43 - In Arrears

[0] This is exactly right.

[1] Hey, this is exciting.

[2] An all -new season of only murders in the building is coming to Hulu on August 27th.

[3] Steve Martin, Martin Short, and Selena Gomez are back as your favorite podcaster, detectives.

[4] But there's a mystery hanging over everyone.

[5] Who killed Saz?

[6] And were they really after Charles?

[7] Why would someone want to kill Charles?

[8] This season, murder hits close to home.

[9] With a threat against one of their own, the stakes are higher than ever.

[10] Plus, the gang is going to Hollywood to turn their podcast into a major movie.

[11] Amid the glitz and glamour of Los Angeles, more mysteries and twists arise.

[12] Who knows what will happen once the cameras start to roll?

[13] Get ready for the stariest season yet with Merrill Streep, Zach Alfenakis, Eugene Levy, Eva Longoria, Melissa McCarthy, DeVine, Joy Randolph, Molly Shannon, and more.

[14] Only Martyrs in the Building, premieres August 27th, streaming only on Hulu.

[15] Bye.

[16] Let's start a punk band.

[17] Okay.

[18] Hey.

[19] What should the name of it be?

[20] Hard kill.

[21] Okay.

[22] All right.

[23] All right.

[24] Welcome to my favorite murder.

[25] My name's Karen Kilgariff.

[26] That's Georgia Hard Star.

[27] Hi.

[28] We're here to talk about true crime, murders, and how it feels to be alive in late 2016.

[29] Georgia, what are your thoughts?

[30] Oh.

[31] Let's fucking get into...

[32] No, I don't know.

[33] Do you really want to ask me that question, dude?

[34] Let's go to the phones.

[35] When you say late 2016, it makes me think that someday this will be like a time capsule.

[36] Someone, and...

[37] Hold on.

[38] I feel like I'm talking with my mouth.

[39] You know that like...

[40] You are talking with your mouth.

[41] The whole thing.

[42] You know, I just ate a bite of something and I have that like weird...

[43] Chewed up food.

[44] Yeah.

[45] That weird chewed up food thing.

[46] That you get in your mouth when you eat things?

[47] Yeah.

[48] I get that sometimes.

[49] It's dinner.

[50] Breakfast sometimes.

[51] Sometimes.

[52] Lunch.

[53] I don't know.

[54] Snacks.

[55] Time capsule.

[56] Hello to 2050.

[57] I mean, seriously, everything that you do that gets put on the internet is permanent.

[58] Unless the internet goes down and everything.

[59] I don't believe that.

[60] That's very true.

[61] Unless the grid goes down and then all of society ends.

[62] That's what I really think is I actually don't feel that this is going to be a time capsule because it's all going to go down.

[63] There's a really great book.

[64] book that I won't remember.

[65] Is it called it's all going to go down?

[66] Yeah, but I haven't written it yet.

[67] And it's not based on anything scientific or it's not like your computer person or anything.

[68] It's just kind of like.

[69] They're going to do a count in 2050 and the word dude is going to appear 4 ,000 times in my book.

[70] Dude.

[71] Dude.

[72] So then?

[73] I texted Georgia.

[74] Sorry, I went away for a second because I had to remember this but I don't know what you're going to say and I'm scared I texted Georgia no it was just about something but I in the text I called you dude it was like something congratulatory and I was like way to go dude and you wrote back that's so dude I know I saw that later I did did you do it on purpose no okay I couldn't figure out if you were being it felt like you were like thanks like it was like you going yeah thanks a lot no what I meant to write actually was thanks dude but instead I wrote that's dude that's so dude and I didn't I didn't notice it till like hours later so I was like well I'm not gonna bother her it was like night time on a Saturday I'm not gonna bother her now so that's a dude like she's gotta know what I mean a little bit I looked at it I was just like she might be telling me to fuck off right now although there's really no reason to anyway I would never if I'm telling you to fuck off it's because I miss wrote something oh because like you type did it, because you were trying to write.

[75] Thanks, dude.

[76] And if I put an exclamation mark, it's friendly.

[77] Oh, okay.

[78] If I put a period, it's not so friendly.

[79] If there's no punctuation, you're driving.

[80] Yeah.

[81] You to hell.

[82] Are we, do we have some corners?

[83] Oh, I have a correction corner.

[84] Okay.

[85] Which I kind of love because it's, I think it's hilarious.

[86] But last week, in a very, in a very special episode.

[87] Yeah.

[88] In the breakdown episode?

[89] And a breakdown when everything went wrong, when the grid started to sizzle.

[90] Yeah.

[91] And in the beginning.

[92] And now it's fully a flame.

[93] Yeah.

[94] And in 2050, when it's completely down, this won't matter.

[95] But I said that the moment I saw, what I meant was the moment on TV on Tuesday night, when I saw Rachel Maddow's face fall, I was like, oh, we're fucked.

[96] Yes.

[97] But instead I said, Anne Maddox, which is a girlfriend of mine.

[98] He's like super sweet.

[99] And awesome.

[100] It's someone you know in real life.

[101] Oh, totally.

[102] It's like a friend of mine who's a comedian.

[103] She's super funny.

[104] Like, she's great.

[105] But I was just like, and I saw Ann Maddo.

[106] Ann Maddo?

[107] Maddo?

[108] Maddox?

[109] And I was just like, man, when I saw Ann Maddox's face.

[110] That's really funny.

[111] Well, I haven't seen her in a while.

[112] So that's not what happened.

[113] Somebody actually tweeted to us and it was just the, with the quotes around it of you saying, when you kept saying don't marrow.

[114] Oh, that's another correction.

[115] That's, I don't know if that's correction corner as much as like stroke corner.

[116] It's, um, we should have stroke out.

[117] corner because it's it happens constantly and when you were doing it it sounded right to me every time that scares me because a I wasn't drinking you know that was your mistake I can't that was the problem I said I said become a I was meaning to say become a bone marrow donor but twice in a row I said don't marrow and I didn't I would have kept going if you hadn't said and you said don't marrow and I was like yeah I wouldn't even notice it's and those are the kind of things.

[118] I feel like such a, it makes me feel like an asshole, but I know that people listening are like, but that just happened.

[119] Like it would, it drives me crazy when I, when I listen to podcast and something happens and then your brain explodes because nobody says anything about it or feels like people don't notice.

[120] I want to be called out on my shit all the time.

[121] Okay.

[122] I want to be fucking imperfect and okay with it.

[123] Yes.

[124] Same here.

[125] Me too.

[126] Yeah.

[127] I mean, I think we're pretty good about that.

[128] About being imperfect?

[129] Well, being imperfect and, and mention.

[130] You're mentioning it.

[131] We are.

[132] I think we do it.

[133] We do it well.

[134] Well, because I trust you.

[135] I know that when you mention it to me, you're just, it's not because you're trying to, like, make me feel small.

[136] You're just like, here's what's actually happening.

[137] Good personalities.

[138] I know.

[139] That's why the other day when you told me you called me out on saying the word fucking all the time.

[140] I didn't.

[141] I know you didn't mean it like that.

[142] If I did, like.

[143] But I, I know intention.

[144] You know intention.

[145] Okay.

[146] Good.

[147] Very well.

[148] That's good.

[149] This is, we're really building a bridge of love right.

[150] We are.

[151] It feels great.

[152] I mean, we need it.

[153] Now.

[154] Now more than ever.

[155] The time is now.

[156] I mean, 2016.

[157] Now more than ever.

[158] Now more than ever.

[159] I have a, this is a very official corrections corner that I really like.

[160] And it's from Milo.

[161] I don't know if, I'm assuming Milo is a man. And it's, I love this.

[162] Okay, so it's misuse of the word psychotic.

[163] Oh, okay.

[164] Hello, Karen and Georgia.

[165] I'm a big fan of my favorite murder, but one thing that I have, noticed is a misuse slash abuse of the word psychotic this is all me because I love my mom was a psychiatric nurse right so I use a lot of the terminology that she used to throw around but yeah you knew what it meant and I don't well when you say you say things psychopath he was a you know he was a psycho whatever right yeah it's in our vernacular but I like I like hearing this me too okay so ready psychopathy sociopathy I don't know how you pronounce that one is different from psychosis.

[166] People suffering from psychosis are actually less likely to commit violent crime than the general public and are actually more likely to have violent crime committed against them.

[167] That's so interesting.

[168] While there are those who have mood disorders or display psychotic behavior that do commit violent crime, like Richard Chase, Vincent Lee, who I don't know who that is and now must know.

[169] Yes.

[170] L .I. The ways we judge them should be different than the ways we judge people who have more awareness for the crimes that they commit.

[171] That's all I wanted to say.

[172] Thank you for your awesome podcast, Milo.

[173] Thanks, Milo.

[174] Milo, first of all, I hope that this is true and that you are some kind of...

[175] Psychopath.

[176] Milo, you are such a psychopath who are standing that.

[177] No, you know, that you're qualified in some way, that you're telling us this from a place of education.

[178] I mean, look at it on Wikipedia.

