79 - Sharpest Needle In The Tack

[0] This is exactly right.

[1] Hey, this is exciting.

[2] An all -new season of only murders in the building is coming to Hulu on August 27th.

[3] Steve Martin, Martin Short, and Selena Gomez are back as your favorite podcaster, detectives.

[4] But there's a mystery hanging over everyone.

[5] Who killed Saz?

[6] And were they really after Charles?

[7] Why would someone want to kill Charles?

[8] This season, murder hits close to home.

[9] With a threat against one of their own, the stakes are higher than ever.

[10] Plus, the gang is going to Hollywood to turn their podcast into a major movie.

[11] Amid the glitz and glamour of Los Angeles, more mysteries and twists arise.

[12] Who knows what will happen once the cameras start to roll?

[13] Get ready for the stariest season yet with Meryl Streep, Zach Alfinacus, Eugene Levy, Eva Longoria, Melissa McCarthy, DeVine, Joy Randolph, Molly Shannon, and more.

[14] Only Martyrs in the Building, premieres August 27th, streaming only on Hulu.

[15] Goodbye.

[16] Bye.

[17] Seral Audio.

[18] Hi.

[19] Hi.

[20] Welcome to my favorite murder.

[21] This is the podcast where we tell you true crimes and horrible things that happen to good people.

[22] Yeah.

[23] And a little about ourselves sometimes when we...

[24] Oh, just a tad.

[25] Just a touch about ourselves.

[26] When we feel like going on a tangent, which is every single episode for a minimum 49 minutes.

[27] Yeah.

[28] It's sprinkled throughout.

[29] Get ready.

[30] Oh, yeah.

[31] Also, we don't just keep it at the top.

[32] We'll put it in the middle and then also at the end.

[33] I mean, listen.

[34] Look.

[35] Look and listen.

[36] Okay, so we should probably start with the biggest announcement and the one that people constantly tweet us about and ask us about.

[37] Thank you for your interest.

[38] We are going on tour again, and we are now going to announce the dates of our Australian and American tour.

[39] tour.

[40] Are you ready to hear what we're doing?

[41] Yeah, Australia, you know already, but we're adding a couple shows, actually.

[42] So, New Zealand, Auckland is, there are still tickets available.

[43] It's on Wednesday, September 16th.

[44] And then we're...

[45] September 6th.

[46] Thank you.

[47] Wednesday, September 6th, the beginning of September.

[48] And then we're adding shows in Melbourne and Sydney, because we have two shows at each, and they sold, or one, they sold out.

[49] So September 10th in Melbourne at the Comedy Theater.

[50] Melbourne.

[51] Melbourne.

[52] And September 12th in Sydney, Australia, there's another show at the fucking opera house.

[53] At the Sydney Opera House.

[54] At the Sydney Opera House.

[55] Dude.

[56] Side room.

[57] Is that true?

[58] We're in the jazz room.

[59] No, I have no idea.

[60] And we're actually in the bathroom.

[61] We're just going to be in the bathroom.

[62] Yeah, that's right.

[63] If you want to come and talk to us at the Sydney Opera House, we're going to be loitering in the women's bathroom from 9 to 11.

[64] It's actually a chamber orchestra that night, but we'll be in the bathroom.

[65] Yes.

[66] Do you want to switch off and we'll just do the dates and cities of each one after?

[67] Yeah.

[68] Okay, so listen to this, you guys.

[69] On Friday, September 29th, we're coming to Detroit, Michigan.

[70] So excited for that.

[71] On October 13th, San Diego, California.

[72] On October 14th, Anaheim, California.

[73] On October 19th, Minneapolis, Minnesota.

[74] On October 20th, Madison, Wisconsin, Wisconsin, Wisconsin, Wisconsin, Wisconsin, Wisconsin, Wisconsin, Wisconsin, Wisconsin, Wisconsin, Wisconsin, Wisconsin, Wisconsin.

[75] We're going to be there.

[76] November 3rd, Tampa, Florida.

[77] November 5th, Fort Lauderdale, Florida.

[78] November 10th, this is big.

[79] They've been waiting for us.

[80] Houston, Texas, we're coming to you.

[81] Fuck, yeah.

[82] And then November 11th, don't worry, Dallas.

[83] We're going to be there.

[84] Oh, hell yeah, Dallas.

[85] We saw your TV show.

[86] We know how good you can be.

[87] December 8th, St. Louis, Missouri.

[88] And then December 9th, Kansas City, Missouri.

[89] And that's it for our 2017 tour.

[90] And then there's going to be more stuff going on in 2018.

[91] But so we also want to tell you guys, okay, so Monday, July 31st at 10 a .m., the pre -sale tickets go on sale, and the password is Murderino.

[92] But you have to go to my favorite murder slash live and then click the links for each show there because otherwise some fucking scalpers are going to buy them and tell them.

[93] you that this is the link you want to use and it's not true so if you want the official link you have to go to my favorite murder .com forward slash live and then find your city there and buy your tickets off the link that we have listed we can't read there's lots of complaints last time about scalping and prices and all that kind of stuff and that's why we do presale so our fans that hear this show can get their tickets first and then you have to do it off the official link obviously we can't you know, we can't make everything work, but that's, we were trying to make things a little bit better so people aren't like buying some, you know, nasty, weird website tickets that don't exist or whatever.

[94] So, murderino.

[95] That's, I'm, which I'm really excited about a lot of these cities, and I won't say which ones I'm, I was about to say which ones I'm most excited about.

[96] I mean, that would be great to not, for you to not say what you aren't looking forward to.

[97] I'm not going to do that.

[98] Um, okay.

[99] What else?

[100] else do you have you got nothing um no I have a thing or two let's hear it okay well it's all just like my rambling but my brother was on a jury where someone died it was like a race car guys on the street and they crashed into a car and killed someone and as he was telling me my seven -year -old nephew was like yeah and like giving me details so it was like okay he knows about it how cute would it be if I recorded him talking about it hometown and so I was like Micah tell me what happened and he was just like, well, someone died.

[101] It was so depressing that I was like, well, I'm okay.

[102] Yeah.

[103] Not playing that.

[104] Yeah.

[105] That's sad.

[106] Yeah.

[107] Yeah, I don't think seven years.

[108] Last night at a show I did, someone's like, oh, my nine and ten -year -old nieces loved your show.

[109] And I was like, that's bone -chilling.

[110] I don't think that's good at all.

[111] Nine and ten -year -olds turn this off.

[112] Yes, but then.

[113] You can lose a couple of listeners.

[114] Some awesome murderinos that were also backstage, one of the guys, I'm sorry, I can't remember your name.

[115] He goes, that's around the time I started.

[116] are getting interested in true crime and then I was like oh okay okay then I don't feel as bad that's true I guess right yeah I think for me it was sixth grade so yeah kids are very advanced and it's like the even though it's not true crime it's like the revving up of it the things are suddenly really interested in like scary movies and bad things and um actually speaking of children this girl named Sarah underscore hall tweeted as a photo of her nine -year -old sister and she said she just named her own bat she I guess was in baseball she just named her own bat, Ted Bundy, all on her own.

[117] Yeah.

[118] I was like, well, that's fucking incredible.

[119] Yeah, that's hilarious.

[120] I mean, Georgia is so loves a pun.

[121] I love a pun and I love a nine -year -old.

[122] You know, and I love baseball.

[123] I mean, it's everything you love.

[124] Love her for everything.

[125] If only that little girl had a vintage dress on the wall, she did that.

[126] Lose my mind.

[127] Later.

[128] Well, I got a tweet that I found very interesting and it's like, this is the kind of, you know, conversations that we like to have.

[129] It was the Coastal Horizons, Rape, Crisis Center in Wilmington, North Carolina, sent to tweet.

[130] So they basically said, hey, ladies, big fans of your podcast.

[131] However, we were disappointed to hear the unintentional victim blaming that took place on the 2020 episode, re -covering your drinks.

[132] The onus is never on the victim to stop an assault.

[133] We need to have a culture shift where instead of telling victims what to do or not to do, tell perps, hey, don't rape people.

[134] Yes.

[135] Also, alcohol is the number one drug used to facilitate sexual assault, not roofies, in parentheses, not saying it doesn't happen, but misinformation can unintentionally compound victims' trauma.

[136] We are a rape crisis center in Wilmington, North Carolina, and we frequently hear victims blaming themselves because they, quote, did everything right, my friend watched my drink, et cetera, and they are still assaulted.

[137] So just wanted to let you all know, love your work.

[138] which I think is such a good point totally um we obviously and we don't it's not like we need to make excuses but when we were having that conversation we were coming from that that point of view which is very for me it's very 80s of like you have to you have to like you have to um be on the lookout at all times kind of yeah beyond the defense and kind of like be aggressively you know aware and all that kind of stuff but it's such a good point that it doesn't matter you can be the most aware you can be the most you know responsible all these things and then something can happen to you yeah and we never want people to feel like in any way obviously that that would be our messaging so that they're to blame because that that hurt me so much and made me sad of like they come in there and feel to blame they mean they didn't cover their drink like we're telling them to do or but the fact that she said it's usually alcohol not it's just alcohol it's not like they need to roof you to take advantage or to assault you yeah exactly it's actually a very common thing that people use all the time that doesn't make anybody feel that worried in the beginning.

[139] And it's the, yeah.

[140] I think also we were having that conversation because it was around the time that that girl, uh, was that thing that happened in Santa Monica where these women saw a guy, right, some, a drug into a girl's drink.

[141] And they basically went and got her in the bathroom and we're like, we just saw this thing.

[142] So we were kind of going off of that in a way, but, you know, thank you for the correction.

[143] Because that's a really good point.

[144] And that really is, you know, please.

[145] raise your sons not to rate that would be great yeah that would be awesome um did you see the trailer for the movie my friend domlin yes holy shit oh my god we're not being paid we're not being paid we should be i want to see it today i know it looks so great it looks so good i love that there's not it doesn't seem like there's anything about him being an older person and actually committing is there that's not what the book's about i didn't i only i don't think it is it is because I feel like I did read that comic book, the graphic novel, but I can't remember the end.

[146] I mean, it's just the story of him, but I think it's him in high school and basically when it all started.

[147] I think it's going on the idea that you already know who Dahmer is and what he's done.

[148] And then so while you're watching the movie, you're like, oh, this is a thing that made it happen.

[149] This is a thing that started it.

[150] It's Teenage Dommer.

[151] Yeah.

[152] It looks and it looks so creepy and so eerie.

[153] It's really ominous.

[154] they're the very one of the first shots in that trailer is kind of a wide of the front of a school and it's just kids in kind of like late 70s clothing walking around and then you just notice there's a guy just standing there staring and it's really fucking creepy it almost looks like if napoleon dynamite was like a scary movie yeah yeah yeah that's exactly fucking right if you change the soundtrack to the Napoleon dynamite which I love when people I love those those I love like the Mrs. Doubtfire as a horror movie?

[155] Have you seen that one?

[156] Oh, yeah.

[157] I fucking love them.

