MFM Minisode 379

[0] This is exactly right.

[1] And welcome to my favorite murder.

[2] The minisode.

[3] That's right.

[4] Here we are.

[5] Oh, and if you belong to the fan cult, you can see this on video.

[6] We're videoing this right now.

[7] You can feel the video tension and the air, and you should see it.

[8] Yeah.

[9] Don't make weird faces.

[10] Don't make weird faces.

[11] That's what I say to myself.

[12] What is that one section of my hair always look unbrushed, no matter how much I brush it?

[13] You want to go first?

[14] Sure.

[15] Okay, this one's called My Mom survived a serial killer.

[16] Oh, wow.

[17] I know.

[18] Hi, Karen and Georgia.

[19] You guys rocked.

[20] I'll attempt to keep this short and sweet.

[21] My mom swears to this day that she avoided an attack from serial killer Derek Todd Lee, aka the Baton Rouge serial killer back in the early 90s.

[22] And that's the serial killer just covered in Baton Rouge.

[23] Yeah.

[24] Lee was convicted and sentenced to death for the murder of two women.

[25] DNA evidence was also used to link Lee to five additional killings from the mid -90s to 2003.

[26] Fear of this guy was crazy throughout the state of Louisiana for years, as he would enter women's homes when they were alone and rape and murder them.

[27] Her story goes like this.

[28] Back in 1990, before I was born, she and my dad were living in an apartment near Baton Rouge.

[29] My mom was, and still is, a teacher.

[30] It was the summertime, so naturally she was home alone most of the day while my dad was at work.

[31] She said someone knocked on the door, claiming to be a repairman who was there to, quote, check on their hot water heater.

[32] She didn't open the door But looked through the people And saw a young man standing on the doorstep He wasn't wearing a uniform And she noticed he was driving a small car Not really what a repairman looks like Or drives, right?

[33] Right Since she was alone, she told him to come back later He then got very rude with her yelling that Quote, if she didn't let him in She would get in trouble with the landlord And he would quote Get in trouble with his boss So consequences for you better open the door Yeah Yeah.

[34] But she, being the smart badass that she is, responded with too bad, come back later.

[35] Assuming he left, she went back into the living room to watch TV when she saw him walking around the side of the house to the back door.

[36] She sprinted to the back door and locked it, realizing he was going to try to come in that way.

[37] When he realized the door was locked, he banged on it again, telling her that, quote, the landlord said her hot water heater was broken and it needed to be checked right away.

[38] there's no hot water heater in the world that's this important no it's not broken and why would the landlord know it was you'd be the person calling the landlord to say something drunk with a hot water heater yeah that's you know that doesn't that's not an outside in job it's an inside out job right um he kept trying the door a few more minutes looking in the back window and yelling at her so she called the police of my dad the man was obviously gone when the cops got there and they couldn't really do anything except take my mom's statement my parents moved to the house we live in now shortly after this incident.

[39] Over 10 years later in 2003, the news broke that Derek Todd Lee had been arrested for the recent killings in the area.

[40] I will never forget this moment as my mom was standing in the kitchen listening to the news.

[41] His picture flashed across the screen and she immediately yelled, oh my God, that's him and started to cry.

[42] The crying part is like the visceral, like it definitely was him.

[43] Yeah.

[44] Through her tears, she told me the story of what happened back in 1990 at her apartment.

[45] I had never seen her that shaken up before.

[46] She then told me exactly what you two have said in earlier episodes, don't be afraid to be rude, go with your gut, and be smart.

[47] You can always apologize later if you hurt someone's feelings.

[48] It just goes to show that being rude might just save your life, but there's no doubt in her mind or mine that the man who tried to enter her apartment that day was Derek Todd Lee.

[49] And with that, thank you for your creativity, wit, and just plain bad assery.

[50] Stay sexy and don't get murdered, Katie.

[51] Oh, God.

[52] I know.

[53] That was written to us a long time ago when I was doing research on that story.

[54] I found that one.

[55] Sometimes we get emails from people who are like, I think my aunt may have almost gone on a day with Ted Bundy.

[56] That's a classic one.

