Flightless Bird: Christmas

[0] Hi, I'm David Farrier, a New Zealander who got accidentally marooned in America, and I want to figure out what makes this country tick.

[1] Now, I've learned a lot this year.

[2] I've learned that Americans eat over 50 billion cheese burgers a year, that 200 million of them consider themselves Christian, and that over 115 million males in the United States are currently walking around with no foreskin.

[3] It's crazy.

[4] Somebody looking at this who's intact would say, that's not my penis.

[5] I've learned that citizens of the U .S. love football, shower curtains, and saying math instead of maths.

[6] Could you ever say maths or is it always math?

[7] Math.

[8] Math.

[9] Math.

[10] Can't get used to it.

[11] Along the way, I've learned that there's a lot to love about this deeply confusing country.

[12] And as this year rushes to a close, it felt appropriate to dive into something deeply American.

[13] Okay, people, tomorrow morning, 10 a .m., Santa's coming in town.

[14] Santa.

[15] Or more broadly, Christmas is almost here.

[16] And to me, America is Christmas, and Christmas is America.

[17] Because growing up in New Zealand, the 25th of December was always dominated by American films.

[18] The Grinch, a Christmas carol, diehard, Home Alone, and National Lampoon's Christmas vacation.

[19] Like in so much of the world, Christmas is seen through an American lens.

[20] Since this is Aunt Bethany's 80th Christmas, I think she should lead us in the saying of grace.

[21] I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands.

[22] One nation is incredible with liberty and justice for all.

[23] Amen.

[24] Amen.

[25] Christmas is also the perfect strange mix of religion and commerce.

[26] and it's big business.

[27] Holiday spending grows at about 5 % every year in the US.

[28] And in 2021, retail sales reached over $800 billion.

[29] This year will eclipse that.

[30] Back in New Zealand, Christmas happens during the summer.

[31] It's all barbecues and going to the beach.

[32] So being here in America feels like being in the upside down for me. It's all sweaters and snow and reindeer.

[33] So hang that mistletoe and put milk out for Santa.

[34] because this is the Christmas episode.

[35] Christmas is coming up in days.

[36] Exciting.

[37] How are you feeling about it?

[38] I love Christmas.

[39] Yeah, same.

[40] It's your birthday.

[41] It's a big day for me. You're right.

[42] It's Jesus' birthday.

[43] and it's David Ferry's birthday.

[44] And that's a pretty big deal in my world.

[45] Not a lot of other people's, but in mine.

[46] We just had this thought the other day that maybe you are the second coming.

[47] Yeah.

[48] Jesus died in his mid -30s or early 30s, I think.

[49] And you're about to turn 40 this year.

[50] We don't need to get into ages.

[51] You're 40.

[52] Yeah, I'm going to be 40.

[53] That's a problem for me. But you're right.

[54] I have to confront the truth.

[55] I've outlasted Jesus, which is a good start.

[56] Right.

[57] But how much longer?

[58] I mean, saviors die young.

[59] I know.

[60] And I actually think I need to clear up some misinformation that's flying around that I have kind of been lying about a little bit during my entire life.

[61] A secret.

[62] It's a secret.

[63] It's a secret that's no longer going to be a secret.

[64] I was born on Christmas Day.

[65] It's a sort of a story that I was born in Bethlehem in New Zealand.

[66] That's not a story.

[67] That's what you told us.

[68] No, no, because it's brought up.

[69] Other people know it and it's brought back to me. but I wasn't born in Bethlehem in New Zealand I moved to Bethlehem when I was about 12 David I'm really look This is so bad No we talked about this the other day and I know it's bad And I didn't clear it up And I want to clear it up publicly now Oh my God Where were you born?

[70] I was born in Auckland City Which is for the people of America It's like the Los Angeles of New Zealand It's sprawling, it's kind of a mess That has nothing to do.

[71] There's no mangers in Auckland.

[72] There's no majors in Auckland.

[73] So look, I was still born on Christmas Day.

[74] Okay, so that's the truth.

[75] I did live in Bethlehem in New Zealand, but I wasn't born and I wanted to be honest because honesty is one thing you've taught me, Monica.

[76] Honesty is important.

[77] Wow.

[78] I taught you that.

[79] Wow.

[80] You taught me that.

[81] Yeah, I can't remember when, but it was definitely you.

[82] Another fact about me, I went to a private Christian school for quite some time and I wore Roman sandals to school.

[83] It was part of our uniform.

[84] What is that?

[85] Do you know what Roman sandals are?

[86] They're uncomfortable.

[87] They're like a sandal.

[88] A jandal.

[89] Like a sandal made out of leather.

[90] And they're called Roman sandals.

[91] It's like a Roman style.

[92] It's what Jesus potentially used to wear was Roman sandals.

[93] Okay.

[94] So at some point, I was a man who was born on Christmas Day, living in Bethlehem, wearing Roman sandals.

[95] Okay.

[96] So this isn't about me. It's about Christmas.

[97] I mean, I'm glad you came forward.

[98] That's all I can say.

[99] Yeah.

[100] Truthful Dave.

[101] That's what they call.

[102] me?

[103] Nope.

[104] Nobody calls you that.

[105] So Christmas, we're going to get into it all the things about Christmas today, but what does it invoke in you?

[106] What sort of feelings, what sort of emotions?

[107] Because we, you know, I was obviously experienced New Zealand Christmas.

[108] You've experienced American Christmas.

[109] How do you feel?

[110] Well, I think I'm maybe a good person to represent Christmas in 2022 because there's so much around it.

[111] But, you know, I'm not Christian.

[112] Mm -hmm.

[113] My parents are Hindu.

[114] By the way, that's a really hard sentence for me to say.

[115] Right.

[116] Because I've avoided saying that sentence my whole life.

[117] I've never heard you say it.

[118] It's the first.

[119] It's a day of firsts.

[120] You're right.

[121] Honesty.

[122] Honesty.

[123] I don't say it because I felt really ashamed of that.

[124] Everyone else was Christian.

[125] And in Georgia, there's a lot of Methodists, Baptists, Presbyterian, any of those things.

[126] I had to lie people around.

[127] Christmas time, like, are you going to midnight mass?

[128] No, we're not doing that this year.

[129] You know, I'd have to lie.

[130] Yeah, because once you say, no, you're not doing it, then the questions probably start, right?

[131] Like, why aren't you doing?

[132] What are you doing?

[133] Blah, blah, blah.

[134] And I'd have to sort of lie and just be like, oh, we don't really go to church, not, oh, we're not Christian.

[135] Because I was so afraid the response would be, then, why do you, how are you celebrating Christmas?

[136] That's bad.

[137] Yeah, you freak.

[138] You're not doing what we're all doing.

[139] You're like a fair weather fan for Christmas.

[140] But now I'm so happy that I'm not really tied to the religious portion.

