Jake Johnson

[0] Hello everybody.

[1] Welcome to Armchair Expert.

[2] I am Jake Gyllenhaal.

[3] I'm joined by the miniature mouse.

[4] Monica Pladman.

[5] Hello.

[6] Hello.

[7] Hello.

[8] And a medium -sized mouse.

[9] I'm a medium -sized mouse.

[10] Well, she's miniature mouse.

[11] I'll be medium mouse.

[12] Of course.

[13] Medium mommy mouse.

[14] So today we have a really fun guest.

[15] Jake Johnson, you definitely know him from the new girl and let's be cops.

[16] And currently he's in Spider -Man into the Spiderverse, a very funny and thoughtful young man that we had a real delight chatting with.

[17] Yeah, I just want to warn our listeners, because I know everyone's very excited right now that Kristen is on this episode, and you're not.

[18] I just want to be clear.

[19] I'm not here.

[20] No. You're not in the episode.

[21] You're just here for the moment.

[22] I'm here.

[23] I came over to the attic.

[24] Yeah.

[25] To visit.

[26] We have an important day because we have been working for two years.

[27] Yes, it's a big day.

[28] It's a big, big day.

[29] in Team Bell Shepard.

[30] The Bell Shepard verse.

[31] The Bell Shepard.

[32] Welcome to the Bell Shepard verse.

[33] We've been working for two years on a line of baby products.

[34] That's true.

[35] Premium baby products.

[36] Premium baby products that are organic.

[37] Ish.

[38] Plant -based ingredients.

[39] Avoiding chemicals of concern.

[40] The stuff we would use on our base.

[41] Well, and do.

[42] And do, yes.

[43] I cleaned up some duty with one of our wipes today, and it went great.

[44] Your butt?

[45] Oh, no. How dare you?

[46] Although it could handle the task.

[47] It's a good way.

[48] I have them in my cabinet.

[49] And are you cleaning yourself with them?

[50] Yeah.

[51] And how do you like it?

[52] They're great.

[53] No rashes, right?

[54] Prove it.

[55] No rashes so far that I can see.

[56] I can't really see back there.

[57] Well, again, we'll take over.

[58] You know, because the products just came in.

[59] This is, we just got them all in.

[60] Literally today, they come out at Walmart.

[61] If you're by a Walmart, head in there, grab some wipes.

[62] Keep them in your car.

[63] It's called Hello Bello.

[64] I don't even.

[65] even know if we said that.

[66] Hello Bello.

[67] It's a real cute name.

[68] It's got your name in it, which makes it even cuter.

[69] You know, you're in the car.

[70] You're pounding one of those rectangle sandwiches.

[71] You spill some mayonnaise on yourself.

[72] Cripe it up.

[73] Well, the Hello Bellow wipes.

[74] You don't have to have a damn baby to do it.

[75] No, wipe it up.

[76] We use them for everything.

[77] And we just got the products in and the girls took a bath two nights ago.

[78] And they used over the recommended limit, I believe.

[79] They used a half a bottle of bubble bags.

[80] Wow.

[81] Thank God it's such a good price point because we are going to be going through this stuff quite a bit because you leave them unattended for a second.

[82] And they pour the whole GD bottle in the tub.

[83] That's right.

[84] They are not ethical consumers.

[85] Now, listen, for real, for real, they're a third cheaper than all of our competitors.

[86] Why?

[87] Because we went to Walmart.

[88] An economy scale has allowed us to start at such a big volume that they're crazy affordable and they're the best ones on the market.

[89] That's true, because I'm really anal about ingredients and I've...

[90] And your anus.

[91] And my anus.

[92] Yeah.

[93] So if you got kids or you spill a lot of rectangle sandwich sauce on your pants, swing by Walmart and pick some up.

[94] Without further ado, Mr. Jake Johnson.

[95] Wondry Plus subscribers can listen to Armchair expert early and ad free right now.

[96] Join Wondry Plus in the Wondry app or on Apple Podcasts.

[97] Or you can listen for free wherever you get your podcasts.

[98] Jake Johnson, I do not say this lightly um monica and i and i'm sure wabi wab although he doesn't say a lot um we're very excited that you're doing this oh thank you i'm very excited to be here yeah there's a little hub of like people who are um super funny in our city that are just the best guests like i put you in a nick crowe category or an ike baron holtz you know just manzou just you know a super dependable wonderful person with uh guys who should be you tell you players.

[99] And in this era, we can every once in a while sneak into a big part.

[100] And if I'm looking too much that way, it's just, okay.

[101] We've discovered it.

[102] It's hard on the guest's neck to look at Monica.

[103] As much as their eyes want to.

[104] Well, I want to.

[105] I want, but I don't, and then it's this.

[106] Don't feel pressure.

[107] I'll pipe in.

[108] Okay.

[109] Sorry.

[110] I just get a...

[111] You're not a rookie to this, and I'm telling you.

[112] No, no, it's good.

[113] That's very kind of you to actually have said, like, this is awkward for me to be looking like that.

[114] We've got to figure out.

[115] No, I just had a radical idea.

[116] I was trying to interrupt you guys.

[117] I think if we turn this couch at a very bizarre angle, right?

[118] Like 40 % this way, you'll kind of be in the middle.

[119] Interesting.

[120] I mean, it would make the room look like shit.

[121] No. You're totally right.

[122] True.

[123] Yes.

[124] I'm going to be insane and stop right now.

[125] We're going to try it.

[126] You're going to be.

[127] By the way, I'll be the other side of the couch.

[128] Oh, this has never happened.

[129] and Wobby Wobble take a picture of it.

[130] Oh, this is incredible.

[131] I mean, yeah.

[132] Let's see what happens.

[133] Why the hell not?

[134] Then you cheat back here.

[135] Uh -huh.

[136] Oh, my.

[137] Wow.

[138] Well, I can tell you're right out of the gates.

[139] I'm already excited about my new proximity to Monica.

[140] I like this too.

[141] Wow.

[142] Because I could see her in it because I was also, you know, I didn't.

[143] And the other thing is I hate not when there, you know, if you do a talk show and there's anybody here?

[144] Yes.

[145] It's, I just did Corden last night.

[146] And I was talking to Corden, and Zach Levi was right here.

[147] He's a super nice guy.

[148] Guy you'd love to give attention to.

[149] Sweet guy.

[150] And I was telling a story.

[151] And then when I did the turn to him, totally threw my brain.

[152] Oh, it did.

[153] Yeah, because I was like, I'm going with Corden.

[154] We're in a moment.

[155] And then I'm like, I haven't looked at Zach.

[156] That's rude.

[157] He's sitting on the couch, and I go, I turn.

[158] I'm like, ah, shit.

[159] Now I got to find a punchline to like a soft story.

[160] It wasn't a good bit anyhow.

[161] So then I'm like, and then that thing happened.

[162] You're like soft laugh.

[163] The guy in the room is telling the crowd to cheer.

[164] And I'm like, Zach, I'm not looking at you.

[165] One quick thing that's hilarious is that.

[166] Yeah.

[167] Walking in.

[168] There's the sign that says, would you date Dax?

[169] It's a photo of you.

[170] Hit him with the results.

[171] Seventy.

[172] Pretty definitive.

[173] No. And that's a very nice freedom that you get in this business when you get in this business get to be in it for a few years, where you're like, oh, I've now, I don't have to read all that stuff anymore.

[174] I don't, I actually just did an interview earlier.

[175] And it was for IMDB and the guy we were talking and sweet guy.

[176] And then at one point, he said, I was in a movie called The Mummy.

[177] Uh -huh.

[178] And he goes, like, I didn't like that one.

[179] And he goes, now you hate me. But he wasn't being rude.

[180] So I want to make this clear.

[181] And I was really happy to say, like, with all due respect, I don't care if you liked it or anything like that's great But like no I don't hate you for dislike And it was a movie that I was in I enjoyed making it I loved the memories I don't care if you like it or dislike it Yeah As long as I'm able to keep doing what I like to do Yeah Your approval doesn't mean that much anymore But you also you want people to like it Because then you get to it's like gambling I love playing poker And if I lose all my chips I don't get to keep playing Right So by people liking it you get more chips Let me ask you this.

[182] Did you at one time have a Google alert for yourself?

[183] No. You never did.

[184] Never did.

[185] Oh my gosh.

[186] I feel like that's so healthy of you.

[187] Yeah, maybe.

[188] I'm an Angles guy.

[189] I like to think the different ways through things.

[190] And things like a Google alert, I don't know how that would be beneficial to me. Well, I can tell you, it's not at all.

[191] I had one for, I don't know, maybe two years.

[192] Because, I mean, in truth, I'm just a narcissist.

[193] And I probably want to know who's talking about.

[194] me. But then with this little lie told myself, I've got to kind of know what the perception of me is.

[195] Right.

[196] What the thing is.

[197] Yeah, so that I can maybe steer this perception.

[198] But the result is just...

[199] It's just negative.

[200] It's just negative.

[201] Yeah.

[202] Yeah, I once read in a Malcolm Gladwell book, they talk about the power.

[203] The chemistry in your brain, the reward center gives you, say, oxytocin for finding a nice ripe piece of fruit.

[204] So you remember, oh, always go to this tree.

[205] But if you were to eat something poisonous, the chemical your brain gives you it's like a hundred times stronger than the pleasure one.

[206] Yes.

[207] So I just started thinking, unless you're Tom Hanks and you're assured that 99 % will be positive.

[208] Then don't even do it.

[209] So there's something that I started doing, I didn't start working as an actor until my late 20s, but I was acting a lot.

[210] I was doing sketch and improv all the time.

[211] And I had a two -man show with a great friend of mine, a guy named Oliver Raleigh, who's now a musician.

[212] It was our heart and soul show.

[213] We had no business strategy.

[214] So we thought, well, we'll just perform at any theater that'll have us.

[215] And what that was was like Fringe festivals.

[216] So like the San Francisco Fringe Festival led us in.

[217] You know, we drove out to San Fran.

[218] We were so fired up.

[219] Somehow I was sure Scorsese would be there and say, you, the guy in the wig playing that character, you have it.

[220] Whatever that fantasy was, I was buying it.

[221] Or Francis Ford Coppola.

[222] I mean, he's up there.

[223] He's there.

[224] He's making his wines.

[225] He's already there.

[226] And so we do this show.

[227] And the show is fine, you know, it was what it was.

[228] But we were on the early message boards, 2002 type stuff.

[229] We read, and we took our comedy very seriously.

[230] And they said very sophomoric fart humor.

[231] Oh, boy.

[232] And it hurt me. We were in a public library, and I honestly think I was crying.

[233] Really?

[234] I was like, I think I'm doing highbrow thoughtful shit.

[235] You said I drove cross country.

[236] I have no money to do fart comedy.

[237] The devastation between my partner and I, Oliver, was so deep that, like, it was, like, a marriage that finds out it's not what we thought it was.

[238] Right.

[239] Later, we found in, like, the local newspaper that said of, like, the top five shows at that fringe, we were one of them.

[240] It didn't feel like anything.

[241] Because you had already...

[242] Yes, but also, and this is probably a terrible realization of ego, but why I believed in it?

[243] I thought we were the top five.

[244] That's why I fucking went out there.

[245] Yes, yes.

[246] When they told me it was fart humor, that's what I was afraid of.

[247] So I don't want a Google alert for people to tell me what I'm afraid of.

[248] I believe the movie's pretty good.

[249] That's why I decided to do it.

[250] Yes, yes.

[251] So if you tell me what's wrong with it, I don't want to go like, well, shit, you're right.

[252] I was medium there.

[253] I did try my best.

[254] But it's a long road to get to this point, don't you agree?

[255] Or maybe not for you.

[256] I guess you might have learned quickly.

[257] Well, it just really hurt and the good didn't feel that good.

[258] So even now if somebody says a comment that feels really good about a performance, it doesn't feel validating.

[259] And I'm not saying that I'm not trying to feel like I'm enlightened by it.

[260] Because I don't think it's like a, I've gotten to this point.

[261] If it felt good, I would do it.

[262] Right.

[263] If having a Google order, if I could see like, Jake Johnson did this, if it gave me validation, that would be the fucking best.

[264] Yeah, if you could enter like a closed loop system.

[265] And it felt good.

[266] Yeah.

[267] But even the good reviews, even the, it just doesn't feel like it.

[268] I'll just go like, nice.

[269] But the bad ones do hurt.

[270] Here's the paradox of it all is if I don't feel like I did a great job and you tell me I did, it doesn't matter.

[271] That's right.

[272] Yet I can think I did a good job.

[273] You tell me I sucked and now I start rethinking it.

[274] Exactly.

[275] Yes.

[276] Yeah.

[277] But also, you know, just to be honest, if I think I did a really good job and I saw it and I like it, whatever you say is fine.

[278] If you say, you know, I didn't really like that performance.

[279] I'd made a movie called Win It All.

[280] It's a little indie.

[281] Well, I really liked it.

[282] Well, guess what?

[283] I watched half of it.

[284] it today at work, and I really like it.

[285] I love it, in fact.

[286] I'm quite excited to watch the last half.

[287] Thanks, bud.

[288] There was a couple years ago, it didn't make a splash.

[289] It didn't do a thing.

[290] The only comments you ever see when I used to do Twitter would people be like, we shot it on film and they'd be like, looks like y 'all shot it on your phones.

[291] I'm like, this is all hurting my feelings.

[292] I don't want to hear anybody's opinion.

[293] I love the movie.

[294] I love doing it enough, but I will tell you.

[295] So I have had a thing with Twitter where when I started New Girl, we had to do it.

[296] I had no interest in it.

[297] It took me a while to figure out the merits of it.

[298] Then I got into it and it was actually fun and you could like hook up with random people, like athletes.

[299] You'd be like, look at me. I'm like twittering with John Lester of the Cubs, you know, amazing.

[300] The downside was so apparent.

[301] And that is there's a little button that's at your at mentions or whatever it is where it's people who you don't know.

[302] who don't love you, don't care for you, have direct access to your brain in your loneliest, weirdest moments.

[303] You're laying in bed at 2 a .m. You can't sleep.

[304] They are talking to you saying the cruelest things.

[305] Sure.

[306] And I was finally like, I'm going to miss being able to text to John Lester and say, I'll win today.

[307] Sure.

[308] I need to take this off my phone indefinitely.

[309] Right.

[310] And you've done that.

[311] And I have.

[312] And I don't, there's no part of me that misses that.

[313] Yeah.

[314] Because I'm like, this was genuinely getting not, it wasn't like taking me into a deep depression.

[315] I'm not giving trolls that level of credit.

[316] But the net result was not positive.

[317] Not even near it.

[318] I would be sitting alone with my family.

[319] Things are going good.

[320] Look at my phone.

[321] Watch it like some kid show like bunked, so bored.

[322] And being like, well, that acting's weird.

[323] Her tone's good.

[324] That guy's terrible.

[325] Let me look at this.

[326] Oh, you're right.

[327] I did look weird in that photo.

[328] Why'd you say that?

[329] Yeah.

[330] And now I'm not on this couch.

[331] anymore.

[332] I'm not having a good time.

[333] And the person I'm not happy with is some anonymous human who I don't think would have the courage to say it to my face.

[334] And also, let's just assume probably having a bad day themselves, probably not feeling at their best and looking to see who else is shit in bad.

[335] Yes.

[336] They see you, oh good, he has, tell him.

[337] And so let's just cut off that communication.

[338] You and I, as I read about you, I will say before you start that, because we're going to get in something.

[339] I've been a fan of your.

[340] for a long time.

[341] You're an interesting character because your idiotocracy run, that's when I was first coming into the game.

[342] And those movies I loved as like, and that's when I remember, I was like, ooh, who the fuck is this guy?

[343] I think you are totally the core of that movie.

[344] And I think that movie, especially as our country keeps progressing, is going to keep getting sadder and funnier.

[345] More of a documentary.

[346] That's right.

[347] But, but it's funny because when I meet you're I guess three years younger than me but when I meet younger comedians I start with oh they probably think I'm a hack they probably hate me like do you have any of that fear I think among comedians were a little meaner to each other for sure well I started up in the I did my own stuff and then I did the UCB in New York after Amy and that Ian in that first group went through yeah but it was like the next tier like the Bobby Monahan group I love him that group, we all came up together, but then I didn't get put on the teams.

