Howard Stern

[0] My name is Howard Stern.

[1] What is this?

[2] A piece of paper.

[3] My name is Howard Stern, and I feel blank about being Conan O 'Brien's friend.

[4] Well, first of all, there's no blank here.

[5] We're not friends.

[6] This is the problem that I have with you that a friendship would imply that we've actually had a conversation off the air, or maybe a dinner, or maybe some sort of phone conversation.

[7] So, in other words, hi, my name is Howard Stern, and I feel badly about not.

[8] not being Conan O 'Brien's friend.

[9] I feel you would be a great friend.

[10] But, you know, I'm intimidated by anyone with a Harvard pedigree.

[11] Fall is here, hear the yell, back to school, ring the bell, brand new shoes, walking loose, climb the fence, books and pens.

[12] I can tell that we are going to be friends.

[13] I can tell that we are going to be friends.

[14] Hey there.

[15] This is Conan.

[16] Welcome to Conan O 'Brien needs a friend.

[17] The podcast, it's really a scam more than anything else where I get people I just really want to talk to to hang with me and have conversations I've always wanted to happen.

[18] So far, I'm loving it.

[19] And I'm joined by my trustee assistant.

[20] Hey, Sona.

[21] Hi, Sona.

[22] And, of course, our terrific.

[23] engineer, producer, I don't even know what to call him, Matt Goorley.

[24] Hi.

[25] So, you doing okay today, Matt?

[26] You're right?

[27] Yeah.

[28] Okay.

[29] He's got a cough in his throat or something.

[30] Sona, you're wearing a t -shirt today that says, what's it say?

[31] I completely forgot I was wearing this.

[32] What does it say?

[33] It says, surprise, I'm drunk.

[34] Surprise, I'm drunk.

[35] Okay.

[36] Does you see your parents?

[37] Did you see your parents today?

[38] I did not.

[39] No, I wouldn't have worn this to see my appearance.

[40] It's, yeah.

[41] Okay.

[42] They'd be cool with it, though, wouldn't they?

[43] No, no, they wouldn't be cool with it.

[44] Surprise, I'm drunk.

[45] No. Okay.

[46] I'm not, though.

[47] No, you're not.

[48] You're doing all right so far.

[49] It's early.

[50] It's early still.

[51] I forgot I was wearing this.

[52] This episode is going to be different.

[53] I think they've all been a little different, but this is a supersized episode of Connor O 'Brien needs a friend.

[54] This is a long one.

[55] and I think it needs to be.

[56] I just this moment flew back from New York City where I was interviewing this gentleman in his serious XM studio.

[57] And so if the quality is a lot better than mine, you'll know why.

[58] They've got real microphones there.

[59] Anyway, of course, he's the long -reaning king of all media.

[60] He has a new book out called Howard Stern.

[61] comes again.

[62] He has, of course, many, many, many fans.

[63] He inspires strong feelings for those people who probably are like, no, no, I don't know about Howard's journey, he's not my cup of tea.

[64] I will say this, whatever you're feeling, I have always found him to be an incredibly original mind, curious, razor sharp, funny, and I have long considered him to be the best interviewer in the business.

[65] He is naturally curious, he's voraciously curious, and I've been lucky to speak to him on a few occasions and really felt like we connected.

[66] So I was thrilled that he agreed to let me talk to him for this interview.

[67] Ladies and gentlemen, Howard Stern.

[68] You really aren't, are you?

[69] You're not, the Harvard thing doesn't bother you, for real.

[70] No, I'm very envious of that.

[71] I wish I had that kind of intelligence.

[72] I wish I had that ability to understand math and was a better writer, even, the English, the command of the English language.

[73] I feel people who go to Harvard are privileged.

[74] But let me try my best.

[75] My name is Howard Stern, and I feel aroused about being Conan O 'Brien's friend.

[76] I'm actually three inches hard right now.

[77] I can see.

[78] All full three inches.

[79] Let me show you.

[80] I can see it.

[81] from here.

[82] No, I'm excited about being your friend.

[83] You know, I...

[84] There's potential here.

[85] We've talked to.

[86] I think there's great potential here.

[87] There really is.

[88] There really is.

[89] And maybe the fact, maybe the fact that there's potential is because no one's tried to force it yet.

[90] Right.

[91] No, this is a thing that's...

[92] We've both been in the business.

[93] I mean, you've been in the business a lot longer than I have, but I've been doing my thing for about 26 years now.

[94] And I think the fact that I didn't push it, I didn't show up and say, hey Howard, man, what about me. What about me?

[95] You would have hated me if I'd done that.

[96] You're a beautiful guy that way.

[97] So let me ask a couple of questions before we start this stuff.

[98] I mean, I know we're into it.

[99] Yeah.

[100] This is it, by the way.

[101] This is it.

[102] This is it.

[103] This is all there is.

[104] This is podcast.

[105] This is podcast.

[106] This is podcast.

[107] This might be my first podcast, I think.

[108] Yeah.

[109] I've never done one.

[110] You haven't done Mark Marin?

[111] No, I haven't done Mark Maron.

[112] I don't think I have.

[113] You know, this is weird.

[114] I turned to, I was doing the show the other day, radio show.

[115] And when I'm doing the show during the commercial breaks, the guys come in, and you had just been on my show.

[116] And I said to the guys, I said, you're going to hate this story.

[117] I said, you know, Conan is such a great fucking guest and such a great guy.

[118] I mean, every time he's on, it's just great.

[119] And I said, you know, it's weird that I've never done his television show.

[120] I never ever did it.

[121] I should have done it.

[122] We might have had some great chemistry.

[123] And then Gary goes, oh, you did do his show.

[124] And I went, really?

[125] I did Conan show.

[126] I go, I assure you I'd remember that if I had done it.

[127] Well, sure enough, they had to prove it to me by showing me on your show.

[128] I had no fucking recollection of it.

[129] I don't remember so much when Jerry Orbach died, I remembered saying to someone, you know what, I love Jerry Orbach.

[130] Wasn't he great?

[131] I wish, and we'd had him on the show a few times, I wish I had had a chance to do like a serious cop scene with him.

[132] Right.

[133] And the person said, you did.

[134] And I said, no, no, no. I swear to God, if I had had it, if I had done, if I had done, that, I would know.

[135] And I said, I mean a real great face -to -face cop scene.

[136] And the person said, I think it was Frank Smiley.

[137] He said, you did.

[138] He left the room.

[139] He came back in.

[140] He put a big three -quarter inch machine in.

[141] I shot a whole scene on the set of his cop show where he shoved me up against a wall and was like, you punk.

[142] And it was this, it was a comedy bit, but we played it real, his inches from my face.

[143] And I had told someone, if only that had ever happened to me. And I did it.

[144] but you've been doing this so long that you have you have tons of that i know i in fact gary's biggest job is to remind me of what i've done i when even when i set out to write this book yeah i'm like uh gary you need to be there the first day i'm going to tape stuff i'm going to talk into a tape recorder you got to remind me of what i've done right and now people wouldn't understand that but i realize doing you know going on the conan o 'brien show going on the tonight show going doing all of these incredible things i've done never struck me or touched me in a way I didn't allow them to and I guess I was just kind of plowing through my life I was doing whatever I had to do to make a living but not really allowing for these moments to be big because other people would say oh that's such a big moment but it didn't feel it's not an arrogance it's not me being an asshole it was just me going oh you know it's just one more thing I have to do you know what it is too it's volume I'm telling you that when you've had, I mean, your job is to meet a different person or person comes in every day.

[145] You talk to them.

[146] Right.

[147] And you're in it in that moment.

[148] You've also had these moments where you've been in New York, premiere of your movie, massive crowds.

[149] But you're in that moment, and for you, in that moment, you're getting through it.

[150] I'm just getting through it.

[151] In fact, when I wrote my first book, there was this weird thing that happened.

[152] I said, I got on the air and I said, hey, I'm going to show up at Barnes & Noble.

[153] and I'm going to just go sign some books.

[154] And because I had done it impromptu like that, the police didn't really, they were just kind of aware that I was going to Barnes & Noble, but there were no barricade set up or anything like that.

[155] And if you ever see this footage, if you look it up on the internet, I'm in this crowd, people lifted me off my feet.

[156] It was, it was nuts.

[157] Right.

[158] And afterwards, someone said to me, oh my God, that must have been something.

[159] And I realized I was like, oh, it was just an exhausting day.

[160] It was very tiring.

[161] I did the radio show, and then I had a sign like, like 10 ,000 books in one sitting.

[162] It wasn't like I was impressed with myself or thinking that somehow I was the greatest thing on earth.

[163] I mean, just the opposite.

[164] I was like, oh, God, I got to go home and figure out what can I do tomorrow to merit that kind of praise.

[165] Hey, I'm thinking of a couple of things.

[166] Number one, when we started the podcast, we shook hands, so I got to put some...

[167] Well, I'm telling you, you really should.

[168] I got to put some, what do you call this, jism on my hands.

[169] There's no reason to go blue.

[170] There really is no. to go blue.

[171] It's a Purell.

[172] It's a antipaterial.

[173] My wife and I call that jism.

[174] Oh, you do?

[175] Yeah, we go, hey, I go, do you have the jizz in your pocketbook?

[176] Those are the lovely little things a couple has over time.

[177] I'm so witty.

[178] That you can't.

[179] What a genius.

[180] Oh, wow.

[181] He calls Purel, jism.

[182] And then the other thing I'm thinking, are people listening?

[183] Do you have any indication if people are listening to your podcast?

[184] This podcast is.

[185] Millions.

[186] No, God, no. I don't think there are millions in podcasts, but it is doing extraordinarily well.

[187] How do we know this?

[188] We know it because they tell me, oh, you're like the number one comedy podcast in, you know, the podcast space.

[189] Oh, nice.

[190] Now, that's including some people call their podcast a comedy podcast, but is it really comedy, you know?

[191] And you know what I've noticed to?

[192] None of them sitting here?

[193] You have a very different approach on the podcast.

[194] Like when I see you on the show, on the TV show, you're kind of like this.

[195] More so.

[196] I used to be more that way.

[197] Right.

[198] And you've changed.

[199] This is something that happens.

[200] This is what I wanted to talk to you about.

[201] Right.

[202] And this is my clever way of turning it back on you.

[203] Good.

[204] Because no one wants to hear about me. You, in this new book, you do something that I think might be unnecessary.

[205] I would say this as your therapist.

[206] Good.

[207] You denigrate your old work.

[208] You put it down and you say, I'm so embarrassed of some of that.

[209] And I love this new way that I am now, but you have a kind of disdain or, embarrassment about your old work, and I'm telling you that's not necessary.

[210] And I'm telling you that as a potential good friend of yours, I think that's the wrong tact to take.

[211] No, you know what it is.

[212] First of all, you know, I mean, I don't know that you have this, but most people, when they look at old pictures of themselves, I look at old appearances on Letterman.

[213] People say, oh, Howard, your appearances on Letterman were legendary.

[214] I can't watch them.

[215] I cringe.

[216] My delivery is different now.

[217] I'm an older guy.

[218] You know, I'm 60 fucking five years old and I look back at 30 year old Howard on David Letterman and I go, yeah, I see me working a little too hard, a little too desperate, not owning who I was.

[219] I critique it.

[220] Yeah.

[221] I can't go back and watch old radio shows, you know, when we did them on TV.

[222] We did them simultaneously.

