Giant Bombcast 03-02-2011 (GDC 2011)

[0] Hello, I'm Jeff Kersman from GiantPom .com.

[1] What you're about to listen to is a podcast that we recorded in our office during the Game Developers Conference.

[2] This was recorded Wednesday night, March 2nd, 2011.

[3] I had a cavalcade of guests in, and it was a lot of fun.

[4] But, you know, keep in mind there's a lot of people in there, so it's going to sound a little rowdy.

[5] It's a little difficult to...

[6] keep all those guys under control.

[7] So with that in mind, you will hear a bit of an audio skip about 13 minutes in, I think, 13, 16, when we're talking about Battlefield 3.

[8] That's just my laptop couldn't keep up and died there, so we lost about 20 seconds.

[9] Nothing too serious, but keep that in mind.

[10] And with that, enjoy the show.

[11] All right, what's up, everybody?

[12] It's the Game Developers Conference 2011, right?

[13] If you believe it is.

[14] Okay, all right.

[15] 2011, and we are here in the Giant Bomb offices back here in the bar with a cavalcade of stars.

[16] First of all, we're missing one Ryan Davis because he has 102.

[17] Yeah, 102 is the last one.

[18] 102?

[19] All right.

[20] So I'm Jeff Gersman.

[21] I'll be hosting this madness.

[22] We're rotating people in and out, I think, as the time goes on, because I think people are going to come back here once the word gets out that we're in our bar.

[23] Why don't we start?

[24] You act like everyone in the game industry is an alcoholic, which is true.

[25] Which is absolutely true.

[26] Of any industry that I can think of, none inspires functional alcoholism quite like the video game industry.

[27] Why don't we start at the end here?

[28] Chris Remo, I want you to kick us off.

[29] Introduce yourself.

[30] Say where you work, and we'll just work our way down the line.

[31] I am Chris Remo.

[32] I work for Irrational Games, Irrational Video Games, in Boston.

[33] Irrational Games.

[34] The United States, Boston.

[35] Video Games.

[36] This is Brad Shoemaker.

[37] I work here.

[38] I'm going to turn him up a little bit.

[39] Check, check, check, check, check.

[40] You go ahead.

[41] Oh, cool.

[42] I can do that now.

[43] I think you know who everyone is, though.

[44] I don't know why Brad specified.

[45] I'm John, John Drake.

[46] I'm from Harmonix, also in Boston.

[47] Boston, representing big here.

[48] I'm Jeff Gersman, as I said before.

[49] Just to confirm.

[50] I'm Adam Sessler.

[51] I'm the cafeteria manager for NBCUniversal.

[52] Wow, you really got demoted.

[53] No, actually, in the NBCUniversal, it's actually a step up.

[54] Adam Sessler, XYG4, that stuff.

[55] I'm John Pearl.

[56] I'm from Video Games in Austin, Texas.

[57] Patrick Kubik, senior editor over at EGM.

[58] Chris Tilton.

[59] I am a freelance composer.

[60] All right, so let's kick it off.

[61] Probably just go down the same road here.

[62] Everyone has really different experiences at GDC depending on what they're doing.

[63] I mean, there are a lot of talks going on.

[64] Of course, the media ends up stocked away in weird meeting rooms seeing actual games instead of seeing people talk about games.

[65] So why don't we go down the risk?

[66] Chris, what are you doing during GDC?

[67] Why don't we keep starting with me?

[68] This is bullshit.

[69] All right, we'll start with the other.

[70] Chris, what do you do with GDC?

[71] We have Chris's at both ends, so it could go either way.

[72] Now you see why I was so careful.

[73] Whichever one jumps in first.

[74] This year, I didn't really plan anything.

[75] I just kind of came up here.

[76] I didn't even actually look to see what the panels were before I even got here.

[77] So I was going to kind of – You're lazy.

[78] Is that how you pick gigs?

[79] Is that a contract?

[80] Is it money?

[81] All right.

[82] I mean you've been doing television composing work with cringe and stuff like that.

[83] So you don't necessarily – you're not necessarily out looking for a ton of game work, right?

[84] Or you can always do more?

[85] I would like to.

[86] What's the workload like?

[87] Well, I would – Working on one show, it's all right.

[88] You can do little things here and there in between.

[89] Certainly summers are completely free.

[90] But yeah, I haven't done a game in like two years.

[91] But I still love coming here.

[92] I still love games, love the game industry.

[93] I love the process.

[94] I'm still interested in doing music for games in the future.

[95] So anyone out there looking to...

[96] Yeah, well, so I like to...

[97] I don't really go much to the...

[98] I did go to one audio panel today for Dead Space 2, but I usually don't like going to those because I like going to the ones where I don't know anything about how things work.

[99] Because you're better than them.

[100] You know those panels?

[101] Have you ever done that where you're like, oh, I want to go check out that panel.

[102] It's something on pixels, and I'm just like, I am the dumbest.

[103] What is happening here?

[104] I can't review anything.

[105] I do three words that were said in the course of this.

[106] Or like the session title sounds really amazing, and then it's just lines of code.

[107] And everyone else is like...

[108] You don't want to be the asshole who gets up.

[109] The ones I'm unsure of, I sit near the back so I can just sneak out and not look like a douchebag when I realize I don't understand script.

[110] It's always amazing whenever they mention something like an upcoming platform or game in the session title, so you're like, oh, well, I'm definitely going to this Uncharted 3 panel.

[111] And then it's an hour...

[112] of a guy going like, here's how the animations, here's how this blends into this.

[113] And you maybe see like two seconds of this upcoming game.

[114] Here's how we integrate Agile into our development process.

[115] Here's the scrum method as it applies to the NGT.

[116] Yeah, I would say the, you know, I've come to GDC about the last five or six years and I would say the general rule is if the game is not out yet, don't go to that panel because they're not going to tell you anything.

[117] So post -mortems definitely.

[118] Yeah, post -mortems a lot of fun because they can tell you pretty much Everything.

[119] And who wants to see on how they did something to a game you never even played?

[120] That's true.

[121] And also, you might not be as post -mortis shit on GDC.

[122] If the game hasn't come out, they're probably going to be like, yeah, we're going to really screw up this part of it.

[123] We don't know what we're doing here.

[124] Here's how we're going to fuck up the animation.

[125] This book's still coming together.

[126] Yeah, we compared this against real fire.

[127] Oh, man. Patrick Klebek, have you been to any panels?

[128] I've actually been to a bunch of panels.

[129] I mean, days one and two of GDC used to be...

[130] kind of weird because they were, like, it's the serious game stuff where they're talking about how to apply, like, game mechanics to, like, teaching you about, like, what's going on in Africa.

[131] Yeah, yeah.

[132] It's mobile stuff and indie stuff.

[133] But they've really, what's been interesting, a couple years ago, the indie stuff was a bunch of guys saying, Fuck yeah, we're indie, and we're out, we're starting our companies.

[134] But now they didn't know what they were doing, and now they're much more confident.

[135] Some have succeeded, some have failed, and some have come back with lessons of how not to make the same mistakes and what they've done with their success.

[136] So it's been really interesting to see indies go from trying to figure it out to kind of have figured parts of it out and to pass those lessons on.

[137] They're much more confident.

[138] So it's not just two days of people saying, like, we think we're going to be the next Minecraft?

[139] Yeah, although that is probably the most...

[140] Like the most name drop game I have heard.

[141] It got mentioned at the EA Partners thing when the guy was up there talking about Rango.

[142] He was like, and you get sucked into an arcade machine for an 8 -bit world straight out of Minecraft.

[143] I'm like, dude, you have never even seen Minecraft.

[144] Someone must have told him that ahead of time.

[145] I'm like, that's going to give you cred.

[146] Yeah, yeah.

[147] Street cred is Minecraft.

[148] Well, then they showed it, and it looked like an N64 game.

[149] And I'm just like, you mean straight out of, like, Super Mario 64, because it's this platformer with all this blocking.

[150] I was thinking more Earthworm Jim 3D.

[151] Yeah, actually, yeah.

[152] I'll give you that one.

[153] I'll give you that one.

[154] Harsh.

[155] I won't get the phone call.

[156] They're not sending these copies of Rango after all.

[157] John, how about yourself?

[158] What's GDC been like for you so far?

[159] Went to the DirectX 11 stuff.

[160] That was kind of cool.

[161] I was kind of surprised at some of the stuff they were showing.

[162] Battlefield, Dragon Age.

[163] That was pretty cool.

[164] They broke it down the first day of just some of the stuff they're doing with DirectX 11, which it looks pretty nice.

[165] So that was cool.

[166] Are you getting a lot of good...

[167] and actually learning things that you'll then be able to go back and apply.

[168] Some of it's real specific.

[169] Like, this is how we figured out how to render dragons.

[170] Or something like that, where it's like, oh, well, that's cool.

[171] That's really awesome.

[172] They just implement speed dragons.

[173] Coming soon.

[174] I would love to know if there's middleware for dragons.

[175] That would be sweet.

[176] I would license that for myself.

[177] I want the middleware for dragons that make dragons fun.

[178] It's true in movies, too.

[179] What is it about dragons that just means you will have a bad time?

[180] It's like, we have a dragon.

[181] Let's make him sound like Sean Connery and be friendly.

[182] No, it's a fucking dragon.

[183] It breathes fire and eats people.

[184] You're very passionate about the subject of mediocre dragons.

[185] It's a dragon slayer.

[186] It's like, yes, it's a version.

[187] That's what dragons do.

[188] There's a slider in Speed Dragon that's breathe fire, no breathe fire.

[189] Is there a Sean Connery tick box?

[190] No, that's a slider, too.

[191] If you want, like, partial Connery, you can get, like, a slight, like, a 15 % Connery.

[192] This dragon should have a mustache.

[193] Has there ever been a game that featured dragons where the dragon part was fun?

[194] That's deep.

[195] Adventure for the Atari 2600.

[196] You get in that dragon's stomach.

[197] Maybe then dragons have to look like ducks and then it'll be a good one.

[198] There's actually a duck slider in Speed Dragon.

[199] I really hope somebody goes and trademarks Speed Dragon right now.

[200] I might have to go do that off camera.

[201] I'll be right back, you guys.

[202] The only game that comes to mind is Panzer Dragoon or anything like that.

[203] Those are dragoons.

[204] Those are dragoons.

[205] I was going to say lair, but you said fun.

[206] Now, Adam, how's it been going for you?

[207] Have you been on the show floor at all?

[208] I don't have my badge.

[209] I don't have a badge yet either.

[210] Because that would require me to go to the show.

[211] Right.

[212] Everything is on 4th Street.

[213] Yes.

[214] It's either at the St. Regis, the W, or some other place.

[215] Right.

[216] And, I mean, what's nice is, and I'm saying this to a lot of people, this is a GDC where I'm doing most of my interviews, I actually give a shit.

[217] And a lot of times, you know, GDC, there's not that much.

[218] That's a first for you in like eight years.

[219] I've been working at my home in a lab for a pill that makes me care.

[220] No, but it's like, you know, EA, yesterday pretty much they were just showing stuff through the day.

[221] And it wasn't like, hey, here's two big games and a lot of stuff that we're going to make you watch to get to those two big games.

[222] It was a rather impressive catalog.

[223] Today was very, very Sony heavy.

[224] And it was similar to that.

[225] It's been quite nice, actually.

