Jim Carrey

[0] Hi, my name is Jim Carrey.

[1] And I feel warm all over about being Conan O 'Brien's friend, except when his hair blocks out the sun.

[2] Then I could catch a chill.

[3] Fall is here, hear the yell, back to school, ring the bell, brand new shoes, walking loose, climb the fence, books and pens, I can tell that we are going to be friends, we are going to be friends, Hey, Conan O 'Brien here And welcome to Conan O 'Brien Needs a Friend.

[4] True now more than ever.

[5] We are, is the second episode of our third season.

[6] And boy, I think all of us are feeling like we need a friend this much into COVID.

[7] I think it's been seven years now.

[8] I'm not sure I lost track for a while.

[9] Actually, this, I have to say, we've had some very nice comments online about people being happy that we're back.

[10] I think no one's happier than I am because I'm so starved to be talking to people and interacting and to get to do the podcast feels like a real blessing.

[11] It really does.

[12] I mean, I know no one enjoys it when I'm sincere and it won't happen again, but it's been, I'm so happy that we're making these podcasts because it really is fun.

[13] It's fun to get to make these.

[14] I'm joined as always by my skeptical assistant, Sonoma Sassian.

[15] It's nice to hear that.

[16] you missed me and Matt?

[17] I like the process of podcasting.

[18] There's ups and downs with the process.

[19] I like the technical aspect of it, the microphones, the machinery.

[20] Oh, you're real gear.

[21] No, no, I am.

[22] You like the machinery more than your pals.

[23] Please.

[24] I find you to be necessary evils, I guess is what we'll call you.

[25] No, I do.

[26] I'm so into the gear of podcasting.

[27] That's how good a podcaster I am.

[28] Of course, using one of my favorite microphones right now.

[29] What brand is that?

[30] This would be the Ruan 44.

[31] Because of the tenor of my voice, this has a 84 hexalite parabola scan.

[32] So what it's able to do is really give me the resonance that I need.

[33] I'm sorry, did you say Ruan?

[34] I would have to listen to the playback to hear what I said.

[35] Okay.

[36] You forgot what the brand of the microphone was?

[37] I'm such an enthusiast that I get so excited that.

[38] But yeah, you're...

[39] Wait, what?

[40] You get so excited that you forgot the name of the microphone?

[41] Occasionally, you know?

[42] That happens sometimes.

[43] I'll really, like a Beatles song will come on that I love and I so love the Beatles and I'll be like, these guys are great.

[44] I don't remember the name of the band.

[45] But, you know, you know that happens when you get really excited about, you've really, you know, it's happy to see your wife again after you haven't seen her for a while and you don't know her name just because of the excitement.

[46] Anyway, what kind of microphone are you using over there, Matt?

[47] Oh, I'm working on a Senheiser myself.

[48] Oh, the old Senheisa.

[49] Those are fantastic.

[50] I will tell you a true story that is one of the things that you have to engage in if you are in late -night television over the years is, and much more in the past than now, but I used to have to do a lot of photo shoots.

[51] You know, if a magazine was going to do a story about, you know, the red -hitted quipster of late night, they would set up a photo shoot, and I would show up, and I did one thing over and over and over again.

[52] It would always work.

[53] The photographer would come out, and I'd say hello, and the photographer would start taking pictures of me on this soundstage, you know, in New York or L .A., and be taking pictures.

[54] and very clearly on the front of the camera it would say Hasselblot and the guy would be taking pictures you've probably even seen me do this Sona and I'd be like and the person would be taking pictures for a while and be doing the chit chat and they always play kind of like cool music to put you in the mood which always just made me self -conscious but they'd be taking pictures and I would see that the guy had a camera and says Hasselblot right on it and I'd go like at some point I'd just go like what is that is that a Hasselblot?

[55] And they'd be like he'd lower his camera and go what, you're into cameras, man?

[56] I went, I love him.

[57] I love him.

[58] And then it would say next to it, and you could clearly see it.

[59] It would say like, Hustlod, you know, 4 .4.

[60] And I'd say, what is that, a 4 .4?

[61] And be like, yeah, it's just my thing.

[62] It's really my thing.

[63] And it'd be like, shit, man. And then he'd put it on, eventually they put it on sticks to get a, you know, a lock shot.

[64] And it would say right on the tripod.

[65] This is the actual name, Sackler.

[66] Sackler's the name of a tripod.

[67] And I'd be like, oh, using the sackler, huh?

[68] And he'd be like, shit, man. And people would be like looking at each other And I'd be like, yeah, I love you.

[69] I mean, you got a Hasseblad, you got a 4 .4, you got a Sackler.

[70] And then I would always take it one too far.

[71] I go like, what is that?

[72] And it would say on the side Some German thing like Miltonstein.

[73] And I'd say, so you're using the, what is that, Miltonstein?

[74] And then he'd always, that's when they would look.

[75] And they'd be like, fuck you.

[76] But for a while, I'd be like, hey man, that's my thing.

[77] You know, that's my thing.

[78] So that's a little peek into my life.

[79] I used to waste people's time.

[80] Yes, used to.

[81] And now you've done it to our millions of listeners.

[82] Well, it's free.

[83] That's true.

[84] That's my, it's always my excuse for this bullshit.

[85] It didn't cost you anything.

[86] So what's the problem?

[87] Anyway, I don't think we can waste a lot of time today.

[88] Because we have an incredible guest on the show.

[89] Yep.

[90] My guest, of course, one of the funniest actors and comedians of all time.

[91] You can look it up.

[92] That's just a fact.

[93] You know him from such movies as The Mask, Dumb and Dumber, The Truman Show, Ace Venture, a Pet Detective, Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind, just to name a few.

[94] Now he's authored the New York Times best -selling book Memoirs and Misinformation, a fascinating quasi -memoir.

[95] I am thrilled he is with us today.

[96] Before I introduce him, I want to mention one quick thing, because we all know I'm talking about Jim Carrey.

[97] Jim Carrey, of course, is unlike any other person I've interviewed on the podcast so far.

[98] He is a force of nature.

[99] So there may be some audio hits and glitches here and there.

[100] Why you ask?

[101] Because at one point in the interview, Jim picks up the microphone for the speaker and pace it over his eye to turn himself into a pirate, I think.

[102] He is a whirling dervish, so he's not wearing headphones because that would literally be putting him on a leash.

