RotoWire Fantasy Football Podcast XX
[0] Welcome on in.
[1] This is the Roto -Wire Fantasy Football Podcast.
[2] I'm your host, John McKechnie.
[3] That is Mario Puig.
[4] This podcast, of course, a welcome distraction, if you will, because...
[5] You know, the nation heals as the Yankees repealed their facial hair policy.
[6] So now guys are going to be all scruffy on the Yankees and pinstripes.
[7] I'm still processing it.
[8] I'm sure everyone that's listening is still processing it.
[9] I had no idea on that one.
[10] It just came out this morning.
[11] It is going to change my life, yes.
[12] Yeah, I pretty much almost took a sick day after seeing that.
[13] I was so disturbed by it.
[14] But, you know, we got to press on.
[15] Again, we got to heal.
[16] And the best way to do that is to talk about football.
[17] And today, in particular, we are going to continue our prospect series looking at running backs.
[18] We got the combine coming up.
[19] Next week, so next week's episode will be all centered around that.
[20] Might even get to some props that we like for the combine once those are up next week.
[21] But today, we're getting all into the running backs.
[22] As you may have heard, as you've kind of turned the page in your offseason football consumption, this is a very good running back class.
[23] It's deep, and it's pretty stacked.
[24] At the top, Heisman finalist, Ashton Gentry.
[25] leads us off.
[26] And Mario, he's a guy who kind of, Boise State, of course, is long known for turning out NFL caliber running backs, dating back to LeGarrette Blount and Doug Martin and J .H .I. I mean, the list does go on, but Gentee seems to be the best that they have produced.
[27] Just an unbelievable career.
[28] Oh, was he?
[29] Oh, he punched him.
[30] That's hilarious.
[31] Yeah, he very much did not play for Boise State.
[32] He got banned from college football from being so not on the Boise State team.
[33] Anyway, that's awesome.
[34] I had to spend a good like 30 seconds.
[35] It felt like thinking that went over.
[36] Anyway, yeah.
[37] Ashton Gentry is the man, though, is where this is all going.
[38] I think he's pretty clearly going to test very well athletically, like not such that it'll be a top.
[39] three or five 40 yard dash guy but i do think it's one of those things that if genti for what it's worth he's listed at 5 9 215 right if 215 is the weight that he played at for boise state this year then he for 215 will he will post a collection of good numbers you know 215 doesn't need to run as fast as 200 or 205 or whatever so if genti runs something like a 4 4 8 at 215 and people try to freak out that it's not fast enough, I would say ignore that.
[40] But I think there's good reason to think he'll run something more like a low 4 .4.
[41] And if Gentry comes in at like 2 .05 or something, then he'll definitely run faster.
[42] But given the kind of workload that he took the last two years, and especially the last year, I do expect him to be at least 2 .10.
[43] And again, the key is just...
[44] Judging relative to the weight.
[45] And I think I think whatever it is that he comes in at weight wise will determine more or less the specifics of the numbers.
[46] So in your mind, you know, this question kind of spans the last few years.
[47] But in terms of prospect pedigree, you know, what are we looking at for Gentry and like the last?
[48] five or so years is he kind of comparable to like a jonathan taylor level prospect is that what we're looking at here or um i'd say better okay and of course we're big jonathan taylor fans it's just that genti should be an all decade kind of running back prospect it's it's not um it's not going to result in as much draft capital as these past cases but if you look at the kind of production ash and genti posted in college The last kind of players that produced like that were basically Marshall Falk and Ladanian Tomlinson.
[49] They were both, I assume, top five picks given the era.
[50] But Gentile will presumably go, I don't know, wherever Dallas is.
[51] I can't remember.
[52] Early teens, low teens.
[53] Yeah, but by today's standards, I think he's a better prospect than B. John Robinson pretty easily.
[54] I think the way to think about Gentile maybe, if this gives anyone kind of like a tangible...
[55] way to understand why i'm speaking such high uh high praise of him he i think is basically all the things that jameer gibbs does but probably like 10 pounds heavier and not with necessarily probably some speed cost at that heavier weight but the deal basically is genti can give you that kind of league leading big play ability on a workhorse level usage volume And Gibbs showed you last year, especially some glimpses of that kind of upside when something like that happens, that the ability to have the highest per -touch numbers while also ranking among the highest touch volume numbers is a rare thing.
[56] And Gentry, I think, has that pretty clearly.
[57] Yeah, I mean, he was so great to watch, especially this past year, because you knew that Boise State was running it, and you knew that the opponents knew that in game plan.
[58] But he was still able to peel off almost seven yards a carry on 374 combined carries.
[59] Just insane stuff from him all year long.
[60] Tons of touchdowns on top of it.
[61] So, I mean, he was appointment viewing.
