JRE MMA Show #125 with Aljamain Sterling

[0] Joe Rogan podcast, checking out.

[1] The Joe Rogan Experience.

[2] Train by day, Joe Rogan podcast by night, all day.

[3] Yatsy.

[4] Undisputed.

[5] The undisputed champ, ladies and gentlemen.

[6] It feels amazing.

[7] God, how good does that feel for you?

[8] Oh, top of the world, liberating.

[9] After all that shit you had to take from people for so long.

[10] How many months was it?

[11] 13 months before I could get back in there.

[12] 13 months of people talking shit.

[13] Yeah.

[14] It's a long time It's a long time But how sweet must it have been When they raise your hand And you got the W And still It was kind of a mind fuck a little bit Because It was a split decision Which I was like, wait I mean like going back now I can see why people were saying that But in my head I thought I had that thing locked up Easy, dead to rights And I was really confident Going into the scorecards And then when that happened I was like you gotta be kidding me They were really trying to take this away for me after 13 months I worked this hard but um you got it yeah that was a weird split decision i mean it was a very good fight but you definitely won the fight i watched it again today actually i haven't i've watched it one time with people normally after the fight within i usually watch it that night and i usually watch it a couple of times and i analyze it and i break it down take notes wins losses because that's how you grow but for this one i just wanted a break and just get away from the sport a little bit and it's kind of decompressed because like I said man 13 months is a long time to just have people just chirping at you and you can't physically do anything because you're healing so I was just really happy that I got it done but now I need to go back and start to get back on that horse a little bit to get ready for the next one yeah go back and watch it you're going to appreciate it it's it's a great fight it's a very good fight but you're just different you're so much different than the first fight which made you know for someone who's had neck injuries myself I was wanting to ask you like how bad was your neck fucked up before the first fight yeah so going into the fight it was fucked up so just to give a kind of a storyline college wrestling freshman year me and this guy talking shit to each other we call each other out he's up a weight class for me but he last year he wrestled the same way class as me I'm very competitive that kid was competitive we're both from New York so we go after he slams me spikes me on my head his name is Dave uh spiked me on my head and I had stingers.

[15] So anytime I would turn my head, I would find like a radiant pain from like the crown of my head all the way down to like somewhere around that C disc or like right around that area.

[16] And then each year it got progressively worse.

[17] Like that got better.

[18] But each year after that wrestling pulling on the head, we do hand fighting drills where we put our hands behind our back and you got to keep your head up in a wrestling position and someone of your partners is just pulling on your neck and yanking it yanking it.

[19] So that didn't help.

[20] Jiu -jitsu didn't help, all these other things.

[21] So over the years, it got progressively worse.

[22] I have MRIs dating back from, I think, 2014 when I had my UFC debut, and every time it was about my neck.

[23] Almost every single fight, I had an MRI about my neck because I kept thinking, okay, this is the time I might have to get a fix.

[24] This is the time.

[25] And we were able to just let it heal, do PT.

[26] And then before the first Yon fight, when he pulled out, I was contemplating on pulling out because my neck had a really bad flare up, and I thought I wasn't going to make it to the fight.

[27] And thankfully he pulled out, gave me some time to do some PT at the UFCPI.

[28] That helped out a ton, everyone over there.

[29] And then I got a shot.

[30] But the funny part about the shot, the cortisone shot, they put it in the wrong spot.

[31] But the doctor said, oh, but you'll still get the effects.

[32] He put it like a disc level too high.

[33] Wow.

[34] So C -67 was mine.

[35] He put it in the C -5 -C -6, he said.

[36] I'm like, well, it's not the end of the world, but I did feel some relief.

[37] but then I go through training I'm rolling with this guy at 10th Planet and I'm in Vegas and it's a guy I'd never trained with before.

[38] He jumps on my neck in a guillotine, cranks my neck on a flow roll to warm up.

[39] It's the very second flow roll right before the fight again I think about three weeks before the fight and I as soon as he did that and the role was done I go to him and I'm like I know the rest of this week is shot and I'm probably going to be out for a couple of days because of this and that's exactly what happened and then we had the fight whatever after the knee i started having some atrophy because now they're rushing me to get back because i i texted dana when i was when you say after the knee tell everybody when you got so illegally knee to the head yeah from the first fight um in march march 6 2021 that night went to the hospital and uh i texted dana white and i told them like i want i want to have the rematch and get this done and settle the right way like as soon as we can kind of thing they were all offered me to fight like, I think like two months, what was it, March, April, May. And I was like, dude, if I was suspended, if that was a legal shot, I would have been suspended.

[40] There's no way I can fight in May. Like, if it was a legal fight ending sequence, I would not even be clear to compete.

[41] Did you get concussed from that name?

[42] Oh, 100%.

[43] So my analysts out there, my doctors that know what a concussion is, they know all the symptoms, they know what a concussion is.

[44] I threw up later that night.

[45] They thought I was drinking.

[46] I was like, I didn't drink.

[47] My friends were there and we, they came to see me so they all spent a ton of money come out buying tickets for the fight for the flight and some of them even gathered that at the house that couldn't pay for the tickets to get out so I had about 30 something people at the house and here I come back from the hospital and I still don't remember much of the night I had to get like people to kind of help me recall what actually happened and when we're at the house I kind of want to just go to bed but then at the same time I felt bad because everyone spent so much money to come see me you know these are friends from college from high school, middle school.

[48] So at that point, I'm kind of like, well, I can't just be mopey.

[49] And, you know, I have these guys trying to lift me up.

[50] Hey, guy, you made it here.

[51] One of the hardest things to do is to get to the top, to even earn a title shot.

[52] Everything you had to do just to get the title shot.

[53] You finally got it.

[54] This is not the way you want to win, but you get an opportunity to do it again.

[55] You know, I had to keep it in perspective, and they helped me do that.

[56] And they just wanted me to have a toast.

[57] So I had a toast with my friends and family, and people took that.

[58] And I never posted anything, but people took that because my friends were posted stuff because they were excited.

[59] I mean, I can understand why, but me, I'm not very excited.

[60] As an athlete, you know, no one wants to win like that.

[61] So it's not a very exciting moment, but I did understand that this was special to have people that care about you and have been following my career for so long to come out and want to hang out.

[62] So for that moment, for me, it was just really cool just to take that moment in with them.

[63] Like, hey, man, like after this, I kind of get back to work.

[64] and we had a toast I said a couple words we'll do it again blah blah blah and you know they said to the champion whatever there was videos out then it looked like I was faking I'm like guys I didn't know there's a protocol how you're supposed to react after being illegally need to end the head from a shot you don't even see while you're exhausted in a high stakes fight I didn't know there was a certain way you're supposed to act I'm like was I supposed to pretend like I was being like macho like I'm just trying to gather myself but after that knee I tried to get back into the gym like a week later.

[65] I started to hit the bag to try to see if I can make, may happen.

[66] But I told my manager that's probably not going to be a go.

[67] They asked for June.

[68] That would have been the Brandon Moreno fight, I think.

[69] They had that rematch.

[70] And that would have been cool, but I couldn't do push -ups.

[71] I hit the bag.

[72] I was getting radiating pain down my arm.

[73] And I couldn't do pull -ups, push -ups, bag work, all that stuff.

[74] So this disc that you had, was it bulging at this point?

[75] Or had it deteriorated to the point where it was bone -on -bone?

[76] Like, where were you at?

[77] So that's a good question.

[78] I never really asked.

[79] It's just I'm having, I was having pressing from, I guess herniation is when it's like spilling out.

[80] Yeah.

[81] So it was pressing.

[82] Is that what it is?

[83] Yes.

[84] Herniating?

[85] Yeah.

[86] So I guess that would be the proper term.

[87] So it was spilling out into the spinal column and pushing on the nerve.

[88] And they said if it doesn't unblock within two to four weeks, that muscle could just end up just being, like I could just lose muscle.

[89] And that would just be it.

[90] That's Bosruton.

[91] Have you ever seen Boss Rutin's arm?

[92] His arm.

[93] I haven't seen it, but I've heard about it.

[94] It's crazy.

[95] He has one arm, he calls baby arm, because it's like, it's so atrophied.

[96] It's like he has nothing there.

[97] His other arm's jacked, and he's got his right arm.

[98] He goes, I can't even hold a gallon of milk out.

[99] It's crazy.

[100] Yeah.

[101] And people don't understand how big of, like, how severe of a thing that really is.

[102] It's been years and years and years for him, and it still hasn't grown back.

[103] Exactly.

[104] So that could have been me had I been just try to be, yeah, try to be tough and say, you know, I'm just going to go fight.

[105] And they looked at it again, and surgery was the option.

[106] I was so afraid to do the surgery, though, because.

[107] I just wasn't sure how that was going to So let's explain the surgery You have an artificial disk Replacement, yeah And Weidman had the same thing, right?

[108] So he did like a desectomy?

[109] He never had an artificial disc?

[110] No, he does.

[111] But the first one he did was a deceptomy, I think, where they just clean it out.

[112] Yeah.

[113] And then I guess that didn't do too well and then they went in and actually took it out and replaced it, so we're like blood brothers.

[114] So when he had his disc, you at least had a friend that it was a training partner you knew well and you got a chance to ask him what the recovery was like and how is he doing is he good to go with that now or is he having issues well he fought after and he fought you right you're right hall i mean obviously that was that was a crazy yeah but he's trained after that um i think he actually fought even other fights after that as well if i'm not mistaken i think he had a couple fights i think you had a couple fights but he said doesn't bother him same thing with me you could barely even see my scar and so your next feels just like a normal neck now?

[115] It's weird.

[116] So I hit the doctor up, Dr. Robert Walker, Watkins Jr. He's the man, super cool, super accessible, and really, like, checks up on his patients, which not a lot of people do that.

[117] And thank God he was the guy who did the hand of the procedure because I think he did a phenomenal job from what I know.

[118] And just being very hands -on with me, walking me through the process.

[119] When I'm asking him about my recovery from a neurological standpoint, when I'm trying to get back in the training and I'm like not feeling the muscle endurance and I still feel like I'm slowing down and he did a good job walking me through everything just saying like hey man it just kind of just takes time just stay with the stuff and the protocol as long as you're not having any pain kind of thing so when you're saying muscle endurance like your neck was fatiguing is that what you're saying just about everything everything like a lot quicker like physically I looked good but like internally like all the neurological things like the wiring it's like since they severed the nerves I guess it just took a while Ever, your nerves?

[120] Well, I mean, I would imagine, like, when you cut the neck, there's probably nerve endings in there.

[121] They don't cut your nerves.

[122] Well, I think the nerves move out of the way or something like that.

[123] Yeah, they push them out of the way.

[124] Yeah.

[125] But when they do cut in, like, something happens there mechanically where you have to, like, get everything back to working the way that was before.

[126] Do you have an image of what it looks like now, like an MRI or an x -ray or something like that, where we could see the fake disc?

[127] That always freaks me out.

[128] I might have something on my IG.

[129] Eddie Bravo's got one of those in his lower back.

[130] He's got a fake one.

[131] I know a lot of guys that have them now.

[132] You know, it's one of the things that we're talking about people that have issues over time and get surgeries over time from jiu -jitsu.

[133] It was like everybody has something eventually.

[134] But a lot of guys are getting disc replacements.

[135] Yeah.

[136] I do have a picture posted.

[137] I mean, it might take me a while to find it because I don't have Wi -Fi.

[138] Yeah.

[139] You'll find it.

[140] But, yeah, man, it was just a crazy process, like just to get back.

[141] and after the knee didn't I do the surgery and I was afraid to do it because I just wasn't sure what I was going to look like because there was only like three people who have done it Alan Joe Band he was very great with me as well Oh Alan did too?

[142] Yeah and I think we had we actually had the same doctor and I asked him about it and we got to talk and that was cool that he got to express everything and kind of similar feelings for the two of us so that was amazing to talk to him talked to Wyman I talked to Wyman's doctor but I almost felt like the guy didn't really you know I'm not trying to offend anybody but it just felt like he didn't really I don't say care but it didn't seem like he was really I feel like I was just another number to him kind of thing that happens with a lot of doctors I think that's the most PC way to put it It's kind of a bummer Yeah when doctors start thinking people just like numbers Like this my neck we're talking about I know right I'm like and I'm not just a regular I mean I am a regular guy but not just a I don't do a regular job Fuck regular guys you're the fucking band I'm champion in the world and your job is crazy as fuck oh there it is wow so that's an articulating disc so that disc allows your neck to move as freely as if you had the regular disc tissue in there yeah and you don't do you feel anything in there so that's what i was oh yeah that's what i was i was going to say so i hit the doctor up um dr walkins and i go is it weird does that it feel like sometimes i need to oil my neck like a like a car because if it's It feels like the joint, it gets, like, dry, because I can hear it go, c, c, c, cut, c, sometimes, not all the time.

[143] Got my shake shack.

[144] Is that right after you had it done?

[145] Yeah.

[146] Wow.

[147] I got a shake shack after I needed that.

[148] Go back to the other picture, Jamie?

[149] Shakeshack needs to step their shit up, though, man. They do?

[150] Yeah.

[151] What's matter?

[152] Like, just a service sometimes is, yeah.

[153] It's like, but they'd make a damn good milkshake, so I'm okay with it.

[154] That is wild, looking at that neck thing.

[155] Yeah.

[156] How am I looking at?

[157] What part of your neck is at?

[158] On the front.

[159] So this thing is going to out.

[160] Live me. Really?

[161] Yeah.

[162] So that never needs to be replaced or anything?

[163] That's the thing that freaks me out when people talk about, like, knee replacements and shit like that.

[164] Like, you got to get another one in like 15 years or something.

[165] And that, I'm good for life.

[166] Because I was talking to Bisping about his, because Bisping was running.

[167] I go, you're running now?

[168] He goes, yeah, I'm running.

[169] I go, wow.

[170] That's pretty damn good, though.

[171] I know.

[172] Does it hurt?

[173] He goes, no. I go, how long is it like last?

[174] He goes, oh, they think it lasts about 15.

[175] 20 years like oh then you gotta go back then what are you doing in 20 years then in 20 years you're 70 yeah like whatever you are 60 something you got to go back and then they got to saw the top of your knee off again and take that old one out and and put a new one in not only that but your bone is probably grown around all the screws and shit so they got to back those out you're probably going to get shorter too yeah for sure you probably lose some of your limbs yeah like some Eddie bravo got taller when he has disc replaced like Burt.

[176] Yeah.

[177] He gained an inch.

[178] Burt.

[179] Yeah, I feel like that's what it does.

[180] Yeah, well, that's how you're supposed to be.

[181] Like, you get, I'm shorter than I was when I was younger.

[182] Yeah.

[183] You get shorter because your disc material disappears.

[184] Compress.

[185] It starts to, especially if you do jiu -jitsu.

[186] Yeah.

[187] J -jitsu or wrestling or anything like that where you're, like, constantly, like, getting pushed on and yanked on your back and get squashed and...

[188] Yeah.

[189] Yeah.

[190] So sometimes it gets a little trippy with that when I'll hear that in the morning.

[191] Like, I'll wake up and I feel like I need to kind of, like, oil it.

[192] my neck first before I start doing anything crazy but once you move around a little then it gets loose yeah then it's good but he said that he said I've never heard anyone describe it like that I was like yeah it feels like I need to oil the car real quick before I can like start doing stuff interesting so you just have to warm everything up and get all the blood flowing and do like neck motion I still I still sleep bad so yeah sometimes I was sleep and the way that I sleep would just jack up everything and then in the morning I'm just like stiff neck and I'm like oh the maybe it's the surgery, but it's not the surgery.

[193] It's just the way I sleep.

[194] How do you sleep?

[195] Honestly, you can ask my friends, family, I'll fall asleep anywhere.

[196] Just give me a chair where I can just comfortably just do this or a corner.

[197] You're a fighter, man. You work hard.

[198] You got to think about the average person is not nearly as exhausted as physically as you are.

[199] After a day of training?

[200] I'm spent.

[201] Sometimes I wonder how I used to work a full -time job doing this when I was coming up, but I was also 21.

[202] Yeah.

[203] Now I'm like, there's no way.

[204] way i could also didn't know any better when you're 21 you know like this is just you're just wild i'm like yeah i go i go harder to paint man my training sessions are pretty intense so it has to be that was one thing that i was so impressed with the difference between the second fight and the first fight was your endurance like you had talked about the fact that you just didn't feel like you fueled up properly for the first fight because you were just a little too anxious and just the moment was such a big moment that you you weren't hungry it just it just completely went over my head that I was fighting hours later than what I normally fight because this is my first main card as a co -main event.

[205] So although I was in Vegas, so it was three hours earlier than the East Coast, I didn't fight till 8 .30.

[206] I had two pancakes and two eggs in the morning after a morning shakeout.

[207] So I'm already burned.

[208] I'm already in a calorie deficit.

[209] I did the morning shakeout, fasted, and then I had the two pancakes, two eggs after that.

[210] And these not even like big pancakes we're talking.

[211] I'm talking about these little itty -bitty pancakes that the U .S .I gave us.

[212] They also gave me lunch and dinner.

[213] But I wasn't thinking about that because normally I'll just eat one time for the day and have like a snack and just stay hydrated and I'll go fight.

[214] And never had a problem before until this one.

[215] I think it just went over my head and I didn't calculate everything the right way.

[216] And I was like, no, no, I'm fine.

[217] I don't want to overeat.

[218] And I didn't realize my body was telling me like, bro, stupid.

[219] You did not eat at all.

[220] Like what you ate is still in a deficit compared to what you – I just had a hard 20 -minute workout.

[221] And then right after that, to just put that back in my body and try to go out there and fight a 25 -minute fight against a Russian Terminator.

[222] Not the smartest thing to do.

[223] But in hindsight, I do feel like I didn't do that bad in comparison to the circumstances.

[224] If that was a three -round fight, I think I could have skated by and I'd be like, ooh, I dodged a bullet kind of thing.

[225] Maybe I could have on the scorecards, I know it was like a split.

[226] I won the first two rounds.

[227] On one judge's scorecards, the other two judges had.

[228] him up two rounds so it was a close fight you know so i mean for what it is i felt like i was still proud of my performance in the sense of i didn't quit i didn't give up i showed that i can take shots and durable it also might have given him false confidence i i 100 % because he's probably thinking oh this guy has no power on his punches i'm like dude i i'm just i'm just going yeah there's a moment in the second or third round where you catch him in the second fight and rock him and you can see and he covers up you want up taking him down right afterwards Yeah.

[229] But you could see, like, he was being super aggressive and taking big risks coming at you, and then you clipped him.

[230] It makes you smile.

[231] Your back mount is so fucking good.

[232] I was watching your transitions, and first of all, the first one, when you move into Mount, the way you scoot into Mount, I know, I know you haven't watched the fight too many times.

[233] I slid into, I slid in it.

[234] Oh, it's beautiful.

[235] Oh, my goodness.

[236] Like you were, like, greased lightning.

[237] You just, woo!

[238] It was so nice.

[239] It's like safe.

[240] Your back control is so good, man. It's so good.

[241] And I watch in the Sanhagen fight, too.

[242] It's like, man, when you get on someone's back there, I love when someone's a specialist in a very particular position.

[243] Yeah.

[244] And for you, man, when you get motherfuckers' backs.

[245] Like, you could see Jan when you had his back.

[246] It was like, holy shit.

[247] It was different.

[248] It was different that time around.

[249] Yeah.

[250] And Pahumpa in his corner was like, don't let him get your back.

[251] Yeah.

[252] Don't give up your back.

[253] And then next round, boom.

[254] You get the back again.

[255] Did you see him, Marco's going like this?

[256] Fuck.

[257] Yeah.

[258] And that's when I looked up at the corner and I smiled and I just go.

[259] And people thought like I was playing that out.

[260] I was like, no, that was a genuine moment.

[261] That's things I do in the practice room.

[262] Like if I'm sparring that type of thing or if we're doing like just regular roles and I get a dominant position or I get to the back after just get in the back and you're probably like, I just can't stop this guy.

[263] And I'm just like grinning, like a sinister grin on the back.

[264] And I'm just like, yes.

[265] Well, you were just a master of back control.

[266] It's very, I love that when someone, when someone, do you remember Paul Sass?

[267] Do you remember that guy?

[268] Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, he was the English guy, no?

[269] Who had this triangle from hell.

[270] Yeah.

[271] He tapped everybody in the triangle, and everybody knew it was coming.

[272] He just got everybody by triangle.

[273] He had the most ridiculous record.

[274] His record was like, out of all of his submissions, like 90 % of them were triangles.

[275] So everybody knew it was coming, and he would still get you.

[276] He would pull guard, grab an arm, all of a sudden, what?

[277] You're like, what the fuck?

[278] He got it again.

[279] He was slick.

[280] I love guys like that.

[281] I love guys who just.

[282] have this one position, because it shows you what's possible with reps when you're in that spot over and over again and you understand the technique and you understand positioning.

[283] Like your fucking back control is a thing of beauty, man. You know what's crazy.

[284] Yeah, here's Paul Sass.

[285] This motherfucker could just get triangles on people.

[286] It was crazy.

[287] That's a slick one, actually.

[288] Oh, man, he would get them constantly.

[289] And guys would be like saying, I know I just have to avoid his triangle.

[290] It's cut two.

[291] It's kind of like Paul.

[292] Craig, Paul Craig gets a lot of people in that nasty triangle too.

[293] Oh my God, his back, off of his back, his guard is fantastic.

[294] Yeah, he's a demon.

[295] You know what's crazy?

[296] I actually, I would say I feel like my triangle finish is better in the room, and I never get it in the fight.

[297] I almost, I thought I was going to get it against Cody Stamen in the first round when I had that triangle locked up.

[298] And then I try to switch to a reverse lock because we were just working that, like, I think one or two weeks ago.

[299] I was like, you know what?

[300] reverse lock?

[301] Yeah, so you have the normal traditional triangle where the lock is on the same side as where the arm is.

[302] Right.

[303] But then I try to do like a bolt lock on the other side.

[304] Oh, I see.

[305] Yeah, and I try to lock it up the other way.

[306] And when I did that, I lost the grip.

[307] And he just kind of just slid out of the position.

[308] Yeah, but that choke on him was fucking sensational too.

[309] Because everybody knows how good he is.

[310] Yeah.

[311] And when you see you finish him like that in the first round.

[312] And it's just, it's also the tightness.

[313] There's no room.

[314] There's no fucking breathing space.

[315] Yes.

[316] It's like, oh, no, this was stamen, stamen.

[317] Oh, Cody Stamen, yeah.

[318] I'm thinking of San Diego.

[319] Yeah, and then I finished him with the sole you have stretch.

[320] Oh, that's right.

[321] That's right.

[322] The funk struttle.

[323] That's crazy.

[324] I call it the funk struddle.

[325] That's a terrifying position because you feel your shit just getting ripped apart.

[326] Yeah.

[327] So most, like, when I fought Mizugaki, I never hit that head and arm troke from the bottom.

[328] And I swear to you, after that, it was like almost every other practice, I was like either getting into that position and guys were panicking.

[329] or I was submitting guys in that position.

[330] And now I actually just hit it last week, which is nice.

[331] So I feel like even with that solely web stretch, I never actually went for it in a fight or sparring session.

[332] Actually, I did.

[333] I did it a lot.

[334] I did it against Henan Barrow.

[335] I tried.

[336] And he survived.

[337] That guy was super flexible.

[338] And he survived, didn't tap, and then this one I got.

[339] But then after that, in the practice room, I was getting it a lot more.

[340] And then in sparring, when I would go for it, guys would just kind of just like, as soon as they step up and they feel me going for it, they'll kind of freak out and go right back down and they'll just let me keep the back control instead.

[341] That's funny.

[342] But your back control, is that like your ultimate position?

[343] If I get there, I got options.

[344] Yeah, I guess so.

[345] Because you're relatively safe as opposed to being on your back and looking for a triangle.

[346] You know, I would never do that in a street fight.

[347] You know what I mean?

[348] So for a street fight, I would much rather be on someone's back.

[349] For sure.

[350] And like if we were in the woods, someone's getting put to sleep and getting buried and it's not going to be me I always remember Rampage versus Ricardo Arona Yeah from the triangle Think about triangles That is the scariest fucking slam in the history of the sport Rampage hoists him up above his head Like he's in a pillow fight Yeah Boom It is the scariest Because you think about the amount of torque involved And how strong Rampage was In his prime My God And it was a headbut in that scene too that split his forehead open.