[141] And I can enjoy the merriment of it and the wonder and the family aspect and mainly the presents.

[142] So what did your family do on Christmas Day?

[143] Because I'm the opposite.

[144] My family was all really Christian and I was Christian.

[145] And so it was this whole thing of being, it was this thing that my mom would always say, which was she got annoyed when you're, people would call it X -mas because she's like, you can't take the Christ out of Christmas.

[146] That was her saying.

[147] Great saying.

[148] It's a really good saying.

[149] But Pam was big into that.

[150] And we all were.

[151] Pamela Anderson.

[152] My mom is not Pamela Ann.

[153] Pamela Ann.

[154] That's right.

[155] That's right.

[156] Pamela Ann, Perry, not Anderson.

[157] But yeah, so I had a very different experience where it was like church.

[158] And that was all totally normal.

[159] I like to think I wasn't going to be one of the kids that would give you shit.

[160] But maybe I would have been, maybe I would have been a little snotty -nosed kid that was like, oh, you weirdo.

[161] not Christian and you're not celebrating Christmas.

[162] I might have been.

[163] Like, you shouldn't be allowed to celebrate Christmas unless you're Christian.

[164] Yeah, we take it away from you.

[165] I could totally see you being that.

[166] Yeah, I could see it too.

[167] I was a little shit.

[168] I thought I had the truth when I absolutely didn't.

[169] It was a really, anyway, that's a whole other topic.

[170] But what did you do for Christmas Day?

[171] Okay, so you stay up all night because they're so excited for the presents.

[172] And I had a tradition with my friend Kim called the Christmas call.

[173] What if that was a cool thing about me that I have old friends, childhood friends.

[174] It could still happen.

[175] You guys could do a Christmas call.

[176] My friend Kim, we were both so excited for presents and we commiserated over this.

[177] Like, oh, it's just so hard to fall asleep, Christmas Eve.

[178] And so we would read all night Karen books, Babysitters Club, Little Sister.

[179] And then when we realized you both did the same thing, we thought, oh, I know, we'll just talk on the phone all night.

[180] Oh, that's so nice.

[181] Yeah, to just make the time pass.

[182] Just rewind for a second.

[183] What are those books?

[184] Karen's Babysitters Club?

[185] Okay.

[186] Do you know about Babysitters Club?

[187] No. Oh, wow.

[188] You got to do an episode of Babysitters Club.

[189] It's a book series.

[190] And what do the club do?

[191] What do they get up to?

[192] Okay, they were a babysitting club, and they would babysit and have adventures.

[193] And then they would get together and make their crafts.

[194] I forget all the details.

[195] But it was a really, really good series.

[196] And then there was a spinoff series called Babysitters Club Little Sister.

[197] And the main character was Karen.

[198] Karen was a little sister of one of the Babysitters Club.

[199] Okay.

[200] So it was like a spinoff with this other kid.

[201] Yes.

[202] And there were so many books.

[203] And they were my favorite.

[204] And I would beg my mom for Karen books.

[205] For me, it was goosebumps.

[206] Oh, I feel that was my thing when you were, yeah, doing those.

[207] Yeah, that was marketed more towards boys and babysitters Club was marketed more.

[208] She was Christy's little step -sister.

[209] Yes, Christy.

[210] And isn't there one name Dawn?

[211] I think Don got cancer.

[212] We've got so much to catch.

[213] Oh, no. I don't actually think that because I think that was too intense for the time.

[214] It sounds amazing.

[215] Her mom had lung cancer.

[216] Wow, I knew it.

[217] That's such an intense thing to put into her.

[218] Because she had just a single dad.

[219] Wait, wait, wait.

[220] It's her friend, her best friend.

[221] Sunny's mom had just been diagnosed with lung cancer and Dawn really wants to be there for her best friend.

[222] Oh, I thought one of them had a single dad.

[223] Anyway, okay, so inside of Karen books, my friend Kim and I would call each other.

[224] And the first year we did this, I had to tell my parents was before cell phones.

[225] Oh, the phone's going to ring at 1 a .m. And they said, absolutely not.

[226] You're going to wake up the whole house.

[227] And I said, well, it's happening.

[228] It's already happening.

[229] It's happening, Mom and Dad.

[230] I'm so sorry.

[231] And so we unplugged every single phone except we.

[232] one that I could answer and then we chatted all night and it's still a tradition although now we talk at 10 a .m. I really, every Christmas Eve, one a .m. Exactly.

[233] I do remember, I don't want to get on too much of a tangent, but I do remember how exciting it was to use the landline.

[234] And I don't know if you did this in America, but in New Zealand, if you wanted to ask someone out on a date, you would call them on the phone and it was so terrifying because it was just, it was hideous Because the parents would pick up Everyone you were It was just the worst thing in the world Let's pretend you're that age You be the mom Is picking up Hello Hi, it's David from school Is What school?

[235] From BFtheum College Is But you're in college?

[236] Wait Wait, wait, wait Wait, wait No, Betham College You're too old for my daughter No, it's different This is what the show's about College is different In New Zealand Wait, what?

[237] No, Bethyam College went from age five right through to 17.

[238] It was the whole gamut.

[239] It was Bethium College.

[240] Yeah, yeah.

[241] And then what did you call college?

[242] Well, what is college in your mind?

[243] College is college.

[244] Yeah, but what are you doing?

[245] Because I don't know.

[246] Okay, you go to elementary school, middle school, high school, and then your post, you get a degree.

[247] Oh, no, that's university.

[248] Okay.

[249] Yeah, yeah.

[250] College is up to 17.

[251] Okay.

[252] Anyway, my point is phones were scary and asking people that was scary.

[253] Christmas, I went to the streets and I said to Americans, what does Christmas mean to you?

[254] A bit of a hat question, but it's the only question you can really put out for this topic.

[255] What does Christmas mean to you?

[256] It's just around family.

[257] It's much time I can spend with them.

[258] I give gift giving, gift receiving.

[259] Lots of food for sure.

[260] We have Christmas cake in New Zealand.

[261] It's like got white icing on it.

[262] It's like a fruit cake.

[263] Do you do that here?

[264] I never had a fruit cake with white icees.

[265] It sounds good, though.

[266] It sounds like real good.

[267] My mom, Pam, makes a real good one.

[268] Christmas means to me spending time with your family at home.

[269] Is it religious at all?

[270] In my house it is, but I don't think it is necessarily.

[271] It's not religious for my family, but it is everyone gets together from far and gets to one house.

[272] And everyone just stays in, cuddly feeling.

[273] It's really warm.

[274] Lots of food, thoughts of cookies.

[275] It's a lot of fun.

[276] Well, before I used to go to church, now I don't.

[277] So I'd be lying if I told you to go to church.

[278] But I still hold the religious aspect of it.

[279] What does Christmas mean to you?

