125 - Bedside Astrologer!

[0] This is exactly right.

[1] Hey, this is exciting.

[2] An all -new season of only murders in the building is coming to Hulu on August 27th.

[3] Steve Martin, Martin Short, and Selena Gomez are back as your favorite podcaster, detectives.

[4] But there's a mystery hanging over everyone.

[5] Who killed Saz?

[6] And were they really after Charles?

[7] Why would someone want to kill Charles?

[8] This season, murder hits close to home.

[9] With a threat against one of their own, the stakes are higher than ever.

[10] Plus, the gang is going to Hollywood to turn their podcast into a major movie.

[11] Amid the glitz and glamour of Los Angeles, more mysteries and twists arise.

[12] Who knows what will happen once the cameras start to roll?

[13] Get ready for the stariest season yet with Merrill Streep, Zach Alfinacus, Eugene Levy, Eva Longoria, Melissa McCarthy, DeVine, Joy Randolph, Molly Shannon, and more.

[14] Only murders in the building, premieres August 27th, streaming only on Hulu.

[15] Goodbye.

[16] And welcome.

[17] Hello and welcome to my favorite murder.

[18] your true crime podcast for when you're feeling spicy or sultry or salty or uh you know synonymous with sexual feelings feelings feelings it had to be an ass let's go over let's take it straight into the gutter at the top so we can come back out and go to heaven at the end this is like you know how cosmo will have like the sex episode oh and it's the thickest magazine you've ever seen filled with garbage.

[19] This isn't that.

[20] I used to like the Cosmo pullout bedside astrologer where you could pretend that you could read a little waste of paper pamphlet about your sign and that was going to tell you what kind of dudes you're going to have sex with in the following year.

[21] And I remember reading it like I had to read it and I felt like it would be that it was somehow like a vision board of like if I focus on this enough this might happen to me where it's like what does it mean someone I already I've already met my Mr. Ray exactly like who could it be I wonder if it is that guy scan your brain for every single person you've met let's I'm gonna read you your sex horoscope right now really?

[22] All right let's hear it sure we can always edit it out if it's stupid I feel like this okay let's just say up top for all those people that drive around with their kids listening because they think it's kind of funny this is going to be our triple X rated show today.

[23] It's summertime.

[24] It's hot outside.

[25] Okay, monthly sex scope for Taurus.

[26] You ready for this?

[27] Taurus, woman.

[28] Karen, this is for June of 2018.

[29] So you better get on this because it's halfway over.

[30] Yeah, I'm not going to.

[31] Okay.

[32] Okay.

[33] Seduction blossoms on hot summer nights, Karen.

[34] Really?

[35] It says your name in it.

[36] It's weird.

[37] Beginning as early as the first week in June.

[38] Is that true?

[39] That's my private business.

[40] Okay.

[41] That's when a grand water trine, followed closely by a quarter of moon on June 6th, what, could ignite a long, sexy, and overdue discussion.

[42] No. Yes, it says that.

[43] I swear to God.

[44] I don't want to have a discussion.

[45] You approach your confusing.

[46] Let's get to, no. A cranky Mars retrograde starting on June 26th contributes to the relationship altercations that arise, Karen.

[47] It's not you being a fucking crazy bitch.

[48] It's fucking Mars.

[49] It's this Mars trying that I can't get away from.

[50] It's not that you ate and you didn't have enough protein and you screamed at him about his fucking car being disgusting.

[51] It's not that I went through his phone when he was in the bathroom at all.

[52] I found something not that incriminating, but...

[53] It's Mars for fuck's sake.

[54] It's Mars.

[55] A full moon in Capricorn, blah, blah, blah.

[56] Neptune is in here.

[57] Saturn is in here to the moon and wildly painting the whole day in rose colored hues.

[58] Today it's difficult to decipher whether it's real love.

[59] or just old -fashioned lust.

[60] So there you go.

[61] Well, isn't that always the way?

[62] I mean, isn't that the great human puzzle?

[63] Is this person that you're hitting up at 134 a .m. Trying to swing by their house.

[64] Is that love?

[65] Is that what lovers do?

[66] How can one know other than reading their daily sex horoscope?

[67] One would never know.

[68] Or their private texts.

[69] Or their private texts.

[70] I love the idea.

[71] it's not like I'm not the kind of person that wouldn't read people's private texts but I'm a hundred percent for it I just want to go ahead and say are you for it a hundred percent getting up into people's business like that like read read a person's shit okay but here's what I find this addendum if you're going to be so brave and strong as to bust in and read your person's shit when you find out shit that destroys your heart and life and soul you don't get to say anything because you fucking did it.

[72] You did it to yourself?

[73] Yes, you do.

[74] Why are they doing shit that's going to destroy your heart, life, and soul?

[75] And at least you found out about it before they kept doing it.

[76] Yeah, but you can't, you don't have a leg to stand on once you have been the crazy person that reads private information.

[77] Because this person, so you find out they're cheating on you.

[78] It's, you, you shouldn't have read their texts.

[79] Well, if you, if there's like, I'm saying, the thing I've made up in my mind is you're doing this cold.

[80] You're having a great relationship and you're like, oh, we just went to the bathroom.

[81] Mom, and I'm just going to poke around.

[82] Okay.

[83] But what do you find?

[84] Innocently, then you find, what I'm saying is, if you find something bad in that, you have to know going in, that's a more than 50 % possibility.

[85] I, is this a relationship podcast now?

[86] I don't know.

[87] If it is, it's the worst, right?

[88] I guess I'm just saying.

[89] I don't think so because I think.

[90] Everyone's a liar, though.

[91] Everyone lies.

[92] You can't, if you, you have to go and know in your.

[93] you're going to find something you're not happy with yeah but know that like at what point you know you can be you can tell them i don't know clearly i fucking have read vince's text and found some shit i didn't like we all have i was like what's up i read your fucking text but i mean isn't there something that in whatever the argument then becomes because all arguments become here's my list of everything i've done right versus here's the list of you everything you've done right or wrong whatever right i'm thinking of like cheating i think feel like it kicks the legs out from under you where then he's like well yeah because you're this crazy bitch that's why i cheat on you oh no i'm just saying oh well you wouldn't want a date a person that would say something like that anyway but i'm just saying i feel like the move itself is is such a big move as someone who has a lot of paranoia and anxiety about relationships and i and being played a fool i just want to make sure that the person that they're portraying themselves as is correct so if i do a fucking quick scroll of your ex -girlfriend's name and your Gmail and nothing comes up.

[94] I'll put the phone away.

[95] Great.

[96] But like, do due diligence.

[97] I think your due diligence is good.

[98] Like, at any point in a relationship, X would have looked at my phone and been like, and looked for something.

[99] He wouldn't have found anything.

[100] True.

[101] Because I wouldn't do anything to compromise my integrity.

[102] But that's a good flip because if you do that, if a guy did that to you, he would be a weird controlling monster.

[103] No, I'd just be like, are you not, like, are, am I doing it?

[104] Is there something in our relationship that makes you think that something's not right?

[105] Because let's just fucking talk about it.

[106] Got it.

[107] But if you say that and the guy's like, no. Like I could, you know, then it would be like.

[108] So you're saying your searching isn't random or just for fun.

[109] It's because you have your suspicions or something came up.

[110] Right.

[111] Got it.

[112] I was, I was more talking about, I was actually thinking of the time that I was in my friend, my grammar school friend, Connie's room.

[113] And I found her diary.

[114] I was like laying weird on her bed and I looked and her diary was there.

[115] So I just pulled it out and started reading it.

[116] And she walked in.

[117] We were never friends again.

[118] She walked in and was like, that's my diary.

[119] And then I was like, oh, well, it's just here.

[120] I wanted to read it.

[121] I want to know what your private thoughts are.

[122] And then I just was like, oh, yeah, that's the kind of thing.

[123] Or like, I've, one time opened a family friend's nightstand because the adults weren't home.

[124] Never do that.

[125] And yeah.

[126] What did you find?

[127] I found proof of.

[128] people having an affair and I was like I was 10 Jesus and it was I couldn't tell anybody what was the proof pictures oh yeah you saw naked pictures they weren't naked no it was just it was more actually romantic but I didn't I told my sister like two years ago it was that big of a like I went like oh shit and then I was like why do I do shit like this I don't want to know this about I think it's different with your friends and family than with your like the person you're like planning to spend their life with you know no that's true well you're now very specifically thinking of like i'm not attacking you for you you whatever happened it feels like it can i look at your phone and make sure you're not attacking me i feel like i'm being attacked right now i just think you can really open up a can worms that you never like you think you know what you're going to find and then you fucking are like wait a second he ships human beings across state lines and you're like uh i have to yeah go into hiding i agree this has been the zodiac sex calendar let's talk about the staircase because everyone wants to talk about the staircase that's i mean twitter i'm going to say this okay i never don't like the obscure ones that are like randos where they're like hold on somebody just said did you see the fear of 13 which is a documentary i love that yeah where it's like i love when it's random yeah because i don't really follow the like you know dateline specials and the abc specials and stuff like that so those ones i like also what i love is when josh makewitz retweets like this is going to be a good episode for Dateline.

[129] I follow him on Twitter.

[130] He retweets the best shit.

[131] He's great.

[132] He's so funny and cool.

[133] Like he's someone I want to hang out with in real life.

[134] He has that hilarious thing where the, I think it's the NBC stories.

[135] Like they haven't, they're not carrying the Dateline products.

[136] And he was like pretending to be mad they don't carry his cut out.

[137] Oh my God.

[138] He's so delightful.

[139] We should have him hang out with us.

[140] We should, we should make him.

[141] We should force him.

[142] Okay, but the staircase did have some extra episodes that were new.

[143] okay that i haven't watched because first of all it's not it's made by the same people who made what seems to me a very fucking bias documentary so i'm not going to find anything earth -shattering and new but again when it's from the same people yeah but then again maybe it will convince me that maybe he's innocent so i should watch it just as due diligence i feel like uh my thing is yeah we've we've kind of been submerged submerged just such a weird word.

[144] But we've been in that documentary and in that story for a long time.

[145] If you haven't, by the way, episode 100 or 100th episode, that's the only murder we discuss.

[146] And I'm on Adderall and I apologize for me. I can now admit, how many episodes out are we?

[147] 15, 115?

[148] 125.

[149] So 25 episodes out.

[150] Karen, I'm just, I'm, okay.

[151] Karen's cyber ventilating.

[152] Oh, shit.

[153] I just did.

[154] She broke her Mike, ladies and gentlemen.

[155] I just want to say I'm, I get really, I get really passionate and I interrupt Karen through the whole thing.

[156] I had a lot of shame afterwards.

[157] You did.

[158] I felt bad for you afterwards because you, you, you.

[159] Shamies.

[160] And I just want to say, don't do drugs.

[161] I, I am, I have ADD.

[162] I'm prescribed at all.

[163] But after that, I went back to my psychiatrist and it was like, it's not working for me anymore.

[164] She gave me something else.

[165] But that was also that combination of us being crazy excited and breaking format, which isn't an easy thing to do, sharing a murder and then talking about it.

[166] And then you and I didn't agree, which was like, that's, that was the perfect example of what I'm normally like when I have a conversation about true crime with someone.

[167] Right.

[168] Is I yell at them.

[169] Sure.

[170] They don't believe me. And I love, you know I love yelling.

[171] Yeah.

[172] But I'm sorry, because that made me laugh so hard just because I, first of, I love that you just said that and you were that honest.

[173] And secondly, I love, I feel like we just have different, um, you know, like I say like when something happens to me, I won't be able to talk about this for four days because I can't process.

[174] I don't know what happens real time.

[175] I have to wait four days.

[176] Yeah.

[177] Like, oh, shit.

[178] Yeah.

[179] And I think your, yours is three months.

[180] You're just like, I don't want to, I don't want to write this second, but like I'll be able to go thereafter.

[181] Because I want to make up for it before I, uh, admit that it was, you know, I want to prove that that's not going to like episode three or 103 if I'd said that it would have been like you need to go take care of that and it's like let me take care of this sure you know what I mean yes it's you're saying I admit I did this and it's no longer a problem I need to rectify it yeah exactly you don't need to have an intervention with me I cleaned up my own mess please don't worry about exactly I love it you know what full respect to that honesty but I'll always talk about my my failings and faults because please do what else is there to talk about it's the most interesting thing to talk about Also, I think the thing with Adderall, well, my thing is just, I don't understand the Adderall High specifically, but having been a speed addict, I recognize the intensity and I don't mind it.