[226] Cool.

[227] All right.

[228] Now let's move over here.

[229] John Drake, what are you doing?

[230] So I've decided that this GDC is the GDC of iPhone games, and that's because I've yet to go to a panel where 15 minutes in I am not playing a game on my iPhone.

[231] Wow.

[232] Paying attention to the panel.

[233] That's not entirely true.

[234] So I go to some of the talks, and we have lunch and dinner and hang out with people.

[235] As part of the Harmonic Street team, you're not necessarily looking to – I'm like flyering.

[236] I am wearing – You should be outputting stuff under people.

[237] I'm putting QR codes on everything so you can just scan them and know nothing about the game that you're being told to advertise.

[238] So we're just around.

[239] We bring a bunch of people out to learn about their different tracks and design.

[240] We did two talks, one about Dance Central, one about the rock band Squire, which just came out in pro guitar.

[241] And I don't know, it's fine.

[242] I went and saw the micro talks today.

[243] Those were really good.

[244] And that's a thing where they basically give you slides events every 16 seconds and you have like six minutes to do a talk about a huge concept like, what was this year's topic?

[245] It was how do you play was the topic.

[246] Did you just get up there and go, yo, I don't play, and then drop the mic?

[247] That was David Jaffe.

[248] Players don't play.

[249] David Jaffe's talk was like, I play games on the shitter.

[250] He was like, fuck you, I play games on the toilet.

[251] Please buy Twisted Metal.

[252] Also, Ian Jones is awesome.

[253] He hit all his talking points.

[254] Just like any interview.

[255] Oh, that's fun.

[256] Interesting that David Jaffe was here because they were supposed to show Twisted Metal at one point.

[257] They were also supposed to show Last Guardian and that didn't happen either.

[258] So they pulled like half of their games from this thing.

[259] Yeah.

[260] Sorcery got dropped.

[261] Like yesterday.

[262] You guys were talking about seeing that like two days ago.

[263] We found out like three hours in advance that it wasn't happening.

[264] And apparently that wasn't just us.

[265] I talked to other people waiting out in front of the Battlefield event last night asking like, so did anyone tell you that Twisted Metal wasn't happening?

[266] And they're like, no, we never heard.

[267] Yeah, exactly.

[268] That seems super last minute.

[269] I thought maybe the Jazz had just decided not to come or something.

[270] If Tristan Metal was going to be shown, I was going to have an 11 p .m. interview for Battlefield, which...

[271] I'm old.

[272] I wanted to at 10 p .m. go to bed.

[273] It's like, I don't need nightlight anymore.

[274] You're drunk by like 4 p .m. So that's seven hours of being drunk.

[275] It ended up working out really poorly for me because the timing of everything was such that with Ryan being sick, so his car broke down on top of that, so it was leaking coolant.

[276] And he had to come back and get me. In his other car, in the middle of a fever dream.

[277] Yes.

[278] How many cars does Ryan have?

[279] Two.

[280] Now, he just got this...

[281] Wait, in the fever dream, it's four.

[282] Yeah, the fever dream is four, yeah.

[283] So he had to go switch cars and then come back and get me. So I ended up actually standing in front of the battlefield thing for about 45 minutes and then left.

[284] Like, it was really awesome.

[285] Like, they were just starting to let people in when he pulled up.

[286] And I was like, well, you're in no condition to come to this event.

[287] And you can't wait that out because he has been on a lot of cold medicine.

[288] So, like, he's got, like, an hour of consciousness at a time.

[289] crashes.

[290] Yeah, pretty much.

[291] So it was like, okay, we need to get home before I die in this car with you.

[292] So I'm looking at Twitter the whole way home, and as I was getting home, people were like, I just got into the Battlefield thing.

[293] I'm like, okay, well, maybe it's for the best that I stand in front of that thing for another hour.

[294] Though it sounds like that demo was amazing.

[295] Yeah, it was impressive.

[296] I know there are some people who legitimately thought that the game felt like it was chasing too much after Call of Duty, but the thing that I found so remarkable, and I never considered this before, is that in a lot of the Call of Duty games, in a lot of the military shooters, you're either in some sort of deserted wasteland or some mountains.

[297] And if it's true that you can actually go through and destroy any of those buildings, like if they give you the firepower to do that, like that...

[298] A lot of games employ destructibility, but you see it in Red Faction where you just go wild with it.

[299] It's in a sci -fi sense.

[300] Built to be destroyed.

[301] Yeah.

[302] It looks like a Call of Duty level.

[303] You lose that little hand level, and then it's just Call of Duty again.

[304] Brad, did you make it to that thing?

[305] Hello, I did.

[306] I saw him there.

[307] When I left, you were at the PopCap party.

[308] Yeah, for about 20 minutes.

[309] That thing was packed.

[310] There were dancing zombies and pork belly, and I had to get out of there.

[311] That's how long you're expected to play a Pop Gap game, though.

[312] It's supposed to be a $20 session.

[313] It's a very casual party.

[314] You can go to that party on the toilet.

[315] I asked for Sapporo, and they gave me the double artillery shell can.

[316] Nice.

[317] Good efficiency.

[318] Good to be making social.

[319] And then you've been also making the rounds, going to appointments and stuff.

[320] Yeah, another member of the Not Yet picked up a badge, spent all my time at the St. Regis in the W club.

[321] I remember those days.

[322] Yeah, it was pretty much all EA and Sony, I guess, for the last two days.

[323] Just one appointment after another.

[324] And then Warner tomorrow.

[325] Yes.

[326] Is it good?

[327] Are you guys excited to be seeing games this week?

[328] I don't know.

[329] It feels like a small E3.

[330] They heaped it on so heavy this year.

[331] Yeah, and it's...

[332] It's not what GDC is supposed to be about.

[333] It's this weird sort of, you know, everyone realizes that there's press here, so that they're just going to have all these events and stack all this stuff.

[334] But do you give a shit if it's not about the concepts of design talks, which you don't go to anyway?

[335] Well, I actually would, in the years past, I would like to go to that.

[336] We would love to go to that stuff.

[337] And be able to kind of just know a little bit more about the...

[338] the inner workings of the industry in some sense and gain a deeper understanding, hopefully, of that, of how you make your silly little dancing good.

[339] That was the working title before they settled on Ace Central.

[340] I take some solace that guys like John and Chris can still go to that stuff.

[341] But then again, there are guys like the Naughty Dog guys that were showing off Uncharted today.

[342] were not at sessions because they were in there giving interviews for that game.

[343] They are losing time to all this promotional stuff that's going on.

[344] I think it's also like a war of attrition where it's like, hey, I'm going to show this game.

[345] Everyone's like, oh, we have to show a game.

[346] And then it just piles on and piles on, and no one's actually checking themselves.

[347] Is this really necessary?

[348] It seems like DICE has become the place to go for that sort of stuff.

[349] The talks aren't necessarily as good, with the exception of yours, of course.

[350] Did I do it?

[351] Oh, I say moderator.

[352] Hot Topics.

[353] Oh, okay.

[354] Hot Topics.

[355] Hot Topics.

[356] Buy your Slipknot T -shirt here.

[357] I think we should get sponsorship.

[358] I mean, you know sponsorship.

[359] I have to give the credit for that, but if we could get whoever makes Hot Pockets, it would just be Hot Pockets?

[360] See, now, I thought you were going to say if you could only get Hot Topics to sponsor Hot Topics, you could wear, like, you could wear, like, a Paramore T -shirt.

[361] Same clown posse makeup and win.

[362] I would watch you do any interview in that.

[363] And Chris Remo, you've just been walking around with a build of Bioshock Infinite on you at all times, right?

[364] Yes.

[365] Putting those on windshields.

[366] Displays out of my room.

[367] It runs on Mac, right?

[368] So just hook it up.

[369] Well, I just display it out of my eyes onto a wall.

[370] It's pretty sweet.

[371] All right.

[372] It doesn't show up on video, though.

[373] The people on the screen can't probably see it.

[374] Whoa.

[375] I know.

[376] Is that fucking rad?

[377] That girl.

[378] That's pretty good.

[379] That girl.

[380] There are crows everywhere.

[381] Oh, my God.

[382] That's a murder of crows.

[383] It's happening.

[384] And achievement.

[385] How's the show been going for you?

[386] It's been going a little well.

[387] This is actually my first GDC in eight years that has not been as a member of the press.

[388] So it's been nice sort of not having to go through what you guys, I know, have to go through.

[389] It's going to be insanity for three days or five days, depending on...

[390] It ends up being three days for us, or four -ish, I guess.

[391] We're not really going to the talks on Monday.

[392] Is it bad for us?

[393] Because we just go from thing to thing to thing, but all those things are different.

[394] And I think about who's giving the demos.

[395] They're doing the same thing.

[396] Right.

[397] Yeah, you don't know the pain.

[398] You don't know the pain of doing the same 30 -minute script 20 times in a row.

[399] Some day in E3 getting a demo, I'm like, I understand.

[400] I know you think that they're doing the same thing, but it is fun.

[401] Something you've worked on and created and showing to someone for the first time, it's a cool feeling.

[402] Even if you do it a whole bunch of times, as long as it's different people.

[403] As long as people react well to it, like, you resent an audience who, like, you're, like, so excited, and they're like, alright, I mean, I guess it's just sort of like Modern Warfare 2 +, like, a funny hat.

[404] And you're like, yeah.

[405] It's a really cool hat, man, shut up.

[406] So it's Dance Central, but it's got, like, Call of Duty perks in it now.

[407] Right.

[408] Great.

[409] Call of Duty.

[410] Call of Duty.

[411] Yeah.

[412] Great, alright.

[413] I'm in for this game.

[414] So I imagine you've given demos for it.

[415] days at a time when it is you know rock band or dance central or something like that like that that probably becomes a little more grueling than the standard yeah it's it crosses a line where like part of the demos that i always have been given like i guess part of the fun of them is that people don't mind when you're doing rock band if you kind of curse a little bit because it's sort of a game where that is acceptable, it's part of the culture.

[416] It's part of the fucking culture, man. But by the end of the last day, I basically, I ended up telling every audience to go fuck themselves.

[417] And they're like, oh, that's so funny.

[418] And I'm like, no, I'm serious.

[419] Go fuck themselves.

[420] Can you see that on the four -part harmony?

[421] Exactly, yeah.

[422] I have everyone behind me in a choir stack.

[423] Fuck you.

[424] I mean, you get excited about it, but you turn off your brain at some point.

[425] It's probably when you've seen 20 demos in a day of different games, you're like, I can't keep these separate.

[426] I just kind of become a note -taking machine.

[427] E3 is actually one of the few...

[428] where I do actually write down notes.

[429] Typically when I'm only seeing one or two games or something like that, I usually kind of remember the stuff that matters and the fact sheet will provide the release date and that sort of stuff.

[430] But yeah, at E3, you definitely get to a point where you're like, I need to write all this stuff down because there's no way to remember even the names of these games in three hours.

[431] That's what I mean.

[432] I think the GDC is turning a little bit into that, but it's not...

[433] And the crush is bad for you guys for three days, but it's not, like, the mayhem of you have to traverse a giant floor for, you know, four straight days of crime.

[434] I think it ends up being a little weird for me personally, just living here, that it ends up being a little different because I'm going home at the end of every night, like, sleeping in my own bed.

[435] It makes it hard to get up in the morning.

