Conan O’Brien Needs A Friend XX
[0] Hey, Conan here.
[1] And for me, this is a very exciting episode of Conan O 'Brien needs a friend because I got to sit down and chat with Paul McCartney.
[2] I got to sit with Paul on stage in front of an amazing audience and discuss his new book, 1964, Eyes of the Storm, which is out now.
[3] The thing you need to know about this book, and it's very cool, is it's a collection of photo.
[4] that Paul took pretty much over like a three -month period during that incredible time in 1963, 1964, when Beatlemania exploded and they came to America.
[5] The book showcases 275 of McCartney's rediscovered photos.
[6] He didn't even know he had these.
[7] It's fun to go through them and talk to Paul, and we had a lot of fun.
[8] To see some of the photos we discussed in this episode, follow at Team Coco on Instagram, Facebook, and Twitter.
[9] And remember, you can always go out and get the book, and follow along.
[10] It's a fascinating document.
[11] Hi, my name is Paul McCartney.
[12] And I feel wildly elated about being Conan O 'Brien's friend.
[13] Oh, my God.
[14] All right.
[15] That's it.
[16] Good night.
[17] Thank you.
[18] Thank you.
[19] Thank you.
[20] Thank you.
[21] Thank you.
[22] Thank you very much.
[23] Please.
[24] Please, thank you very much.
[25] That was almost long enough.
[26] Thank you.
[27] Such a delight to be here tonight at the Tribeca Festival.
[28] And as you know, this is, or maybe you have been told, this is going to be an episode of my podcast.
[29] Conan O 'Brien needs a friend.
[30] Yeah.
[31] And I desperately still need a friend.
[32] There's one rule in show business, which is when you're sharing a bill with Paul McCartney, you waste no time.
[33] Not a second.
[34] Every second I'm out here is excruciating for all of you.
[35] The biggest name in show business is right behind that curtain.
[36] And I'm out here being a jackass.
[37] Because that's what I do.
[38] I am thrilled that he's here.
[39] we're going to be talking about and going through a book of photos never before seen 1964, The Eyes of the Storm, thrill of a lifetime to be able to say, ladies and gentlemen, Paul McCurney!
[40] Here we go.
[41] Paul, do you...
[42] Does it ever get old getting that reaction?
[43] Does it ever, ever get old?
[44] No. And I would like to hear all the girls give a beetle scream, please.
[45] That is...
[46] All right, all right.
[47] Incredible.
[48] I don't know about you, but I'm sterile now.
[49] That's a pitch I don't hear much in my profession.
[50] Absolute joy to be sitting with you here.
[51] This is fantastic.
[52] As you know, this is a podcast.
[53] Listen to billions of people all around the world.
[54] Don't laugh at that.
[55] That's just mean.
[56] Hundreds of people around the world.
[57] Paul, let's dive right into it.
[58] First of all, this book is extraordinary.
[59] You took these photographs.
[60] I think you got a Pentax camera in 1963.
[61] I think you and all the fellas got Pentax cameras, but you were taking a lot of pictures, and then you forgot you had them.
[62] I kind of knew I had them, but I thought I'd lost them.
[63] Because in the 60s, you know, a lot of people used to leave their doors open.
[64] It was all a bit hippie, and, you know, it's like, yeah, man. That's your summation of the 60s was hate.
[65] Yeah, man. That's all I remember.
[66] That's all you remember.
[67] Yeah.
[68] No, so I thought, yeah, I've lost them.
[69] But I was with a photo archivist in London, Sarah Brown, who was organizing an exhibition of Linda's photographs.
[70] And during it, I just said, well, you know, I took some pictures in the 60s.
[71] I said, but I've no idea where they are.
[72] She said, oh, yeah, we've got them.
[73] I said, oh, great.
[74] Let's have a look.
[75] So, yeah, it turned out there were like about 300 pictures.
[76] It's unbelievable.
[77] Unbelievable.
[78] And it makes me think, what else do you have that you don't know about?
[79] That's another story.
[80] Well, there's so many photos to look at, and there's so many.
[81] I look through the book, and I adore this book, and I've been through it many times.
[82] And the photos take me in different directions.
[83] They really are spectacular.
[84] I wanted to start out with maybe technically not the most proficient photo, but one that I think is the right place to start because you were new with the camera, you're trying something out, let's put this up, and this is you playing, looking into the mirror.
[85] What does this bring back to you?
[86] Is this you twain with the camera experimenting?
[87] Yeah, I think so.
[88] You know, just the idea when you get the camera at first was to just take lots of pictures and then see if they turned out.
[89] And of course, it's not like digital.
[90] You had to wait.
[91] Yes.
[92] So you took them.
[93] And then they went, in England, they went to the chemists, as we called it.
[94] Right.
[95] And they go down, they develop it, and then, you know, about a week later, you get your pictures back.
[96] So yeah, I think this is me just seeing what I can do.
[97] Right.
[98] And if I could smoke at the same time.
[99] Looks very cool.
[100] I would like to point out that I think when I talk to young people when I talk to my kids today they have no idea about the limitations with working with this kind of camera we're also used to the phone we can see it right away and as you said these came in roles of maybe 36 photos you take them you don't know and you also it's not autofocus you have to figure out what the F -stop is you have to know all that stuff it's a whole different world yeah it's I like it Yeah You know But as you say It takes them Getting used to But we were lucky Because we were Often around photographers Yes You know They'd be taking pictures Of us For this That and the other And so You could talk Photography to them And you could say What is the F stop In this situation What are you What are you shooting?
[101] 400 ASA Okay well that will be And some of the rogues Would say F8 at a fortnight just screw with you yeah just to screw with it and also they probably didn't want to give away a trade secret that's probably true yeah uh it was it was fun you know yeah i'm gonna move us on because we have a bunch to see and let's say hi to some of the lads this is an amazing photo of john this is liverpool 1963 what struck me about this photo is that we're i'm so used to seeing photos where john and all of you are posing for the cameras or pulling a face or or projecting that image.
[102] Because it's you taking the photo, John is very unguarded.
[103] Yeah.
[104] I think that's the thing I noticed, getting these photos back.
[105] That it's just, it's as if I'm not there.
[106] You know, so he, yeah, you're right.
[107] He's unguarded.
[108] And I noticed it during the exhibition in the book, he's got this little habit.
[109] He's not biting his nails.
[110] He does this all the time.
[111] So it's just great to be reminded of it.
[112] Because it was so long ago, I'd forgotten that he had that little, that's a John thing.
