S14 E1: His Moods Really Swing

[0] Wondry Plus subscribers can listen to something was wrong early and ad -free right now.

[1] Join Wondry Plus in the Wondry app or on Apple Podcasts.

[2] I'm Dan Tversky.

[3] In 2011, something strange began to happen at a high school in upstate New York.

[4] A mystery illness, bizarre symptoms, and spreading fast.

[5] What's the answer?

[6] And what do you do if they tell you it's all in your head?

[7] Hysterical.

[8] A new podcast from Wondry and Pineapple Street Studios.

[9] Binge all episodes of hysterical early and ad -free on Wondery Plus.

[10] This season, guests will be sharing their own testimony in regards to the criminal allegations against Jake Gravbrot.

[11] All persons are assumed to be innocent until proven guilty in a court of law.

[12] Guess experiences are their own and do not necessarily reflect the views of myself, something was wrong, or Wondery.

[13] At the time of this episode's airing, Jake Gravbrot has not responded to our request for comment.

[14] If you have been a victim of Jake Ravbrot or have a crime tip in relation to these matters, please visit something was wrong .com slash 14 for more information.

[15] All names of minors involved in this story have been changed for their privacy and protection.

[16] Some survivor names have also been changed for anonymity and safety purposes.

[17] Season 14 covers a variety of mature topics that can be upsetting, such as emotional, physical, and sexual violence.

[18] violence.

[19] Content warnings for each episode and resources for survivors can be found in the episode notes.

[20] The podcast or any linked materials should not be construed as medical advice, nor is the information a substitute for professional medical expertise or treatment.

[21] Thank you so much for listening.

[22] The following excerpts are from an email I sent on September 27, 2022, to a detective in Seattle Washington's Sexual Assault and Child Abuse Unit.

[23] Detective, thank you so much for your voicemail.

[24] As I mentioned on my voicemail in return, I have put together an overarching timeline of the criminal allegations against Jake Gravbrot.

[25] I've compiled the evidence I've collected into digital folders for ease of access.

[26] To offer more context, I became aware of the allegations through his ex -wives and ex -girlfriends in February of 2022.

[27] The survivors had begun an Instagram page to warn women who meet Jake on one of the many dating apps he uses to meet women, and we believe films them without their consent during sex using cameras in his apartment.

[28] Furthermore, there are overwhelming amounts of other allegations against Jake, rape, sexual and emotional violence, sexual abuse, sexual coercion, and child abuse.

[29] I've spent the last seven -plus months interview, Jake's victims alongside many other support and character witnesses.

[30] What I have learned is that Jake Gravbrot shows a pattern of sexual, emotional, and physical violence towards women and children that is documented and corroborated since at least 2007.

[31] I believe he is a threat to society, women, and children everywhere.

[32] His victims fear his retaliation upon their breaking of silence, but are trusting me a great deal with this information.

[33] I'm happy to make myself available to answer whatever questions I can for you or coordinate discussion with any of the survivors.

[34] Thank you so much for your time.

[35] I'm Tiffany Reese, and this is, something was wrong.

[36] You think you know me, you don't know me well.

[37] Hi, my name is Kaylan.

[38] Our story spans 15 years, starting with my story in two years.

[39] 2007.

[40] And so you're going to hear from a lot of different people that are part of the story.

[41] Our motivation in getting this out there and coming on the podcast is to keep the community safe and also for accountability.

[42] I can't speak for all the other women that you're going to hear from.

[43] But for me, this experience is me letting all of this out there into the world so that I don't have to hold on to it anymore.

[44] Holding on to trauma, it doesn't serve me. So this is my story, our story.

[45] I described Kalyn as an incredible human being.

[46] I'm biased because I am her mother, but she's thoughtful, caring, sweet, puts others before herself.

[47] She remembers people and what's important to them.

[48] She makes people feel good about themselves And she's deeply loved I'm very proud of her as a mother She's always put Emerson first I'll tell you a little bit about me Because my backstory is important Especially because my abuser Like to use it against me I was born and raised in Orange County I was born in Laguna Beach Raised in Laguna Neal In February of 96 I was 12 and I was at one of my friends' houses and her older brothers had their friends there and I had drank too much.

[49] I blacked out and woke up to one of them sexually assaulting me. I told him to stop and he would not.

[50] I couldn't even move.

[51] I was frozen and just laid there because this boy is 17 and I'm 12 and I'm maybe 100 pounds and he is a water polo player much bigger than me. in 1997 I started high school and in 98 is when my parents split up my dad got caught cheating on my mom I came home and I had a bunch of friends over and went upstairs and my mom was sobbing so I went downstairs and told my friends they needed to leave.