[179] I'm sure it's correct.

[180] I guess we'll have to double check it.

[181] I like hearing that.

[182] Remember when, like, like...

[183] it was like 25 % of people are psychopaths.

[184] And then you're like, corrections quarter.

[185] It's only one quarter.

[186] Yes.

[187] Yeah, I get intimidated by numbers.

[188] They're scary.

[189] But I love psychological terminology.

[190] Also, there was somebody that wrote to us that, that, um, uh, was offended by something.

[191] They were offended by something.

[192] They were offended by something.

[193] But it was a thing where, uh, It was almost just like a little, it's a note to be careful of how we are judgmental when people have mental illness.

[194] I was just going to say that because we just read a hometown story where they said that someone was found out that they were bipolar and I immediately didn't want to say what they were because that's not an indication that you're going to be a murderer or that you're mentally ill, well, you're our mentally ill, but that you're, you know, dangerous or criminal.

[195] Yeah, it doesn't need the stigma.

[196] Yeah, I know people who are bipolar and they're very awesome people.

[197] I don't.

[198] I hate, unless it's something extreme and clear, I don't want to say that that person is, has this mental illness.

[199] Yeah, and I think as being conversational and reading stories and especially when we're talking about killers or serial killers, we can be, we can play it very fast and loose with judgments about them because we feel like, well, they're clearly.

[200] a villain.

[201] Right.

[202] But the point that this person was making was a little bit more like, you know, just not everybody that has a mental disorder is a killer and that makes people, if you hear the thing that you have, but it's as if like that's everybody.

[203] We never want to make anybody feel like that.

[204] No. Quite the opposite.

[205] Especially with mental, with mental illness and disorders, which were very big on like, fucking everyone has them and some people treat them and some don't and you shouldn't be scared to treat them because you found out that a fucking serial killer has it.

[206] I don't want to...

[207] Yeah, or like, it's just on this podcast, we're not judging you.

[208] No. And that's not what we are trying to do, and we'll try to be careful about it.

[209] Yeah, we're judging murderers.

[210] Yeah, we get to pick and choose so we judge and we'll adjust it weekly based on how much feedback we get on Twitter.

[211] Just always know we're good people.

[212] We're the best people.

[213] Yeah, always give us the benefit of the doubt, even if we're being insanely effective.

[214] You're probably wrong, not us.

[215] I just want to clear that out.

[216] Such an official corrections corner this week.

[217] So good.

[218] And Maddox?

[219] Shout out.

[220] Ann Maddox.

[221] You're doing such a great job helping us through our political times.

[222] Hold on.

[223] Oh, shirt.

[224] There's new shirts up.

[225] Oh, yeah.

[226] I love that new shirt.

[227] Oh, yeah.

[228] Fuck politeness.

[229] Fuck politeness.

[230] And then it says murderino underneath it?

[231] This is My Favorite Murder Underneath it.

[232] Oh, my favorite murder.

[233] It just looks like, kind of looks like the Murderino design shirt.

[234] It's cool.

[235] So My Favorite Murder Shirts .com.

[236] Today, in a fit of fucking rage and anarchy, I posted Fuck Politeness shirt that Kat Solan.

[237] You know what's so funny is last week on Tuesday, I was going to, I had like made it and I was going to post the new Fuck Politeness shirt.

[238] And she had given me two designs.

[239] And so I was like, you know what?

[240] I'm going to save it for tomorrow for Wednesday after the election.

[241] And I'm going to say to everyone, like, now comes the real vote, which style do you like better?

[242] Because I thought, you know.

[243] Yeah.

[244] You thought you'd have some fun with it.

[245] Yeah.

[246] Like now that that's out of the way and everything is great.

[247] and fine, here's the real important election.

[248] What do you elect for my, so it hasn't happened, and then today I got really angry, and I've been listening to Dead Kennedys, and so I posted, I just posted it, I picked one.

[249] It's very cool.

[250] Thank you.

[251] And we're going to give a percentage, we don't still bringing out donations, but ACLU is going to get a big fucking fat check from us based on these shirts.

[252] So buy one.

[253] So fuck politeness, and buy one, please.

[254] There's toots and tank tops and mugs and mugs too.

[255] Oh, cool.

[256] We, um, we were talking about this earlier.

[257] Fuck politeness, but also in these very difficult times, uh, be careful of the people around you, be sensitive and try to connect on a human level in a way that you normally don't, maybe.

[258] I think it's super important that people around you understand that you, uh, care about them.

[259] Yeah.

[260] And if you are the kind of person who doesn't care about people, do your thing.

[261] But I, just want to underline that fuck politeness in our world means don't sacrifice yourself on the altar of politeness because that could be dangerous for you but it also it does not mean fuck the people around you in general uh especially now especially now now is the time to be uh even more kind of caring and connected um just don't like let people follow you to your car and shit it's a we're talking safety versus you know when you're talking to the person person at Starbucks be nicer than you normally would be because everyone's freaked out.

[262] But if you're being intimidated and you're scared of something, you know, it's a kind of a trust -your -gut type of saying.

[263] Yeah, you guys know what we're talking about, but I just felt like I should underline it.

[264] There's the Mr. Rogers quote of, you know, how his mom always said, look for the helpers in any bad situation, look for the helpers.

[265] Well, how about let's be helpers?

[266] Be helpers, exactly right.

[267] So right now, I think the most important thing we can do is freak the fuck out.

[268] hide under oh no no no no take all your money on it no sorry no uh to switzerland now speaking of being helpers this is my favorite thing that's happened to me in a while okay um so i'm no brag in the writers guild of america look wait i've been waiting to lord this over you for a while this whole time i've been talking to a writers guild number so in the writers guilds guild they have this thing where...

[269] No, I do think it's really cool, though, by the way.

[270] I just want to say that.

[271] That I'm in the writer's guild.

[272] Yeah.

[273] I mean, in the writer's guild is a fucking cool thing.

[274] Oh, thanks.

[275] Yeah.

[276] No, I'm glad I mentioned it.

[277] No, but they do this thing where normally in every other, like, entertainment union, they send you a thing that says, oh, you know, your yearly dues are 160 or whatever.

[278] But because it's writers and most of us are freelance, they base your dues on, based on how much money you made that year, which is, or per quarter, which is based on, it's so impossible.

[279] second I start thinking about it, I shut down and, like, go and sit in front of the TV, like, in protest.

[280] You big old, I can't.

[281] I can't.

[282] It's like math.

[283] It's all the things I hate.

[284] I get overwhelmed.

[285] Yes.

[286] So I have been in arrears and my dues at the WGA.

[287] I've been in what?

[288] In arrears.

[289] Yeah, you texted me that today and I don't know what that means.

[290] Oh, it just means you haven't paid your dues.

[291] That's a cool word.

[292] And you can't, if you do it long enough, they suspend your membership and then you can't work.

[293] So that's how I can't I my sparklets membership is I'm overdue on that that's why you saw all those empty bottles when you walked up my staircase.

[294] Be very careful.

[295] You don't want to get into arrears with the sparklets guy.

[296] I'm in arrears with sparklets.

[297] He will kick you in the arrears.

[298] So that's such a dad joke.

[299] That was amazing.

[300] I love dad jokes.

[301] So I have a lot of these things in my life right now.

[302] But one of them is this the dues that I don't know how to figure out how much.

[303] I need to send.

[304] And I won't take the time like everybody else does to sit down and do it because I think I'm better than other people on special.

[305] Aren't you?

[306] A little bit.

[307] No, so it's a thing that's hanging over my head.

[308] I get a letter today and I'm like, you have to open this, you have to face this.

[309] So I read the letter and the letter tells me exactly how much I am.

[310] And I'm like, oh, oh, this is the letter.

[311] This is what I need.

[312] This is exactly it.

[313] And I read the rest of the letter and it's like, please send it in in a timely fashion.

[314] It's just a, it looks like a form letter except for it has my amount in it.

[315] And the sign off is stay sexy, don't get murdered.

[316] Fuck.

[317] So my friend at the WGA, who works in the dues department and who sends out these letters all the time.

[318] Your new bestie.

[319] My new bestie helped me in a way that she will never know how much it helped me. What if she's actually just been using that sign off for decades?

[320] And she's going to.

[321] to sue us and this first time it actually hit someone who was who wasn't like what the fuck finally someone could appreciate it yeah yeah it was I you'll never know how much that helped me it's such a little wink to you it's a it's such a compliment I know but then also it's like a person was like I'll take care of that this shit my podcast man I mean she's not paying my dues no let's be but that's the real favor she should I mean you're well Thousands and thousands of this podcast.

[322] And I think after last week's episode that I feel really good about the post -election episode.

[323] And all of our friends.

[324] And all of our friends who have been like, I needed that.

[325] And I think we did what we were supposed to do, which was in like a fucking overly crazy political podcast.

[326] But I like, here's the general mood we're in and here's what we can do.

