44 - Live from the Chicago Podcast Festival

[0] This is exactly right.

[1] Hey, this is exciting.

[2] An all -new season of only murders in the building is coming to Hulu on August 27th.

[3] Steve Martin, Martin Short, and Selena Gomez are back as your favorite podcaster, detectives.

[4] But there's a mystery hanging over everyone.

[5] Who killed Saz?

[6] And were they really after Charles?

[7] Why would someone want to kill Charles?

[8] This season, murder hits close to home.

[9] With a threat against one of their own, the stakes are higher than ever.

[10] Plus, the gang is going to Hollywood to turn their podcast into a major movie.

[11] Amid the glitz and glamour of Los Angeles, more mysteries and twists arise.

[12] Who knows what will happen once the cameras start to roll?

[13] Get ready for the stariest season yet with Merrill Streep, Zach Alfinacus, Eugene Levy, Eva Longoria, Melissa McCarthy, Devine, Joy Randolph, Molly Shannon, and more.

[14] Only murders in the building, premieres August 27th, streaming only on Hulu.

[15] Goodbye.

[16] That was our obligatory awkward hug.

[17] What's up, murderinos?

[18] Oh, you're so, I can't fucking see you, but you're pretty.

[19] I don't have a huge speech for this one, because we're going to keep it pretty simple.

[20] When we decided we were going to do the Chicago Podcast Festival, this was a show that was very high on our lists.

[21] We asked, they said yes.

[22] Please welcome to the stage, Georgia Hard Star, Karen Kilgariff, and Mike.

[23] So drunk.

[24] No. A little bit.

[25] Hi, Chicago.

[26] Okay, see you later.

[27] It's just going to be me, a one -woman show tonight.

[28] Oh, this is crazy.

[29] We're very happy to be here.

[30] Here we are.

[31] Anyone not know whose voice was who, and it's freaking out right now because he thought it was the other.

[32] I'm the one who says fuck a lot.

[33] I'm the one that says, look, you know, here's the thing.

[34] I didn't know I did that until you told me. Now I'm going to think about it all the time.

[35] This is fucking not so Very exciting The cool thing is that at some point I'm going to jump into this orchestra pit It's true That's what we decided beforehand We drew straws We drew straws And I was like I'm going to do the pit jump There's no orchestra She's just going to Oh there's no bottom There's no bottom I'll just push you Can I do a model walk to show off my dress.

[36] Oh, yes.

[37] I got this dress today at Chicago, Michigan Avenue, Nordstrom.

[38] I thought you were going to say, shout out Nordstrom.

[39] I thought she was going to say, can I do a monologue?

[40] Yeah, can I, could I do one dramatic and one comedic monologue?

[41] Go ahead, yeah.

[42] A short dance.

[43] Okay, go.

[44] Hold this.

[45] I just wish Karen wasn't so shy.

[46] And I just, what?

[47] Pockets are the greatest.

[48] Stop it.

[49] People love pockets, right?

[50] And I said that I texted you that my outfit was, I was going to cosplay Nancy St. St. St. St. St. St. St. St. St. St. St. There's.

[51] But I was going to wear, like, 80s heels.

[52] And I fucking, I just...

[53] Here, take a walk.

[54] It'll feel good.

[55] It started off, sad, and it ended great.

[56] And then?

[57] Yes.

[58] Should we, let's sit and talk?

[59] Yeah, because this is weird.

[60] This is so weird.

[61] All right.

[62] Well, let's not, should we not with the...

[63] Yeah, we shouldn't use these.

[64] Yeah, yeah.

[65] Except you're gonna.

[66] Although...

[67] Yeah, no, no, no, you're right, you're right, right.

[68] And let's do this, when we tell the stories, we will.

[69] It's just kind of slimming when you have it in front of you.

[70] By sex, draws the eye upward.

[71] Why didn't we ask for a couch?

[72] I need kickpants.

[73] What the fuck?

[74] Is this a small top stool?

[75] I said, give her the one that's wobbly.

[76] Whoa.

[77] So she looks so stupid.

[78] No, I'm fine.

[79] It'll be fine.

[80] I'm fine.

[81] Do you want to sit on the ground?

[82] Yeah, I'll sit cross -legged on the ground.

[83] We could.

[84] I don't know what we're going to...

[85] What were other people doing up here?

[86] Perching.

[87] Like a lady.

[88] Ugh.

[89] Not interested.

[90] Let's see, do you have any...

[91] We should do some business, right?

[92] Like some...

[93] That's right.

[94] No more shouting out, Earl, I'll have to come out there.

[95] The Corrections Corner is that our family isn't a thing up here.

[96] Corrections Corner is our drunk families.

[97] Up in a box somewhere.

[98] Mommy?

[99] Judging us.

[100] Clap for the family.

[101] They're all my mommy.

[102] Do you have things written?

[103] Karen, you're going to fuck him.

[104] Here's my corrections corner.

[105] It's fine.

[106] It'll be funny when I fall.

[107] It always is.

[108] My Corrections Corner, and this one is one of my favorites of all time.

[109] Last week we were talking about, I think we were.

[110] were probably reading a hometown, and someone mentioned, I read the name Vincent Lee, and they were saying, like, oh, that's a fucked up murder.

[111] And I was like, ooh, I got to look that up.

[112] We were like, I don't know who that is.

[113] I know.

[114] You've done it.

[115] So many, so many people wanted to let me know how I did know what it was, because I'd actually reported on it myself on my own podcast.

[116] Yep.

[117] Who would have fucking bunk?

[118] I mean, I don't remember their names or whatever.

[119] I remember the machete.

[120] We don't remember killers.

[121] We remember spirit, things and thoughts.

[122] Also, I would like to say people that catch up, people that are behind a little bit.

[123] Oh, yeah.

[124] I fucking now know that Manitoba is not a city.

[125] All right?

[126] I know now.

[127] You don't have to keep fucking telling me. She gets it.

[128] It's funny the corrections we get where we're like, yeah, we know.

[129] Uh, yeah.

[130] I know, I've known that for like two weeks.

[131] We're bitch, you guys know that we're total bitches, right?

[132] Like, uh, like, Like, Dad?

[133] Like, Winnipeg, Danny.

[134] That was my mom.

[135] Love you.

[136] She's a very tall woman.

[137] Um, oh, also, Stephen Ray Morris could not be here tonight.

[138] Stevie, our audio engineer.

[139] But his sister is here.

[140] His sister.

[141] Better.

[142] Sister Ray Morris.

[143] Stephanie Ray Morris.

[144] And she has no, she's never listened to the podcast and doesn't know that he's like Stephen and I want us all to like give her.

[145] She thinks it's, let her know.

[146] I believe, I think she, she thinks this is a Christian podcast, right?

[147] So this is going to be fun.

[148] Yeah.

[149] And Elvis's mom is here.

[150] Really?

[151] No, but I'll give it to me. I want that to happen.

[152] Like an old cat would come walking down.

[153] Half an ear, bit in the...

[154] I just don't know what to do.

[155] I'm going to get a chair.

[156] Should we get a chair chair?

[157] No, I'm going to beat this.

[158] I'm going to beat this stool.

[159] Don't even.

[160] Don't bring it over.

[161] Don't do it.

[162] Well, so this is...

[163] Oh, so this is my favorite murder podcast in case someone...

[164] Didn't anyone know that?

[165] Thank you for screaming so much.

[166] That's Karen.

[167] And that's Georgia.

[168] Yeah.

[169] I like that we're doing it now as if we do that at the top of every show.

[170] We honestly treat every show like we've never done podcasting before.

[171] It's like it surprises us every single week.

[172] Oh, we should introduce this.

[173] Is it if someone just fucking stumbled upon this?

[174] Like they're changing the radio stations and like, what is that?

[175] Exactly.

[176] It's 1961.

[177] These girls are cursing.

[178] What?

[179] What's that big?

[180] Do you have any corrections or shoutouts or anything you need to talk about?

[181] No, I'm petrified right now.

[182] Oh, okay.

[183] No, this is great.

[184] No, no, I mean, fuck, man. everything's the best right now right now yeah yeah it was the last one we did uh oh yeah okay what are you talking about the last episode we did oh i don't remember at all was it vincent lee i don't know well here we are nice to face a couple of it's like two people who didn't do their book report who are like anyway what i love about books is the paper inside The problem is you're not going to know all the like three hours of shit that's edited out of the podcast.

[185] That's not true.

[186] We just let everything go in there.

[187] Clearly we let it all go in.

[188] Let it go in.

[189] Should we talk about murder?

[190] Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[191] It's pretty, who's a murderina, like, for real?

[192] I mean, that's called pandering.

[193] Now we're pandering.

[194] I don't think it's our thing, though.

[195] I'm sitting on it with my butt.

[196] Oh, are you going to go first?

[197] I think I'm first this time.

[198] Awesome.

[199] I'm going to put my hands in my pockets and put my microphone over here.