[351] Yep, yep.

[352] Arona, Aroma?

[353] Yeah, Ricardo Arona.

[354] He should have known better to let that shit go.

[355] That or transition and cut the angle.

[356] Because once you cut the angle, that distribution of weight, the center of gravity being in line for me to pick you straight up, once you turn, it's almost impossible to lift somebody up unless you're just a freak.

[357] Yeah, he just didn't want to let it go.

[358] Yeah.

[359] Remember, he pulled guard here, right?

[360] So he pulls guard, and Ricardo Arona, I think he's Carl, Gracie.

[361] He's like a legit, very high -level blackbell.

[362] Oh, he's Nogera.

[363] He's got a Nogera thing on his shorts.

[364] So he hooks up this triangle and on most people, that shit would have been fine.

[365] Yeah.

[366] Shout out to the people who can pull guard and win.

[367] I know.

[368] There's not a lot.

[369] Well, Paul Craig's one of them.

[370] Paul Craig.

[371] There's not a lot of guys that are, you know, these guard pullers.

[372] That Chase Hooper Kid actually just did that had a ton in his last fight.

[373] I was like, He's shocked.

[374] He's excellent off of his back.

[375] Well, he's excellent just period on the ground.

[376] He's like 22 years old.

[377] I know.

[378] And he looks like he's like in high school.

[379] So Arona locks up the triangle and as soon as he locks it up, Rampage realizes it.

[380] Yeah.

[381] See, right there.

[382] Boom.

[383] Fucked up.

[384] I mean, that is the worst slam in the history of the sport.

[385] And he was never the same again.

[386] Arona was never the same again.

[387] Yeah.

[388] I mean, I think he only fought a couple times after that and he just, it was over.

[389] Like, Arona at one point in time was in contention.

[390] he was like one of the best guys in his weight class in the world yeah and that one rampage slam just changed everything that's like before i really started watching and that's what i remember for him you know so that's kind of a a bad memory for me to have so that kind of sucks um and the other one that was really bad too is kevin randleman but i know we're talking about triangles and uh fador that was insane for a slam that was just like yeah but phaer just rolled it over he just like like nothing happened yeah like and then immediately He's got a Camorra.

[391] I know.

[392] But if you watch that, he kind of tucks his neck a little bit and catches it more like on the side of his neck and the shoulder.

[393] Yeah, but that's a big lift.

[394] It's a big lift.

[395] All the way down.

[396] And Randleman is so strong.

[397] Randalleman was so strong.

[398] God bless him.

[399] R .I .P. Yeah.

[400] Rest and peace.

[401] Randman.

[402] I met his wife.

[403] She's cool.

[404] What did Randomon die of?

[405] I forget what it was.

[406] Because he had the worst staff I've ever seen in my life.

[407] staff infection yeah did you ever see it no that bad dude he had holes in his underarm where you could look in and see all the muscle tissue oh that's insane i mean a hole like the size of my fist in his underarm it's crazy like he lifts up his arm he's just got a hole and i think randleman unfortunately let that staff go for a long time before he ever got any treatment and it just kept growing like go to here it is He died of a Whoa Complications to pneumonia It said Well how you're not Die from this Yeah exactly Look at the size of that hole man I mean that's crazy I mean that's an apple size hole Under his armpit So he had these Look at that You can see all this chest tissue That had to have contributed It's almost like that doctor game Right You know that doctor operation Dude that's crazy Well I just think he let it go I think he probably didn't go to the doctor and didn't treat it and the problem is when it gets that bad that's coming back and your immune system is probably compromised forever shot yeah yeah i mean staff is fucking terrifying man my friend brian um went over his friend's house once and uh his friend's wife was uh looking terrible and her gums were bleeding and he's like what is going on with your wife and And he's like, oh, she has a staff infection, but we're treating it, you know, holistically.

[408] He's like, what the fuck are you doing?

[409] Get her to the hospital.

[410] Get it to a hospital.

[411] They're, like, giving her herbs and shit.

[412] And she died.

[413] She died from staff.

[414] Oh, no, I feel bad for laughing.

[415] Oh, fun.

[416] You know, it was 20 years ago.

[417] Let it go.

[418] I'm like, oh, this guy's an asshole.

[419] He's laughing.

[420] She passed.

[421] I'm like, oh, shit, my dad.

[422] No, thank God.

[423] Really?

[424] Yeah.

[425] I shower before and after.

[426] That's good move.

[427] I don't understand people that go home.

[428] Like, dude, you just roll.

[429] with like three to six different people right you don't think that's disgusting to just sit in your car and then let it marinate like what do you it's not marinate too that is what it is like not cooking beef like it's insane to me you know it is insane yeah you got to use really good soap too I use defense soap you ever use that stuff I have it's the best or maybe I'm thinking something else defense soap is uh natural it's like it's not it doesn't it doesn't affect in any negative way your natural skin flora.

[430] It's all tea tree oil and eucalyptus oil, so it's actually good for your skin, but it kills all the nasty shit.

[431] Yeah, okay.

[432] It's like naturally...

[433] This is good, really.

[434] It's good whiskey, right?

[435] This is Josh Barnett stuff.

[436] Give a shout out to Josh Barnett.

[437] It's called Warbringer, Warmaster Edition, and Mesquite -smoked whiskey.

[438] And this is Josh's own stuff.

[439] Like, Josh Barnett really knows whiskey.

[440] It's actually, that's impressive, man. I always like fighters, like branch out and start doing other things.

[441] because obviously it's a short career window, so you've got to make the most out of it while you can.

[442] And I'm hoping to try to do the same thing.

[443] I'm trying to start, like, a rum company, brand company, spirit.

[444] So I'm just trying to look into the details.

[445] You're in the shit?

[446] I love rum.

[447] I looked up all the details in terms of, like, what's the best thing for you to kind of drink if you're going to drink?

[448] Because I drink a lot when I'm not training.

[449] And when I say a lot, I mean, like, I would have like maybe a drink every other day kind of thing.

[450] And if I am drinking with people, you know, I get crazy.

[451] Because when I'm training, I don't do that.

[452] So I kind of just unhinge a little bit.

[453] My fiancé thinks I'm crazy.

[454] She's like, you drink way too much.

[455] I'm like, I'm sorry, babe.

[456] But I got to kind of like unwind somehow from all the dialing in for 13 months.

[457] And even before that, just like a whole training camp, you know, it's long, it's stressful.

[458] I don't have many vices, but this is the one, you know.

[459] So I'm just trying to figure out how to do the bottling, the labeling, and where I can get it distilled.

[460] I'm hoping to do it in Jamaica with somebody.

[461] Reach out to the Funkmaster, ladies and gentlemen.

[462] If you have a run company, you've got a rum company, and you're looking for a representative, holl at you boy.

[463] It'll be a thanks.

[464] I got a couple names in mind, too, so hopefully it's something that we can really...

[465] It's got to have something to do with funk.

[466] We're thinking about that.

[467] Yeah, it has to.

[468] Hopefully no one takes that.

[469] Don't do that to me. Don't take it.

[470] Don't be an asshole.

[471] I almost did a deal with the whiskey company, but then unfortunately, I started drinking really old scotch.

[472] And I was like, damn, this stuff's too good.

[473] Like, I really love Buffalo Trace.

[474] That's, like, my favorite American bourbon.

[475] Yeah.

[476] But then I started drinking, like, really old scotch.

[477] Like, what's one?

[478] Like, old, old shit.

[479] What did we have, LaFrog?

[480] What was that?

[481] Yeah, and Laughlin.

[482] Yeah, and they were, like, 18 years old, and 20 years old.

[483] And there's a, there's, like, a smoothness to that old stuff that's just so different.

[484] And then as I was like, Buffalo.

[485] Trace, they don't sell you anything unless it's eight years old.

[486] Everything is at least eight years old.

[487] So that is you know who's got a good one is Brendan Schaub.

[488] I hate the name of it.

[489] I love Brendan, but I hate the name of his whiskey.

[490] It's tiger thick.

[491] Like, shut the fuck up.

[492] But the whiskey itself is outstanding.

[493] It's very good.

[494] And that's 10 years old.

[495] And that's a Japanese whiskey that's blended with an American bourbon.

[496] It's very good.

[497] Now, when they say eight years old, are they actually sitting in a distillery for eight years?

[498] Buffalo Trace does not fuck around.

[499] They take all their shit and they put it in casks and they age it all for the exact same amount of time or longer.

[500] For eight years, though?

[501] Eight fucking years.

[502] That's a long time.

[503] It's a long time.

[504] But that's how you get that smooth taste.

[505] If you drink like, we were talking earlier before the podcast started about somebody gave me some moonshine and you're like, why the fuck would you drink moonshine?

[506] Exactly.

[507] That's how I feel because it's not smooth.

[508] You drink it.

[509] He's like, there's nothing.

[510] Who is Megan's shit?

[511] Resilia, what is it?

[512] What is that called?

[513] Resilia?

[514] Yeah, my friend Megan, she gave me some shit from Mexico, and it's just like straight turpentine.

[515] It's nasty, and she loves it.

[516] That stuff.

[517] What I want to try was that scotch that you had, too.

[518] Yeah, grab that, there's some 12 -year -old scotch up there.

[519] That bottle right in front of you, I believe, Jim.

[520] Who is it?

[521] Wyman.

[522] Yeah, thank you.

[523] I would never forget this.

[524] we were talking and he goes, I drink scotch now because whenever I would do business and having a conversation with Fretita, Lorenzo, he would always drink scotch and that kind of like got him into it.

[525] And he was like, you always do business over good scotch.

[526] And I was like, we already drink it.

[527] So it's just for some reason it kind of sat with me a little bit longer than it probably should have.

[528] And I haven't forgot that.

[529] And I was like, you know what?

[530] I drink scotch now.

[531] Yeah.

[532] It's a gentleman's beverage.

[533] I like a good whiskey.

[534] Yeah, I really do.

[535] Scotch, a whiskey, bourbon.

[536] And like I said, this stuff, I mean, I have no affiliation with this other than that Josh is my friend, but this is fucking fantastic.

[537] This stuff we're drinking right now, it's smoked.

[538] That's what it tastes like.

[539] Check out this bad day.

[540] What happened?

[541] It wasn't today, but I was looking up whiskey storage as I was going to show you guys.

[542] Oh, no, those are barrels.

[543] Yeah.

[544] What happened?

[545] Collapse.

[546] The storage warehouse collapsed.

[547] Thanks.

[548] And you lose a lot of...

[549] They lost all that whiskey?

[550] Yeah, it looks like it started with a fire.

[551] oh no 45 barrels so they imagine you're fucking waiting for years and years and years oh no so yeah that's how they store it so in case you wow they just stack it on top of each other what company is this it does this looks like this was Jim Beam is what it said unless there's multiple times has happened recently so 9 ,000 barrels crashed the ground oh how much money is that Jesus a lot yeah that must be millions that must be millions I would have And then you've got to rebuild it and you're down all that, you know.

[552] Well, maybe some of those barrels are still good.

[553] It looks like they're not all destroyed.

[554] I wonder how...

[555] That was before, so that was the first day, then the rest of it fell down.

[556] Oh, damn, dog.

[557] What the fuck, man?

[558] Clapses again, again.

[559] Why don't they get in there and fucking get those barrels out of there?

[560] How the fuck did they wait a day?

[561] The whiskey or the bourbon got into the waterways.

[562] A thousand fish dead.

[563] That's fucked.

[564] Oh, my goodness.

[565] They were drunk They were drunk They hammered fish Rough day Like even that I'm just wondering Like how you Age something for Like one barrel Like how much How much bottles can that produce So this is the way I'm thinking now Because I'm trying to get into this I'm like Well that one barrel How long does it take So that one barrel Legit sits there for eight years 12 years 25 years Go to Buffalo Trace's website So Buffalo Trace They've been They're the longest running distillery in North America.

[566] They're older than America itself.

[567] Oh.

[568] Yeah, they started in 1773.

[569] Okay.

[570] It's an old -ass company.

[571] And so what they do is, I mean, they have it down to a fucking science.

[572] And when you get Buffalo Trace, like every, like they, they, we had a barrel made for us because we contribute to Fight for the Forgotten.

[573] And it was, you know, Fight for the forgot Justin Wren's company and his charity builds wells and they build wells for the pygmies in Uganda and in the Congo and it's a beautiful charity and Justin's an amazing guy and so Buffalo Trace teamed up with him and they did a promotion where they created a barrel just for us so Justin came on the show we taste tested it and they're all the same to me I mean they're all great but they're the same like what about this one and what about that so like you have a flight of different whiskeys to try but they're all great but it's all like the same kind of smoothness with like maybe subtle differences one way or another but not better or worse but this is how they set it up so they have all their shit like that in these barrels so we got one of those barrels and if you want to I'll give you a bottle if you could take it with you okay because we got cases of it didn't one barrel make like 80 180 bottles I made a lot see that's what I'm wondering like metrics like that so you see that's the Buffalo Trace bottle on top of that barrel.

[574] Yeah.

[575] It's, yeah, they just, but, you know, they don't fuck around, man. Like, you have to wait eight years.

[576] That's it.

[577] So every barrel that they have is accounted for, and, you know.

[578] I'm just like, how much do you have to have in order to have something that was age, eight years before you can sell it?

[579] A lot.

[580] And you have to wait eight years.

[581] It's like, how many cycles do you have of those in your life, you know?

[582] Exactly.

[583] You don't have many.

[584] But the thing is, they'll make a new batch.

[585] They'll make a new batch every X amount of days, and each one of those barrels has to store for eight years.

[586] So you're thinking about 2030 today.

[587] That's what you're thinking about.

[588] It's the only thing that they'll sell.

[589] If the barrels are packed today, you're going to buy that whiskey in 2030.

[590] Honestly, I thought they might have had something like maybe the barrel was aged eight years, and then it sat in that barrel that was aged for eight years.

[591] I'm like, man, they had the whole thing sit for eight years.

[592] I don't know who figured that shit out.

[593] Look, who figured out that if you let the whiskey sit for almost a decade, it's better.

[594] I bet they found some.

[595] They're like, this shit's better.

[596] Yeah, I bet you're right.

[597] Probably.

[598] I bet you're right.

[599] Like, that old, old scotch.

[600] You know, scotch goes for, like, really old scotch goes for fucking insane amounts of money.

[601] And they crack it open.

[602] So that stuff is 12 years old.

[603] 12 years of a barrel sitting there.

[604] It's 12 years sitting there.

[605] And what's the name of that company?

[606] What is that called?

[607] What was it saying?

[608] Kaoila.

[609] Kaoila.

[610] How much do you think the most expensive bottle of scotch that ever sold was?

[611] Oh, I just saw this one.

[612] I'm going to say a million dollars.

[613] Not quite.

[614] How much?

[615] A little more?

[616] More?

[617] 1 .9 million.

[618] A 60 -year -old bottle.

[619] Oh, McCallon.

[620] McCallon's fine and rare 60.

[621] God damn, you're an idiot if you pay that much.

[622] You're rich as fuck.

[623] Even if you're rich as fuck, you can buy a house.

[624] Why would you just...

[625] Is the difference between 10 -year and 60 -year that much that you would spend $1 .9 million?

[626] Maybe if you're Jeff Bezos, you want to press...

[627] You want to press that little lady friend of his.

[628] Listen, baby, we're going to crack a million -nine bottle of...

[629] Birdland!

[630] Yeah, right?

[631] And I'm fucking in there!

[632] It's actually because there's a hundred...

[633] This might be a different one.

[634] It says it was 160 years old.

[635] Oh, my God.

[636] 1926?

[637] That's not...

[638] 160 years ago.

[639] But how much is that?

[640] It says age 160.

[641] Maybe it sat in barrels and then was bottled in 1926.

[642] Does that make sense?

[643] Yeah.

[644] That's the only thing I could think of it.

[645] Or maybe that's just the name of it.

[646] Simply and they just let it sit in the bottle.

[647] Maybe like 1926 was when it was supposed to be opened.

[648] So there were only ever 40 bottles made of that.

[649] Whoa.

[650] And 14 with the label that it has.

[651] So there's things like that I know that make it more rare because if you only have one, you know.

[652] Oh my God.

[653] Look what it says.

[654] Is there?

[655] 2 .07 million dollars for a fucking bottle sold at Sotheby's auction.

[656] It was over 160 years old when it was sold.

[657] But Sotheby's is, isn't that where that movie that we were talking, we talk about all the time, the sour grapes movie where they rip those dudes off with the fake wine?

[658] It's the biggest auction house there is.

[659] So like they do almost every.

[660] There's one or two other ones, but.

[661] But that was one of the criticisms in the movie about the way the wine was sold is that Sotheby's never bothered to.

[662] Do you know the movie?

[663] No. There's a movie called Sour Grapes, and there's this guy who was a wine connoisseur who was buying all this expensive wine, and then he started selling wine, and then he started selling fake wine.

[664] Oh, he was also selling fake bourbon, too.

[665] Oh, Rudy Kurnia one.

[666] Auction House implicated in massive Rudy Kurnia won wine fraud caught selling counterfeit rare bourbon.

[667] so he I don't know if it was him that did that same auction house but the that guy Rudy sold millions and millions of dollars worth of fake wine so he would make fake labels and rub dirt on him and shit and make them old and he sold a bunch of them but one of them he sold a bunch of them to the Koch brothers and you know those guys are rich as fuck and they're billionaires and someone saw the wine and said hey that's not real and he's like what are you talking about and they go into this investment and find out that he got ripped off to the tune of millions of dollars.

[668] Yeah.

[669] And so they went after them and this guy wound up doing time, but it made for a fascinating documentary.

[670] Yeah.

[671] I mean, if I'm those guys, I'm not letting that go.

[672] You're not going to get me like that.

[673] No, no, no, no. You can't do that.

[674] Yeah.

[675] Yeah, especially when it's easy for him to just, you know, just instigate a lawsuit and got an investigation going.

[676] Yeah, that was silly.

[677] I mean, the guy got away with it for years.

[678] That's what I'm saying.

[679] I'm like, whoa.

[680] but it just shows you how those dorks that are willing to pay a million dollars for a bottle of wine like what are you doing you know I get a few thousand for a really nice bottle of wine I get it I get you want to get crazy I get it if you're super rich I get it but get the fuck out of here with a million dollar bottle of wine that's crazy I don't yeah I don't think I could ever like justify myself paying some shit like that what is the most expensive bottle of wine that's ever been released or sold let's guess what do you guess it is Most expensive wine A million dollars I think it's I bet it's more I bet it's a couple million It's probably five to ten At this rate You think so Yeah there's got They just want to have a crazy Dinner party And show everybody How big their bank account is I don't know what the fuck Kind of different money Pretty much right What kind of fucking dinner party You bust out a million dollar Bottle of wine Red Penny Night Yeah We made it We made it honey You definitely have a mega pint Shit I had a red penny night On April night If I tell you that.

[681] Oh, I bet you did.

[682] Right?

[683] I bet you did.

[684] How fucking satisfying was that?

[685] Zing.

[686] Just all those people talking all that shit.

[687] And then when you won, and there were still people that were talking shit that you didn't win after?

[688] I'm like, he fucking won that fight.

[689] What do you guys want for me?

[690] There's two rounds that you could make an argument that there are 10, 8 rounds.

[691] When you spent the majority of the round on his back.

[692] Smiling.

[693] Smiling and he is defending and fighting for his life and has, what is it?

[694] Five and fifty -eight thousand?

[695] That's it.

[696] That's all I can find, yeah.

[697] Wow.

[698] That's crazy that, like, whiskey is more expensive than I would have never.

[699] It might be because you get going to get less liquid.

[700] Because you want to have a whole glass of it.

[701] You don't want to just have a shot's worth, you know, the amount of...

[702] I guess.

[703] Value.

[704] I don't...

[705] Yeah, that kind of makes sense.

[706] You only get four glasses of wine versus, like, you know, 20 shots.

[707] 1945.

[708] I tell you, you know Mark Delagrote.

[709] Yeah, yeah.

[710] Delgarte and I...

[711] Not too long ago.

[712] We were at an Italian restaurant in Florida.

[713] and Mark likes a nice wine.

[714] We're having a nice dinner.

[715] This is this really nice place.

[716] And the Somalié comes over.

[717] And I go, let's get crazy.

[718] I go, what do you got that's like really good?

[719] He's like, well, we have a 1972.

[720] So I go, let's do that.

[721] It was like a thousand dollars.

[722] I'm like, dude, you're going to have a thousand dollar bottle wine.

[723] It wasn't even good.

[724] That's the letdown.

[725] I think the bailiff just handed the verdict to the judge.

[726] Oh, my God.

[727] Crank it up.

[728] Crank it up.

[729] Oh, my God.

[730] The Johnny Depp verdict.

[731] Live.

[732] This is insane.

[733] She's so crazy.

[734] I feel like, look, I don't want her to have to pay him money.

[735] I really don't because I think that lady's broken and psychologically she's so damaged.

[736] She's so crazy.

[737] And I think the real punishment is that it's been exposed to the world how insane she is.

[738] Yeah.

[739] Like she's insane and she's a liar and it's like that lady needs to go to the jungle and do some ayahuasca and get connected to the mother and then come back and apologize.

[740] I always thought about doing that.

[741] You should do it.

[742] That shit just seems intense.

[743] Well, you should do any kind of psychedelics.

[744] I say you should do it, but I haven't done it.

[745] I've only done DMT.

[746] Have you done how many grams?

[747] I don't even know.

[748] That's not enough of that.

[749] Maybe a gram, I think I did one.

[750] I think I got three.

[751] I think I did one.

[752] Five is the number.

[753] That's the magic number.

[754] I feel like that's a lot.

[755] It is a lot.

[756] Because I did that one, and it was my first time doing it.

[757] And I went to another galaxy.

[758] It was another, we had a good time.

[759] Now, imagine what four more will do you.

[760] Yeah, that sounds trippy as fuck.

[761] The way to go, Aljo.

[762] Do you smoke weed?

[763] Occasionally.

[764] What kind of occasions?

[765] Like this podcast?

[766] I mean, this could be this occasion.

[767] It could be this occasion.

[768] Probably a good move for you.

[769] Oh, you know what you should smoke?

[770] Mike Tyson's weed.

[771] I got some Mike Tyson's weed.

[772] Iron Mike is a legend.

[773] Normally it's like, you know what it is?

[774] I just have a harder time.

[775] usually functioning just a little bit don't get crazy because Mike Mike's got some California weed and it will put you in a place where you question reality yeah that dude he's high all the time he's so functioning like you want to talk about a guy who is like sort of reinvented himself as this like wise philosophical he's a shaman he's a shaman he's a introspective guy you know and when I was a kid he was the scariest fucking human being that ever existed.

[776] When he was the top of the food chain and he was the heavyweight champion of the world and even on the way up to the title, he was the scariest guy ever.

[777] No one had ever seen a heavyweight like him.

[778] Moves like a fucking lightweight.

[779] Smashes people, knocking everybody out.

[780] It was just a matter of time.

[781] You know, I smoked with Henry before.

[782] So, hoot?

[783] Mm -hmm.

[784] Really?

[785] He's a character, man. I like Henry, though.

[786] I love Henry.

[787] We actually did the interview at his house.

[788] I made the suggestion and I go, I hear, over here, D .C. talking to somebody, and I go, oh, yeah, Henry lives in Arizona.

[789] And I go, tell him, let's do an interview.

[790] Tell him, let's do an interview.

[791] And he's like, he's not going to do it.

[792] I was like, just ask him.

[793] And he's like, he's not going to do it.

[794] But then he hit me up later on.

[795] He's like, it's a go pretty much.

[796] And I was like, all right, so let's do it.

[797] So we end up getting to his house.

[798] And his one stipulation was to just not be the cringe, do a serious interview for us.

[799] Right.

[800] And he did.

[801] There was some moments where he didn't know what we're talking about.

[802] Henry is the king of cringe.

[803] He does these promos where he acts.

[804] He's so confusing because on one hand, he's an undeniably elite fighter.

[805] Yes.

[806] Undeniable.

[807] Olympic gold medalist in wrestling, two division world champion in MMA, straight up killer.

[808] I mean, the dude's a straight up killer.

[809] One of the last guys or one of the first guys to beat Mighty Mouse in his prime.

[810] Beat Mighty Mouse in his prime.

[811] Close fight.