[158] Or The Shining as a rom -com or like a family sitcom?

[159] Totally.

[160] Or like a coming together.

[161] What's that song?

[162] Da -da -da -da -da -da -da -da.

[163] Oh, um, is it, uh, Shakira?

[164] Were you singing Shakira?

[165] Probably.

[166] Hips don't lie.

[167] Y -M -C -A.

[168] I think it's the Solsbury, the Peter Gabriel's song, Solisbury Hill.

[169] Something like that.

[170] Salisbury Hill.

[171] Salisbury Hill.

[172] Okay.

[173] Because I thought saying Salisbury was clearly going to be wrong.

[174] So I didn't say it.

[175] You were scared to risk it.

[176] I see.

[177] Steak.

[178] Got you.

[179] Salisbury steak and all that.

[180] You know that beautiful Peter Gabriel's song?

[181] Loaning up on Salisbury steak.

[182] I love that song.

[183] It's so like there's those weird, I don't know what instrument it is, but it's like, pooh, pooh, pooh, pooh, pooh.

[184] It's all like, oh, ho, ho, ho, who.

[185] Like he's blowing into a windpipe.

[186] Is that a thing?

[187] Or like, what was the ones you had to play it as a kid, a recorder?

[188] I love Peter Gabriel.

[189] There might be a recorder solo at the beginning of Salisbury.

[190] Salisbury Steak.

[191] Salisbury Steaks.

[192] All of that is misinformation.

[193] That entirety of misinformation.

[194] Wait, what were we talking about?

[195] Oh, Jeffrey Tomor.

[196] Fucking Napoleon Dynamite.

[197] If you have, if you're an editor, if you have the time.

[198] Yes.

[199] If you care.

[200] Could you please make Napoleon Dynamite into it?

[201] I bet you could take.

[202] Into a scary movie with a soundtrack.

[203] I bet you could take the like trailer from Napoleon Dynamite.

[204] Just put all of this, the exact same.

[205] um like voiceover and words from the trailer for domer just put him in there so yeah so it's like napoleon dynamite's mouth is moving in that weird like his braces are still on but they're not mash it up his friend his friend his friend Pedro is the friend who wrote the book like it's perfect it's perfect did you plan this yes it's all written down oh is it no no it's not see those no, oh man, nothing I say is ever planned, obviously.

[206] I never plan anything.

[207] We absolutely assure you that almost nothing is pre -written on the show, even the things that are supposed to be.

[208] Yeah, like our stories.

[209] I think that's all I had.

[210] Did you have anything else?

[211] I'm sure I have other things that I just can't think of.

[212] Oh, I keep writing things that I don't know, like, I'll be like, oh, I should make a note for pre -show, and then I don't know what it means.

[213] So I have Yan Can Cook written down.

[214] Jan Cancook, I feel like, is from when we were talking.

[215] I was watching it the other night.

[216] And then I was like, I got to talk to Karen about this.

[217] I don't remember why I would talk to you on a murder podcast about Yan Cancook.

[218] Because that guy fucking murders chicken.

[219] That guy is the best.

[220] Then I wrote embarrassing illness.

[221] I don't know what that means.

[222] That's probably Crohn's disease.

[223] Yeah.

[224] And then I wrote, Stardust equals anxiety.

[225] Do you mean angel dust?

[226] I don't know.

[227] And I was like, I think I spelled, I wrote something wrong, and I was like, I'll remember.

[228] Were you on drugs or drink?

[229] Yes.

[230] Yes.

[231] Yes.

[232] Yes.

[233] Yes, always.

[234] Well, how do we figure any of those things out?

[235] You just take some time with it?

[236] No, I don't think we need to.

[237] I think as long as I say them.

[238] Okay.

[239] And then everyone knows.

[240] Then if we're standing somewhere and a yang can't cook whatever comes by, we're both going to be like, this is what it is.

[241] Yeah.

[242] And Stardust equals anxiety is probably something really interesting.

[243] Well, there's a movie called Stardust.

[244] Is there?

[245] Yeah.

[246] I don't know.

[247] Star D's memories is a Woody Allen movie.

[248] He would give you agita if you were.

[249] Yeah.

[250] No, it's not that.

[251] I haven't watched that.

[252] Okay.

[253] Anxiety.

[254] Is it that we're all made of Stardust and that makes you worried?

[255] I think it's that, yeah.

[256] I think it's that I get anxious when I think of the entirety of the universe, but I don't know how that has to do anything with murder.

[257] Well, we talked about that one time.

[258] We did.

[259] Because I said, oh, it was when I said, did you see that picture from the Hubble Telescope that showed universes and balls of gas?

[260] And then you were like, please don't do this to me. So I must have wanted to elaborate on that and I was on drink.

[261] Do you think there's a movie or something called Stardust that you saw as a child and that you discovered why it gives you so much anxiety?

[262] I don't know.

[263] I feel like trying, just generally trying to figure out Worries is a fascinating podcasting.

[264] Like, what are you worried?

[265] Isn't there a podcast like that?

[266] I'm being sarcastic.

[267] Oh.

[268] I got excited.

[269] Isn't you go, isn't there already a podcast like that?

[270] I think there is, though.

[271] I think I'm worried about the universe.

[272] I can't remember how, though.

[273] Yeah, I just am.

[274] I don't need to explain why.

[275] If people get, everyone gets it.

[276] Sure.

[277] Well, you need to explain why if you bring it up.

[278] Yeah.

[279] That's really your own.

[280] only the only thing you go.

[281] Yeah, and I did.

[282] Stardust gives me anxiety.

[283] That's not an explanation.

[284] The enormity of the universe gives me anxiety.

[285] Oh, okay.

[286] All right.

[287] Okay.

[288] Okay.

[289] Um, should we do this?

[290] Yeah, I mean, I want to ask Stephen who's going, but he's not trustworthy.

[291] Steven just told me that he keeps getting it wrong, which sucks because you're a big, you're like, I'm like, well, Stephen knows.

[292] Oh, no, he doesn't.

[293] I'm, I'm, I'm no longer a rock um you were attacked you were attacked by that twitter account who was like step and get it together you've been wrong three times in a row shut up you know what it is you know what i realized what it is my brain was doing to me was it's like karen georgia karen like i'm doing that in my brain so that's why i kept saying you would go first because in my mind georgia went last time but she went last last so you're not going you're going karen georgia karen georgia yes but that's not Karen, Georgia.

[294] Georgia.

[295] Karen.

[296] Karen.

[297] Yeah.

[298] I'm just, my brain completely just fell apart at that moment.

[299] So what can we do to fix this going forward?

[300] We have two things that people have made us of how to tell.

[301] Like Twitter accounts?

[302] No, remember the things they gave us at live shows?

[303] I know, but those are like a large abacus?

[304] Is Stephen going to drive around with that in his car?

[305] No, we can leave here.

[306] Right?

[307] I mean.

[308] I mean, it's your house.

[309] Flip a coin or.

[310] Do you think you have it this week?

[311] It's Georgia.

[312] Yeah.

[313] Yes, I thought so, too.

[314] I really knew that.

[315] Stephen wouldn't buck it up this time.

[316] I want to break him over the coals.

[317] I needed it.

[318] Stephen, you have five chances.

[319] You abused three.

[320] I just love the idea there's a Twitter account now attacking you because of the job.

[321] What's it called again?

[322] Who went first last week?

[323] Yeah.

[324] Well, there was, like, they were like five days since accident or something like.

[325] Oh, my God.

[326] I love it.

[327] They were like keeping track and that it was like this many days since.

[328] Oh, should I give it?

[329] Elvis isn't dead, everyone.

[330] Yes, you should definitely give that up.

[331] So last week I talked about how Elvis was at the vet and how scary it was.

[332] Turns out the kitten we got, Dottie, gave everyone fucking crazy infection, an uprest in her infection.

[333] I really, truly thought Elvis was going to die, and I had my cry, and I, you know, apologize to him and held him.

[334] Like, truly.

[335] And he's better now.

[336] He's on the men.

[337] He's not going to die, but he lost his voice.

[338] It's so cute.

[339] you have, before you leave, you have to see him open his mouth to meow and nothing comes out.

[340] Yeah, so maybe Doddy will have to do the sign off.

[341] Did you see the fan art that people made of Elvis in, in front of a black background, and it just says, I survived on the side.

[342] And then in quotes, and it's the first time I saw it, in quotes, it says, yeah, so this kitten tried to kill me, dot, dot, dot, dot, or something like that.

[343] The first time I saw it, I almost had a hard attack.

[344] I was like, if she sees it, she's going to fucking shit a brick because he was still not out of the woods, yeah?

[345] Right.

[346] And it was hilariously awful where I was like, I think I'm going to have to ask these people to take it down.

[347] Oh, well, right.

[348] Now I think I didn't see.

[349] Oh, my God.

[350] If he died ever, yeah.

[351] So thank you ever to everyone.

[352] Everyone was so sweet and, you know, said nice things and reassured me. And yeah, the vet was like, he's not going to die.

[353] Calm down.

[354] So, thanks, thanks Village Bet.

[355] Good update.

[356] Yeah, all as well.

[357] Positive updates.

[358] Hey.

[359] Hey, this is exciting.

[360] An all -new season of only murders in the building is coming to Hulu on August 27th.

[361] Steve Martin, Martin Short, and Selena Gomez are back as your favorite podcaster, detectives.

[362] But there's a mystery hanging over everyone.

[363] Who killed Saz?

[364] And were they really after Charles?

[365] Why would someone want to kill Charles?

[366] This season, murder hits close to home.

[367] With a threat against one of their own, the stakes are higher than ever.

[368] Plus, the gang is going to Hollywood to turn their podcast into a major movie.

[369] Amid the glitz and glamour of Los Angeles, more mysteries, And twists arise.

[370] Who knows what'll happen once the cameras start to roll?

[371] Get ready for the stariest season yet with Merrill Streep, Zach Alfinacus, Eugene Levy, Eva Longoria, Melissa McCarthy, Devine, Joy Randolph, Molly Shannon, and more.

[372] Only Martyrs in the Building, premieres August 27th, streaming only on Hulu.

[373] Goodbye.

[374] Karen, you know I'm all about vintage shopping.

[375] Absolutely.

[376] And when you say vintage, you mean when you physically drive to a store and actually purchase something with cash?

[377] Exactly.

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[388] Connect with customers in line and online.

[389] Do retail right with Shopify.

[390] Sign up for a $1 per month trial period at Shopify .com slash murder.

[391] Important note, that promo code is all lowercase.

[392] Go to Shopify .com slash murder to take your retail business to the next level today.

[393] That's Shopify .com slash murder.

[394] Goodbye.

[395] I, okay, so I go first.

[396] I just forgot.

[397] All right.

[398] This is the story of the collar bomb heist.

[399] Okay, awesome.

[400] You don't know it?

[401] I don't even really know what you just said.

[402] Okay.

[403] It's the story of the collar.

[404] So a collar bomb, meaning like a collar around your neck.

[405] Collar bomb.