[52] I asked her like what was going on and she told me to call my dad and that she couldn't tell me so I called him and he said that he would be over the next day to talk with us.

[53] I was 15, and I'm the middle between two boys, and he came over and talked to my brothers, my mom and I, and told us they were getting a divorce.

[54] I could tell from my mom's reaction that this was the first time she was hearing this.

[55] I was pretty upset at him.

[56] This is around the same time that I was sexually active for the first time.

[57] I had gone to Planned Parenthood, and they told me that I had a thyroid issue and that I needed to go talk to my doctor about it, get blood work done.

[58] They said that my levels were completely off, but I was too thin to be put on medication.

[59] The reason why I was so thin is I had an eating disorder.

[60] Back to my parents, my dad had come to pick me up from school on a Monday, and I was getting out of cheer.

[61] And my mom usually picks me up, and so I was surprised and confused why he was there.

[62] He had told me that my mom had been hospitalized because she lost it on him, and so he put her in the hospital.

[63] That's when we found out that my mom had hepatitis C. She contracted it when she was pregnant with me and didn't know her whole life.

[64] Finding out that she had hepatitis C and she was losing her marriage.

[65] all in the same week was a lot.

[66] My mom took like six months of laying in bed before she was able to kind of pull herself out of her depression.

[67] But I don't fault her for any of that to find out so much in such a short period of time had to have been really overwhelming.

[68] I took care of my mom and my younger brother and made sure my mom was showering and eating and making sure my brother had food and taking him to school.

[69] bringing him home, making sure he had dinner.

[70] I was the caretaker during that time.

[71] It was fine with me. There was never a time where I looked back and resented her, and I want to make that perfectly clear.

[72] I think she regrets doing that and putting me in that position.

[73] I feel like she's an amazing mom, and she was doing the best that she could.

[74] She found a job at a place, which is kind of similar to, like, a Z gallery, where she's selling furniture and art, and one of her customers took a liking to her.

[75] Finally, she gave in, had lunch with him.

[76] That's when they started dating.

[77] He later became my stepdad.

[78] He's an amazing man, and I'm so grateful.

[79] I graduated from high school in 2001.

[80] I decided that I wanted to go to school abroad.

[81] I moved to England, went to school there for six months.

[82] got a boyfriend, stayed for a little bit longer.

[83] And then my mom was like, it's time to come home.

[84] My dog missed me and my aunt was battling cancer.

[85] Coming back to Orange County from being in the UK is a pretty big culture shock.

[86] Even though I had grown up here, I definitely took a liking to not being in such a conservative space.

[87] It felt really good to be with like -minded people.

[88] I, like, grew up in the punk hardcore scene.

[89] Nobody was asking me why I was vegan.

[90] They're just like, oh, yeah, that's rad.

[91] But when I come back to Orange County, they're like, ew, why are you vegan?

[92] That's gross.

[93] I definitely did not feel so much like I belonged here.

[94] Pretty soon after my parents got married, I started seeing a psychologist.

[95] I was having trouble with finding my role in our new family.

[96] She had suggested that I get put on antidepressants.

[97] I spoke with my doctor, the same doctor, that refused to put me on thyroid medication.

[98] Your thyroid is like the control center of your body.

[99] It regulates hormones.

[100] It regulates the amount of serotonin going to your brain.

[101] It is directly correlated with how you're feeling.

[102] Depression is such a big indicator of having a thyroid problem.

[103] He put me on Selexa, and it took about two to three months before I started.

[104] cutting and wanting to die.

[105] I think that that just wasn't the right medication for me. I had a girlfriend over and we were hanging out and I had cut too deep and she went and told my mom because I couldn't stop the bleeding.

[106] They took me to the same hospital that my mom was taken to and put me on a 5150 hold.

[107] That's when they ran my blood and saw that my thyroid was not functioning really at all.

[108] I have Hashimoto's disease.

[109] It's an autoimmune disease and it basically has treated my thyroid like it's a foreign body.

[110] So it has attacked it and tried to kill it.

[111] I had a amazing psychiatrist that got me off Selexa right away.

[112] He was shocked that I was on it.

[113] He said Luxe Pros basically the same as Selexa but with less side effects.

[114] So we tried that and they put me on synthroid right away, as well as respital.

[115] It's a mood stabilizer to attempt to stop my obsessive thoughts of cutting.

[116] The LexaPro wasn't helping.

[117] They changed my medication to Prozac.

[118] That really helped me. I don't know if it was that or that I was on my synthroid, but together it helped me pull myself out of that.

