The Catholic Current XX
[0] This is The Catholic Current with Father Robert Mittag.
[1] The leading cause of death in the 20th century wasn't war, wasn't cancer.
[2] It was democide.
[3] It was governments killing their own people.
[4] So I would say that not trusting the government doesn't make me a conspiracy theorist.
[5] It makes me a history buff.
[6] I think we are getting to a place where our entitlement has degenerated into a kind of assumption that there is no division between ourselves and others, that we are...
[7] are entitled to the fruits of others' labors.
[8] Praise be Jesus Christ.
[9] This is Father Robert McKigge of the Society of Jesus, your daily host for The Catholic Current, where we bring Christ to the world and the world to Christ.
[10] You're listening to us on the station of The Cross Studios, your local radio station, and the iCatholic Radio mobile app where we proclaim the fullness of truth with clarity and charity.
[11] As always, let's start with prayer.
[12] In the name of the Father, Son, and the Holy Spirit.
[13] Almighty God, through the intercession of St. Ignatius, we ask that you pour forth your Holy Spirit upon us, a spirit of discernment.
[14] They might hear your voice and obey your command.
[15] In the name of the Father, Son, and the Holy Spirit.
[16] Amen.
[17] Well, friends, there is a new sheriff in town.
[18] There's a new administration in Washington, D .C., and apparently elections really do make a difference.
[19] And the United States seems to be completely rewriting its relationship with the World Health Organization, the United Nations, and more broadly the world through the unplugging of the U .S. aid organization.
[20] To help me make sense of that, my guest is Vice President for Legal Studies, the Center for Family and Human Rights, and he represents CFAM at Human Headquarters in New York.
[21] Stefano Gennarini, welcome to The Catholic Current.
[22] Thanks for having me, Father.
[23] Stefano, how...
[24] I imagine this has been a busy couple of weeks for you because the map has been rewritten literally and figuratively as well.
[25] What do you make of the changes?
[26] How would you summarize them and how would you characterize them?
[27] Deeply transformative to use an often used moniker.
[28] I mean, but on the left, you often hear the word transformative.
[29] But in this case, we are really hearing transformation.
[30] I mean, from the very first executive orders that President Trump issued, the first substantive ones against the censorship and the weaponization of the federal government.
[31] We are talking here.
[32] about a complete reorientation of the way the federal government does things.
[33] And then the gender executive order, the one on DEI, and then the actions at the end of the first week on abortion, including the statement, very powerful statement of President Trump at the March for Life, the reinstatement of an expanded Mexico City policy.
[34] returning to a strict enforcement of the Hyde Amendment to prevent U .S. taxpayer money from paying for abortions.
[35] And now this week we're hearing about, you know, what the Trump administration is doing as the U .S. Agency for International Development, essentially taking over the agency and evaluating whether or not to shut it down altogether.
[36] We're just very excited about what's coming down the line also.
[37] here at the United Nations.
[38] You know, we're still waiting for Stefanik's confirmation.
[39] And once she comes here to New York, we're really, really are praying for very good things to happen on the pro -life front.
[40] Stefano, if I...
[41] Maybe I misinterpreted the headlines.
[42] I think that they went from a 90 -day suspension of USAID programs to the entire agency has been shut out, and everybody but the janitors have been locked out of the building.
[43] Did you hear that as well?
[44] Yes, and it's only a few janitors, only a select few who were invited to come back.
[45] Okay.
[46] All right.
[47] Yes, this certainly qualifies as transformative, to be sure.
[48] The people who receive federal funds for a living, or better said, distribute federal funds for a living, what has their take been on this?
[49] What have you been hearing professionally?
[50] Well, the reactions have been very interesting.
[51] The media has been quite muted in its reaction against, in fact, even large corporations.
[52] Trump term, anything that Trump did was criticized, and there were threats of boycotts from corporations, from the mainstream media.
[53] Whereas we're seeing criticism now in the media, I think it's a lot more muted than previously.
[54] I think there's like a somber realization that Trump has actually learned how to govern now, and he's actually going to...
[55] going to do a lot more.
[56] He's not going to cave to pressure from within or from outside.
[57] And then that he actually has a plan to govern, which is very significant.
