#1627 - Dan Gable

[0] Joe Rogan podcast, check it out.

[1] The Joe Rogan Experience.

[2] Train by day, Joe Rogan podcast by night, all day.

[3] Is that, so you were telling me that this mask is, this is a wrestling, does this have anything to do with your museum?

[4] Yes, it's the National Wrestling Hall of Fame, but this is the one out of Stillwater, Oklahoma, and the one we have is a subsidiary one.

[5] It's called the National Wrestling Hall of Fame, Dan Gable.

[6] museum in Waterloo, my hometown, but they own it.

[7] And, see, Oklahoma and Iowa are big rivalries in wrestling over history.

[8] And these museums kind of help bring us together.

[9] Ah.

[10] So it's pretty interesting.

[11] So, so the magazine, these actually masks are just the ones out of Stillwater.

[12] I don't know if we have ones in Waterloo or not, but.

[13] Lex Friedman told me that you have a hard time, walking around in Iowa that people will swarm you.

[14] You know, when they don't swarm me is when I'm going to have to worry about, you know, because I'm for the sport of wrestling.

[15] I love that sport, and it's been my life, and I want it to continue to be, and it's a little bit difficult sport.

[16] So, you know, it's something that keeps me appreciative, but it also, I promote it out there, And as long as people, I'm okay with it.

[17] It might irritate my family a little bit once in a while, but they love the sport too, so they got to expect some of this stuff.

[18] Well, coming from a guy that has accomplished what you've accomplished and has become this legendary feature in the sport, it comes to the territory.

[19] There's no way around it.

[20] I mean, you're a beloved character in the sport of wrestling, to the point where I told people that you were going to be on my podcast and their eyebrows raise up.

[21] Like, people get very excited.

[22] Well, you know, I'm glad you said that because every time I tell somebody, their eyebrows do the same when I'm going on this show.

[23] And so, of course, you know, I knew about this show, but I had to do a lot of homework just to see, wow, you know, it's pretty big.

[24] So, you know, I'm excited to be here because I know the effect it can have, not just on me because, you know, but on the sport, you know, and I love the sport.

[25] And it's my hometown of Waterloo was, that's why I got started in it because it was just dominating wrestling at the time.

[26] And you know what's funny is that just from a world situation, sport brings people together.

[27] And, you know, it's like, who better than a sport with Russia or Iran or North Korea?

[28] Because, you know, it's like, or Turkey, you know, they just, you know, especially the first two, you know, they just, we're always in conflict, it seems like with them.

[29] But when it comes to wrestling, We have something in common.

[30] And we usually end up losing to both Russia and Iran, but sometimes we beat them too.

[31] And we are well known for good wrestling, and that has helped, I think, the country be better off.

[32] I had Jordan Burroughs on, and he was describing to me what it's like to wrestle in Iran and how massive the sport is over there.

[33] And he's a giant star over there.

[34] And he's like, and people are so friendly and so inviting and so accepting and just so happy to see great wrestling.

[35] And just wrestling is just an enormous sport over there and immensely popular.

[36] Well, when I won the Olympics in 1972, their most popular athlete was the guy in my weight class.

[37] Wow.

[38] The Iranian.

[39] And I had been in the worlds a year before, but before that, he had two Olympic titles and every world title in between.

[40] And all of a sudden, he became so popular that the government was a little concerned about him, that the people were more appreciative of him than the government.

[41] And so when he went to the Munich Olympics, even though he had lost the year before, because I was there and I won the weight class, we didn't get to Russell, but he was there in representing Iran in 72, and he won his first match by about 15 points.

[42] But he pulled out of the Olympics, and he ended up going.

[43] going to the United States because of his being so popular that he was scared they might do something to him at the government level.

[44] I'm sure you're aware of what happened recently with the wrestler who was killed, the Iranian wrestler who was killed because he was involved in a peaceful protest.

[45] And they made an example out of him.

[46] Yeah, and they claim that he killed somebody.

[47] But, you know, you can claim whatever you want to satisfy the people, but chances are he didn't.

[48] chances are he didn't it seemed like what they were doing was just making sure that people were scared and that if they can kill a man who's so beloved and you know a national hero they can kill anybody yeah and the iranian that came here uh lives uh still here in the united states yeah it's uh wrestling to me is uh it's one of the most important sports because it's one of the very few sports that doesn't have a real i mean there's obviously WWE wrestling and a lot of guys go from wrestling into MMA, but there's not a real professional venue.

[49] I mean, Jordan Burroughs does some legit wrestling, actual, you know, amateur style wrestling and gets paid for matches and stuff now and has sponsorships and the like.

[50] And I'm very happy that he gets recognized and some other wrestlers get recognized, but it's not like basketball.

[51] It's not like any other sport where you have Olympic champions go on, boxing, and become huge stars at a professional level.

[52] With wrestling, it's one of the few sports where the people that participate in it, they take pride in the fact that they work in silence.

[53] They take pride in the fact that they grind.

[54] They take pride in the fact that they are miserable, that their training is unbelievably intense, and that it's so much more intense than most sports.

[55] If you had to compare what an elite baseball player does, you're smiling, right, versus an elite wrestler.

[56] I mean, it's not even comparable.

[57] No, but I appreciate all the sports because I have so many grandkids and a lot of their dads are even baseball players, football players, and even coaches at that level.

[58] So, you know, it's pretty interesting because, like, one of the baseball coach for my local, where I live in Iowa City is, he's got his son named Gable, actually, and he's first team Allstate.

[59] But in baseball, But when he was back in college, he was dating my daughter, and he came to our wrestling practice.

[60] And we were just doing a running practice that morning, early morning.

[61] And we were doing a little less than quarter mile runs.

[62] And I'd give them a little time in between, of course.

[63] But he just wanted to try what we were doing to see how it compared to how he trained that way.

[64] They trained different ways.

[65] but he made one really good lap, and he stayed right with the group, right in there.

[66] I think he claims he might have made another one.

[67] I don't know if it was the second or the third, but we were going to do eight.

[68] And so I think by the second or the third, he was in a full squat, and he couldn't.

[69] I mean, his legs just went out on him, and he couldn't do it.

[70] And I tell you, I think it showed appreciation from him right away from that point of view.

[71] So that's pretty interesting that you bring that up.

[72] I don't think there's any sport like it in terms of the amount of effort that's required and also the margin of fitness and of technique required for victory.

[73] Like at the elite level, there's so many great wrestlers, both on the national level and the international level, that it really requires this insane level of dedication to rise to the top.

[74] Well, you mentioned Jordan Burles.

[75] And, you know, Jordan Burles was a good wrestler in high school and he was a good wrestler in college.

[76] became a great wrestler at the end of college, but I shouldn't even say great because you have another level, and that's that world and an Olympic level.

[77] And I don't think he really realized his talent and abilities.

[78] A lot of it's just because it is a tough sport and that every practice is somewhat of a grind and everything that you do.

[79] But if you stick with it long enough, the mind can develop as well.

[80] And when Jordan Burrell's mind developed to where he felt he was a great wrestler instead of just he's a good wrestler but this other guy is good and it's going to be a tough match but he stayed in it long enough worked at it hard enough where he was able to develop beyond the tools that you need for being on the mat just technically or strategically strategically and so once he got that mind that made the big difference and that's what carries him through right now and again it's like right now he's in a big battle to make the Olympic team, which is going to happen here shortly because we eliminated some of the weight classes.

[81] See, people don't understand in our sport because they say, well, they don't do it in baseball.

[82] They don't do in football.

[83] People weigh 100 pounds.

[84] People weigh 200 pounds.

[85] They're on the same team, and you're competing against them.

[86] But in a wrestling match, a few pounds makes a difference when you're at that high level of excellence.

[87] It's because of, like, physics.

[88] You know, if you understand physics pretty well and positioning, then you can probably be a better wrestler, just because of the amount of weight and skill that you have within your own positions.

[89] And so, for me, it was like I could wrestle anybody.

[90] I wrestled 150 pounds at the World's in Olympic Games, and I could wrestle the heavyweight, who weighed 450, and they go, why could you wrestle him?

[91] I said, because I knew the leverage.

[92] and I knew the skills and the strategy.

[93] And because of that, it gave me the opportunity to feel heavier than him.

[94] And I think that's what a lot of people said.

[95] They say, you don't look that heavy, but when I wrestled you, you felt like so heavy.

[96] I said, well, it's because I knew my positions.

[97] So, you know, that's where, like, Jordan Burles is now.

[98] He's so much better, but not just in his skills from on the mat.

[99] It's a lot in his brains that he knows he's good.

[100] He's had a lot of practices where he's done well.

[101] I don't think I lost a practice from my junior year in college.

[102] So I had my junior year, my senior year, then I had two and a half more years.

[103] So that's four and a half years where I went to practice and never lost a wrestling practice.

[104] And by that, I mean, I pretty much dominated.

[105] And I usually wrestled the bigger guys in the room, even though I was a lightweight.

[106] It's because I could.

[107] And because of that, it gave me a lot.

[108] lot of confidence.

[109] And so people, you know, always ask you how you think you're going to do.

[110] Well, you know, I think I'm going to win, you know, and I think, I don't really think.

[111] I pretty much know I'm going to win.

[112] So it's one of these things that when you have that much success, it works.

[113] And that's where I feel Jordan Burles is developed to.

[114] But like I said, he's got only six weight classes as compared to eight or nine or ten, what we normally used to have.

[115] And he's got a world champion coming down named Dake that will challenge him at his weight.

[116] So they're both highly credentialed.

[117] And so that's going to be a big match coming up here probably pretty soon.

[118] Mental toughness is one of the most important aspects of wrestling.

[119] Obviously, technique and fitness are huge.

[120] But mental toughness is what defines wrestlers, in my opinion.

[121] Because when you see wrestlers, successful wrestlers in the UFC in particular, there's no one like them.

[122] When they come over to MMA, you recognize like there's something special about them as athletes.

[123] And I think that it comes from the fact that wrestling is so difficult.

[124] The practices are so hard.

[125] But in the world of mental toughness, where mental toughness is one of the cornerstones, you're known as a guy that stands out like you stand out amongst like like david guggins likes to say you're uncommon amongst uncommon men like what what what is that like what what what made you stand out from these other wrestlers well i'm going to jump forth to my high school coach even though i got a lot before that but i always i just remember what he said in the room and he was like the best high school coach in the state at the time.

[126] He said, guys, win with humility, lose with dignity, but damn it, don't lose.

[127] And he put those last two lines together real quick, so he kind of had to listen to him.

[128] But it was pretty neat because you win with humility, you lose with dignity, but damn it, don't lose.

[129] And so, you know, that was my first major coach that really taught me. a lot of those type of principles.

[130] But before that I was a kid that was at the YMCA when I was five, six years old.

[131] And basically the reason why I was there because you want to learn how to swim because if you're an outdoors guy and you want to be around water and you want to make sure you know how your kids swim so my mom and dad got me in the YMCA, but what they got me into the YMCA really for was they needed help.

[132] I mean, they just, my dad was a full -time worker and my mom.

[133] She stayed at home a lot, but she also helped my dad at an office at home.

[134] But I was a little helian, and they needed me to learn how to swim.

[135] But they also needed me to learn how to be a little bit sociable.

[136] They needed me to learn how to get along with kids.

[137] My first job was at the YMCA.

[138] I actually competed.

[139] My first sport competitively was, besides practicing, was swimming.

[140] And I won a YMCA state championship when I was 12 years old.

[141] Believe it or not, in the backstroke, which, you know, in wrestling, you know, I know in fighting.

[142] and you can go to your back, and there's lots of tools that you can do there, but I hate going to my back, you know, and I think if I was a fighter, I don't, I would think I hate gravity coming down on me. So I don't mind putting it down.

[143] But, you know, and there's skills there you have to learn.

[144] But I really, I really liked the YMCA because it gave me a chance to learn something away from home.

[145] I was home with my mom, it's home with my dad, home with my sister, four years older than me, but, you know, it's just something, I call it going for help.

[146] And I think my mom and dad realized at that time that they needed some help with this kid.

[147] And I think that's a really good thing to think about as people in the world when you have kids growing up.

[148] And if you're not giving them what you need to give them, why not go for help?

[149] And there's organizations out there.

[150] Now you've got to be careful, you know, who you're putting them into, or even if you're giving them to a babysitter or whatever like that.

[151] But, you know, if you're pretty confident that you have a good place to get some help, you get some help.

[152] And I, same way with me as a coach, same way with me as a husband.

[153] I mean, I got my wife.

[154] I got my family.

[155] I got my assistant coaches.

[156] And I got my fans.

[157] I mean, God, I always had them looking out for me. I built that kind of trust with him.

[158] or more than even trust, just they want to help.

[159] And that was the way.

[160] Now, you can't go overboard.

[161] You still got to make sure that the help you're getting is the right help.

[162] But the YMCA was perfect for me because, I mean, I can remember the first day, they took us to a wrestling room.

[163] We had a little wrestling room at the YMCA.

[164] And I was already wrestling before that because my dad was a wrestler, not a great wrestler, but his friends were.

[165] So when they came to the wrestling, learning the sport, my first wrestling room was at the YMCA there, even though I had been in a wrestling room because these older guys had drugged me around to the wrestling rooms in Waterloo.

[166] But I can remember wrestling a kid, and I handled him pretty good because I had already been wrestling in my carpet at home, wrestling outside in the grass, and these people had had a little experience with me. So, but the kid, you know, kind of got mad.

[167] And so I was waiting for my mom and dad to pick me up after the, after the wise couple hours where you spend there.

[168] And this kid came out and he goes, you know, you can, you know, maybe you beat me in wrestling up there.

[169] But he goes, how about a street fight?

[170] And I said, whoa.

[171] You know, I was probably eight, nine, eight years old at the time.

[172] And, you know, it was downtown, Waterloo, Iowa, a tough town.

[173] I was on one side of the river, and he was on the other side of the river growing up.

[174] And so he probably had been in more fights than me, but I didn't, wasn't going to really, I wasn't going to fight him.

[175] I was waiting for my dad, picked me up, and all of a sudden, he punches me. and so you know what do you do you got to fight i mean either out or run you know and i i fought and i did all right i mean just like in the wrestling room i did all right and so i was i had some of that in me too but when i had the guy on the down and i kind of let him up we both looked over my dad was there standing watching me and that guy's dad was staying there and my mom my dad and his were talking to each other and so you know that's part of an experience that you kind of grow up in and i don't know if they even knew each other but they were kind of supervising yet we didn't know they were there right and that was kind of one of my first experiences uh with understanding a little bit about uh competition outside the organized sports you know yeah raw competition right yeah Yeah, primal.

[176] Yep.

[177] So, you know, actually, speaking of the story there, it was a really good one.

[178] This is about my mom and dad.

[179] My mom and dad were great people, but they like to drink a lot of beer and smoke a lot of cigarettes.

[180] That's why they probably didn't live so long, and they probably had a lot of, had some trouble at home.

[181] And by that, I mean, the cops visited home quite often just to break up fights or, my mom would probably call the cops on my dad.

[182] And so the first time I ever really took notice was when they came the first time and they took my dad away.

[183] And, you know, he had been rough with my mom, so I probably understood.

[184] But I saw him kind of throw a handcuff on him.

[185] I think they just threw one on and kind of took him out the door.

[186] I didn't really see from there.

[187] so he came home that night later on he got he was he he just you know i don't they brought him back later but so the next day i went to school and the cop that had the policeman that had come and picked him up was actually a neighbor down the street just to live about a block of from us and i was really bad you know at the police taking my dad away even though probably was a good thing.

[188] But I didn't really understand what was going on at that time.

[189] And this is different today.

[190] It probably wouldn't go on.

[191] But the neighbor policeman about a block away had a son in my class at school.

[192] So after school that day, we were both walking home.

[193] And I was really mad.

[194] And I pulled out of my pocket a wire.

[195] And I took this kid down.

[196] on the ground and I wired his wrist together and not real hard but like there were handcuffs and I grabbed the wire and I said this is what your dad did to my dad last night and I'm going to do it to you and I'm going to take you and I'm going to take you home this way and I took him home because they lived about a block away and I untook the things off and let him go in but it's probably fourth grade but my dad found out about that and wow, what did I get in trouble?

[197] I mean, he used to hit me on top of the head with a ring.

[198] Probably why I don't have much hair, but, but, and, and he looked at me, and he said, you know what?

[199] I was intoxicated last night.

[200] It was good they took me out of here.

[201] But you know what they did to me when I got me down to the police department?

[202] He said, I played pool with them.

[203] They had a little billiards room down there, and they played pool with me until I sobered up, and then they brought me back.

[204] and you did that to his son I said dad I was just protecting you I thought you know but everybody understood but it's kind of funny how things are and I don't think that's the old days good old days compared to I don't you know they'd probably do a lot more you know they'd lock you up probably but I don't give you too many breaks but it's kind of funny how that's the kind of house you know difference between 40 years ago 50 years ago, 60 years ago.