[113] So, and you know, particularly because he's not here.
[114] It's so lovely for me to see these memories and just remind me of where we were, what we did in those days.
[115] you know what also sticks out in a lot of these photos because there's a bunch of photos and we'll see this where I see sometimes nerves a little bit of tension and what's interesting is everyone in this room myself included we know how the story turns out you the Beatles it's this spectacular success that's never been equaled in show business we all know what happens but especially in these early photos you guys don't know yet what's going to happen it's a mystery to you in these moments And people are constantly saying to you, well, you're a big hit in England.
[116] When's the bubble going to burst?
[117] And sometimes I see that, this really picking up steam, but I see in some of these photos, is it going to work out?
[118] How long is this going to last?
[119] Yeah, exactly, yeah.
[120] And what I love about them, he said modestly, is the innocence.
[121] Yes.
[122] Because we didn't know we were going to be famous and we really wanted to be.
[123] but as you say we didn't know so there's this sort of we're trying really hard so someone says you know the photographers hey hey beetle look over here you know you would do it you know there was no sort of moody like uh -huh later for you yeah um so you know i think that comes over just all this early innocence yeah of us just cute there's a lovely one here I absolutely love this photograph.
[124] And I feel like you're rapidly getting more sophisticated, you know, and the blur, you know, the vision of the accuracy.
[125] Yes, yeah.
[126] But, I mean, this is just a fantastic.
[127] And again, unguarded, I think.
[128] Yeah, I mean, you know, with the Beatles, we knew each other very well before all this happened.
[129] So, for instance, with George and with John on separate occasions.
[130] occasions, I would suggest that we went hitchhiking.
[131] So I knew George as a hitchhiking mate.
[132] And again, you're talking about we didn't know what was going to happen.
[133] Well, you didn't know if you were going to get a lift.
[134] So you shared all of that.
[135] You're sitting by the roadside, you know, just cursing the driver that wouldn't give you a lift and loving the lorry driver who did, you know.
[136] So that's my little hitchhiking mate.
[137] It's funny that that's because it's so personal for you.
[138] I often forget how young you guys were.
[139] George is the youngest.
[140] I think he's 20 here.
[141] And you think about just how young all of you were.
[142] It's just, it's mind -boggling to me. Yeah.
[143] I mean, you know, 20 now from this perspective is like really young.
[144] I mean, I've got grandkids older than that.
[145] But we didn't think it was young.
[146] We thought we were kings of the universe.
[147] Yeah.
[148] We smoked cigarettes, man. We had suits and ties, guitars.
[149] Yes.
[150] We were cool.
[151] Thanks for clearing that up.
[152] I wasn't sure.
[153] Beatles, cool or not, you know?
[154] I'm more of a Jerry and the Pacemakers guy, but all right.
[155] No one's ever said that to you, and no one ever will.
[156] I love, I think this next photo is a terrific photograph.
[157] It is, of course, Ringo, but look what, I just love the way you've captured the smoke.
[158] That's a gorgeous photograph.
[159] Yeah, thank you.
[160] You know, as you said before, everyone was on guard.
[161] So with photography, what I learned to do was look for the light situations where there was something interesting and Ringo, like all of us, actually, we were smokers, you know, but Ringo would do this trick.
[162] Ringo was like suave.
[163] He had like the best car and he would drink like bourbon and seven up.
[164] and when he would when he was going on a date with a girl he'd put two cigarettes in his mouth and light them oh my God and they'd give one to the girl if he didn't stick to his lip well you know that was Wingo he's that kind of guy you know I've done that with gum and they don't like it it's not quite so swath it's not the thing no no don't try it uh we have a photo here that i i again mr brian epstein yeah and what's nice here is he's such a pivotal character in especially in these early years in your life and i know what a complicated life he had in some ways what a tortured life he had and you catch him in this moment of um real just some real he seems at peace and happy and i think that might be because you're taking the photo yeah um I was very happy to rediscover this picture, as I was with all of them, with something like this, it just reminds you that the story about the Beatles manager and, you know, coming to America and all that, he's just some guy.
[165] And we thought it was like very old.
[166] He was all of 30.
[167] Yeah, yeah.
[168] So to us, that was like, but he was a sweetheart, you know, and he was gay.
[169] at a time when it was illegal.
[170] That's right.
[171] So, you know, we'd be able to have very interesting conversations with him.
[172] And he was very open with us.
[173] He was a great, great guy, very nice man. And I think, like you guys, a little overwhelmed.
[174] It got so big, so fast.
[175] And I've seen it in different documentaries.
[176] I think you're catching it here, which is just no one.
[177] He had run a record store just.
[178] you know, a few years before and met you guys and then suddenly he's talking to the biggest people in show business and they all want a piece of you guys and he needs to figure it out, which is, I must imagine, overwhelming.
[179] Yeah, but he handled it very well.
[180] You know, he got into that role quite easily.
[181] He'd been to Rada in London, the Royal Academy of Dramatic Art. So he was going to try and be an actor.
[182] It didn't work out.
[183] But he had a sort of showbiz thing.
[184] He had a style which he would, he would advise us with some tricks of the trade.
[185] You know, so that, where the Beatles at the end of every show would do the bow, you know.
[186] That was the kind of thing.
[187] Brian would say, that would look good.
[188] So we try it.
[189] And he was right.
[190] Yeah.
[191] It felt good, it looked good.
[192] But it gave us a little bit of something that other groups didn't have.
[193] This next photo, I don't think anyone here is going to know anybody who's in this photo, but it's fascinating to me because I'm reminded when I look at this book that you're musicians, you're on a bill, and here you are on the back, I think the side of the stage, and you're taking a photograph of a group called Peter Jay and the Jaywalkers.
[194] And I think they've been lost to us now, but it's fascinating to me to think about you guys waiting to go on.
[195] And there's another group, and they have a big saxophone player.
[196] Yeah.
[197] You guys opted not to go that route.
[198] No, no. Think of what you could have done.
[199] We could have.
[200] We could have.
[201] Imagine Ringo with a big sax.
[202] You blew it, you blew it, man. I know.
[203] No, you know, you were on package bills.
[204] These days, it's pretty much the main act, and there might be a warm -up act.
[205] But then it was a lot of people on the bill Because nobody did long Now, you know, people do three, four hours I blame Bruce Springsteen Yes I've told him so I said it's your fault Yeah, he ruined it for everyone He did Yeah You can't now do an hour Yeah We used to do a half hour That was like the Beatles thing Half an hour Yeah And we got paid for it.