[223] I can't go back and watch that stuff.

[224] There's no shame or embarrassment.

[225] I was trying to entertain an audience.

[226] I was trying to make people laugh who were stuck in the miserable existence of commuting and I was successful at it.

[227] I had one out of every four cars in New York tuned into me. I can't say that that's not a great accomplishment, although I would sit there and look at it and go, why are the other three not tuned in to me?

[228] Right.

[229] Exactly.

[230] So, so in the midst of all of this and some reflection, it's not that I'm apologizing.

[231] I'm not apologizing for my work.

[232] I'm just saying I'm a different guy now and it's painful for me to go back and look at that stuff.

[233] I relate to that.

[234] I have some of young comedians now tell me, oh, I grew up watching you and the weird stuff you did late at night.

[235] And you did a thing in 93 or 94 or 95.

[236] And I'll say, what are you talking about?

[237] I was horrible then.

[238] I can't look at it.

[239] I don't.

[240] And if someone's playing any of that stuff from that era, I can't be in the same room.

[241] Right.

[242] And it's not a schick.

[243] You're saying, hey, it really is painful.

[244] It's painful.

[245] And I understand.

[246] But I want to say this to you as your therapist now.

[247] I've heard.

[248] heard you many times.

[249] In fact, you've told me, you tell me, this is why I love my, the interview I did with you.

[250] Yeah.

[251] You've said to me, you know, the reason I stayed with NBC and I didn't take that offer from Fox, you could have gone up against Jay Leno, would have been a very different sort of history.

[252] Your driving force wasn't money.

[253] The driving force was you wanted to at least have access to your archive of material.

[254] Yes.

[255] So that you had it all.

[256] Yeah.

[257] And when you were talking about that, I said, you know, be careful what you wish for.

[258] I, when CBS sued me, Les Moonvez sued me personally.

[259] At the end of it all, I ended up owning my archive.

[260] I own everything I ever did, which is a tremendous comfort to me. Yes.

[261] But also it's a tremendous curse.

[262] Because some of this stuff now, when we go back, we have to go listen to it because we want to put it on our radio channels here.

[263] It's serious.

[264] And oh my God, some of it I listen to it.

[265] I don't want to hear this on the radio again.

[266] And I don't, I wish I could just burn this shit.

[267] And it's not that it's bad or it's just not me. And it's not you now.

[268] That's right.

[269] But you're you now because of what you did in the 80s, 90s, and 2000s.

[270] And that's the thing that, that's the only thing I wanted to come in right away.

[271] I almost felt like I was on a mission to say there was a time when in show business, everything felt very manufactured.

[272] When you came along and you were alienating people and you were going at them and occasionally I was on the receiving end of it.

[273] I still thought this is great.

[274] This needs to happen.

[275] This is someone who has been told by a, first of all, I have a thing with publicists where someone will come to me, and I'll read the notes that they've talked to the person beforehand, and the person will say, tell us me this amazing stuff on the notes.

[276] Right.

[277] And I'll say, I can't wait to talk to this person.

[278] And then I get out there, and the music's playing, and one of the second producers will come up and lean in my ear and go, cut out one, two, and three.

[279] And I'd be like, what are you talking about?

[280] That's the best stuff.

[281] And they'll say, no, the publicist is here.

[282] The publicist killed it.

[283] The person likes it, but the publicist killed it.

[284] Because it's a little, and I, one of the things that you did was publicist would say, Howard can't ask about A, B, or C. And that would be the first thing that you would ask them.

[285] Right.

[286] Now, sometimes they would walk out, but it was compelling.

[287] You were the only person doing it.

[288] And I think you have no perspective on how that was important.

[289] I do have some perspective.

[290] And I'll tell you what my perspective is.

[291] I was like a guy coming up from the gutter.

[292] I was, you know, I was in Nowheresville radio.

[293] I was working at WR &W and then I had to go to Hartford, Connecticut.

[294] I mean, I really had to play all these markets and work out my, my thing.

[295] And what was always my universal truth was that radio was really dull and could be a great medium.

[296] It could be phenomenal.

[297] It could be so instantaneous that people would, people on things.

[298] television would be jealous that they didn't have a radio show.

[299] That was my sort of core value of doing this thing.

[300] I really believed in the medium of radio.

[301] The problem was the people doing it.

[302] I remember being on the radio in Washington, and I would tune in the local of WTOP in Washington was the all news station, but they had opinion shows.

[303] But who had the opinion?

[304] People in the audience.

[305] The hosts would not give their opinion.

[306] It was all very straight.

[307] And so when I got into radio, I felt like I was like the version of punk rock.

[308] Fuck you.

[309] Fuck everything.

[310] I'm going to be unleashed it.

[311] The interesting experiment would be, could I just blow you away by letting every dark thing out of my mind?

[312] Happy thoughts, sad thoughts, you name it.

[313] Don't really analyze it.

[314] Right.

[315] Just say it.

[316] Right.

[317] And it is such a dangerous act because it's like walking a high wire.

[318] I could have at any point been fired for anything I said.

[319] I could have offended 50 people who I probably, when get off the air, said, oh, shit, I really don't even want to say that.

[320] That was a thought I should have kept to myself, but I just did it anyway, because I thought that process would be revolutionary.

[321] Yeah.

[322] I thought it would be like mind -blowing.

[323] You're driving in your car, and there's this lunatic who's saying everything that perhaps we think, but no one will say out loud.

[324] Right, right.

[325] And that was my approach, and I make no apology for that.

[326] The problem is it wreaked havoc on my personal life, and everything in my life.

[327] It wreaked havoc.

[328] And also, it didn't even allow me to be fully honest in a way because I went to negative dark places.

[329] And that's what I described in the book about Robin Williams.

[330] I mean, I love Robin Williams.

[331] The arrogance to me to think that Robin Williams can't come in on my show and deliver some sort of interesting, funny thing that the audience would stay tuned for.

[332] The only thing that was any good was me. He doesn't get my audience.

[333] And I have to just, that's just, that just sucks for me. Right.

[334] And so the reason I I wrote this book is because I thought, well, what is it I'm really proud of?

[335] I came over to Sirius XM.

[336] Everyone expected me to just interview strippers and have women naked running in here.

[337] Maybe people even fucking.

[338] I don't know what they expected because here there are no rules.

[339] It is the wild west of radio.

[340] Yeah.

[341] I could do whatever I want.

[342] I could talk about, you know, people eating each other's assholes out for four hours.

[343] And that's what I think everyone expected.

[344] But I looked at this as like a weird, unbelievable opportunity.

[345] Here's what I thought.

[346] I am such an outsider.

[347] I am a pariah.

[348] Publicists don't want to bring their guests in on my show.

[349] But wouldn't it be interesting now?

[350] Because I'm that guy, what if I could get really great guests, people who have accomplished things, to open up and have a conversation with me?

[351] And because I have no limitations in terms of what I do, I could do an hour, an hour and a half, however long that person would sit there and we could just keep it as real.

[352] It would be like if you got invited to a dinner party and I showed up and there was Gwyneth Paltrow sitting there what would this this guy who you listened to for years say to Gwyneth Poutro could it be interesting to hear a real conversation and the answer was yes and so when I wrote the book I said what a great summer read a collection of these conversations that I've had with people some of them are really deep.

[353] And I don't think anyone expects that.

[354] The reason I chose you for my favorite interview in the book and people were, David Spade still can't get over it, he's very upset.

[355] Spade's like, oh, go talk to your best friend.

[356] He texts me every night.

[357] Are you talking to your best friend, Conan?

[358] I go, listen, Spade.

[359] I don't even know Conan, really.

[360] I said we had a moment on the air that was so fucking incredible to me. Yeah.

[361] Maybe not to him, maybe not to anyone else in the audience.

[362] but I have never heard a better talk show guest.

[363] You came in and we got into a conversation.

[364] You opened up with a story about Bill Cosby and what you had done in Harvard to get this award.

[365] That was one of the funniest best stories I heard on a talk show.

[366] And then suddenly you said something and I heard something in your voice and we started talking about that you suffer from depression.

[367] And you were so raw and honest about it that I thought this is like if I did have a dinner with you and there were no microphones there.

[368] and I go, oh my God, Conan, I had no idea you suffer from depression.

[369] I didn't know how upset you were.

[370] In this day and age, people don't think of you as a human being.

[371] They see some guy on TV.

[372] Let's attack them.

[373] Let's call him a fucking asshole, you know, all the trolls on Instagram or wherever it is with social media.

[374] Some guy sitting in his basement hasn't taken a risk, hasn't said, fuck at all.

[375] I'm going to go.

[376] You had a Harvard education.

[377] You could have been in a very safe job, but no, you took a chance because you want entertain people at the end of the day i don't think you were looking at being rich i think you really wanted to make people laugh true yeah and so when i sit down with you and i can somehow create a vibe where maybe we forget the microphones are here you can't fully it's never going to be the most full honest conversation but it's the closest that i can get to you and sit down and hear about this incredible climb how you you know how you wrote for people how you got this break and you go on tv and then after you go on TV, oh my God, everyone wants you off the air.

[378] You couldn't even get a 13 -week fucking cycle contract from NBC.

[379] Every day it was like Conan's going to be fired.

[380] I had forgotten that until you brought it up right now.

[381] I didn't want to.

[382] But this is an incredible story.

[383] And to hear you talk about it in front of millions of people, in a way, the art of conversation is dead.

[384] Like, yes, everyone has a podcast.

[385] And yes, everyone's talking to everyone else.

[386] But where can you congregate in front of millions of people and have a real conversation?

[387] And yeah, I'm going to ask people, you know, fucking weird questions.

[388] But you see, to me, the mistake that people can make is they can think that the strippers and the vibrators and the little people, that that represents pushing the envelope.

[389] And what they don't understand is, yeah, sometimes it can.

[390] And there was probably a time when it did.

[391] But at a certain point, sitting down and having a real conversation, with someone is edgier than if you had 65 strippers come in here right now and eat each other out.

[392] Right.

[393] What you're doing, and it's, I see this mistake all the time.

[394] People will start a new late night talk show and they want it to be edgy.

[395] And I've had some of them come to me for advice and they've shown me, I had someone show me tape of their new show and they had taped a pilot.

[396] And it was just them coming out, hard rock music.

[397] They come out, they spray paint all over the wall, they kick something over.

[398] They're wearing half a leather jacket.

[399] There's no form.

[400] They interview someone in the audience.

[401] Then they throw cream pies.

[402] Then someone interviews them.

[403] Then shit comes down from the ceiling.

[404] And I look at it and I said, it doesn't feel edgy.

[405] It doesn't feel revolutionary because you're not, the funniest thing in the world is give someone restraint.

[406] You need to create restraint.

[407] You need to create how engines work.

[408] You make a confined space.

[409] And then you create all this energy and it's got nowhere to go and it pushes the car forward.

[410] Stupid explanation of how an engine works, by the way.

[411] I don't know anyway.

[412] Anyway, you need, what you have here, where we're sitting right now, is a small space, few distractions, and if you can get a person there, you can get them to really open up.

[413] That, to me, is edgier.

[414] But you need to set the rules first.

[415] Like a basketball game is exciting because there's a court and there's two nets and people have to play by the rules.

[416] You just hit into the essence of this book.

[417] Because here's what my thought was.

[418] When I was on Terrestrial Radio, I had the government, and I had religious groups after me every single day.

