my podcast is back with a new season, and let me tell you, it's too good.

[38] And I'm diving into the brains of entertainment's best and brightest, okay?

[39] Every episode, I bring on a friend.

[40] I mean the likes of Amy Pollard, Kell Mitchell, Vivica Fox, the list goes on.

[41] So follow, watch, and listen to Baby.

[42] This is Kiki Palmer on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcast.

[43] People didn't like that Complicated guys Real hard to be a people It is so hard to be a people That especially over distance Like it's one of the things that I love About both you guys And I'd like to say I saw it coming Was that we're all like This is what we do It's a career It's not just like I got to make this movie I like being included in that But in reality especially for this movie That was true for you guys You guys were like a decade into acting professionally.

[44] That specific movie, I really realized as it was happening, that it was such a significant moment for each of us, that it was going to be incredibly important for each of us, for it to work.

[45] I was mostly just scared.

[46] Scared?

[47] I think the finding is that what we tell ourselves past an experience is so powerful because I saw a dude who was explosive, funny, charming, all the time taking risks, zero fear as my coping mechanism of oh my god i don't belong here i'm not certain what i'm supposed to do they're all looking over there i guess when we switch to that camera we all move this way and like a little panicked inside that i'll be exposed is not deserving to be there and a chip on my shoulder about coming from punk sure and having loved both of you and wanting you guys to think i deserve to be there it was complicated it was a complicated moment for you and then i think i'm like overly charming No but You're proving yourself Fearless Here's what I can do I'm afraid about the acting But I can jump off the waterfall Like please Brill Let me do that That'll prove It is funny what we tell ourselves Versus what anyone else is even thinking You were so there on purpose And I who had already met you At Groundlings And then I got pumped by you Ish You want to walk through the scenario What you guys did to him Yes Punt Right which I didn't didn't know existed.

[48] I had spent like years hanging out with the cast of the 70s show because Wilmer and I had done Party Monster together and I just knew all those kids through the business.

[49] We'd all go hang out at the taping of the 70s show and then sometimes go out for drinks afterwards because it was a very pre -cell phone camera time.

[50] It was an entirely different place where you could actually just go out as a gang of highly recognizable people.

[51] So, Womer's like, oh, hey, you should come to, I'm doing a charity.

[52] Just come up to the taping.

[53] It's going to be great.

[54] And I was like, I don't know.

[55] I'm tired.

[56] And he was like, no, do it.

[57] And so I go.

[58] And it was at the sunset tower.

[59] And I had just been in this room six days prior for a table read.

[60] And so I had been in this exact same room where all of the lights are incredibly bright.

[61] And I was like, oh, they remodeled this room.

[62] because a bunch of mirrored extensions were built in front of closets.

[63] Wow, they redid this place and they were like, let's put a ton of mirrors in here.

[64] Well, I just didn't think about it.

[65] You would never imagine that there's like a hidden camera.

[66] All the lights were on.

[67] There's no music playing.

[68] And they're like, do you want to drink?

[69] And I was like, I'll get a drink.

[70] But this is a terrible party.

[71] I was to tell you this party, it sucks.

[72] And I started walking around.

[73] I was like, maybe we dim the lights.

[74] This has a lot about you.

[75] And I think it's lovely, which is like.

[76] Like you got into this situation and there's a ton of other actors there and everyone's acting like they're gambling and stuff.

[77] And he is immediately like, I don't like the lighting.

[78] I'm changing the lighting in this room.

[79] And everyone in the camera department is like, oh my God, shit.

[80] Go up to F4.

[81] You know, like they're changing exposures and everything.

[82] And he has no problem walking into a party that's not his party and completely changing the lighting because it didn't suit him.

[83] And I was like, that's not a people pleaser.

[84] And I'm jealous of it.

[85] It's an enviable quality.

[86] Oh, that's funny.

[87] But it really felt like, oh, I were going to make it.

[88] He wanted to make it better.

[89] You're going to help.

[90] Give me the light, people would have more fun.

[91] You guys try to raise money at this fucking thing?

[92] Like, you're not going to raise any money if nobody's enjoying them.

[93] Everyone looks what are you talking about.

[94] I'm here for the charity.

[95] And then Al, the guy from hits from the street.

[96] E .T. El Shear.

[97] He looked familiar enough that I wasn't scared of him.

[98] Takes me outside and tells me that the whole plate, no, we're all going to give each other COVID.

[99] He takes me outside and says, hey man, I want to be cool.

[100] like your movies.

[101] And I was like, okay.

[102] And my kid really likes you.

[103] And I was like, all right.

[104] And he says, listen, I'm a cop.

[105] And I'm undercover.

[106] Been undercover for weeks.

[107] Oh, my God.

[108] Breaking up this underground gambling ring.

[109] And I was just like, what are you talking about?

[110] And he goes, whose game is this?

[111] And I go, I literally don't know what you're talking about.

[112] My friend invited me to a charity thing.

[113] I'm planning on giving $500.

[114] I wasn't even trying to get in on it.

[115] Oh, that was the other thing.

[116] Cooch comes over to me. And I auditioned for Dude Where's My Car with him?

[117] So I think because I was so young in this business and I've seen all the other young people come into it.

[118] I have a real soft spot for actors trying to do it.

[119] I had a lot of nice people say, hey, hey, hey, you're totally fucking this up.

[120] Don't ever do that again.

[121] And you're just like, oh, thanks.

[122] Thank you.

[123] I actually appreciate that.

[124] So I like being able to give a heads up.

[125] You've probably never been here before, but I've been here.

[126] And if you got, watch that step.

[127] Letting folks know where the potholes are, as we were saying rap.

[128] As we would say.

[129] When I'm repeating lyrics from Jay -Z.

[130] Okay.

[131] Pot holes are my long.

[132] Hold on, I'm going to make my first joke to Matt about Seth.

[133] So this is going to be the 21st anniversary of the episode of Punk.

[134] Oh, it is?

[135] No. Oh, yeah, I don't we do it.

[136] You are deep.

[137] I guess that's true, but you would ask me this question.

[138] You did.

[139] We're already in the dynamic.

[140] We have the whole movie.

[141] 21 years is going by and we're like already in the exact dynamic, which I should have brought a back at my kid.

[142] Start with radio days.

[143] What?

[144] He's so stupid.

[145] Was that your first movie?

[146] That was like my seventh movie.

[147] How old were you?

[148] I was 12.

[149] 12.

[150] Long story short, this guy tells you there's going to be a raid and then all of a sudden there's guys flying through the windows.

[151] Yeah, somebody's literally somersaulted through the window.

[152] And I was like, this is so excited.

[153] So I immediately see that none of these cops have guns.

[154] And I was like, okay, well, this is chill.

[155] You weren't nervous at all?

[156] Yeah, I was nervous, but I've also been in handcuffs a lot prior to this moment.

[157] And in questioned about it.

[158] Did you say a lot?

[159] A couple of times.

[160] Oh, you don't strike me as that.

[161] I was a bad kid.

[162] Seth had the funnest history of he wore trench coats.

[163] He kept sighs.

[164] What are they called?

[165] Sysords.

[166] I never had sighs, but I got into throwing knives.

[167] Well, because the second I found out that ninjas were a thing, I was like, well, I want to be a ninja.

[168] Sure, naturally.

[169] Yeah, well, I got picked on, as you can imagine.

[170] I was not a popular kid.

[171] I had a tremendous amount of energy.

[172] I was hilarious looking.

[173] I wore all of my sisters' clothes because we didn't have money.

[174] And then I had a mom who was eccentric and bought me Norwegian shoes.

[175] And then I had to wear that shit to school in Philadelphia.

[176] Like wooden shoes?

[177] Yeah, like straight up wooden clogs.

[178] There was at least three years.

[179] My sister and I rolled in no socks in clocks.

[180] Oh, my Lord.

[181] Like, if you want to get your ass kicked in the same neighborhoods that Will Smith got his ass kick.

[182] I didn't even play basketball.

[183] It was really bad.

[184] Did you fight?

[185] I've been in a couple of fights.

[186] Like, through punches or got punched?

[187] I mean, I, like, threw punches or?

[188] You swung back.

[189] I flailed meaninglessly in the face of some serious aggressors.

[190] I was also crazy.

[191] This one kid had been tormenting me. We were coming down the stairs at one point.

[192] It was just like four stairs ahead of me. I just fucking leapt off the stairs, wrap my hands like around his neck and started punching him in the face.

[193] It was we both fell to the polished concrete floor, four more stairs below.

[194] Why did I do that?

[195] Well, that's a bit of the red hair.

[196] You always got the X factor.

[197] Really quick, one second story.

[198] So Monica and I were talking.

[199] And I was explaining to her that I growing up saw on like five different occasions redheads get in fights at my school.

[200] In most cases, they were kind of outmatched size -wise.

[201] and that they started crying right before the fight.

[202] And I saw a strength and a veracity I've never seen anywhere else other than the redheads.

[203] And they always won.

[204] And she goes, I find it very hard to believe that every redhead you saw get in a fight, they started crying first and then won.

[205] And I said, let's call Aaron Weekly.

[206] So we call my best friend.

[207] And Monica goes, how did you phrase it?

[208] Something like what happens?

[209] What happens when redheads fight?

[210] And he goes, oh, well, first of all, they start crying.

[211] And then they beat the shit out of whoever they're fighting.

[212] It was like the exact same answer.

[213] Anywho, the point is we knew each other from punk.

[214] I think that's the point.

[215] But who got in the movie first?

[216] You were in with Auto Paddle first?

[217] I was.

[218] You are?

[219] Because I had just made the Italian job with Donald DeLine for Paramount.

[220] Great movie.

[221] Great movie.

[222] It was the only time in my entire career that the head of a studio was like, we want to be in the Seth Green business.

[223] And I was like, thanks Sherry Lansing.

[224] What do you have for me?

[225] And Donald was like, we have this copy.

[226] comedy, this character's written as a fat guy, but maybe he's a short guy.

[227] And I was like, okay, let's read it.

[228] That's a great time for us to introduce.

[229] And this will rain as an excuse about some of the jokes in the film.

[230] It's indicative of the period.

[231] This is 2003.

[232] And to make a comedy, yeah, you're going to have a short guy.

[233] Well, it's more the archetype that you can fill to make a very specific type of physical joke over and over again.

[234] Whoever's playing whatever the archetypical role is has assumed the burden of carrying out all the physical gags possible on behalf of their body type.

[235] John Cleese talks about that endlessly.

[236] Like, you know what you're there to do.

[237] Right.

[238] And you're going to shamelessly do it in a way that lets the audience feel the thing that you need them to feel.

[239] Yeah.

[240] It just was a different time.

[241] I don't think the executives right now are like, hey, we're having a hard time finding a fatso or a little person.

[242] That conversation's not happening.

[243] No. You know, legally, I don't fit the criteria for a little person, but I'll choke that down, I watched it this morning.

[244] I have never seen it.

[245] You did?

[246] Oh, my God.

[247] You've never seen it.

[248] Curious how it reads to someone who never saw it.

[249] Real quick.

[250] Three takeaways.

[251] First and major takeaway is it's so fun and nostalgic.

[252] That type of movie is gone.

[253] And I really was like, oh, yeah, I get why everyone loves this and feels so connected to it.

[254] Great.

[255] Uh -oh.

[256] I have warned you about it, though.

[257] You'd warn me about some things that would trigger me. I do an Indian accent in the movie.

[258] Again, I would not.

[259] Oh, my God.

[260] Of course.

[261] This is like setting up the 2005.

[262] I see that in the script.

[263] And I'm like, okay, I can do that.

[264] And then, of course, Monica and I are becoming really good friends and we're talking about that accent.

[265] And I'm really understanding, like, the only fucking example of your Indian and your kid was Apooh.

[266] And I'm like, oh, my God, Monica, I have done the fucking accent.

[267] And I feel terrible.

[268] So I was like, just don't ever see that movie.

[269] But that's not why, didn't it?

[270] It felt like a boy movie.

[271] You weren't a 12 -year -old boy.

[272] Two is you're the exact same person.

[273] Really?

[274] I can't believe it.

[275] When you're like on your motorcycle and the jokes you're making and even when you're singing in the car, I was like, wow.

[276] He has not changed.

[277] But in a good way, in a good way.

[278] It was like, oh, you've always been that.

[279] I liked it.

[280] You don't agree with that?

[281] You've just seen so much actual internal evolution.

[282] You've witnessed your own expansion in ways that the you in that movie wouldn't have actually imagined possible.

[283] I watched it last night with the girls.

[284] Many scenes.

[285] My body's so.

[286] tight you guys like watching it like oh my god i was new and i was pretty stiff sometimes i just grew as an actor over time i was watching it and i was also thinking like oh my god i was like so tiny you were tiny i actually was like he looks so tall you're not gonna like this but i think the bigger your body is the shorter you appear all right that's why i never get real deep into the bench that's exactly what's preventing me from going to 12 you know because otherwise i'd be wolverine guys Wait, what's your third take away?

[287] The relationship, and I know just from hearing Dex, he reflects on that time as being so special.

[288] Yeah.

[289] I get it.

[290] Like, I watched it, and I was like, oh, man, they all are firing on all cylinders.

[291] The chemistry's so good.

[292] It looks like such a fun time.

[293] I love these guys so much right away.

[294] And they were so kind.

[295] And it could have been competitive and it wasn't.

[296] And it was very mentoring and kind and helpful.

[297] You were so funny.

[298] We were both like, how do I steal his joke?

[299] right away like oh my god oh no i think i stole a joke years and in the makeup chair you're like don't you ever fucking do that again and i was like i think i made a joke not on set even it was on camera it was it coming through the thing we had all i don't remember i don't remember specifically because we were all throwing out some kind of one -liner coming into a scene we're all entering a scene i had not thought of this by the way in 20 years thank you i'm glad because i just swear to god I haven't thought about it.

[300] I haven't thought about it, but I remember each one of these experiences because they were so seminal in all of our experience together.

[301] I've been working for as long as I had been working.

[302] I knew.

[303] Wait, go tell what happens?

[304] Yeah, yeah.

[305] So we're all running the door.

[306] Each one of us starts to say a line.

[307] And then we do a second take and we each come through and add an improv line.

[308] And then the third take through, you said one of the things that I'm under my third improv and then you had grabbed my first improv.

[309] something like that's what happened we were just like picking up each other's shit because it felt very like who cares it was like I had taken his daughter but it's because of where you came from right so first of all absolutely it was not a big deal your line was better than anything I was ever to come up with I'm of course embarrassed by that because again I had done punked before that it was just me I'm out there improvving these things and then prior to that was the groundlings and that was the conversation we had in the makeup trailer I hate that you remember I do because I really regret it but I remember trying to get into it in this way of like you didn't really do like a comedy background huh matt i'm trying to lay out like you would never do that at the ground like you would never improv someone and someone would take it and so yeah i was triggered and scared that i sucked in the movie and how embarrassing and i'm sorry and yes we should all just take whatever it comes up and make the movie great oh it's embarrassing well we all learn and grow even though you're the same you know what's funny can i just talk about the bi dysmorphia that was happening the biis morph body dysmorphia oh you and i and i for the record, were so freaked out about taking her shirt off and being present in our own bodies.

[310] Yes.

[311] That the fear that was a part of that movie from beginning to end was palpable.

[312] I mean, it was defining.

[313] And we were obsessed with the fact that Seth just looked like a fucking gymnast.

[314] We were working out in between takes.

[315] I wasn't eating.

[316] I was like in my underwear the whole time going, look at this.

[317] I'm so fat.

[318] And I look back now.

[319] And you look fucking great.

[320] I think that every time, we look back, we're so ensconced in this fear of that moment.

[321] And the reality is like, oh, you were so beautiful.

[322] For those people at home, like, dude, let it go.

[323] It does not serve you at all.

[324] I teach acting a lot.

[325] I brought this woman in to talk about the woman's perspective on the journey.

[326] And she told this great story about how when she was younger, she had this white bathing suit and she wanted to wear in the movie.

[327] But she was terrified to put on this two -piece white bathing suit.

[328] And at the end of the day, she looks at these pictures of her like 10 years later.

[329] She goes, I was gorgeous.

[330] Yeah, I know.

[331] It was so beautiful.

[332] And the story I was telling myself at that time of my life was so destructive.

[333] And it's impervious to anything.

[334] You can't break out of it.

[335] And there's no amount of, like, accolades or work.

[336] It's just that mindset.

[337] But there's got to be a way in the moment to tell yourself this isn't the truth.

[338] We were.

[339] And we talked about it, and I was like, fuck, that whole sequence is five days away.

[340] We were like pageant contested.

[341] Yes, when the swimsuit section was coming up.

[342] There's like 15 days in our underwear.

[343] Do you remember, we went to Italian restaurants.

[344] I was just going to say a celebration.

[345] Yeah, with Deline.

[346] What was that?

[347] That's good.

[348] Olive Garden.

[349] Like a hearty.

[350] Oh, my God.

[351] And Seth, do you remember you're not wanting to take the compliments, but you look like a gymnast.

[352] So Matt and I would be doing our push -ups.

[353] Push -ups and sit -ups every day.

[354] You joined in.