[206] Yeah.
[207] But I tried to work out.
[208] Why was it so short?
[209] Well, because there was a lot of people on the bill.
[210] And I think when you went to a thing, if you were a comedian, the promoter would say, how long can you do?
[211] Four minutes?
[212] Yeah.
[213] Can you do four minutes?
[214] And the guy would say, yeah, so they would do four.
[215] So we thought, well, half an hour.
[216] That's like epic.
[217] You know, but that was it.
[218] You know, a big Beatles show, we were on and off like that.
[219] that.
[220] It didn't seem strange.
[221] It also reminds me that there were many bands in Liverpool.
[222] Yeah.
[223] And then once you got out of Liverpool, there are many bands in England.
[224] So there's, the Beatles are constantly pushing their way.
[225] Even in 62, 63, you're pushing your way through a sea of other people to get noticed.
[226] Yeah.
[227] Which I think people don't think about that now.
[228] No, there was a lot of action, you know.
[229] It was just a period.
[230] Or you got to remember, it was after World War II.
[231] You know, I was born, as was John and Ringo, Georgia, I think, just missed it.
[232] Well, we were born during the war.
[233] So, you know, you look back on it, you think, God, imagine our parents somewhere like this, if there's a cinema, but there's bombs falling.
[234] Yeah.
[235] You can't cope with that.
[236] You can't realize, you know.
[237] Well, yeah, so we came out of that.
[238] And so it meant that you.
[239] He was striving now in this new world.
[240] And suddenly they were like groups and singers.
[241] And it was all very exciting, Conan.
[242] Rub it in.
[243] I missed it all.
[244] You didn't?
[245] You weren't in a group?
[246] I wasn't in a group.
[247] I was in a group once years ago called The Bad Clams.
[248] Let's move on.
[249] I love this shot.
[250] Again, you're backstage and I see George is twisted.
[251] I love the Beatle boot in the four.
[252] And I also just love these peaks of backstage life.
[253] You're waiting.
[254] Maybe there's some anxiety or you're bored.
[255] There's that great, I think, album in the background for the platters.
[256] But it just, again, this is a view that no one else was getting.
[257] Yeah, I think that's the thing about these pictures.
[258] And he's not going to be bothered to kind of look at me and do a suave look, you know.
[259] He's like, oh, it's Paul, just taking pictures, you know.
[260] So he ignores me. which was a great thing.
[261] It happened to us later when we would be with people like the Maisel brothers.
[262] Yeah.
[263] Who are in New York team, just two brothers Albert and David.
[264] And it turned out they were going to cover our visit to New York.
[265] And so we said to them, what do you want us to do?
[266] They said, just ignore us.
[267] And that was like the greatest direction we'd ever had.
[268] Because you always had to ham it up.
[269] for people, you know, all the other photographers.
[270] I've seen the footage and all these guys with thick New York accents, Beatle, Beatle, Beatle, Beatle, do this, point that way, do that, point this way.
[271] And you think, leave them alone.
[272] You know, it seems.
[273] You know, the truth, we didn't mind.
[274] Yeah.
[275] Because we were in America, the land of music.
[276] And we were just very flattered that these kind of hard -nosed press photographers wanted to take our picture, you know.
[277] and then at the end of the session they'd say, hey, Pete, me, you know, one more, one more for the West Coast.
[278] What?
[279] So, you know, it was exciting.
[280] Yeah.
[281] It really was.
[282] And I don't think we minded it.
[283] Yeah.
[284] Till later.
[285] Till later, yeah.
[286] Then we, the glass wore off a bit.
[287] I think so.
[288] I think you earn the right very quickly, you guys, to say, I think we've had enough.
[289] We're moving on.
[290] This next photo is fascinating to me because it's a great photo and it's an oasis of calm.
[291] You're becoming incredibly famous and you're living in an attic of your girlfriend's house, Jane Asher, and you live up in this attic.
[292] This is at the height of Beatlemania in England and you take this photo out the back.
[293] And I think no one could have imagined that you were living in an attic, I think, with Peter Asher, her younger sister.
[294] Younger brother, sorry.
[295] Yeah.
[296] It was actually a very posh house.
[297] Yeah.
[298] It just had a not so posh view over the back, you know.
[299] This looks fantastic.
[300] It looks beautiful.
[301] It was very cool, actually, yeah.
[302] But this particular thing, this was out of my room.
[303] I was very lucky because I was going out with a girl called Jane Asher, and her mother was really nice woman.
[304] And I was missing home.
[305] and with the Beatles we'd got a little flat in Mayfair so everyone thought it was kind of cool but I went to see it and it was like soulless you know so Mrs. Asher said well you can come and stay here you know so I did I jumped at it she was a great cook as well but then the fans would find out that so they were that way out in the street and I was up here so I had to trying to figure out some way of getting out.
[306] So it was crazy.
[307] We knew this guy next door, you know, the house next door, who lived on this same level.
[308] His major somebody is like an army type lives on his own.
[309] So I would ring him and I would say, I'm coming out.
[310] He said, oh, okay.
[311] So he'd open his window and I'd walk along this little, you know, kind of dangerous little parapet.
[312] and go in his window, and then down in the lift, to the basement, go out of the muse, and escape.
[313] I love this major, who's clearly an older gentleman, thinking, oh, McCartney's coming through, got a lot of men.
[314] Well, this next one is not, you didn't take this, but it was taken, clearly, it was taken with your camera.
[315] Such a great dynamic shot of the two of you, you and John, and you can see, As hard as you worked, you always made it fun for each other, I think.
[316] That was a key ingredient.
[317] That's true.
[318] That's the thing I was saying about the hitchhiking and knowing each other before this.
[319] We'd established a sense of humor and a level at which we could make each other laugh.
[320] And John, of course, was very good at it.
[321] This interesting with that big red mark is to show me that I like these photos.
[322] and these were taken off a contact sheet which kids these days don't know about so you would take your 36 photos and they would be developed on all of them the 36 shots on one print so then you would go through it mark them up and you could get enlargements etc so I have a show in England at the National Portrait Gallery where we've shown some contact sheets and it's surprising how many people don't know what that is.
[323] Yeah.
[324] There's even sometimes in some of the photos that you've found, sprocket holes, because that's how they advance the film with this little gear.
[325] I don't think a lot of kids know what those are, but they really make them seem like such a part of a very specific era.
[326] Yeah.
[327] We have this, I love you guys go to things are really heating up.