[205] What do you think is better, though?

[206] Like, are the good old days, the good old days, or is it better today?

[207] I think I like the good old days.

[208] I mean, I got picked up one other time, and it was my former, I was back home from college, and he was my gym teacher in eighth grade, and Mr. Blue, and he, he was my gym teacher in eighth grade, and Mr. Blue.

[209] and he ended up being a policeman.

[210] So when I came home college, so that was about in seventh grade.

[211] So we're talking six, seven, eight years later where I was home for the weekend.

[212] And I was driving, and he picked me up, and I probably had a beer in a car or something.

[213] You know, he actually let me go.

[214] But he picked me up again the same night.

[215] So he took me down.

[216] down a second time and he put me in his office in the police station and we talked for quite a while but he let me go too but you know you just can't get away with that i mean there's just more rules regulations and if people find out it's like whoa whoa you know i think the good old days probably gave you a chance to actually realize things better than you can today you can actually get a second chance maybe and you know that type of thing so today is not the best day to ask me about the good old days just because today is i would say definitely the good old days because these days are we're divided you know that's what it is and so it's not as much fun you're almost scared to talk you know what did i um i was i came here in an airplane and i out of the airplane magazine, I picked up something because I thought it was interesting.

[217] It'll probably help me because I don't want to get in trouble.

[218] You know, I don't want to get in trouble.

[219] And it said, curious about using this article was in the, said, curious about using gender neutral language in your everyday life.

[220] Are you curious about using gender neutral language in your everyday life?

[221] Well, I just caught up, you know, some guy just texted me the other day after a speech and gave me really a lot of hell.

[222] A guy you knew?

[223] He texted you?

[224] Yeah.

[225] A friend of yours?

[226] Well, I haven't seen him for about 30 years.

[227] What did he give you hell about?

[228] He said, I used the word she and he and all this kind of stuff.

[229] And I said, you can't use she and he?

[230] I don't know.

[231] You can.

[232] Tell that guy to fuck off.

[233] You know what?

[234] Unbelievable of what you said.

[235] Because, listen, one of my former wrestlers who was a school teacher right at the campus at the University of Iowa.

[236] And he's pretty strong in his belief.

[237] because he grew up in a family that didn't have a dad and the government took pretty good care of him also and he was he just sent me a note I told him that story and he told me that well here's how you can talk and he told me how I can talk but then when he got done he says and then go tell that guy to fuck off so that's exactly this is great This is great.

[238] Here's the thing.

[239] I think the reason why that guy gave you hell for something as simple as saying he and she, that highlights what's wrong here.

[240] What people are doing with not just gender neutral language, but with the whole woke movement, politically correct movement, is they have an opportunity to yell at people and tell people what to do.

[241] It gives assholes and low -status individuals power over other people by enforcing this ideology.

[242] and it doesn't make any sense.

[243] Like, you can say she and he.

[244] It doesn't make you a bad person.

[245] And by the way, if you change genders and you say she and he and it switches back and forth, that's fine too.

[246] That's not what I'm talking about.

[247] What I'm talking about is the intent behind what you said was entirely innocent.

[248] And the reason why that guy gave you shit about it is because he's got an opportunity to force you to comply with what he thinks are new rules.

[249] So he thinks he can force them on you and he has a position to have the moral high ground.

[250] and he has a position to make you feel bad or to make you listen to him.

[251] That guy can eat shit because people like him are the real problem with this fucking country.

[252] It's not that people aren't kind.

[253] It's not that people aren't friendly.

[254] Most people are kind and most people are friendly.

[255] The problem is whenever this new thing, a new movement comes along, and this one is particularly divisive because there's so many dipsets that have adopted it and people that are low status, unsuccessful, non -disciplined individuals, and they want to force it on other people.

[256] people and it becomes a big part of their life is enforcing this kind of language and this kind of ideology on other people.

[257] That's what's going on today.

[258] Well, I like you saying it because you can say it a lot better than me, but I feel it.

[259] Yeah, we all feel it.

[260] People feel pressure, but more of us need to stand up against that and highlight who the humans are that are pointing it out.

[261] These are piss poor humans.

[262] Most of these humans have very little discipline.

[263] Most of these people that are doing that They're weak of character.

[264] The people that are pointing it out and yelling at people for things, like don't use gendered language.

[265] Those people are dipshits.

[266] That's the problem.

[267] And it happened so quick.

[268] It happens so quick because they recognize that through social media, they could form these little bully gangs and all of them together, because a lot of them are losers, and they spend a lot of time online, and they don't spend a lot of time socializing the real world.

[269] They live in these fucking Twitter groups, and they go attack people for shit that's not that big of a deal, but they want you to comply.

[270] They want to use this power of the group of having a bunch of people who also believe what they believe and attack folks and think that it's right.

[271] And they get together and reinforce each other constantly online.

[272] And if you pay attention to them, there's a few people like that that I follow just to see how crazy folks have gotten.

[273] They're online 12 hours a day.

[274] Just doing that.

[275] You can't get shit done if you're on Twitter 12 hours a day arguing with people.

[276] You can't.

[277] So these are the type of people that are involved in this sort of behavior they're not they're not people that you should aspire to be they're losers you know what i like when you're saying that but i like you're saying it not me because you know i have you're a coach at a university well not anymore but yeah i was were i mean for a long time but i like to somehow get those ones those people that you're talking about to see the light.

[278] I really would, I would like.

[279] And that's kind of a goal of mine to see the light like that.

[280] But I do have my setbacks.

[281] The other day, I was having breakfast with my family on a birthday breakfast for one of my grandkids.

[282] And we had a big table, you know, full of, we have 23 of us, but one family wasn't there.

[283] This one here, the one that's with me today.

[284] Danny Olsteen wasn't with me. So he has five of them.

[285] So we had 18.

[286] And we just had a breakfast and we had a birthday.

[287] party at a restaurant and so I'm going to go pay the bill and the bill was you know it's not bad it was 135 bucks but that's 135 bucks for breakfast for you know a nice little restaurant so and I and so I went up there and and you know you have to wear your mask until you get in and sit down and eat and so then I had my I just got up from eating and I had my mask in my hand and I was and I was I was looking down at the cash register and this the girl that was there said to me she She goes, and I didn't even look at her.

[288] She, is, I was looking down, reading the bill, and she said, put that mask on.

[289] And I'm looking down, and I'm not looking up, I'm not looking up, but I lost my cool.

[290] And I put my mask on, because I had it right there.

[291] And I was going to put it on anyway, but I just hadn't put it on yet.

[292] So I put it on, and I said, you really piss.

[293] me off and she just didn't know what to say she didn't say a word well she you know because it wasn't her place she was just working there and stuff like that but you know and pretty young gal and so and then she gave me the bill and she didn't say anything and i didn't say anything and and i i gave him the right tip because it was a different lady so so then i finally looked up and i said i never forget that's what i said to it And the funny thing is, it's, uh, uh, I didn't mean to, you know, do harm to her, but probably scared the shit out of it.

[294] Yeah, I know.

[295] Especially because, you know, so, because I, the, the owner is probably pretty decent friends of my family and all that.

[296] Well, there's a way to say it that's nice.

[297] Yeah, sir, please put your mask on.

[298] And you would say, oh, I'm sorry.

[299] I would have.

[300] Because you forget sometimes.

[301] It's not a normal thing.

[302] It's a, I mean, it's become normal over the last year, but it's not a normal thing to remember to put a mask on.

[303] No, it's not, especially when, uh, you've lived, when, when, when, when, you're working out every day too.

[304] Yeah.

[305] And, you know, because you don't really want to wear a mask when you're working out.

[306] That's ridiculous.

[307] No, it's a lot of people have to at gyms.

[308] Like, oh, you know, I can't wait for this fucking thing to be over.

[309] You know, but there's, that's a thing with the mask thing.

[310] I'm not saying that in this case.

[311] I mean, this lady was at work and she probably does feel nervous about people not wearing masks.

[312] But there's a thing where people like to yell at people put your mask on because they know that you have to, and they also know that it's an opportunity for them to tell you what to do.

[313] people enjoy telling people what to do that's why that dipshit that texted you about gendered language he's just telling you what to do he enjoys telling you what to do and you know I don't find any of those people to be of impressive character you know here's another thing because it's kind of along the same line and I hope I don't get emotional on this one but so you know when I was 15 I'd won a state champion championship and my first day championship in wrestling.

[314] First year, it was a high school, sophomore, because high school started then.

[315] And I, anyway, long story short, this neighbor kid end up murdering my sister.

[316] And he had walked to school with me a couple weeks before that and said something to me who I if I would have communicated it might have saved her life you know just because she probably would have never let the guy into her house what did he say he just said like boy you got a hot sister you know and and he was kind of my age one year older than me but my sister was four years older than me so he was probably 16 and she was 19 and and she had a boyfriend and she was living and home yet and and uh so so the funny thing is is I didn't I actually was going to come home and say something to her but when I got home I got distracted and I said oh it's just boy talk you know it's just boy talk and it was mostly about he he just thought my sister was really hot and that he would like to do something with her you know but he never really said it outright I mean I didn't I just figured something you know the boy boys would like to do you know but anyway so you know that two weeks later we're on a fishing trip with my mom and dad and my sister's supposed to join us and she doesn't show up because she worked for my dad after uh she went to college for a year and then she worked for my dad uh after that as a secretary the real estate business so uh she didn't show up so we called the neighbor and back in those days she didn't have cell phones so we had a we had a phone that was outside a cabin that we rented.

[317] And I can date you because the cabin we rented for four bucks a night.

[318] So, you know, it's just unheard of.

[319] And that would have, you know, been 1964.

[320] So we were at a pay phone about a half a block from the cabin that we were renting.

[321] And we rolled the window down and you put the dime or nickel in the phone.

[322] And my dad called the, I was in the front.

[323] backseat my mom and dad were in the front my dad was driving and he called the neighbor and they asked if my sister's car was still in the driveway and he said yes so and she was supposed to be with us 90 miles away that morning she didn't show up so so my dad and my mom get really nervous and they tell them to go get break into that house if you can you know if there's nobody you can't get in break into it or she doesn't answer the door but you know get into that house and call us back.

[324] So you can see the tension in the front seat of the car.

[325] You know, I can see my mom and dad worried.

[326] And the phone rings finally after about 15 minutes later.

[327] And all of a sudden, the, my dad drops the phone.

[328] And my mom was going, she was kind of starting to go hysterical and know what was wrong.

[329] And he looked over and I'll never forget this.

[330] You know, being a 15 -year -old kid, and I looked at my dad said to her, Man's not alive.

[331] And, oh my God.

[332] You know, it's just my mom opened the door of the car.

[333] She took off running back to the block to the cabin.

[334] I got out and ran after him.

[335] When I followed her into the cabin, by that time, she was already on the floor.

[336] And she had grabbed her hair, and she was pulling her head, hitting the wooden floor.

[337] And she looked up, and she had blood all over her forehead.

[338] And so, My dad then followed in, and we packed up real quick about 10 minutes.

[339] We left half the stuff there, and we took off from my hometown 90 miles away.

[340] But within 15 minutes, within a half hour of that phone call, I was in the back seat.

[341] And there was a lot of trauma going on in that front seat.

[342] And I said to my dad, Dad, I may know something about this.

[343] I don't know for sure, but I may. And, you know, he overreacted.

[344] He slammed the car, the brakes on the car, got out of the car.

[345] car came around, opened the door, pulled me out, slammed me against the door.

[346] What do you mean?

[347] You may know something about it.

[348] And then I told him the story about the two weeks before that me walk into school with a neighbor kid and that what he had said.

[349] And he just hugged me and threw me back in the car.

[350] And we stopped at the next town, which is about 15 miles later, and went into the police station and we told the police what had happened as far as sister, daughter, getting murdered the night before and we were on our way there, but my kid told me a story that I think if you could help me as soon as possible.

[351] So they called ahead to the Waterloo Police Department.

[352] The Waterloo Police located, he was at work, sacking groceries the next day in a grocery restore and so they and he'd actually admitted right there that he did it you know after they they they got him but the thing is what's amazing is this guy then he escaped from prison after about 20 he was only 16 he went to got life in penitentiary you know and and uh and uh he escaped and that pretty much doomed him to ever getting out and uh then because he was out for a month before they they caught him and he actually in the trial he was so mad about getting sentenced to life in prison that he pointed to the gable family and on the way out and he said he was going to kill us all and so anyway this guy goes to prison and he lives and he dies in prison after he broke out he never really got a chance to ever let him out but here's the thing so it's just about oh i don't know say it's seven eight years ago when he passed away.

[353] But we got another cabin now.

[354] It's about 30 miles north of the cabin that we were in that time.

[355] And that was a rental cabin that's torn down now.

[356] And we go right by that place.

[357] So we're going right by that place.

[358] Actually, I'd been at, me and my wife had been at our cabin that my mom and dad owned and I inherited it when they passed on.

[359] But we were at that cancer cabin, and we were coming home, and we were going right by the spot.

[360] where that pay phone was and where we had learned about her death and there's a cell phone call it's the warden of the prison he's in I think it was Indiana he was in Indiana the prison and the warden told me that the guy that murdered your sister just died the exact same spot where I learned of the murder, I was driving by, and it's about 150 miles from, well, actually a lot further than that.

[361] So it's like spooky.

[362] It's like real spooky.

[363] And then what's really amazing is what he said to me, the warden, he said, before he died, he was seeing a counselor, and the counselor told me this, that he said, you know, I really, he repented.

[364] He said, I really shouldn't have.

[365] I feel bad about killing Diane Gable.

[366] I mean, this is years later, but that he had told, and he had been rehabbed somewhat, and he goes, and the reason why, he said, I knew I was going to kill somebody, but he said, because she was such a nice girl.

[367] You know, oh, my God.

[368] He said he knew he was going to kill somebody?

[369] He said he knew he was going to kill somebody.

[370] Just it was just who he was.

[371] Yeah, and they told me that.

[372] And, you know, I cried for an hour, and it got a lot out of me. But, you know, as bad as my dad felt, my mom felt, and, you know, I felt probably, I kind of got rid of a lot of hatred when he told me that he admitted that she was such a nice girl that he shouldn't have done it.

[373] And it was, you know, probably not too for him.

[374] He probably did it on his deathbed or something.

[375] but he probably had all these guilt but but you know it helped me too and it helped me because even though i i cried for an hour and i i think that stuff you build up inside you sometimes you just you don't know what it's going to take to get it get it out of you and i think that really helped me with my situation because you always feel a little guilty because of maybe you could have saved her life but but more than that it's been something that i based my whole life on too, just communication.

[376] I mean, this is your business, communication.

[377] I mean, there's, and sometimes my wife tells me I'm telling her too much.

[378] You know, you don't need to tell me. You know, we don't need to talk about this.

[379] I said, yeah, I do.

[380] I do.

[381] You know, I need to talk about, it's not just that.

[382] It's just anything that there's crops up.

[383] I need to go home and I need to have a conversation with somebody that I like and love.

[384] And to be able to see whether I'm doing the right thing or I'm not doing the right thing or I'll get the feelings it's like right now talking to you I love the conversation and I love what you're saying even though I may not feel exactly the same way you do I love it that you're saying it because you're saying it the way I want to say it and I probably do behind my back I probably don't stand in public but I'm probably trying to help some people too and heal some people or or even even maybe get them to change or not feel like because I've been through so many kids and I just seen what some of the things that you've done with these kids and how you've made big differences just like Rico Chaparrelli what you're talking about just like kidding a Brad Penruth who had a who had a twin and he was not going to make it in life very far but by changing him like for example Brad was he needed to stop drinking you know for good He couldn't drink.

[385] I mean, right now I can drink a beer.

[386] I'm not going to go crazy.

[387] But if he drank a beer or two, he'd go crazy.

[388] I'll get in trouble every time.

[389] Every time he had a, got in trouble.

[390] It was alcohol -related.

[391] And I didn't even know it.

[392] What's funny about this kid, Brad Penrith, he won a national championship for me as a sophomore.

[393] And he got in trouble within a week or two after he won the national championship.

[394] And it was the first time he ever made the paper.

[395] They picked him up for intoxication.

[396] Well, you know what?

[397] Once they looked him up, he'd already been arrested quite a few times the year before.

[398] And they'd never even put his name in a paper.

[399] But once he became a famous guy, he made the headlines.

[400] And so I didn't even know.

[401] If I'd have known he'd been getting in trouble, I'd probably been working on him before.

[402] But it's one of these things that it's like who you are.

[403] It's who you are sometimes.

[404] And, but he's, he did well.

[405] He ended up being a three -time All -American.

[406] He got in the national finals three times.

[407] And he won, he got beat both times, the other ones.

[408] But, but, you know, it's controversial.

[409] There's calls.

[410] Could have went his way.

[411] And he went to become a world silver medalist in the world championships.

[412] And, and, uh, but you know what he had to do?

[413] He had to, he's one of these guys that he can't drink.

[414] So he gave it up.

