91. Can Selling Beer Cut Down on Public Drunkenness?

[0] From APM, American Public Media and WNYC, this is Freakonomics Radio on Marketplace.

[1] Here's the host of Marketplace, Kai Risdahl.

[2] Time now for a little Freakonomics Radio.

[3] It's that moment in the broadcast every couple of weeks.

[4] We talk to Stephen Dubner, the co -author of the books and the blog of the same name.

[5] It is the hidden side of everything.

[6] Dubner, how are you?

[7] Hey, Kai.

[8] I'm good.

[9] How are you?

[10] I'm all right.

[11] You know, getting by.

[12] So the new college football season is upon us now.

[13] It is always exciting.

[14] the, you know, just unbelievable sheer athleticism, you see, the marching bands and the freshmen barfing all over the stadium.

[15] Okay, wait, what?

[16] Because that's not what I was expecting.

[17] Yeah, no, that's, so that's what I want to talk to you about today.

[18] Let me start with Oliver Luck.

[19] He is the athletic director at West Virginia University.

[20] That's what he got used to seeing at football games there.

[21] People drinking far too much at pregame parties, tailgate parties before games, sneaking alcohol into games, leaving at halftime to drink even more and come back into the game.

[22] Now, Oliver Luck happens to be the father of quarterback Andrew Luck, who is this year's number one NFL draft.

[23] Yes, he was.

[24] New QB for the Indianapolis Colts.

[25] Got that right.

[26] Oliver Luck, the Papa, that's right, yep, the Papa was an NFL quarterback himself for a few years.

[27] And now, as a college athletic director, he learned that most colleges, in keeping with their academic mission, do not sell alcohol at football games.

[28] But not surprisingly, that doesn't stop everybody, including students from drinking, especially because some schools, West Virginia, among them, they have what's called a pass -out policy.

[29] A what?

[30] Yes.

[31] You heard me right, but you're thinking differently.

[32] I am.

[33] I am.

[34] That's right.

[35] This does not have anything to do with passing out from drinking too much.

[36] It has to do with the fact that you are allowed to pass out of the stadium and back in during the game, which means you can go out and drink.

[37] This whole thing is not shocking, right?

[38] That's the point.

[39] It is not, but that doesn't mean you have to be happy about it or even tolerate it.

[40] So Oliver Luck last year proposed that two things, one that West Virginia get rid of that pass -out policy and that it tries something different inside the stadium.

[41] Okay.

[42] So, you know, I began to think a little bit, you know, sort of counterintuitively that actually selling beer at our stadium would actually help us gain control.

[43] So here's where I need you to explain the counterintuitive thing, right?

[44] Because how does it, I mean, you get some money from the beer sales, but how does it?

[45] does it help you control the problem if you're actually selling the beverage?

[46] Let's do the money first.

[47] West Virginia did clear about $500 ,000 from beer sales that first year.

[48] Which is nice.

[49] Which is nice.

[50] It'll probably double this year, right?

[51] That's a lot of beer.

[52] But you're right.

[53] Now that you're selling beer in the stadium, you might think you're going to have more alcohol trouble, more arrests for underage drinking, more violence.

[54] And that is what the campus police at West Virginia last year in the first year were prepared for.

[55] But that is not what happened.

[56] Here's police chief Bob Roberts.

[57] Yeah, in 2010, we made 117 arrest on game days.

[58] And in this past year, we only made 79.

[59] See, that's almost, well, that's 35 % reduction in arrest we made.

[60] Which is good.

[61] So is, what's his name, Luck, trying to sell this to other schools?

[62] I mean, get them to try it?

[63] I wouldn't say he's an evangelist quite, but when they come, when they see what's happening there and they come for help, he gives it.

[64] The University of Minnesota, for instance, wanted to try selling beer in the stadium.

[65] It had to get, however, support from the state legislature, first.

[66] and luck did talk to some legislative aids along the way.

[67] And now, as a result, this fall, Minnesota will be starting a two -year trial of beer sales.

[68] Yeah, which totally makes sense, right?

[69] You can drink 50 feet outside the stadium gates, but you can't inside, right?

[70] Come on.

[71] Exactly.

[72] I mean, look, this is complicated, and you don't want to make light of it.

[73] Alcohol abuse is a very major problem on college campuses and elsewhere, and the idea of making more alcohol available in more places may strike some people as ridiculous.

[74] But what I like about this approach is that instead of, you know, when you've got a problem, you can stick your head in the sand or you can acknowledge the problem exists and try to come up with a new kind of solution.

[75] And that, I think, is what we're talking about here.

[76] Listen again, Kai, to West Virginia University Police Chief Bob Roberts.

[77] Okay.

[78] You know, you might as well face reality and try to control it and at least keep the environment as safe as you can.

[79] How's that for a motto, Kai, controlling reality one day at a time.

[80] I like that, huh?

[81] That's right.

[82] tries to do that every day of his life.

[83] Freakonomics .com is the website.

[84] He is back in a couple of weeks.

[85] See you, man. Thanks so much, Guy.

[86] In our next podcast, we look at what happens to your rational self when you put on a mask.

[87] A middle -aged lady came and apologized me afterwards and said, I'm so sorry.

[88] I put the mask on.

[89] I found myself being very rude.

[90] I was getting too close to the performers.

[91] I even touched one at one point.

[92] I'm so sorry.

[93] We go behind the scenes of Sleep No More, a fantastically interesting piece.

[94] of immersion theater.

[95] I got a little rude with people.

[96] I was kind of like, get the hell out of the way, man. I would not have usually blindly gone into dark corridors because I'm usually scared of everything.

[97] We'll also hear from the man who created the infamous Stanford Prison Experiment.

[98] Prison 819 did a bad thing.

[99] Prison 819.

[100] That's coming up on the next Freakonomics Radio podcast.