#1647 - Dave Chappelle

[0] Joe Rogan podcast checking out The Joe Rogan Experience Train by day Joe Rogan podcast by night All day Hello Joe, how are you?

[1] What's going on with your mask man?

[2] No, I just fucking with you.

[3] I just want to see how you react.

[4] Oh, this Rona talk.

[5] Oh, this Rona talk.

[6] Sick of it.

[7] Yeah.

[8] Headphones or no headphones?

[9] Oh, I'll do the phones.

[10] Okay.

[11] There you go.

[12] I just don't want to be the only one.

[13] No, that's all good.

[14] Hey, I turn them up right here?

[15] Yeah.

[16] Check, check, check.

[17] There we go.

[18] What's up, Fingers?

[19] He's over there, type, and every few minutes he goes like this.

[20] Let's go.

[21] Let's do this shit.

[22] So first of all, man, congratulations.

[23] You're the first guy to beat the system.

[24] You're the first guy to get fucked over by the system.

[25] Go public with it, and then get your money.

[26] I've never heard it happen before.

[27] I don't think it's ever happened before.

[28] Bro, I still can't wrap my mind around it.

[29] But I do have to shout out Chris McCorm.

[30] McCarthy over at CBS Viacombe.

[31] That guy, you know, when we were working this out, his approach was someone who was actually trying to resolve something.

[32] Came through.

[33] It was amazing, man. It's amazing.

[34] It's a happy ending.

[35] Because usually those artist gripes, they never get resolved, not to where the artist feels comfortable or happy with it.

[36] Right.

[37] They always feel bitter and angry.

[38] They got fucked over and someone else as a producer and they're making millions of dollars off of your work and they continue to sell it and make money off of it.

[39] Well, I could say With a high degree of honesty Not to say I was never angry about it But I don't think I was ever like bitter By this point of my life I wasn't bitter You would joke about it You were angry about it But not to the point where it fucked with your head But you would joke about it Well I mean you know You know the bottom line Is no matter what happens to you You gotta keep going You gotta keep going And bitterness is quite cumbersome Yeah, it's bad for you.

[40] Right.

[41] So, you know, jokes is a way of shaking that off or processing something with the alchemy of levity.

[42] Yeah.

[43] Holding grudges, bitterness, shit's very bad for you.

[44] It doesn't ever help.

[45] No, and now we're getting on an age.

[46] You know what I mean?

[47] When we were younger, it's fine to hold a grudge.

[48] You didn't realize that, you know.

[49] You didn't realize it was fucking with you.

[50] What is that an expression that's about, oh, it's about jealousy.

[51] The jealousy is the only poison that affects the container that's holding it.

[52] Right.

[53] That's exactly right.

[54] But bitterness, the same thing.

[55] Same thing.

[56] Yeah, it's not good.

[57] Yeah.

[58] It's just not good for you.

[59] You've got to be able to let shit go.

[60] Yeah, I mean.

[61] But in your case, you made a ploy.

[62] Like, you said what happened, how you felt about it.

[63] And they were like, he's right.

[64] I think, yeah.

[65] It's given the money.

[66] It wasn't a court of law.

[67] I don't believe I would have got anything.

[68] It's kind of amazing.

[69] In a court of law.

[70] I think in a court of public opinion, it was a good time for.

[71] me to say my peace and I and through the years it wasn't something that I would heart I mean I did interviews and stuff people would always ask me about it but it was something I was actually reluctant to talk about it was a lot yeah well it's hard for other people to relate to this idea that you want more money you know you're talking about regular people and you're saying this thing even though it is yours money is hard for people money is if if you look at life anything in life through the framework of money you'll you'll miss most of the picture Yeah.

[72] And, you know, in business, especially this stage in our careers, you realize through the years, people play incentives.

[73] You know what I mean?

[74] That if they incentivize a certain way, that's the way they're going to behave.

[75] So what they want is never really surprising how they get there is where all the surprises are.

[76] So I feel like I can forgive somebody for playing an incentive.

[77] It was disappointing, but what was so remarkable when I walked away from the show, right, is that it was against incentive.

[78] So people couldn't understand it at the time.

[79] It was so much money.

[80] How could you do that and blah, blah, blah.

[81] But you know, if I had taken that money and finished the show, well, it got the money, but I might never have been the same.

[82] I think it was one of the most gangster moves in the history of entertainment.

[83] And it made you a legend.

[84] And the fact that you then started doing shows like, I heard like Dave's doing a show in the park in Seattle.

[85] He's got like a box.

[86] He pulls out a speaker and just starts doing stand -up.

[87] That was in Portland, yeah.

[88] Because in that sense, it was freeing.

[89] Yeah.

[90] Something about, you know, I was geared a certain way growing up because I wanted to make it in show business.

[91] And boy, that shit fell all the way apart.

[92] And as far as I knew, my career was over.

[93] So where do you go from there?

[94] Yeah, but your career wasn't over.

[95] You just decided you were going to just sort of lay back for a while.

[96] In hindsight, yeah.

[97] But when it was happening.

[98] You really felt like it was over.

[99] I'd never seen these things before.

[100] I didn't see anyone else do this and get back up.

[101] I didn't see, you know, and the drumbeat is, he's crazy, he smokescrack, this, he's that.

[102] It was a wild, it was a wild experience.

[103] The way people close to you react to it, like I had failed or I'd ruined my life, you know.

[104] And then, you know, when you're cold, that phone don't ring that often.

[105] Right.

[106] And then I had over a decade of sitting in that choice.

[107] But I didn't languish in just that experience.

[108] I started doing stand -up for much better reasons than making it.

[109] I still enjoyed it.

[110] I started seeing the places where I was performing.

[111] Normally when you're, like, successful in comedy, you know, you get off the plane or the bus, you hit, do you do the hit?

[112] You go back to the hotel, you get back on the bus, you don't really see anything.

[113] You don't really, like even now, like this last run we did here in Austin.

[114] We was here for weeks.

[115] And then I got to see Austin.

[116] I got to find restaurants like.

[117] I met people that I probably called because I'm in town, stuff like that.

[118] And it was like that all over the world, not just the country.

[119] I started going around and just seeing the world.

[120] I got overwhelmed with this idea that none of my information was firsthand.

[121] I just read it in books or heard it from friends.

[122] and I was eager to just see something for myself.

[123] And I kind of entrenched this philosophy that my memories are some of the most valuable things that I have, these firsthand experiences.

[124] Can't take that away from if I reminisce on a nice day, then, you know, it feeds you.

[125] Remembering something that's neurologically almost identical I've read to experiencing it.

[126] Yeah, I think that there's a real value in having experiences where you do it on purpose, like you go someplace to have experiences and think about having those experiences.

[127] Because most of the time, you know, like you were saying, if we do shows, you just kind of show up, you do the show, and then you go home.

[128] But if you, like, set aside some days to do things, like, that's very valuable for your perspective, which is ultimately valuable for your act.

[129] It's valuable for everything, because you're choosing to take in more information and data specifically to enhance your perspective on life.

[130] Right, you learn things.

[131] You gain perspective, which is very valuable for a comedian and a person.

[132] And it's humbling and it's empowering at the same time.

[133] Yeah, because we know comics, like, that was a big theme during like the 90s, right, where comics would all tell the same stories about being on the road.

[134] There were all the jokes were about airplane travel and hotel food and that kind of shit.

[135] And the maid, do not disturb, knocking on your door, because that's what they related to.

[136] Right.

[137] The road warriors.

[138] Yeah, that was what, that's, that was their life's perspective.

[139] And it's, it kind of shows that experiences, interesting experiences are very valuable.

[140] But you don't think of them as valuable, you think of them as recreational, but they really are valuable.

[141] Right.

[142] And I call, you know, any, any information is valuable.

[143] I call it the expensive knowledge, right?

[144] It's like your buddy that's a war veteran or something.

[145] You don't want to know the shit he knows if you knew what he had.

[146] had to do to know these things that's what they call expensive knowledge i would not recommend quitting your show the way i did yeah if you can avoid it yeah but you but the way you did it was so cool because you know you kind of drifted off i promise i went trying to be cool it was it was a series of troubleshooting it's like fuck it man like what you're gonna do you got you got you got whatever you go through you got you got to you got to live you got to make a way and and find your happiness and you know I'm lucky I'm in this I'm in show business which is a pretty it's a multi -dimensional career path this thing could go a lot of ways yeah especially today oh my god yeah and another time would I've ever gotten that money I don't think so no because there would have been no social media no pressure right no dropping specials on the gram no you know no comment section no movement on .org no and if you had gone to say like the tonight show and made a pitch like that they probably wouldn't even aired it no of course not I had a grite with someone that owned the six of the media yeah yeah what I'm gonna do tell the media on them it's never gonna work right they would they would definitely edit that part out be like why's Dave section only four minutes long yeah edit it spin it whatever whatever it is they do but yeah but uh again you know all part I thought in repairing that situation and I don't want going all into what those conversations were like other than to say and this is not like I'm just happy because they paid me. It was class act.

[147] It was like.

[148] That's beautiful.

[149] It really was.

[150] It was very encouraging.

[151] That is very encouraging.

[152] I think that coming up behind us, these kids are going to be playing on a whole new ball game than we did.

[153] I hope so.

[154] I think there's more accountability now because of the internet because of people's ability to express themselves is so much different than it used to be.

[155] You can't just be some ruthless evil executives fucking over the artist like they did during the, you know, in the music business and I mean it's legendary.

[156] The music business is legendary if you're doing that.

[157] Man, look, first of all, we've got getting into this music business thing in a second, but I was looking on the internet, it was a bunch of waitresses talking about what celebrities did or didn't tip them.

[158] Nobody can fuck up anymore.

[159] It's true.

[160] Yeah.

[161] Yeah, they got a whole website dedicated to bad tippers.

[162] Yeah.

[163] All of a sudden, breaking news, Ellen DeGeneres is a bitch.

[164] What?

[165] What?

[166] You know, who knows?

[167] By the way, I like it on the line.

[168] I'm just saying.

[169] This is what we're faced with.

[170] Yeah.

[171] I don't know.

[172] Our personalities get yelped.

[173] Yeah.

[174] The thing is like, if you talk to enough people, you're going to have disagreements with people.

[175] And if someone accumulates, if they curate only those disagreements and only take it from the perspective of those people that you had problems with, they could paint you out to be a piece of shit.

[176] Even if you're a really nice person who just doesn't take any nonsense from people, if you talk to enough nonsense people, you're going to have enough conflicts.

[177] And if they only curate those conflicts and make like a compilation, like Dave talked to this guy and told them to eat shit.

[178] Well, that's why I usually don't do interviews.

[179] Because I feel like this is about fame in general.

[180] And I see you go through similar shit.

[181] It's like they blow you up.

[182] like a balloon and twisting all these wild shapes like a balloon animal.

[183] Yeah.

[184] Once you're in that thing, they can control the perception of you.

[185] So why fuck with it?

[186] Gaslighting.

[187] Yeah, the gaslight people.

[188] And, you know, again, people play incentives.

[189] I'll give an example.

[190] You know, I'm not, years ago, not that long ago, you remember when all those writings of Gandhi came out.

[191] They're like, all this really racist shit.

[192] Did you ever read this?

[193] I did, yeah.

[194] And you know the context of that.

[195] At the time he wrote those things, he was an attorney in South Africa.

[196] And South Africa had a racist legal system.

[197] And in order to be successful, you had to be a good racist.

[198] And he was just succeeding.

[199] I'm sure he wasn't writing all this nigger shit in India.

[200] I shouldn't have said that, but, you know, I forgot.

[201] I was on the internet.

[202] That's fun.

[203] Didn't Gandhi, there's people that were upset at him because he slept with a bunch of girls too, right?

[204] Didn't, like, tempt himself?

[205] Yeah, I think he tempted himself by sleeping.

[206] I think that was the way he described it.

[207] Like he would sleep with young girls?

[208] To tempt himself.

[209] Yeah, I think that was the...

[210] The evil, conneval of pussy.

[211] And now I will tempt myself.

[212] What the fuck is this?

[213] I think I'm remembering that correct.

[214] That's what I tell my wife.

[215] I'm going to a titty bar to tempt myself.

[216] He tortured himself.

[217] Tortured himself.

[218] He called it.

[219] Is that what he said?

[220] Yeah, let's get this right, because I actually revere Gandhi.

[221] Oh, fucking ad bloggers.

[222] Sexual torment of a saint.

[223] A new book reveals Gandhi tortured himself with the young women who worshipped him and often shared his bed.

[224] Daily male, so this has got to be true.

[225] He was killed by an assassin in 1946, huh?

[226] Wow.

[227] Well, that part was in the movie.

[228] about all this torturing himself.

[229] I didn't know was that.

[230] I thought it was later.

[231] And then they just show a picture of him walking with him.

[232] You know, we don't know.

[233] I don't know.

[234] But go back to what it said there.

[235] Gandhi, a London trained lawyer -turned guru was a ruthless cult leader who enslaved his followers with such bizarre sexual demands that it became difficult for many people to take him seriously even during his own lifetime.

[236] What?

[237] That crazy book.

[238] Oh, it claims.

[239] Gandhi naked ambition claims that Gandhi.

[240] One wrote a book called Gandhi, Naked Ambition.

[241] It goes so far as to suggest that the draconian practice is instituted by this iconic figure in the ashrams he founded prompted the perverted 20th century cults of Jim Jones in Jonestown.

[242] Okay.

[243] Okay.

[244] All right.

[245] Someone wrote this book.

[246] I look at Gandhi as a person that fought against white supremacy in his homeland.

[247] So there you go.

[248] Yeah.

[249] So you like to torture himself a little bit.

[250] I'm sorry.

[251] You like to lay down and get hard on.

[252] What's the big deal?

[253] I'm sorry.

[254] I brought that up.

[255] I didn't know naked ambition just at the stance.

[256] Jose Gandhi, what's it called?

[257] Yeah, but how would anyone know whether or not he tortured himself?

[258] Like, is that his writing say that?

[259] Does he talk about it openly?

[260] Did he like to just get blue -balled?

[261] Yes.

[262] Yeah, see, it's that, though, man. It's all this, like, you know, I hate the debunking of great legacies.

[263] Right, right, right, right.

[264] You know what I mean?

[265] Like, imagine how the whites might feel they tear down a civil war statue.

[266] This kind of thing to me is that.

[267] My equivalent of that.

[268] Like, oh, now we're debunking Gandhi.

[269] You know, it was really funny when they started tearing down statues.

[270] Trump was like, what are they going to do next?

[271] They're going to tear down George Washington?

[272] And everybody's like, well, that's ridiculous.

[273] They're not going to do that.

[274] And then they started tearing down George Washington statues.

[275] They tear down all the statues.

[276] I mean, George Washington did own slaves.

[277] He did.

[278] Yeah.

[279] Yeah.

[280] So did Thomas Jefferson.

[281] Yeah, yeah.

[282] Yeah, many of the framers.

[283] It's one of those things where it's, you shouldn't revere what they did, but what a statue is supposed to represent is here's an image of some person who's historically significant in establishing the country.

[284] Doesn't mean.

[285] Right, that's the analogy.

[286] To me, Gandhi fought against white supremacy and was very successful, and then decades later, start tearing a statue man. Yeah, the worst thing he did was get hard on.

[287] Yeah, I mean, you know, lay there and get tortured.

[288] Yeah, I'm not, yeah, now I'm not trying to put no value judgment on any of this shit.

[289] I'm just saying he did expel the British peacefully.

[290] Yeah.

[291] Which was unprecedented in the world, a peaceful expulsion of oppressors.

[292] Yeah.

[293] It's interesting how peaceful protest, like peaceful protest resonates for years and years and years.

[294] And when someone does something signaling, like remember that image, I'm sure you do, of that, there's a video of it, of a, of, a monk in Vietnam, lighting himself on fire to protest against the war.

[295] It's on the cover of one of the Rage Against Machine albums.

[296] Yeah, that was crazy.

[297] Crazy.

[298] Everybody remembers that.

[299] Yeah, there was another guy who did that underneath the window of the Pentagon here in the United States during the Vietnam War.

[300] Oh, did he?

[301] Yeah, white fellow.

[302] I can't remember his name.

[303] That's a way to go.

[304] That's a crazy way to go.

[305] But Gandhi didn't call it a peaceful protest.

[306] He called it civil disobedience, the idea being that I will not participate.

[307] In my own oppression.

[308] It's a fine idea.

[309] It's a good idea.

[310] Yeah.

[311] Why would anybody concentrate on the hard odds?

[312] Yeah, yeah, you know what I mean?

[313] Yeah, yeah.

[314] Gandhi got so much pussy this.

[315] Let me tell you about this Gandhi you fuck with.

[316] He didn't even do anything.

[317] He just laid there.

[318] Yeah, that's that.

[319] That's a weird move, though.

[320] What, they're just laying there?

[321] Just laying there and get hard and go like, beat it, bitch.

[322] Go on get some sleep.

[323] That's crazy.

[324] I think that I don't know, man. I don't know where this culture is headed.

[325] I don't know what the fuck everybody's doing anymore.

[326] It's COVID year.

[327] Like, I'm a little packed away.

[328] You know, I've been out.

[329] It's doing something to us collectively.

[330] Like, we talked about this the last time I was here, and I told you I was going to come to the show.

[331] I wasn't bullshit.

[332] And remember that day, I said, I'll come after the inauguration.

[333] Yeah.

[334] Because we all smelled that coming.

[335] Yeah.

[336] It's a tough one.

[337] It's a weird one.

[338] We're being tested.

[339] It's testing the foundations of our culture, the foundations of our civilizations, testing how well we can be peaceful with each other and make sense and get along and how much we value getting along with each other and how much there's just so much divisiveness because we've never been, there's never been a time in history where the whole economy and the whole society basically just got frozen for a year and stuck in some weird weird sort of side patch where we had to figure things out fresh and people lost like how many people lost their jobs how many people lost their lives how many people lost their grandparents their loved ones that's right yeah it's it was a weird fucking year and everybody's very sensitive and everybody's quick to pull the trigger and then you got everybody who's there's so many people that have just been online all day long this whole year and that's not good for you i still think at the core of all of this uh this what you call weirdness is is these profound trust issues you know it's like i said on let them and these people that that hoarded toilet paper and and you know went and bought bullets out and you know this none of these things are good signs i think that something about the nature of covid punched us square in our american identity we're individualists we you know the the the The mask and all these things, I don't think are actually oppressive, but I can see why Americans would feel they are.

[340] Yeah.

[341] They just don't trust the messenger anymore.

[342] There's too many mixed signals.

[343] It's hard.

[344] In the beginning, when Fauci was saying you don't have to wear a mask, and then eventually they were saying you got to wear a one.

[345] That was a huge mistake.

[346] I agree.

[347] Yeah.

[348] If you give people information, it may not be true, even if you have the intention of having them behave in a way that's beneficial for everybody, The misinformation, the way you achieve these things, the separation from ends and means can be a profound problem if you're managing something like a nation of 300 plus million people.

[349] We need to be able to trust the institution.

[350] So now you'll hear Americans say, like, they should fix this, they should fix that.

[351] But in reality, the idea is we are they.

[352] Nobody feels that way right now.

[353] Well, we did before.

[354] I think people had faith in the government, in the sense that worst case scenario even if they're incompetent everything will stay together now you realize no no it doesn't have to stay together it can be irreversibly fucked like I think some of our cities are right now I think there's some there's some sections of LA I don't know how the fuck they're going to bounce back you drive down the street and you see everything boarded up you go how does this come back how long does it take is it take a year is it take 10 years like what is what is this and I have no point of reference to even make an educated guess I've never seen any of this before.

[355] Nobody has.

[356] I'll tell you, like, okay, so my experience during COVID, I live in Ohio, I don't live in a cost distance from anyone I don't know.

[357] You know what I mean?

[358] It's open space.

[359] So we were isolated, but it wasn't a press.

[360] I could go outside, I could take a walk, I could, whatever.

[361] I go to New York, I was telling you, maybe a couple weeks ago when they opened all the comedy clubs back up.

[362] You know, just to show support for the clubs that nurtured, you know, my career early on.

[363] And it was, It was a tough one.

[364] I'd been there before, like the Saturday Live week.

[365] That week was, you know, unseasonably warm.

[366] Biden had just won that weekend, so people were celebratory.

[367] This time around, I got a sense of the emotional carnage that happened in that city.

[368] And it was significant.

[369] It was probable.

[370] Like, you would notice it.

[371] I did.

[372] And to hear them say, it's like, things are getting better.

[373] And I was like, better.

[374] Because I hadn't seen New York since it was, like, incredible.

[375] healthy.

[376] You know, in a non -COVID time, I've heard a $2 trillion economy just in the five boroughs in New York.

[377] I don't know what's going on there now.

[378] You know, restaurants open limited capacity, people, it takes courage just to go to a coffee shop or this, that, or the other, especially with this, this problem of trust being in deficit.

[379] Yeah.

[380] It's just a tough one.

[381] Well, it's also a lot of people are moving out.

[382] When people are moving out, you get the sense, like it's an abandoned ship.

[383] Like, it's a sinking ship.

[384] And then people don't want to invest money in it.

[385] They don't know what to do.

[386] They're not sure if they should stay.

[387] They start looking at other states where things are open.

[388] Maybe we should just move.

[389] Maybe we should forget about this business and start fresh in Florida or move to Texas or whatever.

[390] Yeah, I can't imagine New York City not coming back from this.

[391] It'll come back.

[392] It just won't come back the same.

[393] It's going to be different.

[394] It's going to take a long time.

[395] You think anything will be the same after that?

[396] It'll take a minute, bro.

[397] It'll take a minute.