[355] And we were even like, look this asshole doesn't need to do with fucking push -ups.

[356] He's got good ass cheeks.

[357] You're going to do squats, guys.

[358] Because your shit was so legit.

[359] You are in pound for pound for pound the most beautiful man in Hollywood.

[360] I've said it a million.

[361] I was going to continue to say it.

[362] Pound for Pound, the most beautiful man of Hollywood.

[363] Have you seen Kevin Hart?

[364] Oh, man, he looks fantastic.

[365] He's incredible.

[366] He survived breaking his back because he's in such good shape.

[367] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[368] Okay, so you were in the movie first.

[369] Yes.

[370] I'm bringing him back to a semi -chronological timeline.

[371] And then you were in before me, but how did you get in the movie?

[372] Because you guys were really hot.

[373] That sounds embarrassing.

[374] But you were just in the Italian job, and you were just in Scooby -Doo, which was an enormous hit.

[375] The studio loved him.

[376] The only question was whether or not he is this leading man, the guy who kisses the girl, the guy who proposes to the girl.

[377] I tried to talk myself out of that film like three times.

[378] You did?

[379] I read it.

[380] I'm like, I don't love it.

[381] And that could be also my own fear about being that guy.

[382] And there was a whole section in the middle with the women and the trees.

[383] And I'm like, that's so stupid.

[384] It doesn't work.

[385] And I sat down with Brill and Deline.

[386] And I'm like, I just think the comedy's off in some places.

[387] And I try to articulate that there are two different forms of comedy in here.

[388] There's this big, bold, ridiculousness, and then there's this really fellowship -driven.

[389] I'm running for your life, really high stakes, and, like, girls in a tree with long hair on their legs in two different movies.

[390] And I was like, this doesn't make sense.

[391] At the end of the day, they came through with an offer, and I was like, regret what you did, not what you didn't do.

[392] They were like, we have this guy, Dax Shepherd.

[393] Seth Green's in.

[394] I love Seth Green.

[395] We just got to work on Scooby.

[396] That was Scooby One.

[397] Scooby 2.

[398] So this is the reason that I remember.

[399] I loved Matt for so long.

[400] He's one of my favorite actors.

[401] If you didn't fall in Love with Lillard on stream, your eyes weren't open during the screen.

[402] Well, I saw him in SLC Punk and I was like, oh shit, this is just a different.

[403] Well, because like the things that you see him in his studio stuff and then you see the stuff that he's like, this is my heart.

[404] And I'd put this on film so that you can do what you want with it.

[405] That's the shit that impressed me. And so we got to do that scene together.

[406] I was so happy.

[407] That's where I met Gunn, too.

[408] Like, it was an incredible experience.

[409] And so at that point, they were like, we're thinking about maybe it's Matt Lillard.

[410] I said, if this is me and Matt Lillard and Doc Shepard, this is a hit.

[411] The movie will work.

[412] How did you get rude?

[413] I ended up getting the offer, and I said yes.

[414] Did you audition?

[415] So not only did I audition, and this is where I'll say Seth, really.

[416] Seth and Brill, Brill wanted me, which was awesome.

[417] Why did he want you?

[418] He liked Punked.

[419] He thought I was doing something really cool on Punked.

[420] Then I went in Red, and I was not good.

[421] reading the script i was not very good and seth had been brought in to read with me and broil was like forget the script you guys just improv scenes because he knew i could improv and then when i was improvving i was very relaxed and calm and thank god sess a great improviser so we just basically improv three scenes that they sent to sherry lansing president of the studio to get me in that movie but would not have got it by reading tom's science and so really you and brill are the reason we all got putting a situation to win.

[422] And we did this little movie, to Manga's point, they don't make anymore.

[423] Nobody's making a $20 million.

[424] Yeah.

[425] I looked it up, 19.

[426] The thing was made for 19.

[427] In another country.

[428] Okay, so we all get the movie.

[429] We're all in the movie.

[430] We land in New Zealand.

[431] Do you remember?

[432] I remember so many things.

[433] There was some sporting event that was really important for everyone to see.

[434] The Hallblacks were playing the best of.

[435] That was in the middle of show.

[436] Yeah, I think when we got there, there was more like a World Cup thing.

[437] So we get down there.

[438] And what's really cool, and again, doesn't ever happen.

[439] In fact, that's the only time this ever happens.

[440] We were there, like, three weeks early to learn to do all this river work in canoes.

[441] What an awesome way to, like, bond in a hurry.

[442] We were not good at it.

[443] And we were going through things that canoes don't go through.

[444] And they had hired this amazing dude all.

[445] And he was Fijian.

[446] Yes.

[447] He had just won a gold medal and fucking rowing to be in previous Olympics.

[448] And he was such a stud.

[449] and we all were like trying our hardest to impress Augie.

[450] He was so cool, too.

[451] He was like, oh, you go, it's going to get this?

[452] We were like, okay.

[453] He did say at one point he's like, no matter what happens on the river, if you're in trouble, you have to get yourself out because nobody's coming to save you.

[454] That scared the shit out of it for the next three weeks.

[455] Remember, the first thing we got into the Canadian canoe in that whirlpool.

[456] It was like a little waterfall.

[457] At the bottom of it was this churning.

[458] What's this churning thing?

[459] And there's three grown men.

[460] to like our waist with a canoe trying to get it up and just keep falling back into the I was like that was not a great introduction again because it was my first movie I thought this is how it went we did all these things that let's just say I haven't since gotten to do we're jumping off waterfalls and I was operating under this very weird thought of I felt like I was at an amusement park like well this is safe you're on a movie they've got this all figured out If they're letting me do this, everything's cool.

[461] And let's just cut right to like the craziest moment probably on it.

[462] Also, they told us, oh, it's summer, New Zealand, you're good.

[463] The water was never above 50 degrees.

[464] We were freezing the whole movie.

[465] We had no body fat.

[466] We had zero.

[467] No carbs.

[468] There was one scene in particular.

[469] And we arrive and we learn of this.

[470] And I have to be delicate how I say this.

[471] But one of the stunt guys the day before was shooting the canoe going through this class five with all these eight foot drops and stuff.

[472] And this was an Olympic rower.

[473] And he came out and he cracked his head open really, really bad.

[474] Broke his ribs, shattered his shoulder.

[475] They had an airlift him out.

[476] It was my stunt guy.

[477] And the idea was five times a day, they would open a dam and tens of millions of gallons would come rushing down the wireucky.

[478] And they would then, in this huge wash of water, they would put three kayakers in this so that they can get a shot of people kayaking.

[479] in a Class 5 rapid, which we were supposed to be doing, with no helmets and very little safety.

[480] And this is before, like, you just take things out with the computer.

[481] He did three times, and on the third time, he got absolutely obliterated.

[482] He got obliterated, and airlifted out of there.

[483] And then the following day, we're there, and we're not going to try to ride a canoe through, but where the canoe has tipped in the movie, now they need footage of us going through that same section.

[484] So we're just jumping off of a rock into this thing, and they're going to film us.

[485] And you're not acting.

[486] You're just like trying not to die.

[487] Survive.

[488] I did try to make, like, hilarious faces each sort.

[489] Might explain what happens next, which is...

[490] This is crazy.

[491] We're already a little nervous.

[492] That was the day where I was like, oh, if the stunt guy is getting airlifted, maybe I need to watch up.

[493] So we all jump in, and then Matt and I get to the side of the river, and Seth's gone.

[494] There's no fucking Seth.

[495] Oh, my God.

[496] Like, I don't know how many seconds it really was, but it felt like 30 seconds of like, where the fuck stuff?

[497] Where's Seth?

[498] Where's Seth?

[499] Where's Seth?

[500] are starting to rip around because there's jet ski safety.

[501] I'm panicked, like, because I know what just happened to the stunt guy, and Seth is gone.

[502] He is not visible.

[503] He came up, like, 300 yards down the river.

[504] Well, they had said to me, worst comes to worst, you just ride the river.

[505] We got a net down here, and then we got a guy with the binoculars at the end of the river.

[506] Oh, my God.

[507] So they're like, look, we're going to get you.

[508] And if worst comes to worst, we will eventually find you.

[509] You'll have a proper funeral.

[510] We promise that.

[511] We will bring you back to the United States.

[512] We're going to figure out how to sell your stuff.

[513] But you submerged and went under the safety line.

[514] The first safety line.

[515] But then the second guys, they got me like, I stand here, guys.

[516] We got him.

[517] But he was, Monica, he was very, very far away.

[518] It was really funny.

[519] But within that, we also had the greatest accomplishment that I have not ever felt in my life, but we had this moment where we had this, like, little class three wave that we had tried multiple times.

[520] For three weeks straight.

[521] I was in the front, Dax was in the back because he was steering, and sat to be in the middle.

[522] Keeping balance.

[523] Very important wrong.

[524] And you would hit this class three little wave.

[525] You want to get through the wave.

[526] And at the other side, be on this Canadian flat bottom canoe.

[527] And every time, every time.

[528] We either fell over or it filled with so much water by the time we get through.

[529] Just our shoulders would be above water.

[530] And the only time it worked was when we were shooting it.

[531] That was unbelievable.

[532] I have to thank Jonathan Brown for making us all look like superheroes.

[533] The DP that shot that film really made.

[534] Did they ask you guys, are you guys very, very proficient swimmers?

[535] No. Because, like, I would be fully dead immediately.

[536] You could always say no. I've definitely worked on projects where the actors are like, I'm not doing this.

[537] There is a really hysterical moment with Burt Reynolds.

[538] So he arrived, which is incredible.

[539] We were all so excited.

[540] And at that point, there was...

[541] No, that's that true.

[542] Okay.

[543] You were as excited as any child about to meet Santa Claus.

[544] I have never seen anyone adore a man from afar more than you adored Bert Rennel.

[545] Yeah, I brought posters with me. Oh, that's so...

[546] And he signed every one of it.

[547] He got some that I couldn't get my hands on for me and left him in my trailer.

[548] He would literally, preemptively, without you asking, would leave DVDs for you.

[549] Brie got several, too.

[550] She hadn't asked for any.

[551] Bree your ex -girlfriend.

[552] My ex -girlfriend, no, the cheese.

[553] Bert's like a crazy cheese thing.

[554] He loves it.

[555] It's what killed him in the end.

[556] He gave her.

[557] Here's the two photos Bert gave her.

[558] One was with him bare naked on a horse holding a dog over his private parts.

[559] And then the famous rug one.

[560] Of course.

[561] Naked on a rug This is the one for Brie And each of them On a horse Like this He rescued it clearly Seth It was probably injured And it said Like beautiful Brie This is when I was Young and cute Like Dax Oh You loved it It was one for Both of us Yeah Tell the story I'm showing up I had been begging our director Brill To let us jump off the 100 foot waterfall We did jump off like a 25, 30 foot one with the four wheeler gag I had zero interest in jumping off this 100 foot waterfall.

[562] It should be said.

[563] But I was really driving Brill nuts at this point.

[564] He's like, they're professionals.

[565] I'm like, you think there's someone who's professional at falling through the air?

[566] This is a racket you're proposing to me that you can be better or worse at falling through the air.

[567] It's really how you land more than it.

[568] So I was driving him nuts.

[569] Burt got there and I thought, you know what, I'm going to use Burt to help me convince Brill that I should do it.

[570] And I tell Bert like, listen, they got this stunt come up and they don't want to do it.

[571] And he pulls me saying he was listen to me i did the exact same thing on my first movie on deliverance i insisted they let me go over this waterfall i broke my back oh and you cannot tell it's me in the movie do not jump off that waterfall and i was like okay like well if my dad says so i guess i can't the greatest thing about that is he showed up at this incredible resort in the yarecki they've thrown this party for bert like he's supposed to start at seven bird shows up like a 11th Seven o 'clock at night.

[572] Well, time change.

[573] There's five of us waiting for him.

[574] He was everything you wanted him to be.

[575] He loved his stories.

[576] I mean, this is the best possible way.

[577] The story is probably jumping off a 20 -foot waterfall.

[578] That was probably the reality.

[579] He probably slapped his back.

[580] But over time, it had lost pop to him.

[581] And now it was 700 feet and he almost died.

[582] I ate that bear.

[583] But we sat there and every one of us just let him be the movie star that he was.

[584] And he was so loving to actors.

[585] He was rough with directors, but he loved actors.

[586] He got into a place in his career where he needed to remind people that he knew what he was doing.

[587] He would make a bit of a demonstration on set about how much homework he had done or how good he is at his job.

[588] That's a common folly.

[589] It just is an insecurity thing.

[590] You could tell, man, it was the first movie he had done in a while.

[591] And getting back at a job for a studio, not just not the lead, he was much older.

[592] playing like an older man, really struggling with his own vanity, really struggling with what he can look like and what he's supposed to play that can challenge an actor.

[593] Any human.

[594] It's hard to sort of grow old gracefully.

[595] We already admitted were bad version would be vain.

[596] The kinder would be we're insecure.

[597] You and I were already, I don't know if I'm good looking enough to be in these movies.

[598] We grew up with that baggage.

[599] Yes.

[600] Stay tuned for more armchair expert.

[601] If you dare.

[602] What's up, guys?

[603] It's your girl Kiki, and my podcast is back with a new season, and let me tell you, it's too good.

[604] And I'm diving into the brains of entertainment's best and brightest, okay?

[605] Every episode, I bring on a friend and have a real conversation.

[606] And I don't mean just friends.

[607] I mean the likes of Amy Polar, Kell Mitchell, Vivica Fox, the list goes on.

[608] So follow, watch, and listen to Baby.

[609] This is Kiki Palmer on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcast.

[610] We've all been there.

[611] Turning to the internet to self -diagnose our inexplicable pains, debilitating body aches, sudden fevers, and strange rashes.

[612] Though our minds tend to spiral to worst -case scenarios, it's usually nothing, but for an unlucky few, these unsuspecting symptoms can start the clock ticking on a terrifying medical mystery.

[613] Like the unexplainable death of a retired firefighter, whose body was found at home by his son, except it looked like he had been cremated.

[614] or the time when an entire town started jumping from buildings and seeing tigers on their ceilings.

[615] Hey listeners, it's Mr. Ballin here, and I'm here to tell you about my podcast.

[616] It's called Mr. Ballin's Medical Mysteries.

[617] Each terrifying true story will be sure to keep you up at night.

[618] Follow Mr. Ballin's Medical Mysteries wherever you get your podcasts.

[619] Prime members can listen early and ad free on Amazon Music.

[620] Tam.

[621] By the way, still get people.

[622] Oh, Tam.

[623] Oh, yeah.

[624] Because the podcast.

[625] We talked about him.

[626] Oh, damn.

[627] But do you remember that Burt's big stunt that he did?

[628] Yes.

[629] It's not even in the movie.

[630] Please tell the story.

[631] Yes, it is.

[632] Him going over the railing?

[633] I don't know if it is.

[634] I just watch it.

[635] But he was going to get shot and go over a railing.

[636] Over a wood pile.

[637] Oh, okay, over the woodpile.

[638] Yeah, sorry.

[639] It's very important.

[640] I don't know why that's so important.

[641] I thought it was a railing.

[642] Point is he's going to take a big fall.

[643] Sure.

[644] And of course there's a stunt man brought in to do that.

[645] He's like in his 70s.

[646] By the way, Don't do your own stunts.

[647] Yeah, as I said, the irony.

[648] Hold on a second.

[649] Maybe I do want to do this waterfall thing.

[650] So he basically tells Brilly's like, get him out of here.

[651] I'm doing the stunt.

[652] Get my wet suit.

[653] Oh, God.

[654] He travels with it.

[655] Instead of having pads that you should have or normally would have, his move is to put on a wetsuit and he's like, I can jump off anything as long as I have the wetsuit to land on.

[656] So he gets a wetsuit on it, true, and he's some years old and then put his outfit on.

[657] Oh, my God.

[658] And then fucking jump backwards.

[659] He got squibbed.

[660] He goes to launch himself over the logs.

[661] He gets caught on the logs and starts to like scooch over the logs and flops on the back side.

[662] So three of us had rapped and we stuck around to watch it.

[663] The entire place erupts.

[664] And literally he's like, that's a rap on Bert Reynolds.

[665] Uh, bringing Stegger.

[666] Yeah.

[667] This is such a great point of perspective because like in my memory he did it.

[668] Yeah.

[669] I thought he did it too.

[670] You're him, that's why.

[671] I'll never forget.

[672] Burt Reynolds slapped me in a scene, and I don't think I've ever seen you jealous of me in your entire life, except for that one moment.

[673] I was furious.

[674] You were like, how did he slap you?

[675] Why did he slap you?

[676] You put up with so much from him.

[677] Yeah.

[678] But do you know the thing about the slap?

[679] So, Bert Reynolds and all those Cannonball Run movies, and any movie he did with Dom Deloese, when one of them would forget their lines, they'd slap each other.

[680] And at the end of the movie, there would be a great gag reel.

[681] And you'd see Bert Reynolds.

[682] slapping everyone.

[683] And so we slapped Lillard, and I was like, oh, man, I wanted to get slapped.

[684] Yeah, that's sad.

[685] But your point about age, everyone feels this, right, whether you're an actor or not, but for an actor, visually, you see a timeline of your life and little things changing in your body and your face.

