162 - Prom Queen City

[0] This is exactly right.

[1] Hey, this is exciting.

[2] An all -new season of only murders in the building is coming to Hulu on August 27th.

[3] Steve Martin, Martin Short, and Selena Gomez are back as your favorite podcaster, detectives.

[4] But there's a mystery hanging over everyone.

[5] Who killed Saz?

[6] And were they really after Charles?

[7] Why would someone want to kill Charles?

[8] This season, murder hits close to home.

[9] With a threat against one of their own, the stakes are higher than ever.

[10] Plus, the gang is going to Hollywood to turn their podcast into a major movie.

[11] Amid the glitz and glamour of Los Angeles, more mysteries and twists arise.

[12] Who knows what will happen once the cameras start to roll?

[13] Get ready for the stariest season yet with Merrill Streep, Zach Alfinacus, Eugene Levy, Eva Longoria, Melissa McCarthy, DeVine, Joy Randolph, Molly Shannon, and more.

[14] Only Murders in the Building, premieres August 27th, streaming only on Hulu.

[15] Goodbye.

[16] Hello.

[17] And welcome to my favorite murder.

[18] This week's episode, we'll focus mostly on.

[19] The positive.

[20] Why, really?

[21] You didn't tell me that was the rule.

[22] We did not have a meeting about this before.

[23] I hate it.

[24] I think it's the worst.

[25] We're off to a great start.

[26] Here we go.

[27] That's Karen Kilkara.

[28] That's Georgia Hardstark.

[29] The positive of us, positive person in Positivov.

[30] I am the positivist and always have been.

[31] I'm a positive activist.

[32] Oh, a Pactivist.

[33] A pos activist.

[34] A pos activist.

[35] What do you do?

[36] Do you like mostly March or?

[37] I take a now.

[38] because there's no way to be positive when you're conscious.

[39] So you just, right.

[40] Conscience.

[41] Conscious.

[42] Conscious.

[43] So my conscience goes away.

[44] Escapes from this hideous reality.

[45] And then it's just neutralville.

[46] Nice.

[47] That's great.

[48] How are you?

[49] I like to make signs.

[50] Like sign language or like gang signs?

[51] No. Oh.

[52] You know, I glue a piece of paper on a piece of wood and then it'll say a positive activism.

[53] I bet it's, is it a funny pun?

[54] You know, I love puns.

[55] So usually I will go with a pun first.

[56] Good.

[57] So it's like eggs, excuse me. Right, but like eggs.

[58] Always egg based ton.

[59] Don't touch my yeah.

[60] Lego my egg.

[61] Lego my egg.

[62] That's actually be funny.

[63] For like a Planned Parenthood.

[64] Pro Pan, Planned Parenthood.

[65] But the waffles are breast shaped and featured.

[66] I love it.

[67] Sonny side up eggs on it?

[68] Oh, my eggs.

[69] Oh, no. Like, oh, no. We're spithalling.

[70] 2019 and we still don't have rights.

[71] What?

[72] Is it 2019 and we still don't know how to intro a podcast?

[73] I feel personally, like now I resist logic when we do this.

[74] I resist ever having it be clean and clear.

[75] I want to drive new listeners away.

[76] This isn't the podcast, uh, the dropout.

[77] This isn't the dropout.

[78] This isn't the dropout.

[79] isn't fucking the podcast of news time.

[80] Yeah, because, and you know why is because you don't hear light typing in the background, which is how you know you're on NPR.

[81] We have no music budget.

[82] No. We have no journalism skills to speak of.

[83] I feel like Stephen would be happy to bust out that keyboard and play some more of his electronica.

[84] Some tones in the background.

[85] Yeah, his, uh, what is it called thrash garage?

[86] What's Stephen's brand of music?

[87] That's it.

[88] It's mustache thrash.

[89] Must, thrash.

[90] No, that sounds like a mold problem, a bacteria problem.

[91] It is.

[92] He's got mustache thrash.

[93] Oh, have you heard about Stephen's thrash?

[94] Stephen King of coming to work.

[95] Head to toe thrash.

[96] But it's heaviest on his mustache.

[97] It turned his mustache red.

[98] Guys, we're back in the studio.

[99] Yeah, that's right.

[100] We're in the midst of our fucking insane winterfall tour.

[101] We're having so much fun.

[102] It's the fucking best.

[103] I think our next one is in Vegas.

[104] Yes.

[105] Which is really exciting.

[106] Marty is going to be there.

[107] for some reason my dad wants to come my sister nadrine are coming oh like i think everybody wants to come sure it's Vegas it's fucking Vegas baby buffalo everyone's gonna be playing those buffalo machines georgia's already talked about what buffalo machine she would like to have reserved for her double down can you do that double down on a machine i'm doing i'm gonna be the one who sits between two machines and i'm playing it feed it give your money away chain smoking just make sure you always feel lucky let's see what what is my game wheel four No. Oh, best.

[108] Willy Wonka.

[109] That's my game.

[110] I like Will of Fortune, too.

[111] Will Fortune is a classic.

[112] Anything that you can win a spin on a game thing?

[113] Yes.

[114] Great.

[115] And it's, um, anything where you, it feels like you're, uh, actually interplaying with the machine, even though that thing's spinning and whatever comes up is going to come up.

[116] You don't know where it's going to stop on the.

[117] Yes, you do.

[118] And you're like, Bing, Bing, Bing.

[119] Yeah.

[120] You're stupid.

[121] Yeah.

[122] Give us.

[123] Get rid of all your money.

[124] Give us your money.

[125] That's why you, yeah.

[126] It's going to be fine, everyone.

[127] Yeah.

[128] Ultimately.

[129] Ultimately, and later on, it's going to be fine.

[130] Sure.

[131] You're going to learn a lesson.

[132] Oh.

[133] In the meantime, gamble your money away.

[134] Get drunk and gamble.

[135] Get as many free drinks as you can on the floor.

[136] Marty, what's Marty going to do in Vegas?

[137] Oh, I don't know.

[138] Maybe camp outside.

[139] Oh, I took 320s out of the bank and I will, he'll use them throughout the night.

[140] He's going to camp in the garage.

[141] There's a nice bathroom where you can take a shower.

[142] Does Marty smoke a cigar?

[143] like celebratorily?

[144] Does he drink?

[145] How does Marty?

[146] Marty will have a drink once in a while.

[147] Oh, we did.

[148] So the night before we left for this last weekend tour and he was going to stay the weekend and watch the cats.

[149] So he came over the night before because dads can't drive at certain hours.

[150] Right.

[151] That's right.

[152] Yeah.

[153] So he was supposed to, you know, we were leaving.

[154] Is he night blind?

[155] He's blind.

[156] No, he just, he's colorblind.

[157] Okay.

[158] He's just, they just, he's very OCD, like literally and what's the, figuratively?

[159] Literally.

[160] Yeah.

[161] And so, whatever.

[162] He just came over early and we got drunk together.

[163] Oh, nice.

[164] That's the end of the story.

[165] We just drank a bunch of rosé and yelled about Israel and watched a Vietnam documentary by Ken Burns, which I highly recommend.

[166] We just haven't kept, keep pausing it to yell about shit.

[167] And then we'd watch it again.

[168] Yeah.

[169] And Vince was just watching us being like, oh, no. What did I marry into?

[170] That was great.

[171] So that's how Marty Party is a documentary.

[172] A little Vino.

[173] Some nice rosé.

[174] Yeah.

[175] I like it.

[176] That's right.

[177] Oh, I have a correction.

[178] Let's hear it.

[179] That's more of a, yeah, it's a correction from a couple weeks ago.

[180] I just want to make everyone know that the to -da list that I talked about instead of making a to -do list or including a to -do list, you know, just so you have it.

[181] Not just like things I need to do, but like things I fucking accomplished.

[182] Sure.

[183] An accomplishment list.

[184] Yeah, like an angry accomplishment list.

[185] Yeah, a fuck you accomplishment list.

[186] Fuck you to your to do list.

[187] Yeah.

[188] This is essentially what it is.

[189] Always.

[190] And I wanted to.

[191] say that it was created by Gretchen Rubin, who's this incredible author.

[192] She wrote The Happiness Project, we all heard of it.

[193] And The Four Tendencies, Lizzie Cuberman loves her.

[194] She also has a podcast called Happier, which I now need to listen to.

[195] But that was her idea, and I could, I maybe said it was Gail, but it wasn't.

[196] Gail from Gail and Oprah?

[197] Yeah.

[198] Oh.

[199] But it wasn't.

[200] Good.

[201] Oh, you're just sourcing.

[202] Yeah, I just want to make sure that I give her credit.

[203] So that's who, the to -da list.

[204] The Tadda list was written by Gretchen.

[205] Ruben.

[206] Ruben.

[207] Awesome.

[208] Thank you, Gretchen.

[209] Thank you, Gretchen, for your great ideas.

[210] Because that is a really smart way to flip that around.

[211] Because it is like, I have so many to -do lists around my house.

[212] And I never do any of the things on them.

[213] And then I get, then I, when I do do things on them, then I'm like, oh, I'm not crossing that off.

[214] Yeah.

[215] Because it's not all the way.

[216] I'll do like, I'll have a shitty thing that's like, make an appointment and then go get this thing.

[217] And it's like, well, I made the appointment.

[218] I don't really want to go get the thing.

[219] It all gets really depressing.

[220] Oh, why is life hard?

[221] So instead of that negative being attenuated, I don't even know what that word means.

[222] Here we go.

[223] Steven, could you please look up what attenuated means?

[224] You just made it up, I think.

[225] I don't know.

[226] But instead of being acclimated, that's probably not it either.

[227] There it is, too.

[228] It has to start with an A and be really long.

[229] Instead of being aligned with negativity.

[230] Dossile or just being negative.

[231] Oh, it does mean something.

[232] Attenuated.

[233] having been reduced in force, effect, or value in a sentence, it appears likely that the courts will be given an in tenuated role in the enforcement of these decisions.

[234] Totally incorrect.

[235] It's correct.

[236] It's not.

[237] Oh, are you trying to be positive?

[238] I disagree.

[239] I was going to say, uh, corrections corner and heard from a lot of Scots about this one.

[240] I, in talking about head butts.

[241] Guys named Scott are just texting you know?

[242] Luckily no. Um, just, uh, Scottish people.

[243] people letting me know that my little riff, because I couldn't think of the real nickname for headbutts, so I called it a Belfast Good Morning and just acted like that was the real name.

[244] But it actually, what I was really thinking of and what everyone knew I was thinking of without me knowing it was, it's called a Glasgow kiss.

[245] Oh, what's a Belfast Good Morning?

[246] I made it up.

[247] Okay, because that's great, because I, A, didn't know what the fuck you were talking about, thought you made it up and it's like, that was beautiful and incredible.

[248] Totally made up.

[249] Okay.

[250] All right.

[251] But I mean, I knew it was, I knew it was called something like that.

[252] That's, I like, listen, sorry Scottish people, and people name Scott.

[253] I like yours better.

[254] Careful, careful.

[255] They will fucking headbut you so quickly.

[256] My favorite thing when I, I lived in Scotland for a short amount of time when I was on the television show, the book group.

[257] And my friend Michelle Gomez, who is from Glasgow, told me all about the kind of culture there.

[258] And one of my favorite things was when on the weekends, when people go out, Oftentimes, women don't wear coats, even though it's freezing, fucking cold and they're wearing like a tube dress, because they want to seem hard.

[259] They want to seem tough.

[260] So you don't wear a coat.

[261] Okay.

[262] And that, like, is such a great example of what Scottish people are like.

[263] What if I want to seem soft and tender and I wear six coats?

[264] You'll be beaten within an inch of your life in Glasgow, Scotland.

[265] By a 12 -year -old girl.

[266] It's just my favorite because people party really hard there, and they also were just like, And then you walk home in the cold and you like keep on partying.

[267] Like you never, you never quit.

[268] So it's like your 20s all the time there.

[269] Well, I think mostly when you're in your 20s though.

[270] Okay.

[271] It wasn't like the old people weren't really doing it.

[272] Okay.

[273] It wasn't like a lady in a tube talk.

[274] No, it was all the youngs.

[275] I want to give a shout out to the new animated MFM episode.

[276] It's MFM underscore animated on Instagram.

[277] By Nick Terry.

[278] Yeah, and it's on YouTube as well.

[279] He made a. animation of the 400 -year -old sharp conversation that we had that is just so clever I want to punch people in the Nick?

[280] Do you want to punch Nick?

[281] I want to punch people named Scott.

[282] Bring him back into it.

[283] I want to punch Scots.

[284] My friend Patty Riley texted me the other day because she had the Nick Terry shirt and she said that walking down the street, she said when her arm was in a sling, no one ever said a word to her, but walking down the street with the Nick Terry sweatshirt, People constantly stopping her and saying, oh, my God, are you a murdering no one recognizing it?

[285] What I love about him is that he, so he's now selling merch with his characters from our conversations on it.

[286] And he messaged me. Put into the conversations.

[287] But he messaged me and was like, hey, I just want to make sure this is okay.

[288] Like this, you know, it is still your thing.

[289] And I just want your blessing.

[290] And if you're not okay with it, that's fine, whatever the fuck.

[291] And I was like, make that fucking money.

[292] God bless.

[293] It's like, that's how you do it.

[294] And we're like so happy for you.

[295] I should have said no and bought all the rights to it.

[296] But that's just me being a merchandiser.

[297] That'd be a little aggressive.

[298] That's a little hard start of me. Yeah, that would have ruined the fun, I think.

[299] But I'm so happy for him.

[300] I know, and how much.

[301] Well, he's just doing such good work.

[302] I mean, it's incredible.

[303] He nails it every single time.

[304] It's hilarious.

[305] But I can't tell if that's because I'm in it.

[306] And so I just love it.

[307] Of course it is.

[308] Of course it is.

[309] Also, another person who's nailed it lately, truly my favorite is taft in the bathtub.

[310] Oh, yeah.

[311] Someone named Adrian Kelt, I think, C -E -L -T, retweeted it, and it was their drawing of Taft in the bathtub.

[312] President Taft in the bathtub from the Lincoln story you did in Washington, D .C. I mean, I've no, that's also the funniest thing is these things come up and you're like, when did I fucking say that?

[313] When did we say anything?

[314] Remember when you said this?

[315] No. Yeah.

[316] But apparently what I said was, ooh, Taft.

[317] Yeah.

[318] And then it was Taft in the bathtub.

[319] It's a beautiful art piece.

[320] Please look it up.

[321] When we were in Toronto, you say Toronto or Toronto?

[322] I say Toronto.

[323] Toronto, I think is correct.

[324] Okay.

[325] Well, so this gal came through the line with these perfectly packaged for the meet and greet.

[326] These like packages wrapped in brown paper and fucking string and it was like adorable.