[62] I can't wait to see him at the next level.
[63] And, you know, kind of taking this a step further as we've seen best ball.
[64] drafts open up.
[65] I feel like I've seen him get drafted late second round.
[66] Does that sound about right to you right now?
[67] It does.
[68] I wish it were cheaper.
[69] I was hoping that the residual running back hatred in the culture would lead to retaliation against Gentee for being so A, so the man in general and B, such an antagonizing factor to the Travis Hunter heisman campaign and they had to do the running backs don't matter litigation at the college level which wasn't even supposed to be a thing uh but i digress uh i i was hoping yeah that there would be you know and like you know the underdog culture especially of like you have to take 25 receivers in the first 26 picks i was hoping like man maybe i can get genti in like the fourth round that'd be awesome but apparently no such thing will happen so i'll just have to uh occasionally pay that price anyway especially if he lands on like dallas or something it's like He really could just be like a top three fantasy back this year if he lands in the exact right place.
[70] And it feels like that's one of those prospect to team pairings that feels right.
[71] It feels almost like it's written in the stars.
[72] I feel like Jerry Jones would do such a thing and kind of bumble his way into a good idea, essentially.
[73] And I think that Gentry definitely fits there.
[74] And I don't see him sliding much past.
[75] Dallas, I think maybe someone would even move up to grab him.
[76] He's just that level of prospect and a difference maker, especially for any teams that are kind of on that competitive cusp that they could use and add a punch in the backfield.
[77] Sorry, just real quickly.
[78] If Gente lands on a team where he is more like the Jameer Gibbs to the David Montgomery, I think in that case, he can rebrand as a guy who catches like 70 or 80 passes.
[79] So if that, you know, 20 carry role isn't there, I think he can just as easily reconfigure to like a 14 carry for Alvin Kamara, that kind of usage early in his career, even.
[80] Well, yeah, I mean, that sounds it sounds good to me, too.
[81] And I have no doubt that he could.
[82] basically fill any role that's asked of him.
[83] Let's move on to RB2 on your list.
[84] And this is where I think a lot of debate opens up.
[85] I think we've seen any number of other analysts kind of throw their hat in the ring for different running backs, whether it's Trevion Henderson, whether it's Quinshawn Judkins, Kim Skadovo, probably not quite as much as an RB2 consideration.
[86] Johnson out of Iowa also getting some love in that respect.
[87] But you have Amari in Hampton, and I can't fight you on that one.
[88] He, similar to Gentry, was the engine of that UNC offense this past year.
[89] Really strong numbers from him, despite, again, teams knowing that UNC was not going to be particularly effective through the air, and yet Hampton was still able to produce an extremely elite.
[90] Level almost 300 carries, averaging almost six yards per carry.
[91] Just really impressive stuff from him over the course of his tenure in Chapel Hill.
[92] Your thoughts on him?
[93] Yeah, I think I might have initially undersold Omarion Hampton's speed.
[94] Definitely take a glance at his tape and his production in college, and it's immediately clear, this guy's up.
[95] powerful runner he's built to withstand the wear and tear that comes with being a workhorse runner and skill set wise as a workhorse runner he is adept both as a runner and as a pass catcher so all those things at the very least hint at high volume projection in the NFL assuming he gets an opportunity to claim said volume and when you look though at Omari and Hampton's 100 meter times from high school I think You have some reason to suspect that he, or at least in my case, I might have underestimated his speed because he doesn't look, you know, scare quotes, he doesn't look that fast compared to some other guys.
[96] Sometimes that's just...
[97] an optical illusion for a couple reasons you know like sometimes guys with with shorter legs who don't take who don't generate as much distance in their strides necessarily move their legs faster and sometimes that can look like they're faster when they just literally are not uh and being the bigger player is the slower everyone will think they are too like there there were people who used to insist derrick henry was slow and it's just like no he's just huge and you don't understand how things work relative to each other or anything else probably.
[98] But in Hampton's case, his hundred meter times, I think hint at something like a low four or five, maybe even high four fours, which if he's logging numbers like that at two 20, then it's just like, you know, full speed ahead.
[99] There's nothing to question at that point.
[100] I tend to agree.
[101] Love the build and the speed component there.
[102] You're always good for this.
[103] So I feel like you might have an answer for this one, but.
[104] When you kind of break down at a guy's speed, a good sort of rule of thumb that you tend to use is you look at the breakaway runs and the angles that he's able to erase.
[105] Do you have like an anecdotal like Omari run that comes to mind?
[106] There's probably something worthwhile to find there, though.
[107] And yeah, I'm I'm personally awful at guessing how fast the guy is just by sort of watching him run.
[108] But sometimes through the course of games, you'll find cases where it's like.