[119] I had gotten a job at Starbucks.

[120] I still work there now.

[121] 19 years later, I worked and did outpatient and really tried to figure out what the heck was going on with me so that I would be okay.

[122] Once I got that figured out and I was feeling better, this was when my high school best friend, we would date off and on here and there, but he killed himself.

[123] When that happened, I just didn't want to be here anymore in Orange County.

[124] It was just too hard to be here and have him not be here.

[125] I was really sad.

[126] It was the first time that I was like, oh, I'm really sad because I'm really sad.

[127] And it's not just like my brain playing tricks on me. I started dating this guy, I think within three months.

[128] I convinced him to move to Seattle with me because Seattle felt like more my speed.

[129] The guy that I was dating ended up being my first husband.

[130] My mom was not okay with me moving to Seattle with a boy that I was not married to.

[131] So we drove to Vegas and got married and then told her after the fact she was very unhappy.

[132] I think her exact words were get the fuck out of my house.

[133] She needed like a week of cool down and then was like, okay, this is happening.

[134] and she was very supportive after that.

[135] We moved to Seattle.

[136] The first two years, I feel like we had a really good relationship.

[137] We were going to school together.

[138] It was around this time that I stopped talking to my dad because we weren't able to see eye to eye.

[139] And it felt like he was harming me more than he was helping me. He wasn't giving me anything positive.

[140] in my life, if anything, he was making me sad.

[141] I felt like it was better for me to remove him from my life.

[142] When I was 21 in 2006, my neighbor had called me to let me know that one of my ex -boyfriends that was very close friends with his son had killed himself.

[143] This was my second ex -boyfriend that had done this.

[144] both were in front of people, both were with a gun.

[145] It's just heartbreaking, and I wish they didn't have easy access to guns.

[146] I look back and I have a lot of regret that I didn't reach out to them.

[147] I know that nothing I could have done would have changed what they did.

[148] I wish I could have changed it.

[149] Back to living in Seattle, my first husband and I were happy until I got accepted into University of Washington and something changed.

[150] I don't know if he was upset that he couldn't go to school with me anymore or what, but I was so excited when I got the letter and I opened it and I was expecting him to be happy for me and he said, I was kind of hoping you weren't going to get in.

[151] And I was like, geez, why?

[152] I just couldn't wrap my head around why he would not want this for me. And I think it was something that he felt like would pull us apart.

[153] I started at University of Washington in 2007 and it was within a few months of me starting school that we were supposed to go out with some friends and he didn't come home.

[154] I was waiting for him and I was getting kind of worried because he rode a fixed gear in downtown Seattle where there's a lot of traffic.

[155] I was starting to feel like I needed to call the hospitals and he eventually came home.

[156] It was our first really big fight, and he told me that he had kissed someone that night at a party, and I said, I'm done.

[157] I'm Dan Taberski.

[158] In 2011, something strange began to happen at the high school in Leroy, New York.

[159] I was like at my locker, and she came up to me, and she was like stuttering super bad.

[160] I'm like, stop fucking around.

[161] She's like, I can't.

[162] A mystery illness, bizarre symptoms, and spreading fast.

[163] It's like doubling and tripling, and it's all these girls.

[164] With a diagnosis, the state tried to keep on the download.

[165] Everybody thought I was holding something back.

[166] Well, you were holding something back.

[167] Intentionally.

[168] Yeah, well, yeah.

[169] No, it's hysteria.

[170] It's all in your head.

[171] It's not physical.

[172] Oh, my gosh, you're exaggerating.

[173] Is this the largest mass hysteria since the Witches of Salem?

[174] Or is it something else entirely?

[175] Something's wrong here.

[176] Something's not right.

[177] Leroy was the new date line and everyone was trying to solve the murder.

[178] A new limited series from Wondery and Pineapple Street Studios, hysterical.

[179] Follow hysterical on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts.

[180] You can binge all episodes of hysterical early and ad -free right now by joining Wondry Plus.

[181] Scammers are best known for living the high life until they're forced to trade it all in for handcuffs and an orange jumpsuit once they're finally caught.

[182] I'm Sachi Cole.

[183] And I'm Sarah Hagey.

[184] And we're the host of scam influencers, a weekly podcast from Wondery that takes you along the twists and turns of some of the most infamous scams of all time, the impact on victims and what's left once the facade falls away.

[185] We've covered stories like a Shark Tank certified entrepreneur who left the show with an investment, but soon faced mounting bills, an active lawsuit followed by Larry King, and no real product to push.

[186] He then began to prey on vulnerable women instead, selling the idea of a future together while stealing from them behind their backs.