[103] And so you might hear some strange sounds.

[104] Sometimes the audio may be degraded.

[105] This is what happens when you try and record a creative hurricane.

[106] I've had the same problem sometimes.

[107] Anyway, made it about me at the end, even when I'm talking to Jim Carrey.

[108] That's pretty hard to do.

[109] Anyway, thrilled he's here.

[110] Jim Carrey, welcome.

[111] This is the craziest experience because we're doing this over Zoom.

[112] You are not in the room with me because of this virus that I just heard about.

[113] But you're in the room with me. You know how?

[114] How?

[115] Look at that.

[116] This is my letter from Conan O 'Brien who writes letters, ladies and gentlemen.

[117] I wrote you a letter and you framed it.

[118] I framed it, but here's the crazy thing.

[119] It's COVID, right?

[120] So I'm doing all my own framing.

[121] So check out the edge of it.

[122] It's really, what?

[123] I did it with an exact own knife.

[124] I did the edge there.

[125] I don't think you can see it, but it's really uneven and horrible.

[126] And that's how all my pictures are going to be in the house from now on.

[127] It looks terrible.

[128] You know, it was funny because when it be.

[129] think of that.

[130] Wouldn't it be pompous if I had sent you that letter already framed?

[131] Like, my assumption was that it would mean that much to you.

[132] And if that's the way, whenever I sent anybody a letter, because it was coming from me, I sent it framed.

[133] Yeah, with a lot of your hair in it.

[134] Can I ask you how you're really doing?

[135] I'm doing fine.

[136] I'm doing all of bullshit aside.

[137] Okay.

[138] Bullshit aside, I'm doing fairly well.

[139] I've, like, all of us had ups and downs wondering when this is going to be over.

[140] I'm going to narrate what Jim's doing.

[141] Jim is now peering into the lens of the Zoom camera and he's holding what looks like an eye patch over one eye and it's so clearly the bullshit's over you really wanted an honest emotional answer from me because you went right in no no I'm in a deep depression Jim and yeah oh yeah oh no you're gonna kid around now you're gonna make more of your faces.

[142] No no I'm sorry I'm sorry this is when you tell me you have cancer and I go, what an idiot I am.

[143] Yeah, no, you would give it about 30 seconds and he'd be like, what kind of cancer?

[144] Yeah.

[145] One of the easy cancers.

[146] Celebrity cancers.

[147] Celebrity cancers cost extra to treat.

[148] You know what I've done?

[149] I've grown my pompadour out so that now it's a giant.

[150] I don't know if you can see it's just a mop that's falling over my face.

[151] It's an incredible thing.

[152] One of the wonders of the world.

[153] I like walking behind the waterfall myself, just on your eyebrows.

[154] It's a famous scene in Last of the Mohicans, where they're hiding behind a waterfall.

[155] You seem well.

[156] I'm doing fine.

[157] I'm okay.

[158] You know, I'm doing all right.

[159] Yeah, we're hanging in there.

[160] We're part of something that's bigger than us.

[161] I think we're doing the best we can't.

[162] There's a big bad bruiser up top who wants to make a name for himself.

[163] So.

[164] Well, I don't know who you're talking about.

[165] I don't know either.

[166] I don't know either.

[167] I've forgotten the name.

[168] head of General Electric, I suppose.

[169] It's just a gutter response now.

[170] President, oh, president gut punch.

[171] President daily outrage.

[172] When did you get your American citizenship?

[173] When did you become an American citizen?

[174] Was it just in time for Trump?

[175] Is this an ice thing?

[176] Have they gone to see you, man?

[177] Your door's going to ring in about half an hour.

[178] I'm doing the jobs that Americans aren't willing to do.

[179] We hadn't had a really good leading man in comedy until you came because no one wanted to do comedy.

[180] It's a shit job.

[181] Yeah, everyone just wanted to look good.

[182] And then you said, I'll do it.

[183] That's right.

[184] And then we villainized you, demonized you for coming from the north.

[185] Boy, oh, boy.

[186] And taking our comedy.

[187] It's so worth it.

[188] You know why?

[189] Yeah, why.

[190] Couldn't think of anything.

[191] First, we got a lot to talk about.

[192] There's a lot to cover here.

[193] And first of all, I want to.

[194] want to take you down a couple of notches because you've been getting away with murder way too long in my opinion.

[195] No, seriously, we've got to bring you down.

[196] Okay.

[197] Is that what this podcast is about?

[198] That's what this is all about.

[199] This podcast is called Rip You a New One.

[200] And I don't know.

[201] Rip you a new one with Conan O 'Brien would be great.

[202] Yeah, you have a very bad publicist because no one else does it.

[203] And then you were like, I'll do it.

[204] And then you ripped your face off in your allergy.

[205] And I'm like, come on.

[206] Guys!

[207] You know, I find this to be very eerie.

[208] You wrote a book that I really enjoyed.

[209] That's why I wrote you the letter that's framed and hangs behind you on the wall, something you affixed to the wall seconds before this podcast began.

[210] It was in a toilet.

[211] Anyway, your memoirs and misinformation, which you co -wrote, you worked on it with this guy, Dana Vashon.

[212] Yes, I did.

[213] Very terrific writer.

[214] Wonderful writer.

[215] And what's fascinating about this is, anyone thinks a celebrity memoir, they all think the same thing.

[216] And this is, because it's coming from you, it's not what anyone, that's actually what I might expect, but a lot of, this is not a Jim Carrey memoir that anyone would expect in the normal sense.

[217] And what I find amazing is that you must have been working on this for a long time.

[218] The writing, I think, is really quite good.

[219] And there's a lot of really funny and dark stuff in here.

[220] But you're basically writing about the end of the world, and it comes out during COVID.

[221] So I feel like you knew something that we didn't know.

[222] Well, it's amazing when we started working on this thing.

[223] It was like an eight -year conversation that turned into a couple of years of intensive, you know, creative work and we put our hearts and souls into it.

[224] Yeah, it was amazing as the time got nearer to releasing the book that we started noticing all these incredibly kind of weirdly prophetic things that are happening.

[225] And suddenly there is a riot.

[226] on Rodeo Drive, and there is, you know, all of these things that are happening.

[227] And not to mention, I think as a writer, when you let yourself actually, you know, write down and hone what's coming rather than what you think they might like, you know, there's some weird, clairvoyant thing that happens, you know, when you open yourself up to the universe, it knows better than you do what's about to happen.

