168 – Live at the Civic Center in Des Moines

[0] This is exactly right.

[1] Hello.

[2] Hi, everyone.

[3] And welcome.

[4] This is my favorite murder.

[5] And this week's episode is going to be a live show that we're going to post for you a wonderful time that we had in Des Moines, Iowa.

[6] Beautiful Des Moines, Iowa.

[7] But we wanted to really quickly have a couple announcements to tell you guys.

[8] One is that we're going to be doing this year's Cluster Fest in San Francisco.

[9] And it's June 21st to 23rd.

[10] We're going to be performing on Sunday night the 23rd.

[11] So get your tickets at Clusterfest .com.

[12] That's right.

[13] But also we want to tell you about our brand new, beautiful, shiny, awesome fan cult.

[14] We redid the whole fucking thing.

[15] There's going to be new merch and a new design for the official fan cults.

[16] And that's just one part of the new website that all got redesigned.

[17] So the whole thing is new.

[18] Go check all of it out.

[19] But if you are a fan cult member, you can get into a drawing to win two all weekend passes to the entire festival.

[20] No, not just our show, but it's general admission to the weekend.

[21] And it's such a freaking good weekend.

[22] We also always give away two free tickets to every live show.

[23] So if you're in the fan cult, you have access to that.

[24] There's an awesome forum that's brand new and really cool videos and just really fun stuff.

[25] And we're really proud of it now and happy.

[26] And very excited that it's been redone and we think you're going to like it.

[27] So yeah, consider joining the fan cult if you haven't because there's lots of good stuff to get.

[28] And of course, then just enjoy.

[29] the website.

[30] Yeah.

[31] Because, oh my God.

[32] You can send your hometown in from it and just visit there.

[33] Live your life.

[34] Just hang out like it's a park.

[35] Visit with it for a little while.

[36] Yeah.

[37] Take a moment.

[38] Yeah.

[39] Just get some you time.

[40] But on our website.

[41] Right.

[42] www.

[43] www .m .m .com .com.

[44] That's right.

[45] That's your other website.

[46] All right.

[47] And now, please enjoy us live in Des Moines, Iowa.

[48] Yeah.

[49] Thanks for listening, guys.

[50] Stay sexy.

[51] No, get murdered.

[52] Goodbye.

[53] You're doing that.

[54] Yeah, you've just been filmed.

[55] We're going to ask you to fill out some paperwork after the show.

[56] Each one of you needs to give us a release more.

[57] Please.

[58] I hope that worked.

[59] Oh, maybe I'll turn my phone off too.

[60] Sorry, don't like to take any calls during the show.

[61] Please don't text during the show, Georgia.

[62] Please.

[63] Hi.

[64] Oh, wow.

[65] Hi.

[66] We have finally come to you, Des Moines.

[67] Yes.

[68] that's right your patience is amazing yeah truly and you proved you meant it because there is not an empty seat in the house to me it's so crazy here that the elevator got stuck with someone in it did you hear about that someone was stuck in the elevator and Vince came back he's like we might have to hold someone stuck in the elevator I'm like this is amazing we are going to bring them on stage we're going to get the whole story and in my mind of course it's like two girls who are friends.

[69] They had seen each other in a while, but they both have anxiety issues, and so they're freaking out.

[70] And then it ended up being...

[71] An usher.

[72] Yeah.

[73] So everyone on stage, you're like, I don't know what this is, what's a podcast.

[74] They're like, sorry, I'm in a union.

[75] I'm not coming on that stage.

[76] Get out of here.

[77] I don't know how to do your show for you, lady.

[78] I'm not a fan.

[79] I just got the night off.

[80] Yep.

[81] Because of this situation.

[82] I thought I'd just hang out in this elevator the whole time.

[83] You guys busted me. And you got any drive?

[84] for the occasion.

[85] Oh, everybody.

[86] So good.

[87] So good.

[88] It's such a good dress.

[89] I can't believe it.

[90] We went to Donna's dress shop as we were leaving Kansas City over on 39th Street.

[91] Don't be mad.

[92] Don't be mad.

[93] We had to fit it in before we left.

[94] And it got so quiet.

[95] I'd like to talk to you about the importance of fashion.

[96] No, but I usually, usually it's George's time and then I kind of go around and going, maybe there's a purse that'll fit me because that's how it is with the old vintage clothes and the ladies with the tits and the asses.

[97] You don't, they don't.

[98] Right?

[99] Usually you have to wait and you have to go into what I like to call the Italian Widows section.

[100] See what you can find over there.

[101] But Donna's dress shop not only has vintage stuff but then also kind of modern stuff based on vintage.

[102] So I was like, check this shit out.

[103] The only thing is this, I don't think I wore ever worn a plunging neckline to this degree before.

[104] Thank you.

[105] That is, it's a lot of plunge.

[106] There's a lot of tits happening.

[107] For those of you listening at home, you're not here and you don't get to see it.

[108] It's just for me and Georgian Des Moines.

[109] Last time you did that, we were in Vegas and you had a dress on.

[110] That was really plunging.

[111] That was a plunger.

[112] from the gap.

[113] And then the woman, didn't a woman pat you on the tits?

[114] Yeah, do you want to do a quick reenactment?

[115] Sure.

[116] You'd think that then I would stop wearing dresses like that.

[117] I thought that's why you weren't wearing that one.

[118] No, no, no. I wasn't wearing that one because for some reason the shape of it and maybe this is just kind of a longer dresser, like more elongating.

[119] But that one literally, it looked like my tits were trying to choke me to death.

[120] They were way up here.

[121] Way up here.

[122] Anyway, so at the meet and greet, it was literally the first group of people that came through, and it was like a group of five, and we're all kind of like, hi, nice to meet you, da -da -da -da, and I was on the outside, so everybody was kind of coming and talked to Jordan first.

[123] I don't know who I'm playing, and I don't know what I'm doing.

[124] Okay, you can be yourself.

[125] Okay.

[126] And at first you're talking to the people in greeting, and I'm over here on this side waiting for everyone to get down to my area.

[127] And then the first lady who came to my area, it was like broke away from the group.

[128] She was real fun.

[129] She was from Ibiza, and she thinks we should go to Abiza someday.

[130] Ibiza.

[131] Go to Abiza.

[132] We're definitely going to go to Ibiza.

[133] She was like, oh, my God, look at your boobies.

[134] And I was like, I do all the time.

[135] They're not that interesting to me. I snorted.

[136] I understand it's fresh for other people.

[137] And then she goes like this.

[138] We'll put our microphones on because she literally went like this.

[139] Oh, my God.

[140] She patted your boobies.

[141] For real.

[142] Kind of light.

[143] I think I may have done too.

[144] Yeah, you're kind of hurt.

[145] It was sorry.

[146] That's okay.

[147] But it was like a, it was very odd.

[148] It wasn't sexual in any way.

[149] It was almost like, look at I found these two small beach balls.

[150] I know why.

[151] I know why.

[152] Because she, like me, was a small -titted girl.

[153] And when she saw a big booby, all she can think of is, what's that like?

[154] It doesn't understand that they're like, it's a thing.

[155] What's that like?

[156] You know, you don't ever think of them sexually because they're just there.

[157] But also she wasn't, it was very, uh, it was very, uh, objectifying because she wasn't even talking to me. It was like she was yelling to her friends.

[158] Like, I'm touching her boobies.

[159] Or I'm like, you're looking at me. Isn't that what we're fighting against every day?

[160] What are you doing?

[161] Lady.

[162] Listen, I'm not trying to fucking justify her creepy weird actions because I would never do that.

[163] But still, well, my thing is, when they went to walk away, she said it again to her group of friends like they were all like we're going to get in there and it was like some kind of a treasure hunt what is that called a scavenger hunt yeah when it's like we're going to try to pull a hair out of Georgia's head and somebody has to pat Karen on the top of the boobs real weird she said it one more time and I looked at the man that was with them who actually looked very embarrassed and I go some would call it a salt anyway who's next but I'm going back I don't give a shit They're mine.

[164] I'm going to do what I want.

[165] Do it.

[166] The only sad thing is there's no pockets in this dress, which I know.

[167] Look, I'll have them professionally sewn in by an Italian tailor, and it'll be fine.

[168] Tailior.

[169] Tallior.

[170] In Ibiza, I'll send it away.

[171] They do great tailoring there.

[172] That's right.

[173] But, however.

[174] Oh, yeah.

[175] Don't you worry about a thing.

[176] What are you saying?

[177] Don't you worry about a thing?

[178] Oh, okay.

[179] Like someone's got pockets on this stage, so you don't have to worry about it.

[180] So worry, I'm covering for Karen today.

[181] It's nice.

[182] Yeah.

[183] It's great.

[184] She has a knife for me in there somewhere.

[185] But last night I did, remember the cat in the...

[186] Oh, yes, this is good.

[187] So, you'll like it.

[188] Karen can't see shit, right?

[189] And so when this woman held up a life -size fucking reproduction of Elvis, my cat, I lost my mind.

[190] I thought it was a real cat.

[191] until later when I told her like later yeah I was I thought someone was like holding up like this Siamese cat it was kind of curled over and I was like oh that's a bummer like you can have emotional support dogs all day long because they like people and they're loyal and they want to that's the relationship they have with men not cats and it was literally like look at the cat I forced to come here and I was just like oh I can't and she thought I was like really excited about it and like yeah you should totally do that to your cats no it wasn't and then the woman came to the meet and greet and like presented me with this gorgeous like siamese plushy thing that clearly had been like sent away for probably like made yeah it was made but simeese taylor probably and then i was like oh my god thank you i love it so much i was going to cry and karen goes i don't think she's giving it to you the girl was like uh uh uh she wasn't giving it to me she was not why show me thing.

[192] Don't show presents.

[193] Don't show presents and then walk away with the present.

[194] It was so embarrassed.

[195] It was hilarious.

[196] It was hilarious because the girl I watched the girl go you can have it if you want it.

[197] But I didn't hear that because I was so happy.

[198] And then it's like oh, that's where, I'm sorry.

[199] I almost stole it.

[200] That's like the time and I know I've told the story on the podcast but that's like the time I did a show.

[201] It was when I recorded my album.

[202] And afterwards my friends were backstage but it was at this the bootleg theater in los angeles so there was a there's another show right after and no one gave a shit and so i was kind of like standing in the green room being congratulated by my friends and then this girl walks in with a bouquet of mylar balloons and it was as i had no idea i was going to have this reaction because i didn't think i cared about balloons that much but i was like oh my god thank you and i almost started crying and the girl goes these are mine and like walk to the other side of this.

[203] Oh, it's like a little kick in the dick just for fun.

[204] Yeah, that's how I felt.

[205] Yeah.

[206] I almost started crying, holding the sign.

[207] He's like, I'm going to hold this forever.

[208] It's my stuffed animal.

[209] Oh, it's yours.

[210] Oh, I'm sorry.

[211] You keep that.

[212] I'm an adult.

[213] That's yours and I'll get my own balloons if I need them.

[214] I don't need it.

[215] I don't need it.

[216] I have the real one at home.

[217] Yeah.

[218] I'm going to go talk about him.

[219] Yeah.

[220] Oh, my nose is...

[221] Okay.

[222] But we're very excited.

[223] Were those your Kleenexes?

[224] Yeah.

[225] We drove here today, and what was very exciting to come into Iowa and immediately see three competing fireworks stores.

[226] Pyrotown, Rocket City, and fucking let's light everything on Fireville, I think, is what they were called.

[227] Yeah.

[228] Right?

[229] What if they're owned by, like, three siblings across the...

[230] Who hate each other.

[231] Yes.

[232] Oh, those are my fireworks.

[233] This is our new FX series.

[234] It's called fucking Rocket Town.

[235] One of them serves barbecue.

[236] Like, what's going on?

[237] That was exciting.