[327] Oh, yes.

[328] And she's like, I made you guys dresses.

[329] I'm a designer.

[330] And we looked, open them later and they're gorgeous.

[331] And so last night I went to a fucking fancy Hollywood movie and I wore it.

[332] Her name's Sarah Duke.

[333] and it fit me so perfectly.

[334] I felt like a ballerina from the waist down.

[335] And then it was like slit in the back.

[336] So my whole back was showing all sexy.

[337] You could turn it around, but I have no cleavage.

[338] So what's the point?

[339] It was just this gorgeous fucking dress that fit me perfectly.

[340] And like, I just want to buy everything from her.

[341] So her name on Instagram is Sarah and it's S -A -N -O -H.

[342] Sarah, Sarah Duke.

[343] And she's a Canadian fucking clothing designer.

[344] And she's incredible.

[345] Yeah, that's so awesome.

[346] I, like, it's the perfect fit, everything about it.

[347] I love.

[348] And she really did.

[349] Go ahead.

[350] Sorry.

[351] No, no. It has pockets.

[352] Both our dresses have pockets.

[353] She made sure to tell us that.

[354] I apologize.

[355] No, no. I was only going back over your thing because the packages were wrapped.

[356] Gorgeous.

[357] It looked like it was from Victorian England.

[358] Like it was black wrapping paper and then there was gold and then there was like a little thread.

[359] See, I remember it as piece.

[360] Is it brown wrapping paper with black?

[361] I could be 100 % wrong.

[362] Well, the color combo was black and brown.

[363] It's very intense.

[364] Those nights.

[365] Don't, listen, look, don't, there's a, I have a photo of my, not so fucking, I have a photo of myself up on my Instagram of me wearing it, but I was too, because it's a red carpet and I get, it's terrifying.

[366] And so I didn't put my hands in the pockets, which I totally did in front of the mirror.

[367] That's what happens.

[368] You don't know where to put your hands.

[369] That's why we have pockets.

[370] That's right.

[371] And, which I will then mention, God bless Broad Church's Olivia Coleman, who won best actress at the Oscars, her dress had pockets.

[372] Amazing.

[373] And that was tweeted to us.

[374] That Mitchell and Webb look.

[375] Is that the show called?

[376] No, it's peep show was what she was on.

[377] But same guys.

[378] She was on peep show.

[379] She was so good in it.

[380] It's so fun to see her win shit.

[381] She's awesome.

[382] Because also she has been consistently killing it in England for like 20 years.

[383] And she's been on a ton of great shit.

[384] I first got to know her on Look Around You, which is one of my favorite things that's ever existed.

[385] I don't know it.

[386] You have to watch it.

[387] It's like a thing.

[388] fake 70s in studio like PBS type of show.

[389] But it's everything's fake.

[390] So there's one where she introduces a thing that's a computer for women called the Betty Coat V. Sorry.

[391] It's a pink and white laptop or desktop computer.

[392] And then there's when they show like the keyboard, there's a nail file on the keyboard.

[393] You have to see the show.

[394] What's it called again?

[395] It's called Look Around You.

[396] Okay, maybe we can find it on YouTube.

[397] I'm not sure.

[398] Sure.

[399] The first season is all, um, it's like 70s, uh, tapes that they would put in at school when the teacher needed to go like smoke a cigarette, smoke in the alley, basically.

[400] But then the second season is this in studio where they have, um, uh, Robert Popper and Olivia Coleman and Peter Sarah Finowitz and they all host it, but it's, and it's taken very seriously, but everything is like, like the petticoat five.

[401] I love it.

[402] It's amazing.

[403] But we're, I'm so proud of you, Coleman.

[404] I'm so, and it's, the favorite is the best movie.

[405] And she has pockets in her dress.

[406] And she's representing.

[407] Okay, but more so, not more so, but closer to home.

[408] And in addition to.

[409] And as well as.

[410] Scott, stop fucking trying to put words at our mouth.

[411] Don't actually me right now.

[412] I'll say what this next.

[413] Don't Scott's blame me. It is.

[414] Our friend of the podcast, friend of the network, friend of the universe that we live in.

[415] Billy Jensen.

[416] yeah has his book coming out hell yeah so you can pre -order it today the book is called chase darkness with me i wrote the foreword yeah you did oh yeah it's about four paragraphs long um but it is i've read the book and it's what's it about right which one's it about what's it about it's basically about everything he's done like how into true crime he is in why yes and where how he got to start and what it's from and then also then these cases that he has come up against and it's just it gives you everything that a murderer would want in a book.

[417] It's really, really good.

[418] I still, and I must have listened to it 12 times through, listen to Albi Gone in the Dark while falling asleep at night, which is so twisted and fucked up, but that's just the most comforting thing to me. Yes.

[419] And when she helped write or helped finish.

[420] That's right.

[421] Billy Jensen basically came in after Michelle McNamara died and helped Patton finish her book using all of her notes and all of her writing.

[422] Along with Paul Haynes.

[423] Right.

[424] Who was her researcher.

[425] So, yeah, it's, now this is his book.

[426] And please go get it.

[427] You will be so happy that you did.

[428] I'm so excited.

[429] He looks like a goth fucking anime character.

[430] That's nothing to do with anything, but it just helps.

[431] You know what's funny?

[432] In the foreword, I mentioned the first time we met him when he came up to us at that restaurant next to the UCB on Franklin.

[433] Oh, yeah.

[434] And he came up, like, just talking already.

[435] He was like, we're friends and here we go.

[436] Here we go.

[437] with this journalist intensity, where I was like, he's mad.

[438] Like, we did something wrong.

[439] And I was so nervous to, like, when he started talking, because I was like, I don't know whatever date or time you're about to mention.

[440] Yeah.

[441] I don't know what the correct one is.

[442] We don't know what the correct one is.

[443] We don't know that about us yet.

[444] Yeah, no, that's your area.

[445] Yeah.

[446] You get the facts right.

[447] We treat your facts like gossip and talk about it.

[448] We have to give it, speaking of gossip and talking about it.

[449] We have to give a quick shout out, not have to, but want to, because simply safe, which we do ads for all the time.

[450] and everything.

[451] This is not like an overt ad.

[452] This is us thanking them because we have this brand new office.

[453] We're going to be recording here all the time.

[454] We're going to make it our fucking podcast home and a lot of other podcasts that we're eventually going to announce on our network.

[455] Exactly right.

[456] And Simply Safe fucking sent us a whole bundle of everything for fucking free just of security shit for the office.

[457] Yeah.

[458] So we have a security system now for our office because of SimplySafe.

[459] So we want to thank them and thank them for being like with our show.

[460] So long, they've been advertising on the show for a long time.

[461] I mean, honestly, like, those, those ones that you've been hearing forever on those ads for podcasts, I kind of, like, love them because, like, nobody fucking knows and no one believes in podcasts, except for these fucking companies that have been advertising with them for so long.

[462] Thank you, Casper.

[463] Thank you.

[464] You know what I will say.

[465] And I don't know, this is really funny because I was really touched.

[466] I opened a box at my house the other day, and I got a new quip toothbrush.

[467] Oh, shit.

[468] Because remember I said I left my quip toothbrush and.

[469] DC.

[470] And I was like so touched.

[471] Like they heard it and they sent it.

[472] But then I remembered you're on automatic renewal for those things.

[473] Nobody listen.

[474] Nobody cares.

[475] It's either, and this is how it always says with me, either quip is in love with me or quips doesn't give a shit.

[476] Right.

[477] But I'm going to choose because it's the positivity train.

[478] Yeah.

[479] I'm going to choose that quip loves me. Because this episode is all about positive sharding.

[480] I'm sharding.

[481] What'd you say?

[482] I just didn't want to say thinking.

[483] I refuse.

[484] Because there's no power behind it.

[485] This isn't the secret.

[486] Just don't be a dick and do good things.

[487] Yeah, that's right.

[488] And listen.

[489] There's no secret.

[490] There is no secret.

[491] Don't be a fucking asshole.

[492] Yeah, or as my hilarious comedian Bill Dwyer used to say, if it feels wrong, don't do it.

[493] It's that simple.

[494] If you'd be mad that someone else did it to you, don't do it to them.

[495] Don't do it.

[496] it's very simple now here's what you can do okay uh McKenzie sent us a picture of her grandpa sleeping in his onion field that I retweeted it she had tweeted it and then she was on our Instagram it's on our Instagram my favorite murder I think it went it went across all social media I got tagged in that more than I've been tagged in everything and thank you I love it it it's the best and the second picture of her grandpa laying in the field is high art it I want someone to paint that it is a gorgeous thing yeah it's an old man sleeping in his own it's amazing in his own onion field as a champion napper I still can't wrap my head around how he did that why you pick a place to lay down and go to sleep it I can tell you as a farm person I'll call myself a farm girl he got shitfaced and passed out could be that that's always possible but also when you're kind of out in the middle of anywhere and you have something to do and you're going to be doing it all day long it's like repetitive work and you realize you can just kind of do whatever you want no one's out there with you you don't have to you're not under the lash of society the concept is foreign to me it's and the earth is very warm when you lay on it often as someone from literally from southern california except for a three -year stint in san francisco open space and not being near people is i don't even get it i know so congratulations we have to go to like um Montana.

[497] We have to go to like a horse.

[498] Don't promise them.

[499] Let's go to therapy horse ranch.

[500] That'd be fun.

[501] Let's do it.

[502] I want to meet a horse.

[503] I know.

[504] They're the best.

[505] I want to meet an elephant.

[506] Excuse me. That sounded stupid.

[507] You were just taking that.

[508] You were taking my idea and being like, but actually, no one on animals I want to meet?

[509] We're going to meet huge animals.

[510] I just want to meet animals.

[511] I'm going to be honest.

[512] And that got me really excited.

[513] I want to meet horses and elephants.

[514] Those are my two friends.

[515] Those are two good ones.

[516] Yeah, I support both of those.

[517] Yeah, I'm good with just horses and then going home and watching TV.

[518] I want to bathe an elephant.

[519] You know, you're not supposed to ride them anymore.

[520] That makes sense.

[521] You're not, this is our new thing.

[522] There's like elephant ours.

[523] I don't know who the fuck I am.

[524] This is our new thing.

[525] I don't know who I am.

[526] There's like elephant sanctuaries in Thailand and should I follow them on Instagram?

[527] And like the thing now is like they, you don't ride elephants.

[528] That's like, that's fucking cruel and shit.

[529] And now you just, they let you.

[530] bathe them.

[531] Oh, great.

[532] And they're in the fucking water and they're like, yeah, bitch.

[533] Yeah.

[534] You bathe me for once.

[535] That's right.

[536] Sik of spring stuff on you.

[537] Stomp the shit out of you.

[538] That's pretty great.

[539] Go on Instagram and find them.

[540] It's like, I love watching elephant videos.

[541] That's the best.

[542] If I could have anything in my like ideal elephant world, it would be that like Aquaman, I could breathe underwater and then just look at fish all day.

[543] Because that's my, Blue Planet 2 came out.

[544] We were talking about it the other night.

[545] And it's so good.

[546] And it's so amazing.

[547] Like to be able to watch those animals so closely.

[548] Those are aliens.

[549] They're crazed.

[550] They're fucking like what is even happening?

[551] If you don't believe in aliens, put your face underwater.

[552] Get out of here because.

[553] I mean, no. Yeah.

[554] Yeah.

[555] I mean, I mean, I don't mean, kill yourself.

[556] I mean, go look at fish.

[557] What do you get a, would you ever get, would you ever be a fish tank person?

[558] A fish tank person?

[559] Yeah.

[560] Like a big fucking saltwater built into the wall.

[561] That one, what's that TV?

[562] show where they build fish tanks.

[563] It's called fish tanks.

[564] It's called tank.

[565] I swear to go.

[566] Oh, I believe you.

[567] It's the best.

[568] I was about to say, it's some terrible pun.

[569] And I was like, well, real quick.

[570] Right here.

[571] I would never a fish tank because mine would immediately have like the green mold on the glass.

[572] This is why you hire someone to come take care of it.

[573] Yeah, okay.

[574] But then what?

[575] Just so I can look at a thing?

[576] How about a poster?

[577] What about a great, one of those magic eye posters of three dolphins coming out of the ocean?

[578] I'm going to get you for your next birthday, an annual pass to some kind of aquarium.

[579] Great.

[580] Okay.

[581] I'll go there.

[582] Great.

[583] There is the, um, the aquarium that's, I think it's long beach has like the best one.

[584] There is a little fish there that has arms and it holds itself between rocks and it looks all like like a punk.

[585] Like it's like this mean little fish that just sits in there and I'm like me, for real.

[586] I looked at it for so long because it's like basically evolving.

[587] It's this next level where it's like fins are now arms.

[588] Your brain was just like, goodbye.

[589] Sometimes I do that with seals and fucking pit bulls.

[590] Oh, yes.

[591] It's the same creature.

[592] I think cats and seals are very similar.

[593] Huh.

[594] I think you're wrong, but I love you.

[595] But I'm being positive about it.

[596] But I love you.

[597] But what about the whiskers?

[598] Fucking dogs have whiskers.

[599] Am I wrong?

[600] Yes.

[601] Yeah, I'm fucking right.

[602] You know I'm right.

[603] You know it.

[604] I am drinking neat.

[605] warm tequila.

[606] Yes, you are.

[607] Not on purpose, but because this office is not equipped with anything yet.

[608] We're very bare bones here.

[609] That's right.

[610] It's cool.

[611] It's very like college.

[612] It feels college -y.

[613] It feels like we need to put the Boys Don't Cry Cure poster on one of these walls.

[614] Very bright.

[615] If any lamp companies want to sponsor us, any light bulb companies.

[616] Any forgiving lamp companies.

[617] Oh, that'd be great.

[618] And any ice cube companies.

[619] Yeah.

[620] No fluorescent lights.

[621] Like middle -aged lady lighting company.

[622] come on come at me and ice cubes and mixers and mixers yeah hey Sprite yeah what's up who's first um I think it's you right who was first last night of Toronto yeah yeah Toronto yeah Toronto was me yeah no no it was her okay sorry yes great because this fucking tequila neat ain't gonna drink himself Karen you know I'm all about vintage shopping absolutely and when you say vintage you mean when you physically drive to a store and actually purchase something with cash.

[623] Exactly.

[624] And if you're a small business owner, you might know Shopify is great for online sales.

[625] But did you know that they also power in -person sales?

[626] That's right.

[627] Shopify is the sound of selling everywhere, online, in store, on social media, and beyond.

[628] Give your point -of -sale system a serious upgrade with Shopify.

[629] From accepting payments to managing inventory, they have everything you need to sell in person.

[630] So give your point -of -sale system a serious upgrade with Shopify.