[182] I love it because, but the only thing with that was it started to feel like a fax argument, which is my least favorite part about true crime obsession is, you know, the thing I get the worst wrong, which is like, I'm not paying attention to the dates, the seasons, the months, the years.

[183] I'm going, they had a knife in their fucking eye or whatever horrible.

[184] Like, I'm obsessed on the detail, experience, experiential detail as opposed to, you know, I'm not a cop.

[185] I'm not reporting it.

[186] What upset me, and it probably still would, but I just wouldn't scream at you about it, is that we, the conclusion that was kind of, like, to me, it's like, we watched the same thing.

[187] How did you not come to this conclusion?

[188] You're my friend.

[189] Like, and it's just like, but I need to let people have opinions.

[190] And also, what I was saying wasn't necessarily like my, like, in my heart opinion.

[191] I was like, yeah, but what if this?

[192] Yeah.

[193] But it doesn't matter.

[194] It doesn't matter.

[195] I apologize for that.

[196] Thank you, Georgia.

[197] So go listen to episode 100, at the staircase.

[198] And then in episode 200, this time Karen will be on Adderall.

[199] Can I?

[200] Just for the show, just for an example.

[201] I love it.

[202] I mean, I had a friend tell me when right as my speed era ended and I stopped doing it.

[203] she was like oh yeah i i don't think you noticed but i was not friends with you for two years i could not be around you i was like i didn't notice oh yeah you didn't notice i didn't notice anything i was talking and smoking like all day i slept for two hours a night jesus it was rough stuff and it was it's not fun to talk uh or for the experience of being around me is the only interaction can be, did you see this thing?

[204] I hated it.

[205] You're wrong.

[206] Whatever you say is wrong.

[207] You could hate it and just be hating it wrong.

[208] I couldn't let anybody off the hook for anything.

[209] People drive me crazy who do that when you're like agreeing with them and they don't, yeah, whatever.

[210] Okay.

[211] Because you know what it is?

[212] That habit when people go, no, but, and they're not listening to the point you're making.

[213] They just need to possess their opinion independently of it.

[214] It's like you could never understand what their opinion is.

[215] It's like they're closer to it than you are.

[216] Yeah, yeah.

[217] Fine.

[218] Good.

[219] get it all the way up in there i don't need it god bless you for it good bless you my cats don't talk back that's why we have pets that's why we have pets and drugs coffee well wait i wanted to ask stephen this is you're not in the middle of something are you are we in the middle of something always no wait was i no no oh we're just staircase we're just talking explaining why we're not jumping on this staircase bandwagon but we love i didn't mean to be so harsh in the beginning we love that people are this excited.

[220] Totally.

[221] It's super fucking cool.

[222] We'll, by next week, we'll watch, we'll have watched the new ones.

[223] By next week, we'll book club the staircase series.

[224] We'll have, uh, browse the new ones, I should have said.

[225] We'll browse them.

[226] We'll get mad at certain people.

[227] We'll be able to talk about.

[228] I'll do my nails.

[229] My nails will look great.

[230] I'm going to wear a tweed suit.

[231] I'll dress like a North Carolina lawyer.

[232] An owl.

[233] Oh.

[234] I will wear a full owl suit.

[235] What have we dressed Elvis up as an owl?

[236] Oh my God.

[237] yeah Stephen start the costume now Steven sew it Stephen you just got back from Europe because you tell the people what you did in Europe Well I never thought I would do this in my life But I flew You didn't because I was not surprised in any fucking way When you told me I just I mean I just never thought I would be somebody to Basically I really wanted to see the new Jurassic Park movie early Of course because You have a podcast about Jurassic Park Have you ever said that on this podcast?

[238] I don't think so please do See Jurassic Right I just, everyone just shares their Jurassic Park stories because it's my favorite movie and, and you have 15 podcasts.

[239] They're all about a different animal.

[240] Yeah.

[241] Oh, one animal at the time.

[242] But no, I just like the idea of like traveling to go see something I like.

[243] Totally.

[244] And so I've made, because it came out early because of the World Cup.

[245] So they're like Universal is like, we don't want to compete with the World Cup because people aren't going to go to the movies.

[246] So yeah, I flew to London to see the Jurassic, Jurassic World Fallen Kingdom early.

[247] so and that's part that's number three part well it's the fifth Jurassic Park in the second Jurassic world okay yeah yeah yeah but it's good right I loved it yeah yeah I've seen it three times now I said to someone I don't have to have watched the last two if I to see this new one right as if I'm like yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah to you yeah I mean I think you have a good time either way it reminded me of like Pants Labyrinth you don't you don't need to know shit to watch that Stephen come on Pan's Labyrinth was great.

[248] Yeah, it reminded me of like Pan's Labyrinth.

[249] It has more of like a gothic fairy tale vibe.

[250] Oh, that's great.

[251] Did you meet a lot of cool people there?

[252] Yeah, it was like there were some other people that flew out.

[253] And I saw with my friend Katie and then I saw it with my friends Tom and this guy, Clayton, really nice guy.

[254] I love it.

[255] But I was going to say when you're saying, think of London stories, well, the funniest part about the whole thing was I made this plan like two months ahead to go see it.

[256] And then the day before I leave, somebody was like, hey, do you want to see it in L .A.?

[257] There's an early press screening.

[258] I was like.

[259] you couldn't say no because that's like fancy yeah well I was like yes it's important well I was like oh I'm sorry I have tickets to see it in London I don't want to see it in at like yeah never never but I mean I still had a great time I love like I just drank a lot of beer saw museums because also what if your plane had crashed on the way to London and you never got to see Jurassic World that's true never wait never wait to see a wonderful film with dinosaurs yeah that's awesome welcome home yeah thank you or do you feel jet lagged Uh, yeah, I'm like all over the map, but it's fine.

[260] That's the best.

[261] Yeah, yeah.

[262] Take an Adderall.

[263] Yeah, yeah.

[264] Yes.

[265] We'll just take an Adderall and fight with people about T -Rexes.

[266] I think it's a great idea.

[267] All right.

[268] Well, welcome home, Stephen.

[269] Yes.

[270] We're glad you're here and we're glad you.

[271] It's a good idea to make your own fun like that.

[272] And like, if it's important to you, it's important.

[273] So you fucking fly wherever you want to go see a movie that you like.

[274] You saw Jurassic right.

[275] Yeah.

[276] Like, never mind.

[277] Cut that out.

[278] Don't cut that out.

[279] Wait.

[280] What is it?

[281] I don't get it.

[282] The podcast, his podcast called See Jurassic Right.

[283] Right.

[284] So we went and saw Jurassic right.

[285] Correctly.

[286] Oh, correctly.

[287] Got it.

[288] It's a mountain goat song, by the way.

[289] It's a reference to.

[290] Yeah.

[291] See America right.

[292] Oh, see Jurassic right.

[293] Yeah.

[294] Wow.

[295] That's deep.

[296] I always, I was always like, I guess I don't care enough about Jurassic Park to understand what the title of Stephen's podcast means.

[297] I never even thought twice about it because there's so many weird podcast names.

[298] And it's just like, uh -huh.

[299] Sure.

[300] sure we'll find out later yeah all right let's uh ladies in general do you have anything else yes just this one okay um from our live show in salt lake city when i talked about the salt lake city library shooter and uh talked very thoroughly about the true crime show that i saw um about the case and i talked very much about the reenactor michael b woods absolutely played the shooter and was great yeah um somebody uh sent a this is a message saying that Michael B. Woods won just a couple nights ago.

[301] He won a Chicago Theater Award called the Jeff Award.

[302] Oh my God, Jeff.

[303] Which is the funniest name of all time.

[304] It's just like a picture of a guy or like a sculpture of a guy in Dockers.

[305] What thumbs up?

[306] Thumbs up like Jeff's super supportive of your acting.

[307] The trophy is a beer coozy, the photo of Jeff on it.

[308] So it's a very prestigious theater award.

[309] I'm like, fuck you girls.

[310] Yeah, fuck my humongous.

[311] Well, here's the thing, though, the Chicago theater scene is humongous.

[312] It's like on par with New York, it's or, you know, obviously trying to compete with that there's tons of great acting, obviously Steppenwolf.

[313] And there's so much good theater in Chicago that this is, it doesn't matter what the award is because the guy, the idea that he got picked as best principal performer is the, in a reenactment award.

[314] No, he played fucking Serenow.

[315] Holy shit.

[316] And that's what he won the award?

[317] DeBird.

[318] Good for him.

[319] Serena Rosenfeld, it's this play about...

[320] I love watching our little rising stars that we randomly pick out in the podcast.

[321] I know, and thank God we're picking.

[322] We are picking stars.

[323] We're hitmakers.

[324] We're like Michael B. Woods, we're seeing.

[325] What about Cameron from fucking Mine Hunter?

[326] Yes.

[327] He's having a great year.

[328] He's blowing up.

[329] He's going to be in the next Jurassic Park movie.

[330] That's a lie, Stephen.

[331] Don't get excited.

[332] Well, is this over?

[333] Is this podcast?

[334] over.

[335] Oh, you know what we have to talk about?

[336] Huh.

[337] That we did that podcast, the movie podcast.

[338] Movie Crush.

[339] So Chuck, who you guys know from stuff you should know, who's a fucking really awesome, nice dude.

[340] Yeah.

[341] He has a legendary podcast.

[342] Legendary podcast, the network, everything.

[343] He had us as guests on his movie podcast called Movie Crush.

[344] And the movie he picked for us to talk about.

[345] Yes.

[346] Was fucking Silence of the Lambs.

[347] It's the best because it's like, it's basically this podcast is like they just, you take the one movie that the people love, whoever the guests are, and then you just like go over and over and over it.

[348] I could have done that for fucking hours.

[349] I had so many questions for you guys too because I thought, you know, I mean, it went on it.

[350] There were things that came out that we were like, oh, wait, who lost that?

[351] Like, not realizing that I kind of didn't know something where I'm like, oh.

[352] Because that movie's so good because you pick up new things every time you watch it.

[353] I rewatch it when I got home that night.

[354] That's just incredible.

[355] It was so good.

[356] Only I'm really mad at myself because on the episode, when we were talking, talking about the autopsy scene, and she talks about the nails.

[357] I said that Clary Starling says, it looks like city to me. And the fucking line is, it looks like town to me. Oh.

[358] The word is town.

[359] It's such a better word.

[360] I was so mad I misquoted it.

[361] It sounded good still.

[362] I just like to.

[363] Yeah.

[364] So go watch that.

[365] It's called Movie Crush.

[366] Do you mean listen to it?

[367] It's a podcast.

[368] It's a podcast and it's out tomorrow, right?

[369] Yeah.

[370] So Friday.

[371] Yeah.

[372] I'm first, right?

[373] Yes.

[374] But first, I'm going to pee.

[375] Hey, this is exciting.

[376] An all -new season of only murders in the building is coming to Hulu on August 27th.

[377] Steve Martin, Martin Short, and Selena Gomez are back as your favorite podcaster, detectives.

[378] But there's a mystery hanging over everyone.

[379] Who killed Saz?

[380] And were they really after Charles?

[381] Why would someone want to kill Charles?

[382] This season, murder hits close to home.

[383] With a threat against one of their own, the stakes are higher than ever.

[384] Plus, the gang is going to Hollywood to turn their podcast into a major movie.

[385] Amid the glitz and glitz.

[386] glamour of Los Angeles, more mysteries and twists arise.

[387] Who knows what will happen once the cameras start to roll?

[388] Get ready for the stariest season yet with Merrill Streep, Zach Alfinacus, Eugene Levy, Eva Longoria, Melissa McCarthy, Devine, Joy Randolph, Molly Shannon, and more.

[389] Only Martyrs in the building, premieres August 27th, streaming only on Hulu.

[390] Goodbye.

[391] Karen, you know I'm all about vintage shopping.

[392] Absolutely.

[393] And when you say vintage, you mean when you physically drive to a store and actually purchase something with cash?

[394] Exactly.