[238] You guys are living the fucking dream out here.

[239] Every day is Fourth of July.

[240] What more does one want?

[241] What took us so long?

[242] Jesus.

[243] Yeah.

[244] If you had sent one email that said, we have three competing fireworks, warehouses, with barbecue, near a freeway.

[245] You would have been like, okay, let's call United right now.

[246] Get on a flight.

[247] promo code murder.

[248] Oh, by the way, this is my favorite murder.

[249] Oh, the podcast, yeah.

[250] This is Georgia Hard Starck.

[251] Thank you.

[252] Stephen's not here.

[253] He's not here.

[254] I know.

[255] I know.

[256] We like to go up and then down with the cheers.

[257] That's what good storytelling is.

[258] eyes and then very low lows.

[259] That's right.

[260] Yeah, but he's listening.

[261] He's the first one that hears all of these live shows.

[262] He takes them immediately and he goes into the, what I pictures the corner of his apartment and then just pulls on his mustache for like an hour and 40 minutes and listens to every word we say.

[263] That's right.

[264] So he's with us in spirit, always, always.

[265] Always.

[266] Yeah.

[267] Even though legally he's not allowed to be in Iowa ever again.

[268] That's right.

[269] he's wanted by the law Yeah Fireworks situation Oh you should have seen That mustache didn't grow back For months you guys It was sad They told him Fireworks and dinosaurs Do Not Mix And he was like Fuck you, I don't care Yeah he can't He can't mess around anymore Because Stephen is now The head engineer Of the exactly right podcast We made him sign a fucking contract And everything We made him sign a do not Disclose release form or whatever those things are called.

[270] Do not release all the shit that we make you take out when you're recording us and we don't know the mics are on.

[271] We've had a talk with Stephen where we're like, we know you have everything there is to ruin us.

[272] We know you have that on a chip somewhere that you're saving.

[273] In your mustache.

[274] Squirreling all the good stuff away.

[275] I bet you he has his mustache mic constantly.

[276] He's wired for fucking sound at all times.

[277] Is that you're right?

[278] Oh, Stephen.

[279] God damn it.

[280] He didn't even do anything.

[281] Leave it!

[282] How's those elbows?

[283] Great.

[284] How are they feeling?

[285] Good?

[286] Yeah, pretty good.

[287] Yeah.

[288] I was on stage one night, I think, was like probably five live shows ago.

[289] And I did something like this and looked down.

[290] And my elbows, it looked like I covered both of them in ashes.

[291] Like, it was Ash Wednesday, but only on my elbows.

[292] It was not cool.

[293] Is that a thing?

[294] Ash Elbow Wednesday?

[295] It is.

[296] It's the day after Ash Wednesday.

[297] They still call it Wednesday?

[298] What?

[299] I don't know.

[300] Should we sit down?

[301] Yes, this is the kind I like.

[302] These are good.

[303] I was going to say elbow rests.

[304] That's not what they are.

[305] Arm rests.

[306] Ash Wednesday elbow rests.

[307] These make all the difference, guys.

[308] Oh, we're going to put out a line of Chairs someday.

[309] That's next, everybody.

[310] On next thing, furniture.

[311] Chairs you can stand on and adjust.

[312] Nice.

[313] Oh, my phone's still here.

[314] Oh.

[315] Should we call someone?

[316] Yeah, let's call Stephen.

[317] Do you want to?

[318] Yes.

[319] Oh, my God.

[320] What if he's like, how's your diarrhea?

[321] But no, because, remember, I texted Stephen, literally Vince came and said it's time to go.

[322] And then I went, oh, shit, I need to out.

[323] asked Stephen one question.

[324] So let's see if I can get the answer, because he didn't answer in time.

[325] Can I hear it?

[326] Well, we'll just explain what's going on.

[327] FaceTime.

[328] No, no, FaceTime.

[329] They can spy on you.

[330] Are you a child?

[331] We're doing it.

[332] FaceTime.

[333] FaceTime.

[334] Calling him.

[335] Be cool.

[336] Hi, Steven.

[337] Your best friends are here.

[338] Did you get, Karen wants to know her.

[339] answer.

[340] But you, wait, but not in detail.

[341] Just give me a yes or no. Uh, no. Okay, great.

[342] Great.

[343] Thank you.

[344] Cool.

[345] Thank you, Stephen.

[346] But Stephen, is there a caveat to the no, like, maybe once or in a small amount before?

[347] Okay, that's enough.

[348] Oh, do you think someone did your murder that you're doing tonight?

[349] Yes.

[350] And I realized it literally two minutes before it's just to walk on stage.

[351] Oh, my God.

[352] Okay, in a hometown.

[353] Oh, thank you, Stephen.

[354] Um, Tell everyone goodbye, Stephen.

[355] Can I just make this public announcement?

[356] That's so funny.

[357] If you don't know this already, there is a way that people can spy on you through your phone, through Facebook.

[358] I mean, FaceTime.

[359] We know you think that.

[360] It's true.

[361] I'll do it to you tonight, and I'm going to tell you it.

[362] Double dare you.

[363] You'll be like, Jesus, they're boring.

[364] I'm just saying, delete FaceTime.

[365] Delete it.

[366] But how am I going to talk to my nephew?

[367] But how am I going to get Amazon to suggest things for me to buy if they're not spying money on me at all times.

[368] Uh -oh.

[369] It goes all the way to the top.

[370] This is government.

[371] So your murder hasn't been done maybe in a hometown?

[372] Probably not, haven't been done.

[373] Maybe.

[374] Odds are no. Got a hope.

[375] Great.

[376] That's hilarious.

[377] All right.

[378] Oh, this is a true crime comedy podcast.

[379] We have to make this.

[380] Who Wandered in?

[381] Maybe you have a student ID that gets you into shows.

[382] Maybe you are an elevator operator.

[383] Took a night off.

[384] off.

[385] I'll just stick around after.

[386] Hey, why not?

[387] I fix the elevator.

[388] I'm going to dip my head in and see what these chicks are up to.

[389] Have a beer.

[390] Women talking.

[391] Two at the time.

[392] Doesn't even make sense.

[393] I don't log that in the 40s.

[394] Well, it turns out no. We got permission.

[395] We got permission from our husbands and up here tonight.

[396] So proud.

[397] Yeah, it's a true crime comedy podcast if you've never listened before because oftentimes there's people who do listen to our podcast, that then they get tickets to a live show, and then they force people who don't listen to our podcast to come and listen to stories about murder, which is, if you are a person who's been forced, you need to look at the person that you're with and go, does she have my best interest at heart?

[398] Should I trust her with choices in the future?

[399] Probably not.

[400] Or what can I force her to go to now?

[401] N -C -A -A playoffs down the street.

[402] You know who's playing tonight, right?

[403] Yeah, I know who's playing.

[404] No, who?

[405] Oh.

[406] Who?

[407] I thought, the fighting.

[408] Oh, it's going to be this.

[409] The fighting rug doctors.

[410] Yes.

[411] How fun would that be?

[412] What's a rug doctor?

[413] The rug doctors are the steamers you go at the grocery store.

[414] I forgot.

[415] It's so disgusting.

[416] I'm so sorry, I thought you meant the spin doctors.

[417] I was like, that would also be, if the spin doctors fought a bunch of rug doctors, Yeah.

[418] Maybe those fucking chin beards would get clean for once.

[419] Steam those things.

[420] Steem it out.

[421] When you don't have a lot of money but live in an apartment with carpet, and you get, just pay the extra $60 for a person to come clean.

[422] It's the most disgusting thing you've ever, you have to empty the, oh, and you're like, I'm filthy.

[423] Yeah.

[424] In your sink or your toy.

[425] Then you're like, glitter.

[426] I've never thought glitter in my, what?

[427] It's really gross.

[428] Years and years of debris.

[429] Anyway, this is a true crime comedy podcast.

[430] and we just like to explain this because a lot of times that people might not understand who don't listen and don't we don't have the benefit of the doubt.

[431] For people who don't listen, they think you can't talk about something as horrible as murder, which is the worst thing that can happen to anybody or anyone's family, and combine that with comedy, that's disrespectful and it's offensive, and I hate you, and I'm going to write an email about you, which we understand.

[432] And it's, although reactive, it is a natural reaction to this.

[433] And what we would like to tell you is that George and I have both been obsessed with true crime since we were little kids.

[434] It's creepy.

[435] Sadly.

[436] Yeah.

[437] And we were feral.

[438] And so we do love and follow and are obsessed with true crime and the stories about them.

[439] But then we also, personality -wise, we're just both two funny people who like to express ourselves through comedy and as a coping mechanism.

[440] to get through this total piece of shit called life.

[441] So, if that offends you or that bothers you or that's something that's against your religion, we invite you to get the fuck out right now.

[442] Yeah.

[443] And if you were mad about that, last night we made those people stand up, the people who hadn't heard of before.

[444] So consider yourself lucky for just...

[445] Yeah, we made the drag -along stand -up, which was super rude because a lot of people were just like, uh, what?

[446] Do you do this?

[447] Am I going to have water?

[448] dumped on my head.

[449] But there was one guy that just shot straight up.

[450] I'm not here for this at all.

[451] Yeah.

[452] Do I get to be excused?

[453] Yeah.

[454] What do I get?

[455] Drink tickets or something?

[456] Please.

[457] Help me. Help me through this.

[458] Yeah.

[459] We can't help you.

[460] Oh, wait.

[461] Am I first?

[462] You are.

[463] Great.

[464] You look like you were getting ready to go.

[465] No, I like to touch paper.

[466] Okay.

[467] I'm first.

[468] Yay.

[469] Y 'all, this shit's fucked up.

[470] this is the murder of Dustin Wheatie I don't know anymore maybe we need to make everyone be silent whether or not they know it good look it's just weird make them be silent all right here we go at 21 years old our friend this fucking chick Tracy Richter she's from Chicago she's living in Denver Colorado she's studying radiology whatever.

[471] She meets a dude and marries him named John Pittman.

[472] He's a med student Northwestern.

[473] The screaming.

[474] Banchies.

[475] You can't criticize if it's off the top of my head.

[476] You're right, you're right, you're right.

[477] I know it's tacky, but it's the first thing that came out.

[478] I get it.

[479] Give me another chance.

[480] I will.

[481] There's going to be more colleges tonight.

[482] Oh, great.

[483] Everywhere.

[484] Great.

[485] Okay, he's in residency to become a plastic surgeon.

[486] They have a baby.

[487] and they moved to Virginia.

[488] Okay.

[489] Sorry.

[490] They have a baby, but he's becoming a plastic surgeon, so he's fucking gone all the time, like 120 hours a week.

[491] He's out of the house.

[492] So he's never home.

[493] But then he starts noticing strange charges showing up on their credit card, and he finds out that Tracy's leaving their newborn home with babysitters all the time when he's gone too.

[494] Man. No judgments.

[495] No judgments.

[496] I would never do it, so whatever you want to do with a newborn.

[497] born is up to you.

[498] You wouldn't do the first part.

[499] Do your thing.

[500] Just get it done.

[501] It doesn't sound easy.

[502] Keep them alive.

[503] That's all that matters.

[504] So he does what any trusting husband does and hires a private investigator to follow her around.

[505] Right.

[506] Which is just the foundation of a good marriage, I feel like.

[507] It's good to get support in your marriage.

[508] Through photographs or video tape, whatever it takes.

[509] Right.

[510] And, of course, finds out she's having.

[511] a shit ton of affairs, you know.

[512] A couple?

[513] I think so.

[514] It says it's like a spate of affairs.

[515] Okay.

[516] Which, who knows what that means?

[517] You know?

[518] What if it means zero?

[519] She's, she was having less than a hundred affairs.

[520] Well, how many?

[521] We'll never know.

[522] Yeah.

[523] Let me show you a photo, a picture of her.