[109] this guy is running in a straight line and this defender is chasing him also in a straight line.
[110] And whether that defender gains and whether you have a logged 40 time of either of those two players, otherwise you can kind of figure out like, okay, if this guy, this guy went to the combine last year and ran a four, six, five here, he is gaining on this running back.
[111] Therefore that running back probably runs a four, seven, you know, you can find stuff like that.
[112] In Hampton's case, I didn't try to, because I, honestly i think i just assumed he wasn't fast so early that i didn't bother looking for such cases but yeah once i saw his 100 meter times which are about 11 seconds and that's super inconclusive but it's a good sign uh like as much as 100 meter times don't directly 100 translate to 40 times always they usually are a pretty good signal and an 11 Second 100 -meter time for Hampton could, again, hint at something like a low 4 .5 and maybe even better.
[113] The 4 .6 guy chasing down a guy who clocks a 4 .7, we call that the Elijah Holyfield corollary.
[114] And if it's a 4 .8 corner gaining on Braylon Allen, we call it whatever we would name the Braylon Allen version of that.
[115] Braylon Allen.
[116] particle collider thing molasses index very good um your thoughts on on where you know we've kind of established here that that we think hampton's going to test well for his for his frame um is there potential here that he ends up going sneaking into the to the end of the first round i think so particularly if he breaks the four five flat mark if hampton i'm just assuming that Hampton will have really good broad jump.
[117] And, uh, if you have a really good broad jump and a really good 40 time, and you're one of the heavier, denser backs in a class, that's, that's, that's how you find like Jonathan Taylor types, you know, that, that's the whole, that's the whole reason we were high on Jonathan Taylor's.
[118] It's just like, you know, once, once you, as a, just as like a physics anecdote, you know, reach a certain level of density and mass and velocity, it's like, It shouldn't be that hard to figure out, like, why is Jonathan Taylor good?
[119] Because he's like a fire hydrant that goes as fast as a car.
[120] Yeah, that's pretty hard to tackle, as we've come to find out.
[121] Our guy Jamie is planting his flag in the chat, saying that Hampton can run a 4 .45, in which case, yes.
[122] He could.
[123] I don't think he needs to run quite that good to go in the first round, but if he runs that, I think you can pretty much write it in ink that he would.
[124] Yes, I think so as well.
[125] Before we get on to our next running backs, I've got a message from our friends over at Edge Boost.
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[136] We are on to our next topic.
[137] And this is an interesting one because I feel like a lot of times when you see a great backfield tandem at the college level, people tend to kind of like put themselves into camps where, you know, your team player X and therefore like you're out on player Y. But that's not really the case according to your rankings here when it comes to the Ohio State.
[138] pairing of Trevion Henderson and Quinshawn Judkins.
[139] And I'm with you where I think that Henderson is the better prospect, but that doesn't mean that Judkins is a bad prospect by extension.
[140] They're both top five according to your early pre -combine dynasty rankings.
[141] That will be out, I swear to God, after the show, by the way.
[142] I just have to write the last.
[143] tier, which is, anyway, there's 50 players being written up in addition to the positional rankings.
[144] But yeah, sorry, John.
[145] I guess I would also just want to mention quickly, I don't necessarily consider Trevann Henderson the better prospect between him and Judkins, just better for fantasy in this PPR era, especially.
[146] As much as I think Judkins also looks like a good pass catcher, Henderson just looks like he could be a unique category as far as that goes.
[147] I'm basically thinking of If we're thinking of running backs that can be high explosiveness, high volume pass catchers, it's like Gibbs, Gentry and Henderson, somewhat pending the way Gentry and Henderson test.
[148] But with Henderson, there's plenty of reason to suspect he'll run something pretty fast, like, I don't know, maybe even in the four threes.
[149] And if he does that over 205 pounds, ideally, if I could be greedy and say, if he does that over 210 pounds.
[150] Little details like that do a lot to, I think, clarify his ceiling and, you know, make it, make it a sound projection to say that his ceiling is such that he could go over, you know, 250 carries at five plus yards of pop and give you upwards of like 700 yards receiving at, you know, like seven, eight yards of target.
[151] And he could maybe as Gibbs is again, shown in Detroit, like Henderson can do.
[152] if he tests a certain way, there's reason to believe Henderson can do that kind of big PPR damage, even if he's kind of splitting the workload with a, you know, so -called thunder components, him being the lightning.
[153] But yeah, I think him, so Henderson as a downfield receiver looks really interesting in a way that not many running backs do, but Judkins to me looks interesting as a power runner in a way not many running backs do to the point that.
[154] like if it's if a team took judkins in the first round i'd be like hell yeah that's awesome um i think judkins is clearly great and uh even though i don't think he can be like a 70 80 catch running back like henderson could i do think that judkins could be like a 300 carry you know 50 catch kind of running back with uh average or better league wide efficiency metrics I think I think they're both awesome.