[328] You go to Paris.
[329] This is you seeing a poster of yourselves for Les Beatles.
[330] Les Beatles.
[331] Lays Beatles.
[332] And what I love about this, and I don't think you can even see, but when you look closely, First of all, the photos that you're using in these posters were by Astrid, Purcher.
[333] And you also have the old logo that you had for half a minute, the script, the Beatles, with the antenna coming out before you went to that iconic drop T. But this feels to me like you saying, hey, look, that's a poster of us.
[334] Yeah.
[335] It's exciting.
[336] Well, look at that.
[337] In Paris.
[338] Lord, Lord.
[339] Yeah, no, it was, it was great.
[340] You know, we didn't expect Paris.
[341] as to have posters of us because the French were a little late in getting the Beatles you know in England like there was a lot of screaming and girls and stuff going mad for us when we went there it was quite sort of you know come on prove yourselves so we did we had to work it so yeah it was exciting just to see us up in lights as it were and the French to this day call me Paul McCartney McCartney.
[342] Clearing the throat, I think, more than anything else.
[343] I love this photo of That's nice, yeah.
[344] Such a great shot, John George, and this is, I think I recognize this.
[345] It's from a very famous picture that you guys took outside the it's at the Olympia I think theater bright blue bricks and it's a very iconic shot of you guys but I think you grabbed a this is probably in between takes with the photographer and I think you might have grabbed this shot and you can see again this is you guys at work and this is in between taking a photo session and this isn't the hey we're the Beatles it's guys working yeah and I mean you know seeing them after all these years is, what good looking, boys?
[346] Yeah.
[347] Come on.
[348] Good looking.
[349] You do say in the book, you talk about how we were all beautiful when we were young, and I begged to differ.
[350] I've got some photos I'll show you when I was 20.
[351] It's not so good.
[352] But you guys obviously looked spectacular.
[353] What I love, another aspect, of your perspective here is the world is looking at the Beatles at this point but you guys are looking back and this is a great shot of what it was like to be you and the other guys and actually the gentleman in the hat very famous photographer who took a lot of great snaps of you guys is that is it Dezo?
[354] Dezo Hoffman Dezo Hoffman yeah who was Slowback yeah he became a good friend you know so but he would get out with all the other photographers and snap us but yeah we saw this a lot and so I thought well yeah I'll take a picture of them it looks so good you know they're all lined up so yeah but this for this was a daily occurrence yeah you'd get used to this very quickly but it's fascinating to when you're being photographed to turn the tables and say I can do this to you yeah which is really fun and you see the look on their faces they quite liked it it's like This next one might be one of my favorite photos because of its honesty.
[355] And again, I think only you could get this is John.
[356] And again, biting.
[357] He's doing that thing again, yeah.
[358] And anxiety, I see vulnerability and I see some anxiety.
[359] I could be reading into it, but that's what it feels like to me. I don't know about the anxiety, but vulnerability is very true.
[360] and at this time I wouldn't really know that later when I thought as an adult about John's upbringing he had a really tragic life really because you know as a kid his mother was decreed to not be good enough to bring him up Julia his mom who we would visit and he loved her and wrote a beautiful song about her.
[361] But she had to give him up.
[362] The father, Alf, had left the home when John was three.
[363] So that's not too wonderful.
[364] And so John grew up with these sort of little minor tragedies throughout his life.
[365] He was taken in by his aunt Mimi and was brought up by her.
[366] But one night, Mum, Julia, was visiting.
[367] visiting them, come to see her son, and on the way home, she got run over and got killed by apparently an off -duty cop who maybe was a bit inebriated.
[368] It never came out, of course.
[369] They'd cover it up.
[370] But so John was having that, you know, taking off his mom, his mom dies, you know, so it made me realize why he had that vulnerability.
[371] I always admired the way he dealt with it because i'm not sure sure i would deal that well with the stuff you went through also you have a it's him with his glasses on these are very thick glasses because he yeah and uh that was something that was kind of verboten his shots of john with his glasses on when the photographer's around but it's you so he can have his glasses yeah that's really sweet but he he was um very short -sighted as you can see well the glasses but um oh i'm sorry i advanced but that's okay If you can just spoil my story, it's okay.
[372] It's your show?
[373] That was the idea.
[374] Please, Paul.
[375] Please, Paul, there's no time for your story.
[376] Nobody wants to hear you talk about John.
[377] Look what I can do.
[378] He's gone back.
[379] I did that.
[380] Did you have more?
[381] Lots.
[382] But I'm not telling you now.
[383] That's it.
[384] All right, screw.
[385] Okay, I'll tell you one.
[386] Go back.
[387] Go back.
[388] You're making a fool out of me. Well, it's easy.
[389] Okay, well, so John was like really short -sighted, and he used to come down from his house, which was mile or two away from where I lived, and we would write songs and have a little session.
[390] And this occasion, it was Christmas.
[391] And then John, after we finished, he would walk back up in the dark to his place I knew the route he took and it was a place called Booker Avenue and on the corner was this little kind of little posh bungalow so he walks home and then he we talked in the next day he said said you know that the house on the corner Booker Avenue so I went past it said those people are crazy I said why what do you mean he said well they were out you know what time was we finished midnight said they were out on the veranda on the porch playing cards at midnight i said i don't get it so i went up and looked it was it was the manger it was the baby jesus he wasn't going to put his glasses on and a baby won all the money um all right now we talk about again you've got an unguarded wringo and again again we're seeing this backstage life A little pensive, waiting.
[392] And this is you, a technique, which I think you really liked, which is you could surprise people.
[393] You could catch them if you shot into a mirror.
[394] Early paparazzi.
[395] So it's your fault, is it?
[396] No, you're right.
[397] You know, it's just I knew Ringo was just being natural, was act naturally.
[398] And so, yeah, I knew I could get that shot without him looking over and going, oh, you know.
[399] So, yeah, there was a lot of this backstage.
[400] And again, the light was quite nice, you know, so it was a good shot to try and take.
[401] This one is kind of spectacular to me because there's a flurry of activity, and it's a great shot to me because it feels like John is almost pulled into himself.
[402] Things are heating up.
[403] It's getting crazier and crazier, and he seems like he's just trying to be zen.
[404] Yeah.
[405] I think you had to be, you know, because there was a lot of craziness going on.
[406] and you had to take that moment for yourself.
[407] The good thing was he knew no one would be worried.
[408] It's not like anyone would say, come on, John, lively up.