[327] which was awesome it just made me flash on though our reviews for the sugar -free gummy bears and then for the bananas leaser it was amazing now people are posting other reviews and i read the one uh i don't have the name but it's for the vitamin d milk no i haven't seen it and it is it's called like something farms vitamin d milk and they've they've posted it on the facebook page but it's you can find it it's amazon reviews it's the funniest fucking thing.

[328] It's like a jug of milk, right?

[329] It's a jug of milk.

[330] But people are writing it like, have you guys poured this over dry cereal?

[331] It's awesome.

[332] I mean, you have to read it.

[333] Some of them are really short.

[334] One lady wrote this big, long story.

[335] It's the funniest thing.

[336] I feel like, I feel like what happened last week was what was supposed to happen.

[337] For sure.

[338] I'm really happy with it.

[339] And people have been so fucking kind and cool.

[340] I know, not on your Twitter probably or our Twitter.

[341] Well, Twitter's different.

[342] We know.

[343] It's a big garbage can.

[344] of human waste But on Instagram And everywhere else I mean That's the thing about this fucking podcast is like It makes me want to cry I might cry Go ahead This is me crying You're going to do a dry cry That's basically what I do Because I'm dead inside But if I warrant I'd be alive From murderinos Oh and also over the weekend I went to Vince's We went to this like charity events and they had these like free um bracelets where you can you you pick a word and they stamp it into this metal and it's like your word of it they said to me like what's your word of intention that every day you want to look at you know like breathe or like you know it's like one of those like dream i intend to breathe today yeah like no i will you know those like rocks that you get it like fucking bed bath and beyond that say like dream love build be happy whatever the fuck It sounded just now It just sounded a little bit Like you said dream blood Well that's what I got with it No I was like Okay can I get SSDGM So I have one of these that says Stay Sacks who don't get murdered initial Right and I want to give it to someone At the Chicago Podcast Festival right I need to give it to someone Yeah You mean pick someone You could throw it You could slip into their pocket And that you never see That's fun a fun way, right?

[345] I just want to, and I know it's such a fucking trivial stupid thing, but I just think it's fucking hilarious that she was like, okay, and like wrote it down and like, didn't know what it was.

[346] Well, and it kind of seems like it's shorthand for some kind of sadomasochistic sexual situation, doesn't it?

[347] SSB -D -S -S -B -D -L.

[348] I have this, I got my, this is, we can cut this because this is boring, but I'm still going to say it.

[349] I had my, um, goodbye, Skippers.

[350] Goodbye.

[351] my DNA tested on 23 and me, which is like this crazy thing that you get your DNA test.

[352] It tells you where you're from, what percentage.

[353] And it also tells you what DNA abnormalities you have.

[354] And the one I have, the initials basically look like, motherfucker.

[355] Really?

[356] It's M -T -H -F -R or some shit.

[357] And it just looks like, motherfucker.

[358] And it just means you're going to die in a year?

[359] It really basically means...

[360] It's that abnormality.

[361] You're really fucked.

[362] Like, you can't...

[363] Motherfunk.

[364] the fucker it's totally fucked that's hilarious you should have had that on a bracelet it's me the one with M -T -H -F -K -R It's like when you what's the like do not resuscitate bracelet yeah motherfucker do not resuscitate me just don't just leave it it just says I'm good I'm my do not resuscitate you know what if I'm down here leave me here my donor sticker on my license just says just take it I don't even care of I'm unconscious or not you know what You can have it.

[365] Someone else needs it more than I do.

[366] I don't need this liver.

[367] Like, I really just sit around all day.

[368] So just fucking take it.

[369] Give it to someone.

[370] Just take it.

[371] Just give it to someone with a degree in something important.

[372] Someone who's really trying.

[373] Should we talk about what the podcast is about?

[374] Like, should we talk about the thing that the podcast is for?

[375] Like the meat of the podcast, what I like to call?

[376] What the past half hour just didn't talk about?

[377] I mean, look, here's a thing.

[378] We're going to get it so that we no longer talk about murders on this podcast.

[379] Clearly, that's what's coming, is it's going to turn into an Amazon review podcast entirely.

[380] It needs to happen.

[381] Oh, my God, spin -up.

[382] Dude.

[383] Why isn't that a thing, though?

[384] It can be.

[385] Every episode, you find the best reviews.

[386] There was somebody else posted one for something about wet wipes, and I was like, I can't do this right now.

[387] Like, I can't start reading about shit this early in the morning.

[388] But I will eventually.

[389] the bick the bick for her pen later i saw one that says it doesn't do math it won't do math and she just wrote about how once you got into like complicated equations it stopped working when you're a woman and you're using it do you remember i thought of this this morning and when i was seeing all those other reviews the one of the original review ridiculous review site things was the three wolf moon shirt do you remember that yes for a really long time ago yes but that's when people should look up because it's just they gave them powers of this and that yes of those were great i you're right i totally forgot about that three wolf moon uh amazon review i believe it's amazon it's something was on and it is the a ridge that's the oj that is the legit origge hey this is exciting an all new season of only murders in the building is coming to hulu on august 27th steve martin martin short and selina gomez are back as your podcast or detectives.

[390] But there's a mystery hanging over everyone.

[391] Who killed Saz?

[392] And were they really after Charles?

[393] Why would someone want to kill Charles?

[394] This season murder hits close to home.

[395] With a threat against one of their own, the stakes are higher than ever.

[396] Plus, the gang is going to Hollywood to turn their podcast into a major movie.

[397] Amid the glitz and glamour of Los Angeles, more mysteries and twists arise.

[398] Who knows what'll happen once the cameras start to roll?

[399] Get ready for the stariest season yet with Merrill Streep, Zach Alfinacus, Eugene Levy, Eva Longoria, Melissa McCarthy, Devine, Joy Randolph, Molly Shannon, and more.

[400] Only Martyrs in the Building, premieres August 27th, streaming only on Hulu.

[401] Goodbye.

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[403] Absolutely.

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[421] Goodbye.

[422] All right, can I just do my murder?

[423] I hate it.

[424] No, go.

[425] Why do you want skippers?

[426] Keep skipping.

[427] Just don't come back.

[428] skip all the way over I really like my murder so get through this this will be great I'll just skim this I'll throw out some concepts no this was here's the long and short of it I am doing the hometown murder that William sent in that I balked on because I thought that was so unfair of me that someone I would have been so livid if I was listening to this podcast gave a shit about it heard my name they started to do it and they were just like, no, I'm not doing it.

[429] And then they were like, throwing children, nope, bye.

[430] Because I want to know.

[431] So, William, first of all, my many and thorough apologies for jerking you around.

[432] The thing is that once you get into it, it's not like anything saves it.

[433] It's not like it gets better.

[434] It doesn't have a different ending or like there's not cool facts.

[435] So wait, you were correct.

[436] I was correct, but I'm going to power through it.

[437] Good for you.

[438] Sounds like life.

[439] Right?

[440] You just got to buckle down.

[441] You're correct, but you just got to fucking...

[442] You just got to say the hideous facts.

[443] And the hideous facts are this, that basically, this, it took place on August 4th of 1978.

[444] So you set the tone.

[445] We're in Salt Lake City.

[446] It's 1978.

[447] So you got a lot of brown.

[448] You got a lot of corduroy.

[449] A lot of blonde.

[450] actually.

[451] Do you think there are a lot of sideburns or now?

[452] I think there are plenty of sideburns.

[453] I think there's blonde hair with brown sideburns, which is a thing that only happened back then.

[454] It doesn't happen anymore.

[455] Good.

[456] Remember Stephen?

[457] Stephen was there.

[458] He knows.

[459] Stephen and Elvis.

[460] We're traveling band.

[461] So there was, now, as many people know, but Salt Lake City is predominantly Mormon.

[462] I mean, the whole state is very Mormon, Salt Lake City, more so.

[463] And there was a man who, I, oh, where is this?

[464] God damn it.

[465] I did it again.

[466] You do this to yours.

[467] You don't put it in order.

[468] I know.

[469] I, it's just, I have to cut and paste just so.

[470] So it tells me the story.

[471] Oh, if I, if I read what I cut and paste initially, it would be fucking this, it would be a psychopath.

[472] I mean, reading it.

[473] Or a sociopath.

[474] or just someone who's having a bad day or any other thing that's not offensive um this man is named bruce longo and he has been excommunicated from the church of jesus christ of the latter day saints because he's too rock and roll if you're too rock and roll for the fucking church of latter day saints if your ideas are too big and bold and you get excommunicated something's going on because those are people that like they like a group they like they like their religion they want people in it big and bold is they're saying i don't know what's they're saying um yeah i think it's big and bold in big and bold and read all over big and bold in a couple tablets that's us the lDS um i can't wait to see that meme so Bruce Longo he got excommunicated and so he started his own cult essentially that's what you do when you get kicked out of a thing yes that's right you splinter off you start your own you grow a ponytail you gain 200 pounds and you fucking act like the cult leader that you are he also changed his name to Emmanuel David which is a very thoroughly religious sounding name.

[475] Yeah, it is.

[476] And I can never find a name of the cult that he started, but what it was, was everybody in the cult had the last name David.