[187] To the infamous scams of real housewife stars like Teresa Judice, what should have proven to be a major downfall, fall only seemed to solidify her place in the Real Housewives Hall of Fame.

[188] Follow scam influencers on the Wondry app or wherever you get your podcasts.

[189] You can listen to Scamfluencers early and ad free right now on Wondry Plus.

[190] At this point, I'm 23.

[191] We were too young when we got married.

[192] I have really nothing negative to say about him.

[193] He was good to me, with the exception of him cheating on me. We were just too young.

[194] During that time, I'm feeling a little bit out of control.

[195] I made an appointment to get my hair done.

[196] I wanted to cut my hair off.

[197] I wanted to color it.

[198] I wanted a change.

[199] So this is where I meet Jake.

[200] He was my hairstylist.

[201] I went in for my consultation and sat down and he's like, all right, what are we going to do?

[202] And I told him what I wanted.

[203] And I was like, I just need to change.

[204] And he's like, are you okay?

[205] I started crying.

[206] and I was like, no, no, I'm not okay.

[207] And he was like, what's going on?

[208] I told him, and he's like, I don't work tomorrow, but I'm going to come in tomorrow on my day off, and I'm going to cut your hair for you.

[209] We're going to figure this out.

[210] I'm going to make sure that you feel good when you leave.

[211] The next day, go in.

[212] He spends six hours on my hair.

[213] I don't think I've ever spent six hours getting my hair done.

[214] For whatever reason, it took a very long time, and he sat with me and he listened and we talked.

[215] He did not want to take my money and he wanted to walk me home.

[216] There was somebody on the street and he gave money to them and I was like, wow, this guy seems like a really good guy.

[217] This is like three months after my first husband and I split.

[218] It felt good to be seen as a woman again by somebody.

[219] We're walking to my apartment.

[220] We stop at the Mariners store.

[221] He's a big baseball fan.

[222] And I get him a hat and tickets to see the baseball game.

[223] And then he walks me home.

[224] We say goodbye.

[225] He goes to the game.

[226] A couple days later, he messages me and he was like, hey, do you want to come over and listen to that band that I was telling you about?

[227] He had told me about this band called The Sounds of Animals Fighting.

[228] You could only listen to it on this special DVD.

[229] I was like, well, I want to, but I'm studying right now.

[230] I have a test.

[231] He's like, well, why don't you just come over in a home?

[232] you study.

[233] I went over to his house and we ran through flashcards.

[234] That was the first time that we were intimate.

[235] I walked home by myself.

[236] I lived downtown and he lived on Capitol Hill.

[237] It's not that far from one space to the other, but it was maybe like a 20 minute walk and not in the safest area ever.

[238] When I went over to his house, he had told me that he had an ex -girlfriend.

[239] Her name was Courtney.

[240] They never were married.

[241] They had a son together.

[242] He was three.

[243] He said, we're co -parenting.

[244] He didn't make it sound like they lived together.

[245] Later, you know, down the line, Courtney made it sound like maybe they were still together.

[246] He told me he was single and that he had a son, Bowie, that was three.

[247] He was having me drive them around.

[248] He was having me pick him up from school and bring him home to him, put me in the nanny roll almost right off the bat.

[249] Courtney, I later found out that she was abusing drugs during that time, and I don't know the extent of it, but I could see that Bowie needed parental guidance and figures in his life.

[250] He loved to give cuddles and hugs to me, and he was very sweet.

[251] It was fun to be around him.

[252] I was so young.

[253] I was only 24.

[254] So, like, it wasn't a huge red flag at that time.

[255] Now, if somebody did that to me, I'd be like, whoa, back up.

[256] Jake's biological father was a hairstylist and his mom was his client.

[257] I think she was 18 or 19 and he was older, had a family and was married.

[258] He got her pregnant and she was brought up in a really conservative Christian.

[259] household.

[260] An abortion was out of the question.

[261] She had found a couple at church who had a baby and she was going to give her baby to them.

[262] When she had Jake, she gave that family him and they moved to San Francisco.

[263] From my understanding, it was close to when the adoption was supposed to be finalized.

[264] I think he was like two.

[265] I don't know what age he was, but his foster mom, she nursed him and cared for him and was treating him just like her other child.

[266] And then when the adoption was going to be finalized, Jake's mom changed her mind.

[267] She moved in with them so that she could learn how to be a mom, learn how to take care of Jake.

[268] I think she was with them for two months.

[269] And then she moved back to Washington.

[270] As far as I know, I know that he had a challenging relationship with his mom.

[271] She's not a very lovey person.