[409] You know, he could just knew he could just sit there.
[410] And as I say, I always admired that about John.
[411] You know, now I realize I was like a big fan of John's.
[412] We all were actually in the group.
[413] He was like a very cool guy, you know, very witty.
[414] very funny but also very deep and real so these photos show that from an early age we have one you are underrepresented obviously because you're taking the photos but someone took this photo with your camera and i love it it's backstage and um i never looked that good uh but i think we know that but I also love, this almost feels Victorian, that wallpaper, that light switch.
[415] This is, you know, a different, it's show business from a different era.
[416] You guys were changing all the rules, but you're still in those dressing rooms.
[417] Yeah, that's right.
[418] I always think we were on the cusp because often we'd play on a bill, and there would be people from the previous era, and we were like the rock group.
[419] this is the modern thing you know but there were plenty of like jugglers and yeah strange people so yeah we we were in that world which I liked I liked coming out of that and sort of emerging I mean now you know you go to a show and it's all rock and roll you know it's a rock and roll show but then you got all sorts of different acts so yeah So it was interesting.
[420] It made it interesting for us.
[421] You wanted to chat to some of these people, you know, and see what life was like for them.
[422] What's funny, you came out of that.
[423] It really was the English musical tradition, which I think influenced the music, too.
[424] You guys came from that world, which had been around since the turn of the century.
[425] Yeah, and we'd grown up with that.
[426] And then suddenly rock and roll hit, and we were now going to take it further in a different direction.
[427] But yeah, we'd grown up with that.
[428] My dad used to actually operate the limelight, the spotlight, at a theatre in Liverpool called the Hippodrome.
[429] And it was a limelight, which not many people know, was a piece of lime that you lit, and it burned phosphorescent.
[430] And then that went through a lens and became the limelight beam.
[431] I had no, I've never heard that before.
[432] I know.
[433] It's a sort of educational show this.
[434] I love that you assumed that I didn't know anything.
[435] No, so he was in that world, you know, he was in that world.
[436] And so it went right back to all the old musical acts, you know.
[437] And so he knew a lot of the songs.
[438] And he would go home to his sisters in the interval, the two houses he'd go home and he'd sing the songs to them and they'd remember them so they'd all come out of the family sing songs and also he would take home programs for the event that people had left and he would take them home and the girls would iron them make them new again and he'd take him back and flog him a sense of enterprise no yeah but it was that world Like you're saying, it was a whole different world.
[439] That's what I, when you arrived backstage and I saw you go into your dressing room, and I think, you know, some things just don't change.
[440] Here you are.
[441] Another dressing room.
[442] We're putting on a show.
[443] It's exhilarating.
[444] It's still to be part of that tradition.
[445] Yeah, I feel very lucky with that, you know, because so many of your mates at school went on and did uninspiring things.
[446] Yeah, all right.
[447] So, you know, you felt very lucky to...
[448] It must be tough when you show up at a high school reunion.
[449] I think I did pretty well.
[450] I've got a nice hardware store.
[451] I think I did as well as it.
[452] Oh, Jesus!
[453] It's McCartney.
[454] Yeah.
[455] We have a picture here I adore.
[456] Yeah, this is John wearing men.
[457] I mean, sorry, George.
[458] I get them all confused.
[459] You're the drummer, right?
[460] But I love, it's that sense of comedy, too, of don't play the joke.
[461] You know, there is nothing funny happening here, which is the funniest way to be.
[462] I'm going to wear these two hats and I'm going to give you the most serious look in the world.
[463] Yeah, I know.
[464] George is very good at that.
[465] Yeah.
[466] Yeah, you know, he had a good, deadpan sense of humor.
[467] And these hats were just lying around.
[468] They're probably the dancers.
[469] Hats looks like the kind of thing the dancers would get a cane, one of those hats, and a scanty costume, and do all sorts of dancing.
[470] Yeah.
[471] So he picked up the hats.
[472] To that point of that's the show business you're in.
[473] There's some dancers here.
[474] We're going to take these hats and goof around.
[475] Yeah.
[476] This looks like, I know, and this is, I believe you're at a recording studio in it.
[477] I believe it's in Paris.
[478] Yeah.
[479] And this looks like a Chet.
[480] Baker album cover.
[481] It's absolutely, it's a stunning photograph.
[482] You guys are ushering in a whole new era of music, but you're still working alongside these other guys.
[483] Yeah.
[484] It's funny, I never knew who these guys were.
[485] I just, it was, I think it was a rehearsal hall.
[486] And I never knew.
[487] I just liked that looked so cool, you know, I just took the picture.
[488] But I never knew till very recently who they were or what was going on.
[489] And it turns out, Elvis Costello, texted me just the other day, and he said he's got an amazing text from a friend of his who's called Ray, and Ray said, I've got the book, and on page 161, there's this photo of my dad playing guitar.
[490] What?
[491] Ah, he said, my heart skipped a beat.
[492] So now we know who that was.
[493] That was Ray's dad.
[494] Now things really pick.
[495] up.
[496] This is the famous flight, Pan Am 101.
[497] You are going to New York City.
[498] And you don't know what you're going to find when you get to New York City.
[499] You know you're on the charts, a number one hit.
[500] You're going to do the Sullivan Show.
[501] We all know what happens.
[502] But you guys, on the way over, you don't know.
[503] America's the big prize.
[504] The country's in mourning after JFK's assassination, which is two months earlier.
[505] What are you going to encounter?
[506] Is it going to work?
[507] yeah exactly you know so we were very excited just to be on a plane to new york you know that's like enough but what happened was the pilots always radio ahead to idle wild as it was then right before he was named kennedy and so the word got back to us there's a big crowd at the airport oh wow getting exciting so yeah we kind of half knew what to expect But then it was a really big crowd.
[508] Yeah.
[509] And so, yeah, we were just bowled over.
[510] It was America where all the music that we loved came from.
[511] So we were just happy to be there.
[512] And then with a big crowd of admirers, screaming girls, it was great.
[513] And then what was nice after that, immediately we did a press conference at the airport.
[514] And it was like, hey, people.
[515] and all that again.
[516] But we knew that whatever they laid on us, if there was any sort of insult, we knew we could come back with, well, we're number one in your country.
[517] Yeah.
[518] Boom.
[519] Yeah.
[520] That's called a mic drop.
[521] This is what you encounter when you get there.
[522] And I love this photo you took.
[523] We've all seen, of course, the other side of it, but this is what you guys saw outside the plot.
