#789 - Dan Auerbach

[0] da -da -da -da -da -da and we're live and you have come bringing the future this is what we've all hoped for we had all heard about this when we're kids dude they're going to sell weed like cigarettes in a carton and they're going to be pre -rolled and you're going to be buying it just like you buy a marlboro and you've come bringing this this is real sir yeah it's it's a real thing now where'd you get those um i got them in uh Seattle when we just played there this company brought us a whole gift bag And how does it work with transport with things like that?

[1] Well, I guess if I told you, it would screw up our transport.

[2] Yeah, definitely.

[3] I'm not a traveler with.

[4] I'm a choir when you get there kind of a guy.

[5] Sure.

[6] I think it's usually the best move.

[7] It is the best move, but...

[8] Do they even bother checking people in the Seattle airport anymore?

[9] You know, we're on a bus.

[10] It's totally different.

[11] Yeah, of course.

[12] Except if you go to Texas.

[13] I would never, I would never take it on a plane.

[14] No, not a good move.

[15] Not a good move.

[16] But when they arrested Willie Nelson in Texas, and like, wow, that's how much they don't make exceptions.

[17] Yeah, that was weird.

[18] Fucking Willie Nelson?

[19] That was stupid.

[20] It's ridiculous.

[21] I mean, it hurts my feelings.

[22] It's like, really, this is what you're doing?

[23] You're trying to solve crime?

[24] Arresting, what is he, 80 now?

[25] Willie's got to be close to 80.

[26] I mean, he's got to be in the top 10 of, like, people who've done more for the state of Texas than anyone, right?

[27] Yeah, yeah.

[28] Come on.

[29] Not only that, he's undenialably awesome.

[30] I mean, he's a great guy.

[31] Like, why would you want to arrest that guy?

[32] Can you imagine Willie?

[33] He was probably like, really?

[34] Yeah.

[35] He's serious?

[36] It's sad.

[37] It's sad.

[38] The cops must have felt kind of embarrassed, I bet.

[39] Yeah, and we were talking today because today, this is a historic day for music because of Prince.

[40] I mean, this is very strange when a guy that's that powerful, especially when I was a during my teen years, I mean, that was when he was, you know, really emerging.

[41] And that's when people were really finding out about him.

[42] I remember thinking, like, wow, this guy's so interesting.

[43] He's such a combination of different things.

[44] Like, there was no one that was like him before.

[45] I mean, David Bowie was sort of an androgynous before, but he took it into a different new place, and it was mysterious and he had some great.

[46] With David Bowie, for me, it always felt more like theater.

[47] With Prince, it felt more like, that's Prince.

[48] that's really him you know yeah Purple Rain and then did the movie because he just started that way Bowie kind of transformed into that androgyny Prince was like that to begin with right yeah I remember the first time Pat and I played the First Avenue in Minneapolis that's where they shot I think some parts from Purple Rain maybe the live is that right the live segments from that movie and that was the big thing you know just to be there right Right.

[49] Well, he kind of owned Minneapolis, right?

[50] He put Minneapolis on the map.

[51] And he stayed there.

[52] Yeah.

[53] And you thought of Minneapolis.

[54] Like, you thought of Prince.

[55] You thought of Minneapolis.

[56] That was like part of the thing is that he was this wizard that lived in this frozen land and, you know, produced all this crazy music.

[57] They never would have arrested Prince for weed.

[58] No. In Minneapolis.

[59] No. No, he gets a hall pass.

[60] No, yeah, he was the man in Minneapolis.

[61] I mean, he was, he's a god there.

[62] I wonder what it was that got him.

[63] You know, it's 57 years old.

[64] I mean, he's a thin guy.

[65] He looked like he's healthy.

[66] He looked very healthy.

[67] He looked like he could have been mistaken for Farrell.

[68] I mean, he was like...

[69] Those two guys are, like, ageless, you know?

[70] And he did a show just a couple nights ago.

[71] Yeah, yeah.

[72] He was on tour.

[73] I don't know.

[74] It's just so wild.

[75] Well, it's so hard when something like that happens.

[76] You can only speculate.

[77] You know, no one really knows until you hear.

[78] It just reinforces.

[79] this idea that we're so fragile this it all can go away absolutely yeah like like i said it's like it doesn't matter how much money you have can have the best doctors in the world and it's just you have to be thankful for what you have yeah you got to be a good human because it can just all go away so quickly and eventually it's all going to go away for all of us yeah very soon 100 % life is very short yeah it's 100 % not going to last 100 % it's not going to last nobody gets out alive right no one and still it's uh people run through life accumulating shit yeah and and and missing missing opportunities to just take it all in and enjoy it and when a guy like prince one of the undeniable things that he left was uh i mean you'll always have his catalog of work to make people happy like he left uh an undeniable impact on people you know to this day uh i will pull out i want to be your lover because that was like the first big hit and like that's still to this day a fucking badass song absolutely you know what what really kills me though is when you get an artist who people just weren't ready for and they're only they're only showing love after they die yeah do you know what i mean yeah that kind of kills me that's gonna be the case here you know for sure he's gonna get well he was always shown love but he'll be shown a lot more love people appreciate him now that they know it's ended what What you gonna do?

[80] I mean, that's what happened to Michael Jackson.

[81] You know?

[82] Michael Jackson, before he died, people weren't nearly as interested in him as he was, like once he died.

[83] Like, once he died, then his catalog went through the roof and everybody wanted to buy the old stuff up and all the print stuff is like charting now, you know?

[84] Mm -hmm.

[85] Man, I was thinking about Bill Hicks the other day and how he died at his moms in Arkansas.

[86] He, well, you knew it was going down for a while.

[87] He had pancreatitis.

[88] of cancer and it was it's a particularly brutal kind of cancer apparently especially in the 90s when bill died of it and he knew and just went to his mom's place to die but just thinking about that like you just sort of never made it made it you know what I mean yeah and then he dies and then all of a sudden everybody says oh he was the best he was one of the best comics all the time you know he was certainly one of the most influential no doubt about it he he changed so many people's perception of like what comedy could be he like opened up a whole whole new way he's like well comedy could do that too and everybody was like ooh nobody did that before yeah he had a like a consciousness to his comedy or like an elevation sort of thing to his comedy where he's trying to change your thought process along with make you laugh yeah very different thing it's hard it's hard to get to that place that's the place you always want to get to some people are just born there you know what i mean like like we're talking about prince he was prince when he started.

[89] He had the third eye when he started.

[90] You know what I mean?

[91] I think it takes some people some time on stage to figure themselves out.

[92] It takes a few years of like making mistakes, listening to too many people.

[93] Yeah.

[94] Yeah, you could definitely get off on bad pass and you've got to re -correct, come back.

[95] You have to, I mean, there's a learning process to everything.

[96] That's what's so difficult with cell phones nowadays.

[97] It's like you can't learn in private.

[98] You know, you used to be able to go on stage and like practice kind of in front of people, which is best practice you know but now everything's filmed you know even your shit that you're trying to work out mm -hmm you can't like just be so free do you know what I mean big with big deal with stand -up it's a big deal with stand -up because the bits if you hear them and then you hear the finished product it will if you hear though like the starting you like you should ideally heal it hear it for the first time in in a full form and completed form but a lot of people along the way well people enjoy that process, though, like coming to the comedy store and watching people stumble through an idea that they're not exactly sure.

[99] And then they'll see that bit maybe six months later on a television special or something.

[100] I go, oh, he figured it out.

[101] But yeah, it's, but he could also choose as a fan to not seek that stuff out, I think.

[102] But people do.

[103] Yeah.

[104] You know, it stops me from wanting to play songs.

[105] I don't really know.

[106] Wow.

[107] Absolutely.

[108] Because you worry that, like, a video of it getting out there of being kind of in the halfway.

[109] Hacking my way through a new song.

[110] yeah I wouldn't do it fuck absolutely well have you seen some of those things stifled some modern performing have you seen some of those things that Chappelle's done and Hannibal Burrace is done they take these bags and you put your cell phone in it when you go in and it's sealed and when you're in the room you literally can't open the bag and then if you leave the room somehow there's some sensor and it allows you to open the bag it seems like a ridiculous idea but the more I think about it it seems like it's the kind of thing that people may fight but then thank you for afterwards yes yeah yeah yeah for the experience themselves they're like holy shit I haven't really paid attention anything for an hour and a half two hours for years right you know what I mean well if you go to a concert now all you see is phones up and people watching the concert through phones yeah I mean you see this you see people doing this all the time like you'll see a sea of cell phones at these arenas And it's weird.

[111] They used to reach out and try to touch me. Now they reach out with their cell phones to try to take a picture.

[112] Did you notice a shift or slowly, like, almost like people were infected by phones, like ticks?

[113] Fuck yeah, man. I mean, when we started, I was a flip phone generation, baby.

[114] Yeah.

[115] I know.

[116] Those are too problematic.

[117] It's too hard to take a picture with.

[118] Some people were into it, but most people left them in their pockets.

[119] Yeah, no, because the picture sucked.

[120] I mean, it's not something you want to brag about.

[121] Now, everybody's like the best photographer ever with the iPhone.

[122] Yeah, they're so good now.

[123] And they're getting better all the time.

[124] And they're also putting those little lenses on them.

[125] They make them even better.

[126] They slide a little lens over the top of it.

[127] You see a lot of that.

[128] But people aren't experiencing it in a pure way.

[129] You know, you're not going to it and just sitting there and taking in the show.

[130] Instead, you're going into it and you're aware that you're recording it.

[131] You want to make sure you get it in frame and you make sure you've got a good part that's going to look good on your Facebook or wherever the fuck you're going to put it.

[132] You're missing, you're not giving into the experience of the music or the show or whatever you're going to see.

[133] 100%.

[134] Yeah.

[135] Life is not as good with cell phones, I think.

[136] But I have it in my hand all day long.

[137] I wouldn't say that life is not as good.

[138] It's more challenging because it doesn't prevent you from putting it away.

[139] But it makes it very addictive.

[140] It's very hard to put it away.

[141] But you could.

[142] I think it's the kind of thing where, like, you're like, you're like, you're the, life would be better if you didn't have it you would be able to experience life more you'd pay more attention to your kids and you'd have more real true love you know you wouldn't be taking fucking selfies to post you'd actually be hugging them genuinely do you know what i mean i think uh can't do both i don't think so i've not met that person yeah i don't know man i love the data though i love all the information i love that come i'm addicted to it yeah well it's interesting i mean there's always something new there's always some new story that's out there's some new revelation scientific invention, experiment that was done.

[143] There's some new shit always, constantly.

[144] It's like the amount of data that we're getting now is...

[145] But has it made us better?

[146] I don't know.

[147] Do you think you're happier since you have, like, Google in your pocket 24 -7?

[148] I'm happy if someone starts talking shit, and I know they're wrong.

[149] I whip out my phone, wrong, son.

[150] That's nice.

[151] Really?

[152] You know the Google data.

[153] See?

[154] Before you would have left that party like, fuck, I got to learn more about something.

[155] You know what I mean?

[156] Oh, maybe.

[157] I would have left that party going.

[158] That guy's full of shit.

[159] I know he's full as shit.

[160] I just wish I had my phone.

[161] Yeah.

[162] Well, wait, you leave parties thinking people are full of shit?

[163] That's weird.

[164] No, I'm saying if I didn't have a phone.

[165] Yeah, if you leave a party in L .A. And you don't think someone was full of shit.

[166] You're in the wrong party.

[167] There's definitely a lot of that out here.

[168] Or maybe you're just where you need to be.

[169] I can't say I really go to parties.

[170] I might have been to a dozen parties out here in my entire life.

[171] Yeah?

[172] Yeah, probably.

[173] It's busy working.

[174] There's nobody inviting you or whatever, you just don't go.

[175] Busy working.

[176] I mean, like, at nights, first of all, I don't have a lot of friends that put on parties.

[177] That's not normal.

[178] I mean, maybe like a pool party or something like that.

[179] You go over a buddy's house and barbecue.

[180] But that, you know, like a party party.

[181] I've been to a few of those like Hollywood parties where you're walking around and you go, oh, there's Drew Barrymore.

[182] How fucking weird.

[183] And you go into another room, this friend's diller.

[184] How fucking weird.

[185] out of place and you've got to get out of there as quick as you can i've been to a couple of those but never saw them out they always seemed odd yeah i don't love him so much we uh we stay at the um the chateau of course you do i mean that's your spot it has to be i mean that's the spot in hollywood that's the authentic spot it's so cliche but i mean i've just been there yeah sleeping in the bed where you know belushi died just like raging yeah you know what i mean learning nothing from his mistakes.

[186] You know what I mean?

[187] Yeah.

[188] Jesus Christ, I've woken up in that place, like blood on the walls, just like, what happened?

[189] Have we learned nothing from this guy's death?

[190] Do you think that places like that contain memory?

[191] There's a real thought, and we've brought it up before, comics at the comedy store.

[192] Because the comedy store used to be Ciro's Nightclub.

[193] It was owned by Bugsie Siegel, you know, the mobster.

[194] And so there's murder.

[195] that were there.

[196] There's definitely murder.

[197] There was a murder that was there just a year ago someone who got murdered on the front patio at the comedy store where like the rich history of weirdness and of comedy it seems to be in the walls.