[406] Is this a woman and her daughter?

[407] No. Okay.

[408] Heist.

[409] Okay.

[410] And I just want to up top say that there is an article called and wired by a rich Shapiro that has a really good overview of everything happened.

[411] So I used a lot of his information and I just wanted to give him props for that.

[412] And it happened.

[413] He wrote it in 2010.

[414] So there's a little bit of an update since then.

[415] Great.

[416] But so we're in Erie, Pennsylvania.

[417] I looked this up on my favorite murder email to see if anyone had talked about it and it's from their town and a girl named Jessica A. said, the winters are terrible and the summers are filled with water sports on the lake and lots and lots of drinking.

[418] In fact, you will find either a church or a bar at every corner, which I think describes the town really well.

[419] All right.

[420] August 28, 2003, at 228 p .m., a 46 -year -old local man named Brian Wells, walks into a PNC bank in Erie and passes the teller a note.

[421] The note says, gather employees with access codes to the vault and work fast to fill this bag with $25 ,000.

[422] you only have 15 minutes.

[423] Then he lifts his shirt to show the teller a handcuff -like collar attached to his neck.

[424] And according to the note, it's a bomb.

[425] Oh, fuck.

[426] The bomb's like a DIY homemade device.

[427] It's got a metal collar attached around Wells' neck, like a handcuff.

[428] And there were keyholes and a combination lock as well as baking timers and two six -inch pipe bombs.

[429] baking timer yeah you mean like the white ones that you turn that your mom's like you have five minutes sitting in that chair i love that it's never used for banking it's for fucking punish baking it's for punishing your children yes exactly or just being like oh i have to do something in 10 minutes at that timer nobody bakes that is okay how disturbing as you're that you're that teller you stayed up really late the night before drinking wine with your friends you roll in you're like i'm in power through this day.

[430] Yeah.

[431] And I'll be fine.

[432] Yeah.

[433] Because I'm going to go out drinking with my friends again.

[434] Yeah.

[435] And a guy walks up, I imagine sweating profusely.

[436] Yeah.

[437] And like, if a guy walks up to you and your teller and passes you a note, you're like, fuck.

[438] It's not going to say like, hey, how are you?

[439] Next to this, I lost my voice.

[440] I'm Elvis.

[441] I lost my voice.

[442] I'm Elvis.

[443] I'm here to rich awesome cookies.

[444] Yeah.

[445] And no, no, no. It's all bad.

[446] Always bad with a note.

[447] Yeah.

[448] Always bad with a guy that has to pull up a shirt to prove a point.

[449] And he's like, clearly there's something bulging in his shirt collar.

[450] Yeah.

[451] And he has a, he has a shirt on.

[452] His neck is really thick.

[453] Yeah.

[454] It looks, I bet it would look like he has like a, like a trache, tracheotomy.

[455] Tracheotomy.

[456] Kind of.

[457] It kind of looked like that.

[458] And he has like two shirts on and the shirt over it.

[459] And it says, the shirt says, guess.

[460] It's like a guest brand shirt.

[461] No. Which just like fits the.

[462] Are you being sarcastic?

[463] I fucking swear to God.

[464] I fucking swear.

[465] Okay, I'm going to stop hypothesizing.

[466] I let you tell the story.

[467] No, please.

[468] That's the show.

[469] Just the, the, the, the.

[470] visual of like that but like the jerry -rigged baking timer and then but there was also a couple magnetic letters from his refrigerator and I mean you know what I mean and a pipe cleaner and some old gum yeah stuck to the okay yes I don't know who the victim is I don't know who's guilty and I'm saying things like that well it's okay because here we go okay um so the teller's only able to give brian $8 ,700 because there isn't a way to get into the vault at that time like there wasn't enough people there.

[471] So the baking timer goes off.

[472] And then you suddenly smell cookies.

[473] And Elvis is like seconded line.

[474] Hey!

[475] Excuse me, those are mine.

[476] Pulls a cookie out of his neck handcuff.

[477] Yeah.

[478] And says thanks for doing business with him.

[479] But he does do, and I'm not fucking kidding.

[480] He takes the money and leaves and he grabs a dumb, dumb lollipop on his way out.

[481] Oh.

[482] Puts it in his mouth.

[483] Okay.

[484] So he's not as stressed as maybe.

[485] That's what you would think.

[486] Okay.

[487] Or he's really stressed and he needs something to occupy him?

[488] I relate.

[489] Doubtful, though.

[490] Well, I just feel like if you think you're about to blow up.

[491] Yeah.

[492] And look, I love candy.

[493] I don't think it would be.

[494] You're not like, I'm going to blow up.

[495] Oh, dummums.

[496] Oh, my God.

[497] You know when you get these for Halloween, you get like 10 of them at a time?

[498] You stuff them all in your mouth at once because then it's like a real lollipop.

[499] I would just eat it fast and then use the stick as a cigarette.

[500] Yes.

[501] Just stand around fake smoking.

[502] Look how good I look smoking.

[503] Guys.

[504] Um, all right.

[505] Maybe that guy needed a cigarette, Ney, that was the closest thing.

[506] That's what it is.

[507] And he was like, I probably can't smoke around a bomb.

[508] Those things Charlie don't go hand in hand.

[509] There might be gasoline in this.

[510] Definitely.

[511] Yeah, I don't know how bombs are made.

[512] You pour gasoline on them?

[513] I don't know.

[514] About 15 minutes after he walks out, State Troopers spot Brian Wells, that's his name, standing outside of his, guess what kind of car he has?

[515] If you get this right, I'm going to barf.

[516] Is it a Lamonts?

[517] No, it's that.

[518] I don't know.

[519] It's like some kind of, A pseudo -fancy car?

[520] No. It's a Geo Metro.

[521] Oh, remember those?

[522] Second only to the Ugo in bad cars.

[523] It's for you young kids, it's just like the first hatchback and those aren't cool.

[524] It's like a Fiat that gave up on itself.

[525] It's like an 80s hatchback.

[526] But this is 2003.

[527] I don't know.

[528] Wait, he had a Geo Metro in 2003.

[529] Yeah.

[530] Maybe he was an antique shitty car collector.

[531] Do you know what he actually was?

[532] What?

[533] A pizza delivery man. Yeah.

[534] Okay.

[535] So you can see a piece of deliver man having that car.

[536] Yeah.

[537] Okay.

[538] But the tires have absolutely no tread on them once.

[539] Yeah.

[540] They're like all, what's the ones in the back?

[541] Oh, like the replacement tires?

[542] Yeah, they're all replacing tires.

[543] Yeah, they're all spares.

[544] Four spares on a geometro.

[545] I'm sorry we're making fun of this guy.

[546] But it'll be okay and you'll find out why.

[547] Okay.

[548] It's not, well, you'll find out why at the end.

[549] It actually gets really fucking bad.

[550] Yeah, I bet it gets bad.

[551] It gets really bad.

[552] Okay.

[553] So they apprehend him.

[554] They cut his hands, behind his back and then Brian says to them that while out on a pizza delivery he had been attacked by a group of black men because that's everyone's excuse who claim who chained the bomb around his neck at gunpoint and forced him to rob the bank yep that's how it's done he says it's gonna go off I'm not lying he's like desperate at this point it's gonna go off I'm not fucking lying and I just say one thing yes always I my first agent in this business who was a who was a mastermind and a genius one of the first pieces of advice she ever gave me was whether whatever people explicitly state to you for without you asking them is a lie just immediately reverse it in your head of like saying like if I went to a meeting at a management place and they were like look we don't just take whoever and like throw it all against the wall and see what happens it's like oh you just take whoever and throw it yeah is that kind of thing where you just have to kind of why would you proclaim this to me if it were true and I didn't even ask you yeah exactly or say I'm not lying yes that means I'm lying why would you need to tell people that if you have a live bomb on your body or that just happened to you I feel like probably sociopath say I'm not lying a lot because they don't expect people to believe they don't expect people to be smart enough to be like I know that that's a line that people say to get them like and they just don't think anyone's smart that's true I would think that they would be the kind of people who wouldn't say I'm not lying is almost just like a try and I don't think they try them or they know the tells.

[555] I think they're just like so balls out yeah that they're just like I'm not nervous therefore you're never going to ask me a question in the first place.

[556] Right and if you ask me I'm going to tell yeah okay you're going to believe me. All right I'm not lying so the officers call the bomb squad and they take their positions behind their cars their guns are drawn and they leave Brian sitting in the middle of the street cross -legged handcuffed behind his back with his bomb around his neck and he's in the middle of the road just sitting there and okay there's video all this and okay I'll tell you a second okay for 25 minutes while news crews news people are filming there they he's laying in the street he's sitting across like him in the street kind of like slumped in the street um he's kind of fidgeting and stuff so they're sitting there for 25 minutes then out of nowhere the device starts to beep uh -oh beep and you see him it's all on video.

[557] You see him kind of look down and start to struggle like he's trying to get away from the collar and then it fucking goes off.

[558] No. Yeah.

[559] And there is video on this and they don't warn you that they're about to show it.

[560] And so I saw it and I got really, and having to look this up and look at video and news stuff, I just kept having to turn my head away because it's so awful.

[561] And he's fucking dies.

[562] That's horrifying.

[563] So you know this guy dies and you see this bomb go off.

[564] And people are probably watching it live and see this happen.

[565] Fuck.

[566] I'm so surprised.

[567] Yeah.

[568] Okay.

[569] He looked surprised, too, that it was even going off, meaning I don't think he thought it was real.

[570] And it detonates a loud explosion, blowing into his face.

[571] He falls back onto the ground.

[572] He dies almost instantly, I believe.

[573] The bomb had ripped a huge hole in his chest.

[574] Three minutes later, bomb squad arrives.

[575] Oh, no. I know.

[576] So later the police searched his car and they find handwritten notes that were addressed to the bomb hostage.

[577] And they say, one of them says there's only one way you can survive and that is to cooperate completely.

[578] This powerful booby -trapped bomb can be removed only by following our instructions.

[579] Act now, think later, or you will die.

[580] Sorry, handwritten notes to this guy?

[581] Yeah.

[582] So it's basically, they're handwritten notes to Brian.

[583] I thought that meant his handwritten.

[584] written now.

[585] Yeah.

[586] Someone else had written these notes to him.

[587] They were in his car.

[588] So the police had caught him.

[589] It was almost like a scavenger hunt, but he had to rob the bank, then go to these certain places to get the keys, give them the money, that sort of thing.

[590] Right.

[591] So, but police had caught him in the middle of the scavenger hunt.

[592] So they tried to finish the scavenger hunt themselves and find the notes, but someone had removed the remaining notes after Brian had been killed.

[593] So they found the places where they were supposed to be, but there wasn't anything else there.

[594] And sorry, was that, like the video you watched or whatever, was that shown live on the news?

[595] It had to have been because people were talking about having watched it.

[596] Fuck.

[597] Yeah.

[598] Sitting there with their kids, probably.

[599] And it was at like three o 'clock something, so there must have been kids after school watching that.

