JRE MMA Show #129 with Gordon Ryan & Mo Jassim

[0] Joe Rogan podcast, check it out.

[1] The Joe Rogan Experience.

[2] Train by day, Joe Rogan podcast by night, all day.

[3] All right, what's happening?

[4] Not much.

[5] Good to see you, good to see you.

[6] Mo, introduce yourself.

[7] My name is Mo Jassum.

[8] I'm the head organizer of ADCC 2019.

[9] And for people who don't know what ADCC is, Abu Dhabi Combat Club.

[10] When was I founded in 2000?

[11] 1999.

[12] 98.

[13] That was the first one.

[14] Yeah, way back in the day.

[15] That's pretty wild.

[16] You think about like the UFC Star.

[17] Starting in 93, and that's where everybody really got excited about Jiu -Jitsu.

[18] And then Abu Dhabi only five years later.

[19] Yeah, because, I mean, the owner and create...

[20] Pull his sucker right up to the face.

[21] It moves around.

[22] You can grab it, you know, to...

[23] Is that okay?

[24] Yeah, perfect.

[25] Hold on one second, sorry.

[26] What's my...

[27] I'm not recording his mic on accident.

[28] Oh.

[29] Start again?

[30] No, it's good.

[31] Did you record it at all?

[32] But was he recorded before?

[33] I was just going through the wrong input.

[34] I have it on a different thing.

[35] I'll take care of it.

[36] Oh, okay, okay.

[37] All right.

[38] We're good.

[39] All right.

[40] So 1998, it started.

[41] And why did they, no ghee back then was very unpopular?

[42] 100%.

[43] It's sort of an interesting story how it started.

[44] So the owner and creator of ADCC is Sheikh Tachnun.

[45] And he was going to college in the 90s in San Diego.

[46] UFC comes out in 1993.

[47] He gets hooked on it.

[48] And he just starts training, walks into a jiu -jitsu.

[49] school in San Diego and starts training.

[50] He hides his identity.

[51] No one knows who he is, not even his instructor.

[52] He just goes by the name of Ben.

[53] That's pretty gangster.

[54] Yeah, like literally no one knows who he is except a few people.

[55] So he graduates, I believe in 1995, goes back and then tells everybody who he actually really is.

[56] And, you know, he starts creating this rule set.

[57] And you're right.

[58] No Ghee back then was just pretty much non -existent.

[59] So he went against the grain and he did something interesting, sort of like what the UFC did.

[60] You know, the original UFC's, it wasn't mixed martial arts.

[61] It was art versus art. And that was the concept of ADCC.

[62] Judo guys versus Jiu -Jitsu guys versus Samba, et cetera, et cetera.

[63] So he created this rule set.

[64] And then in 1998, the first ADCC happened in Abu Dhabi.

[65] It was really interesting because back in the day, it was frowned upon to have no -gui competitions.

[66] Like, Brazilian jiu -suitsu guys wanted you to train and compete only in the ghee.

[67] Yeah.

[68] You started in the ghee, right?

[69] I started in the ghee.

[70] The first, like, two and a half years was only in the ghee, and then I made a transition to no -gee.

[71] When year did you make the transition?

[72] So I started in 2011, so 2014 is when I really started to make the transition.

[73] and then by like late 14, 2015, then it was like pretty much all no -gey because I didn't have any ghee training partners, Eddie Cummings, Gary, like all the competitors at Hensos, at least John's students, were all no -gey guys.

[74] Eddie Cummings, is he vanished?

[75] I have no idea what happened.

[76] I went to his Instagram the other day to see what he was up to.

[77] He posted like three years ago, yeah.

[78] Yeah, he stopped training with us, and then he was training for a while at Unity, and then I haven't talked to him.

[79] I don't even know if he's still training.

[80] Like, he had a PhD in physics.

[81] So I heard he, like, started teaching again.

[82] He's got, like, a normal job now.

[83] I've, I have no idea.

[84] So maybe he's trained, maybe he doesn't, but he definitely doesn't compete anymore.

[85] So weird.

[86] He was so downed it.

[87] He was, he was.

[88] He went in and was crushing EBIs and had really good, tough ADCC matches.

[89] He had that super close match against Tancino.

[90] And then, yeah, he just, like, after the EBI with GEO, where he lost the Gio, he just, like, we didn't see him anymore for that.

[91] Wow.

[92] Crazy.

[93] But, you know, it's such a wild sport, and it does so much damage to your body.

[94] You know, so many guys, I mean, everybody that I talked to years later, like, oh, I got two discs replaced in my neck.

[95] I got this going on.

[96] I got that going on.

[97] My, because everything we do is concave shoulders, like, with the shoulders coming forward.

[98] I, like, can't lift my, I can't do, like, anything overhead.

[99] I can't, like, wash the back of my neck because my shoulders are just, I'm always inverting doing this.

[100] It's, like, anything like this I can do, but I can't bridge, like, trying to scrub my back of my head.

[101] I'm like, can't get my shoulders back there.

[102] So it's just, like, all a mess.

[103] And I'm only 27, so once I'm 40, I'm going to be fucked.

[104] But I think you could probably fix that.

[105] Yeah, I could.

[106] I'm just lazy.

[107] I'm just like...

[108] You saying you're lazy is hilarious.

[109] That is hilarious.

[110] Every day, I go to watch, like, John Teach, and I'm, like, just sit up straight.

[111] And then I do it with, like, 30 seconds.

[112] I'm like, my back is tired.

[113] And then I just, like, end up sitting like this the whole class.

[114] My fucking head's, like, leaning forward.

[115] I'm like, oh, my God.

[116] Yeah, you got to wonder, like, what...

[117] I mean, who's...

[118] Who's been able to do it the longest?

[119] Like, what's the longest running, like, competitor?

[120] I would say there's Andre Galvao.

[121] I mean, Andre, yeah, I would say Andre.

[122] Because, I mean, he's competing, what, since he's 16?

[123] He's been at the highest levels for 20 years.

[124] You know, I saw him in the early 2000s.

[125] There was a documentary called Artee Suave.

[126] He was a brown belt back then.

[127] This was, like, 2001, two, or three.

[128] And here he is.

[129] How old is Andre now?

[130] He's got to be close.

[131] to 40, right?

[132] I think he's 40.

[133] I'll be 40 for this ADCC.

[134] Is that his last one?

[135] Last year we're supposed to be his last one.

[136] And then he came back for this one.

[137] So I'm going to plan to make sure that it's his last one.

[138] When you do these matches, since you've been doing these no -time -limit match, like the Felipe match, which I think you really shine in those matches.

[139] But that's really for the cognizante.

[140] That's really for the hardcore people that want to see.

[141] It's not spectator -friendly.

[142] It's just to determine who's better edge it to.

[143] But no time -loom matches for spectators are just atrocious because who the fuck wants to watch for as a jiu -jitsu.

[144] Like, most people don't want to watch 10 minutes at jiu -jitsu.

[145] So who wants to watch like a two -hour match?

[146] But they're important to have sometimes just to show who's the best because you actually have to do jihitsu and know how to do submissions.

[147] Well, not in the Filippe match because there wasn't a submission.

[148] But you have to be better at jih Tjitsu than the other guy.

[149] There's no stalling and playing tactics for 10 minutes and winning by advantage or two points.

[150] So they have their place, but to build a sport to a spectator sport is not, no time limits, not the way.

[151] Well, it's not the way for spectators, but it is the way, as you said, to determine who's the best.

[152] And I think that's supposedly what Jiu -Jitsu is all about.

[153] Really, the early days of the UFC, there was no time limits because it was just like, who wins.

[154] And that's the purest form of any martial art. It's like, you know, as soon as you have rounds, then you have people gaming the system, try to win the round by sprinting in the last 30 seconds and really going hard or, you know, trying to figure out a way to manage your time.

[155] You can't really do that if there's no time limit.

[156] Which I think that has a place, too, like points and rounds and stuff, because then you have to, you have the whole tactical element which comes into play.

[157] But I think this is a place for both for sure.

[158] But spectator, spectators definitely need a time limit.

[159] They want to know, like, when this is going to be over.

[160] It would fucking wild, though, if all UFC fights had no time limit in this day and age.

[161] I mean, they would be brutal.

[162] I mean, a hoist have like an hour and something match with chemo, I believe, like in one of the...

[163] I don't think it was that long.

[164] It was like something ridiculous, right?

[165] It was pretty long, but only...

[166] I don't think it was that long.

[167] Okay.

[168] I don't...

[169] Find out how long the hoist chemo match was.

[170] I think it just seemed long because it was so crazy.

[171] Because he was finishing everyone so fast.

[172] And then he was the guys against chemo, and it was a little bit longer.

[173] Tom Erickson had a match with Marilla Bustamante back in the day.

[174] In one of the weird, you know, like offshoots, one of those little small companies that tried to make a big, like an MMA event.

[175] I think there was a no glove event, too, it was back in those days.

[176] And I think that match went like an hour.

[177] Wow.

[178] Yeah.

[179] And, you know, Muriel Bustamante was 185 pounds, and Tom Erickson was 300 pounds.

[180] Yeah, he was a monster.

[181] I remember Tom Erickson.

[182] There's a weird sound.

[183] Do you hear that?

[184] What is that, Jamie?

[185] What?

[186] That sound?

[187] You don't hear it?

[188] No. I hear it like a feedback.

[189] You don't hear it?

[190] You guys don't hear it?

[191] No. Maybe it's just my headset.

[192] Hold on.

[193] Yeah.

[194] All right.

[195] I'll deal with it.

[196] But it's just, again, it's not fan -friendly.

[197] Yeah.

[198] I had my match with Keenan was an hour and 45 minutes in my first match.

[199] That's my longest match, yeah.

[200] Hour in 45 minutes.

[201] Yeah.

[202] How'd that end?

[203] That heel hooked him.

[204] Yeah.

[205] That's actually, that's actually an amazing.

[206] amazing story we have to go over yeah that's how me and mo first met yeah he hired keenan to beat me up so it was only four minutes and 40 seconds so it was really like one one round in the ufc today oh wow i feel like that was just it felt like so much longer because hoist was finishing everyone like the first yeah minute he would just like hit a double leg and then strangle them when they turned around it was also so chaotic and then you know it was so crazy because chemo came in carrying a cross like remember he had a cross on his back like a giant wooden cross like walked in with Joe Son, right?

[207] Yeah, yeah.

[208] Joe Son, yeah.

[209] I remember, and that was one, I remember when Keith Hackney was just punching him in the balls.

[210] Yeah.

[211] Those original UFCs were, those were really no rules.

[212] They were pretty crazy, yeah.

[213] But, you know, that's really the birth of Jiu -Jitsu.

[214] I mean, that's where for people in America, that's where they recognize, like, oh, my God, I don't know shit.

[215] That's what got me into J -Jitsu when I was, like, seven, eight years old, I was watching the UFC, and it just happened to be a Hoyce Gracie tribute.

[216] And there was, like, all the reruns.

[217] of the early UFCs and I was like yeah I'm gonna fucking do that when I get over and then like for the longest time I like wouldn't train I'll just like hear like I'll hear Joe like breaking down how to do it do a Kimora he's like oh yeah he needs to get his left hand here and I like go my buddy the next day I'm like fuck yeah like shit works I'm like fucking doing Kimoras and my fucking friends and shit it's it's really amazing how one martial art was if you look at all the other martial arts every you know everybody wants wanted to be like Bruce Lee, the small guy who could beat everybody out.

[218] But in reality, the bigger people win, like in any kind of fight involving striking and size and speed, it's just such a giant advantage.

[219] Jiu -jitsu is really the only thing where the smaller person actually can dominate a bigger person.

[220] I agree 100%.

[221] I was actually thinking about this recently.

[222] I don't know any other combat sport where you could have two elite -level athletes and a 60 -70 -pound weight advantage and the smaller guy wins consistently.

[223] Right, in absolutes.

[224] I mean, look at, what's his name?

[225] We actually, so we're doing the Hall of Fame for this ADCC, the inaugural one, so I had to look up the stats.

[226] The highest submission rate in ADCC is Marcelo Garcia.

[227] Right.

[228] 89%.

[229] That's pretty crazy.

[230] And he was submitting Rico Rodriguez, guys, a hundred pounds heavier than him.

[231] Rico Rodriguez, who was a UFC heavyweight champion at one point, he hooked him.

[232] And remember, that was after he took Rico's back, and then Rico slammed him.

[233] Remember, he, like, threw all his bodyweight.

[234] And then he's like, let me do a fucking heel hook.

[235] Yeah.

[236] But that was illegal, because in ADCC you're allowed to slam only if you're in the threat of a submission.

[237] So Marcello was on his back with a seatbelt grip.

[238] If he had switched to a rear naked, it would have been perfectly legal.

[239] But he just slammed him, flatlined him.

[240] Yeah, it was also like, come on, man. Guys, 160 pounds, you know?

[241] The difference in size was so preposterous.

[242] But yeah, in any other sport, you would never imagine that a small guy would.

[243] be able to finish.

[244] I talked to wrestlers and like, what do you mean you have open weight divisions?

[245] Right.

[246] I'm like, yeah, like, you know, you have like a 66 kilo guy fighting like 100 kilo guy.

[247] Like, yeah, that just doesn't make any sense.

[248] In wrestling, it doesn't make any sense.

[249] Yeah, I know.

[250] But in Jiu -Jitsu, it actually can kind of work.

[251] Even in our last ADCCC in 2019, there's a guy from Australia, Lachlan Giles.

[252] He got bronze in the absolute, and he submitted a guy named Muhammad Ali.

[253] He's, you got to see this guy.

[254] He was like 260, shredded.

[255] So he took out three of the biggest guys in 2019.

[256] So I think that was the first time since 2007, a guy in the 77 -kilogram division, 170, meddled in the absolute.

[257] Remember when Gunner Nelson when he beat, what's his face?

[258] Jeff Monson.

[259] Jeff Monson, yeah.

[260] That's crazy.

[261] Monson's a fucking fire hydrant, a giant fire hydrant.

[262] Zero neck, all tattoos.

[263] It just took them out.

[264] Like communist tattoos all over his body and shit.

[265] He's over in Russia, singing Russian songs.

[266] The best was the one year he protested.

[267] He just got naked and started walking around.

[268] Yes, I was there for that one.

[269] Yeah, that was 2003.

[270] Yeah, he took off all his fucking clothes when he lost it.

[271] Who did he lose to?

[272] He lost a decision to someone.

[273] I remember that was the one I didn't see, but I just know he stripped down, grabbed his speed on just like threw it to the crowd.

[274] Yeah, he walked off naked.

[275] Yeah.

[276] That's amazing.

[277] Imagine being like the security yard having to fucking tell Jeff Monson.

[278] Like just he's got his cock out and you're like, man, you can't be doing this here.

[279] I mean, he literally looked like the Hulk back then.

[280] He was two -time champion.

[281] I think he was the first two -division champion in ADCC, so he was a beast.

[282] He was the first guy ever saw a do a north -south choke, and a lot of people thought that, oh, you can't only do that if you're strong.

[283] Like, that's like a goon move, that he's just, like, squeezing his head.

[284] Yeah, but now.

[285] And then people realize, then Marcella started pulling it off, and people are like, oh, that's a real move.

[286] That was an interesting about Marcella for me is he would always reinvent himself every ADCC.

[287] So 2005, he's hitting everyone with his ex -guard sweeps.

[288] So that's what everyone's expecting.

[289] 2007 comes.

[290] He's just finishing everyone with North -South chokes.

[291] I saw his debut in 2003.

[292] I was there live in Sao Paulo.

[293] Yeah, that was wild.

[294] Because I was there with Eddie when Eddie was competing, when Eddie beat Hoyler.

[295] And when he choked out Shaolin, everybody was like, holy fuck.

[296] And it was the way he did it, the speed in which he arm dragged and took his back.

[297] And then the scramble, secures the choke, and then finishes it.

[298] like as they're scrambling and just puts them to sleep you know what the crazy thing too is uh 2003 marcello got second in the trials so he was a last minute replacement crazy and like no one really knew who he was and then it's like shallan just got put to sleep and then he even tapped out mike van arsdale he was a fabio gurgel's student right and he wasn't even like he did a lot more gie than he did no gie right yeah that's what he was known for and then he just ended up being like For me, personally, the two greatest champions in ADCC, number one, I'd say Galvao, but there's an art. Some people believe it's Marcello.

[299] So he was definitely a pioneer.

[300] Well, Marcello finished more people.

[301] Yeah.

[302] It depends on what the criteria is.

[303] Like, Andre has more medals, but I think that the way Marcelo won was far more impressive.

[304] And he's got a lot more division wins.

[305] Like, he's got a way better, he's got way more fights than Andre overall in ADCC.

[306] Like, he's did the division every year because he never won the absolute.

[307] whereas Andre just did the division and then the absolute he lost his first two and then he's just been doing super fights since 2013 so he hasn't had that many fights compared to Marcello Marcelo was built so weird too because he had these giant ass tree trunk legs and this like normal size upper body just so weird you know one of the head judges trained with him for a week and he came to Abu Dhabi and he was telling me he's like the weirdest body type he's ever felt he's like these tree trunk legs that could elevate him and these really small hands so he's like once he takes your back there's no way you could training with Mikey is like the same way because his legs are shorter proportionally than his upper body so like you're trying to pass his guard and they're like feet like a little tiny feet like slip into places they normally wouldn't be able to because his legs are so short so I'm like fucking trying to pass his guard and his feet are like coming inside my arms I'm like man I don't know what to do here he sat down outside and I had to get a photo of it because it's so preposterous I'm like how we what do you do doing where his knees come in and his feet go out and he sits he sleeps like that he sleeps like that he sleeps like that on plane on plane rides like he'll just sit in the chair and then fall asleep apparently that's I don't even know how the fuck your body contorts to that shape it has to be like his body developed while he was doing those positions it's because uh I think his legs are actually disproportionately short compared to his torso like I think like for the size of his upper body I I think his legs are actually, like, disproportionate.