[57] But, like, this is so real and horrifying because clearly, if it was 10 years before he was arrested, does it feel like that was in his ramp up toward?

[58] Like, he was just starting to, I don't know.

[59] It's just so awful.

[60] And then also getting the information of how those other women let him in, remember I was saying how they were always very safe, they didn't answer the door to anyone.

[61] But yeah, like it's the same thing with like the Boston Strangler, where it's like, I'm here to fix something that your landlord told me to, you know, a lot of people wouldn't give it a second thought, myself included sometimes.

[62] And if that one doesn't work, he was doing it so long by the time the people you talked about were being like stalked.

[63] He probably had the perfect line and the perfect tone of voice.

[64] and the perfect everything.

[65] Ugh.

[66] Totally.

[67] Okay.

[68] I'm not going to read you the subject line of my first one.

[69] It just starts, hello.

[70] I can't even tell this story inside my own family for stupid reasons I won't go into.

[71] So I'm giving it to you, dear MFF hosts, in all its glorious stupidity.

[72] It is the early 90s.

[73] My then -girlfriend and I had just moved to California after graduated from college on the East Coast.

[74] We were a scrappy pair.

[75] We didn't have a real plan or much money.

[76] For us, it was a big yellow rider truck across the country and then a tiny studio apartment in a strange place.

[77] We were both looking for work, but we didn't have any connections.

[78] Somehow, I thought the one move I should make was to contact a local mobster mentioned to me by my uncle and ask him for a job.

[79] I still don't know why I thought this was a good idea.

[80] It had something to do with the fact that it was a family referral and thus felt safe.

[81] But I was not really paying attention to what I was about to walk into.

[82] I met the mobster in his spacious office.

[83] He was no different than any Italian guy I've ever met, with one exception.

[84] He was wearing maybe the nicest sweater I've ever seen.

[85] That's how you can spot him.

[86] Yeah.

[87] I assumed it was cashmere or something very expensive.

[88] His curly chest hair was popping out from the little zip down part.

[89] He was tanned and easygoing, and he spoke in a softened California version of the Italian East Coast accent.

[90] When he said, oh, can I help you?

[91] Right?

[92] Is that, don't you think that that's a California version of that?

[93] That's a good one.

[94] I realized I had given no thought whatsoever to how I would respond to this question.

[95] I actually said, maybe you have a job that's not listed in the paper.

[96] As soon as these words came out of my mouth, there was a rush of panic in my brain as I came to my senses about what I was doing.

[97] After a pause, he said, well, maybe we have a place for you in our accounting department.

[98] By that time, the mental fog had lifted and I was shitting a brick.

[99] In my mind, I was like, this is not a movie.

[100] I am not reading from a script.

[101] I'm not messing around with characters on the screen.

[102] I asked a guy for a mob job, and now I want to get the fuck out of here as soon as possible.

[103] I had to think quick.

[104] I said, you know, I'm really looking for something downtown.

[105] Do you have anything in that area?

[106] I was either lucky or smart, and it was a good deflection.

[107] He shook his head, no. And then his face lit up.

[108] Hey, you know that place Nordstrom?

[109] That might be a good place for you to work.

[110] That's a really great place.

[111] He went on singing the praises of the fancy department store.

[112] buy a shirt and you don't like it, you take it back, you get a new shirt, you could work there, and then you could buy clothes for a discount for your lady friend.

[113] That last part was especially hilarious because my girlfriend, a thrift store diva, who was at that moment sitting in the lobby in one of her signature outfits, would not be caught dead in Nordstrom.

[114] I made it sound like working at the mall was a really great plan for my future, and I got out of there pretty quickly.

[115] All in all, this was precisely the kind of dumb, bold failure and escape that you can only get away with when you're young and clueless.

[116] I thought the whole thing was over until the phone rang about six weeks later.

[117] It was him checking up on us to see how we were doing in that sweet way that Italian men do.

[118] I told them that both of us had jobs, which was true, and thanked him for his concern.

[119] And that was the last we ever heard from the Nordstrom Dawn.

[120] Stay sexy and wear nice sweaters, Big J. He basically asked for an off -the -record job.

[121] One that's not in the newspaper is like a criminal job.