[600] 100%.

[601] How traumatized are those children?

[602] It's the worst.

[603] I watched it and I was, I am a little fucked up from it.

[604] No, you can't like, yeah, it's that kind of shit you have to be so careful.

[605] And paired for her.

[606] Yeah.

[607] All right.

[608] They traced Brian's last pizza delivery on the day of his death, which is when he said he got attacked.

[609] They found that his last order was to be delivered on the outskirts of the city at a local, at a location of it ended up being a TV transmission tower where the address was.

[610] And they could tell by the scuff marks in the dirt that that's where the caller had been attached.

[611] But he was supposed to be off right before that call came in to order the pizzas, which was kind of mysterious.

[612] all right then cut to september 20th less than a month after the bomb killed brian 59 -year -old bill rothstein who was a handyman and lifelong resident in the area calls 911 he gave the operator his address and told him there was a frozen body in his garage freezer what yeah he told him that what he the story his story was that in mid -august his ex -girlfriend marjorie deal armstrong had called him and told him she had shot her live -in voice friend, James Rodin, in the back with a Remington 12 -gauge shotgun in a dispute over money.

[613] And then she asked him to help her clean up and move the body, which he agreed to.

[614] And so the body had been in his freezer for five weeks.

[615] He also melted down the gun and scattered the pieces around the county.

[616] Wow.

[617] Yeah.

[618] Thoreau.

[619] Thorough.

[620] How do you melt down a gun?

[621] I don't even fucking know.

[622] Power tools?

[623] I think he was a handyman.

[624] Yeah.

[625] He's a handyman, so he probably knows a lot about.

[626] He had some fucking welding thing.

[627] Exactly.

[628] Probably put some, like, I don't know.

[629] You know there's some powder you can probably put on something to make it flammable.

[630] Oh, I think I've seen things where if you put Diet Coke on a piece of meat.

[631] Oh, why do we?

[632] Stop it.

[633] I got so excited.

[634] Isn't that a thing?

[635] It is.

[636] But I'm sure it doesn't melt guns.

[637] I'm almost positive.

[638] Let's try it.

[639] Let's see.

[640] Steven, get your gun out.

[641] It just shoots both of us.

[642] Can that be hilarious?

[643] they told me you I have it on tape it's such a weird ending to that podcast because everyone liked Stephen now we're not wondering he really didn't like those girls but is it just fictional the whole podcast now we have to go back and listen again the whole thing was a play and we have to write down all the times we yelled at Stephen slowly building the rage and Steve and you can hear him breathing in the background harder and harder every week meanwhile he has both hands over his face laughing like a little bright red little Japanese girl just giggling giggling Stephen.

[644] Okay, so he tells them he just couldn't go with the final plan, which was to grind the body up.

[645] So he called 911.

[646] He was afraid of what she might do to him.

[647] So he says he was so distraught that he had even considered killing himself rather than turning himself in.

[648] And he had written a suicide note in which he said who the body was in the freezer.

[649] When he didn't kill him, it says, nor participate in the death.

[650] And then the note ended with, this has nothing to do with the well.

[651] case.

[652] Oh, no. For no reason, says that in the note.

[653] Because he lived behind the TV transmission spot.

[654] Uh -oh.

[655] Yeah.

[656] Okay, now look at my theory, how it's been completely reversed right in my face.

[657] Which is what now?

[658] This, it's the, the first guy going, the victim, saying, I'm not lying in my theories.

[659] That's because he's lying.

[660] Well, then this guy is saying this has nothing to do with it.

[661] Out of nowhere.

[662] Like, he hadn't even been questioned.

[663] about it.

[664] Yeah, don't bring it up.

[665] No. But BTW.

[666] No. So, obviously, what my research reveals is that there's no hard and fast rule about statements.

[667] Or is there?

[668] Or we are not done yet.

[669] Oh, shit.

[670] Twist and turns all over at that place.

[671] They made a movie 30 minutes or less.

[672] Yes.

[673] That came out like 2011.

[674] My friend Ruben Flesher directed that.

[675] Oh, nice.

[676] Well, they think it's like loosely based on this.

[677] So they'll be twists and turns.

[678] Oh, wow.

[679] Okay.

[680] Don't worry.

[681] I haven't seen it, so I don't really know.

[682] But, um, all right.

[683] So here's a little bit about Marjorie, the woman who killed her, uh, boyfriend.

[684] So in 19, she's fucking, in 1984, she's 35.

[685] She's charged with murdering her then boyfriend, Robert Thomas.

[686] Rob Thomas, isn't he from Matchbox 20?

[687] Yeah.

[688] I just hit me. She claimed she shot him six times in self -defense, as you know how you shoot someone six times in self -defense?

[689] Yes.

[690] Well, just to really finish it off.

[691] Just to kill She doesn't.

[692] She was very OCD.

[693] She wanted to finish all the bullets in the gun.

[694] Right.

[695] Sorry, this is the same woman who had the body in the freezer.

[696] Yeah.

[697] This is the body in the freezer woman.

[698] This is a different relationship.

[699] Yes.

[700] Okay.

[701] Years before.

[702] Okay.

[703] A jury acquits her.

[704] And then four years later, her husband, Richard Armstrong, dies up to cerebral, cerebral hemage.

[705] Nope.

[706] Hemorrhers.

[707] Those two words together cancer.

[708] Cerebral hemorrhage.

[709] Yeah.

[710] And, but he, when he got to the hospital, he had had a head injury.

[711] But the death is still ruled accidental and never followed up with by the corner.

[712] Which head injuries and cerebral hemorrhaging don't go.

[713] That's not a thing.

[714] They don't go together?

[715] Yeah, yeah.

[716] Cerebral hemorrhaging means your brain is bleeding, which means someone hit you really fucking hard on the head or something.

[717] Doesn't hemorrhaging just happen, though, too, like the way when people have a stroke or something like that?

[718] Oh, I do.

[719] I feel, look, look, look and listen.

[720] Neither of us are going to claim we're right.

[721] my my assumption as a as a doctor is um no i just think hemorrhaging hemorrhaging can happen in any kind of a way it's not specific to just like an aneurysm aneurysm is when you're like a vessel in your brain explodes and then usually you die okay so yeah hemorrhaging that sounds right okay we please doctors yes please tell us how to do this podcast the best way to let us know about something is to scream at us on Twitter.

[722] I just want everyone to know.

[723] That's the only time we listen.

[724] That's right.

[725] It's screaming on Twitter.

[726] With our hearts.

[727] We're doctors.

[728] Let's see.

[729] Death has ruled accidental.

[730] So Marjorie is like extremely smart, but she suffers from bipolar disorder and she's found to be paranoid and narcissistic.

[731] In 1984, they found 400 pounds of butter and more than 700 pounds of cheese rotting inside her house.

[732] Sorry.

[733] This is from the wired.

[734] article.

[735] Can I repeat this?

[736] So I think she was a hoarder.

[737] So 400 pounds of butter.

[738] How much is that?

[739] It's so much.

[740] Well, a pound of butter is the four cubes.

[741] Okay.

[742] That's a pound of butter.

[743] So she had 400 of those.

[744] And 700 pounds of cheese.

[745] I mean, that's just a dream come true.

[746] I mean, what kind of cheese?

[747] If we're talking about fucking crap singles, I'm out.

[748] If she had it stored somewhere, it's Velvita because you can, you can leave that like in a warm room for two years and nothing will happen.

[749] It's plastic.

[750] Could I tell you what Vince made me for dinner last night?

[751] I was like, oh, I forgot to tell you this, too.

[752] Damn it.

[753] Did you go?

[754] Can I get on a gross food tangent real quick?

[755] Please.

[756] Okay.

[757] So last night Vince, Vince brought home.

[758] He did the thing of I've been craving this thing from childhood and I was like playing along like, I'll try it with you, baby.

[759] So he made me a bologna and American cheese sandwich on white bread.

[760] Yes.

[761] I used to have them every single day.

[762] It was great.

[763] We never had like we never got to have any of that good stuff.

[764] Yeah.

[765] So I had nitrates.

[766] Yeah.

[767] Sometimes he'll fry up the bologna.

[768] Wow.

[769] I know.

[770] But what happened, and this is just, I'm explaining who Vince is, on like Saturday, I picked him up after a thing and we were both hungry and I was like, where should we go.

[771] And I always am like, no, I don't want to go there.

[772] And like, we go where I want to go.

[773] But he was like, he was like, this place, this place or this place.

[774] And I was like, okay, baby, you pick which I was being nice.

[775] Like, I'm just trying to not be a fucking asshole anymore.

[776] Good, good.

[777] Yeah.

[778] But in that effort.

[779] Yeah.

[780] So we went to the Olive Garden for brunch on Saturday.

[781] How do you feel about that?

[782] All I see is like a bunch of Italian spices mixed into shit that I don't want there.

[783] That's the first thing I think of.

[784] You are 100 % correct.

[785] He ordered.

[786] They had a thing called an Italian margarita.

[787] He ordered it.

[788] The guy at the bar was just like such a sassy, funny person.

[789] And he put it in front of the margarita in front of him.

[790] And then he put down a little like shot glass of amaretto and he goes, that's what makes it Italian.

[791] I was just like, oh, I love you.

[792] It was so great.

[793] But they have a nice little soup and salad deal.

[794] Anyways, at the end.

[795] Bottomless brood sticks, right?

[796] Yeah.

[797] Come on.

[798] The salad's actually good.

[799] On the way out, a girl stops me and she goes, don't I know you?

[800] And I did the, oh, searching for my brain.

[801] And she goes, just kidding.

[802] I'm a huge fan.

[803] So she was a waitress there.

[804] And she was just like really cool.

[805] Great.

[806] That's it.

[807] Okay.

[808] I got recognized at the Olive Garden.

[809] Hell yes.

[810] The Olive Garden.

[811] Hell yes.

[812] Because when you're there, you're family.

[813] I was family.

[814] So thank you.

[815] Wait, don't I recognize?

[816] You're my aunt.

[817] Yeah.

[818] Oh, hi.

[819] Oh, my God.

[820] Nice to see you.

[821] Aunt Carol.

[822] Oh, all right.

[823] 700 pounds of cheese rotting inside her house.

[824] Okay.

[825] Sorry.

[826] Yes.

[827] Because you can't even get that from a store.

[828] It's not you can go to an end of vance or whatever your local chain is called and be like, that's all the butter that they have for the month, essentially.

[829] Yeah.

[830] and they yeah do what's she doing do you know how she got it no okay nothing about it it's rotting okay can you imagine the smell like does like it turns but it takes a long time like you can leave it out on the counter and it won't go bad for a while I mean we never we always refrigerate our butter which I hate cold butter you can put it on a plate as long as it's covered on the counter yeah talking about I don't fucking know someone someone is dead someone is so many people are Yeah.

[831] All right.

[832] So I wrote so in capital because I think I knew we were going to go on this tangent.

[833] So back to the, okay.