[812] I must say arguably.

[813] Arguably.

[814] Yeah.

[815] Close ass fight.

[816] But he won.

[817] But he was stopped in the first fight.

[818] in the first round.

[819] Just to come back and have the performance that he had was super impressive.

[820] But the way he stopped Dominic Cruz, the way he stopped T .J. Dillishaw, Henry Suhudo is the fucking man. He's the fucking man. But he does, when he promotes fights, like, he allows himself to make, he gets so ridiculous and so cringy that you have to pay attention to it.

[821] But you could get confused and think he can't fight.

[822] Yeah.

[823] Because he's talking like a guy who's crazy.

[824] But then he fights like an elite world champion.

[825] No, he's a dog.

[826] He's a dog for sure.

[827] Yeah.

[828] I like Henry.

[829] You know, I understand him.

[830] But it's just so funny when I see him.

[831] I know he wants to be taking serious so badly that he just does that.

[832] And it's kind of like he's him trying to laugh at himself.

[833] But at the same time, it's just like, you're a tough guy.

[834] But I know you just want people to kind of appreciate the work that he's put in.

[835] Yeah.

[836] And it just seems like.

[837] They certainly should.

[838] I think MMA fans do.

[839] I think real MMA fans appreciate what he did.

[840] But other people will see him.

[841] They're like, this little dude, I'm like, this little dude, fuck you up, man. Fuck you up.

[842] Dude, the way he fucked up Dominic Cruz, I was like, Jesus Christ.

[843] Like, who does that?

[844] Like, he had such a strong leg kick game in that fight.

[845] It's very interesting.

[846] Because, like, he chopped at Dominic's legs with just, like, you would never, if you watch him do that, you would think, oh, that guy must have been a. Muay champion.

[847] You wouldn't think, oh, that guy was an Olympic gold medalist in wrestling.

[848] Yeah.

[849] You know what I mean?

[850] He's good, man. He's good.

[851] Do you have, like, a thing, like, about a guy like that where he might come back and you've got to, like, keep your eye on him?

[852] Yeah, but it's tough because to keep my eye on him, what's he doing other than making silly jokes in the media?

[853] Do you think that he wants another fight, or do you think that he's just, like, keeping attention on him and?

[854] doing his thing and I think the competitor's side of him wants to compete again I have to, right?

[855] He's still young.

[856] He's still young and I think that's the main thing because you still have those unknowns and what ifs.

[857] The only thing that annoys me about that is you got us who are actually doing it in the mix and fighting the lions and then you kind of had this long -ass break and then you come back and just jump in right where you left off.

[858] That's the only annoying thing because you don't have to go through that gauntlet that we had to go through.

[859] I agree.

[860] I agree.

[861] I agree.

[862] But you got to.

[863] to be honest.

[864] Like, that's the fight.

[865] That's the big money.

[866] The big money is in that guy.

[867] Is it?

[868] I think so.

[869] I think he's the guy that the MMA fans are going to want to watch see if he could come back.

[870] In that division?

[871] Who else?

[872] It's like T .J. And Hsuo beat up T .J. So Chel Suna actually brought up a good point.

[873] I was listening to his podcast.

[874] I had just finished mine.

[875] Then I was listening to Chelle.

[876] And he was talking about Cruz and yeah told him about Dominic Cruz saying that he's never lost a fight that wasn't for a world title and I thought that stat was mind blowing because I never even put that perspective and realize that that's really the case.

[877] Is that true?

[878] What about the Araya favor fight?

[879] That was like the first his first loss ever back in the WC so he means like once he's in the UFC yeah pretty much he hasn't lost the I was like that's a pretty damn good stat in that Pedro's fight you get to see Dominic Cruz is still Dominic Cruz Yeah.

[880] He's still Dominic Cruz.

[881] That was a Dominic Cruz -esque performance.

[882] Like his footwork was on point and he got rocked in the first round and still recovered came back, fought strong, won the fight clean.

[883] Favorite fight was for a title two.

[884] Oh, was it?

[885] No, shit.

[886] It hasn't lost the fight.

[887] What is that for the W .E .C. fight?

[888] Wow, that's wild.

[889] So when I looked at that, I was like, holy shit.

[890] I didn't even realize that.

[891] Dude, that was 2007.

[892] When I graduated high school.

[893] 2007 15 fucking solid years ago man that's a long ass time ago that dominic cruz was fighting for the wec title and he's still really good yeah he's still fucking world class man he's there's a lot of money in him obviously because dominic is a giant name dominic also is uh broadcaster super respected commentator in my opinion he's one of the best commentators this is like my my favorite go -to guys are in in no order Dominic Cruz, D .C., and Paul Felder.

[894] Those are my favorite guys.

[895] And I really used to love Dan Hardy.

[896] I really wish they didn't stop using Dan Hardy.

[897] I don't know what the fuck happened with Dan Hardy.

[898] I don't know the story.

[899] Oh, with that rough.

[900] There was a thing where he got upset at Herb Dean, which I felt like was very, you know, it's inappropriate.

[901] Like, if a fighter is upset, I can understand if you want to talk about a stoppage being too late or too early.

[902] Yeah.

[903] I understand.

[904] But to, like, you've got to be there, like, right on top of those guys, I think, to really get a sense of what the fuck is going on.

[905] And you're going to make mistakes, and you're also, you've got to think of, like, the overall landscape of the guy's performance as a referee.

[906] Like, Herb Dean's one of the best of all time, if not the best.

[907] Yeah.

[908] So when Herb Dean calls a fight or doesn't call a fight, he's as good as it gets.

[909] Like, you're telling me that all, like, he knows when a fighter's in trouble and when they're not.

[910] He knows when a guy might be able to recover.

[911] There's fights where people have recovered, like, Gray Maynard.

[912] Remember that fight with Frankie?

[913] Yeah.

[914] The two Grey Maynard fights with Frankie where Frankie was fucked in deep, deep trouble.

[915] And he still wound up.

[916] One was a draw, right?

[917] One was a draw.

[918] And then the second fight Frankie won, and the third fight Frankie knocked him out.

[919] But I thought there was one that Gray did win, like originally.

[920] Really?

[921] Yeah, I think he had beat him originally.

[922] and then Frankie came back and then beat him for like the belt.

[923] Let's, let's Google that.

[924] I think.

[925] I think that's what I remember really.

[926] I feel like the first one.

[927] So the first one was after the BJ Penn fight, right?

[928] So Frankie beats BJ, wins the title.

[929] So there it is, the draw.

[930] So it was a draw, yeah.

[931] But did they fight before that?

[932] Yeah, he beat Frankie.

[933] Oh, so they fought three times?

[934] At 5 and 0.

[935] So where was that?

[936] That was the UFC too.

[937] Okay, so this is Gray Maynard's record.

[938] Yeah.

[939] Gray was an awesome boxer, too.

[940] Like, very, very good.

[941] A guy like that should have been a world champ.

[942] He probably would have if he didn't fight Frankie.

[943] So the draw was the first fight.

[944] No, I'm sorry.

[945] So he won a decision in the first fight, and then a draw on a second fight, and then Frankie caoed him in the third fight.

[946] And this is way back in 2011.

[947] I think those two fights changed him, though.

[948] Those two fights?

[949] Those are wars, man. And then the Nate Diaz one was rough.

[950] But you're right.

[951] Like if you go from that fight and then you go into like later in the career.

[952] But that is often the case with fighters said that there is this one fight that's a crazy war that you don't necessarily recover from.

[953] Yeah.

[954] Remember when Melchrick Taylor fought Julio Cesar Chavez?

[955] I don't know if I said.

[956] No, I don't think so.

[957] That was one of those fights where it was a crazy war.

[958] And Melchrick was winning.

[959] He was winning on decision.

[960] and Julio stopped him in the last round and I mean with just like very little time left in the fight like a few seconds left in the fight Julio Cesar Chavez put it on him clipped him dropped him and he got up and the referee I believe was Richard Steele and he looked at him and he just called the fight and there was like a couple seconds left to go for the fight and if Meldrick had made it to the final bell he would have won a decision.

[961] Oh man but it was one of those fights where he was never the same afterwards and this was both of these guys were in their fucking prime and Meldrick was an Olympic gold medalist and look at he clips in there with that left hook so look he gets up and they stopped it oh this was this was this the second time the second one yeah yeah oh that the first one you're explained yeah no he he stopped them much quicker in the second fight the first one they fought and he stopped him with like just a couple of seconds to go and from that one on it seemed like Meljerk was never really the same and then there was a a really bad one with Meldrick and Terry Norris.

[962] When Terry Norris was in his prime, do you remember when Terry was terrible Terry?

[963] It was fucking people up.

[964] Like Terry Norris in his prime, there was a period of time where he was a world champion where he was so fucking good.

[965] He was so good.

[966] Terry Norris was a fucking straight killer.

[967] And he caught Melchardt Taylor right after Meldrick Taylor fought Chavez.

[968] Sometimes it's just the right time of your career.

[969] You get somebody, man. But when do you know that?

[970] that's going to be your time like you just know like how do you know as a fighter when to tell yourself like this fight is probably the one that's going to put me in that same revolving door as everybody else where i might not recover yeah this is when terry beat up meldrich and this was Terry when he was in his prime yeah you it's hard to know right like when do you know so it's like all sudden done and then there's people that defy time like randy couture glover to share Anderson Silver.

[971] Anderson Silva has a boxing career now.

[972] He's 47.

[973] He beat Julio Cesar Chavez Jr. He's a world champion.

[974] Anderson beat him at 47.

[975] I'm not saying that Chavez Jr. is the best in the world.

[976] But he was, he's an elite boxer.

[977] He's an elite boxer.

[978] Guy went the distance with Canelo.

[979] Pretty good scout to have at his age.

[980] And Anderson boxed him up.

[981] It was wild.

[982] And people were looking at him.

[983] Look, man, if he never fought Moy Thai and he'd never fought MMA, he might been one of the best boxers ever yeah could have been people forget how good Anderson was when Anderson was in his prime man it was like watching a magician he was like an artist he would find ways to connect his foot to dude's heads yeah he cracked so many people and he was so smooth when he was in his prime he was so smooth he was fun to watch oh my god he was still fun to watch still fun to watch but I do I do work worry about that though at that age but just in terms of like his health going forward yeah it's rough you got a spar still yeah you have to spar you know it's got to be rough there's some people that could pull it off like bernard hopkins pulled it off way into his like late 40s and i'm i mean i think he had his last fight when he was 50 but how do those guys like sound like talk um walk everything Bernard Hopkins was super defensive.

[984] He was, like, very defensively responsible, like, really disciplined in his boxing.

[985] I didn't watch all his face, but.

[986] Well, it was like he had, like, a classic style, like, he would hold his hands up high.

[987] And, you know, he didn't do things just through athleticism.

[988] He did things through, like, perfect technique, excellent technique, knowledge, footwork.

[989] But when he fought Roy Jones, like, the first time he fought Roy Jones, Roy Jones was so exceptionally talented that he was able to do things from weird positions.

[990] Like Roy would have his hands down low and he would throw a left hook instead of a jab.

[991] It was a leaping left hook and it was crazy fast.

[992] Just whap!

[993] And he would hit people with it and you could see they'd be like, fuck, like where is that coming from?

[994] So he was able to beat him the first time they fought but then Bernard beat him later when they fought later.

[995] Because Bernard, his class, like that classic style, he didn't lose as much as he like when he didn't rely as much on athleticism yeah but athleticism is real like Roy Jones in his prime was one of the best of all time the best of all time Roy Jones when he was at the top of the food chain when he was just every fight was like an execution like people forget like that song y 'all must have forgot that's a great name for a fucking song I actually wrote out to that song one of my amateur fights dude his highlight reel is spectacular it's spectacular is this it they're going to do it nasty left him oh you ever see his bice i know it's a big difference it's giant as opposed to his right it's way bigger 2019 291 1 1 answer yes i think we get as mr debt proven by a great now i feel like i'm watching someone get beat up and herrb dean just step in yeah herm team where are you now yamasaki No, it was the other one, Steve Mazzagotti, that one.

[996] Yeah, Mazzagadi would let some fights go.

[997] Sorry, young aside.

[998] Yeah, well, it's like people are making mistakes, man. It's like, it's a crazy -ass job.

[999] The referee job's a crazy job.

[1000] And thankless.

[1001] So thankless.

[1002] If you call a fight correctly, you very rarely get praised.

[1003] If you make a mistake, people are so mad at you.

[1004] You know, sometimes they don't know.

[1005] Like, they think a guy's more hurt than he is.

[1006] They stop the fight.

[1007] People get mad.

[1008] But it's honestly better than the opposite.

[1009] The opposite is where it gets scary when you see people get really beat up and the fight should be stopped.

[1010] Yeah.

[1011] Unnecessary damage.

[1012] Yeah.

[1013] I think that would be way worse.

[1014] Yeah.

[1015] Like the fight.

[1016] Some people are crazy.

[1017] They just want to let me go out on my shield.

[1018] You know it was a good stoppage, Volkinovsky and Korean zombie.

[1019] That was a good stoppage.

[1020] That was a solid stoppage.

[1021] So, like, he was still standing up and this is it.

[1022] This is enough.

[1023] This is enough.

[1024] You know, it was also funny?

[1025] I didn't even get to watch all of that fight I was in the back doing a ton of media so I didn't get to see just highlights Did you ever watch it afterwards?

[1026] No, I haven't even watched my own fight but I want to watch those two fights because now people are talking about me fighting vogue because I may go up a weight class You're so big for 35 It's so hard for me to believe that you're 35 Like what do you weigh right now?

[1027] Probably a fight like 170 Do you really?

[1028] That's so crazy dude How hard is it to lose 35 fucking pounds.

[1029] It sucks.

[1030] It's not fun.

[1031] That is so crazy.

[1032] I want to look at 35 T -bone steaks.

[1033] Like 35 16 -ounce stakes, and that is what you lose.

[1034] It's a lot.

[1035] Oh, man, that's a different perspective.

[1036] Yeah, look at it that way.

[1037] Look at it like 30 stakes.

[1038] You've got to lose that from your body.

[1039] And then put how much back on?

[1040] Like fight night.

[1041] I don't even know what I got to lose.

[1042] You got nothing to lose.

[1043] That's what's crazy.

[1044] But, you know, that's one of the things that we found out from, I think, George Lockhart or Mike Dolce told me, I forget who it told me, but that the bigger muscular guys actually can lose more water.

[1045] Okay.

[1046] Because your muscle is composed of so much water.

[1047] Yeah.

[1048] You know, I feel like I knew that, but I didn't know why scientifically kind of thing.

[1049] Well, look at the guys who cut crazy weight, like Polo Costa.

[1050] It seems to be the big jack guys, yeah.

[1051] Yeah, Paula Costa cuts crazy weight.

[1052] Yel Romero cuts crazy weight, you know.

[1053] You ever see Yowel walking around in between fights?

[1054] He's a fucking heavyweight.

[1055] He's a big man. He's so big.

[1056] He's so big.

[1057] That's a big man. Actually, I think I heard when he said that about the muscles.

[1058] Actually, when you had him on.

[1059] Yeah.

[1060] I think that's when I actually learned that, like, officially like, oh, that's why.

[1061] I love you.

[1062] He's the best.

[1063] I fucking love that guy.

[1064] And look at him.

[1065] See, when we're talking about guys fighting into their older age.

[1066] He's in his 40s, and he's fucking people up.

[1067] He just killed that one.

[1068] Yeah, well, still terrified.

[1069] You think he's sparring, though?

[1070] I'm like, there's no way that he's sparring.

[1071] I feel like he's crazy to the point where he, like, his style.

[1072] It's like, I don't need to spar.

[1073] I don't know, man. I could just do some Yoel Romero shit.

[1074] Dude, he came from that Cuban athletic system that is, like, he came from a different sort of a system.

[1075] Like, he explained it on the podcast.

[1076] Yeah.

[1077] It was really cool because Joey Diaz was the translator.

[1078] So Joey was with Yoel, and Joey speaks fluent Spanish and also from Cuba.

[1079] So he understands, like, where YOL came from.

[1080] He understands, like, all the stuff that he's talking about.

[1081] What is this?

[1082] That's Yowell of the guy he hit.

[1083] Oh, my God.

[1084] He shattered this guy's jaw.

[1085] And they said it was, like, at the end of the round, at the end of the fight.

[1086] Oh, my God.

[1087] Look, it's on the right, the left side of the jaw and right through the center.

[1088] Oh, my God.

[1089] Yeah, Y 'L is terrifying.

[1090] The guy's got to be made out of titanium.

[1091] That's what Rockhold said.

[1092] He said he feels like he's made out of metal.

[1093] That's crazy.

[1094] Do you know the story about him and the doctor?

[1095] They bring Yoel to the, I've told the story before, but I'm just going to tell you guys.

[1096] Yoel gets injured after a fight.

[1097] They bring him to the doctor, and the doctor says, where did you get this guy?

[1098] And the UFC, he goes, yeah, he's amazing, right?

[1099] They go, no, no, no, you don't understand.

[1100] His structure's different.

[1101] He goes, I've never seen a human being like this before.

[1102] He goes, his eye tendons are three times thicker than normal.

[1103] his eye tendons the tendons around his eye because the guy like he had some sort of an orbital issue and he goes and his bones already healing he was already healing they were like what the fuck man like the guy said he was the most extraordinary human being he had ever examined like yo else just yeah just a super specimen so here he is deep in its 40s still one of the scariest guys.

[1104] Even Stylebender had to, like, be minding his P's and Q's swinging at you.

[1105] That guy's fast.

[1106] People were pissed off at that fight, but then when you look at it, like, from our standpoint, like what we know, we understand why, if you're Israel Autotonic.

[1107] Like, you're not.

[1108] After he felt a whiff, he felt a little steam from that first shot in the first round.

[1109] That entire approach changed and say, you know what?

[1110] I'm just going to kick this guy's legs.

[1111] Stay on the outside.

[1112] and just take this one home because this guy can't touch me but you can't be upset at that fight that fight took place because of how good both of them are yeah that's why it was that way and yowell is a unique challenge he's a unique challenge imagine if izzie did try to get over aggressive and open up just to make it more entertaining but you know howl can starch people yeah anybody he hits clean he's going to starch i'm not playing that risk fuck that risk fuck that risk with that guy Remember when you knocked out Rockhold, the way he put Rockhold out?

[1113] Dude, that guy's terrifying.

[1114] Yowell and his prime was terrifying.

[1115] And I think it's, I don't know if his prime is gone, man. That's what's weird.

[1116] Like you watch Fight Bellator?

[1117] The guy he fought did not look bad and Yoel looked like Yoel.

[1118] Like he didn't look like he's diminished.

[1119] Yeah.

[1120] I was kind of sad that the UFC let him go.

[1121] I was like, really?

[1122] You're going to let this guy go?

[1123] He might have got a really good offer.

[1124] And the problem is he's going to beat up a lot of dudes who could be contenders.

[1125] You know?

[1126] That's the issue.

[1127] Bro, he beats up a lot of dudes who can be.

[1128] I mean, he's no picnic.

[1129] You barely get by with him.

[1130] But I feel like the UFC needs that guy.

[1131] They need like that ultimate gatekeeper that if there's someone that gets out of the line in their way class, you go, you know what?

[1132] You're going to fight this guy next.

[1133] Well, listen, Yowell could be champion.

[1134] Like, the same way that Glover became champion.

[1135] champion yeah there's a path for yoel romero to get to a title yeah you know and maybe it's a 205 maybe it's at 85 but who the fuck knows it could happen that fight would he's that good still like fight with wittaker yes he could have won that fight yes isn't it for me that's crazy to know like on a different if i just changed the judging that night there's a good chance I could have won the fight in comparison to the other guy.

[1136] You know, that's such a mind -fuck for me. It should be a mind -fuck.

[1137] It's crazy.

[1138] Because you just never know.

[1139] It's like whoever is just in the corner, you just, I don't know.

[1140] It's such a crazy thing.

[1141] And some opinions are wildly unpopular.

[1142] Like some people will score around for one guy.

[1143] Like Bad Tick McCarthy?

[1144] What did he say?

[1145] Didn't he apologize?

[1146] He did not apologize.

[1147] Did he say he watched it again?

[1148] I saw something.

[1149] It was a half -ass apology.

[1150] saying, I can see why you may score it for Sterling.

[1151] I'm like, dude, you said there was absolutely no way.

[1152] That's a definitive end right there.

[1153] Yeah.

[1154] And people believe him with everything he says.

[1155] They take it like he's like a godsent.

[1156] And I go, we can be wrong.

[1157] We're all human.

[1158] I'm not saying John's not right a lot of the times, but of late, he's been kind of bad.

[1159] Well, whatever.

[1160] He's got his takes on things.

[1161] Yeah, I don't agree.

[1162] Yeah.

[1163] It's like, dude, I think.

[1164] I think when you dominate a guy and you keep him in danger and you have his back most of the round, like most of the round, that's almost four minutes.

[1165] That's a lot.

[1166] Like, what do we call in that?

[1167] Like, that guy's super close to getting finished.

[1168] If he fucks up in any way, he's getting strangled, and he can't get out of there.

[1169] He's completely controlled.

[1170] Like having someone completely controlled in a dominant position, that means a lot.

[1171] It means a lot.

[1172] It's like if you watch your jih Tutsu match, for sure you'd say he'd be winning that fight.

[1173] A wrestling match, for sure you'd be winning that match.

[1174] So in a fight, that's a lot of points.

[1175] That means a lot.

[1176] It should be.

[1177] It should be.

[1178] But it's like the 10 points must scoring system.

[1179] That's not our system.

[1180] It's not.

[1181] It's a boxing system.

[1182] But what are we supposed to, like, how else can we score it though?

[1183] Like, do we have to use a point system?

[1184] I feel like we might even have to just go with like feeling like, nah, nah, nah, nah, he won that round.

[1185] Like, just get rid of score cards.

[1186] like the three judges just thought you won so this way it's not like the points just don't do it just because you add up the points and sometimes it doesn't tell the story of like the fight it's it's too abstract like 10 point 9 point and you could just make decide yeah you can just decide I go with that I like a guy who wrestles I go with that I like a guy was a kickboxer like it's so subjective you don't how many times have there been a fight and you're talking with a friend and he thinks the guy should got the decision and he's not even an idiot yeah he's just he's just got his perspective and you're like oh really and then you realize like wow that's what's weird about like subjective success of styles or like what's more important is it more important to be able to control a person or is it more important as when the person gets up away from the control starts fucking you up and hits you with a bunch of leg kicks and a bunch of punches yeah like who's winning that that's a huge momentum shift too because you're winning you're on the person's back or got them down and it looks like you're going to advance.

[1187] Or if you do, like say you transition into mount and then the guy explodes and escapes.

[1188] And that's a big moment.

[1189] Like you might have had him down and as you're trying to get to a dominant position, he explodes, gets out, and then he just starts, like, whaling on you.

[1190] Yeah.

[1191] Like, to me, that's like, I find that more impressive in terms of, like, what actually happened, unless the takedown was significant that got you to the ground.

[1192] Because in my head, I look at it like a street fight.

[1193] Like, what would I, what thing that I could do to you would be more, damaging because that's what we're ultimately scoring is damage i mean yeah or strikes not even not strikes just like yeah damage i guess that's the overall sum of just everything yeah it's it's it's damage and it is most certainly control and you know obviously submission attempts are very valuable too but it's if you're looking at like what happens you could decide if someone takes someone down and mounts them for three and a half minutes and then that person sneaks out the back door and just starts chopping at legs and fucks the dude up and gets him in trouble and then the bell rings like who won that round some people will say the wrestler won it because he had full control for three and a half minutes some people will say the kickboxer did because you know he landed 20 significant strikes in the next 40 seconds I like wrestling but I am by far not someone who's like if I take you down I won if I slammed you and nothing else happens I think I won because I did the most impactful thing that round.

[1194] Right.

[1195] But if I get you like a technical, like ankle pick kind of thing where it's not damaging whatsoever and I just control you and then you get out and you land big shots, I think from a fighting standpoint within that round, I would feel like if we're just looking at that round and we're like, this is the beginning, this to end, I could just go, no, I feel like what he did was way more impactful for the fight.

[1196] Right.

[1197] In terms of like, if it was a jiu -jitsu, like, oh, we're scoring time and control, that's way different.

[1198] But we're talking, like, for a fight sequence, and what's the goal for the fight?