[122] Like I'm asking you specifically.

[123] Yeah, like chopping up bodies?

[124] Like, what are you talking about one that's not in the paper?

[125] Yeah.

[126] Yeah, you're like, can I run drugs for you?

[127] Totally.

[128] This guy's smart because it sounded probably like a sting operation.

[129] He was like, nope, go to Nordstrom.

[130] Goodbye.

[131] Yeah, exactly.

[132] Or you can, we have an accounting department, but other than that, there's nothing that's not in the paper.

[133] Oh, my God.

[134] Karen, you know I'm all about vintage shopping.

[135] Absolutely.

[136] And when you say vintage, you mean when you physically drive to a store and actually purchase something with cash.

[137] Exactly.

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[152] That Shopify dot com slash murder.

[153] This one's called I stole the Mona Lisa.

[154] Hello, MFM crew.

[155] Picture this.

[156] Summer of 2006, I was home from college in a small town, Brandonburg, Kentucky, and visiting with friends when we decided to head to the nearest bar that served liquor.

[157] Our bars only served beer.

[158] Oh.

[159] I know.

[160] That's like some Blue Laws New England stuff.

[161] Yeah, totally.

[162] This watering hole was just across the Ohio River in Macport, sorry, Indiana, and appropriately named the Hoosier Inn.

[163] I was surely tipsy from pre -gaming when I spotted the Mona Lisa replica on the wall and decided it would be the perfect gift for our friend Ricky who had the hangout house where we're always crashing at.

[164] Speaking of being young and dumb.

[165] I want to steal stuff.

[166] I'm going to steal it and then put it at my friend's house where we all go all the time.

[167] Right.

[168] I got a few friends involved and we made a plan.

[169] First person distracted the bartender, second person slid the painting off the wall, and third person took it out the back door to the covered pickup truck bed.

[170] I think it was like full size.

[171] Jesus Christ.

[172] We figured the bartender would be none the wiser until realizing the wall had a very distinct rectangular outline due to nicotine stains.

[173] Moments later, when I went to the bathroom, the door burst open with a female bartender yelling, have you all seen the Mona Lisa?

[174] And it says, please say in a southern drawl.

[175] So that's why I did that.

[176] That was good.

[177] Have y 'all seen the Mona Lisa?

[178] Hey, have y 'all seen the Mona Lisa?

[179] That guy is back.

[180] Everyone's here.

[181] He's on the case.

[182] He'll help out.

[183] My face would have been a dead giveaway, so thank God I was in the closed stall.

[184] She continued to yell for the missing Mona Lisa and made quite the scene.

[185] Each of us were questioned, but we just shrugged her off.

[186] When we got home later and I presented Ricky with this present, he said thanks at first and then change his mind deciding he didn't want the stolen property.

[187] in his house.

[188] Ricky was thinking straight.

[189] Ricky and the bartender were the two sober people in this scenario.

[190] They're like, yeah, whatever you're doing, stop doing it.

[191] No, it's not cute.

[192] I guess because his neighbor was the Meade County Sheriff.

[193] Loll.

[194] Oh, my God.

[195] I hope the Meade County Sheriff wasn't on the case, too.

[196] The Meek County Sheriff is like literally standing behind you while you're like, yes, what I'm going to do.

[197] I took it back from his ungrateful ass and had kept the Mona Lisa with me proudly displayed on the wall.

[198] of my various homes ever since.

[199] They got away with it.

[200] It is hilarious to me that the real Mona Lisa is missing from a museum for days without notice, but the Hoosier Inn bartender spotted it in a heartbeat.

[201] The Hoosier Inn no longer exists and or has changed ownership, so I felt almost 20 years later, it was finally safe to tell this story.

[202] SSDGM, Eliza.

[203] Eliza.

[204] Here comes the sheriff.

[205] I hope the bartender's listening right now and is like, I fucking knew it.

[206] I knew it.

[207] Those bitches.

[208] You need to write to us immediately.

[209] Also, that kind of thing where, like, it's such a drunken idea.

[210] Yeah.

[211] That's how I spent all my drunken time.

[212] Would it be like looking around, getting a little excited inspiration?