[524] which is absolutely amazing and again probably you would see this in Europe but to realize that this isn't happening in New York City yeah is got to just be an incredible it was great well the whole thing to the the fans at the police the policeman and you know when you see some other photos they've got the old fashioned police uniform with the big buttons and there were mounted police too.
[525] So it was very exciting for us just in a car.
[526] It was like looking, being in a movie.
[527] And because every time I drive down Fifth Avenue, I tell everyone that story.
[528] It's funny because you are tourists.
[529] Think about it.
[530] I think George had been to New York once, but the rest of you are tourists and this is your first view of New York City.
[531] Not many people encounter this when they show up in New York for the first time.
[532] That's not what it's always like.
[533] Well, of course I do, but, you know, I'm me. This, I love Columbus Circle.
[534] I was there this morning, and I knew I'd be talking to you, and I've read the book 50 times, because I adore it.
[535] I love how different it is now, and I can see that you're starting to take pictures of signage.
[536] You're taking a lot of sort of these almost still lifes.
[537] It's a different idea now that you're playing with, which is this is America.
[538] Yeah, I mean, you know, you're just taking photos, so you're not necessarily taking portraits.
[539] You're just taking anything appeals to you.
[540] So to me, that's America.
[541] And actually on that little needle that's on the thing, it's a weather thing, and it's always telling the temperature.
[542] And you can see there's one little bit that's worn away.
[543] So that must be like the most popular temperature.
[544] It was the number one temperature in the country.
[545] Yeah.
[546] I just liked the picture, you know, so I took it.
[547] You guys, this is a great shot of the amazing Ronnie Spector of the Ronnettes.
[548] It reminded me of something I don't think can be stressed enough is what you guys did when you landed is you completely gave it up for girl groups.
[549] And you were a group that played a lot of songs by girl groups and promoted them.
[550] And they were songs that you loved.
[551] ringgo would sing boys didn't even change the gender you know it's just we're going to sing please mr postman baby it's you yeah um and that was i think at the time unusual when everyone was asking you guys what do you love and you said we love these girl groups yeah mostly black american music really except for you know if i feel like Elvis and karl perkins and things um so yeah we love these girl groups and as you say Ringo sang boys and we never thought you know that's strange it just was a great song yeah um so we just liked how it sounded i don't think we really worried about what the lyrics said um and see it was great for us to meet ronnie you know yeah wow all your heroes are turning up and they want to meet you guys yeah it's true um this one also from inside is a double exposure of John.
[552] I was struck with, you guys were slabs.
[553] Yeah.
[554] I'm sorry.
[555] Yeah, but we, you know, we got time off.
[556] We're in a hotel.
[557] We're allowed to slub.
[558] It'd be unusually if he wasn't slopped.
[559] This is the...
[560] Yeah.
[561] Go ahead.
[562] No, you...
[563] I, uh, this is a shot.
[564] We've seen so many shots from different angles of the Sullivan set.
[565] But this is what struck me. Look at how small the riser is for Ringo's drum kit.
[566] I know.
[567] I can't believe it.
[568] And as a guy who I started out as a bad drummer before I moved on to bad guitar and then bad comedy, what I, what struck me about this is guitars, I mean, drums move when you hit them.
[569] Yeah.
[570] It's a miracle.
[571] He didn't fall off.
[572] I know.
[573] He's Ringo.
[574] Ringo didn't fall off.
[575] He didn't fall off.
[576] No, but I agree.
[577] I mean, how did he get up there?
[578] Yeah.
[579] It's like, did he jump?
[580] He was...
[581] Or was he lifted?
[582] I don't know.
[583] This raised so many questions for me. But it does make me, in retrospect, terrified for him on that Sullivan appearance.
[584] That the drums didn't just fall off in the middle of the first song.
[585] He used to have a hard job with all that stuff.
[586] We played in Washington.
[587] And for the first time ever, they said, you're going to play in the round.
[588] We didn't even know what they were talking about.
[589] But there was like a little round stage in the middle of the room.
[590] You know, I now know it's to get more people in.
[591] Yes, that's why they were doing it.
[592] But they said, well, you'll have to play to these people.
[593] Then you'll have to turn around and play to those people.
[594] Then those people.
[595] So we just about managed it.
[596] We'd sort of move our amps and sort of.
[597] Ringo had to move his whole drum kit.
[598] Because his riser didn't move.
[599] There's footage of this, and it's ridiculous because you're the biggest act in the history of the world.
[600] And in between songs, Ringo's jumping down, and it's like he's moving somebody into their dorm room, you know?
[601] It's ridiculous.
[602] I know.
[603] And there's no one running out and doing it for him, and he's pushing and shoving, and you guys are like, come on, Ringo, let's go.
[604] Well, he did it.
[605] Yeah, he did it.
[606] He did what you had to do.
[607] He did it.
[608] This photo you took out the window, it is miraculous, I think.
[609] It's such an angelic shot of this.
[610] Yeah, I love this picture.
[611] Her looking in at you and you looking out.
[612] Yeah.
[613] And she's ethereal, you know?
[614] She's really...
[615] She really is, yeah.
[616] She's so serene.
[617] And, you know, normally we'd see people like this, and they'd be sort of shouting or screaming or waving.
[618] But she's just got this very cool.
[619] look.
[620] Yeah.
[621] It's like you want to paint a portrait.
[622] She's got the headscarf.
[623] And I wish I knew a story.
[624] Who knows?
[625] You know, maybe one of these days someone will say that was my auntie.
[626] But...
[627] It'll be Elvis Costello.
[628] It gets in touch with you.
[629] I know her too.
[630] Maybe he's raised auntie.
[631] He texts me all the time too, I don't believe a word of it, none of it.
[632] After Sullivan, as you said, you guys go down to Washington, D .C., and I love this photo because so much of your art, so much of your music is about working people, you know, and barbers, Eleanor Rigby, firemen, nurses, poppy on a tray.
[633] You have this way, and I love this photo because you're looking out the window, you're at the eye of this hurricane, and you see this man, and you take this photo and you seem drawn to people that are out there doing their job and he's anonymous.
[634] Yeah, because that's my world.
[635] You know, growing up in Liverpool, these are the people you knew and you hung up with.
[636] Also, I mean, I could have just been, in Liverpool, I could have just been to the right clearing up after him.
[637] You know, these, that could be my own call.
[638] So I, it isn't.