[200] Would you mind putting your hands in your pocket, Karen?

[201] As I tell you, I swore I was going to belch and it's about to happen.

[202] She's going to do some Robert Durst belches for us.

[203] Oh, that was a good one.

[204] Did you?

[205] Was that really?

[206] Yeah, that was me. That sounded like a fucking horse.

[207] I swear to God.

[208] I thought you were like doing a joke burp sound.

[209] I'm a lady.

[210] That was unbelievable.

[211] I had a soda pop.

[212] If they want to pay us, I'll say which one it is.

[213] But, oh, not...

[214] Shit, girl.

[215] Otherwise, we don't do branding.

[216] Otherwise, Dr. Pepper.

[217] Okay.

[218] Ready?

[219] Yes.

[220] Are you ready?

[221] Yes.

[222] No, that's too much pressure.

[223] All right.

[224] Okay, so December 23rd, Supernare Christmas, in 1974.

[225] A great year for callers.

[226] and cords.

[227] There you go.

[228] Bring us back, Karen, to a time.

[229] 1974, where the air was filled with lead pollution and everybody had a mustache, even girls.

[230] Yeah, you were supposed to beat your children.

[231] Yes, you were required.

[232] We had to sign a paper when you left the hospital with the baby that said, I promise to hit this child in the face every day.

[233] Yeah.

[234] And I'll let anyone hit them too.

[235] Yeah.

[236] It's fine.

[237] Strangers, people on the street.

[238] probably deserve it.

[239] So, okay, so three ladies.

[240] Renee Wilson, she's 14, Rachel Trilika, who's 17, and Julie Ann Mosley, who's nine, go on a shopping trip for Christmas presents.

[241] Can't be good.

[242] Nope.

[243] No, they were fine.

[244] Let's talk about, we're talking about Ted Bundy.

[245] Anyway, Vlad the Impaler.

[246] So these three girls, They go to a upscale mall, the Seminary South shopping center.

[247] This girl knows it.

[248] I hear someone fucking whispering.

[249] In Fort Worth, Texas.

[250] Oh.

[251] Have you been?

[252] I just thought I should make a noise like that.

[253] Okay.

[254] They were supposed to be home by 4 p .m. Guess what, Karen?

[255] Didn't show up.

[256] They didn't show up.

[257] They didn't show up.

[258] So Renee and Rachel, the older girls, were old friends.

[259] Renee asked Rachel to come with her shopping and then Renee's boyfriend was going to come but he went to a friend's house so his little sister Julie begs to come so they bring her boyfriend's little sister along so it's the three of them.

[260] They get to the mall Rachel parks her car at the top of the fucking car park, Osmobile and they go shopping.

[261] People see them because and this needs to be our new shirt she's wearing a shirt that says sweet honesty what that's that's 1974 for you what the fuck what stoner put that thing together sweet honesty and you know it was like crazy cursive with the why on the honesty did like three loop to lose glitter like all around just on the tits yeah no bra no bra didn't have to 70s tits like that's a thing yeah for sure they were real love So a ton of people see them at the mall people because people see her shirt, whatever the fuck.

[262] And then that evening, families get worried, as they do, they go out looking for the girl, and they find her car where she parked it on the roof of the small area.

[263] And the car is locked and inside her the presents.

[264] So at some point they went to the car, put the presents in there, locked the car, and then what?

[265] Right.

[266] Karen, you know I'm all about vintage shopping.

[267] Absolutely.

[268] And when you say vintage, you mean when you physically drive to a store and actually purchase something with cash.

[269] Exactly.

[270] And if you're a small business owner, you might know Shopify is great for online sales.

[271] But did you know that they also power in -person sales?

[272] That's right.

[273] Shopify is the sound of selling everywhere.

[274] Online, in store, on social media, and beyond.

[275] Give your point of sales system a serious upgrade with Shopify.

[276] From accepting payments to managing inventory, they have everything you need to sell in person.

[277] So give your point of sale system a serious upgrade with Shopify.

[278] Their sleek, reliable POS hardware takes every major payment method and looks fabulous at the same time.

[279] With Shopify, we have a powerful partner for managing our sales, and if you're a business owner, you can too.

[280] Connect with customers in line and online.

[281] Do retail right with Shopify.

[282] Sign up for a $1 per month trial period at Shopify .com slash murder.

[283] important note that promo code is all lowercase go to shopify .com slash murder to take your retail business to the next level today that's shopify .com slash murder goodbye hey this is exciting an all new season of only murders in the building is coming to hulu on august 27th steve martin martin short and selina gomez are back as your favorite podcaster detectives but there's a mystery hanging over everyone who killed saz and were they really after charles why would someone want to kill charles this season murder close to home.

[284] With a threat against one of their own, the stakes are higher than ever.

[285] Plus, the gang is going to Hollywood to turn their podcast into a major movie.

[286] Amid the glitz and glamour of Los Angeles, more mysteries and twists arise.

[287] Who knows what will happen once the cameras start to roll?

[288] Get ready for the stariest season yet with Merrill Streep, Zach Alfenakis, Eugene Levy, Eva Longoria, Melissa McCarthy, DeVine, Joy Randolph, Molly Shannon, and more.

[289] Only Martyrs in the Building, premieres August 27th, streaming only on Hulu.

[290] Goodbye.

[291] yes I don't know you have to tell me so they're freaking out the next day a letter comes in the mail and it goes to Rachel's husband's house now Rachel who was 17 and married what what yeah wait is that sweet honesty that's the other one even a 14 year old is wearing a sweet honesty shirt fuck don't let your babies grow up to be sweet honesty for real she's married to this dude this dude her husband was dating her older sister beforehand look it happens yes guilty they break up her little sister and her boyfriend get married and then the sister's living with them at the time what no like we all know where this is like we know Wait, are you just talking out an episode of Game of Thrones and saying it happened in Fort Worth?

[292] Never seen it.

[293] No, this is Dallas.

[294] I'm talking to Dallas.

[295] Yeah, right?

[296] Okay.

[297] But no. Letter comes in the mail.

[298] Why is he checking his fucking mail the day after his wife gets fucking kidnapped?

[299] You think he should have avoided that mail boss?

[300] I mean, why are you checking it?

[301] He loves mail.

[302] It's the only thing that made him feel better.

[303] fucking catalogs and postcards fair enough well he goes to his mailbox and he finds a letter from her supposedly from rachel says I know I'm going to catch it which is like the cutest phrase I've ever heard in my life like catch some shit I know I'm going to catch it I don't want to catch it I'm going to catch it but we just had to get away we're going to Houston see you in about a week the cars and Sears upper lot love rachel I write I know so like he gets that letter her name is kind of misspelled his name is seriously her first name is misspelled yeah a little bit misspelled like no it has I look I've done that so many times right it's like KA's I want to make fun of that but recently my manager emailed me was like hey your name's spelled wrong and you're real and I was like, what are you talking about?

[304] I looked at it, and it said, G -E -O -R -I -G -A.

[305] I fucking spelled my own goddamn name wrong.

[306] That was like, Giorga.

[307] Jorga.

[308] It's been like three years, and I didn't notice it.

[309] So fair enough.

[310] Once you change it, you're going to get so many jobs.

[311] People have been like, I want to hire her for the million -dollar thing, right?

[312] I can't find her.

[313] Her name's spelled wrong.

[314] There goes a million dollars.

[315] So it does have.

[316] It does.

[317] This isn't crazy.

[318] It happens.

[319] Let's be fair.

[320] Okay, so her husband was married to the legal rah.

[321] Family thinks that the letter, they're like, that's not her handwriting, and she spelled her fucking name wrong.

[322] And in addition, to back that up.

[323] So the stamp had been stamped, you know, like cleared at the thing.

[324] At the post office.

[325] that morning.

[326] So someone sent that thing the night before or on the 24th of when it shut up, which I'm like, if you're just, if you just kidnap three people randomly, you're not going to bother to let the family know.

[327] You kidnap and you get straight to that correspondence.

[328] Yeah.

[329] Like that's to throw people off.

[330] Yeah.

[331] That's not like a serial killer who's like grabbing three people and doesn't give a shit, right?

[332] No, that's like an anal retentive serial killer.

[333] that's like a leave us alone for a minute right serial killer you mean can I have some privacy can I have some privacy while I have some privacy while like to sit at my secretary's desk and just write out with a feather pen like right after I kidnap them though you know what I mean it's weird I get it all right so um so people saw them that day because clearly she had a sweet honesty shirt on and like how are you going to miss that one a 14 year old and like that sounds like a stripper name nothing I'm not saying there's anything wrong strippers it's just a name just a name it's quite it's sweet and honest so a woman tells a store clerk that she saw some men hustle the girls and do a pickup truck but police never located that witness another says that the girls had been spotted in a security patrol car um so in 1981 which was what let's do math was just like so many years later.

[334] Six plus one is seven years later.