[213] It'd be like, come on, we have to do it.

[214] And it's the worst, dumbest idea.

[215] Just like needing some adventure.

[216] Yeah, and kind of thinking, like, the world is now as drunk as you are.

[217] So everyone's perception is fucked up.

[218] And you're going to be able to get away with shit.

[219] You know what we need?

[220] Bartender stories.

[221] Oh, yes.

[222] Are you, have you been a bartender?

[223] Any part in your life, we need the wildest stories, the stupidest stories.

[224] Please, we beg you.

[225] We beg you.

[226] No story too small.

[227] Also, like, somebody was talking, oh, it was a TikTok that I saw where somebody was like, hey, if you're regular at a bar, not only are you not beloved, we hate you.

[228] Oh, no. Oh, no. It was hilarious.

[229] But, I mean, you think about it where it's just like, yeah, these are people that come to your job and get shit -faced in front of you.

[230] Right.

[231] Right.

[232] And try to talk to you.

[233] Yeah.

[234] Yeah.

[235] Oh, my God.

[236] So funny.

[237] I mean, yeah, it's a little harsh, but I like the idea of it.

[238] Okay.

[239] The subject line of this email is Traumatic Girl Scout camping trip.

[240] And it just gets right into it.

[241] It just starts, I'm the same age as Karen.

[242] And aside from the awesome storytelling, one of my favorite parts of MFM is reminiscing on the mayhem that was the 19th 1770s and 80s childhood.

[243] I just finished listening to the minisode with the story of the dad who invented Greasy Pete to scare his kids from wandering off into the woods while camping.

[244] I forgot about that.

[245] I wanted to tell you this story for a while, but Greasy Pete was the sign I needed to write to you about my first and only Girl Scout camping trip.

[246] I was in the third grade, the year we got to go on the real Girl Scout camping trip in the actual woods with tents and campfires and everything a suburban kid who never came.

[247] camped before could imagine.

[248] I had already completed the prerequisite first and second grade camping trips, which consisted of a one -night sleepover on the cold, hard, probably asbestos -tiled floor in the basement of the town's Presbyterian church.

[249] Oh, God.

[250] We did something similar to that.

[251] It's like they're breaking in camping to you, like first you're going to be away from your house, then you're going to be in a sleeping bag.

[252] Here's some pine needles we can put in the church floor.

[253] In the time building up to the trip, the excitement was.

[254] profound.

[255] When arrived at camp, we got our tent assignments, did some outdoorsy stuff to earn badges, and when night fell, the chaperones lit a campfire, and we, of course, got to hear some spooky stories.

[256] They were fairly benign, except for the last one, the story of Lefty Louie, a madman who lived in these woods, had a hook where his left hand should be, and of course eight little girls.

[257] It was a scary story, but everyone seemed pretty okay when story time was over, and it was time for bed.

[258] We lined up flashlights in hand and started down the short wooded trail to the restroom building to wash up.

[259] A few minutes into our walk, out of a pile of leaves beside the trail, jumped a full -grown, hook -handed, bearded man who shouted in a low, low, spooky voice, I'm Lefty Louie.

[260] Why do you need to traumatize children, adults?

[261] I guess it was like they were all stone listening to like Led Zeppelin and like, you know what would be cool.

[262] Yeah, let's scare their shit out of the children.

[263] Out of third graders.

[264] Shrieks ensued, pants were peed, tears were shed, and all at once, the adults realized that they had misjudged the age rating for this prank.

[265] I don't remember how long it took.

[266] Yeah, that's actually a perfect seventh grade prank.

[267] Yes, totally.

[268] Third grade, go to hell.

[269] I'm the third grade lawyer, and I say go to hell.

[270] I don't remember how long it took to get the group calmed down, but I do remember the next morning when our parents rolled up in their wood -paneled station wagons to take us home.

[271] One or two girls must have told their parents about Lefty Louie because there was a good amount of yelling, frantic hand -waving, and what were you thinking directed at the troop leader and her husband, aka Lefty Louie.

[272] I've never camped again, and to this day I only hike if I'm guaranteed to be the fuck out of the woods while the sun is still high in the sky.