[348] Oh, that's harsh.

[349] So we were all on, like, the special teams that we were like the next class.

[350] But then I got, I was the only one that didn't get promoted.

[351] Oh.

[352] So that whole group to, and then my feelings were hurt so bad that I just disappeared from the whole community.

[353] Fully retired.

[354] It was like, it was the same thing with Twitter.

[355] The pain was too great.

[356] It was, I just have to do a 180.

[357] Yeah.

[358] And so I then lost track of that whole scene until years later we all kind of saw each other out here.

[359] When I was reading about you, you and I have a lot of similarities.

[360] I'm going to walk you through some of them.

[361] I'm excited.

[362] Okay.

[363] Well, you're from Chicago.

[364] Yeah.

[365] I'm from Detroit.

[366] Same kind of shit.

[367] Mom and dad got divorced at two.

[368] Both our dads are drug addicts.

[369] Oh, do you know?

[370] Oh, great.

[371] That's wonderful.

[372] Yeah.

[373] But also in the car game, my dad was a car accident.

[374] So was mine.

[375] City Chevrolet.

[376] Did he end up owning this dude?

[377] He did.

[378] How did he do that?

[379] I didn't really know my dad until my 20s.

[380] I knew him up to two.

[381] But Monty Sher, who owned Pontiacs, his family did, you need to be led in through family.

[382] Yeah.

[383] And Monty picked my dad to be partners with him.

[384] He groomed him.

[385] He groomed him.

[386] And did that relationship make the whole voyage?

[387] No, of course.

[388] Yeah.

[389] Those relationships never did.

[390] If you haven't an exposure to, like, the salesman world, it's really a specific thing.

[391] And the best.

[392] Yeah, absolutely.

[393] Wait, I'm sorry, really fast.

[394] So your father was a car salesman?

[395] Oh, a killer.

[396] Do you have any regrets at times that take away success, take away money, take away your beautiful, successful wife and your family?

[397] Do you ever think, man, I should have just been a salesman and just grinded it out?

[398] You know, a tiny bit, but I got to do it for him.

[399] Oh, you did?

[400] Yes.

[401] I didn't sell cars, but at this point in his career, I mean, he had a lot of rackets going, but one of them was, this is fucking humiliating, but he was somehow putting together this hugs, not drugs, like coffee table book and you could like, people could sponsor it in the back.

[402] And I would like cold call all these fucking places.

[403] I went to an Elks Lodge at like 16, told them this bullshit story.

[404] And if I would have had this hugs, not drugs coffee table book, I probably wouldn't end it up in this situation.

[405] And I got them to buy like a full -bench ad oh my goodness me and my friend j rob like had the elks dinner and they're clinking their glasses and they got it was insane but i got to do that and also he he in michigan and invented sub leasing so people when leasing was new right they get locked into these like six -year leases they wouldn't want the car anymore and then so my dad would take terrible people of bad credit and they would take over their lease and so my job at 13 was to call out of the newspaper people were selling cars and let's say they had a you know two thousand Pontiac, fucking 6 ,000.

[406] I'd go, hey, so you're selling this car for $2 ,800.

[407] I imagine your loan's still about $3 ,900.

[408] And they go, yeah, because I'm looking at a book that tells you what the loan is on that car.

[409] And I would talk to them into coming and turning their car over.

[410] So you did get to do it.

[411] I did get to do it.

[412] Yeah, yeah.

[413] So your dad, they split, but you did get to spend time with your dad as a teenager.

[414] Yeah, so my dad left at three.

[415] And all of his buddies were car salesmen.

[416] And he kept the family home.

[417] and we moved to a shitty welfare apartment.

[418] Oh, he kept the home?

[419] Yeah, you sure did.

[420] Wow.

[421] Well, Jake, he bought that house.

[422] What an asshole.

[423] How many siblings you got?

[424] At the time, I had an older brother who's five years older than me. So the three of you had to move out and dance back?

[425] My sister came later.

[426] Okay.

[427] A beautiful part of that story is the dude who moved into our family home, Greg, this guy, Greg Hatter, who was my dad's top dog and drinking buddy.

[428] My mom ended up marrying Greg.

[429] No. And then we all, yeah, Greg, we all took up with Greg and then he knocked my mom up and then, yeah, it's incredible.

[430] It is incredible.

[431] It's incredible.

[432] But it sounds like my dad, so my dad was, he was like had custody every other weekend.

[433] Okay.

[434] But he's very heavy drinker.

[435] Even during the weekends he had, yeah.

[436] Oh, God, yeah.

[437] Yeah.

[438] He would drop us off, just hammered, you know.

[439] But then it was that like.

[440] It was different.

[441] It was different.

[442] I mean, it's still terrible, but we have memories of my dad was rarely around it when we would go out to dinner with him.

[443] the drive homes he used to make up a game he was a big cokehead it would be the booze but then at a certain point you know he would need to get home he would need to be away from his family and me and my brother and my sister and as kids you know we were so excited to see him it would be months so you know when you're a little kid around your dad no matter how much you pretended you didn't miss him you would just explode with energy and I'm a big talker I've always been a little show off so now at 40 I've learned to calm it down at eight I was unbearable.

[444] So I was like, and another thing, and another thing.

[445] Oh, look at it.

[446] Look at the way my tits fart.

[447] The worst.

[448] Right.

[449] And you've got to catch him up on about two months worth of shit.

[450] Every sports game I've seen, everything I played, just the worst.

[451] But he would have a certain point where we would get in the car and we would play the quiet game because his big thing was, and I've never told this, we never talk about this as a family besides with each other because it's absurd.

[452] But he would say he had to take a shit.

[453] Oh, okay.

[454] And he could could only shit alone at his house.

[455] So we had to leave the restaurant right away because he had to go the bathroom.

[456] And we know dad.

[457] He needs to be in his own toilet.

[458] So we would get in his little car and we couldn't talk because now we're playing the quiet game.

[459] The quiet game is everybody has to be silent.

[460] And the way you win is be entirely silent the ride home.

[461] So he would speed home swerving.

[462] And when we got to his house, he would barely stop.

[463] We would all jump off.

[464] He would call off who won, who was the quietest, and then speed home so he could go to the bathroom.

[465] Uh -huh.

[466] And you guys would celebrate your victory.

[467] We, it was very quickly, we still, like, it was like the first couple times we'd be like, I won.

[468] And even as kids, you just, you know, having kids, you understand how much they get.

[469] Oh, yeah.

[470] And even then you would be like, that wasn't awesome, was it?

[471] And then, like, the three siblings quietly walk in and we're like, wait a second.

[472] As soon as dinner was done.

[473] He had to go to the bathroom really bad.

[474] Yeah.

[475] That was if he ate something tainted.

[476] Every, every fifth Thursday.

[477] Yeah, some bad, seafood.

[478] Come on, buddy.

[479] Come on, Pat.

[480] Would he ever do the move where he just, he picks you up and then takes you straight to grandma and grandpas?

[481] No. So he was around less.

[482] He was in a half custody.

[483] My parents split when he was two and a half three.

[484] I asked to live with him as opposed to my mom.

[485] Oh, you did.

[486] At three.

[487] Oh, at three, really?

[488] and so she said yes oh my gosh so i was with him at his little like sad drunk you know apartment yeah you know the fridge full of beer those like playboys all by the toilet the weird cheesy like naked lady playing a saxophone 80s photo and i remember being a kid thinking i got to get to my mom okay so it was a short i said like i want mom back and once i went back to my mom it was the beginning of you know if i didn't see him a year after that that would be six months we'd have a random day and then you know but big chunks of time yeah where i just grew up i felt like my mom was my mom and my dad i didn't believe i had a dad it's when i took my mom's last name it's when i became my mom's kid yeah i didn't know my dad's sisters it was you guys just aren't me and he never left you guys all lived i mean in proximity to one you know right you know 20 minutes away right but there were times growing up you know my sister was having surgeries a lot where she would be in the hospital with my mom and my brother and I would be in the house alone calling him saying even if like we'll just sleep at your place right and he would always pass oh boy so it was hard pass it was just all right man well then fuck you too but then what's tricky is at 17 he's sobered up and now at 40 you know he's a he's my dad now That is a wild.

[489] So it is a really weird thing because for a while he became my buddy.

[490] Then my weird uncle.

[491] Then his friends call him Croco, as in Croco shit.

[492] So then he's like, you know, you can call me Croco.

[493] And I'm like, you know what, Croc?

[494] I like you.

[495] And then I could drink around him, even though he was sober.

[496] And then I bottomed out at 25.

[497] I lived with him.

[498] And me and Croco both realize, fuck, we got a lot in common.

[499] Yeah.

[500] And then we go with both insomniacs.

[501] We could stay up all night.

[502] We had the same sense of humor.

[503] I like Croco.

[504] Then from Crocko, as he got older and I got older, it became like, bud.

[505] And then when I, like, moved out and got married, all of a sudden, we would have talks about kids.

[506] And even though I wouldn't do it like him, he's now dad.

[507] Uh -huh.

[508] And, you know, now that I text him, dad, he'll say, like, nothing feels better for you to call me dad.

[509] But I'm like, well, I genuinely mean it now.

[510] Yeah.

[511] So if he's saying, like, good job doing that.

[512] I'd be like, thanks, dad.

[513] I guess this is what it feels like to have a dad.

[514] It's cool that you were open to it growing like that.

[515] Do you think it's because he was doing the deal?

[516] He did the deal.

[517] I wasn't open to it.

[518] Okay, yeah.

[519] I'm a spiteful son of a bitch.

[520] Me too.

[521] So when my dad left, I didn't give a shit.

[522] I was like, oh, good, that guy who comes home at seven drunk and tells us all what to do, he's out of the picture.

[523] I love my mom anyways.

[524] My older brother can handle this fathering stuff.

[525] I have an older brother, too.

[526] How much older?

[527] Four years older.

[528] Okay, yeah.

[529] And I had the same thing.

[530] Yeah.

[531] And I had uncles who I like.

[532] Yeah, he taught me on a right dirt bike and stuff.

[533] Yeah, I got enough men around.

[534] Yeah, so I didn't really long for it.

[535] But I would, over the years in my childhood, like, give him a chance, maybe.

[536] Yeah, same.

[537] And then maybe we'd be getting on for a while.

[538] And then, you know, he'd, yes.

[539] He would talk about golf.

[540] We would have a thing.

[541] Oh, maybe I'd love golf.

[542] And I'm like, I'm a sporty son of a bitch.

[543] He'll go, you know, maybe we'll play on Sunday.

[544] I would sit outside, wait for Sunday, no show up.

[545] Yeah.

[546] I would be in my little dorky shorts with my, like, And my mom would say, like, he's not coming.

[547] You know, and I would do that, I think you're wrong.

[548] He promised.

[549] And then that humble walking in saying, well, he didn't come.

[550] You're trying not to cry.

[551] And you're like, it doesn't matter.

[552] And then all of a sudden, three days later, you're smoking.

[553] Yeah.

[554] But it has nothing to do with that.

[555] You just wanted to try cigarettes.

[556] Mine was, I think he was supposed to have us on an Easter.

[557] And my mom dresses up in matching sailor suits.

[558] But I had been coming off of, I had the chicken pox.

[559] and his girlfriend of a week's daughter hadn't had chicken pox yet so I wasn't allowed to come over for Easter and we were in the sailor outfits and it's fucking brutal it's so brutal like I look I know where that sailor suit picture is and I'll catch it every now and then at my mom's I'm like it's dark that's dark to not let that little guy come over by the way it's we can laugh about it because I do I have a similar thing I once called him asked I was having a really hard time in school My aunt was watching us.

[560] My mom was at the hospital.

[561] And I did the full -on, you know, beg.

[562] Uh -huh.

[563] Can you come tonight?

[564] Like, I need, like, I need you.

[565] My aunt was crying and saying, like, don't ask him to.

[566] Like, he's like, he's not going to, don't get hurt.

[567] And I was kind of like, shut up.

[568] Like, you guys don't know.

[569] I did, like, my big 10 -year -old stand.

[570] And looking back, it was alcohol and drugs, which I don't view as an excuse.

[571] I'm not a believer that the drugs are so powerful.

[572] It changes you.

[573] I've partied.

[574] Come on.

[575] They're also fun.

[576] But in that moment as trying to weasel out, he said, I would, but his partner, Monty, his son, John, who was in between me and my brother's age, he said, John's going through a hard time and he really needs me right now.

[577] And I know, looking back now that I know the man, he was trying to do a sales job, but he wasn't in the right mind.

[578] So he didn't go to John shares.

[579] Of course.

[580] He sat at home, he did a bunch of cocaine, and he masturbated it until he was.

[581] passed out and then was afraid bad guys were coming.

[582] Or whatever madness he was involved in, but I'm like that's the wrong cell.

[583] Yeah.

[584] For me at least, I didn't right away, I was not forgiven him.

[585] When he wanted to be buds with me, I would do really, my thing is I've got good friends, I got good people I love.

[586] But I don't, if you're not on the team, then kind of fuck you.

[587] And he just wasn't on my team.

[588] Just really quick for both of us, we did it, we made it without them.

[589] That's right.

[590] So the kind of risk -reward analysis is pretty easy.

[591] Like, you know, I've already not had you.

[592] So it just makes it a little bit easier to kind of shut the door, right?

[593] And say, but for me, when he started coming around, I was in my early 20s, I would say, sure, I'll meet with you, and he'll go, great, you know, I'm going through the steps.

[594] He's been a lot of changes.

[595] And I'd go, the only place I'll meet you is at a bar.

[596] And I would drink his drink.

[597] He was a Stoli and Ice Guy.

[598] So I would only drink Stoli, and I would get a pack of cigarettes, merits what he'd smoked.

[599] So I would have him.

[600] watch me get blackout drunk.

[601] Oh, wow.

[602] So, because I knew he still wanted it to be like, I know you're a fuck up and you're going to fuck up.

[603] And my older sister's crying, saying she loves you, and misses you.

[604] And my older brothers, the politician of the group saying like, well, you screwed up.

[605] Well, there's a fuck up sitting with a fuck up.

[606] So fuck you too, Joe Boo.

[607] Let's drink.

[608] And he never quit.

[609] So he never screwed up.

[610] So for me, my test to him went on for years.

[611] Okay.

[612] I kept fucking with this guy.

[613] Uh -huh.

[614] He earned it.

[615] And then he got older.

[616] Yeah.

[617] And then you were looking at an older guy where I still had all this like, I still hate you deep down.

[618] Yes.

[619] And now I'm looking at this old man who's saying like, I don't know how many years I got here.

[620] I'm really, I do love you so much.

[621] Mm -hmm.

[622] And I had to go, you know, having kids changed a lot.

[623] I was just going to say, you had the advantage of doing it differently.

[624] Having kids.

[625] Being a parent, don't you kind of go like, oh, right, I'm a human.

[626] I'm not just dad.

[627] That's right.

[628] And now I realize, oh, my God, my parents are just, they were just fucking humans.

[629] I don't know why you can't see that until you.

[630] I've got a question for you as a guy who, there's not a lot of us who have very similar paths and careers.

[631] Yeah, totally.

[632] And two daughters.

[633] Oh, yours are, your twins are daughters.

[634] Oh, wow.

[635] Do you have the reaction to your father's father and you?

[636] do you father in opposite ways at times just to make sure you're nothing like him or do you just go on all instincts?

[637] Well, what's interesting is in many ways I'm like him.

[638] I will say with all that stuff, my dad was super affectionate to me. He, like, wanted to hug me and kiss me and squeeze me and tell me he loved me and then he just kind of wouldn't do the work.

[639] So I didn't have that thing.

[640] And I'm crazy affectionate with my daughters.

[641] But I just, I'm aware that by the time my first daughter was three, I'd already spent more time with her than he had in the 18 years he had me. Like, just objectively, I had already done that.

[642] Right.

[643] So my thing is, I guess I'm parenting in opposition to him just in how present I am.

[644] Yeah, that makes perfect sense.

[645] How about you?

[646] Yeah, I know that when it started, it was, you know, I couldn't take jobs.

[647] All of a sudden, and my whole career thing shifted, all of a sudden, being on a TV show, being 12 hours, five days a week, felt insane.

[648] as opposed to before.

[649] I was like, I want another take.

[650] And fuck, it's also kind of a party and it's fun.