[335] Seven.

[336] Seven years later.

[337] A man, a man randomly comes around and he's like, hey, I saw a girl, I saw a man forcing them into a van that day.

[338] You fucking dick.

[339] Like, what the fuck?

[340] Where were you?

[341] Where were you?

[342] Oh, in 81, I just like popped into my head that these fucking girls were being forced into a van.

[343] He had so much stuff on his mind.

[344] Christmas.

[345] Tons of littering back then.

[346] But the guy in the van told him, he goes hey it's a family dispute don't worry about it and that's why he never told it until he was till 81 yeah I mean like can you eat I can't even well because you know it was like back then if your family was fighting about something you could throw them in a van forcibly at the mall true it was done how many people out here have like seen that and just never told anyone about it as a family dispute okay your family's psychopaths anything I will call the police just if I see a van I don't give a fuck I don't care.

[347] I'd be like, it's clearly a bread truck.

[348] I don't care.

[349] Call 911.

[350] Karen does citizens arrest all over town.

[351] They won't even believe her now.

[352] Her brother says, Rachel's brother says that there's been sightings all over the Fort Worth area.

[353] You know, it's one of those like, they were white slaves, like people keep saying that.

[354] Some of the sightings were, what happened?

[355] Someone doesn't like that.

[356] It doesn't matter.

[357] Oh, shit.

[358] Someone's mad about something we said?

[359] Okay, and they hired a private detective to look for it.

[360] He committed suicide in 1970.

[361] When your fucking private detective commits suicide?

[362] Like, come on.

[363] You're like, no, we're the ones that are mourning.

[364] And he was like, he had a will that said, like, destroy my records when I die.

[365] They destroy the records.

[366] Commit suicide, then fucking destroyed records.

[367] They were like, you know what?

[368] we're just going to sweep all this under the rug we think that's the way we're going to handle all of this.

[369] You know what we're going to do?

[370] We're going to be of the 80s.

[371] Okay, so these fucking chicks are never found.

[372] So, wait, sorry, now we're in the 80s?

[373] Were that far ahead?

[374] No. 79 that happened.

[375] I just, I said the 80s as like a thing.

[376] Sorry, sorry, sorry.

[377] It just seemed, I'm not questioning you.

[378] I guess you are.

[379] It's our first fight.

[380] Here in Chicago.

[381] It's the place to do it.

[382] Okay, so they were never found.

[383] Spoiler alert, I'm sorry, that sucks, it blows.

[384] But there's two suspects that I find very interesting.

[385] So Mike D. Bardellon, Ben.

[386] Read that.

[387] Read that.

[388] Hold on, let me get my readers.

[389] Mike D. Bardell -Eben.

[390] What I say.

[391] It really is what it says.

[392] That wasn't just you kind of having fun.

[393] It was a copy and paste.

[394] No, no, no, no. That was a copy and base.

[395] So this dude gets arrested for passing counterfeit bills, and then the cops found evidence of sex crimes, including him taking photos of him raping and murdering humans.

[396] Yeah.

[397] Thank you.

[398] Oh, you didn't know?

[399] That's what the whole fucking podcast is about.

[400] Someone's like, wait, what?

[401] I thought you were going to talk out the story of the Wizard of Oz.

[402] No, it's all this bad.

[403] The FBI profilers think that when the face is seen in the photo, he kills them.

[404] When the face isn't seen, he allows them to live.

[405] And you're like, come on, you fucking dick.

[406] Okay, so here's the tie -in is that he's a convicted kidnapper, rapist, counterfeiter, and suspected serial killer was the habit of passing counterfeit bills in shopping malls.

[407] He was operating around Texas around that time and was known to impersonate security guards and other positions of authority.

[408] Remember that chick was like, I saw security guard driving them in his van, right?

[409] Because like who, what girl back then isn't going to like go with, oh my God, my bell chicken, go with his security guard?

[410] Do it into the microphone next time.

[411] We accept you.

[412] My mom is here.

[413] Oh, that's right, sorry.

[414] This is what you raised.

[415] Yeah, I mean, okay, so the guy comes over and he's like, did you see that?

[416] Yeah, it was awesome.

[417] That's good podcasting right there.

[418] That's the kind of shit you can't see when you're listening.

[419] Yeah, Saeed.

[420] Thank you.

[421] She's like the David Blaine of paper.

[422] Okay, so like back then, guys, like I saw you shoplifting.

[423] I'm a security guard.

[424] And you're like, no, I didn't.

[425] And he's like, come with me, you know, and he makes them all come with him.

[426] Yeah.

[427] You go.

[428] It's like he has a blue shirt.

[429] shirt on with a belt and then you're like, oh, I guess you're in charge.

[430] I guess I have to fucking do whatever you say.

[431] There's no stranger danger.

[432] There's, don't fucking talk back to authority.

[433] That's right.

[434] That's what that was back then.

[435] Yes.

[436] So you just get in the car.

[437] Yeah.

[438] Goodbye.

[439] Sweet honesty.

[440] Sweet honesty, she didn't understand.

[441] It's actually you should sweet kick him in the dick.

[442] That's what her shorts have said.

[443] You guys, pepper spray first and fucking apologize later.

[444] These days, George's favorite thing to say, should I pepper spray that guy?

[445] It's my, it makes me laugh so hard.

[446] I can't remember where we were, but you were just like, do I need to pepper spray this guy?

[447] It's like, please don't.

[448] Not right now.

[449] Why not?

[450] Just spray it around, like room freshener in your mouth, beong, vignat.

[451] What is spelled?

[452] Benaka.

[453] Uh -uh, let's do this.

[454] Okay, so he's known to impersonate cereal.

[455] security cards, not serial killers, and other positions of authority.

[456] He lived within a half mile of Rachel, one of the girls who disappeared at the time of the disappearance.

[457] And then I wrote, fucked up, he earned the respect of the FBI profilers because he never gave himself away in unguarded moments, nor bragged about his exploits.

[458] So the fucking FBI was like, good on him, that he never told anyone.

[459] Well, it was like a healthy respect for the enemy.

[460] Because usually they brag.

[461] Yeah, but I don't respect them for not getting it.

[462] out of this dude.

[463] If their fucking killer is smarter, are we going to, should I not talk shit about the FBI?

[464] Probably.

[465] I don't know.

[466] It's a sensitive time.

[467] Do it, someone yells.

[468] You fucking do it.

[469] Listen, love those guys.

[470] I'm just saying this dude was a serial killer.

[471] We're going to do a show at the FBI at Quantico.

[472] Next month.

[473] The murder of our government.

[474] You guys?

[475] Okay, the other dude, who I think is just the fucking dude, Lloyd Welch, he's a drifter and a hitchhiker.

[476] Lord?

[477] Oh, sorry.

[478] That would be cool, though.

[479] He's like a lord?

[480] Lord Welch.

[481] But in Texas.

[482] Lord of the bad manners.

[483] Because he...

[484] The bad manners.

[485] That's what gets cut out usually.

[486] Okay.

[487] He's recently been charged around that...

[488] Oh, recently around now, he's been charged with the murder of the lion sisters.

[489] there's two girls, and you're shaking your head, I can see it.

[490] Catherine, who is 10, and Sheila, who was 12, disappears from a Maryland mall in 1975.

[491] Oh, okay, the exact same, M .O. M .O. At the time of his arrest, he's serving a lengthy prison sentence in Delaware for child sexual abuse.

[492] So he's a real fun guy.

[493] Like a prize.

[494] Yeah, mom is proud.

[495] Good stuff.

[496] So in December 2014, here's another fucking asshole.

[497] Welch's cousin.

[498] tells detectives that he had helped Welch so that they never found the lion sisters.

[499] They were like, you know, these girls got kidnapped from them all.

[500] Never found them.

[501] In 2014, Welch's cousin is like, well, one time I helped him with two heavy duffel bags in 1975.

[502] Dude.

[503] It gets worse.

[504] They met at a property in Virginia.

[505] He said he helped to remove two army -style duffel bags from Welch's vehicle.

[506] Each bag weighed about 60 or 70 pounds and smelled like, death.

[507] It was probably camping equipment.

[508] It gets musty.

[509] You know how when your cousins ask you to help you burn or bury something and you're like, I'm just not asking questions.

[510] I mean, look, we're all cousins.

[511] We have to be at Thanksgiving together.

[512] Just be chill.

[513] It'll be so awkward if I'm like, what's in these?

[514] And you're like, I don't want to tell you.

[515] Come on.

[516] Don't unzip that.

[517] It's my murder duffel.

[518] He tells in 2014.

[519] And then, oh, and he said, further, the best.

[520] bags were covered in red stains.

[521] It's probably Kool -Aid.

[522] Was he blind and death?

[523] And then in 2014, he came to, yeah, and it all snapped back miraculously.

[524] And, okay, so Lloyd Welch happens to be, he happens to work at the time, he was like a drifter, but he worked for a traveling carnival company.