[273] Thank you for keeping us all entertained, bringing back so many Gen X memories, and of course, advocating for those who need it.

[274] stay sexy and maybe don't hide in leaf piles to traumatize third grade girl scouts robin she her Robin is such a 70s 80s name too that's hilarious yeah that's so true oh my god no no it's like scary enough to be in the woods without a fucking monster jumping out of you I have anxiety right now from that email of just like oh that's gonna now they have to get into bed no one's sleeping no and imagine if you did pee your pants how embarrassing that would be in like, oh.

[275] But you're, you were right to pee your pants.

[276] Yeah, it was a pee your pants situation.

[277] By any means necessary, get away from lefty, looney, fuck.

[278] Okay, here's my last one.

[279] Antique Roadshow, hometown, an OG declaration of independence.

[280] Greetings, murderino, royalty.

[281] Listening to the latest minisode, I heard you request for great thrift fines.

[282] And I knew I had to write in about this one because it's almost unbelievable.

[283] Several years ago, my husband was working a job.

[284] You can probably only be hired for in L .A., New York, or Nashville.

[285] He was a cartage driver.

[286] You know what that is?

[287] Cardage?

[288] Is it something like on sets?

[289] Kind of.

[290] You're basically a moving guy, but you work exclusively with famous musicians, moving instruments and gear around to venues and studios across town all day long.

[291] They're like moving guys that don't fuck up because you can't fuck up like Paul McCartney's one guitar.

[292] Right.

[293] And Paul McCartney doesn't want to throw it in his trunk and head there.

[294] So he needs some of the, yeah.

[295] And it's probably like insured and specialized.

[296] Yeah.

[297] Oh my God.

[298] That'd be terrifying.

[299] If you don't mind manual labor and you're chill around famous people, it's the job for you.

[300] He totally had the energy of a UPS driver that marries Jennifer Coolidge in Legally Blonde.

[301] Not exactly you're talking about.

[302] Calm, cool, and collected.

[303] the kind of vibe that comes from someone who doesn't worry too much.

[304] Sounds nice.

[305] I mean, how?

[306] Have you looked around lately?

[307] Things aren't great.

[308] No, things are not great.

[309] It's time to worry.

[310] It's time to worry.

[311] He probably was so chill because 10 years before, he happened upon one of the greatest thrift finds of maybe all time.

[312] At a local Nashville thrift store, he picked up a replica of the Declaration of Independence for $2 .48.

[313] Thinking it was pretty cool and looked old.

[314] That's something I would.

[315] never looked twice at.

[316] You know what I mean?

[317] I don't care about that shit.

[318] Because also you know for a fact, it's not, it can't be real.

[319] It's not like some secret painter.

[320] No, it's from the cracker barrel, fucking gift store.

[321] Like, no. Right?

[322] Yeah.

[323] It's your, that aunt that really loves America.

[324] Right.

[325] It was like, no, I want my own copy.

[326] Oh my God.

[327] It's like she got everyone one for Christmas that year.

[328] And okay, well, this particular replica was one of only 200 commissioned by John Quincy Adams.

[329] No. Handwritten by William Stone.

[330] 1823.

[331] So shows us literal national treasure.

[332] Literally.

[333] His copy was one of 36 surviving copies and was in pretty good condition.

[334] At auction, it sold for $400 ,077 ,650.

[335] Oh, my, half a million he paid $2 .48 for it.

[336] Okay.

[337] So he grossed.

[338] So it says, wait, wait, to an investment firm in Salt Lake City in 2007, which in today's money is over $600 ,000.

[339] Oh, beautiful.

[340] Mikey said he used the money to buy a used car, help his parents, teeth, tith to his church.

[341] That's tithe.

[342] Tithe.

[343] Tive is the money you give every Sunday.

[344] Got it.

[345] And built a sun porch on his house.

[346] I thought you would all love this ultimate thrifting success story.

[347] Stay sexy and find valuable treasures so you can coast into retirement, Rochelle.

[348] Rochelle, I absolutely love that story.

[349] It is epic.

[350] It touches something in me that was opened up around 1990 when I started going in Sacramento to thrift stores and realizing the potential treasure that was in front of me. But you don't really hear, like, you hear the ones that are like, oh, this purse was actually a real Chanel and I redid it and it sold for $4 ,000 or something.