[686] It must be hard.

[687] It's hard for anyone.

[688] Well, it's just my birthday, as we just discussed.

[689] Happy birthday.

[690] You guys already sang to me. It was very sweet.

[691] But, you know, it's like, whoa, no, we don't have to do it again.

[692] It makes you think about, we've been talking about it so much, like death, the mortality, and when you see the visual representation, it must be harder.

[693] I don't feel different.

[694] Exactly.

[695] I still feel like this beautiful boy in the movie, and I look at my body, and I look at my face, and I'm like, oh, I am not the same.

[696] And I do love this sense of gained wisdom over time, and having an ownership of a career that I'm proud of being an artist, like all these things I've grown into as a man, I still look at who I was growing up and like, you've come so far.

[697] It's humbling.

[698] You have a bit of compassion for yourself.

[699] Like, why was I doing that to myself?

[700] In my mindset, I've always been scrambling up a ladder with very little success.

[701] When I look back in my career, beyond my wildest dream to have I been successful.

[702] Exactly.

[703] And still working.

[704] You couldn't shoot this on time.

[705] I wanted this to come out on the exact 20th anniversary.

[706] And it's delayed because you're in another fucking country.

[707] You're in Toronto?

[708] Toronto.

[709] Don't geotag him.

[710] He's trying to get some food with his family.

[711] Well, Five Nights is the single biggest thing to ever happen in my life.

[712] That movie Five Nights of Freddy.

[713] Isn't that crazy?

[714] So Five Nights of Freddy's is a franchise that came out last year.

[715] The movie.

[716] Yeah, it's a video game.

[717] 20 million dollar movie made $300 million.

[718] Oh, my God.

[719] Yeah.

[720] Guys, without a paddle is still my biggest movie.

[721] Is it really?

[722] I've been in a couple that made more, but I wasn't really in them.

[723] You know, like I wasn't on the poster.

[724] But for a movie that I was one of the main people, it never got better.

[725] Film -wise, it went downhill from there.

[726] But you also got to put in years on a drama with some of the most gifted and talented people.

[727] I've always had great luck on TV, and of course, I never embraced it.

[728] It's kind of just become the same thing.

[729] The shows are the shows, the movies of the movie.

[730] Yeah.

[731] Because of the reality TV, I think it's just democratized the concept of fame.

[732] People become intimate with you in whatever your form of expression is.

[733] And I'm at total peace with everything.

[734] I could not be more delighted with the way everything shook out, right?

[735] But that first movie was as good as it got for me in the trades.

[736] Our joke was that the three of us combined hopefully would equal like an Owen Wilson.

[737] Right.

[738] We were like, let's hope that the three of us hands up.

[739] The one of the stories Bert told at that dinner, because it is to this day, probably my favorite story I've ever heard.

[740] And I wonder if you remember it's the Hal Needham story.

[741] He's living with Hal Needham in real life, Bert Reynolds, and one day Hal comes home from work and he says, Bert, you got to take me to the hospital.

[742] I broke my back.

[743] And Bert goes, hell, I don't think if you broke your back, you would have driven home and blah, and he's like, take me to the fucking hospital right now.

[744] So they go to the hospital and Hal and Bert are in the examination room.

[745] This is a weird part of the story, but he does include that hell's like flirting with the nurse and got something going with the nurse.

[746] And the doctor seems to be annoyed by that.

[747] Bert's opinion is that maybe the doctor and the nurse, were having an affair or something.

[748] But it's a little bit of that detail.

[749] How leading him, by the way, the stuntman?

[750] Stumpman and directed Hooper.

[751] He directed Smoking the Bandit, the most legendary stuntman of all time.

[752] So they give him an x -ray.

[753] The doctor comes in and he said, you have broken your back.

[754] Worse, you have a good deal of fluid in your lungs, and I have to drain the fluid out before I put you in the back brace and send you on your way.

[755] And he says, okay.

[756] And he says, you're going to have to stand up against the wall.

[757] I need you standing.

[758] And I'm going to put this needle in your back.

[759] And then he says to the nurse, the doctor says, I want you to hold his legs.

[760] And Hal is in the full little gown.

[761] And so Hal's against the wall.

[762] And right when the doctor puts the needle in his lungs, Hal shits all over the nurse who's holding his legs.

[763] Do you not remember this story?

[764] No, I'm like all the details.

[765] I don't know why you do.

[766] Because I've never heard a story in my life where I thought it was going in one direction.

[767] And it was about how tough he was.

[768] He was flirting with her?

[769] And was the doctor and him going to fight?

[770] And I'm like, hell is shit all over the nerve?

[771] That's what his story is about.

[772] I do not remember that.

[773] How could you have forgotten that story?

[774] I remember the next day you going, I just wonder what part of that was real.

[775] And I was like, man, don't you dare let logic stand in the way of a story of this magnitude.

[776] Just allow yourself to think that happened.

[777] Oh, that's true.

[778] I think another fun thing.

[779] So one of the very scary things was like all the river work and the jumping.

[780] The next thing is Bart the Bear.

[781] Oh, God.

[782] I tell that story all the time.

[783] Wait, I want to, okay.

[784] We want to hear your version because we've heard that and I want to see the comparison.

[785] I bet Bart the Bear comes up on this podcast more than any other thing from my career.

[786] Like Cedar Point, Bart the Bear.

[787] There's some stories we could probably recite.

[788] Oh, you know Cedar Point, don't you?

[789] Yeah, it was.

[790] Yeah.

[791] It was the best.

[792] It was the best.

[793] I can't.

[794] That was like a family vacation.

[795] Tudipot was a favorite vacation.

[796] I know, I know.

[797] This is a run -in -up because anyone who's from Michigan are even around there, we'll start talking and drives her fucking nuts.

[798] And by the way, we all say the same exact.

[799] It's the best.

[800] The best.

[801] Low red.

[802] So happy for you guys.

[803] White trash place in the world.

[804] Okay, so your version is a barth -the -bear.

[805] Yeah, so Bart gets there, right?

[806] He's taking like seven or eight stops.

[807] Utah, San Francisco, China, Australia, New Zealand.

[808] I thought it went to Alaska.

[809] Oh.

[810] Didn't he go up to Utah, Alaska, China?

[811] How many ports he needed to stop in?

[812] Or was this other work?

[813] Yeah, they had to stop like every four, three hours.

[814] Barts doing a bunch of appearances.

[815] Barts!

[816] He signed an autographs at the Alaska.

[817] BART!

[818] Crab Fair.

[819] Parts in Beijing signing all those.

[820] That is exactly.

[821] So he gets there.

[822] They all have this meeting.

[823] They're literally, anyone who's menstruating, please don't be on set.

[824] Okay, that's part of it.

[825] So they've got, like, a long ladled frying pan that they fill with coffee and whipped cream how hard that is to lift it like think about cleaning a pool how challenging that is and then balance a fucking frying pan and they would get this bear all hopped up on coffee and whipped cream and then they bring bard out bart's trainer talk like this and his son's there he's got a dart gun train duty yeah and so long as short of it is there's a scene where the camera's here bart is moving across the foreground and dachs and i are behind Now, listen, the bear has learned not to go over these little wires that literally will get you in the ankles.

[826] They're electrocuted little wires.

[827] During the training, they have been, but then they don't have them electrified when we're actually shooting.

[828] It's just precaution, and it's a psychological trick that they play with Bart the bear.

[829] This could be the moment that Bart was like, hey, these aren't on.

[830] Yeah.

[831] We don't know.

[832] So they get this shot, right?

[833] And we start shooting.

[834] Action!

[835] And the bear starts to walk across all the sides.

[836] I'm halfway through.

[837] The bear stops.

[838] And you hear the trainer goes, BART!

[839] No bar!

[840] No bar!

[841] They're like, don't look at the bear.

[842] And Dax and I are sitting there like, what the fuck?

[843] He's like, don't run!

[844] Don't parent boys!

[845] And the bear's like, oh, oh, and you can see the bear getting agitated.

[846] This is horrifying.

[847] He's like, don't look at the bear.

[848] And we're sitting in our underwear.

[849] Do you remember he tore the fake tree apart?

[850] He attacked.

[851] There was a fake tree.

[852] He just demolished this.

[853] fake tree.

[854] Like we saw his raft.

[855] Right there.

[856] And he's screaming.

[857] And we are like literally two naked men.

[858] We were dressed.

[859] Yeah.

[860] We were.

[861] All of our naked stuff.

[862] Oh, I'm embarrassed.

[863] But yeah.

[864] No, it's okay.

[865] It's embarrassed.

[866] And then you see his son with the gun trained on the Bart. What else did I forget?

[867] My version of course is here are the rules around Bart. If you're on your period, you can't come to sat.

[868] Two, don't look Bart in the eyes.

[869] Three, don't run in front of Bart. It'll trigger his predatorial instinct.

[870] and then don't be afraid around him because he can sense it.

[871] In the very first scene in the movie that you just set up, if you recall, my back is completely to Bart. You guys are staring at him and you guys are telling me to turn around there's a bear.

[872] I turn around, I look Bart directly in the eyes, I scream and then I run.

[873] And I was like, guys, I'm going to do three of the four things.

[874] I'm just not on my period.

[875] That's the only thing I am going for me. It was a wide shot.

[876] So there's nobody close to us on either side.

[877] It's nothing but darkness behind us.

[878] and the bear going across.

[879] And they, don't look at them, boys.

[880] Don't look at them.

[881] Okay, but now turn around and look at him and scream and run.

[882] And then the other weird one that happened was when Bart was thrashing that horse trailer.

[883] I mean, he needed to work, but he was in there thrashing the horse trailer.

[884] Everyone doesn't know what to do.

[885] And Doug got in the horse trailer by himself and shut the door.

[886] And we're listening and you keep hearing Doug go, no, no, Bart. No, Bart, no, Bart. And then the trailer moves around and then you hear, oh, Barr.

[887] Oh, but good boy, part.

[888] And clearly he's calmed him.

[889] And he would lay on top of dog, remember?

[890] That was the thing I remember the most was him laying on top of dog.

[891] Because you would all of a sudden hear that like, good boy, part.

[892] Oh, my God.

[893] It was madness, Monica.

[894] Yeah, I'm shocked you guys survived this movie.

[895] And everyone had the opportunities for all of us to die on that movie.

[896] And none of us did, guys.

[897] No. And everyone had a lot of scars that worked with.

[898] with Bart?

[899] Yeah, yeah.

[900] Except for Doug.

[901] Do you guys remember Doug's eyes?

[902] No. They were magic.

[903] They were like the most beautiful, soothing blue eyes.

[904] I'd ever seen, I was like, that's why he can get down with Bart the way he can't.

[905] Something about those eyes.

[906] Until you can't.

[907] Still a bear.

[908] That's right.

[909] Still a bear.

[910] Popped up on coffee and sugar.

[911] Exactly.

[912] That was crazy.

[913] Everything that happened on that movie is super imprinted for me because it's my first one.

[914] I probably remember so many details.

[915] That was like your 20.

[916] 29th movie.

[917] It was the first time that I had gotten a direct offer.

[918] It was the most I'd made on a movie at that point.

[919] It was the first time that the studio was like, yeah, we're going to put you on the poster on purpose.

[920] On purpose.

[921] You know what I mean?

[922] So there was a little bit of not pressure, but I was like, all right, guys, well, this is our shot.

[923] You leveled up and it was like a thing.

[924] Why didn't it level us up?

[925] It leveled you up.

[926] I never got a leading man role after that.

[927] That's so honest and true.

[928] And we talked about it.

[929] I got a lot of opportunities out of that.

[930] For sure.

[931] You guys were known quantities and I was this new thing and I was a part of something that worked and I got a ton of opportunities after that.

[932] I got to lead maybe three movies in a row right after.

[933] None of them worked.

[934] You'll be happy to know.

[935] So it was a short of...

[936] I don't be happy to know.

[937] I know you're always really funny.

[938] I do think it's funny.

[939] At that point in your career, because you were brand new, you had lots of ideas of what fame looked like.

[940] Lots of ideas of what money looked like.

[941] That was a big thing for you.

[942] You're like, this is what I'm doing if I ever make money and I look at your life now.

[943] You're doing very well.

[944] And the difference between that moment and now.

[945] Yeah, you were so rich to me. It's so funny.

[946] And you probably said so.

[947] Did he say so?

[948] I don't know, but I went to your house in Pasadena and I was like, oh, my God.

[949] Look at this pool and he is a Porsche.

[950] And I think that's funny now because it's not who you are now.

[951] It's also not who you are now.

[952] And what's funny is I got the money when I stopped trying to get the money.

[953] That's how it always goes.

[954] Has anything to do with money.

[955] No. It's the Mike Tyson quote.

[956] He goes, when someone tells me, that having a lot of money will make you happy.

[957] What I know about that person is they've never had a lot of money.

[958] And I'm like, whoa, that cuts right.

[959] But if I had told 26 -year -old docs that that was the case, you'd be like, fuck you, you're rich, you have no idea what you're talking.

[960] Yeah.

[961] Oh, I know.

[962] I say that all the time.

[963] I'm like, I'm passing the sign.

[964] I wouldn't listen.

[965] You're not going to listen unless you can experience it.

[966] Yeah, yeah.

[967] Well, I think movie -wise, unless there's any other scenes you guys think of that we should chat about, but I think now what would be fun is just what was happening off camera was so sweet and so fun we started in wellington in the north island of new zealand and then we were kind of on the road for the second half and when we were in new zealand you had an apartment i had an apartment you were at the intercontinental right just get that hotel life room service up yeah i'm surprised you guys didn't go for that well i was saving if you guys recall all my prudium yeah again back to the money fears i was like i got this per diem i got to save it remember you got like a nice apartment it was by a gym i'm like how much is that place How much of your per diem out you're spending?

[968] You're like, I'm not thinking about my per diem.

[969] That's what it's there for.

[970] I get the money.

[971] Oh, it was driving everything.

[972] And I saved all my per diem until I relapsed at the end of the movie.

[973] And then magically all of this per diem, by the time I got on the airplane, I had zero per diem.

[974] I was like, where'd all the per diem?

[975] Oh, that's right.

[976] I've been fucked up for four days.

[977] And now it's all completely gone.

[978] I just think your ability to express your own journey and sobriety publicly is incredible.

[979] It really is.

[980] Oh, thank you.

[981] I would be like, I can't share that.

[982] There was a lot of things for me that was going on, but one of them was, I was maybe two months sober when I got there.

[983] And it's like my first movie, and you guys are normal, so you can drink and have fun.

[984] And I feel like I'm missing out on that.

[985] And I don't know how much I was talking about.

[986] But I guess when Ethan arrived, I was really fucking happy because Ethan was also sober.

[987] I could at least commiserate with him.

[988] And he and I were both smoking six, 700 cigarettes a day, if you recall, drinking 5 ,000 black teas.

[989] But you quit cigarettes at one point when we were working together.

[990] And I remember specifically because we were out in the lake and you spit something out of your mouth that I had never seen before.

[991] And I was like, are you all right?

[992] And you said, yeah, I'm just not smoking cigarettes anymore.

[993] So all this shit is coming out.

[994] Oh, oh.

[995] Oh, oh.

[996] Oh, shit is coming out of the second you stop smoking, your lungs start doing the thing that they're supposed to do and start filtering all this shit out of your lungs.

[997] You wind up like coughing up all of the stuff that's getting trapped in.

[998] But he was sober too.

[999] Well, he quit smoking weed.

[1000] The athleticism required.

[1001] I just knew it was going to be endurance challenge.

[1002] And also, it was like a first big opportunity.

[1003] I was like, I do not want to be at all cloudy.

[1004] I'm going to run my program.

[1005] I'll find my moments to sleep.

[1006] I'm going to eat what I need to eat.

[1007] I'll exercise when I need to exercise.

[1008] Like everything for the movie at that point.

[1009] And I knew that smoking the way I liked to smoke.

[1010] He wasn't smoking weeds, but he drank.

[1011] People were buying me shots all night.

[1012] Walking in New Zealand with Seth.

[1013] He is the most recognizable celebrity.

[1014] I look exactly like me. Exactly like you.

[1015] And you refused to wear a baseball hat.

[1016] I was still a little bit like, what?

[1017] I'm just going to a movie.

[1018] Let me be a people.

[1019] Oh, my God.

[1020] And we have to surround him to get him out.

[1021] I loved it.

[1022] And you're like, I'm in the movie, too.

[1023] Hi, I'm Dax.

[1024] This punk down here he is not.

[1025] Okay.

[1026] But then all that to say, one of you two, I feel like it was you, Matt, got the idea, let's rent.

[1027] There's this spectacular house.

[1028] Oh, yeah.

[1029] The king of Thailand.

[1030] Had built some crazy house.

[1031] He didn't live there.

[1032] And he was just about to run it out for the first time.

[1033] And you figured that out.

[1034] And you were like, let's all share this.

[1035] I was like, oh, okay, that'll be all my per diem, but yeah, that is just, like, as special as it gets.

[1036] And we were playing games.

[1037] Yes, you were making us do a thing we had to be.

[1038] Running charades.

[1039] Oh, love it.

[1040] That's so much fun.