[308] I think they're shorter than they're supposed to be.

[309] 100%.

[310] You can see.

[311] He's got this long torso on these.

[312] He's so odd.

[313] So good, though.

[314] So good.

[315] He's so good and so weird.

[316] All he does is eat pasta and pizza.

[317] And he only eats once a day.

[318] Yeah.

[319] He's a fucking genius, too, and he talks to the guy.

[320] And then drills the rest of the other 23 hours.

[321] Yeah, he drills 12 hours a day.

[322] Yeah.

[323] I mean, every day.

[324] Yeah.

[325] Yeah.

[326] I mean, but listen, that's where you get results.

[327] You get results in doing those incredibly uncomfortable.

[328] things.

[329] I think he's the third American to ever get a world title.

[330] I think first was B .J. Penn, then Jafel Lovato, and then Musumishi, I think, is like a three -time Ghee champion now.

[331] So he's got definitely the most titles out of any American.

[332] I love the fact that he's going no -gee now, too.

[333] He's doing a lot of no -gee.

[334] Yeah.

[335] Yeah.

[336] Well, who's number one, what they're doing in Austin was so exciting because to be able to go watch world -class jiu -jitsu right here in Austin.

[337] Yeah, it was so fun.

[338] So fun to just go there and just be able to take that in.

[339] Yeah, not a production.

[340] value and everything is through the roof and they're doing a good job.

[341] Yeah, it's amazing.

[342] So Abu Dhabi is, this is an enormous event, right?

[343] And this is happening in Vegas.

[344] Yes.

[345] So like the first major event I did for ADCCC was 2019.

[346] For me personally, my target, I thought the best ADCC ever was 2005, the one in Long Beach.

[347] That was my target.

[348] It had 2 ,800 people there.

[349] You You had a bunch of MMA guys.

[350] You had GSP, Diego Sanchez, Gilbert Melendez, Jake Shields, yeah.

[351] John Jock Machado had that match against Dean Lister.

[352] Dean Lister, that's right.

[353] Yeah, so I was like, I got to beat this one.

[354] This was the best one.

[355] So 2019 comes, we broke the record, we had $4 ,000.

[356] It was a big success.

[357] Then comes this one, and we started selling tickets on Black Friday.

[358] So at 10 a .m., I wake up at like 10 .45, and I had like 6 ,000.

[359] missed calls from the Thomas and Mac, which is where the event's going to be.

[360] I'm like, oh, shit, something went wrong.

[361] And I answered the phone.

[362] I'm like, what's going on?

[363] He's like, do you know how many tickets you've sold?

[364] I was like, no. He's like, you've sold 5 ,000 tickets in 45 minutes.

[365] So we sold more tickets in 45 minutes a year out than we had it in 2019.

[366] And we sold every single premium ticket in the first day.

[367] We sold over 7 ,000 tickets.

[368] That's incredible for Jiu -Jitsu.

[369] I mean, that's so wild.

[370] We sold a million dollars in ticket sales for a crap thing in one day.

[371] That's incredible.

[372] Yeah.

[373] So I miscalculated that one.

[374] Well, now you know.

[375] It's a good problem to have.

[376] As long as you get this guy involved.

[377] Had to charge more.

[378] Yeah.

[379] I mean, definitely.

[380] I mean, having Gordon around, it's been a big boost, you know.

[381] That's a, I get into arguments about it all the time.

[382] I'm like, listen, you can hate the guy.

[383] You know, anytime someone tells me they don't like Gordon, I'm like, okay.

[384] But there's definitely a benefit.

[385] I had a conversation with Mark Zuckerberg about it.

[386] He's like, well, what do you think about his attitude?

[387] I go, why do you think he's so fucking popular?

[388] There's two reasons.

[389] One, because he's the best.

[390] And then two, because he talks so much shit.

[391] You don't think that's a smart move?

[392] The best is, I'm like, so Shadow Band on Instagram.

[393] He goes to follow me. He follows my backup account.

[394] He doesn't, he couldn't find my real account.

[395] Zuckerberg?

[396] Yeah, so Zuckerberg follows, like, my breakdown page.

[397] The other one, but he doesn't fucking follow my real page because he can't find it.

[398] I posted one day, I'm like, I posted like he was following me. And I tagged him, and I'm like, dude, fucking whitelist me, you fuck.

[399] like if I was so shadow band that he couldn't find my real account it's so funny because I think he wants martial arts to be very respectful and you know he trains in martial arts and he does MMA and he really loves it he loves a sport does he yeah and he loves you like he thinks you're like extremely skilled he loves watching you compete he's like I just don't know I'm like that's what's fun it's part of the fun he's like Americanizing martial arts but it's good though because people see me on social media and they're like they meet me in person so their expectations are so low they're like there's no way he could be worse than that so if I'm any better than I am on social media they're like oh man he's a great guy that's funny that's so true you talk so much shit but it's like think about how many more eyeballs are on you to see these accomplishments because if you were just quietly running around submitting all the best black belts in the world it would still be impressive but there's no way it would get the kind of attention that it's getting.

[400] And part of the reason why I get so much attention is because you're smart about social media.

[401] And talking a lot of shit on social media is very effective for getting people hyped up.

[402] Yeah.

[403] I mean, it does two things.

[404] As long as you can actually back it up.

[405] Yes.

[406] Otherwise, you're just the clown.

[407] Right.

[408] Yeah.

[409] And you see that a lot.

[410] I mean, it does two things when you talk shit, right?

[411] First of all, it energizes your fans.

[412] They get all ramped up.

[413] But the people that hate you, they want to see you lose.

[414] So at the end of the day, they're all tuning in.

[415] Yeah.

[416] The flip side to that, though, is it puts a tremendous amount of pressure, you know, so like, you know, people are waiting for Gordon to lose to just, you know, cheer.

[417] So that's the flip side to it.

[418] Which is amazing because people in grappling lose all the time.

[419] Like it's not, like, no one goes on like a 10, like a 10 fight winning streak in grappling, a 10 match winning streak is like unheard of.

[420] Like maybe have like a good tournament, you double gold, but like to win like more than 15 matches in a row that like rarely happens.

[421] I think like Hodger's best winning streak, I think was like 20 matches or something like that.

[422] so like people win some they lose some but I know that the day that I lose again it's just like the end of the world like I haven't lost since 2018 I'm gonna like lose by advantage and be like see was never that good all how many matches are you wanted to run now I think it's 57 since 2018 you know people don't know how crazy that is but again like we were talking about musimachi you train seven days a week yeah that's that's unheard of too you know everybody wants to take day off everybody wants to relax you know there's there's levels to everything there's levels to your commitment and it's also your association with Donna her your amazing training partners the the lineage you come from but if you look at the the success it's just the formula's there I mean it's you could see why you're so successful it's not there's no luck it's not like just the craziest genetics ever it's none of those things it's just it's consistent hard work plus intelligence plus technique plus the great training partners it's just i get that all the time people ask me what makes gordon so good i'm like he's not the most explosive guy there's guys bigger faster and stronger for me it's he does train seven days a week and he just got a gift where he can see a position or any technique in jiu jitza and break it down instantly i've never seen someone who could just break it down to its most basic you know parts and rearrange it Have you always had that kind of discipline?

[423] No, a big thing that improved my work ethic a lot.

[424] I mean, I was always a hard worker, but when I saw Gary was training seven days a week, and then I saw John who, like, could barely walk, like, just teaching, like, a class at Hanzos.

[425] Then he teaches, like, eight privates throughout the day, and then teaches again.

[426] Like, he would just teach, like, 8 a .m. at Hensos in the city, and then he would teach 9, 10, 11, 12 privates.

[427] And then he would teach afternoon class.

[428] and then he would teach, like, three, four, five, six, seven, eight p .m. privates seven days a week.

[429] And then, like, we'd get up and, like, go to walk and he, like, his hip, like, needs a hip replacement.

[430] He, like, can barely stand up.

[431] And I'm just like, man, if this guy can fucking do this, like, I got to step my game up.

[432] Like, this is ridiculous.

[433] And he's been doing the same thing for 30 years.

[434] And it's just like, okay, like, there's definitely something to this consistency that I should be, I should be taking notice of.

[435] It's with everything.

[436] It's with music.

[437] It's with comedy.

[438] It's with writers.

[439] like the people that can like sit down and do the work day in, day out, they lap everybody else.

[440] If you can just show up, you're already ahead of like 90 % of the people.

[441] Yeah, yeah.

[442] Because most people are just inherently lazy.

[443] Yeah.

[444] So if you just are doing jih Tjitsu for 10 years, and even if you don't have a training program, you're just showing up every day and just training hard, even like an idiot.

[445] You're still going to be ahead of most people because most people just don't even take training seriously.

[446] Like me and Moe talk about this all the time.

[447] like this is your fucking job like most people just treat it like a hobby yeah most like I know hobbyists who train more than most black belt world champions like most black belt ADCC world champions train three four times a week like it's just like a hobby to them and they go out but they're all so lazy that they're all of the same level like they have 10 guys who train three times a week so they all progress it relatively the same speed so they can get away with it but now once there's there's more professionalism and there's more money as more money comes into sport you'll see that change and you'll see a real professional start to start to grow well i think with you it's not just the training every day but it's also the analyzing of positions and the doing the intellectual work yeah it's mostly john um he always talks about everyone's happy to come in and do the physical work you know they come in they train hard they get a good sweat they're sore but the mental work is the hardest work and nobody wants to do that he's like you tell someone to come in and fucking do you know you do three round three hard rounds and you do a hundred burpees.

[448] Like, oh, yeah, no problem.

[449] He'd tell them to sit down and figure out why this arm bar's not working, why the mechanics aren't right, and that no one wants to fucking do that.

[450] Right.

[451] So that's the most important stuff is the mental work.

[452] So does John just analyze, I know he analyzes tape, like, all day long, you analyze his video footage, but does he analyze it with you guys?

[453] Does he break it down to you afterwards?

[454] We do tape studies like once every two weeks at my house where we watch, like, specific, he has like specific things that he wants to work on for that week or whatever the case is or the goals he wants to accomplish during that tape study.

[455] So we'll watch tape at my house and then he'll say, okay, this is the theme for tonight.

[456] This is what we're going to look at.

[457] Like the last time we watched, like we call it Scrimmage Wrestling, where it's wrestling with submissions under ADCC rules.

[458] And you don't really see a lot of it in ADCC because of the fact that no one even really knows it exists.

[459] People just take wrestlers and they teach them wrestling and then They go to ADCC and hope for the best.

[460] So the last tape study, we actually watched Diego Sanchez fighting Nick Diaz in the UFC because there was a lot of up and down scrimmaging where Diego would hit a takedown.

[461] Nick would go for a submission and then Diego would always end up on top.

[462] And John just builds this habit of, we call it a hustle to you score where you just don't stop moving until you get to a score.

[463] And it just completely changed the way that we all think about.

[464] the ADCC scoring criteria and how to play the game.

[465] How does John maintain his motivation?

[466] Dude, I wish I could tell you.

[467] He's just been doing the same thing for 30 years.

[468] He just loves it.

[469] I mean, I wish I had like half the dedication and, like, interest in Jiu -Zitsu that John has.

[470] And, I mean, I'm the most dedicated athlete, I would say, to Jiu -Zitsu, and it's still just pales in comparison.

[471] Like, we're at podcasting right now.

[472] John's, like, watching, like, a 1957 boxing.

[473] match or like the semifinals from like the 1960 like judo Olympics like it's insane it's just most people when they work really hard towards something they get a personal reward for it like i mean he's recognized widely as one of the greatest jiu jitsu trainers of all time no question but like it's not like the guy gets a lot of like personal satisfaction there's not like a lot of people like heaping praise on him it's not that's not his motivation which is so so interesting to be that dedicated, like, you get a lot of praise.

[474] Like, you, you're the guy who you're, when Felipe quit and then you fucking walk around with a big smile on your face, or when you write down on a piece of paper, they're going to submit Wagner Rocha with a triangle, and then you go and do it.

[475] Like, you're getting, like, that feeling out of your own personal satisfaction, your own personal accomplishment and achievement.

[476] He's not even getting that.

[477] He's getting it from other people's achievements.

[478] He's so dedicated.

[479] He's really selfless.

[480] I mean, he doesn't ask, I mean, he literally doesn't ask us for anything, no money, no nothing.

[481] He just wants you to show up the training.

[482] And I think he gets a lot of satisfaction from building athletes and seeing them succeed with the stuff that he teaches.

[483] And I think that's where his happiness comes from, is just seeing, like, when I, like, win ADCC or I do something big, like, you can tell he's, like, very, very happy.

[484] That's, like, one thing that genuinely makes him happy.

[485] I remember with John, like, when we used to train with him for about a year when they were in Puerto Rico.

[486] And, you know, most instructors, they'll just come, like the standard is 30 -minute warm -up, three techniques, and then you roll for 30 minutes.

[487] So me and John would actually hang out after class all the time.

[488] He'd just come over, we'd get some food.

[489] He'd always be watching tape, and then he'd always be making notes.

[490] He'd make a program for a week.

[491] He'd always have a goal, one week, one month, three months, and he would just go and apply that every day in class.

[492] So, you know, that's all he does is dedicate himself to his craft, and you see the results.

[493] There's no one like him.

[494] then no one else does that and he doesn't do anything else in life like he bought he has an apartment now and uh i'm like hey do you go like furniture shopping you like get like plates and dishes he's like i have to do that i'm like we've been living here for a year dude i had to go to fucking bed bath and beyond last week to pick him up plates balls dishes uh what does he eat uh take out so he fast and he just goes to uh whole foods at the end of the day and picks up whole foods hits on chicks and uh but he like doesn't have like i helped them move into his apartments like no one's been ever been in like any of john's apartments so i helped him move into the apartment so he's got like some furniture he's got like a bed and like a couch and stuff and he's like i'm gonna need to put some furniture in here i'm like yeah that's never going to happen but then i asked him i'm like do you have like cups and bowls and stuff he's like no so i had to like go and buy him like all this shit he like moves in he's like gordon what do you think about Wi -Fi.

[495] I'm like, what do you mean what I think about Wi -Fi?

[496] He goes, is it worth getting?

[497] I'm like, I'm like, yeah.

[498] I'm like, you want to like hook up your TV and watch like, you know, Netflix something.

[499] He goes, I despise TV.

[500] I'm not going to watch it.

[501] I'm like, okay.

[502] I'm like, well, like, what if you want to have like your phone connected to the Wi -Fi so you can watch tape?

[503] He goes, I can just watch it with the 5G.

[504] It's free.

[505] I'm like, okay.

[506] And I'm like, well, what if you have a chick over on a date and she wants to watch something on Netflix?

[507] He goes, good point.

[508] How much does it cost?

[509] And I'm like, I don't know, like, 80 bucks a month?

[510] He's like, okay, I'll consider it.

[511] I'm like, all right.

[512] He's like a character in a movie.

[513] Yeah.

[514] It really is.

[515] Like, there's, I've never even heard of a person like him.

[516] If a person was like that, they would be pretending.

[517] Yes.

[518] You know, they're pretending to be this stoic master who's just selfless and dedicated to the advancement of their students.

[519] But there's no real people like that.

[520] No, that's him.

[521] That's just like, that's.

[522] that's insane and what you guys have seven I think there's seven of their teammates are in this ADCC so he's doing something right yeah clearly now this this ADCC how will people be able to watch it it's exclusively on flow grappling okay yeah yeah for this one and so is it a pay -per -view thing on flow grappling a subscription so if you already have a flow membership you'll be able to watch it you know they gave me a lot of support to be honest a lot of people like to bash flow but, you know, I've been following the sport for 22 years, so I remember what it was like before they were around, you know.

[523] Like couldn't even watch matches.

[524] It's like a dude and a camcorder, and you get your DVD six months later, you know.

[525] So, for example, this ADCC, they're bringing over 70 staff themselves just to produce this event.

[526] So they've been a big help for sure.

[527] Well, the commentary was always great on Flo, and it was great on who's number one, but Howell's not there anymore, right?

[528] Is that what happened because of...

[529] That is.

[530] That is correct.

[531] So there was like, for people don't know, Leandro Lowe, who's this beloved world champion jiu -jitsu guy, got murdered the day before Felipe Peña.

[532] The day of.

[533] The day of.

[534] The night before, yeah, like in the middle of night.

[535] Did you hear about that story?

[536] It's crazy.

[537] So he's in a night club the night before.

[538] And I knew Leandro, too.

[539] He competed in ADCC.

[540] I hung out with him a few times.

[541] Very nice guy.

[542] So based on what I'd run.

[543] read in pretty good sources.

[544] He's in a nightclub.

[545] Some guy comes and removes a bottle off his table.

[546] So he takes him down, mounts him, says, have you had enough?

[547] The guy says, yes, he gets up.

[548] As he gets up, the guy shoots him in the head, kills him.

[549] This is where he gets interesting.

[550] The guy who shoots him and kills him is a purple bun jiu -jitsu, and he's a military police officer.

[551] So they arrest the guy and, you know, Brazil, they don't mess around over there.

[552] there was like 60, 70 people outside the police station, you know, protesting and just waiting for this police officer to get out.

[553] What the fuck, man?

[554] Yeah, it's, I mean, over nothing.