[524] Here we go.

[525] Oh.

[526] Watch it.

[527] Watch your mouth.

[528] So she's kind of hot, you know.

[529] Are you mad?

[530] At them?

[531] Yeah, I'm mad at them.

[532] Leave us tits girls alone.

[533] There's nothing we can do.

[534] They're just there.

[535] It's all the fucking time.

[536] Taking up space.

[537] Wait, you can't take them off when you go to bed?

[538] No. That sucks.

[539] I'm sorry.

[540] That's all right.

[541] So, in 1992, Tracy, see, her, is now 27, and he knows she's cheating on him, but they work it out.

[542] They're having an argument at one point.

[543] And she does what any natural trusting wife would do and pulls a gun on him and fires at him.

[544] What?

[545] In the home?

[546] Uh -huh.

[547] Oh, my God.

[548] You put the ketchup back wrong.

[549] How do you, I don't know.

[550] You know, and then you fire?

[551] Yeah.

[552] Because that meant she had it in her pocket.

[553] Or maybe she was like, I'm going to be right back.

[554] and, like, then brought it out.

[555] She's like, pause this argument.

[556] Yeah.

[557] I need to do something rational.

[558] So he calls the cop.

[559] She's charged with discharging a firearm during an argument, which is a thing.

[560] Oh, is it really?

[561] And pleads no contests.

[562] And in return, she receives a probated sentence.

[563] Is that probation?

[564] It is.

[565] No, that's...

[566] Okay.

[567] I'm a lawyer.

[568] Here's a thing.

[569] I don't know, but if you say it like that, then it absolutely is.

[570] Okay.

[571] It is.

[572] That's what it is.

[573] Yeah, Georgia.

[574] We all know.

[575] God.

[576] So he, shockingly files for a divorce.

[577] Okay.

[578] Can you believe it?

[579] Yes.

[580] And before it's finalized in 1996, Tracy then during their divorce, accuses John of sexually abusing their five -year -old son.

[581] Oh, no. He's not, FYI.

[582] A judge dismisses the case for lack of evidence, and Tracy moves back to her hometown of Chicago with her son.

[583] So do you think it was a case of she's trying to hurt him the war?

[584] way possible?

[585] Well, wait until you hear more about her.

[586] I'll stop asking questions and listen.

[587] You tell me after you hear about what this person's like.

[588] Okay.

[589] So she moves back to Chicago.

[590] She goes online dating.

[591] She, you know, does the old, it's like the early, like 90s, so that's got to be an ugly time.

[592] That's Craigslist shit.

[593] Yeah.

[594] No, no. Do you need a dresser drawer or a one -night stand?

[595] Come on over.

[596] Do you need a nightstand or a one -night stand?

[597] Do you?

[598] So, but however, she meets a fucking businessman in Australia.

[599] They talk online for a couple months.

[600] He comes to visit, to meet her, and 18 days later, they get married, as normal people do all the time.

[601] Quick red flag.

[602] Do they have businessmen in Australia?

[603] I don't know.

[604] And I change that from entrepreneur, because there's no fucking word, no thing I trust less than when someone's an entrepreneur.

[605] But I think you have to use that word because it's untrustworthy.

[606] It's indicative.

[607] No, he's fine, too.

[608] Oh, okay.

[609] Everyone's fine in this, but her.

[610] Okay.

[611] We don't, yeah.

[612] Spoiler alert.

[613] Spoiler alert.

[614] They get married in 18 days.

[615] Yikes.

[616] Okay, so his name's Michael.

[617] I give it a full 30.

[618] Absolutely.

[619] Yeah.

[620] I got engaged in three months once, and guess what?

[621] It didn't fucking work.

[622] Yeah.

[623] It turns out you can't know someone that quickly.

[624] Was there just kind of a hot, hot, hot, heat.

[625] passion to it?

[626] No, it was a, we're 29 and we're better than everyone else and let's get this over, you know, like yeah, sure.

[627] Look how in love we are with each other.

[628] Sure.

[629] And then it just stopped.

[630] It didn't.

[631] We weren't.

[632] Turns out.

[633] Turns out.

[634] Big reveal.

[635] So Tracy and her new quick husband, Michael, moved to early Iowa.

[636] It's a small town at a, there's, you guys, everyone from, there's 557 people that live there.

[637] So there's like five times the amount tonight.

[638] All of them are here tonight.

[639] They're all here today.

[640] Early.

[641] Early's here.

[642] It's a hundred miles from Des Moines.

[643] Ooh, I'm sorry.

[644] That's gross.

[645] I'm not a germ person like you.

[646] Watch this.

[647] Ew.

[648] I mean, you know where my fucking gross fingers have been because you hang out with me all day.

[649] Washed and washed and washed again.

[650] It couldn't be...

[651] My mouth is now cleaner for having to That's true.

[652] That's true.

[653] They moved to early, as I said.

[654] They have two children.

[655] Let me show you a picture of them.

[656] Why am I going for my telephone?

[657] This thing.

[658] Oh, look how in love they are after 18 days.

[659] 18 days.

[660] I think that happens to haunt people, though.

[661] It would be so difficult to be, like, crazy hot.

[662] And then how would you, you must just be.

[663] You think she's crazy?

[664] Well, I mean, sure, she doesn't not look like, that looks like a Zales ad or something.

[665] Doesn't it?

[666] Yeah.

[667] That looks like an ad that would make me really mad at Christmas time.

[668] I'd be like, what do I have to watch this shit?

[669] Yeah.

[670] Two people spinning around each other and then like, uh -huh, uh -huh.

[671] Chocolate diamonds?

[672] That's not a thing.

[673] Ew.

[674] No. It's a brown diamond, Zales.

[675] Stop it.

[676] I don't want a matching fucking necklace and earrings.

[677] No. Chocolate diamond.

[678] aren't a real thing.

[679] Also, diamonds aren't valuable.

[680] Do you know that?

[681] Diamonds aren't valuable.

[682] There's so many.

[683] Okay, we'll get into that on our other podcast.

[684] Diamonds aren't valuable.

[685] Coming to exactly right in 2025.

[686] We're working on it.

[687] Okay.

[688] Sorry.

[689] No, it's great.

[690] But obviously, their marriage is in trouble almost from the start, surprising to no one.

[691] Michael finds out she's sleeping with other men.

[692] Um, and she, you know, coming home, she's coming home at weird hours of the night and all this shit.

[693] She might be a sex addict.

[694] Yeah.

[695] Mm -hmm.

[696] Um, he tries to work.

[697] He's like, let's get through this, even though you're the one having all the fun.

[698] Uh, you know.

[699] Um, but she has an unpredictable temper and violent outbursts, hence shooting at her ex fucking husband at one time.

[700] Yeah.

[701] I wonder if the gun's back here on those one, like cop straps back here.

[702] Yeah.

[703] Yeah.

[704] Or maybe it's like a cute little one in her sock.

[705] Oh, an ankle gun.

[706] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[707] Those are the cutest.

[708] So cute.

[709] So in 2001, so then in 2001, they're still married and everything.

[710] But her ex -husband, you know, the shooting target.

[711] He's worried about his son's living situation, so he sues for sole custody.

[712] And this fucking sets her off.

[713] So here's what happens.

[714] Okay.

[715] On December 31st, 2001, Tracy calls 911 to report that she had just shot an intruder to death who had broken into her house and tried to strangle her with a set of panty hose.

[716] A full set?

[717] Sorry.

[718] Yeah, I don't know why I said that.

[719] Sorry.

[720] No. A pair.

[721] A pair, yeah.

[722] A pair.

[723] A set.

[724] Some, one.

[725] Or just panty hose.

[726] Just panty house.

[727] Sorry, I didn't have to do that.

[728] I wish you would have.

[729] I'm glad you did.

[730] So.

[731] Stop it.

[732] Sorry.

[733] The victim is Tracy's 20 -year -old neighbor named Dustin Wheatty.

[734] He, W .E., it's not like Wheaties.

[735] Yeah.

[736] She had shot him.

[737] She thought he was an intruder, shot him nine times.

[738] Mm -hmm.

[739] With two separate handguns.

[740] Fucking Annie Oakley style.

[741] Jesus Christ.

[742] But she kept in her home safe.

[743] So she basically was like, there was an intruder.

[744] He came after me. He fought me. My kids were in the room next door.

[745] I was scared for their lives.

[746] He was using a panty hose on me. And she had a panty hose.

[747] She had a mark on her neck.

[748] Who knows if it's from panty hose?

[749] But that's what I'm saying.

[750] And so she got out, ran to her bedroom safe, pulled out two guns.

[751] and shot him nine times, and then realizing it was her next -door neighbor, Dustin.

[752] So, so, uh -da -da -da -da -da, okay, he's a sweet, normal, like, computer nerd dude who lives in his parents' basement and is, like, super just a kid.

[753] Oh.

[754] Yeah.

[755] He's like, he's, okay.

[756] And then, um, he's timid.

[757] He has no criminal record.

[758] Police are like, this is weird.

[759] He doesn't seem like a candidate for home, um, burglary and assault.

[760] and also he had used to come over and help her Tracy out with shit so she knew who he was and he parked his car in her driveway which doesn't sound like something someone would do who's going to break into someone's house and so police search his car and in Dustin's car they find a pink spiral -bound notebook with a written confession inside in his handwriting it says that he says that a mysterious fellow named John Pittman had hired him to kill Tracy and her 11 -year -old son.

[761] And John was her ex -husband who was trying to get civil custody.

[762] Oh, right.

[763] So it made it seem like John was hiring destined to kill Tracy, and so then John would get in trouble.

[764] Does that make sense?

[765] Yes, it does, absolutely.

[766] What doesn't make sense is some dude writing a confession in a pink spiral -bound notebook.

[767] Leaving it in the car, parking the car in front of the...

[768] It's like, I'm about to do a crime, but in case I get murdered, during it.

[769] I'll just quickly confess to it.

[770] Yeah.

[771] And just clean this up real tightly.

[772] Yeah.

[773] We're all like what?

[774] Bullshit.

[775] Bullshit, bullshit, bullshit.

[776] Bullshit sensors going off.

[777] So but John, the ex -husband, the police are never able to find a link.

[778] There's no phone records.

[779] There's nothing to say that they knew each other or ever had any contact.

[780] And so police are fucking suspicious of Tracy's story but they don't press charges against her and the case is classified as a self -defense homicide.

[781] And then she becomes fucking a media star.

[782] I don't remember this in 2001, but she becomes a poster child for gun use.

[783] People compare to Annie Oakley and Wonder Woman.

[784] It's like, this is why you need guns in your house around your children.

[785] What?

[786] Yeah.

[787] So it's your fucking state.

[788] I'm kidding.

[789] I don't know.

[790] Georgia will not be booed.

[791] She will not be booed.

[792] of course sweet Dustin's mom is like bullshit does not fucking believe it she files a civil action suit against Tracy for wrongful death but Tracy and her husband who husband believes the story that Tracy tells they're like well he just got there so of course he believes right fresh off the plane from Australia immediately married so but this Tracy and her husband bury Dustin's mom or family and legal fees until she runs out of money and can't pursue the fucking case any longer.

[793] Fuck that.

[794] Okay.

[795] So shortly after she kills Dustin, Tracy and her family moved to Omaha, Nebraska to start a new life.

[796] Is that what you do out there?

[797] You guys started a new life?

[798] Everybody started a new life.

[799] It's the way to do it.

[800] And then in 2002, Tracy and her husband are on the Montel Williams show.

[801] remember that fucking gem with her she recounts the audience is like believes her her account of what happened and they have so much sympathy for her and they hail her as a hero so she's fucking getting all this attention but eventually Michael's support for her his wife eventually fades and in 2004 the couple separate Michael says the reason for the breakup is because Tracy insisted on doing a trust exercise with him uh oh here we go is it fall backwards off a log or whatever people do a business meeting business camp or whatever it is they might do this but this might be I haven't been to a business camp in a long time so this might be the new thing she would roll him in a sheet and drug him with a sleeping pill and partially suffocate him with a plastic bag do you trust me yeah Jesus.