[58] And I think there's a lot of fear amongst career civil servants.
[59] And there's a lot of obviously negative reactions internationally.
[60] including complaints that the shutdown of USAID or the interruption of USAID pending review of all grants is going to impact people negatively.
[61] But I think a lot of people are realizing that interrupting USAID and reviewing everything that the agency does.
[62] is also going to expose a lot of corruption.
[63] And exposing that corruption is going to delegitimize a lot of those programs that people think are doing good, whereas, in fact, they're very political in nature.
[64] Friends, my guest today is Stefano Giannarini.
[65] He's vice president for legal studies of the Center for Family and Human Rights.
[66] Stefano, I'm a humanities major, so numbers make me dizzy.
[67] And I'm also, I'm not partisan, you know, put not your trust in princes.
[68] But I can't help but notice that certain things are being said out loud now that weren't being said, you know, even two weeks ago.
[69] For example, Zelensky of Ukraine said, yeah, you know, You just sent us $100 billion recently.
[70] We can't find it.
[71] I think that's noteworthy.
[72] I think that should give a great power pause, for example.
[73] And I know that the Division of Office of Government Efficiency and so on has been getting into the Treasury and those responsible for remittances.
[74] And one employee just walked out and one hand over the passwords.
[75] apparently, and we don't have the details yet, but it looks like a whole lot of mischief, maybe even money laundering has been going on for a very long time.
[76] I think there might be some very red faces coming up in the future.
[77] Where do you think we'll go from here?
[78] We've got about three minutes left in this segment.
[79] What do you think might be coming next?
[80] Well, I'm not sure what's going to be coming next.
[81] I'll tell you what I hope will be coming next.
[82] One of the things that I hope that the United States realizes is that most of our international assistance for health is going to programs that are promoting a radically unhealthy way of living around the world, including by encouraging promiscuity.
[83] in early sexual debut, sexual exploration, moral equivalence of all sexual behaviors, and this kind of thing around the world.
[84] And it's actually making the world unhealthy.
[85] And I hope that one of the things that comes out of this shakeup at the USAID and the State Department is a foreign policy and foreign aid policy that actually builds goodwill towards the United States.
[86] states instead of promoting ideological colonialism around the world.
[87] Could you unpack that phrase, ideological colonialism?
[88] I'm pretty sure I know what it means, but it's probably not an everyday phrase around the dinner table.
[89] That's right, yeah.
[90] I mean, it's a term that's been coined and used multiple times by the popes in recent years to describe how...
[91] The system that was created after the Second World War for multilateral cooperation, specifically the United Nations and other international organizations, have been converted into colonial mechanisms.
[92] So instead of using international assistance programs, multilateral cooperation programs, or even bilateral assistance programs to help poor countries, essentially, what we are seeing is mechanisms to control the domestic politics.
[93] and policies of poor countries from mostly Western wealthy countries.
[94] And this is a sort of a new form of colonialism where the colonialism is hiding behind international institutions and other sort of aid mechanisms.
[95] And so what people don't realize is that this actually undermines democracy and it actually doesn't help those poor countries who are badly in need of not only physical assistance, but also moral assistance in the sense of learning to develop their own self -governance.
[96] Right.
[97] And this is not anything new.
[98] I mean, I've taught medical ethics for many years so that I know for decades someone from the U .S. government has said, hey, too bad about that earthquake.
[99] You want help rebuilding?
[100] All right, start passing out the contraceptives and start legalizing abortion.
[101] I know that one of the things that was done in the previous administration just as they were heading out the door was to put aside $50 million for condoms in Gaza.
[102] And whatever else the Gazans might need at the moment, I understand their need is great.
[103] It's a tragic, sad situation there.
[104] I'm pretty sure that $50 million worth of condoms was not really on their Christmas list.
[105] I'm pretty confident about that.
[106] And, you know, I think someone has figured out, hey, you're drunk, you can't drive, and you can't have the credit card anymore.
[107] And I really do want to see where this goes next.
[108] Friends, we come back.
[109] We're going to continue our conversation with Stefano Gennarini of CFAM.
[110] We're talking about the United States' new relationship with world organizations.
[111] Remember, our rallying cry here at the Catholic Current is Christus Mundo, Mundus Christo, bringing Christ to the world and the world to Christ.