[395] And if you're a small business owner, you might know Shopify is great for online sales.

[396] But did you know that they also power in person sales?

[397] That's right.

[398] Shopify is the sound of selling everywhere, online, in store, on social media, and beyond.

[399] Give your point of sales system a serious upgrade with Shopify.

[400] From accepting payments to managing inventory, they have everything you need to sell in person.

[401] So give your point of sale system a serious upgrade with Shopify.

[402] Their sleek, reliable POS hardware takes every major payment method and looks fabulous at the same time.

[403] With Shopify, we have a powerful partner for managing our sales, and if you're a business owner, you can too.

[404] Connect with customers in line and online.

[405] Do retail right with Shopify.

[406] Sign up for a $1 per month trial period at Shopify .com slash murder.

[407] Important note, that promo code is all lowercase.

[408] Go to Shopify .com slash murder to take your retail business to the next level today.

[409] That's Shopify .com slash murder.

[410] Goodbye.

[411] Can you hear the crow we're calling?

[412] Tossed salad and scrambled eggs.

[413] Okay, so this is a really fun combo case where it started with a listener named Kate Butler who tweeted at us.

[414] I wouldn't have said her last name except for it's in her Twitter handle.

[415] Okay.

[416] So she must not give a shit.

[417] And Kate wrote, hey, you guys should do the Appalachian Trail Killer.

[418] and then it like rattled around in my head and I was like something went dang like that's a good one that I've definitely heard of before yeah like a reminder and read about yeah so but then I was like as my as the days progressed I was like I don't feel like doing any work because I have the I have like real summertime fever right now or like that's what your sex horoscope said about it too that's actually you actually have a VD it's not yeah exactly see a doctor your summer time fever is called gonorrhea um no but i just don't can't sit like you know we've been we've been sitting and writing and working on a bunch of shit for so consistently long i can't sit in that chair anymore yeah so i was like that chair i love it there's a work chair that's all you do is there's a there's a whole part of the table i avoid when i'm procrastinating which is always um and i remembered so i was like i'm doing it i survive this week and i was just trying to sit and think of like one I think of that title, which my favorite ones, which ones ding up in my head.

[419] And there's one that I've always loved.

[420] And you know how we always joked it on I survived.

[421] It's always two women who tell you the most harrowing, like, a rape and attempted murder story that they survived.

[422] That's so incredible.

[423] And then there's a guy that's like, I tipped my snowmobile over and thought I was never going to get back up.

[424] And you're like, I'm going to fucking kill you.

[425] Yeah, yeah.

[426] And then it dinged into my head.

[427] That is not always the case.

[428] Okay.

[429] And there is, one episode that I've always loved and the two guys that tell their survival story are straight out of fucking central casting because it takes place on the Appalachian mountains and they're two guys from Virginia and one of them uh is oh I'll so I'll say this this is an episode of I survived starring Sean and Scott Sean and Scott and Sean and Scott and um it's also Also, I got additional information from an article that was from the Washington Post written by a writer named Will Haygood, and the title of it is Lonely, Dark, and Deep.

[430] And it was written on July 9th, 2008.

[431] It's a great, great article about this event.

[432] So, we'll just get into it.

[433] Let's do it.

[434] Tell me everything.

[435] Okay.

[436] It's May 6th, 2008.

[437] So, 10 years ago.

[438] What?

[439] 10 years and a month ago, basically.

[440] Oh, my God.

[441] A decade ago.

[442] Also known as a decade ago.

[443] Do you know that 10 years is called a decade?

[444] I didn't know that.

[445] No, no, no. I didn't know that.

[446] These are all kinds of word lessons that you can learn for me if you pay attention.

[447] Okay.

[448] So they're going on a fishing trip together to a place called Dismal Creek, Virginia.

[449] Perfect.

[450] Go there.

[451] You should absolutely fucking go there.

[452] Now, you know how we love, I survived, or I should say, the thing I love, the most about I survived is how beautifully it's like they use B -roll sometimes in true crime shows as we all know the B -roll and the voiceover can be the most salacious disgusting thing of all time where they just keep cutting to like a half -naked woman screaming and it just goes on forever and you're like what the fuck are you guys even doing with this that's why I survived just so good they the B -roll they use is it'll be like July 6 2008 and then it's this gorgeous creek it's just where they were and they just keep showing you film of now here's their campfire here's the campfire blown out here's where they're camping so this area is gorgeous so it's almost like um like the like the screen savers exactly like showing you a mountainy things but meanwhile and it makes it so much scarier because it's just putting you in that place but it's not filling it in with a bunch of drama it's not showing you blood dropping and all this bullshit exactly because that's how these horrible things happen as you're standing there looking at this beautiful lake like these guys did so ominous music starts playing when you're fucking it's just not and then of course the thing that I is my very favorite thing where at the end as they tell some horrible turn of like then I turned and looked down the hallway and there was a man standing there when they cut to this the next story the transition sound is a man exhaling but it's very subtle but if you watch it you'll see it goes creepy it's the creepiest noise what if you heard that okay it's so perfectly So we're at fucking Downer Lake.

[453] We're Debbie Downer's the mayor of this small city.

[454] It's Dismal Creek, Virginia.

[455] They've got these two guys, Scott Johnston, who I went to high school, the guy named Scott Johnston, and Sean Farmer, and they have been going to this area since they were little boys.

[456] And a lot of, it sounds like from the story I read and stuff that obviously it's the Appalachian Mountains and it's this amazing wilderness and people go there all the time.

[457] and obviously the Appalachian Trail starts a little bit north of where this area is and goes, I didn't know, it goes all the way up to Maine.

[458] Wow.

[459] It's like basically West Virginia or something.

[460] I'm just pointing to the ceiling.

[461] I don't know anything.

[462] Did you know that Maine is in the ceiling?

[463] I love it there.

[464] Okay.

[465] So these two guys, they're like, we're going to go fishing at Dismal Creek this weekend.

[466] Scott gets there first, and he goes.

[467] and fishes by himself and Sean's going to show up in the afternoon apparently I'm filling this in a little bit I like to think that Sean had an office job he could not get away boss was a dick right whereas Scott might be a woodworker and he makes shit on his own he's like I can go up to Dismol Creek any fucking time I want totally so he's there fishing trout fishing in the morning and catches a bunch of fish he's drive he's driving back to the campsite and he sees this old guy come up an embankment from the creek or river area.

[468] Like climb up to the road?

[469] Yes.

[470] And he's really gaunt and he's kind of scary looking, but he's got like a new camouflage hunting jacket on.

[471] So he doesn't look like, as Scott says in I survived, he's like, he doesn't look like a bum.

[472] But he's, he looks gaunt and like he hasn't eaten in a while and like he's been out in the woods for a while.

[473] And he has a dog with him that's so starving its stomach is bloating.

[474] So he stops the truck and he's about to say like, hey, what's going on?

[475] Are you okay?

[476] And the guy comes over and Amelia just starts talking about, I've been trying to fish all morning.

[477] There's no fish in that creek.

[478] And so Scott Set opens his, I pictured it as a wicker basket.

[479] I don't know what it actually was.

[480] He's fucking Yogi Bear.

[481] You know, like one of those fishing baskets you wear in your hip.

[482] He opens up his wicker, beautiful wicker basket with his initials engraved into the top.

[483] That he fucking sewed himself.

[484] He made it himself because he's a woodworker.

[485] He's a woodworker that also likes to work in reeds.

[486] He'll dry out a reed and make a basket.

[487] Absolutely.

[488] He's a man of the earth.

[489] Yeah.

[490] Okay, so he opens the basket, shows him.

[491] He's like, look at all this trout I caught.

[492] And then he gives the guy a couple because he feels bad for him.

[493] And the guy says, thank you.

[494] And he seems happy.

[495] And then the guy asks, are you guys staying nearby here?

[496] And Scott's like, oh, yeah, we're staying at that campsite right over there.

[497] No. Uh -huh.

[498] And the old man's like, oh, oh, I'm staying at the one that's just kind of right past it.

[499] Maybe I'll swing by and, like, visit you guys later.

[500] And so Scott's like, sure, come by.

[501] Real polite.

[502] These are, like, beautiful southern boys that are real polite.

[503] And so he, and then, so Scott goes, he stops to collect firewood.

[504] So in the meantime, Sean, his friend, who's an office worker, look, he loves his job.

[505] It means a lot to him to be able to work for the government.

[506] I don't know any of this.

[507] He actually, I would say this.

[508] Scott looks like he could be played by Tim Blake Nelson.

[509] Who's that?

[510] That actor that was in O 'Brother War Art thou.

[511] Oh, yeah.

[512] That guy is exactly, it's that guy.

[513] Wow, I love him.

[514] And then the Sean character, I think, should be played by our comedian friend, John Gemberling.

[515] That's exactly what he looks like.

[516] He's got like a beard and a round face.

[517] and real, real low key.

[518] Okay.

[519] So Sean rolls up to the campsite and he sees there's this old gaunt guy there and he's a little bit weirded out.

[520] He gets out of the truck and the gaunt guy is like, oh, I met Scott earlier and he invited me to come by.

[521] So immediately Sean's comfortable because he's like, oh, you know, Scott, they already hung out.

[522] Everything's fine.

[523] So when Scott comes back from collecting firewood, he sees that his friend Sean has showed up and the gaunt man's there.

[524] They're talking.

[525] they built a fire chilled out everything's cool as they all talk then scott's like well we're about to bar you know we're about to throw some hamburgers on the grill and cook up these trout do you want to stay and eat dinner with us and the old guy's like sure it sounds good and he said they wouldn't thought nothing of it totally normal older man but he said he also said he looked a little bit like he he looked frail like he might be an alcoholic or like a little sick somehow but other than that he he commented on just how new the clothes looked like his hunting boots were expensive.

[526] Wow.

[527] Um, so he didn't, you know, he didn't think like this was just some stranger straggler.

[528] So they eat dinner, everything's normal.

[529] And right as it starts to get dark, it's like the sun has gone down and it's getting dark.

[530] Um, because the guy wasn't leaving and they kept thinking, well, you're kind of an older guy and you have to get to your campsite.

[531] You'd think you would leave when the sun was still up.

[532] Yeah.

[533] But he doesn't.

[534] Finally, the guy stands up and he's like, all right, then, uh, come on, here we go to the dog.

[535] And as he does that, he walks behind both Scott and Sean.

[536] And I survived, Sean's the one that says it.

[537] And he's like, then all of a sudden, my head was ringing.

[538] Uh -huh.

[539] He hears a big boom, and his left ear is ringing like crazy.

[540] And what's happened is, and from Scott's perspective, the old straggler that they just gave a shit ton of trout and hamburgers to just turned and walked over, pulls out a 22, a tiny gun.

[541] He said he didn't even see, he couldn't see the gun.

[542] gun he just saw the man extend his arm and shoot Sean in the face what the fuck right right here on the left side of his face like cheekbone so yes so so so you see you watch somebody shoot your friend in the head yeah you think that person is dead yeah so scott jumps up and fucking runs he immediately in his mind said he said that he immediately thought there was when he set up the tent he remembered there being like this this um little in bankman area behind it with a cedar group of cedar trees or whatever he was like oh there's a place i can take shelter so he just takes off in the dark into the woods and he doesn't know if the guy's chasing him he does know what's happening but and he doesn't know that the guy then shoots him in the back he doesn't feel it and he doesn't realize it he the guy shot him actually in the nape of the neck oh my god so what happens is when scott finally stops running and he's standing there trying to figure out what happened and what if Sean still alive or whatever.

[543] He, as his heartbeats, the bullet wound is spurting six inches of blood as with every heartbeat.

[544] Behind him.

[545] Well, like, I think he was making it seem like it was a little bit on the side.

[546] But basically, like, the bullet came through this way.

[547] So, you know, from what I put together.

[548] So because he basically took his finger and stuck it in the bullet hole to stop the blood flow.

[549] Oh, my God.

[550] So he's just holding his right index finger in his own.

[551] neck to keep the blood from coming out yeah now meanwhile uh strangely and miraculously Sean gets shot in the head and isn't dead what he stands up and and Sean also is six foot four three hundred twenty five pounds holy crap so he's not i mean a man is holding a gun on him and stuff but he does turn face the guy what the fuck's going on and they're about 10 feet away at this point the man shoots him again in the chest he still doesn't go down Oh my God, how fucking terrifying.