[398] It'll be a new normal, though.

[399] Well, even Austin, like, it's not the same.

[400] It's actually bigger.

[401] It's growing.

[402] This city grew, I'm sure.

[403] I'm sure a lot of people from the Bay moved here for the tech job.

[404] Yep.

[405] The weather's good.

[406] Yep.

[407] The restrictions on is oppressive.

[408] People are nicer, too.

[409] That's the big one for me. My feelings here are different.

[410] I feel of less anxiety here.

[411] I feel like people are nicer They're genuinely friendly But do you think that people are nicer Do you think the circles you were rolling in In California weren't as nice No, it's just general regular people that you meet Like there's a guy in my neighborhood I look forward to wave into this guy every day He's an old dude who works on his lawn And this motherfucker will wave at everybody who drives by He's there digging and see the car It's like No, that's hilarious And every day I see that guy I get ready I get ready I'm gonna wave to my friend I see him like he waves at me make a little eye contact.

[412] It feels good.

[413] I never got that in California.

[414] Nobody ever stopped from digging in their lawn to look up and wave at you at every car that passes by.

[415] This guy waves at every car.

[416] That's sweet.

[417] It's sweet.

[418] How old is this guy?

[419] Probably 70s, 80s.

[420] Okay.

[421] Older fella.

[422] If it's a guy my age, it'd be weird, though.

[423] What's happening?

[424] Nobody wants to see that shit.

[425] Yeah, that's a little odd.

[426] He's a little too friendly.

[427] Call the police.

[428] Yeah, 20 -year -old kids doing laundry.

[429] Out there waving at everybody.

[430] hilarious yeah no it's it's age appropriate but he's uh it's just there's friendly people out here man there's less of them people value people when they're not a burden when you get to you know 20 million people whatever the fuck l .a is people uh they lose their value they become annoying there's too many of them in the highway in front of you there's too many of them around you you know well let me ask you this what what is the mechanics of your daylight is your day mechanically the same as LA, minus the comedy obviously is COVID.

[431] But I would imagine you work out a few hours a day, no matter where you are.

[432] You do your show a few hours a day if you're here or there.

[433] You kick it with your wife a few hours a day.

[434] Even the kids.

[435] What else do you do here that you don't do there?

[436] It's just quieter.

[437] It just feels better.

[438] It feels better.

[439] It feels better.

[440] It feels better.

[441] Like, I just like I like the vibe of the city better.

[442] How so?

[443] It's like, no one's trying to be famous here.

[444] There's a thing in Hollywood, even if you're not a person who's in show business, maybe you had an ambition and you abandoned it.

[445] Or maybe you think, like, now because of reality shows and because of social media, maybe you don't even have to be famous for your talent.

[446] You just have to be famous.

[447] Like, look at the Kardashians and a lot of people that are famous just for being famous.

[448] Like, there's a weird, there's a weird currency in having a lot of people know who you are.

[449] There's a social status to that that exists in L .A. that is primary.

[450] That's very true.

[451] It's above all.

[452] All right, well, let me say this.

[453] First of all, when I remember meeting you in the 90s, this thing never really seemed to affect him.

[454] You seem serious about comedy.

[455] I had heard whispering that you did kung fu.

[456] You know, but you weren't like a, you know, you weren't like a, you.

[457] You were social with all the comedians, but you weren't like the hangout kind of guy.

[458] You were always off doing your own thing.

[459] And even this podcast, even though it grew to be a big thing when it started, I don't even think you would start it with the intention I'm going to blow this motherfucker up.

[460] You just did it.

[461] Yeah, there was never a thought of blowing it up.

[462] It was just silly.

[463] There's a video, it was a funny video that was in the Comedy Store documentary, Tom Segura, leaving my house, talking about leaving my house and talking to Red Band, saying, what is he doing?

[464] Why does he do this?

[465] And he's like, I don't know.

[466] He just, he wants to do it all the time.

[467] He wants to do this stupid fucking podcast that no one's listening to.

[468] Yeah, it's dope.

[469] It's dope.

[470] I mean, but at that time, and even still, the way I remember L .A., it's winter circle.

[471] Yeah.

[472] And earlier in my career, like, if you're doing well in L .A., like, now it's fun as far out there.

[473] You know, all the ropes open up and, oh, Mr. Chappelle, and they accommodate you expertly because they're so proficient with hospitality.

[474] Yeah.

[475] But if you're not doing good.

[476] I didn't remind you just as quick.

[477] Yeah, it makes you feel bad.

[478] It makes you feel bad.

[479] I've seen people, the look on their face when you pass through the line, and the security guard goes, oh, come on, come on up here.

[480] And the other people that are waiting, they watch you walk through.

[481] They feel terrible.

[482] Oh, God, I hope not.

[483] Because I do it all the time, I'm a rope -crossing motherfucker.

[484] No more waiting for me. But you know what I'm saying?

[485] Like, for those people that are in that line to be that person that gets called to the front of the line, and the doors just open.

[486] and they grab that velvet rope.

[487] Oh, Mr. Chappelle.

[488] Right, flagrant elitism.

[489] Yeah, they love it.

[490] They love it, and they wish it was them.

[491] Yeah.

[492] And they want to be hanging with you?

[493] Maybe if I'm hanging with Dave, I'll get through that rope.

[494] Yeah.

[495] I'm with Dave.

[496] Oh, oh, you're with Dave.

[497] Come on then.

[498] I told you the first time I met Denzel Washington, and the guy did that to him.

[499] He came with my table.

[500] Like, you know, Dave, I hate to bother you, but Denzel Washington is here.

[501] Would you like to meet him?

[502] I'm like, oh, my God, yeah.

[503] And he brings me out with the table.

[504] Wow.

[505] Denzel Washington is.

[506] Dave Chappelle.

[507] I'm like, oh my God, he's Denzel very gracious, and then the guy goes and my name is, I'm like, oh, this motherfucker didn't know him either.

[508] He used me. It is wild out there.

[509] That's hilarious.

[510] It's wild out there, man. Yeah, it is wild.

[511] There's social climbers in L .A. It's an art form.

[512] They're skilled.

[513] They know they know how to do it.

[514] I think I moved to Ohio initially to be free of these feelings you describe.

[515] Yeah.

[516] This idea that you know, I started so young that I didn't know how to untether the rest of my life from those interests.

[517] And geography was the quickest life hack.

[518] I love the way you talk about Ohio.

[519] I really do.

[520] I've always loved it.

[521] I love the, you do a lot of things that I think are awesome.

[522] Man, thanks, bro.

[523] It's just you've always been a kind person, despite all of your success, all the accolades all the all the love that you get you've never let it never let it turn you into someone who felt like you were better than other people like I've seen you the way you interact with the door people at the store that to me is everything right how do you how do you treat the door staff how do you treat the bartender are you friendly with all those folks you know and if you're not man you're kind of missing the whole point like you can make someone's day just by being cool that's what always makes me laugh about punky yes she was she was a she was a The last time I saw her, she was a barback.

[524] Now she's on SNL.

[525] And the next time I saw it, she was rehearsing at SNL.

[526] It made me feel real good for her.

[527] She's amazing.

[528] And I thought of all the comedians that might treat the barbacks like shit to be.

[529] You better be careful.

[530] Yeah, right.

[531] Security, Idris Elba, the famous actor, used to be a security guard.

[532] Really?

[533] Yeah, yeah.

[534] You asked me. He used to buy weed from him.

[535] You know, you used to buy weed from Idris Elba?

[536] Yeah, yeah.

[537] I don't know if I should talk about it.

[538] Yeah, you could talk about it.

[539] I did.

[540] It's legal now in New York.

[541] Yeah, yeah.

[542] You know, he had a kickboxing fight.

[543] He's a legitimate.

[544] I heard he's nice with it.

[545] Oh yeah, he's good.

[546] And he fought a good guy.

[547] Like, it wasn't a bullshit fight.

[548] It was a fight.

[549] It wasn't like he went out there and just knocked this guy with one punch.

[550] They were scrapping.

[551] Oh, yeah, it's a good fight.

[552] And he trained for a long time.

[553] Like, this, pull up some video footage of Idris Elba hitting a heavy bag.

[554] This I got to see.

[555] Idris Elba's got skills.

[556] He trains hard.

[557] And he, I think he did it for a television show.

[558] So I think they documented his training.

[559] And he trained for quite a long time.

[560] And, you know, Moitai's, that's a fucking brutal way to fight, kicking legs and...

[561] Is that the shit that they do in Thailand?

[562] Yeah, that's the shit they do in Thailand.

[563] I went to the Moitai fights in Thailand.

[564] Oh, look at it.

[565] Yeah, he's getting after it.

[566] So he would train at this, like, legit Muay gym, and you watch him.

[567] I mean, if I saw him about to fight in the UFC, I'd go, well, fucking...

[568] Not a good move.

[569] Look, yeah, you got dropped there.

[570] like he's training he's doing real I mean he's getting his legs kicked the whole deal and you could tell that this is uh you know they're not cutting any corners he's doing the hard work the real hard work man I came across here's his fight so he had like a fucking real fight oh it's a real fight man a real Muay fight I mean they were getting after it does it show in the fight oh so there's a whole documentary on it if you think about most actors you know too I don't know that they got this kind of grit or humility to possibly get their ass whooped inside of everybody.

[571] That's the thing.

[572] I mean, every human being you get knocked the fuck out, right?

[573] We saw that with Jorge Mazvedal.

[574] Jorge Mazvedal when you got knocked out by Usman, Mazvedal had an iron chin his whole fucking career.

[575] He'd only been like dropped a couple of times and he was fine every time.

[576] Like dropped by big guys like Darren Till dropped him but I mean he's one of the best strikers in the sport and then when Usman flatlined him everybody's like Oh, shit.

[577] Everybody can get knocked out.

[578] The human brain, the human body, the way your face is constructed, it's just not designed to get punched.

[579] So look at this, right here.

[580] That could have easily killed.

[581] That would have dropped me. Yeah, a good shot.

[582] I mean, he's got good defense, though.

[583] He fought well.

[584] He did everything well.

[585] And it was a good fighter alive at the press conference.

[586] But that shit, forget it.

[587] Yeah, it is a real fight.

[588] They're showing in slow motion.

[589] It's hard.

[590] Fighting's hard.

[591] It's hard.

[592] It's hard not to look sloppy.

[593] You know, it's hard, hard to look perfect.

[594] To get to a point where you're looking like, you know, Andre Berto, or Floyd Mayweather, you know, you got to, it takes a long fucking time to develop that kind of timing and poise and movement.

[595] A lifetime.

[596] Yeah, forever.

[597] So what he did, though, is it shows character that he took that chance.

[598] That's a rare person.

[599] Well, my kid was young, my youngest son, he got really in the box and he used to take him down a wild card.

[600] Really?

[601] In Hollywood, we were in LA.

[602] And he trained with Justin Jucco and Shia.

[603] shit like that.

[604] Jugo is a great trainer because he'd make everything fun for my son.

[605] And my son got really into it.

[606] And one day, he was young.

[607] He's like, I want to spar somebody.

[608] So they put him in the ring with this, like his top amateur contender.

[609] Little guy, but, you know, he was nice with it.

[610] And my son and his little child talk was like, I'm going to fuck this guy up.

[611] I know you're not.

[612] They got in there, and, you know, he did all right.

[613] But the gym got real amped.

[614] And I remember one of the fighters came over to me and was like, this thing your son has, you can't train that.

[615] You're either this way or you're not.

[616] Like he was, this, this tenacity he had.

[617] So I always thought about that.

[618] You can't train that.

[619] You either this way or you're not.

[620] Well, some people, they can get better at it.

[621] You can get better at tenacity.

[622] You can get better at mental strength.

[623] It's not totally innate.

[624] Like, some people are just born with it, though.

[625] Some people are ferocious from the jump.

[626] Where did you fall in that spectrum?

[627] I don't remember because it took, it was so long ago, but I always had, I always had unusual power because I have a weird frame, like a very large hands for my body and have wide shoulders and I can generate a lot of force.

[628] And so the problem with that is I would load up and it took me a long time.

[629] What do you mean load up, I'm sorry?

[630] I would try to knock people out all the time.

[631] Those all, like, this is most Taekwondo tournaments, like a lot of, they get, they, most of the fights are won by points, they're won by decision.

[632] I won most of my fights by knockout, a lot of them by knockout.

[633] I mean, maybe not most of them, but I was always trying to knock someone unconscious.

[634] What does it feel like to knock somebody?

[635] Is it satisfying?

[636] Does it scare you at all?

[637] It's, uh, it's shocking and it doesn't feel good.

[638] It never feels like, like, great.

[639] I would pretend it felt great.

[640] I'd be like, yeah, but meanwhile, I was like, what the fuck?

[641] Part of me would be like, what the fuck?

[642] It's always felt weird.

[643] There was one time that I never recovered from when I was 19 years old.

[644] I fought in Anaheim, California, flew out here to fight in the nationals, won my first fight.

[645] Then I won my second fight.

[646] I was fighting this kid, and I was there with just me and my friend Junkick.

[647] He was coaching me. He was cornering me. And this guy, they had their whole team with them, and there's all these people in the stands that were.

[648] I remember saying, come on, Johnny, get him, Johnny, get him, Johnny.

[649] And I knew this dude was just a little slow.

[650] And he was doing some things, and I was seeing some openings.

[651] And I hit him harder than I've ever hit anybody in my life.

[652] I hit him with a wheel kick, which is, I hit him so hard.

[653] I was limping for a couple days afterwards because my heel hurt from hitting his head.

[654] And I flatlined him.

[655] He faced planted.

[656] He started snoring, and he never got up.

[657] They carried him off in a stretcher.

[658] He was unconscious for half of him.

[659] hour and they eventually carried him off put him in stretcher brought him to the hospital but he literally never stood up and walked around and uh that's scary it scared the shit out of me and then i went back the dude i didn't know the dude he was from chicago i was from boston and we just met in california that's what's weird about boxes like beating somebody up that you're not angry at right it's wild thing to think about it is wild yeah they do it all the time you know a lot of mma fighters they're good friends up until the, you know, a lot of them train together, and then they go and they fight.

[660] But I went back to my instructor, and my instructor was a hard man. It's a Korean dude who had been taught by General Cheyung Yi, who's the original founder of Taekwondo, who used to train troops in Vietnam.

[661] And this guy was hard.

[662] And when I went back and told Mr. Kim, I said, you know, we were talking about the tournament.

[663] He goes, I heard you had a really good knockout.

[664] And I said, it was very scary.

[665] I go, uh, made me nervous.

[666] I go, because he never got up.

[667] I mean, I thought he was dead.

[668] And he goes, sometimes they die.

[669] Wow.

[670] And then he walked away.

[671] Wow.

[672] And then I was like, oh, shit, they is me. Yeah, how old were you then?

[673] 19.

[674] Jeez.

[675] And that was the decline of my taekwendo career from that moment on.

[676] My fighting career, I fought for a couple more years, but I lost a lot of my enthusiasm with that one.

[677] fight.

[678] Did the fighting and the stand -up overlap?

[679] They overlap for three kickboxing fights.

[680] I had three kickboxing fights while I was doing comedy and I wasn't I wasn't committing 100 % to either one of them.

[681] I was I was half in with both and then I realized I couldn't do it anymore and I actually got told by a dude who was an open micer he actually like said something that was so true I couldn't even argue with him he goes yeah he goes you started out pretty funny he goes but he got you lost steam somewhere along the line and I remember looking at him going fuck he's right wait wait in what context did he say this talking about comedy like who's getting good who's getting bad we were all like a year in you know we're all struggling and uh we were sitting around talking about oh this guy's really funny and that guy's really he's like yeah he started out pretty good but seemed like you lost steam really he wasn't even being mean to me he was just being honest what was he seeing i just wasn't as i was it wasn't as into it because i was still fighting i was still doing both things and i was still teaching I was still teaching at Boston University.

[682] I taught a course.

[683] So you started stand -up in Boston.

[684] Yeah.

[685] That's a weird circuit.

[686] It's a good circuit.

[687] It's a great circuit.

[688] It's an anomaly.

[689] It was a good place because it was, they have no tolerance for bullshit.

[690] Like, there's no dilly dallying up there.

[691] They want punchline, set up punchline, set up punchline, bang, bang, bang.

[692] They want entertainment.

[693] That Don't be late.

[694] Don't be late.

[695] Don't Gavin, Lenny, Steve Sweeney.

[696] Yeah, man, I remember when I was a kid, I used to catch a train up to Boston and work out with these cats.

[697] Yeah.

[698] And it was the first circuit I'd ever seen guys making like six figures and never leaving their city.

[699] It trapped them.

[700] They would go to bars and shit and you'd think they played for the Celtics or something, like the town embraced the local comedians.

[701] Like they were stars in Boston.

[702] Oh, yeah.

[703] Like nothing else.

[704] There's no other comparison to any other city that's like that.

[705] What was the guy he should drink all the time?

[706] Teddy Bergeron.

[707] Oh, yeah.

[708] You know him?

[709] Oh, yeah.

[710] Well, when he was in it, he was a beast.

[711] Teddy Bergeron had one Tonight Show set that was so fucking brilliant.

[712] It was so brilliant.

[713] And then apparently he got fucked up on pills and booze, and they made him stick around.

[714] But he came back, and he was so fucked up on drugs that it, like, tanked his career.

[715] So he had this one set that was magic.

[716] And he watched that set.

[717] You're like, my God, that guy might be the best comic alive.

[718] He was so smooth.

[719] I remember opening for him.

[720] He was so smooth.

[721] He was so good.

[722] He was so good.

[723] He was such a smart guy, too.

[724] Such a good writer.

[725] But, you know, success in the demons, I mean, that's why one of the things that's very impressive to me about people like you that manage the success and it doesn't change your personality.

[726] Whatever anxiety comes out of all the pressure and all the people paying attention to what you're doing, you got it, you roll.

[727] You roll with it and you handle it.

[728] But some people don't, you know.

[729] You know, it's, it's, that scrutiny, being that, the object of attention is crippling for some people.

[730] I think early in my career, I, it was, I didn't know how to handle that.

[731] You know what I mean?

[732] I was a kid.

[733] I was immature.

[734] It was, it was a weird thing.

[735] But you still handled it well.

[736] Even though you didn't know how to handle it, you figured it out.

[737] Like, you did it.

[738] It was a struggle, but you did, you never became an asshole.

[739] No, no. You never fell apart.

[740] I think life is too just humiliating.

[741] of a practice you know what I mean no matter how you feel about you say you give me more and take that first shit of the day you're a person yeah yeah oh yeah fingers is like gross no it is true it's true it's true yeah I mean the more things that I do that are humiliating or humbling humbling's probably better word more things I do that are humbling the better it is for me well the thing I like about your comedy origin story like I was fighting I was teaching he said and I was doing stand -up I didn't commit to all of them but now that sounds like the recipe for everything you do well the things I do now they enhance the other things it's like if I'm doing a podcast I think it enhances my stand -up could it enhances my perspective the more people I can talk to the more ideas I can take in more conversations I can have with people I get a better understanding of people like I'm building a mountain out of layers of paint like every day I'm getting a little bit more understanding of people a little bit more understanding of myself you got a broad base man like You know, I see you talking to people like Malcolm Gladwell.

[742] I read his books.

[743] It would intimidate me to just chop it up with him.

[744] He's a good dude.

[745] He's easy to talk to.

[746] He seems like a good dude.

[747] I don't know him at all, but he's a brilliant dude.

[748] You are a brilliant dude.

[749] But it's just weird.

[750] It's weird that I know you.

[751] You know what I mean?

[752] It's just so strange.

[753] I think back when we were all so young, nobody knew if we were going to make it, not make it, this, that, or the other.

[754] And what our career has evolved into.

[755] And I use the word evolved very specifically in your case, because none of it was obvious.

[756] No. And the MMA thing, it's not obvious.

[757] This podcast is not obvious.

[758] And these things were what made you, you know, a multi -million dollar player.

[759] I mean, we all, sitcoms, that's like the obvious shit.

[760] We all did that shit.

[761] Yeah.

[762] But you found your lane, and it's a really hard thing to do.

[763] I've just been lucky that I've always listened to my own instincts in terms of, like, what do I enjoy doing?

[764] Whether or not it's a good career move or not, I enjoy.

[765] doing it.

[766] Like, the early days, MMA wasn't a good career move at all.

[767] Like, the people that I was working with on news radio, they would talk to me about it like I was doing porn.

[768] They were like, why are you doing this?

[769] You're going to Alabama to do some cage fighting commentary?

[770] Like, what the fuck are you doing?

[771] Back then I wasn't even doing commentary.

[772] I was interviewing fighters.

[773] I was just interviewing them.

[774] I was the guy who had interviewed the fighters after the fight was over.

[775] Would you call fights?

[776] No, I didn't call fights until 2001.

[777] That was the first time I called.

[778] qualified 1997 I was just the interviewer I was it I did it for a couple years and I enjoyed it but it was just like it was just fun to be there was cool I would just fly into these weird places like you know right with Dothan Alabama you know like weird little spots you'd obviously never go to otherwise and that MMA that MMA thing was just kind of starting out I remember I didn't see you know I started seeing like the Horace Gracie fights and shit like that in the early 90s yeah started doing the Shamrock was another Yeah, 93 is when it started.

[779] Yeah.

[780] Yeah, I came around in 97, so I was doing, I did it 97 and 98, and then I couldn't do it anymore.

[781] It was costing me money.

[782] Like, I could make more money doing a club for a weekend, a comedy club than I could, doing these gigs.

[783] And then, you know, I just decided, I was just going to stay a fan, just watch it from before.

[784] I did it.

[785] I did the little interview thing.