[415] And he hasn't had a drink till, and he hasn't had 50s though and he's doing really well good wife good kids you know here I am I have a beer and we're probably going to drink a beer here sometime but but you know but some people can't drink yeah that's just the way it is it is just the way it is yeah and so this guy just figured it out well let me tell you going into his senior year he got in trouble and my AD called me in his name was bump Elliott we just passed away a couple years ago It's a great, great AD.

[416] And he said, Gable, you're winning all these titles.

[417] You don't need this kid on your team.

[418] He's been in trouble too many times.

[419] And I want you to kick him off.

[420] I don't know if he said kick.

[421] I want you to take him off the roster.

[422] And right there, I just froze because I knew this was his only thing.

[423] And if this is his only thing that's holding him together, we've got to figure something out.

[424] And I told my athletic director about his history, where he come from, he's got a twin brother.

[425] He's a twin brother's not getting any wrestling.

[426] He's all kinds of, you know, this and that.

[427] And I said a few things, and I said, the one thing in his life that is good is wrestling.

[428] I said, do we want to take that out of him?

[429] You know, after actually talking to a guy that would listen, he looks at me and he goes, you know, I'll buy that.

[430] But let me tell you, this is what we got to do.

[431] in -house treatment for 30 days in a hospital and if you can't do that and he can't successfully come out then he's off and he went in 30 days he came out and never drank since and that was 1988 or 88 and here it is 2021 he's got a nice wife nice kids and he's doing well in his life and some good decisions by coach and an athletic director that's awesome I love hearing stories like that.

[432] Some people really can't drink.

[433] Yeah, and Brad was right with Rico, you know, and Roy Seldra, that's another name that's crazy.

[434] And these guys were Hellions, but they could kick butt on the wrestling mat, but they liked to go downtown.

[435] And that's when those days, that was the hard days on me because I had to go downtown and kick him out of the bars.

[436] Well, they actually warned the bar people that own the bars that I would be coming in at 12.

[437] So they would be hiding out the back.

[438] So let us know, and we'll run out the back.

[439] door you know so so you know those days they should have probably happened i shouldn't have let it go that far but when you're winning seven eight nine straight national titles you know sometimes you give a kid a break too and uh it comes back to haunt you so uh you know so um it became a kind of a ritual for me to go leave home about 1130 every night to go downtown to Iowa city to walk into bars to see where some of the guys were and try to get him home and you know That was probably not the right way to go about things.

[440] I should have had them to where I didn't have to do that.

[441] But, you know, you just, you're winning the Big Tens every year.

[442] You're winning the Nassos every year.

[443] Sometimes you just lose control.

[444] And it's kind of like how I lost my last match in college, and that's another whole story.

[445] But you win a lot, and sometimes you think you can cut corners.

[446] Well, you had gone undefeated your entire college career.

[447] until your last match?

[448] Entire high school career and entire.

[449] So seven years.

[450] And that was in scholastic wrestling, not freestyle wrestling, because I didn't start wrestling freestyle until I'm in college, but that's the international style.

[451] And I did lose there.

[452] But for scholastic wrestling, high school was undefeated, and then I was undefeated in college until my last match.

[453] But, you know, my coaches, and here I'm going to be, I was going to become a coach.

[454] I didn't really know it for sure, but I didn't know anything else, you know, because I was always a team captain, team leaders and all these kind of things.

[455] So I'm going into the national championship, and it's like, wow, I'm the show.

[456] I mean, I couldn't look at a newspaper because I was on the front page of the Chuggott Tribune and, you know, sports pages.

[457] It was in at Evanston, Illinois.

[458] And every place I'd go, people, you know, it's come up to me and all this kind of stuff.

[459] And so I, I, you know, from a coaching point of view, if my coaches had to do it over again, and they actually apologized to be years later, but it was like, nobody thought I was going to lose except for one guy.

[460] One guy actually said, I can beat him.

[461] But he didn't tell me, forgot to tell me. So I didn't take him for granted.

[462] I took him for granted.

[463] And so I always went through routines warming up, getting ready mentally.

[464] We weighed in five hours before a match.

[465] From then on, you ate and drank a little bit, and then focus, focus, rest, focus, focus.

[466] I was doing interviews with wide world sport right during the national finals.

[467] And I wasn't the talker.

[468] Like, I could talk pretty good now because I learned to talk.

[469] But at that time, off the mat, I couldn't talk to anybody.

[470] And so when they put a mic in front of me and they wanted to know about, hey, just say this.

[471] Say, hey, I'm Dan Gable.

[472] Come watch me next week on wide world of sport as I finished my career, 182 and 0.

[473] And I hadn't wrestled the match yet.

[474] And so I was supposed to say that.

[475] But you think I could say that?

[476] Hell no, I couldn't say that.

[477] I kept stuttering and not saying it, and they kept doing it.

[478] So finally, after about 15 takes, they wrote it out on big cards.

[479] And so I took about seven takes with that one.

[480] I think I got it done in about 22 takes.

[481] But then I, when I got it done, it wasn't good either.

[482] They just finally said, oh, that's good enough.

[483] Get out of here.

[484] So I turned, I'm on deck.

[485] I'm on deck.

[486] So they already went through the 118, 126, 134, and I was 142 at that time.

[487] So 134 is just wrestling.

[488] And I always warmed up for a good 45 minutes to an hour.

[489] So I hit a quick warm -up and went out in that match.

[490] And I didn't realize there was somebody that actually thought they could beat me. And even though before I always did the routine, I went through it.

[491] But I'll tell you what, you skip once, you're vulnerable.

[492] For only time of my life that within a minute into the match, I could hear the crowd.

[493] A minute in the match, I could feel how I felt.

[494] And I was feeling tired and weak.

[495] I mean, I never knew how you felt in a wrestling match until the match was over.

[496] And once it was over, yeah, sometimes I felt good.

[497] But sometimes I felt weak and tired.

[498] But I didn't show it because I didn't think about it.

[499] I didn't know it.

[500] But the one time he didn't prepare.

[501] And the guy thinking that he could go with you, and he could, you know, you take on everything.

[502] So you take on way more than just your opponent.

[503] And so I talked myself into wrestling after a minute one.

[504] I kept saying, I got to keep going.

[505] I got to keep working hard.

[506] And so I got an early lead, just a quick first take down.

[507] But I kept feeling how tired I was.

[508] And I kept hearing the crowd.

[509] Why do you think you were so tired?

[510] because I didn't warm up.

[511] I was doing talking.

[512] I was not focusing on my match.

[513] Concentration.

[514] No warm up had that much of an effect on your conditioning.

[515] I used to be a pretty, well, even today as you get older, you notice how if you don't warm up and you hit something really hard, you get exhausted.

[516] It's probably kind of like that.

[517] Usually what I did for warmups is probably within a half hour of my match, I would get match heartbeat rate up and go for three or four minutes that way.

[518] So not get real tired.

[519] But then after that, you'd probably have a little drink and get ready to go.

[520] What would you do for a warm -up?

[521] You had a very specific routine?

[522] Pretty much, pretty much, you know, stretching and jogging.

[523] And then actually wrestling, actually wrestling pretty hard.

[524] And to where you would actually sweating good.

[525] And then I actually got to the point where if I had a lot of time before my match, I would actually go take another shower.

[526] But usually when you're the fourth guy out or something, you just kind of stayed loose.

[527] But you didn't really.

[528] And then right before your match again, you might get your heart rate up again.

[529] Because your heart rate didn't really go down below 100 probably.

[530] And you need it in a wrestling match, it's probably going up to 170, 180, you know, stuff like that.

[531] But you wanted to have your heart rate.

[532] rate up to that match -paced heart rate for not seven or eight minutes because that you're going to be not going to recover quick enough you still be tired you'd still be tired so you'd get it up there and spike it up and down for two or three minutes and hitting some really good execution of wrestling holds we do hand fighting a lot of hand fighting and that hand fighting can really can get that heart rate up and pushing and shoving and hitting some live techniques where the guy was letting you do it but you're doing it at live pace and you do some sprints and do some tumbling, gymnastics tumbling.

[533] But in this match, no warm up at all.

[534] When I got done with the 22nd take of the, of the, I had that match to warm up.

[535] So I probably had 10 minutes instead of my normal 45 minutes or so.

[536] But I thought I was still ready.

[537] But it was something out of my control, actually.

[538] And it took me over.

[539] But I did talk my way into, because I got ahead, but then I got real far behind.

[540] I mean, I was behind by six points.

[541] And then I got ahead by two or three points.

[542] And that was right towards the end of the match.

[543] And then there was a flurry.

[544] Could have went either way, but the referee went his way.

[545] And that's the way it is.

[546] I mean, it's just It's just, that's the calls.

[547] Does that haunt you to this day?

[548] Oh, of course it haunts me. But guess what?

[549] I needed that loss.

[550] I really did.

[551] That loss took me to unbelievable heights that I would have never had without that loss.

[552] What's unbelievable is if you ask the guy that beat me, Larry Owings, he said if I had to do it over again I might have lost that match on purpose or not even on purpose just because I didn't know how to handle it I wanted to be an Olympic champion I wanted to be a world champion but when I won that match there was so much hype I didn't know how to handle it he said even broke up my marriage he was married again that's what he claimed he claims and we probably came home and just didn't know how to you're not supposed to be it's kind of like with me when going downtown that now you know i probably shouldn't have been but my wife is behind this and everything but i probably shouldn't have stayed that sometimes i didn't tell you this sometimes i stayed at the bar for a little while and then came home but you know probably shouldn't have stayed at the bar and there's a lot of times when i was on my way home that after coming home at 630 or 7 o 'clock at night then i had kids at home and a wife and they had dinner and they probably got tired of waiting for me that they did get tired of waiting for me they would go have dinner and then time i'd get home, I'd probably have to walk in the bedroom, kiss the kids good night, because they were already in bed.

[553] And that was a tough time in my life, too, because the next year we end up losing the 10th championship.

[554] Going for the all -time record again.

[555] Going for the all -time record once you think a guy learned.

[556] Of course, then you got 10 years later, you kind of forget, and you do the same damn thing.

[557] But you do it not as an athlete, you do it as a coach.

[558] And about, I think about and in my marriage because my wife I think was pretty upset with me and then I got upset with my wife about things and so we struggled pretty hard and uh you'd think you'd learn but sometimes uh you forget and uh and that loss was well I don't I don't forget I'd love to have won that match I would love to won that match but not how I won it because I could have got to call at the end too and maybe still won the match could it win overtime but you think the loss was very important i think that's what almost everybody always says about moments that are real low moments in their life when they thought everything was untouchable and they thought that they were just well look at my sister low moment in my life of of all time and pretty much dedicated my life to that moment as far as uh how i was going to make her proud you know that type of stuff and and and uh you You know, it's pretty amazing that those low points can bring you out and get you back on track, even though, you know, it's hard to say that there was good in it.

[559] Right.

[560] But, you know, one thing, another thing that I really was scared of in my life, that when my mom and dad wouldn't make it together.

[561] and I started as a pretty young age and it went all through high school because even after my sister was murdered his 10th grader it didn't let up in my household a lot of late night drinking and yelling and before that 10th grade it was just mad at each other about something but then after that it was a lot of it was about that murder and they blame each other and stuff like that And we did move back into the same house Because they never found the murder weapon was a knife It could have been one of our knives And it was a lot of blood all over our house And they didn't want to move back in But I convinced them that we should move back in And one of the ways I convinced him was about a month after the murder when we did move back in.

[562] So it was probably the second month.

[563] They were up arguing and I was in bed and I heard my mom say something that I thought was really stupid.

[564] She said I wish I would have raised her a whore.

[565] Because she didn't give in.

[566] She could have gave in.

[567] She would still be alive when I heard that.

[568] I got up.

[569] And I came out.

[570] And our home really hadn't become a home again.

[571] It had been a house.

[572] We moved back in it, but it hadn't gone.

[573] Her bedroom was like just there.

[574] It was just there.

[575] And it was always, the door was always closed.

[576] And so I looked at him and I said, you know what?

[577] I'm tired of this fighting.

[578] And I just heard the conversation that was going on.

[579] I am moving out of my bedroom.

[580] I'm moving it right now.

[581] I'm going into her room, and her room is going to become my room.

[582] And I'm staying there starting right now.

[583] I went in, opened the door, went in, closed the door, and went to bed, got underneath her covers, went to bed.

[584] That room probably hadn't been, nobody been in that room for 30 days, probably 45 days.

[585] And about 10 minutes later, I heard the door, they thought I was sleeping.

[586] They looked inside and saw me sleeping in there, but I wasn't sleeping.

[587] I don't think I slept that night at all.

[588] But that is the turnaround for the Gable family in that house.

[589] We stayed in that house.

[590] And I never thought they would stay married.

[591] And so that was one of the reasons why, besides my sister, I just give them something to really focus on and concentrate.

[592] So when you went away, you know, they could go to all these events.

[593] And hell, my dad, when I won the World Championship, and he didn't, it's the only time he didn't go to my event.

[594] That was a major event, my mom and dad, it was in communist Sofia, Bulgaria.

[595] And when I won the World Championship, He was down at the Waterloo Courier paper with the editor down there, and it was an odd hour, and he was waiting for the teletype or the machine to come over and see how I did in that event.

[596] It wasn't that easy to find out.

[597] So all of a sudden it comes over, it's type, and it was a headline across the paper.

[598] It said, Dan Gable wins World Championship.

[599] My old man, ripped the paper right off that teletype machine, and he ran outside.

[600] and it was early morning and there were people coming to work and he was running down the street swinging his that little newspaper yelling hey my kid's a world champion my kids a world champion and uh you know that that kind of stuff is it's just you can't you can't make that kind of stuff up and it's just it's just it's just amazing that um but anyway so what happened is i found out once i went to college that my mom and dad really liked each other i never knew that because now they only had each other and I wasn't there but they could follow me and they followed me for every and they they wrote me every day so I could go to the I'd get mail every day I'd go to the mailbox and I'd have a letter from my mom every day seven days a week when I was going only 90 miles and in those letters we used to drink a lot of high seat and when you take the labels off you could send seven or eight of them in and they'd give you money back so my mom would send me in in little she'd have a little letter and she'd say here's your here's some money from the high sea and how you doing or something like that and there'll always be a quarter a nickel a dime you know that type of stuff in there so it's it's pretty amazing and she did that three or four times a week i would get change in the mail but you know not a whole lot I was getting a full right scholarship.

[601] That day, you got $25 a month for whatever we wanted to spend it on from the school.

[602] And then my dad gave me an extra $20 a month.

[603] And that was all he was costing him, $20.

[604] Well, he did more than that because he bought me a car, a nice little car to send me off to college and that type of stuff.

[605] But, you know, it's pretty amazing that, you know, when you find out stuff that they really like you.

[606] But yet they still need some common person.

[607] to follow and I was that guy you know when I when I was in when I was in high school I um I was a state champ as a sophomore which is the first year of high school then I won state champion as a junior but I was wrestling my weight was 95 as a sophomore and 103 as a junior and college the first weights were 118 and my dad thought I was to get me getting bigger plus it wasn't really I was pretty skinny and so my dad says you know i want to get you a job this summer going into your senior year because the job you're going to get you're going to want it because you know you like working out hard and stuff like this job's going to be a workout all day long it's going to be with a cement crew he says you're going to be hauling bags 94 pound bags of portland bank of cement you're going to be digging and shoveling cement you're going to be digging and holes you're going to be doing all this hard work carrying buckets of mud and by that they call it cement and so on and so forth you're going to swing in a sledgehammer because you're going to be dealing with a lot of basements because my dad would deal in the house business and so he got me a job when I was 16 years old it was still 16 yet in the summer of my junior year so he got me a job little did I know again it's the old day What's what's good about the old days?

[608] They had to be 18 to get the job.

[609] It was one of those, you know, where you had to be 18.

[610] And I was 16, but he was a house.

[611] My dad was a house builder and he'd always hired this guy to build the basements.

[612] And he told the guy he wanted me to get a job and the guy says, well, I can't really put him on the books.

[613] So he says, I'll keep him off the books.

[614] We'll hire him anyway.

[615] but he says you know we'll just pay him on the cash on the table but my dad says you don't even have to pay him I'll pay you so after about three days of work because I my dad had scared the daylights out of me telling me how hard I'd have to work I didn't realize there was people that were just putting their hours in some of them and I was working arms and legs around these guys carrying running and the people kind of looked at me funny for a while, but then they realized I was on a mission.

[616] Finally, the owner of the cement company, Martinston Construction, Jerry Martinson was his name.

[617] Called my dad after three days and said, Mr. Gable, you're not going to pay your son.

[618] We're going to pay your son.

[619] We'll just do it under the table as well.

[620] We're going to pay him.

[621] We're not going to let you pay him.

[622] You're not going to have to pay him.

[623] He's working everybody under the table.

[624] He's getting along with everybody.

[625] In fact, at lunches, before we, we, eat lunch, he always wants to wrestle everybody on the crew.