[280] Family time, sharing.

[281] Those months when you get older, but when you're a kid, you know, it's all about the gifts or whatnot.

[282] Best gift you ever got as a kid?

[283] Ooh, um, racetrack.

[284] I love racetrack.

[285] That was my best gift ever.

[286] Do you have a real Christmas tree or a fake one?

[287] I always do real.

[288] and I always go to the forest and cut it down to get it.

[289] So you'll be going into the forest yourself for the big sore.

[290] So my family's from a small town in Wisconsin, middle of nowhere.

[291] We've always done it.

[292] And what's the secret to picking a good tree?

[293] Is it sort of the shape, the texture, the smell?

[294] Yeah, all of the above.

[295] And then also one with many spacious branches.

[296] What do you put in the water to keep the Christmas tree alive?

[297] Sugar and fishing line will help hold it up at the right angle.

[298] Great tip.

[299] yeah so some little Christmas tips in there for all of us sugar in the water that made me feel wonder it was beautiful right yeah and that person I was speaking to quite petite and small I just imagine her like going off to the woods with a big chainsaw and just like chopping down a tree and dragging it back to her house good for her I wonder what the percentage of people who celebrate Christmas believe in yeah totally the whole backstory story and that's when my documentary actually begins a little bit with this about how people are celebrating Christmas and what it means.

[300] Because that's the interesting thing about it is it used to be all about, I guess, Jesus and Christianity.

[301] And increasingly, the world is slowly turning more atheists.

[302] So, like, what does it mean for all of us, right?

[303] Stay tuned for more flightless bird.

[304] We'll be right back after a word from our sponsors.

[305] Flightless Bird is sponsored by Better Help.

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[344] So I'm going to kick into the dock.

[345] Okay.

[346] Now, just so we know, the first part of the documentary is kind of looking at the religious side of things.

[347] The second part of the documentary later in the show is going to be more about the crazy kind of festivities involved in Christmas.

[348] We've got it all in this episode.

[349] It's a festive surprise.

[350] Now, it wouldn't be Christmas without the Christmas Grinch, whether it was Dr. Seuss's original book, or Jim Carrey's masterpiece from the year 2000.

[351] Hello, little girl.

[352] How dare you enter the Grinch's liar?

[353] The impotent, the audacinate, the unmitigated gall.

[354] You've called out.

[355] the thunder.

[356] Now get ready for the boom.

[357] Gaze into the fish of fear.

[358] The book was pushing back against the commercialization of Christmas, and that's an argument that often comes up here in the US.

[359] Perhaps the biggest grinch of all is conservative Christian megachurch pastor Pat Robinson.

[360] He's suspicious of American Christmas.

[361] Here in America, the so -called Christian country, we're going to this new age nonsense.

[362] Of course, you've got to remember, ladies and gentlemen, this Christmas trees and all the reeds and all the garlands and all the mistletoe, every bit of them come from Teutonic paganism.

[363] They are not an integral part of Christianity.

[364] The so -called battle for Christmas has been talked about in America forever, the argument over whether it's a religious holiday, a secular holiday, or a mixture of the two.

[365] I wanted to get my head around the meaning of Christmas here in America, so I needed to talk to an expert.

[366] Back in April, when we launched Flightless Bird, our first topic was religion.

[367] Quite a full -on topic for episode one, but we did it and we're still here.

[368] For that episode, I'd interviewed Mike McHagg, a Christian turned atheist, turned something in between, who now consults on superhero movies.

[369] If you've seen anything coming out of Marvel lately, I'd got to work on their multiverse for them, which was a ton of fun.

[370] Basically, Mike is a giant brainbox who was super religious, then not religious, then something of a mystic, studying the Bible as an outsider almost.

[371] I thought that seeing as this is the last episode of the year, I'd go back to Mike to learn what American Christmas is all about.

[372] I'm really interested in social identity formation.

[373] Understand everything people do as belonging.

[374] We're social mammals, and we talk a good talk about our rational brains and our beliefs, but really what most of our thoughts and feelings and behavior around is belonging.

[375] longing.

[376] And a huge part of kind of social formation is tradition.

[377] And I think, at least for Westerners, Christmas is currently like the OG tradition.

[378] As I said earlier, Mike McHagg often consults on big blockbuster stories.

[379] And the Bible is probably one of the biggest stories ever written.

[380] And Christmas is the bit where the hero arrives.

[381] The Matrix had Neo.

[382] The Bible had Jesus.

[383] These days, Christmas is different for me than it's ever been because I've shifted my neurological framing for the holiday, frankly.

[384] I don't want to go straight to nerdery, but I can't answer the question without it.

[385] There's this amazing neuroscientist named Andrew Newberg who studies the brains of religious people.

[386] We sort of understand there's a dichotomy and how people experience faith.

[387] One is located in the frontal lobes of the brain.

[388] People have kind of a cerebral orientation in how they see the world.

[389] They tend to focus on theology and what's the right belief and a rigorous understanding of their faith experience.

[390] Then other people are sort of more biased towards what we would have traditionally called the limbic center of the brain, the emotional feeling part of the brain.

[391] For them, faith is a series of rituals and actions and relationships.

[392] And of course, this is a spectrum.

[393] You can exist with a mix of those two extremes.

[394] Most of my life, I was very cerebral fundamentalist.

[395] So Christmas was about, number one, confronting the commercialism in America, especially, understanding the right beliefs about the incarnation, immaculate conception, and all these sorts of things.

[396] And as I've gotten older and been through some faith transitions, as you and I have discussed, I don't really care about that stuff anymore.

[397] What I'm interested in is after Thanksgiving, putting the tree up with my kids and my wife, and getting together with friends and drinking hot chocolate with alcohol in it.

[398] Hot chocolate and alcohol is a great Christmas gift.

[399] Sometimes I just throw some baillies in the microwave and off I go.

[400] But Mike also loves to dwell on the Christian side of Christmas.

[401] I mean, the fact is, the entire planet tells what year it is by counting the years since Jesus's first birthday.

[402] And Mike says he likes to ponder the notion of what it would be like for God to be born as a little baby about 2 ,022 years ago, what that story means and what it says about the world.

[403] I love the Bible more than I ever have today, which is weird because I no longer think it's the literal word of God or however I used to frame that.

[404] I like the Bible because it's a bunch of semi -related documents written by people who are trying to figure out their faith, figure out who God is.

[405] Ressle with the problem of evil in our world.

[406] And when I read the Gospels or any part of the Bible, I like to understand the history around it.

[407] There was someone who wrote this.

[408] They were writing to an audience and they were trying to convince them of something.

[409] Stories were persuasive tools even in that time in history, perhaps more than now.

[410] The idea of an objective telling of history, what is that?

[411] In biblical times, we told stories to form identity, to create who we are as a group of people, as a cohort, or as an ethnicity or as indeed a nationality.