[198] Do you feel like that about the Chateau Marmal because if you go to that place I mean is there one place more synonymous with Hollywood deboccurring than that place?

[199] I mean that might be the hotel in Hollywood where you think of like Johnny Depp's doing blow and Jack Nicholson is banging these hookers and It's just that's the place, right?

[200] Yeah.

[201] I think that that place just caters.

[202] I mean, as soon as you walk in, it's like this.

[203] I mean, it's dark, thick curtains, no cops.

[204] Do what do you want.

[205] Right.

[206] You know what I mean?

[207] We'll guard the door.

[208] Yeah.

[209] But I think there are places that have magic in them.

[210] I think that there are places that you can't, you just can't explain.

[211] Like Muscle Sholes.

[212] You know, we cut a record in Muscle Shulls.

[213] Right.

[214] It's magic.

[215] Really?

[216] They say that, you know...

[217] Well, I know they have that documentary about it.

[218] They say that Native Americans lived there and that there's like, you know, it was spiritual land.

[219] But, I mean, it's special.

[220] There's something there that you're able to get in touch with yourself easier.

[221] I don't know what it is.

[222] Is it something in the recording studio itself or is there something in the town?

[223] I don't think so because there are multiple studios there and they all produce great stuff.

[224] There are still great musicians coming out of Muscle Shoals.

[225] And, you know, it's just, there are certain places that are just, I don't know what it is.

[226] But is it possible that those buildings, that those recording studios have memory?

[227] That there's like a something, an intangible, something you can't put on a scale, you can't measure it.

[228] Because the comedy store feels like a place with memory.

[229] Yeah.

[230] And that's why I always ask.

[231] Because I took seven years off that place and I went back about a year and a half ago.

[232] And to this day, I remember going back.

[233] again and going oh there's that feeling again like this is a different place you knew the history before you went into the place though so it was before you even got there it was magic to you yes it was like that for me and muscle shoals i went into the studio and i was like oh man yeah that's where edy hinton you know took a shit in that bathroom right there it's like it's like uh i think that i don't know if if you didn't if somebody didn't know ahead of time and they went in there they would think it was just as magic as you did yeah maybe you're right it's one of those things you don't know because you have these preconceived ideas about it that are on just you can't that was mecca for comedians so muscle shoals what did did skinnerd record there as well um i think skinner yeah skinner i think so i'm pretty sure they recorded there the rowing stones recorded there so many fantastic areitha recorded there and uh i mean they cut so many tracks there yeah like as this one spot there's like a waffle house there there's nothing there there's no reason anybody would go to muscle shoals and it was the recording mecca why wow you know what i mean it's not close to any major metropolis it's like uh you know how else how else do you explain that there's this guy named rupert sheldrake i think his official title he's an evolutionary biologist and he thinks that there's memory in everything he thinks you can't you can't extract it but he thinks that there's memory in wood there's memory in stone there's memory in trees he's like That's why people don't like the idea of a haunted house.

[234] Like, we kind of inherently know that someone, if someone died in a house, some horrific tragedy took place in the house, that house actually has that sadness and that feeling in it.

[235] It's a part of the house now.

[236] Yeah, I don't know.

[237] I don't know if I believe it.

[238] I don't either, man. I think we create the history in our mind before we even get there.

[239] You know what I mean?

[240] That's totally possible.

[241] Yeah.

[242] I mean, my dad.

[243] I just got a new guitar.

[244] and it was a guitar that was owned by one of my favorite musicians of all time and this guy named Mississippi Fred McDowell and I swear that it's magic but you know it's just a guitar you know what I can feel it it might be magic though I mean it might have something in it but also it might have just something in it just because you know it was his so that's what I'm saying but it's still real right like that amount of magic is still real.

[245] You would have to prove to me that someone felt it who didn't know head to tell you.

[246] But not really, because it works on you.

[247] Like, magic doesn't have to work on everybody.

[248] Well, then I would explain it that I already thought it was magic.

[249] Right.

[250] Do you know what I mean?

[251] You already thought it was magic, but because you did, it is.

[252] I don't know.

[253] Maybe.

[254] I don't know if I would describe that as magic.

[255] I don't know, man. I feel like if I had a notebook that Richard Pryor wrote in, well, you would never write in it.

[256] You would save it.

[257] That's not a good example but like if somebody gave me like rich if rich prior had a laptop and he wrote some great shit on his laptop and then someone sold it and i had that laptop i'd be like holy shit magic laptop all the sudden it would be magic jokes are just all fire everything you're right well you would you would think like i have to do this laptop justice this is the laptop of the great one you know i have to this there's no bullshit around with this thing yeah you would think about it that way it would be that's the idea behind like things being sacred is like if things If you decide things are sacred, then they are sacred.

[258] Absolutely.

[259] Absolutely.

[260] It's up to you to believe.

[261] Yeah.

[262] And if you treat them as sacred, then they become in your mind.

[263] And life is short.

[264] And if you want to believe in magic, then it's real.

[265] Do you know?

[266] I'm going to go run a mountain right now.

[267] God damn it, Dan.

[268] I mean, all I do every day is go into the studio and like make something out of nothing.

[269] Like, complete, it feels like magic to me still.

[270] I wake up in the more I'm so excited Do you know what I mean?

[271] It's like It feels like Christmas every morning And that's magic to me That's like that's what I live for You know I don't even like But I don't know anything else Like I've never really had a real job You know I worked at my uncle's restaurant But that you know That's it It's all I've ever done Perfect You don't need to do I mean everybody's got a different path You don't have to do other shit.

[272] Why do anything else if you still enjoy it?

[273] You still appreciate it, and the music is amazing.

[274] Why fuck around?

[275] Sometimes it makes it hard to relate to other people.

[276] Right.

[277] You know what I mean?

[278] Just hanging around musicians only.

[279] Stay close.

[280] Not all musicians are like that, though.

[281] Other ones that are.

[282] Find the ones that are.

[283] I don't know, man. It's just me and Sturgle staring at each other in Nashville.

[284] It's it.

[285] Yeah.

[286] I've been a huge fan of the Black Keys for a long time, man. And so for me to have you on is a real honor.

[287] A real treat.

[288] You guys are so interesting because the music is so hard to define.

[289] Like there's different styles in different albums.

[290] And it seems like you guys go off in these like really eclectic ways and paths and there's so much content.

[291] Like you guys have put out so many songs.

[292] You're so prolific.

[293] Yeah.

[294] Again, like I don't know how else to do it.

[295] I don't know what, I don't understand how people go into the studio and take some fucking week to do one song.

[296] They don't smoke weed.

[297] I don't always smoke weed, you know.

[298] But I've done records with no weed, plenty of them, you know.

[299] But I still do two songs a day.

[300] Well, I think you just love it.

[301] And I think if you love something and you just give it that energy and it's obviously giving you a lot of positive results.

[302] Well, the thing is I think that people get so caught up with worrying about what other people think.

[303] They just like over -analyze.

[304] And it's so hard to get really into.

[305] touch with something special when you're worrying so much about everybody else you know what i mean that's a real aspect of social media that i think some people struggle with totally but it's a real thing too you know there are a lot of very opinionated you know places that review music that are very like into the trends you know what i mean and it i can see how it could be crippling to a kid who's just trying to like make music you know yeah well any form of criticism where people didn't like a performance even if it's correct still is painful for people to hear and if you're hearing if you like put together something and then it gets reviewed by a magazine or something it gets poorly reviewed yeah but not being able to take criticism as a sign of weakness right you you know you have to know that you have to grow into that and also music is so ridiculously subjective and there's stuff that people love that I can't listen to sure and there's stuff that I love that people are like what the fuck is wrong with you I mean, it's just always going to be that way.

[306] Sure.

[307] And you have one person's take on it, and it's the best thing ever, and another person's take on it, they fell asleep halfway through it.

[308] It's weird, you know?

[309] There are records like that where, but then, again, on the same hand, it's like, there are records that people played me. I'm like, what the fuck is this?

[310] I hate this.

[311] And then five years later, it's my favorite thing.

[312] I wasn't ready for it.

[313] I didn't quite understand it.

[314] I didn't hear it in the right setting.

[315] Do you know what I mean?

[316] Set and setting is super important.

[317] But that's also what's beautiful about music and art is that it grows with you.

[318] It can, the best of it, can really grow with you.

[319] Yeah.

[320] You know?

[321] Yeah, hearing the right song at the right time can leave like a psychic imprint on you of that song.

[322] And you always will associate that song with that moment.

[323] Sure, powerful moments.

[324] Yeah.

[325] Things that change you forever.

[326] How old were you when you started doing music?

[327] I was always around music.

[328] My dad had a great record collection, always playing music.

[329] music my mom played piano and her whole family played bluegrass oh wow so that's what made me want to play music was i wanted to play music with my uncles they sat around in circles and my aunt and they would play stanley brothers songs and you know my grandma died we all sang around her her um uh grave you know i mean it's just like music is a real part of my my family wow so it's just always been there that must have crazy you all sat around her grave and sang mm -hmm yeah we sang her favorite songs whoa it's really nice that is really nice angel band by this by the stanley brothers it's one of my favorite songs ever how many people were singing six wow six people we brought our instruments a lot of crying um i'm crying just thinking about it no no i mean it was it was her favorite thing You know, it was her, she loved to sit in the living room and listen to her kids play music.

[330] It was like, and it's the reason I'm here now.

[331] Wow.

[332] It really is.

[333] I mean, I, because music has just really been such a part of my life.

[334] Well, that's awesome when someone find something that they really just tune into like that.

[335] And then you see them just pursuing it with such wild abandon.

[336] I mean, that's what everybody, as a fan, that's what someone hopes for the most, that the person, who puts out the sound that you love is really into it and does it all the time.

[337] Yeah, no, it's been the only thing I can really focus on since I was about 15.

[338] Wow.

[339] I mean, girls in music is pretty much it.

[340] I stopped messing around with sports, really.

[341] Yeah, that was it.

[342] Well, you guys figured it out, man. I guess.

[343] I don't know.

[344] That sound nailed.

[345] I mean, we put up like five records before we even had a song on the radio.

[346] Yeah, but people were, talking about it before you guys had songs in the radio you had such an authentic sound that you had already had a lot of momentum but it was it was the cool thing to like that no one knew about yet it was we had a great fan base before we had uh radio success yeah we've been really blessed like every every year was better than the one before what is your take on what's going on now with radio because it's it must be strange to watch this business go from being something where you buy an actual physical thing to digital downloads and I mean what has it been like to watch us all move into the internet it's pretty depressing it's really depressing i don't think people can make connections with music like they used to you know when you used when you owned something and you sat with it and listened you know you know like sat i had an uncle it's just too disposable yeah you know like sitting down with an album opening the album putting the headphones on.

[347] Yeah, not to even talk about how, you know, how the artists are treated with streaming.

[348] I mean, it's just, it's totally criminal.

[349] Well, the streaming thing's weird, right?

[350] It's criminal.

[351] Well, explain it.

[352] I mean, I don't know, like, I couldn't tell you numbers, but, you know, I mean, just like YouTube, you know, they just pay artists fractions of what they should be paying.

[353] And it's just, it's not treated like a real, um, valued thing anymore.

[354] You know what I mean?

[355] Well, we were discussing this the last the other day about streaming services that one of the weirdest things about it is all they're selling is artists work right and that's all you have you can't stream anything unless someone creates it that's all you have so that is what you're selling so who's making all the money and why and what's you know what is how how's that worked out and right now there's a lot of opportunism going on and a lot of people are jockeying for a better slice of the pie in a better position but we were talking about Spotify and all those different things and how little money the artists actually get out of it it's weird it is weird it is weird isn't it I mean can you imagine like going playing gigs at the Moore theater and then saying we're just going to pay you streaming money not the real gig money you know what I mean it would be like that would make no sense right I mean it's kind of the same thing I mean you have a product that you invested your time and money into it should be no different Really, right?

[356] Well, I think there should be some sort of established number.

[357] You should be able to figure out how much money are they making from it.

[358] Like, how much money are they making if they play one of your albums?

[359] Drew.

[360] Do you know?

[361] Streaming?

[362] Yeah.

[363] 0 .005 cents for a click for those.

[364] And if you buy the album, how much is it for a song?

[365] How much are they paying for a song?

[366] For a physical copy.

[367] If you buy the album like on iTunes or on like a CD.

[368] CD or iTunes.

[369] What is the difference?

[370] What's the comparison to those?

[371] If the song is 99 cents, you're looking at...

[372] No one can hear you, but he said if the song is 99 cents, you're looking at 30 or 40 cents.

[373] Mm -hmm.

[374] Hmm.

[375] As compared to streaming, which is, what did you say?

[376] 0 .005?

[377] Is that what you said?

[378] Yeah.

[379] Oh, for time songs clicks.

[380] Every time someone clicks on it.

[381] It has to play for like 10 seconds.

[382] Oh, God.

[383] it's just mass consumption it's weird yeah yeah well it all started with being able to put it on a server somewhere right it all started from being digital that's where things got odd where you could take someone's stuff and you don't need any special recording equipment to make copies you make copy on your computer instantaneously you upload that copy and then that copy is shared by X amount of people who just continually download it and share it Things get weird.

[384] They get real weird when it becomes a digital entity, something that's out there in space and then figuring out how you make money off of it.