[639] but um it's ray's uncle no no no but you know i just i'm drawn to yeah people's working people's faces they they just look good and also the other thing i'm drawn to them for people tend to think working class people are a bit stupid you know he's like look at the job he's got he's been stupid but some of them you know if you know them and you kind of you visit their houses or like my uncle's an they could be really clever people and I love that yeah I mean I had an uncle who was really all right you know what I got a Liverpool you know it's all like that like you know so you would have thought well he's a bit thick I wouldn't people might have thought yes yes well he was great and I would bring homework home from school And he was the one in the family who would know the Shakespeare and the epic poems.
[640] He just, he'd been taught it and he'd remember it all.
[641] So these hidden depths are what I love about working people.
[642] Never underestimate them.
[643] Well, we move on.
[644] This is we're now getting to Miami.
[645] You land in Miami.
[646] And John once had a quote.
[647] He said that the early Beatles touring day.
[648] were like a Fellini film, Satiricon, just madness.
[649] And here you really see it, because get this book and you look up close, there are beauty queens.
[650] Yeah.
[651] There are, I mean, all kinds of, just insanity.
[652] There are all these people there, and you're thinking, why are these people here?
[653] Yeah.
[654] And, you know.
[655] What about the guy or girl in the hat, though, with the sort of leopard skin thing?
[656] Oh, check this out.
[657] I saw the same thing, and I wanted to, punch in on this.
[658] Look who's greeting you, holding, I don't know if you can see this, holding a chimpanzee.
[659] You know.
[660] Why?
[661] Well, we, you know, I think we appeal to everyone.
[662] Even monkeys.
[663] I just love this moment.
[664] I know, isn't that wild?
[665] And I mean, on the day, I just took the picture, but I couldn't ever see that detail.
[666] Right.
[667] Until the book and...
[668] God bless.
[669] I saw that and I thought this photograph captures...
[670] Yes, this is Beatlemania.
[671] And then we had to call the monkey to clear the photo.
[672] Which did not go well.
[673] This is a fascinating photo because you are zeroed in on the fact that this is not something you saw in England.
[674] You didn't see in Liverpool.
[675] You didn't see it, London.
[676] This was new to you.
[677] Yeah, no, this is when we arrived in Miami and we had a police escort.
[678] And this guy on the motorcycle just pulled up right beside us.
[679] And I had my camera.
[680] So I just snapped this picture of him.
[681] Because I was so amazed at seeing like a gun, an ammo.
[682] Because in England, we were very lucky.
[683] The cops don't have guns.
[684] Yeah.
[685] So this was like, yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly.
[686] Well, we are very lucky in that respect, you know, it's, yeah, our laws never included the Second Amendment.
[687] But, yeah, so I was fascinated by this guy, you know, and the gun and everything, and I didn't want his head.
[688] I just wanted that bit, you know, just to remind myself of what America was like.
[689] This is, I'll just love, there's a girl here in the center, and to me that says it all.
[690] I've never made anyone that happy in my life.
[691] Unbelievable.
[692] And I mean, when I, again, like I say, took the picture quickly in the car and drove into the hotel kind of thing.
[693] I mean, then I discovered her when I looked at the picture.
[694] Yeah.
[695] I can almost hear her screaming.
[696] Yeah.
[697] Today should be medicated, yeah.
[698] The parents would be like, no, no, no, Redland for you, but it's unbelievable moment.
[699] And just the looks on all the people's faces, you've got the kid there who's come from school, he's got his books, you know, girl along there who doesn't quite know what to think of it.
[700] And then the cop, who's ready to blow his whistle?
[701] Yeah.
[702] He's ready.
[703] He still hasn't blown the whistle all these years later, no. Well, now it's the Wizard of Oz.
[704] you switched to color, and you guys suddenly hit Miami, which must have felt like a dream, because now you are at the top of show business.
[705] The reviews are in.
[706] 78, 80 million people watch you guys on Sullivan.
[707] The world's going crazy.
[708] And then you hit this incredible water in Miami.
[709] Yeah.
[710] And you're having fun.
[711] You're relaxing.
[712] Yeah, we were very looking.
[713] And I think Brian Epstein was, instrumental in that he always put in a little bit of leisure even though we worked crazy days I don't know like 300 days a year probably but he would always put in like a visit to the beach you know and we were really thankful so this is they'd hired a boat and we just went out for the day and it was so good because after that you wouldn't mind doing a show right You know, you felt so good.
[714] You're here to do another Sullivan appearance, but down in Miami, which suddenly everything's different, and I think you can see that in this photo.
[715] Oh, yeah, baby.
[716] Which is...
[717] Oh, baby.
[718] I mean, that's an album cover.
[719] That is the...
[720] That is such a spectacular photo of George, and are we thinking that's a...
[721] Would that be a rum and Coke, a Scotch and Coke?
[722] What were you guys having at the time?
[723] I think it was a Scotch and Coke.
[724] Yeah, that's what we're doing.
[725] But, no, that is George, live in the life.
[726] I mean, you know, and he took to it very well.
[727] Yes.
[728] So he's got the tan.
[729] He's in Miami.
[730] He's got the tan.
[731] He's got a girl, beautiful girl, in a sensational bikini.
[732] Yeah.
[733] I mean, I think, you know, a designer, I would have to tell Stella about that one.
[734] He's got the siggy.
[735] He's got the drink.
[736] He's got the shades.
[737] Oh, my God, yeah.
[738] It looks like he's got some suntan lotion on.
[739] It's all good.
[740] It's all good.
[741] All good.
[742] Yeah, that photo makes me very happy.
[743] And these next ones are just you guys rehearsing.
[744] Well, actually, you're getting ready to rehearse.
[745] This is, of course, Ringo.
[746] And there's a lot of Beatles paraphernalia.
[747] He's wearing like a Beatles souvenir hat that someone handed to you.
[748] And he said, all right, I'll put it on.
[749] It's a good hat.
[750] Yeah, it's a good hat.
[751] It's free.
[752] And he lets you know who will.
[753] Do you still have any of that stuff?
[754] That free Beatles stuff they gave you?
[755] No, I don't.
[756] Well, it probably turned up one of these days.
[757] It's in there.
[758] It's in that locker you back.
[759] No, the nice thing about this stuff in this series of us, the hotel provided you with, you know, normally you'll get a robe.
[760] Yep.
[761] Or dressing gowns in a hotel.
[762] They had these little terry towel jackets.
[763] Very cool.
[764] I think you see them next because you guys are rehearsing.
[765] We didn't take them off.
[766] No. And we love them.
