The Transformation of Ralph Northam

[0] From New York Times, I'm Michael Bobarrow.

[1] This is a daily.

[2] Two years after facing calls to resign over a racist image, the Democratic governor of Virginia, Ralph Northam, has instead emerged as the most racially progressive leader in the state's history.

[3] Today.

[4] Sabrina Tabernisi spoke with our colleague, Astrid Herndon, about how that happened.

[5] It's Thursday.

[6] I said, tell me why you became interested in this story, in the story of Ralph Northam.

[7] Well, in 2019, I was really looking at the state of Virginia and thinking, what in the world is going on?

[8] All right.

[9] What is going on in Virginia?

[10] The state was thrown into chaos when it came out that Governor Ralph Northam wore blackface in the 80s.

[11] The governor, who it was discovered on his medical school yearbook paper, had a really racist photograph.

[12] The picture shows two people.

[13] You can see it right there.

[14] One in blackface and another in a Ku Klux Klan robe and a hood.

[15] A man in blackface, then another man in a KKK costume.

[16] Just a short time ago, the governor, admitting one of those men is him.

[17] And the governor said initially that it was him, then flip -flopped the next day and said he doesn't think it was him.

[18] I am not the person in that photo.

[19] But he did wear blackface on another time.

[20] That same year, I did participate.

[21] in a dance contest in which I darkened my face as part of a Michael Jackson costume.

[22] And it was a lot of calls for him to resign.

[23] I think he should resign immediately.

[24] The governor should resign.

[25] I think he's shown himself sort of irreparably damaged in terms of his ability to govern.

[26] Can Governor Northam survive this?

[27] No. But then a whole bunch of other stuff happened in the state, too.

[28] Justin Fairfax, Lieutenant Governor, facing two accusations of sexual assault.

[29] The person who would have been next in line if Ralph Northam had stepped down, the lieutenant governor, he was accused of sexual assault by two women in this period, though he denies those allegations.

[30] He's hanging in the job right now as well.

[31] And then you had the attorney general, who would have been third in line, also a Democrat, voluntarily admit that he wore blackface at a party in the 1980.

[32] The state's top three lawmakers now facing separate scandals, although they're all interconnected.

[33] So I think my reaction, sitting in New York at the time, was what was in the water in Virginia.

[34] And more interestingly enough, how come all these people, all three of them, stayed in office?

[35] Interesting.

[36] I remember that series of very strange news items starting with Northam thinking, what happened?

[37] And I remember him saying he wasn't going to leave.

[38] And then it seemed like the story just kind of faded away, right?

[39] Well, on the national level, it did.

[40] You had a Democratic Party that was obviously in the middle of a presidential primary and the election of Joe Biden.

[41] And that was where the attention was on the national level.

[42] But, you know, I think as part of covering that is also following what's happening in the states.

[43] And I was seeing a Virginia that certainly looked differently than before the scandal.

[44] I said, do you like the color blue?

[45] Because I'm here to officially declare today November the 5th, 2019, that Virginia, Virginia is officially blue.

[46] Congratulations.

[47] In November of 2019, Democrats became the majority in both houses of the state legislature, giving them really expanded political possibilities in the state that they've never really had before.

[48] And then you also had an administration that kept putting race and racial progress at the forefront of its priorities.

[49] Governor Ralph Northam signed into law sweeping police reform bills this week that will also expand the grounds to decertify officers who commit misconduct, limit the use of neck restraints, and standardized training requirements.

[50] And Governor Northam got on board with the movement to remove a number of Confederate statues and monuments.

[51] Generations ago, Virginia made the decision not to celebrate unity, but to honor the cause of division.

[52] Symbols matter too, and Virginia has never been willing to deal with symbols, until now.

[53] And I think the last piece for me was the abolition of the death penalty that happened in Virginia, the first state in the south to do so.

[54] When one looks at the history, close to 1 ,400 individuals have been executed.

[55] The great majority of those individuals were African American.

[56] We've executed more people than any other state.

[57] And this is our time to write that wrong.

[58] He was someone who was elected not really as a progressive, but as a kind of tried and true southern, kind of more conservative Democrat.

[59] And he hadn't really leaned in to issues of race and identity before 2019.

[60] And so it was kind of forefront on my mind that after the inauguration and the national elections were over, that it could be a good time to check in with the Northam scandal of 2019.

[61] How did it change this person who clearly was thought to be, you know, dead.

[62] So I went to Virginia and I talked to the governor in this office.

[63] So instead, what does he say?

[64] Just kind of initially as a fact -checking thing, I wanted to make sure it's it's, you know, as you said at the time, you still don't recall being either one of the folks in that picture.

[65] Okay.

[66] In the interview, the governor reiterates that he does not believe that he is either man in the racist photograph on his yearbook page, but that he did wear black face in a previous incident at a party around the same time.

[67] He also states, that his main goal after the news broke was to convince his black staff to stick by him and also he made a pitch to elected officials across the state, particularly the black elected officials, that if they stuck by him, he would show that he's a changed man and those new priorities will be reflected in his administration.