[272] She's not cuddly.

[273] When I would hug his mom, it felt like I was hugging a statue.

[274] I'm the opposite.

[275] Like very cuddly.

[276] Him and his stepdad had lots of issues, especially in high school.

[277] They would go on family vacations and not invite him or not bring him along.

[278] He had two younger half -brothers.

[279] Those brothers were much younger.

[280] From my understanding, they did not want him to go.

[281] And I think it was partially his behavior and attitude.

[282] He was jealous of his brothers when they came around.

[283] There was a story that he would tell me about how he pushed his stepdad into the pool at their house.

[284] Jake got mad at him and shoved him in the cool with his clothes on.

[285] June of 2007, after spending a month together, he started responding very little and it felt like he was ghosting me. Then he responded like a month later saying, oh, my phone was turned off.

[286] I'm sorry.

[287] I was kind of over it at that point.

[288] You can't not talk to somebody for like a month and be like, oh, sorry, my phone wasn't working.

[289] In September, of 2007, I started dating somebody else.

[290] Jake would write me love letters and send me emails and tell me how much he loved me and he couldn't live without me. He was so over the top, distraught seeming, that I could move on.

[291] I only dated him for like a month and he would say how much Bill you missed me and please will you come and hang out with us.

[292] I'd be like, okay, I will will hang out with you in a public place because I did not trust him.

[293] He started telling me he wasn't blowing me off, how sorry he was.

[294] He made me feel terrible and told me that Bowie missed me, and I kept hanging out with him because I felt bad.

[295] We hung out in public places.

[296] We would go to the park or I would take his son to the movies, but there was never anything inappropriate happening during that time.

[297] in December of 2007 he had written me an email I had gone back to Orange County for Christmas and in it he was like give me another shot I would never cheat on you and I love you let me show you and I can be your person I'm not going to do what your dad did to your mom and I'm not going to do what your ex did to you really laying it on thick I was like I'm not even going to respond to this I broke up with the person I was dating and two months later I got back together with him I'm somebody that really says what I mean and is honest I couldn't understand why he would say anything that wasn't true or truly how he felt I can't even fathom how you would put that down on paper when you don't mean that we got back together in May of 2008 It was maybe three months in, and I had let him borrow my computer for something.

[298] I had uploaded all these pictures of Bowie onto the computer.

[299] I don't even remember what happened, but he did something that I obviously didn't like.

[300] And I said, I'm out of here.

[301] I'm done.

[302] I went to get my computer, and he grabbed me by my wrist and said, don't you fucking take that computer.

[303] That has pictures of my son on it.

[304] And he spit in my face.

[305] I was like, are you kidding me?

[306] I don't even think I could register what was happening because it was so out of the norm of my life.

[307] I had never had anyone talk to me like that.

[308] No one had ever spit in my face before.

[309] No one had ever grabbed me like that.

[310] Jake's 6 '4, and I'm 5 '3.

[311] And at this point, I'm 100 pounds, and he's probably like 280.

[312] For him to grab me like that is completely unnecessary when the other person is basically the size of a child is pretty disgusting.

[313] He scared me. I took my computer and I laughed.

[314] I didn't call the police less than a week later.

[315] He had Bowie calling me crying, telling me he missed me, telling me that he was hungry and if I would take him to get food or if we could go to the movies.

[316] And I gave in and I went and picked him up.

[317] I really didn't want to see Jake, but obviously he was there.

[318] I went to drop Bowie off with him and he was like, will you talk to me?

[319] Will you please talk to me?

[320] He blocked the door so that I couldn't leave.

[321] He said how sorry he was and how he was going through so much.

[322] And I didn't quite understand how much he was dealing with at that time.

[323] A couple days later, he showed up.

[324] to my work crying.

[325] And I was like, what the hell?

[326] Why are you here?

[327] Don't come here like this.

[328] He had said, I need to tell you something and you're going to be really upset.

[329] And I'm like, okay, what?

[330] And he said, I just gave my daughter up for adoption.

[331] I was like, what are you talking about?

[332] I only know him to have a son.

[333] And apparently this whole time, he's had a daughter, Evelyn, that he was giving up for adoption.

[334] He never told me about it.

[335] I could see it was really hard for him.

[336] This was Bowie's full sister.

[337] I don't really know the full story because it's murky from each of them.

[338] I just know that Courtney was scared of Jake.

[339] When she went into labor, she had another name on her door, so he didn't know where to find her.

[340] from what I was told Evelyn was born addicted to drugs.

[341] I had suspicion that Jake had used drugs.

[342] I had suspicion that he was dealing drugs because he had two phones.