[651] All the 14 hours, five days a week with commuting to do 22 minutes, I'm missing out on these hours.

[652] No. Drove me insane.

[653] Yes.

[654] But it's also, that's been now a big change.

[655] So since then I'm like, oh, I don't think of jobs.

[656] I don't think of anything because if the old win of our careers is now a loss.

[657] Yeah, 100%.

[658] So I had that huge shift of if I continue to do my business and I win and I win the thing that I was trying to win at 20, then I am going to lose at home because I cannot really be their dad the way I need to be their dad and not be here.

[659] It's different on FaceTime.

[660] It's different for a weekend and then you're gone for two months.

[661] Then you're there for a week.

[662] So what does that mean?

[663] Yeah.

[664] And that fucked a lot.

[665] So at first it was the opposite.

[666] But now that I've made that change and I'm home more, now it's kind of getting.

[667] getting back to just instinct because now I've been doing this long, it would be weird for me to be gone.

[668] Right.

[669] Like now if I wasn't around, my kids who can talk would be like, what's wrong with you?

[670] Oh, yeah, yeah.

[671] My oldest soul, if I, yeah, if I work too much, I will hear about it in a second.

[672] Stay tuned for more armchair expert, if you dare.

[673] We've all been there, turning to the internet to self -diagnose our inexplicable pains, debilitating body aches, sudden fevers and strange rashes.

[674] Though our minds tend to spiral to worst -case scenarios, it's usually nothing, but for an unlucky few, these unsuspecting symptoms can start the clock ticking on a terrifying medical mystery.

[675] Like the unexplainable death of a retired firefighter, whose body was found at home by his son, except it looked like he had been cremated, or the time when an entire town started jumping from buildings and seeing tigers on their ceilings.

[676] Hey listeners, it's Mr. Ballin here, and I'm here to tell you about my podcast.

[677] It's called Mr. Ballin's Medical Mysteries.

[678] Each terrifying true story will be sure to keep you up at night.

[679] Follow Mr. Ballin's Medical Mysteries wherever you get your podcasts.

[680] Prime members can listen early and add free on Amazon Music.

[681] What's up, guys?

[682] It's your girl Kiki, and my podcast is back with a new season, and let me tell you, it's too good.

[683] And I'm diving into the brains of entertainment's best and brightest, okay?

[684] Every episode, I bring on a friend.

[685] and have a real conversation.

[686] And I don't mean just friends.

[687] I mean the likes of Amy Polar, Kel Mitchell, Vivica Fox.

[688] The list goes on.

[689] So follow, watch, and listen to Baby.

[690] This is Kiki Palmer on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcast.

[691] Well, I feel like I have three wives now.

[692] But in a very real, like in a, in a very funny way, in a charming way, but also in a very real way.

[693] Oh, yeah.

[694] They will call me on, we will have talks.

[695] They will sit me down.

[696] The other day I was with my daughters.

[697] and we were in a park near our house and my wife is really into animals and the environment.

[698] Same shit.

[699] Yeah, and I believe in all that stuff.

[700] But I also grew up a rat in Chicago.

[701] So like I probably littered until I was 16.

[702] I'm even knowing litterings of things.

[703] Exactly.

[704] So now I'm like, I don't want to be somebody who litters, but I also don't want to like pick up somebody else's trash because we're in a beautiful party.

[705] But I love that my wife thinks of that.

[706] So I think that's really sweet, picking up someone's cigarette butt, like, imagine the trash lips that were on that.

[707] I know it, because they used to be mine.

[708] But so my daughter picks up this piece of glass, and she's throwing it out, and I'm like, what you're doing is really sweet.

[709] And then she grabs one, and she hands it to me. And I honestly, my instinct was, behind us was just bushes.

[710] Yeah, sure.

[711] We're away from.

[712] So I went like that, and she goes, Daddy, give it back.

[713] She threw it out.

[714] And then she goes, we need to talk.

[715] She goes, an animal could step on that and scratch their foot.

[716] And they need to go to the emergency room.

[717] And I was honestly sitting there, though, talking to a five -year -old who, you know, I just know.

[718] And I'm friends with her, and I'm her dad.

[719] And I was like, I've done this with my wife when we first started.

[720] She would say, like, you drink so much Coke.

[721] Like, it's not water.

[722] And I'd be like, no, I know.

[723] You drink, you're going to drink a bottle of wine every night.

[724] I'm like, no, just to sleep.

[725] Right, right.

[726] But those, like, basic human talks.

[727] Yes.

[728] My wife did them.

[729] And then I was like, oh, yeah, I guess I, there is a way to be a better human.

[730] I guess I should think about how much I drank.

[731] I'm in the exact same boat with my wife.

[732] I mean, she's like teaching me shit that I should have known for 35 years.

[733] Basic stuff.

[734] But back to your littering thing.

[735] I try to explain this to people.

[736] Like, when I grew up, we would go to Toronto occasionally.

[737] My mom would drive us for a trip to Toronto.

[738] We would, as soon as we crossed the border in Windsor, we would get a humongous bag of McDonald's.

[739] And we always finished eating around London, Ontario.

[740] and this bag was so big.

[741] Like when you threw it out the window, you had to push it out the window with both hands and just it never crossed anyone's mind that that's not what you did.

[742] You just chucked a fucking glad 50 -gallon trash bag out the window and just kept it moving and everyone around you was doing the same thing.

[743] And just the highway was just looked like a fucking, you know.

[744] But I will feel now, where I will feel sad sometimes where I'll see a family in a car and they'll just have a sloppy vibe to them.

[745] And I'll see the kids and I'll see them littering.

[746] And, you know, I will say, I love my mother.

[747] I love my brother.

[748] I said, we had a nice thing.

[749] It just wasn't an easy go for me. So I'll see kids in that environment and I'll think like, God, it's got to be hard.

[750] Like you're five years old.

[751] You're in the back of that car.

[752] Like, that looks like a chaotic scene.

[753] Yeah.

[754] And you're like, make eyes now, you know, what I think growing up is I think the best thing about growing up.

[755] is you get to age into your life and you get to all of a sudden pick the people you want to be with and I think people can fade and you can make weird rules to be like, I don't like that.

[756] And then all of a sudden you go like, this is my life?

[757] Great.

[758] It gets to be like this.

[759] Yes.

[760] But I remember and I'll see people in those cars where you're like, you look at a kid and it's that heartbreaking thing of, here's a weird example of it.

[761] I went to a play place with my kids, you know, like Amy's play.

[762] It's like one of those indoor play zones where you pay X amount.

[763] dollars they can play for as long as they want i love them you can sit i'm doing my dad duty they're good for two hours it was closing and there was a woman with two kids and she was frantic and not a hundred percent doing great right her kid was doing fine she starts spilling about her life in her husband who's not helping and her brother who was murk and it was just chaos and then at one point she hands me her son and goes to the bathroom and her son was finicky the whole time and she's gone for a good, like, six minutes.

[764] Okay.

[765] And I'm holding this kid in my arms.

[766] And I had a moment of, like, oh, my God, what if she just, like, disappeared?

[767] I have no link to her.

[768] And there's these two other kids.

[769] And I had, like, the out -of -body experience for a second.

[770] And then I locked in in this little boy's eyes.

[771] And we looked at each other.

[772] And I was like, well, no matter what, but it's going to be okay.

[773] But then I had the deeper thing of, like, but fuck, you got 18 years of chaos if she comes back.

[774] Because she's not okay.

[775] Right.

[776] She's doing the best she can, but she needs help.

[777] And she made it very clear no one's helping.

[778] And you're six months old.

[779] And one day, you're going to be 40.

[780] And that could be great.

[781] But when she walks out of that bathroom and I hand you back and we leave, you got 17 and a half years and some shit, man. Well, look, I'm also very sympathetic to when I'm observing other families, like, I doubt it could be easier than the way we have it.

[782] Like, we have it as easy as you can get.

[783] We were not worried about money.

[784] That's right.

[785] You know, my sister's around all the time.

[786] It's great.

[787] And even in that situation, it's really hard to keep your shit together, not yell at anyone, not be mean, all that stuff.

[788] So, yeah, I just imagine doing this whole thing by myself, dead broke, worrying about everything.

[789] Burdough.

[790] I'd be half the dad, I think, that I am.

[791] Now, did your dad, I'm really curious, was your older brother, since he had had seven years with him?

[792] Yeah.

[793] Did he mourn the loss of him?

[794] than you, or did he have kind of a, you know, a more favorable view of him?

[795] I think it's more favorable.

[796] Right.

[797] He and my dad, you know, I think he forgave him way easier.

[798] They were friends way faster.

[799] He remembers my dad and my mom being together.

[800] He remembers good times.

[801] I don't remember any of that first part.

[802] I just know him as the guy who wasn't around that much.

[803] Yeah.

[804] But, yeah, but honestly, all of us now are, you know, and I don't say this, any kind of spin because it's just the fact, like, we're all now really close with them, which is as weird to me as when it was bad.

[805] Right.

[806] Yeah.

[807] Did mom have, were there stepdad's?

[808] Never dated.

[809] Oh, my gosh.

[810] Yeah, she retired that side of her personality.

[811] How did she do that?

[812] Honestly, I don't know and I don't want to think about it.

[813] But I will say that's something that I appreciate that my mom didn't do because I have.

[814] You know, I had an ex -girlfriend who, you know, we were together for a long time who had a mom who dated a lot.

[815] Mm -hmm.

[816] And those guys come into your life and become kind of parents for a while.

[817] Yeah.

[818] And then kind of discipline you.

[819] Yeah, they got to like out alpha my brother and I right out of the game.

[820] That sounds so tricky.

[821] I don't think for me, the dad being gone was where all the trauma and dysfunction.

[822] It was these random guys.

[823] It's the new men that would come in and.

[824] I totally hear that.

[825] So I very much appreciate.

[826] I think my mom understood that she's just got to shut it down.

[827] Right.

[828] Because our house was totally normal.

[829] There just wasn't a dead.

[830] So when you got out of high school, you went to the University of Southern Illinois?

[831] No. No?

[832] I did.

[833] So my high school was tricky because I dropped out at 15 and then I went back.

[834] Wait, you did?

[835] Yeah.

[836] So it took me five years to get through high school.

[837] How did mom allow you to drop out or was that?

[838] So it's weird timing, but telling you about who I was at eight, with my dad.

[839] That's who I was in class.

[840] So the reason I got into comedy and entertaining was I honestly thought, and when I said it sounds like I'm doing a bit, but I'm trying to be as honest as possible that school was to be, you were there to learn.

[841] I honestly thought you were there to try to get all the kids to look at you as opposed to the teacher.

[842] Absolutely.

[843] And you were really there to make everybody have fun.

[844] And if everybody liked me in the classroom and if, you know, I had enough friends, I was succeeding in school.

[845] I aced it.

[846] Yeah.

[847] So when I would take a, when I would get a grade or a class, I had to take a test, I didn't even care about the grade.

[848] I knew I didn't know any of the information.

[849] I wasn't studying at all.

[850] But it was how do I do this while everyone's quiet to make people laugh and to like me?

[851] And then how do I spin a D into something that's funny?

[852] And it all started crashing down by my sophomore year in high school because kids are starting to get smart.

[853] And then I was the really funny, dumb kid.

[854] Oh, wow.

[855] And that was the turn I did not like, where I was like, well, no, it's not that I'm dumb.

[856] I just don't know anything.

[857] Right, right.

[858] I could.

[859] I could.

[860] But I'm using my intention, entertain you guys.

[861] That's what I like to think.

[862] And there was a book called Cry the Beloved Country that I had to read and write an in -class essay on, and I didn't read it.

[863] And I told my mom, tomorrow we have a class essay, and I can't go because I have a D. I didn't read the book.

[864] and that'll take me to an F. I can't have the F right now.

[865] So I can't go to school tomorrow.

[866] She goes, are you going to read the book tonight?

[867] And I go, oh, God, no. She goes, you're going to read it the next day?

[868] And I go, no. And she goes, when are you going to read it?

[869] And I go, I'm never going to read that fucking book.

[870] She goes, so when are you going back to school?

[871] And I said, as like a challenge, well, I guess I'm not.

[872] And she goes, great, then I'll hold you to it.

[873] Oh, wow.

[874] And so it was October of my sophomore year.

[875] I walked into my room.

[876] I was like, cool.

[877] I won that.

[878] moment, got scared, came out and I said, I'll go back and she said, no, you said you're not.

[879] So my uncle Eddie, who was living with us and hanging knee on signs, he's like, let's go to work.

[880] So I started working.

[881] Really?

[882] And then hated it.

[883] And then went back to school the following year, year younger.

[884] And that's when I got into like theater and creative writing because I'm like, I can't catch up on the other stuff, but I can fake it this way.

[885] That was probably the best thing she could have done is just called bullshit and let you do it.

[886] That's for sure.

[887] She's a instinct.

[888] very smart lady yeah kind of stuff it did she go to college no she didn't no she made stained glass she made stained glass that's a deep cut yeah you i i got confused you went to university of i i went to university of i went to university of i went to university of i was right you know why that happened is i was uh do you know ben falcon have you ever met him yeah okay so he and i are old friends oh no and i was just texting with him because his dad was a teacher in carbondale and i was like did your dad teach at university of illinois down there and he was like no anyways he's a super funny dude he has some of my best sketches we went through the groundlings together oh i didn't know you went off of the groundlings yeah and um he and i had a comedy troupe called uh barry foot and uh i i shouldn't say he and i was in a group that he put together but so we'd rent these theaters and no one would come is that your group that you kind of came up with yes except for i i took like a hiatus to finish UCLA and they all got ahead of me but but that was we yeah my like first level second level, third level.

[889] So when you guys all see each other, you guys all, so that was, they're my oldest comedy for us.

[890] Interesting.

[891] Yeah.

[892] Um, anyway, so, University of Iowa, you got in there.

[893] Yeah, I actually really liked it.

[894] It was, uh, I was really into the beats at the time and I was, you know, reading and I liked that idea of, like caroac.

[895] Yeah, that whole kind of like cool lifestyle.

[896] Me too.

[897] I thought all that was really cool.

[898] Did you like Bukowski?

[899] Of course, yeah.

[900] Yeah.

[901] Yeah, I thought all that was.

[902] When I was watching your movie, I was thinking to Bukowski the whole time.

[903] I had kind of a Barfly vibe to it.

[904] Yeah, for sure.

[905] Barfly was a huge movie for me. Once I saw that type of character, you know, those were, that was my dad and my uncle characters.

[906] That's what I always thought was cool.

[907] Yeah.

[908] You know, I'm not an actor who's, you know, the triple threat.

[909] I never want to do musicals.

[910] There's all that stuff I don't care about.

[911] That was the stuff I cared about.

[912] I was like, oh, I think that stuff is cool.

[913] You're a romantic.

[914] Yes.

[915] Especially in that age.

[916] Yeah, me too.

[917] You know, I've grown out of it a little bit because I used to, I was a romantic because I believed I was in those novels.

[918] Of course.

[919] And I really thought someone was writing a book about me. and I was one of the cool characters.

[920] So it really, Iowa really worked for that.

[921] We had a group that could, I used to hop on freight trains.

[922] Oh, yes.

[923] We could jump, we slept out in the cornfields, doing the whole big jugs of Burgundy.

[924] Yes.

[925] It was the best.

[926] Oh, I love this.

[927] But for me, I lived that game fantasy, that fictional character all through when I went to New York, when I moved out to L .A., and it changed when I was in commercials as an actor.

[928] Oh, that's when you did.

[929] And then I realized, I'm not.

[930] not this cool guy.

[931] I'm literally in a pop -up ad and fighting so hard for it.

[932] And I have a headshot where I have a beanie on.

[933] Oh, wow.

[934] And I realized when the photographer was there, I will do anything for this job.

[935] Therefore, I'm not Neil Cassidy.

[936] I'm just another grinding actor who wants a career in this business because I, you know, I like the rewards of Hollywood.

[937] I'm not a cool character from a novel.

[938] I'm a guy from a sitcom.

[939] Well, mine was Bukowski.

[940] I was like, oh, you can write about taking a shit and getting hammered and chasing girls.

[941] Totally.

[942] Like, that's all I think about.

[943] That's somehow romantic and poetic.

[944] And you're cool for it?

[945] Yes.

[946] You know, it's wild about 2018 and those characters?