[552] So, so when the man, so after he got shot in the chest, that's when he, the man turned away from him, got distracted, shot Scott in the neck.

[553] Yeah.

[554] So that's when Sean runs over to his Jeep and jumps inside.

[555] And his, of course, his driver's side windows down.

[556] No, roll up your windows, everyone.

[557] Like in movies, well, especially when modern cars where you have to have the key in to roll window up or whatever but like remember old movies where you're trying to roll the window up with the crank really fast while like a bad person's coming their arm is coming through the window yeah that whole like window car scenario getting in the car when you're being chased that whole scenario drives me crazy it's crazy making and it's that thing where sometimes i try to practice it like if i'm just letting myself into my front door i'll be like right now you have to do this in three seconds someone's walking up and i can never fucking do it i do that too because my new car like if you have the key on you and you walk to your car, it unlocks all the doors.

[558] Yes.

[559] So I'll see how quickly I can lock well.

[560] I have to know by my brain where the locking mechanism ends.

[561] So before I'm sitting down, the doors are all locked in case someone's trying to get in on the other side or following me. Yes.

[562] It's like not a very safe feature, Toyota.

[563] Toyota, can we talk this through because I feel like you need to think about underground garages?

[564] Paranoid women.

[565] Paranoid women.

[566] And I don't know.

[567] It would just be great to talk to you.

[568] Safety.

[569] Okay, so Sean jumps into the driver's seat fucking scrambling, right?

[570] Scambling for his keys or whatever.

[571] The fucking gont man comes up over his hand goes into the driver's window Sean literally like blocks it with his hand and he hears the trigger pull and no shot.

[572] The guy's run out of ammunition.

[573] He's already shot six times or however I shouldn't say that.

[574] However many is in a 22 which I certainly don't know.

[575] 22 probably right?

[576] Oh yeah, 22 tiny bullets.

[577] Point 22 tiny bullets.

[578] Okay, so miraculously doesn't go off.

[579] So then he's like, he fucking takes off.

[580] In the car.

[581] He guns it and does the thing where he leans down below the windshield and fucking drives away.

[582] So the guy can't shoot him again.

[583] Like he's not up.

[584] Yeah.

[585] Which I fucking love.

[586] That's like straight out of a movie.

[587] Yeah.

[588] So now over in the hauler where he took.

[589] cover, Scott is like, watches his friend peel away and he immediately goes, I have like a pretty critical wound here.

[590] I have to get help.

[591] And if I don't run to the road to meet him to like basically cut off my friends, I'm going to get stuck up on this mountain.

[592] Yeah.

[593] So he just starts fucking taking off through the woods, which is incredibly dense underbrush and all that shit.

[594] And it's dark.

[595] So he has to like beat his way with his finger in his neck.

[596] And every time, when his heart rate goes higher the fucking blood is gushing more well no it's not gushing with the finger in there right so he's like that's a temporary solution oh my god so he and he fucking makes it he makes it to the cutoff so when it's like a movie it's the crazy and it's also these two guys tell it you know that thing we're like and i won't say it's a say necessarily southern thing but like i know a couple people who are from west virginia and it's kind of that thing where it's like everything's like everything's real low key just the facts they're not like it's not like Brooklyn where you're like hey this guy came over here gestures and shit it's all like real sedate you can see these guys telling the story over beers at a bar but they don't but they don't want to like over dramatize it and make themselves seem like showoffs exactly they're the exact opposite of that where they're just like yeah it was crazy yeah um it's the best but then yeah they're now in a Mel Gibson movie level insane uh situation so drives away without looking, gets down.

[597] And the road to, so you have to think about the Appalachian Mountains, they're at a campsite.

[598] So they're not even near a road.

[599] Right now they have to get on a dirt road to drive down a couple miles to the main road that's actually paved.

[600] Yeah.

[601] So, so Sean comes around the corner in the Jeep, Scott's standing there covered in blood and standing there.

[602] He skids up, Scott jumps in.

[603] and they gun it, and this part of I survived.

[604] Scott goes, and I mean, you know, I was just really worried because, like, I couldn't even believe he's driving because he was shot in the head.

[605] And it's like, yeah, yeah, he probably shouldn't have been the driver.

[606] And the weird thing is then, so they're going 40 miles an hour down a road.

[607] They said that they would normally drive 20 miles an hour down because not only is it dirt and really narrow it's a mountain road where every turn has a drop off on the side like a 30 foot drop off so they're gunning it down this mountain and at one point they um he Scott has to tell Sean to break because they're going so fast on this turn because Scott can't actually really see that well he's losing his vision in his right eye oh my God and uh they they come around he's like break break break and they skid out and they go up and they said they're the tire went six inch they were six inches away from the edge of the embankment no but then they're like but you got to go like straighten it out and so they did that the second time it happened this basically the same thing where they took a turn way too fast they're there because they think because scott's truck with the keys in it oh shit are back at the campsite so they're like the guy a hundred percent got into that truck and is chasing us yeah there's no way he's going to let us get away So they're like, we have to go top speed.

[608] Also, we have to go top speed because all of the blood is leaving both of our bodies at one time into this Jeep.

[609] So the second time they do that, they go up onto an embankment.

[610] They turn too fast, go up onto this embankment, almost roll the Jeep, like just barely don't roll the Jeep.

[611] And they kick up a bunch of rocks and break the windshield.

[612] And so that's when Scott goes, okay, you work the gas and the brake.

[613] And I'm going to steer because you can't fucking see and you, like, I'll tell you why to gas and break so we can get down this road.

[614] Oh, because on that second spin out, it was because Sean had blacked out.

[615] Because he had a bullet in his fucking head.

[616] Oh, my God.

[617] Okay.

[618] So they're like, we have to get down this mountain road.

[619] So he finally get to the main road.

[620] So it was like a mile or two on the dirt road.

[621] Then they get to the main road.

[622] The main road, it's five miles.

[623] And once they get down the mountain on the main road, it's 40 miles to a hospital.

[624] No, that's too far.

[625] It's so far.

[626] You guys don't go that far away from hospitals, please.

[627] I mean, that's the thing about camping.

[628] There was no cell service up there at all.

[629] Sure.

[630] You can't use your phone on that mountain.

[631] So it was, of course, like, the worst thing that could happen when you're that far away.

[632] Yeah.

[633] So they know they're on like a clock where they're already in the red zone.

[634] Oh, they're right.

[635] So they race down.

[636] they finally get to the main road and they race down and when they get to the bottom like you know to where there's actually houses the first house they see the lights are on and so Scott yells stop the car they're going to help us and Sean like almost blind just stops the car in the middle of the road and puts it in park and Scott jumps out and runs to the he has lost all the blood he jumps out runs bangs on the door all right let me catch up to myself here so I just want everyone listening to know that Karen is just telling the story.

[637] She's not reading anything.

[638] And it's like really fun to watch.

[639] Well, because I've seen this one.

[640] Yeah.

[641] The other stories in this episode of I survived, it's season three, episode seven.

[642] And the other stories are a really terrible, but it's another one of those women that tells her rape survival story with this amazing look on her face and these bright eyes.

[643] And it was a thing where they, she was in her 20s.

[644] They moved into an apartment.

[645] And her father's like, I don't like that there's no. bars on the window because you're on the first floor, I'm coming over tomorrow to put them in.

[646] No. And that night a guy broke in.

[647] And then this other story is this guy who got attacked by a bear and his dog ladybug helped save him.

[648] It's, good girl.

[649] Season three, episode seven is like peak I survived.

[650] It's incredible.

[651] Everybody survives.

[652] Wait, what?

[653] Spoiler alert.

[654] Spoiler alert.

[655] Karen, what the, edit that out, Stephen.

[656] Every single.

[657] fucking person.

[658] I don't think Ladybug survives, though.

[659] I shouldn't just drop that out there because I'm not positive.

[660] Okay.

[661] But I think it was...

[662] Well, now they have to watch.

[663] Yeah, exactly.

[664] You tell us a fucking Ladybug survive.

[665] I don't think she does.

[666] Oh.

[667] So the house that they stop in front of, this is my favorite, is a woman named Melissa Miller and her 20 -year -old son, Randy, are home.

[668] Thank fucking God.

[669] And of course, she sees someone banging on the door hear someone being on the door as opposed to seeing it then goes to the front door and looks out it's two dudes covered in blood in the car covered in blood so she's like I don't want to get involved in this they clearly got into a fight and blah blah blah then she looks out and recognizes Sean because her friend dated him a couple of years ago yes so she's like wait what is this and then Scott's like this guy just attacked us did it you have to call 911 we need medical help immediately so Melissa Miller calls 911 and they have to wait 20 minutes.

[670] No, don't wait that long.

[671] Because they're so fucking far out of the nowhere.

[672] At one point, they were waiting so long.

[673] So they got Sean out of the Jeep.

[674] She sat Scott down on the porch, sits Sean down on the porch.

[675] They start to get towels.

[676] They're holding pressure on all the wounds and just and giving them water and helping them talking to them.

[677] At one point, Scott has Melissa call his mom because he's afraid it's the last time he has a chance to talk to her and he tells his mommy's fine and don't worry.

[678] It's so, and then so finally the cops come at one point Melissa Miller calls 911 back and goes where y 'all at?

[679] Where are y 'all at?

[680] Because it's like we can't wait very much longer when the cops show up the cops get there before the ambulance and the cops ask Scott for a description and as Scott is describing the gaunt man that attacked them Melissa Miller's father and Randy's grandfather lives in the house he hears the description and he says to Randy he knows all about who this person is because there was a man named Randallie Smith who lived in the nearby town of Peresburg but it's like the fruit pear, not Paris, Paris France, but Peresburg, and I'm probably pronouncing it wrong.

[681] Good.

[682] He tells his grandson to run down to Trent's grocery store and go grab that picture of Randall Lee Smith that had been up because Randall Lee Smith had disappeared from Peresburg six weeks prior.

[683] Oh, my God.

[684] So there's a picture up of, like, have you seen this man?

[685] Yeah.

[686] So he's like, go get that picture.

[687] So Randy has to run down.

[688] The store is closed.

[689] But luckily, it's some tiny town where there.

[690] He goes to the owner's house and he's like, we got an emergency, open the store, grabs the picture, runs back to the house.

[691] And as Scott is being loaded into the ambulance that's finally there, he holds up the picture.

[692] And Scott goes, I am 100 % sure that is the man that shot us.

[693] Oh, my God.

[694] And it's this man, Randallie Smith.

[695] and so they put out an APB for Randall Lee Smith.

[696] When, then two Medevac helicopters land and they put what Scott thinks that because obviously Sean's been shot in the head, he's way worse off than him.

[697] So he's so worried about him.

[698] But they get put in two separate helicopters.

[699] And when Scott is in a helicopter, he overhears the EMT or the person working that like, I don't think he's going to make it to the hospital.

[700] And then he hears her say, yeah, he's lost too much blood.

[701] And I no longer have a pulse.

[702] And he realizes she's talking about him.

[703] Oh, my God.

[704] And he realizes he can't feel his body.

[705] So he's like, oh, I just, I thought I was dead in the helicopter.

[706] Like, I thought I was already dead.

[707] Oh, my God.

[708] Okay.

[709] So meanwhile, police, uh, uh, uh, oh, by the way, I'm, my, might as well just skip to this part.

[710] Well, no, we'll say this part.

[711] So the police know about Randall Lee Smith because in 1981, um, he had befriended two, uh, hitchhikers on, uh, at the Wapiti shelter, um, which was on, uh, in the, in the exact same area, it was one mile away from the campsite where Sean and Scott were.

[712] And, um, he, uh, befriended them, uh, they hung out exactly the, same way where they had like shared a meal or whatever and then um it didn't it wasn't clear if he like slept in their campsite or if he said goodbye but he in the middle of the night um there were two 27 year old social workers and his name was robert mountford junior and her name was susan ramsie and um he he shot robert mountford in the head um and then he and susan ramsi got into this fight or she fought him off and he ends up stabbing her 12 over 12 times with a long nail oh my god it's just hideous and horrible um their bodies don't get found for weeks wow so they it took them a while to find him but he ends up getting arrested for these murders he is convicted of second degree of murder because they plea bargain no he ends up serving 15 years in jail for Two innocent people's murder.