[786] It was fun.

[787] And then the UFC was purchased by the Fortitas, and Dana White and I became friends because I was on Fear Factor.

[788] he gave me free tickets to come to the fights.

[789] That's when no celebrities really knew what it was.

[790] And so if you could get a celebrity to sit up in front row, and then they would interview me, and I knew so much about fighting.

[791] I started asking questions about guys that are fighting in Japan.

[792] And then Dana and I went out to dinner, and he was like, why don't you do commentary?

[793] Why don't you do commentary?

[794] I want to get drunk and watch fights.

[795] Like, come on, man. They had props of Dana White, though.

[796] That's a good move.

[797] Yeah, he saw me on the Keen and I have a way in show, too, making fun of Steven Seagal.

[798] We were talking about martial arts And Dana thought it was hilarious And then we started talking about commentary And then he talked me to doing one I did like the first 15 of them I did for free I did it for a while like more than a year Like maybe two years I did it for no money I just got free tickets He just flew me out It's that bro You know these pads in life They reveal themselves And this goes back to what we're saying earlier If you look at things through the lens of money you're a monetary game you'll miss so much you miss so much this this thing about just following a passion having a good dinner with somebody yeah i'll do it that's usually how the greatest things happen when i did stars born i don't do movies i'm so glad i did it and it was just because i liked bradley cooper i kept meeting them at parties that's awesome and i just like i just like the guy no yeah that's being able to just do what you enjoy doing that's the real success of life because if you're making a lot of money but you hate what you're doing like when i was doing Fear Factor.

[799] I didn't enjoy the job.

[800] I enjoyed the people I was working with.

[801] It was fun.

[802] They were a good group of people.

[803] We had a lot of fun.

[804] We had a lot of laughs.

[805] But it wasn't what I wanted to do.

[806] I was doing it for money.

[807] Right.

[808] And I made, but it gave me, the good thing was it gave me fuck you money.

[809] So it gave me money where I had money squirled away.

[810] It was like, ooh, I can relax now.

[811] Now I just do what I want to do.

[812] And what I wanted to do is like do this stupid podcast.

[813] And then, you know, do these MMA shows, go and do commentary.

[814] And I did all that shit again it was all just because it I enjoyed it and then that became my life my life became only things I enjoy so now whether it's podcast or whether it's stand up or whether it's commentary it's just I enjoy it I look forward to it I had a year like that right maybe the year before I did Chappelle show it was just like I was saving up to take a chance you know what I mean yeah so when it came time to do Chappelle's show you know the money was terrible but but but I saved up I could take the shot yeah I could come off the road and take the and take a real shot and it made all the difference in the world real when you take a chance it's such a weird feeling taking a chance like doing something even just moving here it's so exciting so exciting when you don't know how it's going to play out it's so nerve -wracking like it gets you you're like fuck is this the right move maybe I actually just play it safe and stay where I am I mean LA's got to open back up eventually.

[815] No, this was a great move.

[816] I can't imagine what you saved in taxes.

[817] I don't know.

[818] It's a lot, though.

[819] It's got to be.

[820] It's 13 % is what California state taxes are?

[821] Yeah, yeah.

[822] It's crazy.

[823] I'm not even good at math and I know that's $13 .00.

[824] It's going to get worse, too, man. It's going to get worse.

[825] What?

[826] Because they're jacking the taxes, though.

[827] They're trying.

[828] Oh, yeah, yeah.

[829] They're jacking them up in New York.

[830] You know what?

[831] Yeah, they're fine.

[832] Listen, if I felt like it fixed things, I would be happy.

[833] It's that.

[834] You know, I was with John Stewart.

[835] we went in Copenhagen and you know socialized country and and and John Stewart said to me something that he said you know the difference between a taxpayer here and a taxpayer in America he said these people think they get something for their money yeah but I think socialism or something like that only works in homogenized countries like everyone in China's Chinese a lot of white people in Copenhagen I think like you know I mean, I think in America, it's the them or the they of it all that fucks us up.

[836] It's also small populations, right?

[837] It's like one of the things I was saying about Austin.

[838] One of the ways Austin works is there's only a million people in the city.

[839] And then there's another million on the outskirts.

[840] That's not a lot of people.

[841] That's not a lot of people.

[842] It's one of the reasons why it works.

[843] It's like people are valuable.

[844] They're not a problem.

[845] Even when you're in traffic, it's like five minutes.

[846] Like, oh my God, so much traffic.

[847] Took your extra five minutes.

[848] Right.

[849] It's nothing.

[850] Not, no, not coming from L .A., nothing is traffic after L .A. Maybe Atlanta.

[851] Yeah, Atlanta's rough.

[852] Chicago's rough.

[853] I remember doing radio in Chicago was doing the Schaumburg improv, and you do radio in the city, and then you've got to go back out to Schaumburg, and you're like, holy shit, this is far.

[854] There's so much traffic.

[855] There's so many people.

[856] Big cities, that's the rub on big cities is that people, they don't value each other as much.

[857] When you're in a place like Copenhagen or, any of these uh these any like whether it's denmark or these places are not that big they're big enough but they're not that big united states is so big it's so big it's so big and it's so different there's so much going on so many cities everywhere everywhere's different so many climates 350 whatever the fuck it is million people yeah but if you see an american when you're outside of america there you know they're one of us A lot of times.

[858] Yeah.

[859] A lot of times.

[860] The lines are getting blurry now, though.

[861] How do you mean?

[862] You might think someone's American.

[863] You talk to him.

[864] Hello, mate.

[865] Oh, look at you, a motherfucker.

[866] You're backwards baseball that on.

[867] That is true.

[868] Yeah.

[869] I play overseas a lot now.

[870] And, you know, I used to do it when I was a kid.

[871] It was more challenging.

[872] This Internet makes all the crowds kind of the same.

[873] Yeah.

[874] They know every reference.

[875] Yeah.

[876] And American culture is still a marquee culture.

[877] Like, you know, they know.

[878] much about our political lives.

[879] They know so much about our cultural lives.

[880] So much more than we would know about them going over there.

[881] Yeah, for sure.

[882] And on stage, like, I was doing a show on Tokyo.

[883] I'd never worked in Tokyo before.

[884] What was that like?

[885] If I took a picture from the stage and asked you where I was, you'd think I was playing San Francisco.

[886] Really?

[887] It was interesting.

[888] Yeah.

[889] Some of the people who came didn't even speak English.

[890] They just wanted to see the spectacle of, because they had heard of me. Oh, wow.

[891] That must be wild.

[892] It's Netflix, man. Like, look, Look, you get out in that world, Joe.

[893] You're famous everywhere.

[894] You've never been to these places.

[895] But when you get there, they're going to know you.

[896] Or there's a thing that happened to me years ago in London where I was in a restaurant and I was kind of waiting for the table.

[897] And when the lady, she asked me my name.

[898] She said, what's you now?

[899] I go, David.

[900] She goes, well, this is David on the list.

[901] What's your last name?

[902] I go, Chappelle.

[903] And she looks up.

[904] And I look around and everyone's kind of looking.

[905] I could tell they had heard of me. but they didn't know that that was that kind of thing yeah this was this was after I quit the show but not long after like 05 oh 6 what did you do for those 10 years a lot of shit I learned a lot I mean but it was it was a humble existence you know I had had young children and I was raising my kids I was living a suburban life and then every once in a while I get this feeling like I'm the funniest guy I got to get out there and I would like fly to Denver do a week in Denver or something and that's when he would read I was doing like these six hour shows I performed like I was desperate for it I loved it yeah and at one point I had done one of these big comedy tours that Live Nation put together that oddball tour and I did all right I mean I had a good run I wiped out in Hartford and that was all over the internet that was the first time that thing it happened to me but for the most part the tour went good But it was a tough tour for me because it was a long show.

[906] I had to close it.

[907] You know, my chops weren't as tight as they normally were.

[908] But I didn't suck by any means, but, you know, could have been better.

[909] It was humbling.

[910] But it made me want to go back.

[911] And the shows were like, every show was like 20 ,000 seats.

[912] They were like all these.

[913] What year was this around?

[914] Shit.

[915] I can't remember.

[916] Obama was president maybe.

[917] I don't know, 8, 9, 10.

[918] But you were famous for just showing up places.

[919] You would just fly into places.

[920] That's the one.

[921] That's when I started.

[922] In the summer, I started riding motorcycles, which is like very uncharacteristically.

[923] But I loved it.

[924] And I would, and I wrote, I said, I'm going to ride my bike across country.

[925] And I did.

[926] I cheated.

[927] I had a tour bus with me. It was a trail or so if it rained or something.

[928] Or if I just wanted to bail, I could.

[929] But I rode across country.

[930] And I'd never seen America like that.

[931] We talked about how big it is and expansive.

[932] and, man, I saw all the little pockets on a bike.

[933] You know, you really feel the environment, you see things.

[934] And I would.

[935] I'd stop and play.

[936] One of my favorite birthdays was here in Austin.

[937] I'd never been to Austin, really, and I pulled up on 6th Street.

[938] I'd been to Austin, but I never seen Austin.

[939] Pulled up on 6th Street, it was my birthday.

[940] I was riding with a guy.

[941] He was like, what do you want to do for your birthday?

[942] And at that time, I went drinking and smoking or anything.

[943] I said, I wanted to do stand -up.

[944] And I found a bar.

[945] It was right around closing.

[946] And I saw the DJ packing up, and I said, can I use your microphone?

[947] And he recognized me. So he was like, oh, yeah, yeah.

[948] And I went up then, I just started talking shit.

[949] And, you know, but it was just like, you know, teasing the bar staff as they're cleaning up, talking to patrons and, you know, get a home fast buddy and all that shit.

[950] Right.

[951] And people laugh and they kind of, it was like doing, they used to do street comedy in New York.

[952] It kind of reminded me of that, like, building a crowd.

[953] And after a while, people stopped and listened.

[954] Now, I'm not a tech savvy job.

[955] dude, Twitter had come out.

[956] And I guess people had started tweeting like, yo, it was just crazy.

[957] Dave Chappelle was in here renting.

[958] Man, it might have took like an hour.

[959] That place was packed.

[960] And I must have stayed on stage three or four hours.

[961] Wow.

[962] And, you know, they closed the door.

[963] They locked the door because it was after hours.

[964] And I was in there killing it.

[965] Wow.

[966] Best birthday ever had.

[967] One of the best birthdays ever had.

[968] Sometime around when I turned 40, I just decided that I'm going to have fun.

[969] You know, like right now, you know, this is a weird thing to talk about, but after DMX passed and Black Robb and, you know, now far more often, people from my peer group pass away.

[970] And it just makes me feel like, it's not a midlife crisis.

[971] It's almost the opposite of that.

[972] It's like, look, I know I don't get to stay here forever.

[973] My time is limited and precious, and I don't take any of these things for granted.

[974] I don't take this money for granted.

[975] platform and I'm not talking about the fame platform I'm talking about comedy this genre like I make it this genre it's been so good for me uh my social life the people that I've met the friendships that I've had some that I've lost along the way uh these memories we make you know as the years go on I'm like what a special special way to live your life yeah to see the world like it's like when we We did those dates.

[976] We were in Seattle and Utah, was it?

[977] Salt Lake City.

[978] And one of those nights, there was a massacre in Dayton.

[979] It's not far from where I live.

[980] People where I live hang out in Dayton.

[981] Was that the night we were there?

[982] We were together when that happened.

[983] That same night, the guy that owned one of those comedy clubs in New York was murdered, too.

[984] It was like a really dark night.

[985] And I found all this out right before.

[986] I was going on.

[987] Like, you didn't know, you were already on stage as this news unfold.

[988] I'm sure you got an earful when you got off.

[989] Yeah.

[990] But I was like, you know, during the run, we would go places and I'd see flags at half staff, and I'm like, oh shit, that's for like my city.

[991] It really hit home.

[992] And the best part of that experience was being with comedians.

[993] If anything bad ever happens, comedians are who you want to be with.

[994] You know, 9 -11, I was in a room full of comedians because I had to, you know, I was staying on West Broadway and Canal Street, which is not far from the Trade Center, but Canal Street, I'm on the north side of the street.

[995] From the south down, the city was evacuated.

[996] So I got to stay in my hotel.

[997] But during the day, we didn't know that we, you know, I had a new baby, and I ended up going to a comedian's house.

[998] They lived in Greenwich Village.

[999] Bunch of comedians were there.

[1000] As bad as that day was, that was the room to be in.

[1001] Something that these guys and girls have always inspired courage in me and levity in me. Something, there's some subtext of comedy that everything's going to be okay.

[1002] I spent the day with Joey Diaz and Ralphie Mae.

[1003] Oh, wow.

[1004] Yeah, 11?

[1005] Yeah.

[1006] Who else would you rather been with me?

[1007] When you think back of the tragedy, I bet you can think of four or five things you laughed at that day.

[1008] Not about the tragedy, but we just laughed.

[1009] We were high as fuck, and we were just freaking out about the fact there's no place.

[1010] like look at this guy there's no planes yeah it's that comedians yeah you know it's funny that this genre is under attack because because to me this is that everything's going to be okay genre it's under attack because people have this ability to complain about things now and then people pile on it's a new thing and they realize it's very useful it's a good weapon and if you choose targets you could take targets out you can go after them and so it becomes a hobby it becomes a hobby like if you know if you see a window and you got a rock you feel like throwing that rock and so a lot of times these targets aren't justified but you can find a justification you can say oh they put these words together in this order and if you look at it in quotes written down on paper you go oh well this is aibilist or this is this is this is something we can attack let's attack this is transphobic this is homophobic attack attack and they it becomes it's a recreational It's recreational outrage.

[1011] It is exactly.

[1012] You know, the last time I came on your show when Donnell was here, and I fucked up, I looked at the comments section.

[1013] I'll never do that shit again.

[1014] I'll never do that shit.

[1015] First comment is somebody said, Dave looks like he stinks.

[1016] What did I do?

[1017] Whatever do you, but.

[1018] When Riza was on with Donnell, that was the first thing I said to Donnell after the show, I go, hey, man, that was fun.

[1019] Don't read the comments.

[1020] Don't read the comments.

[1021] And Donnell just dove right into that comments And he was on a deep spiral Of mental illness for several days Yeah, he said, man, I kept saying I interrupt, son Yeah, I heard all about it We was on tour after that He was, he was traumatized He got shook I told him, stay out of there Don't read that shit You're the same person You don't want to be affected by those people No, you know No, because they just want to bring you down To their level They're miserable But whoever wrote that comment Is that Dave looks like he stinks It's probably gonna watch this and be like, nailed it.

[1022] So congratulations, motherfucker.

[1023] And I can't rate to read your comment about me commenting on your comment.

[1024] You're in the big time, bitch.

[1025] Your mother stinks.

[1026] Comment on that, too.

[1027] It's a weird thing, comments.

[1028] Comments are a weird thing.

[1029] Yeah, it is.

[1030] But like you say, and here's the rub, you can just not read them.

[1031] Or you can just not click on that special that's going to hurt your feelings.

[1032] At a certain point, you got to look at this shit like food.

[1033] What are you eating?

[1034] What are you putting in your mind?

[1035] That's what I keep saying about me when people get outraged about my podcast.

[1036] I'm like, well, you don't have to listen to it.

[1037] Like, why are you listening to it, looking for things that are pissing you off?

[1038] Like, what are you doing?

[1039] Yeah, it's like listening to someone's ass when they take it.

[1040] It shouldn't be like, ew, you farted.

[1041] What the fuck are you doing in here anyway?

[1042] It's for all these people.

[1043] Well, people are looking to get mad.

[1044] There's plenty of things to be authentically mad.

[1045] about yes but those are confusing and frustrating and take it takes time patience research yeah right there's a lot going on why do that yeah why do all that yeah i don't know man it's just a it's just a i'm optimistic about the future but i think because i've never seen these things before i can't quite call words going it's a challenging time but human beings have always done better than the previous generation every single generation if you follow like stephen pinker's work From the beginning of time, from recorded history to now, it's the safest time to be alive ever.

[1046] And it's a very clear trend.

[1047] We struggle.

[1048] We have conflict.

[1049] There's ups and downs.

[1050] There's mistakes and there's good decisions.

[1051] But ultimately, things become safer.

[1052] They become better.

[1053] We accept each other more.

[1054] Think about, like, when I was a kid, gay marriage was impossible.

[1055] Like, no one, you couldn't get married if you were gay.

[1056] Whenever they would propose it, people would freak out.

[1057] Now it's nationwide.

[1058] It's like things change even though there's more violence now than ever before I mean there's not more violence now than ever before you see it you see violence now more than you ever have before because of social media you could pull up Instagram videos or car accidents and gun fights and crazy shit but the reality is there's less violence than ever before there's less murder than ever before it's a slow trend and Pinker gets criticized for this because people don't want to hear that because they go but what about all the injustice what about all the murders.

[1059] What about all the crime?

[1060] There is all that shit.

[1061] There is rape.

[1062] All that stuff is real.

[1063] But it's way less than ever before in history.

[1064] And I think as time moves on, it'll get even better.

[1065] There'll be hiccups.

[1066] There'll be ups and downs.

[1067] But it's not less.

[1068] It's not less because people are sick of that behavior.

[1069] It's not like these things happen less often because people had to do things to make these things happen less less often.

[1070] It didn't organically just be like, and that's enough murder for us.

[1071] We had to do some shit.

[1072] People had to do some shit.

[1073] Right.

[1074] We had to, you know, gay marriage.

[1075] People had to be made aware of how people are struggling.

[1076] One of the great things of that movement was when everyone started coming out to closet and everyone realized, oh, like five of my best friends are gay and were embarrassed when we were saying this, that, and the other.

[1077] Right.

[1078] And he realized you like this person more than you like whatever prejudice you're carrying around.

[1079] These types of actions What changes?

[1080] Information.

[1081] Yeah.

[1082] And as more information gets out about what's avoidable and unavoidable, and the more we get to understand each other, the more we realize we have way more in common than we don't.

[1083] Right.

[1084] You know, as time goes on, I think we're going to get better.

[1085] I think our culture, our civilization will be improved upon.

[1086] Like what we have now, we have now is a very unique struggle that's never existed before because it's it's a combination struggle right it's a virus a disease it's it's fear it's anxiety and then economic depression all thrown in together and it scares a fuck out of people because they're powerless because all of a sudden the government comes along and says you can't work or your your business is not essential imagine being told you don't have an essential business I was let's get what comedians are yeah we're not essential uh fortunately podcasts were for whatever weird reason an essential business so we're liquor stores which is kind of crazy well because your podcast was like a beacon of some semblance of normalcy it didn't look so like joe yeah you look good and the world's going on you know but there's also something illusory about it yeah because if they see us on yachts popping bottles while they're going through this thing right they're going to feel like well there's something wrong with me or like yeah there's a lot of tone deaf folks out there that didn't get that or out there taking that photo in front of a private chat with a Gucci bag smiling yeah yeah yeah like hey hey this is not the time for that yeah yeah yeah yeah it's true not the time for flossing no but for some some people that's like a part of their their image you know part of what they do yeah many people yeah i think that in their understanding that that's almost almost definitively what celebrity is yeah it's like how am i going to be successful without doing it and and they sell something different than say you or i might be trying to sell right right right you can't you you're not selling that if you're a comic yeah be careful nah I'm trying to think is there a comic that flaws is Kevin Hart flosses a little bit never bothered me though no he's happy well first of all who the fuck works harder than that guy nobody nobody not me fuck that he makes me feel lazy he's always like co -producing some project and animating some movie and doing a voiceover of this and starring that and then doing a theater tour and then he's got Jumanji 5 coming out.

[1087] You know, so he's always got something happening.

[1088] And he's relentlessly kind and everyone that works with him looks elated and happy.

[1089] He's not a tyrant.

[1090] He's like hanging out with a self -help book or some shit.

[1091] He just makes you feel good.

[1092] He's a powerful, powerful guy.

[1093] Hard, impossible not to like him.

[1094] Yeah.

[1095] And And in fact, in my mind, he's a great case scenario that a good person can do well in life.

[1096] Because there are some cynics that believe that they can't.

[1097] I don't know about any crime behind that fortune.

[1098] You're just a good dude.

[1099] No, it's just a good dude.

[1100] You can be a good person to make it.

[1101] It's just the problem is like making it is usually connected to ambition, which is usually connected to aggression.

[1102] It's usually connected to, you know, someone who's like really fiercely.

[1103] trying to succeed and a lot of that is usually in a lot of people's eyes that's at any cost you know ruthlessly trying to get through the maze of show business of life to succeed and some people back to incentives adopt this ruthlessness thinking well that's how things get done yeah yeah if i can't do this then i'll never make it and that's and that's a myth so let's a great quote on the actor's studio he's talking about rocky being a metaphor for acting and saying that some of the best actors he knew was so sensitive that they couldn't survive the environment.

[1104] So some of the greatest talent that he witnessed, the masses will never see because they couldn't navigate the rocks as far as commerce is concerned.

[1105] And that was his fight, so to speak.

[1106] Yeah.

[1107] I would imagine that that's...

[1108] I mean, there's actors that are like, Real artists when they're putting together a role, whether it's a Denzo Washington or a Daniel DeLewis or, you know what I mean?

[1109] There's like levels of acting and there's a certain level where they're not like just a regular guy trying to be famous.

[1110] They got some thing that they've tuned into.

[1111] They can become Gary Oldman.

[1112] They can become a person.

[1113] Man, Daniel DeLewis, that motherfucker, think about it.

[1114] When he's not working, he's like making shoes and shit.

[1115] Yeah.

[1116] He's not, he's not on what I call the hostrole, that red carpet.