[419] And, you know, I was a horny young man, and I want to see naked women.

[420] But the real thing I was also thinking is, wow, look at the response I'm getting.

[421] It's almost like when you nag your parents for a toy when you're a kid.

[422] And as long as you nag, you become the noisiest kid in the room and you eventually get what you want.

[423] Right.

[424] I thought it was unbelievable.

[425] like I was this revolutionary kind of guy who was sitting there and going you don't you say nudity is bad you fucking hypocrites you say that sexuality is bad fuck you I'll do whatever I want I was like a tantruming child and you know you pick the space that you're in to come to satellite radio where you can do everything and do that is just utter horseshit it's nonsense who cares at least I was railing against something the government was fining me I was the bad boy of radio religious groups were screaming.

[426] They would send out newsletters.

[427] You must send money.

[428] We have to get Howard Stern off the air.

[429] Of course, I would go on the air and say, just send me the money directly.

[430] And if you give me enough money, I will get off the air.

[431] Right, right.

[432] But, you know, it was kind of like, that was terrestrial radio and that was then.

[433] I'm on satellite radio.

[434] I could have strippers running around nude here every day.

[435] I mean, sitting and having a conversation with someone like even Gwyneth Poutro walked in.

[436] And in the old days on terrestrial radio, I just would have been like, hey, you know, do you give you a husband, do you ever blow your husband?

[437] Do you blow your husband a lot?

[438] Do you like to give fallacious?

[439] Do you blah, blah, blah, blah.

[440] Okay, you could say that's something.

[441] But the person runs out of the room.

[442] They don't answer the question.

[443] And as I point out in the book, when I was talking to Gwenith Paltrow, and we were having this deep conversation about what it was like to win an Oscar.

[444] And I was talking about the death of her father.

[445] And we're just going, we're going all over the place with other people in Hollywood about how Brad Pitt confronted Harvey Weinstein.

[446] on her behalf, which is just fucking great to hear about and put Brad Pitt in a whole new new thing.

[447] And then she goes, you know, sometimes when I'm arguing with my husband, and her husband's Chris Martin, Coldplay, and she goes, sometimes it's just easy to blow the guy.

[448] Now, that is way more satisfying to me because it's coming from her.

[449] Right.

[450] I'm not forcing this woman into a weird dialogue and just pounding her with sexual questions because it'll titillate the audience.

[451] I feel way more satisfaction sitting and talking to um i'm thinking about amy schumer mhm amy schumer really funny person a great stand -up i love her stand -up and we're talking but she'd written a fairly serious book and she educated me that day she said to me you know everybody wants rape to be perfect and it stopped me in my tracks like what do you what do you mean by that because i was thinking about all the guys in my audience listening to this who really need to hear it right and i said what do you mean by the perfect rape she goes well the perfect rape is the police come You've been raped in an alley by four guys, and, you know, they take a semen sample and the whole thing.

[452] That's the perfect rape.

[453] Everyone can get behind that and maybe even bring it to court and all that.

[454] But the real problem is, in her case, she opened up about, hey, you know, I was with my boyfriend, and we were messing around.

[455] And then he just got on top of me. I hadn't given him the green light.

[456] I hadn't given him the okay.

[457] But who is they going to complain to?

[458] In a way, they're going to say, well, you were naked.

[459] you were in bed with him no and you know what guys need to know that guys need to know i swear to you i've said this on the air if you're inside a woman and she says get out you get the fuck out you know it's just the way it's got to be this way we have to evolve okay we're back with how it's turn but those kind of conversations to me are way more satisfying and and i that's why i like this i mean that's why I said, maybe what you were saying before was addressing that, that I, you know, I should be proud of everything in my career.

[460] But, but this is what I'm most proud of, these conversations.

[461] I mean, when I'm talking to John Stewart, who I think is terrific, you know, I don't know if you know him personally or not.

[462] Yeah, yeah, not super well, but yeah.

[463] I don't know him personally at all.

[464] And yet this, in a similar way, like when I spoke to you, I was like, oh, I just wish I knew Conan.

[465] Conan just seems so evolved.

[466] John had come in the day that Louis C .K. John was throwing a charity benefit.

[467] He does it every year.

[468] He booked a charity benefit.

[469] Louis C .K. is one of the guys on the lineup.

[470] The whole situation had just broken with Louis C .K. And all these sexual allegations.

[471] John was going around promoting the charity event.

[472] He's on something like the Today Show.

[473] When he was on the Today Show, they're hammering more questions.

[474] How can you have Louis C .K.?

[475] Why are you having Louis C .K.?

[476] He was frazzled.

[477] He was frazzled.

[478] He comes in on my show and he sits down on the show.

[479] the couch and we start talking about that because i'm friends with louis k too i know louis really well and uh i was going through the same thing what is my relationship with louis well how do you know so john starts sitting down and going man and this is this is the book this is why the book is good it's not anything about me it's about other people right this is the first book i've ever written that's about other people john sits down and starts to do a self -analysis he calls it rabbiing it out right And he goes, if I had known Louis was doing that, would I have spoken up, would I have said something to Louis, would I have said something out loud?

[480] How do I feel about Louis doing that?

[481] How do I?

[482] He said, you know, I didn't know in that moment on the Today Show how I felt about Louis doing the show.

[483] I didn't know how to answer.

[484] He goes, why do people assume I have the answer?

[485] I don't.

[486] I need to think things through.

[487] And then why did I feel close to him in this conversation?

[488] If I had been anywhere having this conversation, this is the conversation I'd want to have.

[489] him if i was a hollywood insider and i could be at a party with john stewart we started talking about how everybody when he was doing the daily show how everybody in the audience uh the right wing audience the fox news guys whenever they wanted to get at him whenever they wanted to attack them they'd go uh yeah that john leibowitz they'd start calling him by his birth name john leibowitz and i'm a jew and he's a jew and we know exactly what the fuck that means right they're trying to shame you for being a Jew, motherfuckers.

[490] And when John said it, I felt closer to him than, I don't know this guy.

[491] And somehow we're able to get rid of the microphones and start talking about this shit.

[492] Anti -Semitism and the crap that he's felt.

[493] And then the truth be told, he goes, this is what's so great.

[494] He says, you know why I changed my name from Leibowitz?

[495] You might think it was because I was ashamed of being Jewish or it wasn't a showbiz name.

[496] He goes, it was my mother's maiden name.

[497] My father had abandoned me. I didn't want to be John Leibowitz.

[498] I didn't want any of the Leibowitz's name.

[499] I took my mother's maiden names.

[500] You know, that's the power of the book.

[501] And I think the power of the book reflects sort of with that story you just told.

[502] My experience is that we have a culture where people have to decide quickly who you are.

[503] And so they put you in a box very quickly.

[504] So Howard Stern represents a certain thing.

[505] and maybe I represent a certain thing and John Stewart represents a certain thing and they don't know that you're a person.

[506] And so when I go to my therapist, there were so many times where I'm talking about the ways in which I've experienced pain or hurt or a sense of betrayal or just life, the stuff that everybody feels.

[507] And there are so many people that I think, do you turn into a two -dimensional, like a sticker, like an emoji?

[508] because you're rich, I'm rich, we're rich, shut the fuck up.

[509] And they don't understand how you got there.

[510] They don't understand what you did to get there.

[511] They don't understand anything about your life or how complicated it may be.

[512] They just know that that's Howard or that's Cohner, that's John Stewart.

[513] Fuck them.

[514] You bring up an interesting thing just saying I'm rich.

[515] It's like, that is such a fucking problem for me because I, I get so angry when someone says, you're so lucky.

[516] What do you have to be miserable about?

[517] You're rich.

[518] I go, do you know, what do you think?

[519] What am I, a Kennedy?

[520] Somebody just handed me a bunch of fucking money.

[521] Dude, how do you defend yourself and say, because you're saying you're rich like you didn't deserve it?

[522] How do you defend yourself and say, you know what, dude?

[523] I got into radio.

[524] I just wanted to make $250 a week.

[525] I wanted to be able to get a shitty fucking apartment so I could entertain people.

[526] I didn't give a fuck about money.

[527] I never cared about it.

[528] I just had to be on the radio.

[529] There was something so much deeper in it for me about radio.

[530] My father didn't pay attention to me at all.

[531] But when my father had a recording studio and a guy got behind a microphone, that lit up my father's eyes.

[532] The world was important.

[533] Those guys were important.

[534] When he had Don Adams or Larry Storch working behind a microphone in his recording studio, recording Tennessee Tuxedo cartoons, my father had a look on his face.

[535] For me getting on the radio was a bigger thing.

[536] My roommate in college was in six -year med, one of the most brilliant guys I know, and he's still my friend, this guy, Dr. Lewis Weinstein.

[537] And I'd say to myself, oh, why can't I fucking have that IQ?

[538] I would love to be a doctor and not have to go through, I have to go to a radio station and somehow get people to listen to me and not fuck up.

[539] This whole career was filled with angst.

[540] This wasn't about money for me. Money was an important thing for me because I just want to be able to support my kids and support my family and be able to have a house.

[541] I didn't even know if I could do that.

[542] No one knows my struggle.

[543] And the audience doesn't need to know it, but don't fucking sit there and troll me about money and talk to me about how I'm in it for the money, you fucking piece of shit.

[544] And that's where my anger comes from in some of this stuff.

[545] Even writing this book, what this book represents to me is a collection of my best stuff.

[546] Conversations that unbelievably, happened.

[547] Rosie O'Donnell is sitting on my couch.

[548] I have access to Rosie O'Donnell and I get into this heavy conversation with her and I never felt closer to her and I love sharing this with the audience and having these moments.

[549] She's talking about the pain of losing her mother when she's five and taking a baseball bat and breaking her her bones in her hand and just wanted to feel anything but the pain of losing her mother.

[550] No one had ever explained that to me before.

[551] That was mind -blowing and I'm sharing it with an audience and now I have it in a book i have that and that's my time capsule that's what i'm most proud of when she was talking about she'd go to the school nurse with her broken hands and the woman would be putting bandages on her hand warm compress and warm bandages she was getting mothering shouldn't have a mother to do that so she went to the school nurse and broke her own hands so fuck i thought as i tell you that that's heavy stuff and to have a conversation like that with rosy o'Donnell her sitting on my couch.

[552] Man, that's what I want my legacy to be, these conversations.

[553] What's also interesting, because before you had that conversation with her, you might be guilty too.

[554] Very.

[555] Rosie O'Donnell is just, she's that person.

[556] I was trolling her.

[557] You control her.

[558] I was troll.

[559] I used to get on the radio, and I'm not proud of this.

[560] I was fucking out of my mind, and I would slam Rosie O'Donnell.

[561] And why was I slamming her?

[562] And it took me years in therapy to realize.

[563] She was a successful broadcaster, comedian, and in movies.

[564] And in my little stupid world, there's no room for her.

[565] It's supposed to be listening to me. Yeah.

[566] And I was a jealous, angry asshole.

[567] I didn't hate Rosie O'Donnell.

[568] I didn't know anything about Rosie O'Donnell.

[569] And she miraculously gave me a second chance.

[570] I don't know how she found it within her.

[571] But she somehow did.

[572] And I said to her, I was out of my mind.

[573] And she's become very close to me. I did the view yesterday.

[574] I was promoting the book, and I talked about Rosie.

[575] And afterwards, I got a text from her.