[1199] Right.

[1200] To do and inflict damage, try to put your opponent out or finish the fight.

[1201] So I would look at it more like that.

[1202] Like, what was more impactful for that round that both opponents did that could end the fight or do bring more damage to the fight, which is what we're looking for in a fight situation?

[1203] You're trying to hurt the person.

[1204] Right.

[1205] Ideally, that's what you're trying to do.

[1206] Right.

[1207] there's a way to score it like you would give points for moments in fights where someone either did damage or someone had control but control was not worth as much as damage because you could survive control unscathed you know just because someone like has you down like maybe in half guard and you're just like clinching in control you could survive that for a couple minutes sometimes and nothing happens so that even though the person's in control of you it's not that big of a deal yeah but then damage like how much more is damage worth Like if you see the person gets wobbled or you see like a big impactful kick, something where you're like, wow, that was a significant moment in the fight.

[1208] So that would be worth more.

[1209] And you could, instead of like being attached to this system, it's not comprehensive enough, I don't think.

[1210] I just think there's so much nuance to fighting.

[1211] And even then, but even if you added all this stuff up, people would still disagree.

[1212] There's certain fights where people would be like, man, I don't see it that way.

[1213] It's a special sport.

[1214] I just think maybe because everything is so subjective, even when boxing, I have a hard time scoring it because I don't know what punch is considered a scored shot because if it hits the shoulder or if it hits the glove, I'm like, but if I still hit you, like, if you cover up and I wail on you 40, 50 shots, and you only land two clean shots and maybe it graze off my glove or something, but it wasn't as impactful as me, punching your body like a spaz kind of thing I'm just imagine someone just getting like covering up in a whole way kind of like the kids just you know beating up wailing on somebody and then the one person gets one shot in my head I'm like well dude I kind of beat you up for like a very long time you did do shit you know so I just feel like that's more impactful even though it's like hitting the glove I'm hitting your shoulder I'm hitting I don't know it's weird I think it just comes down to what you look at but then I just don't know what each person is looking at and can be like, okay, that's scored.

[1215] Well, I would say, I would think that if you wanted to be objective about that, hitting the glove is way better than not hitting someone's gloves.

[1216] Right, yeah.

[1217] And nobody wants to do that.

[1218] Like, no one would say, hey, I'm going to hold my hands up high and you just punch me in the face, right?

[1219] Exactly.

[1220] People think that that, like, completely protects you?

[1221] No, it's a little protection.

[1222] Yeah.

[1223] But big punchers, like a Francis Ingano type dude, it doesn't matter if your fucking hands are up.

[1224] She's knocking you over.

[1225] You're not going to stand in front of someone like Francis with gloves covering your face.

[1226] You know, like, a lot of those kickboxer guys, they put that shell up and they come marching like this.

[1227] Like that is, you're still getting hurt.

[1228] You're still getting hurt, even if you're blocking it with your hands.

[1229] Yeah, I feel like those guys, when you talk about like damage and CTE and stuff, like those guys, they get their head rattled so much because that's how they spar.

[1230] That's how they fight.

[1231] When do you ever get a break?

[1232] I know it's only three minute rounds, but that's still a lot of blows to.

[1233] ahead consecutively for a nine minute period versus like us where we could kind of take you down there might not be too much action kind of like a exparza rose fight like the last one obviously not all the fights are like that but um yeah so sometimes i see that but that's not that's not a safe stuff not i don't want to say safe i mean it's a fighting like it's not a safe sport to begin with but no no but that's not a great style in terms for for longevity i'd rather get my head out of the way and like i'd rather land something on you versus miss. If you make me miss, I feel like that's more demoralizing.

[1234] It's not scoring, like, clearly, but if I can, like, land, I feel like, I don't know, if I throw more punches and you cover up, I'm winning the fight.

[1235] Well, the thing about MMA is, I mean, think about your fights with Peodor.

[1236] Like, those fights, those rounds in the second fight where you are on his back, you're taking no damage.

[1237] No damage.

[1238] For minutes and minutes and minutes, minutes minutes and minutes that never happens in kickboxing yeah that just does not happen those guys in the k -1 glory days the highlight really is crazy because they're on knocking each other out jerome the banner knocks this guy out you know peter eritz knocks that guy out ernesto hoose knocks this guy out like holy shit who there's so many goddamn chaos yeah those k -1 glory days when japan was having those giant kickboxing events just huge state stadiums filled with people that we're going to see those guys when they fought in like the k1 grand prix fuck man those days were incredible man i give it up to those guys because they are built different like they say we're like we're tough but i mean i look at those sports and i'm like dude you guys legit piss pound each other the entire time yeah i mean maybe it's not the and they all get caoed yeah it's a tough man's sport for me i mean ernesto who's fought bob sap Remember that?

[1239] Yeah.

[1240] He fought him twice.

[1241] And that's a big dude.

[1242] Yeah.

[1243] I think he fought him twice.

[1244] Pretty sure he fought him twice.

[1245] But Ernesto Hust had Bob Sapp in fucking trouble, but he just couldn't deal with the size.

[1246] It's a big man. He didn't deal with it.

[1247] God damn, he was big.

[1248] Those days of Bob Sapp were incredible.

[1249] Because it's like, it's the age -old question in martial arts.

[1250] Like, does technique overcome size?

[1251] To certain extent.

[1252] Yeah.

[1253] To a certain extent, like Minotaro, like, he got spiked on his head in that fight with Bob, and his neck was fucked forever after that.

[1254] Like, it was never the same after that.

[1255] She's a big dude.

[1256] He was 375 pounds.

[1257] That's why they were way classes.

[1258] Yeah, but those days of the kickboxing days, like, there's never been anything like that in terms of like something that's mainstream as those K -1 glory days where they're selling out giant stadiums.

[1259] It would be good to have.

[1260] Is that sport, like, you know, sometimes those fans that complain and go, oh, they just rustle the whole time.

[1261] I'm like, well, why isn't, like, kickboxing a bigger sport over here?

[1262] It's a really good question.

[1263] I don't get it.

[1264] Like, it's literally everything that you want to see that you bitch about for MMA, which I don't understand.

[1265] It's like, you know that there's, like, if I go to a comedy show, I'm expecting the guy to make a joke.

[1266] Right.

[1267] You go into an MMA fight, and you're expecting that these guys might not decide that the easier path to victory is wrestling as if you're just going to be mind -blown, like, oh, my God, How can you do that?

[1268] You're not supposed to do that.

[1269] Like, I don't know.

[1270] I don't get those people.

[1271] Just go watch kickboxing.

[1272] It's, uh, it's dumb.

[1273] Like, all of it's interesting.

[1274] Jiu -jitsu is interesting, kickboxing.

[1275] It's like, who can impose their game?

[1276] That's what's interesting.

[1277] Combat sports.

[1278] Yeah, and if you're not, if you're not a real fan, you just want to see violence and you just do like, yeah, they're just three guys.

[1279] You need to understand what's happening here.

[1280] It's beautiful.

[1281] Like some of the Damien Maya fights, It's when Damien was in his prime.

[1282] Well, he would take guys down and strangle him.

[1283] Like, do you understand what you're seeing?

[1284] The way Damien Maya went through, like, Neil Magny.

[1285] I was like, would you understand what you're seeing here, man?

[1286] And then he went to his seminar.

[1287] Yeah.

[1288] I heard him say that.

[1289] He went to his seminar after that.

[1290] I was like, that is actually hilarious, but I respect the hell out.

[1291] I respect that, too.

[1292] Yeah, well, that's the kind of dude Neil Magny is.

[1293] But those, I mean, some of those fights, man, when you watch, like, Damien, when he was in his prime.

[1294] man as an elite constrictor if you can't appreciate that then you don't appreciate the real thing you only want the like the sexy parts you only want the KOs and the submissions and yeah more action I just appreciate fighting it's just for me it's kind of like an art man so you get to paint your picture tell your story whether it's almost like how you feel like an expression of yourself I feel, you know?

[1295] Like sometimes you have a game plan and you get in there and the moments just kind of change when you're in there with the individual and you start to feel like the way you feel in that moment is just the way you kind of express yourself.

[1296] Are you angry?

[1297] Are you aggressive?

[1298] Are you calm, cool, collected?

[1299] Are you kind of like trying to be chill and lay back and kind of let the fight come to you?

[1300] And I feel like every time you step in there, sometimes you get a different emotion that day.

[1301] Like being able to dial that in and get to that sweet spot every single time.

[1302] So you're in the zone it's so hard to do and that's why I appreciate that like even a guy like he's still arguably he's still one of the top guys for sure to ever do it for sure but I feel like there is some fights that he could have possibly had because obviously he had a lot of injuries and stuff like that stuff that happened with opponents and stuff so it's not to his it's not his fault but a guy like that who can what I'm trying to get at is a guy like that who can get up 29 times and be in that zone every single time and not have an off night that is the guy that I'm so like wild by because it's not like I know what it is because we've done it.

[1303] You've done it.

[1304] You've competed before so you know what it is to be in that zone being that element where you're just like I have to excel and get this W by no matter like you can't tell me like some of those days if he weren't to go into those training rooms with those guys they might not ever get the better of him on certain days.

[1305] but for him to be on every single night that's impressive that's a hard thing to do it's a super hard thing to do for a guy like that who's in one of the most talent rich divisions yeah and to dominate every time never have an off night yeah and that i'm i don't know i mean do you ever do you work with a psychologist or anything have you ever done any of that no no you know there's uh different people have worked with different mental trainers and like there's a guy viny shorman uh he's worked with a lot of fighters and he's basically he's a hypnotist but also like does like sport psychology stuff for fighters and helps them get in get their mindset now focused I feel two ways about that I feel one you're mentally weak and you could possibly be broken because you feel like you need to have someone else get you to a point to to to feel confident about yourself that's the way That's one way to look at it.

[1306] Right.

[1307] But then the other side I look at it is like, like even for me, I go through anxiety.

[1308] I'm not saying I'm immune to it.

[1309] But on the other side, it's kind of like, you get the help and it makes you better from dealing with it.

[1310] So I'm like, which one is it for me?

[1311] It's like sometimes you know someone is doing it.

[1312] And I wonder what type of person they are.

[1313] Like, does this really get them in the zone and locked in?

[1314] Like, this is something that they feel that they need versus them trying to do it and they're not really all in, and I could probably break them.

[1315] This is the way I think.

[1316] I'm like, I analyze my opponents.

[1317] Like, if I hear, like, they need a mental coach, I'm like, oh, there's probably a mental thing in there that I can possibly do an exploit in the fight that can be a trigger and really just stow off his entire game and make the fight easier than it probably would have been had this guy been locked in the entire time.

[1318] So I kind of look at it like from two sides of the spectrum.

[1319] Like, I don't know.

[1320] My brain is this operative.

[1321] That's a great.

[1322] Predator's brain.

[1323] Would you, when you're thinking like that, would you exploit it in, like, would you, like, bring it up to them that I heard you got a mental coach?

[1324] That's not going to help you?

[1325] Is that the kind of thing you do?

[1326] I mean, I would, but I've never, like, actually said anything like that about anyone personally.

[1327] Like, oh, you heard you got a mental coach.

[1328] Like, I don't want to feel like I'm bullying somebody, you know, because they, you know, oh, you need this.

[1329] But at the same time, because, you know, it's a tough sport.

[1330] I'm all about having fun and talking shit but there's certain parts where you're kind of talking shit it kind of just feels like you're being that bully and I've been like beating up as a kid because I was always just smaller guy so I understand that feeling so sometimes I kind of get like a little weird about it even though we're grown ass men agreeing to punch each other in the face anyway I just I guess my message when I'm like doing the stuff that I do I try not to show that because I don't want to come off as that and like kind of like help project because people are super influenced by everything that someone like an athlete does that they're one of their favorite athletes or something they could be easily influenced by that so I don't know I think real crazy man I started thinking about this I started thinking about that this possibility and then my brain just it's always on I think it's probably why I don't sleep that's a good way to look at it that's an honest assessment of looking at it that's I appreciate that it's um I just know I'm getting that ass If you got that mental coach I'm coming for that ass to say Pause Is it possible that someone could be elite But looking for the most razor sharp of blades And consults with a mental coach To devise a plan To even strengthen the resolve further I agree Because I've had people tell me that Even though they think I'm mentally tough That if I did get a mental coach I could probably get to like the next level of my game yeah but then i don't know how much of that is just talk because i think it probably depends upon the mental coach oh that too i bet there's some mental coaches that are wizards and it's like everything else man like you could learn karate from a bad instructor and you don't know what the fuck you're doing or you can learn jujitsu from hoiler gracy you know like you you could get lucky or you not get lucky i think that's that's possible with that as well you could have a really good mental coach that fucking puts you in a place you that maybe you wouldn't get without one I think it's possible because coaching and like just understanding psychology and being able to frame things in your mind like what is fear why am I why am I think I've done the work I'm I'm folk I'm ready to like no room for any bullshit thoughts don't let them in you've done everything you need to do and you're ready to rock and roll and like to most people can maintain that sometimes that's why we're talking about how impressive it is for Khabib's record yeah because he maintained that his entire career but it's if there was like a clear path in your mind you know how like there's like submission paths like you know that once you're in half guard and you get out of their half guard and you have the arm on your neck you're going to either try to lock it up for a head and arm or you're going to spin and try to take an arm bar and you have these paths in your head yeah maybe it's like that maybe there's like yeah it's a it's a very interesting thing like just the whole approach everything man I that's why I think this this is why I love the sport because it's just there's nothing else like this nothing like like like I do this all the time and it doesn't get old like I get nervous that when I do because I don't want to be fighting until like 40 plus years I don't want to do that yeah you know cutting weight to 135 is not easy it's not fun and I want to be able to have longevity in my life post fighting where I can hang out with my kids talk on my kids properly and I feel like you know I just don't want to have that image of me with my like future kids wife and I don't want the one looking at me as like a like a sad case of you know someone that's stuck around too long kind of thing you know so that's very important and I looked up to like the guys are pioneers man like those guys paved the fucking way and to see those guys how they most like a lot of them aren't in the best of shape but thankfully for those guys they help pave the way for us and I look at them as examples of how to do what they did but do it in a better way that could be long -term beneficial as opposed to just a temporary thing I'm here one day going tomorrow revolving door you know no it's um they're real pioneers like there there's not a sport that's like the UFC where you look back to 1993 and those guys are still around like hoist gracey's still around Dan the B -7s still around they and the B -7s still around like that they're still around yeah it's wild yeah it's wild man those guys from the very early days are still around you know and some of them are still pretty fucking active mayhem miller yeah yeah yeah guys crazy i love that guy that i mean we talked about random before of course mark coleman and i mean how many of those guys who were the early greats they there was nothing before them you know i mean mark coleman was literally the first ufc heavyway champion when he beat Dan Severin.

[1331] Remember he got him in like that scarf hold headlock?

[1332] And tapped him for the title.

[1333] I told my boys we should do like a marathon, like watching UFC1 and like just try to get through like 100.

[1334] Like just to catch up and watch all the fights all over again and just enjoy the events of how it was.

[1335] And we'll gradually see the increase in value of production and the whole everything.

[1336] And the rules.

[1337] The rules and the talent.

[1338] and seeing how things evolve, how strategy evolved.

[1339] I think that would be a fun thing just as a fan.

[1340] So Murillo Bustamante fought Matt Lindland.

[1341] And when he fought Matt Lindland, he took him down and submitted him.

[1342] And Linlin said he didn't tap.

[1343] And so he got him in an arm bar.

[1344] And so Big John McCarthy stopped the fight.

[1345] But then Linlin said he didn't tap.

[1346] And so they made them keep fighting.

[1347] I think it's the only fight like it I've never seen that one I think it was the only fight like it where then they continued the fight and then Bustamante got him in a guillotine and he tapped him again like there's only been one fight that I can remember that was where the fight was restarted twice I'm pretty sure Big John McCarthy was a referee Wait didn't that happen with Benavides and somebody he like finished somebody like twice in one round.

[1348] Really?

[1349] Joseph Benavides?

[1350] Yeah.

[1351] Like the ref...

[1352] Perhaps.

[1353] Like, I don't even remember.

[1354] I think the ref had stopped the fight thinking it was like something illegal and then they resumed and then he finished it again.

[1355] I was like, wait, that's actually crazy.

[1356] Oh.

[1357] It was like a one round fight.

[1358] That was against Figurato, right?

[1359] Wasn't it?

[1360] No, no. Because I think Joe won.

[1361] Oh.

[1362] Because I think he beats someone like two times, and that's when they start calling Joey Two Touns.

[1363] Joey Two Tons.

[1364] Get the paper.

[1365] Get the paper.

[1366] That's such a good movie.

[1367] That was a great fucking movie.

[1368] Can't believe Ray Liotta's dead.

[1369] He wasn't that old, man. No, he wasn't.

[1370] God, that sucks.

[1371] People are just dying too damn young.

[1372] Like 67.

[1373] It's not that old.

[1374] That shit scares me. It shouldn't scare me, but it does.

[1375] Well, I think what you are scared of is.

[1376] very wise what you're what you're saying about being scared of like being damaged to the point where people feel sad being around you yeah i don't want i don't want that well because you don't want that and you got that in your head it's not going to sneak up on you yeah the the people that don't think it will ever happen to them and then they're in denial when it's happened to them that can be a real problem yeah you know it's cool and i'm not you know trying to make this like a sensitive subject but even like when you spoke to Shab and you kind of like politely told him what he pretty much asked you to be honest and real about what you thought kind of thing and I thought that was I can respect that I know some people get really but I'm not talking about him but I know he did get bothered but some people get really bothered when you give them honest criticism or honest feedback and I think when you do that you limit the the power of your friends to help give you true honest feelings and perspective of what they think as a friend looking out for you your best interest and obviously that person has got to mean a lot to you in order for you to take that at whatever they're saying well i also with the shop situation i knew he had another option yeah like he's really funny on podcasts i'm like dude you're really fun to do podcast with i'm like that's what you should be doing especially like me and him we would have so much fun it was so silly he's like a silly dude yeah and that's what i love about shop he's like really fun big silly dude but he wasn't really interested in fighting anymore he was just kind of doing it yeah you know he like there's levels right there's a guy that's hungry that's that's that's trying to fight for a title and then there's a guy who is just doing it because that's what he's been doing and that's where he was yeah and i was like you had a lot more fire for this a few years ago and the problem is like you get knocked out a few times and then it gets worse and then it gets to the point where you get hit with shots and your body doesn't respond that well you see that with certain guys as they get older they get hit and then you see like not even the biggest shot but they just don't feel they don't seem like they can take anything anymore yeah I hope I can catch that myself so I don't have to wait for someone to tell me yeah you know but you remember when Chuck was at the end of his career yeah he talked about that Chuck talked about that really honestly and openly it was very interesting thing the way he would describe it he was like it's like your your brain is like hey you're too tough like you you don't you're going to keep taking these shots so I'm just going to shut off yeah it's just like your brain protects you from the impact after a while because it just knows what's coming and you just you can't take a shot like you used to yeah oh man that's I respect those I respect the hell out of those guys so they took a lot and when the sport was still growing so it's not like they made a ton you know thankfully Dana took care of some of those guys like Chuck Forest and a few of the other guys you know so that's always cool to see because if it wasn't for guys like that I couldn't be doing this you know those guys helped pave the way for for all of us no doubt no doubt if you really stop and think about it there's not another sport like the UFC where you can go back to 1993 and it's almost unrecognizable in comparison to 2022 to.

[1377] It's just, you watch the difference in the ability, the technique.

[1378] Like, everyone's so good now.

[1379] It's just from flyweight all the way up to heavyweight, you have so much skill.

[1380] I tell the guys on a regional circuit at the gym, like, you guys are in a different time period, different, like, this sport is a different beast for these young guys coming up.

[1381] I'm like, you're not fighting just a specialist who might not know how to punch a, punch himself out of a bad kind of thing like these guys can do it all yeah and uh on a regional level so some of these fights that i see i'm like this is so high level this could be literally showcased on the ufc platform beltor horizon yeah they could fight for any of those guys at the the talent and the education that they have and the reflexes the speed the power and the the fight IQ like some of these guys are battle they might not have as many fights but they're so battle tested coming up Like, it's just a different game.

[1382] Like, if I had to come up through this, yeah, things could have possibly played out a little bit differently on my way to the top, but I feel like my specialist talents being good at wrestling and blending that in for catch wrestling and finishing fights with the rain neck and choke on the regional circuit, I feel like that would have been a little bit more contested or maybe I'm self -short, I don't know.

[1383] But I feel like when I watch it, I see these guys, I'm like, man, this would have been much more tough of competition where before these guys couldn't sprawl, couldn't do, like I get these guys down and it's just like that now these guys can actually keep the fight like you gotta work a little bit now to get these guys down it's not just I'm just taking you down and gonna hang out like you gotta fight in these positions so these guys now man good luck and best of luck because the guys who do get through that gauntlet get to the top I just hope they don't take too much damage because again you know it's the same same thing I didn't have those type of fights on the regional circuit I like legit pretty much ran through everybody or I barely got punched so most of the shots I took were literally all falling into the UFC.

[1384] So like it's a cumulative damage in those early, early fights against guys who are real similar to, right?

[1385] Yeah.

[1386] And that's what I'm saying.

[1387] Like these guys from the debut fights are having these type of fights.

[1388] Yeah.

[1389] I'm like, I never had to experience that until the UFC.

[1390] It's hard to find a low level MMA show these days.

[1391] Exactly.

[1392] Even the young guys coming up with two fights are like super skillful.

[1393] Yeah.

[1394] Yeah.

[1395] But that's just so interesting to me because there's not another sport where you can go back to 1993 and it's so much different than it is now yeah it's impressive it's really impressive I mean there was no time limits there was no weight classes no gloves yeah people wore shoes wrestling shoes yeah they wore wrestling shoes or boxing glove crazy like how you're gonna wrestle with that boxing glove on man crazy and the sport is just continuing to to grow and expand that's what's interesting too it's like you're starting to see you know just better and better matchups, better and better fights, and there's so much when you get to the top of like some divisions there's so many killers vying for a spot Yeah, you know?

[1396] 135 is a great example of that, man. I think we are the best way class in terms of ranking on win streaks from the top, from the champ all the way down to I think maybe the top 15 that the UFC actually has ranked.

[1397] There's arguably like four or four, five championship level fighters in that division.

[1398] I think there's a total eight champions or former champions in our weight class.

[1399] That is so crazy.

[1400] Because if you really stop and think about it, any one of the guys is at the very top.

[1401] You know, you're obviously the champion.

[1402] But Jan has been the champion.

[1403] Sanhagen could be a champion.

[1404] They all have that level of skill.

[1405] And everybody's scrapping for that top spot.

[1406] T .J. Aldo Aldo's still dangerous He's not that old either I think he's got the weight cut down And I think that's why his performances Have progressively gotten better And that actually like Gives me like goosebumps when I say like I'm like Dude this guy is still Really freaking good Still really good man Aldo's still really good And I think he's only 33 Which is kind of crazy 33 or 34 something like that Something like that But you got myself You got Jan Dilshaugh Aldo Marlon Vera.

[1407] You got Cruz.

[1408] That's five.

[1409] Faber never actually retired.

[1410] So that's six.

[1411] Your boy Marab.

[1412] Frankie Edgar.

[1413] Yeah, Marab is an animal.

[1414] Marab has the craziest gas tank.

[1415] No, remember I said last time?

[1416] I was like, get yourself a Marab?

[1417] I wasn't joking.

[1418] Dude.

[1419] He's an animal, man. What a great training partner he must be.

[1420] Oh, all the time.

[1421] The guy would take his shirt off his own back for you, man. He is unreal.

[1422] Like, they don't make people like this guy.

[1423] Like, not in the States.

[1424] at least i haven't found nobody like that this guy will do anything for anybody on the team that's just who he is he's so tough too man that uh marlin marize fight yeah jesus christ oh my goodness i had a heart attack in a corner i was like oh my god i was like roll roll marize is an interesting character man he he how big is he he's he very big for 35 like when you're standing next to him He's a thick boy with three Cs.

[1425] I wonder, I always wondered with him, like, what is, like, he doesn't see, he seems to fade, like, in the Sohudo fight, and I've always wondered, like, is he cut in too much weight?

[1426] Because he looks so big.

[1427] I think it's anxiety.

[1428] You think that's what it is?

[1429] Yeah.