[436] It's, like, 8 a .m., and then the alarm goes off, and you're like, I can just stay in my bed.

[437] There's a commute involved.

[438] It's not like E3 where it's like, I'm going to get in this cab, I'm going to walk downstairs to this hotel and go, and then it becomes, like, I'm in my house.

[439] I need to make this bed before I can sleep in it.

[440] Someone has not done it for me. I'm sorry, Jeff, you make your bed before you sleep in it?

[441] Yes.

[442] I think it's tucked in very tight.

[443] I'm trying to establish a new level of class in my life.

[444] It's been absent for a very long time.

[445] Exactly.

[446] I think we should start doing more of these from your bedroom so that the world can appreciate that you're doing this.

[447] I do a lot.

[448] I get a lot done in my bedroom.

[449] That's what she said.

[450] Terrible joke.

[451] When I moved down to LA for G4, suddenly living where E3 was happening became really surreal.

[452] I would go home to a quiet house.

[453] When it's in a different city, the whole experience, a good example for us is PAX versus PAX East because we're in Boston.

[454] When we go to PAX, it's like three days.

[455] It all feels like one big crazy reunion weekend where you're doing this stuff straight through.

[456] And it feels like one crazy dream, and you go back, and it's like normal life again.

[457] But when you go home to your house and, like, see dishes in the sink, you're like, oh, it starts all over the next morning.

[458] It's like this terrible groundhog's day.

[459] I live in the Bay Area for the last 10 years, and now I live in Boston.

[460] And coming back to GDC...

[461] It's rad, because I'm staying with friends who are off -camera, and every day it's just like, sweet!

[462] People flying in from all over the world to see me. From my perspective, that's what it feels like.

[463] It's rad.

[464] It's completely awesome.

[465] That is very cool.

[466] Let's talk about games for a little bit.

[467] Adam, you've been...

[468] Seeing demos, Brad, you saw some stuff.

[469] What's the hottest, Patrick, you saw some stuff?

[470] I think before we get into that, I have to comment on how many of these things are embargoed until next week.

[471] We were trying to do it.

[472] I saw Arkham City.

[473] I can talk about that.

[474] It's the same demos at the Microsoft Showcase.

[475] Last week, with the exception of the one part at the very end, the last ten seconds, is what's embargoed until next week.

[476] It's the same demo otherwise.

[477] The part where the UFO showed up?

[478] Yes, where Batman gets abducted, he gets probed, there's a Kinect support.

[479] Are they still reversing the weird piece of dialogue?

[480] Batman's a sled!

[481] They're still reversing the two pieces of dialogue, and then they play all coy when it happens, because it's related to some secret character that will get announced.

[482] So are they allowing audio recording of that demo?

[483] Well, I recorded it, so...

[484] I don't know if I'm going to upload it to YouTube.

[485] No, no, no. I'm just saying you should spend some time with that clip.

[486] Yeah, you probably could just reverse the audio and figure out what it is.

[487] Yeah, it's...

[488] Arkham City looks...

[489] You know, it's interesting because it's...

[490] They were smart, and it's a bigger landscape that you're exploring, but they've also sectioned it off.

[491] So it's Arkham City.

[492] It's not Gotham City.

[493] It's a piece.

[494] One of the reasons that Arkham Asylum was great was because it was very...

[495] You could go places, but it was very focused.

[496] That's why it didn't run into the tropes of open world games where you've got to fill everything with minutia that is really not worth anything because you've got to see something every couple of seconds to maintain your interest as you're exploring.

[497] So you have a bigger landscape so you can jump from building to building to building, but it's still very confined.

[498] So they have a defined area, but it's bigger so you can be jumping all around.

[499] They have a new mechanic where when you're gliding, you dive down so you can dive back up.

[500] You can attach to helicopters and fly around the city.

[501] I mean, it's no pilot wings, but it's good.

[502] I mean, I was excited for it, but it did all those things that I felt Arkham Asylum was hinting at.

[503] Yeah.

[504] And I was like, okay.

[505] I think also it seems to be more complex in terms of how it's going to use villains.

[506] It's going to have that air of mystery.

[507] Arkham Asylum at the get -go, and I love that game.

[508] It's like, it's all about the Joker.

[509] Right.

[510] And that when you were getting those cars and you were seeing Clayface, it's like, ooh, I kind of want some of that too.

[511] But it was like, no. Right.

[512] It's all about the Joker.

[513] Yeah, I'd be curious if they run into the kind of the problem that happens with superhero movies when like...

[514] For a sequel, you have to add more villains, more villains, more villains.

[515] You can easily run into that problem where you have two...

[516] The reason I loved...

[517] One of the reasons I loved Arkham Asylum was because the Joker was just such a...

[518] I mean, Mark Hamill played him so well.

[519] The Joker factors in Arkham City, but it seems like Catwoman's in there, Two -Face is in there, and I'm sure there will be a whole thingy of others.

[520] It seems a lot more Riddler stuff this time, too.

[521] Yeah, I was fascinated because those last ten seconds, which I didn't see and I couldn't even talk about if I did see it...

[522] I'm dying to see if they actually show the Riddler because I think that's a very challenging character.

[523] I mean, Jim Carrey's interpretation.

[524] His Green Man interpretation of that.

[525] Beach blanket battle on presentation of the Riddler.

[526] I do fear, though, that if it's not in the comic book, you almost always have to end up doing it that way.

[527] He tends to be kind of a lovely queen that's coming down on Batman.

[528] And to see if they can get around, I think it's a big challenge there.

[529] And I thought, you know, something that Brad and I talked about before was some of the stuff like, you know, you're finding frequencies and tuning in to different types of communication.

[530] It seems like mechanically there's a lot of interesting stuff they're doing now that it's a bigger city with multiple factions and that sort of stuff.

[531] I was wondering, and I didn't get a chance to ask them, Ron Steady actually knew they had a hit on their hands when they finished.

[532] Well, I mean, what's amazing is how, I don't know if you saw, but they had baked in the story for the sequel in the first game.

[533] It was hidden behind a wall.

[534] Yes.

[535] And so I think they knew, the way they've explained it is they knew they had something good.

[536] You never know until it gets out there and what the word of mouth is, but they knew they had a structure in place.

[537] They knew the game was going to be good.

[538] And no one found that before the game.

[539] They had to eventually point it out.

[540] He had the sequel inside the original game.

[541] What was the hidden piece?

[542] Was it the Ghost of Arkham stuff?

[543] No, no, no. There's a hidden wall that you have to, like, blast, like, three times with the goo.

[544] And then when it opens up...

[545] There's an outline of Arkham City in there.

[546] They outline the whole premise of the sequel in there.

[547] I like blasting three times with goo.

[548] If you want to know about video game sequels, you've got to shoot some goo around.

[549] That's also the walkthrough for the second game.

[550] You just blast everything three times with goo.

[551] I think it'd be six times in a sequel.

[552] I looked these guys up on a certain video game database.

[553] catalog such things, and their track record is almost non -existent.

[554] Rocksteady?

[555] Yeah, they made one first -person shooter on the Xbox One that I've never heard of, and then they came out with Arkham Asylum.

[556] What was that shooter?

[557] What's that?

[558] What was the name of the shooter?

[559] I think it was Urban Chaos?

[560] Yeah.

[561] Was that a shooter?

[562] I think that was a third -person action.

[563] Wasn't that the weird, like, Lara Croft?

[564] Yes.

[565] No, that was Mucky Foot that did that.

[566] Mucky Foot.

[567] That just sounds made up.

[568] Urban Chaos, I know what desk I was sitting at at Tech TV, and this is when GameSpot was inside of Tech TV.

[569] Right.

[570] Yeah, and if that computer could play Urban Chaos, it could not have been a very good game.

[571] And I know I was playing it at that computer.

[572] So maybe it wasn't Urban Chaos.

[573] I'm pretty sure.

[574] I think it was.

[575] I don't know.

[576] I guess they have Tiger Blood and Adonis DNA.

[577] These guys are showing everybody else how to do it.

[578] I remember when Arkham Asylum was coming along, like, we hadn't seen it yet, and we were kind of cold on the concept of just like, yeah, all right, you're doing a Batman game.

[579] Like, there have been plenty of, like...

[580] bad comic book games, you know, it's a licensed property.

[581] It had a lot of strikes against it, and everyone that was seeing it, like, you started seeing, like, the exclusive cycle come up, and people were like, this is the most amazing game ever made.

[582] And I was like, well, basically, I was like, okay, so your exclusive story is saying that it's the most amazing game ever made, but I'm still not really certain on it.

[583] And I didn't really see too much of it until we actually got a review disc.

[584] Yeah.

[585] Which was kind of a refreshing.

[586] And then the word of mouth spread quickly.

[587] There was a preview disc that was sent out about the first quarter of the game.

[588] Yeah.

[589] And I grabbed it.

[590] I'm like, I want to try this.

[591] I'm like, um, hi.

[592] Right.

[593] And it was like a really good Metroid game that dealt with the biggest problem with Metroid, which is always like, Samus has to lose all her weapons.

[594] Right.

[595] Like, why can't you keep her shit together?

[596] But in Batman, because he just kind of drove out to Arkham for a social visit.

[597] So he didn't think to bring everything with him because he didn't know danger was awaiting.

[598] I thought it was the most clever device to just kind of slowly upgrade the character throughout the course of it.

[599] I think there's still room for the abilities of starting out with everything and stripping it away.

[600] Darksiders kind of did that sort of thing where you start out with all that stuff.

[601] Was that a good decision?

[602] Do you feel that worked out for that game, tutorial -wise?

[603] Yeah, I definitely think so.

[604] It was just a big...

[605] You're Horseman of the Apocalypse.

[606] You have to come in and be a badass.

[607] And it definitely played into the story, I think.

[608] It was always playing that way.

[609] So I think it worked out for the best.

[610] Because you end up getting, in a lot of ways, more powerful because you pick up stuff.

[611] Just like Metroid, you pick up stuff that you probably wouldn't have had.

[612] And you start mutating the character of what they were.

[613] So you get all these crazy artifacts and such.

[614] So it definitely worked out for us.

[615] I think the mythical settings.

[616] It works easier because they have powers that they're kind of blessed with.

[617] Yeah, like out of war.

[618] And they can be just as easy as you can win.

[619] Exactly.

[620] And I think in the case of Batman, it's just like, I'm holding off this gun.

[621] You don't belong into it.

[622] That's also how they justify the expansion of the weapons.

[623] That's why Other M, it was so frustrating because it was just like, random commander says, sure, you can use your missiles.

[624] Right.

[625] Like, what?

[626] Hey, be a good lady and don't use your missiles there, Sam.

[627] It's okay.

[628] Because you understand it as a gameplay conceit, but when it's just like, You have to shoot something three times, and so they're like, oh, by the way, I guess, yeah, you can't go to that heat section?

[629] Yeah, I guess turn on your heat visor.

[630] Like, what?

[631] Like, what?

[632] You've been given clearance to use it.

[633] That was probably, like, the biggest, like, most contrived.

[634] Yeah.

[635] The character's name was Adam.

[636] I had a particular insult to me. I'm like, you know what?

[637] I'm a horrible person.

[638] That kind of horrible person.

[639] You would let the lady use the missiles?

[640] Is that what you're saying?

[641] Yes.

[642] I think.