[834] In fact, when preparing to be tried in the shooting death of her first ex, psychiatrist deemed her mentally incompetent seven times before they finally ruled she was allowed to be on, be tried, which I feel like seven times means you are not ever going to be mentally.

[835] And that's such a hard thing to do is because everyone's like, I'm mentally ill. That's why I killed this person.

[836] Oh, trying to get out of it.

[837] And they're like bullshit.

[838] But sorry, they kept on saying she was mentally incompetent and couldn't stand trial.

[839] And then they finally were like, wait, no, on the eighth time she is.

[840] She's better now.

[841] Oh, got it.

[842] No, but yeah, that's ridiculous.

[843] Got it.

[844] So, I wrote.

[845] So on September 21st of 2003, Marjorie Deal Armstrong is arrested for the murder of her most recent ex, the freezer guy, James Rodin.

[846] She pleads guilty but mentally ill, but she's still sentenced to seven to 20 years in state prison for that murder.

[847] three months after she goes to prison in April federal of 2005 so I might have the dates wrong federal agents investigating the collar bomb mystery they're still like what the fuck happened the handwriting analysis of the fucking notes are baffled they just don't understand why this um scavenger hunt was part of it they doesn't make any sense to them okay they're called uh they are called from the state police officer who was just met with marjorie in prison she tells them that the murder of her most recent ex -boyfriend actually had nothing to do with money, but instead was part of the collar bomb plot.

[848] So they didn't even know she was involved at this point.

[849] She just came forward with that?

[850] Yeah.

[851] She says, she tells, she's like, can I just exchange that piece of information for a stick of butter?

[852] I just want to put it under my pillow.

[853] They only have margarine here.

[854] It's driving me. It's disgusting.

[855] I need some rotten butter.

[856] Well, what she actually wants besides just butter is a transfer from the state pen where she's in to a minimum security spot much closer to Erie.

[857] And if they do that, she'll tell them everything she knows.

[858] So she begins by telling them that she was not, of course, I'm not involved in any way in the plot, but she admits that she knew about it and that she supplied the kitchen timers.

[859] So she's the baker or the punisher of children.

[860] When they were trying to fingerprint that kitchen timer, they were just like, there's no fingerprints, but it is coated in butter.

[861] There's like so much butter all over it.

[862] We need to find the butter culprit.

[863] The butter bomber.

[864] Butter bomber.

[865] It's even better, butter, butter.

[866] She tells them that the actual mastermind, beholden, the whole plot was Bill Rothstein, the dude who lived behind the TV tower who turned her in for murder.

[867] But Bill Rothstein had died of lymphoma about a year earlier in July 2004, so they can't fucking question him.

[868] She also tells the feds that Brian Williams wasn't just the victim, but had been in on the planning from the beginning.

[869] The guy that actually blew up in the bomb.

[870] Yeah.

[871] Twist and turns.

[872] Yeah.

[873] Keep talking.

[874] So he did.

[875] When he said, I'm not lying.

[876] He was lying.

[877] You were right.

[878] Oh, thank God.

[879] That's why I was like, hold up.

[880] That theory was right twice.

[881] Yes.

[882] Okay.

[883] So according to Marjorie, Brian Wells, the victim, had agreed to rob the bank wearing what he thought was a fake collar bomb.

[884] The scavenger hunt he was told was simply a ruse to fool the cops.

[885] If he got caught, he could say, like, well, look at these instructions as evidence that he was only following orders.

[886] But at some point, Brian Wells, and you don't hear this phrase very often, is double -crossed.

[887] Yes.

[888] The fake bomb is switched out to be a real one, which he didn't know until it was strapped to his neck.

[889] They held him down at gunpoint because when he got to the TV station with the pizzas, he realized it was real and tried to run and they grabbed him and held him down at gunpoint.

[890] Okay, wait.

[891] So did he not know, is it Marjorie?

[892] Yeah.

[893] Marjorie and the guy that died of lymphoma.

[894] He didn't know them before?

[895] He knew them.

[896] They had all planned this thing and agreeing that it was going to be a fake bomb.

[897] So he drove there as if it's like, I'm delivering pizzas to this place.

[898] Right.

[899] The whole thing is him being tricked.

[900] He was in on that thinking it'd be a fake bomb.

[901] Got it.

[902] They are like, it's a real bomb.

[903] Get over here.

[904] It all falls together.

[905] Because then that fucking dumb dumb's part makes perfect sense.

[906] Right.

[907] Okay.

[908] And I think even when thinking, when thinking about the dumb dumb.

[909] The way he panicked when the beeping went off is he didn't even know that it was fake until the beeping went off.

[910] That's what I think.

[911] Yes.

[912] Because you mean that it was real.

[913] Yeah.

[914] Because even him saying, I'm not lying.

[915] He's lying.

[916] He thinks it's not real.

[917] And I think they're telling him this.

[918] I don't know why she's telling him this, but I don't believe that.

[919] So what?

[920] Yeah.

[921] Okay.

[922] Yeah.

[923] So they strap it to his neck at gunpoint.

[924] The FBI had already concluded they I checked out the bomb and that it was rigged so at any attempt to remove it at all it would have set it off.

[925] So he was destined, he was going to die no matter what.

[926] Then in late 2005, a few months after Marjorie first talked to the feds, a witness comes forward and says that an ex -television repairman turned crack dealer named Kenneth Barnes was also involved.

[927] Barnes was already in jail on unrelated drug charges, so when threatened with more time behind bars, he agrees to a deal.

[928] He would give the full account, blah, blah, blah, reduced sentence.

[929] he confirms that Marjorie was he says which is what other people were coming forward and saying Marjorie was the mastermind behind the collar bomb plot he claims she needed the cash so she could pay him to kill her father for inheritance money Jesus Christ I know in Erie Pennsylvania she's just she's like a black widow yeah so he sentenced Barnes a sentence to 45 years behind bars but he agrees to testify against Marjorie he also explains Br Ryan Wells' reasoning why he even got in on the plot for money, he needed the money because he had developed a relationship with a sex worker, and he had devised a scheme where he was like, I'm going to sell crack because I need the money to be with her.

[930] I think he was like in love with her.

[931] But he had fallen into debt with the crack dealers.

[932] So he needed to pay him, pay them off.

[933] Okay, so he's like the most romantic crack dealer of all time.

[934] Yeah, it's for love, which is like so sweet.

[935] And then one of the articles, it's like, he was a drug dealer.

[936] And it's like, well, he wasn't, When you call him a drug dealer, you're not, you know, explaining the intricacies, which sounds like a fucking movie.

[937] Look, if you're selling crack to people, you're a drug dealer, it doesn't matter what your motives are.

[938] You're correct.

[939] You could be a cold -hearted snake, or you can be.

[940] You are correct.

[941] You could be the most nicest romantic person.

[942] If you're selling drugs.

[943] Because also, it's not like, oh, he's selling pot, so he's getting 60 bucks a hit.

[944] He's, like, probably making fucking bank.

[945] And these people who are crack.

[946] heads or crack addicts are ruining their lives so he's helping them ruin their lives yes exactly eating it abetting and then also on top of that so that he can fuck a lady who probably doesn't give a shit one or the other about him right otherwise she wouldn't be charging him probably one would like to think that it would go into a julia roberts in that movie kind of direction right where she then does actually kiss him on the mouth oh my god um why am i being romantic about this well you probably got involved in your reading and I'm just counterpointing I just want to know Brian Wells more like I feel he probably wasn't the sharpest needle in the tack I knew I wasn't going to get that right so I just kept going with it you know what I mean that was like a straight up yogi bearer style quote just I took all of the things calling someone else dumb like mixing your metaphors oh man so yeah I don't know To me, he's the, he's the, he lost the motion.

[947] He's not some mastermind.

[948] He's not like, yeah, he got duped pretty hard for a reason that, you know, he didn't understand was, okay.

[949] He also testified that Marjorie's ex, whose body was the freezer body, was also in on the crime.

[950] The reason he had been killed was because he threatened to tell the feds, not because of money.

[951] Oh, wow.

[952] So that's why his freezer body happened.

[953] Okay.

[954] When Marjorie took the stand around trial, she's fucking ranting and raving.

[955] she's like she's bananas she's butter crazy she's butter crazy she claims to have never met brian wills in his brian wells the victim even though he testified that she had even measured his neck for the collar bomb oh the jury didn't believe her she's voted guilty of armed robbery i wrote that day i wrote it voted guilty and i'm like i'll figure that out once for there said i just read it off the paper i mean technically you're right vote they voted they get voted guilty of armed bank robbery conspiracy using a destructive device in a crime of violence she died on April of this year actually as 86 years old of natural causes 86 yeah so she died in 2017 in April whoa yeah when we were just hanging out thinking anything was whatever and then she's dying all right last part and this is also from Wired retired FBI criminal investigators who you know are the fucking coolest people in the world I want to have a drink with him Jim Fisher this guy thinks that there's no way that Marjorie planned the collar bomb heist.

[956] Based on the FBI suspect profile, which they had before anyone got in trouble for this, he thinks Bill Rothstein was the mastermind.

[957] He was a handyman with the skills to create a homemade bomb.

[958] And because it wasn't about money, he thinks, he had never accomplished much in his life.

[959] He wanted to show how brilliant he was by, quote, executing a crime that would grab headlines across the globe and baffle authorities for years.

[960] He recruited conspirators.

[961] knew he could control and kept crucial details of the plot from them, a tactic designed to further complicate the investigation.

[962] Wow.

[963] So he thinks he was just fucking with his head.

[964] Like, I kind of reminded me of the guy from S -town that they...

[965] I still haven't listened to it.

[966] Well, people who have listened to Estown, the master, this guy was like this brilliant dude.

[967] Yeah.

[968] It kind of reminds me of that.

[969] In the end, says Jim Fisher, the son of a bitch ended up winning.

[970] Huh.

[971] Well, not so much, because I'd never heard of this case before.

[972] Yeah.

[973] I mean, we are talking about it now.

[974] He won by dying a free man. Yes, that's true.

[975] And baffling the shit.

[976] And they still don't really understand how and what happened.

[977] Which isn't a victory, because that just means you went crazy.

[978] You victimized a bunch of people.

[979] And it doesn't make sense why you did it.

[980] That's not like, to your genius credit.

[981] No, I think that's fucked up.

[982] What he specifically wanted, which, again, is not a genius move.

[983] It's like.

[984] For me, like the kitchen timer right there proves that he's not a genius.

[985] Like get one of those LED digital readout timers or get the fuck out of town.

[986] Well, I think what he wanted to prove is he could fucking make a bomb in his whatever garage out of anything.

[987] You know those people who like to take things apart and put them back together just to see how they work instead of reading a fucking book and just chilling out.

[988] Take a nap.

[989] Yeah, I guess that's true.

[990] Well, that was fascinating.

[991] Yeah, I'd say look at the picture of him sitting in the middle of the road.

[992] go nowhere near the video of him getting blown up.

[993] In fact, I want you to see the picture kind of.

[994] Stephen, can you pull that up?

[995] Just to see, it's just this clear afternoon news story of him sitting there.