[385] But I would feel like a streaming platform, all they have is someone's work.

[386] If no one lets them put their stuff up, then they don't have anything, right?

[387] Yeah.

[388] Like the only benefit for you guys would be more exposure, which would help, like, ticket sales?

[389] You know the major record label's own portions of these streaming services, too.

[390] Oh.

[391] It gets pretty deep.

[392] I mean, it's just intertwined nastiness, and the artist pretty much falls at the bottom of the barrel.

[393] So the record labels have done the same thing that they used to do with physical records, and now they've done it with the streaming thing.

[394] They just hamstringed everybody.

[395] Wow, that's great.

[396] So should people not use those streaming services?

[397] Is that the way to go?

[398] I mean, ultimately, probably.

[399] I mean, artists probably shouldn't allow.

[400] it but it's like um you can't yeah you know you have to put it on there i don't know so i should have i should have i should have a spreadsheet so do you have the options like do you have the option yeah so like when they come to you and they say hey dan we would want to put all you absolutely and you could say no thank you yeah is it that what you say or do you let them put it up there we don't have anything on title you know but we uh we have it on iTunes they still pay it They pay the highest royalty rate, right?

[401] iTunes?

[402] Yeah.

[403] How's Google play?

[404] Because they're doing, they have that now, right?

[405] That's the newest one?

[406] I have no idea.

[407] You know, Google kind of, they co -own YouTube.

[408] So they get all that YouTube money.

[409] Right.

[410] But don't they have to pay for, like, bandwidth and shit, too?

[411] Isn't that all that expensive?

[412] I don't know.

[413] I don't know.

[414] Yeah.

[415] But it's weird how the world just changed.

[416] It's like I'm a musician.

[417] Now I have to worry about fucking this business side of shit now.

[418] We all have to, like, know about who owns all these little portions of this shit.

[419] I mean, it's like, that's why we get taken advantage of.

[420] Because we're just trying to be artists and trying to make music, we have to become college professors to even figure out our record deals.

[421] Do you know what I mean?

[422] It's really unfair.

[423] And when you sign a kid to a record deal, it's like they pretty much are signing their life on the line, you know?

[424] I'm sure you read that piece that Courtney Love wrote years back.

[425] I don't think I've ever read anything Courtney for Love.

[426] It was pretty famous because a lot of people accused her using a ghostwriter because it was so well done, but it was a piece breaking down.

[427] Like if you didn't know that she was the one who wrote it, you would go, whoa, this is a skating review of how the money is distributed in the record business.

[428] And it was pretty shocking when you look at it from terms of actual revenue to what actually trickles down to the artist.

[429] The only thing that they're selling, the artists work and how these contracts are set up to fuck people over.

[430] but they've been around forever and there's these giant machines right they have so many employees they kind of have to justify keeping all these buildings and having all these employees and there's a lot of money that needs to be earned just to keep this thing floating right well it got so engorged yeah it's a tick at the height of physical sales right yeah it's it's hard to like get used to a certain lifestyle right i mean you're going to move back into apartment next week and like uh yeah it would suck You'd try to figure out how to, you might cut his pay a little bit maybe to offset, you know?

[431] That's what they did.

[432] Yeah, they just wanted to keep.

[433] Well, they had to downsize quite a bit.

[434] I used to love record stores.

[435] I mean, the last real job I had was in a record store.

[436] Really?

[437] The last time I was ever really taxed before being a musician.

[438] I worked at Kwanza Hut Records in Akron, Ohio, and it was awesome.

[439] I learned so much there.

[440] I learned so much cool shit.

[441] people hit me to so much great music that I never would have heard of well back then that was the way you could find out about it you go to the record stores and aficionados would let you know about guys who've dedicated their lives to learning about this stuff you know what I mean they're like essentially college professors of music yeah right the guys that I worked with were pretty much geniuses they were all like 45 55 year old guys with like their living room is just all records you know what I mean and they would teach me things every time I would go in they're like oh so you've never heard this well then you got to hear this and you got to hear this and it changed me you know isn't it funny that that is not like a respected quality in the mainstream world but being a somalier is you know what I mean being a guy who can like swish wine around and tell you what part of France it was grown like that's that's something we look at and we go oh he's a sophisticated Somali but like oh that dude he knows a lot about 60s jazz nobody gives a shit nobody gives a shit.

[442] Yeah, you loser.

[443] I don't give a shit about Somali's stuff, so I mean, I don't know.

[444] You gotta come up with a different comparison.

[445] But you know what I mean?

[446] Like, for a lot of people, it's, sure.

[447] It's a big, fancy, schmancy type thing.

[448] Well, you know, I mean, it's all, it's all a bunch of horseshit.

[449] I mean, it's like, just because you don't have a college degree in it.

[450] Yeah.

[451] It's not taken seriously.

[452] But what really is a college degree at the end of the day?

[453] Well, when it comes to music, I mean, imagine if the only good musicians were musicians who had PhDs and in music theory no it would be like North Korea I mean could you even put together the kind of music that you guys made if if you really like thought about it in that way like your your stuff is so uniquely creative in a way like you have a you guys had a sound for a lot of your songs it's like you would you would hear it and even though it was interesting and unique and different from the previous song you could tell is a black key song You know, it was coming from two guys, you know, it's clearly coming from two guys.

[454] I think as soon as you add a lot of theory and overproduction and different people overseeing things and looking for the right amount of beats per minute and all that jazz.

[455] Listen, man, it's like the greatest people are just the greatest people.

[456] When you, if you could be around Richard Pryor and watch them, you would feel the magic.

[457] see the way he walks, the way he touches his lips, the way he, you know, like when I'm hanging out with Dr. John, I see it.

[458] I'm like, holy shit, this guy is like from another planet.

[459] You know what I mean?

[460] He's just, you can't teach that.

[461] It's just, it's total magic, you know?

[462] I can't even imagine, like, in L .A., Dr. John used to be here doing session work.

[463] Well, that's like when Phil Spector was making records and stuff like that, you know.

[464] it would be a studio full of Dr. Johns.

[465] People that just had their own thing about them.

[466] You know what I mean?

[467] Total self -confidence.

[468] Their own style.

[469] No theory.

[470] No bullshit.

[471] It was just like, this is, oh, this is what he does.

[472] And we're going to incorporate this with 12 other guys who have their own thing.

[473] It's like magic.

[474] You know what I mean?

[475] And that's the cool thing about studios.

[476] We kind of lose now because people can't afford to have studios.

[477] And things are changing.

[478] so much over time it gets depressing the more I work with these older older guys who were just insane it's just so hard to describe you know it really is feels like magic was it because everything they were doing was completely analog no because it was a performance and you had to like not only did you have to come up with the part on the spot you had to kind of improvise you had to play perfectly behind the beat you had to like you had to just like I don't, it's just hard to explain.

[479] You had to just kind of be able to understand the nuance of everything going on around you.

[480] And there's less of that now?

[481] I think that it's harder when people don't get to record together and make music together, which is the case.

[482] You know what I mean?

[483] Because it's, you don't really make money playing music unless you reach a certain level and it's so much harder to now than it ever was before.

[484] It's harder to reach a certain level.

[485] Yeah, absolutely.

[486] But doesn't YouTube and things on those lines Doesn't it help some people reach a higher level quicker without the need for mainstream media?

[487] I don't know.

[488] You don't know?

[489] You don't know?

[490] I don't know.

[491] It beats me. I don't know anybody who, like, got their start on YouTube.

[492] Didn't Honey Honey Band?

[493] Didn't they become famous from YouTube?

[494] I think that's what started all about.

[495] It's a combination of things.

[496] It's hard to nail down on one.

[497] Yeah, I mean, we didn't do that way.

[498] I mean, we were, like, hit the road and we, like, playing shows, and we just kept, you know, hitting up the city.

[499] so I just, I wouldn't know, because I don't know, I don't have experience with that.

[500] So, tell me about the arcs.

[501] Well, the arcs is just a group of friends of mine who I've made records with for years, guys who make some of my favorite records, Leon Michaels, Richard Swift, Homer Steinweiss, and Nick Mofshan, they're just great musicians, you know, and we've made different records together in various forms for different people, and then when we had free time we would record for ourselves just for fun just making stuff up and um Leon and I about a year and a half ago got together just to like categorize them put them in a folder to see what we had and we had like 70 songs that we're just sitting there so we're like what are we doing you know let's let's figure out a way to like share this music and so we just kind of came up with the arcs and that was our platform That's insanely.

[502] It's 70 songs.

[503] 70 songs, yeah.

[504] I mean, every time we get in the studio together, it's like two or three songs.

[505] We'll just make them up, you know?

[506] Wow.

[507] When you go into the studio, do you have any idea, if you're in a session where you might improvise and come up with these stuff?

[508] Do you have any idea of what direction you're going to go in?

[509] Or do you have a concept, or do you just go free ball?

[510] You kind of, I just always Freeball, I guess.

[511] Have you always done it that way?

[512] Yeah.

[513] For the most part, I mean, I don't, I have had some songs written ahead of time, but that's more recently.

[514] When I started it, we were just making shit up.

[515] I mean, Black Keys album were just totally improvised.

[516] And so when you improvise, would you have someone recording it as you're doing it or would you write down the lyrics?

[517] We did it all ourselves.

[518] We did it all ourselves.

[519] In the basement, it was just the two of us, and we had a four -track, cassette recording.

[520] And then we had, like, a digital recorder.

[521] Yeah, no, I mean, we didn't have anybody helping us.

[522] Wow.

[523] Well, that's why it was so cool.

[524] I mean, that's why it was such a, you know, there's...

[525] I'll do big sessions now, and there'll be, like, an assistant running around, like, taking notes, like, what guitar I'm using and shit.

[526] And I'm like, well, this is this guy going on?

[527] Distraction.

[528] It's so interesting.

[529] No, I mean, but it's just, I just never had that, you know, growing up.

[530] It's just feel so weird.

[531] So would you guys...

[532] Would you guys record it initially as you were improvising it, or would you improvise it and get it down and then record it?

[533] We would improvise it.

[534] Usually, like, the first or second take is the one that's best.

[535] Even with the mistakes, it has the best feeling.

[536] For me, the more that you focus on stuff, I guess the more boring it gets.

[537] You lose that, like, initial spark.

[538] Dude, what a fucking cool life you have.

[539] You make cool sounds.

[540] and then you release them I'm not complaining fuck man it's so cool the way you describe it too you just kind of go in there and fall into the trance and make the sounds and for me it's only gotten better the feeling I mean I work harder than anybody I know I get up in the morning I start working and I don't work till I'm asleep I don't stop till I'm asleep you know every day do you think of it as work or do you think of it as Like, when I get paid, I think of it as work.

[541] But when I'm doing it, I never think of it as work.

[542] So when the checks come, it's work.

[543] It must have done some work.

[544] But while you're doing it, it's just passion?

[545] Like, how would you describe it?

[546] It's, I feel so lucky being able to go in the studio.

[547] I love hearing shit like this, man. And living in Nashville, too, which is a place that is Music City, USA, you know?

[548] I mean, you know, you could argue that rock and roll started there with, you know, pretty woman.

[549] Dar -N -N -R -N -R -N -R -N -R - Right.

[550] That riff was done.

[551] Wayne Moss did that riff right down the street.

[552] You know, it's just like, I just love that stuff.

[553] I love learning from those guys.

[554] I love being around that.

[555] It's just so much fun for me, you know?

[556] You know, I had Wheeler Walker Jr. in here the other day, and we were talking about Nashville, and he was talking about the money machine being behind Nashville now and how strange it is that you have some real music, in that town but then you also have this stuff that is just concocted because it looks like it would do numbers in Walmart yeah but you know where doesn't that happen on some at some level it's a music business yeah you're always gonna have that right yeah it's a business i mean you're always gonna have douche holes making a lot of money a lot more money than you you know what mean but the thing that that's so great about that i don't fucking ever see that i'm never around that.

[557] I don't fuck with that at all.

[558] You know what I mean?

[559] And I've been in Nashville six years, seven years, something like that.

[560] But the thing that's so cool about that is they really do hold up that infrastructure.

[561] And like if I run out of tape, I make a phone call and somebody delivers me reel -to -reel tape in like 10 minutes.

[562] Really?

[563] Where else can you do that happen?

[564] You know what I mean?

[565] If that big business wasn't going on, it wouldn't make it so easy for me to be around so many great musicians.

[566] A lot of these country guys that I work with um you know they're embarrassed uh with some of the shit that they play on they they like won't tell me because they're so embarrassed how bad it is but but it's the reason they're there and healthy and able to come in and work with me you know what I mean right so you can't complain about it and then reap all the benefits you know what I mean so I understand there's like positive negatives that's very honest of you that's a good way looking at it too that's a very good perspective because it's not like it hurts you you know if you drive down the street you see a burger king it doesn't hurt you if you don't go in there and eat i i'm i make a living playing music in nashville and i'm i never see it that's interesting well you just surround yourself with a tight -knit group i guess i never leave home so yeah that's how you never see it yeah Nashville is for for a lot of musicians like that is the that's the remaining mecca right um well for for certain musicians people who love uh And Bluegrass, it's definitely the place to be, you know.

[567] Bluegrass still lives in Nashville more than anywhere else, I'd say.