[525] Guess where they set up all the time in the 70s?

[526] Inside a duffel bag?

[527] No. In malls.

[528] And he was in Austin, Texas until around 75.

[529] This carnival set up in malls from the mid -70s to 97.

[530] I'm just trying to picture a mall carnival, and it's like, bumming me out so bad.

[531] You know, your parents always were, like, they were always like, those rides are going to kill you.

[532] They also didn't say, those ride people are going to kill you.

[533] Yes, right.

[534] Basically, everything over there is going to kill you.

[535] Yeah.

[536] Everything your mom, like your parents told you to worry about, and you were like, you're being annoying.

[537] No, they'll kill you.

[538] They're dead on.

[539] Yeah.

[540] Dead on.

[541] It's so annoying when your parents are right.

[542] Yeah.

[543] So in July 2015, Welch is indicted, charged with the girl's murder.

[544] His uncle is a person of interest.

[545] Yeah.

[546] The devil bad guy?

[547] Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[548] Okay, so here's another thing.

[549] So he's in malls, blah, blah, blah.

[550] His longtime girlfriend at the time dated for over 10 years.

[551] We're always on the road together, et cetera, et cetera.

[552] She was a security guard at a mall.

[553] Oh, like for the real deal?

[554] Yeah.

[555] Bared her outfit.

[556] What's up?

[557] Stole those kids.

[558] You know it.

[559] Oh, and then in 2001, a former Sears security guard and Fort Worth Police officer gives a chilling account.

[560] He says that he witnessed girls climb into a pickup truck of a young mall security guard and that they appeared to go with him willingly.

[561] Goodbye.

[562] I mean, that's just fucked.

[563] Never found.

[564] Never found in the other two girls that were murdered.

[565] That was never prosecuted either.

[566] But do we know that the husband and sister weren't involved?

[567] The brother thinks that the sister was involved.

[568] I'd like to bring all of Texas up on charges for this story.

[569] No one's innocent in this, it seems like.

[570] You wouldn't be wrong.

[571] But also, so wait, somebody had, the girlfriend was a real secure.

[572] yards, so they could have been borrowing badges and shit and stuff to make it look real.

[573] Totally.

[574] Or maybe she was complicit?

[575] Maybe she was complicit and fucking was like, get in my car, girls.

[576] And they got in our car.

[577] You know?

[578] Yeah.

[579] All right, so don't go to the mall.

[580] Don't talk to security guards.

[581] Don't wear your sweet honesty shirt ever again.

[582] No sweet honesty anymore.

[583] Stop it.

[584] Don't do it.

[585] I have to say those cold cases drive me crazy.

[586] I know.

[587] I love them.

[588] I know.

[589] That's your favorite.

[590] there's just no we should set up like a red phone on stage in case somebody finds out and they can call us immediately ring through it would be like Lord Welch oh my good you guys and then um and then like the balloons drop and confetti comes down and we all dance and dance well good one that was a good one thank you clapford George's oh I thought you were leaving I was just giving you your time in the spotlight Like, stool.

[591] I'm sorry, I'm sorry to say that about your stool.

[592] Stand and deliver.

[593] I'm going to stand and stare at you like.

[594] Well, I did a very pandery thing, and I picked a Chicago murderer.

[595] You think you're better than me?

[596] What's that?

[597] I said, you think you're better than me?

[598] That's right.

[599] But also, because there were so many choices.

[600] A lot of people love, they love to talk about how, like, Pacific Northwest.

[601] West, oh, you have so many murders in San Francisco.

[602] Hello, Chicago.

[603] You guys want to kill everybody.

[604] Chicago just doesn't brag about it.

[605] That's right.

[606] They're just low -key.

[607] Yeah.

[608] They're just like, yeah, let's go have a beer.

[609] I don't need to talk about that.

[610] How are you doing?

[611] More importantly, we don't need to talk about the torso murders.

[612] How are you doing?

[613] I've all killed.

[614] No, that's not here.

[615] No, that's Cleveland.

[616] Anyway.

[617] So there was a lot.

[618] Lippy.

[619] There was a lot of choices to choose from, and there was a lot of favorites, but I actually had to go with, this is my original, the reason I got into reading serial killer books and watching true crime shows, fucking John Wayne Gayne.

[620] I know this, because she accidentally told me in the hotel room.

[621] It slipped out in the hotel room.

[622] What was the context of that?

[623] You were talking about how the hotel concierge was like, you had to print out your notes.

[624] And she was like, if you like John Wayne Gasey, you'll love this tour.

[625] And then I was like, oh, fuck.

[626] Yeah.

[627] That's all I said.

[628] There was nothing else revealed.

[629] So I don't have the deets.

[630] Yeah.

[631] But I'm about to hear them.

[632] You're about to hear them.

[633] And you may have heard me say this before, but the first thing I ever saw about John Wayne Gacey, because if you know, he buried the bodies of teenage boys that he murdered inside his house.

[634] And when the police arrested him finally, and, uh, He was able to draw a diagram of his house, and he knew where every single boy was in the house, and there were 27 of them.

[635] I bet the FBI didn't respect him after that.

[636] That's right.

[637] They were like, oh, look at Braggie Bragerstein over there.

[638] Take it easy.

[639] So I saw, when I was, like, probably 12, I opened a book.

[640] Good age to see the shit.

[641] It's a perfect age for true crime.

[642] opened a book and they had drawn, based on the diagram that John Wayne Gacy had drawn, they had been, because they just used like long rectangles to show where the bodies were.

[643] And some artist had basically drawn body shapes.

[644] Like, it almost looked like a chalk outline, but like body shapes in a house diagram.

[645] So that's, I like was, oh, childhood, and, you know, Johnny loves chalky and fucking this and that.

[646] And I look down at this thing, and I'm like, why are those boys floating in those boxes?

[647] And then I read underneath it.

[648] And it's like, you know, 27 bodies were buried inside this house.

[649] And I was just like, okay, now I know that.

[650] And now I must know more.

[651] And I won't stop.

[652] Adding that to Charlotte's Web and all the shit you already knew.

[653] Some pig.

[654] So let's talk about.

[655] Fucking good old John.

[656] Also, the middle name Wayne is very common in serial killer world, which I think is kind of great that he got in there.

[657] I don't know, but he, they named him John Wayne Gasey because his mom loved John Wayne, the actor.

[658] Red flag.

[659] Right?

[660] Not a good sign.

[661] That she loved film.

[662] So John Wayne Gacy was born on March 17th, St. Patrick's Day, 1942, at Edgewater Hospital in Chicago, Illinois.

[663] Anyone, Edgewater?

[664] Anyone else?

[665] You guys work there?

[666] Were you also born there with him?

[667] He was the second of three children.

[668] He had an older sister and a younger sister, and his father was a machinist who had been in World War I, and he was a very bad alcoholic.

[669] So the story was that his dad would come home from work and he would go down into the basement and drink brandy which sounds classy But they would have they would The mom would make dinner and then I'll sit at the dinner table and wait for him to come upstairs And see how he felt Well I bet when he came up he was real happy and everyone was like We can finally talk about brandy Well no Oh God Instead, normally he would come up drunk and very angry, and he would beat them with a strap for dinner.

[670] I'm good tonight on strap.

[671] I'm so full of strap from last night, Dad.

[672] You can give it to her, though, if you want.

[673] She's real hungry, her strap.

[674] And part of what they say, they think what fueled his rage is that John was basically a mama's boy, and he liked that, you know, the father was into fishing and hunting and man, man, man, and John liked to cook, and he liked to be in the kitchen with his mom.

[675] He liked planting flowers in the garden.

[676] Things that in, like, the late 40s apparently brought deep shame upon you and your ancestors and were unacceptable.

[677] It made you drink brandy and beat children.

[678] It sounds like the norm back then, though, you know?

[679] Yeah, I think it is.

[680] It's like everybody has to fit into their box If you don't, I'm going to punch you in the face even though you're eight.

[681] All right.

[682] And then I wrote down there, toxic masculinity ruins the party again.

[683] Can't wait to see that meme.

[684] Then when John was nine, he was molested by a family friend, and then when he was 11, he was hit in the head with a baseball bat?

[685] What?

[686] With a swing.

[687] With a swing, exactly like Richard Ramirez.

[688] with a swing.

[689] You know what I was like he got to nine.

[690] He was so fucking close to like not getting molested.

[691] Like you're so close.

[692] And then some fucking shitty neighbor like your dad's family friend.

[693] Yeah.

[694] Comes along.

[695] So close to getting, and then a fucking swing.

[696] Were they like that swing?

[697] Were they not in a metal back then?

[698] They probably were made out of like seven pounds of metal.

[699] They're like this will really center this swing nicely.

[700] Yeah.

[701] And it's lead.

[702] so if you lick it, you're going to die.

[703] So, but he also had a bad heart.