[555] I mean, just shoot some dead in the club right in the head.

[556] So, over nothing.

[557] That's a guy who's probably killed a few too many people.

[558] If you're a little that casual about killing somebody.

[559] Oh, he mounted me. Fuck that.

[560] It's just so crazy.

[561] I mean, literally, Leandro could have broken every fucking bone in his body.

[562] and what would he have done?

[563] Nothing.

[564] Nothing.

[565] And he lets him up.

[566] And he lets him up, and he shoots him and kills him.

[567] It's crazy.

[568] Yeah, over nothing.

[569] It's ridiculous.

[570] It's so sad.

[571] It was so sad.

[572] So anyway, so Leandro was good friends of Felipe, so obviously it's very emotionally devastating for Felipe.

[573] But that's where it gets weird.

[574] Yeah.

[575] Right.

[576] So why don't you fill us in on the rest of it?

[577] So then I get a call.

[578] Like, oh, hey, Leandro died, Felipe wants to cancel the match.

[579] so I'm like, all right, we can't cancel the match.

[580] He's like, well, he wants to change the rules to 30 minutes, and I'm like, no, like, Felipe is notorious for always trying to change the rules last minute or do, like, weasel's way into something that wasn't agreed upon.

[581] So I'm like, no, I'm like, we either fight on the, as the agreed upon rule set, or we just reschedule.

[582] Like, we had the bet match, the contract, it was for a no time limit match.

[583] We should also explain to people that you gave them 10 to 1 on the money.

[584] So you put up $100 ,000 to his $10 ,000.

[585] Correct.

[586] You guys put it in escrow, which is a wild thing to do.

[587] I was the escrow account.

[588] So it's a wild thing to do.

[589] That's how the whole match came because he was competing against him guy who won, like, the Brazilian trials.

[590] And he, like, basically beat Felipe.

[591] It was, like, a terrible match for Felipe.

[592] Fispe won, but he didn't look great.

[593] So he's like, oh, do you want to do a no -time -limit match?

[594] He got called him out publicly.

[595] He's like, do you want to do a no -time -limat match?

[596] we can do a bet match if you want I'm like oh you're doing bet matches in the time limit now I'm like I'll give you 4 to 1 odds I'm like you can pick the number I'll put up 4 to 1 like you put up 10 ,000 I'll put up 40 you put up 100 I'll put up 400 and he makes those big long post basically to say no and I'm like really 4 to 1 no I'm like I'll give you 10 to 1 he's like okay fine 10 to 1 so I'm like okay fine I'm like you pick the number he's like 10 ,000 I'm like 10 ,000 like that's the best fucking number you can come up with I'm like if someone gave me 10 to 1 one odds I'm putting up like at least a hundred grand like fucking figure it out he goes I'll put up 10 ,000 I'm like okay so he wires mo the 10 ,000 I wire mo the 100 ,000 and then he's trying to change the rules and I'm like no we have this like contract agreed on um so I'm like we either fight as agreed or we reschedule the match like if you can fight for 10 minutes you can fight for an hour doesn't fucking make a difference like if you're going to do the match do the match um so then he's like oh no I'm not going to fight I'm not going to fight so then this is where I get interesting because he's like I'm not going to fight I'm not going to fight and doors are about to open so Flo like has a meeting with him and they're like hey like we'll give you some extra money and he's like okay now I'll fight and I'm like okay so you fucking you want it to fight you just fucking want him more money like so so they had to pay him more money to get him to fight and then he goes out and you can always tell when Felipe is starting to lose it he fucking his body language falls apart he starts complaining to the ref so the second he didn't want to sit back We went out of bounds, and he didn't want to go back to bottom guard, which is the position that we finished in.

[597] And I'm like, yep, he's done.

[598] And then I started picking up the pace a little bit, and then we ended up standing back up, and then he just walks over to the judging table.

[599] And Howell was there, and he's like, are you done?

[600] Like, what's wrong?

[601] And Felipe apparently was just, like, looking around, not saying anything, like, just, like, traumatized.

[602] So then, like, there's crowd starts booing him, and then he comes back to the, back to the mat, and I'm like, yep, he's toast.

[603] So then I started picking up the pace more.

[604] And then, like, two minutes later, he's like, okay, he's like, I was like passing his guard about to pass his guard.

[605] And he just looked, he just, I just hear, okay, I'm going to stop now.

[606] And I'm just like, what?

[607] And he's like, I'm going to stop now.

[608] I'm like, really?

[609] He's like, yeah.

[610] I'm like, all right, buddy.

[611] So I just got up and he just fucking quit during the match.

[612] So then he had this whole post -fight interview where he's like, saying, I'm a terrible person and this and that.

[613] So now he's just getting back to his normal life.

[614] Like, things are just starting to settle down.

[615] and I just realized when Mo got here I'm like we have a second bet he's like would you give me the same odds for ADCC I'm like yes absolutely I'm like 10 to 1 so we signed the second contract so now Mo messaged him the other day and he's like hey Filippe you need to send me another $10 ,000 for if you guys meet at ADCC and now he just fucking wakes up to this message like oh man I have to send this fucking guy another 10 grand so now we have a second bet match where if we meet at ADCC, it's the same 10 to 1 odds.

[616] So this is only if, because the brackets are random?

[617] Well, how are the brackets picked?

[618] I do the brackets.

[619] Oh, so you do it.

[620] You select.

[621] Yeah, so, I mean.

[622] Well, you could conveniently select.

[623] I asked them to put the top four seeds on my side, but he told me they couldn't do that.

[624] Yeah, he always does crazy stuff.

[625] I mean, for example, Gordon's the first guy I've ever seen who's doing the super fight and asked to do the division as well.

[626] So he's doing both.

[627] He's going to do the division.

[628] And the crazy thing is this, potentially, very high chance maybe.

[629] I mean, I think Philippe Penna is going to be the second seat.

[630] So if they do meet, it'll be in the finals.

[631] So the two superfight fighters in 2019 was Philippe Penna against Gordon.

[632] So there is a possibility where Gordon would face Philippe Penna, and then the next, you know, an hour later, Andre Galvaal.

[633] So it's just insane.

[634] Someone will definitely kill themselves if I submit Penna and then submit Andre.

[635] Like some hater somewhere is just going to just blow their brains out 100%.

[636] Yeah, yeah, people They've run out of shit to say That's one thing for sure Now they're making The only thing they're making fun of now is my hairline I have like a little widow's peak My dad had like a bad widow's peek They're like man his hairlines receding I'm like that's the best you guys got I'm like this is what we're gonna do now You're just gonna make fun of my hairline Dude I'd kill 50 kittens to have your hair That's all they can make fun of That's hilarious There's a moment where like someone achieves this undeniable success where even the haters have to just take a dig -de -d graph.

[637] It's almost like arguing with liberals about Trump.

[638] Like they just refused to acknowledge facts.

[639] Like there was hundreds of people after the last match like Philippe A3 and O he won that match.

[640] Like they're just like he won the match.

[641] And I'm just like, I'm like, all right guys.

[642] Like I can't even I can't even argue.

[643] Who said that?

[644] Who said that?

[645] There was a ton of them.

[646] I saw the comments.

[647] Yeah.

[648] My issue with that whole thing, that whole Philippe Gordon match was I was actually the one that informed Gordon because he likes to sleep late when he competes.

[649] So it was like 3 .30 p .m. You know, Nat tells me like what happened.

[650] My match might get canceled.

[651] So I was like, shit, I got to wake him up.

[652] So I wake him up and I sit down and I tell him the situation.

[653] And the reality is Gordon was 100 % ready to postpone the match.

[654] So the narrative is that he was the one that was pushing it to happen.

[655] And that's really not the case.

[656] And I know that because I wasn't want to inform them.

[657] So how does Howell fit into that?

[658] So then they did this, they had like this, they had this show on YouTube where, like, they came out and Howell was like, they were doing this interview with these three guys, not this podcast, basically, with three guys.

[659] And Howell, like, basically said that I was, like, offered to move the show, the fight up to the beginning of the car.

[660] and that I was like I said no I refuse and I would only agree I would only fight it and agree upon terms I was not willing to change anything in the contract and that I wasn't willing to reschedule they didn't offer they didn't mention about paying more paying them more money and they like just left some some things out where it just made me look like the bad guy and I'm just like this is just not what happened at all like if you guys are going to like talk about it's a good guy that's what I don't understand like I've known how forever I don't I don't understand what I don't understand what I don't understand what I don't understand what I don't understand why Why would he do that?

[661] Was he misinformed?

[662] Yeah.

[663] So apparently he just got his information from fucking Felipe's Instagram.

[664] I'm like, that's where you fucking got your, I'm like, we both made a public post.

[665] And I'm like, this is just, it's like, I'm okay, where if people call me out for being an asshole and I'm actually an asshole, I'm like, okay, fine.

[666] But like, if you're just going to just attack my character and just say something just didn't happen and blatantly lie about it, then I have a problem with it.

[667] I'm like, just like, no, guys, this is not what happened at all.

[668] It really sucks because he's a very good comment.

[669] commentator.

[670] Yeah, yes.

[671] It's very hard to find someone who's that good at Jiu -Jitsu who understands positions and is also a very good broadcaster.

[672] And I think Howell fits that bill.

[673] He's very good.

[674] He's very talented.

[675] I'd love listening to his commentary.

[676] I was really bummed out and he got fired.

[677] But then when you told me the whole story behind it, I was like, oh.

[678] Yeah, I didn't want him to get fired.

[679] I just, I'm like, guys, you just have to fix this.

[680] Like, this is like, this is not, like, this is not what happened.

[681] Well, he should just apologize.

[682] He just apologize and say he was misinformed and they should hire him again.

[683] He's the best at it.

[684] In terms of like a broadcaster who's like a really good professional broadcaster who's also very knowledgeable in Jiu -Jitsu, understands positions, understands the rule set, understands everything.

[685] For example, he, Hywell signed up because we do ADCC rules seminars because the rules are very complex.

[686] Highwell took the course, and to be honest, very knowledgeable.

[687] So, you know, he took it very serious.

[688] I, you know, me and Hywell bumped heads a few times, but I like them.

[689] We were supposed to do a, you know, for ADCC 2020, we're supposed to do like a pre -match show.

[690] together so I was bummed but I invited him he's going to come to the event and watch so maybe they get ironed it out hopefully yeah I mean he's did he apologize no he didn't he didn't flow flow apologize to me oh he should definitely fucked it up I mean I didn't want him to get fired but he fucked that one up big time yeah but that sucks if you get bad information from someone's Instagram and you think well I know Felipe Felipe is a good guy he would never lie And then you just go and say the thing.

[691] You got to double check.

[692] You should definitely double check.

[693] Especially something that like...

[694] But Felipe is like notorious for doing shit like this.

[695] Like he's like the hardest person ever to negotiate with or do anything with.

[696] Isn't it weird though when someone's that good at something but also has kind of a shifty character?

[697] Yeah, that's like most people in the sport though.

[698] Really?

[699] Yeah.

[700] Because everyone's fighting for the most part over such a small, minuscule amount of money.

[701] And there's so many people in the sport and there's so little money that everyone, and just willing to backstab one another for fucking $10.

[702] But wouldn't you think, though, that at this point, when they've seen how much money you make, because you make so much more money than anybody else, when it comes to, like, selling instructional and just...

[703] It's like a counter to the rest of the guys.

[704] It's so different that you wouldn't you say, hey, you know, like, what is he doing different?

[705] You would think, right?

[706] I should fucking do that.

[707] I don't get it.

[708] I don't get it either.

[709] I think they're just so blinded by hate that they just are just like, fuck that guy.

[710] and they just refuse to even acknowledge anything.

[711] But, yeah, I mean, it makes my job easier.

[712] Yeah.

[713] It's great for me because I'm the only guy doing it.

[714] I mean, not everybody, I mean, no one can do what I do.

[715] Like, no one's going to go on a 60 match winning streak and, you know, be able to call submissions and stuff like that.

[716] But there are other ways to build a brand.

[717] And, you know, these guys are just so bad at it.

[718] But conceivably, someone could do what you've done if they did what you've done.

[719] Yeah.

[720] Like, conceivably, it's possible.

[721] You know, I mean, it's not...

[722] Yeah, if I do it, people could do it.

[723] Yeah.

[724] But it's just, I don't know, man. It's just...

[725] They just don't.

[726] Isn't that interesting when the one person just separates himself from the herd and nobody goes, hey, I need to do what that guy's doing.

[727] And then that becomes, like, the norm.

[728] Like, you must train seven days a week.

[729] You must study tape.

[730] You must analyze it from an intellectual perspective and not just be a brute.

[731] It's so crazy.

[732] Actually, like, I just, we're just releasing it now, like, for ADCC said.

[733] I just wrote a book on this about, like, building brands and, like, how to be successful as a young person or a young athlete and it goes into like a lot of that stuff but it's just crazy how none of these guys can like differentiate themselves like okay if you can't win at least like be different like do something different where it's like you get someone's attention like but you are different the thing is people trying to be different then you get Dylan Dennis yeah you know what I mean you get people just trying a little too hard yeah you know obviously his talent but there's something about that extra trying too hard that people like, eh.

[734] Yeah, it gets like played out.

[735] It doesn't work.

[736] And then, and then when you don't win or you don't compete, then it's just like, then it just kind of spirals out of control.

[737] Then it's like, he's just making a lot of noise.

[738] I mean, my thing with Gorin, too, is he doesn't play it safe.

[739] A lot of guys when they reach the top, that's when they stop taking matches as much and they just want to protect, you know, their position.

[740] He's clearly not doing that.

[741] I mean, he's going into, his division, this has five 80 CCC champions in it.

[742] It's never happened before.

[743] So he's one of them.

[744] So he's got Philippe Penna, Vinnie Magalesis is in there.

[745] Orlando Sanchez, Cyborg, and all these killers.

[746] And he's like, hey, can you put two, three, and four on my side of the bracket?

[747] I'm like, it doesn't work like that.

[748] And I was like, I can't.

[749] I'm like, I'm already going to be there for the weekend.

[750] Like, it's just more free money to get the division.

[751] I'm like, I may as well just fucking do the division and get more money.

[752] Yeah, it makes sense.

[753] Have you read Outliers by Malcolm Gladwell?

[754] I haven't.

[755] It's a really good book.

[756] It's you.

[757] It pertains to you and your success.

[758] It's about the Beatles.

[759] It's about all these different outlets.

[760] liars in sports and art and what they've done that separate them from everybody else like with the Beatles they got this job in Hamburg where they were they were playing seven nights a week they're playing five six hours a night they're playing every night so they left Liverpool they go to Hamburg they're they're playing and they do this for like a couple years and they come back and they are completely different band they're so much better they're so smooth and in sync And then when they came to America, when they broke out worldwide, that was where it all came from.

[761] It all came from insane amounts of hard work, insane amounts of numbers and reps. Did you see, I'm sure you watched The Last Dance?

[762] No, I didn't.

[763] I haven't seen that.

[764] That was really good, too.

[765] I've heard it's really good.

[766] You can see why Jordan was different than the rest of the guys.

[767] Yeah, it's that same thing.

[768] It's just like being willing to put in way more work than everybody else, way more thought into it, way more focus.

[769] And that's where results are achieved.

[770] 100%.

[771] And a lot of these guys, too, like, they're just focused on, like, being athletes.

[772] So, like, they'll teach seminars just to survive, and then they'll just train and do the bare minimum.

[773] But, like, it's like you, like, you're commentating UFC.

[774] You don't just do that.

[775] Like, you have a podcast.

[776] You have this.

[777] You have to be doing other shit besides just training.

[778] Like, you have to, like, get your fucking brand in order.

[779] You got to organize your life.

[780] You got to do all this shit that people don't want to do.

[781] And athletes are so tunnel vision.

[782] I just want to compete.

[783] I just want to do this.

[784] I just want to train.

[785] And you got to branch out and do other shit, too.

[786] Comics are similar, the same way.

[787] Like, when we started doing podcasts in 2009, I told all these comedians, I'm like, do it multiple times a week.

[788] And I'm like, dude, you want to get people addicted.

[789] I go do it three, four times a week.

[790] And even the guys I was doing it with them, like, why are you fucking doing this so much?

[791] And I was like, listen to me. You got to do it more.

[792] The more you put out there, the better you're going to get at it.

[793] And then the more people are going to listen to it.

[794] And they're like, yeah, what I got to do stand -up and this night?

[795] And go, bitch, I do stand -up too.

[796] the fuck we're talking about you go on stage at night well i gotta write well i i fucking write too i write right at night like there's time to do all these things but like the like most of those people i mean some people can change but like most of those people like the second they start making those excuses yeah i'm just like okay like he's done like he's never gonna he's never gonna make it but like i just like give up um yeah but like every now and they get every now and then you get like a guy who like you give him advice you're like okay i'll do that and then they just immediately like it's just so easy just look at the guys who are successful and just use that as the guideline the thing about it is with stand -up there's a there is an argument that impulsive lazy people also can be great stand -ups because they just do it enough where they're going on stage enough and they have these ideas and then they know how to push the idea to the public they know how to set the joke up right, and they do it in front of so many different crowds, that they polish it up to the point where it's this fucking hilarious bit.

[797] Like, I've seen guys that are lazy as fuck, and they're great comics.

[798] And you just got to go, okay, you could be better.

[799] Yeah.

[800] You could be even better than you are.

[801] Believe it or not, and you tell them that, they're like, ah, they don't want to hear it.

[802] That's the problem in Jiu -Jitsu, though, like Gordon said.

[803] A lot of them don't treat it as their career.

[804] It's just like a hobby.

[805] And it's, I tell these guys, it's like any professional sports.