[713] Yeah.

[714] Fifteen fucking years.

[715] Fifteen years in jail.

[716] And then he gets paroled and he goes, he moves to Peresburg.

[717] He works odd jobs for about a decade.

[718] It kind of kicks around.

[719] I'm sorry.

[720] I'm still stuck on this.

[721] No, I know.

[722] And he then starts to run out of money and he just collects up his shit and goes up into the mountains.

[723] And so that was six weeks before Scott ran into him on that trail.

[724] is when he disappeared from Peresburg and when those pictures went up of him of have you seen this man we don't know where he is which also means that for six weeks he was fucking around in those mountains and no one knows what he was doing or who he was doing it with where to get those clothes from clearly he stole them that's right oh so okay so when they finally did find him in a restroom which was almost immediately because he was driving Scott's truck and they the truck passes trying to zoom down that road when the cops are going up um he sees the cops and almost immediately drives up under an embankment and flips the truck over and the police officer that went up to check him he was inside the upside down truck and he said they're the coldest eyes i've ever seen and so they get him out they arrest him randall lee smith tells the police that he had to shoot Scott and Sean in self -defense.

[725] Yeah.

[726] That's why that happened.

[727] Right.

[728] Four days after he's arrested, he dies of natural causes in jail.

[729] What?

[730] Yeah.

[731] What natural causes?

[732] Being an old murderer, having a terrible life and rotting from the inside spiritually.

[733] Oh my God.

[734] These are not confirmed.

[735] This is not the coroner's report.

[736] Please remember.

[737] But okay, so here's the part that's mind -blowing to me. So Sean, who has been shot in the head and the fucking chest, the bullet that went into his chest, he says there was so much muscle mass on his chest, it just pushed the bullet over so it didn't puncture anything critical.

[738] That's the sexiest thing I've ever heard in my life.

[739] It's pretty awesome.

[740] This guy has that, he does have this, like, I want to hear him tell 20 more stories.

[741] He has that, like, real, like, the good, good old boy feel to him.

[742] Yeah, yeah.

[743] But, you know, the bullet that went into his head.

[744] Yeah, I remember that one.

[745] Shot so close that he had gunpowder burns on his cheek.

[746] Oh, my God.

[747] It just went in and went into his nasal passages and kind of ricocheted around a little bit.

[748] Like, just clonked around and just clonked around and didn't come back out or, I mean, I don't know.

[749] I guess they went in and took it out, but like, it didn't give him any brain damage or any.

[750] It just fucked up that one side of his face.

[751] Now I'm just picturing him using a netty pot and a fucking bullet coming out of his nostril.

[752] He just, he can't get it out of there.

[753] he keeps rinsing his nose.

[754] You're like, fuck.

[755] But I mean, that is, he was basically in like recovery, in the recovery room at 4 a .m. that morning.

[756] Jesus.

[757] For being shot in the head and chest.

[758] Dude.

[759] That's also why I love I survived.

[760] Because you, these people are like, so then I got shot in the head.

[761] And you're like, you, the person talking.

[762] Yeah.

[763] I love this.

[764] Okay, I like that.

[765] It's very, like, it's very X -Men.

[766] Like, how did you do this?

[767] Are you special?

[768] are you different from us okay so then the next morning scots out of surgery so he can take his finger out of his neck they sew that whole up yeah he actually has scars so it looked like there was entrance like his his neck was pretty pretty ripped up um you know they're shot fucking multiple times close range it's so crazy and one of his family members shows up at the hospital and holds up a newspaper that says the A .T. Killer strikes again.

[769] So immediately they know that Randall Lee Smith, who is the man that killed these two people in 1981, it's the fucking same guy with the same kind of gun or the same gun.

[770] In the one mile away from where he did it, he did it again.

[771] Jesus.

[772] Yeah, one would have thought maybe, one would have thought he would have been fine after 15 years of prison and they could just let him go and he'd never do it again.

[773] Right.

[774] But no. He tricked everyone.

[775] It turns out that this is one of those times where that isn't what happened.

[776] Yeah, basically.

[777] So did he kill anyone else?

[778] Do we know, like?

[779] Well, there's only, they said, I read a thing that said, there's only eight reported murders, like known murders on the Appalachian Trail.

[780] Huh.

[781] So that's six additional ones.

[782] I'm not sure what they're referencing.

[783] But there's all kinds of missing people that went, they went for.

[784] a walk up in these mountains or whatever that they are not accounted for.

[785] So, oh, it's so creepy.

[786] When Randall Lee, this is kind of the creepy reveal.

[787] In his possession when he was arrested, the police found six pairs of eyeglasses, bloody clothes, women's underwear, 20 knives, a hatchet, satanic and wick and wicken literature.

[788] What?

[789] It's necessarily a bad thing.

[790] Yeah.

[791] Well, with the rest of the stuff and the fact that he's a murderer, it doesn't bode well it doesn't bode well it does not bode so anyway that the idea that in just six weeks these are the this is the amount of like trophy style stuff that he has in his possession is horrifying which means there's probably a bunch of cold cases or or missing people that might be able to get matched with that i wonder whose dog it was because maybe he stole the dog too oh do the dog do the dog What if the Scott and Sean brought the dog home and kept him?

[792] I'm telling you, if you're an I survived producer and you didn't fold that shit right in, then it didn't happen.

[793] Those people know what they're doing.

[794] I know.

[795] But here, let's just say this.

[796] The dog ran off in fear, but then just ate trout for the rest of his life.

[797] His coat got real shiny.

[798] Did he become friends with a bear?

[799] And a raccoon.

[800] He fell in with a group of raccoons and bears.

[801] Raccoons.

[802] Raccoons and bears.

[803] How about our prescient visionary, abilities where yesterday that big drama that was happening was, did you see the baby raccoon that scaled the 23 -story building?

[804] I did, but I couldn't look at it till the end.

[805] He made it.

[806] I saw that he made it, but I tweeted something like, well, I just can't read this because I'm so scared for him.

[807] I missed the entire thing.

[808] Oh, good.

[809] I wasn't, I was busy or whatever.

[810] He made it.

[811] Did you see the photos of him on the fucking belt on the side?

[812] When he was all stretching out?

[813] Yeah, because he was scared.

[814] ski, I would, I mean, I would hate to climb a 23 -story building like a ruck.

[815] Guess what?

[816] You have to.

[817] No. I love it also that they, to lure him to the roof, they put cat food up there.

[818] Yeah.

[819] Everybody wants some cat food.

[820] Scott and Sean say they still go fishing at Dismol Creek.

[821] They've done it all their lives.

[822] It's the safest fucking place for them now.

[823] Exactly.

[824] And they're probably, they probably, I would, if I was either of them, be like, yeah, I'm kind of invincible.

[825] I've been shot in the motherfucking head.

[826] Shoot me. I'll, I don't.

[827] I didn't.

[828] I you and handled it and this is the Sean at the very end in that good old boy way goes other than a few scars we're fine Jesus everyone else at the end of I survived is like I survive because my family and God was watching me personally and he's just like yeah we're fine it's almost like we don't want to talk about it it it's too late you're on a TV show you have to talk about it wow that is that triple crossover isn't that amazing that it's like the I survived I wanted to do Kate's suggestion all wrapped up in this beautiful storytelling bow Now you go It was Italian kiss Was it Italian kiss level?

[829] It was this beautiful Italian kiss I love it I love it Okay All right Karen This is This is the glamour girl slayer And this is the story of You know when you see like Those lists that are like Five photos of of murder victims right before, like the last photos ever taken of murder victims.

[830] I hate those.

[831] And it's the, it's like black and white older photo of a woman, a beautiful woman tied up.

[832] And she's like posing, you know, scared and tied up.

[833] You've seen that.

[834] Is she posing or is it real?

[835] Well, that's the thing is you can't tell.

[836] Okay.

[837] But, you know, it's like.

[838] So it's from the 50s, 60s?

[839] Yeah, 50s.

[840] You've seen the photo.

[841] It's like this is, this is the story of that.

[842] Okay.

[843] Awesome.

[844] it's there's a lot of those I've seen that photo a lot and so I'm finally doing the story here we go okay on August 1st 1956 a beautiful 19 year old blonde woman named Judy Ann Dahl was going through this crazy hardcore custody battle in 1958 which has got to suck even more yeah did women have rights then I don't know she's going through do we have rights over their kids like that's even you know yeah did they even want them right so she's going through a battle or ex -husband over their 14 -month -old daughter, she needs to make money to hire this lawyer to fight the battle.

[845] And so she would take modeling jobs a lot.

[846] So a man named Johnny Glynn called, and he offered her $50, which is a lot then, to pose for the cover of a pulp novel.

[847] And she was like, fuck yeah, I need this money.

[848] Totally.

[849] So back then, though, modeling and modeling agencies weren't it wasn't what it is today all over downtown LA these little businesses were cropping up and they were small modeling studios that they had their own female models inside and they would pose for a price and they would do it either clothed or nude so these like dudes who would claim to be modeling photographers could come in pay $20 do a photo session with a naked model and leave with nudes you know yeah nude nude photos but for more money they would would be given a girl's a model's phone number and he would call they would make arrangements to meet either at his studio which is like if he had one yeah or at her house a lot of the time so essentially this is a little bit of there's a bit of sex work maybe that could be involved it doesn't sound like it oh okay from what i can tell that wasn't that wasn't what was going on i mean just perves do you have pervy stuff just perves wanting naked photos of women and they couldn't get it in other places you know what I mean true it's like hard to get something like that but they can't drive out to the forest and find an old mag that someone through right well I think also like there were legit ones who if you there were a lot of pinup magazine stuff and like there were true crime magazines that would have these photos so you could take them and send them in and maybe you'd make some money with the photos so maybe some of them were trying to be legit in this story there's no nefarious like there's no um sex work going on or anything like that it's all just purely modeling okay And also, like, maybe that, like, a lady in her brown panties went way further back then.

[850] Absolutely.

[851] Then these days where it's like, oh, yeah, that's what's on every street corner.

[852] Well, think of Betty Page.

[853] Like, she's the one who got famous from it.

[854] And she, you know, took her clothes off and did these cheesecake photos tied up.

[855] So I think this was just on a smaller scale.

[856] And hers was, like, it looked like it was her idea.

[857] That was the kind of big revolution about Betty Page.

[858] Betty Page was having a great fucking time.

[859] And it wasn't like, someone made me do this.

[860] Yeah, well.

[861] So the woman got paid, the photos, and the photographers got their dirty photos.

[862] So that's, and everyone is happy.

[863] Right.

[864] So that's how Hollywood was built.

[865] When the photographer that called Judy came to pick her up, he met Judy's roommate, Betty, and Betty thought it was strange that he said he wanted to pick up, to pick her up, to pick up Judy and take her to do some, sorry, the select.

[866] He was going to do peanut picks, but then he told her to get a street outfit, like a normal clothes.

[867] So Betty thought that was weird, but he, but this guy offered her, his phone number of his, in his portrait studio.

[868] So she was like, okay, this is fine.

[869] So Judy left with her, with him.

[870] Wow.

[871] Yeah.

[872] So Betty starts to worry when Judy didn't come home from the photo session when she said she would.

[873] So she calls the phone number that this guy Johnny had left with her, but the number isn't for a photo studio.

[874] It's for a machine shop and no one there had heard of a guy named Johnny Glenn.

[875] So Betty calls the cops and APB is put out for Johnny and Betty describes him as a small bespectacled man and the search for her goes on.

[876] What they couldn't know yet was that Judy had already become the first victim of Harvey Murray Glatman, aka the Glammer Girl Slayer.

[877] I know that name.

[878] Okay, yes.

[879] You've seen photos of him.

[880] He looks like a hip, like a Brooklyn hip, trying to look like a Brooklyn hipster, like squirrely big ears stick out the side of his head.

[881] You know, hipsters have big ears?

[882] He's just like, gross.

[883] I think there was an episode of a crime to remember about this.

[884] Oh, I bet.

[885] Because I just got a really specific picture of Harvey Glatman in my head where I'm like, that's an actor.

[886] Yeah.

[887] Okay.