[626] And in the first day, these guys, they're old timers, but they're big guys and he's weighing a, you know, he's wrestling 103, so he probably have to 125 right now, and he's 125 pounds, and he's 250 -pound guys, they can't beat him.

[627] He said, he's kicking the shit out of every one of them, and they love him, and they're having a great time with him.

[628] In fact, all the hard work, they're giving him all the hard work.

[629] In fact, when he moves those 94 -pound bags of cement off the truck to where they're supposed to go, that's not enough for him so they tell them to move those bags again to the other side of the house so it's just crazy and they're all loving it and they and so you know we're going to pay your son we're going to pay your son so you know my dad was looking out for me they looked out for my dad that's a good old days the police were looking out for my dad you know it's uh you just some I don't know if we're looking out for many people today and if we are it's probably of the like and you know what we all need to be of the like.

[630] So you used that job as a workout?

[631] Eight hours a day.

[632] Did you gain any weight from that?

[633] I couldn't, but I gained strength.

[634] Because I, you know what?

[635] I wasn't carrying 94 -pound bags.

[636] I put three them on there.

[637] So you take 94 times three, and that's when I was carrying as a 125 -pound kid.

[638] Jesus.

[639] Yeah.

[640] So I unload them, because they'd load them up on me, on my arms, and I'd carry them over to where they're supposed to be.

[641] Couldn't pick them up all at one time.

[642] But so, you know, I was crazy.

[643] I was crazy.

[644] I was definitely crazy.

[645] And I used to run to work sometimes.

[646] And it was a couple miles away and then run home.

[647] But guess what?

[648] I always had a five, so we'd get home about 5 .30.

[649] My high school had an open practice for wrestling from 530 to 630 every night after that work.

[650] So I'd go to work all day, weightlifting all day.

[651] Then I'd go to wrestling practice for an hour's independent wrestling practice.

[652] Just open the mat and there's somebody would always show up.

[653] I'd always show up and somebody would always show up that I could wrestle.

[654] So I was getting all that work.

[655] eight hours of weightlifting in a hard type because I would go crazy I'd run back to get the bags run between things and then I'd go to wrestling practice for an hour so then I go home and eat I'd go to bed so I was sleeping by 8 o 'clock 8 30 every night because you had to get up at 6 o 'clock in the morning go to work but I'll tell you made you tough made you tough and there's a lot of things that you did back in those days that you now know that maybe you can't you should just easier ways to not easier way, smarter ways to do things that you probably wouldn't give you some more longevity.

[656] Because, you know, I've worn out my hips.

[657] I mean, I've got six hips, you know.

[658] I got my own, too, and I've got four others.

[659] And who...

[660] You've had how many hip replacements?

[661] Let's have some of your beer.

[662] You've got some gable beer.

[663] Yeah, hey, you know what?

[664] That's some of the rewards you get.

[665] Cheers.

[666] Yeah, people name beer after you.

[667] I got a nutrition drink.

[668] This gable beer comes out.

[669] It's a brewery, one -half a block from the Gable Museum in Waterloo, Iowa.

[670] What's the name of the brewery?

[671] Single -speed, single -speed brewery.

[672] Guess who owns it, Dave Morgan.

[673] Guess who Dave Morgan is state champion wrestler out of New Hampton, about 30 miles north of water?

[674] That's a good beer.

[675] It better be.

[676] I sampled it.

[677] It's good.

[678] I don't think I want a bad beer?

[679] No, it's a good beer.

[680] No, it's a good beer.

[681] It's a good beer.

[682] You know, but here's the thing.

[683] It's been in two cups.

[684] contest you go out to it's the biggest contest too out in denver somewhere and the first year i didn't uh get an award so i said you know like what are we going to do about that because you know i don't like a beer out there without an award you know i went in these prizes and they said well you know what we got the information that the judges gave us we're going to take that we're going to make it better so they made it better so the next year they went back and they got they might have got a bronze medal or they might have got one round of placing or something but they went they survived the cut and went a long way and they felt pretty good to me and I said it's not gold so somebody heard that and they liked it so they come up with a Gable Gold nutrition drink and it's up in New Lisbon Wisconsin there's a former wrestler again Brian Slater who in one of my former wrestlers Barry Davis works up there used to be the former Wisconsin coach and was a three -time national champion for me. Olympic silver medals, Olympic silver medals as well.

[685] But he works up there, and they made a nutrition drink in the last year.

[686] It's called Gable Gold.

[687] So I got a Gable beer.

[688] It's a Munich -style Hellest, and that's where I won the Munichs.

[689] And if you read it on there, what's it say?

[690] It says, Gable, one word can say so much.

[691] In our city, few words, if any, resonate with the name Gable.

[692] I can't even read.

[693] I've got to get my glasses here a little bit better.

[694] He says, but in commemoration of his Olympic triumph in Munich, 1972, we've crafted a beer much more appropriate, approachable, than adversaries found Dan to be on the mat.

[695] He says, it's crisp and gold.

[696] We can't think of a more fitting tribute.

[697] So Dave Morgan got this beer.

[698] People love it.

[699] They want to get it outside Iowa, but it only is in Iowa.

[700] Because I found out you can't sell it outside without going through a lot of...

[701] So it goes to the border.

[702] Now, I've snuck it across the border a few times.

[703] We've got it here.

[704] We snuck it across the border.

[705] We hit it in a package.

[706] It's kind of a shame that you can't sell this else.

[707] It's very good.

[708] Well, it'd probably go to another level if we...

[709] Yes, it would.

[710] I would buy this 100%.

[711] I'd keep it stocked here in the studio.

[712] Well, we're talking about me, but all my friends, when they found out I'm coming down here, they all have got a hold of me. And they all want to tell me to tell them hi and tell them this, tell them that, and tell them I'm their number one fan.

[713] And so, you know, you're a big deal.

[714] I just want you to know that.

[715] You're a big deal.

[716] And you know that, but it's not like you care as much as like me. I want to be successful and I want to win.

[717] I want to do all this great stuff.

[718] But that's just part of what I want to do.

[719] You know, it's not a big deal.

[720] It's just what I want to do.

[721] And so if people have a beer to celebrate with, great.

[722] Now, I do have a limit.

[723] And I got a book here too, and it says, Know Your Limits.

[724] There's a chapter in that book.

[725] What's the limit?

[726] Well, for me, it's a little different than most.

[727] Whatever you think you can limit.

[728] For me, it's 32 ounces.

[729] And I usually just say two beers, but these are 12 -ounce, so I could have two and a half of these.

[730] But that was back in a few years ago.

[731] I'm getting older.

[732] I don't know if I can still do that limit.

[733] Because if I look at the times that I've been in trouble with something at all, it's always been a little beer, a little had a little beer in me, whether it be with the police or whether it be with my wife or whatever.

[734] So, you know, so you got to be smart.

[735] You got to know your limits.

[736] Yeah, you got to know your limits.

[737] How many hip replacements have you had?

[738] Well, I own my own too, because I was, you know, had two pretty good.

[739] good ones but when I was uh let's see when I was 48 well actually I went out to run when I was 38 and all of a sudden my hip start hurting so I ran through the my hip for 10 years if you run far enough you didn't have a hip pain the pain of the the arthritis right right yeah well the pain of running just the hurtness of your can't breathe you know you're running hard so for 10 years I did was stupid because I didn't really know what it was and I didn't really pay attention so just got it out yeah so finally when I was 48 I jumped out of bed one morning and when I jumped out of bed I collapsed and I felt something crunch couldn't get up it was my last year of coaching actually and I didn't know it was going to be my last year of coaching but so I went to the doctor and the doctor Dr. Marsh, a great doctor, orthopedic surgeon.

[740] Actually he was a surgeon.

[741] Actually, he was a, when you get in an accident, I can't remember the term they, they, Christ, not a crisis, but a certain doctor where you bring him in when there's a big accident.

[742] And they brought me into his place.

[743] And he looked at it and he says, wow, you got a bad hip, really bad.

[744] And you just fractured.

[745] It's just splintered.

[746] It's splintered.

[747] when you jumped out of bed this morning it was been so fragile it just splintered and I had been kind of working through the pain for 10 years so I had to get it fixed during my that season and so when I got it fixed immediately it felt good immediately but then I didn't realize my other one was hurting because that one had the most pain so it was overtaken the other one even though the other one was bad so he says we got to do that other one and I said, wow.

[748] So it took a while.

[749] It took four, five, six months to heal to get back going.

[750] So then they had to wait a little while and then they did the other one.

[751] So I, you know, this made me think a lot.

[752] And, you know, I don't think that's what got me out of wrestling.

[753] I think what got me out of wrestling is what I kind of referred to earlier, the mind.

[754] by that I mean meant that there was a certain way of of life that you have lived and if it wasn't if it didn't happen like second place was just not acceptable and so you know to me it was like I got to get that other I got to get my life back to you know and I went back to my mom now that I'm thinking because my mom is what got me out of the sport as a wrestler because she saw me coming home from I was in Iowa City and I came home for and I went to the high school for a workout and when I walked in the house just to have dinner because I was visiting Waterloo, Iowa, I walked in and I sprained my ankle and practice over there at West High at my high school and so I was limping and my mom looked at me and she said my God you're limping and he said you know what you got to get out of this you got to get on with your life and I was already on with my life a little bit but I was still contemplating what whether I should wrestle again.

[755] How old were you then?

[756] Well I had 23 when I won the Olympic so now it's probably 24 because wrestling season October 25th is my birthday so a wrestling season probably is in December.

[757] So she was just concerned from injuries and well yeah she was just tired of seeing me being lamed up for 24 you're not even in your prime yet yeah but I worked pretty hard yeah I was the only you know high school back in the high school days when I first came there as a sophomore, I lived across the street from the high school.

[758] My coach knew that I was a little bit of a fanatic.

[759] And so he says, Dan, I live five miles away from West High School.

[760] And I'd like to have the doors open into the locker room for the team if they want to come early, even during football or even during wrestling, especially.

[761] He says, I'm going to give you a key to the locker room.

[762] to where you can just come right in from the outside because you can come right across this because I know you want to come, right?

[763] He goes, I go, yeah, I want to come in the mornings.

[764] He says, not a required practice.

[765] And I'll get there, but I'll probably not come right towards the end because it's just on your own running, lifting, that type stuff.

[766] And he says, I'm going to give you a key to this.

[767] And this, again, the good old days, you can't do it now.

[768] But, and if you do, you get fired.

[769] So he gave me a key to school I walked across the street I only had to walk a block and I'd open up the gym door go in there and anybody that wanted to come with me well nobody came with me at first because it was wrestling season was just starting just off of football and some of them took a break and even the wrestlers that didn't wrestle or didn't play football they weren't about to go in the mornings yet because wrestling practice at 3 .30 was a bear we had a baby a bear of a wrestling practice I'm going to take a drink of this beer even though I'm probably going to work out yet today but anyway so he gave me a key to school I opened it up nobody there was me so for the first maybe 10 days two weeks of the wrestling season I was the only guy there we had a good team but they were already doing good with one practice so they weren't coming to two so all of a sudden and they didn't know much about me, the old -timers on the team.

[770] And they didn't really give me any credit yet because I hadn't done anything.

[771] I was zero -on -zero in high school.

[772] But the coach told me that, you know, that I was going to make the team.

[773] He could just tell and that he was going to give me this key.

[774] So all of a sudden, I had the first duel meeting.

[775] I win.

[776] I'm one or no. I went, excuse me. I win the second one.

[777] I win the third one I win the fourth one I win the fifth one I'm going into my gym I'm about the sixth or seventh and all of a sudden I open the door and I kind of close oh I'm telling the key I can't get the key out a little bit and somebody bumps into my back and I turn around there's another there's a wrestler and I go what are you doing he goes well you know you've been coming coach tells us you're here every morning I didn't think it was worth it but you haven't lost a match I think I'm going to join you I said good so then it was all of a sudden three three four five six so by the middle season the end of the season we had just about everybody coming in the mornings not the day of the match or the day before but like three days Monday Tuesday Wednesday usually when you could not get ready for the big matches but but it just that's the way people are you know it shouldn't take that way but from a coaching point if you me it taught it taught me a lesson, you know, you always have to have a leader in there because you've got to go for help again.

[778] Here my goal for help is.

[779] So I have somebody in there besides myself.

[780] And that's kind of the way we built the University of Iowa up.

[781] We went for help right away because they weren't that good.

[782] Iowa State was good.

[783] But I thought Iowa was going to be automatically good because they were good.

[784] But they didn't know they were good.

[785] And they never had done good.

[786] And so they weren't good in their mind.

[787] And that's what got me out of wrestling my mind.

[788] So the mind is, such a big thing my mind was really hurting more than my body and i and i didn't really realize it and that's where my mom i think understood it and my wife and and people like that they could see that i was kind of going crazy but from too much competition just too much grinding apparently apparently because here's here's the thing i'd get sick towards the end of the season i would get sick for about two weeks straight.

[789] I mean, kind of sick.

[790] Oh, my God, what's wrong with me?

[791] There's got to be having cancer or something, you know.

[792] But never been...

[793] Just you're beating yourself up.

[794] Just the mental strain.

[795] So we go to the Big Tans, we go to the nationals, and all of a sudden we're winning and the day before the finals and we win the championship the day before.

[796] Or we don't.

[797] But whenever we won the championship, that night when I went to bed on Saturday night, Or even a Friday night, if we won the championship and we still had a bunch of guys in the finals, I would wake up the next day healthy.

[798] So I've been sick for two weeks, and I can wake up healthy as soon as we won.

[799] So it was just the pressure.

[800] Well, it's probably, I mean, if you ever, you should watch me how I coach matches sometimes.

[801] I went crazy.

[802] I never did that as an athlete.

[803] You know, I just, I didn't even hardly let the referee raise my hand.

[804] I was real just humble and didn't do, I didn't jump for joy, I did anything.

[805] But as a coach, I went crazy.

[806] Why do you think that is?

[807] Because I couldn't control it.

[808] It was somebody else.

[809] I knew about me. I knew I was good.

[810] And so, but it's somebody else.

[811] And you just don't.

[812] And so when they come through for you, it's just better.

[813] It's better than you know you're going to win, even though you really don't.

[814] Do you feel more joy out of winning as a coach than you did over winning as an athlete?

[815] A coach.

[816] Yeah?

[817] Because of exactly what I've been talking about.

[818] But let me tell you why.

[819] I didn't even like my athletes.

[820] I loved them, but we got into conflicts because I pushed him hard.

[821] Probably, and they were going along with it because they had a lot of success too.

[822] But there was times, there was moments when they looked at me and they put their fist up.

[823] There was times when they pushed me and I fell over a bike or something like that.

[824] There was times when it wasn't always pretty.

[825] Do you think it was because the way you pushed yourself, they couldn't tolerate it?

[826] So when you wanted to do that to them and you wanted them to work as hard as you worked?

[827] No, depending on the guy individually.

[828] each guy was different and depending on how he was doing depending on how he's living and if he really wanted to be good but let me go one step further I could handle them guys I could handle them because it was my job I was in a room a padded room and I could do that and they would go along with me mostly because of the success that people were having but I know what my mom and dad went through when I wrestled my mom often didn't stand inside the gym she often stood outside the gym and looked through the window I mean it's a tough -ass sport that takes the heart out of you sometimes and it's really tough for a mom or even a dad and so to me when I would get into these altercations with my athletes I could handle it only one reason because I knew they had a mom and dad and I knew what the mom and dad how much they meant because I knew I'd seen I've seen them how they yelled in the stands I saw them how they when their kid got their hand raised what it meant to them the proudness I saw what it did to my mom and dad kept my mom and dad alive and well till they both died.

[829] But they were never going to make it, I thought, in marriage.

[830] But once they were married for over 50 years.

[831] So, but I never thought there.

[832] It was a kid I thought there for sure.

[833] My biggest fear was there going to get a divorce.

[834] Now, that was a kid when I was junior high and grade school.

[835] But so anyway, so these kids, every once in a while when I'd really get upset with a kid because he'd missed three days of practice or something.

[836] Like Rico?

[837] Yeah, like Rico one time did.

[838] But he had a good reason.

[839] He had a girlfriend.

[840] You've told us about that before.

[841] But anyway, you know, I'm one of these coaches that a little bit, I give a little bit, but I always, the first people I looked at after a match when the kid won or lost, I looked at, I knew where their parents were if they were there.

[842] And I'd look at them.

[843] And the look on their face when their kid won a big match or it was just a win as compared to when they looked on when they lost, oh my gosh.

[844] And it went right back to my mom and dad too, just how it kind of appeared to me. But I coached more from motivational point of view from the parents' point of view than I did the kid.

[845] Because I knew the kid was going to be a parent someday.

[846] He's going to be the same thing.

[847] So what the heck?

[848] it's pretty amazing pretty amazing so when you look back on your drive the drive that you had as a competitor how much did it change after your sister was killed how much of a factor was that it never it's still a factor it hasn't let up I mean it's hard to I mean when you when your dad when you know who killed your sister within 30 minutes of finding out that she's murdered and you don't know anything else.