[947] And maybe it's just, I say it's wild because I have two daughters.

[948] But those characters are so not cool anymore.

[949] Oh, that's a wrap on all that.

[950] But it's also, and I'm not even just saying that, like, they're, because I'm going through a big reading stage right now.

[951] I'm reading all the old classics that I've missed where I realized in high school, I didn't read Steinbeck.

[952] It was a sign to me, but I did cliff notes.

[953] So I'm going through like all the Steinbeck.

[954] I just read 1984.

[955] I read Animal for all the books I didn't read when I pick up an old beat book or I still have my Pekowski books that I've saved.

[956] Yeah, yeah.

[957] I'll read one of these poems and I'm like, homie, what are you talking about?

[958] I'm like, no, it's just not it anymore.

[959] And I'm like, and it's not even it when I'm alone in the dark reading with my little light on.

[960] I'm like, even for me, I'm like, even for me, I'm like, the world just changed.

[961] Here's where Bukowski has lost me in this period of my time.

[962] There is an overall hatred he has, and not just towards women, towards himself, towards life.

[963] Oh, he's a misanthroat for sure.

[964] But, like, so deeply and so violently that I think romantically, I've never been that angry, but I like to think I was when I was really pissed at my dad.

[965] So it felt comforting.

[966] It felt like a blanket.

[967] If I was mad about something.

[968] Yeah.

[969] It just does, it just now I feel like, go to fucking therapy, man. There's options, Charles.

[970] Yes, well, I ran it.

[971] Talk to some smart people, homie.

[972] Yeah.

[973] Figure this shit out.

[974] I ran that system for a good decade.

[975] And it just, I didn't feel as good as his stories.

[976] Yeah, that's it.

[977] At the end of the day, I just, I have it.

[978] I seem to have a bigger conscious than he had.

[979] Yeah, that's right.

[980] So he couldn't really enjoy it.

[981] But I still like the fan of size about, yeah.

[982] But you wrote a play while you were at University of Iowa and that got you admitted to Tish.

[983] Yeah, I wrote a, so I've always been obsessed with, we're doing deep cuts on this one, thanks for doing us some research.

[984] We're going to get your pants down.

[985] We're going to inspect everything.

[986] I've always been obsessed with humans and animals and the weird connections that we have and this idea of a spiritual connection between us and this idea that what, and I don't, I don't have any deep scientific answers to it, but there's just a question about it all that I like.

[987] Like when I was growing up, there was an old newspaper clipping.

[988] we had in our house about two monkeys on an old ship that were traveling with a circus from the 1890 was an old newspaper and they were a couple this like boy monkey and a girl monkey and they did their shows together and the girl monkey died and when she died they just threw her over you know her body she was dead yeah so you're not going to bury she's not going to serve her and the boy monkey who was a famous performer monkey with a circus mourned so badly that he couldn't get over it.

[989] So they let him out of his cage and he jumped off the ship and committed suicide right where they'd thrown her to his death.

[990] And the thing that was written was you know, death of beloved monkey who committed suicide.

[991] And that's why it was a funny thing that we saved, like a monkey committed suicide.

[992] But when I read it, I was like, man, what is that?

[993] Yeah.

[994] That's connection between these two people that was so great, blah, blah, blah.

[995] Long story short, I was in Iowa and I wrote a play about a zookeeper whose job was to care for in the San Diego Zoo to care for like the famous gorilla.

[996] And she was the one that everybody came and saw and he was the guy who could go in with her and like, you know, the kind of long -haired dweeby guy who gives her bananas and, you know, Coco doesn't hurt him, waves at the people, scratches her back and leaves.

[997] He's married, he's got a whole life, things are pretty good.

[998] No kids, but things are working.

[999] And then Coco gets sick and dies.

[1000] And when Coco dies, everything falls apart and spiritually he does and he realizes without her he's nothing and his wife's like well i'm here too and all of for him she the friends were all fake because he can't just climb in that cage and live with cocoa and that's where he wants to go and it takes this dark spiral into his kind of sadness i wrote it did not show it to anybody at iowa it was not one of those plays i like sent to my friends for notes right it wasn't one of my cool ones on a typewriter yeah and then mark dickerman the head of Tish read that and said I'm going to let you in we got a lot of work to do but we can do independent studies together and so I stayed there for two years and then I did a year of the MFA studying with him screenwriting and TV writing too Okay yeah so someone though produced your play it actually got made right It got up the And you won a prize You won a prize you want a There was like a there was a bunch College festivals got in It got published one of these got published And you got a grant?

[1001] I got a grant.

[1002] I wrote a screenplay about Albert Einstein's first wife.

[1003] She was a scientific genius, and they were partners.

[1004] And originally he loved her because they were equals, and they could actually, he couldn't believe he could, like, date somebody that they could talk about these big ideas, and she could keep up with them.

[1005] And then in that time, he got a backlash, and they were like, well, we don't want hers.

[1006] And so there was a lot of theories that she was actually.

[1007] half of a lot of his early theories and she got no credit for it and he turned on her when the spotlight came and it drove her bucking and nuts and she ended up getting crazy and becoming like you know mentally ill but there's a lot of paperwork that shows that that connection was very instrumental partnership and as soon as the bright lights came old Albert turned front and center yeah so I wrote a screenplay about that it's not a good movie but just i think that idea you know i'd found her story i got a sloan fellowship and got paid to do that right so i was making money doing that and doing side jobs and then yeah why do you move to l i well i moved to from there well because you did ucb i guess why i did ucb but then i didn't make the team right and you no longer wanted to ever i couldn't be in that scene anymore i was humiliated my feelings were deeply hurt i had a big ego with improv and sketch i thought i was doing good stuff.

[1008] So I couldn't be there where there were people I thought I was doing better then.

[1009] And then I was like, you know, I've always thought, and I still think, you got to make sure you know who the rules are.

[1010] Like, who's making the rules and do you respect the person making the rules?

[1011] So I'm not a believer in just following a rule blindly.

[1012] So if somebody picks a team, well, that's just like your opinion, man. So I've always had that.

[1013] So for me, it was then like, I'm not any worse than I was.

[1014] I just don't like your selection.

[1015] So I'm out.

[1016] right and I was dating the woman Annie and Annie Baker and I broke up so I had to get out of New York I had come up with this really weird idea my buddy Billy Bungroth and I used to talk about how Jerry Seinfeld did comedian where he tore it around and showed what was really like for a comedian I found it really offensive okay because I thought that's not what it's like I tore around and do shows audiences hate me I have to work so hard for them to even go we might like him.

[1017] You're Jerry Seinfeld.

[1018] They kind of like you.

[1019] You're playing to a packed house.

[1020] I'm playing to like nine people.

[1021] So we came up with this idea like, like we should do comedian, but show what it's really like and how paranoid we get and how weird it is.

[1022] And then my buddy Simon and I were writing a movie together, an NYU guy in Oklahoma.

[1023] There's a weird story to get to Chicago, but his uncle took Simon and I out to give him a big talk about like, hey man, you got to do something with your life, man. And in that talk, we all got to.

[1024] you along?

[1025] Yeah, his uncle's like a party guy.

[1026] He's a Coke guy.

[1027] Okay, great.

[1028] Self -made rich guy.

[1029] So the night was wild.

[1030] Blackout drunk.

[1031] Yeah.

[1032] The guy's paying for everything.

[1033] I'm drinking the I'm a guy who's fucking slamming boogie shuggy telling you how to get your life.

[1034] But yelling it.

[1035] And for me, Simon just brought me as a buffer.

[1036] He's like, I got to do this night.

[1037] I actually love my uncle.

[1038] He's crazy.

[1039] Yeah.

[1040] So I'm like, let's have fun.

[1041] I am so out of it.

[1042] And the guy finally turns, he was like, you just can't sit on your fucking ass, man. And I go, well, tell me about it, man, I'm already there.

[1043] I got an idea and I pitched him Project Joke, which is what I called it, which was my comedian.

[1044] Right.

[1045] And I go, we're booked all through the Midwest, man, we got all these top places.

[1046] We got a movie we want to make.

[1047] And he goes, what stop and you fear?

[1048] And I go, no, man, money.

[1049] And he goes, how much you need?

[1050] I go, my producer says 10 grand.

[1051] Uh -huh.

[1052] He wrote me a check right there for $10 ,000.

[1053] Come on.

[1054] Swear on my life, true story.

[1055] He doesn't even remember.

[1056] I've never followed up with him.

[1057] I haven't because I don't link to him.

[1058] So I took the 10 ,000, I called my friend Bill.

[1059] I said, we have to do it.

[1060] So I then went to Chicago.

[1061] We called all these places in the Midwest.

[1062] We rented an RV, and we made a six -day docu series, which would now just be a reality show, but it was 2002, where we traveled around and we wrote a sketch show in a week, and we performed every night at a different venue.

[1063] And we tried it.

[1064] You show what audiences in the Midwest think of two guys.

[1065] They don't know.

[1066] Right.

[1067] And then I was in Chicago editing that.

[1068] never turned out it's never been finished I have rough cuts but they're all very bad I was going to move back to New York to be with Annie she met a new guy said I'm going to be with him so I said well Jakey J's fucked with his weird project my buddy Brian Farrell who I met at a wedding said I have a room in Hollywood on Los Palmas on Selma and give you a room for five random call still one of my closest friends give you a room for $500 a month and I can get you a job at a casino here being a third party player where you'll make enough money and you hang out in the casinos with me and it was right before Halloween and I go January 1st I'm your guy and I moved Where do you work commerce?

[1069] He worked at commerce.

[1070] I worked at Hollywood Park.

[1071] And what did you do at Hollywood Park?

[1072] Third party player.

[1073] So you know if you ever go to those casinos and you play blackjack or a table game?

[1074] There's always somebody there who's got a name tag on and there's a bunch of chips in front of them.

[1075] So they are not associated with the casino.

[1076] It's just a little private business.

[1077] They had the same rights at that table as you have.

[1078] It's a company called corporation, and they just represent the bank.

[1079] But you could represent the bank if you wanted, but they always get there early, take over seat one, and make an hourly wage with bonuses to take the house odds against players.

[1080] That is so confusing.

[1081] It's meant to be confusing so that you go, I don't want to think about it, so that this company gets the house odds.

[1082] Because you hear, you can't go and play blackjack against the house.

[1083] It's illegal.

[1084] Oh, oh, oh, oh.

[1085] Okay, that's what I was missing.

[1086] So if you go to an Indian casino, you're playing against the casino.

[1087] Right.

[1088] Well, here you cannot.

[1089] That's why you play an ante here.

[1090] So that $1 ante is you're just playing cards at a table.

[1091] Okay.

[1092] So who's the casino?

[1093] And it's some privateer.

[1094] It's just some guy at the table who I would sit there and my name, my uncle's name is Mark.

[1095] That's my actual name.

[1096] Uh -huh.

[1097] But I don't go by that either.

[1098] But I kept Mark on so I could feel more.

[1099] Mark died in a motorcycle accident?

[1100] Mark died in a motorcycle accident?

[1101] Yeah, I didn't like.

[1102] reading that yeah that was so stay tuned for more armchair expert if you dare um well let me ask just really quick what dad's an addict yes recovering addict you've mentioned blocking out a few times yeah what was your relationship what was your relationship with with booze and drugs at that time yeah uh it's a complicated relationship we go up and down sure sure uh i uh you know there's i've got my stuff with it but I have never gotten too far in either direction because my friends call me rulebook as a nickname because I always do weird rules so as soon as I know it's getting too weird with myself yeah I will make my own rules and have to dry out for a long period of time right example um I was my wife was five months pregnant I was shooting a scene from new girl I had a little bit of vodka on my breath okay God bless it's later yeah yeah yeah Who's saying black guy?

[1103] What are you?

[1104] You're what in the show?

[1105] This must have been three.

[1106] Okay, that's, you can drink.

[1107] I knew the lines.

[1108] Yes, I knew your character inside now.

[1109] So I had a little cocktail in me. But I was sitting there and our camera operator, this guy, Paul, a camera B walks up and goes, Twins, huh?

[1110] And I go, yeah.

[1111] And he goes, when are they coming?

[1112] I go, October.

[1113] And he was like, great.

[1114] He goes, how much have you read about all this?

[1115] I'm like, oh, we're excited.

[1116] We're excited, Paul.

[1117] And he goes, do you think they're coming in October?

[1118] I'm like, you bet your ass.

[1119] And he goes, you know, at five months, they could come any moment.

[1120] And I go, oh, I don't think so.

[1121] They said October.

[1122] And he goes, they could come and I had this panic.

[1123] If they came now, the first smell they would smell would be stoly.

[1124] Sure.

[1125] Which means I fucking repeated it.

[1126] You did it.

[1127] And just didn't drink another sip of alcohol until I think they were like a year and a half.

[1128] Oh, that's a long time.

[1129] So it's like, for me, I'll like dance around with it.

[1130] Yeah.

[1131] And then, but I don't really party.

[1132] I can't get drunk anymore, but now my game is I'll have like...

[1133] Because you've got to be up so early with the kids?

[1134] It just doesn't feel as good.

[1135] Oh, okay.

[1136] It just changed.

[1137] So that old blackout days is now for me, like if I go to New York to do press.

[1138] When I'm back in the...

[1139] I don't drink at home.

[1140] Right.

[1141] We don't have any booze in the house.

[1142] Right.

[1143] So I'm like, ooh, the hotel.

[1144] Yeah, let's get it on.

[1145] Oh, I could have two cocktails, but I'm not a guy.

[1146] Two doesn't lead to 10.

[1147] Oh, okay.

[1148] I'm like, I'll do two.

[1149] Oh, that's great.

[1150] Yeah.

[1151] And did you ever powder your nose?

[1152] No, my dad was into Coke.

[1153] He asked me when we first started talking, I was in Iowa and I got drunk one night and got aggressive and broke a door and punched through a microwave.

[1154] And I didn't have the money to get out of the problem I had created.

[1155] And this was the beginning of me being like, do I like this man?

[1156] And I had to call my dad.

[1157] My mom didn't have any money and say like, so the university is unhappy with old Jake's behavior.

[1158] And he said, I'm obviously no one to give you advice.

[1159] First of all, I'll help you.

[1160] Consider this a mistake.

[1161] Let's not do it again.

[1162] So I was like, that's a, thank you for being a class act.

[1163] And then he goes, I'm no one to give advice.

[1164] But it seems like of all my kids, you've got whatever I've got.

[1165] Yeah.

[1166] And I was like, I think there could be truth to that.

[1167] He said, I beg you, even though you like alcohol and you like to smoke a little weed, please stay away from cocaine because you will love it and he goes and once you do it Jake he goes I'm not saying you will you might be a bigger man than I was he goes but our makeup that's just it yeah yes well you like to fucking talk you just said you spent your entire I like to get into it your school career chatting nonstop to everyone and that's all it is is super fuel for that I don't like to sleep I like to be part of things I like to feel good I like to yeah never surrender a good time never surrender gold of the ship is fucking totally underwater well it's interesting you say this because i'm i'm still very pro drugs like i do want my children to experiment with mushrooms and stuff and all that stuff in my speech i've prepared for them is drugs are really fun please don't do coke because then you then you lose your right to do all them like i did so coke was the one that changed the game yeah for me coke is just like so what so you could drink you could put no i was an alcoholic there's no question uh um But I could have potentially juggled it, like say how you're doing where like you quit for a while and this and that.

[1168] But it just got to a point where if I had two jack and diets, I was getting Coke.

[1169] And then it's three days later.

[1170] And I just, I had to admit to myself, oh, you're never going to be able to get drunk without getting coke.

[1171] That's right.

[1172] That happened.

[1173] Something I crossed some thing where I could find it anywhere.

[1174] You wouldn't believe where I would find Coke.

[1175] You know, a VFW hall up in fucking Marysville, Washington, you know.

[1176] somehow I find someone who's got it.

[1177] But yeah, I'll say that to my kids.

[1178] Like, do it all.

[1179] Just don't, don't do dope and don't do cope.

[1180] I've battled it because I don't even smoke weed anymore.

[1181] I like weed.

[1182] I like that it's legal.

[1183] I think it should be legal.

[1184] I'm not a guy who's mentally 100%.

[1185] I think I've definitely got some, you know, whatever terms you want to use, whatever the internet thinks is cool these days.