[412] Now, the four main Gospels were written between 66 and 110 AD.

[413] So the Christmas story of Jesus being born was all written after he had died.

[414] So Christians are trying to figure out to talk about their faith in a way that doesn't get them executed.

[415] And so what I love about the birth stories of Jesus is they're really subversive and secretive about it.

[416] They draw from these allegories, these cultural touchstones of what it meant to claim you're a deity.

[417] and they borrow liberally from other faiths and especially the face of the Roman Empire as they do, but in a way that kind of has this step of plausible deniability because you have these people saying, listen, Jesus was special.

[418] Jesus was the one true son of God.

[419] Everybody else is just imitating this true God figure, especially Caesar, which was a thing that could get not only you killed, but your city burned to the ground.

[420] And I love this assemblage that is so.

[421] so historically and cultural -specific of what it means to talk about God come to Earth and what that means for people.

[422] And I know that's probably not the warmest, fuzziest, coziest depiction of, you know, we think about sitting around the fire and reading the early chapters of Luke as a family, and that's still a fun tradition.

[423] But I'm more interested in how the Gospels and all of the Christian faith calls us to imagine a world different and more inclusive and more redemptive than it is today.

[424] And I think a subversive story that calls into question the power structures of the world is a great way to do that.

[425] I never really thought of the Bible as subversive storytelling, but it really was.

[426] The first mention to humanity that God is on the way to do something special and amazing was to a woman in a patriarchical society.

[427] The story begins with the version.

[428] And then when Christ is born and it's time to herald this momentous event in the world's culture, who do we tell the shepherds who are basically homeless workers who live beyond the gates of the city and are smelly and not allowed in polite society?

[429] If you were to script this stuff, Save the Cat style on index cards, your story beats are hitting pretty hard, pretty fast.

[430] In fact, like audiences might be like, this is too much.

[431] I thought this was a family movie.

[432] I love this image of the supposed air to the cosmological throne of reality in a manger surrounded by shepherds and farm animals.

[433] And yeah, some magi who weren't actually there.

[434] I love this story because of its flexibility and a plight.

[435] ability and our ability to explore any situation in which goodness is the underdog.

[436] And how often in our lives does it feel like good is the underdog in the world's story?

[437] So for me, that's probably my favorite theme in the Christmas story.

[438] Good's the underdog, but it's never hopeless.

[439] Of course, a big part of Christmas is how it's experienced by those who have no religion.

[440] And for them, the original Christmas story doesn't enter the frame in a meaningful way.

[441] I don't love American commercialism or American capitalism in particular, but in America, the fastest growing religion and possibly now the largest religious group is people without any specific religious affiliation.

[442] And so we do have to talk about what does it look like for people to be able to have a secularized Christmas, their own experience that's separate from church attendance or participation in a Christian denomination or other tradition.

[443] And some people really resent that.

[444] They don't think you should be able to practice Christmas at all unless you adhere to typically their exact and precise Christian beliefs.

[445] And I think that's ridiculous.

[446] There is the story in the Gospels of the Birth of Christ, but it wasn't organized into a holiday or a festival.

[447] But Christmas was taken in the first place.

[448] It was borrowed from many, many, many cultural festivities around winter.

[449] And a lot of the symbols in Christmas aren't original to Christianity, the trees in particular.

[450] So I just don't care anymore like I used to.

[451] And I think it's so fitting that what is ultimately a cultural celebration allowed to be returned to that for people who no longer identify with this faith tradition.

[452] I think it's oddly possessive.

[453] And if it was me, I mean, I got a background in branding and advertising.

[454] The word Christ is still the majority of the word Christmas.

[455] Take the branding win and let go of the minutia fight.

[456] You know, peace on earth, goodwill to men.

[457] I like that sim in a lot.

[458] I really like that he pointed out that it is the OG holiday.

[459] Because in my mind, the way holidays work in America, you've got Halloween.

[460] Everyone gets excited.

[461] The candy's out.

[462] That happens.

[463] And then you hit Thanksgiving.

[464] And so, oh, wow, we're all eating together.

[465] Yes.

[466] And then it's like we're almost at Christmas.

[467] It's the rule of three.

[468] Halloween is the first of holiday season and it kicks off a levity.

[469] Yeah.

[470] One thing I do want to do real quick.

[471] Yes, please.

[472] Because I do think that America, well, I never knew this.

[473] I thought because I have an insular mind that every country that celebrated Christmas celebrated it pretty much in the same way that we do here.

[474] But then I talked to Anna, our friend, Anna, who's from Venezuela.

[475] And I was saying something to her last year about, like, presents.

[476] And she's like, yeah, we didn't do that that much.

[477] I was like, oh, we don't have Santa.

[478] I was like, what?

[479] They have baby Jesus.

[480] Right.

[481] But they have, like, baby Jesus brings presents.

[482] Oh, Jesus brings the presents.

[483] I want to, can we call her and have her explain it?

[484] Yeah, I'm deeply curious about this.

[485] I found it fascinating.

[486] Please pick up.

[487] Pick up, Anna.

[488] Hello?

[489] Hi.

[490] Oh, my God.

[491] I'm so glad you answered.

[492] What happened?

[493] This has been a tragedy.

[494] No, you're on Fightless Bird right now.

[495] Okay.

[496] Okay, because it's the Christmas episode.

[497] I want people to understand what happens in Venezuela.

[498] Can you lay it out, please?

[499] Yeah, the baby Jesus part?

[500] Yeah.

[501] Yeah, that part.

[502] Um, well, for us, we write letters to baby Jesus.

[503] Dear baby Jesus, blah, blah, blah, and then put them on the tree.

[504] Then the next day they're gone because baby Jesus comes and grabs them.

[505] And how does baby Jesus get in?

[506] Exactly.

[507] How does he get in?

[508] The chimney?

[509] He's just a baby.

[510] Well, but is he?

[511] Because he's three, remember?

[512] Well, that's too complicated.

[513] But he comes the 24th at night, and he brings the gifts for everybody.

[514] Yeah, puts them on the tree, around the tree, and then they're there the next day on Christmas Day.

[515] Okay, right.

[516] But then tell me how Santa is incorporated because your uncle dressed up as Santa, but there is no Santa.

[517] Yeah, Santa doesn't come to bring the gifts, but what we used to do is that my uncle used to dress up a Santa and come to my grandma's house and knock on the door and he would come in with a huge bag and just give us my grandparents' gifts to us so he would just sit on the couch and be like from Grandma to Onon give me the gift and then he would leave like goodbye and then that was Santa's appearance How does it work with kids stop not believing in Jesus then?

[518] Oh everyone in Venezuela believes in Jesus, right?

[519] But the parents don't if they're giving the gifts.

[520] Like, you know, when someone stops believing in Santa, it's not tied to religion like Jesus is.