[351] But $600 ,000.

[352] That's insane.

[353] Do you remember what I was thinking about?

[354] I always think about this.

[355] What was thrifting like in the 70s?

[356] Like, all you found was 1920s, gorgeous art deco shit and turn of the century fucking.

[357] Yes.

[358] Chotchkes, like my dream.

[359] Also, you know, I think about that because there's a Charles Dickens, I think it's Bleak House where one of the characters owns what they call a curiosity shop, which is a basically a vintage store.

[360] But in Victorian times for like antiques.

[361] And I'm like, I know it's just a set, but it's so realistically done.

[362] And it, because everything's like candle lit and in like dusty corners, like, I would absolutely kill.

[363] I think that would be like if you could make a wish.

[364] The wish to walk through that store and see what's actually in there.

[365] Yeah.

[366] Okay, here's my last one.

[367] And it's kind of long, but I think it's worth it.

[368] Okay.

[369] I'm not going to read you the subject line.

[370] So it says, hi, me again.

[371] You asked for a follow up from my previous email and I'm finally getting around to it.

[372] So this was someone that sent in something and at the end wrote, I'll tell you about my coffee date with Anne Rule a different time and then we freaked out.

[373] I believe.

[374] Yeah.

[375] So it says, You wanted an update on my coffee with Anne Rule as well as my great, maybe not so great grandmother who was most likely a black widow.

[376] So here goes.

[377] About 20 or so years ago, Anne Rule had a book signing in my city.

[378] I had just recently become acquainted with her books.

[379] Remember the black and white photos that were always in the middle.

[380] Turn to those immediately.

[381] First.

[382] And I wouldn't know what was going on in the story.

[383] Totally.

[384] That's how I saw that picture in the John Wayne Gacy book that my cousin Marty had.

[385] Right.

[386] That haunted me forever and landed me here on the podcast, my favorite murder.

[387] How fortuitous.

[388] It really has been quite fortuitous.

[389] Okay.

[390] So I was thrilled that she was going to be in town.

[391] The day of her signing was pretty crappy, lots of sleet, maybe some snow.

[392] I can't remember all the meteorological nightmare.

[393] that was that day, but it was bad.

[394] But not for this fledgling murderino.

[395] The bookstore that she was at wasn't too far from my office, so I made the short drive over.

[396] When I got there, I was sort of thrilled that there weren't a lot of people.

[397] And then in parentheses, it says, I'm sure Ms. Rule didn't have the same opinion.

[398] Anyway, she signed several books for me. And since there was hardly anyone around, we just started talking.

[399] And then she asked if I'd like to get a coffee, which I did.

[400] I can't remember if there a coffee shop attached to the bookstore or just one next door.

[401] But we sat with our cups and just talk like old friends.

[402] Oh my God, for some reason, it's making me want to cry.

[403] Also, like, even if it's just like stranger, how do you meet people like that?

[404] That sounds so lovely.

[405] And I feel like she had, you know, she's one of those people I feel like I know her when I'm remembering.

[406] It's like that's my mom's friend, but it's not.

[407] It's somebody you don't know.

[408] But I feel like the breadth of her life and the different work she did, she's like an interested person.

[409] interested in has a great knack for making people comfortable immediately around her.

[410] Yeah.

[411] Journalists, you know, all these things.

[412] Serial killers.

[413] Serial killers.

[414] I mean, she was good.

[415] Okay, so sorry.

[416] To be honest, I can't remember what we discussed, but I just remember thinking what a wonderful, wonderful person she is.

[417] She was very warm, but you knew she had a bit of toughness to her in a good way, in a way that many of us should emulate.

[418] So that's it, just a nice conversation between two women.

[419] On the flip side, there's my great -grandmother.

[420] My dear great -grandma came to a small town in Wisconsin from Paris, where she married my great -grandfather who owned a bar in town.

[421] They had four children relatively quickly, although one child passed at a young age.

[422] One of the bar patrons was a young man who, as my family history tells it, took a fancy to my grandmother.