[631] They're sleek, reliable POS hardware takes every major payment method and looks fabulous at the same time.

[632] With Shopify, we have a powerful partner for managing our sales, and if you're a business owner, you can too.

[633] Connect with customers in line and online.

[634] Do retail right with Shopify.

[635] Sign up for a $1 per month trial period at Shopify .com slash murder.

[636] Important note, that promo code is all lowercase.

[637] Go to Shopify .com slash murder to take your retail business to the next level today.

[638] That's Shopify .com slash murder.

[639] Goodbye.

[640] Hey, this is exciting.

[641] An all -new season of only murders in the building is coming to Hulu on August 27th.

[642] Steve Martin, Martin Short, and Selena Gomez are back as your favorite podcaster, detectives.

[643] But there's a mystery hanging over everyone.

[644] Who killed Saz?

[645] And were they really after Charles?

[646] Why would someone want to kill Charles?

[647] This season, murder hits close to home.

[648] With a threat against one of their own, the stakes are higher than ever.

[649] Plus, the gang is going to Hollywood to turn their podcast into a major movie.

[650] Amid the glitz and glamour of Los Angeles, more mysteries, And twists arise.

[651] Who knows what will happen once the cameras start to roll?

[652] Get ready for the stariest season yet with Merrill Streep, Zach Alfenakis, Eugene Levy, Eva Longoria, Melissa McCarthy, Devine, Joy Randolph, Molly Shannon, and more.

[653] Only Martyrs in the building, premieres August 27th, streaming only on Hulu.

[654] Goodbye.

[655] Did you sign that fish I was back to?

[656] Oh.

[657] Oh, you have to post him.

[658] Oh, yeah.

[659] So it's, was it the axi -o -o -o -o -o.

[660] Is that, is that that thing?

[661] Oh, no. But there's a gif of one of those playing a keyboard.

[662] Shit, it's a keyboard fish.

[663] That's, that's, that's hilarious.

[664] Can you please send me that?

[665] Put that on Instagram.

[666] He'll put it on the Instagram tomorrow when we post our visuals.

[667] The one I'm talking about is not so salamandry.

[668] It actually looks more like a fish.

[669] But it's really got, it's got a bunch of bumps all over it.

[670] Huh.

[671] Oh, we're creepy.

[672] It's so creepy.

[673] It is very creepy.

[674] Can I start now Positive positivity Can I start now?

[675] Sure!

[676] All right So my story is a bit Okay, this is a harsh one But it's a bit of a corrections corner Okay Because at one time in our podcast life I don't know when We said that like date skateboarders They don't kill people Oh Do you remember saying that?

[677] I don't I bet I did But we, not you but one of us did So this is the fucking correction of that Oh no This is the murder of Jessica Burr by Mark Gator Raghowski.

[678] Uh -oh.

[679] Yeah.

[680] I know.

[681] So I got a lot of info from this fucking documentary I saw a couple years ago and was so affected by, had no idea about any of this called Stoke, the rise and fall of Gator.

[682] And it's by this woman Helen Stickler, who spent six fucking years making this documentary.

[683] Wow.

[684] And also an article called Free Fallen by Corey Johnson that was originally in the Village Voice.

[685] So to really understand the rise and fall.

[686] of gator.

[687] That's the skateboarder.

[688] I'm going to call him that now.

[689] Okay.

[690] You have to understand the skateboarding industry in the 1980s, which you and I may be witnessed a little bit.

[691] I definitely did.

[692] California.

[693] But from a distance, nervously, and breathlessly.

[694] Sure.

[695] Because all the boys that skated in my town, it seemed like they didn't have parents at all.

[696] They didn't.

[697] They could.

[698] They could.

[699] And they were so beautiful.

[700] They were gorgeous and beautiful.

[701] It didn't give a shit about you.

[702] No. You were not part.

[703] And there were no, you know, women.

[704] It was like, you, the girls were a side piece.

[705] The one time I tried to learn how to skateboard in high school and I had a friend of mine tried to teach me. Within two weeks, I had fallen so hard and scratched my face up that I just quit.

[706] It just wasn't for me. No. I have hips.

[707] Okay.

[708] So, skateboarding in the 1980s, and this is when Gader was at the top of his career.

[709] So skateboarding in the early days wasn't a popular thing.

[710] And no one was really doing it.

[711] Towards the end of the 70s, those who were skateboarding had started to skate vertical walls, like in swimming pools that had been drained because of the 1976 California drought.

[712] And as we saw in Dogtown and Z -Boys, which is also a fucking great documentary.

[713] So they were doing that instead of the usual street skating that had been going on before.

[714] And they were also skating these ramps that, you know, the ramps we know.

[715] And that's called avert skating for vertical skating.

[716] That's what I call it.

[717] I didn't know.

[718] Yeah.

[719] I didn't know that.

[720] That's what me and my Z boys call it.

[721] Oh, you and your Z boy friends.

[722] So they had this less crazy control.

[723] They could skate faster and they could do these more dangerous aerial tricks and shit.

[724] And since most people, you know, around the country couldn't build or afford these ramps and didn't have access to empty pools, there were very few people who were really fucking good at it because they could practice all the time.

[725] And that was people in California, especially Southern California and San Diego.

[726] Yeah.

[727] So those people got really fucking popular.

[728] really fast because no one else was doing it.

[729] The other thing to remember that we'll put this, that you need to remember while I'm telling you the story about Gator is that he is later diagnosed as severely bipolar.

[730] And that's not to say, this has nothing, I'm telling you this from before when he commits this horrendous crime, but the amount of power and authority he has and the shit that goes to his head, you need to remember that that's based on him being, having, being undiagnosed and untreated mentally ill. So, da -da -da -da.

[731] Okay, so, while he's becoming rich and famous at a young age, his mental illness is unchecked in a lot of ways, which is actually really fucking helpful to his career.

[732] So let's go.

[733] Mark Rogowski is born August 10th, 1966 in Brooklyn, New York, moves to Escondido, California, which is a middle class suburb of northern, fucking San Diego.

[734] At the age of three, after his parents' divorce, his dad, fucking had rage issues and later date and got the fuck out of there.

[735] Mark, who went by Gator, started to skateboard at seven years old.

[736] He took it seriously, even at a young age, and he couldn't afford the boards that everyone else had.

[737] So he made his own, which actually made him have a more unique style because he could do shit that other people couldn't do.

[738] Yeah.

[739] A skate park opened in Escondido, which is one of the first two skate parks in the nation to open.

[740] And just after two years of skating in the park in 1978, he was picked up by a local skate team at just 12 years old.

[741] So, I mean, it's insane.

[742] by 1980 at 14 he's already sponsored by skate brands and making money from endorsement deals 14 years old that's not good so he never had to you know work on his education he never had to be you know uh told by his mom what to do he never had to do any of that shit he never learned the basic stuff where you and i are getting fucking made fun of and life sucks and you have to do what your parents tell you yeah by from 12 years old on he didn't have that yeah i'm not fucking making excuses for him he's fucking horrible and a total piece of shit but like but there's reasons.

[743] Yes.

[744] This is a problem.

[745] Yeah.

[746] So he's already being paid between four and $8 ,000 a month for clothing and skateboarding equipment endorsements.

[747] He is becoming famous immediately.

[748] Everyone loves him because he has a super super, super aggressive skate style and these crazy aerial moves and he quickly becomes one of the biggest names in the sports wins a ton of awards.

[749] Personally, he's charismatic and he's flamboyant and everyone loves his personality.

[750] By 17, he's earning over 100 grand annually as a fucking 17 -year -old.

[751] So exciting.

[752] Yeah.

[753] It pays off his mom's house.

[754] He buys himself a house.

[755] And he's doing it with this thing that comes naturally to him.

[756] It's basically his go -to to get away from things being screwed up.

[757] Suddenly that's rewarding him.

[758] Right.

[759] Like that's kind of he's living the dream at such a young age.

[760] Totally.

[761] Like you shouldn't be allowed to.

[762] no one should allow to be successful.

[763] Yeah, some like guru that's right there going easy, go, like go do your chores.

[764] Right, exactly.

[765] So he's performing around the globe.

[766] He's being flown to Japan just to sign autographs, not even to fucking skate.

[767] Like, shit's bananas.

[768] Eventually, he fucking, he punches a cop in the face at one point.

[769] So, like, he's as.

[770] In Japan?

[771] No, here in the States.

[772] Not Japanese cops.

[773] Could you imagine.

[774] And so, of course, he gets, and that makes him even more famous, all the folks.

[775] photos are in thrash or and shit.

[776] He gets cocky and arrogant and just doesn't give a fuck.

[777] And also, the reason I mentioned the issues with being bipolar is that one, you know, some of the symptoms of that is, oh, God.

[778] Oh, my God, are you okay?

[779] Sorry, I'm right.

[780] What if Stephen died on recorded?

[781] It's okay.

[782] Take your time.

[783] Take your time.

[784] I got really excited.

[785] Sorry.

[786] I'm okay.

[787] You're right.

[788] You were read a minute ago, a second ago.

[789] It looks like a good.

[790] So some of the characteristics of being bipolar are things that ended up making him more famous and a better skater.

[791] Like impulsivity, you know, not aware of hurting himself.

[792] He thinks he's superior.

[793] He, yeah, all that shit.

[794] So it actually helped him, but it also made it so he didn't have to have it, like, taken care of.

[795] Yeah, there's, it's, it's, you see a lot in stand -up comedy as well.

[796] Oh.

[797] Where your person, your deep personality flaws and oftentimes, because if you're an addict or an alcoholic or something, you have these personality flaws that actually completely serve you and benefit you.

[798] And so you spend a lot of time kind of misbehaving and getting rewarded for it.

[799] Wow.

[800] It's very common.

[801] Wow.

[802] I did it for so long.

[803] I was like, are we going to?

[804] It's really hard.

[805] It's really hard to.

[806] Oh, that sucks.

[807] Because you, it's basically like when there's a child that like learns to show, off.

[808] And everyone's like, isn't that the best or whatever?

[809] But then it doesn't end.

[810] Yeah.

[811] Then that child is 38 and borrowing money from you.

[812] I'm picturing this 38 -year -old toddler borrowing money from me. And gosh, she's cute.

[813] Come on, just $2 ,000.

[814] What?

[815] Well, that's, this is him.

[816] A hundred percent.

[817] Yeah.

[818] So by 1987, he's 21 years old.

[819] And he's earning, he's earning $2 per skate deck from the company Vision, which is a new skateboarding company, which we all fucking know nowadays.

[820] but back then it had just started and they were like let's fucking do this and they loved him so they're selling 7 ,000 of gators decks with his specific logo on it it's this like it's almost like this Alfred Hitchcock like vertigo black and white spiral um so they're selling almost 7 ,000 decks on a monthly basis back fucking then can I remind everyone there's no fucking internet yeah like there's nothing this thrash or magazine yeah thrashor magazine fill out this coupon that's right um so resulting in royalties totaling 14 grand a month for him.

[821] So he's making a fucking shit ton of money.

[822] And back then, since there weren't a ton of pro skaters, it was easy for a company just to focus on one person and put everything into that person.

[823] And for Vision, that was Gator.

[824] And he blew up and so did fucking Vision skatewear.

[825] So then of course, after the magazines come out, they start making skate videos, which I remember watching once in a while.

[826] My brother was not into skating, so I didn't get that experience, but her brother was a nerd.

[827] There was several people in my life along the lines that have been into skating.

[828] And skate videos are some of the funniest, coolest, and dumbest things you have ever seen in your life.

[829] They couldn't be all and none of those things.

[830] You're watching somebody like take it in the nuts four times in a row, then landing the most insane trick, and then stealing milk from a 7 -Eleven.

[831] Right.

[832] And they're having so much fun and all you want to do is like be there with them.

[833] But they don't want you there.

[834] They don't want you there.

[835] They don't want you there.

[836] It makes me really mad.

[837] It's totally like this boys club, these dudes who are like, yeah, you want this lifestyle and you can't fucking have it.

[838] But it also to me, from some of the skaters that I've known, it's not as boys club as much as it is like a little survival team.

[839] Right.

[840] These are people who like leave their house because they can't be in their house and they go skate all day because no one's telling them to come home at night.

[841] Right.

[842] And they're really good at it.

[843] It's the fucking latchkey kid of the 80s and 90s that you and I experienced.

[844] Yeah.

[845] Like, go do something creative and like, what's the word?

[846] Go do something constructive or go do drugs.

[847] Like it's, you know, and I couldn't skateboard.

[848] They make, okay, so skate videos start coming out, which means that people all over the, like kids all over the country can actually see what is happening instead of just photos and they lose their shit.

[849] Then they would watch it.

[850] And then, of course, they'd have their favorites, and Gator was the top of the fucking heap.

[851] It made them all skate stars, including, and in this group from San Diego is our friend, Tony Hawk.

[852] He's not our friend, and we don't know him.

[853] Such a close friend of mine, personally.

[854] But he's the face of it now.

[855] But the thing of...

[856] He was on a plane that we were on recently.

[857] No, you're thinking of the ice skater.

[858] No, I'm not.

[859] Aren't you?

[860] Neckle.

[861] Who was it?

[862] Oh, Sean White was on the plane.

[863] That's right.

[864] Wait, but we were also on a plane with an ice skater.

[865] Weir was like, Johnny Weir?

[866] Johnny Weir.

[867] What?

[868] A lot, just like cold weather sports guys.

[869] You and I would be really good at Taboo together as a team.

[870] People would not want to fuck with us.

[871] No, they wouldn't.

[872] We'd be champions.

[873] We'd be on Thrasher for Taboo.

[874] And the gestures would be huge.

[875] And we'd get everything wrong.

[876] So, but Tony Hawk, like, okay, so if you think of Tony Hawk, too, he was his like baby -faced little kid, skinny little nerd.

[877] But Gator was fucking hot.

[878] Yeah.

[879] That's the other thing about him is he looked like a man. He had muscles.

[880] He took his shirt off.

[881] He was fucking in your face.

[882] He was like the punk rock skater.

[883] And he was like hard ass and mean and like didn't give a shit and threw himself into skating in a way that looked like he would break his fucking teeth off.

[884] And he did and like didn't give a shit.

[885] Yeah.

[886] He was street.

[887] He was like a street skater.

[888] And so there was something about him that made everyone just in awe of him.

[889] And so he was the skater that everyone tried to emulate.

[890] he was the top fucking guy like the rebel punk skate star and everyone lost their minds so there were these adolescent kids whose irresponsible behavior was fucking good for business yeah like the more they punched a cop the more fucking press they got sure and they knew it in an interview in Thrasher magazine Gator said that skating is quote a real productive way of venting some harsh aggressions instead of breaking a bottle and slashing someone's face you're throwing yourself at a wall with sweat dripping in your eyes.

[891] And he did have a rage issue that he got from his dad.