[1041] My birthday every year will play, like, celebrity, running charades.

[1042] You told us we all had to bring five minutes of our favorite movie.

[1043] Coffee and Clips.

[1044] Oh, what is that?

[1045] That's funny.

[1046] Coffee and Clips is you ask people to bring a clip of a movie.

[1047] It can be anything, three to five minutes long.

[1048] You just have to have a reasonable.

[1049] why you've chosen it.

[1050] Oh.

[1051] So you show the clip and then you sort of have a conversation about why that clip means something to you what film.

[1052] It's sort of like a great way to get to know people because you're like sharing like this reminds me and my dad.

[1053] Very cool.

[1054] Even within that is I think also what was an interesting dynamic between all of us which is it's impossible that the symmetry could work so well but no one was in each other's lanes and I say this with real respect.

[1055] Matt's a fucking artist.

[1056] He loves acting.

[1057] He loves teaching.

[1058] he loves learning you're like a such a beautiful real artist and set was like in the middle of that spectrum great reverie for it a professional but also can pop in or out and then i don't know what i do back in improv and i don't have much reverie for any of it and it was so fun like we all had such different approaches to what we were doing and then i would even say like you're very alpha you're the leader of wherever you're at and i'm kind of the leader but we're such different ones that there was never, at least from my point of view.

[1059] No, never.

[1060] Never.

[1061] Just like love and coexistence.

[1062] And then you are your own version of alpha, which is like you've never done anything you didn't want to do ever.

[1063] Period.

[1064] It's not happening.

[1065] Maybe not on film.

[1066] But you know, you're a very convicted person in a really admirable way.

[1067] You know what you like and what you believe and you're not easily swayed.

[1068] So, you know, that it just gelled the way it did is kind of magic.

[1069] You know, something I look back on that experience.

[1070] specifically.

[1071] And I think that a lot of people, like, go off and have college experiences.

[1072] They're in a fraternity, they're in whatever.

[1073] We have this moment.

[1074] You're together.

[1075] You're inseparable.

[1076] You're through thick and thief, you're thick as thieves, through thin, through thick.

[1077] I got it.

[1078] I got that part out.

[1079] No. I got to leave that.

[1080] I'm sorry.

[1081] Yeah.

[1082] Thank you.

[1083] Rob, what's a great metaphor for?

[1084] It all just comes together.

[1085] No, but we were together and we're thick as thieves and together all the time.

[1086] and there is that bond.

[1087] Who do you think changed the most?

[1088] Circumstances or as a person?

[1089] Not circumstance, as a person.

[1090] We've just watched him mature and evolve into this role in a way that I think we both saw coming, at least as a possibility.

[1091] What are you talking about?

[1092] When we work together, I'm like, oh, this guy could do it.

[1093] Don't make missteps and you crush this.

[1094] You got the right attitude.

[1095] You definitely got the goods.

[1096] You just got to show up and do the job, like actually do the job.

[1097] You didn't make a great case for it at the press junk.

[1098] I wouldn't have bet on me. Oh, I'm not saying I wouldn't abet.

[1099] And I don't mean career -wise.

[1100] Let's just fast forward to the end of the movie.

[1101] So I had been sober the whole movie.

[1102] We get to the last like five days.

[1103] Well, I know exactly what specifically happened is when I would go out with you, I would always order a Red Bull and you would get a Red Bull vodka.

[1104] I was at the bar, fully intending to stay sober.

[1105] And I ordered a Red Bull.

[1106] And I grabbed it and I took a huge pull.

[1107] And it was Vaca.

[1108] Like right when it hit my throat, I was like, oh, fuck.

[1109] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[1110] I was like, you know, alcohol is such a specific feeling in your throat.

[1111] I was like, oh, I already drank that.

[1112] I'm like, what am I going to do right now?

[1113] Oh, boy.

[1114] And I'm like, I was going to drink the rest of this Red Bull.

[1115] Oh, fuck.

[1116] So I drank the rest of the Red Bull.

[1117] No further issue that night.

[1118] A couple days went by.

[1119] I was like, yeah, look at that.

[1120] I had a drink.

[1121] Shut up for work.

[1122] Everything's groovy.

[1123] I'm like, I'm going to get a bottle of wine when I go home.

[1124] And I'm just going to drink one glass.

[1125] And then I did that.

[1126] successfully.

[1127] We're doing all right.

[1128] Next night, same.

[1129] Cut two.

[1130] It was the Saturday party.

[1131] The sunup party.

[1132] You guys remember us?

[1133] We were shooting through the night and I'm like, I'm going to have a party at my apartment in Wellington when we wrap.

[1134] And I took all my per diem.

[1135] It guaranteed us we were going to wrap in daylight.

[1136] And then we had two days off.

[1137] It was like the last shot of the week.

[1138] And then I'm like, fuck it.

[1139] I did great.

[1140] We have one day left.

[1141] I think maybe I'm going to host a party.

[1142] Before we wrapped, you said, hey, the locals have something they're calling crank.

[1143] And I'm so no. No. P. They called it P. You're like, it's basically like bathtub crank.

[1144] I think it comes from a big pen, like the faculty.

[1145] And I was like, I don't like anything.

[1146] Come to find out.

[1147] I'm just going to get a lot of it.

[1148] Many members of our crew were fully on P the whole time, which was not revealed until this party I hosted.

[1149] So we have a party at my apartment that starts at like 8 a .m. There's like probably 30 people from the crew.

[1150] You're there.

[1151] People are there.

[1152] I'm not there.

[1153] You knew that this was not a good idea.

[1154] I had a wife and kid.

[1155] I mean, I was in a dude.

[1156] They were like, we're going to get some weed.

[1157] And I was like, you know what?

[1158] I'm going to smoke a joint.

[1159] It's in the daylight, during the sun.

[1160] I'll be the first time in three months.

[1161] All the work is behind us enough that I'm going to take this moment.

[1162] I also think I would have jumped in.

[1163] I also don't know if I was invited me. I'm pretty sure I would have been like, bro, do not fucking do that.

[1164] Separating yourself from the situation, though.

[1165] I am.

[1166] You're a very good guy and you would have tried to help.

[1167] And maybe you knew that, which is maybe why you didn't invite him.

[1168] Yeah, oh, I'm certain I invited him.

[1169] I'm sure.

[1170] For whatever reason, he wasn't there.

[1171] Everything is kind of kosher.

[1172] I don't remember his name, and I don't even want to single him up.

[1173] But there was a dude that was hanging around that had been one of the characters in Lord of the Rings.

[1174] And he was an enormous dude.

[1175] He was a stunt man and an actor.

[1176] And he was like 6 '4 and Maori and like 300 pounds.

[1177] We party.

[1178] The normal people leave.

[1179] All of a sudden, the pee comes out.

[1180] I'm smoking pee with the crew members.

[1181] This turns into like a two -day thing.

[1182] Turns into me hanging with this dude who's enormous.

[1183] He's like, do you want to get some mess?

[1184] ecstasy yes cut to me and him on four hits of ecstasy i've been awake for two days and this whole time i'm around him because i'm so afraid he's so strong i have to find out i'm like would you like to wrestle he's like absolutely cut to us wrestling for 40 minutes on ecstasy in my apartment day two somehow get through the last day of work and then the rap party i don't know if you guys remember the rap party but i had had so many hits to x my lips were like so big and drew was like, what is happening with your mouth?

[1185] I'm like, I've been chewing on it for the last three days.

[1186] I'm pee and my God.

[1187] I actually left the rap party after only a half an hour and flew to New York to shoot Sesame Street.

[1188] So I was just having a completely different experience.

[1189] Yeah, yeah.

[1190] I find that so heartbreaking.

[1191] You do.

[1192] Yeah, I know.

[1193] I find it so heartbreaking.

[1194] I know that your candor is like part of your superpower, but it just makes me so sad that that's how it ended yeah i remember on the plane ride home i was flying back sitting next to braille he's like observed the last week of this experience and how quickly it ratcheted up and he goes you know i was like bummed you didn't drink and i'd be fun to party with dax and having witnessed it you shouldn't don't do this and i was like already in the shame of having done all that i just remember that flight home him just real talking me that's one of those moments where like an adult or as much of an adult as you have is like, hey, man, don't fuck this up.

[1195] Yes.

[1196] That's a job.

[1197] I think at some point you said to me, you're like, the difference between you and me is that you can have a drink and be fine.

[1198] I immediately start to think, well, where am I going to get my next drink?

[1199] What time does the liquor store close on Sunday?

[1200] There's a Friday.

[1201] I go, okay, I'm going to go buy bottles for Saturday, but I know I'm going to go through it.

[1202] So on Sunday, I need to make sure I have drinks through the night.

[1203] And then I end up at LAX smoking crack.

[1204] Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[1205] There is no end to the chase.

[1206] Until the body collapses.

[1207] My fear of leaving that state where I don't have insecurities and worries and fears to leave it, I'd rather be dead.

[1208] So I go until the body goes, that's it.

[1209] We're turning you off, you know.

[1210] Well, that got heavy.

[1211] Yeah, it usually does.

[1212] Yeah.

[1213] Yeah, addiction is the fucking worst.

[1214] The upside is like, also thank fucking God.

[1215] I made it through 95 % of the movie.

[1216] I would have ruined that whole experience if I hadn't at least held it together as long as I did.

[1217] You wouldn't be in this seat right now.

[1218] Hollywood would have been like, that kid can't trust him.

[1219] You would not have going to do four more movies to understand that there's real value to you.

[1220] You got to the point where you were able to, in your addiction, love yourself.

[1221] I think, I know nothing about it.

[1222] Yeah, yeah.

[1223] Not that I don't have my own issues.

[1224] Yeah, you chose yourself at some point.

[1225] Yeah, I read Tom Arnold's book, which has the best title ever.

[1226] like how I lose seven pounds in 10 years or something like that.

[1227] Roughly the name of the book.

[1228] He said in that book, luckily, the only thing I was addicted to more than cocaine was wanting to be famous.

[1229] I knew I would lose this other thing I wanted so bad.

[1230] It's the only thing I wanted worse than cocaine.

[1231] And in some level, that was true because I got sober for without a paddle.

[1232] I came home.

[1233] I was fucked up for a period from that relapse.

[1234] Then I got sober for idiocracy.

[1235] then press tour, which is its own funny.

[1236] We could do a whole episode on just our press tour.

[1237] We talk about it on sets, original episode on our show.

[1238] Nine cities and 13 days.

[1239] It was so fun and insane and way too much work for anybody.

[1240] What's your funnest moment from the press tour?

[1241] Was it Wrigleyfield in Chicago?

[1242] Oh, that was fun.

[1243] We threw out the first pitch.

[1244] But it was that whole night was so insane.

[1245] I shot video of you eating the deep dish pizza that still makes me laugh.

[1246] Because we just had a real conversation about how good pizza was.

[1247] And then it turned into a bit of us just eating the pizza and weeping over the quality of the pizza.

[1248] So, Dax is just like, I'm just so hungry.

[1249] The thing I remember most about the whole experience is that the two of you always had bits.

[1250] We're always on.

[1251] We'll start to be the same voice.

[1252] And we're so annoying to be around.

[1253] And Heather was like, have fun today.

[1254] Good luck, getting a word and edge bus.

[1255] Because the two of you make each other laugh.

[1256] You bring each other legitimate joy.

[1257] And so the two of them, at a table, like 15 people, like, giggit, giggi, diggy, diggy, diggy, diggy, diggy, diggy.

[1258] And in that period, we had a good impersonation.

[1259] We were doing an old man voice a lot.

[1260] We were constantly going like, well, those are some decadent penis.

[1261] You had been workshopping this character because you were building your own version of Fletch, which I was like, so excited.

[1262] I'm like, this is what you do.

[1263] And he's like, all my heroes, Steve Martin, it's Will Farrell.

[1264] You write your movie.

[1265] You say, I'm this character.

[1266] and that he had all these characters who was workshopping, and you had this southern gentleman who was a refined, sophisticated fella, He saw himself as an official idol of the nuts.

[1267] It must have been maddening for you.

[1268] It was hilarious when you're surrounded by people that are authentically funny.

[1269] There have been a couple times in my life, I'm like, I'm funny, I'm charming, but these two men are the two funniest people in that space.

[1270] I would try to compete.

[1271] I learned this about myself.

[1272] I can't compete at that.

[1273] that level.

[1274] Yeah.

[1275] So you just sit back and enjoy.

[1276] Or get annoyed.

[1277] Either's fair.

[1278] Or walk away.

[1279] My favorite memory on the press tour is at some point you had two women that you had brought to the plane to go over the border.

[1280] I was like you guys, how are they going to get back?

[1281] It doesn't matter.

[1282] I was like, they need passports.

[1283] You don't have fucking passports.

[1284] You can't just get them on the plane.

[1285] We fell in love in an interview.

[1286] None of that is true.

[1287] I did.

[1288] We were in Canada and we met some press women journalists that were young women comparable age and they were both like very professional we're like listen why don't we go off for dinner tonight come me just at the airport because we got to fly out but we have at least an hour then the plane is grounded we're like hey we're here through the night maybe this is a thing and the whole press store we were like get on the plane with us every city and people were like they were trying to get women on the plane time to remind people you were in an open relationship yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes we're in an open relationship?

[1289] Yes, how could you not remember that?

[1290] I don't remember.

[1291] We were very open about that.

[1292] It was pretty open.

[1293] We would always tell people.

[1294] Stay tuned for more armchair expert, if you dare.

[1295] Okay, my two favorite memories are one, I was always so hung up on where we were going to sit, because all three of us would go do all these shows all around the country.

[1296] Clearly, one of you two should be next to the host.

[1297] It's debatable who's more famous, right?

[1298] Well, we know we're Shepard sitting.

[1299] He's sitting like, wherever the third seat is the whole trip.

[1300] We're doing some weird local sports show in Philadelphia, and you two are right next to the host, and I'm just, like, out in fucking left field, and I'm now bored, and there's a boxing glove on display, and I just grab the boxing glove, and I put it on, and you're, like, mid -sentence and I fucking push you on the shoulders, because this is at the end.

[1301] Like, we had gone, bonkers, and I just fucking blasted you in the shoulder with a boxing glove.

[1302] You turn around.

[1303] Like, I'm wearing a boxing glove all of a sudden.

[1304] They had a finally wide mountain show who's the third guy in the roof.

[1305] I don't remember that, by the way.

[1306] But I do think that that was when they asked you about Family Guy, because Family Guy was down.

[1307] Oh, yeah, we were on the air.

[1308] You were on Family Guy.

[1309] Cut to, it's still.

[1310] It's been on 25 years.

[1311] That's crazy.

[1312] This part of the story plays into the family guy.

[1313] So we had a little gap between interviews, and we were all hungry, and we went to a Chili's.

[1314] That was in the parking lot of a mall.

[1315] in Philadelphia, and we get in the restaurant and we're sitting at a booth looking out the window and Seth goes, oh my God, this is where my mother used to drop me off for the bus that would take me to summer camp.

[1316] No. And she drove such a piece of shit.

[1317] I would always want her to drop me off, like, really far away from the bus, but it's a big open parking lot.

[1318] It's hard to hide.

[1319] And on this one occasion, she pulled into the lot and the car was engulfed in flames.

[1320] caught fire in front of all these kids he didn't want to know and I'm on the bus like trying to make time with this cool girl I'm like hey we're going to spend the weekend together what are you into is that your mom's car on that's a poor kid no way that is crazy no way there's also where he pitched robot chicken yeah I was like that's the dumbest idea I've ever heard and katje he has a studio so back to family guys I don't know what it was three years ago it was very public that the the core actors had signed an incredible deal for an incredible amount of money per episode and that they ordered two years right out of the gates.

[1321] And I read this article and I sent it to Seth and I said, first of all, congratulations.

[1322] I am so fucking proud of you.

[1323] Also, I think you should go buy a brand new Cadillac and set it on fire in the mall and build it off it and say, fuck y 'all.

[1324] Yes.

[1325] I can burn this bitch.

[1326] That is so funny.

[1327] You remember the text?

[1328] I do.

[1329] I love it.

[1330] I had to remind you.

[1331] I just don't have that kind of impulse in my heart.

[1332] I'm not thinking about any of the people in that city or neighborhood or that parking lot or that summer camp.

[1333] Did you have a money thing?

[1334] No. I read a lot.

[1335] I took psychedelics when I was 16 and I really got through a lot of the things that most people take a much longer time to go through.

[1336] Yeah.

[1337] When I met Seth, I was walking into Paramount for something and I see Seth Green pull in to the guard shack.

[1338] And of course, I know Seth Green.

[1339] He's famous and he's rich.

[1340] And he pulls in.

[1341] He's driving a Honda Civic.

[1342] And I was like, what is this guy doing driving a Honda Civic?

[1343] Seth was like known for this.

[1344] He drove a Honda Civic.

[1345] We hung out a ton.

[1346] You and I are fucking bros. We got back for him without a pedal.

[1347] We did not stop.

[1348] He had a little apartment in the valley with all these toys on the wall.

[1349] Uh -huh.

[1350] And he built a tree inside the place.

[1351] He never had any kind of flash at all.

[1352] No. But it's admirable if you, especially you're saying with your mom and the car and the show.