[112] We do it because our Lord says so, for the greater glory of God, the love of our neighbor, and the salvation of our own soul.
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[141] We're talking about America's new relationship with the world.
[142] My guest today is Stefano Gennarini.
[143] He is with CFAM.
[144] Stefano, let's look at the World Health Organization.
[145] I've worked in medical ethics for...
[146] For many years, I've never really been a huge fan of the World Health Organization.
[147] And it seems that every year, every six months, there is new efforts to have a treaty to say, hey, you know, if people get sick, don't you want to give your sovereignty over to us so that we can make decisions for you?
[148] Which seems kind of counterintuitive to me. What's going on?
[149] What's the new relationship with the United States and World Health Organization these days?
[150] Well, right now there's a standoff going on in the administration and the World Health Organization, and it's about how U .S. resources are used.
[151] We're also talking about the fact that CDC and NIH have dozens, I think over 100 staff that works for both the federal agency and the international agency jointly.
[152] And so essentially.
[153] The United States has used the World Health Organization as a branch of our own federal health agency that takes care of global health and tries to use sort of an international agency as a cloak for achieving global health interests of the United States.
[154] countries over the World Health Organizations and the fact that the World Health Organization has an agenda of its own right now, which seems to be independent of what even member states of the organizations agree to, including the promotion of abortion, the aggressive promotion of abortion.
[155] So this standoff is very important because it's creating a lot of close looking at what the World Health Organization is actually doing, and several countries have signaled their willingness to withdraw from the World Health Organization, including Italy.
[156] And this shows the importance of taking a strong stand like what the Trump administration is doing now, and to get other countries on board, because it's not enough to just, you know, withdraw from the World Health Organization because the World Health Organization is likely to continue to operate without U .S. support, even though the U .S. is the largest single contributor to the World Health Organization.
[157] The World Health Organization would continue to go on with European support and support of other Western countries, as well as other countries like China and international foundations like the Bill and the Gates Foundation.
[158] which has 10 % of the World Health Organization budget.
[159] But what we want to ensure is that, you know, if a World Health Organization continues and the US continues to participate in it, and whatever form the World Health Organization takes in the future, we actually have a coalition of countries with aligned interests that is going to reform the organization.
[160] That's very important because it's, you know, Let's say a Democrat comes into the White House in four years' time.
[161] They're going to rejoin the World Health Organization on day one, right?
[162] So if the Trump administration's withdrawal is just by himself, as the United States withdraws by itself, it doesn't have much of an impact on the World Health Organization other than simply scaling back some of the programming.
[163] But what you want to do is actually...
[164] reform the organization from within.
[165] And in order to do that, you have to get a coalition of countries on your side.
[166] So, you know, the threat of withdrawal, even actual withdrawal, is an important first step in sort of creating that negotiation space.
[167] Friends, we're talking about America's new relationship with the world.
[168] My guest today is Stefano Gennarini, Vice President for Legal Studies at the Center for Family and Human Rights.
[169] So what's the upside and what's the downside of America making a cold break with the World Health Organization?
[170] Well, the upside is that the United States, as the largest single donor to the organization, has a lot of leverage.
[171] And so it has a lot of shock factor.
[172] And then the downside of the U .S. withdrawing from the World Health Organization.
[173] is that the World Health Organization can set policy without taking into account U .S. interests, because the European countries will simply laugh off the Trump administration's withdrawal and think, OK, now we don't have to worry about what the U .S. even thinks.
[174] We're just going to set the policy and we're just going to wait till a Democrat goes into the White House.
[175] And then they're just going to rejoin the World Health Organization anyways, because they're always on our side anyway.
[176] And that's the real danger of U .S. withdrawal, that if unless the U .S. has more countries that join its sort of a nuclear option in order to reform the organization and reform how global health assistance is done, then it's actually going to hurt U .S. interests in the long run.
[177] I have every confidence that the Trump administration and the United States, if it actually employs all its foreign policy assets to reform the World Health Organization, can do it and sort of to reform it in a lasting way.
[178] But that's where this game is going to be won or lost.
[179] conservative Americans who just simply think we can just withdraw from these things and entirely ignore them.
[180] And I don't think that's actually a good idea.