[892] And everyone in the documentary would say that he, you know, on a dime would fucking just become a rageful, angry person out of nowhere.

[893] Yeah.

[894] So he was just this combination of style and edginess and being fucking hot and all, you know, being charismatic as a lot of fucking crazy people are.

[895] And it made him a star.

[896] And he changed everything, including making vision create a streetwear clothing for like the reason they have vision streetwear is so that Gator could fucking sell his shirts and berets and fucking stickers and they say hip packs in the article but it's a fucking fanny pack it's a fanny pack let's get on board yeah it's fine just be up front about it yeah it's okay it's kind of like my favorite murder we how we stole how we saw hip packs and berets and hip packs you know um so here we go in 1997 a skate show in scottesdale arizona gator is introduced to a 15 -year -old, and he's like, I think he's like 21 at this point.

[897] A 15 -year -old girl named Brandy McLean, and she's there, they live in Arizona with her best friend, Jessica Bergston.

[898] Brandy is the fucking epitome of the California girl, like, skate style mid -80s.

[899] She's got the bleach blonde hair.

[900] She's fucking cute as shit.

[901] She's really outgoing and competent.

[902] Brandy and Gator, they fall in love immediately, and they start a long -term relationship or a long -distance relationship.

[903] So by the time Brandy 17, Gator had had moves her out to California, which like if I were her parents, I would lose my fucking shit over that to his house that he fucking owns.

[904] And they are, they're like the it couple and they're together in all these vision advertisements you can see from then, like the two of them together.

[905] They're in that, like the reason that article's called Free Fallen is because they're in the fucking Tom Petty Free Fallen video together.

[906] Oh, right.

[907] Because there's the slow motion skateboarding.

[908] Yeah.

[909] There's the skateboarding.

[910] So there's a lady skateboarding.

[911] It's not her.

[912] That's the main girl in the fucking video.

[913] But then when there's a guy skateboarding up on the ramp, that's gator.

[914] And the girl sitting next to him clapping is Brandy.

[915] Like they were fucking it.

[916] And so they are in promotional videos for Vision.

[917] And Vision had become the top selling skateboarding brand of the 80s.

[918] And by 87, it's fucking huge.

[919] They're live touring bringing in like 5 to 8 ,000 audience members.

[920] a show doing these like crazy what do they call them like a demonstration yes and like he has photos with Cindy Crawford and he's on MTV with fucking downtown Julie Brown and shit like he's a fucking celebrity remember and Dr. Bruths over here and let's like just let's like tour through the 80s here's Bill Clinton that's right he plays a saxophone while he and he skateboard's over him it's great yeah so that's and so they're living the life and gleaming the cube, et cetera.

[921] Ooh, she was filmed at my high school.

[922] The only good thing that ever happened in my high school.

[923] Oh, Christian Slater came.

[924] Yeah.

[925] Irvine, what's up?

[926] Okay.

[927] They travel a world.

[928] They live it up.

[929] But, of course, not shockingly, the relationship is tumultuous.

[930] Gator is often breaking up with Brandy when he had what she calls, and this is not me saying this, a quote, manic freak out and would break up with her.

[931] And then two weeks later, be like, I love you, what did I do?

[932] I need you back for, you know, I'm far.

[933] fucked up.

[934] He was really possessive of her.

[935] He didn't want her even looking at anyone else.

[936] It was a really tumultuous relationship, the kind that is super fucking romantic when you're a teenager.

[937] Yes.

[938] And then you get older and you're like, that was really problematic.

[939] Yeah.

[940] Oh, that was not healthy.

[941] Well, as a teenager, though, it's when you get consistently served up some nice drama.

[942] Yeah.

[943] It feels, it makes you feel important.

[944] It makes it feel important.

[945] It's like that's, you begin to think that's what love is.

[946] Yeah.

[947] The problems.

[948] Prove it to me by this and, you know, cry on my front lawn if you like me so much.

[949] That's right.

[950] It's a lot of that kind of stuff.

[951] Yeah, it's very lovely and hopefully we all get over that.

[952] Someday.

[953] So Gator becomes more and more arrogant.

[954] He alienates himself from his buddies.

[955] He's, of course, drinking and they're doing drugs all the time.

[956] And in the nine, but then in the 90s, the Gator's popularity starts to wane as vert skating is overtaken by street skateboarding, which is more the Z -boys, Dogtown Z -Boys thing, where you skate off curbs and you do tricks on fucking flat surfaces and park benches, so it's more accessible to everyone, and people kind of like it a little better.

[957] And the vert people couldn't fucking do that, except for Tony Hawk, which is why we know who he is.

[958] So, like, they weren't, like, Gator wasn't able to learn those tricks.

[959] And neither was I. When you watch those skate videos, though, it's insane that anyone can do those tricks.

[960] Like, especially that one where they go flying and then they skate down the handrail of long stairs.

[961] Yeah.

[962] Everything about that is like, how did you do that the first time?

[963] Right.

[964] Because that's the scariest thing and there's no way you're not going up.

[965] You don't and you just keep doing it, which I'd be like, oh, that hurt.

[966] I did.

[967] I said, oh, that hurt.

[968] I'm never doing that again.

[969] Right.

[970] And they're just like, I kind of can't feel my arms.

[971] I'm just going to keep doing it.

[972] There's a dog.

[973] Can I pause real quick?

[974] A dog skateboarder?

[975] No. What's that dog skateboarder's name, question mark?

[976] Will you put that on the, will you leave that in?

[977] I just texted once.

[978] Okay, I figured it out after a brief break.

[979] His name is Mertie the dog.

[980] M -U -R -D -Y, the D -A -D -A -D -A -D -W -G.

[981] Nope, D -A -W -G.

[982] You were thinking D -O -D -D -O -G?

[983] No, no, no, no. He's the best fucking dog.

[984] He's called the smoothest skater on four -paw.

[985] What was my point of this?

[986] Were you going to not show me?

[987] Oh, I don't know.

[988] She just puts her phone away.

[989] Yep, I just wanted to know his name and the spelling of his.

[990] No. Dude, he's so into it.

[991] He loves it.

[992] He loves it.

[993] He's like such a good pup.

[994] How's that going to cut together?

[995] I don't know.

[996] It's going to be fun.

[997] Okay, Stephen, good luck with that.

[998] Okay, so unable to make the transition into fucking street skating.

[999] By 1990, he's washed up already as a he's like 23 and he's like people are like laughing at him like kids who are skating at the skate park are like laughing at him no yeah so of course he's got this issue i'm sure he is an ego fucking problem yes well and also because it's a thing of like the people that go through that go through it and never think they never think they never think they're gonna not be popular like plus like you know if you become rich later in life you like maybe have some you understand what not to fucking waste your money on and save some of it but like if you're not when you're 14.

[1000] No. I don't think so.

[1001] No, absolutely not.

[1002] So he's washed up as his vision, who files for Chapter 11 bankruptcy too, but they come back.

[1003] Don't worry about it.

[1004] Oh, good, good, good.

[1005] Yeah.

[1006] So he's in Australia for some skate thing.

[1007] This fucking little kid, I don't know how old he is, is bugging him and bugging him to get a fucking autograph and he's like, leave me alone, whatever.

[1008] He wouldn't leave him alone.

[1009] Gator punches the kid in the face, which is like, Australia is like, fuck you.

[1010] Oh, my God.

[1011] Like, so people start to hate him.

[1012] yeah he's got major fucking issues obviously he's a fucking dick you can't punch a child Australia bans him so of course sales there plummet and everyone knows you need to be on Australia's good side yes that's right that's right we love you shut up hey meldon perth we swear will come someday Sydney what a bridge what a bridge um okay and then things this is where things like you can see they They make a fucking hard ollie and turn around.

[1013] Thank you.

[1014] So he's in Germany for a tournament, gets blackout drunk on our best friend.

[1015] Yeagermeister.

[1016] God damn it.

[1017] Which we know is just a gateway to stupid shit.

[1018] To the worst behavior.

[1019] Also, it starts so smooth.

[1020] Like, when you have your first shot of Yeager, it tastes like medicine.

[1021] And it warms you.

[1022] Yeah, it warms you, but it also burns.

[1023] So you're like, okay, I'm only going to do that.

[1024] once and then 19 of those later you're punching a mailbox or whatever no you're not you're falling out of a fucking hotel window and landing on a rot iron fence oh that's what gator fucking did and this whole thing like did he jump out of it because he thought he could fly did he fall out of it did he put like it like it seems like he just fucking fell out of it but him jumping out to think he could fly because he was blackout drunk which he always did yeah doesn't seem out of character no no no for me you mean because you're right well it's one of the things were like it's the guy who has to be bigger than everyone else like there's video of him running around naked in the fucking hotel hallway and he always has to like he has to be the one and so i think like of all these like rebellious skater dudes he's the one that like scared them a little even yeah which is really saying something because i remember uh we had a friend who had skateboard friends that would come to comedy parties and there was one time we were all drunk and like people are dancing in a circle and then one of the comics jumped in the middle of the circle and pretended he was going to take a shit in the middle of the circle.

[1025] And then, of course, jumped back out.

[1026] Who?

[1027] And Nick Schwartson.

[1028] And the skateboard guy, I remember going, yeah, the difference is, this was a skateboard party.

[1029] They really would a shit.

[1030] Well, then I don't want to go to a skateboard party.

[1031] Yeah, I turned to the guy and I go, then there would be shit in the living room.

[1032] Like, that seems to be the disconnect.

[1033] But it really is a who will go the furthest.

[1034] Totally.

[1035] It's just boys who were left upstairs and no one's paying enough attention.

[1036] They never had to mature.

[1037] And of course, there's like, I hate that.

[1038] this and I didn't want to call them like skateboard betties, but there's these skateboard grippies who like, well, love them no matter what, they can get away with that, and they'll be fucking mature in a relationship, they can do whatever they want, you know, and why would they change?

[1039] And they don't think they have to.

[1040] Everyone's working.

[1041] It's, uh, yeah, it's almost like they were forced rich kids.

[1042] It's like unnaturally rich, rich kids.

[1043] Yeah, yeah, exactly.

[1044] No one handles any of that shit well.

[1045] Then then you put some Yeagermeister in there.

[1046] Except Tony Hawk.

[1047] Tony Hawk who oh my God is he wonder I know nothing about Tony Hawk He seems nice I don't I don't know I don't know He seems like I think he does charity things I just saw a thing where he posted a video of his daughter dropping in for the first time And watching she stood there for so long and couldn't do it couldn't do it and then she finally does it And it's the best video He's a great guy yeah our friend Michelle Balloon her daughter who's like eight is learning to fucking skate I'm following them on Instagram I think she's younger than eight.

[1048] I think she's like more like six.

[1049] She's like two and half pipes and shit.

[1050] She's badass.

[1051] Like really badass.

[1052] Okay.

[1053] So he falls on this fucking rod iron fence.

[1054] Impales the shit out of himself.

[1055] Maybe hits his head.

[1056] I don't know.

[1057] So like whatever.

[1058] He impales his neck face and thumb.

[1059] God.

[1060] And he wakes up the next morning.

[1061] He's like, what happened?

[1062] He doesn't even remember.

[1063] And they're like, we had to pull you off of a fence.

[1064] And you then sort of trying to fight the fucking ambulance workers.

[1065] Of course.

[1066] He's out of control.

[1067] So he goes home to Carlsbad to recover where he now lives with Brandy in their condo.

[1068] But he starts acting super fucking weird.

[1069] First, he says, first he wants to reinvent himself and changes his name from Mark Gator Rogowski to Mark, to Gator Mark Anthony saying that his last name.

[1070] Regowski was the name of his dad who we fucking never knew.

[1071] So fuck him.

[1072] Which is like, all right, fair enough.

[1073] still but again like again with the nicknames or whatever it's the name isn't going to do it that's not no if only it were that simple and it was weird because like everyone would be like I was looking through thrasher and suddenly there's this guy named mark named gator mark anthony who the fuck is that this guy's like like he you know I think a lot of people probably were distancing themselves from him at this point already and then that happened then he becomes friends with an ex surfer and skateboarder named Augie constantino who also had been badly injured in a dumb drinking incident but had found God from the incident.

[1074] Okay.

[1075] He was like, I need to learn.

[1076] He couldn't fucking skateboard and surf anymore.

[1077] So he comes a born -again Christian, and he becomes Gator's spiritual advisor.

[1078] Okay.

[1079] And converts Gator to strict evangelical Christianity.

[1080] Whatever it'll take to get Gator off that fence is good.

[1081] No. It's not.

[1082] It's bad.

[1083] Okay.

[1084] We don't like it.

[1085] He becomes fanatical about it.

[1086] And like in the documentary, one of his friends is like he became fanatical about anything he did.

[1087] Sure.

[1088] So it's not like this was new.

[1089] He said, Jesus Christ spoke to me through that incident with the fence.

[1090] I was a blind dude, but now I can see.

[1091] So he's born again.

[1092] He starts covering his boards with religious symbols, preaching to fucking skaters and surfers and anyone else who'll listen to him about his friend, Jesus.

[1093] He tells Brandy, who's now been there for four fucking years of his bullshit.

[1094] So that means she's not in her teens anymore.

[1095] that because of his newfound religion, they can't fuck anymore unless they get married.

[1096] Oh.

[1097] And she takes that chance to be like, great, go by.

[1098] Oh, yeah.

[1099] Okay, great.

[1100] I'm going to fucking take this as my exit.

[1101] Also, Jesus has been talking to me a little bit, too, and tell me to break up with you.

[1102] Exactly.

[1103] She's like, awesome.

[1104] She's sick of his bullshit, including bouts of violence and unprovoked jealousy, and she takes it as her opportunity, get the fuck out of there.

[1105] She goes home to her parents' house in San Diego, her mom and stepdad.

[1106] But the end of this relationship sends Gator fucking over the edge.

[1107] He's already crazy.

[1108] It's not her fault.

[1109] It has nothing to do with her.

[1110] He's not treated and he's mentally ill. And he, and this is his fucking term.

[1111] Breaking point.

[1112] So he starts drinking heavily again using cocaine.

[1113] Then Brandy starts dating a surfer pretty quickly after the breakup and, which she's fucking allowed to do.

[1114] Yeah.

[1115] And Gator becomes obsessively jealous, starts stalking her, fucking breaks into her house and steals back all the shit he gave her, including a car, steals her car.

[1116] Wow.

[1117] And then making threatening calls to her house, to her fucking new boyfriend's family's house.

[1118] Somehow I got the number.

[1119] Like, he's stalking the shit out of her.

[1120] So he's, again, he's a fanatic about making their lives hell.

[1121] Exactly.

[1122] And finally, she tries to, like, have a conversation with him and, like, hang out with him.

[1123] And he's like, I should fucking take you to the desert and kill you and leave you there.