[643] Morgan uses whatever she wants.

[644] Is that what you're saying?

[645] Yeah.

[646] It's just don't tell me. I don't know what's coming.

[647] That's all.

[648] So Dance Central, same deal.

[649] You start out with the jazz squares and then those get taken.

[650] Go all the way back.

[651] Step, touch, step, touch.

[652] Build your way back up.

[653] You bust your hip, and then you slowly try to rebuild it.

[654] So I have to ask, just because we're going to go see Batman tomorrow, and we'll probably see those ten seconds, but did you guys see Mortal Kombat as well?

[655] No, and it's also in 3D on the show floor, is what I was told.

[656] Oh, Mortal Kombat?

[657] Yeah.

[658] The characters are in 2D, so if you don't have the glasses on, you can still actually see the fighting action.

[659] Yes.

[660] Which is pretty rad.

[661] Yeah, it's a pretty interesting execution of that.

[662] And also, it works better because...

[663] The 3D set works better with a fixed perspective, so it's like it's 2D, so the designers can better control what you're viewing.

[664] Other games I've seen where you have control of the camera, it's tough because the designer can't control everything.

[665] That's one of the things I thought was really interesting about the dishwasher vampire smile.

[666] They're doing that in 3D, and that was at the showcase as well.

[667] The 3D with Mortal Kombat was fine.

[668] I was just like...

[669] Why?

[670] Okay.

[671] I don't know why.

[672] I don't know why.

[673] Money changed hands.

[674] That's why.

[675] Why is Kratos in the game?

[676] I was kind of looking just for like, settle me on this.

[677] I probably won't believe it, but it's like, yes, it will.

[678] It will make your penis bigger.

[679] Sometimes.

[680] I don't know.

[681] You just want them to straight up lie to you.

[682] They're going to put that on the back of the box now.

[683] PR people, Adam Sessler wants you to lie to him.

[684] I've been in this industry long enough that when I think I'm being told the truth, I get anxious.

[685] No, Adam, this is just a poor implementation of 3D.

[686] Just accept it.

[687] No, lie to me. My dick's going to get bigger.

[688] That would probably sell me on a game.

[689] They say that, but they're seeking FDA approval right now.

[690] They've got to clear the last few steps.

[691] Specifically right now, it's only when you use Scorpion, but they're looking to get it.

[692] So, okay.

[693] Obviously 3D.

[694] How many of you actually own a 3D TV?

[695] I do.

[696] I have a monitor.

[697] You can play things in modern 3D.

[698] Okay, that counts.

[699] How many bought it because they wanted to get it or just because it came with their TV?

[700] We bought it because we wanted to get it.

[701] Both?

[702] I bought it because I felt that I should see that stuff in 3D if games are going to do it and I want to review stuff.

[703] I live with a designer and he was particularly interested in being like, we should just have this around because we should experience it.

[704] Because it's not going away.

[705] And it has not paid off yet.

[706] I'm not playing a lot of games in 3D and being like, wow, this is a totally different experience.

[707] I'm so excited we have a 3D TV.

[708] I'm like, alright, I guess I'll turn on my battery -powered glasses and play this 2D side -scroller that has a really annoying depth of field all the time.

[709] But it's an interesting thing to add on top of stuff.

[710] It's really interesting.

[711] It's something I was talking to Will about last week.

[712] Will Smith was about how it's crazy that all the tech companies keep ramming 3D down our throats and no one seems to actually be legitimately excited about it.

[713] Not even the people that are implementing it are excited.

[714] Exactly.

[715] It's just a thing you do.

[716] It's just like, well, this will be a good bullet point and Sony happens to be paying us.

[717] Put it in.

[718] So it works out.

[719] Yeah, so shut up.

[720] In 3D good?

[721] I haven't actually gotten a game yet.

[722] It works.

[723] reasonably well, like, from a technical perspective, but I didn't want to play the game that way.

[724] Well, because I was thinking, if I had Move and 3D, it's like the first time where I'm going to run into my television and try to...

[725] I actually, with Move and 3D, not only did I look like a complete fucking jackass, but more so...

[726] Which is more of a jackass.

[727] You look like the future guy.

[728] You just look really, really confused, holding a fluorescent dildo.

[729] I'm blind!

[730] What is in my hand?

[731] Without the context, it just looked like the worst gay dildo porn of all time.

[732] With glasses on.

[733] Or the best.

[734] Yeah, it's...

[735] You know, all I can really say about it is that it works, but at the same time...

[736] It's functional.

[737] Yeah, it's functional, but it made me...

[738] Like the laserness player in your car.

[739] It works.

[740] It's like, I can watch these stars in your car.

[741] Yeah, yeah.

[742] Well, so far they haven't implemented any games that I really want to see 3D in.

[743] Like, I want to see, like, a subtle 3D effect in, like, Fallout or Skyrim.

[744] You know, something that just kind of furthers, brings me into the world just a little bit.

[745] Something I'm not sitting here, look, it's 3D.

[746] It's something just really subtle that doesn't grate in my eyes, but just brings me into the world just a little bit.

[747] And something that's not fast -paced like Call of Duty or Killzone.

[748] It makes you nauseous.

[749] With both Killzone and Call of Duty, I felt nauseous.

[750] And also, I found the HUD elements were really hard to make out.

[751] Because you have to focus on the corner of the screen very carefully.

[752] I've never played a game without 3D and thought there's something missing.

[753] Or at the very least, it's like, oh, I need to see deeper into this television.

[754] Ideally, developers are coming up with things that we don't know we want yet.

[755] I think it's more like head and shoulders shampoo.

[756] It's like they created a dander problem.

[757] I have yet to find any nail out there.

[758] Have you ever been to Gamescom?

[759] Because that dander problem exists.

[760] It's in Southern Europe, and it is weird.

[761] That's not a dander problem.

[762] That's a people problem.

[763] People aren't going to love 3D, like 3D, until...

[764] until you don't need glasses.

[765] It needs to be implemented as subtle as surround sound.

[766] You don't think about it, you don't even realize it's there, but you would notice it if it was gone.

[767] So the 3DS then, we're just glossing on the fact that we're talking about 3D TVs.

[768] Meanwhile, there was a press conference this morning basically about...

[769] I was about to say, the 3DS...

[770] I mean, I don't mind it.

[771] I'm more excited about the processing power looking at it in 2D.

[772] Yeah, I'm excited about a good DS upgrade.

[773] My plane seems further from the background in pilot wings.

[774] I'm going to land.

[775] Yeah, it doesn't look right.

[776] That was my experience.

[777] Very specific.

[778] Put that on the back of the box.

[779] Right.

[780] Oh, the ring's further away.

[781] It makes your penis look bigger.

[782] Adam got that 3DS and just pointed it straight into his crotch.

[783] First thing.

[784] This 3D movie is out of control.

[785] Oh, dude, cannot wait for that patch for 3D video.

[786] It's coming right at me. Literally.

[787] Oh, my God.

[788] Oh, my God, I played so much Scorpion.

[789] And that is the worst gay dildo porn you can make in a video game.

[790] Better have straight to YouTube upload.

[791] God, the bad part is now as soon as I get a 3DS, that's exactly what I'm going to do.

[792] You just accepted it.

[793] Sorry.

[794] Adam, you ruined my life.

[795] There's even all those photos you can take.

[796] Yeah, that's true.

[797] I've been sending out all these 2D photos for years, and I'm not getting a lot of callbacks on the 2D pictures.

[798] It's about the girth.

[799] You need to see this thing.

[800] Where would the first congressman get busted sending 3D photos of his naked bodies?

[801] That might be the moment the 3DS finally becomes useful and magical in my world.

[802] As soon as we all get the Matrix bullet time rigs in our houses, we just do full body rotations.

[803] I can't wait to see what Rockstar's doing with their mocap for this.

[804] This is the worst giant dong cast I've ever listened to.

[805] So can we talk about...

[806] Dance Central 2 is obviously a strip -in game.

[807] Yeah, Strip Central.

[808] We're actually working with Gearbox on a sort of...

[809] It's in between Duke Nukem and the next Dance Central game.

[810] There's sort of a middle...

[811] It's going to be an XBLA title called Strip Central.

[812] Very exciting.

[813] I saw that in the Indian channel already.

[814] Yes.

[815] You don't...

[816] Right next to Controller Massager.

[817] And I heard that the downloadable packs, like, Mommy Needs Money or something like that.

[818] Yeah, I mean, you know, you do what you gotta do.

[819] That's what the message is.

[820] That's not how long.

[821] Hey, hey.

[822] Central colon, you do what you gotta do.

[823] I saw flash dance.

[824] Nightcats will be making a peripheral pole that you can put in your house.

[825] Sometimes welding doesn't cut it.

[826] Will there be a professional upgrade, upgraded pole, like the equivalent of the Fender guitar?

[827] Yeah.

[828] And it's not that Mad Catz does bad stuff.

[829] No, there'll be a plastic PVC pole, and then there'll be a metal pole with a telescope.

[830] Which stage?

[831] Like, can I get a fog machine?

[832] Or what does the rock band stage kit work with it?

[833] This is not cribs.

[834] Like, we're talking about it.

[835] Does it go with, like, a wipe to clean it down, you know, when it gets a little dirty?

[836] Squeegee.

[837] Squeegee.

[838] What are you offering for strip club DJs?

[839] Strip.

[840] There's a DJ hero peripheral link up.

[841] He sort of re -licensed that technology.

[842] We should really beat this joke into the ground.

[843] It is honor.

[844] In the variant, beat it some more.

[845] But the whole soundtrack, just Toto by Afrigo.

[846] That's it.

[847] Yeah.

[848] Bonus points if the Kinect sees you crying.

[849] 3DS 3D video.

[850] Beat it some more.

[851] I think that's the Adam Tesso tagline.

[852] It's going to be...

[853] I'm bringing it back to his dick all the time.

[854] You sure are.

[855] You sure are.

[856] Brad, what did you go and see today that we can actually talk about that we haven't covered already?

[857] I don't think anything.

[858] Everything?

[859] I don't know why.

[860] I guess we could say we saw, like, we saw Alice.

[861] Usually you can't muzzle the press with these things because there's such a volume of information and a volume of people seeing it.

[862] that some European journalist is going to invariably go out there and post it immediately.

[863] Yeah, he's going to get off his shuttle bus.

[864] Nobody embargoes anything at this thing, but for some reason, I don't know, everything is next week.

[865] But what is happening this week that they don't want to make...

[866] If we make news this week, no one will hear about it.

[867] It's like the iPad 2.

[868] What else is happening that people don't want to compete against?

[869] Sometimes embargoes can be nice because you want to be able to...

[870] Time to write.

[871] Yeah, you want to be able to actually have time to write instead of just like, I'm sitting in a press room...

[872] I loved embargoes.

[873] Yeah, like banging out three sentences that go like...

[874] It has...

[875] There is...

[876] There's a graphic in it.

[877] Hitman with rock look good.

[878] Stoner minigame.

[879] You're looking at your notes going, I don't even know what the fuck this means anymore.

[880] But if I don't get my story up in the next five minutes.

[881] Yeah, exactly.

[882] But if we don't have the story in the next five minutes, then obviously no one's going to click on it because they're clicking on someone else's.

[883] Yes.

[884] The media.

[885] Do not get me started.

[886] on that.

[887] We'll be here a lot.