[1430] Yeah.

[1431] I feel like with guys like that, I've seen guys who are stacked in the gym, it's almost like, if they don't get you out of there or hurt you and they have to go to the whole, like, duration.

[1432] I feel like they tend to wilt a little bit because they're not used to that pressure of being the nail.

[1433] You know, they want to be the hammer so bad like if they're not being the hammers.

[1434] Like, I think where I got that from with him, I feel like it's the anxiety because maybe he's gotten tired multiple times in the training room, training with Edgar.

[1435] I don't know if he was there when Garberin was there.

[1436] But situations like that, I feel like when they've gotten tough, maybe because when you mark mark henry goes like think about everything your grandmother or your mother has done i'm like for me that i'm like if you have to go to those depths to get me motivated you know you you know what are you like kind of telling us that we don't know what happens behind the scenes that's what i'm thinking this is like this is my battle warfare talking and and how i like assess things in situations how you could look at it has anyone ever said anything to you in the corner that made you change the way you thought and really fired you up i mean ray ray always ray lago's the best ray and matt that's like all joe you're killing him all joe that's yeah it's uh even in the last one he said look at the motherfucker let's turn around look like yep i see him ray and uh you know and matt sarah should have a fucking show where they should follow them around and they corner firefighters yeah that would actually i think that would be a good series great series and then they go out to eat and talk shit i'd watch it yeah i'd watch it i think that someone should put that together espm plus yeah put that show together ray longos hilarious it's crazy how long he's been doing it too yeah coaching training and uh i think he just his birthday just passed because i just had they just gave me a day aljimate star on day nassau county long hour may 23rd dude you got your own day i got it my own day which is insane yes that's incredible you got your own day it was a wild experience man so i said this is a day of self -care drinking lighting up your jays do whatever you want just be a good person have a good time um but his birthday was the was the uh the 20th and um i forget why i was even bringing up his age i think well i'm saying like he's like 64 there's that beautiful woman yeah this is aljima sterling day that sisters my niece that's amazing um but to see how how he's still doing this at his age it's insane man because he's looking him crazy ray he says some really good words man i love him um when he's awesome when he's in a corner you have to scream yeah you know so at his age to be doing that like i i know it has to weigh on him a little bit like being much on the body but he cares you know about his guys and that's why it's so cool because like to have him at this age still doing this like He loves the sport.

[1437] You know, we love him for it because he doesn't have to be doing this anymore.

[1438] You know what I mean?

[1439] Yeah.

[1440] But he's invested, and I think that's what makes it so special for us because just to have him around.

[1441] I mean, he's been there for now.

[1442] How many world champions now?

[1443] Matt Serra.

[1444] Tris.

[1445] Yeah, Wyden and you.

[1446] All from Long Island.

[1447] All from Long Island.

[1448] When Wydenwood was coming up, I remember Ray Longo told me in the corner.

[1449] He beat somebody.

[1450] I forget who he beat But it was before Quite a bit before he fought for the title Ray Longo looks at me He goes This kid is a motherfucker That's what he said He goes he's a motherfucker I go yeah He goes yeah Keep an eye on him I was like wow Like when Ray Longo Longo tells you something like that You believe And then I think he knocked out Munoz He knocked out Munoz With that crazy elbow Oh my God And it was just like He was just like he was the boogeyman for a while people forget when Chris when Chris Wiedman was the champion and he was on his way up to the title he was the fucking boogeyman put people away oh my god he's almost like marab in the sense like uh no one will say his name kind of thing like no one was calling out chris Wyman no one's calling out Marab you know what I mean so it's like yeah well when he caoed Anderson Silva and everybody was like what that is that real yeah they started grasping at strolls though You know, the thing about that fight, man, is Anderson had a very good strategy in the early going, and he was landed very effectively to Wyman's legs.

[1451] Remember, Wyman dove on a knee bar?

[1452] Yep, from the top position.

[1453] Right.

[1454] He, like, jumped from half guard and went out and spun out into it.

[1455] And I was, I was like, wow, this guy is really going for it.

[1456] Yeah, and Widman's jiu -jitsu is solid as fuck.

[1457] But Anderson got out of it somehow or another.

[1458] And then, but maybe who knows, during that, he might tweaked his fucking knee or something.

[1459] But when he gets up, he's, like, chopping at the legs and looks good doing that.

[1460] But then got into that thing where he's trying to pretend that he was hurt, like just taunting him.

[1461] Yeah.

[1462] And when Weidman did that back fist to the left hook, that was the key.

[1463] Boom.

[1464] Boom.

[1465] It was so brilliant.

[1466] Oh, shit.

[1467] It was so brilliant because he always goes left to right.

[1468] Like, so you throw your right hand.

[1469] he moves offline and then he comes back in the other direction but wideman hit him with a back fist that confused his rhythm turn it off yeah because you've got to adjust then he hit him with the hook yeah so this is like early in the fight he takes him down and i'm i maintain that wideman during this time period when he was a champion was one of the fucking scariest guys ever in this division he was awesome he was a killer do you remember that horrifying joel romero knock out of him yeah that was Oh, that flying knee.

[1470] You know what's interesting about that, too?

[1471] We were speaking about knockouts, talking about our losses and stuff.

[1472] And he was saying, like, that Yowell Romero knockout versus the Gaggard, Musassi, versus that one.

[1473] He said that one was way worse for him in terms of, like, the post -after effects.

[1474] Really?

[1475] And then I had one with Zabit.

[1476] I've talked about this before.

[1477] And versus the Marlon fight, the one with Zabit in the training room, he threw a 360.

[1478] spinning ninja kick and the leg wrapped around my neck.

[1479] Oh, Jesus.

[1480] I closed my eyes.

[1481] I had never seen a ninja jump at me like that in the room, ever.

[1482] Like, I'm not in shape.

[1483] Ray just asked me to jump in there with this guy.

[1484] I don't know who the hell he was, but I felt like I was set up for failure.

[1485] He does a 360.

[1486] He's doing sidekicks.

[1487] He's doing jumping switch kicks.

[1488] So I'm like, yo, what in the fuck is going on?

[1489] And he's a lot bigger than me. I mean, although it was only 45, but I didn't realize how big he was, so he took his shirt off.

[1490] and he's doing these sidekicks from both sides.

[1491] I'm shooting in.

[1492] He's pulling me up and hitting me with these sombo throws, judo throws.

[1493] And I'm just getting ragdolled.

[1494] I'm like, if I wanted to go up at 45 at that point in my career, I'd be, that would be a nightmare matchup ever.

[1495] Like, me and Zabit just would not go well.

[1496] Where's Zabit been?

[1497] I think for like religious reasons, this is what I heard.

[1498] I don't know if it's true or not.

[1499] So don't condemn me. But I heard it was religious reasons that he kind of stepped back.

[1500] And I think like maybe like family too.

[1501] but if that guy came back it would be problems man he doesn't know his gas thing has been questionable but this guy is a certified ninja oh he's fantastic I caught him in an arm what do you call it from half guard well you're full guard and you sit out to your side and you do like a shoulder crunch to clamp I had him in that and I thought I was going to get the tap but he was so flexible his elbow was just hyper extending I'm like am I about to like break this guy's arm I mean hyper extended in the trainer room because he won't tap.

[1502] And then I try to switch to a triangle, he gets out.

[1503] And that was like the only success I actually had with him.

[1504] I mean, I hit him a couple of times, like boxing.

[1505] But overall, I was the one getting kicked from just Guam.

[1506] He just hit me and he's like almost like sagged, just like extending these long ass legs and then getting out of there.

[1507] And then the second round, he just does this tornado thing.

[1508] I'm just like, I close my eyes like, and then it just whack.

[1509] I opened my eyes and everything was just blurry.

[1510] As it felt like it felt like my head was in that big ass bell.

[1511] just went dung and I just sit back I hit the cage and I go I wave off like bro I'm I'm done this is over and I that one actually had way worse symptoms for with that knockout really yeah I mean I wasn't out but I was out yeah I still saw everything that was happening but I couldn't move like my body was like not responding not responding I was like this is not I you got can't have too many of those you know that's a problem with training right like some guys We'll do that to you.

[1512] I didn't know who the hell this guy was.

[1513] If Ray had ever seen a highlight of this guy doing anything even close to that, my whole approach would have been different.

[1514] Or maybe I'm saying, we're not having kicking.

[1515] We're just going to box.

[1516] I'd rather do that because I felt like I had way better success with that than I did kickboxing with him.

[1517] And I'm good at kicking.

[1518] But I couldn't kick this motherfucker.

[1519] This guy was just, he was a ninja man. He's so skilled.

[1520] He's so skilled.

[1521] And he puts all those traditional techniques to use like very few fires do.

[1522] Yep.

[1523] he can do a lot of wild stuff you know there's different styles that we're seeing are effective you know different striking styles that we see that are effective now and there's quite a few people that are taking like almost like a karate approach like a karate approach to movement but see you know yeah well his his was very karate right for a while right yeah yeah the when he fought wilson hayes he's a good karate guy boom he caught him out straight and I was like oh that was nasty if you had to choose if you had to say like this is who I defend my title with who would you choose who would your first after that fight you know I'm assuming yon and you will have a rematch eventually yeah but what is your choice would your choice be to fight him one more time would your choice be to fight tj what would your choice be it was totally up to you so hoodo what's your choice right now damn if it was my choice I mean, I feel like you would want to pick the fighter that you feel like you definitely would be, right?

[1524] I mean, for a title defense, I would think you would want to do that so you could keep the bell as long as you can make some money.

[1525] That's so honest.

[1526] You know what I mean?

[1527] That's so honest.

[1528] Philly talks like that.

[1529] Everybody says, I want to fight the toughest guy.

[1530] Because that's fucking stupid.

[1531] These guys are so stupid, man. It annoys me. Like, I'm an honest guy.

[1532] I can't just be, like, you know?

[1533] I keep it a buck.

[1534] Like, I would want to, pick the fight that I feel I would have the easier time with and keep that belt and make, I'm trying to cash out, Joe.

[1535] I hear you.

[1536] Like, I'm trying to get paid.

[1537] You're not in this position.

[1538] I think it's admirable, to be honest, like that.

[1539] That's why, even like, with the Yon fight, the first one, and people were asking me, like, what went wrong?

[1540] And they would call me delusion.

[1541] I'm like, dude, if I felt that he was better to me, I would have just said it.

[1542] I would have just said, this man is better to me. I need to close the gap doing this, doing this.

[1543] I didn't feel that.

[1544] and that's why I was confident going into that one, you know?

[1545] So it's kind of the same thing.

[1546] Like, if I'm going to be honest, like, if I just want to fight, which one would be the best for my legacy, I think T .J. or Aldo, in terms of, like, oh, I fought this guy.

[1547] Like, you know, even a cruise.

[1548] What fight is harder are those two?

[1549] For some reason, I feel like the hardest fight out of all of them is Aldo.

[1550] We don't really know how good T .J. Jay's leg is.

[1551] Yeah.

[1552] Like, TJ's leg got mangled when he's in that...

[1553] Submission with Corey.

[1554] Yeah, he got caught in a heel hook position.

[1555] And try to punch.

[1556] And he got out of it.

[1557] And in the scramble, I think he said, is when he really ripped it apart.

[1558] And it was...

[1559] I mean, kudos to him for winning the fight after that because that was him fighting three more rounds or four more rounds.

[1560] Was that first?

[1561] I think that was the first round.

[1562] Yeah, so four more rounds with a destroyed left leg against one of the best guys in the division.

[1563] Yeah Yeah Your history over Sanhagen It's probably one of my favorite of yours It's my favorite too It was so clean It was so clean It was so like Oh my God Like this is what's possible This is what's possible To a fucking elite guy Elite guy like Sanhagen He's elite He's really good The way he put out Frankie The way he put out Marlin I mean the way the guy moves I'm a big fan In his fight with Yon I'm a big fan of that but the way you clamped a hold of him took his back and strangled him was like who suffice grip I look as a jiu -jitsu guy that is to me like that is I know how hard that is to do yeah I appreciate that so much because it was it was so smooth you know it was just like it was just like incremental steps closer and closer to the finish once you got him down.

[1564] Yeah.

[1565] Was that like one of your most satisfying submissions?

[1566] I think it was because of everything that was at stake.

[1567] One, them disrespecting the two of us by not even giving us the title shot.

[1568] It was like a way of like booting me out.

[1569] I think they were really trying to make a San Hagan Yan for the title.

[1570] Dude, come on, man. God damn smooth that is out of ring.

[1571] That was amazing.

[1572] It's my power position.

[1573] It is clearly your power position, but that was one of the, best rare naked joke submissions i think i've ever seen because it was just it was so dominant and i know how good san hagen is it's not just that you did it it's just how good it looked and how good the guy you fought was yeah yeah against all the odds and ever since that day i started coming for their asses what is that one accidental blooper this out there you're saying i'm coming in that I said, I'm coming on an ass.

[1574] I say, Jan, you better win your fight because I'm coming on an ass.

[1575] I'm coming for that ass.

[1576] But that's it.

[1577] Good thing I caught myself.

[1578] So when the U .S., you know, your fight was how many months away now?

[1579] It was like how many months away ago was it?

[1580] Almost two months now.

[1581] So when will the U .S .C. come to you with an opponent, you think?

[1582] So I'm supposed to get news either today or tomorrow, who they will.

[1583] want us to be the next guy and um so what i am going to do i am going to release that information as soon as i get it but it's going to be on my podcast oh so people and how does someone get this podcast what's it called um the weekly scraps it's actually on all streaming platforms we're doing like a just i know we talked last time and since then i actually invested in a guy and he's been doing all my content now helping me do the clip outs how helping me with the podcast, helping me just get stuff out there.

[1584] So we're doing vlogs, and now we're looking to transition into, like, instructional videos for, like, MMA for beginners to, like, enthusiasts, like ourselves.

[1585] Like, just from a high -level perspective, like, different things that you would want to see, like an introduction to all the positions in BJJ, like basic positions, like a North -South.

[1586] What is North -South?

[1587] Right.

[1588] What is Fogart?

[1589] What is Half -Guard?

[1590] So I want to do this and try to build, like, some type of...

[1591] online school but there's so many different avenues it could go it could go you half guard but if a guy doesn't go for the underhook or if he does get to the underhook what do you do from that situation and you got to branch off and go into like this specific transitional sequence so there's so much I want to help bring to the um the mame game and just give my knowledge back to the sport uh I think that's going to be cool but we're looking to do that that's what he's helping me with now so hopefully that's going to be launched this week and all the other stuff is just on all other streaming platforms and all that.

[1592] So when you do fight next, when will it be around?

[1593] Probably September.

[1594] Because I think that's the next Vegas card.

[1595] Or I know they got the one in July, yeah, because I'm not, that's too soon for me. Yeah.

[1596] I've been doing too much, too much of this.

[1597] Actually, I take some of the whiskey.

[1598] You want more?

[1599] Yeah.

[1600] You want the Josh Barnett stuff or the Scotch stuff?

[1601] I do the Josh Barnett.

[1602] Shout out to Josh.

[1603] Yeah.

[1604] So when you get to an actual weight cut, like how much you actually cutting, like, day before the fight?

[1605] The last one I did nine and a half?

[1606] Nine and a half, yeah.

[1607] That's not that bad for you.

[1608] No, I'm used to cutting two to four pounds.

[1609] Really?

[1610] The last few fights, I've gotten bigger, thicker, whatever.

[1611] And the day before, I'm cutting way more weight.

[1612] I don't get it.

[1613] Maybe it's, are you doing any different strength and conditioning or anything?

[1614] Just the programs I've been doing since I've been an amateur.

[1615] Same, same exact programs.

[1616] I was thinking about, like, doing tutorials on that, like, what I'm actually doing for those type of workouts, too.

[1617] Because people haven't asked me, like, what we do for conditioning.

[1618] I don't know.

[1619] There's, like, I don't want to do too much, and then it's, like, I'm the, like, you're expecting that from me. Like, it's going to be, like, a subscription service, but I want to do, like, really specifically just hone in on technical.

[1620] things that you would want to know like people obviously want to know how I take the back and certain things so I could break down my fights and give that out so you can see step by step what I'm doing in this situation if someone does these things and how you can get to the back from those positions the one that I really like is the first one I got though in that second round and I slid into that take down like that one for me was almost like an improv too because once I got the takedown and he fell down I knew at that moment he's going to bounce back up unless I can figure out a way to capitalize while he's posting his hand to push himself back up.

[1621] And you have to, like, the way I timed that for never doing that before in training, like you can't drill that.

[1622] You know what I mean?

[1623] Like you can't take someone down and then that's high speed because then I'm just sliding into mount.

[1624] Yeah.

[1625] And yeah, that's like things like that.

[1626] I would like to break down so people can get an idea just to get inside my head of what I'm thinking from a grappler standpoint and for backtaking situations because that's ultimately where I want to be, where I feel like I could finish most of these fights.

[1627] And have you thought about doing the weekly scraps?

[1628] Is this about MMA?

[1629] Is it about life?

[1630] Is it about everything?

[1631] Like, what is this?

[1632] It's mainly about MMA.

[1633] I was trying to do an angle of like some life stuff, like Dana life stuff for me. But I just don't know what people really want to see.

[1634] I feel like people...

[1635] Let me stop you right there.

[1636] Just do what you think is interesting.

[1637] Okay.

[1638] Don't ever worry about what people want to see because you're never going to get a good response.

[1639] It's never going to make sense.

[1640] And it's only going to, like, whatever you want to do is only going to work because it's you.

[1641] Yeah.

[1642] Like, your take on things is going to be very different than anybody else's take on things.

[1643] And so if you want to talk about the news, if you want to talk about footlocks, whatever the fuck you want to talk about.

[1644] You should just talk about whatever you want to talk about.

[1645] Yeah.

[1646] And the people will either like it or they won't like it.

[1647] But it'll be you.

[1648] Yeah.

[1649] and if you think what will the people like like ah you're fucked because now you're going to start reading the comments I read the comments too much you're fucked don't do it you just do what you like like you're an interesting dude you're a smart dude and you're an honest dude that's like the most important thing for podcasting you have to be honest you're a very honest guy you know so you can just talk about stuff yeah and people will trust you they'll listen to you that's what people are missing they're missing like I think it's a lot of people out there that are missing honest conversations they're missing like a campfire talk where people just sitting around drinking whiskey talking shit like those are that those kind of like conversations are valuable and you're good at that so why not do that when you retire look at shop shot's bawling out of control you know there's a lot of fighters can do that chale's doing a fantastic job with that son and you know his He's the man with that.

[1650] He's the man. He's very smart with it.

[1651] And he's also like, you know, his opinion is very good.

[1652] Because his take is very intelligent on, you know, fights and predictions and how he feels like things are going to play out.

[1653] Yeah.

[1654] So there's a lot of great examples of guys who have taken their career post -fight and it just continued to expand and grow.

[1655] Yeah.

[1656] You know, a lot of them go into commentary.

[1657] Have you thought about that?

[1658] I got offered a gig in Boston, but I'm debating if that's really my angle or my expertise.

[1659] Like, I'm good at breaking down the fights, but in the live moment, what you guys do, like, calling the fights.

[1660] Like, even though there are some things, like, fighters are going to always be upset or feel like they're being slighted or biased commentary.

[1661] But it's kind of the nature of the game.

[1662] Like, you kind of tend to resonate with someone's style a little bit more.

[1663] Usually, that's, unless you just really don't give a fuck about the people fighting at this level.

[1664] But for me, I just don't know if I could do that because I feel like I would be more trying to break down every single situation versus like making it a fun experience for the viewer, still giving some knowledge so that they understand what's going on, that type of thing.

[1665] So that's a hard thing to do versus just analyzing it, like sitting down and actually just breaking it down without the pressure of like in real time.

[1666] Yeah.

[1667] Needing to talk about what's actually happening like right now in front of you.

[1668] Well, it's one of those things you get better at the more you do.

[1669] So if you had the opportunity to do it You'd really want to do it a bunch of time So you get better at it It's complicated Because you don't know when to talk And when not to talk And you have to have a good chemistry Between the three people that you're working with Or the two people rather the three of you together When like when John Annick's talking I have to be like real careful Like he might have a promotion And I might not be able to talk But I might see some shit going down I might see there's something happened Where I go oh he's going to about And but I can't say anything yet And, you know, and maybe D .C. wants to chime in with some, you know, points of his own, and he has some idea.

[1670] And so you have to have, like, we have, like, this vibe, almost like we have telepathy.

[1671] Yeah.

[1672] Like, we know when to talk and when not to talk.

[1673] You can feel the energy, the frequency.

[1674] Yeah.

[1675] But we have a shit ton of fun.

[1676] But we also been doing it so long.

[1677] You know, I've been doing commentary since 2002.

[1678] And before that, I did post -fight interviews in the 90s.

[1679] in 1997 and 1998.

[1680] So, like, I've been around for so goddamn long.

[1681] I was like eight years old.

[1682] You little baby.

[1683] Night of the champ.

[1684] But it's just been so long that I, you know, just a fucking insane amount of time.

[1685] Yeah.

[1686] I feel unstoppable right now.

[1687] Yeah.

[1688] I got a day undisputed.

[1689] Did you get to pick?

[1690] Life's good, man. How does it work?

[1691] Do you get to pick who you fight?

[1692] Kind of sort of.

[1693] Kind of?

[1694] I think to a certain extent, I know Dana doesn't think I won the fight.

[1695] I don't know if he changed his mind if he actually...

[1696] He didn't think you won that fight?

[1697] After the fight, went right to the press conference.

[1698] The judges...

[1699] He did it exactly like this.

[1700] The judges blew that one.

[1701] I'm like, what?

[1702] Can you really say that?

[1703] Yeah.

[1704] But then he kind of said, well, it came down to how you scored the first round.

[1705] So then how you can't say then the judges blew that one if you feel like...

[1706] Hey, man, that first round was super close.

[1707] Yeah.

[1708] And I was counting the strikes in my head while I was going on.

[1709] And then when I landed that elbow, I was like, I definitely won the round.

[1710] Like, there's no way.

[1711] I hit this guy more.

[1712] He's coming forward.

[1713] But octagon control is not because I'm walking forward.

[1714] My octagon control be me pivoting, you chasing me around and you can't touch me, but I'm controlling you and dictating where the fight goes.

[1715] So if you're throwing swinging and missing, that means you're not utilizing octagon control, which is being you cornering me every time I try to circle out and you do some damage and then you circle back out and you catch me again.

[1716] Like, you're not doing any of the such things.

[1717] You're just doing this waltz following my lead.

[1718] and I'm landing more strikes I don't see how you can score that and that's supposed to be the very very last criteria ringmanship ring general general um general general general what of it generalship general ship man I'm fucked up today but you can say arguably general membership yeah it's uh you know it's one of those things I mean it really it goes back to what we were talking about earlier that the scoring system sucks yeah it's um you know with no disrespect to the judges or anybody else I just don't think that that 10 -point must system is designed for us.

[1719] I think that's designed for people that are just boxing, and it's a perfect system for boxing.

[1720] It works great.

[1721] But boxing's two weapons, you know.

[1722] And the same MMA fighter has four with the same two hands.

[1723] These judges need to get knee in the head, elbowed in the head, and then they could talk to us about what is more damaging and significant.

[1724] Let me calf kick you four times in a five -minute span.

[1725] And let me, well, in a two -minute spin, because sometimes that happens.

[1726] And you tell me if you're affected from those strikes.

[1727] Why don't you just take their back and put them in a body triangle and squeeze the shit out of their organs?

[1728] Like, does it feel like a 10 -8 now?

[1729] That is the worst feeling, man. People don't know.

[1730] When someone's good and they have that good body lock, it's so disturbing because you can't breathe.

[1731] No, Joe, you're just holding them.

[1732] You're just holding them.

[1733] It's like, it's hard to breathe.

[1734] You remember when Ivan Salavari tapped somebody in the UFC with it?

[1735] I didn't know that happened in the UFC.

[1736] Yeah, Ivan Salivary tapped Tony Franklin.

[1737] He got him in the mount.

[1738] He got him belly down, rather.

[1739] So he got back mount, belly down with the body triangle.

[1740] And he just arches into him and just crushes his shit.

[1741] Goodbye to your spine.

[1742] Your spinal column, your ribs.

[1743] See if you can find that.

[1744] Because it's kind of fucking amazing.

[1745] Because it's what's also amazing.