[477] So that's, it was like, they didn't put together you know, 25 Davids or any kind of like catchy.

[478] The 25 Davids.

[479] That's our band name.

[480] There it is.

[481] That's our punk band name.

[482] Punk Brock.

[483] 25 Davids.

[484] But basically he got, it was mostly his family members and a couple friends, and they got into it.

[485] And he apparently was, like all cult leaders, he's charismatic.

[486] He's very engaging.

[487] He has a ponytail.

[488] He has a ponytail.

[489] He's kind of large.

[490] And he gives people a reason.

[491] You know, he's like a guide.

[492] How great would that be to have that, to believe in a thing?

[493] Right now, if I could meet a 300 -pound man with a ponytail that told me what was what?

[494] Goodbye.

[495] I would quit this podcast.

[496] I would fucking walk on you both I was trying so hard just to let you finish because I just want you to keep going I was like please I didn't even know what I was going to say I will not interrupt this You have to finish this sentence now Email at Karen I'm also I like a bigger man Don't worry don't worry that I'm being sarcastic right now For sure Ponytail no fucking way No gross What are you doing What are you gonna guana do Stop it.

[497] Dude.

[498] Ew.

[499] Did you say, are you an iguana?

[500] Dude.

[501] Are you an iguana dude?

[502] You know the guys who are hanging out at coffee shops in the 90s with a iguana on their shoulder?

[503] What the fuck?

[504] You're a iguana dude.

[505] Yes.

[506] Got him.

[507] They're everywhere.

[508] All right.

[509] So essentially he, they would travel all around.

[510] They were kind of nomadic and they would live in hotels.

[511] And they would stay in these hotels.

[512] And then when they would go to leave, like a couple months later, they would just skip out on the bill.

[513] Before credit cards existed, I think.

[514] Yeah.

[515] And that must have been it.

[516] Yeah, 78.

[517] I think there were credit cards.

[518] This was back when women weren't allowed to have their own credit cards.

[519] Shut your fucking face.

[520] Yeah, I swear to God.

[521] I remember when my mom had credit cards and when she'd go to a place, they had to look her name up in a fucking, like, Yellow Pages book of like Visa.

[522] Oh, there's your name.

[523] To make sure it's legit?

[524] Just to like charge it.

[525] It was so different back then.

[526] Maybe I miss remembering.

[527] are you thinking of the phone book they would look in a phone book then they'd call her and be like is this your credit card this is like two weeks ago so i'm probably wrong i'm sorry go on i'm sorry um so you know among the things that this group did um was they made a large sword for him emmanuel david they made a large sword you acted so casual among the things is that they prayed to you know the different drink off?

[528] Nope.

[529] No, they made a big sword.

[530] Got it.

[531] And he believed, he was declaring now that he was God.

[532] He thought he was God, Jesus Christ, and the Holy Spirit all in one.

[533] Hey, red flag.

[534] You can be one.

[535] Maybe two.

[536] You can't be everything.

[537] He's like a breakfast burrito.

[538] He's just like, I'm breakfast?

[539] A burrito?

[540] Throw it in there.

[541] On them everything.

[542] Hey, how about some sour cream?

[543] Yeah, definitely.

[544] So with his sword, he promised to lop off the heads of thousands.

[545] So we're not, this isn't a positive cult.

[546] This isn't like Sephora.

[547] This is bad news.

[548] He didn't give free samples.

[549] No, not at all.

[550] He didn't call you muffin when you went in there.

[551] That's a true story.

[552] It happened to me one time.

[553] Okay, so, so the police and the Mormon church were keeping an eye on Emmanuel David and his group because he would show up with his followers at Temple Square.

[554] Salt Lake City.

[555] And they wouldn't be violent.

[556] There would never be arrests.

[557] But he, you know, he was there to like tell everybody that he was the real deal.

[558] He was a presence.

[559] Yeah.

[560] And of course, he probably brought that sword.

[561] And then he, what he would do is he would separate the men in the group from their wives and children, send them off to different cities, give them some kind of a task like you, you know, you have to go off and preach in Nebraska or whatever.

[562] And, and, then he would keep all the women and children around him cult leaders love that that's their big thing is like i'm everybody's daddy um so from 75 to 76 uh he lived at the red lion in in missoula montana um while his his followers were working elsewhere working quotes air quotes um but then he had a vision he decided that um the followers he had sent away were actually are archangels and um he renamed the michael raphael and gabriel um and then he he told them that he believed the federal government was about to collapse and well was he wrong i mean he was early that's all um and he promised that he was going to save the republic and become its new leader hey so he told them to sell now this is funny because I didn't set this up because I'm reading from the middle of the page he told them to sell their karate studio wait what I forgot I skipped a paragraph and now I've misled everybody.

[563] He did the film that every co -leader does and every religious said he says sell your karate studio they always try to get you away from your karate studio I'm sorry chip chop karate studio will not be sold you've got to stand by that karate studio.

[564] Chip chop.

[565] That was the first thing that came to my hand.

[566] And you did karate hands while you said that.

[567] I did fucking chip chop.

[568] Chip and a chop.

[569] Basically, Stephen's on the ground.

[570] So essentially he was basically saying you have to dedicate your life to me. You have these other, you have real jobs.

[571] You're kind of still trying to hold it down in normal society.

[572] Break ties and give me the money.

[573] Go to work in other cities and later days, latter days.

[574] come on i'm sorry i interrupted you but that was pretty first of that later days then but then i was like latter days that's right later days later days later days i see and then you put them together do you see that and but first you held your finger up like you had a great secret to tell me because i couldn't listen anymore until i said that oh no i can't listen um no no it was good um look okay i'm this is just all a year later he gets the archangels to come back and he says that he has found the tablets that the Mormon church founder Joseph Smith claimed to have found and read that's Joseph Smith happen upon them well he says he found them so once they get back to Salt Lake he doesn't have tablets but when they all meet together he says I am the tablets now we're right now we're into the bad thing imagine the feeling in your stomach you're one of those archangels like Like you're in it.

[575] You're loving it.

[576] And then suddenly it's like, dude, you're not tablets.

[577] That's not a thing.

[578] This isn't good.

[579] You just like, you cross the line of things I can believe.

[580] Yes.

[581] But now, but once you're in, you're in and you have to kind of keep on playing along because you've already grown out your matching ponytail or whatever they had to do.

[582] I can't find any information about this G. You're just like, well, I did this thing and I thought this was correct.

[583] And so I have to keep going with it.

[584] Right.

[585] Yes, exactly.

[586] Well, and a lot of them were his family members.

[587] So they were like, we love him and he, we believe in all his promises.

[588] They said, he's not a bad guy.

[589] He's not, it's just his ponytail is bad.

[590] So, all right.

[591] Here's, the long and the short of it is, the government is investigating this guy because they keep these, he is being investigated for wire fraud and, um, other frauds, assorted frauds.

[592] It's like a seize candy box for fraud.

[593] He's dark chocolate with all.

[594] almonds with no caramel no grossing you bite into it you're like why is this happening this is the grossest fraud i could have gotten grossest where's the bardo bar what's the one you can't have of the seized candy box um i don't like that one but i also oh the nougat you don't like the white nugget with the nut with the chewing with the chewing and the eating yes i hate it no for real though it's too much chewing it's a lot of chewing nougat fuck yourself nugget i disagree i'm as new as nougots that Compatriot, I'm going to say, you go fuck yourself.

[595] Yes or no?

[596] Yes.

[597] Oh, okay.

[598] We're opposite.

[599] We should split.

[600] We are not opposite.

[601] We are made for each other.

[602] We're made for each other.

[603] Honey.

[604] Except for I can't eat her anymore.

[605] So it's one fact.

[606] So in all of the ways he's broken the law, in all of the mint paddy ways, and all of the molasses chip ways, he's done it all.

[607] And so what he does, so they've been living in, in the International Dunes Hotel in Salt Lake City for a year.

[608] This is a $90 a day hotel.

[609] They are living in a suite.

[610] It's him and his wife, Rebecca.

[611] Yes or no. When you were a kid, that would have sounded amazing, right?

[612] Living in a hotel?

[613] Yes.

[614] I get to live in a hotel?

[615] It still sounds amazing.

[616] That's my favorite.

[617] Does it?

[618] I've been in hotels too many times and I just, they make me sad.

[619] they make me so happy i do love hotel i run into the bathroom immediately because i want to see the bathroom set up oh okay i thought you meant like because you had to use it i just run in there have to pee from excitement no no i guess you're right yeah you're right well here my thing is they're usually very quiet yeah and the beds are cushy and you can just get into them and watch tv that sounds like my house excuse i know but when i do that at my house which i do a lot i always feel bad in a hotel it's like one request a room that's not by the elevators there's a travel tip good tip go on sorry no no um so they've been so they've been uh living in this big hotel um in salt lake city the whole family so um he has uh emmanuel has a wife named rachel and and they have six children um Rebecca, who's five, David, who's six, Joseph who's eight, Deborah, who's nine, Joe Shasha, Joe Shaha, Joe Shaha, who's 10.