[704] So he was prone to fainting spells, which didn't help with the whole also gardening and cooking thing.

[705] I'm saying, ah.

[706] He's just, like, taking five every once in a while.

[707] Type of stuff.

[708] And the, so he just felt, wait, he's all fucked up.

[709] then to add to the household tension John had a secret fetish for women's underwear so he would steal his mother's silk panties and put them hold on in a bag and in a brown bag in the back of the closet and he would that was his like panty stash mommy's panty stash that said he just stashed them he's well I'm I mean who am I to say that he masturbated all over them.

[710] That's what I was looking for.

[711] That's hearsay.

[712] Because I have a fetish for panties.

[713] I buy a bunch of them and I wear them as underwear.

[714] Not the same.

[715] You know, Victoria's, whatever.

[716] You buy a bunch of them and then stick him in a brown bag and tuck them into the back ear.

[717] No, I don't do that.

[718] And then I kill people.

[719] Yeah.

[720] So he told one of his friends that he had them, he showed them to a friend of his and then said he wanted.

[721] He wished he could know what he looked like as a woman.

[722] Oh, never trust anyone.

[723] So then his sister found that brown bag in the closet.

[724] She told the mom, and the mom was like, oh, Johnny's always had a fetish for panties.

[725] So she was quite progressive, actually.

[726] Which is very nice to hear, but not helpful in any way.

[727] So, okay, so when he, so he had a hard time in school.

[728] He wasn't popular.

[729] He fainted a lot.

[730] He was always thinking about those underwear.

[731] And then he was, when he was night, he never graduated from high school.

[732] He went to four different high schools around the greater metropolitan area.

[733] And then he never graduated.

[734] And when he was 19, he just left town.

[735] He moved to Las Vegas without telling his family.

[736] That sounds like what you're supposed to do when you live in the Midwest.

[737] That's right.

[738] Bye.

[739] No, I mean, like, get out of your small town.

[740] I don't mean, not you guys.

[741] They just all come rushing to this thing.

[742] Don't worry, they'll fall into the orchestra pit.

[743] We're totally, say, ah, ah.

[744] So here's the thing.

[745] So he gets a job in Las Vegas, and, like, I was thinking about this.

[746] Like, the first job you get out of high school, it's usually based on the thing you kind of like the most or the thing that you're into.

[747] So, like, I worked at a yogurt shop because I fucking love eating so much.

[748] I worked at a bakery.

[749] Did you?

[750] Yeah.

[751] And, well, John became a janitor at a mortuary.

[752] Yeah.

[753] Because it was his passion, the dead.

[754] And he actually later admitted to the police that when he worked there one night, he, that's right.

[755] No, no. He got into a coffin with the body of a dead boy and fondled it.

[756] It's 47 pages right here.

[757] A lot of this is my poetry I'm going to read later.

[758] Um, his parents actually hire a private investigator to find him.

[759] And they find him in Vegas.

[760] My parents wouldn't do that.

[761] I know, right?

[762] And be like, well, good luck.

[763] I mean, if you've got to be in Vegas, fumbling dead bodies, then live your dreams.

[764] He came back to Chicago, and he went to business college, and it turned out he's a born salesman, because he is a psychopath.

[765] Right?

[766] Right?

[767] We're learning as we talk on this podcast all about terminology and what it actually means as opposed to what I think it means and say it means to a whole shitload of people.

[768] And then people, we didn't know, we're learning that people believe us when we say shit.

[769] Yeah.

[770] I didn't know that.

[771] Yeah.

[772] So I think we've taught like psychosis.

[773] I've mixed up psychosis and psychopath.

[774] half.

[775] So I had the thing where I told people that 25 % of the population were sociopaths.

[776] People do not like that.

[777] And then in corrections corner, she said that it was only one quarter.

[778] Yes.

[779] And I was like, okay.

[780] I didn't question it.

[781] Everything's fine.

[782] You know anyone can do a podcast, right?

[783] Anybody.

[784] Yeah, anyone gets a podcast.

[785] It's true.

[786] So, but for this, I looked it up because clearly we know that these major players are usually psychopaths.

[787] And their thing is that they're very ambitious.

[788] It's like they just want to get ahead.

[789] They're very, very charming.

[790] Which apparently John Wayne Gasey was very charming and had the gift of Gabby's really, he's very, you know, like he just made people feel very comfortable.

[791] And then he had an insatiable sexual appetite.

[792] So he was kind of always doing things so that he could...

[793] Those all sounds so, like, time -consuming.

[794] You know?

[795] Like it makes me want to take a nap.

[796] Yeah, he had to...

[797] You had to, like, take vitamins and just really, like, make sure you got enough water and stuff.

[798] You know, what's great is taking a nap with a cat.

[799] Like, I don't know.

[800] You don't need to be super sexual or talky or fucking cool.

[801] You can just go to sleep.

[802] Yeah.

[803] Well, not John, as far as I know.

[804] I mean, good for him, kind of.

[805] What if he was, like, a crazy cat lady?

[806] He's like, oh, my God, I have, like, 12 cats.

[807] I love it.

[808] He worked at the Nunn Bush Shoe Company here in Chicago.

[809] Anyone?

[810] Oh, Karen.

[811] Did they shut it down?

[812] Stephen, can we edit that out?

[813] Stephen, can we turn that part up where no one supported me?

[814] He was very good at it, and he ended up getting transferred to Springfield, Illinois.

[815] Oh, big time.

[816] Are you representing from Springfield?

[817] I was fucking right.

[818] And he joined a group called the J -C's.

[819] You can cheer for it.

[820] Now I just don't believe that you're actually behind it.

[821] The John Gacy's?

[822] They were all John Gases?

[823] No, the JCs.

[824] That's JGs.

[825] Fuck.

[826] Sorry.

[827] Mom, this is your fault.

[828] Jesus.

[829] The JCs from what I can gather, which there is almost no information.

[830] I think they might be the Illuminati because it just is a website, a weird blue website that's like, we're a non -profit organization in the help for the city.

[831] And it's like, but why?

[832] And based on who?

[833] And like, there's no answers.

[834] Just young people in jackets that are like the JCs.

[835] So he was in the JCs and he made a lot of like contacts and like, you know, I guess made friends or whatever, very active.

[836] And that's when you hear about John Wayne Gacy that he was like, you know, he lived this crazy double life because he was all successful and, you know, was in parades and shit.

[837] Well, I think it was like it was based in the JCs.

[838] That's how it started.

[839] And he was, so on, in.

[840] In February, 1964, he meets a shy bookkeeper, and a year later, he marries her, and she has a very wealthy family, it turns out.

[841] It's an incredibly beneficial marriage to him.

[842] I want to say a shy bookkeeper as to what bookkeepers are usually like, which is fucking out of control.

[843] A lot of theater students become bookkeepers.

[844] And then...

[845] So she's wealthy.

[846] Yeah.

[847] And so he's like, that's so weird, I'm in love with you.

[848] what a great coincidence so later that year so they get married in oh no sorry they meet in February of 64 they get married soon after and then later that year this is mathematically impossible shit later that it's I have later that same year while his wife is in the hospital giving birth to their first child but I'm pretty sure no unless he could have knocked her up before Oh, girl.

[849] John, you dog.

[850] Basically, she gets pregnant with their first child.

[851] She's in the hospital giving birth.

[852] You know, back then, I was like, men didn't have to be in the delivery room.

[853] They weren't, you know, they were just smoking the yard.

[854] Women didn't even have to be there.

[855] They just, like, knocked you the fuck out.

[856] That's right.

[857] You're like, bye.

[858] Baby.

[859] Let me know when the baby comes.

[860] Well, he actually was at a bar around the corner with one of his co -workers, who he ended up fucking that night.

[861] While his wife was giving birth.

[862] wakes up in the apartment the next day, gets dressed, goes to the hospital, and holds his newborn son.

[863] Yeah, so this is the beginning of his double life.

[864] And then, in 1966, his father -in -law says, if you move to Waterloo, Iowa, I will kill you from the audience.

[865] She's just scared because she was thinking about something that happened earlier.

[866] There was a spider.

[867] There was a spider on her seat.

[868] Yeah, and there was a spider.

[869] the father -in -law says if you move to Waterloo, Iowa, you can have three Kentucky Fried Chicken Restaurant.

[870] Oh my God.

[871] Blue chicken?

[872] I would do that.

[873] So he goes there to manage he's 24 at this point.

[874] Holy shit.

[875] And the funniest thing is we watch these I mean there's a million what do you call documentaries about him.

[876] He always looks 53 like from from fucking jump.

[877] When there's pictures of him as a boy you're like, is that the oldest boy in America?

[878] He's just...

[879] At the Kentucky Fried Chickens, they say he's like a good manager and he does very well in the job, but he makes his employees call him the colonel.

[880] Oh, fucking nerd.

[881] Can you believe?

[882] If I was standing there with my dumb apron on, like working Kentucky Fried Chicken, he's like, I'm your new manager, but you've got to call me the Colonel.