[155] I do, too.
[156] I think I don't know if I'm if I'm straw manning here, if anyone is like taking it as a as a slight or a ding on Henderson that, you know, Judkins came to Ohio State this year and like technically, you know, kind of led that that backfield.
[157] You know, I think that that's just smart maneuvering by Ohio State to get the best players that you can.
[158] And they were both overqualified.
[159] That's how you make a juggernaut.
[160] You have a bunch of like overqualified guys and bit roles.
[161] Yep.
[162] And, you know, and then they had Chip Kelly scheming it up and look at that.
[163] They won a national championship.
[164] And, you know, I think two of my kind of anecdotal callbacks to Trevion Henderson, how I remember him is, of course, when it comes to the pass catching his touchdown against Texas at the end of the first half in the college football semifinal this year.
[165] But I go back to his first game.
[166] Ever at the college level.
[167] I believe they were playing Minnesota.
[168] It was a Thursday night, first week of the season, 2021.
[169] And I'm like, oh, my God, they have another one.
[170] Like, how does Ohio State keep finding these guys?
[171] And, you know, I think in that moment, I would have been stunned to say that he would have been at Ohio State for four years as opposed to the three.
[172] He had a 277 -yard game two weeks after that, too.
[173] Yeah, I mean, he was just unbelievable.
[174] By the numbers, his best season was his freshman season, 184 carries, 1 ,255 yards, and 15 touchdowns that season.
[175] Also caught 27 out of 29 targets for 312 yards and four touchdowns.
[176] Had three seasons at the college level with over 200 receiving yards.
[177] He's pretty much got it all.
[178] I have the most exposure to him among the rookie running backs thus far.
[179] I've probably done like five or six, I want to say, underdog drafts thus far.
[180] And I've felt the most comfortable at cost grabbing Henderson.
[181] Sorry, do you happen to recall where he was going generally in the ADP?
[182] Gosh, I want to say like fourth or fifth round, but don't quote me on that.
[183] Wait, Henderson?
[184] Yeah.
[185] Oh, wow.
[186] I didn't realize he was going that high.
[187] I probably don't have the guts to take him that high right now.
[188] But if it ends up being another like Jimmy or Gibbs situation, then that would kind of make clear what the terms are.
[189] And that would warrant that level of cost.
[190] Is he a guy that Henderson, I'm speaking about, does he stand out as someone who could really, really kind of move up the big boards, as it were, with his combine performance?
[191] I suppose I don't really know how high because some people are really high on Henderson already.
[192] And it might be one of those things where the only reason if the consensus is saying that Henderson is whatever outside the first round, then maybe that's just a consensus that hasn't actually been felt out.
[193] And if we just run a quick survey of pretty much everyone, everyone will.
[194] Maybe they'll be surprised, but it'll turn out like, oh, we all had him ranked in the first round the whole time anyway.
[195] I don't know if you call that rising when that happens, but I do think if he's not right now, Henderson will be conventionally talked about as a first -round player.
[196] I just went ahead and scoured my draft history very quickly.
[197] You guys didn't even notice.
[198] Trevion Henderson, I took him at pick 65.
[199] So a little bit later than I was.
[200] Yes.
[201] Yeah, that's I think I could more easily buy in there.
[202] In fact, I might suggest you should try to buy that while you can, because if Henderson does start getting projected more conventionally as a first rounder, I think he'll push for that like fourth round kind of range, which I wouldn't as easily pay, even though I do love the player.
[203] Certain situations aside, I mean, there are so if Henderson lands in Dallas instead of.
[204] then I'm like, oh, crap, like, I don't know, second round, I guess.
[205] Yeah, no, yeah, at that point, whoever, you know, ends up being the first running back is going to be, you know, probably a mid to high second round pick in best ball drafts.
[206] Anything else to add when it comes to this tandem of Ohio State backs?
[207] I think they're both awesome.
[208] And if people are trying to kind of like take sides, I think that's a waste of time.
[209] I do too.
[210] Both very clearly standout talents.
[211] It's okay that they played for the same team.
[212] Let's see here.
[213] Let's kind of open it up.
[214] You know, I think everyone's rankings get a little bit fuzzy after this top four or so.
[215] uh let's talk about cam scadaboo um out of arizona state um he i mean he for as fun as gent he was of course for a playoff team scadaboo i mean arizona state uh on the preseason polls was picked last in the big 12 and they didn't have a whole lot going for him i mean ryan silverfield takes over a team last year that was you know kind of Put in the dark ages by Herm Edwards, and it felt like it was going to be a long kind of rebuild.
[216] They made the college football playoff.