[1117] He ain't doing a, he ain't doing that shit.

[1118] No. He's a serious actor.

[1119] He's a great artist, and that's why he makes a premium for his work.

[1120] I think he quit acting.

[1121] He said he retired.

[1122] Him playing Abraham Lincoln was one of my favorite things I've ever seen someone do.

[1123] And it's not my favorite movie he's been in, but it's a movie about the passing of a bill.

[1124] I can't think of a more boring process than fucking the bill.

[1125] bureaucracy of passing a bill no matter what the bill's about yeah but man something about that performance made me excited about like art itself for me it's the there will be blood yeah it's the fucking greatest movie ever there will be blood is the one that character it was so many things he was a murderer he was evil he was kind he was ambitious he was a victim of circumstance a victim of his environment and also you know kind of a tyrant yeah like I picture myself as an actor reading that script and it's being like yeah I don't get it let alone untangling an emotional life for this guy in a rationale for behaving this way yeah man this guy nailed it yeah he nailed it but that's what people when people think of the worst aspects of ambition they think of that kind of person that character that he portrayed the worst aspects of it the dehumanizing aspects of ambition yeah geez some dark shit yeah dark shit i drink your milkshake yeah beats a guy dead with the bowling pin and i'm finished yeah no spoiler alert my bad everybody yeah fucking heavy great though yeah brilliant you know it's kind of like one of the things i did after i left the show is i got in the boxing i don't know i used just go to the fights.

[1126] And part of it was because that era was like Manny Pachian was fighting, and Mace was fighting, all these guys were great fighters.

[1127] And I got this notion that any time I can be a witness to greatness, I should see it.

[1128] Yes.

[1129] And it's like the fast food of greatness.

[1130] Floyd fight.

[1131] You know, that's going to be good.

[1132] A Pagia fight, you know what I'm going to?

[1133] I was there when he got knocked out, like these moments.

[1134] Oh, you were there when Marquez knocked him out?

[1135] Boy, was I. With my Filipino mother -in -law, she sang the national anthem and everything i was like sorry wow yeah it was crazy man but but you know that was a crazy punch that was now who do you have on saturday we got canello and billy ray saunders yeah billy ray saunders is a problem and he got good feet he can move he can move but there's no one in the business harder to hit than canella right now he learned something from floy mayweather man that was like a harvard ass who when floy gave him yeah it wasn't even like a yeah it was a clinic Trouncing.

[1136] Yeah, it's a trouncing.

[1137] Yeah, it's a trouncing.

[1138] It's a ass weapon, but...

[1139] Floyd didn't hit hard enough to really give him a real ass weapon or really hurt him and punish him and have him in real trouble, but he boxed him up, boxed him up nice.

[1140] It was like watching a Globe Trotter's game.

[1141] You know what I mean?

[1142] Yeah, right?

[1143] It was a, he was beat handily.

[1144] But then if you watch Canello, like, because Floyd was impossible to hit, and I think Canello was like, he thought he was going to be able to hit him.

[1145] And then he realized somewhere in the fight, like, this guy knows everything I'm going to do long before I do it.

[1146] Like, my language, the way I'm speaking with boxing is so slow.

[1147] Right.

[1148] He's just like, many steps ahead.

[1149] But then you watch Canelo now, like.

[1150] He's slick.

[1151] He's so silly.

[1152] The Danny Jacobs fight's a great example of that.

[1153] Yeah, that was.

[1154] He's standing right in front of him, just moving the head.

[1155] His head movement's phenomenal.

[1156] And that's not indicative of a classic Mexican boxer.

[1157] No, they come straight at you.

[1158] Yeah.

[1159] He's not that guy.

[1160] He's so skilled.

[1161] He got the rub.

[1162] That's what we call it.

[1163] When a great fighter fights another great fighter, they learn something.

[1164] You learn something from the higher levels.

[1165] Like when you get beat by a guy, you get that rub.

[1166] You see a lot of times a guy will come out of a fight with a great fight.

[1167] He might have lost.

[1168] But then the next fight, you see like, oh, he recognizes the higher frequencies, the higher RPMs of the real true great ones.

[1169] I think that was a problem box in this idea that people were addicted to undefeated fighters.

[1170] But there's something to be said in greatness for getting beat.

[1171] up sometimes.

[1172] Yes.

[1173] If you can come back from it with your wits and tagged and learn the lessons that the asswhip and thought you, you might see something even more special from a guy that got a loss or two on his record.

[1174] Yeah, but there's a fine line.

[1175] There's a type of loss that you never bounce back from.

[1176] Like the Julio Cesar Chavez, Meldrick Taylor lost.

[1177] Melchick Taylor lost to Chavez.

[1178] He got knocked out with like, Richard Steele stopped the fight with like two seconds to go in the last round but chavez was just getting to him just getting to him and meldrick was so fast meldrick was a part of that team that 76 olympic gold medalist team not 76 was it 84 84 team where it was like mark breeland uh riddick beau was riddick bow in that team no tyrell biggs mark breel biggs pernell whittaker meldrick taylor they were there were so many great fighters all gold medalists and meldrich taylor was so fast he was so good but chavez was relentless.

[1179] Julio Cesar Chavez was relentless.

[1180] He just would bob and weave and weave and we even bob and we even come pop, pop, pop, pop, pop, pop.

[1181] And started getting to him, started getting to him.

[1182] And then finally, last round, boom, drops him.

[1183] And Richard Steele looks in the Melchuk Taylor's eyes and he waves it off with two seconds to go.

[1184] Oh, wow.

[1185] And everybody's like, oh, shit.

[1186] And he never came back from that.

[1187] Never came back from that.

[1188] He fought after that.

[1189] He always looked like something, like Julio Cesar Chavez took a piece of him.

[1190] He never returned 100%.

[1191] I'd tell you another, it's a guilty pleasure fighting because I know, I see what it does the guys.

[1192] You brought a Riddick Boat.

[1193] You know, I talked to him once in a fight, and I'm like, man, this guy took some shots.

[1194] Took some shots.

[1195] And I'm not saying this disparagingly.

[1196] No, it's just reality.

[1197] Yeah, it was tough.

[1198] It was a tough one because, you know, I think about how much I enjoy watching these fights and then come face to face with the price that so many paid.

[1199] I saw Terry Norris had a fight once and he was talking to a fan and I was moving on my way to the seat and I heard Terry talking to this guy and I was like, oh no, it was bad.

[1200] Yeah.

[1201] It was bad.

[1202] Muhammad Ali, my hero.

[1203] That's tough to watch.

[1204] Tough to watch.

[1205] And it happens to all of them eventually.

[1206] If they keep going, it happens to all of them.

[1207] Yeah, you got to hang them gloves up at some point.

[1208] Some of them are, you know, like, that's what makes Andre Ward so special.

[1209] Andre Ward wins a gold medal in the Olympics wins two world championships and two different weight classes retires undefeated they offer money to come back and goes I think I'm better served as a commentator I'm done I talk's perfect talks perfect had him on the podcast brilliant guy thoughtful articulate smooth classy you know and one of my prize possessions is some gloves he sign for me you know I'm a big fan of the Bay area and I was you know before the Warriors were champs you know Andre Ward was carrying Oakland he was their champion and he's doing it with one arm you know that no yeah Andre Ward's right shoulders basically that's right okay most of his career yeah this was when he was I don't know what kind of contractual disputes he had he had the shoulder surgery he was going through all that and we had a conversation about I was really like inspired meeting I mean we had a conversation about the exactly what you're talking about Well, he was talking to me. You know, we didn't know each other.

[1210] I just happened to meet him.

[1211] And he talked to me about hanging his gloves up.

[1212] It was a crazy thing for a comedian to hear.

[1213] Like, imagine saying, okay, I'm done with comedy.

[1214] Like, I could quit.

[1215] I could say I quit the limelight.

[1216] I don't know if I quit doing stand -up in some way, shape, or form.

[1217] I don't know if I could have taken 30 years off like Eddie.

[1218] Right, right.

[1219] Yeah, Eddie keeps talking about coming back, right?

[1220] but he still hasn't.

[1221] He's, listen, bro, he's funny as fuck.

[1222] Like, as far as, like, a naturally athletic comedian, I don't know, that I've ever seen as equal.

[1223] Yeah, I think you're right.

[1224] Remember that?

[1225] I don't know.

[1226] I've ever seen his equal.

[1227] That speech where he talked about them, taking Bill Cosby's...

[1228] Mark Twain Prize, boy.

[1229] I was there when he said that.

[1230] It was so...

[1231] I can remember, too, all the comedians who were there crowding around the monitor because it was the first time he did anything that looked like stand -up.

[1232] Right.

[1233] And he was smooth.

[1234] Right.

[1235] He stopped doing stand -up in 87.

[1236] It's the year I started.

[1237] That's incredible.

[1238] This entire time.

[1239] And so if he does come back, you know, I'd be the first person to buy a ticket.

[1240] I would watch a bad Eddie Murphy show.

[1241] If he was really trying to do a thing, then before I would go see one in my own.

[1242] I remember we were, I forget what club in New York we were talking, and Chris Rock was talking about how good.

[1243] Cosby was.

[1244] He went to see Cosby.

[1245] At the Apollo.

[1246] I've heard this story.

[1247] And Bill Burr and I were planning on seeing Cosby.

[1248] We're trying to figure out where we should go.

[1249] I'll tell you where the correctional facility in Pennsylvania.

[1250] That's where he's at.

[1251] As we speak.

[1252] It was before all that shit happened.

[1253] We were thinking about going to see him somewhere.

[1254] Yeah, I don't know.

[1255] I mean, like, I look at these kids coming up, and there's things that they do much better than we did.

[1256] They can all produce.

[1257] They can all generate their own they make heat out nothing right in the 90s you go to the fucking comedian's parking lot at the comedy store that she used to be filled with shitty cars yeah and now you'll see a guy you never even heard of getting to the hottest whip yep it's that now yeah I don't know these guys look like straight up contest winners like who the fuck is this guy but they're killing it internet money right but what's too bad about it is we're from a process of refinement that doesn't exist anymore Right They'll never The road when you're anonymous Right The road when you're anonymous Just being on the strip And it's smoking night Well not smoking No one smokes anymore But then it'll be in one of those nightclubs And just They're gonna That's a lot to miss Yeah The grind The long grind of developing A real act And to do it also In where there's no cell phones There's nothing You know It's no distractions Right They're competing with too much and it's too bad for them like but I don't fault them for them I'm impressed that these kids made a new way but I like the way we do it there's a new way that they're doing where they one of the things that showed a lot of people's ability to improvise and to change was during COVID a lot of people started doing things online and like Andrew Schultz the best example I think he started doing those things like turn your phone sideways and those long rants, like 10, 15 -minute rants with photographs and punchline after punchline after punchline, and then they did a whole Netflix special about it.

[1258] Like he did a series of Netflix pieces on it.

[1259] And what he did was, he said, okay, I can't do stand -up, but this isn't stand -up.

[1260] So I shouldn't do stand -up like this because there's no audience.

[1261] So the key to this, and he figured it out.

[1262] He's like, the key to this is you've got to hit it fast.

[1263] The punchlines have to come one after the other, after the other, it's got to be fast -paced, and with images.

[1264] So, like, he would use all these visuals while he was hitting punchline after punchline.

[1265] Oh, wow.

[1266] He figured out a new way to do comedy.

[1267] He figured out a way to do internet, Instagram, 10 -minute comedy.

[1268] Well, okay, but that's not, like you say, that's not stand -up.

[1269] No. Like, this thing that you're describing, God bless him.

[1270] Yeah.

[1271] That's not what I do.

[1272] Yeah, it's different.

[1273] Yeah.

[1274] It's different than the way he does stand -up, which is interesting, because his stand -up is slower.

[1275] He holds laughs.

[1276] He holds pause.

[1277] He laughs at shit.

[1278] He fucks around.

[1279] He works a crowd a lot.

[1280] His stand -up is loose.

[1281] Right.

[1282] He has fun.

[1283] He's comfortable up there.

[1284] Right.

[1285] But his little clips that he does on Instagram or rapid fire, bang, bang, bang, bang.

[1286] And he works with a series of writers.

[1287] They all work together.

[1288] They put these things together.

[1289] They work it out, man. By the time it's done, I mean, it is a polished machine.

[1290] But he used that time and innovated, you know.

[1291] That's clever.

[1292] Yeah.

[1293] I don't think I, yeah, it's not, I'm not interested in it because no disrespect to him.

[1294] I like happening in real life Like even during COVID The fact that we Found a way to get in front of the audiences again Met the world to me That's what I do Yeah It's a different thing Yeah I mean You know I could throw a slide show in the shit If I want to But that crowd's not there What's the fucking point for me I know what you mean But for him he's coming up still You know you'd already made it You just wanted to get back in there Yeah And it's a whole different ball and wax That's what I'm saying Like that thing that he was That evolution he was able to make?

[1295] I'm like the old guy who has that hot outfit from the 70s.

[1296] Fashion, go on without me. I look fine.

[1297] I'm that.

[1298] I'm good with what I do.

[1299] Those shows we did at Stubbed felt real special.

[1300] It might not ever be that special again because it was hard.

[1301] It was hard to do and it was weird and it was the fact that you could do a show in a pandemic, like a real legitimate pandemic.

[1302] And what it did for the people who were able to come.

[1303] Yeah.

[1304] And for the comedians who were able to participate.

[1305] We all felt better.

[1306] We felt a lot better.

[1307] We had some wild fun.

[1308] Yeah.

[1309] Life might be okay.

[1310] Everyone, you know, just to laugh around other people.

[1311] Yep.

[1312] During a shit show of a circumstance.

[1313] It was great.

[1314] It was great.

[1315] You know, I wish that we could have done a more diverse.

[1316] array of shows, but we were locked into the circumstances we were locked in.

[1317] Yeah.

[1318] We tested everybody that, like, everyone who bought a ticket, got a COVID test, free mask, you know, and as a comedian, it was a new experience.

[1319] Being in a room full of people or whatever that venue was full of people that just realized that they don't have the dreaded coronavirus.

[1320] Right.

[1321] And they were to show and the music's playing and comedians they recognize come on the stage.

[1322] it was like pure joy in there no matter what we said at a certain point we were all happy to be comedians didn't take it for granted like you know you do a million sets you start thinking it's just another night of the office but every night of the office could have been the last night at the office yeah that was the thing about it too it's like you're never going to have another day like that where or another series of nights like that where there's a first real pandemic of our lifetime where things are shut down but yet we do have this weird opportunity to do shows so they felt electric they really did they felt electric those shows that we did will remain etched in my mind that forever like that was special the fact that you know and also man you know not no gas than nothing but the fact that you're successful as you are all these things you're wildly famous you're also very unaffected but you um you got nervous before your first set, I respected that.

[1323] I said, okay, see, this guy makes all this money, still cares.

[1324] Instead, you see some guys, you can see that you're a fighter.

[1325] Sometimes the fight gets out of them.

[1326] Yeah, they get soft.

[1327] You don't feel like going as hard as he used to.

[1328] You might start worrying about what they're saying in the press and all that shit.

[1329] None of that shit ever got to you, bro.

[1330] You was going hard in the past.

[1331] paint it was fun it was fun to watch like i'm like yo you're going hard to paint bro but it was fun man and and the spirit that i love about the genre was ever present everything's going to be okay is with spirit of comedy always yeah yeah and it was there just made me feel like wow this is if i can't do comedy i'm not going to do comedy you know what i'm saying like if i can't do real comedy if i can't do comedy the way i've always on comedy say wild shit that you don't even necessarily really mean but it's funny that's why you're saying it and everybody knows they know what you're doing they know what you're doing i know guys that you know and they're famous i don't but they struggle with this thing yeah they do yeah and they stop coming around and i miss their presence and their voices and a lot of these young comedians this process of refinement is gone because they don't have these guys to look to right because you know they're making money and i don't want to upset anybody yep yep kids are in college or whatever it's going to be they don't want to ruin what they already put down yeah They lay down some nice roots They got a good thing going on They don't want to fuck it up Would you ever leave the limelight?

[1332] Yeah, sure Does it bother you, the limelight?

[1333] You don't live in a wayward I don't do limelight things You know what I'm saying?

[1334] You got to try some of this shit out, bro.

[1335] It's not bad You got to try some I mean, look, you don't have to do it all time Once and again Once and again I mean I'm I have needs And my needs are you know like exercise keep my mind straight all all those needs like they they those have to be fulfilled yeah they have to be filled for mental clarity and if i get that if i don't do that i don't i'll lose my way you also have a lot of access to shit who are you talking to yesterday uh yesterday was uh david holt house who's a documentary film He's a journalist.

[1336] Yeah, every day.

[1337] You talk to some kind of jogging at some field.

[1338] Elon Musk or Malcolm Gladwell.

[1339] What do you think about this shit?

[1340] Elon's going through with Saturday Night Live.

[1341] Ridiculous.

[1342] Yeah, it's puzzling.

[1343] No one is woke enough.

[1344] They can't appreciate the fact that you're dealing with literally one of the most brilliant men that's ever lived who's going to come do your show.

[1345] You're talking about a guy who simultaneously runs multiple world -changing businesses, whether it's Tesla, whether it's SpaceX, whether it's the boring company, he's making tunnels underneath the fucking Earth.

[1346] He's putting satellites into space to put high -speed internet around the world.

[1347] He's doing all these things simultaneously.

[1348] But can he write a monologue is what we're going to find out?

[1349] He's not funny.

[1350] He's a brilliant guy.

[1351] He could probably do anything if he set his mind to it, but the fact that they've decided somehow that he's problematic, like it doesn't make any sense.

[1352] It makes no sense.

[1353] is it just because he's rich that who knows it doesn't matter anymore they just decide like what the fuck is this and everybody's like what the fuck is this this is bullshit so there was no there was no obvious catalyst for this or okay i was just curious uh there was some people that felt like he dismissed covid's danger at one point in time they didn't like him because of that but he did just because he's intelligent because his perspective was he he's a reductionist or i should say like his perspective on it was like looking at the numbers and looking at what it is as a thing instead of looking at the emotional impact of people losing loved ones and so sometimes someone who's like a genius might say something that appears to be uh appears to be insensitive i don't think he's insensitive i think he was just looking at it in terms of like what is what is the odds that you're going to die and saying that children are essentially immune and he was saying things that a lot of people felt were insensitive but that was a first of all a it was a long time ago And B, he was just explaining his perspective on the disease.

[1354] And he wasn't as fearful as they thought he should be.

[1355] And then, you know, he came to our shows and his pictures of all of us hanging out maskless.

[1356] And then people got COVID afterwards.

[1357] A lot of people thought that it was his girlfriend that gave us COVID.

[1358] By the way, he and she were very incredibly kind.

[1359] Super nice.

[1360] Uneffected.

[1361] I teased him about being the richest man in the world.

[1362] He took him a good humor.

[1363] And what's funny is I had hung out with him years ago After I quit Chappelle's show When I was on that tour that I was telling you about That was a tough one We hung out on a tour bus And he says to me that night When he's all together Here in Austin he goes I met you before I have no recollection And he looked kind of hurt It was a long time ago There was like two, three companies ago I just thought it was funny That he was the richest man in the world I think these, whether the people that are complaining that he's going to be on live, I think what's going on now is like they want someone to be 100 % compliant to whatever ideology they're a part of.

[1364] And any deviation of that is problematic, whether it's because they think, like I saw an article that said Elon Musk donated $150 million to some charity and they called him a cheapskate.

[1365] It's hilarious.

[1366] How hilarious is that?

[1367] Wait until they see when I'm a billionaire.

[1368] Get ready for this cheap skate.

[1369] No, my brother.

[1370] But it's, it was such a shitty article.

[1371] It's just a poorly written knucklehead article.

[1372] Yeah, it's, again, like you say, no one can be woke enough.

[1373] You know, I'm torn because I like a warrior for a good cause, but I'm really in the tactics.

[1374] You're not going to nag people into behaving.

[1375] Right.

[1376] In a way that's, you know, in fact, if you continue with this tone, even if you're right, you'll be very hard to hear.

[1377] Yeah, I think so.

[1378] And it's just, I don't mean, maybe it was the COVID thing, like I'm saying.

[1379] But again, if I think back on his statements, I don't think they were particularly insensitive.

[1380] I think they were just, you know, it was more of like a factual bluntness to the way he discusses things.

[1381] Because he's a, he's a numbers guy.

[1382] He looks at things in terms of equations.

[1383] I mean, he's trying to put people on Mars.

[1384] You know what I mean?

[1385] I remember seeing him on your show once, just like on one of these YouTube clips.

[1386] But I dug the clip.

[1387] There was just one sound bite.

[1388] He said, I have so much in my mind.

[1389] Yeah.

[1390] You remember this?

[1391] Yeah.

[1392] Because I asked him, I'm like, what's it like to be you?

[1393] Like, what's it like just thinking?

[1394] He was, you wouldn't want to be me. I remember, yeah, yes.

[1395] It wasn't bragging.

[1396] It was just like he's being honest.

[1397] Like you wouldn't want this.

[1398] His brain.

[1399] is like a hurricane.

[1400] Like this just ideas like like you could see it while he's sitting there he's trying to sit here and just have a conversation with you and he's probably going over fucking equations and thinking about concepts and new ideas and plotting things and I remember talking to somebody once I'm not going to say who but they go more than half the people on earth live on a dollar a day and at least half of them are happy He says, I know 20 billionaires And all of them are miserable Wow This is reminiscent of a thing my father He should tell me about Just the nature of money And what do you want your life to be about?

[1401] Now, I mean, I'm a lucky guy I've met some billionaires You know, I don't know who's brimming with having us Elon's saying that you had a good time that night Kanye sometimes he's having a great time But I don't know When they're having fun if it's the money that's doing it.