[806] You have a very limited window of your career.

[807] eventually, you know, you're going to have to retire, and they don't think like that.

[808] Do you think it's also because the financial compensation is not at the level of, like, the NBA or something like that, where, like, if you're going to play in the NBA, you're playing against these guys that are, they're fucking grinding.

[809] They're trying to get there.

[810] These guys are practicing every day.

[811] They're focused and driven.

[812] And those are the guys that ultimately succeed.

[813] That's part of it, too.

[814] Another thing that no one talks about to my success is that I have the financial freedom to just focus only on training.

[815] Like most guys will win ADCC and then to support themselves for that year, they'll do like a seminar tour where for three months or four months out of the year they're teaching seminars and they're making active income where you've got to travel here, you've got to travel there.

[816] And that fucks up your training.

[817] And the only reason why people wanted you in the first place for the seminar is because you're talented and you're winning competitions.

[818] So then you just take time away from training, you start losing more, and then the demand for seminars goes down and it kind of spirals out of control.

[819] Whereas I set myself up with the passive income and the instructionals and everything else.

[820] So I don't have to do the seminars if I don't want to.

[821] I just spend all of my time training.

[822] So my training, I have the ability to train way more than these guys because I set myself up in a much better financial position through the passive income.

[823] And no one talks about that.

[824] People spend half the year teaching seminars, and they're like, oh, man, And like, I missed it, I miss, you know, six months of training, and then they lose competitions, and then it just goes down from there.

[825] Is it possible to do both?

[826] Is it possible to travel and still get that training in?

[827] Or is it really, do you really have to be, like, in a specific set and setting?

[828] I mean, you have bodies, right?

[829] But, like, for me, going to Ohio to teach a seminar is not going to be the same as training with John for the weekend.

[830] Right.

[831] Like, it's, I mean, traveling itself just gets old and, like, you're flying all around.

[832] to you not eating probably you're eating airport food and shit so and then you're like mislifting a lot of times a lot of guys travel and they teach a seminar then they'll sit on the beach and it's just without a routine it's tough like it's just much better to stay in a routine so you have like okay I'm doing this this this this today and this this this tomorrow and the traveling gets old and I mean you have bodies but it's not the same as having like a coach with a training program like you just show up at a random gym to teach a seminar and now you have 50 people who you have no idea who they are they're probably going to try to injure you or go super hard right now's my chance to fucking show gordon how good i am it's like no dude i just taught a seminar i'm not trying to fucking get like have you jump into my knee and break my leg right right right that does happen but there's a lot of athletes out there who could go on seminar tours and those are pretty lucrative i mean they can make what two to four thousand dollars per seminar like craig jones it's a great income but it's active income like you have to be there like you There's only so many seminars you can teach.

[833] There's only one you.

[834] There's only so many seminars you can teach in a year.

[835] And every seminar you teach is going to inherently detract from time training.

[836] Whereas your model is put out these DVDs and these videos.

[837] Exactly.

[838] And these instructions.

[839] I spend a weekend in Boston filming an instructional.

[840] And over the course of a year, it'll make me a million dollars.

[841] And it's just one weekend of work for, and then everyone in the world can access it.

[842] It's not like I have to be there to teach a seminar for 200 people.

[843] It's how I just download, I just upload it, and then someone in Europe can buy the instructional and watch it, watch it right at home.

[844] And that's at BJJ Fanatics.

[845] Yeah.

[846] So in doing that, you must, I mean, you must see those techniques and all the training that you've done.

[847] You must see it in other competitors as well, do you?

[848] Oh, yeah.

[849] I mean, a lot of the top -level guys behind closed doors, they'll never admit it, but they tell me like, yeah, I just watch all your instructionals.

[850] And that's how I, that's it.

[851] I mean, and you can see it.

[852] In the older, in, like, my generation and the older generation, you don't see it as much because guys have already fell into their games and they don't want to change, which is why they're getting left behind and the new generation is beating them.

[853] But in the younger generation, like, at ADCC trials, you see a lot of our stuff.

[854] You see, like, the back -attack system.

[855] You see body locks.

[856] You see leg locks.

[857] You see all the stuff that we're doing in the instructionals.

[858] Yeah, it's so interesting to see that systematic, like, very technical approach spreading, you know, like that, that you do see these very, very clear pathways that you guys choose.

[859] And then you see other people adopt those pathways too.

[860] And you see them follow the same things that John is teaching you guys.

[861] You see them, you see other people adopting that.

[862] So for like ADCC, we have eight qualifiers.

[863] So if you win the qualifier, you get to go to the world championship.

[864] So we have North America, South America, Brazil, Europe, and Asia.

[865] The interesting thing to me is the North American trials have skyrocketed past the other regions, past Brazil, past Asia, past Europe.

[866] And this was the first time I did the Brazil trials.

[867] Very tough.

[868] You know, it's a fighting culture, but they're lacking the wrestling and the leg lock.

[869] And if they don't adapt quickly, that gap between the North American athletes and everyone else is just going to get bigger and bigger and bigger.

[870] It's pretty crazy that Brazil, they rejected leg locks for so long.

[871] that some of the really really high -level black belts like if you tap them with a leg like the crowd would throw shoes at you and boo at you used to be viewed as a dirty technique to be honest which is so weird well the thing is it all comes down to technology the people have most technology are going to ultimately win over X amount of years so a big problem for Brazil is the best technology that they have access to or that we have access to is the instructional videos like if you could you could If you can be anywhere in the world and buy a John Danahirt video or a Gordon -Ryne video and you can watch that, that in my opinion, is the best technology that you have.

[872] The problem with Brazil is my instructional's are $250.

[873] That's $1 ,000, and I have 20 of them.

[874] So you're really going to get someone in Brazil that's going to spend $20 ,000, $20 ,000 for us on my instructionals.

[875] They don't have a lot of people in Brazil don't have the financials to be able to purchase the technology.

[876] So that's going to make it harder for them to stay at the level that, you know, America, Europe, that we're operating at because they just don't have access.

[877] A lot of them don't have access to the technology.

[878] Many of them do, but many of them don't.

[879] So it's going to be interesting in the next 10 years.

[880] It's like if you took two islands and you put nerds on one and you put jocks on the other and you have them fight in the first four months, the nerds are going to get beat up.

[881] But then two years from now, now they have fucking spears.

[882] and then they have guns five years later and then the meatheads are still just trying to throw rocks at the notes.

[883] So ultimately, technology is going to prevail.

[884] So I think the big problem that Brazil is running into and we'll run into is they don't have as much readily accessible technology as America, for example.

[885] So I think in the next decade or so, it's going to be a competition between America and Europe, Russia.

[886] When it starts getting money pushing to the sport and it gets bigger, you get a guy who's been wrestling all his life who's fucking group in the fucking middle of nowhere Russia who starts taking up jih Tzu at her early age and he's wrestling like that's going to be a problem what are the best like schools best gyms in terms of like technique that come out of brazil are there some outliers that are more technical there's a i think mika there's a new kid from brazil this for me i think he's going to be the second biggest superstar after gordon he's like 18 years old his dad is producing some serious, serious killers.

[887] A lot of people think...

[888] Mika Galbao?

[889] Yeah, he's a beast.

[890] He's a beast.

[891] I train with him.

[892] My mind was blown.

[893] Very, very talented.

[894] So young, too.

[895] Yeah, he's good in the ghee.

[896] He's good, no ghee.

[897] He speaks perfect English.

[898] And Brazil is a little weird.

[899] It's very rare where all of Brazil will come and support an athlete, and they're all behind Mika.

[900] So his dad is producing...

[901] They got two other athletes in there as well in the 66th division, and these guys are killers.

[902] They were just smoking everyone at the trial.

[903] And do they have that same sort of a systematic tactical approach?

[904] From what I, I think his dad's dad to his coach and he was like a police officer, so he trains like military style.

[905] So whatever he's doing, I mean, it's working.

[906] Another big problem, too, is all the, all the Brazilians who are super successful all move to America.

[907] So most of the Brazilian champions live in America now.

[908] and then you have some good champions that live in Brazil like Felipe lives in Brazil but a majority of the champions moved here to either train or open up schools so it'll be interesting Brazil has a few guys that are good champions that they're producing now like Mika's a very young kid but this over the last five years is a lot less champions coming out of Brazil that's really interesting so they just come over here and then they start schools and make money.

[909] Yeah.

[910] Yeah, which is harder to do over there.

[911] I mean, the other problem, too, is this, if you want to learn leg locks, who do you go to?

[912] Okay, you got John Danaher.

[913] There's some 10th Planet guys who are very good, Lachlan Giles.

[914] There's not that many experts in leg locks.

[915] So, you know, that's a big issue.

[916] And I mean, other than buying DVDs, I don't know how you close that gap.

[917] Because it's, for me, I hate leg locks personally.

[918] It's like a whole other martial art. It's obviously very effective.

[919] But they have to learn that part.

[920] of the game.

[921] And I went to Brazil.

[922] This was the first time I did the Brazil qualifiers myself.

[923] I went there for one reason.

[924] The other ones, they were okay, but I went there to get that passion into Nogi.

[925] And, you know, I was there for two weeks and we smashed it.

[926] A lot of competitors.

[927] So I'm interested to see what happens in 2024 in the next Brazilian trials to see.

[928] Because I've seen the progression in the North American trials massively over the last four years.

[929] So I want to see if that happens in Brazil, because at the end of date, they still own 85, 90 % of all ADCC titles.

[930] It is pretty wild.

[931] You think about it that way, right?

[932] But obviously, that's the birth of Brazilian jiu -jitsu.

[933] Fucking Brazil.

[934] Clearly, duh.

[935] Over the next five years, there'll definitely be more Brazilian, maybe even 10 years, more Brazilian champions than any other country per ADCC.

[936] But the next decade, I think, you'll start to see a shift where it's more Americans, more Europeans.

[937] And are there good guys coming out of Russia Like you were talking about?

[938] Has that happened yet?

[939] Not yet because most of them just are too busy wrestling Or they go right to MMA.

[940] But I think as And a lot of the Samo guys kind of clash and think Jiu -Jitsu is like soft or whatever the case is But I think as a sport grows in popularity And especially when there's more money pushed into it I think you're going to have people who are dedicated From a young age Who are very good at wrestling Like near Olympic level in wrestling but not good enough to make the Olympics, so they do Jiu -Jitsu instead.

[941] And they have like Olympic -level wrestling with high -level intricate J -Jitsu, and that's going to be an issue.

[942] Because the main hole, one of the big, the two major holes of the last decade in Jiu -Zitsu has been leg locks, which is now starting, the gap starting to be filled there, and the integration of standing and ground techniques.

[943] The standing position in Jiu -Jitsu is terrible.

[944] The wrestling for jih Tzu rule sets is mostly terrible.

[945] But when you have Olympic caliber wrestlers who have been trained jih Tutsu since they're five years old, you're going to have a real issue.

[946] Yeah.

[947] So what needs to be done to get more eyes on it?

[948] Because right now, to me, it seems like I know you guys sold thousands of tickets, but those are probably thousands of Jiu -Jitsu students.

[949] Well, I'll be honest.

[950] We ought to do more Rogan shows.

[951] That'll help a little.

[952] So I'll be honest with you.

[953] So 2019, me and my team, realistically, we worked on it for four months.

[954] We didn't really give it our 100%.

[955] But the best feedback I had at 2019 was a middle -aged woman comes up to me. And she's like, I just came here because my son asked me to come and I had a great time.

[956] So my whole thing is I need to cater to the masses.

[957] If I only cater to jitzy fans, I'm not going to grow.

[958] So how do I do that?

[959] For this one, you know, one of the biggest influences for me was Pride FC.

[960] so we're going very heavy on the production and I bring up this analogy all the time how many UFC fans actually train a combat sport it's probably less than 1 % NFL is what 1 % of one you know no one trains it so I need to get the masses and not just cater to jihitsu fans so that's what my goal is with this event the problem is that jujitsu watching jujitsu is not that exciting until someone submits somebody whereas watching mMA everybody understands what's going on.

[961] That guy kicked that guy.

[962] That guy punched that guy.

[963] Oh, my God, he's got his neck.

[964] That's the big thing is it starts at the athletes.

[965] And most athletes are boring.

[966] Like, when I go out, I have, like, the kind of, like, Anderson Silva effect.

[967] Or, like, you go out and you're like, this dude is just going to make his opponent look like he's never trained before.

[968] So, like, that's why people watch me. If you look at what I do, most people are interested in matches because of movement.

[969] Like, that's why Gary's so exciting.

[970] Because, you know, you're going to watch Gary Tonin.

[971] you know it's going to be a fucking sick match because he's going to be just scrambling all over the mat the whole time looking for submissions.

[972] My matches actually don't have that much movement.

[973] But when I get a hold of people, it's just like when I get them into certain positions and they just can't escape, they can't move, they can't do anything.

[974] That's what's interesting.

[975] So most people enjoy movement, but when they watch my matches, it's interesting because of the fact that I just make guys look like they don't know what they're doing.

[976] But most guys are boring.

[977] Like you see Andre go out and he just pushes the guy around for 20, minutes and then hits a shitty double leg and scores too and like yeah everyone knew that was going to happen number one number two no one wanted to watch that um so it really starts uh in the training room um and athlete's always going to train or always going to compete like he trains if you train to fucking submit guys no matter what the rule set is you're going to go out and you're going to try to submit guys yeah there's matches like that one who's number one match between uh Wagner and hanger yeah and hinger it's like oh they just pushed each other around for 15 whole minutes.

[978] No, and there was no wrestling exchanges.

[979] No. There was no Jitsu at all.

[980] It didn't make any sense.

[981] Yeah.

[982] So like, you get a match like that and you're like, oh man, we're going to watch us, who's number one today?

[983] Let me show my friend who's never trained.

[984] And they see that and they're like, what the fuck was that man?

[985] The best part of that match was Eddie Bravo.

[986] Eddie Bravo heckling.

[987] Oh, yeah.

[988] He was saying some, I think he was yelling like Eminari.

[989] Oh, we were hammered.

[990] Yeah, he was yelling out some wild shit.

[991] I think the problem with Jitsu, too, is for the last 20 years, you know, it's been ingrained to the athletes, it doesn't matter how you win.

[992] You can win by an advantage.

[993] You see in the GE championship, they win by an advantage and they'll rip open their ghee like they won the lottery.

[994] And I keep telling these athletes, the days of just winning is not enough.

[995] It's how you win.

[996] You've got to go out and market yourself.

[997] And I think that's the hard part and I was at transitioning from amateur to going a little bit more mainstream.

[998] You have to be exciting.

[999] You have to market yourself.

[1000] Well, some of the young, up -and -coming guys that are very excited, like the Ruea Tola brothers.

[1001] Like, what is the secret of their success?

[1002] These guys are 19 years old.

[1003] I was just thinking about this.

[1004] So the best up -and -comers I've seen are the Rattolo's, Mika Galvao, and there's this American kid, Colabate.

[1005] Yes.

[1006] Who just, he won at 16 years old.

[1007] He won our trials, took everyone out.

[1008] And the one thing I've noticed the common denominator for all of them is extremely supportive parents.

[1009] So Cole's dad's there, Mika's dad, and the Ritolo's mom and father really support them.

[1010] And they've been competing since they've basically been born.

[1011] Those kids are very impressive with the Ritolo brothers I agree with that On a technical level In order to differentiate yourself And be a champion You need to be good at everything Good everywhere And have one to two things You can do better than everybody else So the Ritolo's are good at everything They have a unique ability To manage pacing Better than anybody Better than almost anybody So that's one thing They have a very unique ability To hit Dar Strangles from anywhere.

[1012] They are dark strangle masters more or less.

[1013] They have very good darses and they can finish people with them from any position.

[1014] Top bottom, it doesn't matter.

[1015] And they have an incredible ability to put side to side flanking passing pressure where they're never engaged inside the guard.

[1016] Every time you see them approach a guard, they always touch the legs and they walk to an angle.

[1017] They walk to north -south.

[1018] So the whole time you're in a crunch trying to pull your knees into your chest and they have long they have really long arms so they have hands on your legs and you're trying to make contact with the legs you can't make contact so they have incredible ability to put massive amounts of passing pressure on you if you try to stand up or overextend yourself from bottom position and get up your hand comes out and then you get dars you get strangled with the dars which they're exceptionally good at and then when they see you starting to break from the passing pressure then they pick the pace up so they have three things which they do better than almost anybody else, and that's why they're so successful.

[1019] Everyone has holes in their games, and if you exploit those holes, you can beat them.

[1020] You've seen Craig exploited some of their holes in their game, and Craig managed to beat them, but they do everything well, and they have three things which they do better than almost anybody else.

[1021] So on a technical level, that's why they're so impressive, is because they have something that differentiates them, and they're very dangerous, so you have to respect them from every position.

[1022] Which brother tapped, Gary?

[1023] Ty.

[1024] Ty Ritala.

[1025] Were you surprised by that?

[1026] I was very surprised because we did a whole camp based around Dark Strangles.

[1027] And Gary tried to put a hand in.

[1028] First of all, Gary, he turned towards him and actually gave Ty the arm.

[1029] All he had to do was put his back on the floor.

[1030] So I'm watching him.

[1031] I'm like, what's happening right now?

[1032] And then he turned towards him and Tylocked to Dars.

[1033] And I was like, ooh, that looks tight.

[1034] And then before he can get any of his escapes going, like the cage was in the way.

[1035] And then it just got too tight and he had a tap.

[1036] And I was like, wow.