[68] I said that, you know, I understand what's going on.

[69] I know why these people are hurting.

[70] and I'm committed to listening and learning and then having the pulpit, if you will, to really make some significant changes.

[71] And so that's really the approach that I took.

[72] So I never, you know, I was having people, as you may remember, that were really leaving on me to, you know, I needed to resign.

[73] And I said, I can do more good for people and more good for Virginia.

[74] people will stick with me. And Ralph Northam's telling, the way that the scandal changed him starts on the inside.

[75] That's a moment of embarrassment caused personal growth that then was reflected in his administration's priorities.

[76] One of my proudest moments was being at Greensville Correctional Center and signing legislation to get rid of the death penalty.

[77] I mean, if you look at the history of that, and it's another example of what happened in fact everywhere it hadn't happened.

[78] I'm not sure if my eyes would have been open to the point where I went back and looked at the history and how many people of color had been executed and why capital punishment was being used.

[79] And I mean, we could go through example after example, whether it be access to health care, access, to education, or access to business opportunities, or voting that are all just, you know, just full of racism and oppression that they were, I guess, in front of my eyes, but my brain didn't know about them at the time.

[80] And that's why I'm a much better person now than I was.

[81] And that eyes and brain, mine, though, February 19th, brought together.

[82] Absolutely.

[83] But I wanted to ask him how much of this is also about politics, how much of this is about him repaying a black community that's stuck by him at his darkest time.

[84] Someone told me today that the policy has paid back the debt.

[85] What do you think about that?

[86] You know, I'm not one to, I don't go around taking credit for things.

[87] I think the good policy that has come from all this has been a team effort.

[88] A lot of these things would not have happened if we didn't have the majority in the House and the Senate.

[89] And so why I don't want to take all the credit for that, but this has been a team effort.

[90] And it's been an effort where, again, I've sat down with people who said, these are some things that we can do.

[91] And it's all about time and an opportunity.

[92] When he talks to the people around him, they make very clear that he has taken this period of growth very seriously, that he has really made it his mission to learn about what he says he was ignorant of the history of race and racism before this scandal.

[93] But for a lot of black leaders in the state, whether they were elected officials or whether they were activists, they're frankly unconcerned with how true his growth personally is.

[94] This was a moment of opportunity.

[95] There was a window in which the governor was asking you, what can I do for you?

[96] And they decided that they were going to seize on that.

[97] We'll be right back.

[98] So instead, you said, some of the black leaders in Virginia saw this scandal with Northam as an opportunity.

[99] What did you mean by that?

[100] One of the people I talked to about that was one of his campaign co -chairs from when Ralph Northam originally ran for governor.

[101] And her name is Marcia Price.

[102] I am a delegate for the 95th District, which is parts of Newport, Newfoundhampton, Virginia.

[103] She's a member of what is functionally the House of Representatives for the state of Virginia.

[104] And she had really put her credibility on the line to help get Northam elected and what was a competitive Democratic primary.

[105] So she was going across the state with him kind of as a liaison to black voters and community leaders back when he was initially running to be governor.

[106] So we had gone into intimate spaces within, you know, my network when we were running for election.

[107] And she said that when she found out about the photo scandal, she was crushed.

[108] The moment that the story broke, I was in my office talking with my interns and my fare, and I politely asked for them to step out, and, like, I cried.

[109] The initial reaction was, it hurt.

[110] It hurt like, hell.

[111] I had to deal with that.

[112] Wow.

[113] She has this initial reaction.

[114] Then what does she do?

[115] When she went home to her district as this was going on, it became very clear to her that the feeling among the Black Virginians she was representing was way more diverse and nuanced than the feelings that were happening on the national level.

[116] That weekend and several weekends after, people were coming up to me and making sure I knew how they felt on either side, you know, whether we should push him out, you know, or, or, y 'all leave that man alone and take this as an opportunity.

[117] And so I heard things from, well, that was back then, who is he now?

[118] It was not excusing bad behavior.

[119] It was an understanding on their part, not speaking for myself, but understanding on their part, that if you cut ties with every white man that has done something that was questionable or that you didn't agree with, we couldn't get business done.

[120] You have to remember that we're talking about black people who have lived in the South for a long time.

[121] And that is a different type of racial landscape.

[122] So while there are certainly people who saw that photo and immediately wanted Northam to resign, there are also people who have already kind of baked in the racism of white Americans in the South and didn't find it particularly surprising.

[123] And some who didn't find it particularly invalidating.

[124] I'm a 10th generation resident born in Virginia.

[125] So it is not surprising to most black people in Virginia to hear of black days, to hear of familial connections to the transatlantic slave trade.

[126] This is where it started in some senses, you know.

[127] And it is not surprising.

[128] that it took something huge for someone to realize, I have privilege.

[129] I need to learn more because that's the system that we're up against all of this.

[130] You can see how it's important that all of these things happened at once.

[131] You had the additional scandals for his would -be successors.

[132] You had Northam pitching, what can I do for you?

[133] And you had her listening to her constituents who were giving a more mixed and nuanced reception then the national pressure.