[888] So Harvey Murray Glatman was born on December 10th, 1927 in the Bronx, and he was raised in Denver, Colorado.

[889] those are two different places very different locales it must have been a real adjustment absolutely growing up in the 30s and 40s Harvey's parents began to notice that their kid had antisocial behaviors and sadomasochistic sexual tendencies from an early age that's got to be fun yeah one time his parents found him okay picture this picture you have a four -year -old kid okay and you walk in on him And he has a string tied around his penis And the loose end of the string Is shot in a drawer And he's leaning backwards So that the string pulls his penis taut And your kid's four And you just walked in on him doing that And you're like, who taught you this?

[890] Yeah, Harvey, what are you doing?

[891] Harvey, honey Harvey, honey, what the fuck?

[892] Do you want some tang?

[893] Jesus Christ Yeah I It's insanely disturbing slightly less disturbing was when I was like five and my dad walked into mine and my sister's room and I was playing we are great aunts had given us a stack of 45s that we used to listen to all the time that was this weird music from the 60s and 70s and I was standing in the room lip syncing to the Peggy Lee song is that all there is?

[894] Oh my God.

[895] Have you heard that fucking song?

[896] The creepiest song in the world.

[897] The creepiest song in the world and I'm a five -year -old stand there going is that all there is to a fire is that all there is to a fire is that all there is I would be like let's burn the house down seriously like I would run screaming yeah okay so when he's no brag no brag by the way I knew the words to that song when I was but you're a hipster from Brooklyn my ears are sticking all the way out right now so when he's 12 years old grows up from four years old his parents notice that he had a red swollen neck and they're like what'd you do and he's like well I was in the bathtub, I placed a rope around my neck, and I ran it through the tub drain, and then I pulled it tight against his neck, against his neck, achieving some kind of sexual pleasure from this act, he said, later.

[898] Oh, that he's doing the, um, choke yourself out?

[899] And then he also hang himself in the addicts until he achieved orgasm.

[900] Hang himself where?

[901] In the attic.

[902] In the attic?

[903] In the attic?

[904] And, you know, I don't know which one it is.

[905] now.

[906] It's C. It's addict.

[907] Did I say addict?

[908] You did.

[909] Fuck.

[910] I love it.

[911] It's the weirdest.

[912] I don't know how that happened.

[913] It's amazing.

[914] I don't, yeah.

[915] This is like this podcast in the past two years is the most I've ever said that word.

[916] I've said it maybe twice in my life before this.

[917] So why?

[918] Like I didn't have one.

[919] I'm from Irvine.

[920] We don't have those.

[921] This, that's right.

[922] They don't exist.

[923] Oh, California.

[924] How do we pronounce basement?

[925] We don't have those either.

[926] This podcast is all about, Like, I've never known what an abject failure I am about facts.

[927] I thought I was pretty together.

[928] And it simply isn't true.

[929] And it just gets proven week after week.

[930] Facts and opinions and...

[931] Just attitudes.

[932] Attitude about life.

[933] Anyways, let's talk about murder.

[934] Let's talk about a 12 -year -old child hanging himself in the attic for sexual gratification.

[935] Yes.

[936] His mom is like, we're going to the doctor, takes him to a physician.

[937] And the doctor was like, of course, he'll be.

[938] grow out of it, which is probably true in a lot of cases, right?

[939] Like the kids grow out of it or they don't, or they find, you know, they do it and they don't murder people.

[940] I just feel like the difference is he was like hanging himself.

[941] Yeah.

[942] Like I think if somebody was masturbating a ton, they'd just be like, look, it's just, you know, a phase or whatever.

[943] The hanging part is what you're bothered by.

[944] It's pretty intense.

[945] Nowadays, that would be problematic.

[946] Yeah, and back a day's as well.

[947] Okay, back a day.

[948] Harvey would later say that quote, I guess I was just kind of fascinated by rope.

[949] So it was the rope.

[950] I loved hemp.

[951] In school, Harvey did well academically, but was painfully shy when other kids, especially girls, which is like, who's not?

[952] And he was taunted with the nicknames weasel and chipmunk due to his look.

[953] So you can imagine what he looked like.

[954] Yeah.

[955] As I just made fun of him earlier.

[956] He committed his first sex offenses while he was a teenager.

[957] and when he would break into women's apartments, tie them up and sexually assault them as a teenager.

[958] Shit.

[959] He would also force his victims to pose for photographs so he could keep them as mementos.

[960] And the look of this kid is so, it doesn't make sense with what his offenses are because even as a high school student he must have been even skinnier.

[961] He's this scrawny little nerd.

[962] It's, and I know that like, so you wouldn't have expected this.

[963] Right, exactly.

[964] Based on just the way he looks.

[965] The strength, the bravery, the kind of boldness.

[966] Yeah.

[967] But I was also thinking of, like, can you cast him?

[968] I know.

[969] Because you know who I'm thinking of, and I can't remember his nasty name.

[970] That guy, Jay, that's in, like, this is the end.

[971] And what's his fucking name?

[972] Jay Baryshal?

[973] Thank you.

[974] Wow.

[975] You know who that guy is?

[976] No. He's very lanky and he's, like, long and skinny.

[977] Steven, can you show her a picture of him?

[978] Because I couldn't cast him, I couldn't cast him.

[979] Let's get him cast.

[980] So I need you to cast him, please.

[981] Let's cast, GLAT.

[982] Let's cast.

[983] ask lat oh wow okay well this is what does he look like we're in a bouchemmy area oh absolutely bushamy but then also this picture this is i'm gonna he looks a little bit like andrew garfield's like maybe less attractive older brother in this picture i'm looking at right who's and the guy that played like spider man and um he was in that army movie about how he wouldn't shoot anybody and he still went to world war two which is kind of amazing and true story um okay he also looks like fisher stevens which if you're from the 80s like me he was a big he was uh i think he was married to michel fiffer he's a character actor i think the uh steve bushemi type is a young steve bushemi because he was only 30 when those pictures were taken so and he also looks a little bit like the actor oh what the fuck is his last name go to instagram our instagram is my favorite murder one of this post we're gonna put up 15 actors and then we'll all vote on who is the most I also want to get Scoot McNary into this because he's on Halt and Catch Fire.

[984] Okay.

[985] And he's in one of the, oh yeah.

[986] He's in some cool independent movies.

[987] He's a really good actor.

[988] And no bragged, I'm sorry.

[989] I'm super delaying this.

[990] But me and Bridger went to dinner the other night and it was a little bit crowded around the hostess stand when we walked in and we didn't have a reservation so I immediately got tense.

[991] And then I looked over and the guy that was waiting for the hostess to seat him was staring at her so intently.

[992] I thought he was like, being mean to her.

[993] So then I started staring at him really intently.

[994] And then he turned and looked at me and it was Scoot McNary.

[995] And then I was just staring weirdly at Scoot McGarry.

[996] And then he smiled at me. And then I was like, what are you doing?

[997] Move your eyes away from his face.

[998] And I couldn't because he's really good looking.

[999] Okay.

[1000] Thank you.

[1001] No, thank you for letting me. Wait, where did you go to dinner?

[1002] Adderall Town?

[1003] Did you have an Adderall over medium for dinner?

[1004] That kept a coffee.

[1005] Okay.

[1006] Anyway.

[1007] I'm no stranger Jesus Christ I'm like can I stop you for the 90th time and tell you something that in no way will help your story I don't care okay looks that's what this podcast was going to be called originally listen look and listen in school he did well I already told you that da da da da da and he would take photos of them when Harvey was 18 and still in high school he was arrested after he tied up one of his classmates at gunpoint and sexually assaulted her so instead of graduating high school he went to fucking jail in Denver but But he continued to robins sexually assault women for years, often being arrested and serving short stints in prison, of course.

[1008] He was seen as an impulsive offender, fueled by lust and a rage for the women he assaulted.

[1009] While he was on bail awaiting trial, he kidnapped and molested another woman before releasing her, and that got him eight months in prison.

[1010] Kind of a please sit down and think about this for a little while.

[1011] Yeah, let's give you three squares.

[1012] You'll fill out a little bit so you can work out so you're stronger next to you're stronger.

[1013] time you go out.

[1014] You'll get some bad ideas from the people around you.

[1015] Exactly.

[1016] And then get out there, buddy.

[1017] After Harvey decided to, he, after that, he is like, fuck this shit, I'm going to New York.

[1018] He goes with his mom to New York in 1946.

[1019] So it's women, on women grows Boulder.

[1020] It's one of those obvious escalation stories.

[1021] And more violent in New York, he's eventually arrested for a series of muggings and sentenced to from five to 10 years in Sing Sing.

[1022] Whoa.

[1023] Prison, I know, prison psychiatrist diagnosed him as a psychopath.

[1024] Yeah.

[1025] But he was a model prisoner.

[1026] And so in 1956, they're like, get out of here, you nut.

[1027] You psychopath, get out.

[1028] Get out of here.

[1029] In 1957, he moves to Los Angeles.

[1030] And you know what?

[1031] That's what all the psychopaths do.

[1032] Yeah.

[1033] We're all here.

[1034] We've got so many of us.

[1035] It's fun.

[1036] He gets a job as a television repair man to support himself.

[1037] Positive you're going to say like a television producer.

[1038] Yeah, that's right on the money.

[1039] And now he's our agent.

[1040] And do, da, da, da, da, da.

[1041] Okay, but he also starts back up his fucking love of photography.

[1042] And he starts trolling modeling agencies posing as a professional photographer.

[1043] This has, this is like Alcala, Rodney Alcala, before Rodney Alcala was in Rodney Alcala.

[1044] Yeah, that's right.

[1045] And he's not, Rodney Alcala, like when you see that clip of him on the dating game, the dating game, it's so disturbing because he's.

[1046] He looks like, he looks like the creepiest troll of all the 70s.

[1047] Yeah.

[1048] But he did have kind of fine features or like patrician, kind of manly features.

[1049] One would say like, he's not a bad looking person.

[1050] Yeah, and he has, you can tell he probably had like a swarthy kind of have a game going.

[1051] Yeah, but remember the chick met him backstage and she was like, I'm not going out with him?

[1052] Because she thought he was psycho.

[1053] So clearly he couldn't fucking do it.

[1054] Yeah.

[1055] But I guess comparatively, at least he would have like the first five minutes of the game.

[1056] you're going whereas Gladman no you're not you're looking at that and you're like what's this teenager doing yeah right yeah the day so we go back now to his first murder victim Julie Judy Ann doll the day he picks her up he he had obtained her number through a modeling agency of course and he brings her back to his apartment which he says is his photo studio and they're going to do a pin -up shoot and he ties her up and gag gags her which she goes along with because he says that's part of it.

[1057] So he has that fucking ploy.

[1058] And then so there's some photos of her.

[1059] I've always looked at those photos.

[1060] And I do the thing where I look deep in the person's eye to be like, did you know anything?

[1061] You know, I try to study it.

[1062] Yeah.

[1063] And then the first photos that she's like that tied up, fully clothed in her like, you know, normal clothing.

[1064] And it doesn't look like she realizes, I don't think anything had happened yet that he had attacked her.

[1065] But then after taking those photos he holds her at gunpoint and then he repeatedly rapes her and takes photos of her and makes her pose a whole time and this was the first time so it's said that this is the first time his his assault had escalated to rape and I read in a couple places that that's where he lost virginity but and only in a couple places so I don't know if that's true okay but and yeah how could you know that unless he said it he blabbed later oh okay so it's possible he said that.

[1066] Whoa, that's weird.

[1067] Isn't that weird?

[1068] Of all that sexual stuff going on for since he was four years old.

[1069] Yeah.

[1070] And this is when he loses his virginity.

[1071] Yeah.

[1072] That's intense.

[1073] And then what kind of hatred must he have if he like has to think.

[1074] So he's a fucking horrible person.

[1075] It's not good.

[1076] There's photos of her Judy during the whole ordeal both before and after she comes to the realization that he's this monster.

[1077] After the rape and assault, Harvey drives Judy out to a secluded look in the Mojave Desert, which is outside of Los Angeles.

[1078] Not good.

[1079] Where he strangles her to death with a piece of rope and buries her out in the desert.

[1080] He then takes the rope that he had used to bind her and strangle her with him, and he uses it later.