[568] It seems like this is a really good time for country.

[569] It seems that country is experiencing a resurgence right now.

[570] Like real country.

[571] Yeah.

[572] I think that, I have no idea, really.

[573] I don't know what to say about that.

[574] No?

[575] I don't know, man. You were in the mix, though.

[576] I was going to say something stupid about people buying records of Walmart, but I don't know, man. whatever that's very nice of you to pull back what a good guy you felt it look at me getting smart with age it's also weed weed has me double triple thinking stuff too pull it back son no need for conflict no I mean it's you know country country fans buy more out more physical copies than anyone oh really by far yeah no kidding yeah absolutely really huh they probably still use those CD things probably have those walkman's those big hip ones with the big rubber thing the knee are those things always yellow yeah that's good question and they just like yeah they can never be black they're always yellow that's true it's like hazard there was like a hazard to them or something like they were big all i wanted was that big yellow disc and the tony hawk skateboard it's like all i ever wanted well i remember when they figured out a way to have some sort of buffering so that when you were playing the cd you could actually jump around a little bit and move and it would wouldn't skip it was crazy what did they call when that happened for that ESP ESP 10 second ESP that's right yeah it was a buffering that they had saying it was a magical thing skip protection something yeah something electronic skip protection is what it is it is and then once they figured out how to go digital all that shit died can you imagine these have record players and cars did they yeah for real some early cars used to have that option wow my friend Javier, his mom had an A -track.

[577] I never forgot.

[578] We listened to Pablo Cruz.

[579] When my baby smiles in me, I go to Rio.

[580] And it was in those A -track things.

[581] Like, what is crazy space -age contraption this lady has in her car?

[582] He's pushed this box in there, and it plays music.

[583] It was amazing, you know?

[584] Oh, look at this.

[585] This is crazy.

[586] There you go.

[587] We're looking at a woman playing 45s in her car.

[588] What kind of car is it?

[589] That's a record player.

[590] This is nuts.

[591] That is nuts.

[592] It's a record player like where the Asthma tray sort of would be in a conventional car wow that's crazy every two and a half minutes you have to like look down and flip a record can you imagine those old cars man there was something about those old cars too there were there were a rolling piece of artwork as well there was some design and art to them that just you can't once you start going with aerodynamics and miles per gallon and airbags and yeah all shit happening on the dash yeah there's something with those cars, it's just so extraordinary.

[593] I got to see a car the other day with this digital touchscreen thing.

[594] It was like...

[595] Tesla?

[596] Was it a Tesla?

[597] No. I've never been in a Tesla.

[598] I don't remember what it was, but...

[599] God, it was just so weird.

[600] A lot of the electric cars have real crazy setups now.

[601] Very strange.

[602] Yeah.

[603] Well, the Tesla is a giant screen, like an enormous laptop screen.

[604] Like a big computer screen.

[605] Like, that's what a Tesla screen looks like.

[606] I mean, it's like a crazy laptop.

[607] Well, that's not a distraction.

[608] Is it?

[609] By the way, you can get email on that and websites.

[610] It's like, show me my flight path.

[611] You can.

[612] You can do all that kind of stuff.

[613] You can do Spotify on that too.

[614] You can press a little button and ask it to you know play Michael Jackson.

[615] It'll play Michael Jackson songs.

[616] That's so stupid.

[617] It's so big.

[618] It totally seems like it's in the way.

[619] It is a huge flat screen on your dash, man. Is that a YouTube video that guy's on the right hand side?

[620] You can play YouTube videos where you drive.

[621] That's so dangerous.

[622] Did you see that guy the guy that guy killed in Detroit he was jacking off in his car he crashed his car with his pants down died in the accident he was watching porn jacking off as he was driving and the state troopers when they got to the wreck dude has pants down porn playing on his phone oh man his kids there is pants with driver in Detroit dies in wreck watching porn did they make his use his name got it yep clifford ray jones Oh shit Partially ejected through the sunroof When his 1996 Toyota rolled And he was thrown from the vehicle and died He wasn't wearing pants Police told the Detroit news Oh well Driver inattention is a leading factor In most crashes and near crashes Okay Wait a second, what was he doing?

[623] Was he watching a movie?

[624] It was jacking off He was watching porn with his pants off They said it was a 96 corolla Where the fuck did he get the screen in there?

[625] Well he had it in his phone He was watching porn on a phone and jerking off yeah oh god kid's an animal oh he was 58 oh my god you retard well he should have known about old people in electronics man yeah that was finally figured out how to get porn it was just because he was old maybe you never know you never know are you a car guy are you into cars no not really no i mean i've got a couple old cars but no couple old cars mm -hmm that's what i figured you for i figured you for like an m g or something like that i've got an old um a ford um panel van that i drive around town you know a panel van yeah 1960 like like you're talking about like wood panels on the side no just a green work truck you know with barn doors it open on the back really yeah i used to deliver newspapers in one of those i had a dodge just like that i love it man what do you drive a van for it's not like a van it looks like it looks pretty cool yeah yeah i mean it's kind of beat up i don't have to worry about it Is that why you like it?

[626] Or you can store stuff in it?

[627] I like it.

[628] I can carry all my equipment in it.

[629] You know, it's really easy.

[630] It holds five people.

[631] And if people want to sit in the back, it holds 10, you know?

[632] I don't know.

[633] So, dude, you're just all about getting your music done.

[634] You don't even give a fuck.

[635] You're driving around a panel van, getting it all beat up and just...

[636] I bought a new BMW, like, uh, four years ago.

[637] I still have it.

[638] It's like starting to fall apart already.

[639] Really?

[640] Yeah, all these, like, things keep flat.

[641] And, like, do you take it to get notices in the mail, you know, recall notices.

[642] Like, really from a BMW?

[643] Yeah, airbag may shoot shrapnel at you, you know, it's like.

[644] What model BMW did you get?

[645] It's a, what's it called, the X, uh, X5.

[646] X5, it's a diesel.

[647] Oh, okay.

[648] That's your problem.

[649] Which is a total pain in the ass, trying to find diesel gas.

[650] Yeah, that's gross, too.

[651] Well, the only thing about diesel that's cool is you could grow your own.

[652] Like, um.

[653] Oh, I grow my own.

[654] Do you make your own diesel?

[655] No, I know.

[656] Neil Young does.

[657] Nobody grows their own diesel.

[658] No, Neil Young does.

[659] No, he doesn't.

[660] He makes his own biodiesel.

[661] He pays somebody to grow his own diesel, and he makes money off it, okay?

[662] You might be right.

[663] But I think he was trying to be self -sustaining, though.

[664] So he might not be selling it.

[665] Well, maybe he is.

[666] That's cool.

[667] He's got some amazing cars.

[668] Yeah, he has a gigantic ranch in Northern California, and he does grow his own biodiesel.

[669] Uh -huh.

[670] And he has his cars converted to use it.

[671] Yeah, right.

[672] I've heard about that ranch.

[673] Like he bought it early from the farmer.

[674] Yeah, and he has some crazy sound system set up on his lake where he can get in a boat, allegedly.

[675] Someone told us this, I believe, on the podcast.

[676] And he gets out on this boat, and he has the sound system set up where the acoustics are perfect when he's in the middle of this pond that he has.

[677] And so he has these speakers set up on the side and around the pond, and it just blast the perfect sound that echoes off the water.

[678] Epic.

[679] Yeah, he's a bad motherfucker.

[680] He's the reason why I had to quit work in security at Great Woods in Mansfield, Massachusetts when I was 19, because a riot broke out during a Neil Young concert because people were lightened fires.

[681] Have you ever been to Great Woods?

[682] Do you know the Great Woods Performance Center is...

[683] Maybe I have.

[684] It's an outdoor amphitheater.

[685] Yeah, it's an amphitheater.

[686] It's covered up into the back area, which is called the lawn.

[687] And the back area was literally like a sweeping lawn, and those are cheap receipts.

[688] Sure.

[689] And when Neil Young was there, people started fires there.

[690] They just started lighting garbage on fire And then fights broke out And then it was just chaos And I had a jacket I put a hoodie on over my security guard jacket I fucking put my hoodie on I was like I quit I walked out of there I was like fuck this place And I'll never forget The last time I worked was during a Neil Young concert And as I was leaving People were punching people And there was fire And I was like I gotta get the fuck out of here Yeah I've worked at one of those amphitheaters Blossom Music Center Oh yeah Where's that?

[691] Outside of Cleveland Richfield Another Ohio boy right there You know Blossom Music Center Yeah Columbus I used to Me and my buddies used to be the guys In the parking lot with the flags Why are so many bad motherfuckers from Ohio What's going on?

[692] Why is that state so badass?

[693] I don't know I think that it had I think that it had a lot of money With all the industry So it had a lot of art But now that the industry's gone It's kind of It's a struggle a bit But the art's still there Right And the culture sure the culture right understanding that there's respect for art i think that i don't know i just totally made that up but you might be right that might make sense did that sound there's something there's something there's a bunch of astronauts are from ohio tons of famous a lot of people i've met just here since i've lived here from ohio just hanging around yeah and whatnot it's a badass place do stand up too it's one of my favorite places one of the um one of the uh female astronauts who died and the Challenger explosion was from, went to my high school.

[694] Where was the female astronaut from that wore the diaper that went to the guy's house to kill him?

[695] Remember that one?

[696] She wore the diaper to drive all the way across the country so she didn't have to stop to pee.

[697] What was she going to do?

[698] She's going to kidnap some girl or something.

[699] I remember that.

[700] I remember that.

[701] Any girl is willing to fucking wear an astronaut charged with attempted murder.

[702] Anytime a chick is willing to wear a diaper.

[703] You fucked her up so bad.

[704] She wants to wear a diaper to come and get you.

[705] I mean, would you think that a female astronaut would like...

[706] She doesn't play game.

[707] She wants to win.

[708] She does not play games.

[709] She's got the right stuff, dude.

[710] Absolutely.

[711] Arrival for another astronaut's affection.

[712] Yeah, she attacked a rival for another astronaut's affection at the Orlando International Airport on Monday after driving more than 900 miles from Houston to meet her flight.

[713] Whoa.

[714] Okay, so this girl was flying and this crazy bitch said, I'm going to fucking meet you.

[715] wearing a diaper, shitting herself.

[716] She only had a four -inch blade and a BB gun, though.

[717] She's an astronaut.

[718] It's all she needs.

[719] She'd kill that bitch with a Pop -Tart.

[720] I didn't know that astronauts knew how to kill people.

[721] They teach you that?

[722] They're Americans, God damn it.

[723] They learn.

[724] I wonder, man. I wonder what she knew.

[725] Maybe she just wanted to claw her eyes out or something.

[726] Just bite her in the face or something.

[727] Yikes.

[728] Maybe she didn't really want to kill her.

[729] She had a BB gun, though.

[730] and a map to the house well listen anybody who's wearing a diaper ain't thinking that straight maybe she didn't know as BB going when she picked it up that's awesome she had a map to the house little X well do you know the story about the guy who broke in the White House only one guy ever broke in the White House during the Obama administration and I've been researching it's he the only one who's ever broken ever?

[731] He's ever the only guy's ever breached yeah he had in his car two rifles, four handguns, 800 rounds of ammunition, two hatchets, and a machete.

[732] And he broke in the White House with a knife on him.

[733] And he only got 18 months.

[734] That's what's really crazy.

[735] He said, well, he had PTSD.

[736] Oh, okay.

[737] Did he just drop out of the roof like, ha?

[738] Well, he had a plea deal.

[739] He barred through the door, and there was a woman security guard, and she couldn't stop him.

[740] He was too big, and he ran past her.

[741] And he got deep in.

[742] He got deep in the White House, like deeper than the...

[743] he had originally admitted.

[744] Did he, uh, did he have a map, like with X at the end?

[745] He did.

[746] That's what I was going to say.

[747] He had a map, like White House X. This is dumb fuck.

[748] This guy was completely out of his mind.

[749] But the crazy thing is he only got 18 months.

[750] Uh -huh.

[751] I know a guy was in jail for 10 years for growing weed.

[752] He's in federal penitentiary for 10 years for growing weed.

[753] Yeah.

[754] And this guy got 18 months for having an arsenal in his car and breaking into the White House with a knife.

[755] Idiocracy, man. maybe you see that cop in new york just got a convicted of manslaughter but didn't get any jail time which cop which story just just happened the other day i forget do you know what the case was i think it was at one of those cases where he had the duty where he was in the like kind of sort patrolling the stairwells and projects which sounds horrifying no jail time for ex nypd officer after manslaughter conviction reduced a criminally negligent homicide huh What is it saying?

[756] He did, Jamie?

[757] I don't know.

[758] It's just saying it seems like every day there's just something that doesn't make any sense.

[759] Well, there's definitely a lot of stuff that doesn't make any sense.

[760] And also, a lot of stuff you have to deal with if you're a fucking cop, I think this is a subject that requires balance.

[761] I think there's a lot of terrible things that cops have done, and it's obvious.

[762] We've seen videos of it.

[763] We saw that cops shoot that guy in the back, running away, and then throw the taser on them.

[764] We've all seen horrible shit.

[765] We've seen it.

[766] I think these guys are shell -shocked.

[767] think there's a vast majority of the people out there that are operating as police officers that are barely keeping it together.

[768] I think it's a hard job.