[802] He's like, crikey, mate.

[803] She's like, this is how Americans do it, I swear.

[804] Haven't you ever been to, are you a business man?

[805] Have you ever been to a business camp?

[806] This is if business works.

[807] Yeah.

[808] Entrepreneur.

[809] And Tracy, to get back him, she tells the police that Michael was part of the husband's conspiracy to kill her.

[810] So, like, both her ex -husbands are in on it.

[811] That's what she tells them.

[812] Sure.

[813] Lump them all in together.

[814] Yeah.

[815] And I think the detectives were like, uh -huh, lady.

[816] Yep.

[817] Sure.

[818] So Michael leaves town without his kids, moves back to Finland.

[819] He says he doesn't want to make the kids go through that divorce thing, but I'm like, they're fine.

[820] You should stick around, dude.

[821] Can I ask a question?

[822] Yeah.

[823] When did Finland come into play?

[824] Sorry.

[825] I don't know.

[826] But it's on my paper.

[827] so it's part of the story now.

[828] He's all Australians, if they kind of punk out in America, straight to Finland.

[829] You don't get to go back to Australia.

[830] No, you can't go.

[831] Australia is really against divorce.

[832] No, they're not.

[833] They're all Catholic.

[834] Yeah.

[835] He marries another woman he meets on the Internet.

[836] Goodbye.

[837] Oh, and probably, she was probably Finnish.

[838] That explains that.

[839] I'm sure that one went great.

[840] Okay.

[841] Okay.

[842] So while living in Nebraska, Tracy has more.

[843] Morgan's with the law.

[844] In 2009, she's convicted of welfare fraud and a sentence to probation.

[845] But then in 2010, 10 fucking years after the murder of Dustin Wheatie, Ben Smith, the new Sack County prosecutor, takes office.

[846] And he's like, let's, what's up?

[847] Let's do this.

[848] They love Ben Smith here.

[849] He's amazing.

[850] And DCI Special Agent Trent Valletta, he's like, yo, I've been following this fucking crazy -ass case forever.

[851] now that there's a new prosecutor in town.

[852] Can we do this?

[853] And Ben Smith's like, hell yeah, let's do this.

[854] Then they go to the yard house.

[855] That is word for word, by the way.

[856] So Smith looks over the evidence, and he's like, let's do a new investigation.

[857] And he encounters a federal warrant on Tracy for falsifying information in a passport application, which is like, what do you fucking say, you're 5 '2 when you're really 5?

[858] I don't get that.

[859] How, what are you?

[860] Why would you love?

[861] lie on a passport.

[862] And how bad could the lie be that you'd get in trouble for it?

[863] Is your weight on your passport?

[864] I don't know.

[865] Yeah.

[866] Is it?

[867] I don't know.

[868] I don't either.

[869] That's how I would go down.

[870] Yeah, truly.

[871] What?

[872] Yes, I ain't.

[873] What?

[874] Look, I'm not 5 '5 in real life, but I'm so close that I might as well be, and my driver's license says so.

[875] Oh, and another conviction in Iowa for perjury on a driver's license application.

[876] What are these lies about?

[877] I can see fine.

[878] I don't need glasses.

[879] No, I swear to God I'll donate my liver.

[880] I swear to God.

[881] Liar.

[882] So with that, they're able to subpoena her hard drive, and they find fucking crazy violent porn and snuff films on it, which is bananas.

[883] And they also discover that in between her two husbands, Tracy had seduced an oral surgeon in Chicago.

[884] She was like, hey, literally, hey, let's get high on your laughing gas and have sex.

[885] And as any fucking dentist would, I don't know.

[886] He's like, great.

[887] Yeah.

[888] He's like, I do that anyway.

[889] Yeah.

[890] So it'd be great if somebody else was here with me. That's right.

[891] Thank you.

[892] Join me. Look, we love dentists.

[893] We support them.

[894] But they're perves, and you know it.

[895] You know it.

[896] Yeah.

[897] Send your emails to my favorite murder at Cheetah.

[898] Kara of Georgia.

[899] I'm like, but I did it.

[900] Of course, she takes, she blackmails him.

[901] and with photos and threatens to sue him for sexual assault charges, and she has him signed documents that she ultimately uses for check fraud.

[902] So she just totally blackmail is sued.

[903] The dentist is later exonerated, but, like, loses his practice and shit.

[904] So they find out on her...

[905] Delete your hard drives.

[906] I don't know.

[907] Is that a thing?

[908] Guys.

[909] Throw it into Lake Michigan.

[910] No, don't.

[911] I'm not trying to tell people how to get away with snuff film porn.

[912] Okay.

[913] That would be a whole different podcast.

[914] A forensic ballistics expert determines that Dustin had been shot three times in the back.

[915] And that was the first shot.

[916] So, of course, this contradicts Tracy's claim of self -defense.

[917] And they find a woman who Tracy had told about the pink notebook that they found the confession in, but that hadn't been released to the public.

[918] So she shouldn't have known about that.

[919] You know what I'm saying?

[920] Yes.

[921] So they're like, great.

[922] And they arrest her and charge her with first -degree murder.

[923] so yeah I just like the idea that a piece of evidence in this trial is going to be a Lisa Frank notebook I just think I just wish I was there yeah do you recognize this unicorn with a rainbow behind it and a cat somehow also there's a cat I rest my case I rest my case your honor may I approach the bench with a Lisa Frank notebook so we can write down the boys we like names and then figure out if we're going to live in a shack a mansion and house.

[924] Yes.

[925] Fortune teller.

[926] Uh -uh, uh -uh, uh -uh.

[927] Eleven kids, why?

[928] Oh, I don't know what this next photo is.

[929] There she is.

[930] Wow.

[931] That's her in, um, kind of hot, right?

[932] Like, fucking, like, mean teacher.

[933] Like, if she was your librarian telling you to shut up, you'd be like, all right.

[934] Well, this also looks a little bit like a lens crafters porn.

[935] doesn't it yeah and then she takes her hair down she's like I'll check your fucking retinas so they talk like that in porn probably not probably not yeah every time my roots grow in I'm like I'm gonna do that a skunk stripe thing it looks really hot no no fucking way no way I mean if this isn't an ad for Botox I don't know what is God promo code murder Wouldn't that be great?

[936] We had Botox ads?

[937] No. Okay.

[938] So, of course, the theory of the prosecutor is that Tracy Lord Dustin to her house forced him at gunpoint to write a confession in the pink notebook, but I believe that she tricked him somehow into doing it.

[939] Like, write this thing, I want to, whatever, see it in writing.

[940] Yeah, I don't know.

[941] And then let me wrap you in saran wrap.

[942] Right.

[943] And then fired nine shots at him into his body, and then planted the notebook in his car, so maybe the pink thing was her own, to frame her ex -husband for solicitation of murder, her way of gaining advantage before an upcoming custody hearing and possibly, and she was also, if that happened, she was going to lose her $1 ,000 a month child support payments.

[944] So she was like, what can, whatever.

[945] Okay.

[946] Of course, let's see, the trial starts on October 23, 2011 in the Webster County, town of Fort Dodge, Iowa.

[947] That's where you're all from Tracy's now 45 and her son, her 20 -year -old son is on her side and, but in two weeks a jury of six men and six women take less than two hours to find Tracy guilty.

[948] Ouch.

[949] They were just like, they all went into the room.

[950] They like went into the room with their files and they're like, okay, we should just wait.

[951] A little bit.

[952] We have to wait a little bit, right?

[953] It'd be like rude.

[954] It's only proper that we...

[955] Let's burn an hour.

[956] We'll just get to know each other.

[957] We'll head back in.

[958] That's right.

[959] It's almost lunchtime.

[960] So Mona Weedy, Dustin's mother, tells reporters that her son's murder ruined her marriage and drove her ex -husband to suicide.

[961] But she called the jury's decision a blessing.

[962] Okay.

[963] And then, in January 2012, before Tracy's sentenced to life in prison, which she eventually is, she sends a letter to a Wisconsin prison inmate named James Landa that gets found like in the prison system whatever when they open mail I don't know in the prison mailbox sure okay this dude James Landa was in prison because he was convicted for sexually molesting a 12 year old girl and he had written to Tracy after her conviction and offered her moral support so if you're that's who you're getting support from question your decisions yeah our choices are what we make them yes he said he been following her case, and so she was like, great, I'll take all the moral support I can get.

[964] And then her next letter to him contains personal information about her second husband, Michael Roberts, including his social security number, date of birth, physical description, and home address.

[965] Just sends it along to him.

[966] Wow.

[967] Yeah.

[968] Just like, um, you know, chit -chat, maybe flirting.

[969] I want to share with you, you share with me. That's how some people flirt.

[970] Yeah.

[971] is giving excess social security numbers.

[972] Right.

[973] As a come on.

[974] It's sexy.

[975] On the next Cosmo, like, how to flirt, I would just think.

[976] 542 -8 -3 -6 -7 -9 -4.

[977] Karen, you just gave them my social security number.

[978] What?

[979] I like him.

[980] So, of course, as they find out, the prosecutor learns about this, and clearly she was trying to hire this guy to kill her second ex -husband.

[981] So in June 2012, she's on a two -hour date line special, sticks to her dumb story of self -defense.

[982] And let's see.

[983] Keith Morrison's just like, Mm -hmm.

[984] Hmm.

[985] Let me lean on this thing.

[986] Let me set this up for you.

[987] So, okay, here's what's fucking crazy.

[988] While she's in prison later in Mitchellville, pretty good how many fireworks places do they have so from her from her prison she launches in life in prison launches a custody battle with her ex for for visiting rights with her two children who are 12 and 14 by this guy by this time this dude has the children they go to California and they're going to move back to Australia where all his family and friends are to like give them a normal fucking life.

[989] But she's like, nope.

[990] And so an Iowa judge rules that Tracy hasn't lost her right to regular visits with her children by being convicted of murder and sentenced to life in prison.

[991] Okay.

[992] Judge Nancy Wittenberg.

[993] And so she says that he...

[994] Who, you're name of names.

[995] Shit, girl.

[996] Shit.

[997] I'm just reading what's on my paper.

[998] Okay.

[999] She says that he is legally obligated to make visitation trips from California to Iowa and back.

[1000] to have the kids see their mom, and he immediately goes back to Australia.

[1001] Yeah.

[1002] He just bails?

[1003] Yeah.

[1004] With the kids.

[1005] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[1006] It's pretty fucked up.

[1007] It's like, it's basically like he took the world's worst vacation is essentially what happened to him.

[1008] How was your trip to the U .S.?

[1009] It ruins me life.

[1010] Sorry, I can't do that one.

[1011] That was close.

[1012] That's good.

[1013] You're like a British popper or something.

[1014] That was like your chimney sweet.

[1015] Beetles head injury accent.

[1016] That's what that was.

[1017] It gets crazier still.

[1018] In July 2014, they searched Tracy's mother's computer, Anna Richter, and they find out that the mother had harassed and defamed the first husband and other prosecution witnesses totally trolled the shit out of them and wrote these crazy articles about them on the internet.

[1019] Do you know you can just do that?

[1020] Isn't that to be true?

[1021] It's really weird.

[1022] A lot of the internet is not true.

[1023] It's really crazy.

[1024] So they accuse the former witnesses of theft, perjury, fraud, computer hacking and child molestations.

[1025] And there's still, if you Google the names of the ex -husband's, like articles pop up that's like crazy, like clearly fake, like weird ones.

[1026] It's all in comicsons.

[1027] Satanus runs over a dog and is, you know, it's like, that.