[620] And Rachel, nah, it's J -O -S -H -A -H -A, like Joe's ha -ha.

[621] Aren't those names from a Visi Andrews book?

[622] Some book.

[623] It's a book that they're from.

[624] Kind of.

[625] It's a book that they're from.

[626] SvC.

[627] Andrews.

[628] Rachel, who's 14, is the oldest.

[629] and then Elizabeth, who is 13.

[630] So they're all living in this hotel.

[631] The government's circling.

[632] And so Emmanuel borrows his truck from one of the people, whose last name is also David.

[633] He drives up to a canyon and commits suicide by putting a hose from the exhaust pipe into the truck cab.

[634] What a fucking dick, you know?

[635] I mean, it is quite selfish.

[636] because this family that he has by all reports of the people that worked at this hotel and people that were anywhere around this family they completely depended on him they were like and they were also a loner family so they aside from the rest of the cult which was also their mostly their family they didn't talk to people they didn't interact and the people that worked in this hotel said that the children were very quiet they didn't speak unless their father said they could speak and they didn't use the pool they didn't didn't like they were not loud, they didn't giggle, and they didn't go to school.

[637] They were taught in the hotel room by the parents.

[638] So they didn't go to the Caribbean and get their groove back, I bet.

[639] No, this is, there's going to be no grooves getting, getting gotten back at by the end of this.

[640] Quite the opposite.

[641] So he kills himself because basically it's like, the jig is up and you can't just, I'm sorry, you just can't stay at hotels and then leave.

[642] Would he be having fine if he had paid the bill?

[643] No, because there was other fraud.

[644] It's just that the articles, I was on murder media for the most part on this.

[645] Yeah.

[646] And everything is pretty vague.

[647] And it sounds like it's like he, he was kind of a problem guy in Salt Lake City.

[648] But he left this trail and it was basically like here's how we can get him.

[649] Okay.

[650] So it was just unpaid bills and wire fraud.

[651] Al Capone.

[652] Get him on tax evasion.

[653] That's right.

[654] Okay.

[655] And also I think he he really was ripping these people off when they would join his cult he was like you know it's like sell your karate studio give me the money and you go to Missoula montana to spread the word so they're trying to get chop get him it's the old chip chop all right so when uh rachel finds out that her husband kills himself uh she tells the cops well we don't have any money i don't have money to pay for the funeral um they realize something's terribly wrong and three days later on the morning of august fourth um she they were staying at the suite on the 11th floor of the international adunes hotel and she walked her children out onto the patio um and either through or pushed all of her children off of the 11th floor of this hotel no so there were people standing on the street below and screaming at her.

[656] So one kid hits and they're like, oh my God.

[657] And they think, at first they think it's like an accident.

[658] And then it's six children.

[659] So it just keeps happening.

[660] And they're scream.

[661] They're all screaming at her.

[662] And I mean, I, that part.

[663] Jesus fucking Christ.

[664] This is why I didn't want to read it before.

[665] But I mean, it's that kind of all I can think of is those people who are, you know, there's pedestrians, there's, there were guys that were like maintenance guys that were fixing the road or something.

[666] who there's a truck driver PTSD fucking D Oh yeah That's so traumatic Yeah And but and She's throwing off the little kids And the older ones are doing it voluntarily So it is like a horror movie Oh my God And then at the end They all start yelling for her to jump off Like they go through so much Seeing this and witnessing it And freaking out that they get really angry they can't feel good about that too you know like they have PTSD but they also have to live with that and they and that's not who most of us think we are but I understand why at that point you're like fuck you because they're also down where the kids are hitting and they can't do anything yes they're completely powerless it's horrifying yeah and the thing was they didn't have to even yell that because that was her plan anyway and then she jumped off Jesus Christ all of her children um died except for one.

[667] And it was Elizabeth, who was 13, and she had severe brain injury, and she was in a hospital.

[668] They thought she wasn't going to live, but then she did, and she got better, you know, enough.

[669] They put her in a foster home, and then when she turned 18, she went back and lived with her uncle who was still in the cult.

[670] So the Davids were still an existing religious group.

[671] Jesus.

[672] And she lives with them now, still believes that her father is going to come back from the dead, she still believes her father is God, and believes that everything that happened was exactly what would have happened and says it's what they all wanted.

[673] Let's go break her out right now.

[674] She wants to be there.

[675] No, let's set her free.

[676] She will.

[677] No, I know.

[678] I know.

[679] I just am trying to have it.

[680] It's a solution that wants.

[681] work that's awful but you're just trying to do something and I appreciate it yeah it's it's such a horrible story so it's a terrible story it's terrible um the craziest thing is now they changed the name to the Shiloh Inn the hotel is still there you can go there when we do a live show in Utah guess where we're staying not there not fucking there people there are people that go there and stay on the 11th floor intentionally oh my God there have been reports of hearing laughter coming from the first floor pool area when no one's around but we know they weren't they'd never swam but still maybe it's the idea of they get to have fun now they're good ghosts as well as a pinball machine in the game room that spontaneously turns on and starts playing don't they do that though to show you how to play like that's right they go into like demo mode I don't believe in ghosts But it's ghost But it's actually ghosts this time But it's goes This one time This one time And yeah People just hear voices And they A lot of people think that this place is haunted What I think is pretty interesting Is Danny Elfman Has always been a frequent visitor Of this hotel Danny Elfman Mm -hmm It's he first started going in 1984.

[682] He's from Oingo Boingo, right?

[683] Yep.

[684] He was touring with Oingo Boingo, and he heard the story and stayed on the 11th floor.

[685] He always stays on the 11th floor.

[686] What?

[687] He wrote Dead Man's Party, inspired by that hotel.

[688] They have a great old movie, if you can find it, called a Forbidden Zone made by Oingo Boingo in the 80s.

[689] That's creepy and fucked up, and I wonder if maybe it's connected or inspired by.

[690] Sure.

[691] also it's believed that he was so fond of his young friends oh because he had ghost experiences when he was staying there dude so that's like he would go there intentionally i trust a fucking elfman you trust elfman i mean he wrote the simpsons theme yeah come on yeah um he would go to stay there and um he stayed there while he composed the music and lyrics for the nightmare before christmas fuck yeah that's amazing you just dropped your paper i dropped it as if to say at least there was one good thing in that story that yeah there's that so william we we owe this all to william this was his this was his hometown murder originally and it it got kicked all the way up to a full grown too bad william stopped listening and fucking went on a murder spree when he when you didn't finish he was so angry he was so mad at me he was so pissed um all right thanks william that was amazing well so originally i was gonna and i and i studied for it all day i was going to do harvey milk oh i know and i knew you'd make that noise and so i didn't do it i will do it someday and if everyone needs to know about it you should go look at it but there's a great documentary i think it's called the life in times of harvey milk offhand uh and the reason i love it so much is because it's it's tons and tons of footage of San Francisco in the 70s.

[692] Totally.

[693] So it's like I'm watching my own distant childhood memories.

[694] It's so crazy.

[695] Do you know that fucking Jones town or the People's Temple?

[696] Like passed out pamphlets for them and supported them.

[697] It's pretty sweet.

[698] In support of Harvey Milk?

[699] It's Harvey Milk and Muskoni, yeah.

[700] Yeah, because the People's Temple started as like this.

[701] Very liberal.

[702] It was liberal and it was like trying to help like oppressed low -income people like get together totally yeah so I'm not so halfway through I was like what would Karen say and I was like I'm not doing this no no no it's good I'm glad I'm not because I was looking and I was like what do I do instead and then I found one that I wanted to do for a long time and I'm really excited because I found some more information about it that I'm excited about all right Karen yes let's go back to Chicago.

[703] Okay.

[704] Which we're going to next week.

[705] Yay.

[706] In 1982 Metropolitan area, which is such an 80s term, isn't it?

[707] I don't know why.

[708] Metropolitan makes me big a The buildings are all staggered.

[709] The tall, short, tall short, tall short.

[710] And it's like, it expands upon it, whatever the fuck.

[711] This is the time before tamper -proof seals and pills were sold with just a cotton ball tucked underneath the lid.

[712] So you wouldn't bought aspirin or whatever the fuck, and you just opened it and maybe had been open before and maybe it hadn't.

[713] There was no child proofing on it as you opened it and there was no silver foil.

[714] None.

[715] You could open it and then do whatever you wanted and close it back up.

[716] If you were a baby, if you were old.

[717] Babies could open it.

[718] Yeah.

[719] This is this is 82 so it's before there were like a child one of the things where they can't open the drawers and stuff.

[720] You have to child proof your home when you're Baby, yeah.

[721] This is before that, when the 80s were like, just eat it all.

[722] This was when they used to sell baby knives.

[723] Remember that?

[724] Or there was just like, you could get your baby a really cute knife that they could just hold.

[725] Yes, I remember that.

[726] I still have mine.

[727] Do you?

[728] With your initials on it.

[729] And two ducks.

[730] Oh, oh my God.

[731] That is the cutest baby knives.

[732] I have to say my mom saved it one of my diaper pins.