[1746] Like, I've felt that in training where some guy has your back and it's, you want to tap.

[1747] Like you really, you think it's going to break your back.

[1748] but to be in the middle of a cage fight and pull that off is that's crazy and also interesting that it never really happened again yeah i don't think anybody ever tapped anybody with it again but i think it's valid you know what i mean it's like one of those things like a calf slicer how many calf slices are there in the ufc ever very few very few but that shit's valid how many twisterns very few yeah but that shit's valid yeah you know that might be valid too because i'm like i don't know too many people who've been finished with a body trying so here it is is.

[1749] He's got body triangle, and all he's do is just crushing his back.

[1750] See that?

[1751] Oh, my God.

[1752] And he's tapping.

[1753] Taping.

[1754] Taping.

[1755] Taping.

[1756] That's Hendon.

[1757] No, no, no. That's Salivari.

[1758] Oh, wow.

[1759] That's Ivan Salverry.

[1760] That's looked like a, from the profile look.

[1761] I was like, is that?

[1762] Salverry's got the dopest rooster tattooed on the side of his body.

[1763] It's really, it's really cool, like a fighting rooster.

[1764] But this is to know positions and to see someone tap from this is really extraordinary.

[1765] I've tapped three people with that.

[1766] like that in that position one in a jiu -jitsu tournament and actually two in a jiu -jitsu and one in a rematch that had as an amateur wow well if you get to that position where you're like a Gordon Ryan type character you start writing down how you're going to be people and put another piece of paper please one day do that body triangle from the back flattened out tap someone with that because it's a fucked up position it's a fucked up position it seems legit but I know that even when like if someone has my back and I'm laying on top of them and they have the body triangle it fucking sucks like I do agree those judges need to experience that when someone locks that shit on you and just crushes you in there oh it's so hard to breathe it feels terrible you have to take a shit it's the worst it's just really hard to breathe when your guts are being smushed that's the thing people don't understand like when you breathe If you have a good deep breath, like, there's a lot of movement in your abdominal muscles as well.

[1767] It's not just up here in your lungs.

[1768] When that shit is just fucking completely, destricted, you're like, you don't get much.

[1769] And some guys just know how to put it on you.

[1770] Yeah.

[1771] And that's you.

[1772] That's you.

[1773] Some guys know how to, like, hold a position better than most people if they're in the same spot.

[1774] It's so important for the sport because you get to see someone who, like, well, what's the worst thing that can happen to you in this spot?

[1775] Well, the worst thing you can happen to you in this spot is Al Jemaine Sterling versus Sanaghan.

[1776] Watch that.

[1777] Look at how helpless he gets at the end.

[1778] At the end, that's the worst thing that can happen to you.

[1779] I wanted to finish him standing so bad.

[1780] Why?

[1781] Because that would have been so satisfying.

[1782] Do you fight like that, though?

[1783] No, no, not like striking.

[1784] When I got on it, when I climbed his back.

[1785] Oh, I see.

[1786] And I locked it up.

[1787] And then when I watch it back, it goes, I hear you in a commentary.

[1788] And then you go, I think you say, like, he's got his neck, he's got his neck or something like that.

[1789] But I lock it up and I reap it back.

[1790] And I have, I try to go Matalillon.

[1791] I try to put the hand behind the head.

[1792] And he does a good job of just turning just a little bit.

[1793] But I felt like if I just squeeze a little bit more, I could have gotten it from the stand.

[1794] position and tapped them all the way down and I feel like that would have been an epic just like mind -fucked to everybody like I just came in there and under a minute took this guy's back threw him down climbed him like a tree strangled him and he tapped on the way down that's how the pressure that's how forceful the pressure was that would have been like a poetic justice for me like I mean it was still a beautiful ending but like that's so interesting no that you have like a specific way that you'd like to it have finished him so perfectly it's funny that you have like a better narrative a better one in your head that's like the walk -off KO for a jujitsu artist for me right I'm like very few guys have gotten it from that standing position like that yeah remember when charles olivera fought in the UFC looks like one of the first maybe a second fight in the UFC fought escrowe yeah and when effrain was the ultimate fighter champion and he got his backstanding yeah and finished him yeah and then we get up and he lets you go, it's just like, damn.

[1795] But I wanted to put him out.

[1796] Like, say, like, for a triangle choke, say that epic poetic justice situation for you is him trying to pick you up, and as he picks you up, he just passes out and collapses because you put him to sleep.

[1797] Like, that epic climax end to the fight.

[1798] That's, like, for me, that's what I wanted.

[1799] I wanted to, like, have him, like, on the way down, he's about to tap, and then he just goes out, and then I just get up and there's a dead body.

[1800] yeah and I like I like Corey I'm just saying like this could have been anybody just how I would have liked that finish to have gone well that was uh if you if you like how many times have guys like got a standing triangle before how many times does that happen where someone this Carlos Newton and um yeah powerball Matt Hughes and Carlos Newton catches Matt Hughes in a triangle and hoists him up in the air.

[1801] What is this?

[1802] Jessica Androge just got, oh, that was a standing arm triangle.

[1803] That's different.

[1804] But it was really cool that she did it, though, because that is a legit move.

[1805] Yeah.

[1806] The standing arm triangle.

[1807] But this is this triangle triangle.

[1808] Like from on top, the only time I can recall was Carlos Newton and Matt Hughes.

[1809] And he catches him and Matt Hughes blacked out.

[1810] And as he was blacking him out, he slams Carlos Newton to the ground and knocks him unconscious and then blacks out and then wakes up yes and they're like you won he's like I won and it's like he did win but like it's his last movement before he goes unconscious because he's in this triangle he's like I'm just going to slam him and he slams him to the ground and they both go out and then he wakes up first yeah it's wild is that what's supposed to happen I mean in the real world I guess he woke up first like we were in the jungle fighting to the death, I would have woken up and killed you if I were asleep.

[1811] I don't know.

[1812] I mean, he might have blacked out right after he committed to the slam that caoed Carlos Newton, which in case pressure.

[1813] Yeah, he wins.

[1814] He wins.

[1815] It didn't seem wrong that he won to me. You know, it seemed like it made sense, but it still seemed so crazy.

[1816] Were people disputing that?

[1817] I think people were like, hey, he was only out cold because he was caught in a triangle because he was like on top of the cage almost.

[1818] Do you remember that?

[1819] Yeah, yeah.

[1820] You're like held on?

[1821] I think you could hold on back then.

[1822] Yeah.

[1823] Let's see if you can find that.

[1824] I have standing triangle typed in and it's all it's given me. No, no, no, no, I understand because the thing is a standing triangle is arm triangle.

[1825] An arm triangle is when someone stands up and they clamps this on you.

[1826] What I'm talking about is someone who is in a triangle and someone picks them up and they're literally holding on to the side of the cage.

[1827] So they're riding on the guy's shoulders in a full triangle.

[1828] And, like, that was Carlos Newton and Matt Hughes.

[1829] This wild picture keeps coming up, too.

[1830] Oh, yeah, that was a reverse one.

[1831] Yeah.

[1832] Kind of like, um, Rampage, Rampage and Arona.

[1833] Who, who did that?

[1834] Toby Amada.

[1835] That's right.

[1836] Toby Amada.

[1837] He put him to sleep backwards.

[1838] I thought he was about to be the truth after that.

[1839] I'm not going to lie.

[1840] I thought he was going to be, I was like, that's godsent.

[1841] You did that to Mazel?

[1842] That's wild.

[1843] Um, so find Carlos Newton versus Matt Hughes.

[1844] And this is, that's a really interesting fight.

[1845] Carlos Newton was like one of the first badass submission guys.

[1846] They had like a real comprehensive submission game.

[1847] Yeah.

[1848] You know, Carlos Newton had a wild submission game.

[1849] He was fun to watch.

[1850] Yeah.

[1851] And so they had caught.

[1852] Yes.

[1853] Yep, that's it.

[1854] So Carlos Newton is like a mounted triangle.

[1855] And if you could find it, the actual video, video unavailable.

[1856] Oh, damn it, Zofa.

[1857] Let us have some fun.

[1858] I don't get that shit, man. I don't get that shit.

[1859] I don't even promote your shit.

[1860] How come they don't show the finishes?

[1861] Show the finishes on Instagram.

[1862] Yeah, I don't get it.

[1863] Everybody who bought it's already bought it.

[1864] Yeah.

[1865] You know?

[1866] So, oh, good.

[1867] Boy, we found it.

[1868] So this was like, I want to guess, what year was this?

[1869] Can I guess?

[1870] 2000.

[1871] I think it was saying UFC of 34.

[1872] Is that sound right?

[1873] Yeah.

[1874] I want to say this.

[1875] So look at that hole.

[1876] It's like, I'm going to chill.

[1877] And boop.

[1878] This might have been before 2001.

[1879] So he catches him in this Mald Triangle.

[1880] See, he's like leaning against him and slams him and knocks him out.

[1881] So Matt Hughes is unconscious there.

[1882] I just add to that.

[1883] Oh, they went to an ad.

[1884] Sons of bitches.

[1885] Jesus, Zufa.

[1886] Let us have some fun.

[1887] I'm not waiting 10 seconds.

[1888] I'm an American in 2022.

[1889] One and now.

[1890] So, but that was a case of someone going unconscious.

[1891] in the middle of winning so look they're both out and he wakes up and he's like what I won and he fucking won and he gets up and I think they're telling see he realizes right there he just claps his hands together I won he won what the hell that's got to be I don't know what he's saying mind fuck in his self Matt Hughes was like fucking tank back in his day that dude was a tank he's one of the like one of the pioneers of like that wrestler who's also a submission artist you know when he hit George St. Pierre with that far side arm bar remember that shit George St. Pierre like committed to a Camorra yeah and Matt Hughes hits him with a far side arm bar and you're like holy shit that's pretty high level man it's very high level it's in slow -mo okay so he slams him out Carlos goes out and then Matt goes out to limp limp right there he's fully limp look at his arms and look the referee steps in and pulls him off of him literally like pulls him out of the triangle I think he didn't even realize what was going on either well I mean he won though right because it's like his last gasp of energy slams him and that causes the chaos yeah so it's a legit win it's just the craziest shit ever yeah because I was just saying because he's out cold and then he's also out cold yeah it's wild but he woke up first so i guess i'm sure you've seen those fight fights where uh guys throw left hooks at the same time and they both go out yeah yeah the double knockouts i'm like what that is great that's happened more than one time man like how is that real i know it just seems like a movie you know it's like it's like it's like it's like condit and uh hardy yes both the same time but now instead of the Double knockout, one gets the words.

[1892] But kind of connected.

[1893] Yeah.

[1894] But like I was saying, I miss Dan Hardy on the mic.

[1895] He was good.

[1896] Yep.

[1897] I like his warm...

[1898] Really good.

[1899] He does on YouTube.

[1900] Yeah, I know.

[1901] He's great.

[1902] He does some of the world room stuff.

[1903] But he was also one of the ones that kind of counted me out.

[1904] Like, some of the stuff he said was inaccurate based on like...

[1905] I mean, obviously his perspective as a fighter thinking what I'm doing and some of it was off.

[1906] But for the most part, he does a pretty damn good job.

[1907] It's a hard prediction.

[1908] Two people actually fight, it's a hard prediction.

[1909] And even if they fought, and you don't know about certain aspects of, you know, what was going on with their health or in training camp or it's so hard to tell.

[1910] I gave them the knowledge, though, Joe.

[1911] Yeah.

[1912] I try to tell them what's up.

[1913] I said, you guys are fucking up with this one, but carry on.

[1914] Well, it's, but doesn't that make it all the sweeter when you wait those 13 fucking months of people talking shit online and then win?

[1915] And I was like, no, no, he won one.

[1916] Like he won, he won, it's not he won.

[1917] He fucking won, one.

[1918] He won.

[1919] He won that fight.

[1920] Yeah.

[1921] You know.

[1922] Even my hotel, I'm like, you guys didn't want to give me a day last year.

[1923] He gave me a day after I won one.

[1924] God damn.

[1925] That's what's interesting.

[1926] It's like you've already defended the title once.

[1927] Now, how does it work in terms of like, do you, when you become a champion, do you renegotiate your contract?

[1928] Do they give you more money?

[1929] From what I am to say, I'm new at this?

[1930] Well, you're not new necessarily because you defended the title.

[1931] Yeah.

[1932] but with this I think it just depends on the leverage standpoint and the relationship that you guys have because at the end of the day the UFC could do whatever they want to do they can give me $5 million for the next fight if they chose to but it's solely up to them what they feel no this is what we're going to give you do they try to encourage you to do stuff on social media to try to promote your air quotes brand like did they give you advice on how to like get out there So we had the athlete retreat, which we haven't done in years, which I hope we do do that again because that was a great time.

[1933] Just a bunch of fighters in one building.

[1934] You just never know what's going to happen.

[1935] I think that's, oh man, what was that, Cyborg and Mangana?

[1936] Yeah.

[1937] I was there live, like, from Roan Center.

[1938] You know what?

[1939] Get slapped by Chris Seiborg.

[1940] I was the ref in that one.

[1941] Me and Wyman, we're like two refs, both on both sides.

[1942] That's how close we were.

[1943] I was like, oh, damn, we just watched that in real life.

[1944] That's hilarious.

[1945] That's hilarious.

[1946] But for the most part, do they offer any resources?

[1947] And like, say if you wanted to, like, if a fighter wanted to start a podcast, wouldn't it be great if the UFC had like a department where they could help you get everything set up?

[1948] We would literally not just saying this because you're saying this, like literally just talking about this on the way here.

[1949] Really?

[1950] Yeah, my camera guy and myself, Jake, we're just saying if the UFC had a department literally just to help.

[1951] people that want to do other things like outside of fighting like help them get established in terms of podcasting, media or branding, whatever it is like just someone you can consult with either by weight class or last names type of thing and I think that would be huge because obviously like let's be honest the UFC is not in the business of promoting individual fighters.

[1952] They're in the business promoting the UFC they've done a great job with that.

[1953] Yes but no because promoting individual fighters promotes what you're doing.

[1954] Yeah, yeah.

[1955] Well, you're doing is you're selling fighters you're like you're showing fighters you're promoting fights with fighters the more you pump them up the better it is for everybody yes 100 % that's what you would think but i'm saying that's what then i don't think that's what they're necessarily i think they're always worried about like negotiations yeah you know like now now he's worth more money exactly but you would think common sense would say well if you got me at this percentage and you have me at a four fight deal if i finish in spectacular fashion the next four guys guys like case point let's say shronomali because that's an easy one for people to to understand um he wins his first four fights all by spectacular knockout he looks like he's got sent but he's on the same escalator as everybody else so what's like what's his incentive like now you got me in i showed you what i can do now where's the relationship where we can negotiate and say okay so for the next fight you did this this was the response this is what we think we can do so i think your fair share of or a pay bump up, pay bump up, a bump and pay would just be natural.

[1956] But because that's not the way humans operate, it's just, no, I'm going to keep you at the cheapest cost that I can.

[1957] And I get it.

[1958] It's a business aspect versus the other side of it, the independent contractor, you know, so we obviously always are going to want more money when we see our counterpart in boxing getting more money at its highest level.

[1959] But the guy who's coming in, like a Patty Pimbled, a Sean O'Malley, and they have great finishes coming up, and they have a lot of hype, a good fan base, they're not on the same pay scale as the other guys.

[1960] You know what I mean?

[1961] It's just, this guy isn't the same value as X isn't the same value as Y because X brings this to the table and Y only brings this to the table.

[1962] So I like X more, I value them more.

[1963] I should treat them as such so that we have a good working relationship.

[1964] But at the same time, it's also this only, I'm not trying to go on a fighter pay rent.

[1965] I just think that there's room for improvement.

[1966] I think that's very fair.

[1967] And I think you saying it that way is very important as a champion.

[1968] And I think it's very fair.

[1969] You know, like, there's always room for improvement in everything.

[1970] Like, I think the UFC deals with a machine that is so fucking big in terms of the amount of fighters.

[1971] It's, if you look at guys like Connor McGregor, right, like that's the top of the food chain in terms of, like, the ability to earn money.

[1972] He earns the most money And then who's under that?

[1973] Maybe is he?

[1974] Is he?

[1975] John Jones, when he fights again Yeah, when he comes back Like, what are the big Usman after the Mosvidal fight You gotta think Usman's Up there, 100, but it has to be And that's why they're talking about that Canelo fight It's only because of how big Usman's profile is now Yeah So there's that Like It's I mean, first of all, if you just think about just the sheer talent in each weight class, like how much harder it is to be a champion now.

[1976] It's way harder.

[1977] Way harder.

[1978] It seems like the hardest time ever to be a champion.

[1979] Even for me, it's like even the first fight, like obviously I had a, I was being denied a title shot for whatever, like whatever backstory that they have in terms of promotion or whatever, not wanted me as a champion.

[1980] That's the way I felt.

[1981] It could be completely wrong.

[1982] You felt like they didn't want you as a champion?

[1983] Like, what do you mean?

[1984] Yeah, I felt like they were seeing gold with these other guys as compared to the gold that was in front of them.

[1985] Like, I didn't seem as, I didn't appear as shiny anymore, which I didn't really understand.

[1986] I'm like, dude, I'm just as talented as these guys.

[1987] I'm actually outspoken.

[1988] I'm actually out there promoting.

[1989] I promote the UFC.

[1990] I promote myself.

[1991] Do you think it's like that some companies, not even just the UFC, but some groups of people, don't approve.

[1992] appreciate someone when they're right there.

[1993] Yeah.

[1994] It's like they don't see you for what your potential is.

[1995] They just see you for what your current state is.

[1996] Like, oh, let's look at his Instagram followers.

[1997] He only has this many or let's look at that.

[1998] Only this many YouTube views instead of like looking at you and thinking like, hey, we're partners here.

[1999] We're partners.

[2000] Like if you were partners, you'd probably want to promote me. That's what you would think.

[2001] Really fucking talented and I'll make you a lot of money.

[2002] We'll make a lot of money together, we'll smoke fat cigars and drink some cognac and have a good goddamn time.

[2003] But sometimes people don't see things that way.

[2004] And I think that it's probably an underutilized research, or a resource rather, because if you can make a really good connection between like the fighters and the organization just across the board and like anything has room for improvement.

[2005] But the more you do that, the more you're having like goodwill, like goodwill amongst the fighters and the organization.

[2006] but when people think that there's a lot more money in boxing there definitely is a lot of money in boxing at the top top level but like dudes who are fighting who just have in the beginning they don't get paid any it's terrible it's not like the UFC if you make it into the UFC at least there's like a minimum yeah like what is what is the minimum of a first fighter in the UFC when I started in 2014 when I got in at 2014 it was 8 and 8 Eight and eight.

[2007] And then I saw 10 and 10.

[2008] Explain to people how crazy it is to live off of eight and eight.

[2009] In New York.

[2010] And you have bills.

[2011] And explain like where all the money goes because it doesn't all go to you.

[2012] Yeah.

[2013] So at least for me, the way I break this down, after I get paid, I pay out my coaches, then I pay out my managers.

[2014] And then after I do that, I can tell us the percentages?

[2015] Well, we've agreed.

[2016] This is like in the beginning when we first started.

[2017] My coaches and I, 5 % each, so 10%.

[2018] And then the management, the standard management contract is usually 10.

[2019] I've seen 15, I've seen 20.

[2020] So that's 20 gone.

[2021] 20 % gone.

[2022] Gone.

[2023] Right off the top.

[2024] Right off the top.

[2025] So you make 8 and 8 ,000 to show up.

[2026] Step on the scale, but I think you really have to step in the case.

[2027] And then if you win, you get the other eight.

[2028] So $16 ,000, I pay them 5%.

[2029] I pay Uncle Sam.

[2030] I estimate what I'm going to pay Uncle Sam because if I don't have, a business set up where I can write off expenses I get tax at a higher percentile in the tax bracket just based on the individual getting paid versus me set up an LLC or escort depending on how much you're making at that point you probably would want to LLC and I'm not a tax expert but I'm just telling you what I've done I have an escort because now I make a lot more money but in the beginning I didn't have anything because it was like it didn't make any sense to pay for that if I wasn't going to right actually yeah so then after I do that you deduct expenses but back then I didn't have that so I was getting taxed at the higher percent bracket and then the expenses that it takes to get to the fight in terms of food prep it's a hard fucking road yeah but there's some value in that because the people that really want it as a career they're the ones who rise to the top yeah there's some value in that in the early days but at a certain point then it comes the argument well boxing has more money for its champions and uh if that i mean what what is what is the like what did gervante get for that knockout on saturday night by the way how fucking beautiful was that shit you know what was crazy i was like pull up jervante chaos romero because that is yeah nasty i felt so slick i feel good for romero watch this he goes to the head with a right hand and then he goes to the body with a right hand and then boom i mean look how beautiful it is when he lands this because he lands it and then he slides under the counter look at this look at how he dipped and cut that angle so quickly dude that was amazing offline I'm out of there peace you know what also is interesting is that it appeared that he hurt his hand or something in the fifth round oh well he did this yeah he did like a she like made like a ah like face like ah and there was a lot of speculation that he'd hurt himself and I said that I said that when we were watching live, I was like, I think he heard his hand.

[2031] And they probably listened to me. Like, he, I mean, they probably know I know what I'm talking about, but.

[2032] Well, didn't he break his hand in a recent fight?

[2033] I feel like he broke his hand in 2021 in the December?

[2034] I don't know.

[2035] I think December of 2021 he had a fight and broke his hand and went to a decision.

[2036] It's going to be like Mayweather.

[2037] You know, my friend Radio Rahim pointed something out today.

[2038] We're texting each other back and forth about this.

[2039] He said, this is around the same time in Floyd's career.

[2040] when Floyd started getting hand issues.

[2041] That's what I was just saying.

[2042] It was like he might be like Floyd.

[2043] Like he broke his hand and then he stopped like going after it and just like being people up.

[2044] Well Floyd figured it out though.

[2045] He figured out how to maintain his career even with those hand injuries.

[2046] Yeah.

[2047] You know, he figured out how to get people more excited about talking about him, but be better defensively.

[2048] Like if you go back and watch like the pretty boy Floyd fights when he's pretty boy Floyd, he was just fucking people up.

[2049] Yeah.

[2050] You know?

[2051] He wasn't getting hit like most people were because he was still really good defensively, but then you look how he got like later in his career, like you couldn't touch him.

[2052] Yeah, he put the beats on a lot of people, man. Dude, he was like the least hit boxer of all time.

[2053] If you really stop and think about it, what other fighter that you can say in recent memory who's fought top of the crop, best fighters, guys like Canello, guys like Ricky Hatton when he was coming up, Like, think about all the different people, Midana, all the different killers that Floyd fought.

[2054] Yeah, I didn't think he got hit so off, so little.

[2055] So few.

[2056] Yeah.

[2057] I felt like Madonna won the first fight, though.

[2058] Really?

[2059] Yeah.

[2060] It was close.

[2061] And based on, like I was saying before, about you sitting in the corner and me just wailing on you, I feel like that's got to count.

[2062] It's got to count for something.

[2063] Like, I feel like it was like 200 or 250 plus more punches.

[2064] Do you remember when Midna hit him with that level?

[2065] I think it was at the end of the one round, like fourth round or something like that.

[2066] He made $1 .5 million in total payouts.

[2067] It says according to Sports Grail, Tank was guaranteed a purse of $2 million, oh, I'm sorry.

[2068] Tank was guaranteed a purse of $2 ,000 while his opponent got $500 ,000.

[2069] Davis's pay -per -view share was 60%, which meant he walked away with $5 million, while Romero earned 1 .5 million of total payouts and that is the KEO shot in that photo.

[2070] Look at that fucking phone.

[2071] I also heard it was the largest gate at the Barkley Center.

[2072] Yeah.

[2073] Again Radio Rehame said it was packed and he said there was a lot of crazy violence too and he believes that people have said that gunshots were fired like they try to deny that gunshots were fired but he said there was a stampede and it was pretty wild.

[2074] Sounds like people lost money.

[2075] Something happened.

[2076] Got a little crazy But the fight itself was, you know, that he's emerging.

[2077] The fact that he can sell out that place and have, like, such a stuffed crowd to see him fight.

[2078] And then I want to know the pay -per -view numbers.

[2079] I hope it was really good.

[2080] I want to know my pay -per -view numbers.

[2081] I said it was a...