[1124] And she's just like, my mom knows where I am take me home right now and that's where she's like I need to leave town so she doesn't want him to be able to track her because clearly he can right now so she doesn't tell anyone that she's leaving town except her parents and she doesn't tell anyone where she's going or why she just is like I need to just leave so no one can track me yeah unfortunately this is the fatal move because her best friend from way back in Arizona Jessica doesn't know that and doesn't know it's been going on because, of course, Gator isolated brandy and was like, you can't have friends, you can't go out with your friends.

[1125] So they weren't talking as much anymore.

[1126] And so Jessica didn't really know what's going on in their relationship.

[1127] So Jessica had been living in Arizona and she moved to San Diego.

[1128] She was like this gorgeous girl.

[1129] She was going to be a model.

[1130] She was going to open a flower store.

[1131] So she's 20, it's March 1991.

[1132] She's 22 years old.

[1133] And she had just been in San Diego for like 10 days.

[1134] She gets a hold of gate.

[1135] and she's like the only person I know her know here he's 24 years old and she was like can you show me around and like introduce me to people and um like brandy she's this tall blonde beautiful girl uh her friends describe her as tough and savvy and incredibly intelligent and free spirited so on march 21st 1991 they spend the day together they go to lunch they fucking hang out all day there's no it's no undertone of hooking up and i get this to two, where it's like, you know what, your friend's boyfriends or ex -boyfriends, you're like, I'm safe because you dated my friend.

[1136] We're never going to hook up.

[1137] Right.

[1138] They go back to Gator's condo to watch movies and drink wine.

[1139] And around 2 .30 a .m., she's like, I'm ready to go home.

[1140] He insists on taking her home.

[1141] He's like, let me make sure my driver's license is in my car.

[1142] He goes out to the car and instead of his driver's license, he grabs his club, which we remember as, I don't think people know what it is anymore.

[1143] It's a metal auto anti -theft device.

[1144] My dad still uses it because it's a dad thing.

[1145] He bought me when when I got my first car.

[1146] It's the thing where you put it around.

[1147] Like it's a locking mechanism for the steering wheel that's like a metal thing that you can't steal the car when it's on.

[1148] Yeah, you can't drive because it blocks the steering wheel.

[1149] Right.

[1150] It blocks the steering wheel from moving.

[1151] So it's also like, you know, if you look in the car, you'll see it.

[1152] You'll go to another car.

[1153] Right.

[1154] My dad still uses it.

[1155] Except for the people that are.

[1156] good at stealing cars, break in and then cut that little part of the steering wheel and take it off.

[1157] Oh.

[1158] Yeah.

[1159] Shit.

[1160] Because it only works if there's two sides of the steering wheel.

[1161] Oh, I'm stealing cars from now on.

[1162] I didn't even know that.

[1163] Ask me about these things.

[1164] I'll tell you.

[1165] Shit.

[1166] Karen's a little life of positivity.

[1167] So positive.

[1168] So for some reason, and it was, so it was like this metal bar.

[1169] Yeah.

[1170] He brings it in to the house.

[1171] No. I know.

[1172] And he, uh, she's on the floor, getting her step together, getting ready to leave.

[1173] And he strikes her over the head with it multiple times, knocking her unconscious.

[1174] Just out of nowhere.

[1175] They'd been spending the fucking day together, like hanging out.

[1176] And then he just snaps.

[1177] And he snaps.

[1178] We don't know if he maybe put the moves on her and she was like, no, this isn't happening.

[1179] But later he says that in his mind somewhere during the day, she just turned into Brandy in his mind.

[1180] Like she was, he wanted to do this to Brandy.

[1181] and instead he did it to her best friend.

[1182] So he knocks her unconscious, he ties her up in his bedroom, rapes her for a long period of time, and then he smothers her when he puts her in a surfboarding bag.

[1183] And he takes all the evidence and drives a couple hours out to the desert and buries her in a shallow grave.

[1184] So literally exactly what he threatened to do to branding.

[1185] That's exactly right.

[1186] Unbelievable.

[1187] It's crazy.

[1188] It's so fucking heartbreaking.

[1189] The next day, Jessica's dad back in Arizona is like, why haven't I heard from her immediately files a missing person's report, ends up flying out because he doesn't think San Diego PD is doing enough.

[1190] Of course.

[1191] I'm sure no dad ever thinks the fucking PD is doing enough.

[1192] Of course.

[1193] And so for the next two months, friends are putting up missing flyer, missing person's flyers.

[1194] Even the dad even goes, like, sees Gator and it was like, do you know where she is?

[1195] They had like shaken hands and Gator was like, I don't know where she is to her dad's fucking face.

[1196] Um, and so, so Jessica Bergson's body is found by campers or like, it sounds like it was like a kid fucking mountain biking out there on April 10th, 1991, but I think it was so far away and the body is so decomposed that there's, they can't identify her.

[1197] So I don't think they knew that she was, it was her yet.

[1198] Right.

[1199] But the next day, uh, apparently filled with fucking guilt, maybe.

[1200] Gator confesses to his friend, the surfer dude, Constantine, oh, who told him that, that he needs to confess, takes him to the fucking cops and is like, go in there and confess.

[1201] Oh, good.

[1202] Yeah.

[1203] So, and I mean, maybe he would have never been caught.

[1204] It's very possible if he hadn't confessed, he would have never been caught, which is so fucking awful.

[1205] So, uh, Gator turns himself in on April 11th, 1991, and he, to just to prove that he did it, he has to lead them to where he buried her.

[1206] They were like, what murder are you talking about?

[1207] They didn't even know about it.

[1208] And then police searches home.

[1209] They find evidence of the blood.

[1210] He had bought like a fucking steam cleaner for his rug, but they pulled it up and the blood had gone all the way down to the floorboards.

[1211] And he says that he killed her in a misplaced act of revenge toward his ex, Brandy.

[1212] He said that she was the mold of brandy, the mold that Brandy was made out of.

[1213] So this fucking asshole is so problematic.

[1214] There's certain parts where he seems to take full responsibility for it.

[1215] There's other times where he's like, He says it was because of porn that he watches a kid.

[1216] He says that, you know, it's because of fucking having unmarried sex before corrupted him and it's Satan.

[1217] Like he won't, he's a fucking dick.

[1218] Obviously, he hasn't come to terms.

[1219] Right.

[1220] So then it's just here's the reason and here's the excuse.

[1221] Here's the reason and excuse.

[1222] So I don't feel terrible about myself.

[1223] And so I don't have to take any responsibility for this.

[1224] Yeah.

[1225] So upon entering prison, he's diagnosed with.

[1226] severe bipolar and so but of course he also said that he had thought about getting psychiatric help but his religion his new found religion didn't frown upon that go there's no Satan go get help yeah well and also I don't understand how a religion could frown upon you getting better totally you are suffering a hundred percent that I yeah that doesn't seem to track that what the thing is that is the point is that it's your fault and if you are a better person and pray more, it'll go away.

[1227] And because it's not gone away that means you're a piece of shit.

[1228] Like that's not, that's not science.

[1229] That's not science.

[1230] That's not how it actually works.

[1231] If your religion is trying to teach you that, it's because they're trying to keep you down.

[1232] Yeah.

[1233] And you need to question that.

[1234] Yeah.

[1235] So, of course, the story blows the fuck up.

[1236] It's this perfect story for the media.

[1237] Hard copy does a dramatic reenactment.

[1238] And I'm sure the actress quit acting immediately after that.

[1239] The reenactments from the 80s and 90s.

[1240] I mean, may they all die a quiet death?

[1241] That's right.

[1242] Because there have been some awful ones.

[1243] Horrible.

[1244] He changes the story.

[1245] He makes a bunch of bullshit.

[1246] It says it was kinky sex gone wrong.

[1247] Fuck you.

[1248] He tells his friends to believe in him.

[1249] They don't.

[1250] They do and then don't.

[1251] He eventually pleads guilty to first degree murder and rape, avoiding the death penalty or life without parole.

[1252] So in January of 1992, at the plea hearing, he submits a four -page written statement, accepting responsibility, but also blames himself for having sex outside of marriage for being promiscuous, all this other bullshit.

[1253] Who fucking cares?

[1254] He sentenced on March 6th, 1992, so that day that he sentenced, five extra uniform bailiffs have to be there with metal detectors as guards because Jessica's dad says, I have nothing to lose.

[1255] I'm going to fucking kill that motherfucker.

[1256] Oh, no. Yeah.

[1257] Raghowski apologizes to Mr. Bergstein, who shouts back in a 20 -minute fucking monologue.

[1258] of what a piece of shit this guy is.

[1259] Everyone's crying while he does it.

[1260] He says that he's a coward and he should die a thousand deaths.

[1261] So Rikowski received six years for forcible rape, then 25 years for the first degree murder charges, and he's eligible for parole after 31 years.

[1262] So February 7, 2011, he's denied parole.

[1263] Thank God.

[1264] I'm saying that he's an unreasonable risk to society.

[1265] In 2016, he's again denied parole for seven years, so he's not going to be eligible for parole.

[1266] until March of 2023, which marks the minimum of his sentence when he'll be in his mid -50s.

[1267] So, yeah, it's horrible, awful.

[1268] Jessica's buried in a family plot in Georgia.

[1269] On the day of her burial, her father compared her to a butterfly that had just landed on his arm and said, like a butterfly, she was only on this earth a short time, but brought so much beauty and happiness.

[1270] And that is the murder of Jessica Bergston by Mark Gator Rikowsky.

[1271] Wow.

[1272] Fucking crazy.

[1273] So the fact that something that dark and awful happened in that kind of like, you know, there was a little innocence to that.

[1274] Like a playful world.

[1275] Yes.

[1276] It's like it's a, it's a, it's people getting great at a pastime.

[1277] Right.

[1278] And then cool at a pastime and then close.

[1279] Yeah.

[1280] And here's my line of shoes and I'm Tony Alva and all that where it's all very like, hooray for the little guy.

[1281] So the idea that then the little guy, it turns that.

[1282] hard.

[1283] Well, that's why I think you don't hear about it a lot is a lot of skaters don't want to fucking talk about it.

[1284] Yeah, I bet.

[1285] It just marred their whole, like, it marred their whole, what's the word?

[1286] Job.

[1287] The whole scene.

[1288] The whole scene.

[1289] It made everyone look bad.

[1290] You know, it was like the whole, I was also in the 80s of the satanic panic and everyone wanted to make these guys look like, you know, the bad boys and shit.

[1291] But so they don't know what talks about it.

[1292] Yeah.

[1293] But there's this thing that happened and it really happened.

[1294] Yeah.

[1295] Wow.

[1296] Unbelievable.

[1297] well so while we were um on the road when we did our weekend that was baltimore philly dc i kept finding a show on tv called deadly rich i think it was on hln and i was it was so satisfying it was just like all these stories of rich people murdering each other because and every single time it was you know there's there's some like sun that is a near -do -well, and then someone finds out that there's a life insurance for two million dollars on his mother.

[1298] There's all those stories.

[1299] It's just greed, greed, greed, insane greed, and also really just no ability to kind of big picture it, where it's like this absolutely you're going to get caught.

[1300] You're going to get caught.

[1301] It's almost like, it's the murders and shit that in the crimes that wouldn't happen if you were just average person.

[1302] Yes.

[1303] But suddenly it's like, I got cut out of the will and I thought I was going to live off this $3 million.

[1304] for the rest of my life.

[1305] And I've been acting like it.

[1306] Yeah.

[1307] And now I get nothing and it's because this old bat.

[1308] So, you know, here we go.

[1309] People not living positively.

[1310] So there's a ton of negativity, but please watch Deadly Rich.

[1311] Oh my God.

[1312] It sounds awful and amazing.

[1313] Yeah.

[1314] And and so satisfying like we, us coming home from a night of doing shows.

[1315] And then you're just like, oh yes, people being pushed down long flights of stairs.

[1316] Grand flights of stairs.

[1317] Just the grandest, the grand doms.

[1318] Grand domes.

[1319] So this one came up in one of those episodes and I, it's so funny because I pulled it because knowing that we had a Detroit show coming up.

[1320] Yeah.

[1321] Because it was near Detroit.

[1322] And then, then began my long journey in, did we do this one already or not?

[1323] Okay.

[1324] And me, Stephen, Jay, like a bunch of us looking into it couldn't figure it out for the longest time.

[1325] I thought you couldn't have asked me. Well, I know.

[1326] I couldn't have asked you.

[1327] And when Stephen and I were looking into it, it was a thing where I had basically said I was going to do it and had research for it and then changed my mind day of.

[1328] And the funny thing is Stephen goes, yeah, no, in that Detroit show, and he's mentioning stories where I'm like, I have no idea what you're talking about.

[1329] 100%.

[1330] No memory of it.

[1331] Yeah, it was very like email records.

[1332] It was like, you know, the whole thing.

[1333] We had to like, we had to go onto the motherboard and get the mainframe up.

[1334] So that funny when you ask people who listen, have we done this?

[1335] Because it's been three years of insanity and we haven't caught up with our brains yet.

[1336] So week by week for the past three years, we don't fucking know what we've been doing.

[1337] Well, and also those live shows, we change our mind day of constantly.

[1338] There's something that goes, it's like the part of the panic of this is going to be a live show story.

[1339] And suddenly it's like it isn't good or is good or whatever.

[1340] Yeah.

[1341] But I've been, but also the reason that I couldn't figure it out is because this story has been on date line.

[1342] It's been on every single one of them has featured this story.

[1343] So it's like how we not done that kind of.

[1344] It's a city confidential.

[1345] I love it.

[1346] You've seen it a million times.

[1347] And because it's incredibly lurid.

[1348] Okay.

[1349] It's the murder of Jane Bashara.

[1350] So she, she, her, it's, okay.

[1351] You know what?

[1352] How about you tell me?

[1353] How about I don't tell you?

[1354] And then I tell you.

[1355] Yeah, I'll be just tell me, tell me. Um, okay.

[1356] So yeah, Deadly Rich is, is the main source.

[1357] And then obviously all the, um, Wikipedia style, um, and murderpedia, again, murderpedia, please donate to, please keep murderpedia alive for us.

[1358] Um, okay.

[1359] So we'll talk, first we'll talk about Jane Bashara.

[1360] She, um, is a 56 year old woman who lives in the very affluent Detroit suburb of Gross Point Park, um, uh, with her husband of 26 years, Bob and their two children.

[1361] She has a bachelor's and a master's in business administration.

[1362] Damn girl.

[1363] And yeah, and she has this really high -level job, senior marketing manager for an energy consulting company in Detroit.

[1364] That sounds fancy as fuck.

[1365] Yeah, she's got so many blouses with ties and ruffled necks.

[1366] Real silk, too.

[1367] Her nails were perfect.