[423] He was much younger than she was, and she had small children, but apparently that didn't stop them.

[424] At this point, I'd also like to interject that was during this period that my great -grandmother took up gardening, like a lot of gardening.

[425] and she fenced in that garden so nobody could get to it but her.

[426] Uh -oh.

[427] It wasn't long after this man entered her life and the gardening was blooming that my great -grandfather passed away from an alleged heart attack.

[428] He was 42.

[429] My grandmother sold the bar for a decent amount of money.

[430] She then married this young man. She kept gardening and he worked for the railroad and in those days that made for quite a good living plus there was always the railroad pension.

[431] Apparently the marriage was not the happiest and as luck would have it, husband number two, suddenly passed away from a heart attack.

[432] He was 30.

[433] Oh, my God.

[434] So Great Grandma now had inheritance number two.

[435] At some point, she turned her home into a boarding house, and that's where husband number three comes in.

[436] He was allegedly a renter at her home.

[437] He was older than she was, and Gasp worked for the railroad.

[438] Holy shit.

[439] Oh, my God.

[440] He also had a much bigger pension than husband number two because he had been with the railroad company longer.

[441] they got and stayed married for about 10 years and then he suddenly passed away from do you see where I'm going here a goddamn heart attack did they right you see where I'm going here yep yep love it you would think people would be questioning all these deaths but they lived in a small Wisconsin town and this was about a hundred years or so ago maybe the whole autopsy thing didn't happen frequently I do know that both within the small community and the family there are several including my 88 -year -old mother who think that this woman had something to do with all the deaths.

[442] It turns out that in that fenced garden were quite a few native Wisconsin plants that can cause heart attacks or simulate the effects of a heart attack when ingested.

[443] I did want to end with this.

[444] I am in my sixth decade on this planet and I've often thought that I've lived a very ordinary life.

[445] But I've come to realize that within every so -called ordinary life are extraordinary moments.

[446] After writing this, I realized that I've had some pretty interesting experiences and rule hidden room black widow relative nobody is ever just ordinary nobody we need to remember that about ourselves stay sexy and don't ever think that you're anything less than extraordinary Lori oh my god Lori what a perfect fucking email what a beautiful rich tapestry of an email you know what I my mind goes to the last husband was real true love 10 years it's a long time not to kill someone when you killed the other ones and he actually died of a heart attack almost like it was her karma that the one she actually loved died of a real hard time do you know what you just did is you wrote an incredible screenplay right there that that is like right isn't that irony isn't that like a bunch of this paradox or whatever like a bunch of those big 10 dollar vocabulary words you can slap on there but like then she would be like no no the one I want it all along.

[447] That's beautiful.

[448] Let's write it.

[449] Let's write it.

[450] Don't kill people with weeds or plants.

[451] Don't do it.

[452] Don't do it.

[453] Don't do it.

[454] That's it.

[455] Thank you guys.

[456] Amazing emails.

[457] Bartenders, please send your emails to my favorite murder at gmail .com.

[458] We're going to need it.

[459] Our tinder stories.

[460] Yes.

[461] Bartender stories, please.

[462] And what you think is the ultimate thrift store victory story.

[463] Yeah.

[464] Or even a medium.

[465] It doesn't have to be ultimate.

[466] Did I once tell you?

[467] you that I bought a really cute jacket from a thrift store like an old 60s like sailor jacket and inside was a little piece of paper with the word victory on it.

[468] Really?

[469] So I got the victory that you were just talking at the thrift store victory.

[470] That is circle.

[471] I think I still have it somewhere.

[472] We both die tonight.

[473] No, I can't leave the house.

[474] Stay sexy.

[475] And don't get murdered for 24 hours.

[476] Goodbye.

[477] Goodbye.

[478] Elvis, do you want a cookie?

[479] Ah.

[480] This has been an exactly right production.

[481] Our senior producer is Alejandra Keck.

[482] Our editor is Aristotle Asavado.

[483] This episode was mixed by Lianasquilachi.

[484] Email your hometowns to My Favorite Murder at gmail .com.

[485] And follow the show on Instagram and Facebook at My Favorite Murder and on Twitter at MyFave Murder.

[486] Goodbye.