[1402] No, it's probably not.

[1403] The money give you a certain amount of freedom to do whatever you want to do, but it also comes with so much pressure, so much responsibility and so much scrutiny.

[1404] Think about how many people are looking at every single thing that Elon does.

[1405] Like this Saturday Night Live thing is a perfect example.

[1406] They've just decided that it's not good that he's on Saturday Night Live.

[1407] Maybe I'm wrong.

[1408] Maybe there is like a specific thing they're upset about, but I haven't heard it.

[1409] That's what I was, that's, I'm like literally asking.

[1410] I'm not indicting the cast members saying that I'm fond of all of them, but, but this one puzzles me. I see what I'm talking about, what I'm saying, I see people online going, what the fuck is this?

[1411] Like, it's not even people that were the cast members that were saying that.

[1412] It's just folks online that were upset.

[1413] And I'm like, I don't get it.

[1414] Like, why are you upset?

[1415] What do you think is in for Elon?

[1416] Like, if I was the richest man in the world, what I do, send in a live?

[1417] I don't know.

[1418] I mean, I might, just because I love comedy so much.

[1419] But what do you think?

[1420] I guess he loves comedy.

[1421] Yeah, he loves comedy.

[1422] Yeah, he does.

[1423] I've seen him at the store a bunch of times.

[1424] Yeah.

[1425] Yeah.

[1426] Is it cool?

[1427] Probably cool.

[1428] That's probably the thought.

[1429] Oh, I thought it'd be cool.

[1430] Yeah.

[1431] I'll do it.

[1432] They probably called them.

[1433] Saturday Night Live wants to know if you want to host Saturday Night Live?

[1434] Oh, okay.

[1435] He probably just said, okay.

[1436] Yeah, there's something about that that's endearing.

[1437] It's going to be interesting to watch his monologue.

[1438] I'm going to watch.

[1439] Oh, yeah.

[1440] Depending on where that fight is.

[1441] I've got to watch that Canello.

[1442] Oh, that's this.

[1443] Saturday, right?

[1444] Cannell Sanders.

[1445] Hopefully they won't be against each other.

[1446] Is that fight out here in Texas?

[1447] Dallas, yeah.

[1448] Oh, shit.

[1449] 70 ,000 cap.

[1450] Oh, 70 ,000 people.

[1451] Holy shit.

[1452] Country's about to open up, man. It's open.

[1453] I did Jacksonville, Florida.

[1454] We did the UFC a couple weeks ago.

[1455] Holy shit, it was wild.

[1456] 15 ,000 people.

[1457] Oh, yeah.

[1458] I'm scared to go to Florida.

[1459] It was wild.

[1460] It was wild.

[1461] You probably see that corona cloud from space in Florida.

[1462] This motherfucker's been out there getting it.

[1463] It was interesting.

[1464] Interesting.

[1465] Nobody had a mask on.

[1466] It was like there was no COVID.

[1467] You go everywhere you go.

[1468] People were just out there walking around, normal.

[1469] Remember the last time when I was here when we were doing the shows together.

[1470] And gosh, remember we increased the caps.

[1471] So maybe we're up to like 700 people a night on a busy night, right?

[1472] And we must have tested a few thousand people that week.

[1473] I don't know that we got a single positive that week.

[1474] I think we did.

[1475] I think we got out of all the weeks we did it.

[1476] we only got like four positive tests out of thousands of people that's when it was like okay this is it was I just remember feeling like well we're going to do the MGM that's going to get wild David that's going to get wild David Joe let me tell you something that gig I know I'm not going to say the dates but I know we're talking about doing another two dates yeah towards the end of the summer I'm very excited I'm very excited too we're going to get wild Wild.

[1477] Yeah.

[1478] Oh, it's a fight weekend, too.

[1479] Oh, yeah.

[1480] Yeah, it's UFC weekend.

[1481] This McGregor's fighting, right?

[1482] Connor and Dustin Poirier.

[1483] Who's Dustin Poirier?

[1484] Dustin Poirier's the last guy who beat Connor.

[1485] He knocked him out.

[1486] Oh, so it's his rematch.

[1487] Yeah, they fought twice.

[1488] One time, I think, six years ago, Connor knocked him out, and then he just knocked out Connor.

[1489] Oh, they traded knock.

[1490] This is a good one.

[1491] Oh, it's a real good one.

[1492] Maybe I'll stay an extra night.

[1493] Fuck, yeah.

[1494] Washington.

[1495] You know, I've never been doing an MMA fight.

[1496] What?

[1497] That's outrageous.

[1498] This is the one to go to.

[1499] It's funny, man. I'm such a boxing thing because it's the gentleman's sport.

[1500] You know what I mean?

[1501] MMA, all that grounded, pounded shit.

[1502] It's like really intense.

[1503] I remember talking to you one night at the store.

[1504] You were like, Dave, I see so much violence.

[1505] I'm starting to worry about myself.

[1506] Do you know what I?

[1507] Yeah.

[1508] I worry because people get hurt and it doesn't bother me. Yeah, that's normal.

[1509] Yeah, that's a tough one.

[1510] This is one of the things that happened.

[1511] My wife cut her head.

[1512] She had like a hatchback.

[1513] You know, the car thing was up.

[1514] and she was pulling something out of the car and didn't realize that the corner of the, she miscalculated and it stood up and it dug right into her head and blood was pouring down her forehead and I was like, handle it, bro.

[1515] I just looked at it.

[1516] I was like, that's nothing.

[1517] It's nothing.

[1518] She's like, what are you talking about?

[1519] All this blood?

[1520] I go, it's a tiny cat.

[1521] It's nothing.

[1522] And I'm like, oh, Jesus.

[1523] Like, what's wrong with me?

[1524] Like, it does, I'm so accustomed to people being broken.

[1525] I'm so accustomed to las or, and concussions and broken bones and blood all over the place.

[1526] I'm so accustomed to blood.

[1527] That's crazy.

[1528] Like, I can't even conceive this.

[1529] It's a weird thing because I've definitely become desensitized.

[1530] I've seen, I don't know how many thousands of fights up close.

[1531] I've seen so many people get fucked up.

[1532] And then there's my time from being a young guy and competing in martial arts tournaments and seeing so many people get fucked up there.

[1533] So I've just seen my whole life People get fucked up If you had like a If there was like a chart Of all the people throughout history I've seen people get fucked up Like just the fuck beat out of them I'm right up there I'm at the Genghis Khan level Yeah it's not like a lot of people That have probably ever lived Other than like warriors Who fought with swords and shit There's not a lot of people In the modern era I've seen as many people Get the fuck beat out of them as me In person That is a crazy thing It's crazy Yeah yeah super desensitized to violence and and injuries it's real strange do you think you'd ever come back from it you think if you took a break no and someone's skin in there you'd be like ow i'm too used to it and then there's hunting you know so i'm used to it with animals i'm used to taking animals apart okay yeah see that's that's some next level shit yeah yeah yeah you get used to things like that People get desensitized, like doctors talk about that, like trauma room surgeons, stuff like that.

[1534] They talk about that.

[1535] They get very desensitized injuries.

[1536] I remember talking to a doctor once about just that, but this conversation was more about from their work realizing the fragility of life.

[1537] It's fragile.

[1538] Yeah, humans are fragile.

[1539] Very fragile.

[1540] We're so easy to injure.

[1541] You know, it's so easy to hurt people.

[1542] But, and not just physically, you know, emotionally.

[1543] Emotionally and...

[1544] Yeah, I don't know, bro.

[1545] I feel like recently our country is, our biggest export is heartbreak.

[1546] Like, we got to do better than this.

[1547] Not just our country, the whole world.

[1548] Yeah, but we...

[1549] Emotional heartbreak, like emotional pain being given out online.

[1550] That would be interesting to see.

[1551] Like, the emotional impact of, like, online interaction.

[1552] and harassment and people just fighting with each other online, how much different the emotional content of, like, online interactions, how much of an impact that's had on human beings, if that could be measured, if, like, there was a number that you could attach to it.

[1553] Quantify, but I tell you what, I tell you what, it's a weird thing, but with comedy, most comedians that I know, and in a matter of fact, this even goes with proficiency.

[1554] to a degree.

[1555] The more proficient they are, usually somewhere, you can see that they're wildly sensitive or empathetic.

[1556] They do have a profound acuteness to how, awareness of how they make other people feel.

[1557] Yeah.

[1558] Yeah.

[1559] You know, people would think comedians are callous and, but it is.

[1560] Mostly not.

[1561] They're not.

[1562] Mostly not.

[1563] But sometimes they appear callous because they'll go after somebody just for the laugh.

[1564] Yeah, but I don't even know that that's callous.

[1565] It's almost like, well, I got to sacrifice you for the joy of the rest of the room.

[1566] That's what it is.

[1567] Comedy without victims can be boring.

[1568] Sometimes people got to take a hit.

[1569] I once roasted a guy that both lost his, he lost both his legs in the war.

[1570] And I roasted him.

[1571] Wow.

[1572] Yeah, the crowd was uncomfortable.

[1573] I bet.

[1574] Him and his buddies were laughing so fucking hard because it was one of those things where you're like, I don't know if I should talk about that, but we, yeah, let me just, and then this guy was dying to talk about it.

[1575] It had a real interesting story, like, you know, met the president many times and was like, you know, he sacrificed everything for the country, but his sense of humor was paramount.

[1576] Like, he survived this thing, and I can tell that his sense of humor was very instrumental in doing it.

[1577] And the laugh that we had together, that was one of those special nights who was like, you know, people that people are dope.

[1578] people are dope you know for the most part people are dope and they're dope when you're in front of them they're dope people to people you know look at each other's eyes being around each other I think it's part of the problem that we're dealing with with the online shit is that all the normal cues of looking at someone and saying and talking to them being right there it's not there so you have this ability to write things in text and say mean shit to people and you think it's okay because you don't see him cry.

[1579] You don't see them cry.

[1580] You don't feel their pain.

[1581] You're just pushing buttons.

[1582] You just pushing buttons.

[1583] Metaphorically and literally.

[1584] Yeah, that's what it is.

[1585] How do you like doing this podcast that you're doing?

[1586] It's very good, by the way.

[1587] It's very interesting because it's produced.

[1588] Like you have music and it's edited.

[1589] It's like it's a different thing.

[1590] It's dope.

[1591] Now, there's a weird reason why it's done that way because ultimately they'll all exist on vinyl.

[1592] Oh.

[1593] So that's why the shows are the duration that they are so that they can fit on signs of vinyl.

[1594] Oh.

[1595] It's a while, you know, I'm curious to see how people will react to it, but I love doing it.

[1596] They're going to love it.

[1597] The people that I'm working with, you know, Yassim Bey, formerly known as most deaf Talib Quali, these guys are like great, great friends of mine.

[1598] They're great artists.

[1599] And, you know, it's like you.

[1600] I could talk to you guys for every day.

[1601] about a diversity of stuff.

[1602] Yeah.

[1603] And so in that sense, it was a joyful experience.

[1604] It was during COVID.

[1605] And the whole concept or the genesis of the show was just literally us find an excuse to be together.

[1606] You know, everyone's always so busy, you know, as we get mature in the business, and we got kids, and we got this, and we got that.

[1607] And we never catch up as much as we should.

[1608] Yeah.

[1609] And I'm telling you, in this season, when we keep losing people that, important to our culture and important to our community it was almost like an emergency like yeah why are we fucking around let's just do something together it was one of these things definitely went about the money or anything like that but it was about you know spending time of your friends and as you well know there's art form of conversation yeah you know you're very you're graded it you know most quality I could talk them forever they're well read they're well traveled and they're hilarious dudes and they got an interesting perspective now some friends you have you know you go around the world and you you don't see each other often but when you see each other it's like you'd seen each other just a moment ago and you can download all these obscure and wild experiences and it's safe and it's comfortable and there's no judgment in it because you're friends you're truly friends and that's the way I feel about those guys and I think that's one of the things that makes the show so special like fun to do I look forward to it yeah that's everything you enthusiasm is contagious if you're having an enthusiastic conversation with someone that's one of the things that makes it interesting to listen to because like when you're listening it's like like you're a fly on the wall that's what people like about a good conversation you could be in the room without being in the room you're here and like there's folks listening to us right now in traffic and they're here right they're here right there's no that much different I mean they don't see us if they're driving but maybe they're watching it on the video if it's not much different than sitting in the room is there's a missing element because you're not physically here but it's pretty damn good in terms of the ability to be a part of a conversation and it changes the way you look at things because if you you the more people that I can talk to and get their take on how they think and how they do it enhances my own way of looking at things and talking to people yeah and that's that's again, the big problem with all the lip button in there.

[1610] I kind of like hearing all these different perspectives, whether I agree with them or not.

[1611] You can't silence people.

[1612] You've got to let them fuck up.

[1613] If they fuck up, and you know, there's nothing wrong with apologizing either.

[1614] If you fuck up and you say something wrong, it's nothing wrong with apologizing.

[1615] I don't disagree with it.

[1616] I think context is everything.

[1617] It depends on where I am when I said it.

[1618] Yes.

[1619] Yeah.

[1620] You know what I mean?

[1621] If I'm on a comedy stage and you fucking print a joke I wrote like, it was a stump speech.

[1622] That's a fucked up thing to do.

[1623] It's a fucked up thing to do.

[1624] Yeah.

[1625] And, you know, but, you know, if I'm at a press conference and I'm whoopsie -poopsie, and there you go.

[1626] Sorry, everybody.

[1627] Yeah.

[1628] Whoops.

[1629] Well, it's just, you know, especially with stand -ups.

[1630] I mean, Jesus Christ, how many times is stand -ups just going out to dinner, having a couple of drinks, we say the most ridiculous shit ever?

[1631] It's the greatest.

[1632] That's like one of the joys of my life.

[1633] Now, think about being a politician.

[1634] who was signing up for that shit now all these republicans talking all that shit and i'm not trying to be partisan but when the motherfuckers rushed the capital did any of you guys go to greet your constituents no you ran to the bunker yeah i feel like you know but constituents aren't like fans did you ever see those videos of cops opening the doors and letting people in and opening the gates and letting people through i did what the fuck is that I don't know.

[1635] In fact, there was an investigation about that.

[1636] I don't know the results of it, but I'd heard about it.

[1637] You know, what's ominous about it is you've got to think there's probably like 300 cops on duty, Capitol Hill, right?

[1638] By the end of it, the D .C. police get called in, Homeland Security gets calling, you know, FBI's.

[1639] So now there's a thousand guns inside of the Capitol.

[1640] You know, it could have went a million different ways.

[1641] you have members accusing other members of Congress of giving tours and showing people's sensitive areas and you know this kind of suspicion within law enforcement within government it's a very ominous sign this type of partisanship is a very ominous sign that you know this lexicon now so binary Republican Democrat Republican Democrat that's not doing us any favors you know that in a perfect world the best idea wins and in this current situation I don't know that people even agree on what the truth is that's a problem it's a real problem Chris Rock had a great bit about it remember that bit about gangs like that people just join gangs no yeah what do you say it's just a I don't want to fuck it up but it's basically how whether they're a Democrat or a Republican they really just get into gangs it is that Yeah.

[1642] They just decide that this is my, this is my gang.

[1643] Right.

[1644] And their constituents are worried that they're feckless.

[1645] And like you say, the speed of information is so much faster now than the speed of bureaucracy.

[1646] Yeah.

[1647] That's a problem.

[1648] It'd be like if you turned the air condition on your car and it came on four months later.

[1649] We needed the, we needed the heat right now, bro.

[1650] Especially with the stimulus checks, right?

[1651] Like, how long did it take before they actually sent checks out in the mail?

[1652] Remember all the talk about it?

[1653] Oh, I do.

[1654] Took forever.

[1655] I wonder why they never, I guess I know why.

[1656] I was going to say, this is a stupid question, why they never suspended the gift tax?

[1657] Like if I wanted to give my brother or my sister or my friends some money during the time like this, why tax that transaction?

[1658] They want the money.

[1659] Well, not just they want the money.

[1660] Think about how rich people would move their money around.

[1661] Of course.

[1662] If they unfettered that shit.

[1663] It's the greed.

[1664] It's killing us.

[1665] Their greed, our greed.

[1666] It's killing us.

[1667] It's not good.

[1668] No, it's not good at all.

[1669] but you know it's again like what we were talking about before like you would give the taxes up if you felt like it was for something right it really felt like it did like if you knew that your tax money was really enhancing the world really helping instead of going to some fucked up we're bringing crowns to the ghetto what why are you doing that with the money because kids meet crowns in the ghetto it's like who's prioritizing the shit I don't know bro I mean Not to be cynical, but this thing, this thing, this thing, this one we're doing now.

[1670] I hope everyone does anything that they can do to help foster trust amongst each other.

[1671] Yeah.

[1672] I'm not talking about government and politics.

[1673] I don't give a fuck of someone likes Trump or anything.

[1674] I know a lot of good, decent, hardworking people that have political ideas that I think are nonsense.

[1675] sense.

[1676] But I don't, I don't conflate that with their character.

[1677] I don't conflate that with culture.

[1678] These things are all different issues.

[1679] You know, what they say, throw the baby out of the bathroom.

[1680] They can't do that.

[1681] Like, I'm not going to throw a whole person away because they have four ideas I don't like.

[1682] I just hope that if the economy can bounce back, people will start to relax again.

[1683] And if, uh, not just vaccines, but also some form of effective therapy, so that even if someone's not vaccinated and they get COVID, there's a very effective way to treat it if that does happen all right what about this this is what if say they didn't cure COVID they had no vaccine in nothing it was just like call it six months ago right but during that time they stumbled onto a cure for AIDS do you stay in or do you go out stay in it or go out what do you mean stay inside or do you go out that COVID's still out there but AIDS is cute oh I keep going out yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah I keep going out yeah yeah I keep going Yeah, no, hey, it's break out that disco ball.

[1684] We're going to the goddamn disco.

[1685] Fuck over the 19.

[1686] The real problem is if it becomes some, like, not even COVID, but something else, it's worse.

[1687] Like some really bad one, like a Spanish flu, like something that kills a large percentage of the people that get it.

[1688] This one's pretty bad, though.

[1689] But it was less than 1%.

[1690] I'm talking about something that kills 10%, 20%.

[1691] Jesus, I couldn't imagine.

[1692] Those are real.

[1693] I mean, those have existed throughout history.

[1694] This one, when we say it's pretty bad, it's pretty bad, but it's pretty bad because of the sheer numbers of human beings.

[1695] We got lucky in the sense that, I mean, obviously not lucky for anybody who died, and nothing but love and respect to all those people that lost loved ones.

[1696] That's right.

[1697] But we're talking about just raw numbers, and I think this is also what got Elon in trouble.

[1698] When you look at the 99 point, whatever it is, percentage of people to survive when they get it, especially when they're young, especially people with no comorbidities.

[1699] That is a relatively mild pandemic in comparison to what's happened in history.

[1700] If you look at any sort of real plague, like horrific ones, again, like the Spanish flu.

[1701] I mean, this last one, New York City, for a month straight, lost 2 ,000 people a day.

[1702] It's hard to wrap my mind around that.

[1703] It's hard to wrap your mind around.

[1704] I met some woman who was an ER nurse in New York, you know, who had a witness.

[1705] The carnage up close.

[1706] I couldn't, I mean.

[1707] There was a lot of mistakes made that.

[1708] I wonder if they would go back.

[1709] First of all, the respirators.

[1710] Remember when they were all looking for respirators?

[1711] Yeah.

[1712] Like, New York City needs respirators.

[1713] Then they realized, no, no, no. Respirators kill people.

[1714] Right.

[1715] I do remember this.

[1716] Yeah, they didn't know.

[1717] But that's the thing with COVID.

[1718] Like, nobody.

[1719] It's like getting COVID.

[1720] When I got COVID, the first few days, like, you just sit around and wait to see what it'll do to you.

[1721] You know what I mean?

[1722] And I was incredibly lucky.

[1723] I was largely asymptomatic.

[1724] you know so I was smoking cigarettes the whole time the whole shit but I was waiting to get flattened how many days did it take before he tested negative maybe inside of 10 inside of 10 days like whatever my immune system did that shit worked and you take vitamins do you take care of the shit matter of fact you gave me a vitamin regimen I took it very seriously I took all that shit oh good yeah what was it zinc and all the Corsetton, yeah, I took the shit.

[1725] D3.

[1726] You know, whether that was what was doing it or not, I don't know, but I did it.

[1727] Well, it most certainly would help.

[1728] It didn't hurt me. Yeah, it didn't hurt you.

[1729] It didn't hurt me. And like I said, I was largely asymptomatic, so, you know, I felt very lucky.

[1730] But there was other people that I knew in that same outbreak, you know, and they had a tough time with it.

[1731] Everyone, thank God, it's healthy, but it's just not, you know, just doesn't do the same thing to everybody.

[1732] It doesn't.

[1733] And that's what's, I guess, vitamins are everything.

[1734] And that's one of the things that made me furious during this time that there was no emphasis on taking vitamins.

[1735] They didn't make it seem like it was a big deal.

[1736] And there was no emphasis on getting healthy and losing weight.

[1737] Not in the media, but, you know, every health, and, you know, again, this is the latest thing to say, but every health care professional I talk to because I have access to decent health care did bring up the importance of vitamins.

[1738] And when you said that, it wasn't like completely foreign to my ears.

[1739] I'd heard such thing.

[1740] You just gave me a very specific regiment.

[1741] And I tried it, and it worked.

[1742] It didn't hurt me. Yeah.

[1743] No, you cruise through it.