[217] They won the Big 12.
[218] Amazing story.
[219] And Scadaboo was such a huge part of that.
[220] How does his pro projection look, however?
[221] Because oftentimes we can see a great college running back not really be able to do the same stuff at the next level.
[222] Where does he kind of fit in your mind?
[223] Scadabo is one of those guys that I think going into the Combine, you can say, has a very strong skills grade, but maybe does not have as great of a tools grade.
[224] This is not necessarily a big deal, though.
[225] It would be, I think, a big deal in a bad way if Scadabo ran a 4 .7 or even anything worse than a 4 .65.
[226] And I am very much worried that he could do that.
[227] But even if he does, I don't know if it knocks out Scadabo as a conventional draft prospect and a standout fantasy prospect.
[228] Because as much as you would hope Scadabo would run closer to the 4 .6 flat or even better, he will not...
[229] be confusing anyone for a big playback that's not what the point of his game is he's a workhorse player with a dual threat ability between running and receiving and if you give him big volume as arizona state did he can you know between establishing the rhythm of the game the figuring out the defense and wearing down the defense he can eventually start breaking big plays because he has just instant processing and his motor, you know, he's at 150 % all the time.
[230] So there are times where Scadabo is moving forward while the defense is kind of like trying to gather itself to run in the first place.
[231] And he's just, he's going not very fast, but he is never not going.
[232] And when it comes to contact balance, you might not ever see anyone better than scadabo i mean um it's like it's like watching someone wrestle as in like the the boring kind of wrestling not the not professional wrestling but like it's like watching someone play running back and wrestle at the same time the way it's like every time a defender squares up to tackle him he tries to get he like grab their ankles or something it's like that's how low he's getting and like he bounces off of tacklers that way And in a way that like, he's not taking like a truly big hit, you know, like he's, he's getting under the hit.
[233] And so it's not a, it's definitely not ideal to be a contact dependent running back at the NFL level that generally is bad for your longevity.
[234] But if you're, as Derek Henry showed, there's a difference between kind of taking hits and dealing them out or, and just working around them.
[235] And yeah, Scadabo.
[236] between his pass catching the power, the three down ability.
[237] I think he has unique volume upside in the NFL, just as he showed at Arizona state and, um, a four, six or whatever generally tells you that he won't be making 20 plus yard runs that much.
[238] But as long as he avoids that like four, seven flat, uh, especially in this, this day where people are obsessing about success rate all the time, like you're seeing a movement, it's like yards per carry.
[239] Isn't real.
[240] Success rate is the only truth in the world.
[241] And, um, That metric, as much as I think it's a crap metric that doesn't really tell you anything at all, Scadabo will grade very well at it because he does very well in short yardage.
[242] Third and one, other than these quarterback sneaks nowadays, Scadabo is probably one of the least, one of the guys you'd least like to see as a defense in third and one.
[243] If it's third and six, you're going, ha ha ha, no way, he can't do it.
[244] And you'd be right probably.
[245] But third and one, he's going to get there.
[246] And the actual thing, more than his speed question, that might be a pressing issue is he might be a little crazy.
[247] He seems to be and this would explain this.
[248] This isn't necessarily just a bad thing.
[249] Like if he's a crazy hothead and he channels it all toward working in football and being a good football player, it could largely explain why he is as good as he is.
[250] If he were not a maniac, he might not be the football player that he is.
[251] he is a little delusional in a way that almost makes you worry.
[252] Like, is there like something off with you or something?
[253] Cause he was like in the middle of the season, there was some press conference where he was indignant, not joking at all.
[254] Like pouting, as he said it, like I'm the best running back in the country.
[255] It's like, man, why would you be saying this in a season where Ashton Gentry has like 37 touchdowns?
[256] Could, could you not pick a different year to say that?
[257] And to, to also say it with like complete, like, just he's like mad that anyone would of course i'm the best running back like that's a little that's that's going beyond the the like believing in yourself thing because he he didn't just say humbly like i believe i'm as good as anybody or whatever corny crap people want to hear he had to say of all things like he he was aghast at the suggestion that he wasn't the best running back um it's it's a little weird and there's also clips of him like uh shoving his teammates when they try to help him up off the field you know It's just like, don't shove your teammates when they help you up off the field.
[258] That's crazy.
[259] Anyway, if Scadabo doesn't turn off any teams with his personality, then I think his ability to very obviously play a lot of snaps for almost any offense will get him on the field sooner rather than later.
[260] And yeah, I think particularly if he's on a team with a good offensive line, he could go kind of nuts.
[261] I kind of...
[262] Yeah, the personality stuff, I think, tied in and also the team's kind of general lack of running back talent.
[263] I'd love to see Scadaboo on the Raiders.