[888] So you've seen Everything or Nothing, basically.

[889] Pretty much, yeah.

[890] Everything or Nothing 2 was here?

[891] Finally, getting Bond back on track.

[892] Great.

[893] And that's the end of the podcast.

[894] Did any of you guys play Nidhogg?

[895] I've seen people talking about it by name.

[896] That game is hot shit.

[897] Nidhogg is awesome.

[898] I played that game today at the IGF booth.

[899] It's basically, it's a two -player competitive, like, 8 -bit -looking fencing game, essentially.

[900] Yeah, no, bear with me. You run at each other.

[901] Each player is trying to run either to the far left or the far right.

[902] And you just stab at each other.

[903] You jump at each other.

[904] You punch each other if you lose your sword.

[905] You can throw your sword.

[906] And it's basically, if you die...

[907] The other guy gets to run past you the next screen and you respawn the next screen.

[908] So basically you're both playing like the infinitely spawning enemy to the other guy.

[909] And it just keeps going until one player manages to run all the way to one side and then he wins and then gets eaten by a dragon or something.

[910] It sounds like multiplayer Karataka.

[911] Yeah, exactly.

[912] It looks like that too.

[913] It's got that Karataka, Prince of Persia style fluid animation.

[914] But the characters are basically like stick figures.

[915] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[916] It's like an 8 -bit style, like even pre -8 -bit.

[917] It's fun as hell.

[918] You just get in these, like...

[919] hard -bitten battles, you know, where you get two screens ahead, and you shank the guy a couple times, and then he jumps over your sword and throws the sword at you and hits you in the face, and you die, and then he runs back.

[920] That sounds really complicated from a controller.

[921] It's not, it's not.

[922] There's two buttons.

[923] You can play it on an NES controller.

[924] It looks much more complicated than it actually is, because everything happens so fast.

[925] It's very context -sensitive, right?

[926] It's like, if you're already jumping and you press the button, then you throw your sword at the guy.

[927] Like, if you don't have a sword and you press a thing, you pick up a sword if you're next to one.

[928] Like, it's very intuitive.

[929] Really fluid.

[930] It's one of those games with very simple mechanics, but you feel yourself just getting better at it as you play it, and you feel the depth.

[931] It's just a really good fighting game with really stripped -down mechanics.

[932] Would you say that this is Peter Molyneux's one -button fighting done right?

[933] Yeah, this is great.

[934] Seriously, for being a game with so few controls, the amount of depth and just crazy situations is amazing.

[935] I got in this extended...

[936] battle with my friend Jake who's over there.

[937] You can come on and wave real quick if you want.

[938] We're all about empiricism here.

[939] No one's talking to you.

[940] It's one of those games where you get in the back and forth and if you're in a place where you're in an actual booth, people come gather by and people get invested in it because you can see the back and forth play out really easily on the screen.

[941] That's cool.

[942] It's rad.

[943] I would recommend anyone go play it on the IGF floor.

[944] We're doing our floor time tomorrow.

[945] We're going to shoot there and try to talk to as many middleware developers as we can.

[946] Doing a whole package on middleware.

[947] Speedtree's got some good looking stuff now.

[948] Really?

[949] Okay.

[950] I'm looking forward to it.

[951] Some new Speedtree stuff.

[952] Our Speedtree interview last year I thought went pretty well.

[953] I'm looking forward to getting back there and seeing exactly how that's going.

[954] Any other IGF stuff?

[955] Not IGF, but I went to – the last poll I went to today was – I'm blanking on the designer, but he's one of the lead designers over at Ubisoft Montreal.

[956] And he did seven ways that games can better incorporate morality.

[957] And so it's going to be really depressing.

[958] But it made me chuckle.

[959] Which just sounds bad.

[960] Let me get to it.

[961] Let me get to it.

[962] Make up your mind.

[963] I know.

[964] I know.

[965] So he was explaining the game about morality.

[966] And it wasn't – he was giving examples of like games should look at this and see how ways to incorporate this.

[967] And so there was a game called Train.

[968] And Train is – it's a game where people try to figure out how to best get trains to this destination.

[969] And you're trying to get like the most passengers in and then like get them to somewhere else.

[970] And as I'm handsome, I'm like – This would go really bad if this goes where I think it is.

[971] And you're packing all these people into trains, and then you're trying to get them to destination, and then you flip over a card, and then there's a different concentration camp listed.

[972] But here's the interesting part of the game.

[973] I think that might have come up last year.

[974] That's not the end game of it.

[975] The end game, you can, at that point, choose to try and derail the trains.

[976] You've realized, oh my god, I've been trying to pack people into trains to go to a concentration camp.

[977] And then there are ways in the game to try and save the day.

[978] Or you can just be like, I was efficient.

[979] The idea behind it was to try and introduce situations where the player wasn't bad what you did, even though you were efficient for the gameplay concept.

[980] But then you were tricked into doing something that is really terrible.

[981] And I chuckled at that because they shocked me. But then I felt bad.

[982] That really doesn't happen much in games.

[983] It's that idea.

[984] Do I feel the game is testing me enough that if I did something that kind of implies that my subconscious...

[985] kind of drove me to it.

[986] It's like, I'm a little rattled here.

[987] Any time a game deals with, you know, you are actually a bad character, it's only so that you can have the revelation of, oh wait, I've been bad this whole time, and then Act 3 is you turning on the people that you've been working for for Act 1 and 2.

[988] It was a joke!

[989] The UN is evil!

[990] Oh no, we gotta kill the whole UN!

[991] It's about time.

[992] Or the game just says you can be good or bad, but it's just way more fun to be, gameplay -wise, just to be bad.

[993] And so you just, like, infamous.

[994] Like, I thought it was, it's more fun just to hit triangle and, like, make cars go everywhere.

[995] Everybody likes the color red, and as long as that is the signifier for badness in video games.

[996] If they made it rainbows, then no one would want to be bad.

[997] Exactly.

[998] Actually, I can't play games evil the first time through.

[999] Really?

[1000] Yeah.

[1001] That's what I always do.

[1002] You have to go total Boy Scout.

[1003] I've told Klepek this before.

[1004] I call it the manager's fantasy.

[1005] I find it fun to try and force yourself to do that.

[1006] But if you go with the intention, like, I'm going to go against my natural instinct.

[1007] But I think part of it is because the gameplay...

[1008] like, hooks aren't enough, like, why should I go bad?

[1009] Like, I think it'd be interesting if you went good, like, you're not going to get as many things to do.

[1010] Like, if there was a reason for you to go bad.

[1011] If you were good and they treated you like a big pussy and if you were bad and you were completely ignored and alienated and you didn't get missions because, like, you really lost a lot of the game.

[1012] Like, you killed the quest giver.

[1013] Some people, some...

[1014] Crazy people praised Fable 3 for doing that.

[1015] Because if you played that game as a tyrant, it was a lot easier to get the quote -unquote good ending.

[1016] Yeah, I was going to bring that up.

[1017] Because you guys talk about it a lot.

[1018] It's just kind of crazy.

[1019] Because games, especially adventure games, always teach you, I'll just take the golden path, be nice, and everything works out in the end.

[1020] Except all your people die.

[1021] In the end of Fable.

[1022] And it's just like, wait, I was good.

[1023] Why did I get punished?

[1024] You weren't good enough.

[1025] See, that sounds awesome.

[1026] I haven't played it with you, but that sounds rad.

[1027] It was like a total surprise, though.

[1028] It doesn't happen in a way it should in the game.

[1029] Sure.

[1030] Molyneux is always on to something, because I think he does have a far more caustic view of the world.

[1031] It's a very kind of Mighty Python British view.

[1032] Like, ha ha, all your people died.

[1033] Isn't that hysterical?

[1034] But, I mean, once again, the game didn't...

[1035] convey that in a way that was, I think, satisfying or like, wow, I really kind of spent all my time to screw myself, which I think it was Yu Suzuki once fantasized about you would die in a game and the game itself wouldn't work anymore.

[1036] You'd have to go back to the shop to buy another one.

[1037] Conceptually, I love that idea.

[1038] Except when you actually have to do that.

[1039] Yeah, it'd be great to just erase it.

[1040] Yu Suzuki and GameStop present.

[1041] I saw a pretty good talk today by Kent Hudson, who's starting at LucasArts, and he was talking about how one thing he really admired about Morrowind is that you can just straight up go and just completely systematically, just within the same game rules as govern every other interaction in the game, just kill the main quest giver who drives the entire storyline, and the game just pops up a little dialogue box, and it's like...

[1042] You've completely doomed this world.

[1043] Feel free to keep going.

[1044] And it's not game over.

[1045] Like, nothing happens.

[1046] It's just like...

[1047] They're just giving you a heads up.

[1048] You fucked everything up.

[1049] But, hey, keep hanging out.

[1050] Be on Guest.

[1051] Maybe something crazy will happen.

[1052] Maybe you can see the end of the world.

[1053] I think that's right.

[1054] If you went to a house, you were saying, yeah, right, exactly.

[1055] But you spent, like, you played for six more hours, and finally you get some kind of cutscene or interaction like...

[1056] Well, there was this incredibly important man who's probably going to save us all.

[1057] Apparently he was cut down earlier today on the docks.

[1058] I don't know how to keep the camera work.

[1059] He's running into him over and over again when I turn to pull his weapons out.

[1060] I think that'd be awesome, though.

[1061] If they bothered to support that.

[1062] Yeah, like actually do all the work to make that work.

[1063] Also, I think the other reason, and this is I remember from the original KOTOR, because there's that first mission in the beginning where the woman's been, I think, sexually assaulted or something like that.

[1064] You can be...

[1065] really evil in regard to that.

[1066] And I was like, well, what happens if I get evil?

[1067] And I did it.

[1068] And it was so kind of dark how it resolved.

[1069] I had a moment of panic.

[1070] So I'm like, Oh, I'm connected to Xbox Live.

[1071] What if they're reporting me?

[1072] And that one of the anxiety I think was so thrilling because it was just that, like, wow, I just made this moral transgression and can I really do it in the safety of just this game and no one knows?

[1073] Wasn't that covered under the Patriot Act?

[1074] Right.

[1075] Yeah, that's on your FBI profile somewhere.

[1076] Yeah, exactly.

[1077] Chris Hansen.

[1078] Yeah, it's Sessler.

[1079] Chris Hansen.

[1080] Chris Hansen's monitoring that game.

[1081] Maybe that's where, you know, the games need to go finally is get to that point where they're actually...

[1082] judging us and coming back and saying, like, in all these games you've played, like, make that a part of your Xbox Live program.

[1083] It's not your...

[1084] Gamification, man. You're not picking the pro zone, you're picking the sexual predator zone.

[1085] Or it's getting picked for you based on how long you're looking at certain models.

[1086] We recommend the sexual predator zone.

[1087] People in your neighborhood get armed.

[1088] Every Xbox Live person within a 15 -block radius is like, hey, just, you know, don't.

[1089] invites you over to play some games.

[1090] And if you put in that Gal Gun game, you just automatically are the sexual predator and you can't change it back.

[1091] Unless you pay 500 Microsoft points.

[1092] Change your name, clean your reputation off.

[1093] Now, that's a microtransaction I might be able to get behind.

[1094] You're not buying things to make you better.

[1095] You're buying things that just become acceptable.

[1096] It's just digital soap at that point.