[1368] Tennis bracelets?

[1369] Just every day she was wearing those Eileen Fisher separate.

[1370] Oh, my God, and like walkable heels.

[1371] Yes, but still very fashionable.

[1372] I love her.

[1373] Yeah, and she's well respected at work, but she's also active in her kids' lives.

[1374] She's basically doing that suburban mom thing where she's doing it all.

[1375] She was actually the president of the Gross Point South High School Mother's Club.

[1376] Jesus, they have a mother's club?

[1377] I mean, apparently, and that's the kind of thing that if I even put, like, the flyer in front of my mom, she'd be like, get it away from me. Rich people have so many clubs.

[1378] They have clubs, and they basically know how to manage their time.

[1379] I think it's like they don't eat carbs so they have a lot of energy Oh, it's not tired all the time And they have nannies and house cleaners and shit So they're like, well I didn't spend four hours But they were also raised by like surgeons and shit So they're like this is not important This is important My new favorite phrase is generational wealth Because like that's what some people are used to It's like there hasn't been a poor person around here For 20s in gross point blanks out right okay so but she's just basically doing it all and killing it her husband bob is a 54 year old businessman who owns and manages about 50 rental properties in the area um and his father he's from a like on a wealthy and successful family because his father was a state appellate court judge shit so um i'm on my laptop and i do the thing where i scroll down with the button and then it flips me back up.

[1380] Oh no. Bob also is a lot very much into philanthropy and he is the president of the Gross Point Rotary Club where he is known for and lauded for collecting a million pounds of non -perishable food, a million pounds of books and a million pounds of clothing for families.

[1381] And then lighting it all on fire.

[1382] Oh, saying, you'll get it when you stop doing drugs.

[1383] No. All right.

[1384] That's not.

[1385] He basically is all about giving back.

[1386] Okay, great.

[1387] And obviously, yeah, that's what this family is all about.

[1388] They're basically an all -American Midwest family that's on the, you know, upper range of doing great.

[1389] Okay.

[1390] So it's very surprising when on January 24th, 2012, Jane Bisharra leaves for work, sorry, it's very surprising that on January 24th, 2012, Jane Bishara leaves work around 4 o 'clock from her.

[1391] her downtown Detroit office building.

[1392] She talks to her daughter on her cell phone as she drives home.

[1393] And then that night, at around 8 o 'clock, her husband Bob comes home from work.

[1394] And he had been doing maintenance repairs on one of his rental properties.

[1395] He sees Jane's not home.

[1396] He tries her cell.

[1397] She doesn't answer.

[1398] And he just figures she's outrunning errands.

[1399] They're both busy people.

[1400] That's pretty standard fare.

[1401] So then he just basically goes about his business and relaxes.

[1402] but around 9 .30, when there's still no sign of Jane, he calls some friends and family members.

[1403] He calls his own kids, basically saying, have you talked to mom?

[1404] Where is she?

[1405] What's going on?

[1406] Then he notices her work ideas in the house, which means she came home after work and then went out after.

[1407] But her car isn't in the driveway.

[1408] So by 1130 at night, Bob decides it's time to call the police and like basically file a missing person's report.

[1409] So on Deadly Rich, my favorite news show They had a 911 call that I didn't get to the clicker in time for So I had to listen to it And this is another We've talked about this a lot So I'm the person I don't want to hear 911 calls I don't want to see crime scene photos But on this one I think I let it It's not like a panic I found a body call So it's not like the same thing It's not someone pretending to be upset Which for some reason upsets me 10 times more than how they're faking it.

[1410] But what is funny is he's trying to sound casual, which is just that thing where it's like, You can't sound casual.

[1411] You can't.

[1412] And it's, acting is very hard.

[1413] I think people don't understand that.

[1414] You're being recorded.

[1415] Yeah.

[1416] And basically you're auditioning.

[1417] As you're the, you're the husband that's mildly concerned, but knows there's nothing really to worry about.

[1418] And I like, it's kind of like, do, are there couples who don't know each other's whereabouts for hours?

[1419] I mean, well, this, this is back then, I guess not.

[1420] No, it's 2012.

[1421] As a fucking very, not codependent.

[1422] We, in therapy, we call it interdependent.

[1423] As a very, as part of a very interdependent couplehood, we know each, where the others at all the time.

[1424] Yes.

[1425] Constantly.

[1426] It would make sense.

[1427] Now, these people are like well into middle age.

[1428] They're rich.

[1429] They have children.

[1430] It might get old.

[1431] You guys both might be like enough of this checking out.

[1432] I don't care where you are.

[1433] You're at the bar still.

[1434] I don't know.

[1435] I know where you are.

[1436] Yeah, exactly.

[1437] But at the same time, it is weird that just to have no idea.

[1438] Sure.

[1439] And then it's almost midnight.

[1440] Yes.

[1441] No thanks.

[1442] Okay.

[1443] I would hope to someday be in an interdependent relationship where someone would give a shit if I didn't come home by 1130.

[1444] It's me. Yeah.

[1445] Hi.

[1446] Hi.

[1447] Oh, is it going to be you?

[1448] God damn.

[1449] Karen, where you home?

[1450] And then I start rebelling against you.

[1451] I can do what I fucking want.

[1452] Yeah, you can.

[1453] Oh, oh, I can.

[1454] No, I don't know what to do.

[1455] Okay, so the next morning around 9 .30 in the morning, a tow truck diver comes upon Jane's Mercedes -Benz SUV because it's parked in an alleyway in East Detroit.

[1456] I don't know this one at all.

[1457] You don't know.

[1458] Okay, hold on because the details might start to come to you.

[1459] All right.

[1460] This alley is six miles away from where they live, and it's clearly not in, like, it's a totally different part of town.

[1461] The driver notifies the authorities.

[1462] When the police come to look at the vehicle, they find the dead body of Jane Bashara in the back seat of her own car.

[1463] Honey.

[1464] Yeah.

[1465] They take the body to Wayne County Medical Examiner's office, and there they determined that her cause of death is strangulation.

[1466] Okay, so two days later, Gross Point Park Police issue a statement saying that Bob Bashara is currently their only person of interest.

[1467] obviously as it all goes and we know the husband did it you look at the husband first Bob is cooperating with the authorities he comes in for questioning he also takes a polygraph test so they're kind of like did he not do it well tell me more I will I'd love to I'm being positive I want to know yeah it's really open it's open minded of you to say did he not do I know So both Bob's side of the family and Jane's side of the family comes forward immediately to say there is no way he did this.

[1468] I will never say that.

[1469] I'm sorry, Yolanda and Andy, my in -law, my brother -in -law and my sister -in -law, I will always say he definitely, or she definitely did it.

[1470] I did it, even if you did it.

[1471] Well, isn't that the worst thing in the world, though?

[1472] And I think it's also one of my worst fears is the discovery that you, there are people that you would know where you'd be like, of course, Stephen, would never murder anybody.

[1473] murderer.

[1474] Yes.

[1475] And then you're wrong.

[1476] Well, that's what people, like a bunch of the skateboarders did.

[1477] Like free fucking free gator.

[1478] Of course.

[1479] But it turns out you're just a piece of shitty as a murderer.

[1480] Yeah.

[1481] That's, it's a big fear.

[1482] And also it's like, it's what is the, what is the extent of friendship?

[1483] How well does anybody know anybody?

[1484] You don't know anyone.

[1485] No one knows anyone.

[1486] No one knows.

[1487] And as we've talked about a billion times, the sociopaths and the psychopaths are the most convincing.

[1488] We know, if Stephen got, I would say, Stephen did it.

[1489] There's like a murder that didn't even happen yet.

[1490] I know Stephen did it.

[1491] Look, look.

[1492] Stephen is the last person we'd accuse, so Stephen's the first person we're going to accuse.

[1493] Exactly.

[1494] That's how we're thinking of.

[1495] So, but both families assert that he's incapable of this horrific act.

[1496] That's a quote.

[1497] They also are quick to defend one of the neighbors named, unfortunately, Alex Jones, said, um, said blue blah, blee blah, um, said they were just a great couple.

[1498] There's no doubt in my mind that it was not him.

[1499] So, and so after the questioning, then the police do reveal, and this is what's interesting is I feel like this is one of those things where local news had caught on to that kind of OJ CNN minute -by -minute reporting, where it's such in that neighborhood, it was such a shock that this woman, this white, rich woman was found dead in a car, that then that basically everything that happens in this case happens on the news.

[1500] I mean, those people love nothing.

[1501] The news people, nothing more than fucking cops coming out of a mansion.

[1502] Yes.

[1503] With yellow tape.

[1504] Like, that's their favorite fucking thing and they'll sit on that for hours.

[1505] That's, that's media birthday party.

[1506] That's right.

[1507] That's just like, we all go to the state skating rink and eat cupcakes together.

[1508] That's right.

[1509] This is, and it gets even more so.

[1510] Okay, good.

[1511] Um, which is crazy, but yeah, I mean, it's how it is.

[1512] So, um, so the thing is that the police reveal that Bob was found to be lying on his polygraph test they won't disclose what he's lying about but they basically are like we're still looking at him.

[1513] Would you ever take a polygraph test?

[1514] It doesn't seem like a good idea.

[1515] If you were innocent and you were like I didn't do this, it doesn't seem like it's going to help you either way.

[1516] I don't trust my own self -consum subconscious.

[1517] What is the problem with that word today?

[1518] That's like, that's your subconscious.

[1519] That's my subconscious saying don't fucking talk about me. Don't trust yourself.

[1520] How dare you talk about me in front of these people.

[1521] I just don't, I don't know what I would do.

[1522] Like, I feel like all of a sudden my hands would get sweating in a way that would be like...

[1523] The thing of like, I'm not stealing anything when you're not stealing anything.

[1524] I'm totally innocent.

[1525] Right.

[1526] It's like, yeah, you are.

[1527] Yeah, right.

[1528] But then you look guilty if you don't take one.

[1529] I am so, I paid too close attention to things to not seem suspicious.

[1530] Right, me too.

[1531] Ask for a lawyer.

[1532] That's, I always ask for a lawyer.

[1533] And just kind of put your hands up.

[1534] Like, just be like, I don't know.

[1535] Look, Karen, I don't know what to tell you.

[1536] My lawyer's Karen and Georgia told me to ask for another lawyer.

[1537] Because I have such a guilty conscience.

[1538] It would all be coming up and it wouldn't be related to the crime.

[1539] Totally.

[1540] It arrested me before.

[1541] Yeah, my name is Karen, but my parents wanted to name me Gloria.

[1542] So you're lying about it.

[1543] So I am kind of lying, I guess, in a way.

[1544] Yeah.

[1545] Ma 'am, please just answer the question.

[1546] Well, actually, I have a couple questions about the question.

[1547] Okay, so.

[1548] For real.

[1549] Seriously.

[1550] For real now.

[1551] So on January 28, This is, so this is about four days later.

[1552] The police search the Bishara's home for potential evidence.

[1553] And they are seen, and, you know, it's all on the local news cameras.

[1554] They're seen leaving the home with several items.

[1555] Let me guess.

[1556] It's like a fucking brick, a tutor, a tutor with some fucking columns and shit and fucking clapboard bullshit.

[1557] You've seen this.

[1558] You've seen it.

[1559] You know it.

[1560] Okay.

[1561] In your subconscious.

[1562] Okay.

[1563] So a few days.

[1564] later on January 31st, investigators announced that Jane had been murdered somewhere else and her body was placed in her car after death.

[1565] So, now, it goes on for a while where they're watching Bob Bashara.

[1566] He's, you know, he's like basically saying, I was gone, I was gone that day.

[1567] These are my, and this is my favorite part.

[1568] Well, I'll come to this later, but because Bob, the buildings that he owns.

[1569] Yeah, I was just going to say, can I make a guess?

[1570] Anyone who works in like a construction industry or some kind of thing where they have workers.

[1571] Yes.

[1572] Who they can hire to kill the wife and make it look like a random act of violence.

[1573] So you know this one.

[1574] So stop ruining my story.

[1575] I'm so sorry.

[1576] I'm just kidding.

[1577] But this is literally the next paragraph is the same day that they announced.

[1578] that all of a sudden out of the fucking blue a guy walks into the police station on January 31st his name is Joe Gents he is Bob Bashara's handyman who has worked on different jobs odd jobs for Bob Bashara over the years comes forward to the police confessing he killed Jane Bashara so he tells police in the when they interrogate him or whatever that Bob Basharra had promised to pay him $2 ,000.

[1579] That's it.

[1580] And give him an old Cadillac in exchange for killing Jane Bashara.

[1581] It's disgusting.

[1582] It's disgusting.

[1583] Not that any amount of money is okay to kill someone, but it's like, that's so sad.

[1584] It's terrible.

[1585] Like, she is such an important person to so many people and for fucking two grand.

[1586] It's just all the dirtiest, grossest.

[1587] It's just like what you don't want to know about other human beings.

[1588] Yeah, it's like a human being's life is.

[1589] nothing to you.

[1590] Yeah.

[1591] So Joe states that he agreed to the terms.

[1592] He strangled Jane in the Bashar's garage and then he helped Bob dispose of her body by placing it in the back of the SUV and driving it to the alley in Detroit City where it was found.

[1593] Joe chose to confess out of the fear that if any of that information got got out that all the blame would lay on him and Bob would get away with no consequences.

[1594] So he basically was saying, I'm coming forward and admitting to this because I want to make sure this guy goes down because it was his idea.

[1595] And Joe Gens is, they call him, they use different phrases, mentally challenged as one, like just has a low IQ is another.

[1596] Yeah.

[1597] But he seems to be the kind of person that would be easily manipulated and is basically kind of saying, please make sure that I'm not the only person that goes down for this.

[1598] The problem is that Joe Gens's story is inconsistent.

[1599] In one account, he says that Bob Bishara struck a deal with him to kill Jane.

[1600] Another one, he says that Bishara forced him to kill Jane at gunpoint saying that if he didn't kill her, then he would kill Gens.

[1601] So if Gens didn't kill Jane, that Bichara would kill Gens.

[1602] So immediately then, Bob Bisharro's attorney, a guy named David Grime, he claims that Bishar had actually owed Gens the two grand and that Gens murdered Jane Bashara out of anger for not being, for not repaying him, which doesn't really track.

[1603] Bob maintains that he was in no way involved with Jane's murder and that, um, his team leans on Gens's mental disability to call the confession into question.

[1604] So it's basically like this guy doesn't know what he's talking about.

[1605] He also says that he doesn't, that Bob doesn't even own a gun.

[1606] So the version of Gens's story couldn't be true.