[849] Does she just know she was murdered in her house?

[850] They found her dead.

[851] And you, within 30 minutes, tell your dad who it was and it comes to be true, there's some guilt there.

[852] But it's the kind of guilt that I'm not going to hold me back.

[853] And anger.

[854] And anger.

[855] But mostly from my dad's, my dad's point of view was anger probably more than me but you felt guilt i felt more guilt probably yeah my dad it hurt my dad but and my mom but uh unbelievably it's just so strange a 16 year old can do that and not only that he could do that but that he knew he was going to kill somebody like what kind of he was an adopted kid and he had been in a lot of trouble but mostly just not that kind of trouble you know but he knew eventually he was going to do that yeah he said he knew he was going to kill somebody he just didn't know who yeah that's so crazy so crazy and then he then he repented at the end you know sometime towards the end of his of his jail time what was it like knowing that guy is just rotting away in a jail cell somewhere your whole life your whole life as a competitor your whole life as a coach or your whole life as a man i know it it haunted my mom and dad i guarantee it i mean they just i i i'm hoping that they somehow saw some peace there but but for me you know i don't i don't think the peace really came to me until he he repented and he said that you know and when by saying that meant a lot to me my mom and dad were already gone and hopefully they know that and that they can feel it.

[856] How much of a factor was that, though, for you as a competitor?

[857] I mean, have you ever thought, obviously you would have much preferred your sister to be alive.

[858] But have you ever thought about how much different you were because of that anger and because of that guilt?

[859] You know, I never have.

[860] And I don't think that's something that I'd, look at the good only on that kind of stuff it's kind of like you know talking about people that are just being ridiculous you know the way i feel i feel they're being ridiculous yeah and somehow i have to set back and say how can i get through this without saying that they're ridiculous and they are you know but at the same time i i try to feel i have i try to have a little feeling try to have even though it's difficult it's difficult but it's it's with my sister it's it makes a difference today in my life i mean for people that don't understand like maybe people that don't follow wrestling i just want to let them know like in a world of extreme athletes like the world of wrestling you are very unusual and that you stood out you were one of the few people ever in the history of the Olympics to not have a single point scored upon you.

[861] I mean, that's just phenomenal when you're dealing with world -class wrestlers from all these different countries that are also training the same way you are, just knowing the Olympics is the pinnacle of the sport.

[862] And for you to go there and not just win, but not get a single point scored on you, It's just extraordinary.

[863] That kind of intensity that you carried.

[864] You know what really helped me?

[865] Not knowing it.

[866] I didn't, nobody told me that I had six matches at the Olympics, and they were nine minutes each unless you pinned them, and I pinned half of them, so I pinned three, and I decision three, and I ended up winning this final score on the three that I didn't pin.

[867] I beat him 29 to nothing total scores.

[868] But it was one of these things that had I known, known it would have got into my head.

[869] Right.

[870] And I probably would have lost a point or two or something like that.

[871] You know, it's just, it's just one of these things that you stay focused.

[872] And a good coach, I had a great coach, Bill Farrell, Bill Wick, these are all great coaches.

[873] And as around good people, I had some wrestlers.

[874] We had three wrestlers that were on the Iowa State team and had another wrestler that trained with us.

[875] So we had 40 % of the freestyle wrestling team, the Peterson brothers.

[876] you know so you know we just nobody said hey Gable you don't realize going into your final match that you're unscored upon nobody ever said that to me you know and and some coaches actually point stuff out like that but you know what maybe it's good in some situations depending upon the athlete yeah you know it's maybe so you know it's like you asked a question earlier somebody come in late to practice you know I had to look and see who did, if I felt a certain way about this guy, I'm just, maybe I was just happy he showed up.

[877] You know, maybe or, and you know what, it's, to me, it's like, once you got there at practice, it's what you did during the time of practice, not whether you were here on time or left early or all that kind of stuff, what you got accomplished.

[878] And if you got accomplished an unbelievable a lot that I felt good about.

[879] Well, and again, it's bad to say that, that you have different standards, but, you know, sometimes...

[880] Isn't that part of being a coach, though?

[881] It's also part of being a dad, right?

[882] I think it is, because I look at another kid.

[883] This blows people's minds here, part of being a coach.

[884] So I had these Bannick brothers who were really good.

[885] Some of my first early recruits, they were twins.

[886] and all of a sudden one of them just you could tell he couldn't take a two -hour practice and by that I mean not physically but he got bored he was bored at a practice and almost to the point where he was getting nothing it was going backwards once he only could do a certain style of practice he could most like blow like if you play pick up basketball throw the basketball out there play pickup just Go, go, go.

[887] No time period.

[888] No referees, no nothing.

[889] So if he come to practice, if you roll the basketball out there, roll the headgear out there, roll the mouthpiece, put it in, and say, Russell, he could go.

[890] He'd go.

[891] And he'd go.

[892] But if you stopped and had instruction, and if you stopped and had verbal talk, and if you stopped and had other things, he just couldn't get that.

[893] So how does a coach, figure out how to get the most out of this guy but without hurting the team because that's kind of like in wrestling it's a bear at practice and how do you let one guy have another like do something different than the rest well if you're smart you get the 29 other guys to agree that this is what should be done so me I'm the 30th guy I had coaches I talked to I had a coach named Jay Robinson who was from a different Oklahoma State he was on our team from a he had a lot of different philosophies we talked about and we decided to do this let's talk to the team without Lou there and make sure that they understand where we're thinking they understand how we think and then we'll see what the response is can we maybe holding back a little bit from a standpoint of not maybe let him come to all the practices you know because every practice is broke down most of them are broke down in certain things hard wrestling conditioning talk fire up stuff you have to work on and he wasn't good on that listening he wasn't good on on the on the drilling he was good on live wrestling let's wrestle and so that was about the last hour so i talked to the team talk to coaches and I talked to the team and the team listened to what we said we're not trying to cut corners here guys we want to be better as a team do you think this wrestler Lou would benefit more by not coming to the first part of practice because you know him is better than I do because you're his friends more than I am even I said you think he could just come for that second hour and that he would be good or if not better they voted 29 to 0 that he should only come for the second hour of practice because he could that first hour was a waste of time for him and noticed when he had to come to the first hour his second hour wasn't as good we had noticed that and so they voted easy decision and he two -time national champ a third place finisher Olympic champ 1984 coach the team made good decision.

[894] Wow.

[895] That's how you make decisions sometimes.

[896] You get the team on your side.

[897] What was it like for you making that transition from being a competitor to being a coach?

[898] Was it difficult or was it natural?

[899] Well, I already had a lot of good...

[900] As a leader.

[901] Yeah, I already had that from the YMCA, from all of my coaches, from all my...

[902] Even on academics, I wasn't a good student.

[903] It took a wrestling coach in an algebra class.

[904] That was the algebra teacher to get me to become a good student.

[905] But, you know, it, it was one of these things, what was the question again?

[906] So what was it like transitioning from being a competitor to being a coach and whether or not it was easy or difficult?

[907] I'll tell you what.

[908] I wasn't going to be as good as I turned out to be because unless it went the way it did.

[909] I spent four years as an assistant.

[910] Two years at Iowa State as a grad assistant and didn't really do anything but trained there for the Worlds and Olympics.

[911] But then once I got to the University of Iowa, the head coach was Gary Kirtlemyer.

[912] And he was his first year as a head coach as the head coach.

[913] He'd been the assistant.

[914] But he hired me as the assistant.

[915] But he had been a head coach before in high school.

[916] And he had been running Iowa's program, even though he wasn't the head coach.

[917] It was the old -timer, Dave McCuskey, who was there.

[918] And he was kind of just kind of settling out his years.

[919] And so Gary had actually acted as the head coach.

[920] So he had a lot of cloud.

[921] He had a lot of knowledge, and he'd been a head coach.

[922] And so he brought me in, and he taught me unbelievable stuff.

[923] But here's what's unbelievable about what he taught me right away, and that we started practices, and he let me run a couple practices.

[924] So he'd run a couple, then I'd run a couple, then he'd run a couple.

[925] Two weeks after we'd been in the season started, he calls me in the, because we had the same office, and he comes over, and he sat down, and he goes, you know, Gable, I've been watching you at practice.

[926] You're better in practice than I am with the kids.

[927] You're going to run all the practices.

[928] You're going to do all the training of the athletes.

[929] You're going to do the conversation.

[930] You're going to do what you want to do to prepare them because you're better than that than I am.

[931] First year ever is the head coach and college.

[932] And he gave me within two weeks.

[933] And I just got there back from the Olympics.

[934] and he gave me full -time coaching in the wrestling room.

[935] But guess what?

[936] And then he goes, but you know what?

[937] I've already noticed outside the practice room, not quite as good as you are in the practice room.

[938] You know, you've got to learn to talk a little more.

[939] I'm going to send you to the clubs in town, you know, the little places that people meet for lunch.

[940] I'm going to send you to all the fraternities and all the sororities and all the dorms.

[941] We're going to have speeches.

[942] You're going to give speeches to all those kids on campus.

[943] He says, and then he says, I'm going to, I'm going to teach you how to recruit.

[944] You're going to go with me when we go recruit.

[945] I'm going to teach you all these different things.

[946] I'm going to teach you how to fundraise.

[947] I'm going to, I'm going to teach you how to talk outside the wrestling room, all these things that are important.

[948] And he says, you know, I don't probably not going to coach too long.

[949] I kind of want to move up in administration.

[950] So if things go well here for the next three or four years, I'll probably move up and you can move in if things go well.

[951] Well, exactly four years.

[952] And we went from a team that was top 20, maybe 15 to 20.

[953] We went to probably got maybe 7th or 8th the first year.

[954] Then we went to 4th or 5th.

[955] Then we won the Big 10s for first time in a long time.

[956] Third year, we won the nationals too.

[957] And in the fourth year, we won the nationals.

[958] Then he got out.

[959] He turned it over to me. So, you know, he stayed true to his form.

[960] But he was unbelievable.

[961] Here's the story.

[962] I'm at Iowa State.

[963] I'm training for the Olympics.

[964] And it's December.

[965] Olympics are going to be in the summer.

[966] And I'm defending world champion.

[967] And I'm predicted, you know, I'm one of the top seven favorite to win the gold medal in the Olympics for the America, and he knows he's moving up to be a head coach, and he put his eyesight on me. So he had this guy that lived in Iowa City, but he had been away from Iowa City and working out in New York, and he had been working with my Olympic coach, my Olympic coach that I was going to have in a in a uh because the lumpy coach had a um company that was a wrestling company mats and products and shoes and all this kind of stuff and uh he said he happens to be an iowa city guy but he's out there in new york working and i'm working with him a little bit about you getting a job over in i in ames iowa so he went to work for dr harold nichols business who was the head coach of ames who's my coach and he went to work there because he had a good reputation and he did a good job on that type of business.

[968] But the University of Iowa, Gary Kirtlemeyer, sent him over as a spy.

[969] To follow me, to see what I, you know, not just to see how good I was, but mostly to see how they could land me over at the University of Iowa as his assistant.

[970] So he was over there the whole time.

[971] and you know there's all these things that were going on they were telling me don't you know you can come over and they talk to me and I said I really didn't want to make a decision now because I want to win the Olympics and all this kind of stuff I don't want to be bothered by coaching right now so so he said fine take your time so all of a sudden he's getting reports though because this guy comes in and watch his practice and so on and so forth and I don't know this though and nobody knows it at Ames.

[972] So it's kind of interesting.

[973] So they get me to, he's got a report back home.

[974] So all of a sudden he calls me, he says, you know, what do you think?

[975] I said, well, you said I didn't have to know until after the Olympics.

[976] And he goes, well, just give me an inkling.

[977] I said, I really don't know.

[978] And so he says, okay.

[979] I want to call you back, though, but.

[980] You know, go ahead, just whatever you're doing.

[981] He waited like three days, called me back, and told me to take it or leave it.

[982] And I had no idea.

[983] I hadn't even thought about it.

[984] Well, little did I know.

[985] And he was getting reports every day about me. And so I was getting good reports.

[986] But little did I know that this guy was also, and the guy was the head coach, was working with my mom and dad.

[987] Oh, no. Not from their point of view, but visits, visits, visits.

[988] visits and guess what all my friends were getting visits from these guys phone calls visits they were doing their homework because when they called me and said take it or leave it i said i i can't tell you they said what you're going to take it or leave it you have to know by tomorrow so guess what i do i call my mom and dad and i called my dad my dad i said dad he put this pressure on me he said i have to take it by tomorrow what should I do dad he kind of hesitates and he goes take it I said take it put mom on the phone I said mom I'm in this position and she goes yeah I know what it is I go you know she goes take it I said no I'm I'll call you later so I call my friends and I call my friends and they all said take it you gotta hold it But I had no idea what was going on.

[989] So the next day I called and took, the next day, I had no choice.

[990] I hadn't even thought about it.

[991] And so I thought I was being an idiot and I'd not taking it because everybody told me to take it.

[992] So I took it.

[993] And then Coach Nichols found out about it.

[994] He got upset and he came up because I was visiting home that weekend in Waterloo, Iowa.

[995] And so he said, had you signed anything?

[996] And I said, no. he said, well, if you haven't signed anything, just turn it down.

[997] Well, I had already committed verbally, so I took it.

[998] But what I didn't realize is, and I said, I'll be back.

[999] I'll be back next year, you know, there's no way I'm going to stay over there.

[1000] But what I forgot, and I didn't understand, it's just like me with my teams, that I was the kind of the leaders on the teams, really liked the kids on the teams, and I had an effect on them.

[1001] They had effect on me. They helped me or drink beer, maybe.

[1002] But, you know, it was one of these things that that once you realize something and you don't really know what to do, you just kind of go for help again.

[1003] And when I went for help, I told them, because I was getting ready for the Olympics, I told them, okay, I'll take it.

[1004] But yet I didn't really think.

[1005] So anyway, so I go to the first day of practice at Iowa, and I actually liked it.

[1006] I mean, I liked the kids.

[1007] I liked them.

[1008] And that's what you don't really realize.

[1009] You don't really realize how you're going to fit in to get there.

[1010] And I said after like three or four practices, I said, you guys are great.

[1011] You guys are good.

[1012] You're as good as I've been around state championship high school teams.

[1013] I've been around college teams.

[1014] I've been around in the summer.

[1015] I go to these Olympic training camps.

[1016] And I said, you guys are really good but they didn't know it they didn't know it they just were good but didn't know it whereas all these other guys were good and knew it so the so the head coach curdlemyer he goes to me he goes what do you think what kind of plan should we be on this is after I committed and I came over and we were coaching for about a month and he came we were in the same office and he goes what kind of plan should we be on I said I think we um I think he actually said this to me. He goes, I think we should make a four -year plan.

[1017] By the end of the fourth year that we should be winning Big Ten in national titles.

[1018] I looked at him.

[1019] I said, are you nuts?

[1020] We're going to win this year.

[1021] I said, I've been around good wrestling.

[1022] These guys are good.

[1023] He goes, well, there's more to it than just being a good wrestler.

[1024] He's saying that to you.

[1025] Oh, this is the head guy.

[1026] I know, but still, you're Dan Gable.

[1027] Yeah, but not then, not the coach.

[1028] People didn't know it's going to be a good coach.

[1029] Yeah, but still, you understand wrestling.

[1030] People tell me today that when I came over as an athlete, they said, we never thought you could be a good coach.

[1031] People tell me that today, and they said, we sure found out wrong, didn't we?

[1032] So you got to remember, that's the beginning of my coaching.

[1033] I understand that, but don't you think part of what being a coach is is inspiring the athletes, and there is no one that's going to be more inspiration.

[1034] to an athlete than someone who is literally one of the greatest of all time at the sport there's a thing about athletes when they're in the presence of greatness it inspires them to raise their own level when you're in the presence of someone who has done what you you aspire to do and they're at the you know they're they're one of those people that's achieved what you aspire to achieve and they're one of the legends of the sport, that alone is very valuable.

[1035] It's incredibly valuable because for athletes, they live and die in their own mind.

[1036] You know, there's physical ability, which is a huge component, but a lot of guys have physical ability.

[1037] There's a lot of good genetics when you get to a top team or a top, when you get to, whether it's mixed martial arts fighters or boxers or whatever, there's a lot of really good athletes.

[1038] but when someone can be inspirational when someone is like you know if you're getting coached if you're a boxer and getting coached by Marvin Hagler that means something you know it's there's more to it than just the technical aspects of them showing you how to how to succeed there's something about having a guy like you as a coach it's insanely valuable to an athlete i mean you can't you can't put a value on it because it's it's inspirational it's fuel you know I agree totally but you remember when I talked about the key to the door and then all of a sudden I had to be successful before others even even though they well I didn't really have any credentials at that time as a coach no as an athlete even that sophomore year I had won anything so I can see why they didn't jump on board I did have credentials as an athlete coming into into coaching but what's you write down i'm going to tell you the story here so the story is so we're now at practice i'm running practice curdle mire's in there with me he's running practice but he's the head but he's being my assistant in the room and we're only there for a couple we've only been there for a week or two and a security guy comes in to practice and when he comes in a practice, he called me over, or he called Kirtlemyr over, and then they called me over, and they talked to us.