[228] What I found to be really crazy is that, first of all, I love, this device, I'll call it.

[229] I'll call it a device, but you use real celebrities in the book.

[230] So Jim Carrey is in the book.

[231] Real celebrity.

[232] You want an oxymor on that.

[233] I'm just as real as anyone.

[234] But, you know, what I loved is that, first of all, we've known each other for quite a long time.

[235] I've been to your house a bunch of times.

[236] So it's odd because you're describing Jim Carrey who lives in this house.

[237] Shit has gone missing too, man. And I'm a little bit worried about it.

[238] I want to talk to you.

[239] after the car.

[240] I have to apologize.

[241] A couple of things I've gone missing.

[242] One of my golden gloves is not accounted for.

[243] I'm not, I don't know what happened.

[244] You know what I found is very hard to sell a Jim Carrey Golden Globe.

[245] It's a very hard thing to sell.

[246] People are very worried about getting caught.

[247] You have to change it to Drew.

[248] I chiseled out the gym, and I tried to write in Drew with a Sharpie, but a lot of the people were suspicious.

[249] But I've been to your house, and it's funny because when you're writing about Jim Carrey at home, It's very funny and surreal, but there are also elements that I think, I've been there, and I feel like, yes, this is kind of a depiction of you at home, but it's also not.

[250] You've stretched it out, and it's insane, and you have this very powerful electric fence, and you have these dogs that cost hundreds of thousands of dollars that are trained to show you affection and love, because you can't get that anywhere.

[251] You got to buy it at this point.

[252] You've got to buy it at this point.

[253] But one of the things I really loved is that you have your name dropping and name -trained.

[254] checking people left and right, and you're hanging out with them.

[255] And it's hilarious because you, the Jim Carrey in the book has this incredibly insane relationship with Nicholas Cage.

[256] And Kelsey Grammer is always...

[257] This is that far from reality.

[258] No, it really isn't.

[259] Apparently, the one you created bought a dinosaur skull for a million dollars.

[260] It's a tiny stretch there, but...

[261] A tiny stretch, yeah.

[262] You add it being one of the greater, most incredible, you know, most incredible, uh, centric characters living among us and always, always fun to have around and to exchange creative ideas with.

[263] So we've had a thing going for a lot of years.

[264] We have this thing called the Obie -Dobie Award that we hand back and forth between just the two of us.

[265] A lot of tension about who's going to get it.

[266] There's a big tense moment and someone's announced.

[267] But yeah, that's been a fun part of this.

[268] It's like, you know, you got to do a book on persona and sending persona, you have to use some personas, you know, and the ultimate place is Hollywood.

[269] But I loved, I was laughing out loud.

[270] This is one of the things I wrote you about, as I was laughing out loud at you, Kelsey Grammer keeps appearing in the book.

[271] And we all know Kelsey's manner and his way of speaking and that he's that way in real life as well.

[272] So he keeps showing up in the book and there are moments where people are saying Kelsey shut the fuck up.

[273] There's a, there's like a guru who's saying Kelsey, please, and he keeps interrupting and saying, well, I just think.

[274] No cross -stock, no cross -talk, Kelsey.

[275] Well, Kelsey does this wonderful thing, you know, that I've loved for years.

[276] His, his pomp, his, like, befuddled arrogance and, you know, whatever it is that he does is just amazing.

[277] So he was the perfect character to cast in that part.

[278] The guy that's such a dedicated Thespian that he loves the sound of his own voice.

[279] And he needs to express himself because he needs to hear himself.

[280] It needs to be heard, you know, which is true of a lot of us.

[281] There's a lot of different characters, and I'm starting to trickle in now, the reactions and things.

[282] Nick Cage loves it.

[283] You know, I gave him all the best lines, so whatever.

[284] No, but I was really happy because that could have really hurt if you didn't like it.

[285] Have you heard from Kelsey?

[286] Not yet.

[287] Not yet.

[288] Okay.

[289] But Joan Dangerfield emailed me and was effusively complimentary about it and loved how I handled Rodney and our relationship going forward.

[290] everything, and said she had a ton of quotes in her mind.

[291] But those are the people I kind of was a little closer to.

[292] And then I got a lovely email from Anthony Hopkins that...

[293] Oh, and he's great in the book, too.

[294] He is a wild, amazing character.

[295] And we give him this sad, romantic background and all of these wonderful dramatic things that, you know, I wondered if he would go, like, I'd really rather be asked if you'd like to expose my broken arms.

[296] Never asked.

[297] Never asked.

[298] Always beg forgiveness later.

[299] He actually emailed me after he wrote it.

[300] He was thrilled to get it.

[301] And then I was biting my nails.

[302] And he emailed me two days ago and said that he was just so happy to be a part of such a wild, wild ride and that we broke all the rules.

[303] and it reminded of him of James Joyce.

[304] And, you know, for me, that's, that, that makes my heart go a flutter.

[305] You know, the portrait of an artist as a young man was a really important book.

[306] And so he was just really happy to be part of it.

[307] And he said, thanks for including me with all the big shots.

[308] And he was just lovely and humble and wasn't that nice that he doesn't think he's one of the big shots?

[309] That makes me, I mean, I've always liked him.

[310] The best are always like that.

[311] The best people, I mean, you know, the best people know they're good.

[312] They don't have to rub it in your face.

[313] But also, you know, he has no insecurity.

[314] I've always been amazed by him.

[315] He's one of the only guys I've ever seen in this world who I don't know where he is age -wise.

[316] And he's in the 70s or early 70s, if I'm not doing him wrong.

[317] But he's kept his vitality in movies.

[318] He can still be a leading man in movies.

[319] That's an extraordinary accomplishment.

[320] Jim, I hate to, this is awkward, I just Googled it.

[321] He is 44 years old.

[322] God damn it, I'm so sorry.

[323] He's aged terribly.

[324] He's not vital at all.

[325] You need to do a rewrite.

[326] Yeah.

[327] He was in a bunch of silver spoons.

[328] He's not my problem.

[329] You know what I mean?

[330] His real life is my problem.

[331] You know, there's something.

[332] want to ask you about, which is you wrote this book, and I think there's a lot of bravery involved.

[333] I did my own research, by the way.

[334] Mine says 82.

[335] There's the fake news, man. Who's putting out the fake news now?