[1353] shoes.

[1354] And I feel like most people would be compensating for that for a while if they had the means, which you did.

[1355] When I say like self -conviction, like you know yourself and you're really not trying to appease anyone.

[1356] Yeah.

[1357] When you're this height with this face, you got to figure out how you fit in.

[1358] Perfect bud.

[1359] Well, I don't know where you guys rank it, but it never got better.

[1360] I am so lucky that I got that experience with you two guys.

[1361] Ditto.

[1362] It's one of these things, too, where it's like, I think that experience was nine months.

[1363] Because, you know, I have so many memories about it.

[1364] How long was it?

[1365] It was three full months.

[1366] There's no doubt that that's the most fun I've ever had on a film.

[1367] It's easily the best relationships I've ever made on a film that persevere.

[1368] I mean, we don't see each other, but I love the two of you.

[1369] I've always said that.

[1370] And I feel like it's beloved.

[1371] It doesn't matter what that movie did financially.

[1372] That's one of the highlights of my life, without a doubt.

[1373] I told you guys when it was happening that what was happening was rare.

[1374] Like I've worked on a lot of movies, especially location movies, stuff where you get the luxury of that summer camp vibe where everybody is there.

[1375] And I've done it at the smallest scale on like a shitty independent horror movie, and I've done it on that huge scale.

[1376] Where the studios got like lobster in your craft services, you know what I mean?

[1377] There's an excessive version of it.

[1378] It doesn't necessarily make it better.

[1379] of when it works, when everybody on it has something that they need to prove, and nobody's trying to prove the same thing, when it actually is just working the way it's supposed to work.

[1380] It is so rare.

[1381] This is fun.

[1382] You know, it's so fun.

[1383] Back to, like, looking at yourself and going like, I can't believe I hated how I looked.

[1384] I would say additionally, that movie's not the work I've done that I'm proudest of, and that's the movie that would get traded last.

[1385] Right.

[1386] So it's like results versus experience.

[1387] It's not like I look at the results of that movie.

[1388] And I'm like, yeah, that's my finest moment.

[1389] Not by far.

[1390] I had so much to learn.

[1391] But the last one I would trade, maybe hit and run a movie I directed with Kristen.

[1392] But other than that, that'd be the last on the list of things I would ever lose my memory.

[1393] Yeah, I don't ever want to be.

[1394] So let me ask you a question.

[1395] What did your daughters think?

[1396] They loved it.

[1397] Did they?

[1398] You know what's really great about the movie?

[1399] And I think this went away in comedy.

[1400] He's like, there are set pieces.

[1401] One after another, there's a bear chasing somebody, a bear chasing somebody, a bear.

[1402] carrying somebody.

[1403] There's stakes.

[1404] We're panic.

[1405] Then there's an ATV chase.

[1406] The physical comedy works in that movie like crazy.

[1407] I think it's also funny just to let people know that we thought we were making diner.

[1408] We were certain of it.

[1409] We thought we were making a coming of age, diner, young adult.

[1410] And we all saw it.

[1411] And we were like, I love Brill and I loved a line.

[1412] But we were all a little bum when we came out of the first screening.

[1413] Well, because it's just like, Like, here's what you need to know, and literally nothing else.

[1414] And we had all done this scene with the dead kids' mom and, like, got handed the box.

[1415] And this was important for our friend.

[1416] And we were all in it as actors talking about, well, what was our life like when we were kids?

[1417] Well, clearly we played Indiana Jones and, like, just trying to break it down psychologically to follow the thread of these characters.

[1418] And so they told us early on, Brill was like, yeah, we're going to reshoot some fuck the funeral scene.

[1419] We're going to have you guys find the box in the tree house now.

[1420] You'll discover it.

[1421] Why is the mom?

[1422] She just lost her son.

[1423] Everything's sad.

[1424] He's like, we got to get into the adventure.

[1425] So we did those pickup shots.

[1426] And then you see it.

[1427] When you watch the movie, you can see, oh, shit, nothing matters until we're on the water.

[1428] Yeah.

[1429] The truth is, they were right.

[1430] Yes.

[1431] Yeah, they were.

[1432] It was a movie for 12 -year -olds.

[1433] That's why it worked.

[1434] And it should have been a movie for 12 years.

[1435] And it didn't really matter that we thought we were making diner in the woods.

[1436] But our intent, our sincerity.

[1437] Yeah.

[1438] All of that is palpable.

[1439] Even if you only catch, like, a moment of it, because we did all of the actual emotional work in the margins when you watch these quick clips there's no doubt from the audience that you feel the way you feel that we're going through what we're going through yeah i was really as much as i was hating my stuff i was aware of it at the time but you're really really really great in it you're really great matt and i want to do this podcast every week you can relisten i'm expecting all of us to have a little leg on her face and i watch you i'm like you did as good as a person could do in that role You were really great.

[1440] Thank you.

[1441] You didn't really watch it, did you?

[1442] No, I asked my son who's 16.

[1443] I was like, hey, you want to watch the movie?

[1444] He's like, I've seen it like six times.

[1445] My kids have all watched it.

[1446] It's really fun because your kids are young.

[1447] They're going through the journey of what it's like to have parents that are famous.

[1448] And so you're like, at some point, you don't even register.

[1449] And at some point, all the kids in your life register, so you start to register in a different way.

[1450] And then as they get older, there's a deeper appreciation for what you do.

[1451] We're now at that point where my kids are going back and watching it.

[1452] SLC and watching these little good or bad movies in my past.

[1453] It's kind of a cool gift.

[1454] I was never able to go watch my parents as young people and recognize, oh, they were people and they were young ones.

[1455] It is kind of a neat thing that our kids have the option to do if they wanted.

[1456] All that to say, I love you guys so much.

[1457] The love is never dissipated at all.

[1458] It really was real.

[1459] When I see you in public, I'll just hug the fuck out of me. I'll declare on a microphone.

[1460] I love you.

[1461] Hey, Matt.

[1462] I do.

[1463] I see you.

[1464] I love you.

[1465] Dax, I have seen you from the moment we met.

[1466] And I tell you with all sincerity, I love you.

[1467] Well, I feel it.

[1468] You guys, thanks for doing this.

[1469] When you called, I was like, oh, how fun.

[1470] Let's do the 40.

[1471] Let's do the 30 and the 40.

[1472] I don't remember anything now.

[1473] I know.

[1474] We'll hear how the stories change, the same stories, how they change in 10 years.

[1475] The bear will now be two bears and a cheetah.

[1476] Exactly.

[1477] All right.

[1478] Well, I love you guys.

[1479] I love you.

[1480] Yeah, it was good, bud.

[1481] Stick around for the fact check Because they're human They make lots of mistakes Because Lillard wore a hat And it made you want to wear a hat I was like, oh yeah I guess you can wear a hat in here He makes the rules Because I can't wear a hat upstairs Because of headphones Yeah it's like we can do so much stuff We can wear hair in all kinds of ways It's almost too much freedom Too many options Yeah Is that your shirt on the ground?

[1482] Yeah I didn't know where to put it Where would you have put it?

[1483] Not on top of the trash can.

[1484] That'd be crazy.

[1485] What kind of shirt?

[1486] Can't be in frame.

[1487] What is it?

[1488] It's my guinea tea, my tank top.

[1489] You call that a guinea tea?

[1490] Yeah.

[1491] Is that what it's called?

[1492] It's preferable to wifebeater, right?

[1493] People don't love wife beater.

[1494] Yeah, interesting.

[1495] Yeah.

[1496] So it's rebranded as guinea tea?

[1497] Although I hope they know wife feeder's not like celebrating wife beating.

[1498] It's just that it seems like an inordinate of men of men who did that were wearing those tops.

[1499] It's not good for that, the guinea tea.

[1500] For haines?

[1501] No. Yeah, for ha.

[1502] No, no, no. But it needs a specific, to call it a tank top's not totally accurate either, right?

[1503] It's so specific.

[1504] David Letterman's dinner table.

[1505] Yes.

[1506] I wouldn't go that far.

[1507] This is our first garage fact check.

[1508] Previously black mold paradise.

[1509] Yeah, RIP.

[1510] I can't believe this was that place.

[1511] I can't either.

[1512] I mean, I know intellectually my drum set was right there.

[1513] And yeah, I can't even really.

[1514] There was Amir there too.

[1515] shitty air conditioners water everywhere mold growing up sure rats it's quite a transformation it is it is impressive it had rats and now it has mice i don't think there's anything anymore because i put out a lot of no i'm a mouse oh right sorry sorry sorry sorry i missed that where are you coming from oh the dermatologist how'd that go well is it does it hurt when they give you that shot or you're used to it i'm just so tough high tolerance yeah high pain tolerance um for people who don't know what we're talking about, you'll have to listen to next week's next week's fact check.

[1516] Check out the December 15th fact check for the Easterer.

[1517] I wish you were watching Chimp Crazy.

[1518] Simply because the woman in it, she's, I mean, I applaud her on some levels.

[1519] She lets them film her during all of her procedures.

[1520] And she's always in there getting lip filler or spray tanning, traditional sun tanning booth but she's in this massage chair at one point and she has so much numbing cream all over her lips because it checked and it just looks like there's icing on her lips but it's caking up in corners and then it's falling off and then she grabs her water and she's like they tell you not to drink when you have this on your energy glug glug glug glug glug glug glug and clearly there's numbing cream just going down her throat yeah oh boy yeah what's weird is you know we're full of contradictions as we talk about on here all the time.

[1521] And I'm four.

[1522] I am pro.

[1523] Obviously, I have chin filler.

[1524] I have some Botox now.

[1525] Oh, was that new to?

[1526] Or you?

[1527] Well, that was on the same day.

[1528] Oh, okay.

[1529] Was that your first round of?

[1530] Yeah.

[1531] That's the first time I've ever done anything.

[1532] Your face is very alive still.

[1533] In fact, just now you raise your eyebrows.

[1534] I was like, okay, well, good.

[1535] We have still a lot of mobility.

[1536] He gave me the, I think it's phrased as the I think it's pronounced placebo the like actors dose or something and so it is you still can have movement and emotion minimal movement but have you seen my befores and afters?

[1537] No. I'll show you.

[1538] Do you think they're dramatic?

[1539] Yes, I can tell.

[1540] I mean, yeah, they are.

[1541] Okay.

[1542] Because I have zero ethical issue with Botox.

[1543] I could care less if people use it.

[1544] But I do miss the movement of some people's faces.

[1545] Oh, sure.

[1546] You know.

[1547] Well, I, this is the contradiction.

[1548] I am for people doing whatever they want to make themselves happy when they look in the mirror.

[1549] Yeah.

[1550] But I also do have some sadness.

[1551] The reason I feel like I have to say this is now we're on camera and people saw me go.

[1552] Oh, yeah.

[1553] When you were talking about this lady.

[1554] And it's because I feel sad that she's obviously so uncomfortable with the way she looks.

[1555] Oh, yeah.

[1556] That she has to go, you know, medically changes.

[1557] She's also owning, like, a champ, too.

[1558] Like, there's a lot happening with her.

[1559] I know.

[1560] It makes me sad.

[1561] She's an enormous wig on.

[1562] It's, like, the biggest wig.

[1563] Everything's a costume and a shield and an armor.

[1564] Yes.

[1565] And that's that.

[1566] Okay, here they are.

[1567] Oh, my goodness.

[1568] They prepared, like, a whole file for you.

[1569] Yeah, they did.

[1570] Oh, my God.

[1571] I love that they made you go like that.

[1572] Yeah, you have to make very specific expression so they can.

[1573] Before I get into trouble, just what sides is what?

[1574] You'll be.

[1575] I'm not going to tell you.

[1576] I'll know.

[1577] Uh -huh.

[1578] if you don't know that will be fascinating and we know what's really cute though is it looks to me first of all you look eight years old for whatever reason this makes you look very young and tiny okay yeah what's cute though is that you're kind of you have a little tiny smile on the right because like you know it's post that's because my new face yes exactly exactly so it's like they're not apples to apples because you're like no i think part of it is there is a slight upturn That's part of what they did.

[1579] Okay.

[1580] Yeah, I see.

[1581] I see.

[1582] Do you see looking at me right now that my mouth is a little upturned?

[1583] Yeah, but you just turned it up a little bit.

[1584] This is my favorite photo.

[1585] I know.

[1586] I know.

[1587] They really make you do something.

[1588] That was the direction in this photo.

[1589] You've just smelled something very pungent.

[1590] Hors shit.

[1591] Sticky salmon.

[1592] Like, even dog poop wouldn't be.

[1593] You know what horse shit can sometimes be.

[1594] sharp.

[1595] Like when you're in Central Park, you're like, oh, it's like, it's like, it singes your nostrils.

[1596] Yeah.

[1597] Okay.

[1598] In this one, I'm seeing the Botox difference.

[1599] That's what we're seeing.

[1600] You still scrunch your face.

[1601] Again, like you're just happier in this one because you're, I know, because you're happier.

[1602] No, I'm not happy.

[1603] That's how my resting face is now.

[1604] It's like this.

[1605] It is funny.

[1606] Side by side, I can see a difference.

[1607] Yeah.

[1608] Just if I just bump into you, I'm not going like, what have you done?

[1609] Yeah.

[1610] You know what's sweet, though?

[1611] You got a post.

[1612] these now.

[1613] Oh, God.

[1614] You know what's sweet is when my parents were in town and we had dinner one night.

[1615] Then the next day, I told them that I had shin filler.

[1616] I forgot to tell them.

[1617] Yeah, yeah.

[1618] And or did you have any reservation about telling them?

[1619] Like, did you feel like they were going to be disappointed?

[1620] Like, hey, we made you.

[1621] Perfect.

[1622] I mean, I didn't really care.

[1623] Yeah.

[1624] Sure.

[1625] I really care.

[1626] Yeah.

[1627] Yeah.

[1628] But I was like, oh, I got this.

[1629] And my dad said, I knew something was different about your face.

[1630] He did.

[1631] Yeah, he's like, I didn't know what it was, but I could tell something was different.

[1632] Really?

[1633] Yeah, and I thought that was sweet, actually.

[1634] It is.

[1635] He knows his baby.

[1636] Yeah.

[1637] We definitely notice, like, sometimes night to night.

[1638] A little changes.

[1639] Yeah, Lincoln will wake up, and I'm like, oh, my God, you look just a little bit different this morning.

[1640] Yeah, that's sweet.

[1641] It's really weird.

[1642] It's cute.

[1643] Speaking of looking different.

[1644] Without a paddle, ding, ding, ding.

[1645] Okay, well, now's the time that I guess I was going to, I didn't know when I was going to do this, but I have a surprise for you.

[1646] Oh, my God, I love surprises.

[1647] So I, we have a message for you.

[1648] Oh, okay.

[1649] Okay.

[1650] Do I have to guess who the sender is?

[1651] Or it'll be so obvious.

[1652] Well, that's what I'm wondering.

[1653] Should I tell you now or do you want to wait?

[1654] Do you want it to become?

[1655] You build it.

[1656] Let's build it.

[1657] Okay.

[1658] If you build it.

[1659] It'll come.

[1660] You'll come.

[1661] You'll, I mean.

[1662] they'll come but it's singular i'll come okay it's C -O -M -E no it's i thought it was if you build it they will come oh i thought it was it will come no they the people come watch the baseball game oh i've never seen you even know what it's from yeah it's from field of dreams but i've never seen it yeah it builds a baseball field of corn but i thought it was like a metaphor like if you build it it will come like your dreams will come true the field of dreams yeah sure that's an easy Yeah, I made some of my songs.

[1663] Misunderstanding.

[1664] Okay, ready?

[1665] Yeah.

[1666] 20 years ago, we did an adventure movie.

[1667] In it, we did all the adventure things.

[1668] Rivers, rapids, guns, woods, bears, chases, fires, falls from great heights, ropes, but I swear the biggest best adventure was getting to know old Dax, a .k .a. Dan Shepard.

[1669] Shooting this shit with you was just as fun and exciting as shooting the rapids.

[1670] By the way, I went canoeing a few weeks ago on a placid lake, and it is exhausting and hard and boring.

[1671] It really made me realize how good you got at it.

[1672] We were also fearless.

[1673] We flew a deadly 500 -pound grizzly bear to New Zealand to stand five feet from you.

[1674] Matt was close, but you Dax were like two feet away from certain mauling.

[1675] This should have been and would have been all plates and CG if we did it now or if I was smarter, but we just did it.

[1676] You and the bear in the same frame.

[1677] And only a medium -built jet -lagged Wrangler with the club stuffed in his pants to protect you.

[1678] So dumb but fun.

[1679] You risked your life in pursuit of a moderately full.

[1680] funny scene.

[1681] Actually, I think it was very funny.

[1682] Moderately funny.

[1683] There was near death on and off the set throughout this movie, Wild Kiwi Water God stuntman going straight down impossible rapids and our production designer going straight down a possible staircase but we had fun.

[1684] I actually hate when actors, directors go on and on about how we had so much fun shooting a movie like that matters.

[1685] Oh, I'm so glad those rich, good looking pamper people had fun.

[1686] I would have hate for them to have been uncomfortable during that.