[2082] Dana, what's the pay -per -view?

[2083] They don't tell you?

[2084] Well, they haven't...

[2085] They haven't told us yet.

[2086] Hold on.

[2087] What?

[2088] Jamie?

[2089] This one was, like, 200K.

[2090] Let me see at the bottom.

[2091] That's what it says.

[2092] It got 200 ,000 buys.

[2093] I think it was like estimated he gets 200 ,000.

[2094] I don't know if it was an official.

[2095] He gets 200 ,000?

[2096] Yeah, that's a weird terminology.

[2097] Usually somewhere in the 200 ,000 range for able to be purchases.

[2098] Right, but I think he's bigger now.

[2099] I think there's something that was evident when you saw the sold -out Barclay Center, the way it was sold out.

[2100] It was like, it was a big event.

[2101] I think Giovante is emerging as like a superstar.

[2102] People are realizing, like, this guy sleeps people.

[2103] And he does it, like, that left hook that he had.

[2104] Who's that?

[2105] No, the uppercut.

[2106] Who did he do that, too?

[2107] Oh, man. It was sensational.

[2108] And it was a competitive fight.

[2109] It was a competitive fight against a dude who looked really tough, like you could take it.

[2110] And then he steps off to the left and fires that left uppercut.

[2111] Woo!

[2112] It's so pretty.

[2113] So pretty.

[2114] Watch, he hits him with a right hand, another right hand.

[2115] Bang!

[2116] I mean, come the fuck on.

[2117] Is there a more pretty shot in all of boxing?

[2118] And I'm out right there, just walk off.

[2119] They're all, they're all amazing, like, look at that.

[2120] That's fucking spectacular.

[2121] I mean, you could go back in history and think of so many amazing one -punch knockout fights, but that's as pretty as any of them.

[2122] That's it, one more time, please.

[2123] Dude, he hit him.

[2124] That's as pretty as any of them.

[2125] And he just knew.

[2126] Yeah.

[2127] Watch this shit.

[2128] Right hand, he throws it again.

[2129] Boom.

[2130] I mean, just walk off.

[2131] Sensation.

[2132] So he's a superstar, and he's a guy who delivers, right?

[2133] Romero was no joke, man. Romero is scary.

[2134] I was watching him in his power early on.

[2135] I was like, Jesus, this guy can crack.

[2136] Super confident in his power, too.

[2137] And he kind of had an odd, like, odd, like, sideways, like, almost like a marching in style.

[2138] I was just about to say that.

[2139] I didn't understand when he was, like, almost, like, back jabbing.

[2140] Yeah.

[2141] And I was kind of like, I feel like the way he's mechanically throwing his punches versus the way Gervante was, I just felt like, and I picked Romero to win.

[2142] I was like, I feel like there's something about this guy, but then when the fight started, I was like, why is he punching like that?

[2143] I feel like he's going to get nasty left hook, nasty left hook.

[2144] But I just couldn't see how he was going to land that.

[2145] I don't think he's, I think it's a probe.

[2146] I think, you know, like when he's doing that, I think he's kind of setting things up.

[2147] Yeah.

[2148] You know, I don't think he's, like, trying to, like, traditionally just throw a perfect jab out there.

[2149] I think there's certain times, and people do things where they're trying to set some things up.

[2150] And so they'll almost like backfist you.

[2151] Yeah.

[2152] Well, yeah, that makes sense.

[2153] And I figured he was probably worried about the speed of Davis because it's almost like Mighty Mouse.

[2154] Like he can hop around you and hit you in a blink of the eye and just he's gone.

[2155] Right.

[2156] And he's just like literally like a magician.

[2157] So I almost felt like that with Davis, the size difference, you have the power versus the speed and the power.

[2158] So it's like, this guy hits you.

[2159] He's hitting you and he's the same way he cracked him.

[2160] I'm out.

[2161] Like a thief in the night.

[2162] I robbed that motherfucker and I was out.

[2163] He hits him with that left hand and then ducks under to his right and steps away and he's gone as he collapses.

[2164] So you gotta be cautious of that walking forward so I can see that.

[2165] But then that made me realize like he's fighting Javante's fight.

[2166] Javante wants to play the counterfighter and if he counters him it's going to be ugly.

[2167] Yeah.

[2168] But some guys, even though a guy's a really good counterfighter, they feel like they could still put it on them.

[2169] Like Tiafima Lopez, when he fought Lomachenko, he still put it on him.

[2170] Even though Lomachenko is one of the greatest counterstrikers ever.

[2171] Yeah.

[2172] Like Lomachenko is spectacular.

[2173] It's footwear...

[2174] But Tiafemale presented so much danger.

[2175] He has so much power.

[2176] And he was big, you know, like...

[2177] It's a lot bigger than him, I feel like...

[2178] A lot bigger than him.

[2179] Yeah.

[2180] I mean, Lomachenko is really probably better suited to 30.

[2181] Yeah.

[2182] And 30 to five pounds at 30 is big.

[2183] It's a big difference.

[2184] And, you know, when you look at Tiofimo, he's a big guy for that weight class, too.

[2185] He's cutting some weight.

[2186] He's cutting some weight to get down to that weight class.

[2187] And, you know, he just presented so much danger that even though Lomachenko would probably like to counter, it was too risky.

[2188] You know, and you see that happen in fights sometimes where guys are just, like, every Deonté Wilder fight, everyone's just so scared.

[2189] You can't.

[2190] Because any moment, bang, he just drops the hammer on you.

[2191] Yeah, and gets sent him.

[2192] to the freaking gulags he might not ever come back you see the memes with Anthony Joshua when he got when he got sent what's that when he fought Andy Ruiz yes and he got sent and that's what we say we say you got sent you got sent you know he sent you he sent your shit but yeah when he got sent they showed him like as a ghost leaving the eye at the gun who does those someone does those they're genius The one guy's Ray Rod, I think.

[2193] Yes, I think it is Ray Rod.

[2194] I think it is Ray Rod.

[2195] I think you're correct.

[2196] Yeah.

[2197] He's also the one that put Thanos's glove on somebody.

[2198] It's hilarious.

[2199] It's hilarious.

[2200] Yeah.

[2201] Whoever did Conner's with Eddie Alvarez, that one was being for it.

[2202] Like Dragon Ball Z's like, like, ching, chik.

[2203] I'm like, oh, my God.

[2204] What a combination that was, huh?

[2205] Yeah.

[2206] When Connor beat Alvarez, what a combination that was.

[2207] I feel like it was just a perfect stylistic matchup for him.

[2208] Yeah.

[2209] Oh, yeah.

[2210] Oh, yeah.

[2211] Oh, Tyrone Woodley.

[2212] Oh, my God.

[2213] Like, how do you make this?

[2214] That's insane, bro.

[2215] Rino's got a rumbo comes in and cleans it up.

[2216] That's hilarious.

[2217] Oh, my God.

[2218] It's too good.

[2219] The internet's undefeated.

[2220] The internet is something special.

[2221] Get to showcase your talents.

[2222] Wasn't that a crazy fight?

[2223] This one?

[2224] Jake Paul knocked out Tyrone Woodley.

[2225] Did that surprise the shit out of you?

[2226] Yeah.

[2227] I didn't think by knockout.

[2228] I was like, maybe Woodley.

[2229] takes this fight more serious and I don't know time though yeah I feel like he's all over place he he was supposed to fight Tommy Fury Tommy Fury something happened I think he got injured and so then they called Tyron Woodley but I don't think he they gave him much time no it was a short notice fight very short notice I know he got paid good for his which is good for him at least you know no it's good for him but that's not er yeah I don't know if I would want to I know like the tradeoff like if you put me in that position you give me the option to pick that like to make my money I don't know if I'm taking it.

[2230] Well, some hesitation.

[2231] Clearly, no one gets that choice.

[2232] I mean, he didn't try to do that.

[2233] But if I knew, like, this was my faith.

[2234] What do you think about that?

[2235] Because some people are really dumb, and they think that people choose to get knocked out on purpose for money.

[2236] And someone said, oh, he took a dive in that fight.

[2237] I go, I don't even think it's possible for you to get hit like that and not go unconscious.

[2238] Like, you see the way he got hit, he got it perfectly.

[2239] And if you watch him faceplant If someone's gonna go out They're gonna like break their fall a little bit You know They're gonna they're gonna That dude got knocked out for real for real No you work for that money if you go face plant cold Without protecting your face if you can If they're trying to say you I'm not denying the idea that there would be someone out there That would let you knock them out for money There definitely is And there's definitely some guys that will take a dive Like the ultimate fighter Inside the house where he's like Punch me bro Oh my god That's so crazy.

[2240] It's like, dude, you just wasted one of your knockouts that you had for your career.

[2241] How many do you get?

[2242] How many can you really get?

[2243] It's different for everybody, right?

[2244] But what is like a reasonable number of times you can get knocked out?

[2245] Shit, man, I already got two.

[2246] Well, technically three from wrestling a shot into my teammates' hip.

[2247] We were fighting for the same weight class, and Mark Akara shot into his bony -ass hip.

[2248] He was like 5 -11.

[2249] Bony hips, and I'm skinny too, so I shoot into his hips and I knock myself out.

[2250] in overtime and I lose a match because he takes me down and I have no idea and I wake up and I'm like okay let's finish the match I didn't get injury time nothing I was like oh this is crazy but yeah so wow three times but um I don't know how many of those you can realistically get I mean we can look at the guys who have been knocked out consecutively and then seeing when a jab really makes their eyes roll back in the back of the head kind of thing yeah that's when it gets scary yeah but how do you stop that from happening do you do you think that should be an individual's choice do you think that should be something that the coaches prepare a fighter for early in their career and they go hey we're going to coach you and we love you we're going to take care of you but there's going to come a time where i'm going to have to have a conversation with you and tell you something you don't want to hear which is that your skills have eroded your your body seems to be failing you and we're troubled that you might be showing some evidence of cTE and we would want to stop your career right now yeah see that scares me man i get for this comment kind of this kind of conversation I get more like anxiety not even anxiety like I get more emotional about it yeah like because it hits home you know because I I realistically have to think about that every day and I notice there's going to be the geniuses out there that say well no one told you to do this I'm like yeah but this is what we chose to do obviously someone's going to do it and we enjoy it so I think there's a gene and if you have a variant of this gene it makes you more susceptible to CTE.

[2251] Rhonda Patrick talked about it.

[2252] I think it's, I might be fucking this up, but I think it's APOE4 or something like that.

[2253] And that she said that people who, we'll find out, because I'm gonna butcher this, but people that have this issue with their genes, if they have a specific gene, they're more likely to get like severe brain damage, chronic traumatic encephalopathy that's it what is it called TMEM TM EM 106 what boy did I fuck that up totally why don't I think it was something so different than that scientists have zeroed in our genetic code to better determine why some people develop chronic traumatic encephalopathy the Alzheimer's like disease associated with repeated hits to the head and new study researchers at Boston University CTE Center said that a variant of the gene, T -M -E -M -06B, may influence why some people experience more severe forms of the disease than others.

[2254] So it seems like the variation says are 2 .5 times more likely to develop dementia.

[2255] That's a lot.

[2256] So it seems like you get tested and find out if you have that.

[2257] How's your grandparents?

[2258] Unfortunately, they're not alive anymore.

[2259] Our grandparents?

[2260] Yeah.

[2261] Yeah, they're not alive anymore.

[2262] Yeah?

[2263] But when they were, where, like, conversations, like, good in terms of like?

[2264] Yeah, they never, no, they never developed Alzheimer's.

[2265] Unfortunately, one of my grandparents, I only knew my grandparents on my mother's side.

[2266] And one of my grandparents, she had a stroke when she was, oh, God, I'm not sure how old she was, but they gave her 72 hours to live.

[2267] And I was a kid.

[2268] and she lived for like 12 years wow yeah she she lived for a long time and it was a real struggle it was really rough and then my other grandfather took her husband rather um my grandfather took care of her and i stayed with them when i first moved to new york when i first moved there from boston in like 91 something like that and uh it was so sad man and it was but it was it gave me an understanding that like this could happen this is what happens to people your body fails you and do what you want to do with your life now so for me as a guy who was at the time like 22 23 years old I guess I was and I was staying with my parents because I was trying to make this move to do stand -up in New York and I'm staying with them in Newark and I'm watching these old people die in front of me you know and as a guy who's just beginning his life away from his parents and just you're like starting this career of trying to be a comic and then seeing these people whose life is on the last page of the last chapter and you love them and they've been with you since you were a child i remember fishing with my grandpa when i was five years old man just him like laughing and smiling with me and spending time with me and now here i am a man and i'm staying with him i see him fading and i see my grandmother barely hanging on and i remember thinking you know that this is just how human beings go and you have to get this in your head and if you don't see it you could live your life like you have all the time in the world but you know you don't those days are coming for everybody so live it up bitch yeah that's yeah that's beautifully put because i think um we only have one vessel we only have this one experience i'm not like a super like oh the crazy spiritual stuff and all that but yeah i don't say let me not say crazy I mean not say crazy spiritual stuff, but I'm not crazy into the spiritual stuff, I should say.

[2269] But I do understand that time goes.

[2270] We never get that back.

[2271] And it is the most valuable thing.

[2272] I think you actually, when you talk to Max, he was actually saying that, like, when he goes to the gym, like his most valuable thing is his time.

[2273] Like he comes in, he doesn't talk to nobody.

[2274] He's just super dialed and super focused.

[2275] And I think he's right.

[2276] Like even now, I'm having the trouble with that balance because so many people are pulling me in different directions.

[2277] and I almost feel, I don't want to say obligated, but I feel like because I miss so much when I'm in training camp and I'm never really around, I almost feel like I'm, like for myself, I'm almost making myself feel bad about not being able to hang out with everybody so I need to try to do everything when I do have the downtime to go see everybody because I look at it twofold.

[2278] It's like time, memories, not being able to make those, the sacrifices, to do what I love and also provide an income for my life.

[2279] So it's like, how do you balance that out?

[2280] And I have to try to, I battle with that because I don't know what's too much because I do feel, like since this last fight, man, just imagine 13 months of a whirlwind.

[2281] And then after the fight, you think life is going to slow down because that's what it always does after the fight.

[2282] But it just feels like now I'm getting more, and naturally, but now I'm getting more required.

[2283] us to want to do all these things or come out come hang out come do this come do that people i haven't heard from him so long and i'm just like time to change your number sir yeah it's uh yeah it's uh yeah i feel bad you might want to get a second phone and these are people that i like you know but they're asking me to do this and how much for this or can you come here and just and just do this like not even paid like but it's just like some of the stuff is goodwill but i'm just like how much is yeah you got to have your own time yeah so you're going to have to figure out a way to filter that out and say no because you're yeah you're well you're gonna get to a point where there's no way you could say yes to everybody yeah and you probably already long past that yeah so you're you're you just the sheer amount of time that you need to dedicate to training and preparing for a fight so like say if the ufc comes to you and says okay we have aldo it's gonna be september blah blah blah let's go and you like okay i got to dial in and then all of sudden everybody wants this from you and that from you and come here and do this and could you be on my that And when you do this, and then you're like, fucking Christ.

[2284] Yeah, no, it's a lot.

[2285] But that's because you're the champ.

[2286] Yeah.

[2287] Well, that's what I said naturally, so I get it.

[2288] But I think sometimes they might not realize the pressure that is on us, so to speak, for us to try to please everyone as best as we can.

[2289] To see what Tyson Fury does?

[2290] No. He makes a message.

[2291] Puts it out there.

[2292] He says, I'm going into camp for the next four months.

[2293] And he starts talking about I was going to be off social media.

[2294] I'm not going to be answering my phone.

[2295] I'm going into hiding.

[2296] And that's what I do.

[2297] Yeah.

[2298] And maybe that's what you need to do.

[2299] Just say, look, I'm training.

[2300] Like, this is it.

[2301] If you call me and I don't answer, don't take it personally.

[2302] I'm not answering any phone calls.

[2303] Yeah.

[2304] So now, here's my issue.

[2305] My problem with doing that is that Tyson Fury in terms of what he makes financially to support himself, I feel like if I were to do that, the position that I would be in in terms of self -promotion or making money outside of fighting in terms of like sponsorship and things like that, I would semi need to be kind of like active and out there kind of thing.

[2306] Okay, that's a different talk.

[2307] Right.

[2308] I'm talking about people trying to get you to do things, not give you money.

[2309] Oh, yeah, but these people, some of them are trying to give you money.

[2310] Some of them, some of them.

[2311] Oh.

[2312] Some of them.

[2313] But some of them just want to, yeah.

[2314] Filter those out into the all of them category.

[2315] Yeah.

[2316] So it's a tough balance.

[2317] It is.

[2318] But your time is so precious.

[2319] If you think about the amount of required time that you need to prepare for a fight Just think about how many hours of every day And this is, especially if you take into consideration recovery Yeah Right recovery stuff can take a long ass time Right, if you decide you're going to go to a place And do a son of cold plunge and go back and forth That shit's you killed an hour You got an hour, the hour's gone Okay, so that's the hour you're not training You're just recovering And then how many hours are you fighting?

[2320] You're like, what are you doing?

[2321] Do you run?

[2322] Do you lift?

[2323] Do you have strength and conditioning workouts on top of your jiu -jitsu workouts, on top of your wrestling, drilling, on top of your MMA sparring, hitting pads, doing rounds in the bag, like, shit, man, there's no time.

[2324] And then you've got to eat, and you've got to fucking sleep.

[2325] And you've got to shower.

[2326] Yeah, you've got to shower.

[2327] Double time.

[2328] Kind of wash those nuts.

[2329] How many times, or how many hours rather a night do you try to get in?

[2330] I still struggle with sleep, but I've gotten better where I'm sleeping before two, and now I sleep before one.

[2331] for the most part.

[2332] Last night I went out, I had to explore Austin a little bit.

[2333] It's cool.

[2334] Went to the bars.

[2335] It's so funny, like everything was empty, then slowly start to pick up, and then slowly I'm taking more and more pictures with more people, and then this person is asking, what do you do?

[2336] I'm like, I'm such a nice guy.

[2337] I don't have security.

[2338] I'm just like, for me, I'm just a regular dude that just punches people for money, and that's it, you know what I mean?

[2339] So when I go out and people are like, one guy who was wanted a pitcher, he put his hand on my shoulder, It's always fascinating when I see this.

[2340] The trembling is unreal.

[2341] And I was like, yo, bro, you're about to push me over the mouth.

[2342] As much as you're shaking on my back right now, it's kind of crazy.

[2343] It's weird, right?

[2344] But I get it.

[2345] I get it.

[2346] I don't see myself in that light.

[2347] But you're probably the same thing.

[2348] I'm just freaking being Joe.

[2349] Right.

[2350] You're just being a person.

[2351] Yeah.

[2352] So I think some people look at us in more of a different light, especially I could only imagine for you.

[2353] Like, for me, I'm just like, I'm your everyday Spider -Man.

[2354] here to save the world you know one fight at a time we're we're all just people it's just when you don't get used to being around famous people yeah until you're around famous people and then after a while you realize oh they're just people yeah but it takes a while and some people they're just like dude's taking your picture i remember my uc debut uc.

[2355] 170 you call that one ronda rousey versus sara mcmann dc versus pat cummings and i see all these guys as i'm walking on the campus, I call it campus, the campus of the Mandalay Bay, and I see all these big wigs that I watch on TV all the time, and I'm like, stay calm, stay cool, stay cool, don't, don't look like a weirdo, don't say anything weird.

[2356] Like, I would just do like a cool head and I like, so.

[2357] That's hilarious.

[2358] And just walk by, I'm like, don't be that guy who's overly like fanboying out kind of thing, like just be a regular person.

[2359] And I'm like getting to watch some of these guys warm up and I get to see as a guy coming up making his debut I'm 8 and O at the time and to see how these guys are doing these veterans I got to even see like a better experience for myself in terms of what I'm doing and kind of gives me more reassurance of where I'm going and that I kind of have a good grasp on things at just that point in time and where I was at in my career when you do it now when you're around famous people now like it just seems normal right yeah yeah like like sometimes I'll see people like if I bring my friends out and they'll see somebody and they'll be like and I'll be like yo bro like what are you doing right now and then I have to remind myself like oh yeah this is like their first time so they're going through that that learning curve I'm like yo bro just be chill please but yeah now it's just yeah just regular why this guy puts his pants on the same way we do like that's everybody yeah yeah the only way we're ever going to learn from each other is to understand that we're all exactly the same thing going through different lives we're all just people different amounts of energy different personalities but it's kind of the same essence at the heart of all people they're going through different things and if you had never been around a famous person you're just like this person all of a sudden you're standing in front of Michael Jordan it's like you don't know what to do if I ran into him that would be really cool I'm sure you will like I ran into the rock when he when DC Ford John Jones the second time and he was in the back and I got to meet him that for me was huge I'm like That dude's gigantic Yeah he's a He made me I'm like see this is where I say size And skill I'm like I don't know if my skill Could do anything to this man This guy is probably made out of iron He's too big Yeah There's certain guys that are just like They're too fucking big But yeah It was a cool experience Like I didn't know how I was gonna Like act so I try to like He's a nice guy Like be cool Like obviously I just won the fight So I'm on adrenaline high already And I see this guy I'm like, yo man, I got to get a picture with you.

[2360] I was like, that might have been a little aggressive, but I'm sure he understands.

[2361] How old are you now, Al Jermaine?

[2362] 32.

[2363] So you're like right in your peekity prime right now.

[2364] When you think a professional athlete at like a championship level, that's right there.

[2365] That's like the sweet spot.

[2366] Yeah.

[2367] For a fighter, that's like where you're, yeah, the body of mind.

[2368] But it sucks in the sense of I don't really know how much longer I would.

[2369] want to do this.

[2370] Like, in the sense of I have the desire to want to do this, but I don't know how much I want to more I want to do this in regards to what we were talking about before, just post -career.

[2371] Right.

[2372] Quality of life.

[2373] Right.

[2374] So you have to know when to pull the shoot.

[2375] Yeah.

[2376] And it's like, well, what if it's just one loss?

[2377] But then I can see how that one loss would be like, okay, that was just one.

[2378] Maybe he just got lucky.

[2379] And then you do the second fight and maybe you have another bad loss.

[2380] And then you're like, okay, maybe that was just two bad fights, too bad fights, too bad nights and then now you're going down this consecutive pattern and it's like well when do you know when to chill and I don't know and then we got that killer of course I'm a Rob DeVos really so yeah at some point you know I think we'll um I'm either going up or he'll try to go down it just depends on how soon everything happens I mean because if he beats one more contender you know he's he's next in line well I certainly think that you can have a great career outside of MMA that you can set up now yeah and I think that what we're talking about about you doing podcasts and just talk about whatever the fuck you want like do your podcasts about MMA talk about whatever the fuck you want and something like that could help you know if that can grow it's not much different than anything else like we're already doing it you know how to do it just keep doing it and then people go oh I like the way he talks about shit I like the interesting subjects he covers just talk about whatever the fuck is interesting to you yeah and you can develop something that just like Shab's done, where when you leave your fighting career, you have a full career.

[2381] You have, like, and they're connected, and it helps, they help each other.

[2382] Yeah.

[2383] But see, I guess where I'm at right now, I have to be honest and go, and this is my crazy side again, taking over the way I think, is how much is too much, how much is possibly a distraction and taken away from the main source of income, which right now, which I should be capitalizing on is fighting and getting better.

[2384] That's a good point.

[2385] That's a good point.

[2386] But if you have an hour to play video games, you know, if you have an hour to fuck off, you have an hour once a week that you could do a podcast.

[2387] It's not a lot of time.

[2388] You know, you have 24 hours in a day and seven days in a week, and you just need one hour a week.

[2389] Just sit down and do something one day a week.

[2390] If you just commit, it's not that hard.

[2391] I don't think it'll fuck you out because I think a certain amount of reflex.

[2392] and time off and stuff, is actually good for your performance.

[2393] So, like, if you have this one hour thing that you do once a week where you just talk about shit.

[2394] Yeah.

[2395] I don't think that's bad.

[2396] If you were doing it every day, I'd go, yeah, it's going to get in the way.

[2397] Yeah.

[2398] Because it's not really just one hour.

[2399] It's one hour.

[2400] You've got to get there.

[2401] You got to fucking do it.

[2402] You shoot the shit, and then you leave.

[2403] Yeah.

[2404] Yeah.