[264] That would do it.
[265] I mean, I really think that most teams, if he ended up on, he would force some amount of playing time.
[266] And then, yeah, if there's a team that's sort of auditioning for taking on a new starter this offseason, I think.
[267] particularly if they're a team that's loath to spend like a first or second round pick on a running back and, and Scadabo's there in the third or even the fourth, maybe that team, that, that GM would be able to say, you know, like, look at how much, look at how much EPA I got per dollar out of this running back.
[268] And we love, we love EPA per dollar.
[269] That's our favorite.
[270] All right, so that's the book on Scadaboo for now.
[271] Before we get to our next guys, we do have a message from our friends over at Pool Genius.
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[281] Our guy, Jamie, also kind of had an interesting narrative comparison when it comes to Scadaboo.
[282] If he doesn't test well, you could see him testing poorly but still being productive a la a Kyron Williams or a Bucky.
[283] No one will test as badly as Kyron.
[284] It's impossible.
[285] Uh, maybe, maybe Cameron Scadabo will run a four seven, but he'll do it at like 20 pounds heavier than Kyron minimum.
[286] I do think Scadabo would be awesome in that offense.
[287] If the Rams, because the way they, they're the most success rate obsessed, uh, team in the whole league.
[288] And, uh, behind those guards, that interior blocking, it would be impossible to stop him from getting four yards pretty much every play.
[289] He could be what we hoped Jake Funk would be.
[290] Jake Funk was a burner, John.
[291] That's true.
[292] Jake Funk, shout out to the Terps.
[293] What a guy.
[294] Let's see here.
[295] Two guys that might be a little bit lower than consensus that I want to get your thoughts on.
[296] That's Dylan Sampson out of Tennessee and Caleb Johnson out of Iowa.
[297] You have Johnson.
[298] at number 17 in your ranks, so behind RJ Harvey and Devin Neal as well among running backs.
[299] And then Sampson down at 34.
[300] So start with Sampson because I think he's interesting in the sense that, you know, I think that the combine means a lot for him because the on -field production, I thought that this past year was terrific.
[301] You know, it's, you know, a good sign anytime that you're basically the most productive running back.
[302] in the sec but watching him i don't feel i feel like he is one of those guys kind of like what you were alluding to where where the skill might be pretty high as far as the grade is concerned but i never felt like the tools were all that special um this this is uh this is a case where the combine is definitely important because i was actually concerned it was the other way around like i think Samson looks like a guy who has a ton of speed and maybe not a single other thing.
[303] And he, I, so his hundred meter times, for instance, Dylan Samson's, uh, they hint at him being a sub four, four guy and, uh, being, so let's say, okay, so there's, uh, there's like Jaden blue, the, the Arkansas one who transferred from Texas, uh, maybe, maybe Henderson, those kinds of guys.
[304] Those are the only ones that I think rival Samson's speed in this draft.
[305] But I guess we'll see.
[306] The biggest maybe concern overall with Samson that I have is he looks to me like he's pretty very raw as a passing down back.
[307] Like in blitz pickup, he looks like he's closing his eyes or something.
[308] And when targets go his way, he looks really bad as a receiver to me. I feel like Samson is almost like, maybe a smaller, but slightly faster Israel, a band of Kanda or something like that.
[309] And I, I, I mean, I actually like a band of Kanda and I think, you know, by the time he gets like these 24 or something, he's going to all of a sudden start getting reps somewhere.
[310] But I don't know what to make of Samson otherwise, because like, I feel like he's doing a lot of just kind of like running blindfolded.
[311] not taking as sharp of angles as he could.
[312] I see sort of like a lot of indifference and just kind of like leaning on the speed to break angles instead of like cutting up field to actually exploit space effectively.
[313] But we'll see.
[314] Samson, at the very least, he has wheels and like some running ability.
[315] It's obviously not easy to catch him when you give him the ball.
[316] His production at Tennessee makes that perfectly clear.
[317] I don't know how far that alone can carry him.
[318] And I don't know how to gauge the probability of Samson improving in those other areas, even though he could.
[319] And if he did, you know, then then it's just game on at that point.
[320] I think so as well.
[321] So definitely keeping a close eye on him at the combine.
[322] Let's circle back to to Caleb Johnson out of Iowa.
[323] So he was a guy that, you know.
[324] Early on in his career, like it had had some OK flashes, but I don't know that those Iowa offenses were so largely stuck in the mud early on.
[325] And it wasn't even clear going into this season that he was going to be the starter, let alone the workhorse that he was.
[326] Turns in a strong final season there at Iowa.
[327] A lot of people like him as a potential RB2 in this class or, you know, certainly a lot of people know worse than RB5.
[328] You come in a little bit lower.
[329] Um, why might that be?