[336] I'm telling you, I got this off Fox.

[337] This is solid.

[338] This is very solid.

[339] And we don't have to wear masks.

[340] So it's all good.

[341] Straight from the mouth of the manity.

[342] No, you know, it's funny because you, there's like a duality that you encompass that I find really fascinating, which is on the one side, you can take these big risks and really go for it in a way where, as you just said, you try and connect with what you want to do and what makes you vibrate and not worry about how people will react.

[343] But at the same time, nobody can be a great comedian without an incredible need to please.

[344] And you've got to have both of those.

[345] I mean, and when I look at you in the early work in the early years, I think one of the things that was so dynamic is that you, you've got to have both of those.

[346] you would literally, if it made the audience laugh, you would swallow silverware and hurt yourself.

[347] Do you know what I mean?

[348] It's this.

[349] Sure, but I also have another side to me, which is the rebelliousness against that.

[350] So every 20 shows at the comedy store, I would go with the, you know, expressed determination of getting in a fight with the audience on purpose.

[351] I would actually purposely get up on stage and start being derogatory and negative.

[352] and whatever and self -indulgent and singing songs and doing whatever until there were things flying through the crowd, you know, like chairs some nights.

[353] And, you know, some nights it was like New Year's Eve was swizzle sticks and whatever's and just the angry, bloody faces going, fuck you, get off, the name of my mind.

[354] That's what we all want.

[355] in comedy yeah and of course that made me go even further and one night i stayed up to the comedy store on stage for two hours and by the time i left they cheered they gave me a standing ovation for leaving and and then i crawled through the crowd and stood up and in behind or sat up behind the piano during the next person's act and started banging on the keys and singing i hate you all you gave me cancer and until the entire audience left so there's this weird double thing going on where I want to disrespect the world enough that I can tell the truth, you know, but I am willing to do anything to get to get a laugh for sure.

[356] You know, it's interesting to me that a bunch of things come to mind.

[357] One, Ace Ventura, you went into it with an idea about what you wanted to do to the leading man in a movie.

[358] It's so fascinating because you've said you wanted to, destroy the leading man, the concept of the leading man in a movie.

[359] The guy with the answers.

[360] Yes.

[361] Yes.

[362] And all the cool moves.

[363] You wanted to blow that up, but at the same time, people loved it.

[364] So it's this crazy thing where you...

[365] We loved it too.

[366] Tom Shadyac and I were like sitting there in the dailies every day, howling with laughter, out of control with laughter, and then walking out and going, we're finished.

[367] We're finished.

[368] Right.

[369] This is either going to be a cult classic or we're done forever.

[370] We'll never work again.

[371] You know, I think one of the things that I responded to so much right away was I've always loved comedy.

[372] And it's one of the things that I always loved is someone behaving comedy where someone's behaving outrageously.

[373] Outrageously.

[374] And people notice and make kind of an, you know, hmm, yes.

[375] Well, anyway, Mr. Venture right this way.

[376] And it's like if someone behaved the way Ace Ventura behaved when he walked in the door for six seconds, they'd say, you got to get the fuck out of it.

[377] You got to go.

[378] You got to go.

[379] You're twisting your nipples and things like that.

[380] Yes, you were no longer needed here.

[381] But what I love about that kind of comedy, and you see it with Clousseau, with Peter Sellers, someone coming in and doing something completely outrageous and people are like, and he's just destroyed.

[382] A suit of armor and an antique piano, and the house is flooding.

[383] like, this way, inspector.

[384] No, let's go meet.

[385] You know what?

[386] It's not that untrue.

[387] I mean, it's a conceit in movies that people don't notice certain things or they just go like, okay, I'll deal with this later or something.

[388] But, you know, real life is like that.

[389] People come in with an agenda and you'll find that all the time, especially being interviewed and stuff like that.

[390] There's a lot of times people aren't actually listening.

[391] There's an agenda.

[392] And they're going like, okay, finish your line.

[393] And, you know, they're ready to go to the next.

[394] but they don't want to be thrown off the plan.

[395] So you can get away with quite a bit.

[396] I think Al -EG, not Ali -G, Sasha Cohen proves that a lot.

[397] How far you can push a person into absurdity, into a land of absolute absurdity and unacceptability, and they will try to cling to an idea of normal.

[398] Yes, yes.

[399] Which is always funny.

[400] Harpo Marx can walk up to somebody at the matri -D at a restaurant and he can take out a giant scissors from his pocket and cut the guy's tie off.

[401] And the guy will go, hmm, anyway, this way to a table.

[402] No, that's where everything would stop in real life.

[403] But it is true that one of the things I've really enjoyed, and I feel like you more than most anyone I can think of, maybe anybody I can think of, has you're always pushing, you're always pushing what can this person do that still allows him to bear, exist in society because no one wants to they need something from you they need something from your character they need you know like you said cluzzo peter sellers got away with a lot of that you know chaplain to me was inspiring in that direction because he changed every moment into something magical you know he he made magic happen with every little mundane moment so i you know i i think that way i also think in the way of like not pandering you know uh of like i have a pandering switch you know, that I, that I, that I, I not only try not to do that, but I try to go in the opposite direction, which is, you know, and I've challenged my audience a lot, you know, I've gone off on these tangents in my life and my creative career and stuff and left them kind of scratching their heads while I develop a new limb to bring back to the tree, you know, but, but it's, it's, it's happened that way.

[404] And I've been able to explore all these different areas.

[405] Like, this is, this is such new ground for me, man. This is writing a novel is just an extraordinary accomplishment for anybody, you know.

[406] I can say that for myself because I'm only half responsible for this book.

[407] But, you know, the book is a, is a ton of blood, sweat, and tears and, and a ton of fun.

[408] You know, I do feel like there are moments in the book because you're talking about Jim Carrey.

[409] And Jim Carrey's living, Jim Carrey's life in the book, it bears a lot of similarity to your own life.

[410] And then there are insane departures.

[411] There are just crazy departures from it but there are truths in there like the pressure the Jim Carrey in the book is getting to stay relevant from powerful industry types and you need to make this movie and that stuff you know you keep wanting to go and make this incredibly artistic project where you play Chairman Mao and people are saying of course the studios don't want that and they want you in the hungry hungry hippos movie and you know I have to say managers as well they're like look We made the box.

[412] The box works.

[413] Get it back in it.