[996] They're not too close.

[997] I can totally picture it.

[998] He looks almost like a mannequin sitting there.

[999] It's just like this still body.

[1000] Not dead.

[1001] I'm talking about when he's He was just waiting.

[1002] So was that the whole bomb squad thing?

[1003] They were just waiting for the bomb squad to show up.

[1004] He was just sitting on the curb.

[1005] And they were calling the bombs cut, but also they weren't sure if he was even in on it.

[1006] So they had their guns drawn on him.

[1007] Yeah, that one.

[1008] Go look up the picture.

[1009] It's like, it's like a bummer, obviously.

[1010] It looks like when someone gets stopped at the traffic thing and then they go to arrest him.

[1011] Yeah.

[1012] It looks like that.

[1013] Like he's an unruly drunk driver.

[1014] Yeah.

[1015] Um, what's that?

[1016] Do you know what his shirt says or what that says guess?

[1017] Oh, that's the guest thing.

[1018] Yeah.

[1019] And they think that's part of it is like Bill Rothstein put a shirt on him that says, guess.

[1020] That's fucked up.

[1021] I know.

[1022] Wow, that's a good one.

[1023] Thank you.

[1024] It's so weird because I saw this, like, it was from 2003.

[1025] I think I saw maybe a city confidential or a 2020, like, pretty immediately after happened.

[1026] So, like, no one still knew what was going on.

[1027] And it just stuck with me. And it was one of those ones where I was like, everyone knows this one.

[1028] So I'm not going to do it.

[1029] And then I was like, maybe they don't.

[1030] So.

[1031] I mean, the one I thought it was was there's and I survived about a woman who gets home invaded.

[1032] It's her and her daughter.

[1033] Right.

[1034] they put a bomb on her and make her go rob a bank and she and they're like if you say anything it's the same exact thing but she really was uh you know she was a victim and survived it they get they ended up getting off her yeah oh good yeah few i know well i think you're first this time this week okay my turn let's do it i don't know what that voice was um i i this story is i've been trying to do it for a really long time um but i've been because I've been reading an Anne rule book about this serial killer.

[1035] And, but then I think Frank ate the back half of the book.

[1036] It turned into a thing where then I was trying to find the book again and whatever.

[1037] I think we should make, for new listeners, Frank is her dog.

[1038] It's not her boyfriend.

[1039] That's right.

[1040] I have a really nervous boyfriend named Frank.

[1041] He doesn't like when I learn things.

[1042] He doesn't like when I leave the house.

[1043] um so but but the first chapter of this book is one of the most hook you in and you can't stop reading chapters it's anne rule so she's i've been meaning to read a new one by her so maybe yeah it's this is a great one i had bought one at the airport on uh the last tour that was a it was a bunch of different stories kind of all put together um but i i realize that like that's a little bit too depressing because it's just almost like the same thing over and over again and i like her thoughts on it and stuff yeah Yeah, you, I think I enjoy, like, the full thing more.

[1044] But the cool thing about Ann Rule is that she just goes so far into the victim's lives.

[1045] So you get all that information.

[1046] So if anybody, if this is an interesting story to you, Anne Rule wrote a book called Lust Killer, and it's about this guy.

[1047] But this is the best part.

[1048] So I texted Stephen yesterday.

[1049] I was like, can you please get me a chronology of this guy so that I can get ahead on this story?

[1050] And so he looked up and found this chronology that was.

[1051] put together by some people in the Department of Psychology at Radford University and Radford, Virginia.

[1052] And those people are Mike Keefe, Audrey Mangrum.

[1053] I was going to say Magnum.

[1054] Audrey Mangrum, Kimberly Masked, Heather McGinn, Ryan Miller, Kristen Poucho, Nicole Newsom and Vicki Tanner.

[1055] A lot of ladies.

[1056] So many ladies.

[1057] It doesn't say if they are like students, it doesn't say who they are in the department or whatever, but they put together, it's like an Excel spreadsheet of the years and then the significant like moments in this guy's life, which is a lifesaver for doing a show like this.

[1058] Yeah, I need that.

[1059] Yeah.

[1060] So many times.

[1061] We need it every GD week.

[1062] And then instead you have to read 1 ,800 articles to find that.

[1063] Which is fine and fun.

[1064] It's good.

[1065] But then when you have a spine like this, these guys did amazing work, really good.

[1066] It's just very great detail work where sometimes when you're reading a story, if you read two articles, the second one contradictions.

[1067] the first one, then you're like, well, did he join the army or not?

[1068] Like, it's that thing.

[1069] I always am like, well, the first one said this, so I believe it.

[1070] And it's just the first one I picked to read.

[1071] It's not like, I'm lying about this guy.

[1072] Wikipedia overall.

[1073] All right.

[1074] Okay.

[1075] So, it's Jerry Brutus, the shoe fetish slayer.

[1076] He's, you've seen, there's one million all true crime shows about him, and there's a law and order that's basically his story.

[1077] So, Jerry Brutus is born January 31st, 1939 in Web.

[1078] Sorry, what's his name?

[1079] I didn't hear that.

[1080] Brutus is born on January 31st, 1939 in Webster, South Dakota.

[1081] And it turns out he was an accident and his mother wanted a girl.

[1082] So they lived on a farm.

[1083] When he was five, they moved to Portland, Oregon.

[1084] And they basically move, it looks like every two to five years, his whole childhood and into his adult life, which sucks.

[1085] And also, it doesn't say this anywhere at all.

[1086] My theory is that his dad was an alcoholic or somebody in the family was an alcoholic where they had to just keep leaving town and starting over right um but also they i think he starts his dad starts out as a farmer and it might just be that they're trying to he's trying to basically be a migrant farmer and like go to the new place where you can make money follow the money but every two years it's just so disruptive yeah so sad um anyway so one day he's wandering around alone at the junkyard when he's five years old.

[1087] As you do.

[1088] And he finds a pair of open -toed spike -heeled shoes.

[1089] And he is obsessed.

[1090] Immediately, yes, this is his jam.

[1091] He puts them on.

[1092] He probably never sees women wearing that kind of thing where he's from, maybe.

[1093] Like his mom probably doesn't wear a shit like that.

[1094] I don't know.

[1095] But he goes crazy.

[1096] He plays with them.

[1097] He takes them home.

[1098] His mom finds them and goes berserk on him.

[1099] And is like screaming, whatever, and like never touch these again.

[1100] You're not supposed to touch.

[1101] You're not supposed to like this, whatever.

[1102] Which is a great way to get your kid to be really into something.

[1103] Yeah.

[1104] Hi, we know that.

[1105] So let's take a five -year -old and be like, this is forbidden and then see what happens.

[1106] You don't understand why it's forbidden.

[1107] Eventually, he kept finding them and like she would take them away from it.

[1108] Finally, she burned them symbolically for him.

[1109] Perfect.

[1110] When he's six, they moved to Riverton, California, and he's in the first grade.

[1111] his teacher wore high heel shoes and kept another pair in the classroom so he tried to steal them one day so he could take them home but another kid in the class saw him and told on him so from a first grade this is like a very very early age um he fails second grade uh he is diagnosed with measles sore throat swollen glands laryngitis um he he has frequent headaches that actually leave him unable to see clearly oh my god so he's got some stuff going on but also all of those illnesses that he has it makes me go like were you not taken care of very well definitely not fed well yeah did you not sleep correct you know like why would you just be constantly sick yeah um so in 1947 when he's eight years old the family moves to grants pass Oregon and next door there's a house that has I think it's three teenage girls I right so um they have a little brother and Jerry starts sneaking into that house with the brother to steal these girls underwear oh my god um they first they play in the clothes then he like discovers the underwear and then he so it goes from shoes to under garments um a couple years later, the family moves again to Wallace Pond because Jerry's father is getting back into farming.

[1112] And when he's going through puberty, his mother is disgusted by anything sexual that Jerry does, you know, if he has a wet dream, she makes him wash his sheets by hand.

[1113] There's a lot of shaming, a lot of like sounds like verbal abuse.

[1114] How to create a serial killer.

[1115] Yeah, I mean, so he starts to fantasize that he wants to capture a girl and make her obey his commands and beg for mercy.

[1116] So when he's around 16, he steals an 18 -year -old girl's underwear, then he decides that he wants nude pictures of her.

[1117] So he tells her that he has found out who stole her underwear and to meet him at her at his house.

[1118] so the girl goes over to his house and there she's attacked by a masked man who forces her to take off her clothes and takes pictures of her and then the man runs away and then the girl gets dressed and she goes to leave and she runs into Jerry and Jerry says I was locked in the barn this whole time what happened I just saw a guy running out of here in a mask the girl runs away reports the whole thing to police so essentially he's trying to and there was another story but I could not find it anywhere of him doing that and coming back in and saying that he was his own twin brother and that really sorry it was like one of the first times he did this he was really sorry he basically makes a girl a young girl his age take off her clothes takes pictures of her leaves changes his clothes no combs his hair differently comes in and goes I'm sorry about my brother Jerry I'm his brother what a crazy creepy that like creeps me out it's so creepy.

[1119] And of course, and I think that little girl from the story that I remember didn't report it to the police.

[1120] It was just like this weird, fucked up thing.

[1121] Yeah.

[1122] Um, so anyway, I know it's, it's, it's, it's also that kind of indicative of that the sociopathic thing of I'm smarter than everybody.

[1123] Like, there's no way anyone's going to find out my, here's my great plan.

[1124] I'm going to play my own identical twin.

[1125] Yeah.

[1126] Insane.

[1127] Yeah.

[1128] This is not full house.

[1129] Yeah.

[1130] Exactly.

[1131] So, okay, so.

[1132] um when he's 17 he lures a girl into his car he drives her to a deserted farmhouse beats her up and by some miracle there's a couple that's like sightseeing out in the country and they stop at the same abandoned farmhouse and they find they like walk in on what's happening and call the cops um so jerry claims that he'd also stop to help the girl because they find him and her and she's tied up he says no i found her that way i was here to help her police don't believe it um and they finally they talked to him long enough and he confesses so he's arrested for assault and battery and they find in his house and in his car women's underwear uh pictures and photo equipment um so soon after his arrest they send him to organ state hospital the psychiatric ward for nine months um how do you think that that wasn't a fucking vacay probably no a psychiatric hospital back then?

[1133] What year is it?

[1134] It's 1969, I believe.

[1135] No, no, it's fire hose.

[1136] Bad news.

[1137] He starts talking to the doctors there about his sexual fantasies, his hatred, and revenge.

[1138] They revenge he wants to take against his mother and women in general.

[1139] And he's diagnosed with schizophrenia, which was actually a common thing that would happen back then, that it wasn't actually an accurate diagnosis.