[1687] And I'm not sure I had fun making the movie but I sure had fun getting to know you, Dax and Seth, aka Squire and Matt aka Matt.

[1688] And I know I had fun watching you meet and work with Bert Reynolds.

[1689] That was cool.

[1690] Glad we made it out.

[1691] None of your post paddle journey and success is surprising.

[1692] It just confirms what I thought 20 years ago.

[1693] You are so talented engaging whip smart, funny and fucking awesome.

[1694] Love you.

[1695] Frill.

[1696] What a sweet message.

[1697] Yeah, it's nice.

[1698] Oh, what a sweet message.

[1699] He liked that.

[1700] He's such a good writer.

[1701] Oh yeah, that was fantastic.

[1702] He's such a good writer.

[1703] He has some emails that I have like thought like, I want to print this out and somehow keep this around in my life.

[1704] Yeah.

[1705] What a lovely message.

[1706] Stay tuned for more armchair expert if you dare.

[1707] I would say I often give Ashton so much credit for having discovered you saved me from the swamp i was drowning in uh but equally so brill because it was then quite another leap to take a guy from a reality show and think he should be the lead of your movie and he fought very hard to uh both get me in and then also um was so good at getting things out of me and yeah yeah yeah what a lovely thing how did you get a hold of him i texted him oh did you have his number already no i asked christin for I hope he doesn't feel hurt he wasn't here.

[1708] No, I just got caught up in that.

[1709] Oh, my gosh.

[1710] Oh, my gosh.

[1711] Four people's too many.

[1712] There is four people.

[1713] I mean, regaling.

[1714] Yeah.

[1715] Yeah, three was just barely juggled three.

[1716] Yeah, that's right.

[1717] That's right.

[1718] That's more of a panel situation.

[1719] I did want his voice involved.

[1720] Yeah.

[1721] Oh, what a sweet message.

[1722] I hope you'll forward that to me. Of course.

[1723] Brough was so funny.

[1724] He had so many.

[1725] bits he was um often robot director what's that mean so you would you'd go up to him and you're very sincere and you'd go like broil if i walk over there and i'm supposed to land on that thing i can't walk around the canoe because i'll leave frame right and he'll go peep be pooh pooh pooh boopo peep baby robot director he wasn't just a robot he was a baby robot director oh cute and then i go oh no baby robot director, beep, beep, beep, boop.

[1726] Okay, so I'm just going to kind of have to guess beep, beep, boop, boop, beep, and he would never give you an answer, and you just had to figure out what you had to do.

[1727] That's very funny.

[1728] So baby robot director was sometimes directing.

[1729] Well, that's a ding, ding, ding, because in our world, we have a baby director and a robot.

[1730] And you're right, and a robot wants to be a boy, a real boy.

[1731] Yeah.

[1732] That comes full circle.

[1733] What was this other?

[1734] For old circle.

[1735] Yeah, that was a blast.

[1736] Yeah, it really seemed like it.

[1737] I'm glad you had that experience.

[1738] I just had breakfast when night.

[1739] Yeah.

[1740] How was it?

[1741] It was so fun.

[1742] It's my favorite medicine.

[1743] Yeah.

[1744] We were laughing so hard at the top of our lungs in Cafe 101.

[1745] Fun.

[1746] People were even, I even saw some people were looking at us.

[1747] Like, okay, that's, guys, it's a little early for that level of screaming laughing.

[1748] Yeah.

[1749] You know, sometimes you're laughing so hard.

[1750] Well, I don't know if you have this.

[1751] I've passed, I'm out of air.

[1752] so I'm no longer making a noise but I still have to express my and I clap oh yeah like a monkey with the symbols yeah yeah so there was moments where I was like laid back in the booth and I was like and I was just clapping like a seal what caused that does anything you can share or boy one's tricky I guess if I could leave out the person it's just it's all about deliveries with me and so we were talking about this certain person and he's like yeah and I'm like wow so that's great that she ended up with him he's like yeah yeah you know you know and he loves her and I go yeah yeah he loves her you know he loves her and then it be we just built on that for a very long time you love to build this is a reality we know people they end up together that they were lonely they found a partner and they're doing it together yeah was it the storybook love you know I don't know you know love you they love you that's okay not oh absolutely yeah there's nothing wrong with it but of course you're supposed to go like oh yeah he you know he just loves her he he loves her they're good they're great he's a good husband you know you start just kind of they're good together they're really good together you start keep deviating away from yeah you realize that might have been not the full yeah yeah i don't know he just it doesn't take much yeah yeah well that's fun he's medicine that's good Is that you and Kelly?

[1753] I mean, she's definitely medicinal, but I wouldn't say...

[1754] Who sends you into a laugh riot?

[1755] Jess.

[1756] Yeah, yeah.

[1757] That's the laugh medicine.

[1758] It's powerful.

[1759] Yeah.

[1760] You have a good...

[1761] Our breakfast was one hour.

[1762] In 45 minutes of it was laughing really, really hard.

[1763] Yeah, it's fun.

[1764] It was like, yeah, better than any drug.

[1765] But I don't...

[1766] I mean, I obviously, I love laughing, but in certain relationships I don't have...

[1767] as much of that, but they have other things.

[1768] Right.

[1769] I don't think one's better than the other.

[1770] I love to laugh, but I get...

[1771] It's not your number one priority.

[1772] I think I used to think that.

[1773] Yes.

[1774] When you were an aspiring comedian and at the UCB?

[1775] Yeah, but also even when I think about partnership, I do think...

[1776] You used to think, like, well, my husband would have to be hilarious.

[1777] Have to be so funny.

[1778] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[1779] I still kind of think that.

[1780] I don't think I can be with someone who does not have a sense of humor.

[1781] Right.

[1782] I bet you would say, like, the person has to get humor.

[1783] Yes.

[1784] It's not necessarily that they have to deliver it, but it would suck watching TV with somebody and they're not getting what's so funny about something.

[1785] I'm wrong.

[1786] Okay, you're taking it back.

[1787] I'm taking it all back.

[1788] I'm taking it all back.

[1789] Listen, he loves her.

[1790] You know, he's, they're committed, and he's a good husband.

[1791] He's a good companion.

[1792] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[1793] Um, no, I, now I'm remembering that when I, I, I had gone on a few dates with this person.

[1794] And I, um, and he was great.

[1795] Totally fine.

[1796] Like, he was great.

[1797] He did not love it.

[1798] He was great.

[1799] And I couldn't really figure out what was happening with me. I mean, of course, I was like, what is, what is wrong with me?

[1800] What is wrong with me?

[1801] This person's like, great and nice.

[1802] And why?

[1803] Why don't I like him?

[1804] And when I was in therapy, we had talked a lot about it.

[1805] Because this is the one she gave you permission to.

[1806] Well, she was like, well, tell me about the dates.

[1807] Yeah.

[1808] So we were talking about the dates and she was like, are you laughing?

[1809] Yeah.

[1810] I was like, yeah, yeah.

[1811] It's not serious, but it's not funny.

[1812] And she was like, yeah, well, maybe you need funny.

[1813] And I was like, yeah.

[1814] Yeah, I think it's true that every, every relationship I do prioritize does have a fair amount of laughter.

[1815] Yes, and I think maybe more specifically, you don't need someone who's funny, who, like, they're outward presenting identity as a funny person.

[1816] Like, that's not Breeze presenting first foot forward.

[1817] Yeah.

[1818] But she and I had so many insight jokes.

[1819] Like we did live for inside jokes and she was super funny to me, right?

[1820] Yeah, yeah.

[1821] I think you want that thing.

[1822] Whether they're out like, whether the person at a party making jokes.

[1823] No, no, no. It doesn't need to be, they don't need to be a comedian.

[1824] Right, but you need to have a lot of playful banter.

[1825] Yes.

[1826] It was a ding, ding, ding because I also had it last night because Josh Lawson came over.

[1827] Oh, he did.

[1828] Because he's back in town working.

[1829] He has my number.

[1830] Oh, my God.

[1831] Josh Lusson makes me laugh so hard.

[1832] Yeah.

[1833] And there was a moment where we were at first, we were, we were sauned, then we're in the hot tub together, then we're eating dinner with the girls.

[1834] And he was making the girls laugh, which is really funny.

[1835] Because there's not a lot of adults that make them laugh really hard other than me, which is my main hobby in life.

[1836] Sure.

[1837] Yeah, but he was really making them laugh.

[1838] And then dealt at one point, and it wasn't even like presentation.

[1839] It was just to me, it was an aside.

[1840] And she goes, you know, Lincoln and I always were afraid if you and my mom.

[1841] mom ever got divorced, or you guys married different people, or if you married another woman.

[1842] And I think the person we should be afraid of is him.

[1843] Wow.

[1844] That I would leave mommy for Josh Lawson.

[1845] Oh, that you would.

[1846] Yes, yes.

[1847] Oh, that's funny.

[1848] Yeah, and Lincoln goes, my dad doesn't laugh this much normal around people to him.

[1849] Well, that's, wow, that's a high compliment to Josh.

[1850] Well, it is, and he deserves it.

[1851] But then I got defensive of Aaron.

[1852] I said, well, what about Aaron?

[1853] It's literally not true.

[1854] Yeah, it's not true.

[1855] It's factually inaccurate, but it was a very sweet compliment to give Josh.

[1856] That is sweet.

[1857] Yeah.

[1858] He asked about you.

[1859] I said, I'd like to see him when he's here.

[1860] Anyway, what else has been going on?

[1861] The anxiety is still, again, listen to December 15th episode.

[1862] I discussed my, I've been waking up in the middle of the night with about an hour of anxiety.

[1863] December 15th.

[1864] Remember our fact check from six weeks.

[1865] oh six weeks in the future yeah last night was woke up and i had an image of what my face looked like in the close -up and i was like oh my god i got how do i fix it's like i had some very specific problem areas i was seen i'm like what am i going to do i got some lighting underneath i got to get nose reduction oh my god you know all these things maybe i think maybe we're just too tight.

[1866] And then I'm thinking of other people's shows.

[1867] I'm like, are they as tight as we are?

[1868] But this goes on for, I don't know, 75, 80 minutes.

[1869] I go back to sleep for about 45 minutes.

[1870] Then I wake up for the morning at six.

[1871] And then I go look at the footage that I had watched right before I went to bed.

[1872] Yeah.

[1873] The image I had in my head is not what it is.

[1874] I'm almost 50, Monica.

[1875] I know, but you're still, you're still a person and we're all insecure.

[1876] But it just goes to show like how lopsided and irrational and non -factual my midnight ruminations are they're like they're so can you tell yourself can you write a piece of paper on your nightstand that says whatever you're thinking right now you will not be thinking in the morning i said to myself last night i said this is going to be a very tiny problem in the morning you already know that it might not even be a problem in the morning did it work but if no it's just one little detail of something from the day that I can't stop, just totally powerless.

[1877] You don't do much of that version.

[1878] Yeah, I do a lot of rumination.

[1879] But do you wake up in the middle of the night and have it?

[1880] No, I don't wake up.

[1881] It's before bed.

[1882] It's to get to sleep.

[1883] Right.

[1884] So it often takes me a very long time to get to sleep because of all the chatter.

[1885] Yeah, I take a lot of sleep aids.

[1886] And so, you know, I take melatonin and I take, Trazadone.

[1887] Mm -hmm.

[1888] And occasionally, a leave PM.

[1889] So three.

[1890] No one's going to like that.

[1891] No one's going to like that.

[1892] No one's going to like that.

[1893] There's going to be a lot of sleep experts that are saying that's not good.

[1894] Yeah.

[1895] Regardless, that I can fall asleep pretty nicely with my book on tape.

[1896] I can fall asleep within 10 minutes on that cocktail.

[1897] And I've thought about this now.

[1898] What happens is clearly those all wear off around 4 a. Yeah.

[1899] I need a like a time release of all those things.

[1900] Or I need an intervening a setup of this that trickles it all night.

[1901] I think you need to learn how, and as do I, to turn off our brain before bed, sleep through the night, one P max, and then wake up rested.

[1902] That would be the dream, but - That's ideal.

[1903] And I used to be so angry at myself and hard on myself that I can't figure it out, right?

[1904] Or that I can't do all the things you just listed.

[1905] Sure.

[1906] But I have been a little bit relieved by the fact that, like, one of my children is identical.

[1907] Mm -hmm.

[1908] She clearly is just genetically.

[1909] And also, don't forget on the 23 of me, it did say you're someone who would struggle with sleep.

[1910] Remember, that was one of the weird things that comes up.

[1911] And I was like, well, that's kind of a relief.

[1912] I'm predisposed to be this way.

[1913] But seeing it in her, stop my, like, self -flagellation a little bit.

[1914] I'm like, yeah, you can be born as not a great sleeper.

[1915] Yeah, but it doesn't have to be either or.

[1916] It can be you have some sort of predisposition to not be in the sleep for anxiety, but you can do things to counter that.

[1917] Yes, and if you have a range, you could be on the best end of the range.

[1918] I can cede to that for sure.

[1919] So I'm in the cycle of like mass caffeine all day long to compensate for the shitty night's sleep.

[1920] Definitely that's part of the problem.

[1921] There's no question.

[1922] Oh, that's interesting.

[1923] The sleep beads are wearing off also.

[1924] So the caffeine's still in my system.

[1925] Yeah.

[1926] It's fighting.

[1927] Yeah, I get that.

[1928] Yeah, it's been, this has been interesting for me because I've decided a while ago that once we started in the new space and things were ramping up, that I would get really healthy.

[1929] Okay.

[1930] Which is an interesting time to choose to do that.

[1931] Well, it makes sense.

[1932] Well, that's why.

[1933] Okay.

[1934] It's like, this is going to require a lot more of me. You mean you started before.

[1935] Getting help.

[1936] Oh, I did it.

[1937] On day one of, okay.

[1938] Because I didn't want to waste those days.

[1939] I want to be unhealthy until I have to be healthy.

[1940] That makes sense.

[1941] Like if you know you're going to get pregnant.

[1942] Or you know you're going to get off of, um, drink it.

[1943] You know you're going to become sober.

[1944] You go all out.

[1945] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[1946] So I was like this whole thing, this new life of hours is going to require a lot more of me. And it's going to require more energy and more alertness.

[1947] Stamina.

[1948] Speaking of, I can't believe I didn't start with this, on this episode, I look so bad.

[1949] Wait.

[1950] I look so tired.

[1951] And guess what?

[1952] I am so tired.

[1953] It was my birthday the night before.

[1954] It was Sunday we recorded that.

[1955] I had three martinis, as we've already discussed.

[1956] Over the course of six hours, very responsible.

[1957] One is not enough.

[1958] Three is too many.

[1959] I had three.

[1960] and you can see it.

[1961] You can see it.

[1962] Well, maybe do you think you can see it?

[1963] I'm not going to read the comments, but I have a feeling people will be able to see it.

[1964] And that's fine.

[1965] Are you tired as an incredible question to ask people?

[1966] You know, that's one that's like somehow socially acceptable, but it's so...

[1967] Well, this is our whole...

[1968] Did you get a good night sleep last night?

[1969] It's the same thing.

[1970] I defend that because that was a mood.

[1971] you look so tired is like people feel like they're allowed to say that to other people like oh you look so tired like it's somehow compassionate i know but you go like you mean i look like shit right is that no that's my mom's go -to she says you look tired all the time every time i'm home she's like you look you look tired like okay i am that might be because she just wants you to go take a napy because she wants her baby sleeping in her house yeah You just sleep in our house every night and I'll make you sandwiches.

[1972] You're too tired to go home.

[1973] So I decided to get healthy.

[1974] Yeah.

[1975] Which means, well, I'm going to start working out strength training.

[1976] I told you that.

[1977] I have not starting that for another week.

[1978] Okay.

[1979] Kicking that down the road.

[1980] Yeah.

[1981] But I'm going to start strength training.

[1982] I'm going to drink less.

[1983] What does that look like?

[1984] I know.

[1985] It's a very nebulous thing to say.

[1986] drink less.

[1987] I guess it would, the easiest would be less days a week.

[1988] Yeah.

[1989] Right.

[1990] I don't know how much you're going to be able to like fine tune the amount.

[1991] The amount when you're doing it.

[1992] Yeah.

[1993] That's fair.

[1994] That's fair.

[1995] Because a different version of Monaco will be making decisions than the one of worse sitting here with right now.

[1996] Yeah, you're right.

[1997] So less days, I guess.

[1998] Yeah.

[1999] And what would be, what's the number that's not terrifying?

[2000] Weekends we got a drink.

[2001] Friday and Saturday's on.

[2002] Ideally, I'm not drinking Monday through Thursday.

[2003] Sunday we got it.

[2004] I know, but okay, now with my new strength training, I have to wake up early to go do that.

[2005] That's on Tuesdays and Thursdays.

[2006] Okay.

[2007] And then Monday, Wednesday, and Friday, I want to do my walks.

[2008] This is part of my new health plan.

[2009] Yeah, yeah, regime protocol.

[2010] But these are all things happening in the morning, so I have to be able to wake up.

[2011] Yeah.

[2012] What about Wednesday, Friday, Saturday, Sunday?

[2013] That's four days a week.

[2014] You think I can on Wednesday?