[1097] But some violations won't come clean in the shower.

[1098] You've got to wait for something else.

[1099] So this morning was the keynote.

[1100] Satoru Iwata came out.

[1101] Press conference.

[1102] Yeah, I guess, actually.

[1103] So was it actually built as a press conference?

[1104] Or was it built as a keynote, but was really...

[1105] Became a press conference.

[1106] When Reggie came out in Netflix for 3DS, like, how does that help developers?

[1107] Right.

[1108] Dot, dot, dot.

[1109] How does it help anybody other than Netflix?

[1110] I don't know.

[1111] If I catch a kid watching Citizen Kane on a goddamn 3DS...

[1112] Yeah.

[1113] But unless Citizen Kane is making a kid watching Citizen Kane on a 3DS...

[1114] Citizen Kane is the Citizen Kane on a 3DS movie.

[1115] Yes, I will.

[1116] I can't remember who said it on Twitter, but someone was like, Iwata came out and was like, this is a machine made for gamers.

[1117] Now let's talk about how you can watch movies on it.

[1118] And that was kind of it.

[1119] But the thing is, Iwata, if you read any of his Iwata -ass interviews, the guy is insightful, transparent, likes to talk about Nintendo's process, but it just...

[1120] does not come across in that at all.

[1121] They've talked about the process in the past.

[1122] They've come out at GDC, but it seemed like all their talk about the process was, you should just iterate forever.

[1123] Yeah.

[1124] You should just take a really rich like us.

[1125] It works out great for us.

[1126] Delay it.

[1127] You should just push it back.

[1128] That's the answer from the blizzards, the valves.

[1129] Everybody who has the liberty to do that, they're like, duh.

[1130] Just do it.

[1131] It takes six years to make a game.

[1132] Don't put the game on until you've done everything you want to do.

[1133] Have you ever worked for someone that's like, when you're done with that, when it's done, does it work in the business?

[1134] No, that's when you just go to businesses like auto repair.

[1135] or any kind of repair anything, and they just have a thing up in the back that's like someone laughing, and it's the cartoon that says, you want it when?

[1136] That's the mentality of all these 3D realms and companies from that era.

[1137] There aren't any people like that left.

[1138] You think after Rage, it's going to be able to pull that?

[1139] I imagine Bethesda at some point is going to be like, no, you guys...

[1140] You get one more.

[1141] You get one more.

[1142] Rage already is the first time where they announced a release date way ahead of time.

[1143] Yeah.

[1144] I think it was on purpose.

[1145] Just to say, hey, honestly, it's a new era.

[1146] We are owned by a corporation now.

[1147] Didn't they say that Rage was going to come out last year at some point?

[1148] Yeah.

[1149] But to give a date is big for them.

[1150] That's against the mantra since they were formed.

[1151] So one of the other announcements this morning was, of course, details on the Nintendo eShop.

[1152] I love the letter E. I, for one, super excited about the future of downloadable properties on the Nintendo platform.

[1153] Which podcast are we on?

[1154] Do we just switch?

[1155] We're switching tracks.

[1156] It's unparalleled.

[1157] So...

[1158] Does anyone think that that's actually going to be any less of a shit show than it has been on the Wii or the DSi?

[1159] Given the curation that Nintendo did for Wii or the DSi, we're really excited that they're going to give me an entertainment channel with comedy and drama.

[1160] I really want to see Nintendo's comedy shorts.

[1161] Finally, they're adding 3D to comedy, which has just been, you know, I can't deal with all this 2D.

[1162] It's so flat.

[1163] It's not funny.

[1164] I want my laugh track in 3D.

[1165] That's what I want.

[1166] Kirby is in a circle.

[1167] He's a fucking sphere, and I need to see it, and then I will finally enjoy it.

[1168] Tingle poop.

[1169] That was a Leota laugh, by the way, if I've ever heard one.

[1170] That was a terrifying.

[1171] Sorry.

[1172] So, label me as the sexual predator.

[1173] So, Jeff, the question on everyone's mind, I'm sure, is when is Nintendo Download Express coming in 3D?

[1174] Yeah, you know, we're going to start rendering out in 3D.

[1175] Is that a thing, Nintendo Download?

[1176] Oh.

[1177] Yes, this is a...

[1178] It's an award -winning podcast.

[1179] Oh, the thing where you read all the things.

[1180] Devoted.

[1181] I know this, I know this.

[1182] The podcast where you just talk into a microphone by yourself.

[1183] Like I said, I get a lot done in my bedroom.

[1184] Yeah, yeah.

[1185] And so the interesting thing, I actually, reading over the announcement, they announced virtual console support for like Game Gear games.

[1186] Yeah, TurboGrafx.

[1187] TurboGrafx, Game Boy, Game Boy Color.

[1188] Obviously, that's...

[1189] All those Game Gear games you've been dying to play.

[1190] Sonic Spinball.

[1191] Yeah.

[1192] Like, not the Genesis version.

[1193] No. The Game Gear version.

[1194] Here's the bad version of Sonic.

[1195] Like, thanks, guys.

[1196] I'm really stoked.

[1197] But it's in 3D.

[1198] Well, no, it's not.

[1199] It's not.

[1200] It might be playing as it was meant to be played.

[1201] All that stuff is 2D, but they're also, they have a 3D, 3D classics label for things that they're going to remaster in 3D.

[1202] Classic games remastered in 3D.

[1203] Like Dino Crisis?

[1204] Yeah, no, I imagine it's going to be...

[1205] Well, did you see...

[1206] I just like how the game was called Dino Crisis.

[1207] They couldn't spell dinosaur and they had to re -emphasize the crisis element.

[1208] I mean, like, where's fucking dinosaurs?

[1209] Well, they could be friendly dinosaurs.

[1210] The ones that are vegetarians.

[1211] They may sneeze in your face, but you know.

[1212] What were you saying about that?

[1213] One demo station at E3 when they had the 3DS where they had like 16 different NES games that were converted to 3D.

[1214] And actually the thing is, some of them look kind of badass because...

[1215] Those games are all built on, like, various planes.

[1216] Right.

[1217] So for them, the depth of field is real simple.

[1218] It's like parallax scrolling and stuff like that.

[1219] Yeah, all the parallax scrolling.

[1220] Like, that stuff looks really, it doesn't apply to every game, but, like, one game that looked great was Super Punch, or not Super Punch Out, but regular Punch Out, like, because you have a really giant sprite, and so, and you have a smaller sprite, like, that works really well with the...

[1221] Does it all just end up looking like this for you?

[1222] Huh?

[1223] Like, does it all just end up looking like Paper Mario?

[1224] Just all these, like, flat characters?

[1225] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[1226] But, like, I mean, I don't know if it would be fun over, like, a long period of time.

[1227] But, like, Punch -Out!

[1228] looked really nice in 3D.

[1229] I also don't think it strains your eyes as much.

[1230] Because you don't have, like, these polygonal things in these various fields that have that one flat image.

[1231] It's like, okay, I know where that is.

[1232] Do you get that?

[1233] Like, you just, like, feel the tension forming right here as you look at this stuff?

[1234] It's also, I feel like I'm straining and then I don't know why.

[1235] Because I'm like...

[1236] I'm trying to fly my plane through a rain.

[1237] Are you playing it on the toilet or not, though?

[1238] Are your pants on or off?

[1239] Not even like an iPhone game?

[1240] No, because I feel like once I got the game, I was like, what am I committing myself to?

[1241] I play Game of the Dead Story on the toilet a fair amount.

[1242] Yeah, same here, dude.

[1243] Are you trying to avoid it because then you feel like you're working at your most personal moment?

[1244] Like I'm reviewing games on the toilet.

[1245] I compose the final paragraphs of reviews in my head while I'm on this part of that as well.

[1246] This shit is shit.

[1247] So the one thing they did not announce was new...

[1248] software, like DSiWare, in 3D.

[1249] So they didn't actually come out and say, like, we're doing full -on 3DSware as part of this announcement.

[1250] I guess it's something they've kind of implied in the past, so I expect it'll get it.

[1251] But the only thing they really said today was that in this late May update, it'll do that stuff, plus the ability to bring all your great DSiWare purchases over to the 3DS.

[1252] Yeah.

[1253] If nothing else, that's just, like, this machine is being rushed, like, so hard.

[1254] Like, the fact that you have to update your store in a patch three months after launch.

[1255] Right, yeah.

[1256] Like, your store.

[1257] Hopefully that'll give developers time to actually make decent downloadable games, because there are, like, seven DSiWare games that are made worth playing.

[1258] Well, maybe if they actually just act as curators this time, which they didn't do, they just...

[1259] They're not going to do that.

[1260] I know.

[1261] No, they're not.

[1262] Look.

[1263] This relates to online and Nintendo.

[1264] They're like, I don't know.

[1265] we got this microphone, three games will work with it, and then we're going to come up with another microphone and no games will work with it.

[1266] Honestly, my grandmother is more comfortable with the internet than Nintendo is.

[1267] It really is.

[1268] I like that web thing.

[1269] I'm like, yeah, that's...

[1270] It's also kind of crazy that the 3DS is coming out here just a year after we even heard about it.

[1271] Yeah.

[1272] And they weren't going to tell us when they...

[1273] They even told us that we're going to wait until E3, but I mean...

[1274] Like, that's rare for a Nintendo console to even just hear about it.

[1275] All of a sudden, now we have it.

[1276] And yet they're still shipping one last DS bundle with Pokemon Black and Pokemon White.

[1277] Don't you worry.

[1278] I got one of those.

[1279] Looks very nice.

[1280] Pokemon's are right on it.

[1281] They're just releasing it now because they know all the hardcore people are going to buy it.

[1282] And then they're going to have a big marketing push when it comes to Christmas.

[1283] Do you guys think there's going to be a big shortage of DS?

[1284] of 3DS's.

[1285] I'm trying to figure out why this launch lineup is so phenomenally weak.

[1286] Yes, March 27th is three days before the fiscal year end, but I'm wondering if for Kid Icarus and Zelda, why put it out if they don't have enough 3DS's out there?

[1287] I think it's because they can sell out day one, week one, regardless of what software is.

[1288] They can launch with no games, and that thing would suck, because people would be like, well, I'll buy it.

[1289] And the games that you're talking about will sell whenever someone buys a 3DS.

[1290] That will be a game that they buy, so it doesn't really matter if it launches or something.

[1291] I think they should just, as a joke, put out the Nintendo thing, and it's just a piece of clay.

[1292] It's like, don't worry, the games are coming.

[1293] It doesn't matter, it's ours.

[1294] All right, we're going to take a quick break, but before we go, you're working on a 3DS game, right?

[1295] In my free time.

[1296] Now as our Mox employee.

[1297] No, I'm just harking back to when the Harmonix logo was shown at that press conference.

[1298] Yes, that was the first time I had seen that slide as well.

[1299] Alright, we're going to take a short break and we'll be back after that break.

[1300] Take me to the eShop.

[1301] And we are back!

[1302] Alright, it's very exciting.

[1303] We did some swapping around here.

[1304] We had to swap some spit behind the camera to figure out who was going to come in for part two here.

[1305] Joined by a couple of new guys.

[1306] Go ahead and introduce yourselves.

[1307] I'm Sean Vanneman.

[1308] I'm Jake Rodkin.

[1309] We work at Telltale Games and we did a podcast with Chris a little bit.