[769] And I think those guys are under stress all the time.

[770] Every day might be the end of their life.

[771] Every car they pull over might be someone who shoots them.

[772] You walk into places and you're hated him instantly.

[773] Instantly.

[774] Everybody's lying to you.

[775] And it should be the opposite.

[776] Yeah.

[777] Everybody's lying to you.

[778] And on top of that, they've set them up as the enemy by making them glorified revenue collectors, pulling people over for having a fucking, you know, traffic ticker, you know, your blinker's not working or your license plates expired.

[779] All shit that has nothing to do with crime.

[780] You know, I think there's a lot of that going on where they give them quotas on speeding tickets and they turn them into the enemy.

[781] You're taking money from people.

[782] You're stealing from people.

[783] They're being used.

[784] They're being used.

[785] And, yeah, and it's not right.

[786] Well, I just always hope that when people talk about stuff like this and all these videos that are getting out and the awareness of it that it'll bounce back the other way and then people realize it and the people somehow or another it'll be a self -correcting thing you think that's going to happen i don't know i don't think so you don't think it's in time the things are self -correcting uh i think that's some famous white person has to die and then maybe it'll get corrected oh white people i see hmm might be might be right yeah it seems to be when people take notice I saw that interview that you did with that ex -Baltimore cop.

[787] Yeah, he's coming back in.

[788] Boy, that was like, that should be required viewing.

[789] Yeah, he's running for Chief of Police of Chicago.

[790] He wants to take over to Chicago.

[791] He thinks he can make some leeway.

[792] He's going to come in and talk about that.

[793] That's what an uphill battle that would be.

[794] Well, if anybody's going to do it, it's going to be a guy like him, a radical thinker.

[795] I don't mean fighting the crime.

[796] I mean changing the politics.

[797] Yeah.

[798] That would be the uphill battle.

[799] But both would be a problem.

[800] You know, Chicago became a bloodbath after they started arresting key gang members that were in control of drug distribution.

[801] So they created a power vacuum.

[802] And, you know, much like has happened...

[803] Isn't that why they call it Shrek?

[804] What's that?

[805] Isn't that why they call it Shrek?

[806] Is that what they call it?

[807] Yeah.

[808] Whoa.

[809] They call it Shrek.

[810] You knew that?

[811] Jamie's on black Twitter on the regular basis.

[812] Spike Lee movie just came out.

[813] He called it that too.

[814] That was in the Spike movie?

[815] That's what they call it.

[816] That's what locals call it.

[817] I'm so white.

[818] Because it's a war zone.

[819] Yeah, it is a war zone.

[820] But it's essentially, I didn't know that, but it seems like kind of the same thing where you take out people in power and then it's just chaos.

[821] Well, we were there about a year and a half ago, and there was a guy who I was talking with down there that used to be a cop, and now he was a limo driver.

[822] And he was telling me what it was like.

[823] And it's always been a problem.

[824] He's like, but then when they decided to go and make some key arrests, they had created a bit of a power vacuum.

[825] and then it all ramped up where people were trying to and then there's also like once the violence is ramped up then people want to respond to that violence and it ramps it up even more and how do you stop that you know I mean but if anybody knows it's going to be a guy like Michael Wood it's going to be a guy who was a former cop worked in Baltimore who understands what does he think about drugs does he think they're going to need to be legalized yeah I think so yeah I don't think he's in no locking people up for anything that they want to do I think everybody agrees to that I mean, those nonviolent crimes, like to have these prisons filled up with nonviolent crimes is very bizarre, especially when it's nonviolent.

[826] It's embarrassing.

[827] It is embarrassing.

[828] We should be.

[829] We should be.

[830] We've fucking ruined so many people's lives.

[831] Mm -hmm.

[832] Yeah.

[833] And it doesn't look like they're going to do anything about it.

[834] People make too much money.

[835] Well, people with, you know, political influence.

[836] Well, private prisons.

[837] And then when that judge got caught in Pennsylvania for taking young kids and locking them up in jail for money and that he, was getting some sort of a kickback from these detention institutes where they would send young juvenile detention man just to know that there's people out there that are working in justice that would be willing to take money and sacrifice some young kids future yeah i mean that's really really scary that these are the people that we've led justice to that's heinous i mean i get so scared uh thinking about my kids uh you know i mean every single day you see crazy shit You see some, like, you know, black kid killed by a cop, you know?

[838] It's like, Jesus Christ, it's like never ending.

[839] It does make me kind of want to not leave my house sometimes.

[840] It's awful, but it's also awful black kids killed by black kids, white kids killed by white kids.

[841] I mean, just violence in and of itself.

[842] It's such a, at this point in our life.

[843] I guess it's because I'm only ever going to World Star.

[844] Well, you should get off a World Star.

[845] My favorite video, World Star was this week.

[846] See the one with a little cub wrestling a dog?

[847] Holy Jesus Christ I didn't see this little baby bear Fucked this dog up It was a grown dog man It's a little tiny bear And it looked like the dog was fucking with the bear And then the bear was like bitch Just grabbed it by his head and just ragdolling him It's on my Instagram It is crazy Like you can't believe how strong This little tiny bear is In comparison to a full grown dog That's twice his size He just throws him around like look at this Look at this dog is fucking And he's like bitch Yikes Look, he just He ragdolls this dog Watch the dog gets out Watch his hip toss Watch this act right here Boom Dude that's technique Look like take side control That dog knows what the fuck's going on Or that bear rather Wait a second Play that again And do the commentary That was cool I'll show you exactly what's going on here See the dog's fucking He's like no bitch He got the moly clinch First of all He gets the plumb around the neck Ragdolls him to the ground The dog's trying to reach around behind him He adjusts Flips the dog on his back And look at that hip toss The hip toss at the end is huge He's got the scarf hold He's holding on the neck It's your thing It's huge It's that hip toss is huge Because that's he established his position He did and he keeps it up Very quickly Well because he's smart He knew he was going to get reversed Well apparently the dog Has Jiu -Jitsu And Bear wanted to stay standing up Dog's just big He's a goon Bear wanted to keep it up The dog's a goon The bear's going to win eventually He's going to have to cook him It's going to take some time Trust me I got money out of bear Did you say the dog is a goon?

[848] Yeah he's a goon A goon.

[849] How dare you?

[850] A goon is when you roll with someone and they're not good, they're just strong.

[851] And they throw you off of them and you just got to ride the boat.

[852] You got to figure out a way to ride the ball.

[853] Isn't that like most people with big muscles though?

[854] A lot of people with big muscles.

[855] I'm a boxing fan and like when somebody walks in to the ring and they've got a lot of muscles, I pretty much automatically know they're going to lose.

[856] I got two words for you.

[857] Mike Tyson, that's what you get when you get big muscles and intelligence and a knowledge, a deep knowledge of boxing.

[858] Yeah, totally.

[859] Both things.

[860] But most of the time you don't.

[861] Most of the time you don't.

[862] But when you did, like when Mike Tyson was in his prime, it was so terrifying because there wasn't a guy like that before him.

[863] His super fast, ridiculously powerful guy just came in with perfect technique, bobbing and weaving, throwing bombs at you.

[864] Yeah, his side to side movement was just so, it was terrifying.

[865] Oh, my God.

[866] That little bear would fuck him up.

[867] Grab a hold of his dick, throw him to the ground, flip him over on its back.

[868] I don't know, man. And you seen him with his tigers?

[869] Yeah, he's crazy.

[870] Charlie Murphy had one of the funniest stories ever told on this podcast.

[871] We told about how he pulled up to Mike Tyson's house with a bunch of his friends, and they were all limos, and nobody wanted to get it out of the car.

[872] Because Mike Tyson was on the front lawn with a fucking lion.

[873] He's got like a lion, and he's got an actual real lion, and nobody wanted to get it out of the cars.

[874] Or was a tiger or was it a lion?

[875] One of those things.

[876] But it's an animated thing.

[877] Oh, he's got a tiger there.

[878] He had a gang of cats.

[879] rich do you have to get before you start collecting zoo animals well he was insane wealthy living in Vegas I mean at the time seems to be the thing like you get a monkey you get a well a lot of fighters wind up getting very dangerous animals that was a that was a big thing with a lot of fighters I was wondering what did he do with these things once he couldn't handle like what fight it like who what kind of animals a lot of boxers get pit bulls that's real common a lot of uh kickboxers and M .M .A fighters get pit bulls.

[880] Yeah.

[881] Real common.

[882] They just want to be around something that's as badass as them.

[883] Sure.

[884] You know?

[885] Or it makes them feel badass.

[886] And insist they're safe.

[887] Yeah.

[888] Well, you'll be safe.

[889] It's other people that you've got to worry about.

[890] If you have a pit bull, most of the time you're safe.

[891] If it's your dog, it's very rare that a pit bull attacks its owner.

[892] Very rare.

[893] They please, they want to please people.

[894] And it's not even normal for them to go after people.

[895] Usually the only times that those dogs go after people is when they're abused or I totally believe you, but I wouldn't let my kids around one.

[896] No, that's, the children is different because children are small and they think children are part of my life, so I can't have them around.

[897] I totally understand.

[898] I totally understand.

[899] But children are part of everybody's life.

[900] So it's like when you get a pit bull, you're basically saying I'm, you know, half the population can't be around me. You could say that, but there are some, you know, the problem is it's not worth the risk to make the exception, but there are some people's dogs that are amazing.

[901] Like I used to have this pit bull named Lucy.

[902] She was a sweetest dog ever.

[903] to everybody.

[904] I have a friend with a really sweet pit bull.

[905] It didn't matter.

[906] She loved everybody.

[907] But, you know, when people would see her, they'd be like, is that a pit bull?

[908] And they'd freak out.

[909] But she was the nicest dog ever.

[910] Yeah.

[911] But then you'll have other dogs that are just not like that at all.

[912] You know, they're dangerous.

[913] They're tricky.

[914] And you never know, because they all look the same.

[915] Like, you'd have to get the know the dog.

[916] And you have to know the history of the dog and the dog's parent's history.

[917] And, you know, I have this dog that's a mastiff.

[918] And he's a smaller mastiff.

[919] It's called a regency mastiff.

[920] he is the sweetest dog I have ever had in my life and the reason why is because the guy who raised them like he when he described it to me he's like it's all about the parents and it's all about not letting parents that exhibit any weird behavior breed he's like if you're gonna breed like a really nice dog you just make sure that the dogs are always friendly and only friendly dogs breed and if they're not friendly don't allow them to breed I was like that it's crazy he's got to completely organized that way like genetically you know he makes sure that these dogs are never any dog that growls at somebody any dog that barks for no reason they don't breed those are the ones they put in the other barn where they secretly breed them for fighters well they just fix them he just fixed no they're they're different dogs it's a large dog you know he just one of my friends uh his mom bred uh bull mastiffs oh yeah so I was always freaked out every time I went over they would like be in the yard playing with bowling balls you know and I'd be like I'm not getting out of the car yeah there are some enormous dogs they were originally made like they'd made make them, I think, for some sort of guard dog, right?

[921] That was the idea behind them, to make them as big as possible.

[922] Uh -huh.

[923] Like those English Mastiffs, they're like 200 -pound dogs.

[924] They're enormous.

[925] Yeah.

[926] I don't get those.

[927] I like labs.

[928] I think labs are my favorite.

[929] They're, like, the most predictable.

[930] You know?

[931] They're predictable.

[932] I just like a good mutt.

[933] Yeah.

[934] You know, like a good -friendly mutt.

[935] Good mutts are good, man. Is there any downside to living in Nashville?

[936] Like, what is it?

[937] Is it all good?

[938] living down there or is it you know there's there's been such an influx of people that it's a it's a bit congested now it's it's sort of like austin in that regard right it's i guess so it's the hot spot i've heard that if you're young and you have aspirations and you want to live in a cool place it seems to take longer and longer each year to get across town yeah you know you guys keep talking about it telling people how awesome it is you know you hear me talking about me i just did I work there all the time I used to do Zanies You know what that comedy club is down there Sure I've been there I'm there next month I'm doing the rhyming Yeah I love Nashville The arcs just played the rhyme Oh yeah Awesome we had John Pryan Come out and sing with this Now are you doing the arcs In conjunction with the Black Keys Like how do you No just sort of You know Pat and I Sort of just finished Like the Turn Blue Tour Which ended like four years straight Of touring So we're just kind of Taking a little break And I'm doing this arc the arcs thing now.

[939] When you guys do things like this, do you do things legally or do you just shake hands and say, we're in a band?

[940] I do things legally, yeah.

[941] Yeah.

[942] I do with these guys.

[943] I love them.

[944] They're my friends, but they're, you know, they're pros.

[945] Yeah, you kind of have to, huh?

[946] They all have their own lawyers, you know.

[947] That's a guy to be so weird.

[948] You know, because they have been ripped off, you know, they've been ripped off in the past.

[949] That happens to really good musicians.

[950] What an amazing relationship you could have, though, if you had a bunch of heavy -duty musicians that went out.

[951] on a handshake.

[952] Well, I mean, we don't talk about money really ahead of time.

[953] You know, they'll buy plane tickets and fly into Nashville and spend a week recording.

[954] We'll never once talk about contrast or anything like that.

[955] So it's all done in advance.

[956] It's done afterwards.