[134] And so what she says is that it became clear to her that the most strategic decision, the one that had the biggest upside for her constituents, is to take the governor up on that offer and to really try to use their sense of collective power as black elected officials and as the communities that stood by him in this moment to say, okay, if we do that, we're going to expect things down the line.

[135] If I shut down and didn't seize the opportunity to have further conversations and to work toward legislation that my district needed that I wasn't doing my job.

[136] It was strategic.

[137] If he's in a position now for us to get some things done, then y 'all get some things done.

[138] I mean, it is kind of a sad commentary that it would take a moment of racism to push what is a loyal group of Democratic voters to the top of the priority list.

[139] But basically, that's the decision they come to is to say, okay, he's pitching this.

[140] specifically around policy, and we're sick of being not taken seriously at that table.

[141] So maybe in this moment there's an alignment of values that doesn't often exist even within the Democratic Party.

[142] I definitely can say I feel more listened to by the administration since 2019.

[143] And I don't think that's by happen since, but I also think that that's really important for my district.

[144] And then you look at what got done.

[145] It's things the Black Caucus has been fighting for my whole life.

[146] Like, you know what I mean?

[147] So I don't think that it should be taken is just we let it go or everything was just all fine.

[148] It was we had business and we had to do the business or else we wouldn't have been living up to our end of the bargain as elected officials.

[149] And just to know that I have a governor who is listening when I talk about, you know, the Voting Rights Act of Virginia and why it's still needed in 2021 and why Virginia can be in a different position and trajectory on voting rights than your Georgia, Texas, or, you know, Arizona, that is not by happenstance.

[150] That is by real work.

[151] Boots on the ground, real work with the advocates and legislators who stayed at the table because they knew they couldn't leave.

[152] You know, she's someone who's had a long relationship with the governor, obviously from his campaign all the way through, and then had the moment of hurt when the scandal came out.

[153] I was wondering how she viewed him now, even if she wasn't surprised or she expects little when it comes to white Democrats.

[154] After what he's done, does she consider him an ally to black communities?

[155] You mentioned you don't call everyone an ally.

[156] Is Ralph Northam one in your book?

[157] I would say, yeah.

[158] the governor's administration has been an important piece to the progress that we have gotten since 2019.

[159] And instead, what did you make of her answer?

[160] I think in its core, she shows the real pragmatism that black voters are forced to think about in a two -party democratic system, that the choices have often for black people in America been between bad and worse, and for communities that have often not had the system work for them to cancel everyone who has done a racist thing in the past is an ability they do not have.

[161] And so when you ask her if he's an ally, I think her response shows how meaningless really that word is for the political system.

[162] She doesn't need him to be an ally.

[163] And frankly, it's not important if he's an ally.

[164] What is important for her is that he reflects the things that she believes her community needs.

[165] And to me, that is the black political experience in a nutshell.

[166] It's not about being my friend.

[167] It's about delivering on stuff.

[168] There have been few friends for black people in the scope of American politics.

[169] It is about who has been willing to be a vet.

[170] vessel for that progress, and that has come in many, many forms throughout our history.

[171] People who are open racists, people who were segregationists, people who were slave owners, people, you know, that has been true kind of throughout.

[172] And I think that that is particularly top of mind for black elected officials in the South who have known that directly and have known to navigate that throughout their careers.

[173] Aestead, thank you.

[174] Thank you.

[175] We'll be right back.

[176] Here's what else you need to know today.

[177] Now, I told President Putin my agenda is not against Russia or anyone else.

[178] It's for the American people.

[179] On Wednesday, following their first in -person meeting, President Biden and the President of Russia, Vladimir Putin, described their encounter as constructive and positive.

[180] But during back -to -back news conferences with reporters, in Geneva, it became clear that the leaders remained deeply at odds over issues like human rights and online meddling in elections, which Biden told Putin must stop.

[181] I made it clear that we will not tolerate attempts to violate our democratic sovereignty or to stabilize our democratic elections, and we would respond.

[182] Biden said he had warned Putin not to bring any harm to Alexei Navalny, the Russian opposition leader, jailed by Putin's government.

[183] The bottom line is I told President Putin that we need to have some basic rules of the road that we can all abide by.

[184] Asked about Navalny during his own news conference, Putin countered that the U .S. was silencing its own dissidents by arresting those who stormed the Capitol on January 6th and said that Russia wanted to avoid the kind of political violence that had occurred in the United States during protests over policing last summer.

[185] What we saw was disorder destruction, violations of the law, et cetera.

[186] We feel sympathy for the United States of America, but we don't want that to happen on our territory, and we're doing our utmost in order to not allow it to happen.

[187] Today's episode was produced by Eric Kruppke, Diana Wynn, and Luke Vanderpluk.

[188] It was edited by Dave Shaw and Lisa Chene.

[189] contains original music by Dan Powell and Marion Lazzano, and was engineered by Chris Wood.

[190] That's it for the Daily.

[191] I'm Michael Bavarro.

[192] See you tomorrow.