[1607] And the authorities hold Gens for three days to question him but then they basically say you're right this is a false confession and they dismiss the confession and they release joe gents what yes okay what is that i don't know what's true anymore i know right so and neither do the police so then okay but the thing is the media already has their teeth in this story and it's the classic like then there's a confession but the confession doesn't stick it's almost like good that the media is involved because they're like wait a fucking goddamn minute yes yeah and And they're like, well, there's got to be other stuff and there's got to be people willing to talk.

[1608] And we need more video footage of Tudors.

[1609] That's right.

[1610] That's right.

[1611] We need houses being rated.

[1612] Fully rated.

[1613] And men and blazers walking out and looking concerned.

[1614] That's right.

[1615] We all need that.

[1616] So, okay.

[1617] So then on February 2nd, 2012, the story breaks that Bob Oshara has been leading a double life.

[1618] Of course he has.

[1619] And is this the part, this might be the part that clicks it over and does.

[1620] true familiarity for you.

[1621] Okay.

[1622] Because not only has Bob Ashara been having an affair with a woman and keeping, basically keeping a woman.

[1623] Of course.

[1624] He's also, he runs a secret S &M club.

[1625] How the fuck to have I never heard of this?

[1626] Okay.

[1627] So that would have been the detail.

[1628] That was that would have been the trigger that clicked it into my memory.

[1629] Because that, if the other part was the media birthday party at the roller rink, then that was the Coke dealer showing up and saying everything's for free because a murder in the suburbs and then the husband as a double life as a sex I can hear the city confidential episode which is my favorite fucking show in the whole world yes they fucking interview the local journalists they fucking it's just the best yes they oh my god in the sleepy bird but nal was not in well so in this episode of deadly rich so I'm sure there's a city confidential I'm positive about it but in this episode there is a guy named Mike Boyanis and he runs the bar called the Hard Luck Lounge The local fucking dive where the journalists go to eat well that Babasara owns the building so he's basically Mike Boyanis's landlord and the episode of Deadly Rich kicks off with Mike Boyanus being like he wasn't my friend he was my landlord he gave everybody the creeps like him just holding forth and so then one day we have to go there next time we're in Detroit the hard look lounge I hope it's still there because this guy I love him so much and he says at one point the fuse box like blew out or whatever so they had to get an electrician and they went downstairs into what was known as Bob's office that no one went downstairs into he kept it locked but the electrician has to go in there because that's where the fuse boxes the electrician comes back up stairs.

[1630] I was like, yeah, so he's got like wips and chains and things to hang people from the ceiling.

[1631] He's the real 50 shades of gray.

[1632] It's not some fucking hot dude with like clean fucking equipment.

[1633] It's not a hot millionaire.

[1634] It's Bob Bouchard.

[1635] In the, in the basement.

[1636] With some fucking greasy ass shit.

[1637] Shit under the hard luck lounge.

[1638] Oh.

[1639] Mike Boyanis says to the electrician, I don't want to hear about it.

[1640] He basically goes like, do not make me think about that.

[1641] I don't want to know.

[1642] Oh my God.

[1643] Yes.

[1644] So basically these people, the people that know the real Babashara start coming forward and going, you might want to check those and you might want to check that.

[1645] So that's how all this stuff starts coming out.

[1646] Okay.

[1647] Um, and of course, the media is having an insane S &M field day.

[1648] This is their dream come true.

[1649] Fucking story of the century.

[1650] This is prom queen city.

[1651] Okay, so that then also, prom queen city is the name of the episode.

[1652] Right?

[1653] Sure.

[1654] Okay, great.

[1655] So then they also start learning about this woman that is basically this kept woman that Bob is, it's, like his secret girlfriend.

[1656] Bob comes out and says, no, no, no, we're only friends.

[1657] But then, of course, the pictures and the travel documents surface that prove that Bob took a trip with this woman out of state to one of her relatives' weddings.

[1658] See, this is what happens when you're not interdependent.

[1659] You can't track the fact that your fucking husband is going to weddings of other people's cousins.

[1660] And imagine, this isn't like a sexy, hot sex relationship where they're like, meet me in the basement, I'm going to hang you up by your ankles.

[1661] It's like, kick me in the dick until I cry.

[1662] It's, this is like, I'll go to your cousin's wedding in Albuquerque.

[1663] No. Like, he's, he's, he's in there.

[1664] Like, I'm going to cause you pain.

[1665] Yep.

[1666] I'm going to make you go to my cousins.

[1667] You're going to make small talk with my aunt Marie while you eat canapes in the sun.

[1668] Oh my God.

[1669] That's the real S &M right there.

[1670] So, so, but basically all this proof is coming up where it's like, no, no, no, everybody knows that you were actually not.

[1671] Not only, like, she was his real girlfriend, he was keeping her in an apartment above the Hardluck lounge.

[1672] So her apartment's up here.

[1673] Then poor Mike's in the middle going, get out of here.

[1674] What does she and Mike fall in love and run away together?

[1675] No, Mike talks about very early on that his wife is in the mix.

[1676] Okay, great.

[1677] And he said that nobody, when Bob came around, he was a terrible tipper.

[1678] He never paid for the drinks that he ordered.

[1679] Of course that.

[1680] None of the guys liked him because he was a dickhead, and all the women were super skeved out by him, including his wife who said the only time she ever shook Babasar's hand, the pair on the back of her neck stood up.

[1681] So we got to love Mike, who is the true narrator of this show, and he's just like, ugh.

[1682] So there's a point where the police are surveilling Babasara and, like, watching his every move, right?

[1683] Because everybody kind of knows this guy is dirty and in the mix and something has gone on and we have to get him for it.

[1684] And Mike is watching it on the news and goes, he realizes as he's watching the news story and he goes, oh, this guy's going to use the hard luck as an alibi.

[1685] He's like, oh, we're going to get pulled into this.

[1686] Like, he's watching it on the news going, this son of a bitch is going to make this his alibi.

[1687] Because after a while, it gets so crazy of him being accused and saying, no, what are you talking about?

[1688] I would never go to that part of town and all.

[1689] Okay, so.

[1690] Okay.

[1691] So the woman, who was the kept woman, she's basically, they're kind of tracking her life as well.

[1692] She was normally a model employee.

[1693] I'm not giving her name or where she worked, but you can look it up.

[1694] No need to.

[1695] I mean, yeah, whatever.

[1696] This is a, this has nothing to do with her.

[1697] Yeah, she's more of a, she's an innocent, innocent in this.

[1698] Yeah, maybe.

[1699] Oh.

[1700] But who, also who cares?

[1701] Yeah.

[1702] Like, I don't know.

[1703] she's definitely we don't know how innocent and how involved and what demands she was making on him but I don't know she wasn't demanding that he fucking kill his wife do we know that though we don't so basically you're being positive and I'm saying there was reports that woman was considered a model employee at her work but then slowly starts developing a bad reputation for her apathetic and sometimes aggressive attitude at work.

[1704] And then in 2011, she changed her emergency contact from a female friend to Bob Bashara.

[1705] So she's, I mean, that's kind of like you're out and about with like, that's my boyfriend.

[1706] Yeah, because this motherfucker says my marriage is, we don't sleep in the same room.

[1707] It's not, she knows about you.

[1708] It's totally fine.

[1709] Yes.

[1710] I'm going to leave her soon and we're going to get married.

[1711] And then she's like, well, if all that's the case, then you're going to be my emergency content.

[1712] Yeah.

[1713] That's the basics of like, Like, you're my person.

[1714] Yes.

[1715] It's actually, you know, a very sad thing when you go to fill out an emergency contact and you have to figure out who's name to put on there.

[1716] That's a very, that was a very dark post -divorce time for me. I was like, oh, my emergency contact now.

[1717] I had a post -frenship of that where it was like, well, I clearly didn't trust the dudes I had been dating before that because I always used her name.

[1718] And then when she and I had like a falling out and broke up, it was like, I have to use my guy's name.

[1719] Yeah.

[1720] I guess I have to stay with him.

[1721] What if something happened to you and then they call someone that doesn't like you anymore?

[1722] Yeah, she's like, great.

[1723] Leave her alone.

[1724] Leave her where she lies.

[1725] She said don't resuscitate her.

[1726] Oh, did she tell me, just let her have that seizure out in public.

[1727] She doesn't want stitches and don't resuscitate.

[1728] Goodbye.

[1729] She doesn't like stitches.

[1730] After receiving a poor performance review in 2009, she chalked her poor performance up to family issues, but then promised her performance would improve, but it only got worse.

[1731] And the day Jane's body was found, this woman left work without any note.

[1732] and was later fired.

[1733] So there's a connection that would indicate perhaps that she knew what was going on, perhaps.

[1734] But I don't know, man. I want to defend her.

[1735] Okay.

[1736] You can.

[1737] I end my mind.

[1738] Good night.

[1739] Would you defend her if I told you that this woman is Casey Anthony?

[1740] No. Shut out.

[1741] Are you like?

[1742] Yes.

[1743] You fucking cut.

[1744] I believed you.

[1745] It all.

[1746] It's like every, every terrible.

[1747] true crime story it's like a jam band of true crime assholes okay okay no i i still believe with her okay so um it's basically revealed that bob and this woman's relationship is based around their mutual love for s and m great and um whose isn't like just want to go ahead and say at the end of the day let's not that a shame because it's hot kick me in the dick i love it uh whips and chains the chips and dips So that's a line from like a Bill Murray movie.

[1748] Don't quote me on that one.

[1749] That's a Bill Murray for sure.

[1750] So the woman lives upstairs, the hard lock bars in the middle.

[1751] And then the sex dungeon they used together is downstairs.

[1752] Horrifying.

[1753] Upstairs downstairs downstairs.

[1754] What a horrifying sandwich.

[1755] Horrifying sandwich, right that down there.

[1756] They learned that two were making plans to add a third woman into the relationship.

[1757] They also learn that Bob was.

[1758] planning to purchase a house for this woman.

[1759] Karen, how come you can't be sex positive?

[1760] I'm trying my best.

[1761] I'm just an old prune.

[1762] Okay.

[1763] So then Bob refuses to comment publicly on this affair, on the sexual behavior, on anything.

[1764] But he does say that he and his wife had an open marriage and that these behaviors had nothing to do with Jane's murder.

[1765] A shit.

[1766] A bull shit.

[1767] A bit.

[1768] Shit.

[1769] A little shit.

[1770] On February 8.

[1771] 2012 still?

[1772] 2012.

[1773] Probably because of Joe's confession combined with this new scandalous information, police search the Bashara home again for evidence.

[1774] And they find in the garage hair samples and blood.

[1775] And the area that Joe Gens noted in his confession, they basically just go to his confession and pull up a bunch of samples and send it all in to the lab for test.

[1776] Bob's defense attorney, guy I talked about before, then hires a retired FBI agent so that the defense can conduct their own investigation.

[1777] Oh, no, we found that he's innocent completely.

[1778] And he hates being kicked in the balls.

[1779] Yes, exactly.

[1780] He's never, these hair fibers prove that he doesn't like to get kids in the ball.

[1781] The defense team notes that the second search of the Bashara home could be tainted because so many people had walked through in between the first and second search.

[1782] Around this same time, the police find and impound a Cadillac from St. Clair Shores, a St. Clair Shores parking lot where Joe Gantz had been driving it, and Bob Ashara was registered, the registered owner.

[1783] So.

[1784] Link.

[1785] Linking them together.

[1786] Yeah.

[1787] Now they're together.

[1788] And basically it's like the guy that everyone was trying to say is not that smart or crazy or whatever.

[1789] Everything he was saying is true.

[1790] I'm sure they made some dumb, like, they're shackled together.

[1791] in like the City Confidential episode.

[1792] Oh, yes.

[1793] They're shackled together.

[1794] The puns, I'm sure, were aflowing.

[1795] Um, so on March 1st, the lab results finally come back.

[1796] And the blood sample taken from the Bashara's garage is Jane Bashara's blood.

[1797] Um, the next day, Joe Gents is arrested and charged with first degree murder and conspiracy to commit murder.

[1798] And the conspiracy charge indicates someone else is involved, but there's no hard evidence linking Bob Bashara.

[1799] So he remains free.

[1800] March 9th, authorities report that the clothing that Jane had been wearing the day of her murder was missing.

[1801] And it's believed that the clothing had been released to the funeral home that handled Jane's funeral.

[1802] The clothes may have been mistakenly thrown away.

[1803] Wait, wait, the clothing she was wearing when she was found.

[1804] Yes.

[1805] When her body got sent to the funeral home.

[1806] Yes, everything's gone.

[1807] They throw those clothes away.

[1808] Don't do that.

[1809] No, no. Never do that.

[1810] Holy shit.

[1811] Apparently that happens somehow.

[1812] So all sides' attorneys were mad about that missing evidence, but then they used it against each other to try to invalidate each other's cases.

[1813] In April, multiple sources report that Bob Bashara is the focus of the case.

[1814] He is still the prime suspect.

[1815] But the police aren't saying anything, obviously, to the press because it's a true field day for the press.

[1816] A couple months later on June 24th, Bob Basharra is arrested, but not for the murder of his wife.

[1817] They get him because he tries to hire a hitman to kill Joe Gents before Joe Gens testified at his own murder trial.

[1818] You stupid fucking idiot.

[1819] But the hitman he tries to hire is an undercover cop.

[1820] Oh my God.

[1821] Yes.

[1822] And that's another part in Dudley Rich.

[1823] Those 911 tapes are hilarious.

[1824] The accents, those like Midwest Michigan accents, and And they're like, well, yeah, you know, so you got to, yeah, I, I just need this guy dead.

[1825] We're going to get so much hate mail from people from Michigan right.

[1826] Look, watch it.

[1827] Don't listen.

[1828] Don't listen, but this really happened.

[1829] It's on tape.

[1830] It's, it's pretty crazy.

[1831] And just the idea, it's like, are you just going to kill the world?

[1832] Yeah.

[1833] What is your solution?

[1834] You're always going to get caught.

[1835] It's because when people, you have to have some fucking humility and think you're kind of stupid and, like, have a little bit of low self -esteem and be like, I'm stupid and everyone thinks so.

[1836] Just like half a teaspoon.

[1837] Half a teaspoon.

[1838] It's healthy.

[1839] It makes you not do shit.

[1840] It keeps you grounded.

[1841] Right.

[1842] It keeps you like low key.

[1843] Like having to build up your self -esteem because you have low self -esteem makes you not a fucking asshole who thinks you can get away with anything.

[1844] That's right.

[1845] And also what like the idea that suddenly there was someone there available.

[1846] Oh, get another person who's a fucking, who's happy to be a hitman.

[1847] Yeah.

[1848] Like that doesn't make him suspicious.

[1849] Sir.

[1850] Think it through.

[1851] Okay, so, yeah, if things seem like a little too fateful, it's because it's an undercover cop.

[1852] Right.

[1853] People in general.

[1854] Everyone's an undercover car.

[1855] Everyone is trailing you, just assume that they're all undercover cops.