[343] I thought that was so weird.

[344] Why do you need two phones?

[345] And he said one was a work phone, which is like, what?

[346] You're a hairstylist.

[347] Why do you need a work phone?

[348] That doesn't make any sense.

[349] I should have known better.

[350] I couldn't be mad at him for not telling me about Evelyn.

[351] And I assumed that it was too hard.

[352] I think that they gave her up for adoption so that CPS would stop investigating them because when you give birth to a child that's addicted to drugs, child protective services is involved.

[353] I think that they were afraid that they would take Bowie.

[354] And so they did their best to protect him in this situation.

[355] I think that in that they did what was best for Evelyn because she has been given such a better life away from Jake, knowing what I know now.

[356] She was able to avoid so much trauma.

[357] We moved past it, and I didn't hold it against him.

[358] We didn't really talk about it.

[359] There are certain times that he would, around her birthday, he would want to talk about her.

[360] Sometimes we would drop off gifts around her birthday.

[361] When I was going to University of Washington, they have health clinics on campus.

[362] I was having what I thought was maybe a yeast infection.

[363] And so I went to the health clinic and they were like, you don't have any other, like, sexual partners.

[364] I had already been seen there once before and it had a pap and it was normal.

[365] This time, they were like, well, are you sure you're not having other partners?

[366] And I was like, yes.

[367] And they're like, and you're in a monogamous relationship.

[368] And I'm like, yeah, what, like, why are you asking me all these questions?

[369] And they're like, well, he is not.

[370] She struck him with her motor vehicle.

[371] She had been under the influence and then she left him there.

[372] In January 2022, local woman Karen Reid was implicated in the mysterious death of her boyfriend, Boston police officer John O 'Keefe.

[373] It was alleged that after an innocent night out for drinks with friends, Karen and John got into a lover's quarrel and route to the next location.

[374] What happens next next?

[375] depends on who you ask.

[376] Was it a crime of passion?

[377] If you believe the prosecution, it's because the evidence was so compelling.

[378] This was clearly an intentional act.

[379] And his cause of death was blood force trauma with hypothermia.

[380] Or a corrupt police cover -up.

[381] If you believe the defense theory, however, this was all a cover -up to prevent one of their own from going down.

[382] Everyone had an opinion.

[383] And after the 10 -week trial, the jury could not come to a unanimous.

[384] decision.

[385] To end in a mistrial, it's just a confirmation of just how complicated this case is.

[386] Law and crime presents the most in -depth analysis to date of the sensational case in Karen.

[387] You can listen to Karen exclusively with Wondry Plus.

[388] Join Wondery Plus in the Wondry app, Apple Podcasts, or Spotify.

[389] If you are in a monogamous relationship with him, he is not in a monogamous relationship with you because you have they said you get it from having sex with somebody then not cleaning yourself and going and having sex with me. I had suspicion for a long time that he was cheating on me. I couldn't prove it, but this was the first time where it was pretty close to something I can prove.

[390] I went to him and I said, are you seeing other people?

[391] And he's like, no. And I said, well, my doctor tells me that you are.

[392] He's like, well, your doctor's fucking wrong.

[393] I'm like, well, I have this infection.

[394] I really need you to tell me. And he's like, you're so fucking crazy.

[395] This has nothing to do with me. Just because your ex has been cheated on you and your dad cheated on your mom doesn't mean that I'm cheating on you.

[396] You're so fucking crazy.

[397] I remember being like, what is happening?

[398] Because I'm like, they're telling me that this is fact and you're telling me that it's not and I'm begging you to tell me what's going on so that I have clarity for my physical health and he wouldn't he would not admit to doing anything we had just moved in together and I was like why would we move in together if you're cheating on me why not just tell me that you want to see other people.

[399] Why are you in a relationship with me?

[400] I don't understand.

[401] This is around when I first started looking through his computer.

[402] When he would leave, I would see if he was still logged into his Gmail and I would look through his Gmail chats.

[403] I don't even know if they have that anymore, but it was basically like text messaging through the computer.

[404] So it had a full record of what was being said.

[405] This is when I learned about Carly.

[406] I'm Carly.

[407] I met Jake because he came to work at the hair salon that I was working at.

[408] He was really moody.

[409] Sometimes he would be really happy and nice and engaging.

[410] And other times he would be like really sullen, not talk at all in the back room, not say hi, like no warmth.

[411] So really to depended on his mood, and his moods really swing.

[412] He could be happy and charming and funny, or, like, leave him alone because he's not in a good man. But eventually, we became friends.

[413] We all would go out and party together.