[414] Get inside the box.

[415] When you're describing it, first of all, first of all, I know that you and Dana Vachon created this.

[416] The flip side to the artistic project is the Hungry Hungry Hippos movie, which is already pre -sold and guaranteed to make a billion dollars and everyone wants it.

[417] And they want you.

[418] And so you're getting all this pressure to do it and you don't want to do it.

[419] So you clearly have loathing for that project.

[420] When I was reading the book, I thought this actually.

[421] sounds like a good movie.

[422] I think I would go see it.

[423] You never know.

[424] Which makes me, which makes me a moron.

[425] Maybe a spin -off.

[426] I was interested that that felt like that's true.

[427] Like, I'm sure that you've had pressure before.

[428] Oh, for sure.

[429] It's a constant.

[430] It's a constant.

[431] You know, every decision you make has to be weighed against, like, am I artistically selling out?

[432] Is this cool to be doing?

[433] You know, and then you've got your people you want to take care of.

[434] You got, you, there's a whole consideration that goes on with everything.

[435] I, I generally find to myself a lot flying in the face of what's expected or at least delving in a new territory that that is risky, you know?

[436] And that to me is life.

[437] That to me is what makes life worth living, man. It's like Jacques Cousteau doesn't stop in the tide pools, man. He keeps exploring.

[438] Well, he doesn't anymore.

[439] He's dead as a dormant.

[440] Yeah, he died.

[441] He died because he went, he went too deep.

[442] He went too deep and he died.

[443] He was the bends, right?

[444] He explored and he He shouldn't have, and he should have stayed in the tide pool and creatively been safe.

[445] That's right.

[446] So your own example is a fucking terrible example.

[447] Exactly.

[448] He should have just sat on the porch.

[449] You want to be Jacques Couceau.

[450] No, I think he was like hit by a sob coming out of a restaurant.

[451] I think he was.

[452] What a way to go.

[453] I made that up.

[454] I'm just pretending I have a fake Google here.

[455] Yes, it says here hit by a sob at the age of 32.

[456] Let's start some fake news.

[457] Wow, incredible.

[458] He was very young and he had never actually didn't, never learned how to swim.

[459] They always CGI'd that part.

[460] Was he on the Epstein list?

[461] by the way, can we say that?

[462] You can't you can't just include somebody on that?

[463] I don't think you can retroactively start adding people to the Epstein list.

[464] Oh, okay.

[465] It's another part of the book where when you go to make this movie, basically what they do is they put you in the ultimate motion capture suit and they capture the essence of Jim Carrey and then they're basically saying we don't need you anymore, but you're going to make a ton of money, and you realize that what would have been completely absurd 15 years ago if you had written that now seems 95 % possible.

[466] It's that question that's being raised now.

[467] Do you even own yourself, you know, the IP and the corporal rights to your personality?

[468] It's like, what will happen to the things I've said or done?

[469] You know, I mean, right now you're seeing an atmosphere where you're going to worry about what you said 30 years ago or what?

[470] creative joke you had 30 years ago might come back to haunt you or whatever it is.

[471] Who knows what's going to happen to us as personalities?

[472] I just, I loved that idea and I loved the idea that in order to, like one of my favorite things in the book is the idea that, you know, if you just leave Jim Carrey alone for 48 hours without a compliment, he'll sign the papers.

[473] There's got to be some.

[474] See, see, that's what I wanted to say.

[475] There's a bunch of little clues in this book that I do feel resonate with the real you because it felt like, yeah, there's a grain of truth in there, which would certainly, and I say this, that would certainly ring true for me, is if, if no one paid attention to me for 48 hours, I would literally do anything they told me to.

[476] And the other thing is, you talk a lot about the people that are managing you or trying to control you.

[477] They're constantly floating in name of another actor who could get the part, another A -lister.

[478] And what's funny is I thought, that's funny and also, I'm sure, somewhat true.

[479] I'm sure people are saying, hey, Jim, if you don't do it.

[480] Depp's going to jump right in there.

[481] Johnny Depp's going to do it.

[482] And then there's a part of you, and you admit this in the book, that's thinking, Fission Bill's not afraid of nothing.

[483] You'd chase out all fucking day.

[484] Exactly.

[485] One of the things I've always really appreciated in all the time I've known you is that any time over the many years you came on my show or did anything when I toured and you said you wanted to show up and do something.

[486] I didn't know anybody who would go that far and put that much work.

[487] into it.

[488] And I'll never forget you you came once and you wanted to do a biopic called the Conan O 'Brien story where you played me and you spent hours.

[489] You spent hours getting the makeup and the giant wig and it was you playing this incredible, I don't know where you got the idea for this character, incredibly narcissistic freak and who's abusive, abusive to everybody around him and you throw hot coffee.

[490] I had to dial it down a bit actually.

[491] You did a muted version of Conan O 'Brien.

[492] What was amazing is that's one of my favorite things that we ever did on the late night show, and it's a photograph that I have up in my study.

[493] I have like some photos on the wall of cool moments, and it's you and the giant wig and me standing next to you as we were taping it.

[494] See, in my mind, I'm looking at a room that looks like some kind of psycho murderer with a bunch of pictures and stuff and strings that go to different things.

[495] It's the room they break into when they realize that you're, your life is in danger.

[496] It's like they break into that room.

[497] And in a way I am.

[498] In a way I am.

[499] But anyway, you would go, you came when we did shows in, we did a week of shows in Toronto, and you came and you, I mean, you sang a song, you saw a lady in half, you, you know, you climbed up in the ceiling.

[500] And then at the end, the crowd was going insane.

[501] And you were with the band playing bongos after the show.

[502] was over and people were like no one would leave because you were there playing bongos with the band and I thought I always appreciate people who to them it's like a religion.

[503] The comedy is a religion meaning no you keep doing it or your art whatever you want to consider it you do it when no one's looking do you know what I mean I'm sure I get the sense that I do plenty of that yes yeah no but I'm serious people that do comedy when there's no one around and there's no camera and you're complete alone in isolation but something occurs to you you might do a bit with a tree.

[504] Yeah, I talk to myself all the time.

[505] It's amazing.

[506] I'm worried about you.

[507] Well, you know, see, here's the thing.

[508] I am equally shut in and social butterfly.

[509] I love energy of people.

[510] I love being face to face with people.

[511] I love talking to people.

[512] I love entertaining people.