[1028] Satanist genre.

[1029] The page is yellow with red writing.

[1030] Okay, well, it seems like a newspaper to me. I mean.

[1031] Legit.

[1032] And they think the mother's behind the tax, but she's never formally charged.

[1033] Tracy's currently serving her life sentence, still maintains her innocence.

[1034] Of course.

[1035] A kind of silver lining situation.

[1036] In 2014, another Iowa judge rules that the delinquent child support payments that was owed to Tracy from Australia, a friend.

[1037] He was like trying to get those that he didn't have to pay them anymore.

[1038] And the judge was like, no, you still have to pay those, the back child support.

[1039] But those are all going to the family of Dustin Wheatie.

[1040] Yes.

[1041] So Mona's getting that money back.

[1042] Yes.

[1043] So she's getting $150 ,000 in restitution from that.

[1044] It's not enough, but good.

[1045] Right.

[1046] And that is the fucking crazy story, the murder of Justin Weedy.

[1047] Oh my God.

[1048] Wow.

[1049] How I've never heard of any of that.

[1050] I know.

[1051] Especially she went on a fucking press tour.

[1052] Yeah.

[1053] I mean like, she's been on some stuff.

[1054] Totally.

[1055] That's crazy.

[1056] There you go.

[1057] All right, now I'm going to do the Velisca axe murders.

[1058] Oh.

[1059] Not only because it's one of the most famous cold cases in American history, as you all know.

[1060] But because now, this actually reminds me a lot of when I was in London and I decided to do Jack the Ripper and then as I started to do it I got the cold sweats and I was like why would I do the most famous and involved murder in the place where it happened filled with the experts about that murder but I got through that so this should be fine and apparently Stephen says I haven't done it before so we're fine okay so I got most of this information There are websites called Iowa coldcases .org.

[1061] ValiscaIowa .com.

[1062] And this really interesting one, Wikipedia .gov. God, it's good.

[1063] Oh, truly.

[1064] So many links.

[1065] So we are in Velisca, Iowa.

[1066] It's 1912.

[1067] The 1910 census reports that the population there is 2032.

[1068] Okay.

[1069] So it's a cozy little town.

[1070] And it's Monday, June 10.

[1071] 1912.

[1072] Now, this event that we're about to talk about, they had a Children's Day program at the Velisca Presbyterian Church.

[1073] And so...

[1074] They have a day off work?

[1075] Is that what happens?

[1076] Well, it's summertime.

[1077] But I looked at, because on some websites, it says it happens Sunday.

[1078] They say it's Sunday the 9th.

[1079] There's something about that, but I was assured by several different people that this is, it's Monday the 10th.

[1080] So look, you can have church events on Mondays.

[1081] It's probably really popular to book your church on Sunday.

[1082] Nobody cares about the children's day.

[1083] God loves you seven days a week, Karen.

[1084] Especially in the summer when the kids aren't in school.

[1085] Okay.

[1086] Monday, June 10th, 1912.

[1087] Okay, so they're presenting a Children's Day program.

[1088] Basically, the children come and they do skits and they sing songs and it's show off night for the Lord, is what I like to call it.

[1089] That's what this podcast is, too.

[1090] That's exactly right.

[1091] Oh, I didn't do that on purpose.

[1092] It's getting really problematic.

[1093] I didn't know how much I used that phrase until we named our podcast network that.

[1094] And now it looks like I'm the cornyest.

[1095] That's exactly right.

[1096] Ding, TMC.

[1097] Give me 25 cents.

[1098] It's so lame.

[1099] Okay.

[1100] I like to imagine in 1912, in a town like Velasca that has 2 ,000 people in it.

[1101] Even the Children's Day program at the Presbyterian Church was like the hot ticket that night.

[1102] You know what I mean?

[1103] And there's probably like a group of teenagers hanging out front just because they have to be there because their family's inside.

[1104] But they're like, let's go smoke some corn husks or whatever.

[1105] You know, like that's where the whole town is.

[1106] Yeah.

[1107] One of the co -directors or organizers is 39 -year -old Sarah Moore, all four of her children participate in the event, Herman, who's 11, Mary who's 10, Arthur, 7, and Paul is 5.

[1108] And her husband, Josiah, who's 42, is there in the congregation watching.

[1109] So everything wraps up around 9 .30 that night, and the family gets ready to walk home.

[1110] So the Moors bought their house in Velasca in 1903, and they're an affluent, well -liked, and prominent family in the town.

[1111] So everybody knows who they are.

[1112] and they were the stars of the Children's Day program.

[1113] It's not true.

[1114] All eyes were on Herman.

[1115] Little Herman.

[1116] It's very hard for me. I definitely wouldn't do it on this one, but last night I did another historical one, and I already have a problem with embellishment.

[1117] And it's like, in the historical ones, that's all I want to do is just be like, she woke up fresh and new one morning.

[1118] And it's just like, no, this is in a book.

[1119] It's all conjectured, How did she wake up?

[1120] She'll never know.

[1121] She stretched your arms all the way to the sky.

[1122] No, there's no proof that happened.

[1123] Okay.

[1124] So Mary, their 10 -year -old daughter, had invited two friends over to spend the night after the Children's Day program, eight -year -old, Einis Dillinger, and her sister, Lena, who was 12.

[1125] And they were supposed to spend the night at their grandmother's house, but right before the program, Josiah called the grandmother and said, is it okay if the girls come and stay with Mary and have a slumber party at our house?

[1126] And so they did and that was the plan.

[1127] So they all walked home.

[1128] They got home to the Moors about 10 o 'clock at night.

[1129] They all had cookies and milk and then they went to bed.

[1130] I know.

[1131] Yeah.

[1132] We're saying, oh, yeah.

[1133] People who don't know this are like, why are they sad about them having cookies and milk?

[1134] Are they lactose intolerant?

[1135] What's the problem?

[1136] No. I like milk.

[1137] Okay.

[1138] So the Moors put the Stillinger sisters in the guest room, which is downstairs, and then the rest of the family goes up to their rooms upstairs to go to sleep.

[1139] So let's take a look at everybody that was in, oh, there's the house.

[1140] There's the house at the time.

[1141] Cute little house.

[1142] Well, no, not at the time, because it was in June.

[1143] And that, I'm from California, but I'm pretty sure that's snow, everybody.

[1144] I could swear to God that's wintertime.

[1145] Uh -huh.

[1146] And there's the family.

[1147] The Moors and their children And then those are the Stillinger sisters Yeah Okay All right Page 2 So the next morning around 7 in the morning Their neighbor Mary Peckham Notice that Moors haven't come outside Or done any of their chores For that morning So she goes over and knocks on the door to see if everything's okay And no one answers And when she tries to open the door it's locked So she goes, I guess what was really bothering her is she went and let the chickens out.

[1148] Let's get to the real reason she was there.

[1149] She's like, that rooster will not stop?

[1150] So she lets the chickens out.

[1151] Then she calls Ozza's brother Ross, and she says, you might want to come and check because the door's locked and nobody is answering the door.

[1152] So Ross comes over.

[1153] He tries knocking, and he shouts, no one answers, no one comes to the door.

[1154] So he uses a spare key to get inside.

[1155] And he goes inside, and the first room he checks is the guest bedroom.

[1156] And he finds the Stillinger sisters lying in bed bludgeon to death.

[1157] And there's blood everywhere on the bed.

[1158] He immediately runs outside, tells Mary Peckham to call the city marshal, Hank Horton.

[1159] So Hank gets there about 8 .30 in the morning, and he goes into the house, and he goes upstairs.

[1160] He finds a horrifying scene that I'm sure.

[1161] Nobody had ever even imagined seeing in their life.

[1162] The entire Moore family has been murdered with Josiah's axe, which he found in that guest bedroom where the still under sisters were found dead.

[1163] So everyone in the house had been murdered.

[1164] Doctors later determined that the murders must have taken place between midnight, the night before, obviously, and 5 a .m., June 10th and 11th, if my sources are correct.

[1165] Okay, so the police put it all together.

[1166] look at everything and they theorize that the murder was in the house and waited until everyone was asleep and then upstairs started in Sarah and Josiah's room and that's how he knew that there were people in the basement or the downstairs I think he knew everything that was going on personally so he kills the parents first and then he moves into the kids' rooms he bludgeoned all four more children in the head with the blunt edge of the act and then he goes back to the master bedroom and struck Josiah and Sarah several more times with the axe before heading downstairs to the gastroam to murder the still injure girls.

[1167] Oziah received the worst of the attack.

[1168] The killer used the blade edge of the axe on him and the blunt edge on everybody else.

[1169] So he was attacked so terribly that his eyes were missing.

[1170] So investigators believe that everyone was asleep when the attack started except for Lena Stillinger, which would make sense because everybody upstairs was being killed.

[1171] So can you imagine those little girls were downstairs?

[1172] Lena wakes up hearing noises.

[1173] And she had defensive wounds on her arms.

[1174] And her body was found lying across the bed instead of tucked in.

[1175] So it indicated that she fought back.

[1176] And her nightgown had also been pushed up to her waist, she had no underwear on, and so the police believed she was sexually assaulted by the killer.

[1177] So here's some other weird things that police found in the home.

[1178] All of the victim's faces were covered with their bedclothes after they were killed.

[1179] The curtains were drawn on every window except for two, which the ones that didn't have curtains, and those ones were covered with pieces of the Moor's clothing.

[1180] As well as all the mirrors in the house, they were all covered, and the glass entry doors.

[1181] and a clothing was used to cover the phone and on one of the websites someone pointed out they put a picture of the style of phone that the Moors had in their house which was the old giant fucking box this thing but with the two bells and the thing you talk into and it kind of looks like a face and the person on that website theorized that they were covering the murder was covering all faces and so we kind of looked at the phone and that was like a face too the mirror thing is so creepy like not even wanting to see your own face.

[1182] Right.

[1183] That's so creepy.

[1184] We have a face issue here.

[1185] Okay.

[1186] For sure.

[1187] Okay.

[1188] Then investigators find a four -pound piece of slab bacon leaning against the wall next to the partially cleaned axe that was found in the guest bedroom, in the Stillinger's room.

[1189] And the bacon was covered with a dish towel.

[1190] What?

[1191] So maybe he saw some faces in the bacon.

[1192] Oh.

[1193] But there was just one bacon slab.

[1194] One slab of bacon in the room, but there was also another one in the ice box.

[1195] So he didn't take both.

[1196] What the fuck?

[1197] Yeah.

[1198] Guys, someone has to solve this.

[1199] Wait, it's not solved?

[1200] No. Well, I'm getting...

[1201] Well, shit.

[1202] Oh, shit.

[1203] That's what I said by the most famous cold case.

[1204] Anyway.

[1205] Oh, right.

[1206] I wasn't...

[1207] You don't listen to mine?

[1208] I've got to be honest with you.

[1209] Come on!

[1210] I was listening to yours almost the whole time.

[1211] Then I was also thinking, this is chutes.

[1212] It's too much.

[1213] They need a stitch right there.

[1214] Anyone has a sewing kit.

[1215] We'll talk later.

[1216] Okay.

[1217] All right.

[1218] There was also a plate of uneaten food and a bowl of bloody water on the kitchen table.

[1219] A kerosene lamp was found at the foot of both Sarah and Isaiah's bed.

[1220] and at the foot of the bed in the guest room where the Stillinger's sisters were killed, and the chimneys of both of those lamps were off.

[1221] So you know those old -fashioned lamps that have the big glass thing.

[1222] So that's a chimney, that's off.

[1223] Oh, I get it.

[1224] They're both sitting, okay, good.

[1225] Because it's not, he didn't dismantle the chimney in the house.

[1226] Got it.

[1227] It's a chimney of that lamp.

[1228] There were gouge marks in the ceiling where the fucking murderer threw back.