[1186] I could be self -diagnosed with them.

[1187] Yeah.

[1188] The problem I have with drugs is that if, If your makeup is perfect, if the way your brain is built, your childhood, the way you process emotions and trauma is perfect, drugs seem pretty pure and great.

[1189] If there is something where the wiring might be skewy in that brain of yours, why are we put in like beams of light and pressure there?

[1190] Because if there is mental illness, like acid, I remember, I never took acid.

[1191] But in high school, I remember acid was a big thing.

[1192] Sure.

[1193] And I remember there were people who didn't fully come back where you're like, why do we want to take drugs to, like, you know, I'm into hypnotherapy.

[1194] I really like it.

[1195] I tried to do talk therapy and it never worked for me. Okay.

[1196] I couldn't even get past.

[1197] So does the person actually put you in a hypnotic state?

[1198] I lay down, she, we talk.

[1199] Undresses you?

[1200] No, no, no, no. She just puts her finger on my butt, but it's to relax me. Yeah, of course.

[1201] I'm very tense.

[1202] And then.

[1203] You carry a lot of tension in your prostate.

[1204] Some of the guys she grew up with come in.

[1205] They're big new girl fans.

[1206] The guys she grew up with.

[1207] No, but what the thing is, which I actually really like about it, is you lay there, it feels like a meditation.

[1208] Like I don't feel like I'm like, you are getting sleepy, none of that.

[1209] Okay.

[1210] It's, there's no lights, it's dark, I'm listening to her voice, and then it's just trying to tap into your feelings.

[1211] But because I don't see her and because I don't have to judge her opinion and literally think what she's thinking, because I won't be able to help.

[1212] It's why my marriage, when we got married, we just had our immediate.

[1213] family.

[1214] There was nine people.

[1215] I don't want to do a show.

[1216] I want to tell my wife what I think about her.

[1217] If I have one friend there, I'm doing a show.

[1218] I can't help it.

[1219] Yeah, you got to get that approval.

[1220] Yeah.

[1221] And I also want to make them laugh.

[1222] If you came all the way out here, you're spending your Saturday.

[1223] I'm in show business, man. Tap some fucking coins on my heels and I will dance.

[1224] That's right.

[1225] That's go, man. At the expense of my wife's special day.

[1226] This is a thing.

[1227] And I'm like, with therapy, that's what I would do.

[1228] I would spin the talk so that they would go, great And I'd be like, thanks, out of waste.

[1229] Yeah.

[1230] When my eyes are closed and she's objective and just leading me through, I'm able to actually really trip out.

[1231] And also, but like remember like rooms and smells of my childhood and feelings.

[1232] Oh, that's cool.

[1233] So I wouldn't say, I don't really, I hope my daughters don't do drugs.

[1234] Okay.

[1235] I won't give them the talk.

[1236] Thank you.

[1237] I'll just give my daughters.

[1238] But I hope they have experiences where they get to trip out.

[1239] And if they can't find that and you want to use drugs and you feel, feel pretty solid, because I do think it's important to explode your brain as much as you can.

[1240] Oh, yeah, yeah.

[1241] But so you don't smoke weed?

[1242] I don't smoke weed.

[1243] Then you drink just when duty calls.

[1244] Yeah, I drink at this point probably once every six months.

[1245] Okay.

[1246] And what about gambling?

[1247] I used to have a gambling thing thing.

[1248] Did you?

[1249] Okay, because your movie, win it all.

[1250] But what it captures really brilliantly and it doesn't matter that it's about gambling is just the amount of, when you're addicted to stuff, the amount of conversations you have with yourself about don't do it.

[1251] I'm not going to do it.

[1252] I'm fucking do it.

[1253] No, I'm going to do it.

[1254] No, I'm going to do it.

[1255] And then you paint this scenario where like, oh my God, the mental exhaustion of the talking yourself in and out of it.

[1256] As you were talking, I realized like, because I really don't drink enough anymore to even have the cool slant, like I have a drinking thing.

[1257] I don't gamble anymore.

[1258] I would.

[1259] I would love to still be addicted to gambling.

[1260] I just don't have time with the kids.

[1261] Honestly, like, because it was an addiction, I'm not terrible at gambling.

[1262] So I'm not a gambler where I'm like, 50 ,000 on red.

[1263] I'm playing poker.

[1264] Right.

[1265] So if I'm losing, I'm just losing to people who beat me. So then, you know what I have to do?

[1266] I have to find a table with worse players.

[1267] Right, right.

[1268] Because I would hit a table where I'd lose big, and I'd be like, I got sucked out.

[1269] And then there'd be other day, and I'm like, I lost big.

[1270] And congratulations, you two guys are significantly better.

[1271] Yes.

[1272] So now that I see you in the casino, oh, bye, bye.

[1273] Do you know my trick was I was into, when I met Kristen 11 years ago, I was very into Hold 'em.

[1274] Yeah.

[1275] And my trick was I would take Suduko.

[1276] books with me when I'd play in Vegas so that I was totally entertained not being in a hand So you could fault smart yeah so I could fold and I just I had a fucking rule I only play you know whatever I would decide that I was gonna complain anything worse than that And also while I'm while I'm on the Sudoku book um I'm no longer looking at fucking this guy Mike who I know's fucking bullshitting everyone because then I get into sheriff mode sometimes at tables 100 % like I got I'm gonna call this motherfucker out and it's always the time he does have it I'm going to catch you.

[1277] I'm going to catch you.

[1278] I'm the police all of a sudden.

[1279] If I don't distract myself enough.

[1280] But here, I've gone down both roads.

[1281] Okay.

[1282] So that is the smarter way to conservatively make small money.

[1283] Right.

[1284] Since new girl started and I had money coming in for the first time in my life, if I'm going to go to a casino and spend the 10 hours, I don't want to look at the thing on my lap.

[1285] Right.

[1286] I want to play sheriff.

[1287] Hey, you might bust me, but I might bust you too, boy.

[1288] Yeah.

[1289] And that's what started getting me in trouble where I was like, I know the smarter way to play.

[1290] I know I could go to a house, home game, and play casually and walk out with $175.

[1291] Uh -huh.

[1292] It's also eight hours of my life.

[1293] But it's interesting, when you're playing sheriff, you're forced to join somebody who's playing emotionally or, you know, just not logically.

[1294] Like, you have to meet them there.

[1295] Yes, but then you always, but that's where I really got addicted to.

[1296] Because you loved that.

[1297] Because then I'm now in it with that person.

[1298] Or if somebody's the abusive drunk at the table.

[1299] Yeah.

[1300] Well, and nobody's saying, you know, it's not, if they're being mean to the dealer, there's not a rumor there you can say like, excuse me, sir, that's inappropriate.

[1301] But what you can do is call them, bust them, and then before they flip, you go, just push your cards because you got nothing.

[1302] And then all of a sudden, they don't like you.

[1303] And when they're abusive to you, you can just nod and go, well, now you know and I know, I'm coming after you.

[1304] So now we don't like each other.

[1305] Then you know that I don't like you.

[1306] So all these weird vines, that, you're like, yeah, that.

[1307] all of a sudden started feeling like, I would feel like this energy through my bones.

[1308] Just like, everything would be buzzing, and that's the high I got addicted to.

[1309] Yeah.

[1310] And that, for me, it was the same thing going back to the Twitter stuff.

[1311] Winning didn't feel that good.

[1312] I used to keep all my money in a little side of my car.

[1313] So my steering wheel is here.

[1314] I had a secret compartment.

[1315] That was my gambling money.

[1316] Uh -huh.

[1317] So if I was ever near a casino, ding -knit -ding?

[1318] Uh -huh.

[1319] Who gives a shit?

[1320] I don't even spend it.

[1321] It's fake money.

[1322] Right.

[1323] But when I busted out and I had nothing, and my ATM was busted.

[1324] and I had exceeded my limit, and it was 2 a .m. And I was sitting in the bike casino alone on a Tuesday.

[1325] Uh -huh.

[1326] That feeling, that hurt, I realized this is what I like, and this is why I'm here.

[1327] I'm here for the weird rush, but I'm addicted to losing.

[1328] Which is so weird, isn't it?

[1329] Did you ever read Dotsiefsky's The Gambler?

[1330] No. Oh, you must.

[1331] It's his shortest book.

[1332] I think it's only 70 pages.

[1333] Oh, okay, great.

[1334] And it gets you so deeply into the mind.

[1335] set of someone who's just a degenerate fuck up.

[1336] I love it.

[1337] Yes.

[1338] And the obsession, this crazy fairy tale, a lot of gambling and I spy into where the ultimate goal is they can quit.

[1339] They'll quit.

[1340] But once they get back to dead even, whatever that is, they're all just searching.

[1341] This is this fake finish line of once I get back to square, then I can quit.

[1342] But that's, but there's no square.

[1343] There is no. Because what you're, I'm excited for you to finish the movie genuinely.

[1344] Yeah, yeah.

[1345] But that was the big kind of theme and the big talk of it is when you're, in the throes of an addiction, there's never an out.

[1346] But it's even now, my big addictions now will be, literally, our neighbors dropped over holiday suites, and my wife was with my kids.

[1347] They went to the Nutcracker, and I didn't go.

[1348] So they went with, like, her parents.

[1349] I'm pulling the same move next weekend.

[1350] By the way.

[1351] Well, nothing to do with the Knocker.

[1352] It was the right call.

[1353] I got to watch Sunday football day by myself and my house.

[1354] I had a wonderful day.

[1355] Worst part was at about 11 a .m., they dropped off these, like, rice crispy popcorn things.

[1356] things, and I looked at it, I lived when it all in like the nerdiest fat boy version.

[1357] I'm like, sure, I can enjoy a scoop of this.

[1358] I ate so, I felt sick.

[1359] I would be watching TV.

[1360] I'm like, I legitimately have a stomach cake.

[1361] Then my body would rise.

[1362] And I'd be like, why are we going back to the weird mix?

[1363] Handful, handful.

[1364] Yes.

[1365] And I'm like, oh, that's now my, it used to be cool and like poker.

[1366] Well, there's just a switch you flip in your head where you go, I don't give a fuck.

[1367] I'm not even going to evaluate how to show.

[1368] constructive this is.

[1369] But I want this enjoyment so badly.

[1370] Yeah.

[1371] I occasionally do that still with pizza is my thing where it's like I will eat whatever gets delivered to the house.

[1372] Just like when I bought Coke.

[1373] It's getting snorted tonight.

[1374] That's right.

[1375] Friends of mine who have stories of going to bed with like still half of an eight ball.

[1376] I'm like, what are you meeting?

[1377] That's not how it works.

[1378] That's not it's been designed to use.

[1379] This is not why we do this substance.

[1380] So you got out to L .A. You must have thought during the good times of winning the grant and everything that you're going to be a fucking writer, that's going to happen like this.

[1381] There had to been a bit of a, like, a little bit of humbling.

[1382] The humbling was the Chicago era.

[1383] Okay.

[1384] But the humbling was my end of New York.

[1385] All right.

[1386] Everything in New York was going really great at first.

[1387] It was my plays were getting produced.

[1388] Things were going really good.

[1389] I had a play produced by the Ensemble Studio Theater.

[1390] It was a one -act there's a true story it was my cousin who we grew up like a sister she was you know always over had summers at our house got into heroin got living on the streets everything bad my sister has always been really straight just you know which you take one hit a weed and be like yuck but like it just somehow didn't but they were always best friends and we always all played so I wrote a play about little two kids two little girls playing putting masks on and when they put the masks on one of them starts talking about this darkness her future and the other one can't relate just to show that like you could you could look back we saw it as kids we'd like talk about it we'd be like you could always see in tree like my other cousin Jason died of drugs too and you'd be like oh yeah you could see in jason and teresa yes there was something you know chance a chancer rapper has a song called same drugs but and there's a feeling in there that i could i felt where you're like oh we used to do the same thing but then something in you clicked off yeah but so i wrote that play it got picked up this theater i met the director he was a very new york uh you know theater director he cast the women i was very excited i was a very angry guy i had a lot of opinions they realized i probably wasn't the best match for the theater process so they said you wrote a wonderful play just go back write another one and come to the opening yeah yeah and i realized i was like okay i guess i'm not helping okay you know they're not asking me to sit in right so i went to the the night it was 3 -1 -X and mine was one of them and I was with Annie and a bunch of my classmates were there who I didn't know so I really wanted to impress had a big chip on my shoulder probably was wearing a scarf you know it was like it was at that point there there could have been a hat on yeah sure you know and it wouldn't have been a baseball hat uh -huh the first one goes and it was pretty good I was like that was pretty good and then uh mine starts but they don't introduce them before and this is a non -exaggerated uh no exaggeration there's music and it's like little kid music it's like do do do do do and I thought like hack cheesy oh really it's like reds and white from his circus and I was like I'm a very opinionated guy with my work sure art so right away especially now I'm more like we all try our hardest but at 22 I was like if you're bad I hate you yeah so I was like I hate this one but I'm not going to say anything because the writer might be next to me then the two women come out and they're using little kid voices but they're grown -ups so they're like do you want to play oh boy and i turned to annie and i go this one this sucks and she gives me that look where you see utter sadness in your partner's eyes but i didn't get it and that one was mine that was yours and i was crying it was the everybody after was like congratulations and i was i was the least gracious i asked them to take my play out of the festival oh my the professor had to give me a talk saying you will fake gratitude right now and you will thank the actors and I was like well they did a bad job why they thought like to hate you nightmare so then everything so you didn't blame yourself you blamed to them as you should have sounded like well I still believe I liked the script when I read it now it's not a great play but it should have been better than that right it should have been a B minus yeah where you're like how was it was written by a 22 year old who didn't have the depth of what he was trying to say but there was something there yeah That was a piece of garbage.

[1391] So, no, I blamed them.

[1392] I didn't even get to judge if I liked the writing.

[1393] So then that's when I started going, I will only be in things if I'm in them.

[1394] Okay.

[1395] So that was the beginning of me and Oliver being in plays that we wrote doing the fringe festival stuff.

[1396] Yeah.

[1397] But all that bottomed out.

[1398] So by the time I got to Chicago and I was living with my dad, they was so a lack of heat around me. I was 26 and I was dead broke.

[1399] and my whole character was that I hated my dad.

[1400] Even then, and then I was so broke, I was doing this project joke that we shot that was crazy.

[1401] I didn't know how to edit it.

[1402] I didn't have any money.

[1403] I had to ask him for money to help me get an Adobe, a $100 editing software book.

[1404] And he was like, then he goes, where are you going to live?

[1405] And I was like, I don't know.

[1406] So he was like, come on.

[1407] So that was a period of my life where I had to be like, do you want to have dinner with me?

[1408] And he's like, yeah, I'm buying you dinner, asshole.

[1409] And I'm like, thank you so much, my man. And he gave me $800 to come out to L .A. He was like, so we just, that was the period we transitioned.

[1410] Uh -huh.

[1411] Where I couldn't have - You needed him and he was there for you.

[1412] Yeah, and I couldn't have an attitude because I was nothing.

[1413] Yeah.

[1414] And by the time I went to L .A., it was, I was on step one.

[1415] So that's when I saw commercials and my buddy, Steve Berg, but we did an improv show to And he's like, Jonathan, how do you make your money?

[1416] And I was like, I work over at Hollywood Park.

[1417] And he's like, jeez, you're far too funny to not be getting paid into the world of entertainment.

[1418] He's like, I have to walk into my commercial agent.

[1419] He did.

[1420] I booked my first spot, got in the union.

[1421] And you'd make like 20 grand.

[1422] Yeah.

[1423] And it tapped into all the gambling stuff and everything of what I like.

[1424] Yeah.

[1425] And I thought like, I want more and more and more.

[1426] And I just got hooked.

[1427] Right.

[1428] And then there was no turning back.

[1429] And then you had a, you had kind of a long.

[1430] a little bit of a long spell from arriving in L .A., right?

[1431] Yeah.

[1432] I was in the same boat as you as I was 28 when I got punked.

[1433] Like, I had been at it for a long time.

[1434] I'm not making a living.

[1435] That's right.

[1436] Yeah, so what felt like overnight on the outside to me. You're like, I've been grinding.

[1437] Yeah, we're in 10 years now by the time I do that stuff.

[1438] Was it punked or was it idiocracy where you felt like, all right, now I'm in the game?