[1744] So did Donnell, which is hilarious.

[1745] I know, because he's in terrible shape.

[1746] If Will Smith thinks he's in terrible shape, he needs to take a look at Donnell.

[1747] For real.

[1748] I mean, oh, yeah, Will Smith did pose a dad -baud picture.

[1749] It's hilarious.

[1750] I'm not going to lie to you.

[1751] I'm in the worst shape of my life.

[1752] Oh, he's a funny dude.

[1753] A big smile on his face, though.

[1754] He's a funny dude.

[1755] Yeah.

[1756] Yeah, well, he's, I think what Will Smith is probably going to do.

[1757] Will Smith's one of those dudes that just, like, sets his mind to things.

[1758] I bet what he's going to do is take that photograph, and then you're going to see him four or five months from now, shredded.

[1759] That's what I bet.

[1760] Oh, yeah, I could see that happening.

[1761] Yeah, that's the motivation.

[1762] The motivation is he takes a pose, looks terrible, looks like shit, tells everybody, hey, this is the worst shape I've ever been in my life, and then he's like, all right, now it's go time.

[1763] Yeah, it's funny, he still looked like a movie star in bad shake.

[1764] How the fuck are you doing this, Will?

[1765] Remember when he played Ali?

[1766] It was amazing.

[1767] Dude, he looked great.

[1768] He looked fucking great.

[1769] Yeah, he did.

[1770] He looked great.

[1771] I mean, he got in tip -top Magoo shape.

[1772] He looked fucking fantastic in that movie.

[1773] If you think about even the courage he would take on a role like that.

[1774] How about Jamie Fox?

[1775] Who's he playing?

[1776] Tyson.

[1777] Yeah, okay, that's going to be dope.

[1778] Because Jamie, I'm sure probably by now, if he couldn't before it, can talk just like Mike Tyson.

[1779] Oh, yeah.

[1780] If I memorized the rhythm of Mike Tyson.

[1781] Oh, yeah.

[1782] And he'll probably look like him somehow.

[1783] Jamie's an alien.

[1784] He's so nice with it.

[1785] I remember watching Ray being like, I can't believe I know this dude.

[1786] And he was doing Ray Charles so good.

[1787] And then he took the sunglasses off.

[1788] I'm like, oh, he'd Jamie again.

[1789] He's so talented in every way.

[1790] He's so talented as a singer.

[1791] He's talented as a comedian.

[1792] He's talented as an actor.

[1793] He's just got a way.

[1794] He's got a thing.

[1795] There's no fat in his portrayals.

[1796] you know he just cuts through it it's clean he just knows how to do it he's also one of those feel good people yeah you know super positive yeah he's just fun to be around i never seen him as like a party pooper ever right he's fucking jacked right now is he really jacked yeah because he's building up to play tyson look at him geez louise yeah and you know he's not even done yet he's building up into Mike Tyson's shape yeah that's never going to happen to me by the way I got I got spoiled for a minute but I was like this is stupid you did you got pretty big for a while it was it was ridiculous what happened uh COVID well before COVID yeah I stopped working out in COVID last time I can remember being in a gym was like uh February 2020 you know what I mean And then after that, it was just like, you know, I was on the road.

[1797] I was in London.

[1798] Why did you get Jack, though?

[1799] What made you decide to start working out?

[1800] That Chappelle show shit, bro.

[1801] Yeah?

[1802] Yeah, I think, you know, honestly what I think one of the catalysts was, not the catalysts, but one of them was, the fact that they kept saying I smoked crack and I was a skinny dude and felt like I can't defend myself in this.

[1803] Like, I'm so skinny that this thing is believable.

[1804] That bugged the fuck out of it.

[1805] How many people said you smoke crack?

[1806] Was it in articles?

[1807] Like, what was it in?

[1808] I believe it was an article in Newsweek.

[1809] They didn't say I smoked crack.

[1810] It was some legal precision.

[1811] There was some guy saying, I'm not saying it was the drugs.

[1812] At the time, I wouldn't, you know, I wouldn't do nothing.

[1813] I was like, this is fucked up.

[1814] Yeah, crack.

[1815] That's one of those, like, if you were going to do something to ruin your life, that's the thing.

[1816] I mean, I was from D .C. Our mayor smoked crack.

[1817] The C. He seemed fine.

[1818] and it's not well it's just well it's just yeah wasn't that obscure it's poor people cocaine yeah that's exactly what it is um do you know who uh doctor carl hard is no he's a really interesting guy he's a a guy who is a clinical researcher and was real straight -laced but uh he was a university researcher I forget what university is yet I forget but Columbia brilliant brilliant guy I've had him on the podcast a couple times but was researching the effects of drugs and started realizing the depictions of drugs and drug use are all fucked up.

[1819] Like people have this distorted idea of what these drugs do to you.

[1820] Like he loves heroin.

[1821] And he talks about it.

[1822] Like he does heroin.

[1823] He snorts heroin all the time.

[1824] It's like pure heroin is wonderful.

[1825] He's like, it's great.

[1826] Like it enhances my relationship with my wife and, you know, he talks about trying pure cocaine and all these different drugs.

[1827] He's like, he does drugs all the time.

[1828] And he's a professor.

[1829] He's a professor at Columbia.

[1830] Oh, wow.

[1831] A brilliant guy.

[1832] And, like, it's tough to argue with him because he knows so much about drugs from the perspective of an actual researcher and plus a guy who actually uses them.

[1833] But goes out of his way to tell him he has dreads.

[1834] Like, he doesn't look like a typical professor in that sense.

[1835] It is, like, he looks like a cool guy.

[1836] But, wait, what is he a professor of exactly?

[1837] Yeah.

[1838] There you go.

[1839] Okay.

[1840] Psychology.

[1841] Psychologist, okay, so a psychiatrist prescribes drugs, correct?

[1842] But a psychologist diagnosis.

[1843] Mental illness.

[1844] Right, yeah.

[1845] Yeah, psychologists try to help you work through things, right?

[1846] Isn't that the idea?

[1847] Yeah, but this guy doesn't sound, he sounds like any functional drug addict I've ever met.

[1848] And in my line of work, I have met and do know many.

[1849] Yeah, but he's not a drug addict.

[1850] He's actually, in fact, purposely...

[1851] But he just said he does drugs all the time.

[1852] It does, whatever drugs he wants.

[1853] Let me guess.

[1854] He can quit any time he wants.

[1855] He's actually put himself through withdrawals on purpose to document it.

[1856] So he's put himself into a situation where he, like, he did heroin multiple days in a row to a point where his body became physically addicted and then got off of it just to document what the withdrawal process is actually like.

[1857] And he says it's like having a flu.

[1858] This is the most clever drug addict of a herd up.

[1859] I'm not sick.

[1860] I'm documenting sickness.

[1861] It's crazy.

[1862] Yeah.

[1863] I don't know, bro.

[1864] I think that shit, I've seen so many wonderful people that I'll never know in the same way again.

[1865] Because of drugs.

[1866] Because of drugs.

[1867] That's true.

[1868] It's heartbreaking.

[1869] But what makes one person fall apart due to drugs and another person not?

[1870] That's where it gets tricky.

[1871] Because some of it's biological.

[1872] Some of it's.

[1873] Right.

[1874] But it's just like, And why did I feel fine in 2 ,000 people a day in New York?

[1875] I mean, don't start because I know the fat people are like hot cakes.

[1876] There was a lot of things going on in New York.

[1877] It wasn't just the obesity, but I have a friend who was a doctor there, and he did say it was a lot of obese people, unfortunately.

[1878] If he eat bad food, bad things happen.

[1879] And that's just the reality of being a human being.

[1880] I mean, but I also think it's the reality of being a drug addict.

[1881] Right.

[1882] Take bad drugs, bad things happen.

[1883] Right, this shit is nothing to play with that.

[1884] And how many minds are strong enough like this professor to responsibly do hard drugs?

[1885] Yeah.

[1886] This is a rare, it's like an X -Men superpower.

[1887] Well, he's also a guy who understands the actual physical reaction these chemicals and compounds have on the brain and on the body.

[1888] He knows it from like, you know, an academic perspective.

[1889] I mean, and Michael Jackson OD by drugs that was administered by a physician.

[1890] Well, that was weird shit, right?

[1891] Yeah, it was.

[1892] Imagine the kind of stress that that guy was under?

[1893] He was under so much stress he had to get anesthetized every night.

[1894] Yeah, I couldn't imagine anything Michael Jackson did.

[1895] Once he bought that first giraffe, I was like, you're on a whole new level, bro.

[1896] I don't know what any, I don't know any of the emotional content of a guy's life like that.

[1897] There's people that were pioneers in the fame game.

[1898] And you think about Michael Jackson's one of them.

[1899] Elvis is another one.

[1900] There's people that were pioneers in being super famous to the point where nobody had been super famous like Michael Jackson before Michael Jackson.

[1901] I don't know that anyone ever will again be what he was.

[1902] Or Elvis was or the Beatles were.

[1903] It's a different thing.

[1904] No, I think that shit is done.

[1905] Yeah, maybe.

[1906] It's a different thing.

[1907] I can't think of one thing that everyone will agree on that much ever again in this context I remember Michael Jackson I've told this before but Michael Jackson I was listening to WBCN the Rock of Boston and they were going to look I know this isn't rock but it's so fucking good we're going to play it anyway and they played Michael Jackson oh that's it's that good it was that good yeah so good they played it on rock stations he was ubiquitous yeah I mean, you know, who knows what the fuck that scope is like.

[1908] The closest thing that I've ever, like, seen of that up close would be like Eddie.

[1909] Yeah.

[1910] One of the guys who's been, you know, on that level.

[1911] Yeah.

[1912] And Eddie is a cool motherfucker.

[1913] In fact, if you're in his orbit, it feels normal in there.

[1914] Yeah.

[1915] Go to his house and bowl and talk shit and, you know, his kids come in and out.

[1916] You know, it's just like a...

[1917] It seems like a sitcom, but it's really hilarious.

[1918] Eddie got the heat.

[1919] He's funny as fuck, bro.

[1920] Can talk like anybody.

[1921] Says wildly imaginative things.

[1922] Why do you think he doesn't do stand -up?

[1923] You know, this shit ain't no bicycle, man. You know what I mean?

[1924] He's an anomaly in the sense that I'm sure it would come right back to him.

[1925] Like, when he cuts up in the house, It should be real funny.

[1926] But I don't know what it would mean.

[1927] I don't know what it means to him, having been this person with his right.

[1928] Well, it's also, he feels like his material when he goes back and watches raw, he's like kind of embarrassed by it.

[1929] He's, you know, that it's...

[1930] You know, it's funny when I put out my first two Netflix joints, my name was on Kimmel.

[1931] It was the only press I did.

[1932] But there was a thing going on in the press where everyone was saying that the specials were dated.

[1933] you know, because there were jokes in there that they considered transphobic, you know, and I still don't think those jokes are transphobic.

[1934] You know, I'm not going to have that discussion, but if I ever have to, boy, I'm ready.

[1935] But the point is, the point is that the thing I said to Kimmel was, I don't get mad at a photograph because it wasn't taken today.

[1936] In other words, whatever was going on in 87 when he laid that set down, it was working in 87.

[1937] That's where people are at.

[1938] And a good comedian is an indicator of the time or their context.

[1939] And I look at Eddie's shit like that.

[1940] Like, I wouldn't look at any of his old material as embarrassing.

[1941] Sometimes I'm starting, well, I could never do that now.

[1942] Right.

[1943] But it makes it even more fun to see that there was this time when he was just saying these things.

[1944] You know, I'm a comedian.

[1945] I don't smell any malice in it.

[1946] I don't think he's trying to hurt anybody.

[1947] No. It's just, this guy is just cracking.

[1948] He was doing comedy that was relevant during the time that he was doing it.

[1949] The world was a different place.

[1950] Right, and it's not irrelevant now.

[1951] The thing that's remarkable is he's a different guy now, which is why he feels embarrassed.

[1952] It's not even about what happens to the world.

[1953] What happened to this guy in the world?

[1954] He sees the world different now, and this happens.

[1955] Crazy thing is he doesn't look a day older.

[1956] It looks great.

[1957] He looks amazing.

[1958] He looks great.

[1959] Yeah, it's amazing.

[1960] One time I was watching TV with Eddie And Sanford's son rerun was on And he says I was old now His Red Fonx was in this episode Sam for the Sun That's crazy Right And I look at the television I look at Eddie I'm like damn He goes yeah I'm as old now It was Carol O 'Connor was And all in the family You think how Archie Bunker look That's crazy look terrible That's crazy.

[1961] You look terrible.

[1962] There goes Eddie looking like it's 1987 a shit.

[1963] That's crazy.

[1964] Yeah.

[1965] That is wild.

[1966] Yeah, he's just taking so good care of himself.

[1967] What does he do?

[1968] Does he exercise a lot?

[1969] No, I have no idea.

[1970] It's like Prince.

[1971] You know, I've never seen Prince eat or drink anything.

[1972] I'm sure he does it.

[1973] I don't know what Eddie does.

[1974] He bowls.

[1975] He's a family guy and stuff like that.

[1976] Like, he's really into his family.

[1977] It's good to see.

[1978] it's normal bro like like for all the things you know for all the things you'll hear about Hollywood I'm always startled how normal everybody is I don't know if it's just the angle I get to see or but all that pageantry and shit that's completely unsustainable nobody can do that all the time yeah somewhere somehow you're just going to be yourself isn't it weird that that's what we think about when we think about Hollywood we think about red carpets and people with tuxedos on and ridiculous watches and purses and all just standing there on the red carpet it's a tough one it's weird i mean i don't knock and by the way i don't knock anybody for doing that at all i don't think but that you know that ain't what we do no i'm not interested no it's fun sometimes it's it's just so weird it's so different than real life yeah but in a weird way that is their real life that's a work thing it's a peak work thing it's like this is peak glam but this thing where and I think this is changing in the culture remember there was this thing about celebrities could never be unhappy yeah fuck that man that's that's you know I'm not saying they should display that but just assume everybody has a bad day right fuck that red carpet face I don't want to make that fucking face for the rest of my life.

[1979] Yeah.

[1980] Like that.

[1981] I think, you know, as I get older, I'm overwhelmed by how human we all are.

[1982] It really makes me like people more and forgive people more.

[1983] That's important.

[1984] That's everything.

[1985] Forgive people.

[1986] And forgive yourself.

[1987] Yeah, forgive yourself.

[1988] I just think that the, I don't know, in this season of my life, I'm into hopefully I'll do something I will make this mean something other than just the trappings of success how hot my whip is or you know how pretty my bitch is and all this stupid shit that we have been trained to focus on I wanted to be better than that what do you want to do?

[1989] Do you have an idea?

[1990] I have some ideas nothing I would really want to.

[1991] I don't want to make any public declarations because then I'm going to have to do the shit.

[1992] as just a general rule, by the way, there's so many surprising ways that you can be of use to people.

[1993] Not big things.

[1994] Everyone always trying to hit a homer, but sometimes it's smile you muster for a person, you know.

[1995] It's a lot of things you can do.

[1996] I just try to, you know, walk softly on the earth and have some fun.

[1997] Yeah, you know.

[1998] But I just know that investing celebrity into getting more celebrity is a treadmill I don't feel interesting and run it on in the twilight of my life.

[1999] Right.

[2000] Yeah, fuck that.

[2001] Yeah, no, you get it.

[2002] You know what it's like to be famous.

[2003] Yeah, yeah.

[2004] And I'm not mad at fame.

[2005] When you say fame, I'm not mad at that.

[2006] Celebrity, well, that's the one.

[2007] What's the difference?

[2008] It's fine.

[2009] I was talking to the letterman about it.

[2010] Celebrity is the role.

[2011] That's the one on a red carpet.

[2012] You're famous.

[2013] It's not that you're not a celebrity, but it's not like you're sticking your pinky toe out on the red carpet.

[2014] You're not going to places and people saying, what are you wearing?

[2015] You didn't make your life about that.

[2016] You're not tethered to endorsements and this, that, and the other.

[2017] You're tethered to yourself, to your journey, to your life, which makes it meaningful.

[2018] Right.

[2019] You know, for you to talk the shit that you talk, Even in this context, there's a courageousness that you have to, you know, your subject to so much outside scrutiny, you know, but you do it anyway.

[2020] That's why it's courageous, you know, you're relentlessly yourself.

[2021] It takes, it, it takes, this is a practice skill.

[2022] This takes some consistency.

[2023] You have to choose in the beginning.

[2024] You have to take an inventory.

[2025] or you know who you actually are.

[2026] Some people think they're the famous guy.

[2027] Famous is your circumstances.

[2028] It's not necessarily who you are.

[2029] Trust me, when I left the show, I wasn't famous.

[2030] It was circumstances that I left behind.

[2031] I mean, I was famous, but it wasn't that thing.

[2032] Right.

[2033] It's different.

[2034] And I realized, you know, when we came up, we coveted that thing without even knowing what it was.

[2035] Well, because it seemed unattainable.

[2036] you would see other people that had it you know someone would show up at the club and walk through and you'd be like oh shit look at him everybody knows he is you know right but it was still an abstraction like you know right if Martin walks in and he's brimming with happiness right Martin walked Martin was the first guy that I ever saw that walked in with security hilarious I was like wow he's got security at the store and needed it probably oh yeah I people forgot how fucking strong Martin Lawrence was god damn his act was powerful I used to have to follow him Mitsy Shore was hilarious she used to always she thought you were funny she would put you on after the best comedians and just throw you right to the wolves she always thought it was funny so he always put me on after I was you know 27 26 years old whatever I was she would put me on after Martin Lawrence all the time and I would just bomb but that's what that's how you get great I remember the first time I met Martin.

[2037] I was in high school.

[2038] Wow.

[2039] I saw Martin do a show.

[2040] Him and Tommy Davis, this might be one of the best single comedy shows I've ever seen.

[2041] And it was like a local D .C. club.

[2042] Marlon Wayans was there.

[2043] He was going to college in D .C. at the time.

[2044] It was the night I met him.

[2045] And, man, first of all, Tommy Davidson went on.

[2046] He, man, this motherfucker Tommy can crack.

[2047] He's a funny, funny, funny, funny guy.

[2048] Great performer, great impressionist.

[2049] Every skill set that you could think of, he has an abundance.

[2050] And Martin was headlining.

[2051] I watched Tommy's show, and I was worried for the headliner.

[2052] When does that ever happen?

[2053] Lauren was fine.

[2054] Martin was fine.

[2055] Like the shit he did on that stage that night.

[2056] And this was like in the area that he grew up in.

[2057] So he had that set.

[2058] You know, there's probably a couple girls in high school that dissed him that was there and that kind of shit.

[2059] He did the thing, bro.

[2060] And I'm telling you, that Martin Lawrence was a beast.

[2061] He was a beast.

[2062] On stage.

[2063] People forgot for some reason.

[2064] Shit, I'll never, I'm from D .C., so I can't forget.

[2065] Like, when I was starting out, he was the local legend already.

[2066] Well, when I first came to L .A., it was in 94.

[2067] He was in his peak.

[2068] Oh, yeah, Jesus.

[2069] That was you so crazy days.

[2070] Yeah, that was some Elvis shit.

[2071] He was hosting Devjj, He had the sitcom.

[2072] Yep.

[2073] He was putting out specials and just started getting big in that movie game.

[2074] And when you watch his sitcom, people forget.

[2075] Like, he did a bunch of different characters on that show.

[2076] Like, it was all him.

[2077] The show was all him.

[2078] Yes, he was nice with it.

[2079] He was probably still nice with it.

[2080] I mean, I haven't seen Martin a long time.

[2081] I haven't seen him forever.

[2082] I ran into him at the store, like a few years back, which just briefly.

[2083] You know, he was doing a few sets.

[2084] every now and then he called me after i won the mark twain prize if you you know because i'm from dc i got to tell you this call it means a lot to me yeah he was yeah he was one of my early local heroes i came up on a good circuit too like wasn't boston but dc wanda sykes would start out with me pat nalswell was around you know tony woods martin lawrence timidavison uh there was some there was some great comics that's One thing the comedy always needs, you need to be around other great comics.

[2085] That's true, the circuit.

[2086] And back in those days, no internet, nothing.

[2087] Every city has some different energy.

[2088] And the comedians, they're like, it's always exciting to go to a city and check out the other acts.

[2089] Yeah.

[2090] Boston, like you say, well, that was one of those cities.

[2091] It was a weird city.

[2092] It was.

[2093] But it was a trap.

[2094] That was what we were talking about before.

[2095] Those guys can make six figures staying in town.

[2096] But that's what they did.

[2097] Because if they went on the road, they'd actually make less money.

[2098] What made you go to Hollywood?

[2099] Why didn't you fall for that?

[2100] I saw what they were doing.

[2101] And even though they were great comedians, I saw that they couldn't do the road.

[2102] And I was like, if you want to get on HBO or if you want to, you know, you have a special, you got to get out of town.

[2103] And the young guys coming up kind of saw the old guard that these, some of the best headleaders I've ever seen in my life.

[2104] I've seen Don Gavin have sets.

[2105] Steve Sweeney have sets I mean I would put those sets up against any comic I've ever seen ever You know it's funny the first night I saw Dane Cook They go yawn after so -and -so You know I was a cocky dude I don't worry about none of that shit But I heard the crowd scream so loud I thought they had introduced me Wow It was Dane he was just starting out These were crowd reactions This guy There was a thing in Boston Everyone was a room ripper like They were all about volume.

[2106] Intensity.

[2107] Yeah, Don Gavin.

[2108] That rapid -fire style, I'll never forget.

[2109] And then, in the midst of all that, you'd have a counterweight like Stephen Wright, this wonderfully understated deadpan comedian.