[513] I also love to be alone.

[514] You know, like I have two worlds.

[515] And when I get out in that world and I get around your energy, and I get around the energy, the band.

[516] I love artists, musicians, you know, anytime I have contact with people that make a living, making a song out of life, you know what I mean?

[517] Just like going, okay, I'm going to turn all these disparate worries and, you know, problems and alchemize them into something totally cool and beautiful that people can laugh at and diffuse everything.

[518] Yeah, you said you want to free people from.

[519] concern.

[520] That's a quote of yours.

[521] If it's a serious role, I mean, even if it's a serious role, if it's a serious role or a comedic role, that's what your aim is.

[522] I think you must have like a Hippocratic Oath, which is you embody all of these, to me, you embody all of these dualities.

[523] And one is part of you wants to blow it up and the other part wants to do no harm, like the Hippocratic Oath.

[524] You don't want to hurt anybody's feelings.

[525] And I get the sense that if someone told you, you know, you kind of hurt that person's feelings, you would be devastated.

[526] Yeah, I would absolutely be hurt.

[527] Yeah, I don't want to hurt anybody's feelings.

[528] There's no malice in my game.

[529] The only hints of malice, I believe, are just me making fun of human quirks and ego, you know, and it's not making fun of the celebrity themselves, but it's making fun of the system and the ego system.

[530] You know, there's no malice in it.

[531] The only bit of malice I might have is towards giant, you know, corporate entities that hide in the shadows, you know, and control.

[532] control everything, you know.

[533] So I will take my pot shots at them.

[534] And Dana and I wanted to like make sure that we didn't kill the sacred cows, but we took them for a nice fucking joy ride.

[535] Right.

[536] Well, let's watch the language.

[537] This is a show permanently for kids.

[538] Is it for kids?

[539] Yeah.

[540] This is a Nickelodeon radio network.

[541] I believe the children are our future.

[542] I had an amazing experience with you, which is I was at your house one time and then not that long afterwards you invited me back over and I came over.

[543] And I want to say like six months had gone by.

[544] The house was completely different and it was filled with your artwork, all of which you had made in the span of time.

[545] I mean, it was clearly coming from a kind of manic place, but I was really stunned by how much stuff you would put out.

[546] Who are you?

[547] And I judged you.

[548] I judged you.

[549] And I remember when I put a dark?

[550] You diagnosed me on the air.

[551] Yes, I did.

[552] No credentials whatsoever.

[553] I've been on television for 27 years Which gives me the right to prescribe I've seen a lot of idiots in my time I put you remember I'm the one that put you on Ridland And against your will I gave you little injections in the carotid And you calmed right down And I started forming sentences He was wonderful I want to say one other thing about the book Which is that there's so much That is it could be farcical or it could be seen as, you know, crazy, impressionistic extrapolation.

[554] But also, I could really get a sense of your dad in the book, you know, like your connection to your dad and made me think that I could relate to because my own experience, I think mirrored years, which is when I was a kid, I watched my dad like a hawk.

[555] If something made him laugh, when I was like three, I was like, that's the way in.

[556] Did you watch Sullivan?

[557] Yeah.

[558] I used to watch Sullivan with my dad, and I used to watch Rodney Dangerfield on Ed Sullivan with my dad.

[559] dad and so rodney would make your dad laugh and then you would think my dad laugh and I'd act along with it and just love it every minute of it until I started understanding the jokes right and then I laughed for real but but yeah it was it is that it is a mirror thing it's like my father was the funniest man on the face of the earth uh he just absolutely hilarious and animated in every way like he was a living cartoon when he told a story it was like what this and then the guy comes running he goes hey sure i'm tech baker I just looked at myself for a second I looked like I don't know why they're just like, I'm falling out of window.

[560] My funny valenture.

[561] Yeah, funniest man you ever met.

[562] Rodney Dangerfield loved him.

[563] He was absolutely insane around Rodney, one -liner.

[564] Because let me explain to anyone who doesn't know.

[565] You opened for Rodney for years, and he was sort of your mentor.

[566] Yeah, he used to stand off the side of the stage in his robe, the classic Rodney in his robe, standing off the side of the stage with his balls hanging, you know, basically.

[567] like a perfect timekeeping pendulum.

[568] Oh, you had to reset it every once in a while.

[569] But, you know, it was pretty accurate.

[570] Closely, 12 o 'clock.

[571] Yeah, he found me, he saw me up in Canada.

[572] And we had a completely different view of things from up there.

[573] I think that it might be one of the reasons.

[574] So much brilliant comedy has come out of Canada is that you guys are close, but you're not here and you're smart.

[575] It's a very literate, smart country, and you guys are watching us and you're like sleeping in the next bed watching your brother have a nervous breakdown.

[576] And so you get to, do you think there's some truth to that maybe?

[577] Yeah, that's the feeling.

[578] The feeling is powerlessness right across the board, man. I'm equally with the good and the bad in this, you know.

[579] I just think we should all be honest about what's going on, you know, and that's all.

[580] I wish there was a way to let the people know don't agree with me that disagreement isn't hatred.

[581] We can disagree without hating each other.

[582] And we need to, we need to broom the White House, man. We just need to broom the White House.

[583] I don't know.

[584] I think, I was talking to my kids about it today.

[585] They're in their mid -50s.

[586] And I was, I had them very when I was three.

[587] And, but I was talking to them today.

[588] And I was, I keep going back to the same thing, which is my anger is also directed at, and, you know, neighbors, people around him who are saying, hey, you know, this is, he's helping us get what we want and he's getting us a tax break.

[589] So let's pretend he's, let's pretend the bus isn't out of control.

[590] I want to see all of those Republican senators lined up in hell, fluffing the devil, getting him ready for Trump.

[591] That would mean you're in hell with them, Jim.

[592] I get to visit.

[593] Oh, you just visit quickly and you get it like a nice stuff, man. A mango iced tea and you, the devil's like, no, you'll just hear for a short time.

[594] I'm going to back.

[595] It's pass.

[596] I've got a backstage, fast.

[597] You've got a pass?

[598] I got two sixes and a five.

[599] Not quite there.

[600] Jim, will you be staying?

[601] You know what?

[602] I have some things I got to do.

[603] Of course.

[604] Of course.

[605] Would you like something cool to drink?

[606] So we're not going to be...

[607] Is that a bell I just heard ring?