[330] So for what it's worth, I, um, I lump him in, uh, leave Caleb Johnson in the same tier as, uh, RJ Harvey and Devin Neal.
[331] So I'm giving them all basically like round three type grades for what that's worth.
[332] But yeah, a lot of people have Caleb Johnson is like the running back to in this class.
[333] And, um, very, I guess it seems like, uh, I'm in the minority to have Judkins ahead of him, which is.
[334] We'll see.
[335] That's crazy to me, though.
[336] I think Judkins is clearly better.
[337] But Caleb Johnson is...
[338] Basically, my concern with him is that he might be just simply...
[339] There's a long list of players who are this.
[340] A really good college running back who maybe doesn't translate to the NFL as much.
[341] I know he was very productive at Iowa.
[342] But a lot of running backs who don't play in the NFL have production like this sometimes.
[343] And there are presumably...
[344] additional details that separate them and when i start to separate the the finer details with johnson it's not so much that i see bad things as much as it's it's uh there's absence of clarity relative to guys like you know that i named in the top four caleb johnson did have some hundred meter times attributed to him in high school and they were pretty good but i think particularly when you're talking like classic big 10, which Iowa, you know, real big 10 Iowa is guys who aren't that fast can look fast.
[345] Sometimes you just got to believe if it's not against Ohio state, you just got to worry that the guy who's running away from the defense is running a four, six.
[346] It's, it just happens in the Braylon Allen.
[347] Again, get anybody makes a big, anybody who runs for a touchdown against Purdue, it basically doesn't count.
[348] Everybody on that defense is running a four, eight.
[349] So Caleb Johnson, he made some big plays and he was definitely a great Iowa back.
[350] I think he's solidly in that, you know, round three kind of range, but to catch some of these other guys in this class, I'm going to need to see Johnson just torch at the combine because I mean, the production, the tape, everything looks just so solid for those other five or so that we ranked that I mentioned ahead of him.
[351] And I think another reason, a specific concern with Johnson that I have is that.
[352] He's a bit upright built.
[353] I wouldn't be surprised if he's more like 6 '1 than the 6 foot that he's listed at.
[354] And if you are upright and you kind of lack anchor compared to some other players, if you do lack anchor compared to other players, you need to be faster than the other players to make up the deficiency.
[355] And so I'm worried overall that Johnson might just kind of be like another Rashad White or something.
[356] Like Rashad White was running for like seven yards of carry in the Pac -12, and he ran a 4 -5 -3, you know?
[357] Right.
[358] No, exactly.
[359] So there's some things still to be determined when it comes to filling out his prospect profile.
[360] Jamie in the chat wonders, is Caleb Johnson similar at all to you to Tank Bigsby or Zach Charbonnet?
[361] In terms of build and combine testing, he might.
[362] Caleb Johnson might be objectively kind of similar to Charbonnet, but, um, I thought Charbonnet, even though he, he had a bad, uh, or less than ideal height weight at six, one, two 14 or whatever.
[363] I thought Charbonnet was one of those guys who's good at getting lower.
[364] Like he kind of, he can generate anchor.
[365] When I watched Caleb Johnson, I feel like he, like I'm almost like watching a wide receiver take an end around every play, you know, like quarter L Patterson or something, but not that he's, he's not six, three, like quarter rally, but I am worried that he's over six feet.
[366] And with like a somewhat upright gate.
[367] No, I mean, that's definitely like a, a good distinction to draw between him and Charbonnet.
[368] Cause Charbonnet was definitely sort of like, I was kind of surprised by, by his measurables at the combine.
[369] Cause I thought he ran like much more.
[370] I thought he was like five 11 sometimes watching him, but yeah.
[371] Yeah.
[372] So anyway, but I also got to mention to be fair to Caleb Johnson, if he runs like a four, four flat, then I'll have to kind of, you know, reassess the whole thing.
[373] Right.
[374] Yeah.
[375] If he can, if he can beat the Akram Wadley allegations.
[376] Oh, he was the greatest.
[377] Oh man, what a guy.
[378] Let's see here.
[379] As we kind of round it out here, any other guys that you wanted to discuss?
[380] Maybe some guys that are a little bit off the radar that could turn some heads next week in Indy.
[381] So the 40 times, like we were mentioning before, Jaden Blue of Texas and is it Jakinden Sanders of Arkansas, a former Texas quarterback recruit.
[382] I think those guys are your fastest 40s at the running back position.
[383] I'm trying to look around.
[384] I don't I don't know of any like secret stuff to tell anybody.
[385] I think everybody already knows anything that I could point out.
[386] But like for what it's worth, Jalen Royals was like a state high jumper type in in high school.
[387] I would say Matthew Golden's 100 meter times indicate something in the low four fours or mid four fours.