[1140] Diagnosis blanket diagnosis exactly it was just kind of like you are you're um what is that called I was I want to say devious but it's uh nothing I was going to say deviant devious yeah deviant that's it deviant okay I was going to say that but then you said devious he's a deviant he's a deviant that's what I was trying to say got it Stephen I'd love that you look at me like can you fucking can you help me will you try you said the only word I was thinking okay so so and they also they the things that he's telling them that he likes they don't they don't know how to classify that there's not a thing yet yeah exactly um i mean whatever they there might have been they're basically like slap schizophrenia on him and like treat him for that which is probably electric shock therapy uh he still graduates with this high school class in 1957 oh so this is the late 50s it's not even the 60s wow um so then he joins the army in 1959 he tells the army psychiatrist about these same obsessions and the and the psychiatrist hasn't discharged from the army um so he moves back in with his parents now they live in corvallis organ and um he has to live in their shed oh they make him live out back in the shed i mean he's an adult now can we please fucking treat him like a human or get an apartment yeah i mean yeah so one night he's running an errand and there's he sees a young girl walking by herself and he decides he's going to follow her and he so he basically stalks her or follows her home um attacks her strangles her until she's unconscious and then steals her shoes and that night he slept with the shoes oh my god this is so creepy this is nothing oh no yeah um So he becomes an electronics technician in 1961.

[1141] When he's 21, he gets a job at a radio station.

[1142] And that's when he meets his future wife, 17 -year -old Darcy Metzler.

[1143] Oh, Darcy, run.

[1144] Darcy.

[1145] Of course, Darcy's parents don't approve of the relationship because she's so young.

[1146] And because of that, they're married within a few months of meeting each other.

[1147] That's how it's, like, let's solve this by marrying them.

[1148] Yeah.

[1149] Yes, exactly.

[1150] Well, it's like, you want to get out of your parents' house anyway.

[1151] guy comes along yeah he loves underwear you gotta get him so tie that guy down right literally oh so they settle in salem organ um and jerry's thing is he wants her to do all of her housework in the nude so he can take pictures over while she's doing it oh she's like i'm sweating she's like i'm swiffering yeah um yeah and she's so young that she's completely kind of under his control she probably doesn't know what if this is normal or not exactly yeah this is now married life yeah you know like I guess this is what you do yeah as a wife yeah um and around the same time he starts um complaining that he's getting migraines so bad that he's blacking out and that the only thing that helps alleviate those symptoms is going on uh night prowling raids to steal shoes and underwear from local women everyone who's been taking Advil for your fucking migraines we've got a new solution yeah It's a way creepier solution.

[1152] So he would keep all of those trophies.

[1153] Uh -huh.

[1154] Troffies.

[1155] She was in underwear in a garage that he had built.

[1156] It was like a sub -basement that his wife couldn't enter into until she announced her arrival on an intercom.

[1157] It was he was locked down in this basement and she'd have to be like, honey, can I bring you some writs?

[1158] Let me put this away real quick Yeah, he has it set up Where it's like, this is my man cave You're not allowed down here So In 1962 they have a daughter But Jerry can't hold a steady job They move all the time They finally settle back in Portland Jerry becomes an electrician In 1967 they have a son So I have two kids But his wife won't let him in the delivery room When she's having her second baby and he's so hurt by this was what this article was saying or like it affected him so much that's when the raping and the killing starts wait isn't that normal for back then yeah I mean I think it's probably I'm assuming this is his story of him being like it piss me out so much you know like that's the wife's salts I think that's so normal I think even when my in the 70s when my brother was born my dad wasn't allowed in there right but this was the wife's decision this is what they're saying okay yeah so it makes it sound like he was allowed in for their first child and not this some weird thing had happened yeah um so that's why he that's what he that's what he says yeah of course it's someone else's fault right but also i imagine they've now been married for six years or so she's probably seen some weird shit and she's heard some weird shit and there's a whole room she's locked out of all the time so she's probably there's you know like who knows what her state is she knows him well enough that he doesn't want to go in there for the miracle of his child being born he wants to go in there for something fucking creepy yeah she doesn't trust it right how unnerving oh my god like if i see my husband's face when i'm giving birth i'm gonna cry i will barf barf and cry i'll barf cry and then shit on the table which is what everyone does apparently that's my friend michel balloon does that no i heard that it's terrifying That's the most terrifying part.

[1159] Okay, so shortly after the childbirth, he claims that he stalked a woman in Portland, Oregon, followed her home, waited for her to fall asleep, broke into her house to steal her shoes, but then when she woke up mid -robbery and catches him, he chokes her until she passes out, rapes her, steals her shoes, and then leaves.

[1160] So then in January of 1960, and this is the this is the woman who Anne Brule's book starts with Oh, okay.

[1161] I forgot about that part.

[1162] Yeah, so she starts with this the first murder victim.

[1163] Okay.

[1164] And her name was Linda Slausen.

[1165] She was selling encyclopedias door to door in the rain in Portland.

[1166] Oh, no. And at night.

[1167] No, no, no, no, no, no. This sounds like a horror movie.

[1168] Completely.

[1169] The way this is written, it's like she's trying to decide.

[1170] she hasn't had any sales she's just moved out on her own she's gonna keep trying maybe the next one yeah she like needs the money she has to eat like things are getting bad and then there's like one last house that has a light on and she's like i just want to go home i'll just try this one last house and back then they aren't as scare as we are today and weary no wary of there were so many door -to -door salesmen and women back then yeah and you'd let them in your house and it was yeah and 90 % of the time nothing happened that's right just a lot of vacuum sales right okay so so she goes up and she rings jerry brutus's doorbell he is you see a picture of him he looks like a cartoon he looks like the missing friend on king of the hill like he's just he looks like grown up charlie brown with army issue black glasses on oh grown up charlie brown just a big round head like pasty no distinguishing features a little lumpy uh yeah kind of like almost like a bit of a snowman um just round round round I love the picture in my head I never want to see what he actually looks like just a vicious snowman okay um okay but he when he answers the door friendly nice low key um and he bring he's oh come in I actually just was I really wanted to get a set of those acts super interested then explains that his I think he said his children were sleeping I think that's what his excuse was can you come down into the basement oh yeah so they could talk business down there well she goes down and he almost immediately hits her in the head with a two by four beats her and then strangles her to death oh my and then did he mean to that time do you think yes okay that was the whole idea because he was strangling until they passed out before that right okay but this girl comes to his door and then he's like the wife was out and he knew he had time to do whatever he wanted um so once before she after she's dead and before he gets her to the body he takes off her clothes and dresses her up in the stolen underwear that he has in his collection.

[1171] Then, this is bad, he cuts off her left foot and keeps it in the freezer in a high -heeled shoe.

[1172] So it's like he has...

[1173] No, I'm just processing that.

[1174] Holy shit!

[1175] That is crazy.

[1176] Yeah.

[1177] So then when he...

[1178] And at some point there, his wife came home and he went back upstairs and like ate dinner with the family.

[1179] I believe I read that in the Ann Rule book, but I'm almost positive that that's happening.

[1180] He basically had family interactions like right after doing this.

[1181] Super normal.

[1182] Well, probably as normal as he is.

[1183] Right.

[1184] Yeah.

[1185] He's probably always coming up from that sub -basement a little bit sweaty.

[1186] Sure.

[1187] So later in that night, he rolls her in a rug, drives to a bridge, pulls out all this stuff to make it look like he got a flat tire as almost like safety, and then dumps her body in the river.

[1188] So then in July of 1968, so that was January.

[1189] So six months later, Stephanie Vico is reported missing from Portland.

[1190] And then in November the same year, Jan Susan Whitney is reported missing from Portland.

[1191] Jan's 23 -year -old college student at the University of Oregon, then in March of 1969, so about six months later, a woman named Karen Sprinkler, who was a 19 -year -old college student, goes missing.

[1192] And when the police take the eyewitness accounts of Karen going missing, two young girls tell the police they saw a large man dressed as a woman on the parking lot garage roof where Karen's abandoned car was found on that day.

[1193] If you see a picture of this guy and then you picture him lurking around like a parking structure dressed as a woman, it's very scary.

[1194] It's, anyway.

[1195] It sounds like Norman Norman Bates.

[1196] Yeah.

[1197] Just like his mom kind of a thing.

[1198] Yeah.

[1199] Yeah.

[1200] creepy.

[1201] Because probably from a distance, you're like, oh, yeah, there's a woman up here on the same parking thing.

[1202] You'd feel, I think that's part of what's so sinister to me. You're lured into safety of like, oh, that's the woman just like me. I'm fine.

[1203] I could see myself doing that.

[1204] completely for sure yeah um so a month later um a woman named Sharon Wood uh is a is attacked in a parking garage at Portland State University um she fends off her attacker by biting his thumb until it bled um and it of course turns out to be Jerry once she does this um he beats her unconscious but then a car comes so he has to run So the police get the report of this Make no connection to the other parking garage attack The next day after that attack Jerry sees 14 -year -old Leanne Brumley He tries to abduct her She fights him off and escapes Good for you Day after that A woman named Linda Don Saley is reported missing Her cars found abandoned in a parking garage The police realize now That they're dealing with a serial killer So the next month, which is May of 1969, a local fisherman discovers Linda Saly's body in the Long Tom River.

[1205] It was weighed down by a car transmission.

[1206] And then two days after that, Karen Sprinkler's body is found 50 feet away.

[1207] Oh, my God.

[1208] So that's obviously his dumping ground.

[1209] Karen was also tied to an old engine, which is the reason it kept her submerged for a long time.

[1210] and he this is bad okay he cut off her breasts to keep his souvenirs he also placed a bra from his collection of undergarments over her mangled chest oh my god is the way they worded it yeah um so this guy is basically berserking he's like he's killing he's trying to attack women almost daily killing people and then these bodies are coming up of when he like it's just all going faster and faster.

[1211] Yeah, like he started and then was fucking on.

[1212] Yes.

[1213] And then any time he can't, he can't, you know, someone gets away, then he has to do try it again the very next day.

[1214] Right.

[1215] So it's like, um, wow.

[1216] So the same month, he starts calling dorm rooms at Oregon State University to try to arrange blind dates with the co -eds.

[1217] Oh, what the fuck?

[1218] And it works.

[1219] No. Uh -huh.

[1220] What does he say?

[1221] Yeah.

[1222] I don't know.

[1223] I don't know.

[1224] I want to know.

[1225] how he I mean I would love to know and I bet you it's in that book I promise I'm going to finish reading this book I'm just wondering everyone else should read it with me but yeah insane so they're now the police now are onto the pattern they're staking out places where young co -eds hang out where they end up like parking structures stuff like that a female student who claims to have gone on a blind date with this guy goes to police and gives his description.

[1226] So now the police know what he looks like.

[1227] Wow.

[1228] And when he contacts her a second time for a follow up date, she calls the police and tells them.

[1229] So they, the police show up at the meeting spot.

[1230] Fuck yeah.

[1231] They question Jerry at the girls' residence hall.

[1232] Oh, no. So it's so fucking intense at Oregon State.

[1233] But he's so cooperative and he gave his ID, nothing came back.

[1234] It all seemed legit.