[414] Eventually, we were buddies.

[415] I was single.

[416] He wasn't my type, but I was really attracted to him physically, like a magnet, how that happens chemistry -wise, which never.

[417] now that I know everything about him is so terrifying to me because I'm like, what was that that I was attracted to?

[418] In the last couple days, I reached out to a few other people we worked with asking if they had any experiences or memories of him and every one of them mentioned the moodiness.

[419] I didn't have a crush on him, but I did like the situation of being friends with benefits.

[420] I did like that we could hook up.

[421] It was inconsistent.

[422] I wasn't trying to date him at all.

[423] We would hang out usually in a group, really rarely one -on -one, sometimes at the end of the night.

[424] We would hook up and other times we wouldn't.

[425] I started dating someone and got a boyfriend and stopped hooking up with Jake.

[426] That was when the benefits part stopped.

[427] What I remember about that is we had had one last hookup and then afterwards I had a conversation with him and I was like, look, I'm going to like give it a go with this guy.

[428] So I'm not going to be hooking up with you anymore.

[429] He was like, I'll be your boyfriend.

[430] Why don't you just be my girlfriend?

[431] We can be together.

[432] That was the first time that had ever come up.

[433] It was like, oh, that's sweet.

[434] But yeah, right.

[435] You're not ever going to be my boyfriend.

[436] You're not a boyfriend material.

[437] Your hookup material.

[438] You're a fuck boy.

[439] The faithfulness, that was a big part of it.

[440] The other part was that he partied a lot.

[441] He did cocaine a lot.

[442] I partied a lot back then, too.

[443] I was pretty wild in my 20s.

[444] But the way that he used cocaine was not something that I would have, I wouldn't date someone like that.

[445] We stopped hooking up.

[446] We stayed friends.

[447] We still work together.

[448] We all hung out.

[449] We all went out together.

[450] A year later, I broke up with my boyfriend.

[451] and by that time, Jake was with Kalyn.

[452] I wasn't really paying very much attention to Jake at that time, but I remember vaguely that he had gotten this new girlfriend.

[453] I never met her, but the vibe that I got was he was really serious about her.

[454] The vibe that I got was she was a good person and that it was like a good thing for Jake, maybe a positive influence in some way.

[455] He seemed really kind of dedicated and committed to her.

[456] And then we started getting flirtatious again after I became single.

[457] I'm not really sure how things shifted.

[458] I went back and looked through our G -chats.

[459] I didn't save them.

[460] Google saves them.

[461] I could see how it happened slowly.

[462] At first, it was just friendly G -chatting.

[463] We were probably even would do that when I had a boyfriend, and tonically, he slowly started flirting more and more.

[464] He'd bring up times that we had hooked up in the past and then start to suggest that we do it again or hit on me. I'd be like, what about Kaylin?

[465] And he'd be like, oh, we're going to break up.

[466] Kalen's on the out.

[467] He would always downplay and say, I'm about to break up with her.

[468] In the beginning of our friendships, I would hang out with him and his son occasionally.

[469] At one point, he was in court for seeing his.

[470] son.

[471] At the time, I had no idea what that meant.

[472] I had no idea the implications of that.

[473] Now I know that the courts don't just take away visitation from the dad for no reason, especially in Washington State.

[474] They really, really want both parents involved.

[475] I had only seen him just be sweet with his son at the park.

[476] I didn't understand anything about being a parent or family courts, but he shared with me that he was going to be able to see his son again and that his ex had named me as a potential supervisor.

[477] They didn't end up requiring supervision of him, I don't think.

[478] I was so naive at the time.

[479] Now I know that the court does not require a supervisor if the parent is safe.

[480] That's to provide safety for the child.

[481] At that time, I was like, oh, that's cool.

[482] I'm a special person.

[483] I don't know exactly what happened in that court case, but there was a period of time where he couldn't see his son, and then his son was back in his life.

[484] His son was so cute and sweet.

[485] I really, really liked him.

[486] I just had no clue about being a parent.

[487] I remember going to parties at Jake's house where people are doing cocaine and being loud and his son's down the hall trying to sleep.

[488] Now that I have a son, that just seems so crazy to me. But at the time, I just, I didn't really know any better.

[489] At first, I didn't know that he had another kid, his first daughter.

[490] At some point, he mentioned that he had a daughter also, but that he didn't see her.

[491] And that was just the agreement that he had with her mom.

[492] And that was pretty much it.

[493] One time, me and him and our other friend that we worked with that I would later find out was hooked up with at some point.

[494] We all got tattoos together and he got his daughter's initials and that was all I knew about her.