[576] She wrote, I love you.

[577] It just, I just said, man, I was so fucking crazy.

[578] I might have missed out on knowing this woman.

[579] Right.

[580] And she's so open about even stand up.

[581] She was talking to me. And again, these are the moments I love in the book.

[582] I said, how did you figure this hurt girl, this girl who is in so much pain?

[583] How do you become a comedian?

[584] How do you get up on that stage?

[585] And she says, the first time I got up on stage, it was unbelievable.

[586] I had all my friends in the audience.

[587] I killed.

[588] I killed.

[589] And I knew this was my career.

[590] every appearance after that, she sucked.

[591] Richie Minervini at the local comedy place on Long Island turned to her, you know, and it was like, what happened here?

[592] And she went and watched Jerry Seinfeld on TV.

[593] And she took his entire act.

[594] She thought stand -up comedy was like...

[595] I know.

[596] She didn't realize that the whole point is to come up with your own stuff.

[597] She didn't know.

[598] She thought it was like a cover band.

[599] Like she would go do Jerry Seinfeld.

[600] And all the comedians are going to work.

[601] But, I mean, she starts to talk about this stuff, and we're having a real conversation, and the microphones are on, but they're kind of not there.

[602] That's awesome.

[603] I mean, and I didn't even know if I should write a book about this because these interviews have been on the radio, but they took on a different meaning as a collection.

[604] Yeah.

[605] And I got a chance to say how much you meant to me and Letterman and even the Harvey Weinstein interview.

[606] Yeah.

[607] I'm like, man, this guy, his hypocrisy is completely pointed out in this conversation in the book.

[608] I said, Harvey, what about the casting couch in Hollywood?

[609] Does it exist?

[610] He goes, oh, Howard, oh, no. Right.

[611] Of course not.

[612] Right.

[613] He goes, I'm a producer.

[614] Do you think if I was sitting there and forcing myself on women, I could do business?

[615] Like, you get inside this guy's head, and now you read it in retrospect, and you're like, this guy knew all the right things to say.

[616] Oh, yeah.

[617] It's not like he was.

[618] It's called being a sociopath.

[619] It's called being a sociopath.

[620] You know the right thing, but you're just saying it.

[621] I don't know.

[622] It's all revealing.

[623] There's something you don't bring up in the book.

[624] I think it's a, to me anyway, it's a big turn, and I don't know how you feel about it, but 9 -11.

[625] I remember on 9 -11, no comedians, none of us were on the air.

[626] We couldn't be on the air for a while.

[627] But you narrated it as it happened in real time and reacted.

[628] And I thought of you as you're not a CNN broadcaster.

[629] You're not that kind of broadcast.

[630] You're not that kind of broadcaster.

[631] I think of you as more of a late -night comedian.

[632] I thought, Howard's more like one of us, and you were reacting in real time to it.

[633] And your response to it's incredibly honest.

[634] And I know that you've subsequently played it on the anniversary, and it's really powerful.

[635] And it's hard to listen to.

[636] Yeah.

[637] Because it's such a painful day.

[638] I can't listen to it.

[639] But I always thought that that was a moment where, against your will, maybe prematurely, maybe you were ready for it, but you didn't want it you were forced into this situation that you had to take us all through that day you were on the air and you did and it sort of pre it was an advanced look at where you were going does that seem like it's possible i don't know i i you know when it happened we were on the air i think if i remember correctly again i haven't listened back to it but i think we were talking about pamelaer anderson and how hot she was yeah you know we were really graphically going into what it is we might be doing with her or whatever.

[640] Right.

[641] And that's why Al -Qaeda attacked.

[642] They were so offended by your interview.

[643] Actually, I have the other viewpoint.

[644] If Al -Qaeda had strippers and like sex clubs and porno, they wouldn't even be Al -Qaeda anymore.

[645] Some of those countries had that stuff and that freedom, they actually enjoy living.

[646] I think those guys are so fucked.

[647] I think, I thought our reaction to 9 -11 should have been also to drop porn right on their fucking country so that they were, some of these people would be a little less repressed.

[648] Right.

[649] But all joking aside, it was a horrible day.

[650] I'm sitting there, on the air, someone comes in and says, you've got to put the TV on while I'm on the air, but I'm live.

[651] And I didn't have any thoughts of like, you know, I was helping anyone through this or whatever.

[652] I was just, again, I was in the moment reacting to what I saw.

[653] And I immediately said to Robin, the first plane hit, I go, this is an act of terrorism.

[654] And everyone was kind of like, no, no, no, you don't know that.

[655] You know, it could have been.

[656] I go, it's a clear day.

[657] This is an act.

[658] And then the second plane hits.

[659] And then we're.

[660] And then everyone in the tri -state area starts calling me, people who could witness what was going on.

[661] And suddenly, real reporters were calling in in the sense that everyday people who were sitting there were able to report on their feelings and what was happening and we all shared this together.

[662] And afterwards, some people who worked for me said, I have to leave the building.

[663] I got to get home.

[664] I didn't put any trip on them, I don't think.

[665] But, you know, everyone was like saying, oh, you were so brave to stay in the building.

[666] No, I wasn't.

[667] I wasn't brave at all.

[668] I was just sitting there.

[669] and I was sharing that with my audience and it didn't feel right to leave in the middle of this I felt I should just sit there we had already done like a four hour show and I we were on the air till then like noon we did an extra two hours but it didn't occur to me to leave it just seemed like the right place for me that I would be the most useful right and honestly Conan I was sitting there in shock I was in shock and I was really fucking angry with these goddamn terrorists and I was you know and I was reacting we got to go over and blow them the motherfuckers up you know, we got to, you know, that's how I felt.

[670] But what's amazing is that that's a document now.

[671] I mean, that is a document.

[672] And I think it's probably one of them, for me, one of them more compelling documents.

[673] I can't look at the footage of that day.

[674] I don't think a lot of us can.

[675] I still, I lived in New York.

[676] I was watching it all unfold from my apartment when it was, while it was happening.

[677] Yeah, I didn't know what to do with myself.

[678] But your show that day is a document, kind of a real -time document of an honest person.

[679] reactions as things are laid out.

[680] And because it exists, and as I said, reporters can't say the things that you say.

[681] You're reacting as a real person.

[682] And I always felt like that day, and I think a lot of us felt this way.

[683] I know a lot of us felt this way.

[684] Oh yeah, Howard helped us get through that day.

[685] You were on the air as it was happening.

[686] And the rest of us, none of us could, we were back on the air for a week, two weeks.

[687] You took us through that moment.

[688] And so now it's a document of how a person felt as it unfolded, first plane, second plane, getting calls, shock, anger, speculation.

[689] To me, that's...

[690] And by the way, when you get me thinking now, I remember thinking at the time, why are the late night hosts not going on TV?

[691] Yeah.

[692] Why don't they just break format and sit down with America and say, we're all grieving right now?

[693] Right.

[694] And maybe even just instead of like, Open it up to the studio audience.

[695] Let them say how angry they were.

[696] I would, you know, it's tricky, and I know that, because it might have them been seen as maybe you were taking advantage of a horrible situation.

[697] There's a lot of thought.

[698] There was also no, there was no network time available.

[699] Everyone was just, like flights, we were all grounded.

[700] Right.

[701] And I get that.

[702] And actually, you made me think of another thing, two things you made me think of just now.

[703] David Letterman did call me and say, hey, can I, this was like a year later.

[704] I don't know.

[705] I don't want to even say at what point, but he did say, hey, I'd like to hear your broadcast.

[706] I heard it was great and I heard it was good.

[707] And I was very proud of that, that Dave wanted to hear it.

[708] And the other thing you're making me think, gee, it would have seemed like a natural place.

[709] I'm a little disappointed myself.

[710] It might have seemed like a natural place for me to inject some of my thoughts about that.

[711] When I interviewed the comedian Steve, I always get his name wrong, Steve Ranazzincy or something.

[712] Do you know what I'm talking about, Steve?

[713] Steve for years, he was a stand -up comic who got busted by the New York Times he had always told everyone that he was at 9 -11 He was in the World Trade Center Yes, yes, yes, yes, I didn't know his last thing And that's why I put Steve in the book I actually called Steve, I said, Steve, would you mind if I put you in the book?

[714] Because I know it's very painful for him But he said, please do, I want people to understand I told the lie and I'm trying to get I don't know what I'm looking for But he said I wanted to come on your show and explain myself.

[715] And I almost didn't have them in, but I'm glad I did.

[716] Yeah.

[717] And maybe that would have been a natural space for me to write about my reaction to 9 -11 and being on the air.

[718] But even that feels like a little self -serving.

[719] Right.

[720] And maybe it's just best I didn't write about that.

[721] And it didn't occur to me anyway.

[722] No, it occurred to me that I don't think it needs to be in this book.

[723] Yeah.

[724] But it felt to me that that was the first time that I heard you in a different way.

[725] Yeah.

[726] And I think a lot of us heard you in a different way, and you could probably go back and look at that day and see some of the catalyst possibly for you thinking, okay, maybe there's more than strippers and Pam Anderson.

[727] I don't think I drew that parallel.

[728] I think really when that started to happen for me, and this is what I do explain in the book, is psychotherapy.

[729] Right.

[730] I still think psychotherapy has a tremendous stigma.

[731] Most guys I talk to, you know, they wince a little.

[732] And it took me five years.

[733] It was suggested to me that I go into psychotherapy by a guy named Dr. John Sarno, who had healed me of back pain.

[734] He has a wonderful book if he's now, he's no longer alive, but it's called healing back pain.

[735] Yes.

[736] And the mind -body prescription, and I became a devotee of his.

[737] But he said to me, you got to go into psychotherapy.

[738] It's important.

[739] So for five years, he gave me the name of somebody.

[740] sat on my desk.

[741] I just, it was not brave enough to go confront myself.

[742] And as Bill Murray says in this book, in my book, he says, you know, sometimes we don't want any self -reflection because when we really dig deep, we find the person inside isn't all that attractive.

[743] It's pretty ugly inside.

[744] And I love that Bill Murray says that.

[745] It's a good piece of wisdom in the book.

[746] But I know for me, I just didn't know what it meant to go into psychotherapy.

[747] Nobody had ever listened to me. No one.

[748] I had never had an adult who listened to me. Yeah.

[749] I never had.

[750] I never had an adult who listened to had a teacher that I bonded with.

[751] I never had an adult male role model.

[752] I didn't have those things.

[753] I didn't have anyone I'd ever really had a conversation with who heard me. And as a result, I kind of shut down.

[754] I didn't know that you could even have an emotion and think about it.

[755] My parents had had such a tough life.

[756] I never wanted to burden my parents with any of my problems.

[757] I just didn't know from that.

[758] That's funny because in the book, that you went to your therapist and you, you did, you did stick.

[759] You told jokes, you performed for the therapist, which is hilarious because I completely relate to that.

[760] I did the whole thing about my parents.

[761] I was in there and I, you know, I'm like, you know, how it I raised you to be.

[762] I didn't have the megaphone in the office.

[763] I wish you had had the megaphone.

[764] It would have been, I should say therapist.

[765] Hey, I brought a megaphone with me. By the way, I started using a megaphone when I do my mother because, hey, it just sounds that she's on the phone, it just works, you know.

[766] But so I'm in the office there and I'm doing all these routines for the guy.

[767] I thought that's what you do.