[1039] And he said that there's been a gas leak in a pipe in the building, and we are going around telling everybody this, that's here working out, that they have the right to know this, and that they can leave or should leave if they want to.

[1040] And I said, well, I look at Gary, and I said, we better get the heck out of here because we don't want to you get blown up or anything you know gas leak he said i said is it really dangerous he goes no danger we've already fixed the problem it was just a leak we had a valve we shut it off it's okay but they're making us do this so you got the choice stay or go and i looked at curdomar i said we're not going we're not going we're staying but you still got to ask you got to tell athletes.

[1041] They can go if they want.

[1042] I said, no, they won't leave.

[1043] Curta Meyer looked to me, like, funny, because he'd been around.

[1044] He'd known to you guys.

[1045] But we had recruited eight new athletes, but they were recruited with me as the assistant and me in the conversation.

[1046] So we went, pulled the team apart and said, guys, here's the situation.

[1047] Now, we've been only in two or three weeks into practice.

[1048] Gas League, we don't have the right to keep you here if you want to leave no danger security guy no danger right no danger coaches but we can tell you that if they want to leave they can leave i said okay okay guys nobody's going to leave right the only eight athletes left were the freshmen that we had recruited the other 24 got up walked and i yelled guys where are you going coach we get a chance chance to get out of practice.

[1049] Oh, no. See, that's what I was dealing with that.

[1050] I didn't understand as a coach.

[1051] Never in my life had I been around non -championship teams, whether it be high school or college or the Olympic type state.

[1052] So this was new to me. And Kurt Meyer looked at me like he was a teaching moment for me. It was a teaching moment.

[1053] And it was kind of like those guys that didn't show up until I proved that I won.

[1054] So once we started winning a little bit more, once some of these freshmen started making varsity and all that kind of stuff, these guys, they would have stayed, some of them, not all of them.

[1055] And, you know, it's a process.

[1056] And the Kirtlemyer goes to me, the coach, he says, you know, Gable, we're on a, like I said, we're on a four -year plan to win the nationals.

[1057] And I looked at him and I said, we'll win it this year.

[1058] And he said, I think you better, you know, that's a great goal, but it's going to take a while.

[1059] So first year we had one champ, and we hadn't had a champ for a while, but we didn't win.

[1060] We got fifth, I think.

[1061] Do you think the issue was the fact that these athletes that had already been there had been accustomed to a lower level of tree?

[1062] Absolutely.

[1063] Absolutely.

[1064] Yeah.

[1065] Yeah.

[1066] And they really hadn't had the success.

[1067] And, you know, and wrestling practice is hard.

[1068] I'm going to tell you something about Jiu -Jitsu.

[1069] There's one team, the Hens O 'Gracy team out of New York City, that is they dominate, in particular the guys that are coached by this guy named John Donahir, and they were in town this past weekend for a jujitsu match.

[1070] There's a guy named Gordon Ryan.

[1071] He's the pound -for -pound greatest of all time.

[1072] He has a hard time finding matches, because he's a guy.

[1073] Not only does he submit people, but he tells, he made a, let me show you something.

[1074] He was competing against this guy named Wagner Rocha, Wagner Hocha, and Wagner is a top -level jujitsu guy.

[1075] He's a little smaller than Gordon, but he's still a top -level guy.

[1076] He's an elite Brazilian jiu -jitsu black belt.

[1077] And Gordon is competing against him and puts in an envelope.

[1078] how he's going to beat him and he gives it to the commentators before the match and he says open this after the match and then he puts a triangle and he says who's next and he taps him with a triangle in the match I was there it was amazing he just completely dominated him brutalized him waited for his time and then tapped him with a triangle afterwards I take John Donaheur and Craig Jones and Lex Friedman, you know Lex, we all go out to dinner.

[1079] And we talk, and I said to John Donahir, we were talking about how they train and what they do.

[1080] And he was telling me about athletes that come and train with them and they go through one brutal training session and he says, I'll see you tomorrow.

[1081] And he goes, you guys train like this two days in a row?

[1082] And he goes, yeah, two days in a row.

[1083] And he goes, so some of them come the next day and some of them don't.

[1084] and the ones will come the next day he goes okay i'll see you tomorrow and he goes you guys train like this three days in a row and he goes we train like this seven days in a row i go you train seven days in a row and he goes seven days in row i go you don't believe in rest days and he goes no he goes he goes he goes if you're really tired train light you have an active recovery this team is dominating jiu jutsu but i say dominating i mean it's an understatement guys are living in Puerto Rico right now to train with these guys because they left New York City, Dan, because New York City has these draconian lockdown laws that are similar to Los Angeles where they shut down all the jiu -jitsu gyms.

[1085] They shut down everything.

[1086] They shut down restaurants, comedy clubs, and so people are trying to scramble and figure out how to survive.

[1087] So these guys out of the Don of Her Death Squad at a Henzhou Gracie school, they moved to Puerto Rico.

[1088] They moved to a fucking island in the middle of the ocean so that they can.

[1089] could train jiu -jitsu and compete and people are flying and moving to Puerto Rico to train with them but when they get there and they find out it's seven days in a week there's no there's no rest days if the rest day is he train lighter like if you just go there and just don't don't try as hard if you need a day off but we'll see you tomorrow and these guys are dominating and there's a thing about that that you see in wrestling that just a lot of people don't want to accept the workload they don't want to accept the workload that's required to be elite you know that better than anybody well said actually because you know I'm an everyday guy I don't miss a day seven days a week seven days a week the only time I've ever missed I was in the hospital on my back and it couldn't move and then I was probably trying to crawl out and do push -ups or something.

[1090] If I had my hips getting replaced or something, or I'd have a rope or I'd pull myself up or something.

[1091] And to this day, to this day you still do that?

[1092] I have seven days a week.

[1093] Seven days.

[1094] But here's a thing.

[1095] I'm the master in recovery.

[1096] So what you mentioned is what I'm good at.

[1097] obviously I work extremely hard or I have and do and will and I won't let up on that but I also know how to adjust a little bit now when science didn't tell me and I just went with what science was and I and now it's different I'm sorry because I I messed up but I went with the rules at that time but if there's something that changes and that's better, I'll go with that.

[1098] And so to me, it's like I'm, I know if I'm really sore, I know I can warm up long enough where I will not be sore.

[1099] It might take an extra hour.

[1100] So if I'm unbelievably sore, I'm going to warm up for an extra hour.

[1101] Two hours of warm up.

[1102] Well, whatever it is, whatever it takes to where I feel good.

[1103] I'm going to get rid of my soreness.

[1104] I also know that when practice is over, mentally thinking about the practice, and physically recovering has a lot to do with what you do.

[1105] And I spend at least with my athletes and myself at least an hour, at least after practice is over, recovering before leaving the building.

[1106] What do you do for recovering?

[1107] Mostly heat, mostly ice, mostly massage.

[1108] You're a big sauna guy, right?

[1109] Big sauna guy, yeah.

[1110] He is well.

[1111] I love it.

[1112] I do it every day.

[1113] I do it every day, and lately I haven't been able to do it for about a week because the place I'm at in Florida right now, they're putting the new one in.

[1114] So it's kind of being constructed.

[1115] What temperature do you like to do with that?

[1116] Whatever it is, as long as it's hot.

[1117] But I really like, I like some water over the rocks.

[1118] And I like probably a minimum 170, but I could go 220.

[1119] I mean, I can do whatever.

[1120] You know, I've been in asana.

[1121] I accidentally walked in one at 3 .30 one time.

[1122] 330.

[1123] Well, I accidentally, because it was one of these wood burners, and I didn't have a, and I didn't look at the thing, and I jumped in there, it almost caught me on fire.

[1124] But I turned around and got out, and I let it go down to 260 before I got into it.

[1125] 260.

[1126] But I would, I don't.

[1127] That's roast beef.

[1128] No, I know.

[1129] So I don't, where you like it.

[1130] It depends on how much time I have, but I'm comfortable with 170.

[1131] I'm comfortable with 180, 190.

[1132] I'm comfortable if it's really, you know, if I put more water on it, I can go in 165 or something.

[1133] But I do not want to walk in asana and have to work to sweat.

[1134] Did you learn?

[1135] So I want to recover.

[1136] Did you learn this from foreign athletes in other countries?

[1137] I learned it from a guy that I trained with from my hometown named Bob Buzzard, who was about six or seven years older than me, who was a great wrestler at Iowa State.

[1138] He was on the Olympic team, too.

[1139] He was a local kid, but, you know, at that time, he probably, you know, he showed me, he took me into one of them and showed me how, I think we've used it for losing weight then, but over time, eventually we learned how to use it for recovery, you know, because once you go, done with practice, and you go to heat right away if you want to, you don't have to do anything.

[1140] You're just sweating.

[1141] You don't have to do anything.

[1142] and it actually takes out the lactic acid in your muscles from a hard workout and makes you recover quicker.

[1143] But you don't just combine that with heat alone.

[1144] Now you've got to go to cold.

[1145] So you go to cold shower.

[1146] You know, you go to cold shower.

[1147] And then probably go back into another heat again.

[1148] And you go back into cold.

[1149] And I'm telling you, you know, after we get done practice in Olympic training, a lot of times I would come back.

[1150] I'd be the last guy to leave practice.

[1151] And I'd get there after everybody had been done eating and everything.

[1152] and I'd go eat and I'd be about an hour after I'd be eating and I'd say, guys, I'd feel pretty good.

[1153] I'm going to go out for a hard run.

[1154] Anybody want to go with me?

[1155] Gable, we're exhausted.

[1156] And even the guys that won the gold medals with me and stuff like that, they just couldn't figure out how I could recover so quick.

[1157] But none of them were there setting with me that hour in recovery in the hot, in the cold, back in the hot, back in the cold, getting a massage.

[1158] You know, they might have been getting a massage, but they would, you know, they probably skipped some of that stuff.

[1159] Yeah.

[1160] Well, actually, the suffering was probably whoever's getting beat up on the mat, you know.

[1161] But then it seems to me like if you have that temperature right and that humidity right, you know, it's just unbelievable relaxing.

[1162] And there's proof.

[1163] It's proof in the pudding right now that you can look it up.

[1164] And they got all these studies.

[1165] Before it was all anecdotal.

[1166] There's no anecdotal anymore.

[1167] It's proof.

[1168] They do studies.

[1169] Yeah, it's legit.

[1170] Yeah.

[1171] So do you do ice baths as well?

[1172] Yes, yes.

[1173] I do those.

[1174] I love doing them in lakes.

[1175] I have a minute.

[1176] Every place I go in my life, except right now at the Florida condo, they don't have a son.

[1177] They got one there.

[1178] It's just not put together yet, but it's going to be put together.

[1179] But every place I go, I have an aerodyne.

[1180] That's a bike that, you know, that's good.

[1181] I have, because my joints, it's too hard to run.

[1182] I do more damage.

[1183] You've got to be smart, you know, as you're getting older.

[1184] And I got a workout room, and I usually always have sanas.

[1185] In my, I got a fishing cabin up in northeast Iowa.

[1186] I got a sauna, a wood -burning sauna right on the river.

[1187] And I got an aerodyne there, and I got weights, and I got a chinum bar.

[1188] So I go to my other, I go to Minnesota cabin.

[1189] I got a little garage by the lake that's got a, It's got an aerodyne, it's got a set of weights.

[1190] I got a big lake there to jump in.

[1191] I got a hot sauna right on the lake, a wood burner.

[1192] I don't go anywhere without it.

[1193] I do a lot of homework before I travel.

[1194] You know, I do have a swimming pool here.

[1195] This is why I'm this morning.

[1196] I'm going to work out when I leave here.

[1197] I'd love to jump in a hot sauna or steam, but they don't have one because it's shut down right now on just these two days.

[1198] But I already checked it out.

[1199] But I can handle it.

[1200] I'll just, you know, do a little more working.

[1201] But every day?

[1202] Every day.

[1203] Seven days a week.

[1204] Seven days a week.

[1205] What do you think about people that don't think you should do that?

[1206] Well, I do it to where I don't overdo it anymore.

[1207] I may have overdone it at times when I didn't know better, or that was my philosophy.

[1208] You know, sometimes you got to overdo things, but you really don't want to do something that's going to hurt you.

[1209] So, you know, if I had to do it all over again, I'd have that same attitude, but I'd be more educated.

[1210] and I would do things differently.

[1211] In fact, I coached differently at the end of my career as I did at the beginning of my career.

[1212] Some of these days that I took these kids up on Carverhawk Arena, and it's about a quarter mile along the top of the arena, and it's concrete.

[1213] And I ran the hell out of them.

[1214] And I ran the stairs, 44 steps, concrete.

[1215] Then I did it again the next day.

[1216] I wouldn't do it the next day anymore.

[1217] If I worked you really hard in some, something, I would give you more recovery time to make sure that in the long run, you're going to be healthier.

[1218] I wouldn't cut the learning time.

[1219] I wouldn't cut down the actual effort when I do it, but I would give you the more science to make sure you can last longevity.

[1220] But you only go with what you know.

[1221] And you know what you know right now.

[1222] If you stay educated, things change a lot.

[1223] I'd be a lot healthier now with my knees if the doctors didn't take all the cartilage out of my knees because one year they said there was no function in cartilage and I said but what's the recovery time?

[1224] Well if we take the cartilage out it won't be very long.

[1225] You can think about six weeks but if we tie it back down this was in 1973.

[1226] They took the cartilage out of your knees?

[1227] Well yeah.

[1228] You say that like it's normal.

[1229] At that back in 1970s, back in 1970s.

[1230] In 1973, there was no function.

[1231] At the University of Iowa hospitals, there was no function yet.

[1232] So the next year...

[1233] That's what they thought.

[1234] Yeah, so they didn't...

[1235] Well, they just didn't know.

[1236] Yeah.

[1237] That's crazy.

[1238] Yeah.

[1239] So in 1974, I go back with the other knee, and I go, well, you're just going to take this one out, too?

[1240] Because it hadn't affected me yet.

[1241] And this was why you're still competing.

[1242] No, I'm done.

[1243] I'm done.

[1244] So I couldn't.

[1245] I stopped after 72, basically.

[1246] Okay.

[1247] So, you know, so...

[1248] So your knees have been destroyed just from training.

[1249] Well, I don't know.

[1250] they weren't too bad because I just kept, you know.

[1251] Well, they're taking your cartilage out.

[1252] Well, they took them out on one side, but, but not meniscus, just the cartilage?

[1253] Well, that's what I meant meniscus.

[1254] Oh.

[1255] That's what I meant.

[1256] Okay.

[1257] Okay, the meniscus.

[1258] Okay.

[1259] They took the meniscus out, but they can also tie it down.

[1260] When there's a tear, if you tie it down, it repairs itself.

[1261] But it takes instead of six weeks or four weeks, it takes three months to four months to heal.

[1262] And I wanted, and I, and I, and I, and I, and I, asked them and they told me that it was no difference they didn't know so i said well give me the simplest well we'll just take it out so the next year had no meniscus at all on the right side on my outside of my knee so so then they said okay i came in the next year and i go well just take it out like because i want to get out of here and i want to get healthy quick they go well we can tie that down in the long run it'd be a lot better i go wait a minute i was here a year ago well we just discovered that was a new discovery this year oh boy i said whoa okay i'll I'll do that.

[1263] But, but it's so, you know, it's just a matter of when you do it.

[1264] Do the tie down work?

[1265] Yeah.

[1266] My left knee is pretty good.

[1267] My right knee is hurt me right now.

[1268] I got a baker's cyst behind it right now.

[1269] And, but it's not that bad, but it causes me to.

[1270] Have you ever thought about getting it resurfaced?

[1271] You know, I don't know yet.

[1272] I'm not, it's not that bad.

[1273] Yeah.

[1274] I haven't jumped.

[1275] You know, when I jumped out of bed and I couldn't walk anymore, well, I'm not there yet.

[1276] with my knees and even a doctor told me that about a year ago the same doctor did my hips I went into because I was a little concerned and he goes you know I remember when you came in you're not there yet he said you can wait a little longer I think there might be science every year is a little better yeah little shades so yeah longer you can wait the better especially medical science as long as long as you don't aren't in extreme pain right you know I can handle I can handle it so have you ever gotten any stem cell shots or anything like that?

[1277] I think so.

[1278] You think so?

[1279] I think I got those on my shoulders before.

[1280] Your shoulders bad, too?

[1281] Didn't I tell you I had 22 surgeries?

[1282] No, you left that out.

[1283] You told me he had six hips.

[1284] Yeah, well, I had six hips and I had four, so I had four new hips.

[1285] Yeah.

[1286] But the doctor said last year, my hips had been in for eight, ten years now, the second set.