[181] I think it's important for the United States to engage these organizations effectively.
[182] The problem is conservatives have simply abandoned any effort to engage these organizations for many, many years and have left them up to sort of the liberal foreign policy establishment.
[183] to deal with.
[184] Friends, we're speaking today about America's new relationship with the world.
[185] My guest today is Stefano Giannareni.
[186] He's vice president for legal studies at the Center for Family and Human Rights.
[187] Stefano, what are the odds that America can use its leverage?
[188] And I know there's some other nations that are talking about pulling away from participation and therefore funding of the World Health Organization.
[189] And if you want to get people's attention in a hurry, you threaten their wallet.
[190] What are the chances that we can get the World Health Organization to take the more pro -life stance that has been adopted in Washington in the past two weeks?
[191] Will the World Health Organization say, we've seen the light, we don't want to fund or promote abortion, we've seen the light, we actually want to promote chastity rather than the idea that latex works like magic?
[192] Are those reasonable prospects?
[193] They are eminently reasonable prospects if there is political will.
[194] And obviously the personnel, you know, because personnel is policy.
[195] So if there is the political will, the United States has the resources and the ability to turn this ship around, beginning with changing the leadership.
[196] You know, the current director of the World Health Organization has been an abortion advocate his entire professional life.
[197] an international Planned Parenthood stooge.
[198] And he has done everything possible to advance the abortion agenda within the organization.
[199] So beginning from the top, there's a lot that has to be done, including, you know, mixing programs and reviewing a lot of the health guidance that the World Health Organization has put out over the last...
[200] 20 years in particular.
[201] But it's going to take work, right?
[202] And it's going to take conservatives and pro -life conservatives who want to engage the international space, which are few and far between.
[203] Because sadly, conservatives tend to be a little bit isolationist.
[204] And, you know, a lot of conservatives here in the United States in particular.
[205] don't see the benefit of engaging the international mechanisms at all.
[206] And that's a pity because international mechanisms, whether we like them or not, are going to be around in some form or another going forward.
[207] And so it's important for the U .S. to make sure that these international mechanisms are defending UN interests.
[208] and that we have an ability to set policies within these mechanisms.
[209] I want to open up a big can of worms, and we only got two minutes left in this segment.
[210] Is anyone at the United Nations saying, oh my gosh, maybe we're next?
[211] Do you think that's something that's happening now?
[212] Oh, absolutely.
[213] I am certain.
[214] I'm sure the folks at...
[215] a couple of UN agencies called the UNFPA, the UN Population Fund, and UN Women, which is the UN Super Agency for Women.
[216] These are mostly lobbying agencies around the world, and their programming, especially UN Women, is designed simply to promote the gender agenda around the world, the intersectional gender agenda, so the whole transgender madness.
[217] And I am certain that they have full -time lobbyists in Washington, D .C. I am certain that they are furiously lobbying in the Senate offices.
[218] And, well, until last week at USAID, not this week, it's shut down.
[219] And I'm trying to make sure that the money from Congress keeps flowing to them.
[220] There is, I remember a line from one of my favorite movies was Time Bandits, and there was John Cleese played Robin Hood, and he says, won't you join us?
[221] There's ever so much wealth to distribute.
[222] And then I think of Margaret Thatcher who said, you know, the problem with socialism is eventually you run out of other people's money.
[223] I think there are some people...
[224] who have made a very nice living redistributing other people's money for their own purposes and i think for a very long time no one in a position of authority said wait a minute why are we doing this And is this the only way that we can govern?
[225] And maybe, just maybe, there's an idea that people should keep their own money.
[226] I know John Kerry said, you can't let people keep their own money.
[227] They'll only spend it the way that they want to.
[228] I think that might actually be a good idea.
[229] Friends, we come back.
[230] We're going to continue our conversation with Stefano Gennarini of the Center for Family and Human Rights.
[231] We're talking about America's new relationship with the world.
[232] In light of the fact, there's a new sheriff in town in Washington, D .C. After the broadcast today, go to thestationofthecross .com, get our resources list, download our audio podcast.
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[255] Praise be Jesus Christ.
[256] This is Father Robert McTague of the Society of Jesus, your early host for The Catholic Current, where we bring Christ to the world and the world to Christ.