[768] You go, you sit down and you tell them about your parents.

[769] Yeah.

[770] And so I did it in a funny way.

[771] Also, you were doing your job, which is, I've got an audience, I've got an hour, you've got to entertain in that hour.

[772] Yeah, and the sad thing for me was I didn't think anybody would care about me unless I kept them laughing.

[773] Yeah.

[774] You know, I spent a lot of, my mother was a very depressed woman with good reason.

[775] And, you know, she lost her mother at 9, and she went in, you know, my grandfather tried to send her into an orphanage.

[776] There was no room.

[777] She and her sister were sent off.

[778] And so he sent her off with relatives and she didn't have her mother.

[779] And she was never even told her mother died.

[780] She didn't know anything.

[781] And my mother really went through a horrible life.

[782] And my father's might be equally as bad.

[783] And so they were very traumatized individuals.

[784] But I didn't understand any of this.

[785] But I did know when I'd come home and my mother said, ah, I'm going to commit suicide.

[786] her sister had died when she was in her 40s and I was I think I was in 10th grade and I saw a very depressed woman she's talking about going upstairs and maybe doing herself in and I and I didn't know if she was for real or not and maybe it was just like kind of a schick like because in my family no one ever did everything was just kind of words you just kind of talked and people laughed and and so I found one of the things I could do to chair at my mother I was really good at standing up and doing impressions of all the mothers and fathers in the neighborhood I would take her on a tour of all my friend's houses and start to do these routines and there was one mother in particular who was a complete phony I'd hear her yelling through the door at her son and she'd be like you know let's call him Bob or John or whatever you know John you motherfucker you fucking son of a bitch you fucking dick and then she was rather obese but she always wore a nightgown, like a negligee.

[787] And then all of a sudden, I'd ring the doorbell.

[788] And I'm hearing, motherfucker, fuck you.

[789] And then the door would open up.

[790] She'd go, oh, hello.

[791] Hi, Howard.

[792] Johnny's right down, Bob, whatever his name was.

[793] I want to disguise it.

[794] Bob's right downstairs, and he's playing with the dog.

[795] And it was just this, and my mother, there was such joy and laughs when I was doing these impressions of the neighborhood mothers and the hypocrisy, she loved it and to see my mother smile and lap and it's one of the reasons I was interviewing Stephen Colbert that's why I chose to put him in the book another one of these moments that was so great because Colbert lost his father and his two brothers in a plane crash and we're talking and I said when your mother must have been a very sad woman a very depressed woman and he started talking and I said how do you relate to women now when you only see women as people you have to cheer up he goes whoa you know he stops in his tracks and i and that's why i want people to read the book he stops in his track he goes how do you know to ask that question and we started to have a real moment i go because i had a very depressed mother and i had to cheer her up and his reaction to cheering up a woman is different than mine as you'll see in the book but it's those moments where if you can, you know, because of therapy, because of being in psychotherapy, I got in touch with how much I had to cheer up my mother.

[796] I wasn't even aware of this stuff about what my, what the burden was on me, what I had to carry on my shoulders.

[797] But that therapist, sitting on a couch, stripping away all my fucking bullshit and hearing me and knowing my, you know, knowing my children's names, understanding what I was going through after being divorced, really hearing about whatever my pain was in life it blew my mind and I said what if I could do that with the people on my couch I mean when I'm interviewing the Kardashians who I also put in the book it's more about anal and who you know what do they ever fuck white guys as it should be as it should be it doesn't have to all be heavy right but you know some of this stuff is heavy and some of it's light and it's kind of a gamut of what it is I do and we're back with more Howard Stern you know What's interesting is I've always said, if I could change one thing about myself, it would be to not care so fucking much about what other people think.

[798] Oh, mine is a small penis.

[799] Oh, that was my number two.

[800] Oh, okay.

[801] You probably have a big one.

[802] You have a big penis.

[803] Stop it.

[804] Look at you.

[805] You're reverting.

[806] What are we in?

[807] It was this 1995 again?

[808] We needed a little.

[809] I got insecure that maybe we put some people.

[810] My penis is better than you'd think.

[811] Let's just put it that way.

[812] All right.

[813] It's, uh, it's no Liam Neeson, but it's, it's better than you'd think.

[814] But it's had some damage.

[815] Liam Neeson.

[816] Oh, it has?

[817] Yeah.

[818] What happened?

[819] Lava.

[820] You put your penis in a volcano?

[821] Wow.

[822] I didn't want to hurt my hand.

[823] You see what happens on that couch?

[824] It's magical.

[825] Have you ever put your penis into something weird?

[826] I interviewed a guy who claims he put his penis into a vacuum cleaning, you know, the kind that's in your house.

[827] Yeah, yeah, exactly.

[828] Not the new, not the Dyson one, the one that comes in the wall.

[829] And I'm like, you fucking moron.

[830] That's how people lose their people.

[831] penis.

[832] They're like, are you out of your mind?

[833] It's worth it.

[834] But you were saying the one thing that you would change about yourself.

[835] That I would change about myself is I've always cared so much about what other people think.

[836] Now, what's fascinating to me is that I would have probably said to a therapist maybe 15 years ago, I wish I had more Howard Stern in me. Right.

[837] Because he doesn't care and I care way too much.

[838] I really do care about not hurting someone's feelings.

[839] If someone doesn't like me, I want to know why.

[840] how I can fix it, and I wish I could have that piece of my brain removed.

[841] And what fascinated me about the book is you make it clear that you do really care about what people think about you and you have insecurities about it, which shocked me. Yeah, no, I...

[842] Which also makes sense.

[843] It also makes sense because you are an empath who, in the 90s and early 2000s, you're trying very hard to maybe hide the fact that you're an empath, but the reason that it worked for you is that you really are an empath.

[844] You are paying attention.

[845] And you do care what people think.

[846] Yeah.

[847] In a way, I somehow turned that off because the greater good was, hey, you can't afford to show that insecurity because this Uber man that you've created, this guy who says, fuck you, can't show any vulnerability.

[848] And let me tell you, it was not easy because I am insecure.

[849] You know, I cared too much about are people going to go see?

[850] my movie are people going to think it's good even to this day and i admit this insecurity i've said i won't do it but i'll check twitter once in a while conan you'll be on and we've had this incredible interview and i'll go oh i bet you the people are saying this was the most incredible radio and you're reading oh conan was so great howard and conan blah blah and then some guy writes it was so fucking boring i had to turn it off yeah yeah oh man i'm fucking crushed but you know i can't believe i have a rule I have people come into me all the time and say such and such went really well you should check it out you should read it it's a nice thing I don't read anything I can't and I don't think you should be because we live in a world where if Mother Teresa had been on Instagram or she had been on Twitter and she was literally cleaning the wounds of the lepers yeah and then she went and checked at what people thought she'd feel like an idiot the fourth comment would be you're a whore right you know and what What are you talking about?

[851] And you have small tits.

[852] Yeah, exactly.

[853] And it's like, which she didn't, by the way.

[854] No. But when you think about it, you become paralyzed by that stuff.

[855] Because when I was on the radio and I was really bad for a lot of years on the radio, if there had been Twitter around and they go, hey, I just heard this guy Howard Stern on W .R. And W .R. and W. And he sucks.

[856] I think I would have been crippled inside.

[857] You know, I'm crippled enough inside.

[858] You know, I love that John Lennon song.

[859] You can't hide when you're going.

[860] I mean, I really am.

[861] And that's why I had such a thin.

[862] skin on the air because I am so crippled inside.

[863] I am so afraid of what people might say.

[864] And in fact, with the promotion of this book, I did an interview with the New York Times.

[865] I did interview with the Hollywood reporter.

[866] And I guess I should read them.

[867] I don't even want to read that.

[868] I don't even want to know.

[869] Look, let's say Gary came in and told you this New York Times thing came out.

[870] This is what and it's the greatest piece ever written about anybody.

[871] Now let's finish the sentence.

[872] Yeah.

[873] I would find the most horrible thing.

[874] Yes.

[875] Yes.

[876] Yes.

[877] I would say this, You know, I got a, with all this book promotion, a lot of people contacted me and told me they love the book.

[878] Very famous guy wrote me and said, hey, I love the book.

[879] And I love the piece they did on you on CBS Sunday morning.

[880] And I said, oh, oh, I'm good.

[881] He goes, yeah, I did a couple of pieces on CBS Sunday morning, and they fucking annihilated me. Well, this got me curious.

[882] He said, I got to go watch these things.

[883] So I Googled it and I looked at it.

[884] They were the most glowing pieces I had ever seen on this guy.

[885] They were wonderful.

[886] And I wrote him, I go, what are you talking about?

[887] He goes, oh, it's probably just me. A lot of people suffer from this.

[888] Well, a lot of people have a prism in the front of their brain that whatever light you shoot in there, it immediately refracts and gets twisted.

[889] And so to me, it's women talk a lot about body dysmorphia.

[890] Yeah.

[891] And you'll see these very rail thin women.

[892] And if you ask them to trace their outline in a mirror, they'll draw a really fat outline because that's what they, really see.

[893] And they really do.

[894] And it's heartbreaking.

[895] And it's a heartbreaking sad fact that that's what they actually see.

[896] I think many people in our business have career dysmorphia.

[897] I really do.

[898] I'm not even making a joke that you can look at your career and yourself and you you see criticism, you see pain, you see failure.

[899] Anybody sees that.

[900] Other people don't see that.

[901] They're saying, what are you talking about?

[902] Oh, yeah.

[903] And so if someone gives me an article, I don't read it.

[904] And they'll say, no, no, I'm telling you, it's the nicest thing ever written.

[905] And what I do is I give it a lot.

[906] I ask my wife a lot.

[907] Can you just read this?

[908] And then she'll tell me it's really nice.

[909] But she doesn't say you should read it.

[910] She knows that if I read it, there'll be one line that said, you know, the host who struggled in 90, like, why do I struggle?

[911] What do you mean?

[912] Yeah, right.

[913] It was joyous to have a new book out.

[914] Doing the publicity is the most painful thing.

[915] And I'll give you an example.

[916] So George Stephanopoulos, who I know, I know his wife, Alley, and we have dinner together.

[917] We're friendly, unlike you and me. This is, you know, we go to dinner.

[918] And maybe our relationship is more pure.

[919] I don't know.

[920] This is, I think, is pure.

[921] I mean, this is pretty good right now.

[922] I love it.

[923] Yeah.

[924] I love you right now.

[925] You want to have food brought in?

[926] I love you so much right now.

[927] I'm just even thinking this.

[928] I go, God, Conan.

[929] and he's deep and he gets it and he's such an interesting guy and I go, this is a side of you.

[930] I'm glad you have a podcast because this is a side of you we don't get to see on TV.

[931] But see, in that comment right there, what I, and I'm doing what you would do, I have so many people now that say, oh my God, I love the podcast because, and I'll think, shit, I wasted 25 years.

[932] But you did it.

[933] You know what I'm saying?

[934] This is just another side of you.

[935] Yes, yes.

[936] You know what I'm saying.

[937] I'm saying to you, because I know that's that paranoia.

[938] I'm saying to you, man, this is such an interesting.

[939] the medium of network television doesn't allow you to have these kind of moments.

[940] We would have taken seven breaks by now.

[941] Right.

[942] And it wouldn't have happened.

[943] We would have.

[944] Yeah.

[945] That happened to me on the view.

[946] I did the view and they had to take a break.