[521] Yeah, I guess the question is, at what age do kids start realizing it's not baby Jesus who's bringing the presence?

[522] It's mom.

[523] I would say, I would say very late.

[524] Like, well, to me, I found out when I was like 13 because I found the letters in my mom's nightstand.

[525] But, yeah, people don't talk about that.

[526] Like, you don't ruin that for anybody once you find out, you know.

[527] Yeah, I mean, it's equivalent, I guess, to Santa here.

[528] But that yours is a little weirder because you still believe in baby Jesus.

[529] You just don't believe that he is a present giver.

[530] Right, true, yeah.

[531] And where does he's supposed to live?

[532] Who's helping him?

[533] Who's helping him with all these present deliveries and stuff?

[534] There's no elves?

[535] No, there's no elves.

[536] I mean, Jesus can do it all, right?

[537] Why is he a baby?

[538] Why is it baby Jesus and not adult Jesus?

[539] Oh, great question.

[540] Oh, because he's born that night.

[541] Oh, that makes total sense.

[542] Now I get it.

[543] Once you and I talked the other day, I did ask my mom how people, how they explain that Santa existed in other countries, because we do know Santa comes to kids in the state.

[544] Right.

[545] You know?

[546] Yeah.

[547] And she said, they just said, Oh, Santa goes to wherever there's no, and we just bought that.

[548] Oh, my God.

[549] All right.

[550] Well, that was great.

[551] Thank you for indulging us.

[552] And now we got to learn a little bit about baby Jesus.

[553] I'm glad I could teach you all about it.

[554] All right.

[555] Bye.

[556] Okay, bye.

[557] Okay, well, that was a hoot.

[558] I was an ecstasy during that entire conversation.

[559] That was so good.

[560] Wasn't it?

[561] And it's so funny because all the stories are pretty silly.

[562] Yes.

[563] But when you hear a new silly story, it's so silly that you're allowed.

[564] Because Santa and Baby Jesus, both, I would argue, pretty implausible delivery systems for presents.

[565] Equally unplausible.

[566] Yeah, equally implausible.

[567] Oh, no, I would say it's even more implausible than a baby.

[568] A small baby?

[569] They built up Santa's backstory a little better.

[570] Yeah, with Santa, Santa's got the big sack of presents.

[571] Exactly.

[572] And a sleigh.

[573] in a slate.

[574] What is a baby?

[575] I want to see the imagery around this and how it's actually portrayed.

[576] I love every element.

[577] Me too.

[578] It made me think I bet other cultures there's more of this out there.

[579] Yeah, completely.

[580] And Mike mentioned Christmas trees and the origins of them.

[581] I quickly Googled them.

[582] Decorated trees date back to Germany in the Middle Ages.

[583] German and other European settlers popularizing Christmas trees in America by the early 19th century.

[584] A New York woodsman named Mark Carr is credited with opening the first U .S. Christmas tree lot in 1857.

[585] Wow.

[586] Okay, I also wanted to share one more cultural Christmas item.

[587] In Spain, certain areas of Spain, they have a Christmas figurine.

[588] And it's a little tiny, and you can get different ones, but two inches tall.

[589] Tiny.

[590] Tiny.

[591] Little figurines of sometimes it's sports players, real people, and they're so.

[592] squatting down, their pants are down, and there's a poop underneath them.

[593] And they're called pooping boys.

[594] Well, we call them pooping boys.

[595] When I was in Spain earlier this year, we were on a mission to get pooping boys.

[596] You've got to find those pooping boys.

[597] And we got him.

[598] And I have a little figurine of a boy, a nighttime boy with a nighttime hat, and he's pooping.

[599] And I put him on my chest set, because I don't play chess.

[600] So I replaced one of the pieces with the pooping boy.

[601] These stories are just the best.

[602] things ever right like they're so extreme and so deeply unusual they're deeply unusual in every single way what's the origin of him why is he pooping on christmas no one should be shitting on i mean i know it's wild but he's enjoying it it's not like he's not shitting on it as in yeah he's it's a poop of joy it's a joy i think of the south park episode that had mr hanky the christmas poo which was a poo that would arrive on christmas there'd be poo a little hat on and he danced around singing Christmas songs and I used to love Mr. Hanky the Christmas poo so much when I was in high school.

[603] Memories.

[604] Memories.

[605] Stay tuned for more Flightless Bird.

[606] We'll be right back after a word from our sponsors.

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[637] I love this because I like cooking and I like having some stimuli happening while I'm cooking so I'm not super focused on the chopping and stuff.

[638] Yeah, if I'm cleaning the house, I can't be doing it with nothing else going on because it feels like a waste of time.

[639] I was like, I've got to be doing this horrible task, but also.

[640] taking something in.

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[645] Just say, Alexa, read a Christmas carol and boom, it starts.

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[656] Rudolph, the Red Nose Reindeer, he was a marketing stunt from the Montgomery War Department store in Chicago.

[657] Ah, yes.

[658] In invention back in 1939.

[659] And now Rudolph, we all feel like, oh, warm feelings towards him.

[660] It was just a way to sell things in us.

[661] door.

[662] I mean, whof.

[663] Look, I know there's problems with capitalism.

[664] Don't get me wrong.

[665] Of course.

[666] But there's also fun stuff that comes out of it.

[667] There's really fun stuff.

[668] Like Rudolph.

[669] Ugly sweaters at Christmas.

[670] Ugly sweater.

[671] Everyone loves ugly sweaters.

[672] Yeah.

[673] I think it's just really interesting how much of a good sales pitch it is where we feel so warm towards these things that are just blatantly silly.

[674] But I feel like that towards McDonald's and Coke.

[675] I feel warm towards those things.

[676] And they're the most grossly commercialized things of all time but I love them.

[677] Yeah, but they're yummy.

[678] Do you want an explanation of these pooping figurines?

[679] Yes, please.

[680] Yeah.

[681] So it's been around for a while and they have different reasons.

[682] So it's not a consensus on what it means.

[683] One is that it's fertilizing the earth.

[684] Oh, my God.

[685] That's good.

[686] The other ones, the modern ones, represent celebrities and authority figures and it serves as a leveling device to bring the mighty down.

[687] Oh.

[688] Well, it's a very different take.

[689] Yeah.

[690] And not Christmassy.

[691] Yeah.

[692] Another thing entirely sort of removed from this, but what Mike was talking about, there's this religion, Zoroastrianism, which originated 2000 BC, like a very long time ago.

[693] It started being written about a lot, I think, is 600 BC.

[694] But it was this Iranian religion that basically came up, and look, I'm not a religious scholar, so I hope I've got all this right, but it came up with ideas like the being a Messiah, and the being a heaven and a hell.

[695] Right.

[696] And all those big ideas were invented so long ago.

[697] Yeah.