[1229] He swung the axe so violently that he hit the ceiling.

[1230] I hate when they do that.

[1231] That's in a couple stories of stuff like that and it's just like, that sucks.

[1232] That brings it into a Texas Chainsaw Massacre area where you're just like, I can't, this is a raving lunatic with a fucking axe in a house with a family and children.

[1233] I just wanted to underline that for you if no one understood what was happening.

[1234] So then they go into the attic, and they find two cigarette butts that had been smoked in the attic.

[1235] That's where he was hanging out.

[1236] That's where he was fucking hiding.

[1237] Now, there are theories that because there are two cigarettes, that must mean there were two killers who are waiting up there.

[1238] Someone can smoke two cigarettes.

[1239] Hello, that's what I said.

[1240] Is that legal?

[1241] Was that legal in 1912?

[1242] In the 90s, when I was on diet pills, I could smoke 32 cigarettes.

[1243] At once.

[1244] Like that guy in the Guinness World Record thing where you just smoke them all at once.

[1245] That's right.

[1246] Yes.

[1247] Take me away.

[1248] So I think, anyway, we'll talk about that after.

[1249] The local druggist came to the house.

[1250] So obviously, everyone, it's a tiny town.

[1251] Everyone's like, what happened?

[1252] People start gathering around.

[1253] The neighbors start gathering.

[1254] And then people are like, a crowd, what, if children's day's over, there's nothing else to do, let's go see what this crowd's about.

[1255] Do they let them come on in the house?

[1256] Oh, yes, they do.

[1257] Of course they do.

[1258] Of course they do.

[1259] Over a hundred people walked through the Moore's house before the National Motherfucking Guard got there to cord and everything off.

[1260] What are you doing?

[1261] You guys.

[1262] What I like is that the local druggist showed up with his camera and people were like, you get the fuck out of here, you disgusting monster.

[1263] He is disgusting?

[1264] They're like, I'm trying to tromp through this house.

[1265] You're like standing, stomping.

[1266] Yeah, people literally toured the house with the dead bodies in it.

[1267] Before those people came at like the National Guard, the Velisca National Guard, they showed up and they cordoned that shit off.

[1268] I just like that the druggist was right.

[1269] It's like someone should be taking pictures of every single room.

[1270] He was 40 years early.

[1271] Sorry, buddy.

[1272] Yeah.

[1273] Okay, so I want to make sure I didn't miss any pictures.

[1274] This, of course, hits the press the next day, and it is huge and crazy.

[1275] We have to talk about that should be pulled down a little bit, so you can see the headline.

[1276] What's the headline?

[1277] I don't know.

[1278] We got to fix this.

[1279] I'm sure it's something identity of small.

[1280] It's holy shit.

[1281] It starts with holy shit.

[1282] Something, yeah.

[1283] Okay.

[1284] Yeah.

[1285] All right.

[1286] I was like, I'm looking at it like I'm going to read the article.

[1287] Karen, don't read on stage.

[1288] It's not polite.

[1289] This story was so huge.

[1290] It bumped the sinking of the Titanic off the front page.

[1291] Fuck you, Titanic.

[1292] That's right.

[1293] Oh, my God.

[1294] So, of course, no one knows who did it.

[1295] No one, there's no one, no suspects, like, off the top of, anyone said.

[1296] No, they don't have any enemies.

[1297] It's a lovely young family.

[1298] So the authorities start to look into who's a stranger or new in town and to see if they could be a potential suspect.

[1299] So the first suspect they came up with was a man named S .A. Andy Sawyer.

[1300] And that's because about 6 a .m. on the day the Moore family was discovered, Andy Sawyer approaches a bridge foreman in Burlington and asks for a job.

[1301] and the foreman needed the help so he hires Sawyer but as the day wears on and the time he's there for a couple days the rest of the key the foreman and the rest of the crew noticed that Sawyers behaves a little bit oddly mostly keys to himself but then when he does speak it's about the axe murders and whether or not anyone's been apprehended no he did it uh -huh it was him right just put a little checkmark by that guy and that night he sleeps with an axe next to it making everybody else real uncomfortable.

[1302] That's a bad night of sleep for those guys.

[1303] He's like, well, night night, I'm just going to.

[1304] You guys think they caught anybody or that axe murder?

[1305] Oh.

[1306] And I'm like, I don't want to sleep next to Andy.

[1307] Someone switched with me?

[1308] So another day on the job, the foreman walks up.

[1309] He's behind Sawyer, so Sawyer doesn't see him, and he spots Sawyer rubbing his head with both hands and then suddenly jumping up and saying to no one, I will cut your goddamn heads off.

[1310] And then he just starts swinging his axe at dirt piles in front of it.

[1311] What?

[1312] Yeah.

[1313] And then he got fired, I hope?

[1314] Well, in a little bit, but first...

[1315] That's not enough.

[1316] That's warning number two?

[1317] They had to build this bridge.

[1318] This Sawyer tells the foreman a couple days later, or maybe hours, I'm not sure, that he was in Velisca the day of the murders, had heard about them, but fled town because he was afraid he'd be taken in as a suspect.

[1319] That was the straw that broke the camel's back.

[1320] That's when the foreman turned Sawyer into the sheriff.

[1321] So Sawyer's taken into custody on June 18, 1912.

[1322] So the foreman's son would later testify that while the work crew was traveling through Velasca for the job, Soyer showed him the getaway path of the Moore's family murderer.

[1323] Oh, no. He was like, look over there, JR.

[1324] He jumped over a manure box, and he ran over the nearby railroad tracks.

[1325] Literally, I'm reading this off the paper.

[1326] Step through the creek on his way.

[1327] Literally just was like he went there, and they went down there, went there.

[1328] And the son, whose name was J .R., noted that there were indeed footprints where Sawyer said they would be.

[1329] Yes.

[1330] so doggier that part however upon further questioning Andy Sawyer is able to prove I bolded this town name because I meant to ask someone backstage how you pronounce it O -S -C -E -O -L -A Osceola I said it first Osceola I said it before you I already know and I said it before you Osola Osola Osola Osola Ohio Osola Osola Oceola I got it on my seventh try Damn I mean bolded Yeah You gotta be sure to ask We go back stage You gotta take the time But no I had to just Keep putting on mascara Okay Sawyer's able to prove that he was an Oceola On the night of the murders Well don't be condescending about it because he was arrested for vagrancy there, and the sheriff there confirms the story, so they have to let him go.

[1331] Fucking put him in the clink.

[1332] He did it.

[1333] When police, this is an...

[1334] I put interesting note, when the police bring bloodhounds in to track the murderer's scent, those dogs led police across the railroad tracks and through the creek, exactly like Andy Sawyer said.

[1335] Okay.

[1336] The next suspect is a fan favorite.

[1337] You don't need another one.

[1338] Like I did it.

[1339] Oh, there's a couple.

[1340] Okay.

[1341] Reverend Kelly.

[1342] Reverend George Kelly.

[1343] Let's take a look.

[1344] He's a traveling minister.

[1345] Oh.

[1346] That's a trustworthy face if I've ever seen one.

[1347] He looks like a cartoon of a light bulb, doesn't he?

[1348] I'm going to tell you how to save energy.

[1349] Oh.

[1350] When was a lot?

[1351] Wendy, how long can you just wear gel in your hair before you have to wash it out?

[1352] Oh, back then?

[1353] Yeah.

[1354] You never had to wash it out.

[1355] And how many days and back then times?

[1356] Never.

[1357] Never times.

[1358] Okay.

[1359] He did it, for sure.

[1360] Yes.

[1361] He's got a real Nancy Reagan vibe about him.

[1362] Now that I'm giving him a good long look.

[1363] If Nancy Reagan would just wear a tweed suit every once in a while.

[1364] Smart.

[1365] Okay.

[1366] So Reverend Kelly, of course, he does the thing where he shows a very strong interest in the case.

[1367] He claims to know a lot of the details of the case.

[1368] I mean, it's all of us here.

[1369] True.

[1370] That's true.

[1371] We're being so judgmental.

[1372] He likes the crime.

[1373] He wanted to know the details?

[1374] What a creep.

[1375] Disgusting.

[1376] And sinful.

[1377] He's a reverend, though.

[1378] Someone stands up, I'm a rip.

[1379] He writes a bunch of letters to the investigators and the family of the deceased prompting authorities.

[1380] to like him even more for the crime.

[1381] One private investigator keeps up correspondence with Reverend Kelly, trying to extract as much information from him as possible to see if actually he's the one that did it.

[1382] But because Reverend Kelly was known to have severe mental health issues, the authorities couldn't tell if he was telling the truth, if anything that he was writing or saying was true.

[1383] And then two years later in 1914, Reverend Kelly is arrested for mailing obscene material to women who are applying to be his secretary.

[1384] Oh, come on.

[1385] He takes out like a want ad in the paper of like, do you want to work for a wonderful reverend with a huge forehead and a great attitude?

[1386] And then some people are like, I'd like to have a job.

[1387] I'm a woman in 1914.

[1388] Maybe I could work and have a dollar or two of my own.

[1389] And then so he writes back, sounds good.

[1390] send me naked pictures of yourself.

[1391] No. And like back then taking nudes had to be really difficult.

[1392] It was so hard.

[1393] It's not like...

[1394] You had to throw that thing over your back and then run in front.

[1395] Yeah.

[1396] You can't just be like, send nudes.

[1397] Three months later.

[1398] You have to like, try to find a female photographer, but they don't have any.

[1399] And then you're the least purview male.

[1400] And you're like, okay, I'm trying to get this job.

[1401] Can you just do me this favor?

[1402] So he's taken to a mental hospital for treatment and...

[1403] That's fucking right.

[1404] What if everyone today had to get sent to the mental hospital for nudes?

[1405] There'd be no one around.

[1406] There'd be no traffic.

[1407] Requesting news.

[1408] Lock them up.

[1409] So again, when this all happens and as arrest, the investigators, look at him again for the ballistic murders.

[1410] By 1917, they built up enough of a case to arrest Reverend Kelly, and they even get a confession out of him in what they call private questioning, which is called the one -two punch of questioning, but he later recants his statement.

[1411] He is actually tried, tried, nope, no. Keep going.

[1412] Tried twice.

[1413] There you go.

[1414] You know what?

[1415] The fucking computer underlines every miss. But they never help you.

[1416] They're like, you're not going to be able to say this out loud.

[1417] So why don't you write tried two times?

[1418] Not tried twice.

[1419] Ultimately, he's acquitted.

[1420] So they never find enough evidence to.

[1421] From the hours and hours and hours I know about this case.

[1422] Yes.

[1423] I don't think he did it.

[1424] Okay, neither do I. So let's move on to our next suspect, Frank Jones.

[1425] Oh.

[1426] Oh, he did it.

[1427] For sure.

[1428] I don't think he could have done it because he doesn't have eyes.

[1429] Oh, did they find any goatee hairs left behind of the scene?

[1430] That's how you know.

[1431] Ooh.

[1432] Goatee.

[1433] All right.

[1434] Tell me about good old Frankie.

[1435] Okay.

[1436] Frankie Jones.

[1437] Frank Jones is a former Iowa state senator.

[1438] Oh, he did it.

[1439] He's all in it.

[1440] He's all up in it.

[1441] See, he has papers.

[1442] in a book.

[1443] That's how you know.

[1444] I'll lead you people with my book and my papers and my glasses that cover my lack of eyes.

[1445] Or maybe he's wearing a sleeping mask.

[1446] From the future.

[1447] Okay.

[1448] So Josiah Moore worked for Jones at his...

[1449] Here's an amazing cut and paste for you.

[1450] At his implement store.

[1451] What is an implement store?

[1452] It could have been like a hardware store.

[1453] Probably a hardware.

[1454] store.

[1455] Implement.

[1456] Implement store.

[1457] Horror equipment?