[947] And Whoopi was about to talk to me about something.

[948] And she said, oh, I'm going to ask you that when we get back.

[949] And we got back and she didn't even have time to ask me about it.

[950] And it was kind of a sweet thought.

[951] And it's the same, getting back to this thing with George Stephanopoulos.

[952] So I did an interview with him for Good Morning America.

[953] And it aired.

[954] And everyone was calling me, oh, you and George.

[955] She was so great together.

[956] Blah, blah, blah, blah.

[957] And I think people think sometimes this is an act or something.

[958] I said, I'm not going to watch that.

[959] My wife texted me. She was out of town and she said, did you watch Good Morning America?

[960] I said, no, I don't want to.

[961] I'm having a good day.

[962] I don't want to watch it.

[963] I don't want to have a bad day.

[964] That's what I wrote her.

[965] I said, I plan on painting today.

[966] I want to forget every fucking thing.

[967] And I know there's going to be something there that's going to upset me. And I'm not going to like the way I look.

[968] I'm not going to like the way I sound.

[969] and I should have done this and I should have done that and I shoulda could or woulda.

[970] And she said to me, no, I'm telling you it's safe to watch it.

[971] There's nothing there.

[972] I said, there's something there.

[973] And I trust her enough that she gets me. She knows how fucked up I am and she loves me anyway.

[974] I'm lucky man. But it took a lot for me to watch it.

[975] And I used to read about Letterman's insecurities.

[976] Oh, you know, he'd be throwing things after the show and all that.

[977] And I would goof on it.

[978] And I said, I'd do the same fucking thing.

[979] I'll do an interview This is why I loved In the book I name you as my favorite interview Because afterwards I wasn't upset with myself Somehow I felt like we had just hit Every single mark in that interview Yeah, I'm Christ -like, yeah Well, I don't know what it was To me, it was And you know, Spade can joke about Oh, you know, your buddy Conan He's your favorite It just worked And then I found myself Whenever you were a guest on a talk show I don't know, you had done A series of shows later on I have to watch now because it changed my whole fucking perception of you.

[980] I go, this guy's a great talk show guest.

[981] And it was funny.

[982] I don't know whether it was the Tonight Show I saw you on recently or Colbert or one of them.

[983] You were absolutely on the, I don't know, did I write you a note about how good that appearance was?

[984] You said it on the air.

[985] You talked about me going on Colbert and people came and told me and I was fantastic.

[986] It was nice to hear praise.

[987] But it was completely different.

[988] You had obviously prepared a couple of stories.

[989] You were in your zone.

[990] It was all comedy, pure comedy.

[991] It wasn't like what we had done.

[992] Right.

[993] But yet it was equally as fucking great.

[994] And so, you know, I hope people understand all of my guests in this book were great.

[995] But for me, there was a special connection between us, you know?

[996] Yeah.

[997] There's a, no, no. Just was.

[998] Yeah.

[999] And I've always, my thing is when something goes well, I then don't want to ruin it.

[1000] So I always, and I, and I, This is exactly what I went back to, which is, and I said it when you talked to me on the air recently about when you name me your favorite guest, I said afterwards, and I think I said this to you, my immediate feeling is we'll go to dinner and you'll see, oh, I see.

[1001] And I feel the same way.

[1002] Yes, exactly.

[1003] I say this.

[1004] My wife, well, people go to dinner and they're very disappointed in me. And I have gone to dinner with people, and then you never hear from them again.

[1005] And I'm like, oh, I'm such a fucking bore.

[1006] And I'm, you know, of course they don't, they don't enjoy me. You know, it's weird.

[1007] I got friendly with Steve Martin, who's my comedy hero.

[1008] Yeah, I say in the book, me too, me too, yeah.

[1009] Yeah, I go, I didn't fashion my career after radio guys.

[1010] I wanted to be like Steve Martin.

[1011] I want to write a book.

[1012] I want to do a movie.

[1013] I wanted to do it all.

[1014] I was excited by it all.

[1015] And he was a guy who could do it all.

[1016] And my perception of Steve was like, oh shit, he's just a super funny guy.

[1017] It was so easy for him.

[1018] Again, you fall into that trap.

[1019] And when Steve came on the show And that's why I included him in the book He's talking about the struggle he had It is absolutely mind -blowing to me That he was a writer on The Smothers Brothers And couldn't even write an intro for them When they asked them to He couldn't come up with anything funny So he calls his friend who's funny And he says, can I borrow that joke of yours And give it to the Smothers Brothers And I was like, oh my God Steve Martin couldn't come up with a joke He has to work as hard as this At this as I do As every one of us Who tries to make people laugh He was one of the first revelations to me. The first time I got into big -time show business was Saturday Night Live, and I was, I don't know, 24.

[1020] And you get to Saturday Night Live, and they throw you right in the deep end.

[1021] And I showed up, kid, still going through puberty, I think.

[1022] And they said, go in and pitch Steve Martin, you know, your ideas.

[1023] I go into this room.

[1024] He's sitting there.

[1025] I had only known him as my idol and the guy with the arrow through his head and the extrovert.

[1026] Excuse me. excuse me, and the guy who changed comedy overnight, and I went in to the room, and I saw the most serious, almost seemingly depressed.

[1027] Professor -like.

[1028] Professor -like, yeah, professorial, kind of like, and I just was, and that was my first education, that people are not what they seem, and that some people, I got to spend a day with John Candy once, and he was the John Candy I wanted him to be, but Steve, I, at that moment, I saw, oh, I don't understand anything.

[1029] I'm just, I'm just beginning to get.

[1030] And he was an education, but he's another person.

[1031] My experience, though, going to his house for dinner, I sat there and I went, oh, I shouldn't have come here.

[1032] Steve's so brilliant.

[1033] Steve was being so fun.

[1034] Everything he says out of his mouth, he goes, that should be written down and preserved.

[1035] And I'm sitting there going, I'm not worthy of this.

[1036] Yeah.

[1037] You know, I'm just not, I'm not good enough.

[1038] And I remember Jimmy Fallon was there and Lord Michaels was there and all these, you know, brilliant people.

[1039] And it's just like, oh, now they see who I am, you know.

[1040] Now they see.

[1041] Because, you know, I have to work really hard at putting this stuff together.

[1042] It's, you know, but, but then I learned everyone else does too.

[1043] It's, it is, it is, no one is that naturally.

[1044] And everybody is looking at you the way you're looking at them.

[1045] Right.

[1046] So they're thinking.

[1047] And you're stunned by that.

[1048] You think, no, that's not possible.

[1049] Because you have, your camera's been going since you were born.

[1050] So you went through your childhood.

[1051] You had many, many years of no one knowing who you were and not giving shit.

[1052] Right.

[1053] You went through all your different pain.

[1054] And so it feels like an accident.

[1055] It feels like I'm here.

[1056] The rest of these people are supposed to be here.

[1057] And I'm not.

[1058] But I'm not.

[1059] And I saw that, you know, you started this interview, and I'm going to wrap this up in a second, because I don't want to take too much your time.

[1060] But you started it off by bringing up Harvard.

[1061] And that's the thing that I least like people knowing about me. I wish I could go back and people didn't know that I went to Harvard.

[1062] Because the truth is, I busted my ass to go there.

[1063] I'm not a gifted.

[1064] I'm terrible at math.

[1065] Wow, that's interesting.

[1066] So I was not good at math.

[1067] My math SAT, and I can prove that I took my own SAT, because I'm not a gifted.

[1068] I was, I'm terrible at math.

[1069] Wow.

[1070] That's interesting.

[1071] So I was not good at math.

[1072] I was not good at math.

[1073] And I can prove that I took my own SAT, because my math SAT sucked.

[1074] Now you have to prove it.

[1075] Yeah, yeah.

[1076] My verbal was good.

[1077] I didn't feel smart.

[1078] I've got a brother who's much smarter than me, and I felt unintelligent.

[1079] So I just grounded out in elementary school and high school.

[1080] And in a very unappealing way, I worked like a dog.

[1081] Was your goal to get to Harvard?

[1082] My goal was to get into a great school.

[1083] And so I grounded out, and I was creative, but I just worked and worked.

[1084] I would memorize textbooks.

[1085] I did what I had to do.

[1086] So I got in there, and when I got there, I immediately felt like I'm the fake.

[1087] I don't belong here, which is a common feeling there.

[1088] And then over time, I would look around, and it took me years, but I looked around and I thought, there's a lot of these people who have no emotional intelligence.

[1089] Right.

[1090] They don't know how to tie their shoe.

[1091] They don't know how to talk to people.

[1092] They don't know how to interact and be in the world.

[1093] Some are brilliant.

[1094] Some really aren't.

[1095] Wow.

[1096] And so I get out of Harvard and then people know that you went to Harvard.

[1097] And when I first got into comedy, there was an assumption.

[1098] I remember when I first got to late night show, people thought, oh, the only thing they found out is was Conan O 'Brien, a weird name, he worked for the Simpsons, went to Harvard.

[1099] And people said, oh, it's going to be like a Dick Cavett kind of.

[1100] Right.

[1101] And I thought, no. And then it becomes, oh, they can reduce you.

[1102] It's one of the easiest ways to reduce someone.

[1103] Oh, you went to Harvard, which means you probably come from a really rich family.

[1104] and you just were always smart and nothing was ever a problem for you.

[1105] Yeah, and I'm guilty of that too because I would think about you and I go, oh my God, that guy's so fucking smart and it's like, what is that really saying?

[1106] It was almost like you shouldn't even be in comedy.

[1107] You should be a doctor or something.

[1108] No, I used to get, I remembered once I think 60 Minutes was contemplating doing a piece on people that were from Harvard that went into comedy and it was going to be sort of like, you know, cancer would be cured right now if it weren't few people and I wanted to say I would make a terrible cancer research Or you should have automatically been successful in comedy if you chose that because you're so fucking smart.

[1109] As if comedy equates with that kind of math or science intelligence.

[1110] It's all it's all kind of crazy.

[1111] Yeah.

[1112] And I could see where people might even just look at you and think you have a chip on your shoulder because you went to fucking Harvard.

[1113] Who knows?

[1114] Right.

[1115] And you know.

[1116] But I think that that's what coming full circle because I, in my head is let Howard go.

[1117] He's done a full, you've been working all day all morning and I'm going to let you go.

[1118] go, but I think what is really nice for me as a long -time listener, long -time fan, short -time listener, however it goes, is that there's this nice evolution.

[1119] I think you can start at the beginning of your career and your career has been studied and will be studied, but people are going to go back and they're going to look at the stuff you did in the 80s.

[1120] They're going to look at the whole arc. They're going to look at from the late 70s all the way through.

[1121] They're going to look at the arc. And this book is a really nice place in the arc. But the whole arc is a thing to behold.

[1122] And I think that you should own that.

[1123] I think that's good advice.

[1124] I probably need to hear that.

[1125] Thank you for that.

[1126] Because again, it's my own shit.

[1127] You know, I'll have fans who say, you know, that was your best radio was the 80s or this or that or the other thing.

[1128] And I can't look at life that way.

[1129] As I say in the book, you have to evolve.

[1130] I point this out, the average age of our audience, the audience that listens to Sirius XM, 37 years old.

[1131] It listens to me now.

[1132] 37 years old.

[1133] Back in the 90s on terrestrial radio, average age of my audience, 37 years old.