[2110] That shit was fired.

[2111] Boston was a good circuit.

[2112] Have you ever seen the documentary when stand -up stood out?

[2113] No. This is a comic named Franz Salameda.

[2114] He put together this documentary on Boston.

[2115] It's really good.

[2116] It just shows you what it was like back in those days.

[2117] Like, they kind of invented a movement.

[2118] There's really a lot of it was Barry Crimmons, rest in peace.

[2119] It was Barry Crimmons.

[2120] Barry Crimmons was like the godfather of Boston comedy in a lot of ways because he was just really brilliant guy, very politically savvy.

[2121] And he kept everybody from being a hack because everybody was scared of him.

[2122] He was like this fucking bold, bold guy who would go on stage and he had a jacket on.

[2123] pull Budweiser out of the inside pocket of his jacket and set it on the table.

[2124] He had like these things he would do, but it was a great comic, but maybe more important, he was like a cornerstone of the scene.

[2125] Like, if Barry didn't like you, you were fucked.

[2126] Right.

[2127] If Barry thought you were a hack, you were fucked.

[2128] And they didn't tolerate hacks.

[2129] He didn't tolerate thieves.

[2130] He was quality control.

[2131] Quality control.

[2132] Every circuit, I guess, needs to.

[2133] And it's the thing that Dan Cooks talked about this, too, that they were all men.

[2134] these guys were all these big guys they were all like six foot plus big burly guys who did a lot of coke and gotten street fights all those comics they weren't like nebishy comics who would you know talk about their insecurities they were wild dudes who were like rock stars I remember doing a show on Boston again I'm like saying things but I just remember seeing a guy who was heckling me and the security threw them down the steps yeah and I'd never seen anything like but so casually like this is what we do with trash like Jesus man Yeah there was a lot of violence in Boston It was it was a weird And I never really got a feel for that city I would meet these intellectuals and idiots In the same block The fuck is this place Well there was more colleges per capita In Boston than anywhere else in the country Yeah yeah I used to go up there And play college gigs all the time And you know I remember the Boston police felt particularly menacing.

[2135] Those fucking high boots they wear with no horse to match.

[2136] Fuck all.

[2137] You could stop a ass dude.

[2138] That's a weird city.

[2139] But then it produced so many great, you know, sources of comedy.

[2140] Even people who aren't from boss, a guy like Howard Stern that went to BU, a guy like Patrice O 'Neill came out of the hood, moved down to New York, and cleaned shit up out there.

[2141] It was an interesting scene.

[2142] Patrice is a similar type of thing, right?

[2143] He was like a cornerstone of comedy in New York.

[2144] When people talk about, like, people getting silly or being stupid, they go, God, I wish Patrice was here to see this.

[2145] Yeah, Patrice, yeah, he had that world -weary kind of swag about him.

[2146] Early on me and him didn't like get along, but we became friends.

[2147] Because this guy was like, he was, he was a real deal.

[2148] He was a real deal.

[2149] God, I wish he stayed alive.

[2150] I do, too, man. Oh, the comedy he would have put out during all this shit?

[2151] And, well, that's interesting because I don't know what would happen to a guy like him in this context.

[2152] He's not buckling.

[2153] I'll tell you that.

[2154] I know.

[2155] So I was there.

[2156] Right.

[2157] I don't know what's going to happen to him.

[2158] Yeah, it would be interesting to see.

[2159] It really would be.

[2160] You know, one can only imagine.

[2161] One can only imagine, but he was, man, he was something else.

[2162] He was funny dude.

[2163] I remember him and Kevin got to New York around the same time.

[2164] I just think Kevin was from Boston because I was.

[2165] I'd see them together so much.

[2166] I just so, and their arrival on the scene was like, both these guys, when they got on the scene, it was noticeable.

[2167] It wasn't like they came in quietly.

[2168] They was doing some shit.

[2169] That's another thing that every scene needs, every scene needs a rocket.

[2170] Yeah, someone that shakes shit up.

[2171] Yeah, like, whoa, like someone who's not stagnant, they're not complacent, they're going for it.

[2172] I got to tell you, New York City in the 90s, some of the greatest comedy I've ever seen.

[2173] It was weird, too, because I was one of those guys that would be in New York and then go out to L .A. A little earlier than everyone else.

[2174] Like, you know, I did Montreal, and then I'd go out for this and I go out for that.

[2175] And I started, you know, auditing both scenes.

[2176] You know, New York was like the dream.

[2177] but LA those comics were like the work ethics were different New York is right more you know in general if you do 10 spots in the night you come up with a new joke on the third show you got seven cracks at it by the end of the night even though you just thought of the thing is refined yeah that's a good point yeah L .A. didn't have any opportunity to do that's a different world right la people were so competitive about stage time they was that's just like the karate kid tournament these motherfuckers got killed every night sweep the leg but sense say you got a problem with that that's l .a no mercy l .a in the 90s was everybody trying to get a sitcom too that was part of the problem oh yeah it was a gold rush yeah they saw what happened with rosanne and jerry Seinfeld and i don't even know if that was coming completely from the comedians the studio system was so hungry for comedians to build these shows around yeah they would give you these crazy development deals yeah i you know i did a million of those that's it took me like 13 14 of them shits to be like man fuck that shit before you get a chapels show but the good thing that learned how television worked basically how it was supposed to work and what i'd like to do with it what was interesting is they basically gave you free money the people don't understand this like they would give you like a half a million dollars or a quarter million dollars and you would get this development deal and they'd attach you to a bunch of writers they put together a script and it may or may not go and if it didn't go you just got a free quarter million dollars and you worked on a script and maybe it went to pilot maybe it didn't yeah but if it didn't go you were a bad investment you had a couple of those in you and it could hurt it could you know if they ever look at you like you're a bum investment the thing was with me I was funny Yeah, but they didn't quite know what to do with me. Yeah.

[2178] And I didn't know either.

[2179] Yeah.

[2180] I don't know.

[2181] Those days of Montreal days were weird, right?

[2182] People go out there, just go out there to showcase.

[2183] Showcase their talent, try to get a deal.

[2184] And then, do you remember Chicken?

[2185] Do you remember that guy?

[2186] I do remember.

[2187] He got some huge deal.

[2188] Huge deal.

[2189] Mid -90s.

[2190] And it didn't.

[2191] Late 90s.

[2192] Flopped terribly.

[2193] Like, for whatever reason, they thought he was funny and nobody else did?

[2194] Yeah, the name Chicken should have tipped him off.

[2195] Maybe this is bad ideas.

[2196] Who should we make the checkout to?

[2197] Chicken.

[2198] Well, he had a big, crazy act.

[2199] It was like a lot of energy.

[2200] I never saw him work.

[2201] I saw him work.

[2202] I worked with him in Montreal.

[2203] But that name is stupid.

[2204] No disrespect chicken, but that's a stupid -ass name.

[2205] So it all fell apart, and then he wound up hanging himself in front of a school.

[2206] Oh, now you've got to bring that up.

[2207] I feel bad because I said, I just shouted out chicken and this niggas dead for five years.

[2208] Oh, my God.

[2209] But that's...

[2210] He hung himself in front of his school?

[2211] Yeah.

[2212] There you go.

[2213] Yeah.

[2214] Because of comedy?

[2215] It didn't work out.

[2216] It fell apart.

[2217] So, like, he thought he was on this rocket ship to fame.

[2218] Like, oh, my God, I got the biggest deal ever.

[2219] He got, like, the biggest development deal anybody had ever heard of.

[2220] I remember.

[2221] And then they were, like, they're going to make a show around him.

[2222] I forget what kind of show it was going to be.

[2223] And then it didn't work out.

[2224] And then he slowly faded.

[2225] away and then he vanished and then one day he killed himself how long after the deal fell apart quite a long time more than a decade he never got over the experience of almost making it i don't know who knows maybe he was mentally ill maybe he's suffering from depression from the beginning and maybe that big crazy wild act was his like so it may have not had anything to do with show business totally possible but it's not a good narrative the good narrative the show business got him right yeah but see if you find that guy.

[2226] I never saw a set.

[2227] I remember everyone in town was talking about, but I'd never seen him.

[2228] Comedians couldn't understand what was going on.

[2229] He would make a lot of noise and bounce around on stage and screaming and yelling and everybody's like, what is he doing?

[2230] I've seen a few comics like that.

[2231] They'll be killing though and I'll be like, I don't understand.

[2232] Well, the agents thought they had it.

[2233] They're like, this is it.

[2234] He's going to be huge.

[2235] We got him.

[2236] And, you know, they played against each other and got this giant deal.

[2237] This is tragic.

[2238] It's weird.

[2239] Now I'm mourning the loss of chicken.

[2240] I never even met this motherfucker.

[2241] There were quite a few people that thought they were going to be giant.

[2242] I remember quite a few people who got development deals and all of a sudden they had assistants.

[2243] Like, you know, like, you got an assistant.

[2244] People would show up with an assistant and someone would take notes while they're on stage and they'd have their coffee ready for them.

[2245] And they were, you know, they drove a Mercedes.

[2246] Great.

[2247] It's like, what are you doing?

[2248] You got a development deal.

[2249] My show's going to go.

[2250] It's a got a guarantee.

[2251] And then they do the pilot.

[2252] right that's why i call my company pilot boy you know how many of them fucking pilots i did it was like fuck this this is like gonna be for it was hell that's why you call it pilot boy that's hilarious development hell i spent like over a decade in my life thinking around with that that shit that's hilarious do you do you think you're gonna do more of these podcasts the ones that you uh have produced you gonna keep doing that i'd like to yeah yeah i think uh you know it's not like this gig you know what i mean it's as joyful as this like i talk to people i enjoy talking to you know i don't want to like tip my hand too much because i want people to like listen and see for themselves what it is i don't like describing it's like telling a girl how you're gonna fuck up before you do it yeah let's see what it feels like you know but but i enjoyed it man like again who i'm talking to i hope you do it one day you gotta hear it though you you love i've heard it I've heard episodes.

[2253] Oh, that's right.

[2254] When we were here, I played it.

[2255] I would love to do it.

[2256] I would definitely do it.

[2257] I love what you did in Yellow Springs, too, because you were the first guy to figure it out.

[2258] You were the first guy to say, you know what I'm going to do comedy.

[2259] We got to it early, man. When did you start?

[2260] Like, what was the first shows?

[2261] June 6th.

[2262] The first night was the night I did that video that was on YouTube, 846, that George Ford.

[2263] It was very first night.

[2264] 70 people maybe in Fire Baker Field.

[2265] Wow.

[2266] I was like, as soon as I, you know, what was happening, so many people in live entertainment were furloughed that I started finding out from the production world who had gotten furlough and I'd stop picking them up.

[2267] It was like, you know, and this is a lot of these people I'd pay them in cash because if I did it, you know, straight down the middle, they lose their benefits.

[2268] And if for any reason I had to cancel the shows, then they're just stranded with no benefits.

[2269] I couldn't do that.

[2270] Right.

[2271] So it was like at the 80s and shit.

[2272] I was paying everybody on the table, even though I wouldn't do anything illegal.

[2273] but you know and the night before the first show I was like a condemned man I had to put a call into the governor's office I'm not that I mean fucking nightclub comic I'm calling the governor I'm calling the governor and it was a it was a long shot but but shout out to governor DeWine he hit me back and he he let me do it because uh you know after that massacre and Dayton we had done a big thing that really I think really hope heal the community and because of that he was like okay I'll let you do it but the COVID protocols were so strict and we had to learn from scratch how to how to do it you know nothing's going to be perfect it's a pandemic everything you do is going to be risky but we had to figure out to do it as safe as possible within the within the parameters of guidelines that the government saw fit but we were able to work did you sell booze I don't know we had to give it away oh wow you know like you know there's a lot of stuff that we were building to the ticket the mask and all these things that you know we try to make accessible the shows are expensive produce so i i didn't make any money i'd lose money every night but you know here we are a year later i might be 105 shows ahead of everybody right right because i was working you stayed active yeah we you know we might have done like what we might have done a good a good 30 40 shows here yeah So it's that.

[2274] We found a way, and the best part, like I said, is we all got to be together.

[2275] So, you know, people would fly in from L .A. and New York, and we'd work three nights a week, and some people would stay, and we could chill because eventually we got access to testing.

[2276] That was the game changer.

[2277] So we test every day.

[2278] So when you first started out, there was no testing?

[2279] No, it was just, well, it was for the comedians.

[2280] you know but but the crowd it's like going to the grocery store you come at your own risk everyone mask up everyone was outside everyone was out everything was outside everything was probably socially distanced one of the things I learned early on is selling tickets and pairs you know that was a game changer because it allowed us to get more people in and um you know we it was it just made everything easier because you imagine if there's two single seats you can't put two strangers together in a time like this of course well you know it worked um as far as the audience was concerned not a single reported incident I've heard of someone getting sick infected in one of these shows we were very careful you know and then eventually you started testing the crowd right as testing got became more available in the beginning having tests was like oh my god can't believe we got our hands on these It was very difficult to get testing, and the test one is rapid.

[2281] It would take longer, so you wouldn't have time to test those people.

[2282] I mean, the staffing that you'd have to do to give, you know, a few hundred people test that takes 30 minutes for results.

[2283] And who has that kind of time?

[2284] Yeah.

[2285] Yeah, you can't wait 30 minutes.

[2286] Right.

[2287] You know, but now, like, you know, when we play in Vegas, we have the capacity.

[2288] We could test all 13 ,000 people and get them in a reasonable time.

[2289] Yeah.

[2290] It's crazy, but.

[2291] It's possible.

[2292] Yeah.

[2293] Now it is.

[2294] Early on the pandemic, there was, I think, like, you know, remember when Trump said something like, just stopped testing everybody?

[2295] Yeah.

[2296] I'm telling you from experience, that's a terrible, terrible idea.

[2297] It's a ridiculous thing to say.

[2298] Yeah, like, I can't believe that motherfucker was in charge at a time like that.

[2299] Who you saying?

[2300] That was a wild thing.

[2301] He was saying the reason the numbers are so high is because we're testing more people.

[2302] Yeah.

[2303] Yo, my man. Like, come on, let's think this through.

[2304] Well, that's just something.

[2305] Take a swig of ice all my fucking think about what you just said.

[2306] What the fuck is this guy talking about?

[2307] That's your leader.

[2308] It's so interesting that that guy's not on social media now.

[2309] They try to get back on Facebook.

[2310] And they're like, no, come back in six months.

[2311] It's like he was up for parole.

[2312] Yeah, you know, it's a weird thing being a community.

[2313] meeting because there's a thing about Trump that if the circumstances weren't so dire and the consequences so high that would have been hilarious to watch yeah yeah yeah but but man people died and countries all fucked up now and the capital looks like jail I know it's crazy it looks like a green zone now yeah I'm from DC I got to tell you that shit was particularly offensive to me yeah in DC that's the town business is government and those people that were in that building so many of them are people from them neighborhoods like it feels like you fuck my city up yeah it's just a scary precedent when you decide you're going to break down boundaries and you're going to rush the capital building and you're going to do it with no real plan and you're going to take pictures on Pelosi's desk with your feet up and take pictures holding the flag wearing a buffalo helmet right there's no one to negotiate with who should I talk to this motherfucker with the zip times or this bullwinkle nigga like who the fuck all these people man fuck these people you guys are fucking the country up changed everything one day one day changed everything because then people knew that that was possible that never happened yeah it didn't happen at the million -man march and they was ready for us but look at this shit and the president was the catalyst for it you know whether you want to say he's legally responsible or not that's fine but he did say go take the building back he got to be strong did he say go take the building back is that what he said he said you got to take our country bank he said got to be let me not put words in this fellow's mouth and I'm not I'm not an anti -Trump guy I'm not pro Annie like this shit is like theater to me I remember when he won you had a great speech he said let's give him a chance right and you know I said that because he was duly elected and stormed the Capitol and rub my shit on the wall so next day fucking stupid Did someone rub their shit on the wall?

[2314] I believe a person did It was his first time in the Capitol he got excited It's kind of amazing only one person got shot You know as sad as that was It is amazing because I mean that could have been A terrible Terrible terrible situation Yeah And miraculously You know It could have been so much worse If there was like carnage there, Jesus, because you know, man, if one shot went off in the wrong context, that whole building would have been lit up.

[2315] Yeah.

[2316] There were four or five different law enforcement departments in there by the end of it.

[2317] It's crazy.

[2318] You know, seeing your officials flee their constituents.

[2319] Well, that's crazy.

[2320] You know what's crazy is that was five months ago and they're still catching people.

[2321] Oh, that's.

[2322] That's not going to stop, I doubt.

[2323] I doubt that will stop.

[2324] They're getting people off of photographs, facial recognition software, videos, people turning their friends in.

[2325] Right.

[2326] This is all like, I'm in the shit, bro.

[2327] But hopefully it's a growing pain.

[2328] And on the other side of this, people would be more willing to do, you know, right by each other.

[2329] Yeah, we just need a legitimate leader.

[2330] I'll put an ad in the paper.

[2331] someone who can inspire everybody that you actually want to do that job don't want to do that job you know if it's this hard being a comedian I can't even imagine even a guy like Obama I think about that shit looks really hard to do being black it sounds trite but it's not that was a cultural it was like the moon landing seeing somebody who's not white be president of the United States.

[2332] Especially with a name like Barack Hussein Obama.

[2333] My God, man. We did that.

[2334] You know, I'm fond of what that meant culturally.

[2335] You could argue about policy, this, that, or the other.

[2336] But, you know, Ohio, we voted for Trump twice.

[2337] We voted for Obama twice, too.

[2338] It's an interesting swing state Ohio.

[2339] And normally we pick right.

[2340] Like, whoever we pick is the president.

[2341] This last, going around, being the exception maybe the only exception you know uh yeah fuck politics man yeah like literally that's factless i'm telling you i'm on my kindness conspiracy as long as i'm kind to be like if we live by an ethic of kindness if we foster trust amongst each other will matter less what corporations and politicians say because we'll be able to trust our society's cohesiveness Yeah.

[2342] But if you politicize these things, it's going to become increasingly difficult to come to an understanding or agreement.

[2343] Yeah, I couldn't agree more.

[2344] And I think it's just, it's so difficult when people get attached to whatever political party they're in.

[2345] It's very difficult for them to disagree with that party and so easy for them to go along with it.

[2346] And then so easy for them to hate the people that are opposed to it, the people that are on the other party.

[2347] It's such a binary thing It's so dumb It's also a cold thing to do In front of all of us Yeah Because I don't think people Feel that way No, most people don't No But when we're talking in groups That's when it gets weird Right Talking in tribes Yeah, it's getting tribal here I don't know More than that was funny I don't even really know What you politically believe Or don't believe Who gives a fuck I get along with you Every time I see you You're funny.

[2348] You're nice dude.

[2349] We laugh about shit.

[2350] We learn shit from each other.

[2351] You're from Boston.

[2352] I'm from D .C. It's two very different types of places and types of cultures.

[2353] This culture of common, this common denominator, makes me feel like we're of the same tribe.

[2354] For sure.

[2355] And there's trans people in my tribe, and there's white and black and Asian, and all kinds of people, and all of them are committed to this concept of levity, and we all get there different and interesting.

[2356] unique ways and what's wrong with that?

[2357] It works.

[2358] And we say terrible shit to each other all the fucking time.

[2359] Everyone's fine.

[2360] But it's fun.

[2361] We look forward to it.

[2362] But it is a tribe.

[2363] It's a different kind of tribe.

[2364] Normally I get up in the morning and I dread getting on a plane if I have to go do a work thing.

[2365] I was excited to come here today.

[2366] Not to be on a big podcast.

[2367] I'm going to fucking around hang with Joe.

[2368] I'm sure I probably said four things that I wiped already.

[2369] I don't even know it yet.

[2370] No. I don't take a look at the comment section.

[2371] Yeah, it's good shit.

[2372] Everything you said is dead on.

[2373] Likewise.

[2374] Hey, man, you got any of your cups?

[2375] What is this thing you got with this buffalo wine?

[2376] Yeah.

[2377] I can't see you and not celebrate.

[2378] Now, obviously, is this some cheap shit, Joe?

[2379] No, that's the shit, bro.

[2380] Kentucky straight bourbon whiskey has been around longer than America.

[2381] That's 1773 that company.

[2382] Really?

[2383] Yeah.

[2384] Wow.

[2385] taste like slavery let's get hey fingers you don't got a cup do you right here poured out your water oh my man cleaned it out that's good okay water who drinks that shit anymore all right so to Joe Rogan we don't need ice no ice no ice thank you Jamie Marlon Wayans was at my house in Ohio cheers man Lou.

[2386] Marlon Williams, I got to tell you, is one of my favorite people.

[2387] He's a wildly consistent dude in my life.

[2388] I just hang out in Hollywood and sometimes I drink too much, but I knew where he lived.

[2389] He was like, I'm the only people who I knew where he lived and I just knock on his door.

[2390] He'd open it.

[2391] He got some room in his basement.

[2392] He just stole blankets and they're not to sleep.

[2393] Really?

[2394] Because I trust him, yeah.

[2395] He's just a fucking cool dude, man. He's a funny guy.

[2396] He's a cool dude.

[2397] That's awesome.

[2398] Anyway, I brought him up because he came to my shack.

[2399] That's why I do my show.

[2400] It's like my little hangout.

[2401] I got a little clubhouse in the corner from the crib.

[2402] We all just hang out there.

[2403] Nothing nefarious.

[2404] But Marlon was so incensed that I didn't have ice.

[2405] That he bought me an ice machine.

[2406] It was the weirdest gift.