[1458] No, farm equipment.

[1459] Farm equipment.

[1460] See, that's what happened.

[1461] Did you say horror equipment?

[1462] Horror.

[1463] Horror.

[1464] Horror.

[1465] Horror?

[1466] I don't know why you think it's okay to shout.

[1467] This is supposed to be the Midwest where people are polite.

[1468] You're like, fucking, fireworks going off.

[1469] It ain't like.

[1470] So, at the at the farm implement fucking store.

[1471] Implement was the old -fashioned way to save fireworks.

[1472] So Josiah Moore worked at his store.

[1473] Anybody left to open his own store drew business away from Jones.

[1474] They're like, okay.

[1475] Implement competition.

[1476] People are like, where do I get my implements?

[1477] Well, I'm definitely going to go to state Senator Frank Joneses.

[1478] No, wait.

[1479] I read on Yelp that you should go.

[1480] to Josiah I read on Living Yelp which is this old lady right here three stars I don't know I like Josiah's implements better Josiah also was rumored to have been having an affair with Frank Jones's daughter -in -law which then gave Jones a motive but there was no hard evidence ever found connecting him to the crime here's the daughter -in -law oh she's lovely she's one of the original Donna's Oh, Donna.

[1481] Donna.

[1482] She went on to Star as a secondary character on Parks and Rec.

[1483] Oh, yeah.

[1484] She looks like she put a neck pillow on top of her head.

[1485] You know the kind of you've got an airplane?

[1486] Yeah, instead of wearing it here in the airport.

[1487] She puts it right up there.

[1488] And that's my hairstyle, she said.

[1489] Every time we do stories from like the turn of the century, and I see women's hairstyles, I'm like, I just would have never made it.

[1490] You would have been one of the suffragettes.

[1491] You just had a big bun, and then she took it down and it went to the floor.

[1492] I would have been like a wild woman in the forest that just wore her hair as clothes.

[1493] You're like, I'll never put it up in these your weird buns you require me to wear.

[1494] And you can finally let it go gray.

[1495] Like you've been dying to do.

[1496] That's right.

[1497] The dream.

[1498] Living the dream.

[1499] Goodbye, Donna.

[1500] Okay.

[1501] One other theory involving Jones is that Frank Jones hired a man named William Blackie Mansfield to murder.

[1502] Ah, he did it.

[1503] Oh, my God, he did it.

[1504] Oh, my God.

[1505] Now, Blackie just wanted to be the lead singer of a punk band in 1980.

[1506] And so, let's not be so.

[1507] Mansfield, here's why they liked this was a theory.

[1508] that got developed was because Blacky Mansfield had been tied to several murders, including the murder of his own wife, his infant child, his parents -in -law, or his in -laws, as I probably should have said, because parents as implied, two years after the Moors were killed, he killed basically his whole family.

[1509] So they were like, yeah, probably this guy did it.

[1510] Detective James Newton Wilkerson of the Burns Detective Agency of Kansas City had been investigating Mansfield for his connection to other murders in the area and he built a very convincing case against Mansfield and in 1916 Mansfield is arrested but he has financial records that prove that he was in Illinois when the Moore family was killed so he's released and they didn't have receipt like they couldn't print up a receipt it's just some guy saying yep I saw this skinhead there that's right so then here's another suspect Henry Moore no relation to the Moore family several months after the Moore murders Henry Leymour is convicted of murdering his own mother and grandmother with an axe this leads authorities to believe that maybe he was involved in the Moore murders sure I would have put that together myself but there's no hard evidence aside from the fucking axe murdering.

[1511] Aside from the axe aside from this picture of Henry Moore Also, a lot of people have dreams with this face in it.

[1512] Have you seen this man's face?

[1513] Isn't it like just the most unnerving?

[1514] Yeah.

[1515] If he didn't do it, he should have done it.

[1516] I like how they used to put the articles together like that, where it looks like you were supposed to cut that out and use it as your own mask.

[1517] Oh, yeah.

[1518] It's like a free mask.

[1519] It's like a whole hair and a whole hair.

[1520] That's fucking...

[1521] You can be Henry Moll if you want to.

[1522] Just send a sense of newspaper.

[1523] I like that voice.

[1524] That's a good one, right?

[1525] Yeah.

[1526] It's different than the 25 years.

[1527] That's right.

[1528] It's a different character.

[1529] Yeah.

[1530] They live in the same neighborhood.

[1531] Yeah.

[1532] But they haven't seen each other for 25 years.

[1533] See the difference?

[1534] See the difference.

[1535] Yeah, we see it.

[1536] This one's a little...

[1537] And that one's a little...

[1538] One guy's kind of like this.

[1539] But one guy's like this.

[1540] And that's acting, ladies and gentlemen.

[1541] Thank you.

[1542] Sack State.

[1543] One year and three months.

[1544] Oh, I wrote on my piece of paper.

[1545] The lead singer of Maroon Five lost his mind.

[1546] Traveled back in time and killed a family.

[1547] Oh, God.

[1548] And here we thought he loved yoga.

[1549] Oh, well.

[1550] I mean, you can love yoga and be an ex -murder.

[1551] Is that true?

[1552] It's true.

[1553] No. I guess.

[1554] I'm not a yoga teacher.

[1555] or an axe murderer.

[1556] Oh, good.

[1557] Yeah.

[1558] I'm glad for both of those things.

[1559] Okay, so, goodbye.

[1560] With no solid evidence or leads, the more And Stillinger murders go cold, and they remain unsolved to this day.

[1561] But it's still on the minds of many of us Americans and murderinos and Iowans.

[1562] Thank God.

[1563] That was the other thing on the piece of paper I didn't show to anybody before we came out here and paranormal ghost hunters alike.

[1564] Oh.

[1565] Because you can spend the night in the Velasca Axmark for house.

[1566] No, you can fucking spend the night.

[1567] Oh, you can.

[1568] But seriously, I would do it.

[1569] Would you?

[1570] Yeah.

[1571] Okay.

[1572] Is it the same as it was?

[1573] Same as it ever was?

[1574] They have preserved it.

[1575] Here, hold on, because I have a email from Bailey and she tells us the subject line is, a murder mystery and some paranormal activity.

[1576] from a Midwest teen.

[1577] This is an email that a listener sent us.

[1578] There was another story before this story I'm about to read you.

[1579] It's a very long email because she's a teen.

[1580] She likes to write and communicate.

[1581] She's up in a room listening to music with her Christmas lights and shit.

[1582] Fucking expressing herself and we support it doesn't mean we have to read it.

[1583] So hi.

[1584] So I'm only 16 years old and I've been binging your podcast for about a month, question mark.

[1585] So she's got the accent on paper for about a month.

[1586] I'm only on episode 79.

[1587] I honestly didn't even know if I had a hometown murder or a murder that got me interested in true crime until I remembered a creative writing class that I went to four years ago.

[1588] Then I took out the first one because it's actually very interesting, but it's not related.

[1589] And then she goes, but then the Velisca Murder House.

[1590] During this writer's workshop, we got to talk to the guy who is the caretaker of the house museum.

[1591] One thing you didn't mention in the episode, you discussed it.

[1592] This is why I got a hold to Stephen.

[1593] Because I was like, then the cold chills ran up my spine where I was like, disgusted.

[1594] It's 6 .30.

[1595] Fuck, yeah.

[1596] I haven't taken a shower, and we've already fucking done this.

[1597] Great.

[1598] But I knew we hadn't.

[1599] Yeah, I knew we hadn't.

[1600] But it was in a hometown or a minisota or whatever.

[1601] Okay.

[1602] So she says that we didn't mention that there were two neighbor girls from a different family who were killed.

[1603] I don't know about that, Bailey.

[1604] If we just read a thing, then it's the person's fault.

[1605] I'm not interested in defending myself to fucking Bailey.

[1606] I'll tell you that right now.

[1607] I'm 50.

[1608] Okay.

[1609] But here's what's important.

[1610] She says, the paranormal activity that goes on in the house.

[1611] That's another thing we didn't mention, which I know for a fact is true.

[1612] So, now personally, oh, no, sorry, this is her.

[1613] Now personally, I, Wanted to spend the night in this house since I heard about it.

[1614] But it costs like $500.

[1615] What?

[1616] And I'm a teenager who likes to spend all her money on alcohol and weed.

[1617] What?

[1618] We do not condone that.

[1619] We do not support it.

[1620] We did it ourselves.

[1621] We did it a lot.

[1622] We need you to know.

[1623] It was hard to get.

[1624] Stop it.

[1625] How do you even find it?

[1626] Don't spend $500 on weed.

[1627] That's not.

[1628] You're getting ripped off by that guy that works at the record store.

[1629] Don't do it, Bailey.

[1630] We're going to...

[1631] Stephen, mark that.

[1632] Please, we can't send that message.

[1633] Be cool.

[1634] Stay in school.

[1635] That's right.

[1636] Anyways, we're back into the email.

[1637] Anyways, the caretaker told us some crazy stories about the house.

[1638] I'm going to save the lighthearted one for last because I know how you guys always like to end on a good note.

[1639] Oh, Bailey.

[1640] Bailey's got to...

[1641] Bailey in a month is fucking caught on.

[1642] Yeah, no, she gets it.

[1643] It's pretty repetitive.

[1644] Okay, anyway.

[1645] The first story is from the caretakers' experience himself, and overnight had just got finished, and he was cleaning up the place when he heard some banging in the closet.

[1646] He thought it was just some drunk guy.

[1647] Then she put some parentheses.

[1648] To be fair, who's going to spend the night there sober?

[1649] Let's not do drinking comedy already.

[1650] Who blacked out?

[1651] Okay.

[1652] He opened the door, and there was a small tricycle right in the middle of the doorway.

[1653] Of course, he freaked the fuck out and slammed it shut.

[1654] Then he opened it again.

[1655] and this time there was a motherfucking doll on the tricycle.

[1656] Now, that sounds like something straight out of a movie theater to me. Yeah.

[1657] Bailey, I told you to stay home.

[1658] And guess what?

[1659] We're all uncomfortable.

[1660] Yeah.

[1661] Okay.

[1662] The second story is when some paranormal researchers are something, I honestly can't remember what they were, but they were professional, went into the house.

[1663] the caretaker lives right next door to the house so when he hears a blood -curdling scream he looks over and checks to see what's going on the researcher who had screamed had run out of the house and tore his shirt off of him to reveal three long red scratches down his back maybe this is a parenthesis maybe it was a ghost cat Bailey you got to edit yourself a little bit she's having fun with it and then she says on a final note, I just listened to the Girl Scout Camp Murders from Episode 79 and dot, dot, dot.

[1664] I'm supposed to go to Big Sis, Little Sis, Girl Scout camp with my nine -year -old sister this summer.

[1665] Guess I'm bringing my pepper spray.

[1666] Love you all.

[1667] S -S -D -G -M.

[1668] All right, so I just wanted that.

[1669] Now, just a quick, I'm wrapping it up.

[1670] When I was Googling this story, this was the first link I found was from the Des Moines Register.

[1671] And so I, of course, immediately thought it was legit, and it said, well, you'll see.

[1672] It said, this is the scariest picture from inside the Velisca Axe murder house.

[1673] So I'm like, holy shit.

[1674] I literally, like, braced myself.

[1675] I was, like, backed up a little bit, like.

[1676] Your brage, showing.

[1677] Okay.

[1678] Oh, no, it's a disaster up here.

[1679] Okay.

[1680] Thanks for being so low -key about it.

[1681] your your nipples I asked you I asked you to get me a pin I can't breathe okay the headline was this is the scariest picture from inside the Velisca Axe Murder House Okay That's the attic Is that really from there?

[1682] See that chair?