[257] You're listening to us from the Station of the Cross Studios, your local radio station, and the iCatholic Radio mobile app where we proclaim the fullness of truth with clarity and charity.
[258] We're talking about America's new relationship with the world.
[259] My guest today is Stefano Gennarini.
[260] He is Vice President for Legal Studies at the Center for Family and Human Rights.
[261] Stefan, I think it's fair to say there is a paradigm shift taking place, and I know there's a lot of ink being spilled already.
[262] But I've been told by a number of analysts, and I'm inclined to agree, that the new relationship with USAID, the World Health Organization, the UN, is America putting off the mantle of empire.
[263] America is not the hegemon.
[264] America is not the world's policeman.
[265] And we live in a multipolar world where we're going to act on our interests and people who are allies and were very helpful, at least somewhat, and, you know, pushing back against the Soviet Union.
[266] That war ended a long time ago.
[267] We've got to do things differently.
[268] So we're, you know, we talk about the fourth turning in 85 -year cycles, 80 -year cycles.
[269] Now, if 1945 was the beginning of the American empire, we're kind of on schedule for the end of empire.
[270] I'm sure you've seen analyses to that effect, too.
[271] What do you make of them?
[272] So without a doubt, American influence has lessened over the last 20 years in particular.
[273] not only around the world, but also within multilateral institutions themselves, simply as a result of the fact that other great powers are emerging.
[274] Even though nobody comes close to the United States yet, with the exception of China, but you have India, you have Brazil, South Africa, as I said, China.
[275] Pakistan, several countries that have very powerful economies, powerful economies, growing young populations, and they see the next 100 years very differently than the United States.
[276] U .S. power has diminished over the last 20 years.
[277] And I think one of the things that the Trump administration is trying to do...
[278] is increase the trench of power within this balance of power that the United States wields, or maybe just wield the leverage that the United States has in a more effective way to secure U .S. interests.
[279] But I think one of the biggest conflicts now within the U .S. foreign policy establishment is, of course, between those who think that the United States should wield hegemonic power in a sort of imperial way.
[280] And those who think that the United States should instead have a more conservative sort of foreign policy doctrine, sort of more closer to the Monroe Doctrine or the doctrine that the United States has had since the founding, which is the idea that we're not going to get involved with what's going on within other countries unless we're talking about, you know, our very close neighbors or where they feel that our national security is threatened.
[281] Right.
[282] And I think that we're coming to a point too now where some of us are recognizing that the United States is dead broke.
[283] You know, we're $37 trillion in debt.
[284] I think, I forget the percentage, but the vast, vast majority of dollars ever printed, if we can still use that term, have been printed in the last five years.
[285] You know, eventually, you know, it's like, you know, we all have to clap for Tinkerbell or she'll die.
[286] You know, we all have to believe that the U .S. dollar is worth something.
[287] Eventually, my fear is that people are going to stop clapping.
[288] And then we've got some really, really serious problems.
[289] And since we're throwing buzzwords around like paradigm shift and multipolar reality, let's take out the old favorites of the military -industrial complex.
[290] War is a big business.
[291] War is a racket.
[292] And candidly, some people got really, really rich.
[293] helping to supply the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan and Ukraine and in the Middle East.
[294] Is anyone, do you think, in the military industrial complex starting to break a sweat nowadays?
[295] I wonder about that.
[296] I'm not that, you know, an expert on sort of defense contracts and that kind of thing, but from somebody who observes it with...
[297] Knowing a little bit about U .S. foreign policy, I have to say that not yet.
[298] Not yet.
[299] I don't think the military -industrial complex is quite yet afraid.
[300] And I don't think they necessarily need to be afraid because the United States is always going to be investing heavily in the U .S. military.
[301] And I think what the Trump administration wants to do...
[302] is increase investments in the U .S. military and get more countries to buy from the United States to have the U .S. military have a greater influence.
[303] Yes, and I think the world is a very big place.
[304] What do you understand, and the role of the United States in relation to the big place that is the world, is shifting.
[305] Where would you like to see it go?
[306] If you had seven or eight minutes with Donald Trump and ten of his best friends, what would you begin to advise?