[1037] Like that was that was not what I expected at all Gary puts himself in danger Like he is a risk Taken motherfucker That dude just flies at you When I watch Gary matches I'm a hundred I'm a hundred times more nervous Watching Gary matches That I am competing myself I watch it and I'm just like I'm like Why do you just let him stuff get flattened out In half guard?

[1038] I'm like why did he just let his back get taken I'm like I'm like just go out there and fucking Like try to kill these people Like, don't just mess around.

[1039] The one time, the two best performances Gary's head was the 155 EBI, where he went out guns blazing and just submitted everybody easily.

[1040] And that was match against Paul Horace, I think.

[1041] Yeah.

[1042] Because he, like, really respected Paul Horace.

[1043] And he was like, I don't want to get my leg broken.

[1044] So.

[1045] Also, Paul Harris at the time was on all the steroids.

[1046] Yeah.

[1047] He was like literally.

[1048] He was so big.

[1049] He's the most feared athlete I've ever seen in ADCC.

[1050] I'll never forget.

[1051] One of his opponents in 2011 goes up to him before.

[1052] They're about to face each other.

[1053] Hey, man, if you catch my leg, please don't break it.

[1054] And there was, I'm not going to name names.

[1055] There was famous athletes who were just terrified of this guy.

[1056] Because he hangs on.

[1057] He doesn't let go when you tap.

[1058] Did you ever see that video with him and David a villain?

[1059] Yeah, yeah.

[1060] That was so dumb because they should have never allowed them to restart with a locked heel hook where you can go ready, set, go.

[1061] Those are in their rules.

[1062] That's so dumb.

[1063] That's so dumb.

[1064] Because in scrambles, you, everyone knows this.

[1065] When you're in the middle of a scramble, like, you're still moving.

[1066] Like, if someone's trying to secure it, you're still defending.

[1067] But if you let a guy say, ready, set, go.

[1068] And all he has to do is just crank on it.

[1069] I agree 100 ,000 percent.

[1070] One of the most controversial, oh, man. Yeah, this is it.

[1071] This is the match.

[1072] So they let him start from here.

[1073] It's a bad break in a heel knee bar.

[1074] So he gets broke?

[1075] Yeah.

[1076] See the knee hyper -extend.

[1077] Yeah.

[1078] Oh, my God.

[1079] How bad was his knee after this?

[1080] I mean, that looks bad.

[1081] I don't know if you get surgery or anything, but if you go slow -mo, you can see right there.

[1082] Yeah, that's a bad break.

[1083] Did he break the knee, or is that like a shin bone break?

[1084] That looks terrible.

[1085] You get A -C -L, you get hamstring.

[1086] I mean, it's a heel knee bar.

[1087] So, he has a heel -hook grip, which means that David can't turn back into the knee -bar.

[1088] Because usually, if you have a knee -bar with only one leg extended, the guy can high -leg and twist and turn.

[1089] But if he turn back into it, the normal way to escape, you get broken with the heel hook because he has a heel hook grip.

[1090] That seems so insane that they would allow this.

[1091] So insane.

[1092] To start from that position?

[1093] Oh, God.

[1094] So insane.

[1095] So I think for this match, this was - Leicester let go.

[1096] Nottingham.

[1097] I think the controversy was he tapped and said he didn't, and that's why they put up.

[1098] Paul Harris did?

[1099] No. Avon said he didn't tap.

[1100] Really?

[1101] There was some confusion.

[1102] My memories.

[1103] Oh, let's see that.

[1104] Let me see that.

[1105] I want to see if he tapped.

[1106] Where?

[1107] See, that's when they say...

[1108] Oh, that's a tap.

[1109] See his leg?

[1110] Oh, that seems like he tapped.

[1111] Yeah, watch.

[1112] Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[1113] They should have looked at that tape and said that's a wrap.

[1114] But that's one of the most controversial things we do in ADCCs.

[1115] We'll let you out of the bounds, just specifically for that.

[1116] Look, Paul Hars is trying to...

[1117] Hey, I'm trying to hug.

[1118] Trying to hug.

[1119] Oh, we want to do it again?

[1120] Okay, but let's have a fully locked -in heel hook.

[1121] I would have been like it's over.

[1122] I'm bad, man. The fake tap is one of the saddest things.

[1123] It's so sad.

[1124] Yeah, he tapped out Matt Linland twice.

[1125] Yeah.

[1126] I had to fight that fucking guy a week after ADCC.

[1127] I had, like, my broken hand still.

[1128] I was, like, all beat up from ADCC.

[1129] And, like, the weekend after I had to go out and fight him.

[1130] He was huge.

[1131] Paul Horace.

[1132] Yeah, he's a giant dude.

[1133] He's so jacked.

[1134] He shows up being a tank top.

[1135] He's, like, 2 .30.

[1136] I'm like, oh, my God.

[1137] He's extremely awful.

[1138] Extremely flexible, too.

[1139] It's weird.

[1140] He can do full splits.

[1141] He can rotate his entire torso very easily.

[1142] Really?

[1143] Yeah, I mean.

[1144] That's interesting for a guy that's that built.

[1145] Yeah, he was like full splits and stuff.

[1146] Yeah, he was one of the scariest guys in M .M .A. And then, you know, a few guys figured out his game.

[1147] Belcher, right?

[1148] Yeah, Alan Belcher.

[1149] Alan Belcher trained, I believe he took Lister down to camp with him.

[1150] And they just went over every single aspect of leglock defense.

[1151] And that's all they drill.

[1152] They just drilled that constantly.

[1153] And so he actually entered into, like, leglock positions, entered into Ashi positions, and then beat him up.

[1154] Countered him.

[1155] Belcher's a bad motherfucker, though.

[1156] I hear that.

[1157] Belcher's fighting.

[1158] He's a boxer now.

[1159] And he's a heavyweight.

[1160] Is he?

[1161] Yeah.

[1162] I don't know.

[1163] He's fucking huge.

[1164] Go, Alan Belcher boxing.

[1165] Yeah.

[1166] I didn't know that.

[1167] He's boxing people now.

[1168] Look at the size of him.

[1169] That's him?

[1170] Hello, Usada.

[1171] That's incredible.

[1172] Dude, he's a tank.

[1173] Yeah, he fought 185 in the UFC, but obviously cutting weight to make 185, but now he's a super jacked heavyweight.

[1174] See if you can find a video of him.

[1175] He actually looks very good.

[1176] Well, he's a smart guy.

[1177] Alan's a very smart guy, and he's a very disciplined guy.

[1178] So, like, oh, it's bare knuckle boxing.

[1179] Oh, Jesus.

[1180] That's even grosser.

[1181] Everyone comes into these fights.

[1182] Like, guys who used to fight MMA, they're all, like, three times the size.

[1183] I love it is the bare knuckle thing is weird how that's become so popular but you know like no one has bare knuckle MMA yeah it's it's weird because you really should I mean if you can shin someone in the face like why can't you punch him with a bare knuckle if you can elbow someone in the face why can't you punch it with a bare knuckle that was an always interesting thing to me about Japan they didn't allow elbows but soccer kicks of the head no problem it stomps yeah soccer kits stomp's just soccer kicks are brutal.

[1184] You really have an unrealistic idea of what your hands are capable of though if they're wrapped and gloved because your hands are very delicate instruments.

[1185] I mean, some people's more than others, obviously, but no matter what you do with your hands, these fucking bones are not meant to be hitting people.

[1186] They must like break their hands every fight.

[1187] All the time.

[1188] Fedor used to break his hand almost every fight.

[1189] Yeah, I mean, it's so common.

[1190] Well, it's common in MMA.

[1191] It's common in boxing, just in regular boxing.

[1192] And in the last fight, just this past weekend, Cyril Gone, broke his head, and on Taitui Vasa's head.

[1193] Oh, wow.

[1194] Yeah, but this, the thing about bare knuckles, I don't understand what they're doing with those wraps because they don't really have bare knuckles.

[1195] I mean, the knuckles are bare, but the hand is somehow another supported, which I think, you should be fucking bare knuckle, bear knuckle.

[1196] It's like, just have you have bare elbows, you have bare knees, you have bare feet.

[1197] Yeah, does it protect their hands?

[1198] Maybe for wrist?

[1199] It must do something.

[1200] Wrist support, maybe?

[1201] Yeah, wrist support for sure.

[1202] I mean, when you think about it, like, if your wrist fist is shaped like that, if you hit anything on the edge, it's going to jack your wrist up.

[1203] You know, it'll fuck you up.

[1204] These two bones are the only bones that are really supported.

[1205] These break all the time, though the little ones by your pinky and the ring finger.

[1206] Do you think it's the way they throw punches?

[1207] Because, like, I remember Federal used to throw these huge looping punches.

[1208] Right.

[1209] Those casting punches.

[1210] Yeah, he throws punches like this, too.

[1211] Like, he'll throw these kind of weird punches.

[1212] There's something to that.

[1213] It's also, it's chaos.

[1214] You throw him punches.

[1215] You try to hit him with these knuckles, but you hit him with these two.

[1216] And then your hand shatters.

[1217] And then you have the swollen fucking mass inside your leather glove.

[1218] And you have like two more rounds to fight with a broken man. Guys do it all the time.

[1219] But it's just weird to me. Like, Yariah Faber when he fought Mike Brown.

[1220] He fought both, both his hands.

[1221] He broke both his hands.

[1222] He's throwing elbows.

[1223] Oh, my gosh.

[1224] Yeah, it's interesting because that's the only aspect of MMA where you're, the part of, your weapon is protected.

[1225] And it's really kind of the weakest weapon.

[1226] You know, a punch is, I mean, it's very powerful, obviously, but it's very weak in comparison to a kick.

[1227] Or an elbow, yeah.

[1228] Or an elbow.

[1229] Yeah, I mean, an elbow, you feel nothing.

[1230] You could, like, you could do that on a table and it doesn't bother you at all.

[1231] If you did that with your hand, that would really fucking hurt.

[1232] But you see these guys, you know, fighting in bare knuckleboxing, and you're like, that's really interesting, how that's kind of taking off.

[1233] It's getting bigger, right?

[1234] I mean, a lot of these...

[1235] They're smart marketing.

[1236] They're doing a great job.

[1237] You know, they get a lot of hot chicks over there.

[1238] Do you see that last girl?

[1239] She flashed the crowd.

[1240] Does her name, tie something or another?

[1241] That's amazing.

[1242] Yeah, she showed everybody her tits after she knocks some girl up.

[1243] Nice combination, too.

[1244] She hit this girl with a clean uppercut and a smooth left hook, and then she's like, and here's my tits, too.

[1245] Sign up to my only fans.

[1246] Yeah, I mean, why not?

[1247] Bonus for the next one.

[1248] Yeah, I mean, it was on all over these websites.

[1249] For our first, bare -knuckle boxer flashes of the crowd.

[1250] Smart marketing business.

[1251] move, right?

[1252] Yeah.

[1253] It's just the, I think it should be bare knuckle.

[1254] I also think there should be no cage.

[1255] I really think they should be fighting on like an open field.

[1256] I'm like, if you have a field for football, why don't you have a field for MMA?

[1257] Just have them stand in the center and just fight.

[1258] Like, because it's too easy to get up if you have a cage.

[1259] Yeah.

[1260] Someone presses you up against the cage.

[1261] You can walk, you get back up to your feet.

[1262] The cage changes it completely.

[1263] Wee!

[1264] Oh, Jesus.

[1265] That's the full one.

[1266] Some good -sized cans, too.

[1267] Congratulations, lady.

[1268] It was a nice combination, too.

[1269] that watch the combination boom and look at this clean left hook smack very nice she's hot and she gets crap that was bare knuckle as well yep yeah well they're they're you know they've fought they got page van zant went over there rachel awestovitch so they got these hot girls fighting each other is that in the u .s yeah they can fight in like Wyoming okay i was going to say how did they get sanctioned yeah i think they can only fight in Wyoming it was like fucking cowboy show up with dip in their mouth and I mean, the original Fresh bear scratches Yeah, Wyoming's a wild -ass place.

[1270] It's such a small population And it's like super -duper rich people in like Jackson Hole And then ranchers Yeah It's weird Every hundred miles Yeah, I'm pretty sure that's the only place where they do it Or maybe Oklahoma In Bangkok Oh, in Thailand The one you just saw?

[1271] Yeah, that one was So they're doing it outside the United States as well But they're signing a bunch of, you know, former MMA fighters that just sometimes their knees are gone.

[1272] I think Hector Lumbar was doing it as well.

[1273] Yeah, Hector's doing it.

[1274] Mike Perry just beat Michael Venom Page, which is pretty crazy.

[1275] That's a big win for him.

[1276] Venom Page is a bad motherfuckerucker.

[1277] Monroe, Louisiana.

[1278] Oh, interesting.

[1279] Oh, was in Montana.

[1280] So they do have some in other states.

[1281] Interesting.

[1282] So one's in Montana, Monroe, Louisiana.

[1283] Yeah, it's like, I don't know how they sanction that.

[1284] I don't know what the rules are in terms of, but I'm surprised that no one has come up with a bare -knuckle MMA organization.

[1285] Used to be in the beginning, right?

[1286] Well, you know, you have Lettwe, which is bare -knuckle, like, moitai style with head butts.

[1287] That's David Leduc, that fucking savage.

[1288] He's the king of that shit.

[1289] I trained with him once.

[1290] He's a wild guy to watch.

[1291] Oh, yeah?

[1292] Yeah, he came to Henzos.

[1293] He was in town for, I think, we were at Mosvidal versus Diaz, was New York, right?

[1294] Yes, I believe so.

[1295] I think it was that card, and he was in town, and he came to Henzas the next day, and we did jiu -suitz.

[1296] He's like a blue belt, a purple belt.

[1297] Mm, yeah.

[1298] Yeah.

[1299] I think he's talking about doing some MMA.

[1300] I think he's thought about doing it.

[1301] He definitely entered into a grappling tournament.

[1302] I saw some video of him in a grappling tournament, strangling some people.

[1303] Yeah, he's not bad.

[1304] Not bad.

[1305] He's a wild striker, though.

[1306] I'll tell you that, man. And he's, like, one of the rare guys that, like, puts combinations together with headbutts.

[1307] So, like, as he's holding pads, he head butts the pads.

[1308] Yeah, he's got a good social media, too.

[1309] Yeah.

[1310] Just, like, him, like, breaking watermelts and shit with head butts.

[1311] What's his name, David Luduke?

[1312] Yeah, that can't be good for your head.

[1313] That just can't.

[1314] I mean, you're trying to, I mean, soccer players get CTE.

[1315] From that fucking...

[1316] Just hitting the ball?

[1317] That light -ass, bouncy -ass ball.

[1318] Imagine, like, slamming your head into tie -pad.

[1319] That can't be good for the Noggin.

[1320] I mean, I'd like to talk to him in a few years.

[1321] And just ask him what his memory's like.

[1322] How many more years do you think that you can maintain this level of dedication?

[1323] Have you thought about this?

[1324] Yeah.

[1325] So it's all, number one, pending my health, particularly in my stomach, which is like probably 70 % better now.

[1326] That's amazing.

[1327] Like, the last podcast, like I told you, like, I literally have no idea what we talked about at all.

[1328] besides me telling you that I was nauseous.

[1329] Because you were trying not to puke.

[1330] I was so nauseous.

[1331] I was just like, come on, fucking hold on the other.

[1332] Tell everybody what happened.

[1333] So what happened was you got staff infection.

[1334] Hanzos in New York City was notorious for giving people staff, that basement, because it got no sunlight.

[1335] It was down there, and you got a bunch of savages out there strangling each other and sweating in this puddle, and it just got funky, right?

[1336] And so you got bad staff.

[1337] So I had recurring staff infections in 2018, and then, uh, I was taking oral antibiotics, and it just wiped out everything in my stomach, like all the good bacteria, everything.

[1338] And then I had, but I ended up being a fungal overgrowth, a massive fungal overgrowth in my small intestine, and a huge bacterial imbalance in my stomach, and then H. Pylori, which I had.

[1339] But it was misdiagnosed as gastroporesis because I did a stomach emptying test where you eat, like, radioactive eggs.

[1340] and they scan your stomach every X amount of like every half hour to see how it moves through the stomach and I was emptying slow and so they misdiagnosed as gastroporesis I still have people message me every single day who like are catching up on the podcast they're like man I just saw Joe tell what you did for your gastroporesis I'm like I don't fucking have gastroporesis but they misdiagnosed it after like four years I went to like all the best doctors in the country and they're just useless like they just oh we'll do an endoscopy I had one guy do a colonoscopy, and they're like, yeah, you look fine.

[1341] And I was like, okay, well, if I can't get these doctors to figure it out, I guess I'm just going to deal with it.

[1342] Hopefully it'll get better.

[1343] And then it just got worse as time went on because the fungal overgrowth just started getting worse and worse.

[1344] And then it was, like, affecting my kidney function, and it was just, like, awful.

[1345] And then I had to, like, partially, I took a leave of absence.

[1346] I guess I, like, retired from grappling from a year because I couldn't even, like, function as a human being.

[1347] you never mind like i couldn't even like hold the conversation i was so nauseous all the time um and then uh we were doing the podcast and i was like traveling i was like looking at houses in austin because you convinced me to move to austin and i was here like eating restaurant food like three days before and we went to the podcast and i was like fuck i can't even talk right now um but uh because you used to have to eat very bland food otherwise even even even i would just wake up like 24 -7 nauseous like the best way i can describe it as the worst hangover you ever had like where you want to throw up to feel better but you can't that's like my baseline and then it gets worse from there and then like imagine you go to training and like now picture you have the worst hangover you've ever had and you have to run a marathon 30 minutes later like the more tired you get the worse it gets um so then i was like yeah i just i can't do this anymore um and then somehow like the stars aligned and actually his doctor in california because he had some bad stomach problems he He's like, you've got to go to Dr. Rebar in California.