[1235] So he was not arrested because all they had on him was you're just trying to make blind dates with people which is not illegal yeah but a bummer yeah um but then the thank god the police after that interaction with him go back and they look up his record they look into him further and the blind date went forward after that yeah yeah she's like once he got cleared by the cop she's like so do you like roller skating um so they look into his record they decided to go to his house for some follow -up questions.

[1236] And there, they see several suspicious items in his garage, in his sub -basement thing, and they start building a case against him.

[1237] Because they're like, the old classic line of cops, we like this guy.

[1238] Yeah.

[1239] So eventually they have enough evidence to arrest, to get an arrest warrant.

[1240] He tries to run while the police are serving him with the arrest warrant.

[1241] Never do that.

[1242] It's never going to work.

[1243] No. if the cops are there yeah you're done yeah um but the warrant was for the attempted deduction of leanne brumley um from the month before yeah and so then they started they get him in to take him downtown whatever they started interrogating him and um he tries to call he he tries to call his wife and get her to burn stuff clothing and like his his underwear collection and all my other evidence Like now you can go under the sub -basement.

[1244] Yeah, exactly right.

[1245] Here's the past.

[1246] Oh, my God.

[1247] But Darcy's like, go fuck yourself, for real.

[1248] Darcy.

[1249] Darcy's over it.

[1250] She's had it.

[1251] So the investigator's name was Jim Stoval, and he basically gets Jerry Brutus to confess to the murders of the two recently discovered bodies, as well as the murder of Linda Slosson and Jan Whitney.

[1252] Wow.

[1253] Um, he's test, Jerry Brutus is tested by several psychologists, psychiatrists, sorry.

[1254] And, um, he shows average IQ and cognition deemed not criminally insane, uh, which I'm not, I don't understand.

[1255] Yeah, how can you be, because how can you be a serial, like, murder people and not be a little insane?

[1256] Yeah.

[1257] But I'm not sure what criminally insane must have a very specific thing.

[1258] Hardcore, yeah.

[1259] But he is diagnosed as an antisocial personality manifested by fetishism, transvesticism.

[1260] exhibitionism, voyeurism, and sadism.

[1261] Isn't it funny that back then transvesticism is a crime?

[1262] Yes.

[1263] It's insane.

[1264] Yeah, and it wasn't that long ago.

[1265] Like, what is it?

[1266] It's 1960.

[1267] Something.

[1268] I lost my paper.

[1269] We're in like, we're in the late 60s, 1969.

[1270] I'm sure someone's going to tell us when it went tell and it's going to be recent.

[1271] Yeah.

[1272] Well, I mean, they just fucking passed a thing.

[1273] And it's, it's, uh, yeah.

[1274] Mm -hmm.

[1275] Okay.

[1276] So they, they collect all the evidence.

[1277] Um, he's eventually charged with three counts of first degree murder.

[1278] Um, Jan, Jan Whitney, Linda Sayley, Karen Sprinkler.

[1279] He, um, tries to, uh, plead not guilty by reason of insanity.

[1280] Um, but eventually they just get him to plead guilty.

[1281] Uh -huh.

[1282] Um, and so on the same day that he pleads guilty, he's sentenced to three consecutive life sentences.

[1283] because he confessed.

[1284] Right, right.

[1285] There's no death penalty in Oregon.

[1286] So they just give him three consecutive life sentences.

[1287] He's never charged with the murder of Linda Slosson because her body was never found.

[1288] Oh, no. That's so sad.

[1289] Now, around the time of all these murders, 12 women went missing in that area while he was free.

[1290] Oh, my God.

[1291] So an investigation was ongoing to attempt to uncover the whereabouts of those other missing women.

[1292] And at one point, a neighbor of the Brutus's implicated Darcy in the murders, claiming that she had helped Jerry carry a body from the garage.

[1293] And she actually ended up going to trial for it and being acquitted.

[1294] Holy shit.

[1295] Yes.

[1296] Do you think she did?

[1297] Because what a bummer to like, A, have your husband turn out to be a serial killer and be you're implicated and they have nothing to do with it.

[1298] I mean, that's what I would think.

[1299] I don't think someone, I don't know.

[1300] And based on what she's.

[1301] already done, you would think that she would testify against him for immunity if she actually knew something.

[1302] Right.

[1303] And if she didn't burn, when he called and was like, get rid of the evidence, she's like, no way.

[1304] Yeah.

[1305] That doesn't seem like a person who's like in it for the long haul or like his accomplice.

[1306] Yeah.

[1307] For sure.

[1308] And yeah.

[1309] Anyhow, he goes to jail.

[1310] But he also had piles of women's catalogs in his cell he would write to the companies and ask for their catalogs so they were he claimed that substitute for pornography for him um holy shit and he actually uh it says he lodged countless appeals including one in which the he allegedly oh sorry he lodged countless appeals including one in which he alleged that a photograph taken of him with one of the corpses could not prove his guilt because it was not the body of the person he was convicted of killing so he they found a picture of him posing with a dead body but he was well probably him I would imagine on a timer maybe yeah kitchen timer yeah but so it's like that kind of thing where he's arguing like look that's not the dead body then hey you can't like someone else it's so insane it's a picture of you posing with the dead body.

[1311] Anyway, he died in prison on March 28, 2006 from liver cancer.

[1312] Wow.

[1313] He lived for a long fucking time.

[1314] In fact, at the time of his death, he was the longest incarcerated inmate in the Oregon Department of Corrections, a total of 37 years.

[1315] Oh my God.

[1316] Yeah.

[1317] My age is how my entire life is how long he was in prison.

[1318] Yeah.

[1319] Holy shit.

[1320] So if you want to read Lust Killer, I'm going to finish it.

[1321] And then we'll know all those details because that I really do want to know, like, all that stuff at the end.

[1322] And I bet you it'll talk more about Darcy, too, because I, I'm sure she talked to Anroll.

[1323] I bet you she talked to Ann Roll.

[1324] I bet you she thinks.

[1325] I'd love to hear more from Darcy.

[1326] I'll try to finish up there pretty soon.

[1327] But I want to thanks to those people from Radford University.

[1328] Your research helped me do my thing.

[1329] Thanks, guys.

[1330] Shoutouts to fucking helpers this episode.

[1331] Wired magazine, all this.

[1332] um wow what a creep i had never heard that one it's bad yeah it's one of those ones i've been working on but every time i go to do it i'm like it's just a i mean it's just there's no uh but the the only thing it was the two points i always look for those cinematic moments one cinematic moment is a person dressed up like a woman hiding in a parking garage yes which is the scariest like beyond yeah and and then the other one is that as a child as a child attacking that little girl and then being like, I'm my twin brother where it's like, how fucking crazy are you?

[1333] That's like psycho level.

[1334] Yeah.

[1335] Do you have a good thing for this week?

[1336] I have a good thing this week.

[1337] Obviously, it's Elvis getting better and Mimi getting better, but now that they are better, I can say what was going to be last week before this happened, which is had a kitten, man, a new kitten.

[1338] Like nothing will make it more exciting in your house.

[1339] Like just watching her playing with a little toy by herself is like joyous yes and then at night oh my god at night she nurses tries to nurse Vince's head and it drives him crazy but it's like the cute I like pull her away but not before I look at it for a minute it's just so cute and she like nozzles and she's a real character I mean like having her around she's super cute yeah and it's funny because she matches Mimi they it's like they have the same jacket on but Mimi's like I fucking hate you Mimi's jackets, like, obviously a little more worn in.

[1340] It's because it's a little lighter in color she's washed it more.

[1341] And she fucking hates the kitten.

[1342] Yeah.

[1343] Kitten's name is Dottie.

[1344] She's a real doll.

[1345] So what's yours?

[1346] Mine is, I did a show last night at Largo.

[1347] It was a comedy show for Brian Possein who had, uh, who's been doing comedy for 30 years.

[1348] So it was his 30 year anniversary.

[1349] In comedy.

[1350] So he, uh, asked a bunch of us to do the show with him who he's been doing it with that long.

[1351] And so it was me, Blank a Patch, Derek Sheen, Dana Gold, Greg Proops, and Guy O 'Belam.

[1352] And it was such a good show.

[1353] What a great idea for a show.

[1354] It was so fun.

[1355] And then so everyone was like obviously doing their act, but then also telling these stories and doing jokes from their act from back then.

[1356] Wow.

[1357] And it was so fun.

[1358] And everyone was so insanely solid.

[1359] But then it also was like, at a couple moments, it was very touching.

[1360] I was like, I said something about how lucky I felt to have kind of happened into this tribe that I found where it's like, you know, when those people in San Francisco, those comics that I met and got to be friends with that all ended, we all just moved on mass to L .A. And it was just such an amazing group of talented people who are geniuses and so fun.

[1361] And like telling stories where we're, like I had a recovered memory on stage where I was like, Brian, remember when O .J. ran and we were in Golden, Apple Comics and like it was just like a whole thing like that were it was really really fun that's such a nice thing to like you know you're going through this and you're like you've been in comedy this long and you're keep you're doing it and you're doing it but then to like stop and take take stock of it yeah it's such a cool thing and I really I like that you guys did that I did too and it takes stock in this kind of like I don't it was almost like a high school it had a high school feeling in in me like meaning and the you're part of you're part of this big force and you're part of it you belong in it and I think like when you're in that you of course don't appreciate it because you're young and an asshole drunk all the time and kind of on pills but yeah when you later on when you get older you know just just know that like when you have your like posse of friends it doesn't last because everyone gets married or you know maybe moves away or whatever it's comedy for whatever reason yeah exactly it's just kind of people move away from each other and in ways that you kind of don't expect.

[1362] So I think there was a nice kind of like reunion feel to it that I really liked.

[1363] So awesome.

[1364] Yeah.

[1365] It's those good feelings.

[1366] Yay.

[1367] And I, because I really always, I hate doing stand -up comedy so much.

[1368] And I very often cancel my sets because I'm like, there's no point.

[1369] And I knew I couldn't do it because I wouldn't do that to Brian.

[1370] What's a special one?

[1371] So then when I was actually doing it, I was like, oh, I do like it.

[1372] That's right.

[1373] I do like comedy.

[1374] Yeah.

[1375] You got to pick the ones that mean something to you, I guess.

[1376] Yeah, and just like acknowledge when I'm busy.

[1377] Right.

[1378] And Tai Tai.

[1379] Tired and busy.

[1380] I get so tight -tie.

[1381] So tired.

[1382] Well, should I see if anyone is going to talk?

[1383] Elvis isn't.

[1384] Mimi.

[1385] Well, thanks for listening, everybody.

[1386] I'm sorry.

[1387] Thank you guys for listening.

[1388] Yeah.

[1389] Go on to the website.

[1390] If you want to get those pre -sale tickets for the upcoming tour, Australia heads up.

[1391] Australia, get ready.

[1392] Get in there.

[1393] Australia.

[1394] Be our friend.

[1395] And that's it.

[1396] Stay sexy.

[1397] Don't get murdered.

[1398] Mimi?

[1399] Want a cookie?

[1400] No. Mimi.

[1401] Not this week.

[1402] Mimi's like leaning away from the microphone.