[1439] Because there is a moment where you're grinding in, you're fighting in, you're fighting in, you're fighting in and then whatever level you're at in it yeah then you're just in the pool well and i don't think i actually felt that until about three years ago as stupid as that sounds because i was so singular focused on trying to be somebody like oh i got i want to be adam sandler i want to be will feral i want to be you know so and when i'm in without a paddle the most biggest opportunity in my lifetime i'm still one of three leads right i'm like oh this is a stepping stone to that other thing then all that goes away i'm in movies that make no money and then i'm back to square one then i end up on parenthood and then i learned to just enjoy being in an ensemble where i finally was like no you're good you're in the NBA you're in the NBA you're on the team you're not jordan you're never going to be pitman i too fucking a you're on the team and i think they're going to let you stay in the NBA that's exactly right and you're in the NBA yeah i have the same thing and i'm not jordan right i would imagine after let's be cops you're Your mind must have done that.

[1440] Well, I had a different thing because I really love acting.

[1441] And I know a lot of actors say this, but I really don't like the celebrity of it.

[1442] In that I don't, I'm not a perks guy.

[1443] I don't go out a lot.

[1444] I'm not very social.

[1445] I've been with my wife for 14 years.

[1446] So I never had the like, you know, you go to a club.

[1447] You know what?

[1448] I had my entourage years.

[1449] I never did.

[1450] I never was that.

[1451] I never sat court side.

[1452] I don't go to nice restaurants.

[1453] I don't like dressing up.

[1454] I don't like the big award stuff.

[1455] So all celebrity means to me, the money is very cool.

[1456] I like having a nice house.

[1457] I like not being scared about that stuff.

[1458] I like being able to send checks to people.

[1459] All that's very cool.

[1460] The more my face is in things, it's not necessarily the win for me. So I had a big turn where I'm like, and it's one of the reasons why I'm also so excited about Spider -Man not to do a professional transition.

[1461] But I had a moment when Let's Be Cops was coming out.

[1462] It started testing really high.

[1463] Then I had all those people in my ear being like, when this hits and billboards were all over town, and now it wasn't just the New Girl fan base, now when I'm pulling in the security guard is going like, yo, I know you.

[1464] Now I'm getting pulled over by cops, and they're doing jokes to arrest me because they know, and it spooked me. It did.

[1465] And it didn't, again, it didn't feel validating.

[1466] I didn't feel like, I fucking did it.

[1467] I felt like deep down, I don't feel comfortable with this.

[1468] And do you think maybe part of that is, because I've had a similar reaction to it all, is you have a total lack of control now?

[1469] Yes, and I'm a control freak.

[1470] Yeah, me too.

[1471] I remember my first kind of panic attack was doing idiocracy in Texas, and I went to Fuddruckers, and I'm sitting there, and I'm noticing that about five of the nine tables, the people are staring at me. Yes.

[1472] And I'm like, I don't like this.

[1473] Oh, wow, this is forever.

[1474] Yes.

[1475] And I can't, I can't turn it off.

[1476] I can't unplug.

[1477] My only option is just not go out.

[1478] Yeah.

[1479] Which I'm not going to do because I like to go out.

[1480] I do do things.

[1481] Yeah.

[1482] I'm going to be involved in my kids and my friend's lives and my wife's life.

[1483] Right.

[1484] I'm not that famous.

[1485] Yeah.

[1486] I'm out.

[1487] I remember calling my girlfriend in the parking lot of floodwreckers like in a panic.

[1488] Yeah.

[1489] She's like, get over it.

[1490] That's like an hour of your day.

[1491] The rest of your day you're doing what you love.

[1492] And I'm like, oh, thank you.

[1493] But she's right.

[1494] But there is all.

[1495] Also, when you do have that real, I had it when New Girl first started.

[1496] My wife and I were at a museum in Chicago, and there were these young women following us around.

[1497] And because I was with her, and I've been with her since I first moved to L .A., I didn't know what the fuck they were doing.

[1498] Right.

[1499] And I didn't think of myself as that guy from that show that they watched.

[1500] I thought, why are they following me?

[1501] And what do they want from me?

[1502] And what's the angle here?

[1503] my heart was beating fast and then I like kept looking and they were like young cute girls so I'm like just be a guy so I can just start the fight and you can beat me up and it can be over whatever that thing is I hate this tension and then finally they started walking over but I had the panic and then they go are you that guy and I thought like fuck you ruined an hour and third just ass and I realized I can't control it I didn't like it now I'm not saying what a drag we have it We're both living blessed easy lengths because of it all.

[1504] But I did realize if I continue to push and push in the structure of the game, I had a big moment with my agent while I was doing Let's Be Cops.

[1505] My agents came in town and they said, like, great.

[1506] And I said, we need to have a strategy talk because I've been working nonstop.

[1507] And it's either the TV or a movie.

[1508] And if I'm not doing those, I'm doing press.

[1509] Somebody break down the bigger goal.

[1510] Right, right.

[1511] And they said, well, here's where you're headed.

[1512] You do a movie like this so that it hits so that you can do a movie.

[1513] And you could be your own.

[1514] You don't even need Damon.

[1515] I go, I like, I'm like, no, I know, but he can do his own and you can do your own.

[1516] And I go, but for eight months of the year, I'm doing the TV show.

[1517] So you're saying, I would do a movie like this so that I can do six months of press for this so that I can do a bigger movie that now I'm the only guy in the poster.

[1518] So that then I can go back to the TV show so that the next summer I can be in an even bigger movie so I can even do more press.

[1519] Now we get to talk wonderful things like international press.

[1520] So you can send me all around the world to sell somebody else's vacuum with my face on it that maybe in a good deal, they'll give me some back end.

[1521] Right.

[1522] But I'll have to beg for it.

[1523] Yeah.

[1524] And I was like, it's not working.

[1525] Uh -huh.

[1526] This is not for me. Okay.

[1527] And the thing was, all right, then what's for you?

[1528] And that then became the discussion of like, well, I don't know.

[1529] Right.

[1530] I'd never thought of that.

[1531] Yeah.

[1532] And then you go, all right, well, what do you want to do?

[1533] And at the time, I was like, I want to slow down.

[1534] Uh -huh.

[1535] And it's like, so pass on a job.

[1536] And I'm like, well, I'm afraid about money.

[1537] Of course.

[1538] So chill out.

[1539] And then you start, I want to do.

[1540] I like this project.

[1541] And then, you know, that's when we're like, Joe Swanberg became a bigger character in my life.

[1542] Uh -huh.

[1543] He's the guy who directed two of the movies.

[1544] He did Drinking Buddies.

[1545] We did win it all together.

[1546] We did Digging for Fire together where it became.

[1547] In Digging for Fire, the premises in real life, you and your wife were in the backyard of a rental house.

[1548] Yeah, we lived in Atwater.

[1549] Okay.

[1550] And we were converting our backyard into a farm.

[1551] Uh -huh.

[1552] So we had, it was the first time we had space.

[1553] Yeah.

[1554] So we had said, like, let's get rid of all this soil and spend the time and put good soil in and and then plant corn and watermelon and get after it.

[1555] Right.

[1556] And I was about to do a press tour for a movie called Paper Art, so I had a six -week window to do nothing.

[1557] Uh -huh.

[1558] So I threw Woody Guthrone, rolled a bunch of joints, mixed in tobacco, got to live the old farming, you know, Great Depression life.

[1559] You were living in Steinbeck for you hadn't read him.

[1560] All my buddies would come over.

[1561] We all had shovels.

[1562] We dug everything out, and we were going to clear everything, put great soil in.

[1563] It ended up working, but at one point, as we were digging, I came across a bone, and it was a good -sized bone.

[1564] could be a German Shepherd leg, don't know.

[1565] A femur or something.

[1566] Something real.

[1567] Kept Dagan, found more bones.

[1568] Kept Diggin found a license plate.

[1569] Kept Digan, found the insides of what would be a trunk, the bottom of a trunk rolled up.

[1570] Inside was garbage and some more bones.

[1571] Kept Diggin, found a rusted gun.

[1572] Could have been a toy gun, no doubt about it.

[1573] Or could have been a tiny little gun.

[1574] Kept Dagen found more.

[1575] Quick question.

[1576] As you're finding the bones, you're discussing, should we call it law enforcement?

[1577] Well, it, honestly, it was still, we're having a fun adventure.

[1578] Sure.

[1579] So marijuana was a big part of those.

[1580] So, you know, my neighbors at the time, it was a drug house.

[1581] Okay.

[1582] So they were watching us.

[1583] We were watching them.

[1584] They had been there forever.

[1585] All good.

[1586] So finally, I go like, all right, I guess we do have to call the police now.

[1587] Right.

[1588] So I called the police, LAPD, reported what I had, and the woman on the phone was very annoyed.

[1589] And she said, what would you like me to do?

[1590] And I go, well, I'd like you to come out here and figure out if there's a body that's been buried in my backyard.

[1591] And she goes, it's not the LAPD's job to come dig out somebody else's trash.

[1592] If you find the body, then let us know.

[1593] And I go, well, I found the bones.

[1594] And she goes, a lot of people have buried a lot of things.

[1595] It could be animals.

[1596] If you find a body, let me know.

[1597] And I went like, fucking great.

[1598] And I hung up, and we went on a deep search to find the body.

[1599] And we got about six feet in the ground.

[1600] Oh, my goodness.

[1601] And there was new water pipes that they had put in.

[1602] and they were more recent than the things that were buried underneath it in that somebody put things here on purpose that made it really hard to get underneath.

[1603] We're like, why is there a new plastic pipe here?

[1604] And we're like, but I can't get to here.

[1605] And then there was a zone where there was a carpet that was buried vertically.

[1606] Oh, my goodness.

[1607] And we could get a little bit.

[1608] There's a photo of it that I've got somewhere that Jeff took a photo of me, or I think my wife took one of Jeff and I, where we're all the way in, you know, chin down is the hole.

[1609] And we just couldn't, with the new pipes, get any deeper in.

[1610] And we thought, well, what do we do?

[1611] Because this could just be trash.

[1612] A lot of it was trash.

[1613] And in the end, we put dirt back on.

[1614] So somebody, whoever resides there, has an unsolved mystery perhaps in their backyard.

[1615] What we did is we planted corn there.

[1616] The corn grew great.

[1617] We had corn for two seasons, and then I put a little plaque.

[1618] So there's like a little, it doesn't say anything, but it's a nice little artwork thing that we just had in the house that I put in the dirt and made sure the grass go around so I can always find that same spot.

[1619] But I still go to Atwater and walk by the house and look in.

[1620] So that origin was the origin of that movie.

[1621] And just quickly, how did you get New Girl?

[1622] Because I did an independent movie with Max Winkler called Ceremony.

[1623] And Liz was writing a script with Max.

[1624] They were all there.

[1625] And Liz was watching early cuts and then brought me in to audition for no strings attached with Mr. Ashton Cuscher and Natalie Portman, Greta Gerwig, mini Kaling.

[1626] There was really weird for me to be around all those celebrities.

[1627] Everybody was really nice to me because I had a character in it.

[1628] But I was not there in my head.

[1629] I was like, you know, I'm a commercial actor who does a bit.

[1630] Why does my character have a name here?

[1631] I should be like bar patron number two.

[1632] Yeah.

[1633] But I'm like, I'm here, whatever.

[1634] And Natalie was really sweet.

[1635] And she's like, oh, I'm doing a party.

[1636] You want to come.

[1637] So I went to her house, a beautiful home.

[1638] And, you know, I'm expecting to party a little bit.

[1639] Yeah.

[1640] I was like, all right, let's just get weird.

[1641] And it was not that.

[1642] It was like more of a dinner party scene.

[1643] Didn't feel, I wasn't comfortable in my own skin.

[1644] I didn't really want to be there, even though everybody was nice.

[1645] Yeah.

[1646] She then initiates a game called apples and oranges or apples and apples.

[1647] Apples to apples.

[1648] Apples to apples.

[1649] I don't like those games because, you know.

[1650] They're hard to do in a blackout.

[1651] Yeah, but as well as it's any of those like mental games like where you can like get caught up, I'm always bad at them.

[1652] I'm not quick like that.

[1653] So then the whole bit is just how bad I am at him, which if I'm with certain friends, I love to be the above the joke.

[1654] Let's all have some laughs.

[1655] Yeah, but now when you're trying to impress Natalie Boren.

[1656] And not knowing how to and knowing how like she's like very smart and she's very edge.

[1657] I was like, I have no throughground for you to think I'm cool.

[1658] I was never funny around her.

[1659] She would read the New York Times in the trailer when we're doing hair and make.

[1660] Very new.

[1661] She's like, how are you?

[1662] And I'd be like sweating, be like, not going to tell you my funny like talk show story about how I got here and almost got in a car accident.

[1663] So I was like, anyhow, so we do the house.

[1664] And she goes, oh, we're going to play, you know, apples to apples.

[1665] Do you want to play?

[1666] And I was like, actually, I go on such a gober.

[1667] But I was like, sounds like a lot of fun, but I should go.

[1668] And she was like, oh, okay.

[1669] And I was like, goodbye, everybody.

[1670] And there was only like six people there at that time.

[1671] And they were like, oh, bye.

[1672] And I exited her back door, but I was in her, she has like a whole gated structure.

[1673] Sure, sure, sure.

[1674] And I didn't know how to get out.

[1675] Oh, boy, that's stressful.

[1676] But they were playing in a zone where I had to walk through.

[1677] So I thought, I'm not going to know, enough time has passed while I walked around the backyard.

[1678] I considered hopping the fence legitimately too big.

[1679] Yeah.

[1680] So I then sat in the backyard thinking the move will be when the game ends.

[1681] everybody leaves, I can sneak out where there's...

[1682] Oh, my God.

[1683] This is a terrible plan.

[1684] Well, I didn't have a plan.

[1685] I don't.

[1686] Oh, Jesus.

[1687] And then when I, then they played so that when I finally went like...

[1688] They got really caught up in the game.

[1689] I sat in the backyard for a while, but...

[1690] And then I was trying to do the cool thing, like, I'm just out here thinking.

[1691] Oh, my goodness.

[1692] And I was hoping they were going to be like, what are you doing?

[1693] And I could be like, oh, it's just beautiful night.

[1694] All right.

[1695] No, I just wanted to enjoy the...

[1696] Wonderful to see you guys.

[1697] But I didn't have a...

[1698] I was like really trying to like be discovered so that I could leave.

[1699] But I'm like, how do I get discovered that I come off as cool?

[1700] And I was like, if I had a cigarette, I would have loved to have been like, oh, sorry, I was just smoking.

[1701] But I was like, I don't even have that.

[1702] There's no reason I went this way.

[1703] And then...

[1704] Oh, boy.

[1705] So then I eventually, it went up, so I just walked through it and they were like, what are you?

[1706] And I was like, I'm trying to get out of here.

[1707] The vibe was like laugh, not a big deal.

[1708] I walked out and I was like, jumped in my little Ford Focus with tinted windows.

[1709] Because that's what I, when I first booked the gig, I tinted my window and got a CD player.

[1710] I pulled my little maroon for it focus out of it.

[1711] Oh, that's really, that you was the worst outcome of the many options.

[1712] It was really.

[1713] You delayed long enough that they knew you were fucking around in the backyard for some time.

[1714] I know, I can almost care.

[1715] Have you run into her again?

[1716] Yeah, just high, high.

[1717] Okay.

[1718] Yeah.

[1719] We didn't have like a. I want you to kind of bring that up with her and just walk her through what you went through.

[1720] My sad reality is I think the level of my importance of that night was that they didn't even discuss it when I left.

[1721] Do you know what I mean?

[1722] I know exactly what you.

[1723] I was just telling Monica this.

[1724] I was at Costco about eight years ago and like ringing up with talking to the lady.

[1725] And she goes, oh, she goes, I heard you were dead.

[1726] And I go, you heard I was dead.

[1727] She goes, yeah, my daughter told me you were dead.

[1728] That you died.

[1729] And I go, oh, no, I'm alive.

[1730] She goes, oh, good, good.

[1731] And I go, how did she say I died?

[1732] And she goes, how I don't, I didn't ask her.

[1733] And I was like, do you know how not interested you have to be to not ask how someone dies?

[1734] Like Octamomom.

[1735] If you told me Octam died, I resent her.

[1736] She's a terrible person.