[733] Oh, yeah, you had, you had safety pins.

[734] Safety pins on diapers, cloth diapers and safety pins.

[735] Gross and dangerous.

[736] The safety pin itself was humongous and so sharp.

[737] And cute.

[738] So the baby would be like, I want to play with that.

[739] What the fuck?

[740] How are we, how did we survive?

[741] I mean.

[742] All right.

[743] So let's start with, I'm going to do it kind of a timeline thing.

[744] Because it's like one and a half days of fucking a shit show.

[745] Okay.

[746] So 1982, September 29th, the first thing.

[747] to happen is that Mary Kellerman, who is a 12 -year -old from Elk Grove Village, Illinois, wakes up feeling sick.

[748] Her parents are like, you can stay home from school.

[749] They give her some Tylenol to make her feel better.

[750] She goes in the bathroom to take it moments later.

[751] She collapses on the floor.

[752] She's rushed to the hospital.

[753] I know.

[754] Sorry, how old was she?

[755] She's 12.

[756] She's exactly the same age as me. Sorry.

[757] Because I was just thinking of like, it's 82.

[758] I'm 12.

[759] Oh, I thought you meant right now you were pretending to be 12.

[760] Oh, my God, what the fuck?

[761] And that's how old I am right now.

[762] I did get carded over the weekend, so it's cool.

[763] Did you?

[764] And I was like, I know you're joking, but fuck you.

[765] We went to button mash, and the guy was carding everybody else, and then he looked at me, and I just shook my head, no. And he started laughing and opened the door for me. But it does that, too.

[766] Yeah.

[767] He goes, he like gestures like, come on, dude.

[768] Yeah.

[769] I'm not trying to.

[770] How good is their food there, by the way, buttmash?

[771] Oh, yeah, me. Oh, it's good.

[772] Okay, sorry, sorry, sorry.

[773] No, the place is great.

[774] She wakes at feeling sick.

[775] Sweet Mary is pronounced dead at 9 .56 a .m. Next comes Adam Janice.

[776] He's a 27 -year -old poster worker in Arlington Heights.

[777] Takes a sick day, doesn't feel good.

[778] He picks up his kids from school, stops on the way home at the Jewel, which I guess is a thing.

[779] It's like there, CVA.

[780] Yeah.

[781] And get some tile on.

[782] and he says to his wife, I'm going to take some Tylenol and lay down.

[783] A couple minutes later comes staggering into the kitchen and he dies at 3 .15 p .m. At 3 .45 p .m., Mary, quote, Lynn Reiner, who's 27, is at home in Winfield.

[784] She had just given birth to her fourth child.

[785] So she's home recuperating.

[786] She's not feeling good.

[787] So she takes some Tylenol that she had been given and brought home from the hospital after giving birth.

[788] there's just weird shit we'll talk about it later um she she yeah so she takes those and then moving on to 5 p .m so this woman named nurse helen jensen who is the badass motherfucker of the story she's a public health nurse for arlington heights and um The Janus family, I remember earlier Adam, who was the poster worker, had come in.

[789] The whole, the whole Adam family, the whole Adam family.

[790] Oh, shit, Elvis is going to vomit.

[791] You know, that's welcome to my life.

[792] That was gross, right?

[793] I mean, I had pots.

[794] That's all they do.

[795] I know.

[796] Okay.

[797] So the whole Janus family is there.

[798] Adam dies and so they all go back to his house to like to figure out what they're going to do and start mourning and planning the funeral and Adam's younger brother Stanley he has chronic back pains his wife Teresa gets him some Tylenol she comes she gives him to Tylenol she comes back and took two Tylenol as well she had a headache they both go down oh my god the brother they go what are the chances they going back to his house where he had fucking fallen 6 .30 p .m. In a store in Lombard, Illinois, Mary McFarland, a 31 -year -old resident of Elmhurst tells her co -worker she has a headache.

[799] She goes in the back room, takes a couple Tylenol, and within minutes, she hits the floor.

[800] 8 .15 p .m., Stanley Janice, who's Adam's brother from earlier, is pronounced dead.

[801] 3 .15 a .m., Mary McFarland's pronounced dead.

[802] 9 .30 in the morning, Mary Reiner is pronounced dead.

[803] So everyone's fucking taken the shit and dying within hours.

[804] At 115, Teresa Janice, the wife of Stanley, dead.

[805] So at 5 o 'clock, the next day, police discover the body of Paula Prince in her old town apartment.

[806] Old town is the town.

[807] The night before she, so she's a flight attendant.

[808] The night before she lands, she's a 35 -year -old woman.

[809] She stops at Walgreens because she has a headache to buy some Tylenol.

[810] There's a surveillance video of this and some photographs from it like that you can see online.

[811] She, uh, she's not heard from for a couple days.

[812] So the cops get sent there.

[813] The bottle of Tylenol is sitting open on her vanity and like she's, she steps away and collapsed.

[814] Oh.

[815] So nurse Jensen, who we were talking about.

[816] talking about, the badass motherfucker, says, I found a bottle of Tylenol and there were six capsules missing and three people were dead.

[817] In my mind, it had to be something to do with the Tylenol.

[818] And of course, there was no protective ceiling on this or any over the counter drugs.

[819] They just had cotton tucked in there.

[820] So I went back to the hospital and we took the bottle with us.

[821] And I said, this is the cause.

[822] And of course, nobody would believe me. And I stamped my feet.

[823] They said, oh, no, it couldn't be.

[824] It couldn't be.

[825] Like, they had, had not piece these things together yet.

[826] But I think once the brother and sister -in -law of one of the deceased died in the same home, they realized it was something that was going on.

[827] Yeah.

[828] So, the investigator name Pishos sees that the Tylenol bottles all have the same control numbers on them, meaning they're coming from the same plant.

[829] He, let's see, medical examiner know, and the deputy medical examiner named Donahue tells him to smell the bottles.

[830] And he he smells inside of them and he smells that telltale sign of cyanide that's almond.

[831] What were you going to say?

[832] Bubble gum.

[833] Just kidding.

[834] Because you seemed so out of it.

[835] You lifted your finger.

[836] No, I knew, but then I, but I wanted to have fun with it.

[837] Go ahead.

[838] So cyanide has a strong smell of almonds or bubble gum.

[839] because you know in stone fruit any kind of pit in anything right there is a little bit of cyanide and if you eat enough so yeah but you couldn't really ever eat enough because it's so hard to eat but digest and if you breaks down right yes but um i think it's because i had it you know how i know this is i had um one of those crazy blenders um what's a called vitamin mix where you can stick everything in it Vitamix yeah VitamX and they're saying like an apple seeds you or you know like that there's cyanide in there totally but it's it's a tiny tiny tiny trace them out but there's also tons of vitamins in there so that when you can throw everything into a blender you get way more vitamins you know what else vitamin or vitamins are in vitamins oh yeah you can just take some vitamins just fucking take some vitamins yeah not related kind of related I once never mind okay I once ate watermelon rind to make myself throw up, so I didn't have to go to Hebrew school.

[840] Oh, did it work?

[841] It did.

[842] Oh, good.

[843] And here we are.

[844] If only you had studied your Hebrew better.

[845] Really?

[846] I mean, what would have happened?

[847] I don't know.

[848] Very nice Hebrew.

[849] Okay.

[850] I mean, we can go deep into this shit if we want.

[851] Let's not.

[852] Let's not do it.

[853] So he smells almonds and the medical examiner said that, um, how lucky lucky he was because only 50 % of the, or half the population can actually smell the almonds and cyanide, which is terrifying and amazing, right?

[854] And it turns out that the Tylenol pills were laced with potassium cyanide at a level toxic enough to provide thousands of fatal doses.

[855] So each one had thousands.

[856] So the reason they fucking hit the ground immediately is there was so much.

[857] It was like they were overdosed.

[858] Way overdosed.

[859] Jesus.

[860] So at 315, Mary McFarlend died.

[861] 9 .30 in the morning Mary Reiner dies.

[862] Did I already say that?

[863] I might have.

[864] And so the pills had all come from different plants, supposedly, and had bought it, had been bought at different Chicago stores, so the police thought that a single person had bought all the pills at different places, tampered with them, and then returned them to the different stores.

[865] So on Tuesday, October 5th, which is not shortly after Johnson and Johnson recalls all Tylenol products nationwide.

[866] I remember this.

[867] Do you remember this?

[868] Oh, yeah.

[869] I was 12.

[870] It was on the news.

[871] It was the craziest thing in the world.

[872] We, in our house, I think my, my parents bought Bayer.

[873] Yeah, that was, that was, they were like, it was just a whole, I mean, I remember standing in the living room and watching it on the news.

[874] And these are, so everyone should know, these are the capsules that you get that you can open up and there's powder inside of them.

[875] These are, that's what these are.