[1683] Okay it says the attic of the Velasca Axe Murder House This was by Brian Hullgrave so if you know Brian you tell him he's full of shit it says did you see it if you look closely it appears like the front leg of the chair is lifted off the floor we just got chills no that's called the furniture thingies yeah that's called being in a shitty restaurant you have to stick of like a matchbook or a napkin under there every chair is like that also this house is from the turn of the century do you think maybe the wood might be uneven underneath the chair yeah Des Moines Register, ladies and gentlemen We call bullshit I think they're trolling us I think they're so fucking sick of this story they're like okay here let's us get some clicks We want clicks too Yeah okay Now finally In conclusion I have recommended this book now So many times it's called The Man from the Train It's by Bill James And he's a yeah he's an analyst He writes a lot about baseball but he wrote this book.

[1684] And so he basically, he has this theory, there have been axe murders of families in homes around the United States from 1898 through 1912.

[1685] And so I will now list the similarities of the man from the trains, M .O. and to the Velisca axe murders.

[1686] I'm buying this book immediately.

[1687] It's such a good book.

[1688] I never listened to you before, but no one.

[1689] The man from the train attacked, usually within a mile or two, from train tracks, at night while the family was asleep.

[1690] He usually hid out on the family's property somewhere.

[1691] He watched the family, usually for about a day.

[1692] He used an axe that he would find in the yard of the house.

[1693] He always used the axe that belonged to the family.

[1694] He covered all the windows.

[1695] The family usually had at least one.

[1696] young girl in the house, and that girl was often sexually assaulted.

[1697] He often ate the family's food after the killings and spent time in the house more time than necessary.

[1698] He took any kerosene lamp he found and removed the chimneys.

[1699] In all of these?

[1700] In all of them!

[1701] Stop it!

[1702] How many?

[1703] Are we talking?

[1704] A shit fucking ton.

[1705] A book this big.

[1706] A book this big.

[1707] It's just chapter after chapter of it happening over and over.

[1708] He locked all the doors when he left, and he was never seen or met by anyone, because he would leave, he would do it and leave in the dark, because it was usually in the middle of the night or in the early morning.

[1709] If this theory is to be believed, then by the time the man from the train got to the Velisca house, he had been doing it for 14 years.

[1710] And they think that the Velisca, this theory in this book, they're saying it's possible that this was his last big murder.

[1711] and that he is maybe America's first and most prolific serial killer that no one has ever heard of.

[1712] And it's this book, if you want to get it, I think you should.

[1713] It's called The Man from the Train.

[1714] It links it all up.

[1715] And that is the unbelievable and still unsolved Belisca Axe murder story.

[1716] Amazing.

[1717] Great fucking job.

[1718] Thank you.

[1719] Kindly.

[1720] I was scared but determined.

[1721] I'm so glad I didn't have to follow that.

[1722] But now one of you do.

[1723] Yeah.

[1724] Should we have time for a...

[1725] Let's do it.

[1726] Hello.

[1727] Well, there it is.

[1728] Hey, hey, hey.

[1729] Oh, hey.

[1730] So tomorrow, before we drive to Omaha, don't even ask, we're not going to that fucking...

[1731] Okay.

[1732] That's fine.

[1733] Other thing, we've got to get the hell out of here, so make it a quick one or not.

[1734] It has to be fast, fast, fast.

[1735] Okay, thank you.

[1736] Thanks, Vince.

[1737] All right.

[1738] Vince Averill, everybody.

[1739] Avril.

[1740] All right.

[1741] So make it quick.

[1742] You guys know the rules.

[1743] I think you know the rules.

[1744] you can't be so drunk, you can't tell your own story.

[1745] It needs to be local.

[1746] It needs to be local.

[1747] I can't say it enough.

[1748] And I don't understand the people who hear us say it needs to be local.

[1749] And then they fucking get on stage and they're like, I'm from fucking Kansas.

[1750] What are you talking about?

[1751] It needs to be fast.

[1752] Tonight it really needs to be fast.

[1753] Absolutely has to be fast.

[1754] Okay, can we get the lights on, please?

[1755] Okay.

[1756] Okay.

[1757] What are you pointing at?

[1758] Yeah?

[1759] Okay, you better know, yeah.

[1760] You better know the girl you're pointing at, guys.

[1761] I'm blaming you.

[1762] Hi.

[1763] Hi, everybody.

[1764] Sorry.

[1765] Okay, here she comes.

[1766] Oh, can get the lights down, please?

[1767] Yeah, lights back down, please.

[1768] Because it's really scary, and you're like, oh, shit.

[1769] There's so many people.

[1770] Here she comes.

[1771] You guys, shh, here she got.

[1772] Hi.

[1773] What's your name?

[1774] Thanks to meet you.

[1775] Hi.

[1776] What's your brain?

[1777] Uh -oh.

[1778] Uh -oh.

[1779] Oh, I brought a drink.

[1780] That's a bad sign.

[1781] Right after that.

[1782] Right over here.

[1783] It also kind of looked like a urine sample.

[1784] Let's step up a little bit.

[1785] Right here.

[1786] Okay.

[1787] Tell the people your name and where you're from.

[1788] My name's Jessica.

[1789] I'm from Carol.

[1790] Good job.

[1791] Good so far.

[1792] Now tell us what your hometown is.

[1793] My hometown is from Sack City, where the county attorney was Ben Smith.

[1794] Yeah.

[1795] Who you spoke about.

[1796] Yeah.

[1797] So I texted him.

[1798] He said she was guilty as hell.

[1799] Oh, good.

[1800] He got that one right.

[1801] So this is the murder of Mark Koster.

[1802] I'm an attorney in a small town, and there aren't very many of us.

[1803] So we all get along well, we drink together, we tell war stories when we're together.

[1804] So this is a story as told to me by the people involved.

[1805] I probably shouldn't say who, but the people involved in the case.

[1806] So this is 2010 -ish, 2009.

[1807] So Mark Koster is living with a friend of about 30 years.

[1808] His name is John Green.

[1809] I don't know why I brought my phone.

[1810] We could call Steven.

[1811] Someone would steal it.

[1812] That's what I was going to do.

[1813] John Green and Mark have been friends for about 30 years, living together for about a year.

[1814] There may be lovers.

[1815] I'm making that part up, but that's just my fan fiction.

[1816] It seems like as a lawyer you should not do that.

[1817] In that lesson, yeah.

[1818] Okay.

[1819] So one day, John Green decides he's going to leave town, Stack City, town of about 2 ,000 people.

[1820] Did I say that?

[1821] It's important.

[1822] Tiny little town.

[1823] Tiny.

[1824] Leave town.

[1825] He's going to go back to Mississippi where he came from.

[1826] Mark Koster has never seen again alive.

[1827] So Mark Koster's family gets concerned.

[1828] They come to his house.

[1829] They look for him.

[1830] Look all through the house.

[1831] They can't find him.

[1832] The police come.

[1833] They look all through the house.

[1834] can't find him.

[1835] They do find a note.

[1836] The note says basically, I'm leaving goodbye, Mark Koster.

[1837] Not in his handwriting.

[1838] So the police are very suspicious, the family's suspicious.

[1839] A year later, they actually have him declared dead.

[1840] Once they're able to find John Green, he's in Florida, of course.

[1841] They get a warrant for him because there's all these suspicious circumstances.

[1842] He's brought back to Iowa.

[1843] So he's charged with first degree murder and he is classic psychopath.

[1844] Everyone loves him.

[1845] The jailers love him.

[1846] They bring him food.

[1847] They bring him treats.

[1848] I think they have to bring him food.

[1849] I think legally.

[1850] I've always imagined it's like McDonald's like McDonald's or something special.

[1851] Yeah, okay.

[1852] Got it.

[1853] Something special like McDonald's.

[1854] That's how you know someone really loves you.

[1855] They all love him.

[1856] So two years after Mark Koster disappears, a new person has bought the house and they're going through the house.

[1857] This is after there's been multiple searches for this guy.

[1858] No. And they go into the basement and they're lifting these boxes and they lift this hot water tank and they find the completely mummified body of Mark Koster.

[1859] And I know you're from a desert, so you might not understand.

[1860] Mummification does not happen in Iowa.

[1861] Oh, okay.

[1862] Good to know.

[1863] Wet here, we're all wet all the time.

[1864] Racy.

[1865] Some racy shit.

[1866] Anyway, John is, John Green is tried for first -degree murder.

[1867] He decides to testify on his own behalf, which don't do that.

[1868] No. But that's classic psychopath move, right?

[1869] Yes.

[1870] But unlike a classic psychopath, he gets.

[1871] sits on the stand and he just looks like an evil person.

[1872] So the jury goes back and they deliberate for four hours.

[1873] They find him guilty of second degree murder.

[1874] And as well remember from our criminal law class in law school, the difference is premeditation.

[1875] So John Green, his story is, I came home from work.

[1876] Mark had made dinner.

[1877] He made chicken.

[1878] It was so bad.

[1879] that Mark came at him with a baseball bat.

[1880] And John says, I wrestled the bat away from him.

[1881] I pushed him to the ground and cut off his, whatever.

[1882] What was his head?

[1883] Okay.

[1884] So basically the jury believed his story that it was self -defense.

[1885] Wow.

[1886] So I know it's kind of a mundane murder, but the whole reason I wanted to tell it was because of the mummification.

[1887] This is sort of a pro -tecate.

[1888] tip for you, Georgia, in case you're ever in a situation where you need to mummify a body.

[1889] Me?

[1890] I would never.

[1891] I mean?

[1892] I would never.

[1893] What John...

[1894] How dare you?

[1895] What John Green did is he covered the body in kitty litter.

[1896] Oh.

[1897] And of course it absorbed all the liquid and it kept the smell.

[1898] That's that simple?

[1899] That's horrible.

[1900] Any kind of Johnny Cat?

[1901] What are we using here?

[1902] Storebot?

[1903] Fresh stuff.

[1904] I'll get the details.

[1905] Oh my God.

[1906] amazing.

[1907] Don't forget your own sample.

[1908] Suck that down.

[1909] You deserve it.

[1910] Oh my God.

[1911] Only attorneys from now on.

[1912] That was good.

[1913] As soon she said she was attorney, I was like, great.

[1914] We're done.

[1915] Easy.

[1916] Easy.

[1917] Just talk.

[1918] Easy, peasy.

[1919] That was incredible.

[1920] This has been fucking incredible.

[1921] You guys have been an amazing audience.

[1922] The fact that we get to do this and travel and fucking just talk to you guys in person is so incredible and we can't believe this is our lives.

[1923] It's, uh, We're very, very thrilled that this many people want to watch us do that.

[1924] It feels like a goddamn miracle, and it's very exciting.

[1925] And it's also very beautiful because you guys are creating, and we say this every time, but we really mean it, like, you're creating a real community for and with each other.

[1926] And that's, I think, the most amazing thing about a true crime podcast is people are making friends.

[1927] There's people who came here tonight alone who would never go anywhere alone and they came tonight, right?

[1928] Hell yeah.

[1929] We hear that all the time because they know when they come here they're going to sit next to people that they know and can talk to and people always say that to us when we meet them and meet and greet and they go, I feel like you're my friends but you don't know me and we're like, no, we do know you.

[1930] You're just like us.

[1931] And that's beautiful.

[1932] It makes us feel great.

[1933] Thanks.

[1934] Because of all your support, we now get to do things like have our own fucking podcast network.

[1935] It's incredible.

[1936] It's bananas.

[1937] I can't believe this is our lives.

[1938] So thank you.

[1939] We'll never be able to thank you enough ever.

[1940] But, you know, we can show up every once in a while and do a show for you, right?

[1941] That's a start.

[1942] And I'll wear a really plunging neckline.

[1943] That's part of the thank you.

[1944] That's the deal now.

[1945] That's part of the deal.

[1946] Stay saved.

[1947] And do God's missions.

[1948] Right.

[1949] That's important, but more than that, stay sexy.

[1950] And...