[1134] And that to me means the show has to change.

[1135] It has to keep people's interest.

[1136] It has to change with the times and all of that.

[1137] I don't, it's not that that stuff was, I know what I was out to do.

[1138] I was out to entertain.

[1139] I was out to blow your mind.

[1140] I was out to be this unleashed id. All of those things.

[1141] And I do own it.

[1142] It's just that I can't stand to hear it.

[1143] Yeah, but you know what?

[1144] It's not your place.

[1145] You are the worst judge of your own work in some respect, meaning it's not your business.

[1146] As we started out in the beginning of the conversation saying, your job is to be you and do the work and love the people in your life and feel what you're feeling.

[1147] And this is your canvas and you've done that.

[1148] And that's your job.

[1149] It's not so much your job to say, this is the good stuff, this is the bad stuff.

[1150] This is what's resonating with you now, which is fantastic.

[1151] It's funny you say that because recently I had to make a will.

[1152] I changed my will and I was thinking about all this stuff.

[1153] And I said, just get rid of all of it, you know, destroy it.

[1154] That's in my will.

[1155] Just get rid of all of it.

[1156] All the shows, everything, just fucking burn it.

[1157] You know what I mean at some point?

[1158] Right.

[1159] But, you know, maybe you're making me rethink that.

[1160] Some of it's important.

[1161] I mean, some of it isn't.

[1162] But I guess as a whole, it's been one hell of a career.

[1163] Yeah, yeah.

[1164] It's been crazy.

[1165] It really has been nuts.

[1166] And I don't think in this whole world anyone was banking on me to someday be sitting here talking to you or perhaps, you know, becoming an announcer that had some success and then went on to this big career and they made a film of his life.

[1167] It just is unthinkable.

[1168] But this is a snapshot.

[1169] Yep.

[1170] And right now, if I was to say to you, and you didn't, you've never heard.

[1171] heard my show and I'd say, Conan, here's a book.

[1172] Howard Stern comes again.

[1173] This is what I've been able to do at Sirius XM.

[1174] This is what in my life I stand most proud of.

[1175] I was able to sit with some of the greatest people in the world from Paul McCartney, see ya, music, show business, and other people and say to them, hey, I'm going to ask you every question that I've been curious about and I revealed myself and I reveal these people and I think it is a glorious ride and yeah this is how I feel right now if I could just take this and hand it out to every person I would because this is who I am well you make no money if you hand it out so my advice you're like my publisher yeah let's get this in stores we handed out a bunch in Times Square the other day you know are you okay yeah did you get what you needed yeah I got what I needed and I have a technique I use on my show I'm interviewing so when it goes on.

[1176] It's long and everything.

[1177] And then I go, okay, listen, we got to wrap it up.

[1178] Let's review everything that just happened in the interview.

[1179] And then they feel like the interview is over.

[1180] We're reviewing now.

[1181] And then the best shit comes out.

[1182] Yeah.

[1183] Because now we're not in the show anymore.

[1184] Right.

[1185] Now we're just revealing.

[1186] What happened?

[1187] Let's review.

[1188] What happened?

[1189] What did we look?

[1190] What did you, what is your takeaway from this?

[1191] My takeaway is that, uh, you don't lie when you say you're germaphobe.

[1192] Right.

[1193] Because you, you, you put the, uh, the liquid jizz on your hand immediately.

[1194] Do you want some jiz?

[1195] No, I'm happy to have your germs.

[1196] I have a sponsor now.

[1197] He came up with jizz that goes on your hand and protects you up to eight to ten hours.

[1198] Has he proven that?

[1199] I'm accepting him at his word.

[1200] Then you're a fool.

[1201] I'm no scientist Conan.

[1202] I didn't go to Harvard.

[1203] I went to BU.

[1204] Oh, oh God, that's sad.

[1205] I'm sorry.

[1206] That's as good as I could do.

[1207] I was the worst student.

[1208] Oh my God.

[1209] Yeah, but that's, you know, I mean...

[1210] I didn't understand education.

[1211] I I wish I could go back.

[1212] Don't you want to go back now?

[1213] I do.

[1214] Because I would love, my sense of history is zero.

[1215] I lived in a horrible neighborhood.

[1216] The idea of education, you just survived.

[1217] The school that I went to was locked up by the government.

[1218] It's the only school in the entire country in the United States that is run like the prison system.

[1219] It's run by the state.

[1220] And so education, I would shit my pants when I walked into that building.

[1221] Was it going to live another day?

[1222] Right.

[1223] and you're fighting and this and that, if I could just do it over and understand if I could have understood how important it is, education, history, the science.

[1224] But you do that now.

[1225] The thing is you can do it all.

[1226] I'm playing catch up.

[1227] I went to an English teacher.

[1228] This is funny.

[1229] I met a guy who was talking to, and he tells me he's an English teacher.

[1230] I said, would you give me a syllabus?

[1231] I want to learn about first start with World War II, everything leading up.

[1232] And I gave him myself, and he started giving me books to read and I was like why did I waste so much time I feel like I wasted so much fucking time it's so negative that's what I'm when I'm when I'm wrapping up with you is to say that what I have taken away is everything has a negative I wasted so much time I didn't know I fucked up yes I wish I could do it again I and then I'll get you as your therapist your second therapist the one you don't pay I get you to say what a career, what an amazing ride.

[1233] I'm so proud of this book.

[1234] I wish I could be like that.

[1235] But you get there, but then you immediately backslide into, I wasted so much time.

[1236] I didn't read.

[1237] You're so right.

[1238] I was on the view yesterday.

[1239] Okay.

[1240] Perfect example.

[1241] Right before we were about to tape this, I was talking to Will Murray, who is the head rider on the show.

[1242] And I was saying, man, he says, oh, it's great on the view, you know.

[1243] It was really funny and blah, blah, blah, blah.

[1244] And you came out and you started talking about where's Julie Chen Moonbez?

[1245] Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, he loved all.

[1246] Yeah.

[1247] I said, oh, but I fucked up.

[1248] He goes, what do you mean?

[1249] I said, well, at one point, I'm sitting there on the view.

[1250] And I know all the Yentha's there, except they have one new Yenta.

[1251] And I'm talking to, talking to Whoopi, I'm talking to Joy.

[1252] It's going well.

[1253] Talking to Senator McCain's daughter there, Megan McCain.

[1254] And they got this new woman there, and she starts attacking me a little bit.

[1255] And, you know, I handled it.

[1256] And I said, I should have gotten up from the, the table, walked into the audience, sat down next to one of the guys there and said, okay, let's take a break, a breather, what just happened?

[1257] So far, I've got Whoopi.

[1258] Yeah.

[1259] She seems to be on my team.

[1260] She made no negative faces.

[1261] Joy Behar, I think I have her eating out of my hand.

[1262] Right.

[1263] Megan McCain, I complimented her father.

[1264] She's in love with me. What's with this one?

[1265] She's attacking me. Wait a second.

[1266] All right.

[1267] I collected my thoughts.

[1268] Let's go round two.

[1269] Like Muhammad Ali, I'm going back in the ring.

[1270] Yeah.

[1271] And now I was thought to myself, wow, if I had done that, I would have broken through the fourth wall.

[1272] I would have been talking to the audience at home.

[1273] I would have been analyzing what I was doing, right?

[1274] It would have been great fucking television.

[1275] And I blew it.

[1276] Yeah, you blew it.

[1277] I suck.

[1278] The whole thing suck.

[1279] The whole thing suck now.

[1280] So that's it.

[1281] And I relate to this because Paula Davis, who's came with me because she's, she's been with me 26 years.

[1282] Paula Davis?

[1283] I don't know Paula Davis.

[1284] Paula Davis is your biggest fan and just she came.

[1285] She's back.

[1286] She's back there.

[1287] Is that the woman you do the podcast with?

[1288] No, no, that's Sonom of Sessian, who's my real -life assistant.

[1289] Oh, so who's Paul?

[1290] Paula Davis is a booker on the show, and she's been with me, and she's a huge fan of yours, but I will talk to her every day, and she says, oh, my God, the relentless negativity in your head.

[1291] Oh, it's horrible.

[1292] And she says to me, it is unbelievable.

[1293] And I'm in therapy.

[1294] Yes, but.

[1295] What's going to be?

[1296] I say to my therapist, when are we going to fucking help me here?

[1297] Well.

[1298] I mean, he has.

[1299] Don't get me wrong.

[1300] But don't you admit, don't you admit that, you know, I would say if you want to analyze what we've looked at here, you want to wrap it up, I would say that you have to accept in some way that the negativity and the pain, some of it is the fuel.

[1301] Yeah, but how do you live like that?

[1302] You've found, you're figuring it out.

[1303] I'm doing it.

[1304] You're figuring it out.

[1305] You found, by the way.

[1306] My wife says, you found you, you found your, you know.

[1307] Beth is the opposite of me. Right.

[1308] She is just light.

[1309] I mean, she can get dark too, but, but she said to me, I've never met anyone so dark.

[1310] And I said, well, how can you love me then?

[1311] She goes, I just do.

[1312] Yeah.

[1313] You know, and it just makes me so grateful that somebody could care about me. She was watching, again, she watches the appearance on Jimmy Fallon the other night.

[1314] And she was watching it.

[1315] And she goes, oh, I'm so happy for you.

[1316] There's such a celebration of this book, and people just seem to really be getting it and enjoying it and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

[1317] And I was like, wow, somebody's happy for me?

[1318] Like, she's genuinely happy for me?

[1319] I'm just like...

[1320] But you know a lot of people are.

[1321] I don't know that.

[1322] Well, I'll tell you.

[1323] I think this book evokes jealousy.

[1324] I see it.

[1325] Where's this woman that you work with?

[1326] Who is she?

[1327] Paola Davis?

[1328] Yeah.

[1329] Do you think she's listening right now?

[1330] She's listening out.

[1331] She's back there.

[1332] She's listening.

[1333] Oh, she is?

[1334] Yeah.

[1335] And she thinks she thinks this went well.

[1336] Do you want to get a critique?

[1337] But is that us again being insecure?

[1338] What's just fine?

[1339] Paula.

[1340] Wait a second.

[1341] Why can't we own that this went well?

[1342] I think it went really well.

[1343] I was very, I was, I had a blast and I know that Paula.

[1344] Paula will be, this is Paula Davis.

[1345] Paula, hi Paula.

[1346] She is, she adores you.

[1347] Did it go well, Paula, in your opinion?

[1348] Amazing.

[1349] Will you tell Howard that every day I come into your office and I make you laugh really hard?

[1350] And then what do you say?

[1351] I say, what's the?

[1352] noise in your head.

[1353] I'm not going down this road.

[1354] This is relentless.

[1355] Who did this to you?

[1356] What happens?

[1357] Yes.

[1358] Oh, my God.

[1359] Oh, yeah.

[1360] Wow.

[1361] That's so important.

[1362] No, and it is every day.

[1363] She says the noise, I'm not going to do this with you.

[1364] You want me to hate you with you, and we're not going to do it.

[1365] Do you think everyone has this noise in your head?

[1366] I do think everyone has it.

[1367] They do, right?

[1368] We're not unique.

[1369] We're just exposing it.

[1370] You're, you guys have higher stakes jobs than us normal people.

[1371] So I think your noise might be a little bit louder and a little more relentless.

[1372] but I've come to believe that we all have it.

[1373] Yeah.