[2015] Yeah.

[2016] I think you're going to need a drink once during the week.

[2017] I know.

[2018] What I think would be most achievable would be start there.

[2019] That's still the majority of the days you're drinking.

[2020] God.

[2021] You know what's crazy?

[2022] That's scary.

[2023] Sounds like nothing.

[2024] Yeah, yeah, of course.

[2025] Of course.

[2026] So the majority of the days you're drinking, so that's great.

[2027] You're drinking more than you're not.

[2028] Sure.

[2029] That's the dream.

[2030] And then once you're doing that for a minute, I think you lob Sunday off.

[2031] I know.

[2032] Because then you give yourself the best shot for starting the week on Monday.

[2033] Yeah, I know.

[2034] That would be.

[2035] But what about like, or Sunday brunch?

[2036] No, that's bad.

[2037] I mean, then you're a whole day, I don't know.

[2038] Yeah.

[2039] You tell me. God.

[2040] I mean, you're like, what about morning drinking on Sundays?

[2041] What about you only drink in the morning?

[2042] Oh, God, do you think brunch?

[2043] Do you think brunch drinking is akin to, like, like, shower drinking?

[2044] Tell me about shower drinking.

[2045] Like, didn't you used to drink beer in the shower?

[2046] Oh, sure, sure.

[2047] Yeah, to me, that's so extreme.

[2048] Right.

[2049] And, but to you brunch is extreme.

[2050] well no no um i'm in no position to be judgmental of sunny what i think is funny though i don't think you're being judgmental i i do think we label things and and we're pretending what that it's not what it really is which is like yeah i drink in the morning on sunday but i call it brunch drinking which is fun and playful yeah in an event and blah blah blah but it's it's drinking when you wake up in the morning on sundays which i don't care about.

[2051] And then there was different rules when you'd go camping, which I loved, which is like when you go camping, you start drinking as soon as you wake up.

[2052] And it's part of it.

[2053] It's fun.

[2054] I know.

[2055] I know.

[2056] You have some a little bite to eat.

[2057] Then you crack open a beer and then you drink all day.

[2058] And that's bad.

[2059] Well, I don't, you know.

[2060] I know you're not saying it's objectively bad.

[2061] You're not judging, but we are just talking about my health routine.

[2062] Well, that's why I'm I'm talking about me. Well, I have an opinion about if you're going to do it, when should you do it?

[2063] And I do think, ideally, it'd be Friday, Saturday, and Wednesday.

[2064] Okay.

[2065] But Wednesday seems hard because of the Thursday strength training.

[2066] So I actually think maybe then it should be Tuesday.

[2067] Okay.

[2068] Yeah, that's fine.

[2069] Okay.

[2070] Yeah, because then you have two days off and then two days off Wednesday, Thursday.

[2071] That's great.

[2072] Okay, so Tuesday, I'm going to get hands.

[2073] Yeah, get shit talked.

[2074] Whatever we record on Wednesdays, everyone will be able to tell.

[2075] They'll be like, is this Wednesday recording?

[2076] Yes.

[2077] I also have a bit of self -consciousness and insecurity that people are very worried.

[2078] We're never going to stop talking about video.

[2079] But I would rest assured we're going to.

[2080] So you're just listening as so many people will still do.

[2081] They're like, oh my God, now when I'm listening, I got to hear them talk about video all the time.

[2082] And I just want to say that I'm aware of it and we're just processing our new experience.

[2083] Yeah.

[2084] Do you have that for your or no?

[2085] I guess I do, but I've sort of like, we've done this.

[2086] This is a new thing.

[2087] Yeah, yeah, right.

[2088] And if we're going to do that.

[2089] It's also taking up a lot of our brain space right now.

[2090] Yeah, exactly.

[2091] Anyway, actually, the whole reason I brought this up is because I want to be healthier, blah, blah, blah.

[2092] This week is a huge week for us.

[2093] We're working a ton.

[2094] Yeah.

[2095] And I've been working until between 930 and 10.

[2096] since Sunday.

[2097] Yes.

[2098] And I've been waking up early because we've been starting early, but also.

[2099] And even appointments throughout all this.

[2100] That's why.

[2101] Then I've had appointments and I've had to throw them at like the early, early top of day because there's no other time.

[2102] Yeah.

[2103] So I've been waking up early, but I'm tired at night now.

[2104] Oh, so you're falling asleep.

[2105] I am falling asleep.

[2106] And that's interesting.

[2107] It is.

[2108] And it's how I a little bit counteract my panic because I have to believe the same thing I tell Lincoln, which is like your body will take care of itself.

[2109] So how many hours did you get last night do you think?

[2110] You know it just occurred to me. People have heard about your eye roll forever.

[2111] Yeah.

[2112] And they could see it now.

[2113] I know.

[2114] We talked about that.

[2115] When?

[2116] We talked about it upstairs when we were leading up to this that people are going to start seeing it.

[2117] Oh.

[2118] Can you do one on command?

[2119] I could, but.

[2120] What do you do on for me?

[2121] well why don't you why don't you instigate one okay i will okay you spent way too much on those pants okay i think you need to drop it in at a time where i'm not expecting it okay so later yeah later okay okay okay okay foreshadowing even though you also just said that we do you don't want to make this about video and now you know but then it just occurred to me that but you have a very legendary eye roll that we've talked about i'm sure people have I'm sure it's I'm sure people have seen it by now how I'm sure I've done it I think you think I don't think you've eye -rolled.

[2122] I'm sure I have.

[2123] Not your nuclear option eye -roll that you gave the gal in the parking lot at the preschool.

[2124] There are levels to the eye roll.

[2125] But you know that in theater, in my ninth grade theater class, my teacher told me, like, you have an eye roll.

[2126] It's so distinct.

[2127] Oh, really?

[2128] And basically, like, get rid of it.

[2129] Get rid of it.

[2130] Because you would do it in scenes.

[2131] It's how you would express that emotion.

[2132] It was coming out so involuntarily that I didn't.

[2133] It's a tick.

[2134] Really, it's a tick.

[2135] I don't even know if it's that indicative of my feelings.

[2136] Well, it is in the parking lot of the preschool.

[2137] Well, sure.

[2138] Yeah, yeah.

[2139] Well, she was such a bitch.

[2140] Right.

[2141] And when people would walk away from the counter at SoulCycle, certainly.

[2142] They were such a bitch.

[2143] They were such a bitch and a dick, too.

[2144] Yeah, they were.

[2145] I don't do it at niceness.

[2146] No, I know, I know.

[2147] Generally, it's a, it's a, fuck you.

[2148] I think it's warranted.

[2149] Right.

[2150] Personally.

[2151] I don't know how I'm going to earn it, but I guess I'll try.

[2152] You'll figure it out.

[2153] How much hours did you sleep last night?

[2154] I think I got like seven and a half to eight hours.

[2155] That's solid.

[2156] It is, except I work best at nine.

[2157] Yeah, and do you think, you know, one of my reservations about these sleep monitoring devices is that you wake up and you get a score.

[2158] And I just don't know how you have a good day if your score is like 40 or you go to the gym because then you're like, well, probably my body doesn't want me too excited and getting asleep.

[2159] I just don't know how that doesn't become a self -fulfilling prophecy that part.

[2160] I agree.

[2161] And that's an Easter egg for a Thursday's episode because we discussed that on Thursday's episode.

[2162] And I, yes, I think like people get victimy about when they wear these things, they're like, oh, I'm just like really bad at sleeping.

[2163] Yeah.

[2164] Yeah.

[2165] But the thing I was going to ask you about, is it similarly learning recently, this is making the rounds that women need more sleep than men, that didn't have any impact on you?

[2166] Because I could imagine hearing that and being like, well, Jesus Christ, now I need 10 hours of sleep.

[2167] I felt bad when I wasn't getting 8.

[2168] And now I've learned my sex dictates I should be getting 10.

[2169] All it did was confirm what I knew.

[2170] That you need more sleep.

[2171] That I need at least 9 hours.

[2172] Okay.

[2173] Right, right.

[2174] I can sleep till 11.

[2175] Right.

[2176] That's so enviable.

[2177] I can just go and go and go.

[2178] Never wake up.

[2179] That'd be a title of your biography.

[2180] Though I do, no, remember, it's coffee makes me sleepy.

[2181] But I do think part of that is because I don't sleep restfully.

[2182] So I need a little bit longer of time to make up for not sleeping very well.

[2183] Yes.

[2184] So if I start sleeping better, I think I will need less.

[2185] Yeah, that's a good theory.

[2186] I remember being able to sleep late, and I felt like my best sleep came between like 6 a .m. and 10.

[2187] I know.

[2188] Like I'm done wrestling with all my demons.

[2189] I've processed all my anxieties.

[2190] And now I'm just like, oh, yeah.

[2191] I'm not stressed anymore.

[2192] Yeah.

[2193] Last thought.

[2194] Maybe there'll be a technology.

[2195] Probably not.

[2196] But the dream for me would be I could hook my brain up to a machine an hour before sleep.

[2197] And it would accelerate all that processing that I know has to happen.

[2198] Right.

[2199] And then that would just be done.

[2200] That's the problem.

[2201] And then you could actually sleep.

[2202] Update.

[2203] I didn't take my antidepressant.

[2204] Acutely last night.

[2205] That's not an update.

[2206] That's an Easter egg.

[2207] I know for January 6th.

[2208] January 18th.

[2209] It'll be my birthday episode.

[2210] I'm glad to, I'm kind of glad to hear that.

[2211] Not, I mean, not, I regretted it in the middle of the night.

[2212] I know, I was like, fuck, I just forgot.

[2213] I didn't decide not to.

[2214] I just forgot.

[2215] Okay.

[2216] So maybe I will in a couple hours.

[2217] There's a brunch SSRI.

[2218] Well, that's the other piece.

[2219] That's the other piece.

[2220] As much as I, I love to drink.

[2221] Yeah, drinking.

[2222] That sentence is bad, but I, look, I have to be able to say it.

[2223] if it's true.

[2224] And it is.

[2225] But also, of course you love to drink.

[2226] It's fun.

[2227] I know.

[2228] It just sounds.

[2229] You don't like how it sounds.

[2230] I don't think it sounds good.

[2231] When you say the truths.

[2232] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[2233] You have to hear the truths.

[2234] You know, and that's a hard thing for all of us, I think.

[2235] But I think it's important when you're struggling with anything or you're just like evaluating anything.

[2236] That's why people have pros and cons lists so they can literally see.

[2237] in front of them, the realities.

[2238] But let me ask you this, because that might also be more about the implicit shaming and judgment.

[2239] Let me just say this.

[2240] No one feels guilty saying, I love pizza.

[2241] And then you go, of course you love pizza.

[2242] Everyone loves pizza.

[2243] And as I'm saying, like, yeah, of course you love drinking.

[2244] Yeah.

[2245] It's really great.

[2246] Have I transitioned from not judgmental to enabler?

[2247] Maybe.

[2248] Has that happened?

[2249] No, I love pizza.

[2250] I love pizza is one thing.

[2251] But I love pizza so much that I eat pizza every day.

[2252] Or that you're like, I'm thinking about pizza.

[2253] I got to go down to eating pizza four days a week and I'm nervous about it.

[2254] Yeah, that's.

[2255] And can I have pizza for breakfast?

[2256] And the answer is yes, you can have pizza for breakfast.

[2257] Yeah, cold.

[2258] Cold pizza is great and hot pizza is great.

[2259] I don't like cold pizza, but yeah.

[2260] I mean, me either, but I don't really understand that, but that's fine.

[2261] Pizza in the shower.

[2262] Pets in the shower.

[2263] That's a red flag.

[2264] You think?

[2265] But what if you're in a hurry?

[2266] That's efficient.

[2267] But if in general you have to have a piece of pizza while your shower.

[2268] And then we're doing this thing where it's like, well, I'm fine because I don't have that weird shower thing.

[2269] Equivocating.

[2270] Yes.

[2271] Justifying.

[2272] People, I think, you know, you know.

[2273] You know.

[2274] When you have past your limits and when you haven't.

[2275] Yeah.

[2276] I think people, if you really are doing an evaluation of yourself, you know.

[2277] Does the question, the woman I think is most salient is like, does it take more than it gives?

[2278] Yeah.

[2279] I think that's the kind of quintessential question.

[2280] Now, whether people can evaluate that and answer, that honestly is tricky.

[2281] I think that's actually hard to evaluate.

[2282] It is.

[2283] Because when you want to do it, the positives are overweighted.

[2284] And all you can think about is losing those positives.

[2285] And then you're not maybe remembering every little part of it that's not beneficial.

[2286] Ideal.

[2287] Yeah, the taking part.

[2288] Do you think they'll ever invent a drug that after you drink, if you take it, there's like no re -per -cut, no hangover at all?

[2289] Oh, right.

[2290] I mean, it seems feasible.

[2291] This is my same, this is my billion dollar pharmaceutical that I have invented that I don't know how to bring to market, which is the caffeine one.

[2292] You take a pill at 9 p .m. And it metabolizes every caffeine molecule in your body.

[2293] So there's none left.

[2294] Yeah, that's great.

[2295] That would be incredible.

[2296] If people could bang coffee like up until 9 o 'clock after dinner.

[2297] I would love to drink coffee after dinner.

[2298] Me too.

[2299] I always wonder, at Italian restaurants, they always offer coffee at the end.

[2300] And I don't understand how people are doing this.

[2301] But when you're in Italy, have you done it?

[2302] Because I cannot sleep if I drink coffee after four.

[2303] And when I'm in Italy, I will have a cappuccino after a meal.

[2304] And then I go right to bed.

[2305] And I'm like, oh, this is all psychosomatic.

[2306] And then I eat pasta the whole time I'm there.

[2307] And I don't have any gluten issues.

[2308] And then they go, oh, it's because it's heirloom flour and there's no gluten in it.

[2309] I'm like, maybe it's just all psychosomatic.

[2310] But, yeah, they got a whole, that's the power of culture.

[2311] It really is.

[2312] Yeah, we drink of caffeine at night, no problem.

[2313] Sometimes the baby get a diarrhea from a caffeine, but in general, it's nothing.

[2314] Oh, I thought you might get an eye roll, but I don't think you did.

[2315] I know, that was a good, yeah.

[2316] That was a good move to try to get one.

[2317] It was.

[2318] But okay.

[2319] I always want to get your pants so hard.

[2320] Wear your pants.

[2321] I can't find them.

[2322] I never said, no, wear pants begin and ends.

[2323] on a woman.

[2324] Good to see your throw -up face and your eye roll face.

[2325] I don't think.

[2326] Throw up everywhere.

[2327] I don't care.

[2328] I like a mess.

[2329] I'm messy myself.

[2330] Don't tell anybody.

[2331] My room's a sty.

[2332] Stop.

[2333] Stop.

[2334] Stop.

[2335] Caffeine.

[2336] Oh, the pill to metabolize alcohol.

[2337] Yeah.

[2338] That would be fantastic.

[2339] But in a way, because you don't want to, it can't just be a pill that metabolizes alcohol because then you'd feel really bad while that's happening.

[2340] Yeah, that's the weird thing about alcohol is.

[2341] I do think you'd feel a little withdrawaly.

[2342] I think that's what a hangover is.

[2343] Yeah, it is.

[2344] So we'd have to invent something where it just fully negates.

[2345] Well, that would be the $1 billion invention.

[2346] Because there's all these over there.

[2347] You'll see them at gas stations like hangover care.

[2348] And even those are selling and they don't do a damn thing.

[2349] No, they don't.

[2350] Unless they're sponsored.

[2351] Unless they're good.

[2352] Yeah, is that the only downside?

[2353] For me, yeah.

[2354] Because there's a philosophical downside.

[2355] Okay.

[2356] Tell me. Which is it's a pacifier.

[2357] So it allows the mundane to be exciting and novel.

[2358] Yeah.

[2359] And potentially you're not pursuing things that really are novel and growth -inducing.

[2360] I mean, that's like a philosophical.

[2361] I know, but growth -inducing, that's also a construct.

[2362] Like, what's growth -inducing for one person is not necessarily growth -inducing for another like I do I do get so much joy out of just being cocooned with people I love and I feel safe around right and I don't I'm in no position to say getting around and being social and chatting is not productive or good or philosophically great but when I drank my life was very repetitious I got together with the same people we got drunk we talked about the same thing we planned it was like this vaguely overly optimistic things we're going to do in the future that we're not really going to do and trips were planning and parties were planning and all you know and it was just this cycle and it really could have just gone on forever and even when I wasn't evaluating the many downsides that were clearly present just philosophically I was alike I was felt like it was a rut yeah this is all I needed to do is I needed to pick up a 12 pack on the way to Scotty's and my night was handled.

[2363] Yeah.

[2364] And that's nice.

[2365] It's convenient.

[2366] But also, I'm not putting much effort into it.

[2367] And it's just the same thing over and over again.

[2368] And I would like to, I'd like to get bored with a group of five people and figure out what we're going to fucking do.

[2369] And maybe let's go drive go carts next time and let's do this thing.

[2370] And I just, when I reflect on my life, I'm personally, it's not for everyone.

[2371] Yeah.