[957] It's, you know, hey, we finished a record.

[958] We'll work it out now.

[959] Right.

[960] That's how it should be done, right?

[961] Until you get screwed.

[962] And then you're like, shit, I should have done this ahead of time.

[963] I don't know.

[964] I think that's how it should be done.

[965] But at least there's a level of trust that you guys do the recording in advance.

[966] I mean, that's a high level of trust And then figure it out afterwards That's a very high level of trust Because what if you guys Catch lightning in a bottle One of you bitches gets greedy Yeah Someone gets those Scrooge McDuck Ching Ching those dollar bills in his eyes The next thing you know Have you guys ever had your songs Ripped Off before?

[967] Oh yeah Absolutely What does that feel like?

[968] Strange You know I mean for Pat and I It was like We spent so many years Just trying to get noticed to like have people copying us.

[969] It was just so bizarre.

[970] We had this one case where, I mean, it's happened multiple times to us.

[971] But we had this one case where some casino did an advertisement and the owner of the casino posted something on Twitter or something like, hey, check it out.

[972] We just ripped off this Black Keys song for our new ad.

[973] You guys like it?

[974] And we just used that in the case and won.

[975] It was insane.

[976] Did they just not know?

[977] I don't think he knew how the internet worked.

[978] I don't know.

[979] I thought maybe he was, maybe he was just thought he was posting to his buddies.

[980] That's hilarious.

[981] Was it like Native American casino where they thought they had different laws?

[982] I don't know.

[983] I don't know, man. Do they have different laws when it comes to that kind of stuff?

[984] I don't know.

[985] I don't either.

[986] I mean, that was like the whole thing.

[987] It was like that Native American casinos, they were allowed to have casinos in places that you can never have casinos because they had their own rules.

[988] That's where a lot of the early MMA fights were done because it was illegal.

[989] It was illegal to have MMA competitions.

[990] So it was illegal to have MMA competitions, but it was legal to have them at the Native American places.

[991] So they must have different laws.

[992] Yeah.

[993] In some ways, yeah.

[994] That's how they have casinos.

[995] Yeah.

[996] So what do you guys doing now?

[997] You're just touring across the country with this new music?

[998] Yeah.

[999] We're just on tour playing some shows.

[1000] And you're here for Coachella?

[1001] Yeah.

[1002] What is that experience like?

[1003] you know it's it's like most kind of festivals it's it can be fun if you're if you're into that type of thing i guess i don't know well it seems like it's got to be good for like the young up -and -coming guys and gals to be included in these lineups and people to be able to experience maybe some bands i know for honey honey it was a big deal you know to be able to experience some bands and maybe you weren't aware of before and say oh let me yeah i'd see For me, it's kind of weird, like, watching music in the sun.

[1004] It just feels weird to me. And then you don't get sound check.

[1005] So you kind of go up there blind.

[1006] Oh, okay.

[1007] And then, you know, and then you have a very short set.

[1008] Normally, most bands play.

[1009] You know a band that's playing, like, the more theater or something that's playing, like, an hour or half at least.

[1010] When you play at a festival, you have 45 minutes.

[1011] That's it, you know.

[1012] So it's like, you know, it's a lot of effort to not be at your best.

[1013] You know what I mean?

[1014] Yeah.

[1015] It's sort of, um, that can be a little difficult.

[1016] But when you play a great festival and you get a great crowd, it can change your mind, I guess.

[1017] We just played last week and it was awesome.

[1018] We had a really nice crowd.

[1019] It was great.

[1020] What is it like being there?

[1021] I mean, how many people go to that goddamn thing?

[1022] It's got to be enormous now.

[1023] Yeah.

[1024] I mean, it's huge.

[1025] I mean, yeah, I'm, it's become this whole big thing out there, too.

[1026] They do two weekends now.

[1027] Yeah.

[1028] Not one.

[1029] And then the weekend after that, they do essentially the same thing but with country music.

[1030] What's it called?

[1031] Stagecoach festival.

[1032] So it's like three weeks.

[1033] The whole town, like, is for three weeks, at least, is just completely inundated with people.

[1034] How strange.

[1035] And how do they choose that spot?

[1036] I don't know.

[1037] They do it on the polo grounds there.

[1038] Do they use those polo grounds when it's not in season?

[1039] That's true.

[1040] Yeah, I don't even know.

[1041] I don't know.

[1042] They just decided to put it on down there.

[1043] But it's become this gigantic thing that everybody has to go to.

[1044] A lot of guys who do those festivals will be the same ones who do festivals all over the place.

[1045] You know, they'll, you know, like those Lollapalooza guys do different festivals.

[1046] They've started different ones.

[1047] And the benefit of doing those things is really essentially just for exposure, right?

[1048] I mean, there's money in it, but it's not like you guys do it on your own.

[1049] It's good money.

[1050] It is good money?

[1051] It's better money than playing shows.

[1052] You get more money.

[1053] Really?

[1054] Yeah, yeah.

[1055] Wow.

[1056] It's good money.

[1057] to route a tour around festivals no shit yeah absolutely wow that's interesting huh because comedians always think of it as like south by southwest because when you think about festivals that's not festival what is that that's a more an industry thing and it's it's everybody's kind of playing for free yeah what the fuck is that that's really weird when you're starting that you know it's a place to be seen yeah it's more for up -and -comers i think or when you have a brand new record coming out, you can go down there and you know that all the media is going to be there.

[1058] Is Coachella the Big Festival?

[1059] I think so.

[1060] Yeah, Coachella is one of the biggest.

[1061] Lala Ploos is the other.

[1062] Yeah, there are a few that are mainstays now.

[1063] Coachella is definitely one of them.

[1064] Do you find that in the age of the Internet that you are getting better crowds in different places, that you're getting people that understand what you're doing and are big fans, and they're all over the place now, instead of like in urban pockets I don't know we don't go outside of urban pockets really to be honest really I mean we stay in major cities we don't we don't often hit the small towns no because we can hit major markets in Australia Western Europe North America we can do it in South America and then like by the time we finish that you can kind of do those again you know what I mean Right, right.

[1065] It's like you really have to want to go there and make a lot less money.

[1066] Right.

[1067] I get it.

[1068] Makes sense.

[1069] Yeah.

[1070] Well, I would just think that maybe that would, especially for fucking around and creating new stuff, sometimes getting a new look, you know, and being in a new place and performing for a new kind of, it gives you a new feel for what you're doing.

[1071] Yeah.

[1072] I mean, I think if you're that kind of band, that does a lot of improvising and, you know, fly by.

[1073] the seat of your pants, but for me, I'd rather be creating in the studio.

[1074] Do you enjoy travel?

[1075] Do you enjoy, like, international gigs?

[1076] Uh, less and less.

[1077] Yeah, less and less.

[1078] The more, the more productive I am at home, the less I want to leave, you know, and I love being around my kids.

[1079] It's, it's been a lot of fun.

[1080] So, it's definitely become less and less a thing I want to do.

[1081] I got to tell you, dude, your dedication and the way you describe wanting to do music, it's very infectious.

[1082] I love hearing shit like this because it really does make me want to go do something, you know?

[1083] And I think that effect is one of the reasons why people really enjoy conversations with people like you.

[1084] Because when we're reminded...

[1085] I've never really done this.

[1086] Really?

[1087] I've never really done an interview like this.

[1088] No shit?

[1089] Never.

[1090] So comfortable, though.

[1091] How are you so comfortable?

[1092] I don't know.

[1093] I guess I just feel comfortable around you, John.

[1094] I feel safe.

[1095] You're definitely safe.

[1096] I feel like you're going to keep me safe.

[1097] I'm 100 % say.

[1098] If my stalker with the map comes through, bar just through that door.

[1099] Everything's fine.

[1100] You're going to be fine.

[1101] But it's like when a person hears someone like you that is just in love at what they do and produces amazing stuff and just has a passion about it, it makes you, there's like a bubbly thing.

[1102] It like starts boiling inside it.

[1103] You want to get going.

[1104] You want to get moving, man. That is the fuel of inspiration.

[1105] That's so important for people.

[1106] I mean, I think for all of us, I think every.

[1107] Everybody who was into certain artists growing up knows that music, especially, I think, it's probably one of the most inspirational things.

[1108] As far as, like, the way it hits you, the way it emotionally, way it hits you.

[1109] Like, as far as art forms, you can listen to a three -minute song, and it can hit you in a way that three minutes in a movie has no hope of.

[1110] Like, from start to go, the three first minutes of a movie never hit you like some songs do.

[1111] They just tell a story in this intense, moving way with music.

[1112] music and sound and the soul behind the way a person sings the words.

[1113] And that, to hear from a guy like you that that process is so intoxicating and you love it so much and that you still, after all these years, do it and love it and you can't wait to get back in there and you want to be productive and that you work all the time and that you work at it and you don't even consider.

[1114] That's like it.

[1115] That's what everybody wants to hear, man. Because that, when you hear a guy like you talk about that, I guarantee you this podcast to be heard by over a million people and out of those million people thousands of them are gonna start new projects and get inspired to do things just by hearing you do this I think so fuck yeah man they gonna want some of that man so people what they hear that and they go back that sounds like bliss that sounds like career bliss someone who loves what they do and well yeah the business side is is hard there's a lot of bullshit you know what I mean and most people don't make it you know we started over 10 years ago and we used to tour with a bunch of bands that just don't even exist anymore.

[1116] Do you know what I mean?

[1117] We know that we're lucky, you know what I mean?

[1118] But at the same time, I've always felt something more from music.

[1119] You know, it's always meant more to me than it did to all my friends.

[1120] Just because I don't know why, you know, it's like part of my family.

[1121] But even still, you know, my dad had a great record collection, but I am pretty quickly, like, surpassed his knowledge and just delve deeper.

[1122] You know what I mean?

[1123] But I always felt really into it.

[1124] tune with music.

[1125] Like, I, I can remember being, like, 14 and hearing Sam Cook and the solsters and, like, it making me cry.

[1126] You know what I mean?

[1127] It was able to reach someplace inside me that nothing else ever was able to, you know?

[1128] I don't know that everybody gets that thing.

[1129] Right.

[1130] But I definitely have that, and it's like, it's really controlled the way that I've made all the decisions in my life.

[1131] Well, I've got to think, as a young man, in such a music -rich environment that you described your childhood growing up like that, I mean, that had to have sparked and fueled some areas of your creativity that just led you to embrace it the way you have.

[1132] I mean, it's, I mean, it seems like a really fortunate situation that you grew up in.

[1133] Yeah, absolutely.

[1134] I mean, that's the story of you guys around your grandmother's grave singing that song.

[1135] That's an amazing story, man. Yeah.

[1136] I kind of wish I had that in my family, you know?

[1137] Yeah.

[1138] I mean, and I know it.

[1139] I know it, you know, and not only were my uncle's great musicians, but they had great taste.

[1140] Like, my uncle Jim taught me how to sing.

[1141] He's still got one of the best voices I've ever heard in my life, you know what I mean?

[1142] And, you know, I was into blues music, but I was a real snob about it.

[1143] I liked certain things, and I really didn't like other things, you know what I mean?

[1144] And I had my uncle Tim, he just had amazing blues albums.

[1145] And he hit me to the cool shit, you know what I mean, early on.

[1146] And I knew the difference between, like, that kind of corny bar blue shit and, like, the deep stuff, you know.

[1147] And so I really had a head start.

[1148] I can't say that it was just all, like, I just got it.

[1149] You know, I had, like, I had great teachers, and I was around some cool stuff growing up.

[1150] Yeah, that's what it seems like, you know, and I think that having around a bunch of people that are not just have great taste, but also express themselves, like freely and over.

[1151] openly like that they can sing at a funeral you know that's not a lot of families where they're so musical that they'll they'll sit around and sing your grandmother's favorite song when she died well yeah i mean it became it it it ceased to be music for me it was just who i was it was my life as a human is music it's it's just it's like eating music showering i mean it's like a part of the thing i do you know what i mean and without thinking about it And no matter what you did, even if you didn't pursue it as a career, you would still be involved in music.

[1152] But you can't even think about that, can you?

[1153] Yeah, I don't, I wouldn't know, man. I mean, really, I knew that I felt totally out of place, like working in a kitchen and, like, working anywhere else.

[1154] Is that a boxing glove around your neck?

[1155] Yeah.

[1156] What's that from?

[1157] You know, they used to give these out to Golden Glove winners, local, regional Golden Glove winners.

[1158] Did you win a Golden Gloves?

[1159] No, no, no. I found it in a junk shot.

[1160] It does look cool.

[1161] I like how you're rocking it underneath the collar, old school, style, Catholic school, like an Italian horn.

[1162] I thought they would wear it.

[1163] Do you remember Italian horns?

[1164] No. People used to wear those stupid little gold horns, like a horn, like a bull's horn that was like hanging.

[1165] Do you know what I'm talking about?

[1166] Not at all.

[1167] Is this thing they would call them Italian horns.

[1168] They were a big East Coast Guido thing.

[1169] Where'd you grow up?

[1170] That's what they look like.

[1171] I was born in New Jersey, and I grew up in Boston.

[1172] That's kind of looks like sperm.

[1173] Stupid charm.

[1174] It does look like sperm.

[1175] That's probably what it really is.

[1176] 14 -carried gold sperm.