[698] And religion, Judaism, and Christianity and Islam, just, you know, we're all like grabbing other ideas and swapping them and changing them.

[699] And I feel like that's the same thing with Christmas.

[700] Just like in Hollywood.

[701] There's no new ideas.

[702] There's no new ideas.

[703] All right.

[704] It's time for part two of the documentary.

[705] Great.

[706] It's another adventure.

[707] Best divinity.

[708] I'm about to go on.

[709] Another festival adventure.

[710] Oh, I love adventures.

[711] Adventures are good.

[712] I wanted to experience a big American Christmas, but I had a huge problem.

[713] This episode is coming out before Christmas.

[714] So how could I possibly experience an American Christmas?

[715] Christmas before Christmas.

[716] It was impossible, so I decided to do the next best thing.

[717] I'd do a Christmas activity, something Christmasy that was happening before Christmas.

[718] I decided on something called Holiday Road, a 45 -minute drive from my apartment.

[719] Holiday Road promised the experience of Christmas, its website proclaiming an immersive holiday experience in all caps.

[720] A magical Christmas experience you could walk through on foot.

[721] I arrived just after 7 p .m. What have we got here?

[722] Santa's Workshop.

[723] As I walk in, in true American style, there are a number of Christmasy backgrounds you can pose for photos in front of.

[724] I see, so you can get your photo taken in some different sort of photo booth areas.

[725] It's nice.

[726] I'll definitely have to get a photo in there.

[727] Okay, let's line up.

[728] A staff member is positioned in front of one of them, a Christmas photo frame.

[729] He's trapped in a purgatory being handed people's cell phones so he can take photos for them.

[730] How many photos have you taken this Christmas?

[731] Right now, like more than a thousand.

[732] It's a lot of photos.

[733] I ask another staff member about how America does Christmas.

[734] And they point out it's always a big build -up to the main event.

[735] I mean, it starts with Black Friday, right?

[736] It's a holiday shopping, capitalism at its finest, basically.

[737] tree lot's huge biggest trees I live 15 minutes away from they claim the world's largest Christmas tree it's in the Citadel outlets standing at something feet tall yeah it's insane but everything has to be like bigger and better everything has to be bigger and better I mean it stems from Texas that's literally their state model everything is bigger in Texas basically doesn't that capital building didn't they specifically build it a bit taller than like the actual capital capital in Washington?

[738] Sounds very American, so yeah, I would say yes, yes.

[739] Merry Christmas.

[740] Merry Christmas.

[741] I often reel off information about America with no idea if it's true or not.

[742] Terrible behavior.

[743] But I Google the Texas Capitol thing, and for once I'm right.

[744] The main U .S. capital in Washington is 288 feet tall.

[745] When Texas built its state capital, it made sure it was 14 feet taller.

[746] It was basically a dick measuring contest between Texas and the rest of America.

[747] Totally normal stuff.

[748] I joined the queue to get into Holiday Road with a bunch of other Christmas lovers.

[749] We have Christmas in New Zealand, but it's much smaller, whereas here...

[750] Everybody decorates their houses, decorates inside their houses, they go to church, you know, whether at Midnight Mass, you go to caroling or go see caroling.

[751] If you go to, like, Disneyland or Natsbury Farm, those amusement parks, they're decorated to the nines.

[752] It's great, and they have all sorts of stuff.

[753] for that as singing and shows that go with it.

[754] Disneyland has a Christmas parade.

[755] So it's really fun.

[756] Are you decorating your house this year?

[757] Yes.

[758] Yes, we are.

[759] Do you go all in?

[760] Do you get new decorations?

[761] Do you bring out the old ones?

[762] Oh yeah, I bring out the old ones.

[763] And then I always sneak in new ones on my husband and he gets mad.

[764] What's the power bill like each year?

[765] Oh, I don't know.

[766] Who cares?

[767] I think of the street I live on and how over the last few weeks all the lights have started going up.

[768] I've noticed that Americans love I love wrapping Christmas lights around tree trunks, and that all those American Christmas movies I watched as a kid are kind of spot on.

[769] Up ahead, someone is checking out tickets.

[770] I paid $35 for this Christmas treat and can't wait to see what awaits me. What can we expect in here?

[771] Very beautiful lights, wonderful music, and just an overall great experience.

[772] What does Christmas mean to you?

[773] Just spending time with your loved ones and being grateful for what you have and trying to be positive and spread cheer.

[774] So sort of walking down a path and it's just, I'm surrounded by glowing Christmas decorations.

[775] There's some big stars, some big trees.

[776] One thing that America loves is lights.

[777] They love the light bulb and they love putting light bulbs on everything.

[778] As I walk through all the light bulbs, the Christmas music swells around me. I'm just entering a tunnel of lights.

[779] It's like entering heaven.

[780] The lights are hypnotic and I find Christmas spirit leaching into my body.

[781] I emerge from the tunnel into some kind of half -sized Christmas town complete with snow.

[782] It's like being on a Hollywood set and very American.

[783] Around the corner I stumble upon the American classic Mike McCarag and I had discussed baby Jesus in a manger.

[784] See if they've got the key elements.

[785] They've got the magi.

[786] They've got a wise man. Now inside the manger we have some angels.

[787] We've got a little baby Jesus.

[788] We've got a couple of Magi inside.

[789] That magi is being left outside in the Coles.

[790] And Mary and some shepherds over there.

[791] Classic, isn't it?

[792] Classic scene.

[793] I keep walking along this little Christmas path and emerge into a display about Hanukkah, the Jewish festival held between December 18 and December 26th.

[794] Around another bend, there's a little area dedicated to Kwanza.

[795] Showing my absolute whiteness, I'd never heard of Kwanza before.

[796] It was first held 56 years ago and as a celebration of African American culture that happens between Christmas Day and January 1st, timed in with African Harvest Festivals.

[797] We wander on and arrive in an area with some Christmas toys for sale.

[798] It wouldn't be Christmas without selling stuff.

[799] What has been your best seller in the shop?

[800] Well, tonight it's the plush dog on a leash.

[801] Why does anyone need a fake plush dog on a leash?

[802] Who knows?

[803] I walk on and pass a giant Santa lit up in lights.

[804] I do like that Santa is this universal lie we just teach every westernized kid.

[805] It's such an odd thing.

[806] It is weird to lie to kids about a man breaking into your house each Christmas.

[807] But then again, Santa is based on a real guy, but he didn't break into houses.

[808] It's something Mike McCarag and I had talked about earlier.

[809] The Santa Claus, Father Christmas, whatever you want to call him, is mean to be a real guy, St. Nicholas.

[810] St. Nicholas is this incredibly compelling character, and in Europe especially, there's a great understanding of a historical St. Nicholas, but one place American commercialism has really upset me is turning St. Nicholas into a catalog toy pitchman.