[388] What else?
[389] Cam Ward is going to be six feet tall, not six foot two.
[390] He might even be like five eleven and five eighths or something like that.
[391] I guess I guess that's all that I really.
[392] Oh, as far as like running back sleepers, though, specifically that I like otherwise, not enough time to talk about them much.
[393] But Todd Brooks interests me a lot more than expected.
[394] He looks kind of like athletic, even though people say it's like he's he's just he's like a turtle.
[395] You know, he's just he's just this stout guy who kind of scoots between defenders occasionally.
[396] It's like, I don't know.
[397] He was kind of moving on some of those plays.
[398] He might be like a faster, less fat CJ Anderson or something like that.
[399] Damien Martinez, Khalil, Khalil Mullins.
[400] Two 230 types who, if they test well, can indicate uncommon big playability for their builds.
[401] But yeah, that's about all I got, I suppose.
[402] I'm tickled that you mentioned Todd Brooks.
[403] I'm a big fan of his.
[404] I had to stop watching his tape because I was like, I'm going to end up convincing myself he's like the running back five or something.
[405] I can't do things like that.
[406] If people need a quick CliffsNotes on Taj Brooks, what does he bring to the table?
[407] Well, so I mentioned CJ Anderson because he's basically like unusually heavy for his height, but it's not because he is built inappropriately.
[408] It's like he just has a weird distribution of the weight where you look at or I don't know about you, John, but when I watched when I watched Taj Brooks.
[409] I did not assume he was listed at five, nine, two 30.
[410] I assumed he was like five, nine to 10 or something.
[411] And it's basically because like, he doesn't have to gather himself the way a 230 pounder at five, nine should.
[412] It's like, he just kind of, he moves like someone who, you know, the, he moves like someone lighter than himself and his production was never outrageous or anything.
[413] So he's probably not exactly fast, but.
[414] I think he might be one of those guys who his 10 -yard athleticism is actually, especially for the kind of unique build he has, very good.
[415] And if you can just get to the linebacker level and make one person miss, you can make some big plays in the NFL, even if you're more like a 4 -5 -8 kind of 40 runner.
[416] Right.
[417] I mean, once a guy of his...
[418] Stature gets moving, and he's into the second, third level.
[419] It's going to be hard to find nickelbacks or safeties that are wanting to take that head on because he's a physical force out there.
[420] Big fan of Taj Brooks.
[421] Anyone that can convince Texas Tech to run the ball, that's impressive in its own right.
[422] We do have a request to touch on Basial Tootin out of Virginia Tech.
[423] Your thoughts there?
[424] I know that he's getting a bit of a sleeper buzz as we get closer to the combine.
[425] Yeah, he's pretty interesting.
[426] He's definitely an explosive athlete by running back standards.
[427] I guess we'll see at the combine just how much.
[428] I was a little surprised to see his weight was listed pushing 210.
[429] I would have figured watching Tootin that he was more like a 195 or something.
[430] But whatever the case, the official testing is helpful because it clarifies these things and makes clear which things you were just judging wrong from a glance and which things you were correct to suspect.
[431] But Basial Tootin...
[432] should run i don't know like he he could run really fast his hundred meter times hint i think it's something like the the high four fours if i remember right but that stuff is always that stuff is negotiable like jameer gibbs's hundred meter times would have led you to think he was like a four six instead of a four three seven or whatever he ran so so those aren't perfect uh every time but the biggest problem with tootin that i saw is um like he he fumbles quite a bit And I otherwise don't really know how to distinguish him from just this recent string of Virginia Tech transfer backs that they've gotten.
[433] It's like they specifically targeted Tootin out of North Carolina, A &T or whatever, because they were like, oh, we got to find our Raheem Blackshear Khalil Herbert of this year.
[434] And Tootin might be the best of that group.
[435] It wasn't that long ago that people were pretty high on Khalil Herbert and even saying he's better than David Montgomery.
[436] I wouldn't be shocked if Tootin has some hype from some time or another.
[437] But right or wrong, I would be surprised if he emerged as a starter in the NFL.
[438] I get the sense that he's more like an off -the -bench firecracker type.
[439] Yeah, I don't get workhorse vibes from him either.
[440] But, you know, obviously someone to keep an eye on here as draft season unfolds.
[441] But that is going to do it.
[442] For us here on the running back edition of the Roto -Wire Fantasy Football Podcast, looking ahead to this upcoming class of rookies, we'll be back next week talking combine, all things combine.
[443] That's always one of our favorite episodes of the offseason.
[444] Big shout out to our guys over at Edge Boost and over at Pool Genius and, of course, over at the Blue Wire Network.
[445] For Mario Puig, I'm John McKegney.
[446] Thanks for listening.