[1177] Hey, you fuck with the bull, you get the horns.

[1178] I don't know why it was a horn.

[1179] I have no idea what it meant.

[1180] But when I was a kid.

[1181] It looks like you have sperm on your chest.

[1182] Like a golden sperm.

[1183] Like Liberacee came in your chest.

[1184] I don't know why.

[1185] I brought that up.

[1186] I don't even know where they came from.

[1187] I was just curious about, I just wanted to know if you boxed.

[1188] Yeah.

[1189] Yeah, I box.

[1190] Do you?

[1191] Mm -hmm.

[1192] What do you do?

[1193] Do you do it for like...

[1194] Just for fun.

[1195] For fun?

[1196] For working out, yeah.

[1197] Do you spar or do you hit pads?

[1198] Really?

[1199] When my cousin's in town, he taught me on a box.

[1200] He's been boxing since he was like 14.

[1201] He got me into it three or four years ago.

[1202] I have some friends that still spar and I'm like, dude, be careful.

[1203] Yeah.

[1204] Yeah.

[1205] Even though you have those things, big helmets on it, shit hurts.

[1206] Those helmets don't really help you.

[1207] No. The problem is the brain Smushing around inside the head And those helmets Nobody's hitting me like that No Inspiring man, no But just a little jolt Even jolts like that Real bad for the brain Swashing around inside the head Uh huh yeah Absolutely I was talking to a doctor He said that jet skiing Can give you brain damage Jet skiing Jet skiing Just Be on a jet ski He said the bounce of a jet ski No bullshit Gives people concussions Wow Yeah because you don't What a concussion is is you're concussed, like the impact doesn't have to hit you in the head.

[1208] A lot of concussions happen for people get a hit in the chest and then all of a sudden they'll be depressed and their mood swings being, their cortisol levels are all fucked up and they'll find out that they're from the cussed.

[1209] It's from the sort of like whiplash from the movement of the brain.

[1210] From the impact, yeah.

[1211] I always heard that.

[1212] That's what I mean, I know it's true in boxing with the big gloves.

[1213] I know they cause more brain damage than the small gloves.

[1214] I know MMA's technically safer than boxing is in the long term.

[1215] Yeah, believe it or not, It'd actually be safer if they wore no gloves.

[1216] Yeah, absolutely.

[1217] No gloves, no wrist tape.

[1218] Your wrist would bend easier.

[1219] It would be harder to hit people hard.

[1220] Also, your hands would break, so you'd have to pick your shots better.

[1221] Absolutely.

[1222] Safety.

[1223] Safe first.

[1224] Safety first.

[1225] Even in extreme sports.

[1226] Yeah, well, that's the thing, right?

[1227] Like, how safe can you make it while still have it be so exciting?

[1228] I don't know.

[1229] Right.

[1230] Do you watch boxing now, though?

[1231] You're a big boxing fan?

[1232] Oh, yeah.

[1233] You had chocolateitos in Santa Monica.

[1234] right now training oh have you watched him uh i mean i'm a big fan of his i've never seen him live but i want to go there and watch him train yeah manny pack you out train once it was a real pleasure it was um i went and trained it at wildcard and they let me go down and train in the room the manny room oh yeah and you know the double -end bag was like so fucking tight yeah i could barely hit the thing i felt so stupid because i was like all right i'm at a place where i feel comfortable I can go to wildcard and maybe work out and not feel like a total shithead and I was like I gotta get out of here I was like uh give me a couple white card t -shirts and you'll never see me again watching manny hit the pads man he was hitting the pads wasn't with um it was it with freddie roach it might have been with freddie yeah it was with freddy it was with freddie and another guy um and he goes through all this warm -up routines and goes to all this stuff and then he starts hitting the pads kind of slow and loosens up and then eventually he starts firing off these combinations like and he's just firing off these ungodly quick combinations you just realize like yeah there's a difference there's a difference in certain people yeah there's a big difference you see his calves too yeah yeah yeah what the hell yeah's going on over there well that's where his power comes from his power is all from his legs the pushing off of the legs and delivering these lightning fast combinations yeah did you see his last fight was an absolute bust they lost money Yeah, nobody wants to see him fight If it's not Floyd Mayweather And people are really disappointed too Well, that's not totally true I mean he just fought Tim Bradley It's like a third fight Yeah I don't think anybody really cared Tim Bradley's a fun guy Tim Bradley's awesome Yeah It's his third fight Let's let's There are a bunch of great welter weights out there I agree Terrence Crawford The best Yeah he's awesome I want to see that fight He just he's just inked deal with To fight Victor Paul Stahl Oh really That's gonna be a great fight too I think Terrence is going to win it, but that's a really good fight.

[1235] And I'd love to see that Terrence Crawford isn't scared to fight anybody, even the best.

[1236] Terrence is something special, and also that he fights from the Orthodox dance, but just as good, if not better, from the Southpaw, and he'll switch up on guys.

[1237] I know.

[1238] He'll be outboxing you.

[1239] Usually I hate when I see guys do that.

[1240] I'm like, oh, this fucking guy.

[1241] But he's awesome.

[1242] It's almost like he's feeling you out as an Orthodox, and then when he knows he can fuck you up, he switches over and starts lighting you up.

[1243] He's something special.

[1244] He's awesome.

[1245] And I love to watch his brainwork, too, because he does, he won't just go out for the knockout or whatever.

[1246] He plays with, he plays with it for a few rounds.

[1247] Well, he's smart about it.

[1248] Yes.

[1249] He always plays with the person for a few rounds and then starts destroying them.

[1250] Well, I think he values and appreciates the skill and art of boxing, the actual art of it.

[1251] I mean, there's no way he could be as good as he is without it.

[1252] If you get to that level, you have to, you have to, like, reach that point where you understand that there's a total art to it.

[1253] Yeah, so what he's doing is, like, he's setting traps and slow.

[1254] dragging guys into his game and then fucking them up.

[1255] Yeah.

[1256] And for a guy who really appreciates the skill and the subtleties of what he's doing, it's amazing.

[1257] Absolutely.

[1258] I love watching that guy set traps.

[1259] Chocolate Tito's awesome too because he's just like watching his side -to -side movement.

[1260] Oh, yeah.

[1261] Watching, it's just like second nature for him.

[1262] Mm -hmm.

[1263] More so than anybody.

[1264] Mm -hmm.

[1265] He's just a boxer.

[1266] Yeah.

[1267] You know?

[1268] The fluidity of those combinations where you step off to the left and crank off these It reminds me of Finito Lopez in that way, where it's just, like, perfect form, and the movement is insane.

[1269] This is a good time for boxing right now.

[1270] Garnati Golovkin, another one.

[1271] I want to see what happens with Canelo Alvarez and Amir Khan, which is coming up.

[1272] I worry about Khan.

[1273] You know, we're talking about muscles, and Khan keeps saying, I feel stronger, and he looks huge.

[1274] He looks ripped.

[1275] I worry that he just will have no stamina in the fight.

[1276] Yeah, I wonder.

[1277] Is this the first time that...

[1278] What are they fighting at 160?

[1279] Or is it 154?

[1280] I don't remember.

[1281] So when Mayweather and him fought, they fought at 150.

[1282] Was it a catchweight fight?

[1283] Yeah, I think so.

[1284] Mayweather wanted him a little small, right?

[1285] Mayweather gets wherever he wants.

[1286] Shrink him down a little bit.

[1287] Get that big bruiser down.

[1288] But Gernady Golofkin is, he's an interesting guy because a lot of people don't want to, like, his pay -view got like 150 ,000 buys, which is a huge bust.

[1289] It's a disaster for them.

[1290] But for boxing fans like you or me He's the best He's the guy to watch I can't wait to watch We still haven't seen him tested though I don't think I don't think so either But he's gonna fight You know everybody wants to see him fight Wade I mean Canello For sure But he's fighting Who is he is Yeah it's Wade Wade is the guy's name The mandatory challenge Oh no he's fighting Wade right now But Andre Ward Oh Andre Ward's gonna go up And fight Kovalev though You know that?

[1291] Andre was now fighting 75.

[1292] He had his first light heavyweight fight at 75.

[1293] It looked great, and now he's going to fight Kovalev.

[1294] Kovalev's a beast.

[1295] Oh, he's another terrifying guy.

[1296] Yeah.

[1297] This is a great time for boxing.

[1298] Although Bernard Hopkins, you know, as old as he is and kind of as slow as he is, with respect, he popped Kovlev a few times.

[1299] He did.

[1300] I mean, it was the Bernard Hopkins of 10 years ago.

[1301] It could have been a completely different fight.

[1302] Yeah, that's what I'm saying.

[1303] Like, I think if, again, it's all, it's, that's the other thing about boxing is it, like, with the thing that's so great about MMA is they pit the best against the best and in boxing there's so much bullshit you know you got to see these dumb fucking fights with guys fighting people that you know they can just beat so easily definitely too many different world titles like you have three different guys who call themselves the world champion in there in the same weight class that's crazy you know there's a lot of that doesn't make any sense like yeah deciding what a world champion is and who owns the right to say world champion that their guy is or this guy is and not have them fight against each other rival promotions they don't want to get together and ink deals don't don't want to lose their superstar what if you know what if ufc had a company that was just as big as ufc because that's kind of essentially what happens in boxing you know what i mean you don't you don't talk about it in u sc because there's no one else who really can compete you know if you want to do mma you do them ufc right you know belltor's just not quite as big but like with boxing there are just all these promoters um top rank and arum and that they never cross remote you know what I mean right it really does a disservice to the sport I think well it certainly can because they know that they they have a guy who can make a lot of money and if that guy loses to somebody then they're fucked and they lose their big guy and that's the other thing I kind of hate about boxing is that if you lose one fight somehow you're tainted beyond belief do you know what I mean I don't quite understand that yeah well it's an old school way of thinking because they used to build a fighter up and get them 49 and oh and then they would fight you know right and it would be a big thing he's undefeated he's going for the title you know if a guy had 10 losses and he's going for the title everybody was like why am i even watching this that's why it's so cool to see con fight canello and to see uh you know to see um who do we just say Miguel Cotto he's another fighting postal loss hunting postal oh godani Golovkin no postal um Terrence Crawford you know what it's so great when you actually see a real fight it's yeah oh shit this is awesome yeah yeah well there's just too much talent right now and the a few divisions, like, there's some unavoidable, like, chaotic matchups.

[1304] And I think Canello and Amir Khan for as long as it last should be very interesting.

[1305] Canello's just such a bruiser, man. He's a scary puncher.

[1306] Yeah, but he's slow.

[1307] He's a little slow.

[1308] And Amir, I mean, when you see him against...

[1309] Or Mayweather.

[1310] When he fought Mayweather, he couldn't, I mean...

[1311] He couldn't even catch him.

[1312] Yeah, that's true.

[1313] But Mayweather's a motherfucker.

[1314] He's such a good boxer.

[1315] But Con is, you could argue, is this fast?

[1316] Maybe.

[1317] Well, he won't be losing as much weight, so maybe he'll be better, and maybe he'll be better because he fought that fight.

[1318] You know, I mean, a fighter doesn't stay at the same level of skill year after year.

[1319] Ideally, if they keep training and keep learning, and he's completely dedicated, he's going to be getting better and better all the time.

[1320] Confident as a champion.

[1321] I mean, that one loss to Mayweather, I think he probably learned more about what can happen to him in a fight than all those fights were beat guys down.

[1322] Yeah, I don't, I can't imagine the pressure.

[1323] pressure that Canelo is under.

[1324] I want to see Canello and Granada Golovkin.

[1325] That's the fight that I want to see.

[1326] Yeah.

[1327] I want to see what happens.

[1328] That's this two guys that don't like to take backward steps and both have ruthless power and great chins.

[1329] Yeah, I think Ganadi's a better boxer.

[1330] He's so technical.

[1331] He's so technical.

[1332] I love watching him train to video him training, just like just working head movement in the clinch for like an hour.

[1333] You know what I mean?

[1334] Just like, and then he's like teaching some kid also stop to teach somebody.

[1335] It's like he loves the sport, you can tell.

[1336] Yeah, he certainly does, but I think Canello does too.

[1337] I think Canello is, like you said, he's a little slower and he's just such a bruiser that he's got that sort of style to him, that he just loads up and bangs at guys.

[1338] But I think he's getting better, too.

[1339] I think he's slicker now that he's ever been before.

[1340] I think also a fight like Mayweather is just such a wake -up call.

[1341] You could fight a guy like Mayweather or hate him.

[1342] He's arguably one of the greatest boxers ever.

[1343] The guy retires whether or not he actually retired.

[1344] I don't think there's an argument.

[1345] It's no argument.

[1346] Yeah, he's one of the greatest.

[1347] If not the greatest.

[1348] I mean, he just doesn't get hurt.

[1349] He has the uncanny ability to make every fight he fights the most boring fight you've ever seen your life.

[1350] Incredible.

[1351] And, you know, it kind of sucks because it's hard to get your friends into boxing when it's like, check it out.

[1352] This is supposed to be the best fight of this millennium.

[1353] Yeah.

[1354] Pacquiao versus Mayweather.

[1355] And everybody's like, what the fuck?

[1356] Can we watch something else, you know?

[1357] Well, he just fights so safe and so smart.

[1358] And he's better.