[608] All right.

[609] Well, listen, you know, I can't go with you on these anti -Republican rants.

[610] I just can't.

[611] You know, it's very simple.

[612] Bob Dylan said it.

[613] Yeah, but no one understood it.

[614] He was mumbling.

[615] No, Bob Dylan said it.

[616] He said, that's all.

[617] It just doesn't work this way.

[618] It doesn't work this way.

[619] It doesn't work this way.

[620] When we hate each other, it doesn't work this way.

[621] We don't understand each other.

[622] When we can't go as far as like removing painful reminders of slavery to people, you know, that's not that far to go.

[623] You know, that's not your culture.

[624] That's a, that's a dark part of the culture that reasserted itself during the civil rights movement.

[625] And, you know, that's just not right.

[626] And I think it would, all of those Confederate statues would make a wonderful marine environment for sea life.

[627] Right?

[628] At the bottom of the fucking Marianas trink.

[629] Yeah.

[630] Well, also, I, you know what, I'm going to go a little further.

[631] I think all those statues should come down.

[632] And I think the minute you put up a statue of any human being, it's problematic.

[633] I mean, I do.

[634] I idolizing anybody is a strange thing.

[635] Yeah.

[636] Let's hope it never is.

[637] No, I don't, I think only celebrities should be idolized.

[638] I feel strongly about that.

[639] People that have worked in film and people that have worked in television, people that have primarily worked in comedy, those are the idols.

[640] Those are the people that should always be paid the most.

[641] Those are the people that should always be preserved in the culture.

[642] And consider seriously, as philosophers.

[643] Yes.

[644] Well, I think we've done a lot of great philosophizing here.

[645] Listen, Jim, I've kept you for a long time, but please do a follow -up to this book where I Conan O 'Brien gets to be in it and I'm an incredible womanizer.

[646] That's all I want.

[647] It's just an incredible womanizer who's insatiable.

[648] I give you permission to go ahead.

[649] I'll call it stating the obvious.

[650] Jim, always lovely to talk to you.

[651] Great talking to you, man. I love you and you're wonderful and I love you as a person and as an artist and as a friend and I want you to protect me because you're bigger.

[652] I am slightly bigger.

[653] And you know what?

[654] I will say a genuine and thanks for, you've been incredibly nice to me since the very beginning and always generous with me. It's a pity.

[655] It's a pity.

[656] But I've always appreciated that.

[657] There's a real kindness in you.

[658] And, you know, we don't get to see it much.

[659] Well, you bring the best out in me, man. You bring the best out.

[660] You do in people.

[661] So anyway.

[662] All right, Jim, God bless you, sir.

[663] Be well.

[664] And I look forward to seeing you soon when the madness is over.

[665] Yeah, brother.

[666] Only six more years to go.

[667] That's it, man. We can do this time, stand on our heads.

[668] It is time now for us to review the state of the podcast.

[669] You know, there's a state of the union address.

[670] Yeah.

[671] I think of myself as the president of the podcast, the commander -in -chief.

[672] It's constitutionally required that I every year give a state of the podcast.

[673] And I address my minions.

[674] Those with less power than me. No, no, they're all different branches of government.

[675] They just don't have power.

[676] And then there's me. And what I'm saying is that the state of the podcast is good.

[677] The podcast flourishes and thrives.

[678] We are in our third season of the podcast.

[679] You know, the rising tide has lifted all boats.

[680] We are coping during this time of pandemic.

[681] We have pulled together.

[682] And I think the podcast is stronger than ever.

[683] You're not the real president.

[684] Well, no, thank God.

[685] No, you're pulling quotes, inspirational quotes, from actual presidents.

[686] No, I'm just saying, I like to, as you know, I am someone I'm a fan of history, and I like to project confidence and calm.

[687] And I am saying, Matt, don't you agree with me, Matt, that the state of the podcast is good.

[688] As much as I hate to agree with you, yes, I do.

[689] Yes, yes, it is flourishing.

[690] We started out, remember early on people said Conan can't have a podcast.

[691] It'll never work.

[692] I don't think anyone said that.

[693] I'm one of those people that likes to invent in my mind that people were against me. It helps me. Remember the Michael Jordan documentary?

[694] He was always fabricating that someone had dissed him so that he could destroy them in a game.

[695] I'm so much like Michael Jordan.

[696] Well, no. Listen, it's more shocking than you'd think.

[697] It's the tyrannical kind of thing.

[698] No, no, no. We're similar ages, both very naturally gifted athletes.

[699] both an incredible desire to win at any cost Both the face of the 90s He was the face of winning in the 90s And I was the face of winning in the 90s What were you winning?

[700] I was winning, what was I winning?

[701] I was winning across the board I had the late night show killing it I was just hitting it with the lady's Oh no though I really wasn't You weren't though right no no No but listen what I'm saying is, I was hitting it with the ladies, no one says that.

[702] Hitting it with the lady.

[703] I was hitting it with the lady.

[704] Let's just break that down.

[705] What were you hitting exactly?

[706] It sounds like we were at some sort of state fair and they had whack -a -mole and they had two mallets.

[707] And there was a woman there who didn't want me to, who was like, well, he can play alongside me. So I was technically hitting it with the lady.

[708] Oh, okay.

[709] That's my explanation for that one.

[710] But anyway, no, no, please don't get me off track.

[711] The state of the podcast.

[712] In the beginning, everybody was against us.

[713] Everyone said, you can't make it.

[714] There's no way.

[715] There's no way.

[716] He's too good -looking.

[717] You know, that's why he's on TV.

[718] He can't be on radio.

[719] And so then this happens.

[720] Not only do we succeed, but we excel.

[721] We exceed people's expectations.

[722] We sell an incredible number.

[723] of Fracture frames.

[724] They haven't advertised on this show in 60 episodes.

[725] Is that true?

[726] Something like that.

[727] We did so many ads for them in the beginning.

[728] How come they went away?

[729] I think because they're getting all kinds of free ads every time you mentioned.

[730] Well, fracture.

[731] Hey, listen, if you have, if you have a photograph and it's not laser printed on glass, then you're a fucking moron.

[732] And then there's a fracture guy just going, can you believe this guy?

[733] He does it for us for free.

[734] Just let them roll.

[735] It's because early on on the podcast, I had to do so many ads for Fracture that now I'm, all I do is walk around her house and there'll be a picture of my son on the wall when he was, you know, first born and it's hanging up in a nice frame, but it's a photographic print.