[811] That really, really bugs me. We haven't taken the Christ out of Christmas, but we've absolutely taken the St. Nick out of it.

[812] it and I mean St. Nicholas.

[813] That makes me sad.

[814] St. Nick was a Christian bishop, born around 270 AD and dying age 73.

[815] He was an actual person who had an office in the church.

[816] His origin story is growing up with wealthy parents and detesting being wealthy in a world where poverty exists.

[817] And then this Christian bishop reportedly found three girls who were sex trafficked.

[818] Human trafficked, we'd call it today.

[819] It's kind of and forced prostitution.

[820] And him having money, he takes these bags of gold, sneaks to their house at night, and drops bags of gold into their window while they sleep.

[821] Why?

[822] It was enough money for a dowry.

[823] It allowed them to buy their ways out of sexual slavery.

[824] Now, this is a really different story than toys under the tree or stockings hung by the fire.

[825] But what we see is someone who was self -sacrifice, and who cared about people on the margins, especially those who were kind of despised by polite society.

[826] And you also have these stories of him being disrupted in the first council of Nicaea.

[827] He got very upset about some of the directions the church was taking, basically saying nothing about this faith is about power or influence.

[828] And I don't even really care about orthodoxy if there's anything about Christ that matters is that Christ was with the hopeless and the destitute and the poor, and our theology should reflect that.

[829] So I find this to be like an incredibly compelling character, and what we get in America today is, oh, oh, oh.

[830] And I just think that's sad.

[831] But so many of our venerated traditions are literally commercials, right?

[832] Rudolph, the Red Nose, Raneer, Santa Claus is Coming Town.

[833] And all these things are literally ad campaigns that became cultural touchstones, including the man in the red suit.

[834] So many things about Christmas are weird myths.

[835] Like, I've just ended up in some kind of polar bear display right now, which shows a bunch of polar bears standing with penguins.

[836] Absolute bullshit.

[837] A lie spread by Coca -Cola advertising.

[838] Polar bears don't live anywhere near penguins.

[839] Polar bears live in the Arctic.

[840] Penguins don't.

[841] This whole thing's a lie.

[842] It's quite a weird display, which has got a lot of polar bears and penguins.

[843] I've always sort of gone for the polar bear sound effects, which are, when you're walking through America, as we learn from the bears episode, when you hear a yowling bear, it's not a good thing.

[844] It's scary.

[845] What's been your highlight and your low light so far?

[846] I don't think there's any low light so far.

[847] Everything's been pretty nice.

[848] One thing I've noticed about Americans in the lead up to Christmas is they seem so positive about.

[849] about everything.

[850] More positive than normal.

[851] This whole walk I've been trying to trick Americans into ragging on Christmas, but they refuse.

[852] As we walk through some snow billowing down from the heavens, I try to counter the positivity with some Kiwi cynicism.

[853] It's not snow, it's fucking bubbles.

[854] It's a fucking bubble machine.

[855] It's all an illusion.

[856] Cleaning the bubbles off my glasses, I stumble into the middle of a giant field pulsating with different colored lights.

[857] So this feels like the climax of the walk is a giant feel.

[858] lights all flashing in sync with the music.

[859] A lot of people are taking photos.

[860] There's a lot of selfies and there's, yeah, always music blasting out.

[861] Wherever you turn.

[862] Merry Christmas.

[863] Best and worst gift you've ever received across your years of life.

[864] Pajamas and then...

[865] Is that best or worst?

[866] That's the worst.

[867] And then best would probably be a hotel vacation.

[868] Who gave you the pajamas?

[869] That sounds like a parent gift.

[870] That's my mother.

[871] Yep, that's my mother for you.

[872] As I wonder what terrible gifts this man will receive this year, I realize the walk is over, and we're back at the entrance again.

[873] I've just experienced 45 minutes of Christmas bliss.

[874] As I walk to the car, I bump into three women who have also experienced bliss.

[875] They're walking arm and arm, grinning ear to ear.

[876] 20 out of 10.

[877] We went through it twice.

[878] Twice.

[879] Twice?

[880] Twice.

[881] Nice, yes.

[882] The wine helped, but yeah.

[883] Yes, and it's, oh, by the way, it's all over my pants.

[884] Yeah, there's been a wine spill.

[885] The Christmas spirit has hit these three hard.

[886] What was the highlight?

[887] It just was magical.

[888] I think we're all going through like some times in our life that are a little bit disturbing, sad, depressing.

[889] And we just wanted to be in the zone and walk through it and just not think about that stuff.

[890] So it was...

[891] It's like tapping out of reality for a little bit.

[892] Exactly.

[893] Exactly.

[894] And what are you most looking forward to on actual Christmas Day?

[895] What are you all going to be doing?

[896] I'm going to be with my mom.

[897] I booked a flight home to Arkansas, so I'll be with my mom.

[898] We'll be having mimosa's and opening gifts, and I'll be Instagram storing her, and she's nuts, so it'll be hilarious.

[899] And what about you?

[900] What's your Christmas Day going to be?

[901] I'll be with my mom, my brother and family, just that magical feeling.

[902] that Christmas Day brings, regardless of what's happening, it's kind of a reset.

[903] And you can kind of have a little bit of magic and, yeah, sort of look forward to the next year.

[904] I love it.

[905] I love it.

[906] And what about you?

[907] I'm going back to New Jersey to be with fam.

[908] It's going to be amazing.

[909] Mamosas will be happening as well.

[910] Lots of Instagram stories.

[911] We celebrate Christmica.

[912] So we celebrate Christmas and Hanukkah in my house.

[913] Oh, I love that.

[914] My stepdad is Jewish and we grew up.

[915] you know, celebrating Christmas.

[916] So our presents are from Santa Steen, Christmas Cup.

[917] That's what it's about.

[918] I love that so much.

[919] You all have the best Christmas.

[920] Merry Christmas.

[921] I was struck by the fact that all just talked about their mums.

[922] And I got to thinking about my mum all the way back in New Zealand.

[923] In New Zealand, we spell it M -U -M by the way, so it's mum, not mom.

[924] Anyway, when I got home, it was dark in America, but still light in New Zealand.

[925] and the next day, which is weird.

[926] I decided to zoom my mum to talk to her about a special Christmas gift she had received many years ago.

[927] When did you know that I was coming?

[928] When on Christmas, did it start happening?

[929] Christmas Eve sometime after dinner, I think.

[930] My mum's name is Pam.

[931] I want to talk to her about giving birth to me on Christmas Day in December of 1982.

[932] I think Dad and I had some Chinese food.