[1081] Judy's skeletal remains are discovered later in December, but she wouldn't be identified until months later.

[1082] Seven months after he kills Judy, he finds his next victim.

[1083] He actually met Shirley Ann Bridgeford, a 24 -year -old divorcee and mother -of -two through a lonely heart's ad, again, using a fake name.

[1084] So it's one of those, like, it's fucking Craigslist.

[1085] Like, do you want to meet up and go on a date before Craigslist existed?

[1086] Yeah, and then it had that also the innocence of like late 50s or at least 60s or whatever where it's like, you write a letter and then in your mind, you know, some man who also has a lonely heart.

[1087] It's like, even the name at Lonely Hearts.

[1088] It's like, we're sad and alone.

[1089] And innocent, innocent and sweet almost, where it's just like, oh, here come the purves.

[1090] Harvey picks up Shirley under the pretense of taking her to a dance, but once they're in the car, he's like, hey, can we not go dancing?

[1091] And instead, can we take a long drive in the country and we'll get dinner along the way?

[1092] And she's just like, okay.

[1093] So they drove south.

[1094] No. I know.

[1095] The answer's no. No. And they end up in the foothills of the Valacito Mountains near Amiens.

[1096] state park.

[1097] Don't know what that is.

[1098] And you are a lifelong Southern California nerd?

[1099] Yeah, I'm gonna guess they changed the name.

[1100] Yeah, they did.

[1101] It's now called, uh, what, you know.

[1102] The San Gabriel Mountains.

[1103] Yes, actually, I think.

[1104] Yeah.

[1105] Okay.

[1106] There at gunpoint, he forces her to undress.

[1107] He ties her up and photographs her.

[1108] So I think this is one of, there's a couple photos of a woman on a picnic blanket in her clothes, again tied up.

[1109] And I think that in these photos, you can tell that she knows, like, in her eyes, you can see this, like, worry across her forehead.

[1110] She's gagged and bound, and it's really horrifying and awful.

[1111] I mean, I just would like to, as the person who doesn't look at these pictures, I would just like to say, sometimes when you look at those pictures, they do not leave your mind.

[1112] Uh -huh.

[1113] That's why I don't sleep at night.

[1114] I know, but I mean, like, you're telling me this, like, oh, really?

[1115] Because I just forget about them.

[1116] I just don't, don't look too many of those it's so upsetting it's too late it's so upsetting i know it's so late okay i look at all of those and i can't stop i know and then i can't sleep and i have anxiety yeah and i love it okay in a weird way yeah well you know you know exactly what's going to happen yeah it's a it's a controlled a bad feeling experiment yeah and i feel like it makes me understand the crime a little more like you know that that photo there's nothing going on in it you would think it's just a normal like a bound pin -up photo from the 50s, right?

[1117] Yes.

[1118] Well, and it's that thing of like looking at looking for the difference.

[1119] Yeah.

[1120] The difference of when a person is like, okay, here's your dumb thing.

[1121] Oh, I'm scared.

[1122] Yeah.

[1123] Oh, and then the difference of that of holy fuck.

[1124] I mean, she just has just like across her forehead, this worry.

[1125] Yeah.

[1126] Across her forehead that is horrifying.

[1127] Then he takes her to the same does.

[1128] where he had taken Judy and strangles her with the same rope.

[1129] He uses the same rope and takes it home with him.

[1130] And he leaves her body unburied in the desert.

[1131] So Harvey found his next victim, Ruth Mercado, who's 24, again, through the modeling agency.

[1132] And when he arrives at her place for a planned photo shoot, she's like, you know what?

[1133] I have a headache.

[1134] Get out of here.

[1135] This isn't going to happen.

[1136] Oh, good.

[1137] No. And he leaves.

[1138] But he returns to her house a couple hours later and breaks in.

[1139] and again, repeatedly rapes her at gunpoint throughout the night.

[1140] It's possible that he even made her sit next to him and watch his favorite sitcom with her.

[1141] Oh, man. Like he's just a psychopath.

[1142] A psychopath.

[1143] In the morning, he forces her to walk to his car and then he drives her to the desert where he photographs her tied up, forcing her to pose.

[1144] And then he kills her again in the same manner with the same fucking rope.

[1145] Wow.

[1146] I know.

[1147] That's horrible.

[1148] Harvey later stated she was the one I really liked so I told her we were going out to a deserted spot where we wouldn't be bothered while I took more pictures he later said we drove out to the Escondida district and spent most of the day out in the desert I took a lot more pictures and tried and tried to figure out how to keep from killing her but I couldn't come up with an answer yeah because you're a fucking psychopath yeah and also I hate when they I hate hearing from the killers because like him going like she's the one I like the most.

[1149] Who gives a fuck?

[1150] Yeah.

[1151] You fucking...

[1152] No, 100%.

[1153] You're right.

[1154] I don't care which one you let.

[1155] It doesn't...

[1156] Yeah.

[1157] That's not...

[1158] Your preferences are not interesting.

[1159] Like, doesn't make her a better person because you somehow didn't want to kill her.

[1160] You liking her or not liking her, she still went through hell.

[1161] Yeah.

[1162] Because of you being a psychopath.

[1163] Totally.

[1164] So she's reported missing on July 27th, 1958 by her landlords four days after she was.

[1165] left for a photo shoot with an unknown man. So his next, so his next potential victim is 28 -year -old Lorraine Vigel.

[1166] Vigel had just registered with the modeling agency when she was contacted by Harvey for her first photo shoot.

[1167] Okay, so after the appointment was scheduled for them to meet up, Lorraine got a call from the owner of the modeling agency who was a woman.

[1168] And she was like, look, this dude just came in here.

[1169] He needs a model.

[1170] I gave him your number.

[1171] But I just to let you know he's a he be careful with this loser she says quote be careful with this loser she got a fucking bad vibe from him yes she said he's not a professional and is rather creepy you know what i mean yes so she warns her yes that's all you got to do yeah just tell it call a gal up and just be like i don't get a great feeling so just so you know yeah but she needs the money and so she decides you know what i can deal with this right creepy guy so on october 27th 1958 Lorraine is picked up by Harvey and isn't worried at all until he starts driving in the opposite direction of where they were supposed to be going.

[1172] He gets on the fucking Santa Ana Freeway and starts going south towards Orange County.

[1173] Boo.

[1174] Uh -huh.

[1175] There's no photo shoots need to happen in Orange County.

[1176] Nothing good happens down there, clearly.

[1177] Except Disneyland.

[1178] And even that.

[1179] So he starts driving crazy and erratic and she's like, where are we going?

[1180] This isn't the right direction, slow down.

[1181] And she says that he wouldn't look at her or even answer.

[1182] answer her questions.

[1183] So after they drove for a while, Lorraine wouldn't stop berating him.

[1184] And he suddenly pulls over to the side of the freeway off ramp and he pulls a gun on her and then tries to tie her up.

[1185] But Lorraine is like, fuck no. She grabs the gun by the muzzle and starts to fucking wrestle with him.

[1186] Yes.

[1187] He tries to convince her that if she let go of the gun, he wouldn't kill her, but she was like, fuck you.

[1188] Bullshit.

[1189] This isn't, you're an idiot.

[1190] They fight over the gun.

[1191] the gun goes off and it passes through Lorraine's skirt grazing her thigh.

[1192] Whoa.

[1193] But she's still fucking struggling.

[1194] And at that point, she fucking goes down and bites his hand and he lets go with a gun.

[1195] She fucking tumbles out of the car.

[1196] He's like grabbing at her sweater trying to get her.

[1197] She holds the gun on him until the cops show up.

[1198] Yes.

[1199] It's fucking right.

[1200] It's like a citizen's arrest.

[1201] Hell yes.

[1202] So Highway Patrolman Tom Mulligan later testified that he had, quote, he had a lunatic stare.

[1203] I'll never forget that wild look he had in his eyes.

[1204] Wow.

[1205] Police arrested him, arrest Harvey.

[1206] Can I just say, how beautiful did Tom Mulligan look when he pulled up and Lorraine is standing there with this guy at gunpoint?

[1207] Yeah.

[1208] She's just like, thank fucking God.

[1209] There's some bad news, but.

[1210] Oh, shoot.

[1211] Well, here's the thing.

[1212] I was going to say, actually, like, instead of being celebrated for her courage and this, and he gets taken in and he admits to these.

[1213] murders.

[1214] Lorraine is dismissed from her job as a result of the notoriety and reports circulated that she'd known that Harvey was an ex -con when she accepted the modeling job.

[1215] Oh, so they fucking victim blamed the shit out of the fucking hero of our story.

[1216] Sure they did.

[1217] Of course they did.

[1218] Let's give Lorraine Vigal some fucking props.

[1219] Vigal -I -G -I -L.

[1220] Vigil.

[1221] Oh, Michael?

[1222] Or vigil.

[1223] Vigil.

[1224] She's a Vigilante.

[1225] Vigio.

[1226] Oh my God.

[1227] Vigil.

[1228] Vigil.

[1229] I feel like a dick.

[1230] No. I mean, who knows?

[1231] Yeah.

[1232] I think you're right.

[1233] We never know the correct pronunciation.

[1234] It's wrong no matter what.

[1235] Like she, yeah.

[1236] That is the good part.

[1237] I think that we are evolving.

[1238] That story's changing.

[1239] Yes.

[1240] We're changing it.

[1241] It's taken 500 years.

[1242] Okay.

[1243] So police arrest Harvey and after hours of interrogation, he admits to the three previous murders.

[1244] he eventually leads police to the toolbox in his apartment that contains pictures of hundreds of women that he had assaulted, including his three murder victims.

[1245] All of in all of, so after he had murdered the three women, he had tied them up and put them in various poses and taken photos of them.

[1246] Oh, they're dead bodies.

[1247] So the police were even like, you didn't look at those, did you?

[1248] There aren't any.

[1249] You can't find them.

[1250] No, no, no, no. I didn't, but I would have.

[1251] I know, I know.

[1252] I just feel, I feel a little obligated.

[1253] I've talked about this before where it's like, if I'm going to talk about, talk about these women who went through this horrible shit, I feel like I should fucking witness it, you know?

[1254] That's just my feeling.

[1255] Grade the impact.

[1256] Just keep your eye on the impact.

[1257] You're right.

[1258] Thank you.

[1259] As my therapist, you, I appreciate that.

[1260] As the least qualified therapist on the planet, listen to every word I say.

[1261] That's right.

[1262] No, you're right, though.

[1263] Thank you for saying that.

[1264] Okay, da -da -da -da -da -da.

[1265] Photos.

[1266] All right, finally.

[1267] so he takes the cops to the sites and they find the bodies and he tells investigators that he did do so he becomes known in the media as the lonely hearts killer and the glamour girl slayer when he's put on trial for his crimes he pleads guilty and repeatedly asks to get the death penalty and even attempts to stop the automatic appeal given after he does in fact get the death penalty he's like kill me I know which makes me wonder like psychologically what was going on in his head yeah because it's there's a little bit of I mean he also admitted to everything brought them to all the bodies like gave everybody closure kind of like shut the whole scenario down I'm totally aware that the it's almost like it was he wanted to kill that person who murdered all those women too he wanted to kill that guy too yeah you know yeah that makes sense Um, and, um, da -da -da -da -da, he, in on September 17th, 19th, I just had a brain.

[1268] I think it's called a stroke.

[1269] On December 17th, 96th, Judge John A. Hewicker found, found Harvey Glatman, who's now only, he's 31 at this point.

[1270] Whoa.

[1271] He finds him guilty in the murders of Shirley Bridgeford and Ruth Mercado.

[1272] He's sentenced to death.

[1273] And on September 18th, 1959, he goes to San Quentin's infamous green room.

[1274] Did you know that was what it was called?

[1275] I didn't know that's what it was called.

[1276] Where he's put to death by inhaling cyanide.

[1277] Shit.

[1278] And later, once this is coined, he's recognized as one of the nation's first serial killers.

[1279] Yeah.

[1280] Even like using the same rope is like very like story book serial.

[1281] And he's keeping a memento, which is the photographs.

[1282] Yes.

[1283] Like that was this thing to relive it over and over again.

[1284] They talk about it in the, you know, what's the detective?

[1285] Mind Hunter.

[1286] They talk about in the books and stuff that they write.