[2372] The story of my life that involves having done a bunch of activities and tried new things and gone places is more satisfying to me than sitting in someone's living room or sitting in the same bar and having the same conversation 10 ,000 times over the course of a lifetime for the story I'm telling about myself yeah like wreckage aside yeah I understand that yeah I just remember thinking as I approach 30 like well we've done this we've done this for a decade we've gone out and gotten drunk and is that that is that what i'm going to now repeat for the next five decades yeah like a lot of people and i kind of want more than that yeah but let me ask you this let's say every day after work i go and i hang out with people same people let's say same people every day and we have drinks and we chit -chat yeah come i go home yeah What, like, and I mean really, like, philosophically, what's the difference between we finish work, you go into your house with the same people, you go sauna like you do every day with the same person.

[2373] Yeah.

[2374] And that period of time takes up the equivalent amount of time that I'm, like, we're all doing the same thing over and over again.

[2375] But you are illuminating the challenge of marriage, which is it is.

[2376] so easy for it to be just that and you have to kind of actively like yes right now we're sauna but if you rewind a year and a half ago before that it was another thing and before that it was another thing because you do tire of repetition of booze isn't involved like even if we're on vacation with the richardsons we can play spades and hang and chat for four nights in a row but we're going to have to do something else we're going to have to go find a sauna and then have to go on a sightseeing thing we're going to have to bubble if we just drank we would be able to just get to our hotel we'd go out for drinks in the evening and then we'd have dinner and that would be it but we get bored after a few days of just playing space or just doing this and i and this family gets bored it's like well let's go to at least let's go to bob's big boy and look at old car night before we have dinner um we're not going to eat at cafe 101 every single night where it does get boring without alcohol in the mix and we do have to change a lot and we've had a bazillion different little patterns and hobbies but I was in one that was 10 years long when I drank with very little difference yeah the bars would change right you know there were years where every night the three of us or the four of us would hang out and play the same game or watch the TV show would change but we would watch movies and TV shows and TV shows booze for sure like TV is booze I love it I use it just like booze I know how I'm going to feel when I watch it if it's good and it's going to be two hours it handles that two hours yeah you know the girl's bedtime before mine and even that I'll go like okay we've been watching TV for 13 days straight it's time to mix it up but I never was like we need to mix it up when I drank right as long is we i had a 12 pack like i didn't really you know i was fine yeah yeah interesting well let's do some fackies there's not too many oh i really loved his idea of coffee and clips i thought that was such a cute game can you guess what i wanted to ask okay raising you can guess that's a great guess it wasn't raised in Arizona okay um it was heat really not much closer okay same director um it was you probably have just forgotten the name of my favorite movie of all time that i watched again back to being drunk that i watched every night i was drunk not Roadhouse.

[2377] Thief.

[2378] Thief.

[2379] That's right.

[2380] Michael Mann's thief.

[2381] Okay.

[2382] So I brought thief and I showed him the opening sequences, which is my favorite.

[2383] Okay.

[2384] Him cracking into a safe in committing a robbery.

[2385] It's so cool and stylized.

[2386] What did you say why it was important to you?

[2387] I can't remember even when as he was describing how it worked, I do remember I had to like talk about it for a couple minutes but I can't remember what my take was.

[2388] I don't know if I admitted like I used to watch this movie addictively.

[2389] I think I talked about that was the first time and it created a whole genre.

[2390] Prior to Thief in Miami Vice, there weren't these elongated montages done to really cool music.

[2391] They were almost the precursor of music videos where like the music was at the front and center of this sequence.

[2392] The sequence was designed around the music.

[2393] Yeah.

[2394] And it was very surreal.

[2395] It like gave birth to this really cool surreal feeling that was even like movies were already a dream.

[2396] And then this was even a dream beyond that.

[2397] It was like a surreal, you know, I think people can relate to that wishing there was theme music when they walked around.

[2398] Like when you're walking on the street and you're feeling it and you want a certain song to be playing.

[2399] It was that feeling.

[2400] And it was the first time I ever saw it.

[2401] And I was like, oh, this is so cool and surreal.

[2402] And I want to.

[2403] to live in this montage.

[2404] I wish life was this montage.

[2405] Yeah, I get that.

[2406] That's cool.

[2407] What would you have played?

[2408] Episode of Friends.

[2409] Yes.

[2410] No. Um, it's not your fault.

[2411] Yeah.

[2412] It's not my fault.

[2413] It's not your fault.

[2414] It's not your fault.

[2415] Yeah.

[2416] That would have been.

[2417] In that exact scene?

[2418] Goodwill hunting.

[2419] That scene, yeah.

[2420] Or...

[2421] Oh, flag on the plate.

[2422] Or the scene between Ben and Matt.

[2423] Ben is telling Matt, like, don't, don't, don't, wander this and all I want is to show up to your apartment one day and you not be there.

[2424] Yes.

[2425] That's a great scene.

[2426] Very sweet.

[2427] Oh, self -sacrifice.

[2428] Give from the Magi.

[2429] We're not gossipy.

[2430] We try to really not be gossipy.

[2431] But it would also seem crazy to not check in with how you feel about Matt or rather Ben getting divorced.

[2432] I feel really sad for them.

[2433] No excitement that is available?

[2434] No. Okay.

[2435] You really love them.

[2436] It's like the speech in the movie.

[2437] You're like as much as I want to come here and pick you up for dinner, I want to come here and have you tell me, you must leave.

[2438] I'm married.

[2439] That's right.

[2440] That's right.

[2441] No, I just feel like it must suck so much to have all eyes on you over and over again while you're going through your shit.

[2442] All I have thought is like I largely think paparazzi have gone a while.

[2443] way and when I see things pop up by the way it just finds you this information in clips and like I'm on Instagram it's like I'm seeing video of Ben walking from his car somewhere yeah constantly right and I'm just like when I see that selfishly I'm like I am so fucking glad I don't get filmed everywhere I go I would oh my God but fuck that's still a thing where yeah everywhere he drives presumably there's six or seven cars following him and he's gonna act kind of normal and then but then he doesn't and then people are like it's impossible to act normal or he has a resting bitch face whatever it's like duh yeah because there's seven men who you have no control you have no recourse nothing there's nothing you can do yeah he's ever just deal with these six guys shouting shit at you oh i know very triggering yeah and and i i don't know him much.

[2444] I hate to admit that, but I don't know him.

[2445] I mean, you know his soul.

[2446] I do.

[2447] I know his heart.

[2448] Yeah.

[2449] But I don't know.

[2450] You know the real him.

[2451] Yes, but I have a sense he's sort of like you.

[2452] And I imagine it's probably extra hard for him to let some of this go.

[2453] Yeah.

[2454] Like being followed.

[2455] I bet he's battling not to fight these guys with every bit of willpower he has.

[2456] Yeah.

[2457] And then also then trying to tell your face not to uh telegraph that yeah yeah and in general i just think it's sad if a relationship doesn't work out yeah okay you mentioned pee the drug pee oh i would love if a riding lawnmour just crashed through the garage door right now and drove into frame and then did a 360 oh god yeah uh sound could be be better in here.

[2458] Oh.

[2459] Well, that's nice.

[2460] You said, you talked about P, the drug.

[2461] Oh, yes.

[2462] It is meth.

[2463] Yes.

[2464] I confirmed that.

[2465] Okay, great.

[2466] You looked it up.

[2467] Where was it at?

[2468] What website tells you the Kiwi name for math?

[2469] Well, if you type in.

[2470] I knew it was math for sure.

[2471] Yeah.

[2472] If you type in New Zealand Street drug P, methamphetamine comes up.

[2473] And did you just put the letter P or P -E or P -E -A?

[2474] letter P. And it is that according to this.

[2475] Speed, pure, P. Oh, pure.

[2476] Burn, gooey, crank.

[2477] And he was saying crank.

[2478] Seth was.

[2479] Yeah, that was the most popular name for meth in the late 90s, early 2000s.

[2480] Yeah, okay.

[2481] In Californians.

[2482] By the way, I think I've said this before.

[2483] That drug was, there was no such thing as that drug of Michigan.

[2484] Meth?

[2485] Meth.

[2486] We did not have meth.

[2487] Really?

[2488] No. When I left in 19.

[2489] I left in 94, got here in 95.

[2490] As soon as I got here, everyone did meth.

[2491] It's always been huge on the West Coast.

[2492] Yes.

[2493] And it wasn't a thing in Michigan.

[2494] When I brought it back a couple different times to Michigan, and people were like, what is it?

[2495] I've heard of this.

[2496] I'm like, yeah, they have this stuff.

[2497] It's kind of like Coke, but way cheaper and way worse.

[2498] Oh, my God.

[2499] It's like fashion, how it starts on the coast and then makes its way.

[2500] Yeah.

[2501] Something to do with the biker.

[2502] gangs and the proximity to Mexico, whatever.

[2503] It was just huge on the West Coast.

[2504] Okay, gooey, crank, meth, crystal, ice, and yaba.

[2505] In Hawaii, it's ice.

[2506] So I've bought in this locally in enough places that I've had to use, I had to be respectful of the local culture and ask if anyone who would get ice.

[2507] If I would have been in Hawaii and asked for P, I would, they would have been, what the fuck is this?

[2508] This guy's a narc.

[2509] Oh, God.

[2510] You got to make sure no one thinks you're a narc.

[2511] Okay.

[2512] Tom Arnold's book title.

[2513] is how I lost seven pounds in eight years it is how I lost five pounds in six years still the best title that's a great title he we talked about Friday night I'm sorry five nights at Freddy's which is was the movie that Matt was in that was huge oh yeah I was ashamed I didn't know what that was I had heard of it from the youth okay the video game was released in 2014.

[2514] Okay, so it's a movie based on a video game.

[2515] But he plays Voldemort.

[2516] What?

[2517] Yeah.

[2518] Wait.

[2519] What?

[2520] No. Really?

[2521] Yeah.

[2522] This is the one that he's just filmed the sequel to?

[2523] Up in Toronto?

[2524] I don't know.

[2525] We're talking about the same movie?

[2526] I don't know.

[2527] I don't think so.

[2528] Maybe.

[2529] Hold on.

[2530] Yeah, he's in a movie that just did like $300 million.

[2531] Yeah, that's this.

[2532] Yeah, he plays Voldemort.

[2533] wait you better look up cast and see it says Voldy on there are you allowed to say it yeah we say things here we don't keep things quiet and Harry says we don't believe in not saying oh we do believe in not saying words that are offensive but we unless they're towards white people again guinea tea I have my guinea tea here ready to work out in okay Matthew lowered five nights at Freddy's no he plays William Afton So he plays two characters It looks like Tough acting to act It says American actor and film director Who portrays William Afton In the Five Nights at Freddy's film I mean It seems like Do you think maybe he was telling me He plays like a Voldemort character Probably Probably Okay Because I did think What is the intellectual properties Yeah that would be insane I just think he's the villain.

[2534] Also, Steve Raglan.

[2535] He also plays Steve Raglan, aka Voldemort.

[2536] No, do you remember quiz, pop quiz, do you know Voldemort's real name?

[2537] Do you remember?

[2538] Harry Raglan, what was that?

[2539] Tom Riddle.

[2540] Oh, I do know that.

[2541] Yeah, and he's, is he, Terrence's dad?

[2542] Uncle?

[2543] He's, uh, he's Voldemort.

[2544] Well, there is a, there's like, They're connected, you know, but they're not, no. His mom's brothers?

[2545] No, they're just connected, spiritually.

[2546] But his dad is James and his mom is silly.

[2547] You need to reread.

[2548] Yeah.

[2549] Okay.

[2550] Now.

[2551] For whatever reason, my retention of that material is low.

[2552] I have gone through the books.

[2553] It is interesting because you generally have a high retention.

[2554] For nonfiction.

[2555] Oh, yeah.

[2556] Okay.

[2557] I think my mind's like, this is fake.

[2558] I'm not going to use the hard dry.

[2559] space for something that's fake wow yeah fake is all relative everything's fake okay oh wait say that again fake is all relative everything's fake that was my setup for an eye roll yeah that wasn't very good it's my first time it wasn't very good i did i think that might have been my first time can you do it again yeah that was better it was quicker yeah i milked the first one didn't I well also I was like I went around the moon you didn't even no you went up and then you just moved your head The eye itself has to move.

[2560] No, it's like this.

[2561] Take three.

[2562] Tell me everything's fake.

[2563] Oh, oh, that was nice.

[2564] Yeah.

[2565] See, the eye itself move is not your head.

[2566] And you did like 270.

[2567] Oh.

[2568] All right.

[2569] Now say it last time, third take.

[2570] Okay.

[2571] Everything's fake.

[2572] I mean, really everything's fake.

[2573] It's pretty powerful.

[2574] You should try to work that into your repertoire, your arsenal of nonverbal.

[2575] Oh, my neck out.

[2576] Okay, is the Burt Reynolds going over the railing slash wood pile stunt in the movie?

[2577] I don't know because I didn't re -watch it.

[2578] Right.

[2579] And I didn't know to look for it.

[2580] It was big enough of you to watch it the first time.

[2581] I was excited to watch it.

[2582] Okay.

[2583] So the people can tell us.

[2584] How embarrassed were you for me, zero to ten?

[2585] Please be honest.

[2586] I can handle it.

[2587] I wasn't embarrassed for you at all.

[2588] You weren't.

[2589] No. And that's sort of what I was telling you when you.

[2590] I was expecting...

[2591] To be very embarrassed.

[2592] Not to be embarrassed, but to feel like it's going to be really different than what I'm used to.

[2593] You're then parenthood.

[2594] Exactly.

[2595] But no, that's why I was sort of surprised when you were very much the same.

[2596] Except, look, I will...

[2597] Here we go.

[2598] I will give you that it's you at...

[2599] A 10.

[2600] Forced.

[2601] A little more forced.

[2602] Not as much as I think you saw.

[2603] Right.

[2604] I don't think most people would think that, but I do know, like, your sweet spot.

[2605] Yeah, yeah.

[2606] And it did feel, it did feel a little.

[2607] It was redlining, as we'd say, in racing.

[2608] Oh, what's that?

[2609] Well, on your tachometer, you have like an ideal range that the motor is supposed to rotate in the engine.

[2610] Uh -huh.

[2611] And after a certain point, it starts rotating.

[2612] It's not making more power.

[2613] and now it's getting in jeopardy of exploding.

[2614] I see.

[2615] So I was like, I was definitely redlined.

[2616] Uh -huh.

[2617] But it was still funny.

[2618] Like, it wasn't, it wasn't like, oh, he, that's not funny.

[2619] Well, except for the Indian.

[2620] You're not going to like this because I did take a shower in the middle and I was sort of in an...

[2621] Oh, God.

[2622] So I think maybe I missed...

[2623] You did a shower in the middle.

[2624] I had to shower.

[2625] We were recording.

[2626] You're recording, and it was after my birthday.

[2627] How long was your shower, like 45, 50 minutes?

[2628] I did a hair mask.

[2629] 90 minutes.

[2630] No, no, no. I don't think I missed a lot, but I was a little in and out.

[2631] Okay, so you missed that part.

[2632] I missed it, and I think that was my dad.

[2633] He gave us that.

[2634] The only problem is, is that part does happen in one of the funner parts of the movie, which is we're running from bad guys.

[2635] Right.

[2636] This marijuana field has caught on fire.

[2637] So we're running as fast as we can and we're inhaling tons of weed and we're running, running, running, and then all of a sudden we're laughing, laughing, laughing.

[2638] And that's a very funny idea.

[2639] That is a very funny idea.

[2640] I'll watch it again.

[2641] No, that wasn't.

[2642] I'll forward to that scene and I'll make sure to watch that one.

[2643] Well, but don't watch the beginning of the scene.

[2644] I'm going to watch it.

[2645] But that's it.

[2646] All right.

[2647] Well, that was a very heartwarming episode for me. Yeah, that was lovely.

[2648] I'm glad we did that.

[2649] And, you know, when I was editing it, I was like, oh, this is like commentary.

[2650] DVD commentary, which I used to love so much.

[2651] And I don't remember if we did that.

[2652] I have a DVD copy, obviously, of the movie.

[2653] I wonder if there is a commentary.

[2654] I know that Coucher and I did a commentary on like eight hours of punked or eight episodes, not a smart idea.

[2655] Because you were on drugs.

[2656] No, it wasn't.

[2657] It's just, you're just riffing for hours.

[2658] You're saying a lot of stuff.

[2659] and no one's protecting you and you're trying to make each other laugh and then you're forgetting your I mean again there's no podcast back then it's a totally different time like I've I've not gone back to listen to that nor would I ever but I can't imagine you know that that aged well I see okay let's not we're probably talking like two horny 20 year olds at times and which was your identity at the time we were quite horny we shared that in common sure sure i think maybe don't go back no totally guys all of us we don't need to keep going forward yeah that's right let's just keep it time to go back it goes forward don't run from the pain run toward it you love there it is jzy lyric and it was natch all right i love you love you follow armchair expert on the wondry app amazon music or wherever you get your podcast you can listen to every episode of armchair expert early and ad free right now by join joining Wondry Plus in the Wondry app or on Apple Podcasts.

[2660] Before you go, tell us about yourself by completing a short survey at Wondry .com slash survey.