[1310] A little bit.

[1311] Once in a while.

[1312] It's a couple years.

[1313] Well, thanks for coming.

[1314] Look over here.

[1315] We have the same people over here, right?

[1316] Don't worry.

[1317] Just ignore this.

[1318] We lost the dude.

[1319] So as we were also lamenting, we kind of talked about a lot of what you talk about for GDC.

[1320] There's not too much more to cover.

[1321] How was your guys' GDC experience as Telltale?

[1322] Were there a lot of adventure game panels, a lot of poker panels?

[1323] All poker panels.

[1324] All poker panels.

[1325] Is that one of the GDC tracks, poker?

[1326] Yeah.

[1327] Poker panels is actually a WiiWare game.

[1328] And then the BioWare doctors just win it every time.

[1329] Yeah.

[1330] My GDC has been me sitting at the office working on a video game.

[1331] You were at the recruiting booth today?

[1332] I was.

[1333] If you know any good UI artists, let us know.

[1334] That's not...

[1335] That's true.

[1336] That's not actually a guest, please.

[1337] No, really, seriously.

[1338] If you know any UI artists, go to Telltale...

[1339] TelltaleGames .com?

[1340] Yeah, it's a good website.

[1341] If you're not really confident about it...

[1342] be the website.

[1343] It's telltale .me. My company's hiring like a dozen positions.

[1344] Can I plug all those?

[1345] Is that what we're doing here?

[1346] Only if they're UI guys.

[1347] This is actually the number one UI podcast.

[1348] We're looking for a UI guy.

[1349] We're looking for someone to make Jeff's bed.

[1350] Yeah, if ladies only want to come make my bed.

[1351] I'm a user.

[1352] It's where things get done.

[1353] Irrational Games is hiring irrationalgames .com.

[1354] They're hiring IrrationalGames .com?

[1355] All websites that are IrrationalGames .com, we're hiring them.

[1356] We're hiring IrrationalGames .com to write a story for this website.

[1357] So we're going to add that in there.

[1358] We figure it could use a good narrative tying it all together.

[1359] We've got all these quests and stuff, but it's just like you just click on stuff.

[1360] What's that about?

[1361] I don't know.

[1362] If we had a story tying it together, maybe that would make more sense.

[1363] So if you've written that story, go to IrrationalGames .com.

[1364] And so we've got a handy form.

[1365] Also, the story needs to involve the apocalypse needs to have happened or is currently happening.

[1366] And you need to go to New Detroit and meet up with Old Man Rock, who is just an aged version of Kid Rock.

[1367] That sounds like the RoboCop reboot that we've all been waiting for.

[1368] Believe it or not, that's what the hiring sheet says.

[1369] Okay, great.

[1370] I hear that's actually the secret plot to Bioshock Infinite as well.

[1371] NDA -ed, bro.

[1372] Sorry.

[1373] It was friend -y -aid.

[1374] Hey, friend -y -aid, bro.

[1375] Someone pulled that out on me a month ago, and I was like, this is...

[1376] I can't be a part of this conversation anymore.

[1377] Sounds like something they say in the fine eye.

[1378] Was it actually about video games, or has our ridiculous relationship with the publisher suddenly just transmuted itself into our own personal relationship?

[1379] It was someone I know who actually works on games who was telling me something he should not have told me. Not about the game, though.

[1380] He was just like, hey, man, look.

[1381] He's like, I'm not going to actually make you sign anything, but, you know, friend EA.

[1382] I said I was sorry that I used that term.

[1383] You keep reading it up everywhere we go.

[1384] Now that he's further away, I can say it because he's not going to punch me in the stomach.

[1385] I'm a little disappointed, though, that you're breaking our friendier over the use of the term friendier.

[1386] I thought you had my back.

[1387] That was the long break was the explanation of the friendier and the context.

[1388] And how has your GDC been going?

[1389] It's the best GDC.

[1390] I missed the best GDC.

[1391] No, I don't know.

[1392] I saw two panels that were both pretty sweet.

[1393] And then I played Not Enough Nidhogg, which Chris already talked about.

[1394] We also played Button.

[1395] Oh, yeah.

[1396] That game's great.

[1397] Sorry, B -U -T -T -O -N.

[1398] What is it?

[1399] Brutally Unfair Tactics?

[1400] Something, something, something.

[1401] They brought out a dance mat for us to play, though.

[1402] So instead of using an Xbox controller, we all had to just run and then push our hands to the ground.

[1403] It was nice, though.

[1404] The game told all four of us to go into the fetal position from six steps away and then sort of roll our way over and then push the button.

[1405] But the way that game works is you're only supposed to press it.

[1406] I don't even know.

[1407] Is this happening?

[1408] This is what GDC is about when you're a game developer.

[1409] No, but we had to all crawl over to a button on the show floor in the fetal position.

[1410] And then it tells you to press the button 11 times or you're eliminated.

[1411] So then it became four people in the fetal position crawling all over each other to defend the button that is yours to keep people from pressing it a 12th time, which would make you lose.

[1412] This is an IGF contestant.

[1413] It's great.

[1414] This sounds like we dare.

[1415] This game was designed for you guys to overlay on top of the fucking people pressing the dance shit while you're just in the background recording the podcast.

[1416] I'm just happy that someone finally found a way to make Twister interactive entertainment.

[1417] I saw this game at IndyCable and I was a judge on that.

[1418] What's so clever about it is that Yes, you're using the digital interface, but the fun of the game is screwing other people over.

[1419] Everyone has to play along.

[1420] You kind of realize that once you play a game, you're so like, I will follow your rules.

[1421] Yeah, exactly.

[1422] And everything you're doing, you actually have quite a bit of agency to not do it.

[1423] To have fun, you have to engage in it.

[1424] It told us that we had to hold the hand of the contestant who we thought was the sexiest.

[1425] Everyone...

[1426] Yeah, everyone stopped for a second.

[1427] But then we all held hands.

[1428] We made the choice.

[1429] And then we fought over a button on a dance mat.

[1430] Was there a collective choice?

[1431] Huh?

[1432] Was there a collective choice?

[1433] Did you all decide?

[1434] No, it was two mutual coverings, which was a little awkward.

[1435] Yeah, we did.

[1436] Oh, man. It's nice that you could pair off like that.

[1437] Yeah.

[1438] That's kind of sweet.

[1439] That's adorable.

[1440] There's someone out there for everyone.

[1441] It was me, Spath, Chris.

[1442] No, I was in the second round.

[1443] It was me, Spath, Ben, and Glenn.

[1444] Isn't this the Ubisoft game that they won't release in the US?

[1445] Where it's got women not quite making out on the other side of the microphone and jamming Wii remotes down the back of their heads.

[1446] I see this trailer from Ubisoft and I'm like, what's the age of consent in Europe?

[1447] You can no longer watch that trailer in North America because they blocked people from watching it.

[1448] It's a little weird expansion to Imagine Babies.

[1449] Is it We There or is it OUI?

[1450] So it's We There?

[1451] Yes.

[1452] But yeah, it's basically...

[1453] They're taking the let's tap concept of put the Wii remote on something and then tap the thing that it's on.

[1454] Except that thing that makes someone tap.

[1455] The way you're tapping is that.

[1456] Let's tap.

[1457] A Brad Shoemaker is done.

[1458] This whole two halves is weird.

[1459] There's a game of button going on over here.

[1460] Friend EA?

[1461] Those guys are fucking assholes.

[1462] We need like two separate podcasts.

[1463] For one while there, we were all having separate conversations, which I'm sure sounds like, shit.

[1464] We're talking to you guys to the right, and we'll be over here on the left.

[1465] I was wondering about We Dare, though.

[1466] The actual content on the screen from that video, not explicit in any way.

[1467] Who's cartoonish?

[1468] Would that be rated E?

[1469] It's rated the equivalent of T. It's like Peggy 12.

[1470] It depends who the rated community is.

[1471] It's hard to say what the on -screen prompts are.

[1472] If it is...

[1473] I don't think that it tells you to put the Wii Remote in a hoo -ha.

[1474] Oh, it's insane.

[1475] But yeah, it is rated 12.

[1476] And it is going to come out on the PS3 as well, so move controllers will be a part of it.

[1477] So y 'all have directionality in everything that you're doing.

[1478] Yeah, exactly.

[1479] I've seen some of the later levels in We Dare, but it's all under Prem Vargo until...

[1480] It's Prem Vargo with benefits.

[1481] In Ubisoft, they're calling it the fun shot.

[1482] Jesus.

[1483] So, in the podcast.

[1484] I'm excited to watch Gershwin come back from this.

[1485] Now that we all get together with the entirety of the game industry and all the students that are out there attending GDC hoping to catch on and get jobs and all that stuff.

[1486] How do we feel that the industry is doing?

[1487] Does it feel like games are out there getting signed, everything's going great?

[1488] Is it a bloodbath out there?

[1489] Do you see more layoffs ahead for all these huge companies?

[1490] Well, it's really cool to see stuff like the Indie Fund, where a bunch of guys who got really successful making indie games, making really good indie games, get out there and like, hey, we will give you an amazing, basically...

[1491] loan contract.

[1492] Yeah, it's $40 ,000 to $150 ,000.

[1493] Yeah.

[1494] And it's their money.

[1495] Exactly.

[1496] It's not, they didn't go to an external funding and like, hey, we're indie, so we know how to talk to any developers.

[1497] This is their extra money.

[1498] Because one of the questions they asked was like, one of the audience members was like, could you make it more of like a social thing?

[1499] Like, we vote on the game that makes the most sense.

[1500] Yeah, no, they're just making choices.

[1501] Because Ron Carwell's like, no, this is my money.

[1502] But I don't, yeah, but I don't think that was as transparent until like that.

[1503] talk and explain, no, this is all money.

[1504] They're not managing a fund.

[1505] Yeah, 2D Boy has some extra cash on the side and we got together with some other sweet people that have cash on the side and we want to make voices heard.

[1506] But if you want to crowdsource your idea, there's Kickstarter.

[1507] Yeah, there's all kinds of ways.

[1508] Yeah, it's great right now.

[1509] It's pretty exciting.

[1510] And the Indie Fund is amazing.

[1511] I mean, I think they said something like, if after three years you can't pay us back, we just dissolve your...

[1512] We just dissolved your company.

[1513] We just dissolved your fucking company.

[1514] It's a friend dissolve.

[1515] How do you get that deal?

[1516] I love this idea.

[1517] You have to play button naked.

[1518] And lose.

[1519] Only the European release.

[1520] In that talk, one of the interesting questions was a guy came up and said, so who would like to get the money for the Indy Fund?

[1521] And there was a lot of guys who put up their hands.

[1522] So who has submitted for the Indy Fund?

[1523] And then very few hands went up.

[1524] And then the third question was, who hasn't done it because they're afraid of getting turned down?

[1525] And it was because you've got guys on the stage, Capoeira Games, 2D Boyd, like...

[1526] that game company.

[1527] These are like the amazing pedigree of developers.

[1528] Those guys are, a lot of those people in the audience are just like, I got something I want to talk about, but I don't want to be told it's a stupid idea.

[1529] So one of the things they actually went back and forth about was really interesting to try and figure out how to make it more encouraging for developers to, failure's okay.

[1530] That's the whole reason they dissolved the debt in three years is because if your game doesn't work out, it's okay.