[1374] Because I know when I was a dishwasher, it was the happiest time of my life.

[1375] I loved washing dishes.

[1376] I just never really felt like I was, I felt actually, they told me I did a really good job and then I went home.

[1377] Right.

[1378] And I was okay with that.

[1379] Yeah.

[1380] I think, what you've done, Paula, and I think Paula has given us the button on this is, yes.

[1381] She is very emotionally intelligent.

[1382] And I love Paula.

[1383] She's been with me all through, through the highs and the lows, and she adores you.

[1384] She's so good at listening people and knowing people.

[1385] And she has sort of helped me a lot saying, you know, that tape you do where you hate yourself, and I've listened to you now for an hour and plus.

[1386] This is, there's an undertow.

[1387] It's like a wave that crashes, and you have this accomplishment, and then it pulls back.

[1388] That is what I hear in you.

[1389] That's what I feel in me. and I think that's what Paula picks up on.

[1390] Yeah, you know, you just made me think there's a wonderful woman who runs my company, Marcy, she, once in a while, when I get really fucking nuts, and when this book was coming out, I was like, I'm going fucking nuts.

[1391] I have to go on all these shows.

[1392] I'm going to go on these shows.

[1393] I'm going to disappoint everyone.

[1394] I'm going to go on Conan's podcast.

[1395] I'm going to disappoint him.

[1396] I'll go, I'm foul on this boy.

[1397] It's just horrible negative thoughts.

[1398] And she wrote down a series of reframes, which I never, you know, I thought, ah, what is that?

[1399] I started reading him, and she said, you know, And it was basically reminding me, you wrote this book because you really believe in this book.

[1400] You love, where is the love that you had for this book?

[1401] You wanted to talk about all these people in the book.

[1402] And I started to read them and I went, yeah, I got to hold on to that.

[1403] Yeah, yeah.

[1404] I got to not get sucked into, well, you know, guys in their problems.

[1405] How are you going to wrap it up?

[1406] I'm going to wrap it up by saying your job.

[1407] Okay.

[1408] Is to continue your journey.

[1409] Interesting.

[1410] Yeah, your job.

[1411] Dr. Conan.

[1412] See, this is the heart.

[1413] Harvard guy showing off his.

[1414] Your job is to continue doing what you're doing.

[1415] And I think if, I think you have moments.

[1416] I believe you have moments where you understand how much you've evolved.

[1417] And you can, even if it's just for a millisecond, you can say, good job, Howard.

[1418] Nice, nice job.

[1419] All right.

[1420] Nice job.

[1421] Then we're going to end on that.

[1422] We're going to end on that.

[1423] Nice job, Howard.

[1424] It's all good.

[1425] And by the way, job well done today.

[1426] I like you I like that sound I know you do I know what that means I know you do What does that sound mean I've seen you do that before That's usually when you have a hot female guest Yeah I go It's the last thing It's still okay in the Me Too era You're allowed to go You can do that You can still do it I always thought it was a bit much I'm okay When Howard Stern's telling you to back off It makes women uncomfortable Number of times Howard thank you This was an absolute joy Thank you Good luck with the podcast Thank you.

[1427] Love you.

[1428] God bless and La Chayem.

[1429] Hey, do you want to do some more review the reviewers?

[1430] Sure.

[1431] This is from Renee, EKD -87.

[1432] Conan is my Don Knott's.

[1433] When I was 11, I would sneak into the living room to press record on the VCR, so I never had to miss an episode of late night.

[1434] When I was 12, I got a homely white cat.

[1435] I loved him more than anyone in my family did.

[1436] I named him Conan.

[1437] Love the podcast.

[1438] That's nice.

[1439] Of course, I always go to the negative.

[1440] Oh, boy.

[1441] Do you?

[1442] She named a homely cat after me. Uh -huh.

[1443] So anyway, that can just...

[1444] Only white cat.

[1445] Homely white cat.

[1446] I had a white cat growing up.

[1447] What was its name?

[1448] Pebbles.

[1449] Oh.

[1450] And I named it.

[1451] I named it Pebbles.

[1452] And I got that cat when I was four years old.

[1453] Was that your cat or was that the family cat?

[1454] It was my cat.

[1455] I wanted a cat.

[1456] And my dad tells the story that I was maybe three and a half years old.

[1457] And he was driving in our 1960, Chevrolet Impala, and he was driving me somewhere, and I was so small that my feet just went straight out.

[1458] They didn't bend over the, you know, the seat.

[1459] My feet went straight out, and then I said, do you think I could maybe possibly one day somehow have a cat?

[1460] I had, I put all these, he said he was remazed that I had all these conditional, he started screaming at me. Oh, my God.

[1461] And the beating that ensued was memorable.

[1462] No, my dad.

[1463] got me the cat, we went to a shelter, and they got me a white cat.

[1464] And it was my cat.

[1465] And I remember really just thinking, wow, I'm in this massive family.

[1466] And nothing's really yours when you're in a big family.

[1467] But the cat was mine.

[1468] You know, I was my cat.

[1469] So, and I had that cat for a long time.

[1470] Did anybody else have their own pet?

[1471] Yeah.

[1472] We had two dogs and, well, this isn't funny.

[1473] This is really tragic.

[1474] But they, God, they were collies.

[1475] The first one was rule.

[1476] And he got out of the house somehow and took off.

[1477] And we lived right near a highway.

[1478] Oh, no. And he ran right under the highway and got killed in front of a Dunkin' Donuts.

[1479] And then we replaced him with another dog as a collie.

[1480] And his name was Raggles.

[1481] And the first chance he got, charged right to the same highway and committed suicide, just like the first one had.

[1482] And it made me think, oh, my God, at the time I thought they would rather die than live with us.

[1483] That's what I remember thinking.

[1484] They would rather die than live in this crazy family.

[1485] Oh, my God.

[1486] Yeah, and both in front of the Dunkin' Donuts.

[1487] Oh, God, that's awful.

[1488] I know.

[1489] It's terrible.

[1490] And you have the appropriate response.

[1491] Welcome to a very special Conan O 'Brien.

[1492] No, I just told you something about my life.

[1493] I had a cat.

[1494] We had two dogs that committed suicide in front of a Dunkin' Donuts rather than live another day in the O 'Brien house.

[1495] I had a turtle that ran away, and it felt like anywhere but there.

[1496] A turtle can't run away.

[1497] It was in the middle of the street walking in an Uber.

[1498] No, it was just in the middle of the street walking the opposite direction of our house Like anywhere but the gorleys Yes, well All my pets were happy What kind of pets did you have?

[1499] I had a hamster, we had two dogs You don't ever know if a hamster's happy They can't do anything They're like in jail and they've taken their belts And their shoes away They can't end their life, you know?

[1500] They do chew on the cage And try to break it Yeah, so you don't know They're listening to all the Armenian madness Going on your home No, that's not an okay I'm just saying your family There, I'm sure.

[1501] We're loud.

[1502] We're allowed.

[1503] Oh, God, you are very loud.

[1504] You came from a house with six kids.

[1505] You were loud, too, probably.

[1506] But you make more noise.

[1507] You alone, Sona, are louder than I think anyone I've ever met.

[1508] That could be true.

[1509] I mean, Sona will be on the complete other side of the office.

[1510] And we're in a big building on a soundstage, and I'll hear her talking so loudly.

[1511] Yeah.

[1512] And that's your, is that everyone in your family?

[1513] Your dad's not like that.

[1514] No, everybody's loud.

[1515] Your dad is not loud.

[1516] My dad is not loud.

[1517] My mom is loud.

[1518] Yeah, she's loud.

[1519] Okay, relax.

[1520] When I first met your mom for the first time, I hired you and I came out here in Los Angeles, and you brought your mother by the set of the show.

[1521] And she said something, I wish I could remember what it was.

[1522] It was sweet, but she said, I want to meet Amazing American Entertainer Man. Something like that.

[1523] She said something like, you rock the USA.

[1524] Yeah, I want to meet, man. Yeah.

[1525] I want to meet you.

[1526] You rock the USA, I think she said.

[1527] And it reminded me of no -ho Hank on Barry, something he would say.

[1528] You know what I mean?

[1529] Like, Barry, you know, you rock the USA.

[1530] I love your mom.

[1531] You know that.

[1532] I know you do.

[1533] She loves you too.

[1534] She thinks you're jacked.

[1535] What?

[1536] Sorry, last time that they saw you, they were like, Conan's been lifting weights.

[1537] He looks really buff.

[1538] I do.

[1539] I do work out a lot.

[1540] And you know what?

[1541] This has been a theme on the show.

[1542] Many times, whenever anyone makes a comment about how I'm kind of sexy or I look sexy, you guys go, ew, ew, your mom has sexualized me in her mind.

[1543] Oh, come on.

[1544] Oh, come on.

[1545] Did I go too far?

[1546] That's my mom, dude.

[1547] Oh, okay.

[1548] Well, I'm just saying, she's coming home and she's saying, she's saying to your dad, he's jacked.

[1549] Get out to the gym.

[1550] Why don't you look at gym?

[1551] You're trying to do an accent.

[1552] Yeah, why is Arnold Schwarzenegger?

[1553] What is that accent?

[1554] Well, her mom has an accent.

[1555] Does she not?

[1556] That's not like that.

[1557] That is not my mom's accent.

[1558] Get out to the gym.

[1559] Oh, my God.

[1560] Go to the gym.

[1561] And into the chopper.

[1562] Yeah.

[1563] Go to the chopper.

[1564] I hope there's a gym in the chopper.

[1565] Let's hope there's a gym inside the chopper.

[1566] Consider the divorce.

[1567] Gilmore Sessian getting the gym, so you jack like Conan.

[1568] Right?

[1569] Isn't that sort of what it sounds like at your house?

[1570] And then the gerbils in the corner trying to make a noose.

[1571] I want to get out of here.

[1572] I want to die.

[1573] Look at the...

[1574] Ramsster can't kill itself like...

[1575] Conan's dogs.

[1576] Should we go home?

[1577] All to our one home that we live in?

[1578] Yeah.

[1579] You know, our podcast house.

[1580] Just for you listening, yeah, we all live together and we sleep in a stacked bunk bed for three.

[1581] Triple bunk.

[1582] And when we snore, it's in unison like the three stooges.

[1583] When we get up in the morning, we all get out.

[1584] out at the same time and we go crashing to the floor and then I get up and go, come on, you lame brains.

[1585] All right, let's wrap this up.

[1586] We've got to get to our house.

[1587] Conan O 'Brien needs a friend with Sonam of Sessian and Conan O 'Brien as himself.

[1588] Produced by me, Matt Goreley.

[1589] Executive produced by Adam Sacks and Jeff Ross at Team Coco and Chris Bannon and Colin Anderson at Earwolf.

[1590] Special thanks to Jack White for the theme song.

[1591] Incidental music by Jimmy Vivino.

[1592] Our supervising producer is Aaron Blair and the show is engineered by Will Bechton.

[1593] You can rate and review this show on Apple Podcasts, and you might find your review featured on a future episode.

[1594] Got a question for Conan?

[1595] Call the Team Coco hotline at 323 -451 -2821 and leave a message.

[1596] It too could be featured on a future episode.

[1597] And if you haven't already, please subscribe to Conan O 'Brien needs a friend on Apple Podcasts or wherever fine podcasts are downloaded.

[1598] This has been a Team Coco production in association with Earwolf.