[307] Well, I would advise a foreign policy where, first of all, there simply can't be any peace.
[308] or international cooperation without respect for sovereignty.
[309] This is the foundation of the international order since the peace of Westphalia.
[310] It's the recognition that every country has sovereignty and the sovereignty is an expression of the legitimacy of the government of each country, which is a...
[311] You know, and I think that works not only from a legal standpoint, it also works from a sort of a natural law, common sense standpoint, in the sense that, you know, in the Catholic tradition, in any case, we've been talking about the importance of respect for sovereignty and the legitimacy of government, you know, since Thomas Aquinas and before then.
[312] Sure.
[313] I think, without a doubt, foundation of the U .S.'s relations with other countries should be respect for their sovereignty and their right to self -determination.
[314] And that this is the foundation not just of the international legal order from the point of view of great power politics, it's also the foundations of respect for human rights.
[315] So today you see human rights being pitted against sovereignty.
[316] And I think we have to go back to that kind of foundations for foreign policy.
[317] Because if we fall into sort of the great power politics perspective, then the only way to run the world is through an endless succession of wars.
[318] Right.
[319] And that doesn't serve anybody well, but a very small handful of people and a lot of young men die horribly.
[320] And I'm enough of a student of history to know that I really don't want that sort of thing anymore.
[321] And since we're talking about Catholic social principles and social teaching, we have to give a shout out to the principle of subsidiarity.
[322] that says you only go to the next higher level of government when the level that you're at isn't sufficient anymore.
[323] But the people who are affected by the decisions should have the preponderance of decision -making power.
[324] And the idea that someone in a distant capital is going to make decisions for everyone and that some unelected, unaccountable bureaucrat, whether in Washington or Brussels or wherever is going to decide health policy or economic policy or trade policy or the nature of borders.
[325] That offends human dignity, and I think it offends God's plans for a nation and the understanding of law.
[326] So someone needs to volunteer to give the new administration a crash course on Catholic social theory and Catholic political theory.
[327] I'm not volunteering myself.
[328] My specialty is metaphysics and medical ethics, but there should be somebody out there to begin to volunteer.
[329] Stefano, we got about three minutes left.
[330] It's time to put fresh batteries in your crystal ball.
[331] What do you think is going to happen near term in the coming weeks and months with the new administration?
[332] I think that if the Trump administration is able to put in place all their nominees, I think we're going to see a really incredible moment in our government's history, simply because the change will come fast.
[333] The pace of the last two weeks has been tremendous.
[334] And if the Trump administration is able to get all its nominees in place, then what we're going to be seeing is more of this pace, and we may actually see an acceleration.
[335] And so what I hope to see...
[336] is the conservative, pro -sovereignty, pro -life, pro -family perspective.
[337] I think the whole world is hungry for this kind of leadership.
[338] They're waiting for the United States to exercise pro -sovereignty, pro -life, pro -family leadership in the world.
[339] And I think a lot of countries will join Trump's efforts to reform the United Nations if he is sincerely and politically committed.
[340] to those kinds of changes.
[341] I think that what would really, really help with that is to just open up the books.
[342] Let people know this is where the money has been going.
[343] for so very long.
[344] I mean, I'm already getting reports that what's being discovered by the Department of Government Efficiency is that we've been financing terrorist organizations that we've been fighting against for years.
[345] Again, Zelensky of Ukraine says, yeah, we can't find that last $100 billion that you sent us.
[346] When we look at the Pentagon, how many audits it has failed, we have been taxing ourselves into oblivion.
[347] And I would like to hear members of the Catholic hierarchy acknowledge that an oppressive tax burden...
[348] inhibits people from starting families and starting small businesses.
[349] And that is catastrophically bad for society.
[350] It's bad for families.
[351] It's bad for the economy.
[352] It's bad for the church.
[353] It violates every form of law you can think of.
[354] And I think that if we had a big reveal as to where the money has been wasted and where the money has been laundered and where the money has been siphoned off to a few pockets, I think that you'll have that populist response that will demand concrete and, I hope, irrevocable results.
[355] And again, I'm not a partisan.
[356] If I criticize one candidate, it doesn't mean I'm promoting another.
[357] If I praise one policy, it doesn't mean I'm voting for anybody in particular.