[1737] I'd still go, oh, how'd she die?

[1738] For sure.

[1739] Less interest in me than someone would have an Octamomom.

[1740] Just dead.

[1741] Okay, great.

[1742] I don't have to hear about him again.

[1743] No follow up question.

[1744] So tell me, so Spider -Man is an animated.

[1745] This is an animated feature?

[1746] It's an animated feature.

[1747] Phil Lord and Chris Miller are doing it.

[1748] Oh, they're the best.

[1749] There is.

[1750] The movie's really good.

[1751] I really love this movie.

[1752] To bring everyone up to speed.

[1753] Lord Miller famously did the Lego movie.

[1754] They did the Lego movie.

[1755] They did cloudy.

[1756] They did 21 Jump Street, which I did with them.

[1757] I did a scene.

[1758] And that's when I realized how talented they were because that was, I was like, what we were was really wild and loose.

[1759] And I was like, I don't know if they're going to pull this one together.

[1760] and they are like editing geniuses guys.

[1761] And they also did Will Forte's show Last Man on Earth.

[1762] And they are truly outside the box smart thinkers.

[1763] What is it of all the big themes you wish we all had the discussions about before you start?

[1764] They really are.

[1765] And so I got an email from Phil a couple of years ago saying, so I'm writing a new Spider -Man movie.

[1766] But it's to introduce Miles Morales, who is, I'm not a big comic book guy.

[1767] Me either.

[1768] But Miles is that.

[1769] the first spider person of color.

[1770] Oh, okay.

[1771] He's half Puerto Rican, half black.

[1772] So there's a name for that.

[1773] Afro Latino?

[1774] No, I mean, no, funner name.

[1775] Joey Bryant told it to me. Because there's a lot of half black, half Puerto Ricans in New York.

[1776] There's a fun name.

[1777] But he's the first, this is like his origin story.

[1778] This is how he becomes Spider -Man.

[1779] So I'm his Mr. Miyagi.

[1780] He's the karate kid.

[1781] And then we introduce, because it's, I'm Peter Parker from this dimension, and I get sucked into his.

[1782] And then all the other spider people come.

[1783] So there's the first spider girl.

[1784] It's Spider -Gwen.

[1785] When I told my daughters, I was doing this, and I'll go, I have to go to work.

[1786] They always ask what I'm doing.

[1787] I'm recorded Spider -Man.

[1788] So then we're playing in the house, and they wanted to be Spider -Man girl.

[1789] Well, as a white man, I never thought about representation, because I always had it.

[1790] Sure.

[1791] So having daughters, I would be like, no, honey, you can't be Spider -Man girl, because there's not Spider -Man girl.

[1792] I was like, but you can be Wonder Woman.

[1793] And then I was like, fuck it, let's just make up our own.

[1794] And the whole thing started really pissing me off.

[1795] And then what I like about the ideas of this movie that they originally did was the idea is anyone can wear the mask.

[1796] So in this movie, Spider -Man, as we know him, is Peter Parker?

[1797] He's still there.

[1798] But he's now 40.

[1799] So it's Peter Parker after he was a superhero.

[1800] Oh, it kind of.

[1801] And it sucked.

[1802] Sure.

[1803] Because he lost his wife.

[1804] And he saved a bunch of people, but no one cares about you after you.

[1805] save him.

[1806] Yeah.

[1807] And he's going through a pretty dark depression.

[1808] Uh -huh.

[1809] And he doesn't want to be Spider -Man anymore.

[1810] He wants to have his life work.

[1811] Yeah.

[1812] He has to be the mentor to this kid who's becoming Spider -Man, but doesn't know how to.

[1813] Right.

[1814] But he's got to save the world.

[1815] And I need him to learn the tools to send me home.

[1816] Yeah.

[1817] So it's like all the - And maybe also hopefully warn him of the pitfalls of being.

[1818] Yes.

[1819] And he reminds me, well, fuck, it's pretty damn.

[1820] cool to have superpowers enjoy it right uh the very last thing i want to ask you back one of the things i'm i was most excited about reading about you today is that uh so you've been with your current wife yes aaron yes since 2004 yeah isn't it so fantastic that you met her before everything for sure isn't that so wonderful to have taken that ride with her yes and it's also it um she was with me and we had decided to fall in love and to, you know, make our lives together when I was still at the casino.

[1821] Mm -hmm.

[1822] And so the whole, my career part of it is a scream.

[1823] But if it fades or when it fades and when I'm off the ride, it's fine.

[1824] Well, you already know she was with you before.

[1825] It's like it's, we both know, I'm probably not going to be invited to this party forever.

[1826] Mm -hmm.

[1827] So when the day comes where you're like, oh, it's been about 18 months.

[1828] I think it's over.

[1829] And we're like, oh, let's cash in our chips.

[1830] Did we save enough?

[1831] How did we do?

[1832] Yeah.

[1833] But yeah, I find that to be a very nice relief.

[1834] She had a thing that really put me in perspective when I was doing a UCB show.

[1835] It was when that moment starts in your career where things are probably, you know, popping.

[1836] Right, probably right before punked for you where you're like, all of a sudden from doing like a comedy show, you're like, there's an energy around me that wasn't there a month ago for some reason.

[1837] Right.

[1838] And I'm like, damn, like all of a sudden, eight.

[1839] agents are, like, being nice to me. I did the shows before where they weren't.

[1840] Yeah.

[1841] And we were doing a live version of E .T. My friend Charlene Yee and I wrote it.

[1842] And it was a one -night -only show, and Seth Rogan played my older brother.

[1843] Okay.

[1844] And I am a fan of it.

[1845] I think he's so goddamn talented.

[1846] Me too.

[1847] And really nice, and has always been really nice.

[1848] I always wanted to be in all his movies.

[1849] Yeah.

[1850] I wanted to be, you know, I was never in his group of friends, but I was like, come on, man. I can't handle the dope, but let me in.

[1851] Yeah, yeah.

[1852] Let me be the cousin of this group.

[1853] Yes.

[1854] And he was there and he was being like so nice to me and he's just nice.

[1855] And he was being nice to everybody and my wife was there.

[1856] And I'd never done it before, but I was like really like, like, I'd been with my wife, you know, for years already.

[1857] But I was really like showing off that I knew Seth.

[1858] Right.

[1859] Yeah, of course.

[1860] And I was really excited about it.

[1861] Uh -huh.

[1862] And I really thought she was going to just look at me a little different.

[1863] Yes, of course.

[1864] Like, hey, you always said comedy, but now you're delivering it.

[1865] Because she saw all my bad improv shows.

[1866] One of our first dates, she saw me at the Improv Olympic, where I probably did one of the worst improv shows in the history.

[1867] And then we, like, went and got a burrito.

[1868] And she was like, it was funny.

[1869] I don't love improv.

[1870] And I'm like, no one does, especially at the Improv Olympic.

[1871] But we then get in the car, and she was like, the show was really funny.

[1872] You were great.

[1873] Charlene's great.

[1874] She's like, she's like, in getting all the compliments that you feel good.

[1875] Yeah, it was fun.

[1876] You know, it all worked out.

[1877] whatever, it's fun.

[1878] And then I go, pretty cool about Seth.

[1879] He's a cool guy, yeah?

[1880] And I couldn't believe we hadn't let out with it.

[1881] I was like, there's a fucking elephant in the room.

[1882] Let's just talk about it.

[1883] Seth could make a call.

[1884] I could be a movie star if he wants me to be.

[1885] And I was like, and he was being nice to me and was talking about how funny the scenes were.

[1886] And she goes, yeah, and she goes, who?

[1887] And I go, Seth Rogan.

[1888] She goes, which one is Seth Rogan?

[1889] I go, the fucking guy we were talking to.

[1890] He's in every movie.

[1891] All the movies that I'm watching, he's the star of and is probably wrote, and she goes, oh yeah, she goes, I think I have seen that guy.

[1892] And then she goes, he was pretty funny in it.

[1893] And I had this moment of she's not in the game.

[1894] Right.

[1895] So it doesn't matter.

[1896] Which is good.

[1897] Which was really great because I got to breathe it out and go, I'm giving Seth Rogen too much importance.

[1898] He was really nice.

[1899] He's not going to make a call, make me a movie star.

[1900] He was being really sweet.

[1901] He's always been nice.

[1902] Move on.

[1903] But If she would have been excited about that, too, I would have buzzed about that.

[1904] We would have had a Seth Rogen talk, not been able to sleep.

[1905] And as soon as we got home, the talk was honestly, she was like, you were funny.

[1906] And then we got to be like, yeah, it was fun.

[1907] All right, let's do dinner now.

[1908] It's kind of over.

[1909] And that's been a really, whatever I do when I come home, she's not impressed by this.

[1910] But she's not not impressed, but she's not like a moviegoer.

[1911] Yes.

[1912] So I think that's very healthy.

[1913] I have a different version of it, which is if I have a crazy day or I have a crazy opportunity or I've been on a press tour that's been kicking my ass, my wife's like, yeah, I know, yeah, I do the exact same thing.

[1914] Right, totally.

[1915] Yeah, they suck.

[1916] Yeah, they're very tired.

[1917] Yeah, that's right.

[1918] And whatever, I do it too.

[1919] And I'm like, oh, yeah.

[1920] Well, I feel like my ex -girlfriend, who was also with her very long time, that was part of the problem is I would complain about that.

[1921] and then, you know, she would either indulge it or be resentful because why aren't I grateful for this thing?

[1922] The whole thing, it was a bad, you know, dynamic for me that I didn't handle well.

[1923] So as soon as I was doing safety, not guaranteed, and Aaron was visiting me, we were in the hotel deadline announced, new girl got picked up for 13, and as unromantically as it is, I leaned over.

[1924] I'm like, so should we get married now?

[1925] I was like, should we, and now, could we just join accounts?

[1926] Yeah.

[1927] This will, 13 will give us enough.

[1928] I can help my mom out.

[1929] We can figure out student loans.

[1930] We can be done.

[1931] But 13 will get us out.

[1932] Right.

[1933] And it's not going to make sense for me to write you a check and you to have your check in account.

[1934] And then she was like, yeah, that makes sense.

[1935] Then we were both like, all right.

[1936] So I go, if it's 13 and if it's good, we could get 22.

[1937] And if we get multiple seasons, now we can build, we can buy somewhere.

[1938] Yeah.

[1939] But it's now time to just, you know.

[1940] Well, that's great.

[1941] So you were immediately.

[1942] And then we did like the.

[1943] fake romantic one where I got on my new but even then she was like, who is this for?

[1944] And I'm like, this is for the story.

[1945] Our non -romantic one was like laying in bed being like, Anna?

[1946] She's like, yeah.

[1947] I'm like, okay.

[1948] And then watch TV.

[1949] He was in a stern.

[1950] Yeah.

[1951] Oh my God.

[1952] You did that Ronnie, the limo driver's proposal to his fiance.

[1953] Did you hear that?

[1954] I haven't heard that.

[1955] Oh my God.

[1956] He does it over the phone, Monica.

[1957] He is before he went to work, he hid the ring in like a box in the closet.

[1958] And he calls her from work and he's like, you go into the closet.

[1959] Move the box.

[1960] Now open it.

[1961] up open the one no nothing open the other box she opens the bike oh my god there's a ring in there yeah there's a ring in there you want to put it on your finger yeah he's like uh so why are you you doing it or not he's the worst he's the word i love him i fucking love the show yeah it's so great um well jake i i i really adore you and um again i loved your movie that i watched today win it all and then i'm really excited to see um spider man because i love Lord of Miller.

[1962] And I like you, so there's really no reason that this shouldn't be fantastic.

[1963] Thanks, man. I really hope people check it out.

[1964] It's awesome.

[1965] Yeah.

[1966] Should we go home and see our girls now?

[1967] Yes.

[1968] Okay.

[1969] Thanks for coming, Jake.

[1970] Thanks for having me, guys.

[1971] And now my favorite part of the show, the fact check with my soulmate Monica Padman.

[1972] Flakey Jake Johnson.

[1973] Don't call him Flakey James.

[1974] No, that was one of my favorite restaurants in Phoenix, Arizona when I was a kid.

[1975] Flaky Jakes, it was basically the first fudruckers.

[1976] It had a huge bar of condiments you could put on two large bars.

[1977] It was right across the street from ASU.

[1978] When we'd visit my stepdad out there because he worked there in the winters, we ate several meals a week at Flaky Jakes.

[1979] Flaky Jakey's.

[1980] Yeah, Flaky Jakey.

[1981] So that's positive.

[1982] What was their signature?

[1983] Burgers.

[1984] Burgers.

[1985] Burgers.

[1986] They probably made a chicken sandwich.

[1987] It was Fuddruckers.

[1988] I want a chicken sandwich right now.

[1989] Me too.

[1990] Rectangle one or Houston's?

[1991] I want rectangle I want Houston's.

[1992] I want Chick -fil -Lah.

[1993] but I'm not going to have it.

[1994] Okay, right.

[1995] Although, some people are saying that I can have it again.

[1996] No, I think I heard recently that the CEO doubled downed on his anti -gainess.

[1997] Kristen said that, but since then I've heard that...

[1998] He's retracted.

[1999] Yeah.

[2000] There's a new Chick -fil -A in Burbank.

[2001] And it is getting a lot of attention, lots of long lines.

[2002] Uh -huh.

[2003] Like, all these people are allowed, but not me. Yeah, you should do some research.

[2004] Because if they won't hire gay people, you just can't eat there.

[2005] I don't know.

[2006] I can't eat there if they do that.

[2007] So maybe the listeners can tell me, because I don't have time to do research, really.

[2008] Your research is relegated to this show.

[2009] All right, Jake.

[2010] Flaky Jake Johnson.

[2011] You know what?

[2012] I'll be honest.

[2013] There are no facts in this.

[2014] Oh, my God.

[2015] That's exciting.

[2016] Our first no fact episode.

[2017] At all.

[2018] Oh, except so you, we talked at some point.

[2019] Oh, Jake talks about Spider -Man and the character.

[2020] being half Puerto Rican, half black.

[2021] And you said, oh, there's a name for that.

[2022] Yeah.

[2023] And on Urban Dictionary, it's called Afroricon.

[2024] Afro recon.

[2025] Afro recon.

[2026] That's not the one I was thinking of.

[2027] I knew it probably wasn't the one you were thinking of, but that's what I found.

[2028] Yeah.

[2029] Okay, Afro recon.

[2030] By the way, that movie Spiderverse was fantastic.

[2031] Yeah.

[2032] And we were supposed to get this out earlier to help promote it.

[2033] So check it out on VOD.

[2034] Flaky.

[2035] I'm sorry.

[2036] No, it's, what would be Afro -Reican?

[2037] Afro -Reican?

[2038] Was that it?

[2039] Is that what you just said?

[2040] Yeah, that was pronounced.

[2041] Oh, how did you pronounce it?

[2042] Recon.

[2043] Oh, Afroican, I like, that sounds.

[2044] That's not what I was thinking of, but it makes a little more sense, though.

[2045] Okay.

[2046] Oh, the story you told about you being a little boy in the sailor outfit and you couldn't go to Easter.

[2047] Yeah.

[2048] That's a sad story.

[2049] Well, I don't know if I told this part of it when.

[2050] we were interviewing jakey um my father did tell me uh later that he was because my mom uh went we got portraits in those matching sailor outfits from kmartz and um he found them in the garage years later and he had a good two -hour cry about it he did that's sad oh what happened something that's getting funky he was like a DJ's a real -time mixing i had to turn it down for just he gets crazy he's like a wearer of.

[2051] We are dealing with some kind of freaky moon right now.

[2052] Mercury?

[2053] No, moon.

[2054] I think my mom was, she was explaining to the girls.

[2055] It was like super moon or ghost moon.

[2056] Oh.

[2057] Something like that.

[2058] There's something about mercury rising.

[2059] I don't think it's, I think it's bad.

[2060] I think it makes people.

[2061] Oh, it sounds sexy.

[2062] It does, but I think it makes people emotional, no, angry.

[2063] Mercurial.

[2064] Hmm, mercurial rising.

[2065] Yeah, mercurial rising.

[2066] Anywho, so I'm sorry about that.

[2067] Oh, that's okay.

[2068] It made me sad to hear that story.

[2069] Well, it's okay.

[2070] I don't know that I remember being disappointed.