[883] I'd be like, see you fucking later, Colonel.

[884] I don't work here anymore.

[885] But you know, he thinks it's like fun.

[886] I'm like, you can call me this.

[887] But every time you don't, he's like, call me this.

[888] I said call me this.

[889] And she comes home from a hard day of work, and she's like, my 24 -year -old fucking boss, I'm 53, I just fit.

[890] He was telling me to call him the fucking colonel.

[891] He also loves boys.

[892] Yeah, so he quickly becomes a well -liked member of the community.

[893] That's what he does, what he's good at.

[894] He joins the J -C's in Waterloo.

[895] They're everywhere.

[896] Now you're going to see them everywhere.

[897] It eventually turns into Scientology.

[898] And they said he became the most valuable member of the JCs because he got put in charge.

[899] He's the chairman of the membership drive.

[900] And what he would do to get people to join the JCs would have them meet in a motel room and show stag movies and bring prostitutes and have orgies.

[901] That sounds amazing.

[902] And then people would be like, sure, I'll join the fucking JCs.

[903] Let's do this.

[904] Yeah, like, what did it take to become the most valuable member back then?

[905] Just, like, some money for prostitutes.

[906] Fucking sex workers, sorry.

[907] Back then, I think they were prostitutes.

[908] Historical.

[909] So, oh, then his sister in one of these documentaries talks about, she finds out when they go visit them one time that him and his wife swap partners.

[910] Like, they're, what is that called?

[911] Swingers.

[912] They're swingers.

[913] Like Vince Vaughn and his friend.

[914] We don't even know what that mean.

[915] And we're like kind of proud of it.

[916] He tells his sister when they're visiting.

[917] I was like, yeah, we're going to go to this party tonight, but we might go home with other people.

[918] I was like, okay.

[919] You know you're both gross, right?

[920] You know I know about the underwear and the bag, right?

[921] Yeah.

[922] And then he's voted the J .C.'s man of the year.

[923] So...

[924] Call me Colonel.

[925] So then, in...

[926] When he's in Waterloo, he ends up, his wife goes out of town, he invites the 15 -year -old son of a fellow JC and a state senator over to the house to watch a stag film and get drunk, and he molests this boy.

[927] No shit.

[928] And then he told him, you can't tell him, because I have ties to the mafia in Chicago, here's 50 bucks, keep your mouth shut.

[929] And it works for a little while.

[930] It works for long enough so that he molest this.

[931] second boy.

[932] And then finally one boy breaks and then the other one does and he gets arrested and he gets sent to prison probation for 10 years.

[933] Okay.

[934] The prison psychiatrist recommends that he not be released ever as he was a sexual sadist and could never be rehabilitated but he was so well behaved that he served 18 months.

[935] Yay!

[936] Fucking fuck, man. his wife divorces him she's like the swinging thing was one thing but what the fuck so he goes back to Chicago while he's in jail his father dies has a heart attack and dies and he's convinced it's because of what he did which is probably true so he goes and moves in his mother helps him buy a house and they move in together and he's like trying to make good on all of his bad behavior Good luck with that.

[937] So they buy a house at 8213 West Somerdale Avenue in the Norwood Park.

[938] Anyone live there at that house?

[939] But for real, though.

[940] You can't cheer if you don't actually live there.

[941] And we're all going there right now.

[942] And then in June of 1971, he starts his infamous contracting company business, I should say, called PDM, which stands for painting, decorating, and maintenance.

[943] What does it really stand for?

[944] Pedophile.

[945] Penis.

[946] Karen.

[947] It stands for penis, but he put DM after, just to throw people off.

[948] And here's the thing.

[949] He basically only hires teenage boys to work for him.

[950] Red flag.

[951] And when, I mean, really.

[952] And when anybody asks him about it, he's like, they're more reliable than grown men.

[953] Uh -huh.

[954] Teenage boys in the 70s.

[955] there's like literal movies made about teenage boys in the 70s being unreliable being unreliable so okay so in January of 1972 when he is 29 61 he picks up he's single now so he doesn't have to no one's checking on him I don't think his mother's really paying attention party so one night he goes to the Greyhound bus station and he picks up a teenage runaway named Tim McCoy.

[956] And he takes him back to his house where they party, they have sex.

[957] They believe that part was consensual, but then Gacy grabs a kitchen knife and stabs him to death.

[958] So this is his first kill.

[959] And he's also the first body that's buried in the crawl space.

[960] And because he was a runaway, no one ever knew the boy was missing, so the cops were never alerted.

[961] baby.

[962] So then the next line is, then he remarries a woman named Carol.

[963] It's very easy for him to date for some reason.

[964] It's so funny how much more these people have their shit together than you and I. Like, he's just You mean me. You're married.

[965] No, I mean us.

[966] No, I heard.

[967] I heard what you're saying.

[968] I'm married by the string of my teeth.

[969] What do they say?

[970] I mean.

[971] It was a friend of his sisters from high school.

[972] And his sister, again, in a documentary is like I mean I didn't really see you know them together but you know they seem happy so and it's just like oh all right so basically he's just using her as body armor and then just like going about his day so in 1975 uh is when he starts dressing up infinitely as pogo the clown now everybody's seen the pictures but if you haven't if you're from Norway or whatever.

[973] Has anyone?

[974] They don't do that.

[975] He dressed up as a clown, but he did the makeup.

[976] There's like a rule in clown makeup where everything has to be rounded.

[977] Everything's circular and rounded and like fun because you're staring into the face of children.

[978] And Pogo the clown.

[979] And you know what they say like round shit?

[980] They love round shit.

[981] Donuts and cookies.

[982] and fucking clown eyes.

[983] But John Wayne Gacy's clown makeup is pointy, pointy, point.

[984] It's the scariest thing.

[985] It's truly like a clown nightmare.

[986] It's a luminaughty, right?

[987] Fucking death trap.

[988] Light swastika on the forehead.

[989] So bad.

[990] Okay, so in 76, after three years of marriage, his wife leaves him.

[991] Just because.

[992] You know, she just didn't feel like it anymore.

[993] I'm just not feeling it.

[994] So there's this story and this guy, Tony Antonucci tells the story on one of the documentaries.

[995] He was 16 at the time.

[996] He was working at the contracting company.

[997] John Wing -Gacy invites him over, because this was the thing.

[998] It would be like, come up my house and let's smoke a joint, and we'll have a couple of drinks, we'll hang out.

[999] And then when the teenage boys would get there, he would be, so this guy was a high school wrestler.

[1000] So John Wayne Gasey's like, oh, come on, Mr. Restle, show me your wrestling moves.

[1001] And the guy's like, okay.

[1002] That's such a thing.

[1003] Yes.

[1004] It's a real...

[1005] All of that.

[1006] It's a real thing.

[1007] Yeah, because when, you're high and then you're like, well, I'm not going to say no to my boss who wants me to wrestle with me. Yeah, and then suddenly you can, though.

[1008] Just know that.

[1009] You guys.

[1010] You can literally just put the joint down and be like, I'll see you tomorrow.

[1011] You don't need to drink with older people.

[1012] I don't know.

[1013] My parents are older than I drink with them.

[1014] It's fine.

[1015] Something about, you know, something is, there's something deep there.

[1016] There's something in there.

[1017] It's just, no, we're going to dig around in that.

[1018] Just go with it.

[1019] For sure.

[1020] You don't need to drink with older people.

[1021] The age range...

[1022] Just pepper spray everyone.

[1023] So basically, he challenges him to a wrestling match, and while they're wrestling, he throws a handcuff on one of Tony's wrists, and he tries to get the other wrist handcuffed.

[1024] And he's fighting him and fighting him.

[1025] And then he thinks he gets in, so Gacy leaves the room.

[1026] And then Tony, what had happened is, like, he fought him so much that the handcuff was only clicked to, like, the first thing.

[1027] So he was able to pull his hand out of the handcuff.

[1028] But then when Gacy walked back in the room, he kept his hand back, so it still looked like he was handcuffed.

[1029] And so when Gacy came over to him, he fucking took him down.

[1030] He did like a wrestling move, took him down to the ground.

[1031] And Gacy goes, oh, you passed the test.

[1032] So then Tony's like, oh, okay.

[1033] And then he just kept working for him.

[1034] Oh.

[1035] Yeah.

[1036] I wanted that to end better.

[1037] I mean he was alive to tell the story so that's good But it was that thing where he was like You know it's your boss And you just you want It was a good job They were probably making you know A good amount of money And it's such a weird story That there's no way to explain it to someone And sound like now you'd be like This thing happen And that would be a classic assault But now But then it was just like He's just goofing around Yeah You know we got high in that thing Where your boss wrestles you and handcuffs you.

[1038] Didn't you work at the gap?

[1039] That happened to you once at the gap, right?

[1040] Yes, it happens all the time.