[358] We live in a fallen world.
[359] I never forget that.
[360] But I believe we have an opportunity to do better than I ever dared hope for in my lifetime.
[361] Stefano Gennarini of CFAM, thank you for a fascinating conversation, and I do hope you'll join us again soon.
[362] Thank you, Father.
[363] It's my pleasure.
[364] I'm Jesuit Father Robert McTague, your host here every day of The Catholic Current.
[365] You want to stick with us for the rest of the hour.
[366] Coming up next, timely thoughts reflecting on what you and I heard today.
[367] Be part of the conversation.
[368] Follow what we're following by following us on Gab.
[369] That's G -A -B .com.
[370] The channel is The Catholic Current, and you can influence the conversation.
[371] You can contact us at thestationofthecross .com slash askfather.
[372] Comments, questions, objections, reread them all.
[373] We're in this good work together.
[374] Be back in just a minute.
[375] Just two minutes, please do stay with us.
[376] This is Jesuit Father Robert McTague, your daily host of The Catholic Current.
[377] Join me on Thursday at 5 p .m. Eastern to welcome back Dr. Michael Pakulik of the Catholic University of America.
[378] Our topic will be Catholic clarity about charity.
[379] Are we obliged to provide free stuff for everyone to infinity?
[380] Find out on The Catholic Current on Thursday at 5 p .m. Eastern, coming to you from the Station of the Cross and the iCatholic Radio mobile app.
[381] Have a question or feedback about today's episode?
[382] Want to suggest a guest or a future topic?
[383] Go to thestationofthecross .com and help influence the conversation.
[384] Praise be Jesus Christ.
[385] This is Father Robert McTague of the Society of Jesus, your daily host for The Catholic Current, where we bring Christ to the world and the world to Christ.
[386] You're listening to us from the Station of the Cross Studios, your local radio station, and the iCatholic Radio mobile app, where we proclaim the fullness of truth with clarity and charity.
[387] Here we are, the last segment of a timely Tuesday.
[388] You know what that means?
[389] You and me sharing timely thoughts, reflecting on what we've heard today.
[390] My guest, who I was very glad to meet, is Stefano Giannarrini.
[391] He's Vice President for Legal Studies at the Center for Family and Human Rights.
[392] We're talking about America's new relationship with the world.
[393] Before I get into that, I want to talk about our new relationship with the Catholic current.
[394] We've made some adjustments to the schedules.
[395] We have to be good stewards of our gifts, and we've got over 1 ,500.
[396] amazing episodes in the archives, rightly called classic episodes.
[397] And for folks who are just joining us, you might want to hear what we've been doing so far to set the tone.
[398] And for folks who've been with us for a while, it'll be good to refresh your memory.
[399] So here's the deal.
[400] On Mondays and Wednesdays, we'll be offering classic episodes of The Catholic Current.
[401] So if you join us tomorrow at 5 p .m. Eastern, we'll have the classic episode with my good friend, Jesuit Father Robert Spitzer.
[402] We'll be talking.
[403] about the four levels of happiness.
[404] And here's the deal.
[405] On Mondays and Wednesdays, in addition to the classic episode, you're going to get bonus content.
[406] If you go to your favorite Podcast platform of choice.
[407] There'll be 10 minutes of new content.
[408] I'm going to be giving a little talk called When Did You First Suspect?
[409] And then bonus bonus, an advertised special on aisle seven of The Catholic Current.
[410] That podcast will be available with video on the iCatholic Radio.
[411] YouTube channel.
[412] So if you want to see what I mean when I say that my face was made just for radio, this is your opportunity.
[413] And if you're really curious, you can look over my shoulder and see what books I have on the shelf.
[414] That having been said, let's reflect on what we talked about today.
[415] My guest and I were talking about significant changes taking place in America's relationship with the world now that there's a new administration in Washington, D .C. And make of the change what you will.
[416] We're nonpartisan here at The Catholic Current, but it is undeniable that the changes have been rapid, they have been many, and they have been significant.
[417] What are we to make of all that?
[418] We're going to be talking at length with other guests about all that.
[419] Here's my take on it.
[420] I believe that in politics, there should be no forbidden questions.
[421] I think it's 100 % fine to ask, why are we doing that?