[2071] I think it was more of my mom's end.

[2072] Yeah, that'd be hard for a mom.

[2073] Yeah.

[2074] She probably had plans to go out, and she couldn't go out.

[2075] So you had to stay there in your chicken pox.

[2076] That too could be it.

[2077] No, but if I sense that the girls wanted to see Kristen really bad and then Kristen didn't, because of her boyfriend's kids, I would probably have a hard time getting over that.

[2078] You'd be pissed.

[2079] Yeah.

[2080] Someone would pay the bill.

[2081] Do you have any chicken pox scars?

[2082] Not that I'm aware of.

[2083] Really?

[2084] Maybe on my lower butt cheeks or some area that I can't see very well or my low back.

[2085] There's a whole bunch of my, there's half of my body I can't see.

[2086] Isn't that crazy?

[2087] Like, I don't even know what that looks like.

[2088] Me either.

[2089] I am I have I don't want to think too much yeah I have I don't have the best you know what suspicions about how it all looks in back I think sometimes occasionally in the gymnasium when I'm exercising in tank top I'll catch a little bit of my back upper back yeah but I don't know what's going on in my but hole my butt cheeks my upper thighs my inner lower thighs no clue it's a mystery it is a mystery that only Kristen really knows I guess yeah Oh, I have a chicken pox scar under my eye, see?

[2090] You do?

[2091] Yeah.

[2092] That's what that is?

[2093] That's a chick pox.

[2094] Chick pox scar?

[2095] Yeah.

[2096] Did you have them bad?

[2097] I think I did have them bad, but I don't really remember.

[2098] I was like five or six, but.

[2099] Isn't it amazing there's a vaccine now and that kids don't get chicken pox?

[2100] How great is that?

[2101] I know.

[2102] It's great, and I'm sad for them.

[2103] It's not a character, Bill.

[2104] It's just miserable for no, there's no upside of it.

[2105] I know, but it's, like, cool.

[2106] It's like, when did you get chicken?

[2107] Like, it's just a ride of passage, like your period, you know?

[2108] Oh, Mike's got chicken pox.

[2109] Ooh, so many pox.

[2110] I heard he's got terrible chicken pox.

[2111] Oh.

[2112] Yeah, everywhere.

[2113] The worst guy.

[2114] Had to tell.

[2115] He took an oatmeal bath last night, I heard.

[2116] I don't know if it's true.

[2117] I'd love to bathe them in that oatmeal bath.

[2118] Yeah, so I have one under my eye.

[2119] And everyone, when I get my makeup done, They always think it's mascara, and they're always trying to rub it off.

[2120] Is it black?

[2121] No, but it's a little, it's just a little darker than my skin, which is black.

[2122] Well, hold on now.

[2123] So I guess it is black.

[2124] You have the most enviable skin tone of anyone on planet Earth.

[2125] Let's just start there.

[2126] Thank you.

[2127] I really want steak.

[2128] You do from all time?

[2129] Yeah, I do.

[2130] I want that steak, too.

[2131] Anyway, sometimes I want things, and I have to say.

[2132] Yeah, you got to say it out lie.

[2133] You got to put it into the universe, the secret.

[2134] I know.

[2135] I believe in the secret.

[2136] You do.

[2137] You had a vision board.

[2138] Yeah, I thought about that today.

[2139] I thought about that vision board today.

[2140] You did.

[2141] I'm not going to a callback audition.

[2142] Mike, Mike Scher, and Morgan.

[2143] Number one.

[2144] We're there.

[2145] And I left and I was really thinking about that vision board and what was on there.

[2146] And, you know, Parks is on there and the office.

[2147] this and it's crazy.

[2148] Yeah.

[2149] It's really crazy.

[2150] It's so wonderful.

[2151] Yeah.

[2152] That's very full circle.

[2153] But Mike and Morgan sat in the back and the corners.

[2154] They, you know, when I came in, they're like, hey.

[2155] And, you know, we talked for a second, but they were like, we were told to sit back here.

[2156] And I didn't really think about that.

[2157] But then 10 minutes ago I was thinking about it.

[2158] And I was like, I wonder if my mom told them to sit back there.

[2159] And mom.

[2160] So embarrassing.

[2161] Moms are so embarrassing.

[2162] They are so embarrassing.

[2163] I know they're trying to help their kids, but like...

[2164] I 100 % believe that's what happened.

[2165] I do too.

[2166] I was like, who told them that?

[2167] Someone from, like, oh, she knows you, so sit back there.

[2168] No one knows that.

[2169] Except my mom.

[2170] Except for your mother.

[2171] Yeah.

[2172] Anywho.

[2173] Your cocazoid mother.

[2174] Yeah.

[2175] My real mom would never do that.

[2176] She wouldn't?

[2177] No. She would never, like, make a call and be like, for her emotional stability, can you please sit in the back?

[2178] She wouldn't meddle.

[2179] She wouldn't meddle and she wouldn't think about that.

[2180] Like, she would just be like, okay, you're nervous and that's, you're just going to be nervous.

[2181] Yeah, that's fine.

[2182] I think that's the way.

[2183] Like, I was maybe going to take one of those beta blockers.

[2184] Oh, uh -huh.

[2185] And for.

[2186] Too risky, though.

[2187] A couple things.

[2188] You got to experiment with it first.

[2189] It was too high pressure situation.

[2190] Plus, I was like, okay, well, I don't know what these things are going to do to me long -term.

[2191] I don't really want to put this in my body.

[2192] And then I was like, also, nerves is normal.

[2193] You know, unrelated to that, but kind of related because your mother, my mom and I were watching Bill Maher and Rahm Emanuel was on.

[2194] I saw.

[2195] You saw it.

[2196] And he was talking about his parents are immigrants.

[2197] Yes.

[2198] And those three fucking boys are number one agent in the world, one of the best politicians in the world, and the best doctor in the world.

[2199] I know.

[2200] We were just talking about him, too.

[2201] And then he appeared.

[2202] He appeared because of the vision board.

[2203] Yeah.

[2204] But my mom and I both, like almost at the exact same time, my mom goes, this is Monica.

[2205] Aw.

[2206] She's like, this is why we need immigrants because we turn all of us into lazy pieces of shit.

[2207] Like, most you're going to get is like three generations of hungry.

[2208] And then it just goes to shit.

[2209] We need a constant stream in this country of fucking hungry and tart.

[2210] Yeah, I agree.

[2211] It's really, I hadn't really thought about it in that way, which is just like, yeah, if those people don't come here with that crazy hunger, who the fuck is the best doctor in the world?

[2212] Yeah, who's going to raise the bar?

[2213] Yeah, I mean, I like that theory and that, but I, I, there are plenty of, you're so motivated and hardworking.

[2214] And your kids will be lazy shiths.

[2215] No, I won't let them.

[2216] I'll spank them.

[2217] They're going to be useless.

[2218] They're going to live off the fat of your land.

[2219] P -H -A -T, fat -natchy.

[2220] They're going to live off the, well, they literally will live off your fat -natchy for the first couple of years.

[2221] They will.

[2222] Oh my God, speaking of Rahm Emanuel, when I watched that, I meant to tell you, I think he is also one of your soulmates because he has a...

[2223] A missing finger?

[2224] Yeah.

[2225] He has like a missing...

[2226] That he owns the shit out of.

[2227] He points with that fucked up half a finger more than any of his other fingers.

[2228] And I'm like, that's what you do.

[2229] Yeah.

[2230] I was going to make a joke and text it to you that you are, you guys are soulmates because his finger looks like your toe.

[2231] Oh, yes.

[2232] My new toe.

[2233] Your new toe.

[2234] They match.

[2235] My toe transplant.

[2236] But also, the reason his finger is like this is.

[2237] because he cut it really badly working at Arby's.

[2238] No. Yes.

[2239] Oh, my gosh.

[2240] And then it got infected because he went into some water with it or something.

[2241] And remember when Jason Leno was here and I said, when he told us about Arbys and why it was successful, they had never been able to cut the roast beef so thin.

[2242] Right.

[2243] And I said, I used to stare at that fucking slicer with just abject horror when Papa Bob and I were ordering those beef and cheddar extra cheddar.

[2244] And now I realize I was right to be.

[2245] fearful.

[2246] You were right.

[2247] It took out Roms' finger.

[2248] It did.

[2249] But man, it's, it's, he must have cut some portion off and then they decided to go to the next knuckle.

[2250] No, what happened is he got a bad cut from it.

[2251] He didn't get a cut off.

[2252] He got like a really bad cut and then it got infected later.

[2253] Beef infection.

[2254] It got a beef infection.

[2255] Uh -huh.

[2256] It got mad cow.

[2257] Oh, that makes sense.

[2258] Oprah was right.

[2259] So anyway, so then he was in a pool.

[2260] He was, he was, I don't know, at the beach.

[2261] or something he was swimming and then it got infected and then they had to amputate oh okay okay so they had to go much deeper to get out that uh that necrotic flesh the the poison the poison yeah yeah yeah oh boy i love how much he owns it though he is not he puts that he'll i bet if he ever was mad enough to poke you in the chest he'd use that oh i hope and i bet he gets mad enough makes me think of my teacher mrs house who i've talked on here before about it the one teacher i almost got transferred out of her class.

[2262] She had a nub, and she always pointed at the chalkboard with her nub, and she'd bang on the chalkboard with the nudge.

[2263] It was so aggressive.

[2264] And did you guys make fun of her?

[2265] Nope.

[2266] I mean, not for those reasons.

[2267] Not for the nub?

[2268] She was probably a lot of students' favorite teacher.

[2269] I can't say objectively she was mean, but boy, she and I were oil and water.

[2270] I can say that with confidence.

[2271] I'm just, I just.

[2272] Now you're rooting for her because she has a fucking half finger.

[2273] I'm rooting for her.

[2274] That doesn't get you out of everything.

[2275] Just because someone's got to happen.

[2276] That's not why.

[2277] I just generally, I side with, like, I think you are probably a brat.

[2278] Oh, well, what a great opinion you have of me. Well, as a kid, I think kids are.

[2279] Haven't you spoken to my mother?

[2280] I was the sweetest boy.

[2281] I think you made fun of her finger.

[2282] I don't think I did.

[2283] I don't think so.

[2284] Okay.

[2285] That's too pedestrian for me. A good comedian can't go with the obvious.

[2286] But at that age, I was honing my shit.

[2287] You're still figuring out your comedy.

[2288] Well, maybe you're right.

[2289] She actually pushed it to the finger area, and then you brought it back.

[2290] I hadn't found my voice.

[2291] That's right.

[2292] Do you think there's anyone that's been with Rahm Emanuel or Mrs. House and felt kinky about them touching their privates with that?

[2293] This is going to sound horrible, but I think probably a girl would be more excited about that than a guy.

[2294] Yeah.

[2295] Like what's the girl going to do with her nub to the guy that's so exciting?

[2296] Massage of Aeronium.

[2297] I know.

[2298] Wait, that's just going to feel like another finger.

[2299] As would the clitoral stimulation with a nub, probably.

[2300] No, man. But just mentally knowing that there's something real kinky and new going on down there.

[2301] It probably is a little different feeling.

[2302] Yeah, not as pointy.

[2303] Anyways, it's food for thought, you know.

[2304] Okay.

[2305] So, oh, okay, I just have a question for you.

[2306] I'm just curious.

[2307] When you tell people you're in the ground, you were in the groundlings and they don't know, like he did.

[2308] He was like, oh, I didn't know you.

[2309] Do you feel tried to tell them, or do you feel bummed that they don't know?

[2310] Or both?

[2311] Yeah, both because I'm, my first stops in security.

[2312] So if this person surprised I was in the groundings, and I think, oh, they don't think I'm really a comedian, that I was just an actor.

[2313] And then I ended up in some funny things.

[2314] But I, yeah, I want them to know, no, for five years I worked tirelessly at comedy.

[2315] Yeah.

[2316] But they're probably not thinking I wasn't a real comedian because I hadn't been a ground lane or a second city or UCB.

[2317] No, they're not thinking.

[2318] Right.

[2319] But yeah, sure.

[2320] And then you get excited to tell them that you.

[2321] That I'm the real deal.

[2322] That you're the real deal.

[2323] The real deal, holy field.

[2324] So, so silly, right?

[2325] Mm -hmm.

[2326] There are funnier people.

[2327] Mm -hmm.

[2328] There are people, although a good percentage of the funniest people ever to live.

[2329] live were groundlings.

[2330] I mean, Will Ferrell is as funny as human.

[2331] Vince Vaughn isn't.

[2332] He's none of the schools.

[2333] You're right.

[2334] You're right.

[2335] When you're right, you're right.

[2336] So I'm right.

[2337] Okay, well, you said Octo Mom is a terrible person.

[2338] Do you believe that?

[2339] Yeah, I do.

[2340] You do.

[2341] I do.

[2342] I think she had kids to get attention, which is a foul reason.

[2343] Even though we don't know her.

[2344] And maybe that's a big.

[2345] I've heard her interviewed several times.

[2346] She used to be on Stern a lot.

[2347] And I would say she's not a good person, yeah.

[2348] I'll stand by that claim.

[2349] I don't talk shit too frequently on here about anybody, but I would say, yeah, Octa Mom's not a great.

[2350] Because of that.

[2351] I wouldn't want my children to turn out like an octa mom.

[2352] How about that?

[2353] Or like this asshole, like some of these people, right, this guy, he faked that his kid had blown away in a bouncy house.

[2354] Do you know this?

[2355] No. The whole thing was a whole prank so that they could get a reality show.

[2356] So someone that does that, I think, is a piece of shit.

[2357] I know.

[2358] But it's so much more complicated than that, right?

[2359] Because we don't know them.

[2360] I just, I just am trying to not do that based on not knowing a person at all.

[2361] I agree.

[2362] I think that's a good thing to aspire to.

[2363] And I'm sure that if I met this turkey who set this thing up, there'd be something sad about his background that would lead him to that.

[2364] But when you cross the bridge that you're using a child to perpetuate your own weird fame desire, I don't, I'm going to weigh in on that and say, That's a deal breaker for me. I know.

[2365] I agree.

[2366] But we also don't know the dynamics of that family.

[2367] Like, what if that kid is obsessed with reality shows?

[2368] And all he can talk about is, like, wanting to be that and wanting to be on it.

[2369] And then the dad is crying.

[2370] All the more reason to.

[2371] I know, but some people aren't evolved enough to differentiate.

[2372] Like, that's actually bad.

[2373] Or that means this.

[2374] Or that could lead to this.

[2375] They're just saying, like, this person likes that.

[2376] Sure.

[2377] Let's try.

[2378] Yeah.

[2379] I mean, I don't know.

[2380] I made all this up.

[2381] but I'm just saying it could be.

[2382] It could be.

[2383] So, yeah.

[2384] That's what Kristen would assume.

[2385] Yeah.

[2386] Now apparently you.

[2387] I thought we were cynics together, but.

[2388] I'm still.

[2389] I'm halfway.

[2390] Yeah.

[2391] That's kind of it, I think.

[2392] There really, there were no facts, which was a shock and a disappointment.

[2393] I'm so sorry.

[2394] I just like facts.

[2395] Yeah, I know.

[2396] No, you're like a fact file.

[2397] A fact.

[2398] Factict.

[2399] Like a pedophile.

[2400] Yeah.

[2401] I was trying to do fact and addict.

[2402] Oh, a fact dick?

[2403] That's what I said.

[2404] It didn't work.

[2405] All right.

[2406] Well, I love you and you look so cute in your suit today.

[2407] Thanks.

[2408] Monica represented the armchair expert team today at the podcast Upfronts because I was shooting and you made a speech in a suit.

[2409] I did.

[2410] And I'm really proud of you.

[2411] In a clueless.

[2412] suit.

[2413] It looks like I walked straight off the set of Clueless.

[2414] Yeah, it is kind of whatever her name was.

[2415] Share.

[2416] Share.

[2417] I always wanted to be share.

[2418] Well, guess what?

[2419] You are Cher.

[2420] Congratulations.

[2421] Yay.

[2422] All right.

[2423] Love you.

[2424] Love you.

[2425] Follow Armchair Expert on the Wondry app, Amazon music, or wherever you get your podcast.

[2426] You can listen to every episode of Armchair Expert early and ad free right now by joining Wondry Plus in the Wondry app or on Apple Podcasts.

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