[1287] Yeah.

[1288] And he said, they look really good.

[1289] Oh, that's nice.

[1290] But, you know, but I kept wrestling.

[1291] and pounding on the first set.

[1292] And I didn't, I adjusted.

[1293] Smarter.

[1294] So even after the hips, you're running and doing everything else?

[1295] You were at the time?

[1296] I did.

[1297] I did for the next eight years.

[1298] And then you had to get them replaced?

[1299] Yeah, again, yeah.

[1300] Well, they're better with those too, right?

[1301] Yeah, they have different product.

[1302] Yeah.

[1303] Definitely different products, all that.

[1304] 22 shoulder surgeries?

[1305] No, no. I mean, if you add them up, you know, you got, I got five, six cuts on my knees.

[1306] I have six hip, four hips.

[1307] I have two or three lip surgeries.

[1308] You know, you know what it was?

[1309] I didn't wear a mouthpiece.

[1310] All I had to wear a mouthpiece.

[1311] I would never have had my hip on my mouth.

[1312] But that was, you know, and I finally after about five years of coaching, they said, I think you should wear a mouthpiece.

[1313] You know, and so then nobody gets hurt anymore.

[1314] Yeah.

[1315] You know, especially when it really came out was when the blood was being bad or something.

[1316] I can't remember what that was, because you bite your tongue a lot.

[1317] Right.

[1318] So the mouthpieces really prevent a lot of that stuff.

[1319] So in rustling, headgear, and mouthpiece are really critical.

[1320] They really are.

[1321] Yes.

[1322] They really are.

[1323] I have a lot of friends of Jiu -Zit -to that they love having cauliflower ear.

[1324] I don't know if, you may love it, but you know what, it's...

[1325] I don't have it.

[1326] I've always worn headgear.

[1327] Yeah.

[1328] So I always wore headgear.

[1329] It messes with the way you hear.

[1330] It does.

[1331] It does.

[1332] Yeah.

[1333] Yeah.

[1334] And a little bit, they stick out once in a while, too.

[1335] You know, a lot, they like it because it looks cool.

[1336] A lot of guys do.

[1337] Well, they think it's your mark, your trademark.

[1338] Yes.

[1339] But you know what?

[1340] Some girls don't like them.

[1341] Those girls are useless.

[1342] Okay, okay.

[1343] My wife doesn't mind it.

[1344] I'm sure she doesn't.

[1345] But, I mean, there's a function to the shape of your ear.

[1346] It's like it helps you hear better.

[1347] I don't want to have problems hearing.

[1348] No, you don't.

[1349] I have a little bit of call.

[1350] flower like in little spots and stuff but I just think it's uh there's a reason why your ears design that way yeah no you're right you're right no I think a headgear for wrestling yeah pretty damn good and you can't wear a mouthpiece is important too yeah and you can't wear a headgear in the Olympic wrestling well unless you get a doctor's order that's just competing that that makes sense to me I understand that I want to talk to you about the difference between the way the Russians approached wrestling versus the way the Americans approached wrestling because I know that you are a big fan of the Russians and their technique.

[1351] And when did you realize that they had a different approach?

[1352] How do you feel about that?

[1353] I was just a goer.

[1354] I mean, at the beginning, you know, I just, a tough guy, you know, just throw the ball out there and turn me loose.

[1355] In fact, in college, that's kind of how we train.

[1356] we had enough good athletes so we could just wrestle each other we didn't have to have structure and all that kind of stuff and i'll tell you once you started watching once you got a little bit and watched a practice from the russians and the coaches you realize they were technical crazy when did you first see that i don't think i saw it until after i was done with college can you believe that really yeah i mean i was around him a little bit i went to um well i went to the 1970 world championships and in Canada.

[1357] They were in Canada, and I was like a spy again.

[1358] I was the spy this time because I was an alternate to Bobby Douglas.

[1359] And so what I did was all these foreign countries that worked out, I went to the practices and watched them.

[1360] They thought I was a person that was like a keeper there.

[1361] They didn't know that there's a little guy spying on you.

[1362] I kind of learned that from a guy spying on me from hiring me at Iowa.

[1363] later on, I guess, too.

[1364] But, you know, so I would follow this guy.

[1365] I'd follow the teams around and watch them.

[1366] And they were really, really technically oriented, strategically oriented.

[1367] They didn't do a lot of as much conditioning as we did and that type of stuff.

[1368] So they were very, very much science, very much a lot of science.

[1369] And I don't think I really, again, I lost to Owings.

[1370] That really helped me become more of a guy that, pay attention to details, pay attention to details, coaching details.

[1371] Don't get caught up on this.

[1372] And I also kind of says, maybe I've got to get better too.

[1373] Maybe I've got to get better.

[1374] So when I went to these world championships that summer in Canada, I really followed a lot of the top wrestlers.

[1375] and sometimes I follow them right after matches right into their locker rooms or right back where their team was staying and they just thought I was the guy that was there and they didn't really know that I was doing spying and I was just surprised that you know how things were different a lot than how I was myself trained but I know that when I lost that match in Owings I didn't know how to finish a match even though I didn't know how to start it on that one because I wasn't ready but I knew that I didn't know how to strategically finish a match.

[1376] How so?

[1377] What do you mean by that?

[1378] Well, I was ahead, and I could have just kind of maybe stalled it out, but I didn't know how to stall.

[1379] So there's actually an art in stalling, even though you don't like the word.

[1380] When I was in the finals of the worlds and the Olympics, I could have probably scored more.

[1381] But you're taking a risk, because the only way you're going to lose, They had rules.

[1382] You could actually lose.

[1383] You could get beat, but you could actually lose and win and stuff like that.

[1384] There's just, it's not so much that way now, but back when I wrestled, there were.

[1385] So, you know, I needed to not put myself in any danger at the end of a match to make sure I would win.

[1386] So it's kind of like, okay, how do you tie a guy up where he can't move?

[1387] You don't necessarily have to shoot underneath him.

[1388] You don't have to do holds on him.

[1389] You don't have to risk for scoring, but you've got to tie him up.

[1390] It's kind of like learn defense.

[1391] I didn't really have much of a defense until I got beat by Owings.

[1392] And then I realized that I got to learn how to finish and I got to have a better defense and how to score from a defense because I was just offensive -minded.

[1393] And I learned by watching these Russians that they have really good defenses.

[1394] and so that really shuts their area down for scoring on them and especially during the end of the match because if you're going to end and you're going to win a match pretty easily but if you take risk you could lose, why do I do that?

[1395] Right.

[1396] So I actually, the last minute or two of the match in my world final match, it was in Bulgaria, it was outside in a soccer stadium.

[1397] There was 12 ,000 Bulgarians rooting for the Bulgarian and I just tied him up for about a minute to win the match easy.

[1398] I was ahead eight to three, and so I didn't take any risk, and I won solid.

[1399] So in the Olympic finals, the only way he could beat me, he could actually, he could take me down and still beat me, but the only way he could beat me, he had to pin me to beat me. And so when I'm up in the last minute or two, I just kind of tied him up and stayed with him and didn't worry about too much for me scoring.

[1400] so there's strategy that I didn't really know at the beginning and the technique part too so you know in wrestling you can shoot you know you don't know how to do moves from one side but this is what's crazy about wrestling you could have 10 moves but if you did the same moves from the other side of the body you got 20 moves so you definitely need to know how to score from both sides of the body and you could be better at one side, but if you only are one -sided, you are, what happens if a guy comes out and he's all a one -sided wrestler, just the side that you're not good at?

[1401] You're in trouble.

[1402] So, wrestlers, you know, we have to be, you know, we have to be aware of that.

[1403] And you have to, like, I shoot a high -crotch really good to one side.

[1404] I have a high -cross, the other side, not quite as good.

[1405] But I have a single leg the other side that's really good, you know, that type of thing.

[1406] Or I have a fireman carry to this side, and I have a two -on -one -foot sweep to this side.

[1407] So I've got to balance of how I wrestle because you just don't know what you're coming up against and you never know where you're going to be in a flurry to be able to score.

[1408] What did you see about the way the Russians trained?

[1409] What was different?

[1410] They were already good.

[1411] They had their sports schools back in the day and they had the right people in their sport.

[1412] Anybody can wrestle in America and anybody could wrestle in Russia but chances are you were actually handpicked to be for that sport.

[1413] how it was at the beginning and it's not quite as much that way now but i did see that everyone was pretty much they looked alike you know there was a few that kind of broke that wave and and showed that they can also go the other way too uh but what i noticed was they had a lot of the same moves everybody and they all had the same stance and you could kind of prepare for them once you If you prepare for a Russian, here's what you do.

[1414] Boom, boom, boom, boom.

[1415] If you prepare for American, you don't know what you get.

[1416] Right.

[1417] Which makes it a little harder to prepare, but you might not be as good.

[1418] You just might not be as good because they are damn good.

[1419] Because they have their best athletes in the right sports.

[1420] And sometimes we don't have that.

[1421] We just chose to be honest, we did wrestling was my best sport.

[1422] Even though I did other sports until 10th grade.

[1423] He did swimming until seventh grade, did baseball, football, all through seventh, eighth, and ninth grade, along with wrestling.

[1424] Played basketball, even at the Y, you know, in some events.

[1425] And it's just they hand -picked people and put them in their best, what they can do best at.

[1426] So that's why they're talented.

[1427] They're talent.

[1428] They had some talent.

[1429] So they were good to begin with.

[1430] They were people that were designed for wrestling or built for wrestling.

[1431] But what was the difference in the technical aspect of their training as opposed to the way the Americans trained?

[1432] They were technical as hell.

[1433] And by that I mean they would hit solid repetitions of live action with one side and not the other.

[1434] So they would do a lot.

[1435] They might go out and they might perform a live action move 12 times in five.

[1436] three minutes.

[1437] Whereas if we were going one -on -one live, both guys going tough, nobody might not hit a move because we're going tough.

[1438] They, you know, it's called drilling, but it's called live drilling.

[1439] They did a lot more live drilling, and they knew how to do that better than we did.

[1440] We have picked it up pretty damn while now, though.

[1441] Because we learn from them.

[1442] I think so.

[1443] Yeah.

[1444] I think so.

[1445] Yeah.

[1446] And how did they figure it out?

[1447] You know, structure, they have more structure in their system.

[1448] That's just the way it is.

[1449] You walk in their house, and if you talk, the government's listening.

[1450] Back in the day, I'm talking about the communism.

[1451] It goes back to the communism.

[1452] I think still today.

[1453] They might be listening here.

[1454] Well, they're definitely listening to us.

[1455] Well, we're trying to, is not what we're trying to do in America now?

[1456] We're trying to listen to us.

[1457] In America?

[1458] Yes.

[1459] I mean, well, they want to listen to us.

[1460] Yeah, but not surveillance.

[1461] Right.

[1462] Yeah, so we don't want that.

[1463] We don't want that.

[1464] We don't.

[1465] No. I'm very nervous.

[1466] pretty outspoken about that yeah i don't i don't i don't like to uh say much because i don't want get people i like everybody but i certainly don't want to have that kind of scare tactics for no i don't use i don't either and it's that's how it goes as soon as you start listening to people then it becomes an incentive not to talk or you get punished for saying the wrong things and then next thing you know we're living in fucking china it's it's it's a slippery slope it's it's real.

[1467] And the government is supposed to work for the people.

[1468] We're not supposed to work for them.

[1469] They're not supposed to be our dominators.

[1470] You know, I just did a thing on this this week with the government because in 1972 we had the Munich attack.

[1471] The Arabs and Israelis, and so they killed a bunch of people.

[1472] And they had no security at the Olympics.

[1473] But then they opened the door for security.

[1474] And we continued the Olympics, though.

[1475] I was already done.

[1476] But But we continued the Olympics and it finished them off.

[1477] But then in 1980, we boycotted to go into Russia.

[1478] In 1980, Olympics, we're in Moscow.

[1479] And the 1980 U .S. team did not go to the Olympics.

[1480] None of us.

[1481] And because we wanted them to get the hell out of Afghanistan.

[1482] So the government used us sporting people as pawns a little bit.

[1483] So then in 1984, we hosted the Olympics.

[1484] I was the coach.

[1485] I was the coach in 82, but I didn't get to go.

[1486] And I had a hell of a team that we were going to go over there in Russia and win.

[1487] But in 1984, they didn't come, and 12 other countries didn't come up, mostly all communists.

[1488] And so, you know what?

[1489] What good did that do?

[1490] And this week, I just did an editorial.

[1491] I did a column and told them, really didn't do any good because we're thinking about boycotting China.

[1492] Now everybody's got their opinion but I think it showed from 80 and 84 what good did it do and only I think we can do good and so even though and the only sentence that I said that that really said that I wasn't just sports crazy was I said if safety is of concern that we don't go.

[1493] But I mean real, I said real safety.

[1494] That's the word I used, real safety, not just presumed.

[1495] Because we've already shown it before.

[1496] It was more of a pawn that you could use it as a tool, you know, try to get your way in the government.

[1497] And so I said that.

[1498] Well, it came out about a week ago and it made some pretty good news, but they took.

[1499] took that sentence out about safety.

[1500] Can you believe it?

[1501] Why did they do that?

[1502] That was the most important word that I, the sentence I had.

[1503] I kind of hit it in there, and I figured, so it wouldn't be a big deal, but they took that sentence out.

[1504] Do you have a social media account?

[1505] My daughter's do it for me. I don't pay attention to it.

[1506] Well, that's the beautiful thing about social media is that you could put something like that on Instagram, and they couldn't take it down.

[1507] They wouldn't have any say in it.

[1508] Yeah, I'll probably have it.

[1509] have to do that because it's i haven't had the reaction yet i haven't had the reaction yet yeah you'll have to do that you can't trust those people they you know you have to be able to express yourself 100 % on filter they can disagree with you or agree with you that's fine but they can't change your words if they change your words we got a real problem yeah yeah yeah so anyway that's fine did you ever see the documentary icarus no i haven't it's a really interesting documentary by this guy named Brian Fogle and it's all about he uh what what happened was it was a very fortunate documentary in that he was making a documentary about one thing and it became about a different thing he was making a documentary about a bike race uh you know um uh he was doing a bicycle race and he was going to do it clean one year and then he was going to uh get doped up on uh performance enhancing drugs and do it the second year and see what the difference is and And he hired Gregory Wachankov, who is the, he was the head of Russian anti -doping at the time.

[1510] And he was explaining to him what he was going to have to take and how to take it, this and that, along the way while they were doing this.

[1511] So he filmed the first race.

[1512] And then in the year leading up to the second race, the Sochi Olympic scandal happened.

[1513] And Gregory Wichengov was, he was a part of that, where he explained.

[1514] He had to leave the country.

[1515] He escaped and came to America because he was being implicated in this whole scandal where they were taking the urine from the athletes.

[1516] They were opening up these supposedly – there was some container that couldn't be opened, but the Russians had figured out how to open it.

[1517] They would take out the dirty urine and replace it with clean urine.

[1518] So they doped up their entire team.

[1519] And Gregory was explaining how they doped up the entire team.

[1520] Everyone except the figure skaters.

[1521] They found that the figure skaters, when they doped up them, the fine motor skills, there was no benefit, and the females became too manly.

[1522] But it's a fascinating documentary where it shows you the lengths that some countries will go to cheat.

[1523] It's crazy.

[1524] No, it's unbelievable.

[1525] And I think it had, you know, it goes back to that government control, like, you know, a lot too.

[1526] I think, you know, just for sure.

[1527] For sure.

[1528] Because they're a tool.

[1529] The athletes are a tool.

[1530] They felt that sport shows your power.

[1531] Yes.

[1532] You know, and that's the power of the country.

[1533] Yes.

[1534] You know, just how dominant you are.

[1535] You know, so that, you know, it's crazy.

[1536] So, in fact, I, there was a movie that I was just in by chance about a little over a year ago.

[1537] It's called The Last Champion.

[1538] And it's by Glenn Withrow.

[1539] Was it a film or a documentary?

[1540] No, it's a film.

[1541] It's an actual film.

[1542] And it just got kind of.

[1543] but it went it's it's it's been on google it's been it's been around but it's a little bit it's got a little bit of a uh it's about a guy that uh that was a champion wrestler and the act and i and i was they brought me in at the end just because somebody looked at the rustling and they said it wasn't very good and so they just said can you come in and look and see what we can do with the help the wrestling part of it so i when i flew out to i don't remember where I flew out to, but I think it was vague.

[1544] No, Dallas, actually.

[1545] Actually, I flew into Dallas, and they shot it there.

[1546] And at a high school or an auditorium, and I watched the wrestling, and yeah, it needed cleaned up.

[1547] And so we cleaned up the wrestling.

[1548] But then the guy, when I was there, he said, why don't we make this guy because he got kicked out of the Olympics after he won him by steroids in America.

[1549] and why don't we make him one of your kids?

[1550] And you're doing the announcing, and you guys will meet again.