[2405] And before I got Jake, I was shooting myself, editing myself, trying to do my own clipouts to myself, and uploading everything myself.

[2406] this is during the training day and then I'll go train twice that day like it's a lot of effort and as a champion particularly because you're training for five round fights yeah and that additional 10 minutes of work is a lot that's a big that's a big gap isn't it people don't get that you're fighting for almost half an hour you have to be absolutely focused for almost half a fucking hour and talking to one minute break in between rounds, like, talk about intense.

[2407] Like, I don't, like, most people who don't have the attention span to even, like, read a book, you know what I mean?

[2408] So to have that attention span to do that for a half an hour where the consequences of you not focusing are so detrimental to your health and well -being, and you being a highlight reel for the rest of your life, it's a high -stakes sport, man. So you got to read, it's a lot more difficult than people think.

[2409] and I it's tough it's just not easy well also you have to avoid being injured is there another combat sport where people get injured as much as MMA fighters when you factor in the wrestling the submissions and the striking all together I feel like the opportunities to get injured for MMA fighters to pull out of fights they're way more numerous than boxers do anything like more MMA fighters pull out of fights because of injuries than boxers oh yeah 100 % but then we also like if you hurt your rib and you're a grappler, like, that could be very, very crappy and you might just go in there mainly because of the paycheck that you just need, or because they probably work another job or probably don't have any other income, which I've been in that situation twice before.

[2410] Or, yeah, because if you're a grappler, that's going to affect you more, so you probably be tough to do it.

[2411] But if you didn't have any of those woes and you just had that happen, you're probably going to pull out.

[2412] Like, no, I'm not going to fight injure.

[2413] What's the point?

[2414] They say that Anderson, when he fought Chale Sun and had a fucked up rib.

[2415] Oh, yeah, I did see that.

[2416] That's why I didn't really struggle so hard to avoid the takedowns and try to fight off his back and then tapped him with a triangle.

[2417] Ribs are not fun.

[2418] It's a shitty injury.

[2419] Terrible injury.

[2420] Did you see that fucking dude in Bellator, Korskov, who caoed that guy with a spinning back fist or a spinning back kick to the ribs and broke seven of his ribs?

[2421] I didn't know he broke that many ribs.

[2422] It was a nasty kick, though.

[2423] Oh, my God.

[2424] It's when you watch the impact of that and you see where it's hitting on the guy's body, you're like, holy shit.

[2425] Like, because we know.

[2426] Because I felt it.

[2427] You felt it.

[2428] You know what that feels like.

[2429] Yeah.

[2430] The everyday person, I don't know if they know what that feels like in high speed.

[2431] Like, that's a fucking...

[2432] The impact, when you see like the slow motion photo, its foot is like four inches deep into the guy's rib cage.

[2433] Yeah.

[2434] It's just like, oh.

[2435] Yeah, I wouldn't trade places with that guy.

[2436] Yeah, they had an x -ray of it.

[2437] All the, all, like, things, seven ribs are shattered, and they had to screw them all back together again with plates and stuff.

[2438] See, I don't like injuries like that, man. This is where it lands, like, right there.

[2439] Boom.

[2440] Yeah.

[2441] Collapse.

[2442] Yeah.

[2443] And Chance is a really fucking tough guy, too, man. For a guy to go like that, to go down like that, like, you know he's in real bad shape.

[2444] Yeah.

[2445] Now, that guy is pretty damn good.

[2446] But Ben Ascran be him, though.

[2447] Ragdoll him.

[2448] Ragdoll him.

[2449] What does that say?

[2450] I still maintain that.

[2451] That Ben Ascran was primetime Ben Ashton.

[2452] 100%.

[2453] When he did the same thing to Douglas Lima, he manhandled him too.

[2454] Ben Ascran, look at that.

[2455] That's his ribs.

[2456] Look how bad they are.

[2457] He gets a lot of flak, but...

[2458] Dude, Ben Ascran, when he was the fucking Belator champ was the shit.

[2459] He was ragdolling everybody.

[2460] Yeah, and his hip.

[2461] Because he had surgery and his hip.

[2462] Yeah.

[2463] So before that, I think when he was like, at that point, I think he would have beaten a lot of guys.

[2464] And I think a lot of these other fights probably would be a lot different.

[2465] I mean, DeMazvizal need, that's just perfect timing.

[2466] Yeah.

[2467] It was a great strategy, too.

[2468] Like, the way he circled off to the right and then charged at him, almost like, like, Ben's instinct would just be to try to take him down.

[2469] He saw it coming.

[2470] Imagine if he actually tried to sprawl instead, like, instinctually.

[2471] Right, right.

[2472] That fight goes maybe a completely different way.

[2473] Right.

[2474] Yeah.

[2475] Oh, body kicks, man Spinning back Spitting back body kicks Damn What's that?

[2476] Fucked up He was like Rinding in pain from that Yeah, well, that's the exact same spot First of all, it's where the liver is And second of all, your ribs break Yeah That spot is a terrible spot And it's the heel The heel's like the hardest bone In the human body Yeah, you stomp on rocks with that thing Yeah, you throw that shit And someone's rib cage Spinning the torque Speed, it's not, it doesn't feel good.

[2477] Do you anticipate going up to 45?

[2478] I do.

[2479] And I think it just depends on the rest of the, like, how the next few fights go.

[2480] If Max Holloway and Volcanowski fight, and then after that, you know, whoever wins that fight, would you think about that fight?

[2481] Like a super fight like that?

[2482] That would be cool.

[2483] You know what's crazy?

[2484] That would be a great fight.

[2485] I still came and wrapped my head around that I'm the UFC fucking champion.

[2486] It's pretty crazy Like I knew it was possible Right But actually being able to say that out loud It's like Is it even sweeter that you did it But people were mad at you The way it went down Yeah And then you did it for real, for real Yeah Is it even sweeter?

[2487] Oh 100 % But I had more pressure on me Because then it was like Oh, you were never the champ anyway Even though I did feel like I was a champ When I beat Sanhagen We were the two best And highest ranked guys With the most high profile wins For some reason got leapfrog For a title for a guy that was coming off of a loss with Jose Aldo and Pejorian, shielder.

[2488] So those guys, he fought a guy that had just been and knocked out, you're right?

[2489] I mean, it is what it is.

[2490] That's history, but I felt like the champ for a while and I felt like I just had a shitty defense, but in whatever happened, in reality, you know, that was a shitty way to win the belt and the way I won it made things so much better.

[2491] Like, I didn't care about the win or the loss.

[2492] I really didn't.

[2493] I just wanted have a good performance to remind everybody who I was what I'm capable of doing and to show people that that last fight was not that was a shell of myself and I still did as good as I did and for me I I pet myself on the back because I'm like man most guys would have quit and like this is too tough this is too hard I'm just gonna just just go home I can pack it in at any given moment when he hit me with some of those shots man those I feel like those would have put a lot of people down hands down came and picked my hands up because I'm so exhausted and just three two crack me right down the pipe no head movement nothing I'm like Dude, I took my looks like a man. He messed up, gave me an opportunity to show that that was 100 % correct what I was saying and got to really show who was who.

[2494] And he had more time to prepare for me. I was on the sidelines, you know?

[2495] Right.

[2496] So way more satisfying to come back and do that.

[2497] And even the October fight where they want us to fight, I shit you not.

[2498] I came home from a sparring session with Marab and I told my roommate, Steve, and Pumi at the time.

[2499] And I just tell him, I think I'm going to have to go out there.

[2500] wing it again and they looked at me like what the fuck are you talking about i'm like dude my conditioning's not getting any better you guys have seen the sparring i'm not ready to fight but i need the money one i needed the money um and two i felt like i couldn't pull out of the fight because of um just the standing of the way everything was i felt like the UFC would have been really pissed i mean who wouldn't be obviously you but they i felt like they didn't ask me before they put me into that.

[2501] I don't feel like I know they didn't ask me. Do you feel differently now that you're a champ, like you wouldn't accept fights if you really don't think you should be fighting?

[2502] Like now you wouldn't make that fuck and I need the money decision?

[2503] Yeah, 100%.

[2504] And it's not like I'm bad with my money, so just so people understand that.

[2505] I live in New York.

[2506] I bought a house in Vegas to save money on taxes, so that's my primary residence.

[2507] So I try to spend more than half the year out there.

[2508] And the other side of it is I don't spend a lot of money on other stuff and I normally pay all my taxes right away.

[2509] I'm pretty good with that type of stuff.

[2510] So for me to say I'm having issues with money, like it's not issue, let me not say issues.

[2511] But now just being able to see where I'm at, especially after the last fight, I put myself back in the green where now I don't need to do that.

[2512] Like I don't need to jump into a stupid fight just to prove that I'm tough or just to prove that I need to make a paycheck.

[2513] Well, as a champion, I mean, what are the protocols?

[2514] Like, how do you, do you get to decide who you fight next?

[2515] Does the UFC tell you, here are your options?

[2516] Do you get to pick out of those options?

[2517] As far as I know from this very short title, well, actually, it's a pretty long title rain at this way.

[2518] Over here.

[2519] Oh, you weren't really the champ.

[2520] You were really the champ.

[2521] I don't know if I really have, like, options like that.

[2522] I think they know who's the money fight.

[2523] And who moved.

[2524] And you think that's all done?

[2525] who moves the needle.

[2526] I don't know if it's Aldo that moves the needle.

[2527] I know Tj definitely moves the needle.

[2528] You can ask you Sada.

[2529] Tah!

[2530] Oh, no. We should end the podcast with that.

[2531] That's hilarious.

[2532] And then Sehudo.

[2533] And then Sehudo.

[2534] So there's options.

[2535] Yeah.

[2536] So you got a lot of options.

[2537] And how long for Sean O'Malley?

[2538] Honestly, if I'm being honest, that guy is really fucking good.

[2539] He's fucking good.

[2540] And I like his honesty.

[2541] and the way he breaks down fights and analyze it, kind of reminds me of myself, except he's a little bit more brash about it.

[2542] It's like, Frankie was winning that entire fight with Cheeto until he was won 13 minutes of a fight until he got caught with the front kick.

[2543] Very accurate.

[2544] Cheeto was losing that fight.

[2545] And the way he breaks down all this stuff, he's a good analyst and honest about what he's looking at.

[2546] His terminology may not always be the best to describe it, but he knows what he's talking about.

[2547] Good movements, slick on the feet.

[2548] And I think his faints are what really does him well, especially having that length and that range of this weight class.

[2549] I do think he might be a little weak, though.

[2550] Like, I feel like if I grab that guy and put a body lock on that guy, I probably break his ribs and get a submission with a standing body lock.

[2551] Really, he crunches back like the Hulk, just gah, go.

[2552] How rude?

[2553] How rude is you?

[2554] I just think he's, something has to lack.

[2555] You can't have the power, the speed, the height, and the lever.

[2556] You can't have all those things.

[2557] God did not bless you like that and to have a big, you know what I mean?

[2558] Like something has to lack.

[2559] So you feel like if someone is real long like that, they're probably not as physically strong.

[2560] Yeah.

[2561] I feel like that was the case with Sanhagen.

[2562] I feel like that was the difference.

[2563] Like even Jan, I don't feel like he was overly strong, but him being more compact, I feel like he was more explosive than Sanhagen.

[2564] I felt like he was a little bit stronger in some of those positions as well.

[2565] Yon's style is very interesting to me because he's one of the rare guys that fights and moves forward with his hands like way up here.

[2566] With four ounce gloves.

[2567] way up here I mean he's he's a very strong defensively too you know it's like by being by being that hyper -aggressive a lot of times guys open up but he doesn't open up that much he stays in a pretty solid shell that's why the second fight was so fun for me one part that did scare me though he did something different in that it was either fourth for frown this is why I need to will watch it and really break it down that he's never that I've never seen him do when I was breaking down his fight footage to see where I would be best at.

[2568] And he started, normally he'll start the combination, he'll switch, he'll play with the hands a little bit, he'll do his faints, like a little subtle movement, and then he'll touch with either a jab or parry the hand, hit the jab, switching to a south pole, hit the cross, and come back with another south pole, another, a cross from the south pole position or a hook to catch you coming out.

[2569] He started one of the combinations, from what I remember with an uppercut, and then switched stances.

[2570] And I swear to you, when he hit me with that, It caught me so off guard.

[2571] I was just like, abort, abort, abort.

[2572] And this is what I turned my back to him.

[2573] And I kind of, like, run away a little bit.

[2574] I'm like, yo, bro, I'd never see you do that.

[2575] You got to chill out.

[2576] You can't be changing what we've watched all fight camp.

[2577] You know what I mean?

[2578] So that's just how I am.

[2579] So I see different things.

[2580] And when he caught me with that, it was so far.

[2581] And I was like, oh, that was a sneaky setup.

[2582] And it landed a good shot.

[2583] I had to, like, really, like, get out of there and reset the position to make sure I was still in the driver's seat of that fight.

[2584] because that was like for me the one scariest moment because I'm like he could have came with a head kick right behind that caught me off guard and I could have walked right into that but that's why I kind of like try to turn away from him so if he did hit a head kick it would have been like on my shoulder or something you know what I mean just kind of get out of the way what if they came to you with a rematch I don't want to fight him again not right now let me not say I don't want to fight him again right now I had to think about this guy for almost 24 months I like to see a different face I feel like we're married you know it's like a Sauer relationship at this point.

[2585] I bet that's how Max Holloway and Volcanovsky feel by each other.

[2586] Have to.

[2587] And I think, what if Max wins this time?

[2588] They've got to fight again.

[2589] That's insane.

[2590] It's going to be like a Turogadi and Mickey Ward, right?

[2591] I feel like if Max wins and it's definitive, I think Dana moves on to another fight.

[2592] Really?

[2593] That's what I think.

[2594] Really?

[2595] I felt, even if the fight with Jan and I was a no contest, I felt like he would have moved on to another fight.

[2596] And wouldn't have even give me a chance to redeem the...

[2597] title shot because I feel like he kind of has his like layout what they do in the war room like where they want fights to go who they kind of expect to win and if it does go that way they's like okay this will go here and they kind of like moving around like chess pieces to kind of like see which way they could build the best storyline or make the most money kind of thing which is smart is that also just dependent upon results inside the octagon no of course you're marketable you're only marketable based on what you've done yeah but I think they have an idea of what this person might do like I talk to the matchmakers and you can hear like the way that they analyze the fights and they'll kind of rate a fighter based on like what they think like from their perspective they see like a physique and this is just I'm just making this up but they see a physique and they go like oh that guy's a fucking killer like that guy's so good like they have like they're predetermined like what they could potentially do and they kind of have an idea of like who they're going to match them up with who can sell because of their style their performance and I think they have to kind of see like they have an opinion so to speak but the fights and the results results or how the fight, like, no, who would have thought Carla Exposer 2 and Rose Nama Eunice would have looked like that?

[2598] You know what I mean?

[2599] So it's like, it's crazy.

[2600] Like, you just never know, but you kind of have an idea.

[2601] That's the best example ever of you never know.

[2602] Yeah.

[2603] Because it's crazy.

[2604] I thought that was going to be a wild scrap.

[2605] I did too.

[2606] Carla beat her in the first fight.

[2607] Carla has shown much improved skills in submissions and takedowns and stand -up, everything.

[2608] You know, Rose is the queen.

[2609] You know, Rose dominates Yawanna.

[2610] Rose beats Zhang Wei Lee with a head kick Like come my fuck on man Yeah And then beats her again In the rematch Like come on That fight should be chaos Yeah Nope Nope for whatever reason That was That was But that's Fighting is crazy You know what's sad about that Both of them think That they won Do they really?

[2611] Yeah How can they think that And that's what I said I was like But you both didn't really do anything I mean who can Who can say Who won that fight?

[2612] Yeah, it's got close.

[2613] I would, if you were a judge, you should have a shrug option.

[2614] You know, you should have like, just in case.

[2615] Every now, they brought out the shrug, like, because it's so crazy.

[2616] Like, you decide.

[2617] I'm not even going to decide.

[2618] No one can tell you who won that fight.

[2619] So who gets the belt?

[2620] Who keeps the belt?

[2621] They kill the division.

[2622] We're killing the division.

[2623] You're going to have to fight at 125 now, ladies.

[2624] I did.

[2625] Actually, I know you talked about this before.

[2626] Belt changing hands with DQs.

[2627] Yes.

[2628] Yeah.

[2629] Yeah.

[2630] I know you've talked about that.

[2631] I don't think it should.

[2632] I think you definitely should have won that fight, and I think you should have gotten your win bonus, and I think...

[2633] I got a flat fee, by the way.

[2634] He got...

[2635] Do you?

[2636] Yeah.

[2637] For the title, challenger, I got a flat fee.

[2638] At least that was written in a contract before with the fight.

[2639] That's nice.

[2640] And then...

[2641] I just think that should be the case with all fights, don't you think?

[2642] Yeah.

[2643] I mean, are you really fighting harder to get...

[2644] You know what I'm saying?

[2645] Like, you're fighting.

[2646] It's the hardest fucking thing in the world.

[2647] I want to win.

[2648] You want to win.

[2649] You're not going to fight less hard if you...

[2650] you, you know, don't think that there's a bonus.

[2651] Like, you want to win.

[2652] And your pay goes up if you win.

[2653] So why would you not want to?

[2654] I don't like that.

[2655] Because it's your subject.

[2656] This is why I don't like it.

[2657] I don't think it's an effective motivation or incentive.

[2658] And two, I don't trust the judges.

[2659] Not all judges.

[2660] Some judges are great.

[2661] Let me clarify.

[2662] Some judges do a fantastic job, and I agree with them 99 % of the time.

[2663] That's all you can ask for.

[2664] But occasionally, some of them are so egregiously wrong.

[2665] 3027 one way 3027 the other way That's make any sense And the people Boo when they hear the decision Like what the fuck Occasionally And now if that costs you Half your money Because someone didn't do a good job Or a couple people suck at their job Yeah That's dumb That doesn't make any sense I always before I would break down My financial earnings And what I would have to like Estimated to pay And see what I would be left over with Before each fight And I would do two sides One if I won and the other devil's advocate, if I lost, like, okay, this is what I would have and kind of help me budget in that sense.

[2666] But it's like, so if it's like no one gets the belt, then it's like, then what happens with the belt?

[2667] Do we both fight for a vacant belt?

[2668] Then no one gets championship paid.

[2669] They fight again for free.

[2670] Everybody gets their money back.

[2671] I don't know what does happen.

[2672] I don't know what the right thing is.

[2673] Well, the real question is like, who does Carla fight now?

[2674] You know, what really would be interesting is a rematch with Yawani and Jay.

[2675] check.

[2676] Oh, yeah.

[2677] Because that first fight, when Yonah beat her, I mean, that was a brutal fight.

[2678] But can you throw her back into that after that last one with Wei Lee?

[2679] I think that was the last time she fought.

[2680] Well, I think.

[2681] Aren't they fighting again?

[2682] Yeah, they are fighting again.

[2683] Yeah, Yohanna and Wei Lee are fighting next.

[2684] That's going to be a...

[2685] Well, I was saying if Carla were to fight Yawanna again, I feel like that would have been tough to kind of just throw her in there after that.

[2686] After not...

[2687] After not being active and her last fight was a loss.

[2688] I think it was a loss.

[2689] I'm not sure if she fought somebody else, but...

[2690] Yonnas fight?

[2691] Yeah.

[2692] I think she lost.

[2693] She lost to Wei Lee and then that was it.

[2694] She lost by decision, I thought she won that fight.

[2695] I thought she won that fight too.

[2696] But it was super, super close.

[2697] So that's June 11th.

[2698] That's a great fight.

[2699] It's a great fight.

[2700] Is that the Singapore card?

[2701] Yeah, that's Singapore.

[2702] That's the Singapore card.

[2703] Oh, that's a fantastic card.

[2704] That card is amazing.

[2705] That's Glover and Yuri Prohastka, too.

[2706] I don't know why I just did that high -pitched voice.

[2707] That's crazy.

[2708] That's amazing.

[2709] Yuri Parhaska is fucking interesting, man. he's interesting he's a wild card such a wild card he there's no backward steps he just comes at you with this wild ass karate style you know did you see the clip of him yelling in like the wilderness or somewhere I was like what the hell is going on in this world he like wraps a towel on a tree and punches trees and shit out there he's like the 205 Tony Ferguson yes yes with crazier hair yeah but uh You know, his fight against, like, Dominic Reyes is a perfect example of that.

[2710] He just waded right into the fire against one of the most athletic strikers in the division and eventually caoed him.

[2711] Yeah, I felt bad for Dom.

[2712] I like Dom.

[2713] I like Dom a lot, too.

[2714] And Dom, arguably, a lot of people thought that he should have got the decision over John Jones in that fight.

[2715] Right?

[2716] Remember that?

[2717] I mean, John had two fights like that, with Gustafson, the first one, and the Dom Reyes fight.

[2718] where I really, when I first watched the Gustafsson fight in real time, like when I was watching it live, not in person, but live, I thought Gustafsson won.

[2719] And when he got the decision, obviously, that's a friend of mine.

[2720] So I was happy he won.

[2721] I was like, oh, shit, it was close fight, but glad he got the win.

[2722] But that was a fight.

[2723] I actually thought he had lost.

[2724] And the Dominic Reyes fight, every time I watch it with my roommates, we talk about the fights and we go, who won that fight?

[2725] They always say, Dom.

[2726] I'm like, yo, I don't know, man. We watched the fight.

[2727] We try to score each round.

[2728] And I go, not John Jones won that round But then I'm like, I don't really know I feel like you can The argument is there that Dom won that fight It could, you know In a close fight Look, with different judges It could have easily gone that way Yes It was one of those fights But that's interesting about John's career Is because like when he's challenged That's when he's at his very best He's good man When John's challenged But one of the things that happens with John I think is like some fights aren't as big a fight It's on Tiago Santos.

[2729] So don't train is hard.

[2730] Maybe.

[2731] You know, I mean, it's hard to tell because, like, when he shows up for D .C., he's fantastic.

[2732] Yeah.

[2733] You know, when he shows up for certain guys, when they're really dangerous.

[2734] I think it's that competitor's edge when someone's talking shit, you almost want to rise to the occasion even more to kind of shut them up.

[2735] I feel like John has that ego in him where it's just like, I have that extra competitive edge where I want to win and shut you up so bad that.

[2736] This fight, I'm going to look like a motherfucker.

[2737] Yeah.

[2738] And, yeah, that's what he did.

[2739] I'm interested to see what happens at heavyweight.

[2740] The Stebe fight is going to be good.

[2741] Is that actually happening?

[2742] I don't know if it's actually happening, but if they make that, I can't see why they won it.

[2743] The other fight is in Ghana.

[2744] Yeah, but he's out.

[2745] For how long, though?

[2746] ACL surgery, I think it was.

[2747] I think he tore a couple of things.

[2748] He's a couple months out of surgery, right?

[2749] But then training camp, you got to recover, get the stuff.

[2750] John Jones v. Steepay makes sense for UFC fight this summer.

[2751] Dana, and that's in April 27th, or April 17th, rather.

[2752] Yeah.

[2753] Who knows?

[2754] I would rather watch that.

[2755] Well, Al Jermaine, let's wrap this up.

[2756] Congratulations.

[2757] It's beautiful to see you succeed after that 13 months of people talking shit about you.

[2758] You win in the end.

[2759] They can all suck it.

[2760] The troll master.

[2761] It means nothing now.

[2762] Every mean word means fucking nothing.

[2763] You won.

[2764] And best of luck to you and everything.

[2765] And tell everybody how to get a hold of you on social media.

[2766] What your accounts are?

[2767] One of my accounts are Funkmasters MMA, Instagram, the Twitter.

[2768] I talk a lot of shit on the Twitter.

[2769] TikTok, I'm on that now.

[2770] YouTube, Funkmask MMA.

[2771] So check out all the vlogs.

[2772] Behind the scenes.

[2773] We've been doing a ton of stuff.

[2774] The fans, especially the weight -cutting stuff, the fans seem to love all that science and crazy shit.

[2775] I hate it because I'm dying.

[2776] It's horrible because you're dying, but it is kind of fascinating when you realize how a guy, like, people say, oh, he's the 135 -pound champion.

[2777] I go, nope.

[2778] Yeah, he's 135 pounds for about.

[2779] four minutes yeah that's it all right well thank you brother appreciate you good to see you good luck in the next fight and bye everybody