[1348] And I saw him, and he's like, yeah, I don't think you have gastroporesis.

[1349] I think you just have something in your small intestines, which is backing up into your stomach and causing like a bile and food back up.

[1350] And that's why you're emptying slowly, and it's mimicking gastroporesis.

[1351] So he did a bunch of tests that no one's ever done.

[1352] And, like, my levels are, like, way off.

[1353] Like, one of the things was, like, normal was between, like, zero and five.

[1354] and then high was like like over five or over 10 and my level was like 5505.

[1355] It was just like 50 times of what it was supposed to be.

[1356] So he, so I've been on this treatment now for a year, a year in October and I'm like 70, 75 % better now.

[1357] I can actually like hold the conversation.

[1358] I can eat food.

[1359] I can like do shit.

[1360] And now I'm competing again.

[1361] So are there cases in like medical literature that talk about?

[1362] people taking high levels of antibiotics over, because you took it over a 12 -month period, right?

[1363] You were constantly on antibiotics.

[1364] Yeah, because, so basically, you take the antibiotics and it wipes out the good bacteria in your stomach, and then your immune system is trying to fix that.

[1365] So then your immune system's low.

[1366] It's not as strong as it usually is, and you're training all the time, so I'm always just run down, and then you get staff again, and then you take more antibiotics, and then it wipes out your stomach even worse, so then your immune system on overdrive trying to fix it and then you get staff again.

[1367] So you just, it's like a cycle where you just keep getting staff and keep fucking up your immune system and your stomach.

[1368] So there was probably like a year period from like 2018 to 2019 where I think I was on antibiotics more than I wasn't for staff.

[1369] I would like get staff and be like on 10 days, two weeks of medicine and then three days later I'd have staff again and I go back on antibiotics.

[1370] Like it was just miserable.

[1371] And for anybody who's, never take an antibiotic and tried to work out.

[1372] It just drains you.

[1373] It just kills you.

[1374] You have no cardio.

[1375] You have nothing.

[1376] So then I started using hibic cleanse in the shower when I would train.

[1377] It's like the soap that they use to wash their hands before surgery.

[1378] It's like a super strong soap.

[1379] And that helped a lot.

[1380] And then I met his doctor, Dr. Rabar.

[1381] And now that I'm getting better, I hardly ever get stuff.

[1382] I get like maybe like once every six months.

[1383] Do you use defense soap?

[1384] I know John was skeptical of that, but it's because he hasn't seen the research on it.

[1385] Like, defense soap is fucking legit.

[1386] Yeah.

[1387] And the good thing about it is it doesn't kill any of the bad bacteria, or the good bacteria, rather.

[1388] That's the thing with hiboclonez is that wipes out everything.

[1389] That's not good.

[1390] But I'll try defense soap because, like, there was like a point where if I didn't use, if I was like on the mats and I didn't use hiboclens, I was guaranteed to get staff.

[1391] I will have them send it to you.

[1392] Okay.

[1393] But my friend Guy Sacco, who runs a company, he, created it because wrestlers, like they were working with wrestlers, and they were all getting staff.

[1394] And so he did all this research into various essential oils and things that are good for healthy bacteria, but kill off bad bacteria.

[1395] So it's got like eucalyptus oil and tea tree oil.

[1396] Yeah, I'd love to try it.

[1397] And it also smells good.

[1398] It's only soap I use.

[1399] I'm going to try it.

[1400] I use it every day.

[1401] But it just, it stopped for me. It stopped all staff, ringworm.

[1402] I was getting it all the time, but I got two, I got staffed twice and I got ringworm.

[1403] probably three or four times okay so it was annoying as far I don't get it at all and I wasn't getting it at all when I was using it on a daily basis it's just it also it just like it smells good okay it's it's just bad like regular soap but it yeah and they have wipes they have all kinds of shit that you like they have stuff they're like even if you can't get to a shower immediately they have these wipes that look like those butt wipes yeah and just fucking clean yourself off with them but I definitely love to try that but to your original point of how long I'm gonna compete for right so uh so But keep going on with that.

[1404] So what did they do to, how did he, what it was the medication to fix that?

[1405] So I just got, he just got, like, got to my house to do this show.

[1406] And he's like, what are all these fucking pills?

[1407] I literally have, like, 30 pill bottles that I have to take twice a day.

[1408] And it's just a combination of, like, over -the -counter stuff to help me. There's, like, nothing that's in it, that's a, that's a prescription.

[1409] But he gave me, I'm on a strong oral antifungal.

[1410] First I did eight, first I treated the H. pylori um and then i'm on a strong antifungal and then all just like immune and like gut supporting uh medicines that just take time to rebuild the gut bacteria and flush out the the fungus and the bad the bad bacteria so i know we talked about this before in the last time but what is you have you ever said you know i'm going to take like a month and just do some serious hardcore fasting and see if that helps so i i did do the fasting um it wasn't my choice i just literally couldn't eat.

[1411] But I did try to do probably about three weeks of fasting.

[1412] And it just, it didn't help.

[1413] I think I needed the medicine.

[1414] The first success I had was when you introduced me to Brigham with the ways to well.

[1415] So they gave me, you know, a bunch of stuff which increased my appetite a lot and was helping.

[1416] I was able to, because my main thing is keeping weight on and gaining size.

[1417] I'm like a very big, but I'm a small heavy weight.

[1418] So my depending on my stomach, I'd be 205, you know, one day, and then I have a good month, and then I'm 225, 230, then I'm back to 210, and my weight would fluctuate based on how much I could eat.

[1419] So they put me on this regimen, and they gave me, you know, a bunch of stuff that increased my appetite, so I got super big, but I was still getting nauseous, so it didn't, like, fix the problem.

[1420] I could eat more, but then I would just be nauseous after.

[1421] So then I was using a combination of the ways to well stuff with his doctor and now their stuff makes me more hungry and I can actually eat food now so everything's getting a little better and I feel like I used to just eat like two eggs and I would just feel it like sitting in my stomach it just wouldn't filter down so I would just be carrying food all day long and then I'm trying to force feed myself to keep the weight on and they actually did a test and they're like yeah you're not only can you not eat but your body's only absorbing like 60 % of the food that you actually do eat So I was eating like 10 times less than I was supposed to And then just not absorbing half of it So it was just like a total disaster How much longer do you have to be on all this medication?

[1422] Well, I have to do a retest like this week I have to take a like a P test and some blood work And then I'm going to do a meeting with him on September 20th Right after ADCC And then he's going to tell me where to go from there We have to see what my levels are But I'm sure he's going to keep me on a lot of the stuff It's just like overall stuff to like help promote digestion and an overall stomach function.

[1423] But I'm just listening to what he says because everything he's said so far has been accurate.

[1424] A lot of the meds are over the counter, right?

[1425] They're all over the counter.

[1426] Because he's a medical doctor, but he's also like a holistic guy as well.

[1427] Like an integrative guy.

[1428] Because I had stomach problems too.

[1429] I went to UCLA.

[1430] I went to Cedars.

[1431] I even went to the emergency room six times because I thought I had a heart attack.

[1432] And yeah, it's like so much pressure in my chest.

[1433] And they're like, it's not your heart.

[1434] So I went to every doctor I go to this guy He fixes me in one week And it's been seven years What was your issue?

[1435] I had a parasite Oh Wow So they thought And I went to You know The best doctors in the world And none of them could figure it out What kind of parasite was it?

[1436] I don't know what the exact name was But I went to Mauritius Which is a very tropical island And so I took antibiotics I was cured in a week So I know he's messed up Because he's been over a year of treatment So That's wild crazy.

[1437] Yeah, that was...

[1438] And still dominating everything.

[1439] It was rough.

[1440] I'm looking back now, I have no fucking idea how I did this.

[1441] So, like, we're doing tape study a lot of times, and, uh, like, we were doing tape study with my match against Lucas Barbosa.

[1442] And, uh, I'm, like, talking about tactics.

[1443] And so, right before the points, uh, part of the, uh, the fight started, I set to guard, and I'm like, I'm like, pause.

[1444] So there's like, 20 of the guys watching the tape.

[1445] And I'm like, you see, tactically, he's, um, the guys watching the tape.

[1446] And I'm like, you see, tactically, here.

[1447] I should have just kept hand fighting because he was getting really tired.

[1448] He was way more exhausted than I was.

[1449] I'm like, I should have just kept hand fighting and kept wrestling him.

[1450] I would have broke him in the next few minutes.

[1451] I'm like, but I was so goddamn nauseous that I had to just fucking sit to guard and recompose myself to get ready for the overtime because I fucking just couldn't wrestle anymore because I was so nauseous.

[1452] So like a lot of stuff you see me do isn't tactically correct, but I'm just like trying to manage the nausea through the match.

[1453] What's crazy that when you talk about if your health holds up with most grapplers, they're like, oh, my back, my arm, my this, my that.

[1454] But you, it's just a stomach thing.

[1455] Just my stomach for now, yeah.

[1456] So if that gets still 100%, how much longer do you think you maintain this level of discipline?

[1457] An activity.

[1458] First is contended upon John coaching.

[1459] I'm not going to compete unless John's coaching.

[1460] Really?

[1461] Yeah.

[1462] So if he retires, you're done.

[1463] Yeah, I'm done.

[1464] Or if he fucking gets into a car accident or something, yeah.

[1465] Wow.

[1466] So, you know, John is a major part of this, so I won't do it at him.

[1467] And that is also a huge part of it.

[1468] She runs the diet and the lifting and supplements and everything.

[1469] That's such a giant advantage.

[1470] Having a girlfriend who really knows her shit when it comes to like bodybuilding and weightlifting.

[1471] So probably without John or without her, I probably wouldn't do it.

[1472] So as long as those two are there, I'll be doing it probably until I'm 40.

[1473] I want to compete until I'm 40.

[1474] 13 more years.

[1475] That's wild.

[1476] Everyone's like, oh man, Gordon's in his peak now.

[1477] it's like no like my peak is going to be like between 35 and 40 because what people don't understand is most sports you peak earlier because they're explosion -based sports football explosion -based sport wrestling explosion -based sport um but in jihitsu it's a sport built mostly around isometric tension and my entire game isn't a movement based game it's an isometric tension game it's about negation of movement i'm not athletic so i don't try to make myself more athletic than the other guy i try to make him less athletic than I am.

[1478] So you peak, especially with my kind of game, or like a Hodra kind of game, you peak much later.

[1479] So instead of peaking where you have, you know, your 28 and now your explosivity will decline after that age, it doesn't matter.

[1480] My game isn't built around being explosive.

[1481] It's built around being isometrically strong and negating movement.

[1482] So you hit your isometric peak between the ages of 35 and 40 while you still maintain cardio.

[1483] After 40, you start to diminish with the cardio.

[1484] But between 35 and 40 is when I'll be my strongest and I'll have another 10 to 15 years of technical development which I've only been training for 12 years now so I'll have twice as much technical development and I'll be more physically mature by the time I'm 35 so that's the time I'm really going to peak it's not now at 27 it's 35 to 40 wow that's wild we just got to make sure we get more eyes on this fucking sport that's that's the thing it's just if guys like you people like the Rutolo brothers, people like Mika Galvao, people who are submitting people.

[1485] These young guys that are coming up, guys like Gary, exciting people to watch.

[1486] Mar Galley's doing a real good job, too.

[1487] Yes.

[1488] And amazing, him coming over from Geat.

[1489] Yeah.

[1490] And now, like, that fight with Lovato was amazing.

[1491] To dominate him and almost finish him.

[1492] You know what's crazy about that is Nicholas never did standing position ever in his life.

[1493] No, not in the ghee.

[1494] He never wrestled, never did anything.

[1495] All that wrestling was like two months of wrestling with John.

[1496] That's crazy.

[1497] I've never seen a gey guy transition to no gey like that.

[1498] He's been training, what, five months?

[1499] That's even less than that.

[1500] That's insane.

[1501] Just so smart the way he went to you guys.

[1502] Just such a smart move.

[1503] Yeah, he was willing.

[1504] I mean, he's with it.

[1505] Like, he understands, like, you know, what we're doing.

[1506] And he has the same mindset of, you know, control that leads to submission.

[1507] So he's, like, a perfect fit.

[1508] Have you seen, like, an uptick of people watching and people, like, has, who's number one and flow?

[1509] Have they noticed that there's, like, a steady increase in the amount of viewership?

[1510] 100%.

[1511] I mean, I'll be honest with you.

[1512] The problem is a lot of jiu -suits who's just painful to watch.

[1513] Right.

[1514] Like, the ghee is rough.

[1515] John Jock Machado said that.

[1516] He goes, man, the ghee is so boring.

[1517] Even I don't like.

[1518] This last who's number one was the, was the, me and Penna, was the biggest flow grappling show ever by a landslide.

[1519] It was bigger than 2019 ADCC.

[1520] So now this ADCC is going to blow everything out of the water.

[1521] So there's definitely a huge increase.

[1522] So when you say big, like how many people tuned in?

[1523] I don't know, I don't know the numbers.

[1524] They don't get the metrics.

[1525] They don't tell you?

[1526] Oh, they're like Netflix?

[1527] Yeah.

[1528] Yeah, fuck out of here.

[1529] Tell me the numbers.

[1530] I know.

[1531] But they just like, it was like, they said it was bigger by a landslide.

[1532] The problem with the ghee, though, is it's, it's competitor -based.

[1533] They're never going to, I just don't see them ever getting massive amounts of people to go watch.

[1534] They'll always have a lot of competitors.

[1535] like last weekend I think they had five or six thousand competitors but they're never going to get spectators it's just there's too much education to appeal to the masses in my opinion the best part is is that people will never admit this and they fucking hate it I think I'm the only person who can save gijitsu like if I started competing the ghee that's the only way people would watch it but no one will ever say that have you you have thought about doing that right yeah I'm gonna start mostly I just want to learn how to teach in the ghee just so I can, if I ever have a school or something, I can teach students.

[1536] So I'm confident in the ghee now.

[1537] Like, I train with Merigali and the ghee and other Blackbought World Champions, so I know where I stand.

[1538] But I don't feel like I can teach Gigi Jitsu as good as I can teach no Gigi Jitsu.

[1539] So I'm going to start training in the Ghee after ADCC just recreationally.

[1540] And then if I want to compete, then I'll do a match here and there.

[1541] But I definitely want to start training in the GEE just to sharpen up the teaching and everything.

[1542] Oh, everything.

[1543] Could you imagine if you won a Ghee World title?

[1544] Oh, my gosh.

[1545] Well, that would also be a great way to get people to compete against you because they would probably jump at that.

[1546] Yes.

[1547] There's a lot of Gie guys that are experts in collars and sleeves.

[1548] I've seen them in the Ghee.

[1549] People, they don't believe him.

[1550] I'm like, he's really good in the Ghee.

[1551] I've seen him with my own eyes.

[1552] They just think you lose your powers he put on the Gis.

[1553] That's not how it fucking works.

[1554] No. John Giac Machado used to tell me, because, you know, John Jock only has one hand.

[1555] Yeah.

[1556] So when he transitioned to Abu Dhabi, It was very easy for him.

[1557] He goes, because he never grabs.

[1558] Like, his game is all overhooks and underhooks, but he was elite in the ghee and elite in no ghee with basically the same game.

[1559] Yeah.

[1560] He was so good, though.

[1561] Oh, John John's a bad motherfucker.

[1562] Like, all, my entire game is, like, if you're standing and I'm on bottom, you go into Ashi Garami.

[1563] Well, if I have pants to grab and I'm in Ashi Garami, it's going to be easier to knock you down.

[1564] Yeah.

[1565] If you're on your knees, then I go butterfly sweep at Summeguishis.

[1566] If I can get to a belt and pull you onto me, I can hit Sumigishi is easier.

[1567] And then it's forcing half guard from top position.

[1568] And if I can get to half guard and I can feed a lapel and use a stronger cross face, I can pass your guard easier.

[1569] Yeah.

[1570] And then mount and back, there's just more friction to hold people and more callus to strangle with.

[1571] It's just the main thing that fucks me up is like if I get caught in like a like a spider guard or lasso guard like with an expert who like can like keep my grips and not allowed me to start flanking the legs and I got caught like in a deep spider guard or something.

[1572] it's kind of annoying but people are just idiots and just think that you just lose all of your jiu -jitsu if you take the ghee off or put the guy on.

[1573] Yeah, that's pretty dumb.

[1574] But they're hoping.

[1575] But at least you could trick them and be competing with you for a little while.

[1576] I don't think we've ever seen a no -gee guy go to ghee though.

[1577] I like a strictly no -gey guy.

[1578] I can't think of one.

[1579] It's always been geese to no -e.

[1580] Yeah, no, I don't know.

[1581] So it's more technical.

[1582] Got a train of the ghee to be good at no -gee.

[1583] Well, that was always always always.

[1584] weird thing where the MMA fighters would tell me that their instructor made them train the gey I go explain how that makes any sense yeah and Eddie Bravo would say like okay now imagine if you were supposed to be playing the U .S. open for tennis and they said my friend you got to learn racquetball yeah like what it's a fucking there's just a wall why am I playing racquetball yeah they got to get more technical imagine any Olympic trainings until they just bring in geese for the wrestlers to wear right like you're going to do judo today I always thought that combat Samba was so strange because they're wearing headgear and chin pads and MMA gloves and a fucking and shorts but with a kimono top yeah that's that's odd that's out there yeah that's what federal is in yeah yeah yeah that's what he came from yeah I mean that was his uh he was a world champion in that my career is rolling around on the ground so I can't really talk shit so you think by time you're 40 then you'll you'll be done where do you think the sport will be by then I mean if really look into the future in 13 years.