[2407] He didn't even tell me he just sent it in the mail.

[2408] Who does that?

[2409] Tell me about this club that you're opening.

[2410] Comedy Club?

[2411] Yeah.

[2412] Had a conversation once with Chris Rock.

[2413] Yeah, I love Chris Rock.

[2414] to.

[2415] I love all comedians, but Chris and I were talking about, this is an interesting question and see how you feel about it.

[2416] I said, how many seats are you optimal?

[2417] Like, when you look at a crowd, how many people do you want to see you out there where you feel like I'm home?

[2418] Chris said like $6 ,000.

[2419] I forget sometimes, we've got big, big star.

[2420] Me, 200.

[2421] That's like a sweet spot.

[2422] for me. That's why I love playing the punchline, you know, but I don't even need that many.

[2423] The belly room, one of my favorite rooms on earth is the belly room of the comedy store.

[2424] That's like 70 seats soaking wet, right?

[2425] Yep.

[2426] I would make this club 120.

[2427] This club is not for people who are trying to count the gate.

[2428] This club is for people who want to rock, like, really get into some shit, like try some shit out.

[2429] Yeah.

[2430] It's like when that alternative scene, in the night.

[2431] 90s for people at home, Joe, I'm not saying this.

[2432] I know you know, but in the 90s, it was an alternative, what they called an alternative comedy scene.

[2433] This was Patton Oswald and Janine Garofalo and Dave Cross, Bob Olden Kirk, these type of people.

[2434] And it became real popular.

[2435] It became like a scene.

[2436] And I would check it out.

[2437] Now, traditional club comics hated that scene.

[2438] They resented it because the things that was going on there, these jokes weren't structured.

[2439] it was like a lab almost people would go there and try shit out what was interesting about it to me wasn't what the comedians were trying as much as it was the way the crowds would listen to them like it was one of these setups if you went there and just did your act no matter how funny act is that's not what they wanted to see what they wanted to see was someone take a chance and that shit was like heaven on earth when a crowd pushes someone to just try some stuff you don't have to land the trick but the beauty is in the attempt just try it whatever this thing is that you're worried it makes you nervous uncomfortable and that that scene made a profound impression on me that that was possible that you could make a crowd into that because I'm you know comedians are addicted to the process of refinement you know a guy like Seinfeld He would never do a podcast because it's such a spontaneous off -the -cuff endeavor.

[2440] And his skill as a comedian, one of his super, super -duper powers.

[2441] Jerry Seinfeld is like a well -refined comedian.

[2442] He can take an abstraction and make it a refined piece.

[2443] This scene didn't have any of that refinement.

[2444] Seinfeld does that, but then he also does that, cars comedians getting cars in cars getting coffee show where he's like a podcast he's loose I I did that show I enjoyed it actually we did it in D .C. What kind of car did you drive?

[2445] A French piece of shit it like broke down I don't think they cut that out yeah it was a good looking car but it was a piece of shit he's in the well he's mostly into Porsches his most of his thing is Porsches if he's driving those other cars it's really more for show I think but it reminds me that show reminds me you a little bit in the sense that it's about his passions he loves cars he loves comedians he loves comedy yeah and apparently he likes coffee did Jay Leno you ever done Jay Leno's garage no I've done that he is so much better at that show than at least the way not that he was bad at hosting the tonight show but he's himself he really is himself like he doesn't have to dress up he wears like the same shit every day like a jean shirt and jean pants and he doesn't give a fuck what he looks like he's got no hair and makeup on the set he just wants to talk about cars the guy's got like hundreds of cars he's got warehouses filled with cars full -time employees all over the place like working on all these people he's got fabricators people that make sheet metal like fix fenders and shit and all kinds of stuff and the fucking man loves cars and i brought my 1965 corvette in and just he and i just geeking out over lines and Steve Strope the guy who built my car he came with me and you know we talked about all the various aspects of the car and all the improvements all the different things that he had done to it and you can see Jay Leno going over it and knows the details of the 1965 the original motor yeah so he's talking about all the different things and then and then he drove it he's the only one other than me that's ever driven that car really yeah he takes it out we go out to the hills and went up to Los Angeles Crest Forest you know man he took me out one that you had a hot one that Porsche used to drag Oh yeah I still got that That was a hot one bro That was fun That night was wild And you started doing the motherfucker You know we was up in them Hollywood Hills He started doing them James Dean turns I got scared I got scared That's what you're doing That car's glued to the ground though Oh I know That's what you were demonstrating You were whipping that shit Oh that was the night we went to Naomi Campbell's book release party Yeah That shit was fun though It was wild It wasn't that weird It was weird to me Well, because you weren't expecting it Yeah You were just at the comedy club I ran into you Yeah And it was like, yo I need DD Let's go to this party Joe We were so high too I was like okay let's go It was fun man It was really fun But it was like You know I thought it was just gonna be A regular night at the store Next to you know We're in an elevator That's going up the side of the hill Oh that mountain Yeah that was crazy Weird It's a nice house Giant naked picture of Naomi Campbell On the side of the building Remember that?

[2446] No Of course I do Of course I do It was like 40 -foot -thold nude It was crazy And then you get in there And there's all these famous people This is one of my favorite parts Of the night We're sitting around And you and I are talking You know man I would not want to be famous Like these people And I look to you I go do you're the most famous person here That's hilarious Turns out it was you Joe And you're like no am I I go you were the most famous person In this fucking room I don't have You know Well, you know, I could forget about it.

[2447] Yeah, you can forget about it.

[2448] You know how to let it go, but it was Lenny Kravitz was there, Demi Moore, and there was all these famous people.

[2449] It was wild.

[2450] I was like, oh, there's that guy.

[2451] You know, again, I'm always shocking how, like, Lenny Kravitz is a cool motherfucker.

[2452] Very cool.

[2453] I really dig him.

[2454] The first time I met him, Sherman Hemsley, they used to play George Jefferson.

[2455] Yeah.

[2456] Introduce me to him.

[2457] Really?

[2458] I did a movie with him years ago.

[2459] It was me, Norm MacDonald, Sherman Hemsley, was in it.

[2460] Wow.

[2461] And I remember, I didn't know him well, but, you know, I was awestruck because I'm Jefferson's fan.

[2462] Any Norman Lear show is what I was watching.

[2463] And he invited me to come to this concert with him.

[2464] And I didn't realize the time that Lenny Kravitz's mother was on to Jefferson's, which is how he knew him.

[2465] Oh.

[2466] Man, I smoked a joint with George Jefferson, and we went out to see this Lenny Kravitz show, and Lenny couldn't have been nicer.

[2467] Yeah, he was very.

[2468] Very normal.

[2469] Doesn't he, he lives on a, like a giant ranch in Brazil?

[2470] He has a giant ranch in Brazil.

[2471] Oh, he doesn't live there?

[2472] He just goes there occasionally?

[2473] Yeah, he's one of them dudes.

[2474] He got a beautiful house in Paris.

[2475] I've never been, but I've heard stories.

[2476] He's got, you know, spread in the Bahamas where his family is from.

[2477] Oh, wow.

[2478] And then he got the Brazilian jump off.

[2479] So, you know, he does it big.

[2480] And Lenny is the style guy.

[2481] everything he does is just fly.

[2482] Prince was like that, too.

[2483] Everything just kind of fly.

[2484] They did a tour of Lenny's house.

[2485] It's a video.

[2486] He's going over all the art pieces and who designed this chair and who made all these things and showing this video of this place in Brazil.

[2487] It's beautiful, man. He started making furniture, designing furniture, stuff like that.

[2488] Now, you know, it's funny.

[2489] I don't have really, Kanye is like this.

[2490] Kanye West is a design genius.

[2491] Like, it's not a trick.

[2492] You know, people call Kanye jeans all the time.

[2493] this is not just the label they're slapping on it.

[2494] If you ever see him in a studio session, this motherfucker looked like Captain Kirk.

[2495] He's running the bridge.

[2496] Like he knows he's nice with it.

[2497] I've been very lucky to get to see people who are graded things up close, even being on his podcast.

[2498] I feel like, you can't even make podcasts up, but you kind of make podcast up.

[2499] And I know he is fucking a strange neighborhood in life.

[2500] You know, it's one of the, like, joys of my life, getting to know these people, knowing and singing, them be human.

[2501] You know, we struggle through these things, we belly ache about decisions, we, but everyone, no, none of these people that I know are contest winners.

[2502] They all work very hard to be great at what they do.

[2503] Everyone is gifted, but these people spent time refining their gift and getting rejection and taking all those shots that you take.

[2504] taken life and they made something of it.

[2505] I can't begrudge them that you know and I always hope that none of us white.

[2506] We all survive it and I think that's why that cancel culture shit bothers me. I don't, I'm not even opposed to the ideas behind you know, some of these cancellations.

[2507] I get it.

[2508] I get.

[2509] I get do good things.

[2510] Stopping harassment you know, stopping racism, harassment, everything.

[2511] This ism, that is it, this phobia, that phobia.

[2512] I get it.

[2513] Let's fight it.

[2514] And the inclination, all of it to make the world a better place.

[2515] That's the inclination.

[2516] It gets abused and misused sometimes by the wrong people and bad actors, but at the end of the day, what they're trying to do, at least what they think they're trying to do, is eliminate bad aspects of our culture and our society.

[2517] Right.

[2518] That's what they're trying to do.

[2519] Right, because society doesn't correct itself.

[2520] And in that sense, I appreciate it.

[2521] Like, my kids make me very hopeful for the future.

[2522] You know what I mean?

[2523] Like, a lot of people say, I wouldn't want good people I know.

[2524] I don't want to bring kids into this.

[2525] world like my age no kids don't do that shit if you if you think you're a good person please have a kid put all your good ideas in that kid so that the world will be better i quote you all the time because there's something he said to me in the parking line the comedy store you said my children didn't just increase the amount of love in my life they increased my capacity for love that's very true they they they say they saved my life wasn't in a dying straits but man i i wouldn't be fractional I think when I am or I have some of the courage that I was able to muster.

[2526] It's not like I'm not scared I'll be scared but I just do this shit anyway.

[2527] Everybody who knows me says there's like me pre -children and post -children I'm like a different person I'm so much nicer.

[2528] I always liked you Joe I never saw you was a mean guy you always kind you're always edgy and everyone was scared of you because you know Kung Fu but you know it's not like he was in the comedy club sweep kicking niggins and shit you we was kicking it and I don't know bro like I just feel real grateful for the years I got to do this like I don't feel I feel grateful too you know I think we're so fortunate you know you look at people that are living their life and that uh that famous quote that I love most men live lives of size violent desperation wow who said that and why did they say it such a thing uh walden pond what is his name thererson thoreau yeah oh oh yeah yeah yeah that was oh it's throw's quote it's a great quote and it's so true most most people are just just fucking god every day it's his struggle they don't whether it's what they're not doing what they want to do they don't feel love they're not surrounded by interesting people they're not stimulated like every day my problem is i just have a lot of shit to get done that's my only problem every day but all the people are because a lot of the shit you do there's less social capital in it this is an easy existence now men don't have to lift heavy things anymore you know you're out here hunting your own meat sharpening your kung fu lifting weights yeah i'm not doing none of that shit But I realized a long time ago I have to do all those things to keep my head right.

[2529] I get that.

[2530] I get that.

[2531] I don't know that I have a similar passion, but you know what?

[2532] I find my solace in people.

[2533] There's so much shit that I see, you know, I want to say, like, I'm talking about circumstantially, what they say, normal circumstantial people who have these incredible capacities in them.

[2534] It's harder now that I got notoriety to be around the people that move me the moment.

[2535] But it's people like that, that guy that goes to, the guy that goes to the job he doesn't like.

[2536] Yeah.

[2537] I respect this guy.

[2538] Oh, yeah.

[2539] You know, there's so many people that have met.

[2540] It's will.

[2541] That's a real willpower.

[2542] People who do actual public service, not these fake votivists, but the woman that works at the shelter for the abused women or helps women get out of relationships that are abusive with their lives.

[2543] Or helps veterans cope with PTSD or get counseling.

[2544] This guy I met that lost both his legs and was cracking up laughing with me when he was talking about it.

[2545] These people blow my fucking mind.

[2546] Yeah, as they should.

[2547] It's exciting.

[2548] Yeah, there's a lot of exciting people out there.

[2549] And just because someone's famous doesn't mean they're exciting.

[2550] Oh, boy, ain't that the truth.

[2551] I ain't going to start naming lemons, but some of these niggas is lemons.

[2552] Lames.

[2553] Lames.

[2554] It's so true.

[2555] There's so many of them.

[2556] They're so bland.

[2557] Yeah, but then I'll meet somebody who doesn't have any notoriety, and they humble me because they're such spectacular people.

[2558] Yeah, I've been very fortunate to meet a lot of interesting people, and I think doing this show has really changed the way I look at life.

[2559] But your kung fu has suffered, Joe.

[2560] I don't know a little bit.

[2561] It has a little bit.

[2562] That's age, right?

[2563] That too.

[2564] But it's also just the lack of practice all the time.

[2565] I just couldn't keep getting injured.

[2566] That's the problem.

[2567] You would never fight again, with you?

[2568] No, not now.

[2569] I'm 53 years old.

[2570] Would you fight another 53 -year -old, like on some Mike Tyson shit?

[2571] No, Mike Tyson is still fighting demons, man. Wow.

[2572] Those demons are still there.

[2573] Mike Tyson is the reason why this desk is this width.

[2574] Did I tell you that?

[2575] No. This is real?

[2576] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[2577] I had a smaller desk that I was planning on using for the new studio.

[2578] This is the exact same width as the studio desk in my old place, the exact same one.

[2579] And I had a small one.

[2580] I'm like, maybe be better for.

[2581] I'm a little closer to the people.

[2582] But then I did a podcast with Tyson.

[2583] I did two of them with Tyson.

[2584] One, when he was high, when he's running Tyson's ranch, he had a little bit of a belly.

[2585] He was jolly.

[2586] He was just high all the time.

[2587] We had a wonderful conversation.

[2588] And then next time he came in is when he's preparing for the Roy Jones fight.

[2589] Oh, wow.

[2590] Jacked.

[2591] And he had these big -ass muscles on his forearms, and he just looked ready to go.

[2592] And he made me so nervous.

[2593] Like, he was so keyed up.

[2594] You could tell.

[2595] Like, he was ready to go.

[2596] Oh, wow.

[2597] ready to go and I'm like no no no fuck this small table I need to be I need I need to not feel so nervous I need to have some distance so as I was thinking if I was any closer to Mike so instead of like here if I was like like this and he was that amped up it'll probably like affect the way I was communicating with him I'd be nervous he's a intimidating guy oh yeah I am fascinated with him as a public figure well he is so multifaceted there's so much going on if you just looked at him as this brute who used to be one of the greatest knockout artists of all time you'd miss so much he's a scholar of boxing and that's probably not a man alive who knows more about the all -time greats he could talk to you about like Harry Greb and Jack Johnson and Stanley Stanley Ketchel he talked to you about guys that you never even heard before even the tattoos he's got Arthur Ash and Mao I think it's Che Guevier on him too?

[2598] I don't think so.

[2599] Does he have Cher Guevara?

[2600] It definitely got my own Arthur Ash.

[2601] Yeah, if he has Che Guevara, I hope he lasered it off.

[2602] That one's like, that's like the bad boy eyes or keep on trucking or something.

[2603] He said keep on trucking.

[2604] It's such a silly.

[2605] Does he have Che Guevara?

[2606] Yeah, I think he does on his stomach, right?

[2607] Yep, yep, right there.

[2608] Yeah.

[2609] All right.

[2610] Okay, I thought I was making it up.

[2611] The Arthur Ash one, though.

[2612] And then, you know, he's got one on his face.

[2613] One of the only celebrities that pulled off the face tattoo I mean Jake Rivera and Fidel Castro did take over Cuba when in their early 30s like when I was doing the second season in Chappelle show last motherfuckles was taking over Cuba that's the crazy negotiating the United States and Russia Fidel ran Cuba until he fucking died he did crazy but you know he's one of these guys and I know as an American especially people always kind of frowned Fidel Castro but I remember like the deployment of Cuba doctors and the reason they were able to do that is because the education system was so good.

[2614] Cuban doctors, some the most renowned doctors in the world, aid packages that Castro sent to Africa.

[2615] It wasn't like Cuba was rolling in dough.

[2616] I don't know.

[2617] He's an interesting guy for time.

[2618] And I say these things, people are going to think it was days of communists and Chile.

[2619] He's not even close.

[2620] No one's all bad.

[2621] No one's all bad.

[2622] Very few people are all bad.

[2623] And I'll be the first to tell you, communism does not look fun to me. No. It removes incentive.

[2624] Yeah.

[2625] Everybody that looks at people like Bill Gates or, you know, Jeff Bezos, look at these billionaires and say, they have too much.

[2626] We've got to eliminate billionaires.

[2627] They have too much.

[2628] They're the outliers.

[2629] They're the weirdos that have figured out how to accumulate so much wealth that it's preposterous.

[2630] But you can't take away all incentive for people.

[2631] to perform because if you do that you're not going to get any innovation you're not going to get all the things you enjoy you wouldn't have iPhones and sure microphones and fucking Samsung TVs if people couldn't make money it's funny because in our business we make you know millions of dollars and all this shit but like famous and they still have award shows like like this is funny and I got a trophy too this is crazy it's really fun and a red carpet to take pictures on yeah this is this is like it's just so it's very strange yeah it is very strange you think you're ever gonna do any more acting or you just stick in a stand -up now man I got this weird idea I want to go to Africa and do some of these nollywood movies I've been watching them and it's it's like this I was telling they own about on her podcast which the same thing I'm talking about with these Cuban doctors how people can solve problems with so little resources mm -hmm this is what these African directors are like the movies look crazy But it's funny how crazy they look.

[2632] But it's also all -inspiring because I can't believe this guy with no resources.

[2633] Solve the complicated filmmaking problem with this type of ingenuity because they had to.

[2634] What if somebody had a reputable American star to apply these tricks to?

[2635] I come with the funny.

[2636] You just give me that look, baby.

[2637] Don't you worry.

[2638] It's all going to work out.

[2639] I want to do that.

[2640] I want to just see what's popping over there.

[2641] Africa's popping right now Do you have an idea of like a script Or an outline of a story I don't know that I need one You gotta see one of these movies To know what I'm talking about But it's just like Something about it Makes me feel like joyful when I watch it Like someone is just I don't know I just want to try some shit I tell you what Africa's taking over in the UFC right now Are they really Three African champions and they're three arguably the best of all time.

[2642] What countries, do you know?

[2643] Cameroon, that's, that's, um, Francis, Ugano.

[2644] He was, he was, he kept trying to get him in games.

[2645] He fled the country.

[2646] Yep, yep, found a way to train.

[2647] That was a great story.

[2648] It's a crazy story.

[2649] He got, they kept catching him when he was trying to get into Morocco or from Morocco to Spain.

[2650] To Spain, yeah.

[2651] And they kept sending him back to the Sahara Desert.

[2652] Oh, wow.

[2653] To die.

[2654] That's what they did, they just drop you off of the desert.

[2655] like good luck and he made it back seven fucking times and finally made it across to Spain they put him in jail in Spain for two months which they do and you get over there and then finally they released him he was homeless in France slept in a parking lot made his way to a gym and uh he wanted to be a boxer and they he was like you know I want to be a boxer and they but they paid him 500 bucks to fight so he's like okay I'll do it so he beat the fuck out of some people and now he's the heavyweight champion of the world.

[2656] Oh, wow.

[2657] And not just a heavyweight champion of the world.

[2658] The most terrifying heavyweight champion of all time.

[2659] Nice guy?

[2660] Nice guy.

[2661] Super nice guy.

[2662] Super friendly.

[2663] Just a sweetheart of a guy.

[2664] Terrifying in the cage.

[2665] Terrifying.

[2666] Just nukes people.

[2667] Joe, that's, oh, oh dear.

[2668] Oh, exactly.

[2669] Get Idris Alba on the phone.

[2670] Idris, I want you to fight somebody.

[2671] He's such a specimen.

[2672] And he just won the title beating the greatest heavyweight of all time.

[2673] Steve Miochik.

[2674] He just nuked him in two rounds.

[2675] What are you thinking like a flick like that?

[2676] What does he weigh?

[2677] He's 265 when he gets on the scale, but he's about 270 -something when he gets in the cage.

[2678] He has to lose weight to make the heavyweight limit of 265 because the UFC has a heavyweight limit.

[2679] And he's, without a doubt, the scariest heavyweight that the sport's ever seen.

[2680] Because he flatlines people.

[2681] How tall is he?

[2682] 6 -5?

[2683] 6 -4 -6 -5?

[2684] Yeah.

[2685] He's huge.

[2686] See, show the video of him knocking out.

[2687] Oh, yeah.

[2688] Go to the top KO finishes.

[2689] Yeah, watch this.

[2690] Go full screen.

[2691] I mean, he just fucking flatlines people.

[2692] He's different because you can't make any mistakes with him.

[2693] Because as soon as he touches you, boom.

[2694] See, dudes just go down.

[2695] As soon as he touches you, you're just like, what in the fuck just hit me?

[2696] And he can do that to everybody.

[2697] Ah, fine.

[2698] Give me another one.

[2699] What is the UFC ref looking for?

[2700] That was, when you back up a little, that was the where you just were.

[2701] That was the steep fight.

[2702] What is the UFC?

[2703] referee looking for?

[2704] Yeah, like...

[2705] Watch this one.

[2706] Like, he's clearly out.

[2707] Okay, that guy, yeah, he did the right thing right there, right there.

[2708] They, there's, I mean...

[2709] That was...

[2710] That was...