[767] In all the rehearsal shots, you can see that you guys are wearing.
[768] I'm surprised you didn't wear them for the next three albums.
[769] And just a shout out to, that's Mal in the back of Mal Evans, who was your rody.
[770] Yeah.
[771] And he's got a sunburn.
[772] Mal, yeah.
[773] Mal was a lovely man who was our rody and a big bear of a man. And he was a sweetheart.
[774] You know, he just, he loved us and we loved him.
[775] You know what's incredible, too, is you look at what a band travels with today.
[776] There hasn't been a band nearly as big as you guys since, and yet your entourage is very small.
[777] It's mind -boggling by today's standards.
[778] Yeah.
[779] Two people, Mal and Neil.
[780] Yeah.
[781] Taking care of instruments, hotel rooms, in and out, taking care of everything, baggage.
[782] Yeah.
[783] And one of them was here with you.
[784] That is, of course, George Martin, and I believe his fiancé.
[785] She was a fiancé at the time, and they later got married.
[786] Judy Lockhart Smith.
[787] Oh, that's a nice name.
[788] Very posh.
[789] She's still alive.
[790] She's a lovely, lovely lady.
[791] Well, she is Lady Martin now, as George was knighted.
[792] But they were great.
[793] They were a lovely couple.
[794] And, of course, George was a brilliant man and a great producer.
[795] He also had a fantastic sense of humor.
[796] So he and Judy got on very well.
[797] And, yeah, they were a great couple.
[798] Also, I just have never seen a photo.
[799] I don't think I've seen him in a bathing suit.
[800] It's just such a...
[801] I am always seeing him iconic, even late in the Beatles days, is when everyone else is wearing whatever, he's always suit and tie proper, you know, EMI, this is the way we do things.
[802] And so this picture was, I thought, very arresting for that reason.
[803] Yeah.
[804] There's a later picture where he's got Judy, he's going to throw her in the pool.
[805] But that was lovely.
[806] You know, just having these moments of leisure.
[807] Yeah.
[808] And then these friends of ours who were on the trip could join us with the...
[809] This photo is so funny.
[810] You're there, I think, on the beach, and you see an ad go by, and you take a picture of it, there is only one Mr. Pants.
[811] And it's true.
[812] Have you ever seen another Mr. Pants?
[813] I have not.
[814] Me neither.
[815] There's only one.
[816] But I love the idea that Mr. Pants decided, I'll buy an ad.
[817] We'll have the plane fly by where the Beatles are.
[818] Maybe one of them will take a photograph and show.
[819] Show it 60 years from now.
[820] And I'll get some free advertising.
[821] Oh, man. So what do you think it was?
[822] Like a trouser firm?
[823] Mr. Pants.
[824] Yes, it's got to be trousers.
[825] It's got to be trousers.
[826] Back in the day, trouser firms, as we called them, we're all the rage.
[827] Firm trousers.
[828] Yeah.
[829] A trouser firm.
[830] You made it sound like a law firm.
[831] I love it.
[832] Welcome to the trouser firm This is one of my favorites Because it's George as happy as anyone could possibly be Yeah In the toweling jacket In the toweling jacket No you know I can say you've got to imagine my joy Yeah At first of all Rediscovering these And then seeing this Yes It just you know It just takes you back It's like your family snapshots But these are shots My family snapshot But they're of the Beatles And And just so lovely to capture a moment of George like that.
[833] You know, you don't kind of see him like that.
[834] And we were on a boat in Miami, and we were loving it.
[835] And then I'm going to end on the photo that's on the cover.
[836] Oh, no, I'm sorry, there's one more to go.
[837] I wanted to get in one before we wrapped it up.
[838] It's me being horrified, but the fact I've caught a fish.
[839] Yeah.
[840] Yeah.
[841] You didn't intend to catch one.
[842] You got one.
[843] And I think you put it back.
[844] I did put it back, yeah.
[845] In a hurry.
[846] Already, the inner vegetarian in you was saying.
[847] It was already cooking.
[848] This will not work for me. You may go, fishy.
[849] You may go.
[850] Yep.
[851] And then I wanted to end on this one.
[852] This is the cover shot.
[853] Just for fun, I walked over there today.
[854] It was amazing how much it's changed.
[855] But also, what's still the same?
[856] I looked at this photograph and I thought, there you are, I think, shooting out the back of the window.
[857] I think you're on your way to the plaza, maybe from the Ed Sullivan, but just the fact that you had the presence of mind to take some photos while all this was happening is miraculous to me. It's a great shot.
[858] Well, thank you.
[859] You know, the thing is we were so fascinated being in America, seeing American life, American cars, American buildings, New York.
[860] So, yeah, you know, if people are running up the street, that's, to us, that was fascinating.
[861] You know, wow, we've made it.
[862] Yeah.
[863] Well, I want to make sure that I wrap this up.
[864] I have to tell you that I have been lucky enough to be in my business now for, you know, 30 -some -odd years and I get to talk to everybody.
[865] I can't think of a single person who's brought more joy to more people.
[866] than you.
[867] And it is, I mean that, seriously.
[868] And I really mean that.
[869] And I don't just mean, I don't just mean with the Beatles.
[870] I mean, and my son would agree, wings, the solo work, the work that you've been doing, McCartney 3.
[871] You just don't stop making really lovely, beautiful music.
[872] And so when I arrived here today, someone in your group said, well, thanks for doing this, Conan, and I said, what are you talking about?
[873] This is an absolute joy and a thrill and can't think of anything cooler than to get to spend an hour with you.
[874] Wow.
[875] And look at these photos.
[876] So I think on behalf of everybody here, I want to say, thank you, Paul McCartney.
[877] Thank you.
[878] Thank you.
[879] Conan O 'Brien needs a friend with Conan O 'Brien, Sonam of Sessian, and Matt Goreley.
[880] Produced by me, Matt Goreley.
[881] Executive produced by Adam sax, Nick Liao, and Jeff Ross at Team Coco, and Colin Anderson and Cody Fisher at Your Wolf.
[882] Theme song by The White Stripes.
[883] Incidental music by Jimmy Vivino.
[884] Take it away, Jimmy.
[885] Our supervising producer is Aaron Blair, and our associate talent producer is Jennifer Samples.
[886] Engineering by Eduardo Perez.
[887] Additional production support by Mars Melnick.
[888] Talent booking by Paula Davis, Gina Batista, and Britt Kahn.
[889] You can rate and review this show on Apple Podcasts, and you might find your review read on a future episode.
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