[1585] How big do you think can it grow?

[1586] I think there's going to be some money.

[1587] I mean, the problem is, like, I'm trying the best I can, but I'm one guy.

[1588] So, like, I'm trying.

[1589] I mean, there's a trickle -down effect, so everyone's going to get paid.

[1590] Everyone who fights me gets paid, like, twice as much.

[1591] So athletes will make more, but I think that it is possible to bridge the gap into a spectator sport.

[1592] I think there's always going to be a cap on how many people will watch it.

[1593] Like, it's never going to be as big as the UFC.

[1594] But I think it'll be a lot bigger than it is.

[1595] And I think that, we can start getting people to get paid well as like real athletes for for matches like um i think that i'll be making seven figures a fight and other people are making six figures a fight um so that people can compete and not have to worry like they can just compete and be athletes like right now if you want to make a career you have to own a school or you have to teach seminars you have to do something else you can't just be a competitor um like for most people um you know now I'm competing, I can be, like, I'm the first guy, I think, who can just make a, like, a career and be rich off just competing.

[1596] But we're a long way off to have anybody else be able to do that.

[1597] How much of an impact has, I know you just recently started using a cold plunge.

[1598] How much of an impact has that had on your recovery?

[1599] Yeah, so I, I had the Morose Co. And you were talking about it, and then Brigham had one.

[1600] And for those of you who don't know, I fucking hate cold water.

[1601] like if it's below 80 degrees i won't get it so so i'm like talking to rogan he's like been trying to convince me so that i met him he's like sauna cold plunge heat chalk proteins try it bro and i'm like i'm like so then one day i'm like oh fuck so then our friend at roca was doing uh was doing an ice bath and it was like one of the ones that you like pour the ice in too like just a bucket and then you pour the ice in so i like said it i got it and i was like oh this is fucking terrible.

[1602] And I said in it for like five minutes and I got out and then I messaged Rogan I'm like I just did an ice bath.

[1603] He's like which one?

[1604] I'm like I just pour some ice and he goes yeah it's fucking weak shit.

[1605] You can only get it to like the high 40s you can't get it down to freezing and I'm like okay so I'll try a real one I guess but I felt I don't really feel physically a lot better but I feel so mentally sharp after I do it I feel like very calm for the rest of the day if like next 24 hours and I feel just like if I want to want to go to sleep because I basically just had a fucking panic attack.

[1606] I can warm up and I can go to sleep or I can like wake up and like do shit that I have to do.

[1607] So then I tried Brigham's at like 30 degrees and I set for three minutes and I fucking got out.

[1608] I was like on a different planet.

[1609] Yeah, that's the Morosco one.

[1610] And shit and it was like it was like actually freezing.

[1611] There's ice floating around.

[1612] I was like oh my God, that was terrible.

[1613] But then I felt really good after.

[1614] And so now I do them like five times a week probably.

[1615] I do it like five times a week I just got it and I sit in usually three four minutes and I did seven one time and I could have did more I should have did more but you got to like being the mood to go for a record yeah I did it once for 20 but I did it because I filmed it and I put it on Instagram I was like I just want to see how long I could go wow so I just filmed it and I did 20 it was fucking horrible and I couldn't warm up for the rest of the day I drove to work it was 95 degrees outside in Texas I drove to work with no AC on my windows rolled up shivering Yeah, we did it the other day.

[1616] I had like a barbecue at my house.

[1617] And one of the guys who's here filming for future kimonos, my sponsor, he's like a cameraman, and he's never done an ice bath before.

[1618] So he gets in, and I'm like sitting down.

[1619] I just did it.

[1620] So I was sitting by the fire warming up.

[1621] And I look back like fucking, I don't know, it felt like a half hour later and he's still in there.

[1622] And I'm like, how long has he been in there to like 12 minutes?

[1623] I'm like, oh, fuck.

[1624] So he gets out and he's like, yeah, I could have did longer, but I don't know.

[1625] I just figured I would get it.

[1626] out.

[1627] So I'm like, okay, so I don't think anything of it.

[1628] Like two and a half hours later, he comes up to me and he's wrapping the towel still in his underwear, just shaking.

[1629] And he's like, do you have a shower I can use?

[1630] And I'm like, yeah, man, go to the bathroom.

[1631] He sat in the shower with the water as hot as it could go for like an hour.

[1632] And he comes out, he's like, okay, I'm a little bit better now, like still shaking.

[1633] When you go from cold plunge to sauna, it feels amazing.

[1634] Oh, because you warm up, like, instantly.

[1635] Yeah, well, it takes a couple minutes, but, I mean, the 185 degree sauna feels like nothing.

[1636] Is that okay to do, though?

[1637] I always thought it was hot to cold, but you can go cold to hot.

[1638] Yeah, it's okay if you're not a pussy.

[1639] Yeah, you go, you should always end in cold, though.

[1640] Okay.

[1641] You end on cold because the idea is you want your body to reheat itself.

[1642] What temperature do you do for the cold plunge?

[1643] Because I hear different things you should do 40, 50 for a couple minutes.

[1644] He's got at 36.

[1645] Yeah, we have a 34 at the house, and the blue coop, blue cute.

[1646] that I have here in the studio I love, it's a little different than the Morosco because the water circulates, so it's even more uncomfortable, and that's 37 degrees.

[1647] But I can't differentiate between getting in that at 37 degrees and the Morosco at 34.

[1648] It feels the same to me, because obviously three degrees is nothing.

[1649] But that one thing that does feel different is the circulation of water.

[1650] So when you get in the blue cube, you're like, Jesus, what the fuck is it?

[1651] It's more uncomfortable.

[1652] If you move in the Morosco, So you feel it like, I'm like, oh, fuck, I'm getting cold way faster.

[1653] Yeah, like when I check my watch to see what time it is, how long I've been in there for, like, just the movement, like, then your hand's like, fuck, fuck, fuck, fuck, fuck, fuck.

[1654] Someone commented the other day on my Instagram, like, move around more because apparently when you sit still, their body creates like a thermal layer where, like, I don't know, apparently you don't get as cold.

[1655] Yeah.

[1656] Move around.

[1657] So I started, like, moving around, and I was like, oh, I'm going to sit still down.

[1658] that's where the blue cube is really excellent because the blue cube is the water's always moving so you don't ever get that thermal layer I'm trying to convince him to do it oh fuck I wish we could play I wish we could be so he had his girlfriend go in this in the thing it's fucking hilarious so I'm like so Rogan has this rule I'm like he fucking invites people to his house and he's like I'll give you a thousand dollars to do a minute I'm like you should do it with Lena he goes okay he's like there's no way she'll be able to do it I'm like I don't know money's a pretty big motivator for Lena so she's fucking he's like I'll give you $1 ,000 to do it for a minute she's like $1 ,000 he's like yeah he's like okay so she gets in I'm like trying to coach her I'm like nice deep breath I'm like she gets in she's like oh my fuck okay so she's like shivering and I'm like nice deep breath take it easy she's just screaming a thousand dollars a thousand dollars turn it off she gets in it's like 15 seconds she's like how many minutes how many minutes has been how many minutes and I'm like it was been like 10 seconds and she's like a thousand dollars a thousand dollars and she makes it through the minute and she gets out and she's like on the floor like in the blanket like all like shivering my daughter's 12 year old friends did it I had three of her friends come over and I go if you guys go in there for one minute I'll give you a thousand dollars and their eyes are lighted up they're thinking toys all the shit they're gonna buy did they make it yeah man they all did it they all did it one of my daughter's friend's sister who's nine did it.

[1659] Nine years old.

[1660] She jumped in there for a minute.

[1661] Just gritting her teeth.

[1662] I know.

[1663] Now I have to do it.

[1664] She's just gritting her teeth thinking about toys.

[1665] I gave it to them $100 bills, too.

[1666] These crips, crisp, clean, $100 bills.

[1667] They were, like, looking at it, like, this is amazing.

[1668] I go home, Joe Rogan just gave me this.

[1669] Yeah, they're like, what if I do two minutes?

[1670] I go, then you get $2 ,000.

[1671] It's going to give them a thousand a minute, but no one ever did more than a minute.

[1672] When do you do it?

[1673] Do you, like, first thing in the morning?

[1674] Right before I get a little.

[1675] Right before I get here.

[1676] So I work out, I worked out this morning, and then right after I work out, I go right into the sauna.

[1677] I do 20 minutes in the sauna, and then I do three minutes into the cold plunge.

[1678] That's my general daily routine.

[1679] What about post -training?

[1680] Does it help with lactic acid?

[1681] Yeah, it definitely does.

[1682] Well, it flushes your system in a wild way, right?

[1683] Because your circulation, like when you're in 185 degree sauna and it's really hot, man. That last 10 minutes is rough.

[1684] 185?

[1685] Yeah.

[1686] the last 10 minutes is right and I throw water on the rocks too so it's fucking we're at we're at Brigham's we're gonna we're supposed to do like 20 minutes it's like me and Nat Justin Renn and Brigham like the four of us like smashed into this four person sauna which like we barely fit in because we're all huge and he's got the timer outside like the timer doesn't go off so we're like fucking 27 minutes then we're like how long have we been in here and it's like oh man we're like seven minutes over I'm like oh perfect I'm about to have a heat stroke I used to do 25 I was doing 25 for a while, but I would just be so tired after it was over.

[1687] I felt like I was doing too much, like the time was too much.

[1688] It was like I'd pass the point of diminishing returns.

[1689] So I feel like for me, it seems like 185 degrees, 20 minutes, and then as far as cold plunge, three minutes seems like the magic number.

[1690] Occasionally I'll do five minutes.

[1691] One thing I will do, though, if I go back and forth and back and forth, then I'll do more sauna time.

[1692] so I'll do like 20 minutes in the sauna and then I'll do three minutes in the cold plunge and then I'll do another 20 minutes in the sauna and by the time that 20 minutes is up I'm barely I'm barely suffering and then I'll do another two minutes in the cold and I ended always on cold that's what I was going to ask you.

[1693] Always end on cold because it's easier to end on hot because it just warms you up you're like okay I'm done but when you end on cold then you're like fucking do fuck fuck fuck and you make your body heat itself back up and that's where you get a lot of the The sauna is what I'm missing.

[1694] Like, I feel like if I do, like, a hard workout, like, in my gym, I have to, like, take, like, 10 minutes at least to cool down before I can get into the cold plunge.

[1695] I'm just, like, my body's just, like, so shocked.

[1696] I feel like if I just sat in the sauna and relaxed for, like, 20 minutes after the workout, it would be a lot better to then move into the ice bath.

[1697] It also increases your red blood cell count.

[1698] It has a mild EPO -like effect.

[1699] Wow.

[1700] And it also maintains your heart rate.

[1701] So if you do a hard training session, and you have elevated heart rate and then you go straight into the sauna it maintains an elevated heart rate like I've gone in the sauna with one of them chest traps on the my zones chest straps and it was reading 140 beats per minute just sitting there in the sauna because I'd gone right from working out and gone so it's so fucking hot like you don't get a chance to like completely cool down so your body's pumping all that blood it's actually 20 minute workout essentially yeah exactly while you're static you're just sitting there And your heart rate doesn't go down.

[1702] It just stays pretty much.

[1703] I mean, slowly.

[1704] Well, it does go down slowly, but not when you're in there at 185 degrees for 20 minutes because you're fucking suffering.

[1705] So when you're suffering, you're like, when I looked at my watch and I see like, I'm only at 12 minutes.

[1706] I don't know.

[1707] It's eight minutes to go.

[1708] And I'm like, fuck, this is rough.

[1709] That's me in the ice bath.

[1710] I don't even look at the timer.

[1711] I'm just counting the seconds.

[1712] It's so much worse.

[1713] I'm like, fuck, five seconds only going up by.

[1714] Yeah.

[1715] It's hard.

[1716] But the benefits are really.

[1717] really worth it.

[1718] The benefits for your immune system and then mental clarity, as you're talking about.

[1719] I just feel so sharp mentally after I'm, like, having all these ideas pop into my head.

[1720] I'm, like, answering emails I was, like, procrastinating.

[1721] So it's, uh, it's been, it's been good for me for sure.

[1722] Yeah, I have one at the house.

[1723] I got to use it once.

[1724] You don't use it?

[1725] I've never used it once.

[1726] You just have it sitting there?

[1727] Now that my girlfriend is used it, I have to.

[1728] So, I'm like, he's like, he's like, we have one of these in Puerto Rico.

[1729] I'm like, how is it?

[1730] He's like, I don't know, I never used it.

[1731] It's like, you have to use it?

[1732] And my girlfriend just did what?

[1733] Two minutes yesterday.

[1734] Now she's hooked.

[1735] Are you still in Puerto Rico?

[1736] Yeah.

[1737] Are you staying there?

[1738] Yeah, I love it.

[1739] Fuck taxes, right?

[1740] I just always go back and forth, Puerto Rico, Miami.

[1741] So for taxes, you have to spend, like, 51 % of your time there or something like that?

[1742] Yeah, 183 days.

[1743] But I always hit, like, 210, 2 .15.

[1744] Yeah?

[1745] I like, I just get away from everybody, and it's very relaxing.

[1746] That's dope.

[1747] I'm a homebody, so I'm not one of those guys who has to go out all the time.

[1748] I thought it was pretty gangster.

[1749] You guys moving your entire organization to Puerto Rico because they wouldn't let you train in New York.

[1750] Yeah.

[1751] How crazy is that?

[1752] Looking back on that now, how fucking crazy was all that?

[1753] Dude, I saw it.

[1754] Tell you you can't do jujitsu.

[1755] Did.

[1756] What?

[1757] Like, the government's going to come in and tell you you're not allowed to train.

[1758] I know a lot of people who lost their business.

[1759] And now COVID's still around, and all the people who are yelling at you are just walking around like it's normal now.

[1760] How about that Dr. Lena Wend, the lady from CNN, is now telling everybody that her children's verbal skills, their speech development, was hand.

[1761] hampered by wearing a mask like yeah they could have told you that they said that yeah people speech experts would have told you that this is terrible for children like this idea that you're just going to like with no problem whatsoever stop society i mean has there been any studies that show the masks were effective i mean n95 masks have um they have an effect but they're none of them are 100 % effective and it's like it's a respiratory disease respiratory disease is spread period end of discussion If you talk to virologists, they'll tell you you cannot contain a respiratory disease.

[1762] I mean, you could like protect yourself if you're in an area where there's like a heavy spread and you have an N95 mass. It's properly fitted.

[1763] It will have an impact.

[1764] But, you know, the most important thing is to protect your immune system.

[1765] And that's the least discussed aspect of the fucking pandemic.

[1766] Just be healthy.

[1767] Yeah.

[1768] Don't be fat.

[1769] Don't be fat.

[1770] Take a lot of vitamins.

[1771] Vitamin D deficiency is a giant problem.

[1772] At one point in time, they did a stuff.

[1773] would show that 84 % of the people in the ICU were deficient in vitamin D. The funny thing is I thought obesity would be the number one is actually, I believe, vitamin D. Yeah, it was like 78 % was obesity.

[1774] And 84 % was...

[1775] And what they do?

[1776] They just had everyone go inside.

[1777] Yeah.

[1778] Perfect.

[1779] Let's get fatter and paler.

[1780] I was in Europe last year.

[1781] I got a ticket for not wearing a mask outdoors.

[1782] Oh, my God.

[1783] He sent me this voice note.

[1784] I was so bad.

[1785] I was about to crack my phone and half.

[1786] He's like, yeah, they stopped me outside and they gave me a fucking ticket.

[1787] I'm like, can I just imagine if I was in that scenario, like some fucking cop telling me, hey, I'm going to give you this fucking $400 ticket.

[1788] I'm going to give you a ticket for not wearing something that doesn't even work.

[1789] Yes, outdoors.

[1790] Yeah, and now that they know that they don't work, like, they've talked about it on CNN.

[1791] I mean, like that same lady, that Dr. Lena Wend just said that it's like facial decorations, that a regular cloth mask is like facial decorations.

[1792] And they increase the chances you get bacterial pneumonia, right?

[1793] Yeah.

[1794] Because if you wear the same mask over and over again, it just traps all the bacteria on.

[1795] to the mask.

[1796] Fucking gross people.

[1797] They're not cleaning that thing.

[1798] It smells like your bad breath.

[1799] I know you've got to get out of here at 2 o 'clock, right?

[1800] We're okay.

[1801] You're good?

[1802] Yeah, we keep going.

[1803] Yeah, the fact that you guys had to do that and that you had to move the entire organization down to Puerto Rico was just, I love that you did it, but it was like, wow, what a crazy sign of the time.

[1804] We had to do, about it was somewhere because we didn't know, like, what was going to happen in Austin, like, you know, places were going to shut down, and at least moving the area, had a place to train.

[1805] So I was like, we'll move there.

[1806] And then that was going to be like a three to five year thing.

[1807] And then we were trying to open up a school.

[1808] Oh, my gosh.

[1809] Couldn't open up a school.

[1810] Disaster.

[1811] I went to a shopping center.

[1812] There's 40 outlets.

[1813] Two of them are occupied.

[1814] I tried for a year to open a school.

[1815] It was like impossible.

[1816] I'm like, they wouldn't return my calls.

[1817] Like, it was impossible to work.

[1818] I'm like, guys, this is just, I don't know what to do.

[1819] It's a little too relaxed down there.

[1820] That's a problem with living in paradise.

[1821] Island time, you know?

[1822] Island time is real.