[1287] Because he's, yeah, he's early, perfect example.

[1288] Yeah, so any of those books you read, this guy's talked about.

[1289] So it's possible that Harvey is responsible for another murder.

[1290] This one's a cold case.

[1291] On April 8th, 1954, two, this is way before this, the first murder.

[1292] Two University of Colorado students hiking near Boulder Falls found the body of a naked and beaten young woman along the banks of the Boulder Creek.

[1293] She became known as Boulder Jane Doe.

[1294] until 55 years later in fucking 2009, when this woman, a 25 -year -old woman named Michelle Fowler, who's clearly a fucking murderer, you know, is like, wants to do some sleuthing on her, what would have been her great aunt's disappearance.

[1295] She disappeared when she was a teenager.

[1296] She had done all this, like, she didn't even live in Boulder.

[1297] She was just, like, doing all this web sleuth sleuth and, like, put these things together.

[1298] And she, uh, her send in some DNA.

[1299] And it turns out that Jane Doe was her, long -loss missing great aunt, Dorothy Gaye Howard, known as Dot.

[1300] Wow.

[1301] Oh, Dotty.

[1302] And they exhumed the body.

[1303] They did DNA testing.

[1304] She was 18 years old when she was reported missing from Phoenix, Arizona.

[1305] And a theory based on circumstantial evidence is that Harvey Glatman, who was in Colorado at the time, who there's some circumstantial stuff like with the car he was driving, leads to her being maybe one of his first murder victims.

[1306] Wow.

[1307] But there's, I haven't found any information updating it.

[1308] And that is the story of the glamour girl slayer.

[1309] That was great.

[1310] Thank you.

[1311] God, that guy's, I mean.

[1312] Steve fucking Bishemi, stop it.

[1313] Poor Steve Bouchemmy.

[1314] Oh, yeah.

[1315] I mean, like, he gets looped into all this stuff anytime somebody has like, so he's probably really upset right now.

[1316] You imagine Steve Boucho.

[1317] You imagine.

[1318] Oh, I would get so nervous.

[1319] I know me too.

[1320] Because you know why?

[1321] Steve Bouchamie is the shit.

[1322] He started as a fireman.

[1323] What?

[1324] Yeah, he was a fireman before he started getting acting parts.

[1325] Are you kidding me?

[1326] Yeah, he was a San Francisco.

[1327] He was a New York City fireman.

[1328] And on 9 -11, the firehouse he used to work in was one of the ones that lost a bunch of firefighters.

[1329] And he did all this volunteer work and went down and like went, I mean, he's, Steve Bishamie's the fucking shit.

[1330] Oh, my God, I love him.

[1331] Aside from being one of the best actors.

[1332] ever in one of the best movies Fargo like he also Border Rock Empire oh so good the best so good I love him love him um and on a Steve Bishemi note let's do fucking hooray okay great actually I need a second well there's the standing fucking hooray of Steve Bushemi obviously if you haven't seen him in Ghost World yeah please my fucking hooray is the like enormous vat of nacho cheese that you brought to my birthday party last weekend and I just want to Thank you for it.

[1333] It was just the funniest fucking thing.

[1334] Karen brought a crock pot, like a family -sized crock pot.

[1335] Filled to the fucking brim of nacho cheese.

[1336] We plugged it in.

[1337] And it was, and I appreciate you holding court.

[1338] And you just like.

[1339] It was fun.

[1340] Thank you for doing that.

[1341] And then we left it out for like two days, Vince and I. And I was like, well, we should just leave it in here and give it to Karen full.

[1342] Yeah.

[1343] But then we ended up having it like, it was so, and it was still so full that Vince and I had to, like, had a team up to, to dump it out.

[1344] When I, I didn't really think about this, but so, so I said to Georgia, you know, like, tell me what I can bring and like, in the forceful friend way where you're like, delegate to me. Yeah.

[1345] Instead of being like, no, just come.

[1346] We're shopping.

[1347] I'll get everything.

[1348] I was like, no, come on.

[1349] There's got to be some stuff.

[1350] And then she started throwing out dips.

[1351] And I was like, yeah, okay.

[1352] Dips.

[1353] You know you want some lipped onion dip.

[1354] Oh, and you did.

[1355] those ruffles yeah made a couple of those but then i was going to make um like homemade nacho like casso basically and i was looking up recipes and i was doing this that and the other thing and when i went to go shop i was worried about if i put something together what if i had this big that if something that tastes like shit so i was really concerned because i'd never tested out like my own caseo recipe yeah especially when you have to make you have to like triple the recipe because it's so big and stuff that's scary yeah and then i do what makes me a bad cook is I kind of give up in the middle often where I'm like this sucks and then just whatever when I was shopping at Smart and Final I looked up in the like where I was in the like Hispanic food section and I look up at the top shelf and there is a can of nacho cheese sauce that is as big as my head and I was just like problem solved I'm going to have this thing done in 20 minutes I got two cans of rotel diced spice tomatoes oh my God and I pulled down that plastic cheese sauce that they serve.

[1356] I kept saying it, they serve it at the roller skating rinked.

[1357] And so that everyone loves at a party and it's so delicious.

[1358] It is.

[1359] It's like, it's easy to eat.

[1360] It seems like it's made of plastic.

[1361] It's very, like you shouldn't be doing it.

[1362] It's really orange.

[1363] It was bright orange.

[1364] And people, the fun part was, and this is what I always have to do because, A, I can't be out in the sun.

[1365] So like, it was a pool party Georgia's whole area was, it was like, there was tons of young beautiful people all around the pool and I was like what's that a pool house with air conditioning goodbye and I noped out of the patio area and then plugged in that cheese sauce on the counter and pretended that I needed to stand next to it for the for the next three hours but then we had a great time because someone started playing the drinking game asshole which is like a card game that Joe DeRosa taught us yeah we start playing it and at some point about an hour in fucking Kara Clank walks in and she's a comic friend of ours um she is one of my favorite people and one of the funniest fucking people she's a good person at parties too she's perfection she starts like in telling everybody what the actual rules are she's like you can't just like grabbing cards out of people's hands and be like you need to go over there like managing shit yeah but also hilarious she has that camp vibe too where she's like it's like good time your camp friend yes managed good times.

[1366] Yeah.

[1367] So then it kicked it up to like the next higher level of like, then it got real loud in there.

[1368] It was really fun.

[1369] Well, thank you for making that and supporting me on my birthday.

[1370] Happy birthday.

[1371] Throwing birthday parties are scary and thank you for doing that.

[1372] Well, I love that you were like, so, um, you're like, it starts a two and I don't know.

[1373] It was like you were really tiptoeing and I'm like, oh dude, I'm being there.

[1374] I'm going to be there at 130.

[1375] That's the whole idea.

[1376] That's the best as having early friends.

[1377] You have to have early friends.

[1378] It's so important.

[1379] And you're in one's life to have early friends have friends that yeah have friends will come and stake out the bench that you want with you yes we'll be there and like okay well yeah we'll go to that restaurant we'll eat lunch there and then we'll just take over the back end sure it's like people that are going to like basically like three to five man team yeah lizzie and I did it for you the birthday exactly so we have to do you know when lizzie's birthday is sometime I think it's in November okay good because now we have to do it for her all right what's your fucking array but also when I pulled up I pulled that crock pot out and I was like if you can take this I will park my car and then bring the rest of the bags myself yeah and she was like okay yeah and then I handed her a 90 pound crock pot filled with like the most typical over nacho cheese yeah it was like a tidal wave of cheese it was good it was great we should have poured in the pool and gone swimming um it was the first day of like summertime feelings though and I was just like I am going to be miserable this summer people I don't have a pool but I don't have a pool but I the way, it's an apartment building that has a pool in the fucking...

[1380] George's indoor pool dome with a slide and a life friend.

[1381] That I own and it was a million dollars.

[1382] She owns and operates her own pool.

[1383] Yeah.

[1384] Mine is just TV shows because I did watch some crime -based TV shows, but God damn, one of my faves Marcella or on the show they often call her Marcella but I won't say it that way.

[1385] Season 2 of Marcella is on Netflix.

[1386] It is better.

[1387] I believe better than season one.

[1388] Wow.

[1389] And way darker, my friend Molly Davis texted me and was like, I think she texted me right after, you know how midnight puts things up, I mean, Netflix put things up at midnight.

[1390] So she texts me like, you better be watching this.

[1391] It was like one of those texts of, I hope you're watching this because it's crazy.

[1392] And then I just binged it all day long.

[1393] Oh my God, I love it.

[1394] And her sweater is the thing I always talked about for season one was like she there's one scene where she has a maroon sweater on that like broke my heart for some reason it's like the best sweater I'd ever seen the sweaters just come fast and loose in this season sweaters like they knew how good they were last time also she wears a lot of pants as floods so she'll have a big pair of like Oxford wingtips on or one or the other or both and then and then like no socks and then her pants start like it's the cutest look and I'm like I love that look and then it's like I always love the look of a girl who's she's probably four foot eight oh yeah it's like little little wafy girls can dress like old men and pull it off and it looks great yeah that's for them yeah good luck with that I stay in the pool house and then the other one is there's there's a series on stars called CB strike that's also British that's great and amazing and I'm only two episodes in but I love it can I suggest a show too I just remember there's a show called Succession.

[1395] I think it's on HBO.

[1396] It's on HBO.

[1397] Oh, okay, because I looked for that on like Apple TV and Netflix and I couldn't find it.

[1398] It's, it's HBO.

[1399] Okay.

[1400] I think you can get it on, I don't know, it's on HBO, but Colin Culkin, McCauley Culkin's little brother.

[1401] Oh, yes.

[1402] Colin, I think is news.

[1403] Yes.

[1404] That doesn't sound right.

[1405] Colin Culkin, no, no one would do that.

[1406] Well, there's a couple younger brothers.

[1407] He plays the real good actor one.

[1408] Yeah, he plays the best douchebag.

[1409] He slaps his sister in the face.

[1410] It's essentially, it's so fucking good.

[1411] It's almost like a Vip were really, really dark.

[1412] So it's this family, the patriarch is this fucking rich ass with his own company.

[1413] All his kids are trying to get control of the company.

[1414] Which one is it?

[1415] Kieran Culkin.

[1416] I knew Colin Kalkin wasn't a fucking, Kieran.

[1417] He is so good.

[1418] He was the Scott Pilgrim's gay roommate in that movie.

[1419] And he was so excellent in that part.

[1420] Yeah, it's a succession.

[1421] It's a fucking great show.

[1422] I don't know.

[1423] The The girl who plays a sister is fucking excellent, too.

[1424] Succession.

[1425] I have to watch that.

[1426] It's really fucking fun.

[1427] You'll like it.

[1428] It's like rich people too.

[1429] Yeah.

[1430] So it's like, this is how they live.

[1431] Sorry.

[1432] I love it.

[1433] I stood on your.

[1434] No, you did not.

[1435] Okay.

[1436] I almost think we might need to pull our show recommendations out of fucking hooray.

[1437] It's going to make it harder.

[1438] Yeah.

[1439] And just have them be like, just do, do, yeah, we'll talk about it.

[1440] I mean, we're going to do something.

[1441] Be more spiritual.

[1442] Yeah.

[1443] I don't know.

[1444] Thankful.

[1445] Okay.

[1446] We'll do it.

[1447] Sometimes I'm just a, I'm just a straight -up permit and I haven't left the house so I can only be thankful for TV shows.

[1448] I'm thankful for Elvis sitting next to me right now.

[1449] And the way he was looking at me when I was telling my story just now.

[1450] Did you see it?

[1451] Yeah, he was riveted.

[1452] He was just looking at my face.

[1453] Like, bitch, where's my cookie?

[1454] Bitch, we are long past my, the line.

[1455] Yeah.

[1456] All right.

[1457] Thanks for listening to you guys.

[1458] You know, do stuff.

[1459] Be good.

[1460] Be good.

[1461] Thanks for your support.

[1462] we love you.

[1463] We do.

[1464] Stay sexy.

[1465] And don't get murdered.

[1466] Goodbye.

[1467] Hey, Elvis.

[1468] Want cookie?

[1469] Whoa.

[1470] He wouldn't even let me finish.

[1471] Want cookie?

[1472] Good boy.

[1473] Good boy.