[422] Who decided it was okay?
[423] How do we know that it's working?
[424] Is it really worth it?
[425] And I think it's 100 % okay for people to say, Who's getting money?
[426] Where is the money coming from?
[427] How do we know we're getting our money's worth?
[428] And I think it's especially right to ask that question when you realize America is $37 trillion in the hole.
[429] $37 trillion in debt.
[430] You, your children, your grandchildren, and their great -great -grandchildren are going to be on the hook for generations and generations and generations just to pay the interest on a debt that benefited them not at all and that they did not vote for.
[431] So it is not wrong at all to ask, is this really right?
[432] Is this really just?
[433] Does this benefit anybody except a few?
[434] And we can even ask, is this madness?
[435] And I do want to ask those questions.
[436] You know, when you're kids, you assume that, you know, mom and dad have a money tree in the backyard, there's a gold mine in the backyard, there's an oil well in the backyard.
[437] There's something where there's just infinite money.
[438] all the time.
[439] And of course, that's childish.
[440] And I remember when I was a sophomore in high school, gosh, all those years ago, for a year, I was part of Junior Achievement where with other high school kids, you put together a business.
[441] And one of the things that you learned was, it's really hard to run a business.
[442] It's really hard to turn a profit.
[443] You got to work your tail off to turn a profit.
[444] Money has to come from somewhere.
[445] And we have to recognize that we ourselves are the gold.
[446] Money is just a fungible proxy for human effort, intelligence, creativity, labor, and sweat.
[447] And when we squander money, we are squandering, if you will, human capital.
[448] And that's not okay.
[449] And I think lots of people with putatively good intentions who've never had to pay the rent or cover someone's salary have the solution that the only genuine Catholic charitable attitude is more free stuff for everyone to infinity.
[450] And no. No, I remember when Paul Ryan was Speaker of the House and he was speaking at a very prominent Catholic University and he was vilified because he was going to slash federal spending.
[451] And what he was really doing was he was slowing the rate of the increase of spending.
[452] He wasn't really cutting anything.
[453] And I think it's not illegitimate to ask.
[454] You know, there are people in Gaza in very great human need.
[455] And someone in the federal government with access to your tech dollars said, you know what I'm going to do before I sign out for good?
[456] I'm going to put aside $50 million for condoms for Gaza.
[457] Somebody thought that was a good idea with your money.
[458] I'm going to see if Mr. Producer can find out how many condoms $50 million can buy before I sign off here today.
[459] We'll see if we can do that.
[460] Friends, we need to have a very serious conversation, not only about justice, but also about charity.
[461] Is it wise?
[462] Is it...
[463] Is it godly?
[464] Is it advisable that churches present themselves just as NGOs, non -governmental organizations, who work as agents of Caesar to distribute largesse to preferred recipients collected from citizens at gunpoint?
[465] I don't think that is a good look for Christian people.
[466] institutions.
[467] And if we can't afford to care for the physical needs of the poor, then we need to have an examination of conscience and ask why not.
[468] How many people did we lose?
[469] How many people did we let go?
[470] How many people did we drive away so that now there really is no one to serve the corporal works of mercy on this account except for um except for diocesan bureaucrats that that's a fantasy that's madness and i think it is well that we can have this conversation because i think it's been a forbidden topic for a long time I'm Jesuit Father Robert McTague, your host here every day of The Catholic Current.
[471] Just a reminder, join us for a classic edition of The Catholic Current tomorrow, 5 p .m. Eastern.
[472] Jesuit Father Robert Spitzer will be talking about the four levels of happiness.
[473] On Thursday, we'll be welcoming back Dr. Michael Pakalik of the Catholic University of America.
[474] We're going to be talking about Catholic clarity, about charity.
[475] After the broadcast today, go to thestationofthecross .com, get our resources list, download our audio podcast.
[476] Where you can find audio, you can find us.
[477] Take us to your family and friends.
[478] Together we'll take it to the whole world.
[479] Through the intercession of Our Lady of Mount Carmel, may Almighty God bless you, Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.
[480] Go in peace, and please do pray for me, for I am a sinner.
[481] Thank you for listening to this podcast brought to you by thestationofthecross .com, a listener -funded nonprofit organization.
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