[1856] They put a GPS thing underneath your car.

[1857] Be aware.

[1858] Be paranoid.

[1859] Okay, so Bob pleads guilty, but he admits he did attempt to have Gents killed, but he says it was not in an effort to keep Gens quiet.

[1860] No, no, no, no. No, it was a revenge killing for the murder of his wife.

[1861] You're so brave.

[1862] He was so livid.

[1863] Either way, Bob is sentenced to six to 20 years in prison.

[1864] Okay.

[1865] While in prison, Bob exhibits a series of strange and aggressive behaviors and routinely gets himself into trouble.

[1866] He tracks up violations for hiding or hoarding his medication.

[1867] He also gets in trouble for lying, which apparently is a big deal in jail.

[1868] Really?

[1869] I don't know.

[1870] Lyer, liar, pants on fire.

[1871] he gets in trouble for talking when he's not supposed to and using profane language.

[1872] I'd be fucked like in prison.

[1873] Dude.

[1874] Also, what is this prison?

[1875] It's like a kindergarten.

[1876] Convent prison.

[1877] So December of that year, 2012, Joe Gantz pleads guilty to second degree murder for his part in Jane Bouchar's death.

[1878] And he's sentenced to a minimum of 17 years in prison.

[1879] That's not long enough.

[1880] It really isn't.

[1881] None of it is, it's all such a disgrace.

[1882] Yeah.

[1883] And his for Jane Bashar.

[1884] Her children have to live with this.

[1885] Yes.

[1886] For more than 17 fucking years.

[1887] That's right.

[1888] So, but the good part is because of all the information that gets disclosed during Joe Gens's trial, Bob Bashara is once again implicated for the murder of his wife.

[1889] But this time, they have much more, like, stronger evidence that actually sticks.

[1890] So on May 1st, 2013, after more than a year after Jane's death, Bob is arraigned on first -degree murder, a conspiracy to commit murder, solicitation to commit murder, witness intimidation, and obstruction of justice charges for his part in his wife's murder.

[1891] You dick.

[1892] Yeah, dick.

[1893] During Bob's trial for Jane's murder, it's revealed that he was experiencing marital and financial problems leading up to her death and several of Bob's mistresses testify in court against him.

[1894] Several.

[1895] Now, you should see this guy.

[1896] This guy looks like a soprano's older cousin that let himself go.

[1897] Oh, my way.

[1898] It's not, it's again that thing where you're just like, is it his confidence?

[1899] It is, is it his his ideas that he thinks?

[1900] Let me see him.

[1901] Steven's got a photo.

[1902] Oh, yeah.

[1903] Absolutely not.

[1904] No. Would not touch that dick.

[1905] Or kick it.

[1906] Hard.

[1907] That's all he wants you to do.

[1908] Yeah.

[1909] Okay, so they, his mistresses testify against him, including the one he was buying the house for, saying that Jane had found out about the affairs weeks before the murder and basically that they provide the motive.

[1910] Suddenly, it's all very clear what he was doing and why.

[1911] So on December 18th, 2014, Bob Bashar has found guilty on all charges for murdering his wife.

[1912] And on January 15th, 2015, he's sentenced to life in prison.

[1913] Now, what's odd is Joe Gents in December of 2015 recants his statement that Bob was involved with his murder and claims that he was coerced by police to sign the affidated stating Bob's involvement.

[1914] Yes, which is very odd because basically his initial testimony is what brought all the evidence that proved he was involved.

[1915] Yeah, that you can't take that away once it's proven.

[1916] No, it's very strange.

[1917] Okay.

[1918] So, but then Bob files for retrial saying that that his legal team from 2014 was ill -equipped and mishand the case, but it all gets denied and he remains in prison under a life sentence.

[1919] And if you watch Deadly Rich, there's this really amazing part.

[1920] The woman who was the judge in that trial has none of it and is super, like they talk about, she actually is there talking about how she could tell that Babashar did not like that a woman was there deciding his fate.

[1921] He was very angry and very combative.

[1922] And very weird with her.

[1923] And she is the biggest badass.

[1924] You have to watch it because she's so cool.

[1925] Oh, my God.

[1926] But essentially, all his requests are denied, and he remains in prison under a life sentence, basically, for having his wife killed.

[1927] And that is the very tragic murder of Jane Basharra.

[1928] Holy shit.

[1929] Nuts, right?

[1930] And then what about Casey Anthony?

[1931] What happened?

[1932] And she went ahead, and now she's hosting her own Fox game show.

[1933] Oh, my.

[1934] my God.

[1935] I have never heard of that.

[1936] What a dick.

[1937] Yeah.

[1938] Just so gross.

[1939] Yeah.

[1940] Just so gross.

[1941] Yeah.

[1942] And weird.

[1943] And also, you know, you can, you can be super into S &M and not kill anybody.

[1944] Just break up with each other.

[1945] Yeah.

[1946] Like, what a, oh, that makes me so sad to think of like being in a marriage and not knowing all these things about my life, essentially, that are happening, you know, it's happening.

[1947] Yeah.

[1948] It's so unfair.

[1949] Well, and also I think he, you know, because he had this financial problems is that kind of thing where it's like this was going to be a murder of convenience a solution to a problem that you made yeah a solution to like nine problems yeah yeah and it's also poor it's like borderline Cohen brothers how badly he did it how badly he planned it he was so cocky that he thought whatever dumb ass fucking plan he made was going to work well and that he was pulling in people not professionals but like he basically was pulling like the cheapest person he could find it's just all dirty and awful I hate him yes the end the end let's fucking hooray this shit do it mine is hotel chicken strips which is why I wanted you to go first so I could think of something else but I have to say these travels we've been doing being able to order off the kids menu in a hotel and just get fucking chicken strips.

[1950] Yes.

[1951] It's really comforting to me. Mine was going to be the Shangri -La Hotel in Toronto, which is the nicest hotel I've ever stayed at, had the best customer service, like, in a way where it almost didn't make sense.

[1952] They were anticipating what you needed and giving it to you.

[1953] Like, leave me alone.

[1954] I'm not stealing anything.

[1955] Oh, my God.

[1956] What are you accusing me of?

[1957] And it's like, no, we're just really good at being a hotel.

[1958] I had chicken strips twice there.

[1959] Did you?

[1960] Off the kids menu.

[1961] Yes, I fucking did.

[1962] No, that was, I support that fucking hooray.

[1963] It's like a comforting thing.

[1964] Like after a crazy show, it's bananas.

[1965] You come back to the hotel room.

[1966] You don't want to, like, you want to order food.

[1967] I go to the kids' menu.

[1968] I order chicken strips.

[1969] It's a dream.

[1970] It's a dream.

[1971] Well, the reason I made you do chicken strips first is because I wanted to talk about.

[1972] And it's a thing that we actually talked about at one of the live shows, but it won't go up.

[1973] This will be up before that.

[1974] Yeah.

[1975] Um, is the, uh, death of Brody Stevens, who is a, a really legendary standup comic here in LA.

[1976] Um, he's also been in a lot of movies and he has a very long resume.

[1977] You can look him up on IMDB.

[1978] He's been in everything.

[1979] Um, but he's, he was also just one of those people like a lot of, uh, I knew him pretty well, um, but a lot of people, he was one of those comics that did three shows a night every night.

[1980] So lots and lots of comics, he was like a, a, a, a part of everyone's life he was like a standard he was just around but he really really suffered with his mental illness and he did the thing there's actually a show that they made that was on HBO and Comedy Central called Enjoy It with Brody Stevens and it is a brilliantly made show Zach Alfenakis and Mike Gibbons were the EPs Joe Wagner and Tom Sharp were the writers I did a little thing for it in episode 12, but it was an amazing television show about a comic who has mental illness and deals with it and is trying to deal with it.

[1981] And it's such a tragedy.

[1982] If you are dealing with your mental illness and you feel lost and you feel alone, please reach out.

[1983] And there are tons of, we will post a great place to reach out to and put it out there.

[1984] But hopefully one of the things about this community that has grown up around this podcast is the freedom people feel to talk about mental illness and mental health and the importance of it.

[1985] And it really is important.

[1986] And Brody Stevens, the idea that he's not here anymore is just leaves a hollow feeling.

[1987] It's just, it's the strangest, worst feeling.

[1988] And the idea that he felt alone and he felt that he was, at the end of his rope that way is fucking awful.

[1989] And I just would really urge you if you are even close to any of those feelings, please, please, please reach out and get help and get real help and let people tell you how to manage your mental illness and your mental health.

[1990] Because you can't see it from the inside and it is a huge struggle.

[1991] And these days, you know, because so many people don't have benefits with their jobs and there isn't the support that there should be.

[1992] It's really hard, but people want to help you.

[1993] So please remember that.

[1994] And please, in the spirit of Brody Stevens, who would constantly on stage talk about positive push and going for it.

[1995] He just always seemed like he was actively working to be positive.

[1996] Ironically, our joke of the show.

[1997] Yeah, I mean, that really, it's what he really was like.

[1998] And, you know, watch all his comments.

[1999] Because he also was an incredibly individual voice.

[2000] He really was doing his own comedy all the time.

[2001] And he was hilarious and he knew how funny he was.

[2002] He also didn't understand how funny he was.

[2003] But his material and his act, it was the celebration of himself.

[2004] It was incredible.

[2005] It was the best.

[2006] It was always a joy to see him on a lineup.

[2007] You'd walk in him like, this is going to fucking blow me away.

[2008] Yeah.

[2009] And he was so vulnerable too.

[2010] And I mean, it's so, It's just, yeah, it's so sad.

[2011] When I worked on Late World with Zach, which was the second staff writing job I ever had, and it was Zach.

[2012] Jack Alfanakis had a talk show on VH1 before the Hangover Fame came.

[2013] And a lot of the people I just named worked on that show, and Brody was the warm -up guy.

[2014] And we would make sure that we got all our stuff done so that we could get over there for the beginning of the taping, which you really don't do most of the time as writers.

[2015] the warm -up guys are very, it's a very noble and lonely job that they have to warm that audience up by themselves and they do it.

[2016] Brody was the warm -up guy for one of the worst audiences consistently, like people nodding out on heroin.

[2017] Oh my God.

[2018] Because it was a paid audience.

[2019] And paid audiences are the worst because they're only there for the money.

[2020] A lot of times they don't speak English.

[2021] They're like, they're tourists that have come in and then they're like, oh, do you want to go see a TV show?

[2022] You could make 50 bucks.

[2023] Or get a free.

[2024] lunch.

[2025] So it was Brody busting ass to make people laugh.

[2026] There would be like five comedy nerds in the audience and then 45 people who are like, I kind of don't want to be here.

[2027] Or am not here.

[2028] And he every, you know, I'm from recita.

[2029] I have headshots.

[2030] I mean like he just gave it to those people for two full hours and we would just go watch him and cry laughing.

[2031] What's so sad is that when you have this mental illness and this issue you know it's the whole thing of like people call people saying incorrectly that suicide is selfish when it's not you think you're doing everyone a favor yes and you're not because people are mourning you we want you there think of it in a way that like get better so you can someday tell other people who are in the position you're in right now that it does get better and there is help and like i think you said before that anxiety is a liar yeah whatever your brain is telling you that you should you don't deserve to be here you should be gone it's it's a lie it's a fucking lie it's a fucking lie and you do and your depression and your anxiety and your mental illness makes you interesting and who you are and a good person and meds aren't going to get rid of that right they're never going to well and that is another thing that I said the first time the night it happened and I just kind of said something weird because it was so shocking yeah I just try I just wanted to say something but but it really is true that this idea that this idea we're not all trying to become perfect.

[2032] No, no one should want that at all.

[2033] And comparing yourself to, like, the way you think people live, that's also a lie.

[2034] What's most fascinating is being your true fucked up vulnerable self, which is why good comics are good and bad because good comics stand on stage and go, here's me and all my weird, hairy, sweaty truth.

[2035] And people go, oh my God, I'm hairy and sweaty tooth, thank God.

[2036] And if you go up there going, I'm, I'm, I'm.

[2037] perfect and listen to my ideas everyone in the audience goes i feel terrible and i don't want to watch this right and that's brodie was the embodiment of that i'll tell you all the things that are going on with me and yell and positive push and we're going to like we're going to have the best time and it's like it's rare a lot of people don't get that about comedy and that's that's why he's going to be so missed is that voice he he did more than i think he even understood he did Obviously, yeah, 100%.

[2038] I'm really sorry.

[2039] Oh, thank you.

[2040] I mean, I'm sorry, too.

[2041] I couldn't be more sorry.

[2042] That's a huge loss.

[2043] Yeah.

[2044] Well, I'm glad I didn't go second with fucking chicken strips.

[2045] I was trying to give you the old eyes signal of like, mm, chicken strips.

[2046] You go ahead with your dumb ass chicken strips.

[2047] No, it's true.

[2048] But chicken strips, I feel like we, I couldn't be more grateful actively about this life that this, this conversation that we get to have has given us.

[2049] Because truly, it's my dream to eat chicken strips in a fancy hotel room.

[2050] It's my true dream.

[2051] Yeah.

[2052] And my dream is coming true.

[2053] We really have a very lucky, happy, incredible, ridiculous life that I'm so grateful for and that I, three years in, can't wrap my head around.

[2054] Yeah.

[2055] It's a lot.

[2056] It's real, there's a lot of whiplash because it's very different.

[2057] It's very different than my life before.

[2058] It's like chicken strips in a hotel room was a distant fucking dream for me. Only two years ago.

[2059] Being able to talk and listening to you, talk about mental health to people who need it and don't need it or have friends and don't, you know, I feel very lucky that we get to do that.

[2060] Yeah.

[2061] Yeah.

[2062] It's important.

[2063] Yep.

[2064] Thanks, you guys.

[2065] We really appreciate you.

[2066] Yes.

[2067] We 100 % do.

[2068] And we will post good outreach numbers right away.

[2069] Yeah.

[2070] Because we don't want to just say stuff like that.

[2071] We really want people to be able to.

[2072] reach out.

[2073] Twitter, my favorite murder, and Instagram, my favorite murder.

[2074] We'll post the numbers on there.

[2075] Also, apparently there's somebody on YouTube that's playing Red Dead Red Dead Redemption 2 and using our logo and it's all in Spanish.

[2076] All of it is probably my favorite thing that's ever happened.

[2077] That's our channel.

[2078] Don't worry.

[2079] It's our channel.

[2080] We have hired a guy to play Red Dead Red Dead Redemption 2.

[2081] 24 -7.

[2082] With our logo.

[2083] And we'd love for you to watch it.

[2084] It's really good for you.

[2085] Thanks, guys.

[2086] Stay sexy.

[2087] And don't get murdered.

[2088] Goodbye.

[2089] Elvis, you want a cookie?