[1551] So it's a redemption story, and it's really good, actually.

[1552] And it's been out for it.

[1553] A lot of people have really liked it.

[1554] And he's in negotiation now to have overseas rights and all this kind of stuff.

[1555] Glenn Withrow is, I think, has I got the last champion up there?

[1556] Yes.

[1557] Yeah, that's the name of the movie.

[1558] But it's about exactly that.

[1559] and how a guy comes home, a small little town in the United States, and I'm not sure it's on the Pacific coast somewhere like maybe Washington, I think it was, where he came home, and the town hadn't seen him for years because his mom died, so he come back to sell her house.

[1560] And when he comes back to sell her house, believe it or not, the wrestling coach dies, and they want to.

[1561] want him to stay and be the coach.

[1562] So he actually stays and bes the coach.

[1563] And it gets into conflicts and all of a sudden he comes through with this conflict, you know, and makes it makes it right.

[1564] But it's a really a good movie, and it's about exactly that.

[1565] You know, it's just because, you know, in our sport, or any sport, and there's this book out.

[1566] And I couldn't, but I don't know what the name of the book was, but it said, like, overseas in these places, like, because it takes you out of poverty, it takes you out of being nothing to somebody.

[1567] They say that, like, give me whatever.

[1568] And the statistics were, like, unbelievable that how many people would say they would take a pill that would win them the right to win a gold medal in the Olympics.

[1569] but yet a year within a year after you won those gold medal you died and they had a statistical thing on it and it was like most people still take the damn pill wow but i think it's the where you actually took the pole at it was again it was this pole in this area of the world that probably needs hell deeply impoverished yeah yeah that's that is a thing about the Olympics in other countries is that it's a way out of poverty for some people.

[1570] Whereas in our world, in our country, it's almost in some ways a way into poverty.

[1571] These athletes, like, they're dedicating their whole life in many ways.

[1572] You've got your guys like Michael Phelps who go on and wins gold medals and has all these endorsements and becomes wealthy because of that.

[1573] But how many athletes don't?

[1574] I mean, they dedicate this an enormous amount of time to a sport.

[1575] It doesn't pay off for them financially at all, but yet the Olympics reaps incredible rewards for it.

[1576] They make billions of dollars every time the Olympics rolls around.

[1577] The networks, these different countries, the windfall is incredible, but not for the athletes.

[1578] It's a weird scam in a lot of ways because it's an amateur sport, and it is an amateur sport, but only for the people that are the most important for the athletes.

[1579] It's not amateur for the networks.

[1580] It's professional.

[1581] There's a lot of money involved, a lot of money.

[1582] money does not get distributed to the athletes for the most part well it didn't go to me at all like i said i had to pay my dad had to pay 500 bucks or me to wrestle in the Olympics but you know i i'm a kind of guy again a little bit different between me and you again you know you're you're pretty hardcore on this stuff but for me it's like i do it i look over time how i can do well and so you know it's like it's like uh uh like i'm i've been hired with asics for How many years?

[1583] I said, 1978, so 22 and 21, 43 years.

[1584] And I've been having shoes with him for 35 years and still selling shoes.

[1585] I just signed another four -year contract with him.

[1586] And I'm hoping to go another four years after that.

[1587] And so, but at the beginning, I didn't get anything, you know.

[1588] And so, and I start, and I signed my first, my coaching job was 13 ,000 a year.

[1589] You know, and so what's funny about this.

[1590] that is that wasn't going to make it for me because I got married and my my I don't handle any money I don't like I don't like to get caught that mental that drives me crazy I got enough of issues so my wife's saying well I don't know if we can pay these bills on this new house that we're living in and so I remember my dad when I said my went to the YMCA I remember I got a job down there my and my dad said I'm going to start you some kind of a plan when when you get your first job and I was 10 years old and so I went to my dad when I was 29 and I said dad I said we're hurting for money a little bit but didn't you tell me that you started be some kind of a plan in my life when I was young he goes yeah I did I go is there any money in that plan dad I'm 29 I'm been I'm actually I'm 28 27 27 28 first year head coach bought a new house I'm married probably got me one kid and I said he said I'll call you back So he calls me back in about 15 minutes.

[1591] He said, yeah, I just pulled out the latest what they send me. He said, I should have this sent to you anyway.

[1592] No, because, you know, I just never turn.

[1593] It's in your name, and I just get it to me. Because when you made it up, you were 10 years old.

[1594] All they did was start taking money out of your payment checks on the YMCA.

[1595] Then you went to work for me, and then you went to work for Martins and Construction, they went to work for a wheeler lumber company, you know, in all those years.

[1596] Then you went to work for the University of Iowa, or Iowa State as a graduate assistant.

[1597] Then you went to work for the University of Iowa.

[1598] And so I said, well, is there any money in it?

[1599] And so it's been, it was 19 years of accumulating what they could take out of that to put in a retirement plan.

[1600] And this is 1977.

[1601] That's a long time ago.

[1602] And so the figure he gave me was a lot of money to me. It was $250 ,000.

[1603] That's a lot of money.

[1604] Yeah.

[1605] And I just looked at my, I said, thanks, Dad, that's all I need to know.

[1606] I mean, I'm good.

[1607] Don't even worry about it.

[1608] I just needed that.

[1609] I could get by with what was going to happen, but I knew I had this money.

[1610] But again, my dad, he took, you know, he helped me, you know.

[1611] And that's what is so important and so valuable for me is that I had so many good things that that happened to me even though you can't say a murder is a good thing but you turn them into somehow not good things but for betterment you turn that guilt and that anger into something amazing so you know it's just like it's just like right now you know it's over all these years I've been working for ASICs for you know I got a beer we're drinking beer called Gable you know it's I got a nutrition gold that's uh but you're dan gable this is the there's so many other athletes i understand i didn't get the money from the you know i get it but i had to go out i get it you got the endorsements but after 35 years of winning you can do some of these things yes yes you can't you got the shoes yeah yeah you can yeah exactly what drives me crazy is that the right but the networks are making so much money no i agree totally it drives me nuts because i think it's a it's a wild scam that athletes aren't compensated, and insane amounts of money are being generated by them competing.

[1612] And I get, there's a purity.

[1613] It's heading more that way.

[1614] Because of people like you, though.

[1615] I hope so.

[1616] No, I'm honest, you know, because, you know, you're talking one way, and a lot of people are listening, and a lot of people here.

[1617] And, you know, some people aren't educated on this stuff.

[1618] It's just not fair.

[1619] That's the problem.

[1620] It's not just that the athletes.

[1621] don't deserve the endorsements.

[1622] They do deserve the endorsements and more.

[1623] They deserve the endorsements if they win.

[1624] They deserve the endorsements if they become someone like Dan Gable.

[1625] But the problem is the networks are making all the fucking money while these people are giving their life to compete.

[1626] And the networks are treating it like a professional sport where they don't have to pay the athletes.

[1627] That's what it is.

[1628] It's not just a regular professional sport either.

[1629] It's the biggest professional sport because it's, international.

[1630] It's a gigantic world event every two years, every two years where they have the Olympic Games.

[1631] It's a gigantic world event.

[1632] And the people that make the most money, the people that broadcast it on television, not the actual athletes.

[1633] You're not broadcasting.

[1634] You're not producing anything.

[1635] The athletes are producing the entertainment.

[1636] The entire reason why people are tuning in is to see exceptional athletes perform.

[1637] They know they've dedicated their life to this they know that there's years and years and years of toil and sweat and grind and here they are and you're going to put a camera on it and because you put a camera on it you're making all the money fuck you that's crazy that's crazy to me that's crazy to me and it's disgusting it doesn't make any sense so you you obviously you have answers for that right well they should they should distribute some of the money that's what i'm saying to the athletes and they but they but they a lot of it okay well the same way they do with the NBA, same way they do with the NFL, there should be money distributed to those athletes.

[1638] And I guarantee you we'll have better athletes because you know in other countries they compensate their athletes.

[1639] You know they compensate their athletes in Russia.

[1640] They compensate their athletes in China, not as well as they should, but they do.

[1641] And a lot of these countries, when you're talking about high -level athletes, they pay them to train and they take care of all their expenses and they make sure that they're properly prepared because they're representing their country.

[1642] In our country, they rely on corporations like, great corporations like ASICs or whatever the corporation is that can compensate these athletes after they're done competing.

[1643] And I think we both are actually on the same page.

[1644] I think the difference is, for me, it's like I've kind of had this opportunities over time it's not like great opportunities but I just take this one and I take this one I take this one and instead of really getting compensated up front by what you're talking about I'm able to because I've stayed in front of public yeah and it's hard to do that sometimes I mean it's hard to go from an Olympic athlete to automatically being a great coach or being a you go to work in some other business I mean you just don't see where it shines but I've been able to do that and so it's It's a little easier.

[1645] In fact, right now, a feature film.

[1646] I just got a contract.

[1647] All these things are great, Dan.

[1648] The problem is money is being generated, and it's not being distributed to the athletes, and the only reason it's being generated at all is because of the athletes and their performances, but they don't get any of it.

[1649] That, to me, is criminal.

[1650] They're working on, I think, a little bit in the NCAA, too, right?

[1651] They should.

[1652] They should in the NCAA.

[1653] That's a lot.

[1654] The amount of money, those teams, those teams, those.

[1655] those colleges earn, those universities earn from, because of the fact their sports teams are successful, their programs are successful.

[1656] It's just crazy to me. It's just one of those legacy institutions that's been around for so long that we just accepted the fact the athletes get ripped off.

[1657] That's what it is.

[1658] There's no Olympics without the athletes.

[1659] If they all said, you know what, I want money.

[1660] How much do you guys make?

[1661] You're making billions of dollars?

[1662] And we get how much we get zero the fuck out of here you know i love you're saying that even though i don't say it i know that's why i'm saying it's so loud right so you know so what i would not you know because what i want to say to the athletes is let's make our own breaks let's don't depend on luck let's you know let's work extra hard let's do this and then you know because you got to do both yes it's got to do both and otherwise you won't be and they've already done both a lot but It doesn't stop, even though you get an Olympic gold medal, you still got to, I mean, you're pretty young usually.

[1663] I mean, an athlete's not going to win Olympic gold medal unless you got a different kind of the ancient Olympics or something, you know, the old timers.

[1664] But, and then that's not the valuable one.

[1665] What's like the oldest athlete that ever won the Olympics?

[1666] I don't know.

[1667] I think we've had some in the 40s that wrestled, but barely.

[1668] And one?

[1669] I think 41 or 2 or something.

[1670] That's incredible.

[1671] Yeah, it's just, it's just, the average age when I was there was 27, you know, back in 72, so I don't know exactly.

[1672] That makes sense.

[1673] Yeah.

[1674] So, but, no, no, that's good that, you know, so that's why, you know, it's like me here, I'm selling A6 shoes.

[1675] I'm selling, I got a cable beer.

[1676] I got to, I'm glad that you're doing all these things, and you deserve that and all, and more.

[1677] I know, but, but what I'm saying is I have to do it.

[1678] Yeah.

[1679] I got to keep doing it.

[1680] Right.

[1681] This still happens.

[1682] I don't mind working.

[1683] I like it.

[1684] And it helps our sport.

[1685] You know, maybe not the beer drinking, but, but, uh, the celebrate, maybe.

[1686] But, but, you know, it's just like the videos, the cassettes, uh, you know, they're, they sell a, at human kinetic publishers, you know, they, they sell a championship video, you know, all these places.

[1687] And this guy, I, I'm making a movie right now, you know, I just, they sent me a contract and I looked at the contract.

[1688] and I'm going to tell you, ooh, it's a little scary.

[1689] You know, it's not much there for me. But, you know, it's like maybe I don't know yet because I didn't really know how to read a 30 -page contract yet.

[1690] So, you know, maybe you're enhancing me a little bit here.

[1691] You can maybe get my price up a little bit better.

[1692] I hope so.

[1693] I can only hope so.

[1694] We just did three hours, Dan Gable.

[1695] We've done three hours already?

[1696] Yeah.

[1697] Well, we're just starting.

[1698] No, I'm just kidding.

[1699] I'm just kidding.

[1700] And these guys over here, they don't want to work overtime.

[1701] You know, so like I said, I'm the first to arrive, last to leave.

[1702] That's how you've become who you are.

[1703] And the hardest working guy there.

[1704] But that doesn't mean everybody is.

[1705] That doesn't mean everybody is.

[1706] And I already told you that I didn't, I let, I'm probably the only coach in the country, let the guy come half a practice.

[1707] But the team made it.

[1708] The team made it.

[1709] But I think you understood the unique psychology of that one individual.

[1710] Well, you need to know your subjects.

[1711] You need to know your subject.

[1712] That's wrestling.

[1713] And then you need to know your subjects, and that's your wrestlers.

[1714] And obviously, you do a good job and a great job with your experience here.

[1715] I don't know if you call it a podcast or not.

[1716] Yeah, that's what we call it.

[1717] But you do a lot of work, and you've worked your way here.

[1718] And so, you know, that's how people are – I'm amazed that all these people that are just – are listening, I will listen to this.

[1719] I'm amazed too.

[1720] It's confusing.

[1721] Well, I don't know if it's confusing.

[1722] It is to me. Yeah.

[1723] Because I just live my life like no one's listening.

[1724] I mean, I know they are, so I do my best, but I just sort of show up and just keep living like a normal person.

[1725] But you're good at it, you know.

[1726] You didn't have notes.

[1727] I had notes.

[1728] I had a notes.

[1729] I don't see a note over there.

[1730] No, I don't have any notes, but I've been thinking about you for a long time, my friend.

[1731] I really have.

[1732] I've been looking forward to this day.

[1733] and it meant a lot to me that you came here.

[1734] And I appreciate you as a human being and I appreciate you as an athlete and as a representative of what I believe is one of the greatest sports ever.

[1735] Well, you know, it's one of the hardest, definitely.

[1736] I mean, if you can go through one of my practices, you're going to be a pretty good person.

[1737] I mean, it's pretty tough.

[1738] It's pretty tough.

[1739] But, I mean, it goes back to, I mean, it's like my high school coach, you know, you know, it's like he had a drink for us.

[1740] it was called burly juice because his name was Bob Siddens but we called him Burley Bob not to his face but coached surgeons but he mixed he had Gatorade.

[1741] Gatorade just came out back in those years and it was a powder for him then and but it wasn't that good yet and so we didn't really like drinking it but he Mountain Dew just came out in 64 1964 to that kind of mountain dew that's kind of there today and he mixed it he'd make his Gatorade And then he'd put a can of Mountain Dew in there, and wow, did it taste good.

[1742] Of course, he didn't know we were slipping a couple other cans of Mountain Dew when he wasn't looking.

[1743] So it was a little bit more Mountain Dew.

[1744] But, you know, it's just one of these things that you learn over the years.

[1745] And, you know, I've been strict as hell at times.

[1746] By that, I mean, I wouldn't drink a pop.

[1747] I wouldn't drink a soda.

[1748] I wouldn't, I would only eat perfect at the beginning of my career.

[1749] But as I got older and as I got better at what I did, I started, I can drink a Mountain Dew.

[1750] I can, I can, even when time I got to the, before the Olympic Games, I might drink a beer after, you know, after a hard workout.

[1751] You know, I might drink a beer, you know, that type of stuff.

[1752] And I might drink a nutrition drink before.

[1753] I did.

[1754] I used to drink Nutrimand, it was called.

[1755] But, you know, now it's gable gold, but, but, you know, it's like you adjust, but your mind is going to tell you whether what you can do.

[1756] and how good you are.

[1757] And the mind also tells you when to hell to get out, you know, or your mom tells you when to hell to get out.

[1758] But she's looking at my mind, and I would not be here.

[1759] You know, if I hadn't stepped down in 1997, I was on the road for, I'd be dead.

[1760] But I figured I'd make four more years, but I'm 24 years now.

[1761] Just too much of the road?

[1762] Just, just.

[1763] much nervousness just nervous all the time you know you you know you're just too hyper i mean you know you got to settle down at a certain point and if you want to live what you know want to live well because you cared so much because it was so important to you about living competing the competing was so important to you that's what the nervousness was coming from yeah i think i think it was a success you know just getting used to it and when if if you didn't have success people were like i can remember when I lost the 10th championship in a row, the article in the paper, they were taking people's comments.

[1764] And it said, actually, this was after I lost to Owings in 1980, or 19, back in 1970 nationals after 181 wins and lost my, the Des Moines Register had, you know, had a little comments.

[1765] And one guy said in there, you just ain't got it anymore you'll never do it you'll never do anything in wrestling that's what he was hoping that's what a person like that they're projecting guess what guess what and it had the guy's name on there and guess what the guy got a get well card too sorry i'm sorry to hear you're sick from my mom in the in the mail that week that's how i've lived my life dan gable thank you very much for being here.

[1766] I appreciate you, brother.

[1767] Thank you.

[1768] Thank you.

[1769] It was a pleasure and an honor.

[1770] Thank you.

[1771] Bye, everybody.