[1041] It's normal.

[1042] All right, so basically, this is his, it turns out that this becomes Gacy's M .O. It's either the handcuffed trick or the magic rope trick.

[1043] The magic rope trick was he would say, oh, I'm going to show you this magic rope trick, and it was all around the fact that he was Pogo the clown.

[1044] So he's like, I'm a clown, I have these tricks.

[1045] I'm going to show you the tricks.

[1046] Oh, no. It's such a nightmare.

[1047] you're like kind of high like okay even just the clown stuff I'd be like I'm sorry I just had an emergency call I have to leave like they didn't have phones back then that's right they couldn't they just had to sit there in their down vest being like cool man the fucking rope trick the magic rope trick is they stand there and he goes so this is what I do and then he would just throw a rope around their neck and fucking strangle them that was the magic rope trick so it was quick and bad So the problem was that he hired these boys and a lot of them are written off as runaways when they would disappear and oftentimes it would come to him so they'd be like oh he worked for you have you seen him lately and Tony Antonucci tells in one of those stories he said he was supposed to meet this boy John Zick and John Zick never showed up for the job they were supposed to go do together and then Gacy came up and goes he called me and he said that he went to Cabo San Lucas.

[1048] Yep.

[1049] Yeah.

[1050] Because that's where you go when you're a teenager.

[1051] When you're a teenager.

[1052] By yourself.

[1053] I'm just going to go.

[1054] I'm going to quicksies.

[1055] I just need to go down to the Mexican Riviera for a while.

[1056] Real quick?

[1057] Yeah.

[1058] I'm going to go.

[1059] I just need to take it easy.

[1060] Goodbye.

[1061] So at this point, oh and also around this time, Gacy also put red lights in his car and would, when he would see a target, he would pull them over and say that he was an undercover cop and that he was had to bring them in, he would handcuff them and then he would have them.

[1062] Never pull your car over when you're getting followed by a cop.

[1063] Tell them I said that.

[1064] And when the cop comes to your window, you should pepper spray him in the eye.

[1065] Which is also the thing that Hillside Stranglers did.

[1066] They posed as cops and pulled women over and would be like, you have a bunch of tickets to get into our car.

[1067] Which is why you actually, I mean, I'm not fucking bullshit.

[1068] now, you do want to pull over in a well -populated area.

[1069] You don't want to, if some cop is stopping you on a fucking deserted road, you're fucking getting off on the next stop and parking in a McDonald's.

[1070] You know what you're doing?

[1071] You're high -speed chasing it.

[1072] Bye!

[1073] To evolve.

[1074] Tell them your mother sent you.

[1075] Karen and Georgia.

[1076] So, around this time, at this point, he's been getting away with murder for six years.

[1077] At the end of 1977, he'd killed 19 boys.

[1078] Fuck.

[1079] And by 1978, he was committing a murder every two to three weeks.

[1080] Holy shit.

[1081] It's your town.

[1082] I can't even vacuum every two to three weeks.

[1083] I get so much dog hair on all my clothes at all the time.

[1084] Me too.

[1085] The only reason we don't have it is because we packed these.

[1086] I bought this here.

[1087] All right.

[1088] So his last victim, this was in December 1978, and it was 15 -year -old Robert Pist, and he worked part -time at a job.

[1089] drugstore and desplanes.

[1090] Desplanes.

[1091] Deplanes?

[1092] Deplanes?

[1093] Desplanes?

[1094] It doesn't matter.

[1095] So his mom, Robert Peace's mom is in the parking lot to pick him up when his shift is over, but he goes, hold on a second.

[1096] I met this guy who has a better job for me, and it's a really good paying job.

[1097] I'll be right back.

[1098] And he never comes back.

[1099] They go out into the parking lot after 15 minutes.

[1100] and he's nowhere to be seen.

[1101] But here's the thing.

[1102] And this is where, if you've ever seen, there's a movie where Brian Denny, he plays John Wayne Gacy, and you have to see it.

[1103] It's so crazy.

[1104] Because he was a crazy drunk and on pills.

[1105] So by this point, he's been doing it and getting away with it for so long.

[1106] He's, like, sloppy as hell.

[1107] He thinks no one's ever going to catch him, and he's just really sloppy.

[1108] So the people in this drug store knew who John Wayne Gasey was.

[1109] The guy who always offers kids' job, probably.

[1110] Exactly.

[1111] Exactly.

[1112] Pogo the clowns here again.

[1113] It's that guy who wears a sweet honesty t -shirt all the time.

[1114] I brought it back around.

[1115] Yeah.

[1116] Thank you.

[1117] It's called to bring it back around.

[1118] Thank you.

[1119] Thank you.

[1120] So anyway, they file a missing person's report.

[1121] He is not a runaway.

[1122] They can't blame it on any of that shit.

[1123] This boy was an Eagle Scout, a loving family.

[1124] So the cops, they trace it back to Gacy.

[1125] The cops go to his house to question him.

[1126] at 3 .30 in the morning when they finally trace it back.

[1127] And he's super pissy.

[1128] He's like really bitchy to the cops.

[1129] I would be.

[1130] Oh, no, I'm sorry.

[1131] They go to his house like at night, normal time.

[1132] And he's really bitching.

[1133] He's like, I will come down to the station.

[1134] I'll come down to talk to you.

[1135] He shows up at 3 .30 in the morning at the police station covered in mud.

[1136] So they're like, could you take a seat in here, please?

[1137] We just have a couple questions to ask you.

[1138] What the fun.

[1139] And they finally do a background check and see that he was convicted for sodomy in Iowa and they're finally like, I think we've got the guy.

[1140] Yeah, but can I just say that sodomy is a bullshit charge that they, because they didn't give him the, you guys, never mind.

[1141] It's just a thing where they like didn't want to charge him with child molestation or give him a real fucking charge.

[1142] They gave him 18 months because they gave him sodomy instead, which like anyone could get sodomy.

[1143] That's right That's right And if you're not comfortable with that Maybe it's your problem Yeah They detain him at the police station I mean I don't know what to say Okay They detain him at the police station They go and search Gacy's home And they find a trap door That leads down to the crawl space and then a cop crawls down to the crawl space and they're like there sure is a lot of lime down here and they just come back up they didn't find anything they came yeah someone said no no there's more in this paper I swear to go on so what they do find is a bunch of jewelry that does not belong to him and one of the things that they found was a class ring with the initials J .C. inside it and they trace that ring back to John Zick.

[1144] His last name is spelled so insanely.

[1145] It's C -Z -Y -S -Z -K or something like that.

[1146] I just wrote it Z -I -C -K because I couldn't deal.

[1147] But they basically see, they trace the ring, they get John's name, they go to the Zick home, and they say, the mother tells them he's been missing since January 20th, 1977, and they're like, ding, ding, ding, here we go.

[1148] This is our guy.

[1149] So then they start, they stake him out.

[1150] And they have to get, they have to get a search warrant for his house.

[1151] So while they're waiting, they put the surveillance team on his house.

[1152] And Gacy is doing things like leading them on long, medium speed chases till dawn.

[1153] Or like...

[1154] He doesn't even know anyone's following him.

[1155] No, no, no, he does.

[1156] He's doing it on purpose.

[1157] Or he's, like, buying them dinner.

[1158] Like, they're out there, you know, like trying to order food or whatever.

[1159] And then he just picks up the tab.

[1160] Like, he's fucking around, like, Like, he's, there's, he can't ever get caught.

[1161] But they get a second search warrant, and that's when, oh, no, sorry, he invited them in for a fish dinner.

[1162] And while the two cops were inside, one of them said, could I use your restroom?

[1163] And when the cop goes into the restroom, he, they said it was around Christmas time, so the heater was on.

[1164] And the cop walked into the bathroom, I keep saying restroom, but it's a home.

[1165] He goes into the bathroom and smells death.

[1166] And he's like, this...

[1167] What?

[1168] Did you hear that?

[1169] What?

[1170] I just heard a ghost.

[1171] The heating vent came on.

[1172] That's when we found out Karen was crazy out of her mind.

[1173] Totally insane.

[1174] The heater vent came on, the air came out, and it was the smell of death.

[1175] And he knew that this was...

[1176] they had to search this house, basically.

[1177] Oh, my God.

[1178] So, essentially, blip, bleep, bleep.

[1179] Sorry.

[1180] Oh, how they finally got him was he had driven to a gas station and, like, dropped off a bag of pot to somebody.

[1181] So they got him on this really dumb charge, but they were able to hold him at the police station.

[1182] They got the second warrant.

[1183] They go into the house, they go into the crawl space, and after 15 minutes, because they just didn't take enough time the first time.

[1184] After 15 minutes, they're like, We have three bodies down here.

[1185] And then it's on like Donkey Kong.

[1186] And eventually they find in that crawl space, the 27 bodies of young men and boys.

[1187] I feel so bad for those cops that had to do all that shit up.