[1823] Is this impossible?

[1824] How much of a jiu -sit -s scene is there now?

[1825] Like, did you guys, like...

[1826] Over there?

[1827] Because you guys went there, and, I mean, how many people stayed and kept training?

[1828] They had jih -jitsu there.

[1829] I mean, I think some of them were upset, to be honest.

[1830] You guys showed up?

[1831] They're like, how we're going to compete with these guys, you know what I'm saying?

[1832] So, but it's not too big there.

[1833] But, I mean, everyone who moved there with us moved back here, and then a couple of the guys, like three of the guys, We have Fernando, Luis, and Juan, who lived their whole lives in Puerto Rico.

[1834] Like, Fernando's almost 40.

[1835] He's been there his whole life, and they moved to Austin with us to train.

[1836] So that was pretty cool.

[1837] But, yeah, we were training out of our buddy's gym.

[1838] He actually used a gym for one of his camps where he brings guys down.

[1839] And then it was called Combat 360.

[1840] And we were just training there for the year, trying to open up a gym, which he was, like, hammering away, trying to get people to help us, and just was.

[1841] literally impossible to do any sort of business.

[1842] John was going to strangle one of these guys.

[1843] So me and John go together.

[1844] And this guy's like trying to charge us.

[1845] John just has no patience for incompetence.

[1846] We meet with fucking talking to everybody there, which is the problem.

[1847] We meet with this, the owner of the shopping center.

[1848] And 40 stores, two of them were occupied.

[1849] He's trying to charge like 250 a square foot.

[1850] So John just like looks like he's about to kill this guy.

[1851] He's like, you're trying to charge me Manhattan prices for this.

[1852] And I told the guy, I'm like, look.

[1853] around like we'll bring you you you know if we get 400 students here we're going to bring you football wouldn't budge then that was I was like all right guys it's just not gonna work here then I was like here I like did the I did the show with Rogan I talked to him for like a half hour just like probably most of his friends and he convinced me to move to Austin I'm like I'm like Rogan has this thing where every one of his friends he's like come on bro just fucking make the move it's the greatest city ever it's it's really I love it's so great and there's only a million people here for you get around Where are they going to go?

[1854] You have to build.

[1855] There's no houses available.

[1856] And when you get around, it's so easy.

[1857] Me coming from L .A., everything was a fucking hour.

[1858] Everything.

[1859] I'm from L .A. too, yeah.

[1860] Go to the comedy store at 8 o 'clock at night.

[1861] It takes an hour.

[1862] It should take 22 minutes from my house.

[1863] It takes an hour.

[1864] Everything takes an hour.

[1865] And plus, in the morning, you want to fucking shoot yourself.

[1866] L .A. is the fucking the worst.

[1867] It's crazy.

[1868] Going down to Orange County is death.

[1869] It takes hours.

[1870] It would take us two, three hours.

[1871] to take my kids at Disneyland it was crazy it takes an hour just to get from LA to LA and if the shit goes down if something happens if there's an earthquake if something goes down you're not getting anywhere you're not getting out of there there's just too many fucking human beings also people devalue people when there's that many people people become like a they become a problem they don't become like a valuable asset like oh this is my community of people that's my neighbor Bob hey Bob no it becomes all these fucking Look at all these fucks in front of me. New York's same way.

[1872] But people in Texas are so nice.

[1873] They're the nicest.

[1874] Anywhere you go.

[1875] It doesn't even matter.

[1876] They're all fucking armed.

[1877] Dude, we fucking, we fucking pull up to Terry Blacks the other day.

[1878] There's like a fucking 100 -person line.

[1879] I parked like right in front.

[1880] A dude fucking runs out.

[1881] He's like, I knew it was you.

[1882] I knew it was your truck.

[1883] He's like, come on and we're going to take care of you.

[1884] They fucking cut the whole line.

[1885] Oh, that's awesome.

[1886] Got us all, everything we needed.

[1887] And it was like, you guys need anything.

[1888] He's like, please let us know.

[1889] And I was like, no, it's okay.

[1890] Those guys are great.

[1891] They're all so helpful.

[1892] Terry Blacks is the shit.

[1893] I eat it every single time.

[1894] God damn, those beef ribs are preposterous.

[1895] They're so good.

[1896] There's sausages and brisket.

[1897] I love barbecue.

[1898] I'm so happy to be here.

[1899] There's just so much good shit about this town.

[1900] And then there's so many comedy clubs here, and I've talked so many comedians in the movement here now.

[1901] He loves fucking comedy.

[1902] I'm taking him to see Kill Tony tonight.

[1903] Oh, you're going to have a great time.

[1904] The only thing I like doing, because I'm from L .A., but, you know, not too much of a fan.

[1905] as I used to be, but the only thing I like doing there is going to the comedy store.

[1906] So every time I'm there, I go like three, four times a week.

[1907] Yeah, the comedy store is awesome, but we're recreating something like that here.

[1908] We have an amazing scene.

[1909] I mean, there's like 12 world -class comedians that have already moved here.

[1910] That live in Austin full -time?

[1911] Yeah, that move here.

[1912] And we don't even have, I mean, the main comedy club is still being built.

[1913] My place is still being built.

[1914] Well, I'll definitely be stopping my old time.

[1915] But we'll be ready.

[1916] Somewhere around January, right, the turn of the 20 -23, we should be ready.

[1917] Is it going to be multiple rooms?

[1918] Yeah, we got a couple rooms.

[1919] Yeah, it's going to be fun.

[1920] And then there's a lot of other good spots around here, too.

[1921] Like, there's a creek in the cave.

[1922] It's a great room.

[1923] The Vulcan where we're at Tuesday and Wednesday nights every week.

[1924] That's a great room.

[1925] Then there's Cap City Comedy Club reopened to the domain.

[1926] So Austin has a boom and scene.

[1927] It's a great place for stand -up.

[1928] It's just like they're fun crowds, too, man. They're not fucked up and woke and annoying.

[1929] I was in the comedy store one time.

[1930] Mark Marin is performing.

[1931] This guy gets up, like, starts yelling at him.

[1932] And it's like, it's Mark Merrin.

[1933] It's not Andrew Schultz or Anthony Jesselnik.

[1934] And this guy looked like he was, like, on a gram of test.

[1935] What's he yelling on him for?

[1936] He's yelling at him because Mark Maron made some Jewish joke.

[1937] He finally stops the big.

[1938] Mark's Jewish.

[1939] That's what he says to the guy.

[1940] He's like, bro, relax.

[1941] I'm Jewish, too.

[1942] And this guy's like, it's not funny and stuff like that.

[1943] I'm just looking like, who goes to a comedy club with that mindset?

[1944] Righteous twats.

[1945] LA's filled with these fucking virtue signaling douchebags.

[1946] They're filled with people that want to show everybody how, how righteous and ethical and moral they are.

[1947] That's why I love Tony.

[1948] Because Tony doesn't tolerate it at all.

[1949] He just fucking crushes you the second anything happens.

[1950] He's the greatest host of a podcast, like a live podcast ever.

[1951] He's the best at it.

[1952] It's just crazy.

[1953] That show killed Tony.

[1954] No one's faster.

[1955] I used to see him in the comedy store all the time.

[1956] I'd be dying laughing, but people would just like the looks on their face.

[1957] He'd be so...

[1958] He goes hard and the paint.

[1959] But if that's what you like, he's your guy.

[1960] Yeah, the dark humor.

[1961] It just kills me every time.

[1962] No, he's an animal.

[1963] And so, you know, he's out.

[1964] here Tom Zaguer is out here Christina Posizki's out here yep yep Tim Dylan Brian Simpson just moved here David Lucas is here Hans Kim is here Duncan Trustles here we got a lot of fucking comics here right now it's fun it's fun so every Tuesday Wednesday night it's a party at the Vulcan I can't wait I mean I love stand -up comedy it's just weird to me because like I remember growing up watching Eddie Murphy's delirious and when he's ripping on Arabs and stuff like that me and my brother were just dying we'd be like yeah he's ripping on us now, you know?

[1965] We're like, we made it.

[1966] That's funny.

[1967] Everyone's just like, they think like being offended is like a badge of honor.

[1968] It is.

[1969] Yeah, it is something like, it's social media.

[1970] Social media fucked everybody's head up because everybody had an opinion now.

[1971] Everybody had an opinion.

[1972] The worst people.

[1973] Yeah.

[1974] The most complaining.

[1975] Yeah, the people who don't have any accomplishments and just have all day to spend on Instagram.

[1976] Those are the people who are most heard.

[1977] That is what the problem is, is that they have the time to do that.

[1978] And it's a great distraction from accomplishing anything in your real life.

[1979] If you just spend all your time complaining about shit, you feel like you're getting something done.

[1980] My thing is intent.

[1981] It's obviously they're just performing.

[1982] Like, do you really believe, you know, like Chappelle, like, do you really believe he's just a bad person?

[1983] Like, it just doesn't make any sense.

[1984] They don't care if they really believe that.

[1985] They care if they can pretend that they believe that so that they have a target so that they can pour all their outrage at and it makes them look more virtuous.

[1986] But it's really just about cutting someone down to make yourself look better.

[1987] If you look at the content of what Chappelle put out that they criticized, it's not transphobic at all.

[1988] I've seen it six times.

[1989] He's genius.

[1990] And, you know, it's great that he does it and that they attack him because it shows how ridiculous it is.

[1991] Yeah.

[1992] Because then people watch and they go, what the fuck are you complaining about?

[1993] Like, what is going on?

[1994] Like, this is comedy.

[1995] Like, what do you, comedy without victims can be pretty fucking boring.

[1996] Yeah.

[1997] Okay, it's like, someone's going to take the hit, kids.

[1998] But it's amazing because everyone they try to cancel, who just doesn't apologize.

[1999] You just get bigger.

[2000] They just get way bigger, yeah.

[2001] Yeah, you just get bigger.

[2002] Just don't quit.

[2003] They canceled one of Chappelle's shows, right?

[2004] Like, they went to the venue and he had to.

[2005] Oh, that didn't mean anything.

[2006] No, I know, I know it does it.

[2007] But those are silly people that work there.

[2008] They're like, you know, we wouldn't, yeah, we will not stand for this.

[2009] So he went to another place right across the street.

[2010] Like, it was right down the street.

[2011] It's just crazy to me because last minute change of venue.

[2012] When I grew up, if you didn't like something, you just don't watch it.

[2013] But that's not enough for them.

[2014] Well, it's just these fucking people, man. No one can watch it.

[2015] Everybody's special now.

[2016] You know, this is what happens when you give kids participation trophies for getting their ass kicked at soccer.

[2017] They grow up and they think everybody's special.

[2018] No one's a loser.

[2019] Everyone's amazing.

[2020] Your opinion's valid.

[2021] You need to be heard.

[2022] You need to speak your truth.

[2023] Go speak your truth.

[2024] And everybody's like, I need to be heard.

[2025] We can't tolerate this in our community.

[2026] Meanwhile, you're ready to turn on the next person.

[2027] You're ready to turn on.

[2028] They'll never be woke enough.

[2029] No one will ever be woke enough.

[2030] They'll push the boundaries until they eliminate everybody who's not this far left.

[2031] And then they'll go further left.

[2032] They'll go full communist.

[2033] They'll never be satisfied.

[2034] Never.

[2035] That's the point.

[2036] That's the problem because they're malcontents.

[2037] These are not like normal, healthy, rational people with good lives that are successful.

[2038] Didn't Kevin Hart apologize for years ago, like for that bit?

[2039] And they still, it wasn't enough.

[2040] It didn't matter.

[2041] And he said he wasn't going to apologize again.

[2042] He's like, I'm not apologizing again.

[2043] I did it a long time ago.

[2044] Like, I'm a good person.

[2045] These are just jokes.

[2046] They don't want to apologize because whenever someone apologizes, then they actually get canceled.

[2047] Well, what they want is you to bend the knee.

[2048] Bend the knee.

[2049] It's power.

[2050] Yeah.

[2051] It's just a weird time for people in their opinions, you know, because it's so easy to get an opinion magnified.

[2052] Like if you have an opinion and then a bunch of people retweet that opinion and, you know, you see people, they spend all day on Twitter just posting their opinions on things and bitching about shit.

[2053] That's why I love Chappelleau.

[2054] He's like, I don't give a fuck about Twitter.

[2055] It's not a real place.

[2056] Yeah, it's not a real place.

[2057] Well, it's a real mental institution.

[2058] That's what it is.

[2059] If you, like, no bullshit.

[2060] If you collectively looked at the people that post the most on Twitter and then you looked at the amount of medication those people are taking.

[2061] The amount of therapy those people are taking.

[2062] The amount of anxiety and mental illness.

[2063] those people have.

[2064] It's not representative of the general population.

[2065] It's a sick group of people.

[2066] Yeah.

[2067] I mean, I just don't get it.

[2068] Like, why should Andrew Schultz or Jessumach fans not be able to go watch the show?

[2069] I just don't understand that.

[2070] Why should an adult not be able to go enjoy something that you don't?

[2071] It's just makes no sense.

[2072] Because people are crazy.

[2073] It literally makes no sense.

[2074] But it's also people that don't have like real struggle, like physical struggle in their life.

[2075] One of the things you find out about jujitsu.

[2076] people.

[2077] Jiu -jitsu is one of the best medicines for a human being because the exercise is so fucking difficult.

[2078] It's so hard to get good at jiu -jitsu and then training is so hard that like everything else is kind of easy.

[2079] You have like a real problem.

[2080] Yeah.

[2081] Like you're not fucking worried about bitching when someone's trying to break your arm.

[2082] Yeah, exactly.

[2083] Like people who don't, everyone's so comfortable now, they don't have real problems, so they make up imaginary issues to complain about in their head.

[2084] What they need to do is.

[2085] get some imaginary real problems like Jiu -Jitsu.

[2086] It's not a real problem like you have to do it, but you should do it.

[2087] And if you do do it, you'll be better at the other things you do.

[2088] And you'll be better at coping.

[2089] Just your coping, because you're dealing with real adversity.

[2090] Someone's fucking mounting you trying to strangle you.

[2091] Like that's real adversity.

[2092] It's not a microaggression at the office.

[2093] But Jitsu is tough out of the combat sports because basically you just get your ass kicked for the first three, six months.

[2094] That's what people need.

[2095] And you don't even know what's happening.

[2096] There's so many people out there thinking they're the shit.

[2097] They're nothing.

[2098] They need to know they're nothing.

[2099] They need to know that they're basically helpless.

[2100] And that's what's great.

[2101] I remember the first time I ever went into jiu -jitsu class.

[2102] It was at Carlson Gracie's.

[2103] And this purple belt just fucking raped me. Just manhandled me. He wasn't even bigger than me. He was the same age as me. I had no disadvantage.

[2104] Yeah, he couldn't rationalize it involved.

[2105] No rational.

[2106] And I was like, I know how to fight.

[2107] I used to kickbox.

[2108] I could fight.

[2109] Oh, it was a Tychoin Joe champion.

[2110] I could fight.

[2111] And this guy was just doing whatever he wanted to me. And it was like, wow.

[2112] And I remember leaving there going, well, that's important to know.

[2113] Yeah.

[2114] Because I didn't know that that was real.

[2115] I didn't know that I was that.

[2116] I thought, well, bigger people could probably kick my ass.

[2117] And, you know, world championship black belts could probably kick my ass.

[2118] But a regular person, no. It's like, that's good for you.

[2119] Getting your ass kick like that is fucking good.

[2120] good for you because you gotta break it down before you could build it up and it's like as close to a superpower as you can get oh yeah like like grappling or fighting a normal person who has like no martial arts experience oh my god it's like literally playing with a child yeah like you see like bodybuilders grappling like jih Tzu guys and it's like it doesn't matter you're like they're just they look like the children playing with their dad do you remember the old uh no rules fight with Pedro Sauer Pedro Sauer fought this bodybuilder this fucking giant giant Jack bodybuilder.

[2121] He's Hunter Hickson.

[2122] Yeah.

[2123] I remember that.

[2124] The big monster.

[2125] Yeah, it's like a famous old school like one of them dojo matches.

[2126] Not having seen it.

[2127] It's another one of those cases where we were talking about like the early days of MMA recognizing that jujitsu is really like the only martial arts that delivers as promised.

[2128] Yeah.

[2129] Like a small technical person can defeat a small, a larger untrained person.

[2130] Yeah.

[2131] That's and that's what it showed.

[2132] I mean, I always heard it for the UFC won, they purposely picked Hoyce, hoist, instead of, like, Hickson or something like because of his muscular stature.

[2133] Sort of.

[2134] Is that true?

[2135] There's a little bit of that.

[2136] Also, they couldn't control Hickson.

[2137] Like, no one could tell Hickson what to do.

[2138] Hickson was not playing any games.

[2139] And Horyon, I think, had a lot more control of the situation if Hoyce was his champion.

[2140] But the idea was, if anybody ever beat Hoyce, then you throw in Hickson.

[2141] Yeah.

[2142] And he malls everybody.

[2143] Because Hoyler and Hickson had much more impressive competitive career.

[2144] Hoyler certainly did, but Hoyler obviously was much smaller.

[2145] Yeah, too small.

[2146] Yeah, I mean, he competed at Abu Dhabi at 45, right?

[2147] Yeah, 145.

[2148] So, all right, so tell everybody one more time, it's on flow grappling.

[2149] Tell everybody the dates.

[2150] ADCC 2020, September 17 and 18 in the Thomas and Mac Arena, Las Vegas.

[2151] Awesome.

[2152] Gordon, you're the fucking man. Thank you.

[2153] Thanks for being here.

[2154] Bye, everybody.