[1359] he's better at fighting that style than you are dealing with that style and so when guys fight him they just can't get to him and they fall into this sort of defensive shell like eight or nine rounds in where he ends up making you look foolish and you start with swinging wildly and it's like you play right into his trap yeah it's almost it almost sucks that I want to know who he's going to fight next do you think he's going to fight again yeah yeah yeah don't think at one point in time you don't think he's going to retire maybe I haven't heard any real rumbling, so have you?

[1360] He just started flamboyantly saying he was retiring too much for me to believe it's a real retirement.

[1361] It just feels like more of his promotion.

[1362] You know what I mean?

[1363] And it's not like he stopped training.

[1364] He hasn't?

[1365] I don't think so.

[1366] He's in the gym still.

[1367] Well, you're probably right then.

[1368] Maybe he was waiting for the Manny Pachiaf fight.

[1369] Like maybe waiting to see if it generated a lot of income and if Manny was back and people loved him.

[1370] Because you've got to kind of give Manny a chance to rebound, like after the Juan Manuel Marquez fight, We got knocked out.

[1371] He had to give him a chance to take some time off, fight against Chris Algeri, look good, and then you can mark it to the fight.

[1372] Yeah.

[1373] I don't know.

[1374] That was just such a bust for me. That fight, it was just so goddamn boring.

[1375] Yeah.

[1376] And, you know, I was such a Manny Pachial fan and to see him come up with nothing.

[1377] And then have the shoulder thing afterwards, after the fact.

[1378] God, it sucked.

[1379] Well, the word was before the fight that his shoulder was fucked up.

[1380] Yeah.

[1381] People had heard about that.

[1382] It was bookies were talking about it.

[1383] So some people didn't know that his shoulder was fucked up.

[1384] Yeah, they should have postponed the fight.

[1385] Yeah, but the problem is...

[1386] Didn't they, like, some association sue him or something like that?

[1387] Well, I mean, he threw punches with it.

[1388] I mean, there was a class action lawsuit.

[1389] So the question is, was it the injury bad enough where he had to step back?

[1390] I don't know what he did.

[1391] He asked for a shot.

[1392] Cortezone shot?

[1393] Before the fight.

[1394] And they said no?

[1395] Yeah.

[1396] I should have just done it Can't ask shit like that Just do it Get a bunch of your buddies to do it I mean I just love mini pack yeah He's like mini Elvis Flying around his own jumbo jet With like a jumbo jet full of his entourage Yeah He's got a whole A whole giant posse And none of them like gay people Yeah That was such a bummer It was weird Yeah but that's all that religious stuff though man It's just heavy Catholic.

[1397] Yeah, but Catholic or not, you hate to see somebody who's so fucking blessed tear people down.

[1398] And over nothing?

[1399] I mean, I'd never pay for a mani, Pacquite, again.

[1400] Because of that?

[1401] Yeah.

[1402] Really?

[1403] Yeah.

[1404] Fuck that.

[1405] Wow.

[1406] That's interesting.

[1407] 100%.

[1408] When you get to that level and you have that much money, you should know fucking better.

[1409] Yeah.

[1410] You know what I mean?

[1411] That's disgusting what he said.

[1412] And then he said it twice.

[1413] Yeah, we tried to justify it with the Bible in God's word.

[1414] Well, I mean, he probably didn't know the reaction that he was going to get, you know?

[1415] I bet in his culture...

[1416] He said gays are less than dogs, less than animals.

[1417] Was that the exact word?

[1418] Yeah.

[1419] Um, I think he might have been misquoted.

[1420] I think, I think they tried to explain what he said based on what it says in the Bible that...

[1421] Al after the fact.

[1422] Yeah, I don't remember, but yeah, whatever it was, it was not good.

[1423] I don't know, man. I just, I don't...

[1424] It's just, he's too rich and too...

[1425] Too blessed.

[1426] To be bringing people down, persecuted people down.

[1427] It's just no good.

[1428] That cost him a lot of fucking money, man. He lost his Nike sponsorship because of that.

[1429] He'll never get my 99 and 95.

[1430] That's for sure.

[1431] Yeah.

[1432] You're not the only one, I'm sure.

[1433] It is a bummer.

[1434] I don't know that that many boxing fans actually care.

[1435] You don't think so?

[1436] I don't know.

[1437] There's got to be some boxing fans like you that are boxing fans but aren't apes.

[1438] Maybe.

[1439] For sure.

[1440] Can't be all those people watching Yeah No I mean my friends My friend bought the last fight And I kind of gave him a little shit And just because of the gay stuff Yeah I was like you do that You know it's gonna be a shitty fight anyway It's like why would you Well the poor guy He's all ate up with Jesus Yeah Yeah I just I don't know I don't know I'm not that familiar with His culture and exactly how But I know for a fact A lot of Catholics Yeah You know, the Philippines is just overwhelmed with Christianity and Catholicism.

[1441] Mm -hmm.

[1442] So he probably thought he was actually trying to save people in some strange way, you know, in his brainwashed mind.

[1443] Yeah.

[1444] I wonder how much of the negative feedback actually gets to him, though, you know?

[1445] None.

[1446] You don't think so?

[1447] No. You don't think anybody?

[1448] That's what I'm saying.

[1449] He's like Minnie Elvis.

[1450] He doesn't hear anything.

[1451] He's got, like, his shades on, 50 people on his own jumbo jet.

[1452] Who, who's going to tell him that he's an asshole?

[1453] Nobody.

[1454] That money can last.

[1455] If he keeps rolling In the Philippines?

[1456] Yeah Well, honestly He probably saves money With his own check Because they need to have to buy 50 plane tickets Maybe, right?

[1457] Maybe it's like cost effective For him to have his own jet That's an interesting way I look at him But he's so beloved in his country They probably just give him a jet You know, he's a hell of a pool player That guy's a hell of a pool player Is he?

[1458] Yeah And he's a lefty too Yeah, he plays really good He plays like at a professional level Does he?

[1459] Yeah Well, the Philippines are It's a giant place for pool the GIs brought it over there in the 50s and some of the best pool players in the world come out of the Philippines matter of fact the consensus greatest player of all time Ephrae and Reyes came out of the Philippines a magician yeah they have some of the best players and really interesting to watch them because they play like they're playing a musical instrument like a very gentle game for them it's very different it's not like stiff or hard it's a very gentle flowing yeah they're stroke they have a very particular type of stroke that other players worldwide have emulated the Filipino style of playing pool wow interesting I didn't know that yeah what what other countries are like embracing like American rock and blues music and doing a good job with it today I mean UK has always been a huge supporter France Australia they've always you know Australia I mean shit they live and live and live and die for rock and roll do they get good artists that are coming out of there today like to you, what do you, where do you see?

[1460] Yeah, Australia, there's great, great music coming out of there.

[1461] I mean, do you ever listen to Tame Impala?

[1462] No. They're from, they're from Australia.

[1463] How do you spell it?

[1464] T -A -M -E and then Impala.

[1465] Tame Impala.

[1466] Yeah, they make really cool records.

[1467] They're pretty famous now.

[1468] I would say they might even be like a festival headliner at this point.

[1469] Really?

[1470] Yeah, they're a big band and, and they're from Australian.

[1471] There's a whole scene there, kind of around that.

[1472] In the absence of radio, Like, what is the traditional method that bands get noticed now?

[1473] Like, is it just hustling and touring and work and spread?

[1474] I don't know.

[1475] I have no idea.

[1476] You just do your shit.

[1477] I have no fucking idea.

[1478] I just had an 85 -year -old gospel singer from Mississippi in my studio last week, and that's all I was thinking about.

[1479] You know what I mean?

[1480] It's like, I have no idea what goes on in the music business.

[1481] I really don't.

[1482] What was the gospel singer's name?

[1483] His name is Leo Bud Welch.

[1484] Wow.

[1485] Oh, yeah.

[1486] So cool.

[1487] what did you have them do play music man what like we did a record with him i had some of my friends in and we uh we just sort of like would let him start a song and try to try to you know get him where we fit in wow yeah and we did a whole record in three days with him and then you know it's just like that's incredible yeah yeah he was he's incredible great he like plays guitar and sings and and he's very frail and kind of hunched over, but he keeps perfect time.

[1488] Like, we could record him by himself, and then you could just watch him on a, like, with the BPM, and he'll just write on it, man. It's wild.

[1489] A lifetime of doing it, you know?

[1490] There's something about old gospel and old blues.

[1491] There's like, there's a sound to like a lot of the old South that there's this inescapable, soulful sound, you know there's some there's some old blues like to this day like some john lee hooker like boom boom boom like you listen to like wow like this is just such a special kind of sound and it's instantaneous and you don't have to know anything about it to love it yeah which is so cool and it took the world by storm i mean john lee hooker was really influential in africa like his records went over there and people like ali farcatura he was like one of the greatest african guitar players heard his records and like inspired him you know i mean yeah it's just that there's something about it that's like some of those guys it's just undeniably awesome and you don't really know how to describe it there's like the ingredients are so minimal yeah everybody else had a guitar why didn't they make it sound like that too you know what i mean well it seems like there was a bunch of different things going on it was the the audience that had been exposed to a lot of other great music and they appreciated it there was like the experience of the people that were performing it the life experience that they had behind the words they had lived like sorrowful times and expressed it legitimately and and truly in the music right but it was also just where they're from who they yeah it's who it's who they are it's not even like that their maybe their lives were so bad it's just like again it's like it's just such a part of who they were they would never be able to explain it right you know what I mean?

[1492] right and they can never teach a course on blues and uh at harvard you know you have to live it right and you'd have to experience that vibe from another musician to know that it's possible for someone to do it right i don't know i mean i there's only so much you can learn from people right you know at a certain point you have to understand that what makes them special is because it's them it comes out of them you can't learn that you can't really take it but what you can take is the feeling of they have their own identity, and you've got to find that in yourself.

[1493] That's the thing that you want to ultimately get.

[1494] You know what I mean?

[1495] You want to be influenced by all these people, but the main influence that I think you should learn from the greats are that you have to find it in yourself.

[1496] You know, you can't rely on it to anybody else.

[1497] And I think to see it in someone else gives you that inspiration to try to find it in yourself.

[1498] I used to search for it just constantly.

[1499] I mean, I'd be at the library, getting out VHS videos and just watching.

[1500] rewinding watching and then I would drive 19 hours from Akron to Mississippi just to like maybe find a musician who I heard lived in some town you know what I mean just because I wanted to see it you know and and when I find when I found it shit is life changing man I mean I was like 17 and I went to Greenville Mississippi and I just started asking around for this musician name his name was team model Ford and he made some really cool team model Ford yeah he was total badass he played a death metal guitar really a pv yeah and it said with like the letters you put on a mailbox it's like said team ought to for the tail dragger and he had it spray painted on his trailer that he pulled around with his Lincoln and I you know just going there I would never want to just like become that person right but whether they're from Mississippi or they're like a classical composer from Germany there's a thing that these all these guys have in comment and it's like a sense of self you know what i mean anybody i've ever met has a real just a confidence that you know even though they may not be the best at certain things they can like bring out the best in themselves you know and that and that's like enough do you know what i mean i definitely know what you mean i know what you mean yeah i know exactly what you mean you described it very well that that's a great way of putting it is it like the seeing it in other people recognizing it in other people and trying to find it in yourself And that seeing it in other people means you know that it's real.

[1501] The thing that inspires you.

[1502] Yes.

[1503] Yes.

[1504] And you see somebody like T -Moddle or any of these guys, you know, they didn't have any extra thing.

[1505] They didn't have anything like any like advantage, really.

[1506] You know what I mean?

[1507] It was a struggle just like it is for anybody, you know?

[1508] But they found it in themselves, I guess.

[1509] Well, that's all any artist he'd ever.

[1510] hope for.

[1511] That's the number one aspiration.

[1512] Find out whatever is the best part of you, right?

[1513] How do you get your best stuff out there?

[1514] I mean, I'm still trying.

[1515] I mean, I think that for me, I just don't want to ever be too critical, too self -critical.

[1516] I want it to be, I want to try to, like, have it on the record, like, in the first couple takes.

[1517] So it feels, for me, it'll feel a bit more real, a bit more genuine.

[1518] Do you know what I mean?

[1519] I think.

[1520] I that's really helpful to a record some of my favorite records whether they're hip hop or whether they're rock and roll or whatever they're made usually generally made pretty quickly big grand masterpieces that were labored over i don't tend to listen to that much i'll listen to it and it'll be maybe i'll hear something sonically that oh that's cool that they did that but then like at the end of the day i always go and put on that one record that that one guy did in a day you know That's the one I always want to live with.

[1521] That's my desert island shit, you know.

[1522] My desert island shit.

[1523] Well, listen, man, thank you very much for doing this.

[1524] I really appreciate you coming in here.

[1525] And I appreciate what you do, too.

[1526] I really do.

[1527] For me, I'm geeked out as a fan.

[1528] I'm super psyched.

[1529] And to get you to talk about your creative process like that, it's just giant for me. So if people want to get your music, the arcs, you guys, what do you have out that's out right now?

[1530] we have a record called yours dreamily and that's available at all the local record shops that don't exist anymore iTunes all that stuff everywhere beautiful all right thanks brother appreciate you being here man thank you that's it for the week fuckers see you next week thanks everybody bye