[1188] It's so, even just the old footage is so upsetting looking.

[1189] I didn't see it.

[1190] Yeah, you have to look at it.

[1191] Was his mom just playing solitaire the whole time or something?

[1192] No, she died at some.

[1193] point.

[1194] She's like, what's that, Johnny?

[1195] I didn't hear you come in.

[1196] No, I don't want to do the handcuff trick again.

[1197] I don't want to.

[1198] You know, you did that to me. I fell for it.

[1199] I fell for it.

[1200] So there's 27 bodies in the house, and then he admits that there are also six.

[1201] He dumped in the river, and that's when he was covered in mud at the police station.

[1202] He had just dumped Robert Pist's body.

[1203] He basically dumped it and went straight to the river.

[1204] police station.

[1205] He stands trial in February of 1980.

[1206] He never shows an ounce of remorse.

[1207] They put the victim's family members and friends on the stand, so everybody sees all of these boys and all their family and all the people that were affected.

[1208] And in three hours, the jury finds him guilty on all counts.

[1209] He's sentenced to death.

[1210] And after 14 years of appeals, he's put to death on May 10, 1994.

[1211] His last words were, kiss my ass.

[1212] he's a good guy and his last meal was Kentucky from chicken that's right that's cool I mean no it's awful I don't know I kind of like it I know and then they destroyed that house when I first saw the footage of that they like pulled the whole fucking thing down and then I was like that's a bit dramatic and then I was like what am I talking about like what real estate could sell real estate agent could sell that fucking house Like that killing 27 people isn't dramatic, but them tearing the house down.

[1213] Tearing the house down.

[1214] I was like, stop it, you guys.

[1215] You're being nuts.

[1216] You're being, uh, what's the word?

[1217] Dramatic?

[1218] Yes.

[1219] And that's Sean Wayne Gasey.

[1220] Good job, Chicago.

[1221] Yay.

[1222] Thank you.

[1223] Great.

[1224] Yeah, we might have time for one hometown murder.

[1225] Do we have one?

[1226] Is there a way to turn the lights on for one second?

[1227] You have to jump over the orchestra pit, though, if you're going to say, if you're going to do it.

[1228] it's someone's birthday yeah hold on a second because it's someone's birthday there's two people's birthday Karen look there's Elvis's face you have to stand up the pointing the pointing doesn't work look what's happening that's Elvis's face what the fuck it was empty up there it's not I was hoping because I couldn't stand it that's exciting that's not hi nope nope okay does anyone have a hometown that's like really good though if someone's pointing you in there, okay.

[1229] Okay.

[1230] How do we...

[1231] We should have thought this through.

[1232] Can she walk over and around really quick?

[1233] Yeah.

[1234] No, they're like, we hate you.

[1235] There's someone standing over there.

[1236] Someone must be in charge.

[1237] Who's in charge that could help us?

[1238] We're not.

[1239] Does someone work here?

[1240] Uh -oh.

[1241] Can we just have one person run up here really quick?

[1242] Oh, no. Is the answer no?

[1243] We'll do a dance in the meantime.

[1244] Will you stand up?

[1245] Whoever has it?

[1246] Will you stand up?

[1247] Yeah.

[1248] Is it you?

[1249] Okay, what's your name?

[1250] I think I'm going to throw this too.

[1251] Oh, fuck.

[1252] Oh, Jesus.

[1253] You took your shoes off?

[1254] I'm sorry.

[1255] Yeah, well then, careful.

[1256] Okay, throw it to her.

[1257] Oh.

[1258] Yeah, all right.

[1259] We're having a hometown.

[1260] It has to be beginning, middle, and end.

[1261] Oh.

[1262] Are you all right?

[1263] Yeah, fine.

[1264] I'm going to let her sit on my.

[1265] my stool see how she does yeah uh housekeeping do any housekeeping steven's actually home watching my cats right now it's pretty pretty sweet they really like they really like him i'm gonna keep here she comes what's her name her name ashley yeah just sit right here oh we're happy to be here sit on it do it don't fall yeah let's just see how you do it it's fucked up right yeah it's really wobbly.

[1266] You sat on this for an hour?

[1267] Yes.

[1268] And it's slippery, too.

[1269] And I have these weird boots on.

[1270] Yeah, that's impressive.

[1271] Um, okay, tell, what's your hometown?

[1272] Where are you from?

[1273] Um, so I am from about an hour outside of the city, DeKal, Illinois, anybody?

[1274] And I, yeah, so there's a big college out there.

[1275] Tony Keller.

[1276] Tony Keller.

[1277] I know him.

[1278] Yes.

[1279] That's another really good one.

[1280] Um, Tony Keller, if you ever get a chance to look that up, that's a really good one.

[1281] Oh, well, I thought you were talking about, like, someone you went to school yeah he's a murderer I bet so I'm not gonna take full credit because this is actually my boyfriend's hometown murder he's a local in the area we'll take it and he told this story to me on one of our first dates and I was really fascinated by it that's a keeper like are you taking notes um are you taking no so um so um he lived in a really small town actually outside de calip small farming town and um he worked in a gas station when he was in high school and there was a guy who would come to the gas station every day and every day he would buy a pack of cigarettes and a 30 rack of beer and he was approximately 300 pounds so you know living the dream yes yeah um the town kind of noticed that he went missing um and they filed a missing's person's report about a couple weeks um after he went missing he was a cook at this restaurant slash motel that was um it's on highway 47 if anybody knows of that it's bad news bad news it's like in the middle of nowhere motel on a highway no way yeah so it was called the bohemia and uh the owner of the restaurant um was a guy he uh he owned the restaurant he hired this guy as a cook and he also the guy also lived in the motel so um after a couple weeks police are searching for this guy somebody calls in a tip and says hey i actually was helping my friend the other day he owns the bohemia restaurant He had some extra money laying around, so he decided he wanted to bury it in the cornfields.

[1282] So he asked me if I'd come out and help dig some holes for him, which is totally logical.

[1283] This guy's like, you know, I was thinking about it.

[1284] So how many duffel bags were involved in this?

[1285] Well, so he tells us the police where they buried it, or they buried the money, and the police go out there, dig up the holes, and, spoiler, it was not money.

[1286] No. No. In the hole, they found two garbage bags.

[1287] One was the head of this man, the cook, the 300 -pound cook, and the other bag was his torso.

[1288] Ooh.

[1289] So they did an autopsy.

[1290] They found out, I mean, it's sad.

[1291] Obviously, he was murdered, but he was kind of on the verge of death.

[1292] He actually, they ruled that it was a heart attack because his heart stopped.

[1293] Because his head was removed.

[1294] Probably.

[1295] But actually that came up where they weren't almost going to press charges because it's technically, all they had was the torso in the head.

[1296] What's the carbs, everybody?

[1297] Yeah.

[1298] He also had cirrhosis of the liver and emphysema.

[1299] Oh, don't smell.

[1300] Which I was going to say eczema, but my friend corrected me in the car, and she's like, no, you wouldn't die from that.

[1301] He probably had that, too.

[1302] Yeah.

[1303] So they end up pressing or indicting the owner of this restaurant, the Bohemia, and come to find out, he was murdered in the kitchen where he was a cook.

[1304] I hate the reason why he was murdered.

[1305] It was over a bad drug deal, which I'm just like, I don't know.

[1306] But what happened after is just like amazing.

[1307] So the thing was, is like, is he wanted, I guess he didn't come up with this plan right away because obviously he couldn't move the 300 -pound man, decided to cut him up, didn't know what to do with him at first, the whole, digging a hole in the cornfield didn't come to him.

[1308] So he decided to store the body parts in the motel room fridges, the refrigerators.

[1309] And they were able to collect evidence because there was his DNA in the fridge.

[1310] The little ones?

[1311] I mean, I don't know how big they were, probably.

[1312] It probably had, like, peanuts and candy, you know.

[1313] Yeah, and then it had body parts and bags.

[1314] Oh, it tastes weird.

[1315] Yeah.

[1316] That's amazing.

[1317] So the guy was actually sentenced to 90 years in prison.

[1318] He is still alive.

[1319] and I'm so sorry I forgot his name.

[1320] I don't.

[1321] Oh, then you're fire.

[1322] I'll leave.

[1323] I'll leave.

[1324] That's amazing.

[1325] But one thing I will point out is his head and his torso were recovered, but his limbs, his arms and legs were never found.

[1326] So I don't know what time of your flight leaves tomorrow, but if you guys want to go on a little excavation.

[1327] I'd love to find some legs and arms.

[1328] Yay.

[1329] I think that would be great.

[1330] Lim City.

[1331] Yay.

[1332] Thank you, Ashley.

[1333] That was all done.

[1334] Yes.

[1335] They're all sweet baby angels.

[1336] It makes, it means the world.

[1337] to us this is crazy we've never done a crowd this big yeah it really does it's really amazing yeah and you know what you guys stay sexy and don't get murder