[1531] Because you'll learn something from it and hopefully your next game is better.

[1532] But it's also the intimidation factor of talking to your idols and your idol telling you you're not good enough.

[1533] Well, they get them all to just put a stocking over their head and just videotape their submission on Betamax.

[1534] I like what Pat was saying.

[1535] I think there are games that are not perfect that we see the flaws in.

[1536] Plenty.

[1537] Plenty.

[1538] Well, one of the recent ones is like Heavy Rain, where there's so much to admire, but you also know where it's falling short.

[1539] There's something so instructional about it.

[1540] Having ambitious games that don't succeed in their intentions becomes very informative, especially for very young developers.

[1541] It's like failure is just part of that process of creative iteration over and over again.

[1542] I do think that we as the press sometimes, if it's not there at the get -go, then we're just going to ban it and turn it back.

[1543] We're just over here going, if it has perks, it leads.

[1544] I know that doesn't rhyme.

[1545] If it has persistent online multiplayer.

[1546] And you can shoot guys in the face.

[1547] And it's exclusive.

[1548] Right.

[1549] Yeah.

[1550] For me. For you.

[1551] Right.

[1552] This is my exclusive Tuesday play section of blank.

[1553] But what's the scene like?

[1554] You can friendiate on the name of that game.

[1555] What's the scene like down in Austin?

[1556] Does it feel healthy?

[1557] I mean, they're down there making Star Wars.

[1558] You just run into guys.

[1559] They're glazed over saying like, I've been working on Star Wars.

[1560] Or does it seem nice down there?

[1561] That's what Sixth Street is like all the time.

[1562] I'm not saying that.

[1563] That's true.

[1564] They don't work for Bioware.

[1565] It is kind of weird.

[1566] I know with DC Universe just shipped, and you're a big fan.

[1567] I remember seeing the review.

[1568] Huge.

[1569] Love that game.

[1570] Lifetime subscription.

[1571] That was in Austin.

[1572] It's kind of weird with the Bioware thing.

[1573] I just haven't seen much from it, but they're just absorbing developers like a black hole.

[1574] It's great because, hey, look, all these people can come to Austin.

[1575] They can get jobs.

[1576] They're working on a big title.

[1577] But if that thing doesn't just go gangbusters, it's like there's going to be this huge explosion of people that are like, oh, I don't have a job now.

[1578] It's like they all walk into that building and they never come out.

[1579] Yeah.

[1580] Oh, no, they'll all come out and they'll just be like, oh, job.

[1581] Like job zombies.

[1582] If that wouldn't happen.

[1583] That seems like it would be a thing that would be catastrophic for EA.

[1584] There could be people outside of Austin losing jobs, I think, if that game goes totally sideways.

[1585] It's kind of weird, too, because I know there's been a ton like Disney laid off and closed tons of studios.

[1586] I'm actually kind of surprised because I've talked to some people at the booths that I knew that were running the booths.

[1587] There's still not a lot of developers, like, seasoned developers on the floor.

[1588] It's still, like, students.

[1589] Right.

[1590] And I'm just really surprised.

[1591] Like, well, where do all those people go?

[1592] It's like, I don't know.

[1593] So either they're getting jobs or they're not coming to the GDCs or they're not coming to.

[1594] GDC is expensive.

[1595] Yeah.

[1596] It is expensive.

[1597] But you can get, like, a pass for, like, I think it's, like, a couple hundred bucks to get into just the hall to get in.

[1598] I mean, if I was looking for a job and it's like, I want to hit on a cost of payment.

[1599] Remember, the dev cycle has so changed that usually this time of year there are no games coming out.

[1600] Or at least in the second quarter.

[1601] And there's a lot of studios that right now are in crunch time trying to get stuff finished.

[1602] And they don't have the time to attend GDC.

[1603] I think it was in March because back in the 90s it was perfect.

[1604] But now it isn't.

[1605] But when you're talking about really seasoned developers who maybe have been let go because of a change in...

[1606] I can face you.

[1607] Have been let go because of a change in the structure of their company or whatever it is.

[1608] Wouldn't you think that the more seasoned that developer is, the less likely they are to need to come here and have one -on -one FaceTime on the floor of GDC versus networking, maybe meeting in a hotel lobby and having a drink and just doing a quick chat, and then that's sort of the networking that they do.

[1609] Or they've got a resume with so many shipped games on at this point that that kind of speaks for them.

[1610] It's like an inevitable conclusion they'll land somewhere, and so coming here is not the open door that is for a lot of students where they're looking for that first job or that second job that's sort of jumping off of working in an area.

[1611] Have you guys seen people getting hired out of GDC?

[1612] Promising students coming to booths.

[1613] You're actually talking to people.

[1614] Yeah, I mean, I would say that 98 % of the people I've talked to today were recent graduates or students.

[1615] It's great for us as a resource because you get this young, excited talent and you find the right guy.

[1616] And you get him in there and burn him out.

[1617] Yeah!

[1618] Two and a half years, he wants to kill himself.

[1619] The press is the exact same way.

[1620] It's great.

[1621] They post it on the forums, then you bring him in and go, here's what it's really like, kid.

[1622] And they go, oh, fucking God, what have I done?

[1623] But I think a lot of those...

[1624] I think you're probably right.

[1625] If you're a seasoned developer and you've shipped three or four titles and have some good stuff under your belt, the point is come to GDC if that's where your friends are.

[1626] I think that's the way.

[1627] If I was looking for a job right now, that's what I would do.

[1628] The floor is a lot of students.

[1629] I tell the students the same thing every time.

[1630] Show me something awesome.

[1631] Entertain me for two minutes and we would love to have you come work at our studio.

[1632] You know, that's it.

[1633] You demand an actual song and dance.

[1634] Dance for me. Dance right now.

[1635] Play button.

[1636] Play more button.

[1637] Play button with that guy.

[1638] Kiss that guy.

[1639] They really want jobs, though, so...

[1640] Just saying.

[1641] Oh, this guy's good intern material.

[1642] Sam and Max are in a strange direction.

[1643] Max in future games.

[1644] on this black suit with the balls on it.

[1645] That's a brand new meeting tonight.

[1646] Mocap.

[1647] Mocap balls.

[1648] So I said put on the black suit with the balls on it.

[1649] I didn't know what the hell you were talking about.

[1650] Oh, sure.

[1651] Come on.

[1652] I've fallen for that before and I won't again.

[1653] I guess, you know, it seems to me that there is still hope out there.

[1654] You know, it seems like in the years past...

[1655] For those who dare to dream...

[1656] Jeff Gershman, that is the single most positive thing I have known you for 14 years professionally.

[1657] I've never heard the word hope passionately.

[1658] Reason for hope.

[1659] There was that time when I said, I hope Tekken comes out in the Dreamcast.

[1660] And then they translated our interview into Japanese.

[1661] And then at some point, the rumor started that Tekken was coming to the Dreamcast.

[1662] And that Tekken was hope in itself.

[1663] And that was my hope.

[1664] And now, Tekken has no hope.

[1665] Come on, Tekken tag.

[1666] Tekken's gonna fight Street Fighter.

[1667] Do you have no hope for that?

[1668] That might be interesting.

[1669] That might be a game.

[1670] That might be the thing.

[1671] That might be a video game.

[1672] That'll ship.

[1673] That will be a video game that ships.

[1674] It will be presented at some point to the public and they will fight.

[1675] Yes.

[1676] The public will fight.

[1677] But no, in the years past, for as many layoffs as there still are going on, it seems like deals weren't getting signed.

[1678] The indie developers out there, the smaller, I don't mean like indie, like the indie.

[1679] But independent studios out there looking to get work, art studios and middleware guys, it just seems like the deals weren't happening.

[1680] It seems like those deals are starting to happen again.

[1681] It's not a problem for those guys.

[1682] It's a problem for the big Activision and EAs trying to figure out what's next.

[1683] The one part of Iwata's keynote that was good was like, look, this stuff is not manageable.

[1684] Like, the costs are going up, what you get back from it is not worth it, or if it's one out of five that is worth it.

[1685] So that, it's really, you know, those independent studios where they can manage their costs, like, that's not happening on the AAA scale.

[1686] And, you know, we all want, like, new IPs, but that makes no sense.

[1687] It makes no sense to invest in new IP.

[1688] It makes sense to just sequelize because, yeah, you might get a little tired of the mechanics.

[1689] You're advertising the engine development costs across the trilogy.

[1690] It's funny that we have another Jeffrey Katzenberg letter that was so notorious in the 90s in Hollywood where he, Jeffrey Katzenberg of all people, said, hey, we're spending too much money on these big bunch of things.

[1691] We need films about people and things that are real and everyone laughed at them.

[1692] You know, that's what Jerry Maguire, I think, is, like, actually based on.

[1693] But that's exactly what's happening in the game industry.

[1694] Everyone's trying to open up each other, and eventually you're going to hit a brick wall, and then everyone's going to lose.

[1695] Well, but you need to think, I mean, think about it from a developer's perspective and a publisher's perspective.

[1696] The developer's perspective is we want to have a new IP that's going to, like, launch out of our studio and make us sort of a flagship studio that's going to kill some cool aspect of the industry.

[1697] And we're going to bet this many people working this many hours for this long to make that happen.

[1698] From a publisher's perspective, it's like we need something on the books where we can guess, because that's what publishing is, is guessing how many units you'll sell.

[1699] We're like, well, we know if we sequelize this game, we can probably sell at least 80 % of what we sold at the last game if it's not a terrible disaster.

[1700] And so you go out and you know exactly what that profit and loss sheet looks like before you start versus a new IP where it's like, yeah, it's either going to make us a bajillion dollars or it's not going to sell at all and we won't exist anymore.

[1701] developer that's not making multiple games for multiple publishers, that's really scary.

[1702] So those little houses need to sort of either become bigger, which is hard to do when you don't have an existing IP, or make sequels or work as a middleware studio or whatever it is.

[1703] Well, I think sequels will become like the IP, like the movie IP, where it was like, that's a sure thing.

[1704] Now, thank God, those are done.

[1705] It's like, they don't make money anymore, the movie tie -ins.

[1706] It's like, you don't see those as much anymore.

[1707] It's not this flood, but it is now.

[1708] Sequels are, well, we can definitely cash in on this.

[1709] That used to be, for sure, you do a movie tie -in.

[1710] All the grandmas are going to buy it.

[1711] It's going to be amazing.

[1712] We're going to do big money.

[1713] Darksiders 2 coming soon.

[1714] Yes.

[1715] For grandmas everywhere.

[1716] Your grandma loves this game.

[1717] She does.

[1718] We're doing a complete ad campaign.

[1719] Your grandmas love this game.

[1720] All right.

[1721] Well, I think that's going to just about do it from the bar for tonight.

[1722] We're going to probably be back tomorrow night.

[1723] So if you guys want to come back, that's cool.

[1724] No, we're taking you up to Petaluma.

[1725] I get a lot of work done up there.

[1726] You'll like it.

[1727] Oh yeah, we'll show you the kill room.

[1728] It's pretty awesome.

[1729] But you folks do not get to see the kill room tonight.

[1730] That's it from here.

[1731] See you.

[1732] Internet.

[1733] Bye, Internet.

[1734] Goodbye.

[1735] Video games.

[1736] Don't say that.

[1737] Thanks for coming, guys.