[495] Once he started flirting with me again after I was single and he was with Kaylin and he would say, me and Caitlin are on the outs.

[496] I just need her.

[497] He was back in court for his son and he needed her to testify or support him or whatever.

[498] I can't remember exactly.

[499] But he would say that that's why he hasn't broken up with her yet.

[500] When Kaylin would be out of town, he would come out with us.

[501] And by us, I mean me and our coworkers out at night.

[502] I don't remember if this happened more than once that we hooked up again.

[503] And it was like, oh, oops, we're out late and this just happened.

[504] And it shouldn't have happened, but it happened.

[505] The way that my relationship ended with him, he had invited me to come to his house, his apartment.

[506] and Caitlin was out of town.

[507] We had hooked up before, but it was always, it was an accident.

[508] And now it was like, am I going to purposefully and consciously make this choice to like go over to his house to do this, knowing that he has a girlfriend and that this is wrong?

[509] I did it.

[510] And it's like still something that I really hate that I did.

[511] This is really not behavior that I want to share with the world.

[512] It's part of the shame.

[513] And it's part of why I didn't tell any, what was happening with me and Jake, because I knew it was wrong.

[514] He had a girlfriend.

[515] No one at work knew that this was happening.

[516] What a convenient way to keep us all quiet and to keep us all from talking and figuring out what was going on.

[517] There's a shame involved.

[518] You're ashamed of your behavior.

[519] It's really what keeps survivors quiet is the shame if I can have a chance.

[520] And also, if it's helpful to anyone who is skeptical about believing survivors to just understand that me sharing my story does nothing for me. It makes me look bad.

[521] People don't share this stuff for their own game.

[522] But making that choice to go over to his house, I really, really regret that.

[523] That was the last time I saw him for years.

[524] Shortly after that, I got a message from Kaylin.

[525] I had never met her, never talked to her, and she had found G -chat, Jake and Mize conversation, seen all of the heavy flirting.

[526] And she was like, I don't know if anything has happened between you guys, but she's asking me to not talk to him anymore.

[527] I reach out to Carly and I ask her, what is going on?

[528] Will you please tell me?

[529] Because I can read what's going on.

[530] He's gone to her house.

[531] They're talking about staying the night together.

[532] They're talking about past hookups, but they're not talking about, like, come over so we can do it.

[533] So I have proof.

[534] I wanted real proof.

[535] I wanted real proof.

[536] I wanted her to be like, yes, we are having sex.

[537] I wrote her and asked her, and she ignored me, did not respond.

[538] And I wasn't going to like badger her or continue to email her.

[539] I had asked him about it.

[540] And once again, I was crazy.

[541] I was getting to the point where I was tired and I was done.

[542] And I felt so lonely in this relationship, I was paying for everything.

[543] at this point.

[544] I was paying for Bowie to have winter clothes.

[545] I'd buy winter jackets and I would buy whatever he needed.

[546] He was taken care of, but it was through me. At this point, I've been in his life since he's three.

[547] And so he is somebody that I wanted to protect.

[548] In 2009, when I was getting ready to graduate, I remember wanting to tell my mom, I can't be with this guy anymore.

[549] He's taking everything from me. me. He's like sucking the life out of me. I put on a happy face and pretended like everything was fine and was like, I'm going to break up with him, I'm going to leave.

[550] I can't do it anymore.

[551] And then I got pregnant.

[552] When I told him that I was pregnant, he said, well, now you're going to have to marry me. That's next time on something was wrong.

[553] I start to panic as we are barely getting in our car, I can see in my side view mirror Jake barreling down the road.

[554] He gets there and blocks us in.

[555] He starts punching my window.

[556] As hard as he can, he's punching it over and over again, and he's yelling, and he's enraged.

[557] And he's trying to break the window.

[558] Once Jake wanted something, he would get it come hell or high water.

[559] I never wanted to have sex with him.

[560] I would tell him, no, but he would just continue pushing it and pushing it.

[561] I can't even imagine how much time and effort would be spent talking to all of those women.

[562] There must have been multiple people a day at that rate.

[563] Thank you so much for listening.

[564] Until next time, stay safe, friends.

[565] Something Was Wrong is a Broken Cycle Media Production, created and hosted by me, Tiffany Reese.

[566] If you'd like to support the show further, you can share episodes, with your loved ones, leave a positive review, or follow Something Was Wrong on Instagram at Something Was Wrong podcast.

[567] Our theme song was composed by Gladrags.

[568] Check out their album, Wonder Under.

[569] Thank you so much.

[570] If you like Something Was Wrong, you can listen early and ad -free right now by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts.

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