[876] So it's not like, you know, the, like, the, like, gel caps you get today or anything like, anyone could open, them of whatever they want in them there's no seal on any of this so and there's also a very famous commercial at the time and maybe a little bit earlier for contact cold medicine yeah and in the commercial to some fingers pull apart a contact pill what and all the little beads inside the pill fall out and then it talks about all the benefits of this whole shit it's like here look what you can do i mean it's it feels to me like that that was it was in the consciousness if not exactly well someone who is fucked up and evil see like some one person puts that together you know like the majority people who see that don't fucking think how easy it is to fucking poison people right so so johnson and johnson recalls all Tylenol products people fucking lose their minds and panic 31 million bottles valued at more than a hundred million dollars of Tylenol products are removed from shelves.

[877] Nationwide.

[878] Nationwide.

[879] And Chicago police go through the streets with loudspeakers warning residents of the dangers of taking Tylenol.

[880] Oh my God.

[881] And the thing about this is Johnson and Johnson was totally on board with this.

[882] They were the ones who fucking were like, yes, you know.

[883] Because this was back when people cared about human beings.

[884] Right.

[885] When they were like, how much money is that going to make me lose if I recall this car?

[886] We'll just pay the lawsuit.

[887] Yeah, it's not worth it.

[888] I don't need another boat.

[889] No. And if the lawsuit happens, our insurance will just pay it.

[890] But also, have you ever, I don't know if there's anything else that's ever happened like this, where it's like recalls on cars or one thing where you're like, yeah, take your car in or whatever.

[891] Yeah.

[892] But, like, I don't remember anything like this ever happening.

[893] Like a panic of a thing that everyone has in their home.

[894] And then no one used again for years and years and years and year.

[895] And they knew that was going to happen.

[896] Yeah.

[897] So, all right.

[898] I wrote such an 80s thing that, oh, the, the driving through the streets with loudspeakers, that was such an 80s thing.

[899] That's like Blues Brothers.

[900] Totally.

[901] Vote for mayor, whatever the fuck.

[902] Yep.

[903] It's, yeah, back to the future.

[904] Goldie.

[905] Goldie, Goldie, Goldie, Galdi.

[906] Mayor Goldie.

[907] I'm going to be mayor.

[908] Okay.

[909] So, all right.

[910] So I wrote this whole thing about the guy who they suspected was, who, They still, they still, they're, it's still suspected he's, no one was ever fucking arrested.

[911] Okay.

[912] No one was ever arrested.

[913] A man writes a letter to Tylenol manufacturer in October, 1982, so like a month or two later, demanding one million dollars to quote, stop the killings.

[914] The letters are traced back to a tax consultant named James, whose name I don't want to say because he's never, he was never arrested and he was never convicted.

[915] and I'm scared of people.

[916] Well, and also if it's such a nightmare because if just by chance it really wasn't him, but then everybody thinks it was and that's horrifying.

[917] Totally.

[918] And I wrote all these things that were like, it was clearly him, but then something happened the moment you got to my apartment and I had a fucking study.

[919] So this guy James had been charged in 1978 in Kansas City of the murder of a murder after police found the remains of one of his former clients in his attic.

[920] Oh.

[921] Addick.

[922] Addict.

[923] It sounds so wrong to me. But the charges were dropped.

[924] Oh, it's at tick.

[925] Attic.

[926] There's our D. Attock.

[927] There you are.

[928] Addick?

[929] Did I say it right?

[930] Now it makes no sense to me. That's not too many times.

[931] Attic.

[932] Attic.

[933] Attic.

[934] Oh, Attic.

[935] When you do it on the stage.

[936] At tick.

[937] No one says it like that, though.

[938] At tick.

[939] Up in the attic.

[940] Okay.

[941] Up in the attic.

[942] No tea.

[943] I know.

[944] I just can't.

[945] Charges are dropped after a judge rules that the police search of his home was illegal.

[946] So like, motherfucker.

[947] Wait.

[948] So they find a body, but it's still, they vacate the...

[949] Yep.

[950] They went in without a fucking search warrant.

[951] Oh, shit.

[952] He's like, sorry.

[953] Yeah, you can't do that.

[954] So when he, so they trace this, uh, this letter saying he wants a million back to this dude, James.

[955] And James gives him a detailed account of how the killer might have operated and described how someone could buy medicine, use a special method to add cyanide of the capsules and return them to store shelves.

[956] Like he tells them how it could be done.

[957] Mm -hmm.

[958] Um, but he thinks, he says he's innocent.

[959] and what actually he was doing was when he asked for the $1 million, he gave the bank information for a former employer and he wanted to embarrass that man and send the money to his bank account and like frame him for it.

[960] Oh.

[961] But he is, they don't think it's him, but he's charged with extortion and sentenced to 20 years in prison just for that fucking letter.

[962] Released to 95.

[963] Oh, God, is this getting boring?

[964] Okay.

[965] Bibibba.

[966] They reopened the, investigation in February 2009.

[967] They search his fucking house.

[968] They don't think it's him.

[969] There's not enough evidence to charge him.

[970] Okay.

[971] But here's where this gets interesting in where I fucking last left off.

[972] Two words for you.

[973] Ted Kaczynski.

[974] One more word.

[975] Unabomber.

[976] So the Unabomber has some weird connections to this.

[977] Okay.

[978] That I really fucking love.

[979] And it's so far -fetched and crazy.

[980] But I love this shit.

[981] So I looked at a map.

[982] of where all the locations were in Chicago, and the map that most made sense led back to where Ted Kaczynski's family is from.

[983] It was within 20 minutes of the tampering sites at the epicenter of the fucking tampering sites.

[984] Is where his family's from.

[985] Yeah, all the lines lead back to fucking the parents' house.

[986] And in that year, in 1982, Kaczynski's bombs were calculated to commit mass and indiscriminate murder he had let a bomb off in 1980 on an airline and a 1981 fire bomb at the University of Utah and in 1982 a fire bomb at UC Berkeley.

[987] So he was active as fuck at this time and his family is from 20 minutes of where all of these fucking places where they were bought.

[988] Yeah.

[989] And he had stated his motive was a desire to destroy the public's faith in the technological industrial system and in his manifesto he expressed a dislike for the manufacturer of drugs and pills.

[990] The Unabomber said that?

[991] Yeah.

[992] Yeah.

[993] So, we're done here.

[994] No, we're not.

[995] Okay, but want to hear something even cooler that I fucking love.

[996] This is so cool.

[997] And I had to check a lot of fucking, I had to dig for this information.

[998] And it didn't, I mean, this was hours of research before I found this information.

[999] This is from unizod .com, unazod .com, which specifically highlights the link between the Unabomber and the Zod killer.

[1000] Oh.

[1001] I know, which is like, what?

[1002] But it's also like, what?

[1003] So the Unabomber has an obsession with wood specifically.

[1004] I know.

[1005] two of his victims were Percy Wood and Leroy Wood Barson and the founders of Johnson and Johnson Company were named Robert Wood Johnson and James Wood Johnson I'm sorry That's crazy right?

[1006] What am I being?

[1007] Okay All right so I don't know I just think you did it they think he's giving a clue to his location this is a thing he does is like give weird clues and like how the Zodiac Killer does as well and then there was also a Tylenol murder in Sheridan, Wyoming and this was like 15 minutes from Kaczynski's house before all this happened And, sorry, hold on a second.

[1008] Yeah, I don't know.

[1009] It just fucking, it all adds up to this guy to fucking, to Ted Kaczynski.

[1010] So wait, the other, but the other guy you believe was just trying to embarrass his boss.

[1011] He was definitely a crook and a con man. And initially I was like, clearly this is the guy.

[1012] But when I started reading more into this, it doesn't, it, it, there's no MO of the Tylenol murders that makes sense unless they were focusing on one specific victim and trying to hide it by killing a bunch of other people.

[1013] But none of that adds up to the actual people who got killed.

[1014] There's nobody that they can pinpoint.

[1015] Whereas Ted Kaczynski, clearly it's like, it's all kind of laid out there.

[1016] Yeah.

[1017] The motive is that he was in fucking anarchist insane person who wanted to fuck companies and fuck the government and whoever got in the way and whatever the victims were were just par for the course.

[1018] Well, because he was trying to cede, like, that panic and that, like, basically unrest, yeah.

[1019] Totally.

[1020] And so there's a lot of weird, like, weird similarities.

[1021] And also, I mean, I know that the fucking Zodiac killer shit sounds weird, but there's a lot of, there's a lot of instances of when he was in the time and the place and there's evidence of him in these places and times.

[1022] Ted Kaczynski.

[1023] Yeah, when Zodiac was active.

[1024] Wow.

[1025] I know.

[1026] I sound then that's when Georgia went crazy I mean you were on the internet for 12 hours and all of a sudden you're like and the other thing is that Ted Kaczynski is also a big foot which is gonna sound weird when I first say it tell me more but there so there's this photo of the woman who was the woman who was a um an airline a stewardess there's she picks up her medic her Tylenol she's a headache there's a man in the aisle on the surveillance camera looking at at her directly.

[1027] No. And he has receding hairline in a beard, which both fucking, both dudes, Ted Kaczynski and this other guy both look like that?

[1028] They both look like that.

[1029] It looks more like Ted Kaczynski to me, honestly.