[736] Yeah, gross.

[737] And I tear it off the wall and smash it.

[738] Yeah.

[739] If this is either on glass or I'll wipe my ass, it rhymes.

[740] Okay.

[741] Anyway, Fracture, I don't know why I keep mentioning them.

[742] You're saying that as your legs are just bouncing up and down.

[743] I know I have restless leg syndrome.

[744] I have restless.

[745] I have restless.

[746] My mom, I tell you this, at the dinner table, my leg, I always had restless leg syndrome and my leg would be going.

[747] My mom sat next to me. We'd all six of us, seven of us, whatever there were, six kids, two parents, six kids, two parents and a grandmother, we'd all be sitting around this table the way Murphy Brown, they all crammed together around a small table and ate their lunch.

[748] We were all crammed around this table.

[749] and my leg would be going and my mother would take her hand and she would put it on my leg and say stop it people will think something's wrong with you oh no yes stop it people will think something's wrong with you and something was and something was that's what's going to make people think that something's wrong yeah not the not the muttering I am the least I am the least Zen person that's ever lived but that leg is like Like the metaphor, you're the perpetual motion machine.

[750] It's always running and you fuel this thing.

[751] Mm -hmm.

[752] I do.

[753] And that's why the state of the podcast is good.

[754] There you go.

[755] It's because I love doing the podcast.

[756] I really do.

[757] I enjoy it.

[758] Matt, do you enjoy doing it?

[759] Be honest.

[760] Yeah, sometimes it's a little scary.

[761] You know, I never know where, what you're going to say to me. And I'm just have to be ready for everything, you know.

[762] Well, but Matt, you should know that this is a safe space.

[763] It's the most unsafe space I've ever been to.

[764] And I was in Vietnam.

[765] No, no, no, Matt, Matt, listen.

[766] No, this is creepy.

[767] This is scary.

[768] Matt, I joke and I suppose I Josh.

[769] But you should always feel safe, Matt.

[770] You should always feel safe.

[771] I would never, ever snap at you or try to demean you in any way on this podcast.

[772] And if I have in the past, and I don't think these things are, there's no record of them, so we'll never know.

[773] There's no way to go back and listen.

[774] But no, you're my friend.

[775] And when I say friend, someone I've been forced to work with.

[776] The way you said that to me And the way you looked I'm going to share my screen with you right now You're looking at me so nonpluss Like you're going to kill me Nonplus, that's my real face That's just my face Sona I hope you're having a good time On the podcast We just heard from Matt That he sometimes feels afraid Yeah I have to say I feel like I Really lucked out Because I do the least amount of work on this podcast Oh you do yeah Next to nothing Next to nothing And so I get to just, you know, come in and talk with, you know, my pal Matt and you and you and it's nice.

[777] And then, you know, you have way more pressure than I do.

[778] And then Matt has to produce it.

[779] So I'm, I really do the least.

[780] And it's, it's a great position to be in.

[781] I have a theory that, you know, like all humans, I'm made primarily of carbon.

[782] Carbon when pressurized turns into, Matt, tell us.

[783] Diamonds.

[784] That's right.

[785] I always had a theory that when I die, the coroner is going to cut open my chest and I'm going to be all diamond.

[786] I'm carbon and I've been under incredible pressure during my entire lifetime.

[787] What do you think of that?

[788] I think that's a pretty accurate assessment, but I also think you put yourself under all that pressure.

[789] You don't have to be.

[790] I've got to be.

[791] No, you don't, Conan?

[792] No. What's the movie where Al Pacino says, it keeps me on the edge where I got to be?

[793] Heat.

[794] Oh, yeah.

[795] In the movie Heat, he's talking to his wife, former wife.

[796] And he says, it keeps me. on the edge.

[797] That's also the movie where he goes, she's got a great ass!

[798] Wait, is that true?

[799] Which one?

[800] He says that in heat?

[801] Yeah, he's having like a talk with like some street informant and you can tell he just kind of improvised it and the look on the actor's face is not acting where he's like looking at the director going, what the fuck is going on right now?

[802] Yeah, he's got a great ass.

[803] Yeah, sometimes I love an odd choice in a movie that's there for all of time.

[804] I think I may have mentioned this, but on Wall Street.

[805] Talk about odd choices.

[806] There's a scene where Charlie Sheen and Martin Sheen are riding down an elevator together.

[807] And Charlie Sheen's really mad at his dad because his dad just blew the big deal he had by speaking the truth and not going along with Gordon Gecko's plan.

[808] And he's like, Dad, Dad, that was such a great plan.

[809] How come you do this?

[810] I'm not going to do this.

[811] And Martin Sheen's line is supposed to be, well, sometimes some of us care more than just what's in our wallet.

[812] And he goes, well, some of us sometimes we care more than just what's in our wallet.

[813] I want to play these.

[814] We should get the audio.

[815] And it's just like, you swear to God, the audio people would have said, yeah, we got to go again.

[816] And then the director would go like, yeah, yeah, let's get to just get one more of those.

[817] I'll play the clips.

[818] This is heat.

[819] Why do I get mixed up with that bitch?

[820] Because she got a great ass.

[821] And this is Waltzoo.

[822] What you see is a guy who never measured a man's success by the size of his wife.

[823] Okay, the state of the podcast is secure.

[824] Conan O 'Brien needs a friend, with Sonamov Sessian and Conan O 'Brien as himself.

[825] Produced by me, Matt Goreley, executive produced by Adam Sacks, Joanna Solitaroff, and Jeff Ross at Team Coco, and Colin Anderson and Chris Bannon at Earwolf.

[826] Theme song by The White Stripes.

[827] Incidental music by Jimmy Vivino.

[828] Our supervising producer is Aaron Blair and our associate talent producer is Jennifer Samples.

[829] The show is engineered by Will Beckton.

[830] You can rate and review this show on Apple Podcasts and you might find your review featured on a future episode.

[831] Got a question for Conan?

[832] Call the Team Coco hotline at 323 -451 -2821 and leave a message.

[833] It too could be featured on a future episode.

[834] And if you haven't already, please subscribe to Conan O 'Brien needs a friend on Apple Podcasts, Stitcher, or wherever fine podcasts are downloaded.

[835] This has been a Team Coco production in association with Earwolf.