[933] and I went into Middlemore Hospital in Auckland As far as births go obviously you'd already had one child my older brother, Robert so I was your second how was I to birth Was I easy, difficult How would you rate it Without too much crazy detail No detail But it was long But the obstetrician that came in Because mine was on holiday Thought that it could be a bit tricky And long So Dr. Blue, I'll never forget him And he said he would sleep in the next room Until all was well and you'd been born And he did and he attended to me And you were born at, I've forgotten what time, Christmas Day A Christmas miracle called Cinnamon entered the world A blessing for the entire planet Do you remember anything else This Christmas gift was being burnt into the world Sort of what was going on around you Do you sort of remember anything else?

[934] Yes, I do remember that the salvation army were outside my window playing Christmas carols and the staff came around with sherry and Christmas cake for me and I told them to go away and they did and they came back later but I still didn't feel like it.

[935] Most people like relaxing on Christmas and kicking their feet back whereas you were sort of an intense childbirth scenario.

[936] Do you resent me for that?

[937] Are you okay about it or was it a beautiful Christmas gift?

[938] No, it was wonderful really.

[939] It was It was a gift, and the staff actually at the hospital made it really Christmassy and celebratory, so it was really nice.

[940] And what's it been like having, I know we've often sort of bickered about this, having my birthday on Christmas Day, because I often want to make it about me, and obviously it's more about Jesus and Christmas.

[941] But how has it been for you having a child with a birthday on Christmas Day?

[942] Well, I haven't seen it as a problem.

[943] I've tried to differentiate between a birthday and a Christmas, but it's really difficult.

[944] We'll try different methods, and it hasn't really worked, so you just have to accept what happens on Christmas Day and your birthday, and you've been quite good about that.

[945] Your attitude's been quite good, so I've appreciated that.

[946] And, yeah, you've got to be 40.

[947] Yeah, we don't need to talk about the age.

[948] I'm still dealing with that.

[949] Okay, and that's about all.

[950] Well, thank you.

[951] Is there anything you'd like to say to people, listen to Flightless Bird for Christmas.

[952] Have a blessed Christmas and remember what the reason for the season is and Merry Christmas from Fongare, New Zealand.

[953] Speaking of New Zealand, I'm about to go back there for a holiday.

[954] This flightless bird is finally taking flight because the borders are open and I can return there to visit my mum and the rest of my family.

[955] I'll be taking a month off and Monica, Rob and Dax can finally get away from me. I'll be returning to America next year.

[956] in 2023.

[957] I'll even bring back a special flightless bird episode recorded in the faraway land of New Zealand.

[958] Yes, I'll be returning to the United States because I love it here, and I still have so much to explore here on flightless bird.

[959] I want to crawl into every American orifice that I can find, learning about America's unique, strange, wonderful, and puzzling ways.

[960] Did you like Pam?

[961] I loved Pam.

[962] Pam Ann.

[963] She's cool, right?

[964] Pam or Ann.

[965] Pam Ann.

[966] That was beautiful.

[967] I loved hearing from your mom.

[968] We tried once having my birthday in the middle of the year.

[969] Okay.

[970] Like a half birthday?

[971] Like a half birthday.

[972] But rubbish.

[973] No one sort of got into the spirit of it.

[974] And there was an ongoing problem that a lot of people have when they get presents where you'll get one present, but you'll be told, oh, it's both together and it's a bit bigger, but it's not.

[975] Did that happen a lot?

[976] I had a pretty rough childhood.

[977] Okay.

[978] So there's been an observation made about you.

[979] Stutz, which you've watched.

[980] Yeah, I love Stutz.

[981] We love Stutz.

[982] I love Stats.

[983] One of his tenets.

[984] So there's a shadow who is the version of yourself that you are trying to hide from the world.

[985] And the moment that that shadow sort of gets cemented is part X. And Christmas.

[986] Oh, you're saying me being born on Christmas.

[987] Pretty much define my entire reality and my entire life.

[988] And why you run.

[989] Yeah, I think it definitely had a lot to do with things But I also, I'd like to say I'm confronting some of them today And I'm confronting a lie that I've been telling Because I've almost been leaning into the myth As a way of getting through that But I've almost leaned in and my life has become a lie You know, I'm now the guy that's saying I'm born in Bethlehem on Christmas, you know, a lie I lied to you about it, I lied to Dax about it I lied to Rob about it You know Our first episode, you said that Yeah, I've been lying to everyone from the start.

[990] Honestly, David, I've told so many people that you have been born on Christmas in Bethlehem.

[991] I said it's Kristen yesterday and her mouth dropped.

[992] If she had heard it was just Christmas, she would have been like, oh, wow, but the Bethlehem piece makes it such a story.

[993] Yeah, and now that's all fallen apart.

[994] That's all gone.

[995] You know what I've learned from this episode is that sometimes you should keep.

[996] No, definitely not.

[997] Because once you start telling the truth, that's when the problems begin.

[998] No. I think what we can take a better moral is that we can still love you, even though parts of your origin story are flawed lies made up, just like Christmas.

[999] And you still want to spend time with me, even though the story has been a lie?

[1000] I mean, I'm busy for the next couple weeks, but maybe we'll see what we can.

[1001] can get on the books.

[1002] Maybe in 2023, we can get through this.

[1003] I appreciate this.

[1004] I'd like to thank you and Stutz for helping me confront a part of myself that I have been running away from.

[1005] What did you think was going to happen if you just told people you were born in Auckland?

[1006] The story happened out of my control.

[1007] Someone got it wrong years ago back when I was in New Zealand working in a newsroom there.

[1008] Someone published the fact I was born in Bethlehem on Christmas Day and it was just a case of not correcting it.

[1009] And it spread and it spread and as more people fed that lie back to me, I didn't want to ruin that Christmas by ruining it for them.

[1010] You started to believe it.

[1011] And so I started to lean in and I thought, what's the damage?

[1012] What's the harm?

[1013] And it just snowballed.

[1014] And I've been just living with this guilt for so long now and built sort of an entire career on the lie.

[1015] It feels both good and terrifying to have it out there that I wasn't born in Bethlehem.

[1016] I moved to Bethlehem at a later date.

[1017] I think this is good.

[1018] We're on the eve of your 40th year.

[1019] You're a new, you're a real.

[1020] You're Reborn, ding, ding, ding.

[1021] Reborn.

[1022] This is your resurrection now that you've...

[1023] I like this.

[1024] Start mythologizing things again.

[1025] You've explained your lie.

[1026] Now you can start anew.

[1027] Thank you.

[1028] It's a Christmas miracle.

[1029] Or all our listeners are leaving and not come back because they don't trust you.

[1030] Oh, no. No, that's not going to happen.

[1031] Oh, no. It's been really fun.

[1032] It's been a really fun year.

[1033] And I am going to bring back a flightless bird New Zealand edition because it is the land of flightless birds.

[1034] Great.

[1035] And I'll bring back an extra special episode for you.

[1036] All right.

[1037] Well, happy holidays.

[1038] Merry Christmas and happy birthday.

[1039] Oh, thank you.

[1040] You remembered.