[1030] But he's someone who would claim responsibility for it, so it's kind of weird.

[1031] Okay.

[1032] So in May 83, Congress approved.

[1033] Bless you.

[1034] Do you want some Tylenol?

[1035] Are you okay?

[1036] I'm just going to lay down for a second and here.

[1037] X is for eyes.

[1038] Button nose for eyes.

[1039] Okay, Congress enacts the fucking Tylenol bill.

[1040] Everyone has to fucking pull.

[1041] Was it called the Tylenol bill?

[1042] Oh.

[1043] In 83, they have to, you have to pull shit off of your fucking pills before you take them.

[1044] In 89, the FDA sets national requirements for all over -the -counter products to be tamper resistant.

[1045] So that's the Y. That's, that's the Y. You've always been looking for that Y. Here it is.

[1046] And here it is.

[1047] The Y. So, but there's no, no, there's nobody.

[1048] It's just a bunch of people got fucking killed from taking a fucking aspirin.

[1049] And there's insufficient evidence to charge anyone.

[1050] And no new or promising leads as of 2015.

[1051] I, there's no, I looked for everything.

[1052] There's nothing news since then.

[1053] you know what's awful about that is the panic how horrible like those cops must have been going crazy and like those detectives like it was there they had to be everywhere at once it's like it's not one victim in one place it's like and basically in all these neighborhoods around metropolitan chicago people are dropping so like clearly the person who did this is in this area and you can't find that and what i always think about is how awful it must be for those cops for weeks to go by and the more they keep taking people off the case and suddenly there's five people on this case when there used to be a hundred and yeah and yeah that's like what are they going to do yeah there's nothing they can do and when your leads dry up it's just like oh and there's no um it's not like people were like doing something to a tamper proof package yeah it's like they suddenly realize anyone could be doing this at any time to any product it could be any of the family members of the people who died it could be any of the co -workers of the people whose who's fucking relatives died yeah it could be some rando to me it makes the most sense that it's some fucking anarchist fuck the government it makes a lot of sense dude who sends in the mail bombs to blow up in people's faces yeah i know this sounds crazy but the wood he was obsessed with wood and all things would and the johnson and johnson's middle name was wood I lost my mind But when you say When you were saying He was obsessed with all things wood You used Then you gave the example of the names But was he also Was it like other things like Yeah there were a lot of weird Like wood types And trees and like really weird Like he was really into like Earth wind and fire Like In the same way the Zodiac had his What's it called?

[1054] The letter?

[1055] Like the um the lettering oh oh the the puzzle that he the puzzles yeah cryptogram or something cryptogram Ted Kaczynski left a lot of clues in the things he did on purpose okay to kind of fuck with people and they liked to see it and wood was one of his things oh my god so they were this in this um and he lived out in that weird cabin yeah he did yeah and which is by 15 minutes from where the fucking first guy who died of a cyanide fucking poisoning from tile from tile Tylenol died.

[1056] You know what?

[1057] Case closed.

[1058] I'm sorry.

[1059] I'm sorry.

[1060] And I just want to go ahead and again give fucking shoutouts to Unizad.

[1061] Oh, yeah.

[1062] These dudes, I mean, I would, I would, there's nothing in any of the news reports that connect these things.

[1063] There's, there's also two cops who got poisoned the night before any of this started because they found boxes of of Tylenol from a manufacturer with powder in the middle.

[1064] they rub the powder on their fingers and they got sick which makes it seem like it didn't actually the guy didn't just go into fucking drugstores and pull this like he actually had a connection to the manufacturer right which of course Johnson and Johnson wouldn't want to admit I mean and also what if you were the PR person for Johnson and Johnson or like that product specifically your life is like now just constant living that is a I mean obviously an incredible tragedy and just like a random awful people dropping dead is just the worst obviously totally but then on top of that you have to get out in front of like the worst PR nightmare kind of next to like the Exxon Valdez or something where it's just like oh this is just massive tragedy thinking about how many you know how many people who are 30 and under who listen to this who don't know any of these fucking references we're making and so when I wanted to do Harvey Mell it's like this shit's important fucking Exxon Valdez that's fucking important I mean well they can look it up I mean what we can't fucking carry the world on our goddamn backs we can't be everything for any millennial every millennial they if they want to they'll find out about it it's pretty fucking cool right it's great I you know what's super weird I thought the I thought the Tylenol poisonings I remember reading something somewhere where it was a husband and wife.

[1065] There was a woman who ended up shooting two people who they suspected could be.

[1066] She was in that area at the time.

[1067] She was very mentally ill. Oh, okay.

[1068] And they looked into her and her husband.

[1069] But the guy, the other guy I mentioned, his wife also might have been, they suspected was complicit in it.

[1070] But there was no, there was never anything tying them back.

[1071] And don't you wonder about like when they pulled those Tylenol bottles from those fucking houses, like the fucking fingerprints that could have been on them that then were ruined because everyone touched them.

[1072] That's right.

[1073] This nurse, though, man. They didn't know.

[1074] She knew.

[1075] Fucking high fives to her.

[1076] High fives to nurses who are the ones that, you know, they're the brains behind it all.

[1077] They're the badass motherfuckers of the medical fucking world.

[1078] Bamp.

[1079] I want you to get that put on the back of a leather vest and then just ride your your motorcycle all around town doing it it's a moped is that okay okay yeah it's not it's fake leather is that right yeah as long as you gun the engine and stuff this has been a wonderful episode yeah i mean in terms of tragedy i'm sweating uh karen what's one good thing that happened to you this week i know i know i like that we don't think about this because it has to be something boom boom boom think about it what is it um no don't what's one good thing that's happened this week I mean, it's been a tough one.

[1080] And it will continue to be.

[1081] I guess it has to be different than my than anything I've said already.

[1082] One good thing.

[1083] Why don't you go first?

[1084] You fucking asshole.

[1085] Oh, no. Oh, my God.

[1086] Okay.

[1087] Ow.

[1088] I guess Jesus Christ.

[1089] Yeah, right?

[1090] It's hard.

[1091] All I can think about is food.

[1092] Oh.

[1093] Oh, that's good.

[1094] That's valid.

[1095] Oh, oh, Westworld.

[1096] Uh -huh.

[1097] That's a good show.

[1098] Let's help me. Yep, okay.

[1099] I see.

[1100] Nothing.

[1101] There's nothing.

[1102] Westworld counts.

[1103] Okay.

[1104] What, did you think of another one?

[1105] No. I mean, tattoos that people are getting of my favorite murder shit.

[1106] Oh, that's fun.

[1107] Mine would be the show that I did last night at Largo.

[1108] Oh.

[1109] That was really awesome.

[1110] and it was me Blank Patch it was Pat and Oswald's night so it was Pat and Oswald and Friends Bobcat Goldthwaite and then Fred Armison was just hanging out because he was in town so I had him come on stage oh first of all I should say this my set started they introduced me this one woman started screaming and then as the applause died down she screamed the murderino so loudly like so loudly and I was like you've had seven beers.

[1111] Like it was one of those kind of things where it was like, she didn't know I was on the show because they don't ever advertise who's doing it.

[1112] Oh, that's cool.

[1113] So I think she was just like so delighted.

[1114] I don't mean to accuse her of being drunk, but it seems like she was.

[1115] It was me, Karen.

[1116] Oh, my God.

[1117] That was so supportive.

[1118] I remember who I was really funny, though.

[1119] She was really excited.

[1120] But then, as I told you, at the end of my set, I had Fred come out and pretend he was my comedy coach.

[1121] That's hilarious.

[1122] did a bit that we didn't even, it wasn't even like we made, we just said that's what we were going to do and then we just kind of improved it and it was really funny.

[1123] That's amazing.

[1124] It made me feel much better.

[1125] I wish I'd been there.

[1126] Next time.

[1127] Next time you'll tell, I wish I knew about.

[1128] Well, you can't ever get into Largo shows.

[1129] I can't ever or other people can't ever.

[1130] Oh.

[1131] Well, yeah, I just never think of inviting people because they're always so packed.

[1132] I'm kidding.

[1133] I can't get in to anything.

[1134] Well, what I realize now is I can get you in.

[1135] I'm like murdering.

[1136] That's why I don't ask you to come any of it.

[1137] If you guys would go to iTunes in your sadness and grief and just fucking leave us a review right, that might help.

[1138] It might make you feel better.

[1139] Maybe it'll make you feel better.

[1140] And if it doesn't, please go read the milk reviews on Amazon.

[1141] Because it's totally worth it.

[1142] Not the Harvey Milk reviews.

[1143] Just the milk reviews.

[1144] Plain old vitamin D. It's like Tuscan Farms.

[1145] I think is the meat of the milk.

[1146] That's gorgeous.

[1147] Thank you guys for listening and being fucking cool people.

[1148] And you know what?

[1149] Stay sexy.

[1150] And don't get murdered.

[1151] Bye.

[1152] Elvis, want a cookie?

[1153] Want a cookie?

[1154] Cookie?

[1155] He said yes.

[1156] Bye.